WEBVTT - Pandemic Has Students Reconsidering Whether or Not to Be Teachers

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<v Speaker 1>It's Monday, April five. I'm Oscar Ramirez from the Daily

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<v Speaker 1>Dive podcast in Los Angeles, and this is Reopening America.

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<v Speaker 1>The pandemic flipped the educational system upside down last year.

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<v Speaker 1>It changed so much for students, but it also made

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<v Speaker 1>it difficult for teachers, making worse a trend that was

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<v Speaker 1>already happening before the pandemic. Fewer students are wanting to

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<v Speaker 1>pursue teaching lope was already making people think twice, but

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<v Speaker 1>now add in the perceived increase in risk. Emma Goldberg,

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<v Speaker 1>reporter at the New York Times, joins us for more.

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<v Speaker 1>Thanks for joining us, Emma, thank you so much for

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<v Speaker 1>having me on. We've talked a lot on the podcast

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<v Speaker 1>about how the pandemic has affected schools and our students,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, teachers as well. One of the main things. Obviously,

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<v Speaker 1>the falling behind in the academics is one thing. The

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<v Speaker 1>mental health of students and teachers has been another issue.

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<v Speaker 1>But now we're also seeing kind of an exacerbation of

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<v Speaker 1>something that was already happening before the pandemic, fewer people

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<v Speaker 1>wanting to be teachers, or at least people apply trying

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<v Speaker 1>to programs to be teachers, and we're just kind of

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<v Speaker 1>seeing that intensify with the pandemic. There's been a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of things. Fear for your health obviously, and then just

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<v Speaker 1>kind of all the added things that have come along

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<v Speaker 1>with the remote learning, hybrid school learning. It's just really

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<v Speaker 1>been a difficult go. So I'm gonna tell us a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit about what we're seeing with fewer students wanting

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<v Speaker 1>to pursue their teaching degrees. So I think we know

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<v Speaker 1>the pandemic has up ended a lot of different professions,

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<v Speaker 1>but as you kind of alluded to, just now do

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<v Speaker 1>more so than teaching. You know, people are either going

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<v Speaker 1>into work in person and there's not concerned for their

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<v Speaker 1>own safety and health, or their teaching remotely or into

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<v Speaker 1>the hybrid format, which can be really challenging in terms

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<v Speaker 1>of getting the results you want to see for your students.

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<v Speaker 1>So I spoke with the American Association of Colleges for

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<v Speaker 1>Teacher Education, which did a survey of all their member institutions,

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<v Speaker 1>and they did find that Enroland is down at both

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<v Speaker 1>undergraduate and graduate level teaching programs for under good to

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<v Speaker 1>A levels. That's almost for graduate level, just about ten

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<v Speaker 1>percent of a decline and enrollment this year. So tell

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<v Speaker 1>me now a little bit about why they think enrollment

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<v Speaker 1>is down. You know, as I mentioned, a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>things having to do with the pandemic, but historically also

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<v Speaker 1>there's a lot of dissatisfaction with low pay, the working conditions,

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<v Speaker 1>and the tough teachers that are put in having to

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<v Speaker 1>take care of so many kids. Really expand on that,

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<v Speaker 1>if you could please, This is a long running problem.

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<v Speaker 1>For years, enrollment has been dropping at both graduant undergraduate

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<v Speaker 1>level teaching programs, and that low pay compared to other

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<v Speaker 1>professions that require a similar level of education is often

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<v Speaker 1>cited as one of the main reasons. So a public

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<v Speaker 1>school teacher might make around six dollars a year, but

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<v Speaker 1>that's lower than people with similar levels of education, including

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<v Speaker 1>advanced degrees. So that's been a long running problem. But

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<v Speaker 1>then suddenly you add the pandemic, which brings a whole

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<v Speaker 1>slew of other problems for teachers from you know, having

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<v Speaker 1>to go in in person and be potentially exposed. Although

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<v Speaker 1>you know, there is that research showing that there isn't

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<v Speaker 1>as much of a risk of transmission in schools and

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<v Speaker 1>with kids, but it's still you know, is a challenge.

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<v Speaker 1>It just having to go in and do your work

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<v Speaker 1>in person when other people are teleworking, and then the

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<v Speaker 1>other it's just all the challenges of remote teaching. Teachers said.

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<v Speaker 1>A lot of the trainees as they spoke to said

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<v Speaker 1>they had looked forward to being in the classroom, being

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<v Speaker 1>able to form real emotional personal connections, and that's a

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<v Speaker 1>lot harder to do when you're on zoom with your students.

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<v Speaker 1>So some of the motives for why they wanted to

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<v Speaker 1>go into the profession in the first place might have

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<v Speaker 1>been kind of taken away during the pandemic, right. And

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<v Speaker 1>there's a lot of students also that are in flux.

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<v Speaker 1>They've gone through maybe half of a program or half

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<v Speaker 1>the years of schooling that they need to get their

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<v Speaker 1>credentials in all, and they might be stuck. They might

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<v Speaker 1>be considering other avenues, other types of employment where skills

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<v Speaker 1>can be transferable, or they say, hey, I'm I'm so

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<v Speaker 1>far in this, I gotta finish now. And then after

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<v Speaker 1>that the training that comes with it. You know, you

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<v Speaker 1>have to be placed in classrooms and be trained, and

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<v Speaker 1>some of that has been taken away altogether because of

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<v Speaker 1>the pandemic. If it's remote schooling, I mean how can

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<v Speaker 1>you get into classroom and start working with kids. So

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<v Speaker 1>that's been another difficulty for students and people trying to

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<v Speaker 1>become teachers. Exactly. I spoke with a lot of different

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<v Speaker 1>students across the country who are studying to be teachers

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<v Speaker 1>right now, and I heard a real ranto reductions. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>some of them really are considering switching to different career paths.

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<v Speaker 1>Some of them are looking for career paths that have

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<v Speaker 1>transferable skills, like human resources, because they're saying, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>I realize this is not what I want to do.

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<v Speaker 1>I want to I want to take my skills and

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<v Speaker 1>apply it to something else that might be easier or

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<v Speaker 1>higher playing. And some of them are sticking it out,

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<v Speaker 1>and they're saying this is actually reinforced the reasoning for

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<v Speaker 1>wanting to go into the profession. I did talk to

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of students who said, more so than Aubury

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<v Speaker 1>this year, they're aware of how deeply teachers are needed,

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<v Speaker 1>and so this is only reinforcing their desire to do it.

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<v Speaker 1>So I heard a broad range of responses. Yeah, I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>even mid endemic, we're hearing stories about teacher shortages only

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<v Speaker 1>because teachers didn't want to go in. They were scared

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<v Speaker 1>for their safety, didn't want to catch the virus. And

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<v Speaker 1>you know, school districts were turning to bus drivers, other attendants,

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<v Speaker 1>janitors even to watch kids in the interim until they

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<v Speaker 1>can get substitutes in there, and and even rules relax

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<v Speaker 1>for substitute teachers so that they can take over classrooms.

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<v Speaker 1>You know. So there's been a lot that has been

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<v Speaker 1>going on throughout the pandemic. This decrease in in teachers

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<v Speaker 1>and and people applying to these programs hasn't been happening everywhere, though.

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<v Speaker 1>I think in California, California State University Long Beach still

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<v Speaker 1>saw some enrollment climb up for them, So it's not everywhere.

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<v Speaker 1>But this is just kind of looking forward towards a

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<v Speaker 1>possible shortage of these other trends continue exactly. And you

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<v Speaker 1>know that is a little bit of a problem when

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<v Speaker 1>you consider that actually, a schools begin to open more

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<v Speaker 1>and more in person, we're actually gonna need more teachers,

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<v Speaker 1>basicly because a lot of schools are hoping to have

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<v Speaker 1>small out costs I do to allow students to social

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<v Speaker 1>distance from one another, especially while children still are ineligible

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<v Speaker 1>for the vaccine. So you know, you are looking to

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<v Speaker 1>have smaller class sizes, and at the same time you

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<v Speaker 1>might have fewer teachers to draw from a smaller pool,

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<v Speaker 1>So it's hard if you want to bring on more

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<v Speaker 1>staff that you're facing a potential shortage. We saw that

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<v Speaker 1>there was a lot of money being poured into schools

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<v Speaker 1>through these COVID relief bills that were just recently passed.

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<v Speaker 1>Is anything being appropriated to help with this, to get

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<v Speaker 1>more teachers. I know a lot of it was focusing

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<v Speaker 1>on vaccines and testing, but has anything any been any

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<v Speaker 1>money been thrown with regards to this part of it.

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<v Speaker 1>The COVID relief package to prove by President and and

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<v Speaker 1>does include a hundred and twenty nine billion dollars in

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<v Speaker 1>funding for K to twelve schools, which is great. Some

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<v Speaker 1>of that can be used to increase staff, and actually

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<v Speaker 1>the new Secretary of Education due to recently call for

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<v Speaker 1>all kinds of things that are needed to reopen schools safely,

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<v Speaker 1>including bringing on more employees, So it looks like some

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<v Speaker 1>of that can begin to up and there might be

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<v Speaker 1>some money coming from the release pocket. I mean, it's

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<v Speaker 1>been such a roller coaster for schools, for the children,

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<v Speaker 1>for the teachers, administrators, everybody. Really. I'm hoping that once

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<v Speaker 1>we start getting a little bit back to normal, this

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<v Speaker 1>stuff will start to normalize as well, because it's an

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<v Speaker 1>important part of our students lives, so and you know,

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<v Speaker 1>we need the teachers there to support them, so hopefully

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<v Speaker 1>this will all turn out. I'm a Goldberg reporter at

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<v Speaker 1>the New York Times. Thank you very much for joining us.

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<v Speaker 1>Thank you so much for having me on. I'm Oscar

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<v Speaker 1>Ramirez and this has been reopening America. Don't forget effort

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<v Speaker 1>today's big news stories. You can check me out on

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<v Speaker 1>the Daily Dive podcast every Monday through Friday. So follow

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<v Speaker 1>us on I Heart Radio or wherever you get your

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<v Speaker 1>podcast