WEBVTT - Ep63 - Special Edition: Oscar Nominees 0:00:00.040 --> 0:00:27.560 M m M. You're listening to Playback, a variety I 0:00:27.680 --> 0:00:31.680 Heart Media podcast. I'm your host of Variety Awards editor 0:00:31.760 --> 0:00:35.480 Chris Tapley. I just want to listen to this beat 0:00:35.520 --> 0:00:40.440 for a second. Thanks to Stewart Park for the new jams, 0:00:41.720 --> 0:00:45.240 new Playback, new jams. Yes, we're super excited to be 0:00:45.280 --> 0:00:48.240 a part of the I Heart Media family. So welcome 0:00:48.320 --> 0:00:51.920 to all new listeners. And this is Playback, a film 0:00:51.960 --> 0:00:56.960 focused weekly podcast. We talked to movie stars, we talked directors, 0:00:57.840 --> 0:01:02.440 basically exclusive conversations with the talents behind many of today's 0:01:02.440 --> 0:01:06.200 hottest movies. That's what we do here. And the ninetieth 0:01:06.200 --> 0:01:09.040 Annual Academy Awards are right around the corner on Sunday, 0:01:09.440 --> 0:01:11.800 So first order of business. We've got a lot of 0:01:11.800 --> 0:01:14.560 good movies, a lot of good performances, but a weird 0:01:14.640 --> 0:01:19.160 year overall. I thought it never quite found itself, so 0:01:19.400 --> 0:01:21.480 kind of going into the Oscars here, we have a 0:01:21.520 --> 0:01:24.160 lot of question marks and a number of key races, 0:01:24.760 --> 0:01:28.319 so it should be a pretty exciting night. We've talked 0:01:28.319 --> 0:01:30.640 to a number of this year's nominees here on the 0:01:30.680 --> 0:01:33.480 show over the last twelve months, so today we thought 0:01:33.560 --> 0:01:36.600 we'd pull together a few of those conversations and anecdotes 0:01:37.440 --> 0:01:40.960 make for a little trip through two thousand seventeen. We've 0:01:41.000 --> 0:01:43.919 got chats with actors like Gary Oldman and Searsha Ronan, 0:01:44.600 --> 0:01:47.480 and filmmakers like Christopher Nolan and de Reese, just to 0:01:47.560 --> 0:01:51.720 name a few. So let's dive in the year started, 0:01:51.760 --> 0:01:54.760 as it always does, at the Sundance Film Festival. It 0:01:54.880 --> 0:01:58.400 was there that Universal Pictures decided to drop Jordan's Peel's 0:01:58.440 --> 0:02:02.200 get Out as a surprise screening. It was a very 0:02:02.240 --> 0:02:05.640 bold move, but it immediately set this genre film up 0:02:05.640 --> 0:02:07.760 as more than a genre film. I mean, it became 0:02:07.880 --> 0:02:12.320 a critically acclaimed movie that clearly could be a prestige picture. 0:02:13.000 --> 0:02:14.560 And here we are a year later, the Proofs in 0:02:14.600 --> 0:02:17.440 the Pudding. The movie is competing for Best Picture, Best Director, 0:02:17.520 --> 0:02:21.840 Best Actor, and Best Original Screenplay. It's quite the whirlwind. 0:02:21.919 --> 0:02:24.360 And I spoke to Jordan just ahead of at least 0:02:24.400 --> 0:02:27.320 way back on February twenty three, just over a year ago. 0:02:28.200 --> 0:02:30.200 One of the things we talked about was the genre 0:02:30.200 --> 0:02:33.720 bending quality of the film. It's a horror film, but 0:02:33.840 --> 0:02:36.760 it's also a social satire with comedy elements, and it 0:02:36.840 --> 0:02:39.520 was classified as a comedy of the Golden Globes, which 0:02:39.600 --> 0:02:43.440 caused quite a stir. But way before all that happened, 0:02:43.520 --> 0:02:46.440 Jordan and I talked about that nebulous quality of the film. 0:02:46.520 --> 0:02:50.560 So here's Jordan one that it felt like the comedy 0:02:50.720 --> 0:02:53.040 education that I got, I've gotten the last you know, 0:02:53.760 --> 0:02:59.160 decade or so worked perfectly in this film. Um. You know, 0:02:59.240 --> 0:03:05.000 I feel that both horror and laughter are ways we 0:03:05.000 --> 0:03:08.880 we face our demons way ways that we deal with 0:03:08.960 --> 0:03:14.840 our fears of death in a way, Um, it's about tension, tension, tension, 0:03:15.320 --> 0:03:21.920 and then release with a certain pinpoint precision. And you know, 0:03:21.960 --> 0:03:24.800 in in in a way the tension, tension, tension and 0:03:24.880 --> 0:03:28.960 release is kind of a a metaphor for life and 0:03:29.040 --> 0:03:31.680 death in a way. You know, we spend our whole 0:03:31.720 --> 0:03:37.080 lives fearing the ultimate absurdity, which is that this is 0:03:37.520 --> 0:03:42.360 a temporary That's right, that's right, that's true. Uh. I 0:03:42.400 --> 0:03:45.400 went to the You had the kind of premiere in 0:03:45.640 --> 0:03:47.840 l A the l A live screening your Head that 0:03:47.960 --> 0:03:51.960 last week, and you said beforehand that for you, growing 0:03:52.040 --> 0:03:54.760 up race was like a nightmare, That's how you put it, 0:03:54.760 --> 0:03:57.080 and you wanted to put this nightmare on the screen. 0:03:57.440 --> 0:04:00.440 What it got me thinking was what was the chicken 0:04:00.440 --> 0:04:03.000 and the egg? Like, did you want to make a 0:04:03.040 --> 0:04:06.040 movie with those themes in mind? And then you kind 0:04:06.040 --> 0:04:08.240 of gravitated into a horror film? Or did you want 0:04:08.280 --> 0:04:11.280 to make a horror film? And these are the things 0:04:11.360 --> 0:04:13.080 that came up that you wanted to explore within that 0:04:13.360 --> 0:04:15.440 I wanted to make a horror film. Yeah, I just 0:04:15.560 --> 0:04:19.200 you know, I've I've I've I've had the this dream 0:04:19.279 --> 0:04:21.799 of being a director since I was since I was younger, 0:04:21.920 --> 0:04:26.200 being specifically a horror director, and um, you know, part 0:04:26.200 --> 0:04:29.799 of the process of figuring out what I could bring 0:04:30.400 --> 0:04:33.880 to the genre that would be of any worth or 0:04:33.920 --> 0:04:37.280 anything I would be proud of. Um, you know, I 0:04:37.440 --> 0:04:41.000 I realized that I've sort of done enough thinking about race, 0:04:41.360 --> 0:04:44.240 enough work in the comedy space about you know, walking 0:04:44.279 --> 0:04:46.640 that line how to deal with race and art, that 0:04:46.720 --> 0:04:49.880 I was kind of uniquely equipped to deal with it. 0:04:50.320 --> 0:04:54.000 Um you know, I think, you know, yeah, not only 0:04:54.279 --> 0:04:56.000 is race a nightmare for me, you know, I think 0:04:56.040 --> 0:04:59.720 that the greater point is that, um, you know, race, 0:05:00.040 --> 0:05:02.800 this country is is a and in the world is 0:05:02.880 --> 0:05:08.479 this human demon. It is a monster that we is 0:05:08.480 --> 0:05:11.599 in our d n A. And so I just felt 0:05:11.640 --> 0:05:15.640 like race was I realized it's if anyone was going 0:05:15.680 --> 0:05:19.040 to make a modern move horror movie about race, it 0:05:19.080 --> 0:05:23.200 should be me. Did you feel yourself like, were your 0:05:23.200 --> 0:05:25.320 self governing it all, like, oh that's too far, I 0:05:25.320 --> 0:05:26.800 need to pull back on that. Or did you just 0:05:26.839 --> 0:05:28.839 kind of let yourself go as far as you felt 0:05:28.880 --> 0:05:30.839 like you wanted to go. It's it's yeah, it's all 0:05:30.960 --> 0:05:36.800 self governing. Really, you know, it's you ask yourself, you 0:05:36.839 --> 0:05:41.919 know a lot of questions, but ultimately, um, you know, 0:05:41.960 --> 0:05:46.440 you sort of realize you can't write a movie with 0:05:46.720 --> 0:05:51.560 the taking into too far into consideration, how how the 0:05:51.640 --> 0:05:53.960 people will react to it, whether or not you can 0:05:54.000 --> 0:05:58.440 sell this movie. Um, I really wrote this movie for myself. UM, 0:05:58.520 --> 0:06:01.000 to say, look, this is gonna be a fun project 0:06:01.160 --> 0:06:05.320 to write. It is. Um if I was right a movie, 0:06:05.600 --> 0:06:09.520 my favorite movie that doesn't exist yet? What is that movie? 0:06:09.640 --> 0:06:13.640 And I just followed that um fun Um. You know 0:06:13.640 --> 0:06:15.880 it's kind of you know, it's how I imagine um 0:06:16.120 --> 0:06:19.760 Tarantino works. It was one of the great Like you know, 0:06:20.000 --> 0:06:21.800 you can just tell he's not making a movie for 0:06:21.839 --> 0:06:27.640 anyone else. He's making the movie he wishes. Um. Jordan 0:06:27.760 --> 0:06:31.920 joined an elite group of filmmakers with his nominations as producer, 0:06:32.080 --> 0:06:35.400 writer and director of get Out. By the Way, only 0:06:35.440 --> 0:06:39.320 Warren Beatty and James L. Brooks have managed that particular 0:06:39.400 --> 0:06:44.719 hat trick on their debut film, so that's pretty exclusive company. 0:06:45.000 --> 0:06:47.640 Hats off to Jordan's. Nearly a year later, we spoke 0:06:47.680 --> 0:06:51.360 to the film's breakout star Daniel Kaluya, just after he 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:54.800 received his life changing Oscar nomination and when he was 0:06:54.839 --> 0:06:57.880 in the midst of promoting Black Panther. He stars as 0:06:58.120 --> 0:07:00.360 Wakabi in that film, by the Way, which has been 0:07:00.480 --> 0:07:03.320 crushing it at the box office. I love this guy. 0:07:03.400 --> 0:07:06.640 He's so genuine, you don't feel like you're getting canned answers. 0:07:06.640 --> 0:07:10.200 He's very thoughtful and conversational, and I don't know, he's 0:07:10.240 --> 0:07:12.520 just a good dude. He's going to be doing this 0:07:12.560 --> 0:07:15.640 for a long time. And what I was particularly interested 0:07:15.640 --> 0:07:19.040 in talking about with him was the quiet nature of 0:07:19.120 --> 0:07:22.400 his character, and get Out sort of calls on Daniel 0:07:22.440 --> 0:07:25.600 to be quite reserved in his performance. A lot going 0:07:25.640 --> 0:07:28.440 on behind the eyes, under the surface, and as it 0:07:28.440 --> 0:07:31.440 turns out, that's exactly the gear he prefers to work in. 0:07:32.040 --> 0:07:34.040 So here's Daniel. I mean itsunds in the sense that 0:07:34.080 --> 0:07:36.920 I mean, I learned so much on Sicario and Welcome 0:07:36.960 --> 0:07:41.720 with that group of actors where the audacity to do nothing, 0:07:42.240 --> 0:07:45.360 you know, the confidence and and and seeing him doing 0:07:45.400 --> 0:07:47.360 it on set and not understanding it, but then seeing 0:07:47.360 --> 0:07:49.600 it on screen and go, well, but a Toro is 0:07:50.120 --> 0:07:53.640 amazing in that film, Josh is amazing. He's amazing, and 0:07:53.800 --> 0:07:58.600 I kinda it's a and then you and I have 0:07:58.680 --> 0:08:02.160 often I kind of had to rethink how I saw storytelling, 0:08:02.160 --> 0:08:04.560 how I saw acting in a sense that like I 0:08:04.880 --> 0:08:07.920 don't want people to see him doing it, and I 0:08:07.920 --> 0:08:11.640 can kinda. So it's just kind of like if you're 0:08:11.640 --> 0:08:13.680 playing a real dude, he's a real dude, you mean, 0:08:13.720 --> 0:08:16.160 and it's like and he's going through this, and it's 0:08:16.200 --> 0:08:19.200 about like people may not it may not be the 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:21.640 showy role, and you have to be okay with people 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:24.760 not noticing that you're doing what you're doing. But did 0:08:24.760 --> 0:08:27.080 they notice the story? They are they feeling the beats 0:08:27.080 --> 0:08:31.040 of the story that that's the priority for me. So 0:08:31.160 --> 0:08:34.480 it was me engaging with kind of like just kind 0:08:34.480 --> 0:08:36.920 of death of like the acting ego in me, like 0:08:37.000 --> 0:08:39.160 just kind of go, let me just do what I 0:08:39.200 --> 0:08:43.560 feel feels right and and and feels real and and 0:08:43.640 --> 0:08:46.680 with the internal is kind of like I find that. 0:08:46.720 --> 0:08:49.240 I just find a dynamics really interesting and stuff that 0:08:49.400 --> 0:08:51.440 I think I' probably doing life, and loads of people 0:08:51.440 --> 0:08:53.240 do that in life. I find it interesting I watch, 0:08:53.679 --> 0:08:55.679 so I find it interesting when someone says a kind 0:08:55.679 --> 0:08:59.120 of like, especially in the professional environment, especially in this industry, 0:08:59.120 --> 0:09:02.280 people say a lot of lick stuff. Las weell absolutely 0:09:02.440 --> 0:09:04.719 see a lot of slick ship. It's encouraged. Let's say 0:09:04.720 --> 0:09:06.520 we say a lot of slick ship and then like 0:09:07.080 --> 0:09:09.240 around that's kind of like but no one can say 0:09:09.280 --> 0:09:11.839 it directly because I'm from a quite direct tone, so 0:09:11.920 --> 0:09:14.040 it's I'm having to learn that, and I can see 0:09:14.040 --> 0:09:16.280 people react to it, but they can't really react to it. 0:09:16.320 --> 0:09:19.120 So there's there's what's being said on paper, what's being 0:09:19.160 --> 0:09:22.560 said is nothing like, it doesn't mean anything, but underneath, 0:09:23.080 --> 0:09:26.240 both parties know that there's something happening, and their faces 0:09:26.280 --> 0:09:29.040 are given hints to something that's happening. So I just 0:09:29.120 --> 0:09:31.040 kind of was like, oh, I find that, really, I 0:09:31.080 --> 0:09:33.120 find that more interesting to see in cinema, So it's 0:09:33.200 --> 0:09:36.760 kind of like, let's try and do that like in 0:09:37.559 --> 0:09:39.320 But then I think I've with my intent. It's always 0:09:39.320 --> 0:09:42.120 been like I don't want to feel like I'm showing 0:09:42.120 --> 0:09:46.160 off what I can do. I don't. I don't want that. 0:09:46.280 --> 0:09:48.120 Like even when I was doing plays and there was 0:09:48.160 --> 0:09:50.079 like a sequence where I had to show rage, I'll 0:09:50.120 --> 0:09:52.360 be like, even in Black Mirror, like what I was 0:09:52.400 --> 0:09:54.440 doing that monologue, I'll be like, is it too much? 0:09:54.960 --> 0:09:57.199 I mean, I don't want it. I don't want people 0:09:57.200 --> 0:10:00.320 to go because I probably find that quite over welming 0:10:00.440 --> 0:10:03.320 me is And that's just my personal taste. And so 0:10:03.559 --> 0:10:05.560 we've get out. It was just kind of have this 0:10:05.600 --> 0:10:07.679 in mind, but also as well conversations with Jordan and 0:10:07.720 --> 0:10:10.800 Allison and just going how do we ground this amazing 0:10:11.160 --> 0:10:13.720 genre story, you know, like and and I just I 0:10:13.800 --> 0:10:15.760 just kind of felt and that Jordan was like minded 0:10:15.800 --> 0:10:18.360 about like you have to believe this character and believe 0:10:18.400 --> 0:10:22.640 this relationship and believe that this is real, which grounds 0:10:22.920 --> 0:10:27.600 all the kind of supernatural or other worldly like genre 0:10:27.840 --> 0:10:31.960 elements to to the piece. If it's grounded, you know, 0:10:32.080 --> 0:10:35.160 and you're you're way more likely to believe a lot 0:10:35.240 --> 0:10:37.880 more stuff, the stuff that's real. But you don't even 0:10:37.960 --> 0:10:42.560 believe Jim. And it's like because of the gravity at 0:10:42.600 --> 0:10:45.840 the center of it Isn't It's rude Sunday. It was 0:10:45.880 --> 0:10:50.320 actually a powerhouse uh for Oscar contenders last year. In 0:10:50.360 --> 0:10:52.440 addition to Get Out, there was also Called Me By 0:10:52.480 --> 0:10:55.839 Your Name and mud Bound, as well as The Big Sick, 0:10:56.280 --> 0:11:00.200 which was written by and stars Kumon and Johnny one 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:04.360 of my favorite shows, HBO's Silicon Valley. Kumale was nominated 0:11:04.360 --> 0:11:07.360 for Original Screenplay along with his wife, Emily V. Gordon. 0:11:07.840 --> 0:11:10.760 And this was about as personal an experience as you 0:11:10.800 --> 0:11:12.960 can get. I mean, The Big Sick tells the story 0:11:13.120 --> 0:11:17.559 of Emily's sudden coma when Kumaloe was courting her, and 0:11:18.000 --> 0:11:22.360 how the experience both strengthened and tested their families. And 0:11:23.800 --> 0:11:26.360 you know, when you're pouring your soul out like that 0:11:26.720 --> 0:11:30.160 and literally telling your story on screen, you have to 0:11:30.160 --> 0:11:33.640 feel somewhat exposed in a way I guess very few 0:11:33.640 --> 0:11:36.360 of us can identify with. So I wanted to talk 0:11:36.400 --> 0:11:38.679 to Kumale about that over the summer when the film 0:11:38.720 --> 0:11:41.960 finally released in theaters. So here's Kumale. Well, you know, 0:11:42.000 --> 0:11:44.800 as a stand up. At some point I started taking 0:11:44.880 --> 0:11:48.320 personal stories and personal experiences and talking about them on stage, 0:11:48.320 --> 0:11:51.480 so I had a little bit of experience being personal 0:11:51.720 --> 0:11:54.959 and sort of giving of myself in little ways. This 0:11:55.000 --> 0:11:56.679 is sort of the deal. I was thinking about this 0:11:57.600 --> 0:11:59.920 earlier today or last night when I couldn't sleep. You know, 0:12:00.080 --> 0:12:04.040 there is a little bit of you lose a lot 0:12:04.040 --> 0:12:06.559 of people see your vulnerability, right, but a little bit. 0:12:06.600 --> 0:12:10.120 I think that's sort of the deal with the devil. 0:12:10.160 --> 0:12:12.480 You have to make to do what I get to do, Like, 0:12:13.040 --> 0:12:15.120 what you get is you get to live your dreams 0:12:15.120 --> 0:12:17.640 and tell your stories and it's really exciting. But what 0:12:18.000 --> 0:12:19.560 the price of that a little bit is that you 0:12:19.600 --> 0:12:24.160 are giving a piece of yourself for everyone to analyze 0:12:24.320 --> 0:12:29.280 and judge. Um But I knew, like a few years 0:12:29.320 --> 0:12:32.920 after these the events of the movie had happened. I 0:12:33.040 --> 0:12:35.319 knew that I wanted to like do something with it, 0:12:35.360 --> 0:12:37.920 like either do a show about it or something, because 0:12:37.960 --> 0:12:42.160 it felt like this very specific emotional thing that had happened. 0:12:42.760 --> 0:12:46.600 And I knew that nobody else had this story, and 0:12:46.679 --> 0:12:49.800 that only Emily and I were the ones who would 0:12:49.800 --> 0:12:52.200 be able to tell this story, like kind of if 0:12:52.240 --> 0:12:54.320 we didn't tell the story, the story would just not 0:12:54.520 --> 0:12:58.920 get told. Nobody else has this so um and and 0:12:59.320 --> 0:13:04.400 I really think for me writing and I think the 0:13:04.440 --> 0:13:08.600 best writing is sort of you're trying to deal with 0:13:09.040 --> 0:13:13.120 your concerns and tackle stuff that's complicated and messy for you, 0:13:13.480 --> 0:13:15.920 And part of it's a little bit of like self 0:13:15.960 --> 0:13:20.080 therapy working on something like this. So I knew that 0:13:20.520 --> 0:13:23.680 this was a story I wanted to tell. Emily took 0:13:23.679 --> 0:13:26.400 a little bit more convincing. I knew this was a 0:13:26.400 --> 0:13:28.520 story I wanted to tell because thinking about it would 0:13:28.559 --> 0:13:30.640 like paralyze me. And I knew that I had a 0:13:30.640 --> 0:13:36.160 lot of like stuff floating around inside this black box 0:13:36.200 --> 0:13:39.960 that I hadn't opened. And I knew that in in 0:13:40.120 --> 0:13:43.200 order to be able to move on from this kind 0:13:43.240 --> 0:13:46.360 of crazy event and have to write about it and 0:13:46.520 --> 0:13:50.400 really get into it and and and sort of figure 0:13:50.400 --> 0:13:52.160 out how I felt about it, you know. And it's 0:13:52.240 --> 0:13:53.800 very easy to be like, well that was a tough 0:13:53.840 --> 0:13:57.000 time when you actually opened the box and think about 0:13:57.040 --> 0:13:59.319 like what did I do this day? And then this happened? 0:13:59.320 --> 0:14:01.320 And this happened is how that made me feel? Like 0:14:01.400 --> 0:14:06.960 going through all the events piece by piece is it's 0:14:07.080 --> 0:14:11.040 very difficult, but I think it's also allowed us to 0:14:11.040 --> 0:14:14.079 get a handle on this big, big part of our life, 0:14:14.360 --> 0:14:16.400 did you get swept up in any kind of emotion, 0:14:16.440 --> 0:14:18.720 like in the moment in a scene that would obviously 0:14:18.720 --> 0:14:22.800 remind you of this very emotional moment in your life. 0:14:23.000 --> 0:14:26.440 There are some scenes that I cried when I wrote them, 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:29.520 I cried when I rewrote them, I cried when I 0:14:29.960 --> 0:14:33.560 hurt them, and and then shooting them was the same thing. 0:14:34.120 --> 0:14:37.520 I was surprised at how much of it actually felt 0:14:37.600 --> 0:14:41.320 like going through the real thing. Part of it is, 0:14:42.920 --> 0:14:45.200 I mean more of the hospital stuff, because when you 0:14:45.200 --> 0:14:47.200 were in a hospital. This wasn't a set. We shot 0:14:47.240 --> 0:14:51.120 in a real hospital. The sense memory of being in 0:14:51.160 --> 0:14:53.720 a hospital, and I hadn't that it had been about 0:14:53.800 --> 0:14:57.920 nine years since that stuff happened. Just the lighting, the 0:14:57.960 --> 0:15:02.000 smell of tape, the smell of addison, the sterility sound, 0:15:02.320 --> 0:15:06.080 the sounds, yeah, the weird beeps you hear, all that stuff, 0:15:06.080 --> 0:15:11.040 the sounds of wheels on um linoleum or whatever it is. 0:15:12.200 --> 0:15:15.880 All that stuff took me back immediately, Me and Emily, 0:15:15.960 --> 0:15:19.280 both of us like immediately. So it was actually more 0:15:19.320 --> 0:15:24.800 of a struggle to not uh go back into that 0:15:25.000 --> 0:15:29.000 really sad space. It was actually more of a start 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:31.280 of struggle to not do that than it was to 0:15:31.400 --> 0:15:33.400 like get into it, you know, like like waiting in 0:15:33.440 --> 0:15:36.920 the waiting room or all that stuff. I hadn't been 0:15:36.960 --> 0:15:40.160 in a hospital really since all that stuff happened to us. 0:15:40.160 --> 0:15:42.680 And going back into it and shooting it there, it 0:15:42.760 --> 0:15:45.640 was very very It was very intense, and it was 0:15:45.720 --> 0:15:47.880 very intense for Emily. It's about ten years ago, right, 0:15:48.040 --> 0:15:51.360 there was two thousand seven. Like I mentioned, mud Bound 0:15:51.520 --> 0:15:54.080 was a big sundance player as well. This year it 0:15:54.120 --> 0:15:57.880 was acquired by Netflix for an astounding twelve point five million. 0:15:58.360 --> 0:16:01.000 I don't know if it's astounding, it was worth that certainly. 0:16:01.280 --> 0:16:04.880 Um It's an amazing film and the movie's co writer 0:16:05.000 --> 0:16:08.160 and director de Reese uh is one of the most 0:16:08.160 --> 0:16:14.320 headstrong and driven directors I've ever interviewed. She's already a 0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:18.960 masterful artist just three films in, and her cinematographer, Rachel Morrison, 0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:22.960 actually made history this year with her Oscar nomination for 0:16:23.040 --> 0:16:26.400 Best Cinematography. She's the first woman to do so, which 0:16:26.440 --> 0:16:29.280 is obviously a long time coming. We'd like to dig 0:16:29.280 --> 0:16:31.520 in on the craft of filmmaking on this show, and 0:16:31.560 --> 0:16:33.880 something D and I talked about was settling on the 0:16:33.960 --> 0:16:37.720 look of this post World War two drama and plenty 0:16:37.720 --> 0:16:39.720 of talk about her work with Rachel, So here's d 0:16:39.840 --> 0:16:42.160 talking about that. Yeah, so we didn't look at other films. 0:16:42.160 --> 0:16:43.960 So like, for me, like the visual art world so 0:16:44.080 --> 0:16:46.600 has been my inspiration and like you know, creating kind 0:16:46.600 --> 0:16:48.960 of images for the screen, and so for me inspirations 0:16:48.960 --> 0:16:51.160 where there's artis named Winfield Lavel who does let of 0:16:51.200 --> 0:16:53.400 tone on tone paintings to temporary artists, is a sculptor. 0:16:53.440 --> 0:16:55.200 I love Na Mary Frank who does a lot of 0:16:55.240 --> 0:16:58.600 things that united bidenes and landscapes. And then Rachel had 0:16:58.640 --> 0:17:01.120 like Dorothea Lang and all these w p A photos. 0:17:01.120 --> 0:17:02.640 So we really kind of worked from there and wanted 0:17:02.680 --> 0:17:05.640 the film to feel very kind of candid, very kind 0:17:05.640 --> 0:17:08.680 of like like honest in a way. And another thing 0:17:08.760 --> 0:17:11.400 I love, I love um Less Blank that does these documentaries. 0:17:11.400 --> 0:17:13.200 He'd done this, like this documentary called The Truth of 0:17:13.280 --> 0:17:16.160 Corn and to Lightning Hopkins. So you know, we looked 0:17:16.160 --> 0:17:18.080 at that and like wanted the film to have a 0:17:18.200 --> 0:17:21.800 very kind of moving at the speed of life feel. 0:17:22.000 --> 0:17:26.400 So it doesn't feel presentational, it doesn't feel stagy, which 0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:27.959 can be you know, the catch of a lot of 0:17:28.440 --> 0:17:30.200 period pieces. But we wanted to move with the speed 0:17:30.200 --> 0:17:32.359 of life and feel honest, you know, and yet it's 0:17:32.400 --> 0:17:34.040 I wouldn't call it like a verity thing. I think 0:17:34.040 --> 0:17:39.159 it's a it's aesthetically beautiful, uh, you know, working I 0:17:39.160 --> 0:17:41.280 don't know what your budget was, but like were there 0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:44.400 limitations that absolutely We shot this film in twenty nine 0:17:44.440 --> 0:17:46.440 days for ten million dollars. So this is an indie 0:17:46.480 --> 0:17:48.879 film that no one realizes as an indie film, and 0:17:48.920 --> 0:17:50.520 you know, and that was because Rage was able to 0:17:50.520 --> 0:17:52.520 work so fast and use a lot of lighting, and 0:17:52.760 --> 0:17:55.000 you know, a big you know problem was basically we 0:17:55.080 --> 0:17:57.119 shot in actual sharecropper's cabin, so like a lot of 0:17:57.119 --> 0:18:00.000 the challenge was balancing like the inside versus the outside 0:18:00.040 --> 0:18:01.960 it and so she actually had to cut holes in 0:18:01.960 --> 0:18:03.760 the ceilings of these cabins to be able to put 0:18:03.840 --> 0:18:06.040 lights like in the roof of these things, so that 0:18:06.119 --> 0:18:09.240 you know, the value difference wasn't so great between the 0:18:09.320 --> 0:18:11.919 X tears and interiors and just really you know, making 0:18:11.920 --> 0:18:15.560 these characters feel like they're of the world. And I 0:18:15.600 --> 0:18:17.880 really love to let actors move through the space and 0:18:18.240 --> 0:18:20.760 I don't like blocking that kind of inhibits kind of 0:18:20.760 --> 0:18:22.879 they're they're they're flowing and that's all depend on having 0:18:22.920 --> 0:18:25.320 a DP. This want to be flexible with lighting and 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:27.600 being able to work with you so that the actors 0:18:27.600 --> 0:18:29.680 have maximum freedom, that the actors are able to kind 0:18:29.680 --> 0:18:32.520 of do their best work. Moving out of Sundance and 0:18:32.640 --> 0:18:36.480 into the release calendar, James Mangold's Logan hit theaters on 0:18:36.560 --> 0:18:39.040 March three, which was less than a week after the 0:18:39.080 --> 0:18:41.760 last year's Oscars were over. And the craziness of that 0:18:42.200 --> 0:18:45.320 envelope snaff who, which I think James and I even 0:18:45.320 --> 0:18:47.280 talked about maybe or that might have been off the air, 0:18:47.720 --> 0:18:50.480 I can't remember, but in any case, I spoke to 0:18:50.560 --> 0:18:54.040 James just before this film released, and I very much 0:18:54.080 --> 0:18:58.080 doubt at the time he expected that, you know, a 0:18:58.160 --> 0:19:01.760 year later he'd be sitting here sharing the first ever 0:19:02.400 --> 0:19:05.720 screenplay nomination for a superhero movie with his co writers. 0:19:05.720 --> 0:19:08.920 But here we are, uh, and I think it's well deserved. 0:19:09.080 --> 0:19:12.600 This film stands out from the fray of superhero movies. 0:19:12.680 --> 0:19:17.320 I feel I'm a big fan of Westerns, as is James, 0:19:17.400 --> 0:19:20.640 and this movie has that genre and as DNA, which 0:19:20.640 --> 0:19:23.840 I thought was a brilliant flourish, so naturally we talked 0:19:23.880 --> 0:19:26.760 about that. So here's James talking about the Western qualities 0:19:26.800 --> 0:19:30.040 of Logan. It's central to the entire story of this 0:19:30.160 --> 0:19:32.800 character as well. UM. I mean for those who aren't 0:19:33.160 --> 0:19:36.840 X men fans. UM. One thing has been essentially true 0:19:36.840 --> 0:19:39.520 about Logan through his comic book history and movie history, 0:19:39.560 --> 0:19:42.520 which is that he's carrying a ton of shame on 0:19:42.600 --> 0:19:46.320 his back about dark deeds he committed when he was 0:19:46.600 --> 0:19:50.560 younger and called weapon X in his incarnation as a 0:19:50.640 --> 0:19:53.439 kind of UM. When he was a gun slinger, he 0:19:53.520 --> 0:19:57.160 was well, he was a drug drug pumped killer. UM. 0:19:57.160 --> 0:19:59.399 But yes, but in the metaphor of the Western he 0:19:59.640 --> 0:20:04.119 was he was a gun slinger and UM and UM 0:20:04.160 --> 0:20:05.840 and a lot of people were hurt, and they weren't 0:20:05.920 --> 0:20:09.240 all UM in it. They weren't all guilty in some way. 0:20:09.280 --> 0:20:12.040 It wasn't always the justified death, if you will. And 0:20:12.119 --> 0:20:16.280 the UM. I think that that's something that's been played 0:20:16.320 --> 0:20:20.119 with throughout UM as I said, comic book history with 0:20:20.160 --> 0:20:22.879 this character and in the movies. But the the idea 0:20:22.960 --> 0:20:25.280 for me of coming of this character, coming to terms 0:20:25.960 --> 0:20:30.399 um with his life UM in a final film seemed 0:20:30.400 --> 0:20:34.080 to me necessary to find some way to go deeper 0:20:34.480 --> 0:20:39.800 into his own odd um relationship with violence. When did 0:20:39.880 --> 0:20:42.720 this kind of conceit because it is it does have 0:20:42.880 --> 0:20:47.520 the dna of a Western When did that Did you 0:20:47.520 --> 0:20:49.119 go into it with that conceit in mind, or did 0:20:49.119 --> 0:20:52.600 it develop as you developed the project like some of 0:20:52.800 --> 0:20:54.840 some of some of some of that comes along with 0:20:54.920 --> 0:20:59.600 just me meaning you know, my second film, Copland, which 0:21:00.119 --> 0:21:04.280 all outward appearances is a kind of Sydney Lamett esque 0:21:05.040 --> 0:21:10.560 New Jersey, kind of Peyton Place cop movie, uh, was 0:21:10.760 --> 0:21:14.320 very much structured actually built on three tena Huma. The 0:21:14.440 --> 0:21:17.639 idea of this kind of weakened mail in the center 0:21:17.680 --> 0:21:20.520 of this town of gun slingers who has called upon 0:21:20.680 --> 0:21:23.879 to kind of find the reserves to stand up to 0:21:24.119 --> 0:21:29.359 this um gun slinging bunch of corruption around him. Um 0:21:29.520 --> 0:21:33.760 the that's all very much. Um was hugely Western influence, 0:21:33.800 --> 0:21:36.000 And in fact that movie ends in a giant gunfight, 0:21:36.960 --> 0:21:41.159 um the um. But a gunfight not like you'd see 0:21:41.320 --> 0:21:44.359 in Heat, but one more like one you'd see in 0:21:44.440 --> 0:21:48.560 High New and the Western has had a powerful effect 0:21:48.640 --> 0:21:54.720 on me. Um. I couldn't completely explain why. But in 0:21:56.160 --> 0:22:00.880 I'm kind of uh a classes I mean I'm not 0:22:01.320 --> 0:22:06.560 I I am from the same generation, Um that a 0:22:06.720 --> 0:22:11.040 host of really talented kind of postmodern directors have come from. 0:22:11.040 --> 0:22:13.640 Probably the leader of all of them would be Quentin 0:22:14.280 --> 0:22:16.200 and I'm a huge fan of his work. But I 0:22:16.240 --> 0:22:23.560 couldn't do anything like that, Like, it's not the whole um. Uh. 0:22:24.040 --> 0:22:27.399 There's something I'm always looking for, something very earnest. I 0:22:27.560 --> 0:22:31.040 miss I miss amid all the really wonderful films made 0:22:31.040 --> 0:22:33.399