1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:05,439 Speaker 1: It's time to get inside the Giants hut. Let's get 2 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:08,160 Speaker 1: the Giants mobul, give me some joke. Part of the 3 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:09,800 Speaker 1: Giants Podcast. 4 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:12,360 Speaker 2: Met with Welcome to another edition of the Johns Little Podcast, 5 00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 2: brought to you by Citizens, the official bank of the Giants. 6 00:00:14,440 --> 00:00:15,480 Speaker 1: I am John Schmelt. 7 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:20,440 Speaker 2: Joined today by longtime NFL quarterback Super Bowl champion Brian Hoyer. 8 00:00:20,480 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 1: Brian, thanks for joining us, man. How are you hey, John? 9 00:00:23,640 --> 00:00:24,319 Speaker 3: Thanks for having me. 10 00:00:24,360 --> 00:00:24,759 Speaker 1: I'm good. 11 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:28,480 Speaker 3: I'm excited to talk about Jackson Dart. I self admittedly 12 00:00:28,640 --> 00:00:31,000 Speaker 3: had him as one of the higher rated quarterbacks coming out. 13 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:33,879 Speaker 3: I know a few people weren't as high on him, 14 00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:36,680 Speaker 3: but the more I watched him on film, I thought 15 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:39,000 Speaker 3: he was a first round pick. And when I saw 16 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:40,519 Speaker 3: the Giants trade off for him, I thought it made 17 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:42,320 Speaker 3: a lot of sense because to me, and I'm not 18 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:45,360 Speaker 3: comparing him to this guy, but Brian day Ball had 19 00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:48,120 Speaker 3: experience with a young Josh Allen in Buffalo and that 20 00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:50,960 Speaker 3: I think that's when Josh really took off and became 21 00:00:51,440 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 3: the quarterback we see today, and I think day Ball 22 00:00:54,000 --> 00:00:57,280 Speaker 3: saw a little bit of that in Jackson Dart and 23 00:00:57,880 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 3: you can kind of see the comparisons, you know, Jackson 24 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 3: comes in and provides a spark to that Giants team. 25 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 3: And it's not all the passing, it's the running. And 26 00:01:05,560 --> 00:01:08,560 Speaker 3: I think he's hanging around camps scatterby a little too much. He's, 27 00:01:08,600 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 3: you know, like leading with his head. And my son, 28 00:01:11,720 --> 00:01:14,600 Speaker 3: of course, my son's an eighth grade football player, and 29 00:01:14,640 --> 00:01:16,720 Speaker 3: he loves Jackson Dark because he has what he calls 30 00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:19,600 Speaker 3: aura whatever. That means, nothing that I ever have when 31 00:01:19,640 --> 00:01:21,920 Speaker 3: I was playing. But my Son's trying to run guys 32 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:23,880 Speaker 3: over now, and I'm like, where are you learning this from? 33 00:01:23,959 --> 00:01:26,800 Speaker 3: And he's like guys like Josh Allen, guys like Jackson 34 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:29,520 Speaker 3: Dart and so it's a unique playing style. But I 35 00:01:29,560 --> 00:01:31,880 Speaker 3: think for a rookie quarterback, you come in the league, 36 00:01:31,920 --> 00:01:34,319 Speaker 3: you want to make something happen. The guys rally around that, 37 00:01:34,520 --> 00:01:36,160 Speaker 3: and he can see the energy that he's brought. 38 00:01:36,520 --> 00:01:38,959 Speaker 2: Yeah, I will give Robert May's credit from The Athletic 39 00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:42,040 Speaker 2: Football Show. He said, right now, Jackson Dart and Cam'scaddo 40 00:01:42,120 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 2: a little too much similar styles of play. 41 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:45,840 Speaker 1: Right now, you want to kind of avoid that if 42 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,160 Speaker 1: you're a quarterback. I agree. You talk about how he 43 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 1: liked him as a college prospect. 44 00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:51,600 Speaker 2: How do you think so far what you saw on 45 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 2: his college tape has transferred over to what he's done 46 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:55,480 Speaker 2: so far with the Giants. 47 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 1: Brian. Yeah. 48 00:01:56,000 --> 00:01:57,600 Speaker 3: The one thing you know when you watch like the 49 00:01:57,640 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 3: top guys, the one thing that I would say that 50 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:02,080 Speaker 3: Jackson did the best, and you've seen it a little bit. 51 00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:04,880 Speaker 3: He was a guy who wanted to move up into 52 00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:07,560 Speaker 3: the pocket, whereas guys like the cam Ward, guys like 53 00:02:07,560 --> 00:02:11,320 Speaker 3: Shador I thought Jackson, Dart and Will Howard were the 54 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:13,359 Speaker 3: ones who were most pro ready when it came to 55 00:02:13,440 --> 00:02:16,120 Speaker 3: pocket movement. And you've seen it and watching that game 56 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 3: last Thursday night, he had a lot of great plays, 57 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:20,080 Speaker 3: but the one that really stuck out of my mind 58 00:02:20,200 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 3: is like, man, he's playing that's a professional throw. There 59 00:02:24,120 --> 00:02:26,480 Speaker 3: was a play Jahad Campbell I think, was coming free 60 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:28,720 Speaker 3: on a blitz and he hung in there, stepped up 61 00:02:28,760 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 3: and hit THEO Johnson on a sail route and I 62 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:33,520 Speaker 3: was like, that's that's a legit NFL play right there, 63 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:35,840 Speaker 3: Like he's not trying to escape the thing about playing 64 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:38,680 Speaker 3: quarterback in the NFL that's different from the collegiate level, 65 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:41,160 Speaker 3: and I'm nowhere near I was nowhere near as athletic 66 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:43,360 Speaker 3: as some of these guys play now, But if you 67 00:02:43,360 --> 00:02:45,079 Speaker 3: want to play quarterback, you got to hang in there 68 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:47,519 Speaker 3: and take some hits and know my guy's going to 69 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:50,160 Speaker 3: be open. Here comes the pressure. And that was probably 70 00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:53,440 Speaker 3: one of the more impressive throws for Jackson Darr last 71 00:02:53,440 --> 00:02:56,640 Speaker 3: Thursday night, and he showed that in the collegiate level, 72 00:02:56,639 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 3: and so to see that translating now he's getting, you know, 73 00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:02,360 Speaker 3: a few starts under his belt. That's what you want 74 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:03,720 Speaker 3: to see. And I think day Ball is the right 75 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:06,640 Speaker 3: guy to have to bring him along. It's okay, let's 76 00:03:06,639 --> 00:03:08,880 Speaker 3: have a few design runs. It's okay to scramble, but 77 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 3: let's keep developing that pocket presence and hanging in there 78 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 3: and hitting the guys when we know they're going to 79 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:14,240 Speaker 3: be open. 80 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:17,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, and having that type of spidy sense right to 81 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 2: understand where the rushers are. There was one play against 82 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:21,880 Speaker 2: the Eagles and I don't remember which edge rusher it was, 83 00:03:21,919 --> 00:03:24,080 Speaker 2: but he came kind of you know, he went around 84 00:03:24,120 --> 00:03:25,679 Speaker 2: the edge, came all the way around and it looked 85 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 2: like he was and a dart roll to his right. 86 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 2: It looked like he was by the thing that got 87 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:32,440 Speaker 2: from behind and maybe stripped. But somehow dart senses him, 88 00:03:32,440 --> 00:03:34,119 Speaker 2: steps up in the pocket, gets back to his left 89 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 2: and avoids it. Brian, is that something that almost can't 90 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:39,680 Speaker 2: be taught and something a quarterback has an innate feel 91 00:03:39,720 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 2: for just understanding their physical presence in the pocket versus 92 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 2: where the defenders are. 93 00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:47,920 Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely. I think it's something that you develop over 94 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:50,840 Speaker 3: time and the fact that he was doing it in college. 95 00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 3: Now the speed is picking up, but he has a 96 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 3: feeling of the pocket. I think that's the biggest thing 97 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 3: with young quarterbacks. You want to feel the pocket and 98 00:03:57,840 --> 00:03:59,320 Speaker 3: not see it right. You don't want to put your 99 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 3: eyes down. The one thing that you've seen from him 100 00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:03,240 Speaker 3: is he's keeping his eyes up and there's a lot 101 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:06,080 Speaker 3: of plays where he's moving around and extending the play 102 00:04:06,720 --> 00:04:08,640 Speaker 3: and a lot of the positive plays come off of that. 103 00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:10,119 Speaker 3: But I think the fact that he keeps his eyes 104 00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:12,440 Speaker 3: up and he's seeing what's around him, and you know 105 00:04:12,480 --> 00:04:14,720 Speaker 3: the touchdown to Wande Robinson, he moves around and he 106 00:04:14,760 --> 00:04:17,360 Speaker 3: finds him, his eyes are up, throws the ball, he 107 00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:19,320 Speaker 3: breaks a tackle, it's a touchdown, And I think that's 108 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:22,560 Speaker 3: what look As he develops, you're gonna want to lean 109 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 3: on those types of plays, but also you want to 110 00:04:24,920 --> 00:04:26,840 Speaker 3: see more of the plays I just talked about where 111 00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:29,080 Speaker 3: he hangs in the pocket, he knows his guy's going 112 00:04:29,160 --> 00:04:31,560 Speaker 3: to be open, take a shot, complete the pass, keep 113 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 3: moving on, dude, I don't know. He's got to be 114 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:36,120 Speaker 3: so sore when he wakes up on Monday mornings with 115 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:38,719 Speaker 3: the day after the game, because playing quarterback, you're gonna 116 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:41,240 Speaker 3: get hit enough as it is. And thankfully, you know 117 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 3: he's a muscular guy. I didn't realize you watch him 118 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:46,520 Speaker 3: out there. I mean, he's he's juking Zach Bond, but 119 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:49,000 Speaker 3: he's also running some of these guys over. Now, you 120 00:04:49,040 --> 00:04:50,919 Speaker 3: want to limit some of those hits obviously as you 121 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:53,680 Speaker 3: go on. But I think that's something is a little 122 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:55,680 Speaker 3: bit of a learning process. And I'm sure day Ball's 123 00:04:55,680 --> 00:04:57,800 Speaker 3: in there saying like, look, I love it, but we 124 00:04:57,880 --> 00:04:59,640 Speaker 3: got to make sure you can make it through the season, 125 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:02,360 Speaker 3: so you don't stop hanging out with Skataboo. I'm sure 126 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:04,479 Speaker 3: at some point we'll see Scataboo throw a ball like 127 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:07,200 Speaker 3: he did in the college level. And you know, day 128 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:09,840 Speaker 3: Ball has a bag of tricks that he can go to. 129 00:05:09,960 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 3: But if you're a Giants fan, you got to be 130 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:16,840 Speaker 3: so excited about this injection of youth at these positions 131 00:05:16,920 --> 00:05:19,159 Speaker 3: and they're winning games. I mean, who would have thought 132 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:23,240 Speaker 3: they're beaten the defending Super Bowl champs on Thursday night 133 00:05:23,279 --> 00:05:25,760 Speaker 3: with the whole country there to watch, And so that 134 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:27,480 Speaker 3: can do a lot for your locker room, a lot 135 00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:28,680 Speaker 3: for your team the. 136 00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:30,120 Speaker 1: End, no question about it. And it's funny. 137 00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:32,719 Speaker 2: I knew he was a good college athlete, right you 138 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 2: can see him move around in college. I'll be honest 139 00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:38,520 Speaker 2: with you, Brian, I did not think his athleticism darts 140 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:41,680 Speaker 2: would play as well as it has at the NFL level. 141 00:05:41,880 --> 00:05:43,680 Speaker 2: I mean, he's one of three quarterbacks that have more 142 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:45,840 Speaker 2: than fifty rushing yards in his first three starts as 143 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 2: a quarterback. You know, the guys are Jalen Hurts and 144 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:51,000 Speaker 2: Lamar Jackson, and I would not put him necessarily in 145 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:53,680 Speaker 2: that category coming out of college, but what he's been 146 00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:56,239 Speaker 2: able to do with his legs has really been impressive. 147 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:57,640 Speaker 1: In you know this, it takes a long. 148 00:05:57,520 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 2: Time for college guys to figure out the art of 149 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:01,280 Speaker 2: playing quarterback, right. You know, reen defense is going to 150 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:03,800 Speaker 2: your progressions all that stuff. But you can hide some 151 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:05,760 Speaker 2: of that stuff and still succeed if you have bring 152 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:08,680 Speaker 2: some of the athletic traits and his running has just 153 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:10,880 Speaker 2: it's been a lot more effective than I thought it 154 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:13,159 Speaker 2: was to the level that it has been early in 155 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:14,280 Speaker 2: his NFL career. 156 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:15,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, I would agree with you. I mean the touchdown 157 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:17,839 Speaker 3: run where he jukes that bond and then he pulls 158 00:06:17,880 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 3: away and I'm like, Okay, who's going to catch him? 159 00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:22,839 Speaker 3: And he really built speed and you know, I'm sure 160 00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:25,159 Speaker 3: you know maybe with next gen stats what his top 161 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:27,560 Speaker 3: speed is, but he kind of does play like a 162 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:30,080 Speaker 3: Jalen Hurts type of style of football. And when Jalen 163 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:32,279 Speaker 3: gets out, you're like, okay, and all of a sudden 164 00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:34,120 Speaker 3: he's taken off and they guys can't catch him. He 165 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:36,599 Speaker 3: doesn't look like Lamar, he doesn't look like Jayden, but 166 00:06:36,960 --> 00:06:39,360 Speaker 3: he's he's he's running past people. And that's where I think, 167 00:06:39,720 --> 00:06:41,840 Speaker 3: you know, day Ball is content right now with like 168 00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:44,359 Speaker 3: bringing him along and teaching him how to play quarterback 169 00:06:44,360 --> 00:06:47,760 Speaker 3: while allowing him to use his athleticism to extend the plays, 170 00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:50,560 Speaker 3: make the big plays. And I think you know that 171 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:52,800 Speaker 3: that's why I said you look back to a young 172 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:55,040 Speaker 3: Josh Allen. I remember a game in Minnesota. He's trying 173 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:56,719 Speaker 3: to hurtle guys in the middle of the field and 174 00:06:56,760 --> 00:07:00,440 Speaker 3: taking shots from linebackers and safeties. And now he's gotten 175 00:07:00,440 --> 00:07:02,359 Speaker 3: to the point where he's the MVP of our league 176 00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:04,080 Speaker 3: because he does it when he has to, not because 177 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 3: he's always trying to do it. And so I think 178 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:08,560 Speaker 3: with Jackson Dart, each week he'll learn a little bit more. 179 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:11,720 Speaker 3: He'll understand coverage. I mean, day Ball is basically running 180 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 3: an offensive system that I'm very familiar with that he 181 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:18,400 Speaker 3: brought from New England, has taken Alabama. It's it's molded adapted, 182 00:07:18,840 --> 00:07:21,160 Speaker 3: and I think the one thing I know about that 183 00:07:21,200 --> 00:07:23,920 Speaker 3: system is you need a guy who's smart at quarterback. 184 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:26,840 Speaker 3: And so he's directing the line where the mic point 185 00:07:26,920 --> 00:07:29,640 Speaker 3: is and he'll continue to grow in that too. And 186 00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:32,200 Speaker 3: and by all accounts, and I'm sure you've seen it 187 00:07:32,240 --> 00:07:35,520 Speaker 3: because we all watched the Gruden quarterback camp, I thought 188 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:38,080 Speaker 3: Jackson Dart was very well prepared when he did that. Now, 189 00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:40,160 Speaker 3: I know Gruden got on him for the clapping of 190 00:07:40,200 --> 00:07:42,520 Speaker 3: the cadence, but his cadence sounded pretty good out there 191 00:07:42,560 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 3: on Thursday night. And so he's coming along. And I 192 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:47,760 Speaker 3: believe in in Dayball. And you know, Mike Kafka is 193 00:07:47,760 --> 00:07:49,880 Speaker 3: a guy I've known for a long time, played against 194 00:07:49,880 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 3: each other in the Big Ten, came across each other 195 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 3: during our careers. A very smart guy, has a little 196 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:57,400 Speaker 3: bit of that Kansas City influence. So you got the 197 00:07:57,480 --> 00:08:01,120 Speaker 3: right guys in place, and now you've in interjected this 198 00:08:01,480 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 3: energy into into the team. I mean, I'm seeing mister 199 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:07,560 Speaker 3: Moraw talking about you know, this is better than any 200 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:10,480 Speaker 3: type of treatment I could get for cancers, beating the Eagles, 201 00:08:10,520 --> 00:08:12,520 Speaker 3: and so it just goes to show you that can 202 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:14,680 Speaker 3: go a long way in an NFL. In an NFL 203 00:08:14,680 --> 00:08:16,920 Speaker 3: locker room, guys start to believe. I'm we're seeing it 204 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:19,920 Speaker 3: up here in New England with Drake Manny. He's taken 205 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:23,280 Speaker 3: four years of development in a leap in just three 206 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 3: hundred and sixty five days. A lot of it has 207 00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:27,680 Speaker 3: to do with Josh McDaniels being back, and you know, 208 00:08:27,800 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 3: no one closer than with Josh than Brian Daball. So 209 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:33,040 Speaker 3: they have the right philosophies and now it's just about 210 00:08:33,040 --> 00:08:34,160 Speaker 3: going out and executing it. 211 00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:36,720 Speaker 1: Howd up get in here? If you're lined up here, 212 00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:39,520 Speaker 1: you gotta go over the middle with at the score great, 213 00:08:40,040 --> 00:08:42,760 Speaker 1: how do we make that happen? I don't know, but 214 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 1: citizen does. 215 00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:48,000 Speaker 3: It makes sense of your money with citizens official Bank 216 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:49,040 Speaker 3: of Eli Manning. 217 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:52,800 Speaker 2: You mentioned the offensive system, how does and surprisingly both 218 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:54,480 Speaker 2: of you and Dave's had two stints of knowing when 219 00:08:54,520 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 2: you missed each other both times by about one year. 220 00:08:56,960 --> 00:09:00,720 Speaker 2: But what is it about that system and how it 221 00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:03,559 Speaker 2: can work with jackson dart skills, and how it can 222 00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:05,360 Speaker 2: you can lean into some of the things you have 223 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,240 Speaker 2: in it to help develop a young quarterback, And how 224 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:10,079 Speaker 2: do you go about maybe giving him a little bit 225 00:09:10,120 --> 00:09:12,680 Speaker 2: more every week and just how you think he's going 226 00:09:12,760 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 2: to grow in that system. 227 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:15,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think from what I've seen, you know, Daves 228 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:19,040 Speaker 3: is keeping it pretty simple as far as the route concepts. 229 00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:20,600 Speaker 3: I don't see a ton of alerts, but I know 230 00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:24,400 Speaker 3: that's part of it. You see it from time to time. Ultimately, 231 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:27,040 Speaker 3: you want to put what's on the guy's plate, what 232 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:30,120 Speaker 3: he can handle, and so right now, I think Dave 233 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:32,120 Speaker 3: Ball is like, look, let's keep it simple. We'll run 234 00:09:32,160 --> 00:09:34,120 Speaker 3: our core concepts. If it's not there. We have a 235 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:36,200 Speaker 3: guy who can extend the play and make plays with 236 00:09:36,240 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 3: his legs or by scrambling and throwing the football. And 237 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:41,319 Speaker 3: I think each week the more comfortable he gets, you 238 00:09:41,360 --> 00:09:42,760 Speaker 3: add a little bit more, and you add a little 239 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:45,040 Speaker 3: bit more. But the way I look, I played in 240 00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:47,960 Speaker 3: every offensive system. There is the one way I would 241 00:09:47,960 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 3: describe this offense you know that derives from New England, 242 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:54,959 Speaker 3: is it really gives the power to the players and 243 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:57,560 Speaker 3: ultimately to the quarterback to get in and out of 244 00:09:57,559 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 3: good plays, to see what the defenses do and make 245 00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:03,360 Speaker 3: those adjustments out on the field. Whereas you know other systems, 246 00:10:03,400 --> 00:10:06,560 Speaker 3: maybe like the West Coast, it's kind of like, hey, 247 00:10:06,800 --> 00:10:08,600 Speaker 3: I'm going to game plan really well and you just 248 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:11,400 Speaker 3: go out and execute the plan and if something bad happens, 249 00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:14,840 Speaker 3: like you know, they got us well in this system 250 00:10:14,960 --> 00:10:18,520 Speaker 3: that day Ball and Josh McDaniels, the system that they run. 251 00:10:18,559 --> 00:10:20,640 Speaker 3: It's like, if you see a bad look, let's not 252 00:10:20,840 --> 00:10:23,240 Speaker 3: just run a bad play because they got us. Let's 253 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:24,520 Speaker 3: see if we can get in and out of it 254 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:26,520 Speaker 3: and get to the right play. And I think you'll 255 00:10:26,520 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 3: see that more and more as he becomes comfortable with 256 00:10:29,200 --> 00:10:32,160 Speaker 3: Dart and knows what he feels comfortable out there executing 257 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:36,160 Speaker 3: on the field. But it is I mean, look, offenses 258 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:38,560 Speaker 3: are like family trees and everybody has their own branch 259 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:41,120 Speaker 3: and so I think the cool thing about day Ball 260 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:44,120 Speaker 3: and his experiences. He goes down to Alabama and coaches 261 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:45,920 Speaker 3: in the collegiate level for a little bit, and there's 262 00:10:46,280 --> 00:10:48,720 Speaker 3: the zone read and the run game and the RPO, 263 00:10:48,840 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 3: and then he takes it to Buffalo and now becomes 264 00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:53,960 Speaker 3: the head coach in New York. And look, I don't 265 00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:55,800 Speaker 3: know how you guys feel about it, but Danny Dimes 266 00:10:55,840 --> 00:10:59,200 Speaker 3: looks pretty good over there in Indie and day Ball's 267 00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:02,280 Speaker 3: first year, Daniel Jones looked like a really good player. 268 00:11:02,320 --> 00:11:04,480 Speaker 3: He dealt with some injuries, could really not get back. 269 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:07,400 Speaker 3: But I think Dave Ball knows how to utilize a 270 00:11:07,480 --> 00:11:10,280 Speaker 3: guy with Jackson Dart's skill type. The guy can run. 271 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:12,959 Speaker 3: You can call some design runs for him. Now, I 272 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:14,560 Speaker 3: don't think you want to be doing ten a game. 273 00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:15,560 Speaker 1: You want to let him. 274 00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:18,560 Speaker 3: Play quarterback, but as of right now, you gotta do 275 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:21,280 Speaker 3: what you gotta do whin the football games. So it's 276 00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:24,520 Speaker 3: a good mix. And I think the more Jackson Dark 277 00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:27,960 Speaker 3: gets comfortable of playing quarterback, you'll see him excel at 278 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:28,720 Speaker 3: that role too. 279 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 2: How sustainable Brian is kind of this way that Jackson's playing, 280 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:34,000 Speaker 2: the way I've kind of called him as a playmaker 281 00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:36,520 Speaker 2: where he's not quite playing quarterback yet. 282 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:38,120 Speaker 1: But he's just making plays out there. 283 00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:41,640 Speaker 2: How long can this work or will we eventually see 284 00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 2: a diminishing return on this style? 285 00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:44,360 Speaker 1: Yeah? 286 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:46,760 Speaker 3: I think first of all, the diminishing return. We've seen 287 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:48,560 Speaker 3: a lot of young quarterbacks get hurt this year, right 288 00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:52,360 Speaker 3: JJ McCarthy Jayden Daniels like, how long is it sustainable? 289 00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:54,840 Speaker 3: These guys are are bigger and faster than anything that 290 00:11:54,880 --> 00:11:57,640 Speaker 3: they've experienced in their collegiate career. You're gonna get You're 291 00:11:57,679 --> 00:12:00,839 Speaker 3: gonna take some hits, and so on. I would say 292 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:05,400 Speaker 3: the health issue would be a sustainable question that you're 293 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:08,559 Speaker 3: going to have. And then ultimately teams are going to say, Okay, 294 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:11,480 Speaker 3: what we have to do with this guy is have 295 00:12:11,559 --> 00:12:14,120 Speaker 3: a disciplined rush and don't let him get outside the pocket. 296 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 3: So you're gonna find and maybe it's the Denver Broncos 297 00:12:16,800 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 3: this week who say, look, we all know we want 298 00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:22,600 Speaker 3: to get sacks, but if we get out of our 299 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:25,679 Speaker 3: rush lanes, that's the one chance that Dart's going to 300 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:28,960 Speaker 3: turn into a playmaker. Let's let's just rush, keep him 301 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:31,000 Speaker 3: in the pocket, and let's see if he can play quarterback. 302 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:33,439 Speaker 3: I think that's what good defensive coaches are going to 303 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:35,560 Speaker 3: look at the film and say, the only way this 304 00:12:35,679 --> 00:12:37,640 Speaker 3: guy is going to beat us right now is if 305 00:12:37,679 --> 00:12:40,160 Speaker 3: we give him the access to get outside the pocket 306 00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:42,439 Speaker 3: and make some of these scramble plays. And then it'll 307 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:45,720 Speaker 3: come down to, all right, Jackson, how fast can you 308 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:48,760 Speaker 3: progress as a dropback quarterback staying in the pocket and 309 00:12:48,800 --> 00:12:52,280 Speaker 3: picking apart these defenses when they're not letting you escape 310 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:55,200 Speaker 3: the pocket. So you know it's hard. You don't want 311 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:57,080 Speaker 3: to coach it out of them. And he's got to 312 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:59,079 Speaker 3: have a feel. And I'm not going to draw the 313 00:12:59,120 --> 00:13:03,240 Speaker 3: comparisons to Drake, but Drake where he's excelled so much 314 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:05,080 Speaker 3: up here at New England is he has a really 315 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:07,240 Speaker 3: good feel now of when he knows to stay in 316 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:09,120 Speaker 3: the pocket because he has the right matchup to throw 317 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:11,680 Speaker 3: the ball, and also he knows when it's time to 318 00:13:11,720 --> 00:13:13,720 Speaker 3: pull it down. And so I think that's always the 319 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:16,959 Speaker 3: struggle for a young quarterback who is capable of getting 320 00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:20,280 Speaker 3: outside the pocket and making the plays like Jackson, Okay, 321 00:13:20,320 --> 00:13:22,160 Speaker 3: take it when it's there, but don't force it. 322 00:13:22,720 --> 00:13:25,120 Speaker 2: Johnson podcast is brought to you by Citizens, the official 323 00:13:25,160 --> 00:13:27,000 Speaker 2: bank of the Giants intererf your chance to watch a 324 00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:29,760 Speaker 2: Giants ROADI game at MetLife Stadium with a special appearance 325 00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:32,080 Speaker 2: by Eli Manning courtesy of Citizens, the Official bank of 326 00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:34,680 Speaker 2: Eli Manning and the Giants. For details to enter, visit 327 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:37,800 Speaker 2: away game watchparty dot com. By November first, Brian, you 328 00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:40,240 Speaker 2: talked about trying to make him read out the defense. 329 00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:42,840 Speaker 2: I think there was one play last week. I think 330 00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:44,840 Speaker 2: it was a third down. He looks left, little Jordan 331 00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:46,920 Speaker 2: Humphrey's not there in a little stop route. He gets 332 00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:49,000 Speaker 2: back to his right, he hits won the Robinson on 333 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:51,040 Speaker 2: time on a crosser that was kind of the one 334 00:13:51,040 --> 00:13:53,080 Speaker 2: player around, like all right, he got to one side, 335 00:13:53,120 --> 00:13:55,079 Speaker 2: got back to the other on time, made the play. 336 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 2: We haven't seen a ton of that. But how have 337 00:13:57,120 --> 00:13:59,400 Speaker 2: you seen him Jackson in terms of seeing the field. 338 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:01,520 Speaker 2: I've seen some plays where there had been some guys 339 00:14:01,559 --> 00:14:03,400 Speaker 2: open down the field and he hasn't necessarily gotten the 340 00:14:03,440 --> 00:14:04,760 Speaker 2: ball out to him and is run instead. 341 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 1: How have you seen that part of his game developed? 342 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:09,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, I would agree with you. I remember watching that 343 00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:11,719 Speaker 3: throw to Robinson back on the crosser, and I think 344 00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:13,920 Speaker 3: the one thing about this offense too, and I'm sure 345 00:14:13,920 --> 00:14:15,760 Speaker 3: this is how Day ball is treating it. You know, 346 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:19,160 Speaker 3: you have progression reads, you have coverage reads, you have 347 00:14:19,600 --> 00:14:22,520 Speaker 3: man versus zone reads, and so I think with dayball, 348 00:14:22,840 --> 00:14:24,640 Speaker 3: the best thing he's doing is probably keeping it in 349 00:14:24,680 --> 00:14:28,600 Speaker 3: the progression read kind of scheme, because what that tells 350 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:30,640 Speaker 3: you is a right Jackson, we're gonna go left to 351 00:14:30,680 --> 00:14:32,960 Speaker 3: right on this, and the first guy who's open, that's 352 00:14:32,960 --> 00:14:33,840 Speaker 3: who you're throwing the ball to. 353 00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:33,920 Speaker 1: It. 354 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 3: If it's not there, okay, then do what you gotta do. 355 00:14:36,800 --> 00:14:39,720 Speaker 3: And I think you see the aspect of him being 356 00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:41,840 Speaker 3: able to do that. But I think, like you said, 357 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:45,080 Speaker 3: like I said, there's times where you can tell he 358 00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:46,520 Speaker 3: gets a little answer and he's like, all right, let 359 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:49,200 Speaker 3: me get outside. Because the one thing that people have 360 00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:51,920 Speaker 3: to understand as a quarterback, all of us would love 361 00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:53,760 Speaker 3: to get outside the pocket. There's no one in front 362 00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:56,000 Speaker 3: of you, You see everything. You don't have to read 363 00:14:56,280 --> 00:15:00,320 Speaker 3: coverage with ten guys in front of you. So he'll 364 00:15:00,320 --> 00:15:01,960 Speaker 3: get to the point where it's like, okay, it's a 365 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:05,320 Speaker 3: progression read number two. Number one's not there, number two's there, Boom, 366 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 3: give them the ball, Let's keep moving the sticks. Let's 367 00:15:07,640 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 3: not try to turn every play into an extension and 368 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:13,800 Speaker 3: try to make this heroic play. Sometimes you can just 369 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:16,080 Speaker 3: play football and take what they give you. Try to 370 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:18,640 Speaker 3: keep it in I manageable situations. But I did see 371 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:21,320 Speaker 3: I remember on Thursday night game, coming out of halftime, 372 00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:23,000 Speaker 3: they interviewed Dayball. He's like, yeah, you know, we want 373 00:15:23,040 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 3: to just stay on track. Skip third down. Well, that's 374 00:15:25,160 --> 00:15:26,840 Speaker 3: a great way to do it for a young quarterback, 375 00:15:26,880 --> 00:15:29,520 Speaker 3: right hit some of these plays skip their down that way, 376 00:15:29,560 --> 00:15:32,000 Speaker 3: You're not getting into these You know, third down is 377 00:15:32,040 --> 00:15:34,000 Speaker 3: the hardest situation in football until you get down in 378 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:35,560 Speaker 3: the red area because now you've got to be able 379 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:38,400 Speaker 3: to keep the offense out there. If you can skip 380 00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:40,920 Speaker 3: their down by getting a first down on first or 381 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:42,480 Speaker 3: second down, now you don't have to worry about it. 382 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:44,640 Speaker 3: It's kind of behind you. And so I think Dave 383 00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:47,160 Speaker 3: Ball is doing a good job of giving those types 384 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:49,760 Speaker 3: of reads to them. And now if you're a Jackson 385 00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:51,360 Speaker 3: darr you just got to trust it and when you 386 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:53,160 Speaker 3: see the first guy who's open, get it to them 387 00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:54,600 Speaker 3: and keep moving those chains. 388 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:56,160 Speaker 2: All right, And I'm going to get to the matchup 389 00:15:56,160 --> 00:15:58,560 Speaker 2: with the Broncos the second. But I really think the 390 00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:01,280 Speaker 2: run game in Scataboo has really helped Dart here too, 391 00:16:01,360 --> 00:16:01,960 Speaker 2: by the way, So. 392 00:16:01,920 --> 00:16:03,040 Speaker 1: It's the return of Andrew Thomas. 393 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:05,480 Speaker 2: The Giant's offensive line has played better the last three 394 00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 2: weeks that it has in a couple of years. But 395 00:16:08,160 --> 00:16:10,960 Speaker 2: they ran the ball over forty times in Dart's first win. 396 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:13,320 Speaker 2: They ran the ball thirty nine times in darts second 397 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:15,160 Speaker 2: when now some of those are quarterbacks scrambles, I know, 398 00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:18,880 Speaker 2: but when you can run more than you pass for 399 00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:21,160 Speaker 2: a young quarterback, Brian, how does that help a guy 400 00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:24,120 Speaker 2: when not everything is on him and you're in either 401 00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:26,080 Speaker 2: third and reasonable or you're not even getting the third 402 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:26,520 Speaker 2: down at all. 403 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:28,400 Speaker 3: Yeah, any quarterback who says he doesn't want to run 404 00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:30,520 Speaker 3: the balls lying to you, I promise, because running the 405 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:32,800 Speaker 3: football makes it easier on everybody. Makes it easier on 406 00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:35,400 Speaker 3: the offensive line, it makes it easier on the receivers, 407 00:16:35,720 --> 00:16:37,800 Speaker 3: it makes it easier on the quarterback because once the 408 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:40,320 Speaker 3: defense has to commit to stopping the run, it's when 409 00:16:40,360 --> 00:16:42,240 Speaker 3: you're gonna hit some of these play action passes or 410 00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:45,240 Speaker 3: even get some single high coverages where you don't have 411 00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:47,160 Speaker 3: as many people in the back end of the defense. 412 00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:49,680 Speaker 3: And so I think the one thing that they have 413 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:52,440 Speaker 3: going for him, as you mentioned before Cam Scattyby, who 414 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:55,120 Speaker 3: brings a toughness factor where if you're a defense and 415 00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:57,400 Speaker 3: you're coming in to play the Giants, you're like, man, 416 00:16:57,400 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 3: we gotta get in the box to stop this guy. 417 00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:01,480 Speaker 3: He's going to run some of these people over. The 418 00:17:01,480 --> 00:17:03,480 Speaker 3: first guy isn't going to be able to bring them down. 419 00:17:03,760 --> 00:17:06,440 Speaker 3: So when that the defense has to commit more defenders 420 00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 3: to the run game, it makes it simpler when it 421 00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:12,520 Speaker 3: gets to the passing game. And so having Skataboo kind 422 00:17:12,520 --> 00:17:16,879 Speaker 3: of have this coming out party, so to speak. Defenses 423 00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:18,639 Speaker 3: have to honor that. And now that gives you a 424 00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:20,800 Speaker 3: little bit more one on one matchups on the outside. 425 00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 3: And also it allows you to hit some of these 426 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:26,920 Speaker 3: play action passes off of the run and that really 427 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:30,240 Speaker 3: becomes you know, it takes a lot off the quarterbacks played. 428 00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:32,040 Speaker 3: And let's not forget the team that won the Super 429 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:33,760 Speaker 3: Bowl last year ran the ball more than any other 430 00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:37,160 Speaker 3: team in the NFL. And granted they had Saquon and Jalen, 431 00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:39,520 Speaker 3: but you could kind of have your own poor man's 432 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:43,240 Speaker 3: version of Jalen Hurts and Saquon Barkley with Jackson Dart 433 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:46,040 Speaker 3: and Cam Scataboo right, because they're both threats to run 434 00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:49,040 Speaker 3: the football. Now, defenses have to commit, and I know 435 00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:51,240 Speaker 3: the Giants don't have a j Brown and DeVonta Smith 436 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:53,879 Speaker 3: on the outside, but you have some guys that can 437 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:56,600 Speaker 3: make some plays and make it to one on one. 438 00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:59,080 Speaker 3: Look little little Jordan Humphrey as a guy I played with. 439 00:17:59,119 --> 00:18:01,399 Speaker 3: He's a big, tall tar and Jackson threw it up 440 00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:04,080 Speaker 3: to him last week. He boxed the defender out and 441 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:06,879 Speaker 3: he can go get that. So you're gonna have those opportunities. 442 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:09,280 Speaker 3: I think Theo Johnson will be a guy who really 443 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:12,879 Speaker 3: benefits from the run game because knowing this offensive system. 444 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:15,320 Speaker 3: You go back to Gronkowski or even now in New 445 00:18:15,359 --> 00:18:18,760 Speaker 3: England with Hunter Henry, a lot of their production comes 446 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:20,640 Speaker 3: off of the play action game. So I'm sure day Ball, 447 00:18:20,720 --> 00:18:23,359 Speaker 3: especially come in from coaching tight ends in New England, 448 00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:25,360 Speaker 3: is gonna want to be able to use that that 449 00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:27,120 Speaker 3: type of concept for the Giants. 450 00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 1: If you want to know how to manage two minutes 451 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:30,800 Speaker 1: of crunch time football, I'm your Matt. 452 00:18:30,840 --> 00:18:33,120 Speaker 2: But if you're wondering about a long term financial plan, 453 00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:34,720 Speaker 2: you should talk to citizens. 454 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:36,840 Speaker 1: Hey, I can also talk long care. I'd like to 455 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:39,640 Speaker 1: learn about Amolli routine. Yes, I knew I could help 456 00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:43,320 Speaker 1: make sense of your money with citizens, no question about. 457 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:44,640 Speaker 1: All right, let's get to the matchup here. 458 00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:46,760 Speaker 2: And we were talking before we started, Brian, this is 459 00:18:46,760 --> 00:18:49,800 Speaker 2: probably gonna be the best, you know, the toughest test 460 00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:52,560 Speaker 2: that Darts faced. We thought the Eagles last week could 461 00:18:52,600 --> 00:18:54,600 Speaker 2: be really tough with then Gil and cardinis't play Quinny, 462 00:18:54,680 --> 00:18:57,440 Speaker 2: Mitchell coubles out early, and they already had issues at cornerback. 463 00:18:57,440 --> 00:18:58,840 Speaker 2: So it turned out to find your one on one 464 00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:00,440 Speaker 2: matchup and just kind of take it and of it, 465 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:02,399 Speaker 2: which work. You're not gonna be able to do that 466 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:05,800 Speaker 2: against the Broncos this week. The other thing about I 467 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:07,879 Speaker 2: think that's been constant with the teams the Giants that 468 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:10,320 Speaker 2: face the been heavy z own teams, Right Saints, heavy 469 00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:12,960 Speaker 2: z Own team Chargers, heavy z Own team Eagles last week, 470 00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:16,160 Speaker 2: Heavy's Own team Chargers. I mean, the Broncos rather play 471 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:18,760 Speaker 2: a ton of man and they have good corners. And 472 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:21,240 Speaker 2: you mentioned normal league nighbors, the Giants wideouts. You're not 473 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:22,719 Speaker 2: rolling out a bunch of guys that can just one 474 00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:24,560 Speaker 2: one on one matchup. So what do you think this 475 00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:27,240 Speaker 2: matchup looks like for for Dart? How does Dable get 476 00:19:27,320 --> 00:19:29,199 Speaker 2: and CAFTA get him ready for it, and what's the 477 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:32,200 Speaker 2: game plan to try to have success against what's probably 478 00:19:32,200 --> 00:19:33,360 Speaker 2: the best defensive football. 479 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:34,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a toughy. I mean, look what they did 480 00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:38,200 Speaker 3: to the Jets in London. I mean it was as 481 00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:40,240 Speaker 3: an offensive player, I hated watching that game because it 482 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 3: was a defensive Let me get to the one o'clock games, 483 00:19:44,119 --> 00:19:45,040 Speaker 3: because this is brutal. 484 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:46,560 Speaker 1: But you're right. 485 00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 3: I mean, look, they have a very formidable pass rush. 486 00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:52,280 Speaker 3: They can lock you down on the outside, and so 487 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:54,440 Speaker 3: to me, the game plans gotta be you got to 488 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:56,800 Speaker 3: try to run the football, make them commit, and maybe 489 00:19:56,880 --> 00:20:00,280 Speaker 3: use THEEO. Johnson as your matchup because outside that is 490 00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:02,000 Speaker 3: not going to be where you want to go, especially 491 00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:04,439 Speaker 3: in man covers. Now, the one thing that can always 492 00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:07,000 Speaker 3: help against man covers as a quarterback who can run 493 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 3: because they don't always account for him, right if they're 494 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:12,080 Speaker 3: out there covering. So I would look to see, you 495 00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:14,920 Speaker 3: know early on, is there a spy for Jackson darda 496 00:20:14,960 --> 00:20:17,200 Speaker 3: they play a man coverage and instead of that extra 497 00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:19,840 Speaker 3: guy helping in coverage, is he's spying Jackson? So when 498 00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 3: he goes to take off, he goes to to you know, 499 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:24,840 Speaker 3: get after him. So it's going to be the toughest 500 00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:27,879 Speaker 3: task by far. The best thing that the Giants can 501 00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:30,240 Speaker 3: do is establish a running game and not try to 502 00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:32,800 Speaker 3: make it one dimensional, because if you try to get 503 00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:37,119 Speaker 3: into a passing matchup with the Broncos Nick Benito Cooper, 504 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:39,280 Speaker 3: they're going to be pinning their ears back to rush 505 00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:41,600 Speaker 3: and the guys outside are going to lock down your 506 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:44,880 Speaker 3: receivers because Patrick's certains, you know, the best corner of football. 507 00:20:45,240 --> 00:20:47,879 Speaker 3: Like you mentioned, you don't have neighbors. If you have neighbors, 508 00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:50,840 Speaker 3: at least it equalizes a little bit. Now, I think 509 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:53,119 Speaker 3: the game plan has to be let's stay ahead of 510 00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:55,240 Speaker 3: down in distance, Let's run the football, and let's see 511 00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:57,560 Speaker 3: if we can get some explosive plays in the past 512 00:20:57,560 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 3: game off of the play action pass. 513 00:20:59,320 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 2: Now you kind of make this earlier, how teams might 514 00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:03,639 Speaker 2: just start trying to crush the pocket, right, Well, the 515 00:21:03,680 --> 00:21:06,040 Speaker 2: Broncos too outside rushes. They're speed guys, right, they want 516 00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:08,360 Speaker 2: to went outside with Cooper and but you know they're undersize. 517 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:13,399 Speaker 2: Does Dart's ability to run take something away from that 518 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:15,320 Speaker 2: outside pass rush a little bit? Because you don't want 519 00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:17,160 Speaker 2: to get too far outside the pocket and create those 520 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:17,800 Speaker 2: running lanes. 521 00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:18,639 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. 522 00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:20,880 Speaker 3: And that's when you have like these elite pass rushers 523 00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:22,840 Speaker 3: who want to get sacks. How do you coach them 524 00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:25,760 Speaker 3: and say, look, that's great, but if you run by them, 525 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:28,080 Speaker 3: now he gets out here making it easier on him. 526 00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:30,359 Speaker 3: And I remember, you know, all those years in New England, 527 00:21:30,359 --> 00:21:32,320 Speaker 3: we'd sit in those team meetings and we'd be playing 528 00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:35,320 Speaker 3: an elusive quarterback and Bill Belichick, we get up there 529 00:21:35,320 --> 00:21:37,840 Speaker 3: and say, look, I know you guys want to get sacks, 530 00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:41,439 Speaker 3: but this week we have to play team defense. You 531 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:43,359 Speaker 3: have to stay in your rush lanes because if you 532 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,119 Speaker 3: go up the field and the quarterback squirts out to 533 00:21:46,160 --> 00:21:48,399 Speaker 3: the right and we don't have anyone there, it's the 534 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:49,960 Speaker 3: only way he's going to be able to beat us. 535 00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 2: Right. 536 00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:53,040 Speaker 3: So, I think if you're the if you're the Giants, 537 00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 3: you're hoping for these guys to just scream up the 538 00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:57,720 Speaker 3: field and give Darts some of these lanes to go 539 00:21:57,760 --> 00:21:59,760 Speaker 3: out and make a play with his legs. If you're 540 00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:02,200 Speaker 3: the Broncos, youve got to be preaching all week. We 541 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:04,399 Speaker 3: have to keep this guy in the pocket and make 542 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:07,920 Speaker 3: them play quarterback and complete passes against man coverage. It's 543 00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:10,040 Speaker 3: going to be very difficult for him, So see if 544 00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:11,600 Speaker 3: they can be disciplined. 545 00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 2: And do that. Yeah, it's funny you mentioned the spy 546 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:15,320 Speaker 2: that play that you were talking about last week. Zach 547 00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:17,320 Speaker 2: Bond was spying Jackson Dart on that play. That was 548 00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:20,040 Speaker 2: his responsibility and Dart shook him. Anyway, Well, teams have 549 00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:21,919 Speaker 2: to start spying him with a safety like do you 550 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:24,640 Speaker 2: have to change the type of spy you're using if 551 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:27,320 Speaker 2: Dark shows his mobility maybe is too much for the linebackers. 552 00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:29,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's definitely one of those things. You've 553 00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:31,359 Speaker 3: seen it with a lot of guys. You know, Jayden 554 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:33,920 Speaker 3: Daniels gets that treatment a lot. And the one thing 555 00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:36,800 Speaker 3: is when they start to scramble and that spy comes 556 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:39,720 Speaker 3: out of you know, coverage basically like where he's waiting 557 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:42,159 Speaker 3: for him to commit, Now you do open up some 558 00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:45,040 Speaker 3: of the lanes behind him. So look, I wouldn't want 559 00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:46,719 Speaker 3: to be a spy having to treat some of these 560 00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:49,200 Speaker 3: athletic quarterbacks because you're kind of damned if you do. 561 00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:51,200 Speaker 3: Damned if you don't, Like, once he commits to the 562 00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:53,439 Speaker 3: line of scrimmage, you got to go tackle him. But 563 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:55,359 Speaker 3: if he's still behind the line of scrimmage and can 564 00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:57,800 Speaker 3: throw it to now the spot that you vacated. That 565 00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:00,199 Speaker 3: becomes a dilemma, which is why I think, you know, 566 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,520 Speaker 3: this is the type of quarterback the NFL is trending 567 00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:05,320 Speaker 3: to get to. Is a guy like Jackson Dart, a 568 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:09,879 Speaker 3: guy like Josh Josh Allen Drake may justin Herbert Mahomes 569 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 3: because it puts the defense in such a bind. 570 00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:14,119 Speaker 1: All right, let's flip it. 571 00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:16,639 Speaker 2: You know, bon Nix has had a slower start to 572 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:19,400 Speaker 2: his second year than he had to his first. Still 573 00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:21,600 Speaker 2: a lot of short passes, They get the ball out quick, 574 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:23,960 Speaker 2: they move the pocket a lot with him. The Giants 575 00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:25,920 Speaker 2: similar deal, right, they have speed rushers. They want to 576 00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:27,480 Speaker 2: get up the field and rush to pass there. What 577 00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:29,480 Speaker 2: do you think about Nix and how Sean Payton wants 578 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:32,280 Speaker 2: to run that offense worth versus how the Giants are 579 00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:34,560 Speaker 2: trying to get to the quarterback and Shane Bon's defense? 580 00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:36,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, are we talked about the Denver Broncos 581 00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:38,720 Speaker 3: pass rush. I mean, is there a better pass rush 582 00:23:38,720 --> 00:23:40,720 Speaker 3: after them than the New York Giants. These guys get 583 00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:43,280 Speaker 3: after the quarterback and do a tremendous job, but they 584 00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:45,840 Speaker 3: have to be disciplined as well, because bon Knicks very similar. 585 00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:48,760 Speaker 3: He may not run the ball like Jackson Dart with 586 00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:50,919 Speaker 3: the power, but he has the ability to use his 587 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:52,639 Speaker 3: legs and he's going to keep his eyes up and 588 00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:54,240 Speaker 3: try to throw the ball first and then he can run. 589 00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:57,080 Speaker 3: So you have to be disciplined in that pass rush. 590 00:23:57,160 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 3: I love the additions that the Giants made in the 591 00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:02,680 Speaker 3: offseason with a Debo and Javon Holland. I mean, two 592 00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:05,120 Speaker 3: guys that I always respected when I played against him, 593 00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:08,040 Speaker 3: and so you're seeing the defense come along. It's gonna 594 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,560 Speaker 3: be a challenge because they have some big receivers outside 595 00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:12,199 Speaker 3: the tight ends like to be involved. I mean, it's 596 00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:14,240 Speaker 3: a Sean Payton offense. You know what you're gonna get. 597 00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:18,359 Speaker 3: He's gonna have those first fifteen scripted and they're gonna 598 00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:21,320 Speaker 3: be a screen, an outside zone running, inside zone runner. 599 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:23,119 Speaker 3: I mean, he's gonna keep you guessing. So you have 600 00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 3: to stay disciplined and you have to try to make 601 00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:27,800 Speaker 3: bo Nicks beat you with his arm. Don't don't let 602 00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:30,440 Speaker 3: him get outside the pocket. So a very similar game plan, 603 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 3: I would say, if you're the New York Giants defense 604 00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:34,439 Speaker 3: of what the Broncos defense is going to try to 605 00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 3: do to Jackson Dark. 606 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:37,160 Speaker 2: All right, final question you mentioned you know what you're 607 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 2: getting with the with the Sean Payn offense. How does 608 00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:42,000 Speaker 2: a Sean paying offense try to attack? Are they trying 609 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:44,480 Speaker 2: to stretch horizontally vertically? I know he tries to do 610 00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 2: a lot of different things. Is screen games great? If 611 00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:48,800 Speaker 2: you're a defense you're getting ready for Sean Payton. What 612 00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:51,720 Speaker 2: are some of the telltale signs that Giant fans should 613 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:52,639 Speaker 2: get ready for that. 614 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 1: A Sean Payn offense is going to show the Giants defense. 615 00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:58,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, in a very similar fashion to like the Patriots system. 616 00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:00,679 Speaker 3: I would say Sean Payton system is very similar. You're 617 00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:02,760 Speaker 3: going to see a lot of kill kill plays Like 618 00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,200 Speaker 3: we can all see Drew Brees and if we close 619 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:07,119 Speaker 3: our eyes, kill kill. He's trying to get to the 620 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:09,520 Speaker 3: perfect play, right, and he's trying to keep you on 621 00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:11,679 Speaker 3: edge and he's trying to make you defend everything. And 622 00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:14,560 Speaker 3: so you're gonna see a lot of those plays where 623 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:16,520 Speaker 3: it's an outside zone to the left and they come 624 00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:18,600 Speaker 3: back with a half roll and it's a boot play, 625 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:19,959 Speaker 3: and then they go back to a screen and now 626 00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:20,400 Speaker 3: it's a run. 627 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:21,000 Speaker 1: It's a draw. 628 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:23,520 Speaker 3: He's going to try to make you defend every blade 629 00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:26,400 Speaker 3: of grass and the best way at least I can remember, 630 00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:28,960 Speaker 3: you know, when we would go against those offenses. I 631 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:31,600 Speaker 3: could hear Bill in my mind. Look, you just have 632 00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:34,960 Speaker 3: to be disciplined, don't fool for the fakes. Just read 633 00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:37,479 Speaker 3: your keys and respond. And I think the biggest thing, 634 00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 3: like I said before, is that pass rush. Just stay disciplined, 635 00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:42,760 Speaker 3: don't try to get out of your gap because you 636 00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:44,520 Speaker 3: think you have a sack now all of a sudden. 637 00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:46,679 Speaker 3: It gives bo Nix the ability to get outside the 638 00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,199 Speaker 3: pocket and see what's down the field as opposed to 639 00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:51,960 Speaker 3: crushing the pocket, making them let's see if he can 640 00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:54,240 Speaker 3: pick you apart and get down the field, as opposed 641 00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:56,720 Speaker 3: to maybe a big explosive play when he gets outside 642 00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:57,240 Speaker 3: of the pocket. 643 00:25:57,440 --> 00:25:59,480 Speaker 1: You can find Brian Hoyer on Serious XM. Brian. 644 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:01,399 Speaker 2: What else do you going on? Where can the folks 645 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:02,760 Speaker 2: find you? What are you up to in your post 646 00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:03,320 Speaker 2: playing career? 647 00:26:03,480 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 3: Yeah? I got a podcasts up here in New England. 648 00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 3: Not that many Giants fans are going on to tune 649 00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:09,760 Speaker 3: into that, but I do. With David Andrews, he's a 650 00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:12,040 Speaker 3: former center of the Patriots, and we've known each other 651 00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:14,840 Speaker 3: for a long time. Also do a few things around 652 00:26:14,880 --> 00:26:17,479 Speaker 3: the New England Patriots with their local media, but Sirius 653 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:19,520 Speaker 3: XM is the one area you can find me covering 654 00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 3: all things of NFL. The Opening Drive with Solomon Willotts 655 00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 3: on Thursday morning seven to ten. 656 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:27,080 Speaker 2: Hey Giants, get the Patriots, lady he or maybe we 657 00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:28,679 Speaker 2: can get together and do a little preview before that 658 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:29,159 Speaker 2: game right now. 659 00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:30,879 Speaker 3: Well, teams are hot right now. I would love to 660 00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:34,240 Speaker 3: do it, and maybe we're both vying for playoffs spots 661 00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:35,760 Speaker 3: when it comes to that point of the season. So 662 00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:37,000 Speaker 3: looking forward to it. 663 00:26:37,119 --> 00:26:39,400 Speaker 1: Brian, good stuff, appreciate the time, my friend. All right, 664 00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:40,960 Speaker 1: take care Brian Hoy and the Johns. 665 00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:42,920 Speaker 2: Little Podcast brought to you by Citizen's Official. 666 00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:45,119 Speaker 1: Bank of the Giants. We'll see you next time. Everybody,