WEBVTT - William Friedkin Paid Off the MTA to Make 'The French Connection' 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:03.520 This is Alec Baldwin and you're listening to. Here's the thing, 0:00:04.200 --> 0:00:08.360 My chance to talk with artists, policy makers and performers, 0:00:08.400 --> 0:00:12.560 to hear their stories. What inspires their creations, what decisions 0:00:12.640 --> 0:00:18.520 change their careers, what relationships influenced their work? Thank you 0:00:18.640 --> 0:00:22.840 very much. Good evening, Good evening. My guest today is 0:00:22.920 --> 0:00:26.360 film director William Friedkin. I spoke with him at the 0:00:26.400 --> 0:00:29.960 Turner Classic Movies Festival in Hollywood, where we screened his 0:00:30.080 --> 0:00:34.199 picture The French Connection. Film critic Roger Ebert called The 0:00:34.200 --> 0:00:39.640 French Connection quote all surface movement, violence and suspense unquote. 0:00:40.200 --> 0:00:42.800 Many say it has the best chase scene ever between 0:00:42.800 --> 0:00:46.680 a car and an elevated train in Brooklyn. The French 0:00:46.680 --> 0:00:50.519 Connection won five Academy Awards, but Friedkin told me it 0:00:50.640 --> 0:00:53.640 wasn't a smooth ride to the red carpet. This film 0:00:53.680 --> 0:00:58.520 had been turned down by every major studio at least twice. 0:00:59.360 --> 0:01:02.800 And my do sir, a guy named Phil D'Antoni. He 0:01:02.880 --> 0:01:06.840 and I were going to do Dirty Harry with Frank Sinatra, 0:01:07.880 --> 0:01:10.920 and we had prepared that for about six months, and 0:01:10.920 --> 0:01:16.240 then Sinatra pulled out and the project was dead. We 0:01:16.360 --> 0:01:20.920 left and did The French Connection. But We went to 0:01:21.160 --> 0:01:25.200 every studio and they all turned it down. And finally 0:01:25.400 --> 0:01:29.679 Dick Zanek, who ran twentieth Century Fox, called us one 0:01:29.760 --> 0:01:32.040 day and said, you know, I don't know what the 0:01:32.040 --> 0:01:35.040 hell this thing is that you guys are talking about doing. 0:01:35.240 --> 0:01:38.960 The scripts not very good, he said, but maybe if 0:01:39.240 --> 0:01:41.760 I just have a hunch up about it, if you 0:01:41.800 --> 0:01:44.440 can make this thing for a million and a half dollars, 0:01:45.440 --> 0:01:47.680 go ahead. And he said, you better do it right 0:01:47.680 --> 0:01:50.840 away because I'm gonna be kicked out of here in 0:01:50.920 --> 0:01:56.640 about three weeks. And he was now New York. The 0:01:56.880 --> 0:01:58.920 New York that's depicted in this movie in the in 0:01:59.280 --> 0:02:04.480 the early seven these is a steaming, feated cesspool. Obviously, 0:02:04.520 --> 0:02:09.800 it's just so disgusting that there might be a couple 0:02:09.800 --> 0:02:12.280 of blocks in the sixties between Fifth and Park that 0:02:12.360 --> 0:02:14.640 might be cleaner than might have been cleaned up. But 0:02:14.639 --> 0:02:17.240 it was a pretty nasty back then, right. I liked it, 0:02:17.600 --> 0:02:19.120 you know, I thought it was I thought it was 0:02:19.240 --> 0:02:23.519 very cinematic. And I'm from Chicago, and I used to 0:02:23.680 --> 0:02:27.040 ride the subways and the elevated trains all the time, 0:02:27.560 --> 0:02:31.400 and I love the streets. I love the streets. And 0:02:32.400 --> 0:02:37.120 after this film was successful and I had another successful film. 0:02:37.200 --> 0:02:41.160 After that, I moved to California, learned how to play 0:02:41.200 --> 0:02:47.800 tennis and ruined my career. Don't ever if you're a 0:02:47.840 --> 0:02:52.520 young filmmaker, don't ever learn how to play tennis. Forget it. 0:02:53.480 --> 0:02:56.720 And you know you wanna walk the streets the way 0:02:56.760 --> 0:03:00.320 you did. You want to ride the subways, you want 0:03:00.360 --> 0:03:05.239 to see life. And so that's the way I approached 0:03:05.360 --> 0:03:10.120 this film. I came from this world. Did slumming? Did 0:03:10.200 --> 0:03:13.120 they give you your way in terms of the casting. 0:03:13.160 --> 0:03:15.200 What was it like for you casting actors back then 0:03:15.240 --> 0:03:18.760 when you made this film. Well, originally I wanted Jackie 0:03:18.760 --> 0:03:25.880 Gleason and the hell is so funny Jackie Gleason, you know, 0:03:25.919 --> 0:03:29.359 it's one of the greatest actors who ever lived and 0:03:29.520 --> 0:03:33.240 uh he was known as a comedian. But Dick Zanick said, no, 0:03:33.639 --> 0:03:37.560 I will never make another film with Jackie Gleason because 0:03:37.600 --> 0:03:42.840 Gleason had just prior to this, made a film that 0:03:43.000 --> 0:03:46.720 was the biggest disaster in the history of Fox. It 0:03:46.840 --> 0:03:50.520 was a silent movie about a clown called gi Go 0:03:51.560 --> 0:03:55.080 and it was a disaster. So we went through a 0:03:55.120 --> 0:03:58.280 lot of guys and we had um a very short 0:03:58.360 --> 0:04:01.520 time left when we had this at and we had 0:04:01.560 --> 0:04:05.360 a meeting with Gene Hackman, my producer, and I. We 0:04:05.360 --> 0:04:09.240 weren't that impressed. It was one of the dullest meetings 0:04:09.280 --> 0:04:12.800 I've ever had. But we had to start the picture, 0:04:13.680 --> 0:04:18.720 and so we hired Gene. I hired Roy Scheider immediately 0:04:19.680 --> 0:04:23.120 he walked into the room. I had a casting director 0:04:23.240 --> 0:04:26.080 who was not really a casting director. He was a 0:04:26.080 --> 0:04:31.719 critic for The Village Voice and he uh had. His 0:04:31.839 --> 0:04:35.839 name was Bob Wiener, and he had discovered a lot 0:04:35.880 --> 0:04:39.919 of interesting people as a critic. He discovered Whoopie Goldberg 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:43.719 a number of other people. And he brought me Roy Scheider, 0:04:43.760 --> 0:04:47.720 who had not made a film. And Scheider came into 0:04:47.760 --> 0:04:51.440 my office and sat down. He had a resemblance to 0:04:51.800 --> 0:04:55.599 the character he played, whose name is Sonny Grasso. He's 0:04:55.640 --> 0:04:58.919 in the film too. I never auditioned. I've never have 0:04:59.120 --> 0:05:02.320 and never will addition and actor. I think it's embarrassing, 0:05:03.360 --> 0:05:06.640 you know, I think you probably know this early in 0:05:06.680 --> 0:05:09.760 your career. A lot of actors can read but then 0:05:09.920 --> 0:05:13.080 can't act it, or vice versa. So I go on 0:05:13.200 --> 0:05:18.680 instinct and Scheider sat down. I said, so what are 0:05:18.720 --> 0:05:20.760 you doing now, Roy? He said, well, I'm in an 0:05:20.760 --> 0:05:25.720 off Broadway play by Jean Jane and I said, what 0:05:26.000 --> 0:05:28.520 part do you play? He said, I play a cigar 0:05:28.680 --> 0:05:33.320 smoking nun. And I said, it's interesting. Okay, you're hired. 0:05:34.440 --> 0:05:37.919 That was it. He was perfect. He walked in the 0:05:38.040 --> 0:05:43.480 room as he was perfect. You know. Hackman had done Bonnie, 0:05:44.279 --> 0:05:48.200 done Bonnie and Clyde, but uh, you know, he was 0:05:48.279 --> 0:05:52.840 not really a lead. He was a great supporting actor, 0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:55.400 but hadn't played a leading role. And I didn't see 0:05:55.520 --> 0:05:59.200 him as Ed Egan. Let me say right away that 0:05:59.360 --> 0:06:07.400 I believe he became one of the greatest American actors ever. No, absolutely, 0:06:08.320 --> 0:06:12.240 but I didn't have him in mind at all. And 0:06:14.120 --> 0:06:17.520 I had a shorthand with my casting director. I said 0:06:17.560 --> 0:06:21.080 to him, look, let's get that to play the part 0:06:21.080 --> 0:06:23.599 of the French guy. Let's get that guy that was 0:06:23.640 --> 0:06:27.080 in that movie belde Jure, you know, as a Louis 0:06:27.160 --> 0:06:32.040 Bonoel film, wonderful movie, Catherine Di. Let's get the guy. 0:06:32.160 --> 0:06:35.440 You know, he had a kind of a beard, um 0:06:35.920 --> 0:06:38.960 two or three day growth of beard. And he said, 0:06:39.000 --> 0:06:44.080 you mean, uh uh, I forget the name of that 0:06:44.240 --> 0:06:48.440 Pierre something. I said, no, not that guy, the other guy. 0:06:48.680 --> 0:06:52.680 The So he went out and he hired this guy 0:06:53.320 --> 0:06:58.320 and he said, okay, the guy's name is Fernando Ray. 0:06:58.520 --> 0:07:01.440 I said, we'll hire him. So I went to the airport, 0:07:01.680 --> 0:07:05.960 Kennedy Airport, met his plane and uh, in those days, 0:07:06.000 --> 0:07:11.680 you could go right to the gate, and I didn't 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:16.000 see the guys looking for I got paged. I went 0:07:16.040 --> 0:07:20.840 to the desk and there's this guy and it's not 0:07:21.400 --> 0:07:26.320 the guy from Bell Dejure. It was not at all 0:07:26.440 --> 0:07:29.720 the guy from Bel Dejure. But his name was Fernando Ray. 0:07:30.560 --> 0:07:33.960 So I meet this Guy's got this little goatee and 0:07:34.000 --> 0:07:39.600 he's very sophisticated Spanish. He looked like a Spanish grande. 0:07:39.680 --> 0:07:42.200 And the guy who was playing was had been a 0:07:42.200 --> 0:07:47.480 longshoreman and a Corsican, you know, a real rough hewn guy. 0:07:47.520 --> 0:07:52.080 So I'm driving this guy to his hotel and uh, 0:07:52.160 --> 0:07:56.400 I said, you know you you can't have this uh 0:07:56.560 --> 0:08:00.920 goatee for this case. Oh, I could never share my goatee. 0:08:02.080 --> 0:08:04.480 I said, why not? He said, Oh, I have sores 0:08:04.560 --> 0:08:07.640 all over my face. You would never want to see 0:08:08.040 --> 0:08:10.240 the sword. He said. By the way, you know, I'm 0:08:10.280 --> 0:08:14.040 not French, I'm Spanish, but I can learn enough French. 0:08:14.920 --> 0:08:19.080 I said, you weren't in Belle de Jure. No, no, 0:08:19.120 --> 0:08:23.160 I wasn't in bell Dejure. I've done other films with 0:08:23.520 --> 0:08:27.200 Louis spoonwell, but not Belle de Jure. So I get 0:08:27.240 --> 0:08:31.440 him into his hotel and I called my casting director 0:08:31.480 --> 0:08:36.319 and producer. I said, you stupid asshole, I said, this 0:08:36.440 --> 0:08:40.120 is not the guy. This is the wrong guy. Thank 0:08:40.160 --> 0:08:44.120 you very much. This is the wrong guy. And so 0:08:44.160 --> 0:08:46.280 he's what are you talking about? I said, this isn't 0:08:46.280 --> 0:08:49.800 the guy from Belle de Jure. So he looked it 0:08:49.880 --> 0:08:53.480 up and indeed the guy we wanted was named Francisco Ribal. 0:08:54.559 --> 0:08:56.600 So he said, well, what do you want me to do. 0:08:56.720 --> 0:09:00.960 I said, fire this guy and hire friend Cisco Ribal. 0:09:02.040 --> 0:09:04.280 I went back in the office. By the time I 0:09:04.320 --> 0:09:10.599 got there, they found that, uh, Francisco Ribal was not available, 0:09:11.120 --> 0:09:14.600 did not speak a word of English, so we got 0:09:14.760 --> 0:09:19.080 stuck with Fernando Ray. I would like to tell you 0:09:19.720 --> 0:09:25.640 that it was all my genius, but I didn't. I 0:09:25.679 --> 0:09:28.640 had nothing to do with casting the two leads in 0:09:28.679 --> 0:09:37.600 this picture. Now here it was. It was really the 0:09:37.640 --> 0:09:40.880 gift of the movie God. And I think you'll bear 0:09:40.920 --> 0:09:43.600 this out. There is a movie God. You know that 0:09:43.800 --> 0:09:47.240 sometimes smiles upon you an other times I wasna. I 0:09:47.240 --> 0:09:50.160 did the movie Hunt for Red October and they offered 0:09:50.160 --> 0:09:52.400 it to Sean Connery and he was sick. He had 0:09:52.440 --> 0:09:55.400 throat cancer and orient something seriously wrong with him, and 0:09:55.440 --> 0:09:58.080 they said he can't do the film. So they cast 0:09:58.559 --> 0:10:02.000 uh Klaus Maria and Dour in the lead role. And 0:10:02.400 --> 0:10:04.040 he was casting the lead and they called me up 0:10:04.080 --> 0:10:07.160 and they said we're gonna get Las Maria. Brand said okay, 0:10:07.200 --> 0:10:09.520 and then Connery calls back, like several weeks later, he's 0:10:09.520 --> 0:10:12.160 had treatments and he's on the mend and he comes 0:10:12.160 --> 0:10:14.200 back and said, I think I can do the film. 0:10:14.240 --> 0:10:16.040 So they called Classma Brandon when they say, you know, 0:10:16.120 --> 0:10:18.480 what were the dates you said you could work? And BRANDI, 0:10:18.679 --> 0:10:21.600 I am directing an opera and I am appearing in 0:10:21.640 --> 0:10:23.840 a film in the early window, I can shoot the 0:10:23.880 --> 0:10:26.320 film as these six weeks. I have to shoot the 0:10:26.360 --> 0:10:29.240 film these six weeks. And they were like, oh, that's 0:10:29.280 --> 0:10:33.400 too bad. We're so sorry. We'd get the schedule. We 0:10:33.480 --> 0:10:37.040 can't do it during those six weeks. Were so very sorry, Klaus. 0:10:37.360 --> 0:10:40.240 And he's gone, and Sean showed up and there you go. 0:10:41.000 --> 0:10:43.839 So the casting of films can sometimes be very very 0:10:43.920 --> 0:10:46.760 and sometimes it's very strange. It was in this picture. 0:10:47.080 --> 0:10:51.520 I can't think of anyone else in that part. Now, Um, 0:10:51.559 --> 0:10:55.960 he was just great and an absolutely wonderful actor. He 0:10:56.080 --> 0:10:58.760 told me how he got his start in film. He 0:10:58.840 --> 0:11:02.800 was actually discover Herd by Louise bun Well. Um. Bun 0:11:02.800 --> 0:11:08.360 Well's producer brought Bunwell to see some movie with another actor. 0:11:08.480 --> 0:11:11.920 He wanted to look at another actor in that film. 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:16.040 And uh, after the movie, his producer said, well, what 0:11:16.080 --> 0:11:17.920 did you think? And he said, oh, I didn't like 0:11:18.080 --> 0:11:21.720 that actor. But the guy who plays the corpse, the 0:11:21.880 --> 0:11:26.080 dead guy, which is was Fernando Ray. He had no lines. 0:11:26.120 --> 0:11:29.840 He was laying in a coffin, and boon Well hired him. Now, 0:11:29.880 --> 0:11:32.200 I wrote this down. I have it on a piece 0:11:32.200 --> 0:11:33.920 of paper, but I may have left it in my seat. 0:11:34.200 --> 0:11:35.959 But off the top of my head, I'm struggling. Who 0:11:36.080 --> 0:11:38.520 edited this film? Who cut this film for you? A 0:11:38.600 --> 0:11:42.520 guy called Jerry Greenberg? Okay, and what was that experience? Like, yeah, 0:11:42.559 --> 0:11:48.800 let's hear it for the editing in this film? Who? Um? 0:11:48.920 --> 0:11:52.640 Jerry Greenberg edited The Boys in the Band with a 0:11:52.720 --> 0:11:56.160 man named Carl Lerner who was a very distinguished New 0:11:56.240 --> 0:12:01.920 York film editor, and Jerry was his assistant. And uh, 0:12:01.960 --> 0:12:04.680 when it came time to do this, Carl Lerner wasn't available, 0:12:04.720 --> 0:12:07.080 so I asked Jerry to do. What was that experience 0:12:07.120 --> 0:12:09.000 like for you? And him? Did it? Was he responsible 0:12:09.040 --> 0:12:10.760 for most of the cuts? Who do you get heavily 0:12:10.800 --> 0:12:14.120 involved without your song? I I work on every single 0:12:14.160 --> 0:12:18.120 aspect of editing. That's where the film is made. You know. 0:12:18.360 --> 0:12:21.600 To me, what you shoot is just raw material for 0:12:21.679 --> 0:12:25.160 the cutting room. The the when I first made films 0:12:25.160 --> 0:12:28.040 in New York, we would, uh, we'd come somewhere and 0:12:28.360 --> 0:12:30.320 you know, I think if my memory for years ago, 0:12:30.360 --> 0:12:33.240 as we'd stand inside of building and someone would say, man, 0:12:33.280 --> 0:12:35.240 this is a great lobby, and I think this is great, 0:12:35.280 --> 0:12:37.160 but you know, we can't kind of deal with them. 0:12:37.160 --> 0:12:40.040 This location is too expensive. And someone would make a 0:12:40.080 --> 0:12:41.760 joke and they'd say, well, we can come in here 0:12:41.760 --> 0:12:44.559 and do it Paul Morrissey style, you know. And when 0:12:44.559 --> 0:12:46.600 I was younger in the business, I turnus, I go, 0:12:46.800 --> 0:12:49.600 what does he mean, what's Paul Morrissey style? He said 0:12:49.600 --> 0:12:52.800 that means we run into the building without permits and 0:12:52.840 --> 0:12:54.640 we just start shooting till they kick us out. We 0:12:54.679 --> 0:12:56.679 kind of we go in, we stage it, and we 0:12:56.720 --> 0:12:58.440 go in. We squeeze off a couple of quick masters 0:12:58.480 --> 0:13:00.559 and some shots, and then we run out before the 0:13:00.600 --> 0:13:02.280 cops come. And I was like, wow, shoot up, miss 0:13:02.360 --> 0:13:05.200 people do that? I must say this film. Did you 0:13:05.200 --> 0:13:07.160 have permits for everything you did? For this? We didn't 0:13:07.160 --> 0:13:13.440 have a permit for for nothing except one thing. We 0:13:13.480 --> 0:13:16.120 had no permits to shoot in the streets or any 0:13:16.160 --> 0:13:18.360 of that. We just went out. But I had some 0:13:18.400 --> 0:13:21.520 actual cops with me who had badges and stuff, off 0:13:21.600 --> 0:13:25.440 duty cops and the two original French Connection cops. But 0:13:25.600 --> 0:13:28.520 I thought my producer and I thought, well, you know what, 0:13:28.760 --> 0:13:32.520 we better get permission from the subway to shoot on 0:13:32.600 --> 0:13:37.000 an elevated train. So so we went to see this guy. 0:13:37.760 --> 0:13:41.480 First of all, I asked him he was the head 0:13:41.679 --> 0:13:48.599 of the transit authority. He uh, it wasn't the CEO 0:13:48.800 --> 0:13:52.080 or anything like that, but he ran everything. We got 0:13:52.080 --> 0:13:54.559 an appointment with him, and the first thing I had 0:13:54.600 --> 0:13:57.640 to ask him was how fast can one of these 0:13:57.679 --> 0:14:00.840 trains go? Which I didn't know. I said, if a 0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:04.800 train could go at top speed at i'll say a 0:14:04.880 --> 0:14:09.360 hundred miles an hour. This chase idea would not work 0:14:09.880 --> 0:14:13.760 because the car would not be able to catch the train. 0:14:14.360 --> 0:14:17.360 And he said, well, the fastest speed that one of 0:14:17.400 --> 0:14:19.840 these trains goes as fifty miles an hour. So I 0:14:19.960 --> 0:14:24.200 the great, We've got a chase scene here. He said, 0:14:24.200 --> 0:14:26.840 what do you mean great? He said, the way you've 0:14:26.920 --> 0:14:30.480 described what you want to do. He said, if I 0:14:30.520 --> 0:14:33.640 gave you permission to do this, I would be fired. 0:14:34.240 --> 0:14:37.840 He said, we have never had a train crash, We've 0:14:37.920 --> 0:14:42.120 never had a guy hijack a train. He said, it's 0:14:42.240 --> 0:14:46.840 just you know, it really never has happened, and it 0:14:46.840 --> 0:14:51.600 would be extraordinarily difficult for me to approve anything approaching 0:14:51.640 --> 0:14:55.960 what you've just told me. So we thanked him, and 0:14:56.120 --> 0:14:59.520 I figured, well I'll steal this thing, and we started 0:14:59.760 --> 0:15:01.920 on a way out. He said, wait a minute, were 0:15:01.920 --> 0:15:06.480 you going? And my producer said, you just told us 0:15:07.160 --> 0:15:13.360 it would be extraordinarily difficult. He said, did I say impossible? No. 0:15:14.440 --> 0:15:18.560 My producer, who is a Sicilian, said to him how much? 0:15:20.680 --> 0:15:25.640 He said, New York He said forty thousand dollars and 0:15:25.720 --> 0:15:32.280 a one way ticket to Jamaica. And uh, I remember saying, well, 0:15:32.320 --> 0:15:35.720 why a one way ticket? Why don't you just go 0:15:35.840 --> 0:15:37.840 down have a nice face, he said, because if I 0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:42.400 give you permission, I will get fired and we'll we'll 0:15:42.440 --> 0:15:45.160 have to go down there and live live out my life. 0:15:45.280 --> 0:15:49.560 And that's what happened. Well, we gave him forty grand 0:15:49.600 --> 0:15:53.600 which was a huge percentage of the budget, and he 0:15:54.320 --> 0:15:59.560 lived happily ever after in Jamaica. There was no chase 0:15:59.640 --> 0:16:03.080 scene in the original script, so Friedkin and its producer 0:16:03.080 --> 0:16:07.200 Phil D'Antoni added one they were determined to outdo the 0:16:07.280 --> 0:16:10.640 chase scene in Bullet, the Steve McQueen film released a 0:16:10.680 --> 0:16:14.080 few years earlier. Take a listen to the Here's the 0:16:14.080 --> 0:16:17.600 Thing Archives, Well you can hear Turner Classic Movies host 0:16:17.720 --> 0:16:22.400 Robert Osborne talk about his night with Lucille Ball. Where 0:16:22.440 --> 0:16:25.360 was the house on Roxbury right next door to Jack 0:16:25.440 --> 0:16:30.080 Benning exactly and just down the street from Ira gersh 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:33.080 one and around the corner front celebrity back with me. 0:16:33.320 --> 0:16:38.040 You take a listen, and Here's the Thing Dot Org. 0:16:40.080 --> 0:16:43.200 This is Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the Thing. 0:16:43.880 --> 0:16:48.400 When The Exorcist came out in it ushered in a 0:16:48.480 --> 0:16:52.840 new age of horror cinema. Audience reaction to the film 0:16:52.920 --> 0:16:57.040 was so strong that theater ushers carried smelling salts to 0:16:57.160 --> 0:17:01.640 revive those who had fainted. My guest, William Friedkin directed 0:17:01.680 --> 0:17:06.320 the movie. Warner Brothers did not want me for The Exorcist. 0:17:06.840 --> 0:17:14.360 Warner Brothers UH wanted for The Exorcist either Stanley Kubrick, 0:17:14.840 --> 0:17:20.880 Arthur Penn, or Um who else? Arthur Pens, Stanley, Mike 0:17:20.960 --> 0:17:25.439 Nichols and Arthur Penn turned it down. He said he 0:17:25.440 --> 0:17:28.399 didn't want to do any more violence on film he 0:17:28.440 --> 0:17:32.639 had done Bonnie and Clyde. And Mike Nichols said, you 0:17:32.720 --> 0:17:35.640 will never be able to get a twelve year old 0:17:35.680 --> 0:17:39.679 girl to carry this film on her back and do 0:17:39.800 --> 0:17:45.000 the kind of things that are required. And Kubrick said, look, 0:17:45.080 --> 0:17:50.040 I only UH direct the films that I find and 0:17:50.119 --> 0:17:53.600 prepare myself. So all three of them turned it down, 0:17:54.600 --> 0:18:00.000 and the guy who wrote the novel in the screen 0:18:00.119 --> 0:18:05.119 play wanted me. And finally I was like the last 0:18:05.200 --> 0:18:08.760 man standing, and I had just won the Academy Award. 0:18:09.080 --> 0:18:11.239 That's how I got the exerci Now the same as 0:18:11.280 --> 0:18:13.520 with with French Connection, as with I mean, you do 0:18:13.600 --> 0:18:16.000 these two films back to back, French Connection and The 0:18:16.040 --> 0:18:20.520 Exorcist to classic films. Um what's it like in terms 0:18:20.520 --> 0:18:22.760 of you directing actors? Are you very Do you just 0:18:22.880 --> 0:18:24.960 hire them and you bring them in to do what 0:18:25.000 --> 0:18:26.720 you know they're gonna do, or do you have some 0:18:26.800 --> 0:18:28.880 kind of input with what they're like. Let me tell 0:18:28.920 --> 0:18:31.440 you how I work on a film. I I would 0:18:31.480 --> 0:18:33.679 not work this way on a play, And I direct 0:18:33.720 --> 0:18:36.400 a lot of operas, and I don't work this way 0:18:36.480 --> 0:18:39.639 on an opera. But with a film, the films that 0:18:39.760 --> 0:18:44.600 I've made, I'm more interested in spontaneity than anything else. 0:18:45.119 --> 0:18:47.920 The stuff that I do, the scripts that I've done, 0:18:48.080 --> 0:18:53.959 is not Shakespeare, you know. It's mostly street dialect, especially 0:18:54.200 --> 0:18:58.760 the French connection. So I want spontaneity, so I don't rehearse. 0:18:59.840 --> 0:19:03.080 I would talk to the actors and find the things 0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:07.840 that move them, either that caused them to laugh or 0:19:08.000 --> 0:19:13.040 cry or be frightened or whatever, and I would use 0:19:13.160 --> 0:19:16.639 those things from time to time in the making of 0:19:16.680 --> 0:19:22.600 the film to suggest, whenever it was necessary, some emotion. 0:19:23.200 --> 0:19:26.919 But I would never tell an actor really how to 0:19:27.040 --> 0:19:30.200 do it. The thing I look for more than anything 0:19:30.240 --> 0:19:34.480 else in an actor is intelligence. The actor's ability to 0:19:34.640 --> 0:19:39.800 perceive what the story is about and a way to 0:19:40.000 --> 0:19:42.920 get into it and you can find that out just 0:19:42.960 --> 0:19:46.520 by talking to an actor, you know, Roy Scheider. When 0:19:46.560 --> 0:19:48.359 I cast and he said, don't you want me to 0:19:48.600 --> 0:19:51.200 read for this part? I said, there's nothing to read. 0:19:51.560 --> 0:19:55.680 The guy goes, uh, get your hands up, Get what 0:19:55.680 --> 0:19:58.560 what is that? Who wants to listen to that? And 0:19:58.600 --> 0:20:03.200 a and a goddamn inference room? You know? Uh, He's 0:20:03.200 --> 0:20:07.320 so No, there's nothing to read. It wouldn't the Academy 0:20:07.359 --> 0:20:10.680 Award for Screenplay too exactly. But when you come, when 0:20:10.720 --> 0:20:13.760 you come into the experience of doing I'm only mentioning 0:20:13.760 --> 0:20:17.160 this because of it's because you're coming from French connection 0:20:17.160 --> 0:20:19.520 and winning the Oscar and having all the success, and 0:20:19.600 --> 0:20:23.520 you come into um the Exorcist. Was Jason Miller your 0:20:23.560 --> 0:20:25.560 first choice? It wasn't the same thing again where a 0:20:25.560 --> 0:20:27.879 whole lot of actors turned down the parts of the content. 0:20:28.200 --> 0:20:31.479 Once again, it was the movie God we had cast 0:20:32.320 --> 0:20:36.480 another first of all this for The Exorcist. The studio 0:20:36.600 --> 0:20:41.800 wanted either Audrey Hepburn, Jane Fonda, or Anne Bancroft, and 0:20:41.840 --> 0:20:45.600 I thought, wonderful, you know this is great. After they 0:20:45.680 --> 0:20:49.440 hired me, so they offered the part to Audrey Hepburn, 0:20:49.840 --> 0:20:53.320 and she was married to an Italian doctor living in Italy. 0:20:54.200 --> 0:20:57.520 She read the script and she called me and said, 0:20:58.000 --> 0:21:01.359 you know, I this is very interesting. It's different for me, 0:21:01.400 --> 0:21:03.320 but I'd love to do it, but you have to 0:21:03.400 --> 0:21:07.359 come to Italy to film it. And I said, I'm 0:21:07.400 --> 0:21:11.240 not gonna go to Italy. I don't speak Italian and 0:21:11.560 --> 0:21:14.600 I wouldn't be able to communicate directly with the crew. 0:21:14.880 --> 0:21:18.480 We'd have to bring every actor over to Italy because 0:21:18.720 --> 0:21:24.280 you know it's set in Georgetown. And I said, miss Hepburn, 0:21:24.760 --> 0:21:28.040 wouldn't you just come over for a little while and 0:21:28.119 --> 0:21:32.320 do this. No, so she was out. We then went 0:21:32.359 --> 0:21:36.640 to Anne Bancroft, who said, I think this is terrific. 0:21:37.000 --> 0:21:38.600 So I love to do this, but I have to 0:21:38.640 --> 0:21:43.639 tell you I'm in my first month of pregnancy. And 0:21:43.880 --> 0:21:46.600 she said, if you guys want to wait for me now, 0:21:47.160 --> 0:21:49.480 I said to her, look, I think when you have 0:21:49.680 --> 0:21:52.800 your child, you are not gonna want to go right 0:21:52.840 --> 0:21:57.600 back to work. Nor do we want to wait nine months. Unfortunately, 0:21:58.000 --> 0:22:02.520 so we had a let her go. We then sent 0:22:02.640 --> 0:22:06.679 it to Jane Fonda, who sent us all the same 0:22:06.720 --> 0:22:10.240 telegram that said, why would I want to be in 0:22:10.280 --> 0:22:15.720 a piece of capitalist rip off? Bullshit like this. Now 0:22:15.720 --> 0:22:19.280 I've seen her since and she doesn't remember having sent that, 0:22:20.440 --> 0:22:25.920 but I haven't. That was her response. That I don't 0:22:25.920 --> 0:22:31.840 know how she really felt, but that was her response, honest. Yeah. Meanwhile, 0:22:32.160 --> 0:22:36.520 Ellen Burston was hockeing me all the time. I had 0:22:36.640 --> 0:22:40.919 seen the Last Picture Show, but I didn't know Ellen 0:22:41.000 --> 0:22:44.640 Burston from Claris Leachman. I didn't know which was which. 0:22:45.320 --> 0:22:49.959 But Ellen said to me, do you believe in destiny? 0:22:50.680 --> 0:22:55.919 Has anyone ever asked you that before? Uh? Well, she 0:22:56.080 --> 0:22:58.800 was the only one who ever asked me that. And 0:22:58.840 --> 0:23:01.200 I said, I guess I believe. And she said, I'm 0:23:01.320 --> 0:23:04.480 destined to play this part. I said, look, with the 0:23:04.600 --> 0:23:08.719 studio wants Jane Fonda and Bancroft or Audrey Hepburn, this 0:23:08.800 --> 0:23:11.640 was all going on. She said, I don't care. I'm 0:23:11.680 --> 0:23:15.640 destined to play this part. And it came about that 0:23:15.720 --> 0:23:19.919 she was the last person standing, and so we cast 0:23:19.960 --> 0:23:24.800 her against the wishes of the studio. They did not 0:23:25.320 --> 0:23:30.280 they wanted a big star for that um. Then we 0:23:30.520 --> 0:23:35.720 cast Stacy Keach to play Father Cares. He was a 0:23:35.840 --> 0:23:39.240 great is a great actor. He was the go to 0:23:39.840 --> 0:23:45.280 Eugene O'Neill actor on Broadway, and what happened. I went 0:23:45.320 --> 0:23:51.280 to New York and maybe it was that No but no, 0:23:51.480 --> 0:23:55.639 we cast her. I went to New York and I 0:23:55.680 --> 0:24:00.359 saw the opening night of a play called That Championships Season. 0:24:01.119 --> 0:24:04.080 And it was written by a man named Jason Miller. 0:24:04.320 --> 0:24:07.600 Never heard of him. Uh I thought the play was great. 0:24:08.080 --> 0:24:14.159 It was it really reeked of lapsed Catholicism. It was 0:24:14.200 --> 0:24:16.520 a play about a group of high school guys who 0:24:16.600 --> 0:24:21.760 won a championship under their coach, but cheated to win 0:24:22.320 --> 0:24:25.679 and they were suffering this guilt and the stage was 0:24:26.840 --> 0:24:32.560 just filled with Catholic guild. I felt so I I 0:24:32.600 --> 0:24:35.240 said to my casting director, who was this guy that 0:24:35.280 --> 0:24:37.520 wrote this? I'd love to talk to him, just to 0:24:37.560 --> 0:24:41.440 talk to him. It turned out that he had studied 0:24:41.480 --> 0:24:46.280 for the priesthood three years at Catholic University in Georgetown. 0:24:46.760 --> 0:24:50.040 He came up to meet me in and I was 0:24:50.080 --> 0:24:53.199 staying at the Sherry Netherlands Hotel and I had the 0:24:53.280 --> 0:24:56.320 flu and I had a lot of pills. He thought 0:24:56.320 --> 0:25:00.239 I was a pill freak, and uh, I thought he 0:25:00.280 --> 0:25:03.240 was a drunk. And he didn't know what the hell 0:25:03.280 --> 0:25:05.960 he was doing up there. And I asked him a 0:25:05.960 --> 0:25:09.000 lot of questions about studying for the priesthood and stuff, 0:25:09.280 --> 0:25:12.800 and I was a horrible meeting. And I went back 0:25:12.840 --> 0:25:17.240 to Los Angeles and about two weeks later, as we're 0:25:17.280 --> 0:25:21.520 starting to prepare the picture, he called me at Warner 0:25:21.560 --> 0:25:24.640 Brothers and he said, hey, you know that that book 0:25:24.680 --> 0:25:26.600 you were telling me about that You're going to film 0:25:26.640 --> 0:25:30.080 that Exorcist? He said, I said yeah. He said, I 0:25:30.119 --> 0:25:35.080 am that guy. He said, I am that character. I said, well, 0:25:35.680 --> 0:25:39.680 you're not. Stacy keach is that he's going to play 0:25:39.720 --> 0:25:42.760 the part. He said, I'm telling you, man, I am 0:25:42.840 --> 0:25:46.720 this guy. And he said, have you ever done anything 0:25:46.800 --> 0:25:49.960 like a screen test? And I said no, I've never 0:25:50.040 --> 0:25:53.159 shot a screen test. And what's the point. I told you, 0:25:53.240 --> 0:25:56.440