1 00:00:08,440 --> 00:00:21,360 Speaker 1: Body Backs with Joseph Scott Morgan. As I've gotten older, 2 00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:24,440 Speaker 1: I think that corn of things I enjoy doing more 3 00:00:24,440 --> 00:00:27,240 Speaker 1: than anything on weekends with my wife. I can't believe 4 00:00:27,280 --> 00:00:31,040 Speaker 1: I'm saying this, but it's actually going antiquing. I love 5 00:00:31,080 --> 00:00:33,040 Speaker 1: to go to old junk stores and I love to 6 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:35,839 Speaker 1: go to antique shops and just look at things that 7 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:38,640 Speaker 1: it's not that I'm necessarily going to buy anything I like, 8 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:41,840 Speaker 1: and I think because I'm a frustrated historian at heart, 9 00:00:41,920 --> 00:00:45,840 Speaker 1: and every item in every one of these stores has 10 00:00:46,680 --> 00:00:51,680 Speaker 1: its own tail to be told. And it's fascinating, particularly 11 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 1: when you walk through an area of a store and 12 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:57,000 Speaker 1: you see tools that are left behind that people find 13 00:00:57,080 --> 00:01:00,600 Speaker 1: useless nowadays, but it's things that meant something to people 14 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:03,480 Speaker 1: in their workaday life, things that they used on a 15 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 1: regular basis, and it draws you in. You can learn 16 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:12,039 Speaker 1: a lot about a person in the life that they 17 00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:17,280 Speaker 1: have lived, I think perhaps by those things that they utilized. 18 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:20,839 Speaker 1: And that brings me to what we're gonna talk about today. 19 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: The lady that had lived a full life, had made 20 00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:31,000 Speaker 1: it into her seventies, had retired and was now just 21 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:35,480 Speaker 1: wanting to live at peace, working on clothing, working as 22 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:39,559 Speaker 1: a semstress and using an old fashioned iron, a steam iron, 23 00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden, whole world exploded in Charleston, 24 00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:48,040 Speaker 1: West Virginia. My name is Joseph Scott Morgan and this 25 00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:59,080 Speaker 1: is body Bags. I was very hesitant to talk about 26 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:05,880 Speaker 1: this case to a However, I think that it's emblematic 27 00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:11,919 Speaker 1: of how quickly terror can fall upon us at any 28 00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:16,440 Speaker 1: moment in time. And I had to talk about this 29 00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:21,080 Speaker 1: case with my friend Jackie Jackie Howard from Crime Stories 30 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:24,400 Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. Jackie. I don't know that over the 31 00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:27,160 Speaker 1: course of our discussions of encountered a case like this, 32 00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:30,640 Speaker 1: but it it really kind of punched me in the 33 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 1: gut when I began to think about you live your 34 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:35,280 Speaker 1: life and you just want to be at peace. You 35 00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:38,200 Speaker 1: just you want to love those that are around you 36 00:02:39,000 --> 00:02:42,320 Speaker 1: and enjoy your years that you've worked so hard for 37 00:02:42,600 --> 00:02:46,440 Speaker 1: to live in in this kind of environment where you 38 00:02:46,480 --> 00:02:48,760 Speaker 1: don't have to get up and do those things that 39 00:02:48,800 --> 00:02:50,560 Speaker 1: you have to do, you do the things you want 40 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:52,360 Speaker 1: to do. I don't know how it affected you, but 41 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:56,399 Speaker 1: this case, when I read it, it was just horrifying. 42 00:02:56,800 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 1: We have talked about so many things that we as 43 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 1: humans can do to each other. But this is one 44 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:08,480 Speaker 1: of we'll have the worst that we've talked about. Seventies 45 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:12,440 Speaker 1: seven year old Barbara Steele was in her home just 46 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:15,160 Speaker 1: enjoying and doing the things that she wanted to do 47 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:19,640 Speaker 1: when Joshua Drennan, twenty eight years old, entered her home 48 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:24,960 Speaker 1: and attacked Barbara Steele. Let me warn you now, not 49 00:03:25,120 --> 00:03:27,800 Speaker 1: that I think that you're listening to this podcast with 50 00:03:27,919 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: children in the room, but if you have someone who 51 00:03:32,120 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 1: is sensitive to rough content, we advise you now this 52 00:03:37,040 --> 00:03:41,120 Speaker 1: is a rough podcast to listen to. Very heinous things 53 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 1: were done by Joshua Drennan and multiple He went on 54 00:03:46,160 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 1: a mini crime spree, attacking multiple victims, but it started 55 00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 1: with Barbara Steele. He went into her home and attacked 56 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 1: this woman. The piece of equipment that you're talking about, Joe, 57 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:04,120 Speaker 1: the antique here is an iron. You know, there's a 58 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:09,280 Speaker 1: term that people, you know that study artifacts use, and 59 00:04:09,320 --> 00:04:12,280 Speaker 1: I've always been fascinated by this term. It's called patina, 60 00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:18,760 Speaker 1: and patina gives you an indication that the appearance of 61 00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:22,039 Speaker 1: an item, a work of art, or whether it be 62 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:26,680 Speaker 1: an instrument of some kind that over the years that decades, 63 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:29,560 Speaker 1: perhaps it has aged in a particular way, and it 64 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:32,719 Speaker 1: you know, it takes on these different characteristics where almost 65 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:36,520 Speaker 1: the item itself is kind of morphinous as years go by, 66 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:38,680 Speaker 1: and we would expect that, and it seems kind of obvious, 67 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:43,040 Speaker 1: but I've seen images of this steam iron and if 68 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:46,480 Speaker 1: I can, you know, just kind of describe it. It 69 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:49,479 Speaker 1: looks like an old fashioned iron that you would play, say, 70 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 1: for instance, on a stove. It's not an electric iron. 71 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:56,240 Speaker 1: It's something that you would place perhaps on a stove 72 00:04:56,560 --> 00:04:59,119 Speaker 1: and you know, heat the thing up, you know, something 73 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 1: like a great grandma there would have used. My grandmother 74 00:05:02,480 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 1: actually had a couple of old fashioned irons that you 75 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 1: would put on the surface of a of a wood 76 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:10,880 Speaker 1: burning stove, of pope belly stove, and you know that 77 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:13,039 Speaker 1: you don't really give it a second thought. But this 78 00:05:13,080 --> 00:05:14,880 Speaker 1: one looks a little bit different. It's got a kind 79 00:05:14,880 --> 00:05:17,200 Speaker 1: of a bulb on the front of it and a 80 00:05:17,279 --> 00:05:20,440 Speaker 1: metal handle. It's kind of rusty in appearance, I guess, 81 00:05:21,160 --> 00:05:25,320 Speaker 1: and the bulb itself apparently is where water is contained. 82 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:28,960 Speaker 1: And it's an early iteration of what we would refer 83 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:32,560 Speaker 1: to as a steam iron, so that when it's heated, 84 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:36,400 Speaker 1: the little ball that contains the water heats up and 85 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:39,400 Speaker 1: it transfers that steam, you know, to the item that 86 00:05:39,440 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 1: you're ironing, you know, pressing. It's fascinating to see that 87 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:46,400 Speaker 1: someone would still use this to this day. But from 88 00:05:46,480 --> 00:05:50,400 Speaker 1: from what we understand, this item was in fact utilized 89 00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:52,960 Speaker 1: by the victim in this case, she worked as a 90 00:05:53,000 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 1: seamstress and would still utilize this iron something that she preferred. 91 00:05:58,120 --> 00:06:00,240 Speaker 1: You know. Even her children said that they had seen 92 00:06:00,320 --> 00:06:02,599 Speaker 1: it in the house for years and years. It was 93 00:06:02,640 --> 00:06:05,159 Speaker 1: just part of who she was. She liked it. I 94 00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:08,240 Speaker 1: don't know what the origin of this item is, and 95 00:06:08,279 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 1: maybe it's something that had been passed down through her family, 96 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:13,440 Speaker 1: you know, because this is an art form, working with 97 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:18,520 Speaker 1: clothing and doing alterations, and it's something that maybe she 98 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:21,280 Speaker 1: had had in her family for a long time. Maybe 99 00:06:21,320 --> 00:06:23,480 Speaker 1: it had been passed on from you know, almost from 100 00:06:23,560 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 1: master to apprentice, you know, as it were, and something 101 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:31,480 Speaker 1: she had held onto. And so the iron itself becomes 102 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:34,359 Speaker 1: part and parcel of the story. It's kind of what 103 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:37,200 Speaker 1: the whole thing centers around, because it's an item that 104 00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:40,360 Speaker 1: is what we would refer to from a forensic standpoint, 105 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:45,840 Speaker 1: is a weapon of convenience. It's something that a perpetrator 106 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:51,760 Speaker 1: does not come armed with. It's something that they utilize 107 00:06:51,960 --> 00:06:56,559 Speaker 1: that is within arms reach. That's something that is part 108 00:06:56,640 --> 00:07:01,160 Speaker 1: of that environment which they kind of invade step into. 109 00:07:01,839 --> 00:07:04,479 Speaker 1: And in this case, it was you lost in the 110 00:07:04,480 --> 00:07:07,560 Speaker 1: most brutal way that I don't think that anybody could imagine. 111 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 1: Police were made aware of what was happening inside this home, 112 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 1: or what did happen inside this home by neighbors who 113 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:21,040 Speaker 1: witnessed Joshua Drenning exiting Barbara Steele's home. Now, remember, Barbara 114 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:26,280 Speaker 1: Steele is seventy seven. Joshua Drenning is twenty eight. The 115 00:07:26,360 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 1: owner of a business that was located across the street 116 00:07:29,680 --> 00:07:32,880 Speaker 1: from Steele's home, and he had known her from quite 117 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 1: some time, was the first person to find her. He 118 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:39,400 Speaker 1: said he looked through the screen door and could see 119 00:07:39,480 --> 00:07:43,520 Speaker 1: down the hallway, and he described it as looking like 120 00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:47,320 Speaker 1: a battle zone. He said, there was broken glass everywhere, 121 00:07:47,440 --> 00:07:52,440 Speaker 1: things were toppled over. It basically looked like a tornado 122 00:07:52,800 --> 00:07:56,960 Speaker 1: had gone through so forensically, Joe, what do we see here? 123 00:07:57,000 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 1: What can that tell us? How many times have we 124 00:08:01,320 --> 00:08:04,960 Speaker 1: talked about over the course of our years together? Jackie 125 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:09,640 Speaker 1: on Nancy Show, and any other kind of medium that 126 00:08:09,720 --> 00:08:11,800 Speaker 1: we're on. You know, when they come to me and 127 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:16,160 Speaker 1: they asked me about crimpsty assessment, it's our it's kind 128 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:19,640 Speaker 1: of our our fallback position, we say, you know, there 129 00:08:19,720 --> 00:08:22,240 Speaker 1: was no signs of forced entry or struggle, all right, 130 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:27,600 Speaker 1: in this case, this is a classic sign of struggle. 131 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:33,040 Speaker 1: You've got items that are randomly broken, shattered glass. I 132 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:36,720 Speaker 1: think that was the most striking thing about this, that 133 00:08:36,760 --> 00:08:40,200 Speaker 1: there was broken glass. People kept implying that. I think 134 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:42,120 Speaker 1: a lot of it had to do with the fact that, 135 00:08:42,200 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 1: in addition to what had gone on inside of the home, 136 00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:49,840 Speaker 1: Miss Steele's vehicle that was parked at at her home 137 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:52,720 Speaker 1: there the police described in an interesting way. They said 138 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:55,800 Speaker 1: that her vehicle had been attacked. And when I was 139 00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:59,719 Speaker 1: reading over the police reports in this particular case, that 140 00:08:59,840 --> 00:09:03,840 Speaker 1: was an interesting you know, kind of turned the phrase 141 00:09:03,920 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 1: there her vehicle was attacked, because you think of people, 142 00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:09,839 Speaker 1: or you know, an animal or you know, being attacked, 143 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:12,560 Speaker 1: you don't think of a car being attacked. But that's 144 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: the way it was described. And I think that that's 145 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 1: also something that had drawn the neighborhood's attention to this, 146 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:26,040 Speaker 1: because when Drennan left her house he has the steam 147 00:09:26,040 --> 00:09:29,760 Speaker 1: iron that we talked about in hand, and he's essentially 148 00:09:30,320 --> 00:09:35,400 Speaker 1: pounding on the outside of her car and breaking the 149 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:38,160 Speaker 1: windows and all that sort of thing, and he met 150 00:09:38,200 --> 00:09:40,800 Speaker 1: with a certain level of frustration where he couldn't gain 151 00:09:40,880 --> 00:09:44,679 Speaker 1: access to it. So you can imagine that in this 152 00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:47,480 Speaker 1: environment which the neighbor had talked about. You know, you've 153 00:09:47,520 --> 00:09:51,080 Speaker 1: known her for years and years, and miss Steele was 154 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:54,079 Speaker 1: known as somebody. First off, she retired from the local 155 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:56,840 Speaker 1: school board, had put in her time there. She was 156 00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:01,760 Speaker 1: highly regarded, and you know, the thing that you come 157 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:05,760 Speaker 1: away with when you read back through the interviews of 158 00:10:06,160 --> 00:10:09,560 Speaker 1: witnesses and people that were in her circle. They talked 159 00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 1: about how gentle she was and how kind she was. 160 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 1: She had a lot of kids that she I'm sure 161 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:18,360 Speaker 1: she had touched their lives, and in this community. She 162 00:10:18,400 --> 00:10:20,760 Speaker 1: lived on the west side of Charleston, West Virginia, in 163 00:10:20,760 --> 00:10:24,880 Speaker 1: a just a modest wood frame whitewood frame home. She 164 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:29,800 Speaker 1: was widowed and just living this kind of peaceful existence 165 00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:32,680 Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden her world explodes with 166 00:10:32,800 --> 00:10:35,880 Speaker 1: this guy that there's no indication that they had ever 167 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:40,440 Speaker 1: crossed pass before, and that's what makes this all the 168 00:10:40,520 --> 00:10:43,720 Speaker 1: more horrific. Why, of all the people in the world, 169 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:47,800 Speaker 1: would you, in fact target a lady like this who 170 00:10:48,280 --> 00:10:51,200 Speaker 1: is obviously going to be weaker than you, who's not 171 00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:54,440 Speaker 1: posing a threat in anyway. There's no indication, you know, 172 00:10:54,520 --> 00:10:57,319 Speaker 1: that she was screaming at at this guy as he's 173 00:10:57,360 --> 00:11:00,079 Speaker 1: walking down the street, you know, engaging with him the 174 00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:03,319 Speaker 1: way he just burst into her life and just absolutely 175 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:07,440 Speaker 1: just ripped the shrip. Besides the assault on Barbara Steel, 176 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:13,680 Speaker 1: the assault on the car, Joshua Drennan continued his crime spree, 177 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:20,719 Speaker 1: going through the neighborhood and ultimately assaulted at least two 178 00:11:20,800 --> 00:11:22,880 Speaker 1: other people that we know of. One was a woman 179 00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:27,880 Speaker 1: sitting in a drug store parking lot. What happened to her? Again, 180 00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 1: somebody just randomly sitting can you imagine? And all of 181 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:34,680 Speaker 1: us had done this, hopefully nobody's you know, texting while 182 00:11:34,679 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 1: they're driving, and this this lady had pulled over into 183 00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:40,079 Speaker 1: local drug stores parking lot and was sitting there, and 184 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:43,840 Speaker 1: she's like in a two thousand four Honda's CRV, you know, 185 00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:47,080 Speaker 1: her back it's to disguise. He's approaching her car and 186 00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:50,400 Speaker 1: she's sitting there, she's texting, you know, and you're thinking, well, 187 00:11:50,440 --> 00:11:52,079 Speaker 1: what would she be texting about it? And you can 188 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:54,320 Speaker 1: kind of superimpose your thoughts about it. But maybe she's 189 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:58,120 Speaker 1: at the drug store. She's trying to contact her family, saying, look, 190 00:11:58,160 --> 00:11:59,719 Speaker 1: I'm at the drug stores and anything I can pick 191 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:01,600 Speaker 1: up me while I'm here, this sort of thing. And 192 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:05,079 Speaker 1: then all of a sudden, her driver's side window just 193 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 1: explodes in the hail of glass. This iron that we 194 00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:13,320 Speaker 1: talked about is being wielded by Brennan. He drives this 195 00:12:13,360 --> 00:12:17,319 Speaker 1: thing through the glass and begins to pummel her with 196 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 1: this iron and beat her and then doesn't open the door. 197 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:26,160 Speaker 1: He drags her out of the car through the broken 198 00:12:26,200 --> 00:12:30,480 Speaker 1: window and onto the ground adjacent, you know, to the vehicle, 199 00:12:30,480 --> 00:12:32,400 Speaker 1: and he hops in the vehicle and drives away. And 200 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:37,040 Speaker 1: I can only imagine, you know, you know her, it's 201 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:40,600 Speaker 1: not surprised, doesn't even begin, you know, to kind of 202 00:12:40,600 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 1: describe this. You're minding your own business, and all of 203 00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:47,600 Speaker 1: a sudden the world just explodes in this the shattering 204 00:12:47,679 --> 00:12:50,720 Speaker 1: of this cube safety glass, which is what you know 205 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:53,080 Speaker 1: we have, you know, in these windows of sign if 206 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:56,000 Speaker 1: you ever see a car, the glass on either side 207 00:12:56,280 --> 00:13:00,520 Speaker 1: shatters into these little cubes and she probably would have 208 00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:04,120 Speaker 1: wound up with tiny little lacerations as a result of 209 00:13:04,160 --> 00:13:08,000 Speaker 1: the glass fracturing into these little bits that comes across 210 00:13:08,040 --> 00:13:12,040 Speaker 1: these little cubes. They make these little l shaped lacerations 211 00:13:12,120 --> 00:13:14,800 Speaker 1: as they strike skin, and that's one of the reasons. 212 00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:17,800 Speaker 1: That's kind of how in motor vehicle accents, for instance, 213 00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:21,720 Speaker 1: we can tell which side of the vehicle and individuals 214 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:24,840 Speaker 1: positioned in were they a passenger in the front seat, 215 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:28,280 Speaker 1: do they have these cube they called it cubing injuries 216 00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:30,520 Speaker 1: on the right side of their face. That gives you 217 00:13:30,559 --> 00:13:33,240 Speaker 1: an indication they were adjacent to that window, and on 218 00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 1: the less side, you know, of the face, that would 219 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:37,520 Speaker 1: give me an indication that you're on the driver's side, 220 00:13:37,559 --> 00:13:40,079 Speaker 1: either in the front or the back seat. And then 221 00:13:40,120 --> 00:13:43,800 Speaker 1: she's drug out there and she's probably dazed, in a 222 00:13:43,840 --> 00:13:46,600 Speaker 1: state of complete and total confusion, and then she looks 223 00:13:46,679 --> 00:13:50,480 Speaker 1: up and her car is just gone. Total stranger has 224 00:13:50,520 --> 00:13:56,280 Speaker 1: just driven off with this vehicle, and he's this guy 225 00:13:56,400 --> 00:13:59,080 Speaker 1: is in kind of this amped up state. He's driving 226 00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:01,680 Speaker 1: along the road and a warding to what the police 227 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:08,280 Speaker 1: reports are saying, he wound up striking another vehicle that 228 00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:11,920 Speaker 1: a gentleman was driving, and I don't know if the 229 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:15,160 Speaker 1: CRV that he had stolen had become disabled, but he 230 00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:20,000 Speaker 1: decides that he's going to try to commandeer the vehicle 231 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:23,400 Speaker 1: that he has just struck. But suddenly reality sets in. 232 00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:26,040 Speaker 1: I think a lot can be learned about the nature 233 00:14:26,080 --> 00:14:29,000 Speaker 1: of this fellow. It's at this point he approaches the 234 00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 1: driver of that vehicle and the next thing you know, 235 00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:35,360 Speaker 1: he's staring down the muzzle of a gun because this 236 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 1: guy is a concealed carry guy, and he draws his 237 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:42,480 Speaker 1: weapon and all of a sudden, Drenning suddenly, I guess 238 00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 1: he has a lucid moment he realizes, Oh, this guy 239 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 1: is a threat. Keep in mind, the two people that 240 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:54,880 Speaker 1: he has brutally attacks so far have been women, unarmed women, 241 00:14:55,840 --> 00:14:58,080 Speaker 1: and now he comes face to face with a person 242 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:02,360 Speaker 1: that is prepared to shoot him, and he runs away. 243 00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:07,160 Speaker 1: At that point in Tom the next person that Drennan 244 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:11,280 Speaker 1: runs into Joe, is a police officer, who by now 245 00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:15,640 Speaker 1: are made aware that this has happened. In Barbara Steele's home, 246 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:19,960 Speaker 1: witnesses saw Drennan leaving and reported it to the police. 247 00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:24,400 Speaker 1: Now you have a second woman injured, as you said, 248 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:29,360 Speaker 1: and then he runs into a police officer the police officer, 249 00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:32,880 Speaker 1: This gentleman, he is aware. You know, there's radio chatter 250 00:15:32,920 --> 00:15:35,560 Speaker 1: at this point. You know, something ain't right. I can 251 00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:38,360 Speaker 1: tell you know, they probably don't have this kind of thing. 252 00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 1: You know, Charleston is not a tiny town, but I 253 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:45,880 Speaker 1: can tell you they they don't have some maniac running 254 00:15:45,920 --> 00:15:48,520 Speaker 1: down the street every day with an antique iron pummeling 255 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:51,280 Speaker 1: people with it. He's aware. Now it's gone out on 256 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:54,560 Speaker 1: the radio. Can any of us imagine how terrified you are. 257 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:57,320 Speaker 1: You're seeing this and there are calls that are coming 258 00:15:57,320 --> 00:15:59,480 Speaker 1: into the non eleven center. You know, people are seeing 259 00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:03,880 Speaker 1: this one even I think he videotaped a goodly portion 260 00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:07,320 Speaker 1: of this at a distance. At this confrontation that Drennan 261 00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:10,760 Speaker 1: winds up having with the police officer, he begins to 262 00:16:11,160 --> 00:16:15,600 Speaker 1: again hummel this police officer with this iron. I mean, look, 263 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:19,320 Speaker 1: cops are set up there trained to have situational awareness, 264 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 1: that is, those those things that are occurring in the 265 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 1: environment around them. I don't know if in the academy, 266 00:16:25,640 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 1: you know, they prepare you for you know, what do 267 00:16:28,840 --> 00:16:30,800 Speaker 1: I do if a guy shows up with an antique iron. 268 00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:34,640 Speaker 1: I'm sure that the police officer is shocked, but he 269 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:39,320 Speaker 1: reaches into his belt, his service belt, and pulls out 270 00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:42,880 Speaker 1: his what's referred to as an ASP. It's a deployable baton. 271 00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:47,360 Speaker 1: New people have seen these their telescoping and they're very heavy. 272 00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:49,880 Speaker 1: You extended by popping it out, and then you go 273 00:16:49,960 --> 00:16:53,400 Speaker 1: into position to to strike, you know, the person that's 274 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:58,360 Speaker 1: advancing on you. The problem is is that apparently as 275 00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:02,600 Speaker 1: the officer set Drenning is advancing on the police officer 276 00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:08,040 Speaker 1: with the iron and begins to swing it wildly at him, 277 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:12,280 Speaker 1: and the police officer backs up and trips. This is 278 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:15,919 Speaker 1: horrifying when you think about trips backwards over a curb. 279 00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:21,119 Speaker 1: And he drops his ASP and in the meantime, Drinning 280 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:23,879 Speaker 1: just descends on him. I mean, he begins to pummel 281 00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:27,800 Speaker 1: him again with the iron, beating him all over. The 282 00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:29,679 Speaker 1: only thing the police officer can really do is just 283 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:32,560 Speaker 1: kind of contract into a ball on the ground. I'm 284 00:17:32,560 --> 00:17:34,920 Speaker 1: sure he's got his vest on, but that's not protecting 285 00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:37,480 Speaker 1: his head, it's not protecting his hands and his hips, 286 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:40,120 Speaker 1: that sort of thing. And you've got this wild man 287 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:43,960 Speaker 1: just assaulting you. And it's at this point that the 288 00:17:44,040 --> 00:17:47,439 Speaker 1: police officer, his name is Casto. Officer Casto, you know, 289 00:17:47,560 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 1: was able to draw his weapon and shoot Drinning in 290 00:17:53,800 --> 00:17:59,520 Speaker 1: the chest and the neck area. Now, amazingly, Drenning survived 291 00:17:59,560 --> 00:18:03,960 Speaker 1: that two gunshot wounds at close range, just survive them, 292 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:06,760 Speaker 1: but it stopped a threat at that moment time they 293 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:09,840 Speaker 1: were able to you know, pack Drinning off to the 294 00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:14,679 Speaker 1: local hospital where he was treated and arrested there and 295 00:18:14,760 --> 00:18:18,040 Speaker 1: spent some time in the hospital. Obviously, guy has been shot, 296 00:18:18,119 --> 00:18:20,600 Speaker 1: so they had to do surgery on it. But all 297 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:24,640 Speaker 1: of this happened in a very short period of time 298 00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:31,320 Speaker 1: where this perpetrator traveled just a few blocks and in 299 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:53,240 Speaker 1: his wake, you know, he just left absolute horror. So 300 00:18:53,280 --> 00:18:57,960 Speaker 1: many times, it's the quietness to get you when you're 301 00:18:59,080 --> 00:19:03,520 Speaker 1: here at a crub scene. It's really kind of hard 302 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 1: to put into words, but it used to be. When 303 00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:09,600 Speaker 1: I would get a call to roll out on you, 304 00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:15,720 Speaker 1: you get this sudden, i don't know, jolt of adrenaline, 305 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:19,280 Speaker 1: the anticipation of what's going to happen. You show up 306 00:19:19,280 --> 00:19:22,480 Speaker 1: and there's lights flashing, there might be fire trucks there, 307 00:19:22,600 --> 00:19:29,240 Speaker 1: there's people crying and and carrying on, and you're standing 308 00:19:29,280 --> 00:19:31,520 Speaker 1: there and you're about to make entry into the scene, 309 00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:34,320 Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden, the outside chatter begins 310 00:19:34,359 --> 00:19:39,280 Speaker 1: to die down, and there's this kind of uneasy piece 311 00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:42,520 Speaker 1: that kind of settles in the environment. Things get really 312 00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:46,919 Speaker 1: really quiet. You no longer hear the chatter, and you 313 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:49,000 Speaker 1: stand there just for a moment, And many times I 314 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 1: found myself I'd be there by myself in the room 315 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:58,159 Speaker 1: with a decedent, and you are able to begin to 316 00:20:00,920 --> 00:20:10,359 Speaker 1: see what had happened. Quietly, consider what had happened just 317 00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:15,520 Speaker 1: for a moment to the victim lying there, and what 318 00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 1: the police saw when they walked into Miss Steele's house. 319 00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:28,680 Speaker 1: I can't even begin two fathom what kind of course 320 00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:31,560 Speaker 1: through their bodies at that moment time. I would imagine 321 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:37,280 Speaker 1: that the police officers had never seen anything like this. Well, 322 00:20:37,320 --> 00:20:41,239 Speaker 1: I would certainly hope not, Joe, because this scene just 323 00:20:41,359 --> 00:20:45,440 Speaker 1: absolutely horrendous. The the indignities that this poor woman suffered. 324 00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:49,800 Speaker 1: Let's take them one by one. First, we know she 325 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:54,520 Speaker 1: was beaten with the iron. You think about this item, 326 00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:57,960 Speaker 1: and I urge anybody that wants to research this case. 327 00:20:59,040 --> 00:21:01,400 Speaker 1: Police take a look at the pictures that are available, 328 00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:05,880 Speaker 1: and when you you see this thing, it's not like 329 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:08,359 Speaker 1: you're looking in one of the things that we talked 330 00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:12,240 Speaker 1: about in forensics blunt force injuries. Okay, and I think 331 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:17,080 Speaker 1: many people think blunt force injuries they all automatically their 332 00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:20,320 Speaker 1: default position is something like say, for instance, a club, 333 00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:23,720 Speaker 1: a baseball bat, and you have those do generate obviously 334 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 1: blunt force injuries, but there are a myriad of other 335 00:21:27,080 --> 00:21:32,120 Speaker 1: items that can do this as well. And when you're 336 00:21:32,160 --> 00:21:37,040 Speaker 1: trying to interpret blunt force trauma, you're having to assess 337 00:21:37,040 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 1: it on various levels. You want to try to understand 338 00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:44,040 Speaker 1: how old the injuries are. You know, if somebody's sustained 339 00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:47,440 Speaker 1: a contusion or bruise. You want to if it's recent 340 00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:50,439 Speaker 1: or if it's in the distant past. And then you 341 00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:55,600 Speaker 1: try to determine is there a pattern to the item 342 00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:59,760 Speaker 1: that was used to strike somebody with. Let's say, for instance, 343 00:21:59,800 --> 00:22:02,199 Speaker 1: to the example I gave a baseball bat. When you 344 00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:06,680 Speaker 1: see somebody that is struggle with a baseball bat, they're 345 00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:09,880 Speaker 1: going to have these very kind of defined linear margins 346 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:13,800 Speaker 1: on either side that would give you an indication that 347 00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:18,640 Speaker 1: you've got this surface that has contacted the flesh and 348 00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:22,000 Speaker 1: it's left these kind of lines of demarcation. If you 349 00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:25,960 Speaker 1: will running parallel to one another, and you'll have you know, 350 00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:31,680 Speaker 1: an associated bruce with but with this item, this ironed. 351 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:37,040 Speaker 1: You look at the surfaces along the edges of this thing, 352 00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:41,679 Speaker 1: and they're multiple. You've got kind of the base of 353 00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:45,320 Speaker 1: the thing that's got a sharp leading edge, it comes 354 00:22:45,359 --> 00:22:48,600 Speaker 1: to a point, and then you have all of these 355 00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:52,720 Speaker 1: other elements to the structure of this thing that are 356 00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:57,080 Speaker 1: kind of protruding from it. So just imagine it's being wielded, 357 00:22:57,080 --> 00:23:00,480 Speaker 1: beholding this handle that's in the superior portion, just like 358 00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:03,359 Speaker 1: you think about an iron has an old fashioned handle 359 00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:06,360 Speaker 1: though that's kind of got a curved appearance to it, 360 00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:09,919 Speaker 1: and it's being brought down. Now, the totality of the 361 00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:11,960 Speaker 1: weight is going to be in the base. Remember, the 362 00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:15,640 Speaker 1: purpose of an iron is to place a heated surface 363 00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:18,840 Speaker 1: that has weight to it that will essentially run all 364 00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:21,800 Speaker 1: the wrinkles out of anything that you're pressing, if you will, 365 00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:25,879 Speaker 1: And so there will be a lot of weight that 366 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:28,480 Speaker 1: is going to be associated with the base of this thing. 367 00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:31,239 Speaker 1: It looks like it's made out of some type of 368 00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:37,159 Speaker 1: cast iron more than likely. So when you're delivering that 369 00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:40,800 Speaker 1: that strike with the same the energy that is transferring 370 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:46,280 Speaker 1: from this element from the iron to that surface that 371 00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:50,239 Speaker 1: you're striking in this case, miss Steel's head, you're going 372 00:23:50,280 --> 00:23:54,639 Speaker 1: to get these really deep, gash like injuries, but you'll 373 00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:57,000 Speaker 1: also have to try to pick out all of these 374 00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:59,920 Speaker 1: little attachments that are along the side of this thing, 375 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,760 Speaker 1: because they're going to generate a different type of injury 376 00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 1: and they're going to impact the body in a very 377 00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:09,760 Speaker 1: specific way. So it's it's going to be very difficult 378 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:13,280 Speaker 1: to kind of interpret these along the way, and the 379 00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:15,760 Speaker 1: pathologists would have had to have made sense of this. 380 00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:19,240 Speaker 1: And he said, well, Morgan, wi is it important you 381 00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:21,360 Speaker 1: know we know that she's been beaten to death. Well, 382 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:25,359 Speaker 1: it's important because you begin to understand that for every 383 00:24:25,359 --> 00:24:28,879 Speaker 1: one of these strikes, there's a readjustment perhaps of the 384 00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:32,840 Speaker 1: victim and of the perpetrator relative to one another. So 385 00:24:33,359 --> 00:24:35,440 Speaker 1: did he hold her down, did he put his foot 386 00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:37,640 Speaker 1: on his on her chest and began to strike down? 387 00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:40,280 Speaker 1: We'd at her. Was he chasing her about? Because those 388 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:42,920 Speaker 1: types of strikes are gonna look different than say somebody 389 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:46,840 Speaker 1: that's in a static position. What we do know is 390 00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:53,760 Speaker 1: that when they observed her, they noticed that these insults 391 00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:57,240 Speaker 1: that she had sustained, these injuries she sustained. He had 392 00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:01,520 Speaker 1: total involvement of both the head in the face on her, 393 00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:06,560 Speaker 1: and she was greatly, greatly disfigured. When you talk about 394 00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,959 Speaker 1: something that has this kind of concentrated weight to it, 395 00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:15,200 Speaker 1: like this old fashioned iron, it, with a single blow 396 00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:21,440 Speaker 1: you could strike lethally because the surfaces that you're going through, 397 00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:25,520 Speaker 1: the skin, the muscle, and of course the table, the 398 00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:29,320 Speaker 1: table of the skull. With that energy transference, you can 399 00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:35,000 Speaker 1: collapse all of that with one strike. And it's that 400 00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:40,960 Speaker 1: transferred some energy that can essentially render that person incapacitated 401 00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:43,679 Speaker 1: with one blow. Now you might not necessarily kill them 402 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:46,560 Speaker 1: with one blow, but you're gonna have high probability with 403 00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:50,000 Speaker 1: something that's heavier as opposed to something that's lighter. In 404 00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:53,680 Speaker 1: that same vein, I'm thinking that this would be we 405 00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:56,560 Speaker 1: throw around the term throw around. It's not really an 406 00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:58,919 Speaker 1: accurate way of saying it, but we do use the 407 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:01,880 Speaker 1: term a lot over kill. I think that that's when 408 00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:04,760 Speaker 1: you see this case where she has struck so many 409 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:08,240 Speaker 1: times with this item over and over again, you begin 410 00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:11,000 Speaker 1: to think why was this done and why did you 411 00:26:11,080 --> 00:26:14,959 Speaker 1: do this? Because you go from the point of killing, 412 00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:19,239 Speaker 1: which in and of itself is horrible, to mutilation. At 413 00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:21,600 Speaker 1: that point, you know, because you're doing it over and 414 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 1: over and over and over and over again, which is 415 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:30,520 Speaker 1: again so horrific, you know, in this particular case, and 416 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:34,560 Speaker 1: it would be absolutely horrific no matter who had happened 417 00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:36,639 Speaker 1: to But in this case we're talking about the steel, 418 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:40,920 Speaker 1: and the steel was this, you know, a very affable, passive, 419 00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:44,159 Speaker 1: gentle kind of person. You think, what would drive somebody 420 00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:48,000 Speaker 1: to do this to her? A knife was also used 421 00:26:48,320 --> 00:26:54,879 Speaker 1: to kill Miss Steele, and the damage that was left behind, well, 422 00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:00,240 Speaker 1: it's just nightmarish. I cannot imagine if you're not used 423 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:02,040 Speaker 1: to seeing this sort of thing. If you're a patrol 424 00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:05,120 Speaker 1: officer and you walk in and I've heard patrol officers 425 00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:08,480 Speaker 1: say this, you know, have stated this to me, and 426 00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:10,280 Speaker 1: they'll say, I don't see how you do what you 427 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:12,320 Speaker 1: do for a living. And of course, on my end 428 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:14,679 Speaker 1: it it never got easy. But it's very difficult for 429 00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:17,520 Speaker 1: say a police officer that walks into an environment and 430 00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:21,600 Speaker 1: they see not just this general soul who has been beaten, 431 00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:25,240 Speaker 1: you know, um about the head and face with a 432 00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 1: heavy object, but now they notice that her clothing is 433 00:27:29,560 --> 00:27:32,600 Speaker 1: in disarray, and it's in disarray to the point where 434 00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:38,200 Speaker 1: when they look at her abdomen. She's been partially eviscerated. 435 00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:43,640 Speaker 1: And for those that don't really understand that term, and 436 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:45,520 Speaker 1: it's by no fault of your own, trust me, I 437 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:48,679 Speaker 1: wish that no one knew what this tournament. But in 438 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:52,000 Speaker 1: our world, in the medical, legal world, and specifically in 439 00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:54,560 Speaker 1: forensic mythology, one of the things that takes place is 440 00:27:54,600 --> 00:28:00,439 Speaker 1: that when we remove organs, that process is called this ration. 441 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:05,120 Speaker 1: And if this ration means to expose and remove, well, 442 00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:09,560 Speaker 1: I don't know that they were necessarily removed, but her 443 00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:13,280 Speaker 1: vowels were essentially outside of her body. And in order 444 00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:16,800 Speaker 1: to accomplish this, this is not something that you could 445 00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:20,399 Speaker 1: have done obviously with this this iron. It would be 446 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:23,359 Speaker 1: a herculean task to do that and would take a 447 00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:26,680 Speaker 1: protracted period of time. So then you begin to think about, well, 448 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:29,640 Speaker 1: it was there an opportunity to, you know, again, use 449 00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:33,719 Speaker 1: a weapon of opportunity, that is, those things that are 450 00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:37,760 Speaker 1: at at his at Drennan's reach, or did he have 451 00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:41,280 Speaker 1: a knife on his person in order to go through 452 00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:46,080 Speaker 1: her abominal wall and essentially create a situation where she 453 00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:50,200 Speaker 1: had loops abowl resting outside of her body. Now, imagine 454 00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:52,480 Speaker 1: that you've beaten this woman to this point with this 455 00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:57,280 Speaker 1: antique iron, and now you have, you know, essentially opened 456 00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:03,080 Speaker 1: up her abdominal cavity to expose her intestine. When we're 457 00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:07,320 Speaker 1: in the morgue, we have specialized tools that are created 458 00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:11,000 Speaker 1: for this purpose. You know, you have the scalpels that 459 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:16,040 Speaker 1: are so sharp they're disposable, not handles, but the blades themselves. 460 00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:20,000 Speaker 1: They're so sharp you can essentially only use them that 461 00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,280 Speaker 1: one time. Some people are amazed that we have to 462 00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 1: change them so frequently. But the edge is so fine 463 00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:27,440 Speaker 1: on the things, and it's so very sharp that it 464 00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:29,880 Speaker 1: dolls very quickly. And the reason it dolls is that 465 00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:34,960 Speaker 1: you're going through multiple different types of tissue to get 466 00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:37,720 Speaker 1: down through the abdominal wall in this particular case, to 467 00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:41,320 Speaker 1: go through that layer of of skin, and then what's 468 00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:44,680 Speaker 1: referred to as the subcontaneous fat, and then down through 469 00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,920 Speaker 1: the abdominal muscles, which is an entire complex in and 470 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:51,960 Speaker 1: of itself, just to expose the bowl. This is quite 471 00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:55,560 Speaker 1: messy work as well for someone that is not clothed 472 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,120 Speaker 1: for it or prepared for it. There's no way to 473 00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:02,640 Speaker 1: avoid getting blood on on you, so you will if 474 00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:06,560 Speaker 1: you're perpetrating this crime, you will essentially be awash in blood. 475 00:30:06,720 --> 00:30:10,200 Speaker 1: You'll be speckled with blood all over your body. You'll 476 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:13,000 Speaker 1: have great, you know, kind of swaths of blood that 477 00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:18,400 Speaker 1: have been smeared upon you. And and if for us forensically, 478 00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:21,400 Speaker 1: when you begin to look at this, that type of 479 00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:25,440 Speaker 1: blood or transfer blood from an abdominal injury, as you're 480 00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:30,080 Speaker 1: opening up about, is going to appear completely different than 481 00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:33,520 Speaker 1: the dynamic kind of injury that you have when an 482 00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:38,120 Speaker 1: individual is being beaten with something like this heavy iron, 483 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:41,160 Speaker 1: that's going to have a completely different appearance to it. 484 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:45,479 Speaker 1: It's very important when you get an individual who is 485 00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:48,640 Speaker 1: clothed still with the clothing that they were wearing at 486 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:52,160 Speaker 1: the time, that you secure that clothing because you can 487 00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:55,240 Speaker 1: really begin to tell the tale as to what happened 488 00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:57,640 Speaker 1: and the dynamics of this environment. At least it will 489 00:30:57,640 --> 00:30:59,800 Speaker 1: give you an indication as to what may have happened, 490 00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:04,040 Speaker 1: even more disturbing than what you've already told us. Joe 491 00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:09,720 Speaker 1: Barbara Steele was also sexually assaulted. Yeah, she was. And 492 00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:14,120 Speaker 1: I think that just amount of a sense of propriety. 493 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:16,760 Speaker 1: I'm I'm not going to go too deeply into this, 494 00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:19,640 Speaker 1: just suffice it to say that she was in a 495 00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:22,960 Speaker 1: most horrific way sexually assaulted. And I think that this 496 00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:27,080 Speaker 1: extends out into a bigger, a broader narrative when it 497 00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 1: comes to Trenton, where his mind was, perhaps where you 498 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:37,160 Speaker 1: would feel compelled at whatever level to do this, to 499 00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:41,000 Speaker 1: to this this dear woman, what would be the driver 500 00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 1: behind obviously assaulting her, not just in life. But you know, 501 00:31:46,680 --> 00:31:49,640 Speaker 1: I have to put forth my opinion of the fact 502 00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:52,960 Speaker 1: that this was done post mortem, so you've got a 503 00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:58,000 Speaker 1: degree of of of post mortal activity that has a 504 00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:00,360 Speaker 1: sexual connotation to it, and I think that that's just 505 00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:03,880 Speaker 1: absolutely it raises it to an entirely different level if 506 00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:26,640 Speaker 1: this can get any worse at all. Forensic psychologists many 507 00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:29,520 Speaker 1: times they'll we'll talk about the ordered mind and the 508 00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:35,760 Speaker 1: disordered mind, or disorganized events versus organized events. In the 509 00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:41,040 Speaker 1: case of Mrs Steele's attack and and the others that 510 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:44,920 Speaker 1: were attacked at the hands of Trending, there is apparently 511 00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:50,600 Speaker 1: no rhyme or reason to a lot of this. Jackie, 512 00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:52,719 Speaker 1: you had mentioned just a moment or two ago, use 513 00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:55,840 Speaker 1: the term tornado. I think that one of the witnesses 514 00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:58,840 Speaker 1: saw that, and and having lived through a tornado, I 515 00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:01,000 Speaker 1: have to say that that that kind of sums it 516 00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,920 Speaker 1: up because everything is in disarray, everything is strown about, 517 00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:06,920 Speaker 1: there are no patterns to it, and many times as investigators, 518 00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:10,959 Speaker 1: that's kind of what leaves a scratching our heads. In 519 00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:16,600 Speaker 1: addition to an iron, we assume and supposed that it 520 00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:20,680 Speaker 1: was a knife, and then we have the sexual assault. 521 00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:25,880 Speaker 1: But the last part of this case, Joe, is how 522 00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:31,480 Speaker 1: Barbara Steele's body was positioned and left. We know that 523 00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:36,880 Speaker 1: his attorneys during his trial said that they attributed his 524 00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:41,480 Speaker 1: crimes to mental illness that included methamphetamine news and that 525 00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:48,120 Speaker 1: Drennan suffered from religious delusions, and we kind of see 526 00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:54,080 Speaker 1: a little bit of that inference and how Barbara Steele's 527 00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:58,800 Speaker 1: body was positioned after the crime. Yeah, I can only 528 00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:01,160 Speaker 1: recall I was singing about this when I was reading 529 00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:02,840 Speaker 1: through her case, and a couple of points kind of 530 00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:06,360 Speaker 1: struck me, and I was thinking, had I ever worked 531 00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:10,719 Speaker 1: anything that had a religious connotation to it? And yet yeah, 532 00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:13,400 Speaker 1: I have there there were a couple of cases along 533 00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:16,520 Speaker 1: the way. Obviously you're gonna have, you know, these kind 534 00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:19,919 Speaker 1: of people that are in spiritual conflict and that sort 535 00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:21,800 Speaker 1: of thing, and they wind up taking their own lives. 536 00:34:21,880 --> 00:34:24,880 Speaker 1: And you'll you know, you'll get these very involved suicide 537 00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:26,680 Speaker 1: notes and all those sorts of things. And I've had, 538 00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:29,279 Speaker 1: i think, to the best of my knowledge, I've had 539 00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:33,680 Speaker 1: one homicide that was a multiple homicide that had heavy 540 00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:40,120 Speaker 1: religious overtones. But in her case, what was kind of 541 00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:43,960 Speaker 1: stood out is the fact that when they observed her body, 542 00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:47,759 Speaker 1: her body had been positioned And I think that that's 543 00:34:47,920 --> 00:34:51,200 Speaker 1: very important here to use the term positioned on her 544 00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:54,600 Speaker 1: coffee table, so that you know, coffee tables are not 545 00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:57,600 Speaker 1: very big. You know, you have to think that you 546 00:34:57,640 --> 00:35:01,560 Speaker 1: know her goodly portion of her body to lead the appendages, 547 00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:03,920 Speaker 1: that appendicular areas of the body of the arms and 548 00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:07,280 Speaker 1: legs are hanging off, and the trunk of the body 549 00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:11,040 Speaker 1: is essentially supported, so the chest is kind of thrown upward. 550 00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:14,399 Speaker 1: It would seem as though that the coffee table had 551 00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:17,400 Speaker 1: been used, almost as if it were an alter, you know, 552 00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:20,080 Speaker 1: with kind of the hyper extended chest and the abdomen. 553 00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:23,879 Speaker 1: Remember we talked about the the trauma she had sustained. 554 00:35:24,760 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 1: I hate the word why, and you've heard me say 555 00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:31,600 Speaker 1: that before, because why so highly subjective, particularly in a 556 00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:34,440 Speaker 1: case like this, because you'll you'll never you'll drive yourself 557 00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,120 Speaker 1: to madness if you try to understand why. I try 558 00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:39,920 Speaker 1: to figure out why, it's much safer at least I 559 00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:43,200 Speaker 1: think intellectually to stay with you know what happened, and 560 00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:45,879 Speaker 1: maybe if we can explain that. But sometimes things are 561 00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:49,240 Speaker 1: just beyond the pail, if you will. In this case, 562 00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:53,560 Speaker 1: with this kind of hyper extended posture that she's in, 563 00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:56,719 Speaker 1: it was important to note, and I found this kind 564 00:35:56,760 --> 00:36:01,200 Speaker 1: of fascinating, that a clock had been and taken off 565 00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:03,800 Speaker 1: of the I guess it was the adjacent mantel piece 566 00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:06,839 Speaker 1: there in her home and placed upon her chest. There 567 00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,560 Speaker 1: was no indication, at least per the police reports, that 568 00:36:09,640 --> 00:36:11,920 Speaker 1: she had been beaten with the clock. The clock was 569 00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:15,799 Speaker 1: essentially placed on her chest. Why would you do that? 570 00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:18,640 Speaker 1: You know? Again, there's the why question. I don't know 571 00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:21,360 Speaker 1: that there is. You can never answer that. But I 572 00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:24,240 Speaker 1: do know that another item that they found immediately adjacent 573 00:36:24,280 --> 00:36:27,680 Speaker 1: to her body was a bowl from within her house, 574 00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:30,880 Speaker 1: and contained within that bowl was it's been described in 575 00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:34,520 Speaker 1: a couple of locations is either across or crucifix, you know. 576 00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:39,879 Speaker 1: But again you've kind of got this heavy religious overtone here. 577 00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:43,040 Speaker 1: I find it kind of fascinating when people go down 578 00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:46,560 Speaker 1: this throad of mental illness, you know with people where 579 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:49,000 Speaker 1: they say, well they were affected by drugs or they've 580 00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,839 Speaker 1: got this kind of hyper religiosity thing going on where 581 00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:54,960 Speaker 1: they're delusional and all that. When you look at that, 582 00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:58,279 Speaker 1: you think, well, why didn't he go to the home. 583 00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:02,640 Speaker 1: If he's so you know, out of his mind, why 584 00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:04,359 Speaker 1: didn't he go to the home of say a two 585 00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:08,160 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty pound auto mechanic, and walk into their 586 00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:11,279 Speaker 1: house and do this to them. That gives you an 587 00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:14,680 Speaker 1: indication that maybe he had targeted her for whatever reason. 588 00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:18,520 Speaker 1: It's disordered as an environment. Was he picked somebody that 589 00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:22,400 Speaker 1: was weaker than him. It was a completely asymmetrical attack. 590 00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:26,640 Speaker 1: He didn't pick anybody twice twice. Yeah he did. And 591 00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:28,279 Speaker 1: and that was the other thing. You know, the woman 592 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:31,200 Speaker 1: in the parking lot, what do we say about her. 593 00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:34,200 Speaker 1: He snuck up from the rear with her. It's not 594 00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:36,960 Speaker 1: like he approached her from the front and was menacing 595 00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:38,960 Speaker 1: her where she could have given her an opportunity to 596 00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:41,719 Speaker 1: drive away. No, he he snuck up from the rear. 597 00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:44,440 Speaker 1: And then when he crashed that vehicle, what did he do? 598 00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:46,560 Speaker 1: He came face to face with a guy that was 599 00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:49,400 Speaker 1: prepared to kill him. And what did he do? He 600 00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:52,760 Speaker 1: ran away. So he has some inkling of self preservation, 601 00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:56,040 Speaker 1: if you will. He's picking out people that are weaker 602 00:37:56,080 --> 00:38:00,319 Speaker 1: than him where he can dominate over them. In Miss 603 00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:03,640 Speaker 1: Steele's case, I mean, you know, God bless her family. 604 00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:07,560 Speaker 1: I can't even begin to imagine the depths of sorrow 605 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:12,040 Speaker 1: that's associated with it. Year old Joshua Grennan was convicted 606 00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:16,840 Speaker 1: of killing Barbara Steele seventy seven years old and injuring 607 00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:20,160 Speaker 1: a police officer. He was sentenced to life in prison 608 00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:25,560 Speaker 1: without the possibility of parole, and an additional ninety two 609 00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:29,680 Speaker 1: years on the other charges for the other crimes, including 610 00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:41,080 Speaker 1: attempted murder, robbery, malicious wounding, assault, stealing a car, and larceny. 611 00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:46,200 Speaker 1: I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this his body bags