1
00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:02,920
Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray.

2
00:00:03,160 --> 00:00:09,880
Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to stuff mom never told you?

3
00:00:10,080 --> 00:00:18,080
Speaker 1: From housetop works dot com. Hello and welcome to the podcast.

4
00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:20,680
Speaker 1: I'm Kristen and I'm Caroline, and you're in today for

5
00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:24,360
Speaker 1: another episode of Summer Shorts, and we are talking about

6
00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:30,280
Speaker 1: summer camp, which I was really looking forward to because

7
00:00:30,720 --> 00:00:34,839
Speaker 1: I loved camp. As kid, you and I are so different,

8
00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:37,400
Speaker 1: really well, a girl trying to kill me at a

9
00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:39,360
Speaker 1: y m C a day camp, So I never went

10
00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:43,440
Speaker 1: back to any camp man. I was totally the opposite.

11
00:00:43,479 --> 00:00:46,600
Speaker 1: I mostly went to church camps. I would not have

12
00:00:46,640 --> 00:00:50,360
Speaker 1: gone to one of your secular wife what Young Men's

13
00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:53,239
Speaker 1: Christian Association, No, I'm I'm kidding. I mean like more

14
00:00:53,280 --> 00:00:56,880
Speaker 1: like church sponsored camps. I would go by myself for

15
00:00:56,920 --> 00:00:59,640
Speaker 1: a week or so, and then my whole family for

16
00:00:59,680 --> 00:01:02,960
Speaker 1: a few summers went to family camp, which was also

17
00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:06,920
Speaker 1: a lot of fun. And then for a few years

18
00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:11,800
Speaker 1: in late middle school and early high school, I was

19
00:01:11,840 --> 00:01:16,200
Speaker 1: a day camp counselor. That's fun. Yeah, I bet you

20
00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:20,880
Speaker 1: didn't let any girls strangle any of your campers. Her

21
00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:23,320
Speaker 1: name was Morgan any Patch, I'm just gonna throw that out.

22
00:01:23,520 --> 00:01:25,520
Speaker 1: She thought I was talking smack about her, but I wasn't,

23
00:01:25,560 --> 00:01:28,280
Speaker 1: and she turned around and started choking with an eyepatch

24
00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:33,280
Speaker 1: reminded the She turned her one intense eye on me,

25
00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:37,040
Speaker 1: was like, are you talking about me? No? Sounds fright.

26
00:01:37,120 --> 00:01:39,160
Speaker 1: If I had been her camp counselor Caroline, I would

27
00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:43,360
Speaker 1: have I would have stopped that fight. But let's not

28
00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:49,040
Speaker 1: get sidetrack. Uh. With a quick rundown, eleven million American

29
00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:51,800
Speaker 1: kids are probably gonna be shipped off to camp this year.

30
00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:56,080
Speaker 1: According to the American Camp Association. They're around twelve thousand

31
00:01:56,240 --> 00:02:00,400
Speaker 1: traditional camps all around the United States. The weekly average

32
00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:03,920
Speaker 1: cost of sleepaway camp is anywhere from three to seven

33
00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:07,720
Speaker 1: d and eighty bucks, which I'm sure it's bargained for parents.

34
00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:14,280
Speaker 1: That's true during the summer. But the start of camps,

35
00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:21,480
Speaker 1: which is really quite an American phenomenon, uh, got its

36
00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:26,600
Speaker 1: start in the early twentieth century because there was a

37
00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:31,880
Speaker 1: fear of kids essentially being cooped up in school too long. Yeah. Well,

38
00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:34,600
Speaker 1: and there was also the whole reaction to industrialization in

39
00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:37,240
Speaker 1: the late nineteenth century. Right, people were like, oh my god,

40
00:02:37,400 --> 00:02:39,480
Speaker 1: people are all in the cities and they're outside and

41
00:02:39,480 --> 00:02:42,560
Speaker 1: they're loafing around the streets. Well, like we mentioned in

42
00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:45,120
Speaker 1: our episode on the p T A and the by

43
00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:49,559
Speaker 1: the eighties and eighteen nineties, you had those first compulsory

44
00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:52,519
Speaker 1: school laws to get kids out of the factories and

45
00:02:52,600 --> 00:02:56,800
Speaker 1: off the streets and into school. But then during the summer,

46
00:02:57,480 --> 00:03:00,560
Speaker 1: what is a child to do exactly? And you can't. Yeah,

47
00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:03,480
Speaker 1: you can't just let them roam free. So you had

48
00:03:03,520 --> 00:03:06,200
Speaker 1: to get them out of the city's back connecting with nature.

49
00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:10,119
Speaker 1: And according to camp director Henry W. Gibson, back during

50
00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:12,920
Speaker 1: this time, you know, he was very concerned about this

51
00:03:13,080 --> 00:03:15,880
Speaker 1: new fangled idea of a summer break, like, what is

52
00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:18,680
Speaker 1: this You're just letting them roam around? And he said

53
00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:21,720
Speaker 1: that it's a period of moral deterioration with most boys

54
00:03:21,720 --> 00:03:25,560
Speaker 1: who have heretofore, wasted the glorious summertime loafing on the

55
00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:31,119
Speaker 1: city streets or as disastrously, at summer hotels or amusement places. Yeah,

56
00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:35,200
Speaker 1: summer camps started off initially, even though girls quickly jumped

57
00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:39,119
Speaker 1: into the game, but it started off as a thing

58
00:03:39,320 --> 00:03:43,560
Speaker 1: for boys. It was focused on getting the boy making

59
00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:46,360
Speaker 1: sure that they were cultivating masculine skills, making sure that

60
00:03:46,400 --> 00:03:49,880
Speaker 1: they were self sufficient, not being too coddled by the

61
00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:55,200
Speaker 1: luxuries of urban life. Because it was also more focused,

62
00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:58,400
Speaker 1: as you can imagine, toward middle and upper class families

63
00:03:58,440 --> 00:04:01,320
Speaker 1: who could afford to send their kids out into the wilderness. Yes,

64
00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:04,800
Speaker 1: such as the Gunnery Camp, which in eighteen sixty one

65
00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:08,680
Speaker 1: was started by headmasters of a private school in Connecticut,

66
00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:12,160
Speaker 1: Frederick and Abigail gun And it's considered the first organized

67
00:04:12,160 --> 00:04:15,760
Speaker 1: American camp. And they basically took some of their private

68
00:04:15,760 --> 00:04:19,240
Speaker 1: school students out into the woods for two weeks. And yeah,

69
00:04:19,279 --> 00:04:22,680
Speaker 1: that's considered the first organized camp. Yeah. And then in

70
00:04:22,920 --> 00:04:26,560
Speaker 1: eighteen seventy four, the Philadelphia chapter of the y w

71
00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:30,760
Speaker 1: c A, the Young Woman's Christian Association, founded the organization's

72
00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:36,159
Speaker 1: first summer camp, or vacation project as it was called.

73
00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:38,679
Speaker 1: And I need a vacation project. Yeah. The the approach,

74
00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:45,080
Speaker 1: initial approach for boys camps versus girls camps quite different. Yeah.

75
00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:48,160
Speaker 1: Boys were out outside, they were fishing, they were canoeing.

76
00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:51,479
Speaker 1: As Dr Winthrop Tisdale Talbot said in nineteen o five,

77
00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:54,000
Speaker 1: it was a chance to let the sunshine pour upon

78
00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:57,000
Speaker 1: every portion of their bared bodies, which is kind of

79
00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:00,400
Speaker 1: weird out of context. But for girls at this why

80
00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:02,839
Speaker 1: w c a camp, they had a summer boarding and

81
00:05:02,960 --> 00:05:06,520
Speaker 1: vacation house for quote tired young women wearing out their

82
00:05:06,560 --> 00:05:10,200
Speaker 1: lives in an almost endless drudgery for wages that admit

83
00:05:10,279 --> 00:05:15,160
Speaker 1: no thought of rest or recreation. So girls rested while

84
00:05:15,200 --> 00:05:17,800
Speaker 1: boys went out and climb trees and stuff. But then

85
00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:20,919
Speaker 1: things started to pick up for girls in summer camps,

86
00:05:20,960 --> 00:05:23,919
Speaker 1: as we would start to think of them now in

87
00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:27,800
Speaker 1: nineteen o two with a lady named Laura Matun who

88
00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:32,200
Speaker 1: founded Camp Kihonka for girls in New Hampshire. And Camp

89
00:05:32,240 --> 00:05:36,400
Speaker 1: Kihonka was pretty revolutionary because it kind of brought the

90
00:05:36,440 --> 00:05:41,120
Speaker 1: same wilderness, roughnit approach for girls camps like they have

91
00:05:41,240 --> 00:05:44,760
Speaker 1: for boys camps. And she was so intent on girls

92
00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:49,520
Speaker 1: having uh enriching outdoor experiences that she created And this

93
00:05:49,560 --> 00:05:52,160
Speaker 1: is a two, so keep in mind that this was

94
00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:55,800
Speaker 1: would have created quite a stir. She created bifurcated skirts

95
00:05:55,839 --> 00:05:58,840
Speaker 1: for girls so they could move freely in the outdoors.

96
00:05:58,960 --> 00:06:04,680
Speaker 1: And i'm them essentially as very large billowing coo lots. Yeah,

97
00:06:04,720 --> 00:06:07,119
Speaker 1: they were kind of shorter than I I saw a picture.

98
00:06:07,120 --> 00:06:09,400
Speaker 1: They were kind of shorter than I actually expected they

99
00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:13,240
Speaker 1: were yeah, but they were billowy Yeah. Yeah. And then

100
00:06:13,279 --> 00:06:16,000
Speaker 1: in nineteen twelve, the first Girl Scout camp is held

101
00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:18,960
Speaker 1: very close to where we are right now, Caroline and

102
00:06:18,960 --> 00:06:23,000
Speaker 1: Savannah Georgia. I had no idea. Two years later the

103
00:06:23,040 --> 00:06:26,400
Speaker 1: first Campfire Girls camps held, and according to The Daily

104
00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:29,440
Speaker 1: it was actually founded in nineteen ten by Luther Glick

105
00:06:29,480 --> 00:06:33,279
Speaker 1: with a curriculum design to make housekeeping duties seemed like

106
00:06:33,279 --> 00:06:35,720
Speaker 1: an adventure and I feel like I need someone to

107
00:06:35,760 --> 00:06:38,000
Speaker 1: come do that for me. You want to go to

108
00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:41,480
Speaker 1: housekeeping camp? Yeah, sweeping is not an adventure at all

109
00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:44,839
Speaker 1: in my mind. But sweeping builds your moral character. At

110
00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:46,800
Speaker 1: least that's what they probably would have said. Because one

111
00:06:46,839 --> 00:06:52,400
Speaker 1: thing that hasn't changed so much about camp over the

112
00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:55,200
Speaker 1: twentie century and now into the twenty first century is

113
00:06:55,279 --> 00:06:59,480
Speaker 1: that there has always been this emphasis on building character

114
00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:02,159
Speaker 1: in it's teaching them these kind of practical skills like

115
00:07:02,279 --> 00:07:09,840
Speaker 1: team building, conflict resolution. Uh. I don't know, latch key making, friendship,

116
00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:14,240
Speaker 1: bracelet corporation. But yeah, I mean it's all these Uh.

117
00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:16,920
Speaker 1: There is this notion that we I don't think that

118
00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:18,880
Speaker 1: we were that comfortable with the idea of kids just

119
00:07:18,960 --> 00:07:21,760
Speaker 1: running around willy nilly during the summer, and that they

120
00:07:21,840 --> 00:07:26,440
Speaker 1: need um this special outside place away from the hustle

121
00:07:26,480 --> 00:07:30,880
Speaker 1: and bustle of city life and modern life to teach

122
00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:36,119
Speaker 1: them um traditional kinds of skills. And after World War Two,

123
00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:41,120
Speaker 1: summer camp reached its zenith because of the middle class

124
00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:45,480
Speaker 1: that emerged out of those postwar years, and in this

125
00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:49,160
Speaker 1: idea of wanting to send kids out to experience nature

126
00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:53,520
Speaker 1: and to really build up their patriotic and civic characters

127
00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:56,280
Speaker 1: as well, it became less of a worry about their

128
00:07:56,280 --> 00:07:58,560
Speaker 1: moral character, like what were they doing on the streets

129
00:07:58,560 --> 00:08:00,560
Speaker 1: in the summertime out of school and war on? Like

130
00:08:01,120 --> 00:08:04,520
Speaker 1: your American camp as American as apple pie, like go

131
00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:07,040
Speaker 1: be proud of your country at camp. And that's why

132
00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:10,800
Speaker 1: you might see themes at summer camp like color wars,

133
00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:12,600
Speaker 1: Like you go to camp a lot of times you'll

134
00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:16,720
Speaker 1: immediately be assigned to some kind of cabin and the

135
00:08:16,760 --> 00:08:18,600
Speaker 1: cabin might have a color or you might just have

136
00:08:18,680 --> 00:08:24,080
Speaker 1: a color and U. Color Wars, though are not they

137
00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:26,680
Speaker 1: were not invented after World War Two. They actually go

138
00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:30,000
Speaker 1: back to the mid nineteen tins and they were built

139
00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:34,520
Speaker 1: off the game Capsule Flag and became popular in Northeastern

140
00:08:34,640 --> 00:08:40,360
Speaker 1: boys camps, but the colors were often blue and gray

141
00:08:40,440 --> 00:08:43,880
Speaker 1: for the Union and Confederate armies of the American Civil War.

142
00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:48,040
Speaker 1: So that's where color wars came from. Interesting kids playing

143
00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:51,880
Speaker 1: Civil War. Okay, color wars. I only went to day

144
00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:53,800
Speaker 1: camp once ever, so I kind of know what you're

145
00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:55,440
Speaker 1: talking about. Wait, and it was that and that was

146
00:08:55,480 --> 00:09:00,400
Speaker 1: where I patch almost killed. Yeah, exactly, I patch trauma using.

147
00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:05,400
Speaker 1: But UM camp started shifting after this whole baby boomer

148
00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:09,560
Speaker 1: going to camp thing, because eventually the baby boomers grow up.

149
00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:13,600
Speaker 1: Camp started to get more organized and professional UM and

150
00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:16,520
Speaker 1: by the nineteen eighties and nineties there was a definite

151
00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:19,560
Speaker 1: decline in new residential camps. Also, a lot of this

152
00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:22,480
Speaker 1: beautiful landscape by lakes and rivers and stuff ended up

153
00:09:22,480 --> 00:09:25,400
Speaker 1: getting picked up by developers, so there were condos and

154
00:09:25,480 --> 00:09:30,439
Speaker 1: vacation homes on the shores instead of camps. UM and

155
00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:33,840
Speaker 1: we've also in the meantime seen the surge of day

156
00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:39,160
Speaker 1: camps especially and then also these specialty camps like just

157
00:09:39,200 --> 00:09:42,920
Speaker 1: going to sleepaway camp to make popsicle sick crafts and

158
00:09:43,160 --> 00:09:46,760
Speaker 1: paddle boat around on a lake for eight weeks. It's

159
00:09:46,840 --> 00:09:50,839
Speaker 1: really not it's really not the norm anymore. Yeah, parents

160
00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:54,120
Speaker 1: are really concerned now with either having their kids learned

161
00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:57,160
Speaker 1: skills or having their kids learned something that looks good

162
00:09:57,200 --> 00:09:59,720
Speaker 1: on a college resume, and also to keep them busy

163
00:09:59,800 --> 00:10:03,559
Speaker 1: there where. There are two articles, one in Time magazine

164
00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:06,920
Speaker 1: one from the Christian Science Monitor that we're talking about

165
00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:12,040
Speaker 1: how summer camp has changed to be driven by UM

166
00:10:12,080 --> 00:10:14,480
Speaker 1: I guess they need to entertain kids constantly because they're

167
00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:19,559
Speaker 1: concerned that if there's nothing for them to do, then

168
00:10:19,600 --> 00:10:22,400
Speaker 1: they're just going to be bored and not do anything. Yes,

169
00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:25,160
Speaker 1: that stuff on fire, things like that. And at the

170
00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:29,240
Speaker 1: same time, they these specialty camps have emerged to really

171
00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:33,480
Speaker 1: tap into that um so science camps in particular have

172
00:10:33,520 --> 00:10:37,120
Speaker 1: become extremely popular. But there are camps out there for

173
00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:39,400
Speaker 1: anything from like kids who want to be chefs to

174
00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:44,560
Speaker 1: uh stunt people to filmmakers, acting camps, all sorts of camps,

175
00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:46,520
Speaker 1: and there might even be a podcast camp out there,

176
00:10:47,200 --> 00:10:50,319
Speaker 1: like I don't know, it would be awesome. Well, the

177
00:10:50,400 --> 00:10:53,120
Speaker 1: Christian Science Monitor article does kind of take issue with

178
00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:55,760
Speaker 1: this whole attitude of like keep them busy all the time,

179
00:10:55,840 --> 00:10:59,200
Speaker 1: send them to a super specific camp, because there are

180
00:10:59,200 --> 00:11:02,880
Speaker 1: a lot of there are camp advocates, real like quote

181
00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:07,000
Speaker 1: unquote real camp advocates who say that we're we're taking

182
00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:10,760
Speaker 1: something away from our kids by making them be hyper focused,

183
00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:13,600
Speaker 1: and that summer camp is being elbowed out by the

184
00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:16,880
Speaker 1: viral pace of childhood, where the school year starts earlier

185
00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:19,680
Speaker 1: and earlier earlier, where high school sports and their very

186
00:11:19,679 --> 00:11:22,760
Speaker 1: specific skill sets now dangle the promise of a free

187
00:11:22,760 --> 00:11:24,719
Speaker 1: read to college. So there's a lot of pressure that

188
00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:27,760
Speaker 1: we're putting on our children even at camp, right. Um.

189
00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:31,679
Speaker 1: And I will say, though, one thing that they did mention,

190
00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:34,480
Speaker 1: these articles did mention about the camps today is that

191
00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:38,280
Speaker 1: even though they might be more activity driven than they

192
00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:42,200
Speaker 1: were in the past, kids typically, though we can breathe

193
00:11:42,200 --> 00:11:44,640
Speaker 1: a cyberleaf, are not allowed to bring their cell phones

194
00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:49,520
Speaker 1: to camps. Some allow email access for parents. Um. And

195
00:11:49,559 --> 00:11:52,200
Speaker 1: the one strange thing that I read about this is

196
00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:56,000
Speaker 1: coming from a spokesperson from the American Camp Association, was

197
00:11:56,040 --> 00:12:00,280
Speaker 1: talking about the newest trend of parents wanting to see

198
00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:05,720
Speaker 1: a photo of their child at camp online. Helicopter parents. Yeah,

199
00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:08,480
Speaker 1: pretty soon after they dropped them off. To make sure

200
00:12:08,559 --> 00:12:14,840
Speaker 1: they're there, to analyze their body language. Yeah, make sure

201
00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:19,079
Speaker 1: that they're doing okay, um, rather than fending for themselves. Um.

202
00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:22,880
Speaker 1: Actually ran across a pretty recent study that was trying

203
00:12:22,920 --> 00:12:27,960
Speaker 1: to evaluate predictors for homesickness in female campers. I guess

204
00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:31,240
Speaker 1: it left for sleepaway camp for longer periods of time,

205
00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:36,720
Speaker 1: and uh. They ruled out the maternal relationship as being

206
00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:41,320
Speaker 1: a correlative factor for extreme homesickness and more. How to

207
00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:48,160
Speaker 1: do with um, the female campers relationships social relationships outside

208
00:12:48,160 --> 00:12:50,800
Speaker 1: of school and day to day lives. So yeah, so

209
00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:54,000
Speaker 1: some moms aren't just you know, holding you back. Yeah,

210
00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:56,600
Speaker 1: what's what? What you know? What's the camp song? Hello mother?

211
00:12:56,640 --> 00:13:00,319
Speaker 1: Hello father? Here I am a camp? What is it?

212
00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:03,760
Speaker 1: I don't know? Something that rhymes with muta and fata. Well,

213
00:13:03,880 --> 00:13:05,440
Speaker 1: I think that's all we got to stay about. Camps

214
00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:10,880
Speaker 1: they started off in in response to urbanization, really get

215
00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:12,559
Speaker 1: kids back to nature. Which is funny because there was

216
00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:14,839
Speaker 1: all this movement away from the farms and the rural

217
00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:18,440
Speaker 1: areas of America to cities for job opportunities and whatnot.

218
00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:21,680
Speaker 1: And then they're like, oh, shoot, yeah, our kids don't

219
00:13:21,679 --> 00:13:23,559
Speaker 1: know how to build a fire. They didn't want to.

220
00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:27,600
Speaker 1: They were worried that we were making kids kids too soft. Um.

221
00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:31,440
Speaker 1: But now there there's a plethora of summer camps to

222
00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:33,680
Speaker 1: choose from, and I would like to hear about people's

223
00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:37,200
Speaker 1: experiences at camp, whether they were good or nightmarish like mine.

224
00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:39,760
Speaker 1: So really was it because of that instance that vision

225
00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:41,679
Speaker 1: I was like a camp as a very small child.

226
00:13:41,679 --> 00:13:45,960
Speaker 1: I had the attitude of, uh, don't try try again. Um,

227
00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:47,839
Speaker 1: a girl tried to kill me. So I think I'm

228
00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:50,120
Speaker 1: just gonna be cool with going to the pool every

229
00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:52,360
Speaker 1: day instead of going to camp. Yeah, that doesn't sound

230
00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:54,400
Speaker 1: at that too. Yeah, my parents were like whatever, as

231
00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:56,000
Speaker 1: long as you're out of the house. I wanted to

232
00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:58,120
Speaker 1: be a lifeguard. So I mean you were still straddling

233
00:13:58,120 --> 00:14:02,760
Speaker 1: my too summer dreams as a child. So that's all

234
00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:05,880
Speaker 1: we gotta say about camp. We would love to hear

235
00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:08,880
Speaker 1: your camp stories, mom. Stuff at Discovery dot com is

236
00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:11,880
Speaker 1: where you can send them. And in the meantime, I've

237
00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:16,040
Speaker 1: got an email here from a listener about our episode

238
00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:22,520
Speaker 1: on gypsies, and just for a head that this is

239
00:14:22,560 --> 00:14:26,800
Speaker 1: coming from uh Eliza, who's an American living in the

240
00:14:26,840 --> 00:14:30,320
Speaker 1: Czech Republic, and she says, before moving here, I had

241
00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:34,680
Speaker 1: never really heard of gypsies outside fiction. I was surprised

242
00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:37,680
Speaker 1: to see the open and accepted racism against them. Here,

243
00:14:37,960 --> 00:14:42,080
Speaker 1: politicians often run on political platforms that include their removal.

244
00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:45,120
Speaker 1: An overwhelming percentage of Roman children are sent to special

245
00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:47,600
Speaker 1: needs school and even friends of ours have warned us

246
00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:50,040
Speaker 1: that our daughters will probably grow up to be criminals.

247
00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:52,320
Speaker 1: In fact, the reason we were able to adopt our

248
00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:56,160
Speaker 1: daughters so quickly is because there are many biracial children

249
00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:58,840
Speaker 1: given up for adoption by Check mothers who worry about

250
00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:01,280
Speaker 1: the social stigma of a dark her skin child, and

251
00:15:01,320 --> 00:15:04,520
Speaker 1: there are very few checks willing to adopt Roma children.

252
00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:08,040
Speaker 1: I hesitate to support a television show and she's referencing

253
00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:11,640
Speaker 1: My Big Fat Gypsy wedding that showcases the cultures differences

254
00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:14,720
Speaker 1: for the sake of mainstream voyeurism. But there certainly needs

255
00:15:14,720 --> 00:15:17,920
Speaker 1: to be more publicity for the oppression and discrimination that

256
00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:21,440
Speaker 1: the Roma have experienced and continue to experience in Europe.

257
00:15:21,880 --> 00:15:24,360
Speaker 1: In fact, it was not until visiting a memorial here

258
00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:27,840
Speaker 1: that I learned that during the Holocaust of all checkborn

259
00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:31,600
Speaker 1: Roma were killed, the Roman populations of Croatia, the Netherlands,

260
00:15:31,600 --> 00:15:34,720
Speaker 1: and Estonia were also all but wiped out. I didn't

261
00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:37,520
Speaker 1: learn this when I visited the Holocaust museums in Washington,

262
00:15:37,600 --> 00:15:40,840
Speaker 1: d c. And in Jerusalem, towards several concentration camps in

263
00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:43,840
Speaker 1: Central Europe, or took two university courses that covered the Holocaust.

264
00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:46,200
Speaker 1: We are letting the story of the Roma fall through

265
00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:49,360
Speaker 1: the cracks in history as well as modern social and

266
00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:55,160
Speaker 1: political justice movements. So thank you Eliza straight from the

267
00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:58,680
Speaker 1: Czech Republic. Were sharing your thoughts and opinions with us,

268
00:15:58,880 --> 00:16:01,040
Speaker 1: as well as everybody else who has written in mom

269
00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:04,080
Speaker 1: Stuff at Discovery dot com is where you can write

270
00:16:04,120 --> 00:16:06,480
Speaker 1: us and you can find us on Facebook. Give us

271
00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:09,280
Speaker 1: a like, We're so close to ten thousand likes, so close,

272
00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:12,480
Speaker 1: so close. I do check it frequently. I do yeah,

273
00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:17,440
Speaker 1: like citing so so help us, help push us over.

274
00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:21,520
Speaker 1: Be a pal, Yeah, be a pen pal. And you

275
00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:25,000
Speaker 1: can also follow us on Twitter at mom Stuff podcast.

276
00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:27,360
Speaker 1: And if you want to have some summer fun during

277
00:16:27,400 --> 00:16:29,600
Speaker 1: the summer, what better place to do it than over

278
00:16:29,680 --> 00:16:36,120
Speaker 1: at our homesite. How stuff works dot com for moral

279
00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:38,720
Speaker 1: this and thousands of other topics. Does it? How stuff

280
00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:45,880
Speaker 1: works dot Com brought to you by the reinvented two

281
00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:48,480
Speaker 1: thousand twelve Camray. It's ready, are you