WEBVTT - Why are Pentecostals growing so rapidly? 0:00:00.720 --> 0:00:03.240 Hey, everybody, it's me Josh, and I'm here to tell 0:00:03.240 --> 0:00:06.240 you it's official. We're going to be in Vancouver, b C. 0:00:06.720 --> 0:00:10.880 And Portland, Oregon this March. On March twenty nine, will 0:00:10.920 --> 0:00:13.200 be at the Chance Center in Vancouver and on March 0:00:13.840 --> 0:00:16.920 will be at the Arlene Schnitzer Concert Hall in Portland. 0:00:17.200 --> 0:00:20.880 So come see us. Tickets go on sale this Friday. 0:00:21.040 --> 0:00:23.919 Go to s y s K live dot com for 0:00:24.000 --> 0:00:26.759 ticket links and info and everything you need and we'll 0:00:26.760 --> 0:00:30.440 see you guys in March. Welcome to Stuff you Should Know, 0:00:30.680 --> 0:00:40.040 a production of I Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hellellujah 0:00:40.080 --> 0:00:47.040 and welcome to Stuff you Should Know. I'm Josh, There's Chuck, 0:00:47.159 --> 0:00:51.479 there's Josh t over there, and uh, this is, like 0:00:51.520 --> 0:00:53.960 I said, stuff you should know. Hey, you know we 0:00:54.000 --> 0:00:56.880 should plug Josh's record. Can you get that anywhere? Josh 0:00:57.240 --> 0:01:01.360 Migrant Worker? All right, he's got a new album out. 0:01:01.440 --> 0:01:04.360 He's a very talented musician. What's the name of the 0:01:04.360 --> 0:01:09.160 album self titled? I don't think they wrote out self titled. 0:01:09.640 --> 0:01:13.000 I think it's just called Migrant Worker. And it looks great. 0:01:13.040 --> 0:01:15.680 I haven't heard it yet, but the artwork is is amazing, 0:01:15.680 --> 0:01:18.319 and I know Josh is talented, So yeah, go out 0:01:18.360 --> 0:01:22.080 there and find it. Everyone. Jerry's not in a band, No, no, 0:01:22.160 --> 0:01:25.280 you know, I mean, I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna 0:01:25.280 --> 0:01:29.039 weigh their individual talents against one another. But Jerry's not 0:01:29.040 --> 0:01:31.920 in a band. What if Jerry is like secretly in 0:01:31.959 --> 0:01:34.280 a Heart tribute band or something that would be that 0:01:34.319 --> 0:01:38.040 would make my life. Yeah, well, I want to hear 0:01:38.080 --> 0:01:43.640 the album to Josh. Okay, okay, says Josh um So Chuck. 0:01:44.959 --> 0:01:48.560 I said Hallelujah to start this one off. And the 0:01:48.560 --> 0:01:52.640 reason I did that because it was a nod to Pentecostalism, 0:01:52.680 --> 0:01:55.720 which is why we're going to talk about today. That's right. 0:01:56.040 --> 0:01:58.760 I could have sworn we did an episode on speaking 0:01:58.760 --> 0:02:01.040 in tongues. We did not. We did went on faith 0:02:01.040 --> 0:02:04.640 healing and snake handling. Yes, both of those were excellent, 0:02:04.760 --> 0:02:07.000 and we must have talked about speaking in tongues some 0:02:07.200 --> 0:02:10.880 enduring both of those. Yes, but we're gonna talk about 0:02:10.880 --> 0:02:13.680 a little bit more because it's a big part of 0:02:14.000 --> 0:02:18.520 the Pentecostal movement, which huge surprisingly and you may have 0:02:18.560 --> 0:02:21.000 been the one that dropped that stat on me recently 0:02:21.000 --> 0:02:25.480 about being the fastest growing sect of Christianity is that right, Yeah, 0:02:25.480 --> 0:02:27.480 I did. It was the other the other day. I 0:02:27.480 --> 0:02:31.080 don't know where it was, and he said, well, maybe 0:02:31.120 --> 0:02:37.440 it was just Ah, I can't remember what you said evangelical. Yeah, 0:02:37.520 --> 0:02:39.600 I think I that doesn't sound like me. I probably 0:02:39.639 --> 0:02:45.560 said look it up. Of course I'm right. Oh goodness, 0:02:45.919 --> 0:02:48.400 that was a great Josh impression. But it is true. 0:02:48.600 --> 0:02:52.480 It is um, And I guess it just seemed counterintuitive 0:02:52.520 --> 0:02:56.560 because I naively thought that pentecostal Ism was sort of 0:02:56.600 --> 0:02:59.840 antiquated and something that was going away. Oh. No, that 0:03:00.000 --> 0:03:01.280 how they get you. That's what they want you to 0:03:01.360 --> 0:03:03.440 think of. The family spring on you. If there was 0:03:03.400 --> 0:03:08.200 a snake in your face. They say, here, hold this center. No, 0:03:08.320 --> 0:03:11.040 but we're gonna be respectful here because it's pretty interesting. 0:03:11.080 --> 0:03:15.519 I think. Starting now, okay, uh, we need to get 0:03:15.520 --> 0:03:17.200 in the way back machine, though, and go back to 0:03:17.200 --> 0:03:20.840 where this all began. Um, not really where it all began, 0:03:20.880 --> 0:03:23.919 because in truth that would be Biblical times, but where 0:03:23.960 --> 0:03:27.520 it began as a modern thing, is uh not that 0:03:27.560 --> 0:03:32.280 long ago nineteen o six in downtown Los Angeles they 0:03:32.280 --> 0:03:36.080 had something going on called the Azusa Street Revival, which 0:03:36.200 --> 0:03:38.600 we talked about that in The Faith Healing Episode two Yeah, 0:03:38.600 --> 0:03:41.400 it was a very big deal. This was at the 0:03:41.480 --> 0:03:45.320 Apostolic Faith Mission in downtown l A. There right on 0:03:45.400 --> 0:03:49.760 Azusa Street. Um, downtown I looked l A looked very 0:03:49.760 --> 0:03:52.559 different back then, obviously. Yeah, this is like the industrial 0:03:52.760 --> 0:03:56.120 area I saw. Yeah, I mean now it's just downtown 0:03:56.280 --> 0:04:00.640 l A. You're like the toy the toy zone. What 0:04:00.680 --> 0:04:03.920 do you call it the toy zone, not the zone. 0:04:03.960 --> 0:04:06.880 What do you call an area where district, toy district. 0:04:07.240 --> 0:04:11.440 There's a toy district there is. Yeah, downtown he's got 0:04:11.440 --> 0:04:13.640 a toy district. That's in a fashion district. It's where 0:04:13.720 --> 0:04:17.520 like you go get raw fabrics off the truck or 0:04:17.960 --> 0:04:19.840 cheap toys straight off the boat. That kind of thing. 0:04:20.000 --> 0:04:22.919 Got okay, it's not like just a wonderlantern. I know. 0:04:23.040 --> 0:04:24.720 I was like, I want to go see this. This 0:04:24.760 --> 0:04:27.159 sounds amazing. I want to go to the toy zone. Yeah, 0:04:27.400 --> 0:04:32.360 they zone. So, Um, this was going on back then 0:04:32.720 --> 0:04:36.400 down there. Uh. And that was led by a minister 0:04:36.480 --> 0:04:40.760 and African American minister from Louisiana named William Seymour. Yeah. 0:04:40.760 --> 0:04:43.480 And what was interesting about this, um is that this 0:04:43.520 --> 0:04:48.120 is six and at the Zooza Street Mission. Um, this 0:04:48.200 --> 0:04:51.920 was a like a like black and white. I'm not 0:04:52.000 --> 0:04:53.680 sure about Hispanic, but I would not be at all 0:04:53.680 --> 0:04:56.160 surprised it was Hispanic as well. Okay, they were like 0:04:56.640 --> 0:05:00.440 UM races worshiping together UM, and it was a very 0:05:00.440 --> 0:05:03.200 big deal. Just that alone was a very big deal. 0:05:03.640 --> 0:05:06.680 But what makes this the start of pentecostal is M 0:05:06.720 --> 0:05:09.600 is that UM at some point, I think in April 0:05:09.640 --> 0:05:14.680 of nineteen o six, they started holding UM three services 0:05:14.720 --> 0:05:17.560 a day, seven days a week, and these were like 0:05:17.680 --> 0:05:21.240 marathon hours long services each one. And the reason that 0:05:21.279 --> 0:05:25.480 they were doing this is because if you're a Pentecostal Um, 0:05:25.560 --> 0:05:30.320 you believe that the Holy Spirit UM had descended upon 0:05:30.440 --> 0:05:34.160 the Azusa Street mission and was in baptizing all of 0:05:34.200 --> 0:05:39.120 these people with fire and causing them to UM speak 0:05:39.160 --> 0:05:43.640 in tongues, to dance, a clap, to sing, and basically 0:05:43.720 --> 0:05:48.920 revived religion as as or Christianity as we know it. Like, 0:05:49.000 --> 0:05:52.040 that's what happened here in Los Angeles starting in April 0:05:52.040 --> 0:05:55.760 of nineteen o six, that's right. And they get that 0:05:55.760 --> 0:06:01.040 that goes back to the biblical days where the eleven 0:06:01.160 --> 0:06:07.359 remaining disciples after Christ was crucified, because you know, Judas 0:06:07.440 --> 0:06:10.160 was the twelve you know what happened to him. He 0:06:10.200 --> 0:06:12.520 didn't pan out so well, he didn't pan out so well, 0:06:13.200 --> 0:06:17.040 didn't kill himself after that? Yeah, he hung himself. Hanged himself. 0:06:17.120 --> 0:06:20.120 Excuse me, I always get that wrong. I always get 0:06:20.160 --> 0:06:23.919 that wrong too. But those eleven remaining disciples were baptized 0:06:23.920 --> 0:06:27.320 in the Holy Spirit and filled with the Holy Ghost 0:06:27.360 --> 0:06:31.600 and began to speak in other tongues during the Pentecost feast, 0:06:32.240 --> 0:06:35.440 which was a Jewish feast named so because it was 0:06:35.600 --> 0:06:41.320 I think fifty days after uh, the Crucifixion, after Passover, 0:06:41.600 --> 0:06:48.560 after Passover, and the in is Greek. Pentecost is Greek, right, Well, 0:06:48.600 --> 0:06:52.520 well put chuck, oh yeah, yeah, So what happened at 0:06:52.560 --> 0:06:55.919 that first Pentecost feast back in the first century, see 0:06:56.200 --> 0:06:59.960 was um they were like you said, they were by 0:07:00.000 --> 0:07:03.320 eight in the Holy Spirit. They were speaking in tongues. 0:07:03.400 --> 0:07:06.039 They suddenly had powers to like heal and all this 0:07:06.120 --> 0:07:11.440 happened at that Pentecost feast. Um. And in apparently in 0:07:11.480 --> 0:07:16.160 the Bible it basically says, um, hang around and wait 0:07:16.200 --> 0:07:18.600 for this to happen again, and you will know this 0:07:18.640 --> 0:07:22.160 will be a sign that the second Coming of Christ 0:07:22.440 --> 0:07:27.200 is at hand. And so again if you're a Pentecostal, 0:07:27.600 --> 0:07:30.160 you believe that in April of nineteen o six, the 0:07:30.200 --> 0:07:33.720 Holy Spirit showed up on earth again and basically bathe 0:07:33.760 --> 0:07:38.520 these followers in it in itself, in the Holy Spirit um, 0:07:38.680 --> 0:07:42.320 and to announce that Christ was coming again for the 0:07:42.440 --> 0:07:46.880 second time. That's right, and this um, if you are 0:07:47.480 --> 0:07:51.920 a complete agnostic or atheist, nonbeliever, this all sounds very weird. Probably, 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:56.320 But even back then and now, if you are um 0:07:56.360 --> 0:08:00.920 a non Pentecostal Christian, let's say, you might think it's 0:08:00.960 --> 0:08:04.120 pretty weird too. Um. It got a lot of blowback 0:08:04.200 --> 0:08:08.320 back in nineteen o six from U Christians and atheists alike. 0:08:09.000 --> 0:08:11.000 The l A Times. It was a reporter who wrote 0:08:11.000 --> 0:08:15.800 a story entitled Weird Babble of Tongues, where they wrote 0:08:15.840 --> 0:08:20.520 about attendees breathing strange utterances and malving a creed, which 0:08:20.520 --> 0:08:24.800 it would seem no sane mortal could understand. Devotees of 0:08:24.840 --> 0:08:28.840 the Weird Doctrine practice the most fanatical rights, preached the 0:08:28.880 --> 0:08:32.439 wildest theories and work themselves into a state of mad 0:08:32.559 --> 0:08:37.960 excitement and so um. It wasn't just the Los Angeles 0:08:38.000 --> 0:08:40.480 Times that thought this was a little odd. There was 0:08:40.520 --> 0:08:44.760 a guy named Charles Parham, who five years earlier is 0:08:44.840 --> 0:08:49.439 considered possibly the actual founder of Pentecostalism. Because this is 0:08:49.480 --> 0:08:53.640 really important. Speaking in tongues is the the basis. It's 0:08:53.679 --> 0:08:58.080 the thing that differentiates Pentecostalism from everything else. The idea 0:08:58.160 --> 0:09:00.440 that you can speak in tongues and when you do 0:09:00.480 --> 0:09:03.280 speak in tongues is because you are being baptized by 0:09:03.280 --> 0:09:06.320 the Holy Spirit and your your souls being sanctified, and 0:09:06.360 --> 0:09:08.840 that if you don't speak in tongues, you're not actually 0:09:08.880 --> 0:09:12.400 saved yet. That's that's the big differentiator. Well back in 0:09:12.480 --> 0:09:16.000 nineteen o one and topeaka Kansas, Charles param was preaching 0:09:16.360 --> 0:09:20.160 and one of his church members, Agnes uh Ose and 0:09:20.200 --> 0:09:24.160 I think her name was, started speaking in tongues. And 0:09:24.200 --> 0:09:26.000 so some people are like, no, this was the first 0:09:26.000 --> 0:09:28.920 appearance of this Holy Spirit that was announcing the second 0:09:28.920 --> 0:09:32.320 Coming of Christ. Other people are like, yeah, yeah, Agnes 0:09:32.440 --> 0:09:34.400 is great and we'll we'll give her her do. But 0:09:34.600 --> 0:09:37.840 really it was the Zuzu Street Revival where it wasn't 0:09:37.880 --> 0:09:41.440 just one person, it was everybody who came this this revival, 0:09:42.080 --> 0:09:44.760 this um, this thing where people were dancing and clapping 0:09:44.800 --> 0:09:47.760 and speaking in tongues. For essentially the first time ever 0:09:48.240 --> 0:09:51.000 or at least since the the Apostles back in the 0:09:51.040 --> 0:09:55.079 first century. Um, this went on for years. They held 0:09:55.280 --> 0:09:58.720 three services a day, seven days a week, four years, 0:09:58.800 --> 0:10:01.679 and people were coming and being ecstatic and having just 0:10:01.760 --> 0:10:03.960 a heck of a time. Almost said, a hell of 0:10:03.960 --> 0:10:08.880 a time at this mission. Um, it's like nine years total. Yeah, 0:10:08.960 --> 0:10:12.079 and then spreading out and going out into the world 0:10:12.120 --> 0:10:16.439 to basically say, Hey, everybody, Jesus is coming. Look busy. 0:10:17.480 --> 0:10:20.160 Do you remember that that was like Stephen King's favorite 0:10:20.440 --> 0:10:22.960 T shirt for a teenager to be wearing, Jesus is 0:10:23.000 --> 0:10:25.319 coming and look busy. Yeah. If you read his stuff 0:10:25.320 --> 0:10:29.560 from the seventies, like in every book there's a teenager wearing. Yeah, 0:10:30.000 --> 0:10:33.920 that's like George Constanzas when he stumbled upon the thing 0:10:34.240 --> 0:10:37.920 that if he looked annoyed every time someone passed his office, 0:10:37.960 --> 0:10:44.240 then they thought he was working hard. Serenity. Now, Uh, 0:10:44.320 --> 0:10:47.120 One thing we should point out to that the early 0:10:47.160 --> 0:10:52.640 Pentecostals were oddly ahead of the curve and allowing women 0:10:52.800 --> 0:10:56.160 to take leadership roles in the church at a times, 0:10:56.160 --> 0:10:58.240 and many times women of color. And this was not 0:10:58.280 --> 0:11:01.640 the norm in nineteen o six in any capa city um. 0:11:01.679 --> 0:11:04.040 So we should give them their due for that. Well. 0:11:04.080 --> 0:11:06.840 In fact, William Seymour, the guy who was heading the 0:11:07.040 --> 0:11:10.920 Zuosas Street Um revival Um, he married a white woman 0:11:11.360 --> 0:11:16.120 and he believed that the races um worshiping together was 0:11:16.480 --> 0:11:20.240 a clear sign that you know, God was present, the 0:11:20.280 --> 0:11:22.600 Holy Spirit was present, and that this was like the 0:11:22.640 --> 0:11:25.800 real deal, like this was really happening. But what's ironic 0:11:25.840 --> 0:11:28.720 and kind of I guess tragic even about it is 0:11:28.760 --> 0:11:33.240 that there was a faction that split off at the 0:11:33.320 --> 0:11:37.520 mission um and a group left the mission and founded 0:11:37.559 --> 0:11:41.240 basically their own branch of pentecostali Um. There's like one 0:11:41.760 --> 0:11:46.640 really clear through line that aside from the um the 0:11:47.280 --> 0:11:52.240 like religious beliefs of Evangelicalism and pentecostal um um. And 0:11:52.280 --> 0:11:55.520 that is the politics of it, right, so true, So 0:11:55.679 --> 0:11:57.960 there'll be some leader who comes along and says, no, 0:11:58.160 --> 0:12:01.559 this and this literal interpretation is being interpreted incorrectly. We 0:12:02.200 --> 0:12:04.480 know it's actually you're supposed to say this word. And 0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:06.440 all of a sudden, this guy's got his own his 0:12:06.520 --> 0:12:09.280 own church with his own followers, and they spread their 0:12:09.320 --> 0:12:12.600 own word right Um. This happened at the Azuza Street 0:12:12.600 --> 0:12:16.280 Mission and out of that came the two largest congregations 0:12:16.920 --> 0:12:19.520 UM that are in the United States at least, the 0:12:19.600 --> 0:12:23.199 Church of God in Christ, which is predominantly African American, 0:12:23.760 --> 0:12:28.160 and the Assemblies of God, which is predominantly white. And 0:12:28.200 --> 0:12:32.360 so what started out is this really amazing like um 0:12:32.640 --> 0:12:38.959 racially mixed, multi racial UM ecstatic worship of God split 0:12:39.040 --> 0:12:43.439 into two different factions of the same thing that divided 0:12:43.480 --> 0:12:47.520 along racial lines. Amazing. Yeah, So let's take a break 0:12:47.559 --> 0:12:49.319 and we'll come back and talk a little bit about 0:12:49.320 --> 0:12:53.480 what's happened since then, and uh, what Pentecostals believe and 0:12:53.559 --> 0:13:28.640 why they're growing so quickly. Alright, So before the break, 0:13:28.720 --> 0:13:32.960 you mentioned the Church of God in Christ, largely African American, 0:13:33.120 --> 0:13:38.040 six point five million members, not too shabby. Assemblies of 0:13:38.040 --> 0:13:41.760 God three point two million members. Also, I mean a 0:13:41.760 --> 0:13:44.640 lot of stats in here as we go, UM to 0:13:44.720 --> 0:13:48.480 really drive home what what has happened here? What has happened? 0:13:50.520 --> 0:13:53.840 Something golful? It's not how I mean in NT six 0:13:53.880 --> 0:13:58.840 percent of all global Christians were Pentecostals. By two thousand fifteen, 0:13:59.280 --> 0:14:06.160 that had grown to twenty five from two fifteen. That's astounding. 0:14:06.280 --> 0:14:09.760 It's like a nineteen percent jump and but also, Chuck, 0:14:09.840 --> 0:14:13.319 that means that one in four one and four Christians 0:14:13.360 --> 0:14:16.920 are Pentecostals. Now, yeah, and I think the stat from 0:14:16.920 --> 0:14:20.720 that Washington Post article says one in twelve human beings 0:14:20.760 --> 0:14:25.000 on planet Earth are Pentecostal, of just all humans. Yes, 0:14:25.800 --> 0:14:28.120 And if you're a Pentecostal, you're like, well, that's clear 0:14:28.160 --> 0:14:33.000 evidence that the Holy Spirit is spreading throughout the world. Um, 0:14:33.040 --> 0:14:36.680 this is not just the United States, in fact, it is. 0:14:37.960 --> 0:14:41.480 It is such a big deal because it's a global movement. UM. 0:14:41.520 --> 0:14:45.000 What is referred to as the Global South UM, which 0:14:45.080 --> 0:14:50.360 is Africa UM or regions of Africa, Latin America, Southeast Asia. 0:14:50.440 --> 0:14:55.080 The Global South is booming with even with I'm sorry Pentecostals. 0:14:55.920 --> 0:14:59.160 That's right, um, And I mean we'll talk a little 0:14:59.200 --> 0:15:00.920 more about that, but just kind of put a pin 0:15:00.960 --> 0:15:03.640 in that that that is I was right that it 0:15:03.760 --> 0:15:07.600 is the fastest growing religion or religious sect. Yeah. So 0:15:07.720 --> 0:15:11.960 there's this guy, he's a New Testament professor at evangel 0:15:12.200 --> 0:15:16.640 University of Missouri named Martin middle Stat and he's quoted 0:15:16.680 --> 0:15:19.000 a lot in this Uh who wrote this was this 0:15:19.080 --> 0:15:21.880 Dave Ruse. I don't know, I didn't he might have 0:15:21.920 --> 0:15:25.520 been Dave. But it seems like the author got an 0:15:25.520 --> 0:15:28.960 interview with with Mr middle Statt. I don't know if 0:15:28.960 --> 0:15:32.560 he's a doctor or not, but he he had a 0:15:32.600 --> 0:15:34.480 lot of great light to shine on this and kind 0:15:34.480 --> 0:15:40.320 of what's going on. Lightbringer, he's a lightbringer? Um, he said, sorry, 0:15:40.480 --> 0:15:43.840 Dr Oh, you just called him doctor and he might 0:15:43.840 --> 0:15:47.400 not be. But I also just called him Lucifer to well, 0:15:47.880 --> 0:15:52.080 good point, Dr Lucifer. All right. So he said that 0:15:52.160 --> 0:15:55.120 this is kind of like any kind of restoration or 0:15:55.120 --> 0:15:59.960 renewal movement within Christianity that happens when and it's happened 0:16:00.040 --> 0:16:03.640 over time in different ways, but that happens when Christians 0:16:03.720 --> 0:16:07.440 feel like, hey, we've been ignoring something pretty important here 0:16:07.440 --> 0:16:11.800 in the Bible directly from from Christ's words, and we 0:16:11.840 --> 0:16:14.440 need to recover that in a big way. And in 0:16:14.480 --> 0:16:17.640 this case, they're talking about the Book of Acts, which 0:16:18.200 --> 0:16:21.120 details what we went over earlier of what happened with 0:16:21.160 --> 0:16:25.320 the disciples after the passover. Right wait, wait and there 0:16:25.360 --> 0:16:29.720 so like this this idea is that it's literally being recovered, 0:16:29.760 --> 0:16:32.960 like there is this is literally happening. The Holy Spirit, 0:16:33.320 --> 0:16:38.440 as prophecied, is returning to Earth and andy in hearkening 0:16:38.520 --> 0:16:43.040 the Second Coming of Christ, right, yeah, so so like 0:16:43.080 --> 0:16:47.200 these renewal and reform movements have happened before, and in fact, 0:16:47.480 --> 0:16:51.600 some people trace Pentecostalism to one in the late nineteenth 0:16:51.600 --> 0:16:56.120 century called the Holiness Movement. And these these renewals um 0:16:56.240 --> 0:16:59.040 that follow in the tradition of the Holiness Movement. They 0:16:59.080 --> 0:17:03.840 are based on um, like a charismatic belief that's it's 0:17:04.000 --> 0:17:06.800 really easier to explain what it's not, and that is 0:17:06.880 --> 0:17:11.240 that stayed kind of call and response service where everybody 0:17:11.280 --> 0:17:13.959 sits down, stands up all at the same time, and 0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:18.880 it's it's very structured. Charismatic worship is the exact opposite 0:17:18.920 --> 0:17:21.960 of that. It's not structured. It almost seems like things 0:17:22.000 --> 0:17:25.199 are coming apart at the seams. Um. People are dancing 0:17:25.200 --> 0:17:28.120 and clapping, everybody's almost doing their own thing, and it's 0:17:28.160 --> 0:17:31.760 like there's a lot of room for you to have 0:17:31.880 --> 0:17:37.280 your own experience directly with the Holy Spirit, not necessarily 0:17:37.320 --> 0:17:40.080 just through this preacher or this priest or whoever is 0:17:40.119 --> 0:17:42.719 acting as the conduit like in a normal service. This 0:17:42.840 --> 0:17:44.840 is like the Holy spirits there in the room and 0:17:44.880 --> 0:17:48.320 everybody's interacting with it in their own way. Yeah, which 0:17:48.520 --> 0:17:51.800 Um sounds kind of fun, to be honest. I grew 0:17:51.840 --> 0:17:54.199 up in a Baptist church that was the opposite. It 0:17:54.240 --> 0:17:58.040 was one of these very sort of dry things. Every 0:17:58.040 --> 0:18:01.080 Sunday you would get your sermon that had to wrap 0:18:01.160 --> 0:18:04.040 up by noon because the pot roast was in the 0:18:04.040 --> 0:18:07.119 slow cooker and the falcons were gonna come on in 0:18:07.119 --> 0:18:10.600 an hour, and you could feel people getting anty. You know. 0:18:10.680 --> 0:18:12.880 It was just one of those deals. That's the church 0:18:12.920 --> 0:18:14.639 I went to. I remember we had a guy that 0:18:14.720 --> 0:18:18.560 came and visited one week that sat on the front 0:18:18.640 --> 0:18:23.400 row and started, uh started talking back, Oh yeah, oh yeah, 0:18:23.480 --> 0:18:26.600 started and just with like you know, you know, all 0:18:26.720 --> 0:18:29.600 all glory, hallelujah. So you know, they were just I 0:18:29.680 --> 0:18:32.080 was like, what is going on? Everyone did? Everyone was 0:18:32.119 --> 0:18:35.159 like what is this guy doing? Um, we don't do 0:18:35.240 --> 0:18:37.920 that here. There was They didn't say that, but that 0:18:38.040 --> 0:18:41.960 was the feeling. I think that man turned out to 0:18:42.000 --> 0:18:45.960 be St. Paul. I just remember being a kid and 0:18:46.040 --> 0:18:48.080 hearing him and seeing the reaction of people and getting 0:18:48.080 --> 0:18:50.439 the feeling that they're all like, don't screw this up 0:18:50.480 --> 0:18:54.280 for us, buddy, we uh yeah, right, were gonna doing things. Yeah, 0:18:54.359 --> 0:18:55.920 we can get out of here. In forty five minutes 0:18:55.960 --> 0:18:59.120 just clamb up. Um. I went to a funeral recently 0:18:59.359 --> 0:19:03.960 at a Pentecostal church and it was something else. But 0:19:04.000 --> 0:19:07.280 there there were people speaking in tongues and a lot 0:19:07.359 --> 0:19:10.359 of like shouting back and and like like you were saying, 0:19:10.400 --> 0:19:13.240 like that guy in the front row right there, Oh, 0:19:13.280 --> 0:19:16.200 I was in the thick of it. Yeah, And um, 0:19:16.240 --> 0:19:19.399 it was like it wasn't just that one guy, it 0:19:19.480 --> 0:19:22.320 was everybody there was doing that and they were doing 0:19:22.320 --> 0:19:24.800 it like at their own, like on their own terms, 0:19:24.840 --> 0:19:27.560 on their own speed, and um, it was really it 0:19:27.600 --> 0:19:30.280 was something to see. It was really impressive. I would 0:19:30.280 --> 0:19:33.960 pay cash money to see a hidden camera video of 0:19:34.000 --> 0:19:37.199 you during that. I was playing it super cool. I 0:19:37.240 --> 0:19:41.080 bet every once a while did you go right on man? Yeah, 0:19:41.600 --> 0:19:45.480 I said, freebird. I'm not into this, but you guys 0:19:45.480 --> 0:19:48.119 seem cool. No, I was. I was there and being 0:19:48.480 --> 0:19:52.080 explicitly not judging of course, you know, Like I was 0:19:52.400 --> 0:19:54.440 like I was a guest there, and I felt kind 0:19:54.440 --> 0:19:58.400 of honored to have been invited because everybody knew who 0:19:58.440 --> 0:20:00.840 knew me that was there knew that I'm not into 0:20:00.840 --> 0:20:03.160 that at all. But I also didn't want to put 0:20:03.160 --> 0:20:05.159 out any kind of vibe like I was being judging 0:20:05.320 --> 0:20:07.240 or anything. Would you even go if you're just gonna 0:20:07.280 --> 0:20:10.000 sit there and smirk, you know, that's no fun. Well yeah, exactly. 0:20:10.320 --> 0:20:12.239 But also I was very um. I had a lot 0:20:12.280 --> 0:20:15.840 of respect and admiration for the deceased, I thought, you 0:20:15.880 --> 0:20:20.159 can say. I was also very drunk. I had taken 0:20:20.200 --> 0:20:23.000 some shrooms a couple of hours before, and it really 0:20:23.000 --> 0:20:25.159 made everything even more interesting. That's cool. I'm glad you 0:20:25.200 --> 0:20:28.520 had that experience. Yeah, me too, Actually, me too. I 0:20:28.520 --> 0:20:30.640 think people should experience all kinds of things in their 0:20:30.680 --> 0:20:34.359 life like this that. But yeah, can possibly uncomfortable, exactly, 0:20:34.800 --> 0:20:37.160 And and like I could also see I was like, yeah, 0:20:37.200 --> 0:20:39.359 you know, like if you're really kind of open to 0:20:39.400 --> 0:20:41.280 this or even on the fence about it, you can 0:20:41.320 --> 0:20:44.960 feel how somebody would get swept up and be like, yeah, 0:20:45.000 --> 0:20:48.760 this is what I believe, you know. I mean, the 0:20:48.800 --> 0:20:54.040 word charismatic is an excellent word for um for that 0:20:54.040 --> 0:20:56.760 that type of worship, like it's perfect, but it's not. 0:20:56.800 --> 0:20:59.160 And we tend to think of it as like Pentecostals 0:20:59.680 --> 0:21:03.040 who just do that, and it's not. There's actually different 0:21:03.160 --> 0:21:08.359 charismatic movements that revived other Christian sex to like Catholicism 0:21:08.400 --> 0:21:11.840 had one back in nineteen seven, the Methodists had a 0:21:11.920 --> 0:21:15.920 charismatic revival, and um, it's typically kind of looked upon 0:21:16.840 --> 0:21:19.359 favorably by church leaders because they're like, all right, this 0:21:19.440 --> 0:21:21.280 is a little weird. We might start having to go 0:21:21.320 --> 0:21:24.320 an hour and a half of our services. But ultimately 0:21:24.359 --> 0:21:28.200 what it represents is people coming along and saying this 0:21:28.400 --> 0:21:31.399 religious sect is not dying. We're gonna breathe new life 0:21:31.400 --> 0:21:34.560 into it. Or if you believe in this kind of stuff, 0:21:34.680 --> 0:21:37.560 the Holy Spirit has chosen to breathe new life into 0:21:37.560 --> 0:21:41.680 this sect to keep it from dying off. Or it's 0:21:41.920 --> 0:21:44.840 good for business. That's another way to look at it 0:21:44.880 --> 0:21:46.760 for sure. And we'll we'll talk about some people who 0:21:46.800 --> 0:21:50.480 are who view the whole thing kind of transactionally to uh. 0:21:50.520 --> 0:21:52.280 So we should point out to you here about the 0:21:52.280 --> 0:21:55.760 different kinds of baptism. When we're talking about someone being 0:21:55.880 --> 0:21:59.399 quote unquote saved or baptized in the Holy Spirit, this 0:21:59.520 --> 0:22:02.560 is a you're at baptism. It is if you've seen 0:22:02.880 --> 0:22:05.640 uh people get dunked in the pool or in a river. 0:22:06.200 --> 0:22:09.280 If you're in a more rural church, that is a 0:22:09.320 --> 0:22:14.000 water baptism that is merely a symbolic public gesture to 0:22:14.240 --> 0:22:17.480 kind of celebrate and tell everyone, Hey, I had the 0:22:17.520 --> 0:22:21.520 spirit baptism. I'm saved now, so hey, get a load 0:22:21.520 --> 0:22:23.560 of me. Yeah, get a load of me. Watch I'll 0:22:23.600 --> 0:22:26.919 get dunked. Yeah. But if you're a Pentecostal, you're basically like, 0:22:27.000 --> 0:22:32.000 that's that's great. That's a nice first quarter step, right that. 0:22:32.240 --> 0:22:34.600 And it's not just Pentecostals who believe that, Like I 0:22:34.640 --> 0:22:38.600 think you know, if you're Catholic, when you're baptized, you're baptized. 0:22:38.640 --> 0:22:40.720 It's just done. You have a water baptism and you 0:22:40.760 --> 0:22:43.960 are officially baptized, your your your baby soul is not 0:22:43.960 --> 0:22:45.880 going to go to purgatory any longer. You can finally 0:22:45.920 --> 0:22:50.719 go to heaven, right with Like Baptists, I believe the 0:22:50.760 --> 0:22:56.000 water baptism is enough too. But what differentiates evangelicals from 0:22:56.000 --> 0:23:00.000 other other religious sects that believe that by Baptist baptism 0:23:00.080 --> 0:23:04.000 through water you're saved right then? Um? Evangelicals are like, no, 0:23:04.160 --> 0:23:07.000 you've just said that, Okay, I'm dedicating myself to God 0:23:07.400 --> 0:23:12.359 into Christ specifically. But what differentiates evangelicals is that there's 0:23:12.400 --> 0:23:15.439 still some other thing coming, and that's that baptism by 0:23:15.480 --> 0:23:19.040 the Holy Spirit. Well, it was the different in my church. 0:23:19.080 --> 0:23:23.320 It was you wait till you have that spiritual baptism 0:23:23.400 --> 0:23:26.680 and then afterward you have the public water baptism. Oh 0:23:26.720 --> 0:23:29.120 is that right? Okay, okay, so I've got that backwards. 0:23:29.119 --> 0:23:32.399 But but that's what so so even so, then I 0:23:32.400 --> 0:23:36.760 guess would Baptists be considered a type of evangelicals? I 0:23:36.800 --> 0:23:39.560 don't know. I don't know either. But here's what I 0:23:39.640 --> 0:23:44.160 found that differentiates evangelicals or that defines evangelicals. You're ready. 0:23:44.680 --> 0:23:48.240 There's a scholar from Baylor. He's an historian, but he's 0:23:48.240 --> 0:23:52.560 also an evangelical scholar named David Bebington, David W. Bebington, 0:23:53.600 --> 0:23:57.680 and he defines evangelicals as subscribing to four big points. 0:23:58.440 --> 0:24:01.600 One is that the Bible is the literal word of God, 0:24:02.680 --> 0:24:05.359 where like, if you're reading that God wrote that, do 0:24:05.480 --> 0:24:07.720 not question it, do not try to interpret it any 0:24:07.720 --> 0:24:11.800 other way, Like it is literally on its face what 0:24:11.840 --> 0:24:15.439 it means is the word of God. The second second 0:24:15.440 --> 0:24:20.240 point is that Jesus, Jesus suffered on the cross and 0:24:20.280 --> 0:24:25.960 died in order to cover humanity, and that you can 0:24:26.040 --> 0:24:31.280 be saved by accepting that as fact. That Jesus Christ 0:24:31.320 --> 0:24:33.960 is your savior. Man, I feel like we're having a 0:24:34.040 --> 0:24:39.119 revival here ourselves. Okay, we've worked up this. The third 0:24:39.160 --> 0:24:42.280 one is that you have to be born again by 0:24:42.280 --> 0:24:44.879 a baptism by the Holy Spirit. So I don't know 0:24:44.920 --> 0:24:46.960