Speaker 1: The volume. This is Prime Cuts, the best of the
Speaker 1: Colin Coward Podcast. Two great guests this week. Coach k
Speaker 1: former Duke legend, joined me right before Yukon rolled to
Speaker 1: the title No surprises there. He told me why he
Speaker 1: wasn't surprised by Yukon's success and told a great story
Speaker 1: about one of the great shots in Duke history. Plus,
Speaker 1: my buddy Nick Wright hit a bunch of topics we
Speaker 1: always do. But first my top takes of the week.
Speaker 1: I want to start with some thoughts on Caitlin Clark,
Speaker 1: the Iowa basketball star and Angel Reese, the great player
Speaker 1: for the national champion LSU Club. Sometimes social media is
Speaker 1: truth serum. People show you their lack of discipline by
Speaker 1: what they post. People show you their politics, their leanings,
Speaker 1: They show you their temper. I'm always amazed at people
Speaker 1: who think they're invisible on Twitter. For the record, folks,
Speaker 1: we have thirty employees now and growing at the volume.
Speaker 1: I've literally not hired people because of how they act
Speaker 1: on social media. Watching the media on this Caitlin Clark
Speaker 1: Angel re situation was really striking. One of the reasons
Speaker 1: I think women's basketball is so much better today than
Speaker 1: twenty years ago. Is because it's feisty and there's a
Speaker 1: little trash talk, and it's a little chippy, and there's
Speaker 1: a little more physicality pushing and shoving from time to time.
Speaker 1: That's the ultimate sign of growth because we've had that
Speaker 1: men's basketball forever. Women's basketball, more than any sport in
Speaker 1: this country, has improved over twenty five years. More young
Speaker 1: women are being encouraged to be athletes. It's always been cool,
Speaker 1: but a lot of people didn't get it and didn't
Speaker 1: encourage women. When you watch LSU and you watch IOWA,
Speaker 1: the people that rushed to Caitlin Clark's defense because of
Speaker 1: some taunting by Angel Reese timeout, that's called one road
Speaker 1: trip for Patrick Beverley. We don't rush to NBA men's defense.
Speaker 1: It's part of au it's part of college basketball, it's
Speaker 1: part of now all basketball. Nobody took a swing, Nobody
Speaker 1: tried to physically intimidate Caitlyn Clark, and let's stop there.
Speaker 1: Do you understand to get to the highest levels of
Speaker 1: any form of basketball, women's basketball, do you understand how
Speaker 1: tough you have to be, how resilient you have to be.
Speaker 1: Do you know how competitive Caitlin Clark can aim Jel
Speaker 1: Reese are Since they picked up a basketball, people try
Speaker 1: to intimidate them, box them out, get chippy. That's called basketball.
Speaker 1: I watched Larry Bird trash talk and Gary Peyton trash talk.
Speaker 1: If you really respect women, then allow them the same
Speaker 1: freedoms that we allow men. Verbal sparring is part of
Speaker 1: the sport. I watched Doctor Jay and Larry Bird throw
Speaker 1: punches at each other. It didn't end their careers. They
Speaker 1: were able to overcome it. Ten minutes later, Caitlin Clark
Speaker 1: when asked about Angel Reese, I'll read you the quote.
Speaker 1: We're competitive, we shore emotions in different way. She's tremendous.
Speaker 1: I have nothing but respect for I love her game.
Speaker 1: The way she rebounds, scores the ball incredible. I'm a
Speaker 1: big fan of her. Stop pandering. She's okay, she's tough.
Speaker 1: She can handle it. Show the same respect you would
Speaker 1: a guy playing basketball. He can handle some trash talk,
Speaker 1: you know. Years ago, I worked with somebody named Christine Leahy.
Speaker 1: She did the herd Line News Update, and she was
Speaker 1: in her mid twenties and LaVar Ball came on the
Speaker 1: show and started took some verbal shots at her. Didn't
Speaker 1: try to physically intimidate her, but took some verbal shots
Speaker 1: at her, and I didn't rush to her defense because
Speaker 1: she immediately landed two or three of her own verbal shots,
Speaker 1: and I didn't want to make her look weak. I
Speaker 1: thought the ultimate sign of respect to either Jason McIntyre,
Speaker 1: Christine Leahy Joy Taylor is their equals. They can handle
Speaker 1: some sparring and trash talk. I mean, I have strong
Speaker 1: opinions about athletes. Can I not handle a strong athlete
Speaker 1: having an opinion about me. The point is, if you
Speaker 1: really respect women, then you have to respect them enough
Speaker 1: to understand and they can handle it right, They can
Speaker 1: handle it. Caitlin Clark's fantastic Angel Reese is fantastic. I
Speaker 1: don't want to hear about Well, when's the last time
Speaker 1: that you saw a winning team taunt a losing player? Oh?
Speaker 1: I don't know. All throughout the college football season. I mean,
Speaker 1: you kidding me? In these rivalries, I remember Baker Mayfield
Speaker 1: grabbing his junk on the sideline. I got guys at
Speaker 1: the coin toss talking trash in college football one of
Speaker 1: the most amazing parts of the women's Final four. What
Speaker 1: about chippiness, Well, intimidation people trying to get into each
Speaker 1: other's heads. Women's basketball's officially arrived. They can defend themselves.
Speaker 1: Caitlin Clark's going to come back. She's going to be
Speaker 1: an All American. I will probably be one of the
Speaker 1: if it's to win the national championship, but to get
Speaker 1: to the top of even college sports, college baseball, college
Speaker 1: women's men's basketball, college football, college wrestling, it doesn't matter
Speaker 1: what it is. Do you know how tough and resilient
Speaker 1: you have to be as an athlete, a man or
Speaker 1: a woman. Show the women respect. I probably like the
Speaker 1: business side of sports more than you do, but I
Speaker 1: like it. And one of the cool things about owning
Speaker 1: this company the volume I can talk about what I
Speaker 1: want to talk about, and a lot of this stuff
Speaker 1: I don't talk about on FS one or Premiere Radio.
Speaker 1: So the WWE has been purchased by a company that
Speaker 1: had previously purchased the UFC. Now the w w E
Speaker 1: and the UFC together will form a separate company. And
Speaker 1: here's why it's interesting to me. I know Nick con
Speaker 1: and Dana White, who run the WWE and the UFC respectively,
Speaker 1: and boxing, because it's been so poorly managed forever, has
Speaker 1: really wilted and mostly vanished. There are occasional fights I like,
Speaker 1: but it's just not consistently delivering entertainment. And I said
Speaker 1: this years ago and I covered boxing in Vegas, that
Speaker 1: the UFC took advantage of the scarcity of boxing matches
Speaker 1: the cost whenever there was a good one. So UFC,
Speaker 1: whether you like it or not, just delivers a more
Speaker 1: consistent product. WWE same delivers a more consistent product. And
Speaker 1: so to combine those two for a new business, to
Speaker 1: me is utterly fascinating. And I went to the WrestleMania
Speaker 1: with my son on Saturday night. At so far I
Speaker 1: knew I could watch on YouTube TV highlights of the
Speaker 1: college basketball games, which I did Sunday morning. So the
Speaker 1: best way to describe eighty thousand people at Rustlemania is
Speaker 1: if you take yourself or you take life too seriously,
Speaker 1: you're probably missing the point on Rustlemania. I don't think
Speaker 1: my son, who's not a big sports fan. You know,
Speaker 1: he likes to ski, he likes to water ski, anything
Speaker 1: in the pool. He's good with a you know, he's
Speaker 1: played a little basketball, a little soccer, a little football,
Speaker 1: but not really a team sports kid. The environment. I
Speaker 1: haven't seen him laugh like that. I haven't seen him
Speaker 1: smile like that for three straight hours. I couldn't tell
Speaker 1: you when it's just a spectacle. And you know, I
Speaker 1: watched it as a kid, and then he used to
Speaker 1: lampoon make fun of wrestling fans. But then when you
Speaker 1: have kids, things change. And as a dad, I'm always
Speaker 1: looking for connecting points with my son, who's very much
Speaker 1: into science and tech, two things I'm not necessarily into.
Speaker 1: So I'm always looking for like connecting points. And so
Speaker 1: I told him, I said, we're gonna go to this,
Speaker 1: and I have a feeling you're not going to know
Speaker 1: all the storylines, but you're just gonna boo and share
Speaker 1: thumbs up thumbs down. And we got pretty seats, and
Speaker 1: i gotta tell you, it was as good a night
Speaker 1: as I've had in a long time. And I've said
Speaker 1: this before. My wife isn't into sports. She loves going
Speaker 1: to UFC because she likes the spectacle, the crowd, the glamour,
Speaker 1: the cocktails. My favorite sports to go to for years
Speaker 1: and years was boxing, but there's just not that many
Speaker 1: fascinating boxers or boxing matches. So I just found that
Speaker 1: story at WWE and UFC being combined. I can't wait.
Speaker 1: My wife and my son's favorite thing to go to,
Speaker 1: and now they've morphed. Can't wait. So Mike, I thought
Speaker 1: it was It's an interesting year. I follow recruiting, so Kentucky, Duke,
Speaker 1: Michigan State, Yukon or having very vibrant recruiting years. So
Speaker 1: I imagine next year the big brands will be back
Speaker 1: at the Papa College Basketball, that's my guest. Or or
Speaker 1: has the transfer portal created a new phenomena where the
Speaker 1: San Diego States, the Florida Atlantics are going forward going
Speaker 1: to have older players, elite transfers. How do you view
Speaker 1: this wacky kind of unique March madness this year. Well,
Speaker 1: I think it's a sign of the times. I think
Speaker 1: there's going to be a mixture and they're going to
Speaker 1: be more more really good teams. I'm not sure how
Speaker 1: many great teams, because to be great, I think you
Speaker 1: have to be together for a little bit more than
Speaker 1: one year. And so over the years we've had good
Speaker 1: recruiting classes and we've been able to try to mesh
Speaker 1: them in one year and then a lot of them go. Well,
Speaker 1: now when they were talking about one and done, they're
Speaker 1: about eighteen hundred one and duns in the transfer and
Speaker 1: so now each year in the last few years, so
Speaker 1: probably be more this year. And so how how can
Speaker 1: people build chemistry in one year? And so the people
Speaker 1: who go to the transfer portal a lot. Uh, they're
Speaker 1: gonna have to spend time trying to figure out how
Speaker 1: they how they developed culture. I just think, like when
Speaker 1: the year started, I said, it's going to be wide open,
Speaker 1: and I didn't think it would be this while, but
Speaker 1: it's it's wide open, and I don't I don't think
Speaker 1: anything's going to change next year. You know, Um, replacing
Speaker 1: a legend is hard. I think you did it the
Speaker 1: right way. You gave it a lot of thought, right
Speaker 1: and John Shire, to me, really works. But have you
Speaker 1: ever thought, okay, because if I'm John Shire, I'm like, okay,
Speaker 1: I want to be respectful to coach k and the culture.
Speaker 1: But what if there's something I really like? It really
Speaker 1: is different than than Mike, Like, have you ever thought
Speaker 1: about replacing you? Is not the easiest thing in the world. Well,
Speaker 1: I've talked to my wife about it, and that time
Speaker 1: she said that it wouldn't be that hard. But most
Speaker 1: of the time she said it would be hard. You know,
Speaker 1: it's not just picking the right person, but giving the
Speaker 1: amount of time that's needed. John was with me for
Speaker 1: nine years and when he was announced as the head coach,
Speaker 1: we had a runway of about seventeen months before he
Speaker 1: ever coached, so he could recruit two classes on his own.
Speaker 1: In other words, were with them knowing that I'm not
Speaker 1: going to be the coach, and the developed of relationships
Speaker 1: that were needed. And I think you saw it this year.
Speaker 1: He had great relationships with his team and we had
Speaker 1: an outstanding year. I've always told me, just be you man,
Speaker 1: being you. A lot of what you are will be
Speaker 1: us because we've spent so much time together. But you
Speaker 1: can't fill some on shoes. Just be comfortable into shoes
Speaker 1: you're wearing, and you know our culture and you develop
Speaker 1: it the way that you think is right. I have
Speaker 1: all the confidence in the world and John, I am
Speaker 1: a big fan of new things, but also regulation, be
Speaker 1: at Wall Street or tech. I am for the transfer
Speaker 1: portal and nil. But there needs to be guard rails
Speaker 1: right for everything. It doesn't matter if it's our freeways,
Speaker 1: our government, Silicon Valley, or college sports. It was a
Speaker 1: little to me wild wild West for the first fifteen
Speaker 1: months it was just the gold rush? Right, Is there
Speaker 1: anything you see so far? If you could make a
Speaker 1: change and go, like on the NIL, let's start with
Speaker 1: the transfer portal, because the NIL some schools are just
Speaker 1: not going to partake in it. But transfer portals here
Speaker 1: for everybody. Is there anything you would say, hey, let's
Speaker 1: be very careful of this or maybe alter this. Yeah?
Speaker 1: I think first of all, both concepts are really good.
Speaker 1: There were intended consequences that are easy to see. You know,
Speaker 1: an athlete should be allowed to benefit from their name,
Speaker 1: image and likeness. An athletes should have the opportunity to
Speaker 1: move and so okay, that sounds really good. Yeah, But
Speaker 1: if it's a business, you say, okay, these are the
Speaker 1: intended consequences, what would be the unintented In other words,
Speaker 1: put the guardrails up before you let the horses out,
Speaker 1: and once they're out, like, I don't see how you
Speaker 1: can control NIL completely. And it's a pre market. Yeah,
Speaker 1: if you have a better NIL than meet, what are
Speaker 1: you going to give it up? Is someone going to
Speaker 1: put a limit? Where do we put a limit on
Speaker 1: anybody in our society and how much they make? And
Speaker 1: so the transfer portal, I think it's been confused a
Speaker 1: little bit with the extra year of COVID. You see,
Speaker 1: I mean that combination Nil, you add that to it,
Speaker 1: add that to it, and so you have guys who
Speaker 1: you know, there are three different schools. You know, they're
Speaker 1: in a five year year period. I think the average
Speaker 1: age was a year and a half older this year
Speaker 1: than it's normally been for college and for college teams.
Speaker 1: And the thing that happens too when these kids stay,
Speaker 1: there are less scholarships for the high school kids. And
Speaker 1: so that was not an intended consequence I think. I
Speaker 1: think first of all, we think Congress is going to
Speaker 1: solve all this. We got to be Rooney Tunes here,
Speaker 1: and but the main thing Congress can do is to
Speaker 1: make it equitable in every state, which it isn't. Transfer
Speaker 1: portal is equitable, Nil is not. There's some states that
Speaker 1: don't allow it, and so it's got to be equal
Speaker 1: for everybody. And you know, my big thing, I wish
Speaker 1: we could take men's and women's basketball and make it
Speaker 1: its own entity, just like football is, and be autonomous.
Speaker 1: Have a certain foundation of rules with the NC double A,
Speaker 1: but let our two sports, our sport be run like
Speaker 1: a business. Have a marketing plan. Have the autonomous Football
Speaker 1: is autonomous. The game of basketball is not speaking of
Speaker 1: the game of basketball. I just read where the NBA
Speaker 1: is proposing going forward a positionless all NBA team, which
Speaker 1: and I remember years ago I worked in Portland. This
Speaker 1: is a long time ago. Bob wits. It was the
Speaker 1: GM and I remember Bob smart guy saying Colin, you
Speaker 1: guys in the media get too caught up on positions.
Speaker 1: I just one good, good, long, fast, twitchy basketball players.
Speaker 1: I don't care. So Bob was about twenty years ahead
Speaker 1: of me, right unintended consequence, I do like an old
Speaker 1: school point guard who distributes first score second. That's me.
Speaker 1: I'm probably outdated. What do you make of positionless basketball?
Speaker 1: Or does it Lebron make everybody think it's easy? Or
Speaker 1: the truth is, positions are pretty good. It's just Lebron's
Speaker 1: blown it up because he can do anything. Well. You
Speaker 1: know your love for the point guard. I'm a point guard,
Speaker 1: so in some essence you have a love for me.
Speaker 1: But then maybe it's not that big. But the old
Speaker 1: fashioned point guard just doesn't exist, or it's so like
Speaker 1: an extinct animal. Run of it right now, you know,
Speaker 1: really in the late eighties and early nineties, we started
Speaker 1: at Duke what I call positionless. I always used to
Speaker 1: tell my staff and family, Well, desistn't a baseball team.
Speaker 1: There's not a third baseman. They go to a position.
Speaker 1: Why the heck do we have guards, forwards and centers?
Speaker 1: You know? Just introduce him as as players and in
Speaker 1: other words, like you and I are two of the
Speaker 1: top four players on a team, and we are both
Speaker 1: the two guard. Am I only going to play one
Speaker 1: of us? Or am I going to play my four
Speaker 1: best players? I'm going to play both of us? So
Speaker 1: why put a limit on us? Saying that, you know
Speaker 1: we're two guards, we're really good basketball players, and both
Speaker 1: of us can shoot. I always like saying that because
Speaker 1: ye wasn't I wasn't referred to as a good shooter.
Speaker 1: So's that analogy? Actually, I feel pretty good about it. Well,
Speaker 1: you were a defender, and you were tough. You had
Speaker 1: the many of the Chris Paul qualities I like, which
Speaker 1: is That's where I'm I'm very much about. I like
Speaker 1: the new basketball. I think it's very very skilled. I
Speaker 1: covered Arvidas Sabonis, who was pre Yoki almost like a
Speaker 1: point now he would have been the greatest player, one
Speaker 1: of the great if he was here young, yeah, young
Speaker 1: boy and his in early twenties, he would be one
Speaker 1: of the top five or ten players in the history
Speaker 1: of the game. Uh yeah, no question about it. You
Speaker 1: got him later in his probably mid thirties or yes, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: But he was a great player, not a good Oh oh,
Speaker 1: I mean Mike. He would hit a twenty four footer
Speaker 1: and he would make a behind the back pass. I
Speaker 1: got the heavy footed Arvitas Sabonis. Yes, remarkable player and
Speaker 1: a fun guy to cover. So do you remember, because
Speaker 1: really what you you you Nick Saban, It doesn't matter
Speaker 1: if it's Beheim Mark few your talent accumulators. So what
Speaker 1: you're doing is you're a and you're finding kids who
Speaker 1: aren't fully developed emotionally physically. It's very difficult to pro
Speaker 1: football coach. I get four years of film through college.
Speaker 1: I know what he can and can't do. You're taking kids.
Speaker 1: I'm a late I'm a I blossom late. I think
Speaker 1: in my career, I think a lot of people do. Um,
Speaker 1: how often do you see a player and did you
Speaker 1: know instantly, oh, okay, that person will be a pro.
Speaker 1: Now at Duke I think a lot of people would suggest, oh,
Speaker 1: it's duke guys, but you've recruited some three star guys
Speaker 1: in your career. How follow it? How often did you
Speaker 1: see a lebron Ish player and go okay, that's done?
Speaker 1: Or the players develop more slowly than most of us think. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well there are a few. I mean, you can see
Speaker 1: Scion if Grant Hill was in this time. Yes, you know,
Speaker 1: uh dose players, Uh, Jason Tatum, you know Bagley one,
Speaker 1: Dell Carter could probably say it another year, but you
Speaker 1: can see it. But you also you also can see
Speaker 1: like where their bodies. In other words, do they fit
Speaker 1: the dimensions of an NBA player wingspan? It's not just height,
Speaker 1: it's wingspan, speed, okay, And then are they where are
Speaker 1: they emotionally? We try to recruit kids with good character
Speaker 1: because they're gonna in order to not just to get there,
Speaker 1: but to stay, they're going to have to have balance.
Speaker 1: And so we're able to see that pretty much with
Speaker 1: the guards. Like when I saw Tias Jones the first time,
Speaker 1: I said, Wow, this kid's like a machine. Now he
Speaker 1: is an old point guard, and when he has his
Speaker 1: name on that ball, you can't when he throws it
Speaker 1: you better catch it because he doesn't want to turn
Speaker 1: it over. When I saw him the first time, I said,
Speaker 1: I gotta have him. I didn't know that he would
Speaker 1: be a pro rud away. I felt that he would
Speaker 1: be a pro after Awhile Mike Dunleavy. When we recruited him,
Speaker 1: he saw out of Portland and yeah, and he was
Speaker 1: six six and a half one seventy five, had no
Speaker 1: hair on his chest, did not shave. Three years later
Speaker 1: he was six to nine and a half and two
Speaker 1: thirty and so there's some guys brandon Ingram. When we
Speaker 1: recruited him, I told his parents they were going to
Speaker 1: the McDonald's game. I said, we're not allowed the first day.
Speaker 1: The pro people will be there. Your son will be
Speaker 1: a top five draft pick after the workout. And they said,
Speaker 1: what do you mean. I said, he's got all the dimensions.
Speaker 1: He's got you. Not only that, but he can play
Speaker 1: any position. He can be a guard. And so you
Speaker 1: can see those those type of things and predict them,
Speaker 1: and some kids you can't. Batty did not fit, and
Speaker 1: he wasn't a great athlete, but for a while he
Speaker 1: became he was intellectually ahead of others and in today's game,
Speaker 1: the younger players are not They're more athletic, but they're
Speaker 1: not as savvy about the game as the players even
Speaker 1: five years ago. That's something with all the workout guys
Speaker 1: and that they're great, but they teach you stuff with
Speaker 1: the ball. And if we're playing a forty minute game
Speaker 1: in college, if you have the ball three minutes, that's
Speaker 1: a lot. So you better learn the game without the ball.
Speaker 1: You got to learn to get your shot before you
Speaker 1: get the ball. That's not taught to the level that
Speaker 1: it used to be. So I think we're getting better athletes,
Speaker 1: but more undertaught players as far as the game goes.
Speaker 1: I always love when the Patriots played the Chiefs. You
Speaker 1: got a I get a chess match between Belichick's brain
Speaker 1: and Andy Reid's I love that. I love when they play.
Speaker 1: Was there a coach and maybe it's a well known coach.
Speaker 1: It's a Jim Calhoun, Um, it's a Dean Smith. But
Speaker 1: is there a coach maybe that I wouldn't think of
Speaker 1: off the top of my head. That you love the
Speaker 1: intellectual chess match that he was just move for move.
Speaker 1: You always knew it was not only between Duke and
Speaker 1: a team. It was between you and that coach. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think that the frequency of the time he competed
Speaker 1: against Dean Smith, you know, because he you know, he
Speaker 1: was a remarkable coach and he had immense loyalty from
Speaker 1: his from his players. You know, he really really wanted
Speaker 1: a great coaches of any sport. Uh, my buddy Jim Valvano. Uh.
Speaker 1: The spontaneity of doing anything at any time. There was
Speaker 1: some predictable with some coaches up to a point, and
Speaker 1: then there was the unpredictability of like like Jim and uh.
Speaker 1: But you know, sometimes you play against your coach, against
Speaker 1: the team that you say, I don't know if I
Speaker 1: can coach a team better than John Becker at Vermont,
Speaker 1: you know, and who year after year just produced his
Speaker 1: that that high level of team. I thought one of
Speaker 1: my good friends friend Dumphy, who got back into college
Speaker 1: coaching when he was the coach at Penn, he was
Speaker 1: on a decade movement of just he got it at
Speaker 1: a high at a high level. But now I think
Speaker 1: you weren't from coaching against all different types of people.
Speaker 1: But those are a few of the ones that made
Speaker 1: an impact on me. I remember covering I was a
Speaker 1: young sportscaster. I was in Denver. Bobby Hurley had about
Speaker 1: with stomach sickness all ye that yeah, And so I
Speaker 1: remember you saying it could have been to me or
Speaker 1: a group because I was in Vegas as a sportscaster.
Speaker 1: You and this meant so much to Tark. I can't
Speaker 1: tell you how much this meant to Tark. You said,
Speaker 1: we play hard at Duke. I've never seen any team
Speaker 1: play that hard between Gurgerich and Tark, and I covered Tark.
Speaker 1: You have no idea. You and Mickey were very complimentary
Speaker 1: of him. It meant so much to him, and I was.
Speaker 1: I look back at your career and I think that's
Speaker 1: one of your great moments because that team was stocked.
Speaker 1: They so you lost in Denver the following year. One
Speaker 1: of your stars was a true freshman. You'd been beaten
Speaker 1: badly by him the year before. There was a psychology there.
Speaker 1: Go back to the time you beat you and l
Speaker 1: v If. I said to you three or four moments
Speaker 1: of your career. I remember walking out of that game
Speaker 1: and thinking, I don't think the media gets what just happened.
Speaker 1: I thought it was just an incredible moment. You know,
Speaker 1: I've done I've done a lot of speaking, and since
Speaker 1: I retired, I did a couple of commercials. I've done
Speaker 1: some things and one of the statements and one of
Speaker 1: the commercials has closed the gap, and we were able
Speaker 1: to close the gap from ninety to ninety one. Grant
Speaker 1: Hill helped us close that gap, but also the experience.
Speaker 1: We were pretty good, but then we got to be
Speaker 1: really good. And the ninety one semi final final four
Speaker 1: game with Vegas, it's one of the epic games in
Speaker 1: the history of our sport. One I had Jerry Carcanian
Speaker 1: I were good friends and I had ultimate respect because
Speaker 1: anybody who can get his team to play that hard
Speaker 1: with that especially that level of talent, you gotta be
Speaker 1: crazy good. But we were really, really good, and I
Speaker 1: thought what helped us in that game was said it
Speaker 1: was a semifinal, not the final. They had won forty
Speaker 1: five in a row. They had beaten us. Psychologically, we
Speaker 1: have an advantage, you know, we do have an advantage,
Speaker 1: and they had destroyed everybody, and no, not beaten, they
Speaker 1: crushed crushed everybody. So we got we were talking about
Speaker 1: if we can get them in the last few minutes.
Speaker 1: We've been there before. They haven't been there before. And
Speaker 1: everyone talks about Latner shot against Kentucky and which they should,
Speaker 1: but one of the defining moments for me it was
Speaker 1: Hurley shot just over two minutes to go. I think
Speaker 1: they'd gone up by five and Tark went to as
Speaker 1: Amba defense and before I could say anything to call
Speaker 1: out anything, Hurley comes down and he jacks up at
Speaker 1: three and he hits it. So for me, I think
Speaker 1: in possessions two points, there were three two point possessions,
Speaker 1: so his shot knocked it down to one two point possession.
Speaker 1: It was really wanted the biggest shots in my you know,
Speaker 1: for my career that a player took and I didn't
Speaker 1: call it. I didn't call it, and then we were
Speaker 1: fortunate we got their guard filed out, uh you know,
Speaker 1: and uh Greg Anthony and uh Laitner hit some free
Speaker 1: throws and God bless America. You know, we won a
Speaker 1: lot of sad people in Sindon City. Believe me, I
Speaker 1: was a sportscaster there. So let's welcome to Nick Wright.
Speaker 1: Uh you know, I'm your love him. First thing first,
Speaker 1: what's right with Nick? Right? So I was standing in
Speaker 1: my six seven minute preamble to you, is the ultimate
Speaker 1: respect to women as they can handle themselves, and that
Speaker 1: Caitlin Clark is not a lamb to be able to
Speaker 1: get to the highest level of any Division one sport baseball, football, hockey, wrestling,
Speaker 1: women's basketball. You've been mocked, you've been taunted, you've been
Speaker 1: boxed out, You've probably taken a punch. These women are
Speaker 1: feisty and they talk trash, and the ultimate respect isn't
Speaker 1: rushing to their defense, it's realizing they can handle that.
Speaker 1: She's nobody's underdog. Colin Listen, Angel Reese is awesome. Angel
Speaker 1: Reese is Some of the people commenting like, oh, who
Speaker 1: was Angel Reese to trash talk? She was the fourth
Speaker 1: leading scorer in that game. She also set the all
Speaker 1: time record for double doubles in a season, was a
Speaker 1: first team All American, was the MVP of the goddamn tournament.
Speaker 1: So angrew Reese when they win the championships. Allowed to
Speaker 1: talk trash if she wants now. Caitlin Clark was the
Speaker 1: best player in the country, and I know for some people,
Speaker 1: because of Angel Reese's race and size, they looked at
Speaker 1: her talking trash different than cait Clark talking trash. It's
Speaker 1: nonsense and Caitlyn Clark didn't ask for anybody's protection. Caitlyn
Speaker 1: Clark dished it out, knew she could take it the
Speaker 1: whole thing. And what I find so there is the
Speaker 1: reaction to the trash talk, which I know you talked about,
Speaker 1: We've talked about everywhere. To me, there was there were
Speaker 1: obviously an obvious, massive racial component to who is and
Speaker 1: who is not allowed to trash talk. But then there
Speaker 1: is the what could have been action of the trash talk.
Speaker 1: The bigger story, which is the success of this tournament
Speaker 1: and can women's basketball at the collegiate level become women's tennis,
Speaker 1: which is on par, if not at times exceeded the
Speaker 1: interest in men's tennis, because we as a country have
Speaker 1: shown we will watch women's sports if there is it's
Speaker 1: not an inherent sexism, like we won't watch women's sports.
Speaker 1: What we need is to feel like we're watching the
Speaker 1: best product possible. And I feel like in tennis, the
Speaker 1: men's serves became so powerful that there wasn't serve and
Speaker 1: volley plus then all of a sudden, Serena comes around
Speaker 1: and you have a massive American starts like a perfect storm.
Speaker 1: It's like it's a better product. It's more entertaining, all
Speaker 1: of it. Women's college basketball is a better product than
Speaker 1: men's college basketball, Flatland, because the things you need, which
Speaker 1: is consistency of roster continuity stars are there in the
Speaker 1: women's college game in a way they're not in the
Speaker 1: men's game. And I think women's college basketball can have
Speaker 1: a huge moment here because that LSU team scored one
Speaker 1: hundred and two points in a regulation college basketball game.
Speaker 1: San Diego State one going to score one hundred and
Speaker 1: two last night if they got a third half by themselves,
Speaker 1: and no disrespect, but I guess that's a little dispect
Speaker 1: to them. It there is just it's a hell of
Speaker 1: a product. The shop making awesome. And yes, we understand
Speaker 1: you're not gonna get the same level of athleticism you
Speaker 1: get from the men's game. We can go to the
Speaker 1: NBA for that. And I like the attitudes, I like
Speaker 1: the personalities, I like the stories. I really my daughter
Speaker 1: and my youngest daughter, who's of my two daughters, a
Speaker 1: bigger sports fan, has asked me, you know, why don't
Speaker 1: I watch more women's sports? And I've never had like
Speaker 1: the greatest answer for her. She's nine, and I was like,
Speaker 1: we can go to some w NBA games, but the
Speaker 1: w NBA versus the NBA one is just clearly from
Speaker 1: basketball wise, a superior product. But the female college games
Speaker 1: were awesome. They were. And here's the other part of it.
Speaker 1: I wonder if with Nil Colin, if there's not way
Speaker 1: more money playing in college then going to the w NBA.
Speaker 1: I wonder if for Caitlin Clark, can she not make
Speaker 1: more money like whatever her sponsors will be, wouldn't they
Speaker 1: prefer she be staying in college as long as possible
Speaker 1: because those ratings are more viewers, more everything then at
Speaker 1: the w NBA level. So I think that sport can
Speaker 1: really have a moment right now. I really do. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And I think the men's final four, the women blew
Speaker 1: out ratings. The men's was one of the least watch
Speaker 1: because you had underdogs and beat Between the transfer portal
Speaker 1: and men's college basketball and the one and done culture,
Speaker 1: you can't name any starters. The average college fan this
Speaker 1: morning couldn't name two players for San Diego State and
Speaker 1: they were in the title game. So and I do
Speaker 1: think that doesn't it doesn't completely puncture the NBA. But mobility,
Speaker 1: Adam Silver's always been more concerned about it than I would.
Speaker 1: But I think one of the reasons the Warriors continue
Speaker 1: to get the best TV ratings and the Celtics are
Speaker 1: right behind them is because it's the same group of
Speaker 1: core group of guys for like six years, and that
Speaker 1: really matters. That's why Brooklyn had all these stars and
Speaker 1: terrible ratings. By the way, the Lakers last three years
Speaker 1: I've had terrible ratings because the rosters constantly influx well
Speaker 1: and the NBA doesn't need to do a better job
Speaker 1: in my opinion of marketing its next generation steps thirty
Speaker 1: five Lebron's thirty eight, you know what I mean. Durant's
Speaker 1: an old thirty four because of the injuries, Like you're
Speaker 1: gonna you're really living ratings wise off a group of
Speaker 1: players who should not still be excellent. You know, they're
Speaker 1: very the fact that Lebron's going on twenty years of
Speaker 1: super high level play and relevance. That's borrowed time and
Speaker 1: now maybe they're gonna try to transfer that to Bron,
Speaker 1: But that's a hell of a bet they're nat Well.
Speaker 1: The other thing, what can we take Sometimes I will
Speaker 1: see a business out there with the volume we have
Speaker 1: over thirty employees now, but I'll see a smaller business
Speaker 1: and I'll say, oh, I like what they're doing. So
Speaker 1: I think you see this with big companies all the time.
Speaker 1: They look and see what young ascending companies do. And
Speaker 1: what can the NBA take from college sports? Well, the
Speaker 1: quality isn't close, but the urgency is amazing. And if
Speaker 1: I was Adam Silver, you cannot have seven game first
Speaker 1: round series if you're looking for upsets, which clearly clearly
Speaker 1: the urgency and the sudden death nature of college men's basketball.
Speaker 1: Some of these ratings in the early part of this
Speaker 1: tournament between no name teams get huge numbers. So I
Speaker 1: think if you want to pass the baton from the
Speaker 1: ters to the kids, you gotta have some shorter series
Speaker 1: where sometimes a young team comes in with hutspun energy
Speaker 1: and upsets Memphis and upsets a really good team that
Speaker 1: now we know over time that young team in the
Speaker 1: NBA won't win for a series. But I do think
Speaker 1: the NBA playoffs could use more upset well, or let
Speaker 1: me give because the counter to that will always be
Speaker 1: how much more? How much benefit are we getting from
Speaker 1: less revet and less inventory of our most valuable time
Speaker 1: of year? Which is postseason games. Right, Someone give me
Speaker 1: an actual answer why of all sports the NBA has
Speaker 1: not gone to drafting your playoff opponent. You want the
Speaker 1: regular season and matter if you are the one seed,
Speaker 1: if you are Dinnbert, if you have earned it. Once
Speaker 1: the field is set, you pick who you play. That
Speaker 1: would be a massive reward. And if you're the two seed,
Speaker 1: you get you get to pick next. As opposed to
Speaker 1: what we're gonna have happened, which is now, all of
Speaker 1: a sudden, you're gonna have I can't it's gonna be
Speaker 1: unbelievable to watch. In these finals, one hundred and twenty
Speaker 1: hours of the season, the Lakers have been fighting like
Speaker 1: hell to avoid the play in, and now, honest to God,
Speaker 1: I believe they might on the final day of the
Speaker 1: season be the sixth seed and risk falling back into
Speaker 1: the play in to avoid moving up to the five
Speaker 1: where they have to play Phoenix. You know what I mean,
Speaker 1: You're gonna have the Lakers, Warriors, Clippers in like this
Speaker 1: staring contest of who wants to play, like who wants
Speaker 1: to guarantee they're not in the play in. But if
Speaker 1: you do that and the other two teams take the
Speaker 1: night off, you now all of a sudden, congrat you
Speaker 1: avoid the play and here's Kevin Ryan, Devin Booker in
Speaker 1: round one. Let these teams draft their playoff opponent. It
Speaker 1: would so let me get in the East a team
Speaker 1: that I know you've liked historically, Boston. Boston has been
Speaker 1: better than Philly. Boston has not, over the course of
Speaker 1: the year, been better than Milwaukee, but they did beat
Speaker 1: him twice by forty points. You know what, Boston's big
Speaker 1: reward for their season is going to be Miami in
Speaker 1: round one. Congratulateuculations Boston. You know what I mean? Philly,
Speaker 1: who's been worse than them. Philly's gonna get a shell
Speaker 1: of a Brooklyn team. And it's like, Okay, Michael Bridge
Speaker 1: is a nice player, but that's fine, that's absurd, it's ridiculous.
Speaker 1: Let and that would add intrigue and it would add
Speaker 1: import to the regular season, and every first round series
Speaker 1: would feel like a grudge match because the team would
Speaker 1: be like, you picked us, why'd you pick us? Why
Speaker 1: didn't you be it? So I wish they would do that.
Speaker 1: I've encouraged that for all across all sports, but nobody,
Speaker 1: the leagues don't want to do it well. I do
Speaker 1: think they're going to do a midseason tournament in the NBA.
Speaker 1: I think what's happening. Analytics, to be honest, do not
Speaker 1: always help sports. In baseball, it slowed the sport down right.
Speaker 1: It was home runs, it was strikeouts. It was like,
Speaker 1: does anybody hit a single anymore? So they finally got
Speaker 1: rid of the end by the way, more singles, more
Speaker 1: stolen bases, more plays at the play, more action. The
Speaker 1: ratings are up, the games are better, more of everything.
Speaker 1: But I do think the NBA, the analytics are telling
Speaker 1: general managers rest your stars because this sport is so taxing.
Speaker 1: So in baseball you go into a town and you
Speaker 1: hang out for four days and a third of the
Speaker 1: team doesn't play. They're in the bullpen. But in basketball
Speaker 1: and hockey, and especially basketball, because you're not on the
Speaker 1: ice for forty five seconds, then off a player who's
Speaker 1: abnormally large anyway, right, like a seven foot one guy
Speaker 1: who travels, gonna be harder for him, regardless of the plane.
Speaker 1: So he's going to play forty minutes both ends, burn
Speaker 1: through seven thousand calories, get on a plane, land in
Speaker 1: a city at four in the morning, go to bed quickly,
Speaker 1: get up, shoot around. Frankly, have you seen old basketball players?
Speaker 1: They're all bent over, they all look like hell. So
Speaker 1: the analytics are telling you play stars less. So even
Speaker 1: though this minimum number of games for awards sounds like
Speaker 1: on its face it will solve it for a veteran player,
Speaker 1: he's not gonna a veterans by the way, Yannis. He
Speaker 1: doesn't care about awards anymore. He wants to be healthy
Speaker 1: for the Celtics, gona play. I don't know that there's
Speaker 1: a solved. It is because it's the constant conflict between
Speaker 1: the GM and his cross sports, the GM slash head coach,
Speaker 1: who's own only incentive and obligation is winning an ownership
Speaker 1: in the league, Who theoretically should the only incentive should
Speaker 1: be we're an entertainment product. How do we maximize our
Speaker 1: entertainment value? Like? The only thing I could compare it
Speaker 1: to is the schedule. I live in New York City.
Speaker 1: The Broadway schedule is insane. You get Mondays off, still
Speaker 1: do seven shows a week? Hey, there're two and a
Speaker 1: half hour shows, right, and a lot of these. There's
Speaker 1: a show I went to with my You know, my
Speaker 1: daughter's a senior in high school. She's a theater major.
Speaker 1: It's what she wants to go into. Show called Funny Girl,
Speaker 1: the Fanny Bright Story. The main character, the star of
Speaker 1: it now is this girl from Glee who is legitimately
Speaker 1: fuhnomen And the moment she signed up to do it,
Speaker 1: tickets through the roof. They you know, they announced she's
Speaker 1: not doing Thursdays or whatever, but she's doing every other
Speaker 1: show they do. My guess is I can't prove this,
Speaker 1: but she probably would be slightly better if she was
Speaker 1: only doing three shows a week. But Broadway understands our
Speaker 1: entire purpose is entertainment. We're not competing, you know, we
Speaker 1: are here to entertain the audience therefore make money. So
Speaker 1: you are out there every single night. Can you imagine
Speaker 1: if a Broadway had the same type of thing in
Speaker 1: the NBA, It's like, well, you know, we've looked at it,
Speaker 1: and she's really only going to be able to peak
Speaker 1: performers on three days a week, and we're not going
Speaker 1: to tell the audience any idea what three days those
Speaker 1: are going to be until they show up and kill him.
Speaker 1: And so I don't know what it is. I don't
Speaker 1: know what the solve is. If the NBA keeps trying
Speaker 1: to do it, but I don't think Adam Silver is
Speaker 1: quite a harsh enough hand to force it because he's
Speaker 1: in a partnership with the players. But this does go
Speaker 1: ahead because I have a different question. But go ahead, well,
Speaker 1: because I don't think there is a solve, and that's okay.
Speaker 1: NASCAR's audience is old. Every sport as a whole and
Speaker 1: a problem. NASCAR's sport is old. How solvable is it.
Speaker 1: NFL's got a concussion issue, it's grown men tackling each other.
Speaker 1: It's not going away. Baseball's got a pace issue and
Speaker 1: a lack of scarcity. There's a billion games that's not
Speaker 1: going away. Hockey relevance. Gretzky helped a little briefly college
Speaker 1: basketball one and done culture. The truth is the NBA
Speaker 1: problem like every sport. Cricket had a pace problem. Soccer,
Speaker 1: there's just so few elite players that if you get
Speaker 1: one and you face teams that don't have one, you
Speaker 1: just dominate for a decade. So I don't feel bad
Speaker 1: for the NBA because I think you can mitigate some
Speaker 1: of the issues. But every sport has an issue. This
Speaker 1: is really the primary one for the NBA stars sitting
Speaker 1: you won't completely solve it, but I think like concussions,
Speaker 1: less hitting in practice, better helmets, it will take out
Speaker 1: about thirty percent of it. And for the record, if
Speaker 1: you give me thirty percent more stars playing, it won't
Speaker 1: be on talk shows. It will give ten years ago.
Speaker 1: And it was never a topic. That's right. You know
Speaker 1: that's one hundred percent correct. All right. One. I don't
Speaker 1: know where else you want to go, but when you're
Speaker 1: talking about college basketball and then resting guys brought me
Speaker 1: to something that I mentioned on TV today that I
Speaker 1: want your thoughts on. All right, So everyone saw the
Speaker 1: Victor winban Yama highlight, the seven foot five alien did
Speaker 1: a step back three missed it, went and got his
Speaker 1: own dun got his own foot back dune. I also
Speaker 1: saw a video of the pregame workout he does for
Speaker 1: his feet. He does like these foot stretched things to
Speaker 1: whatever to try to keep his feed healthy. And then
Speaker 1: I heard saw this quote from a Western Commerce general
Speaker 1: manager saying, we're all going to feel like idiots for
Speaker 1: not tanking for this guy. I am quietly very concerned,
Speaker 1: and my entirety, the entire reason for my concern is
Speaker 1: literally never have I ever seen someone taller than seven
Speaker 1: three not be ravaged by injuries ever? Not once? And
Speaker 1: this guy is going to be playing on the perimeter
Speaker 1: on that type of wear and tear. Colin, I don't
Speaker 1: care how far back we have to go. Ralph Sampson
Speaker 1: his feet, it killed him, Rick Smith's or Vias Sabonis,
Speaker 1: Yao Ming Sam Booth and I don't know if he
Speaker 1: was seven of the A's quite as tall, but yeah,
Speaker 1: Greg Odin who wasn't quite as tall. Durant even had
Speaker 1: the Jones fracture and now seems to be breaking down
Speaker 1: a little. Or zingis por zingis all of them? Forget
Speaker 1: the super tall guys you minute Ball and some of
Speaker 1: those guys that dealt with some tragic stuff. I everyone
Speaker 1: is talking that. People are like, he would go number
Speaker 1: one in the draft if Lebron were in it. Guys,
Speaker 1: the thing is, I get it. If you tell me
Speaker 1: Wimban Yama's gonna be healthy for fifteen years. Yeah, he's
Speaker 1: one of the three greatest prospects ever, maybe the best
Speaker 1: prospect ever. I don't know, but I have seen I
Speaker 1: am so when Chet was coming out, I was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's the skinniest player I've ever seen, and we got
Speaker 1: wild and Brew killed me for it on the show.
Speaker 1: I was like, skinniest player I've ever seen. He played
Speaker 1: one summer league game against Lebron and we've never do
Speaker 1: We've never seen him yet since then, Wimby concerns me
Speaker 1: because when you're so tall, your agent is lying about
Speaker 1: your height in the other direction, alarm bells go off
Speaker 1: for me because I don't know, man, I just what
Speaker 1: makes him so special is what would terrify me. And
Speaker 1: here is the reason I was thinking about it. Team.
Speaker 1: Have the Pelicans helped or hurt Zion? I don't know.
Speaker 1: I know they've been as cautious as possible. He's played
Speaker 1: one hundred and twenty games in four years. Maybe you
Speaker 1: can tell me if they were, you know, more old
Speaker 1: school with him, he'd he'd be out of the league
Speaker 1: by now. Hard time believing it. I think maybe that
Speaker 1: the being so cautious with everything with him has not
Speaker 1: been the best for him. I can totally see the
Speaker 1: same thing happening with this kid. He comes into the league,
Speaker 1: has a little minor thing, they're like, oh, give it
Speaker 1: six weeks. Like, I don't know. It makes me nervous.
Speaker 1: It makes me nervous. Yeah. Yeah, we just recently came
Speaker 1: to terms with size matters for quarterbacks. I remember pushing
Speaker 1: back on Kyler Murray and like, guys, he's significantly smaller
Speaker 1: than everybody else, Russell Will, anybody's ever been. And I
Speaker 1: remember very early an All Pro defensive lineman in the
Speaker 1: NFL who I know played him year one and said, brother,
Speaker 1: he's not going to be in this league seven years.
Speaker 1: He does not like to get hit. He goes. I
Speaker 1: hit him, he went absolutely, But I have another theory
Speaker 1: on that. So people were very uncomfortable. I didn't like
Speaker 1: Baker Mayfield. I said, as a one, he's too small.
Speaker 1: He's not that. So we're coming to terms with Drew
Speaker 1: Brees was the outlier that size matters and quarterbacks. I
Speaker 1: said the same thing about chet Holmgren. I said, up,
Speaker 1: I had one pick, I wouldn't take him, but Oklahoma
Speaker 1: City had so many picks. So he's such a physical
Speaker 1: uniform unicorn. You owe it to yourself to take take
Speaker 1: the take the flyer. I'm fine with it. I just
Speaker 1: I don't like most or least biggest or smallest anything basically, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I like that, and I know I can get aren't
Speaker 1: on it, but this is. And I'm curious what your
Speaker 1: theory on Bryce is because Bryce is clearly the best
Speaker 1: on film prospect, it's not even arguable. But then I'm like, wait,
Speaker 1: they're saying he's thinner than Guyler. I don't know if
Speaker 1: I think he might be undraftable for me, Like he's
Speaker 1: so small, So I that he's too small, like the
Speaker 1: biggest or the smallest just concerns me. I want to
Speaker 1: see someone else do it first. What's your theory on Bryce? Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: So my theory is you can't treat every investment like
Speaker 1: a four oh one K. So a four oh one
Speaker 1: K you put money into and never take it out
Speaker 1: until you retire. But you can also day trade stocks.
Speaker 1: You can buy stuff and sell it. You can flip houses.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of equities, and there's a lot of
Speaker 1: investments that aren't built for long term, and those are
Speaker 1: also excellent investments. So not every quarterback you draft is
Speaker 1: for ten years. But if Carolina said to themselves, listen,
Speaker 1: our doctors say you're going to get three really good
Speaker 1: years out of him, and by year four Hill deteriorate.
Speaker 1: To stabilize the organization, wouldn't you still take him? Oh
Speaker 1: that's interesting. Yep. So what you don't want to be
Speaker 1: in the NFL is Indianapolis a wreck. But in that
Speaker 1: division in the NFC, Frank Reich's a good coach. You
Speaker 1: bring him and by the second year, you draft a
Speaker 1: quarterback in the sixth round. The third year you draft
Speaker 1: one in the fourth round, the fourth year you draft
Speaker 1: one in the second. The Patriots every other year drafted
Speaker 1: a quarterback with Brady. There's an argument to be made
Speaker 1: you should draft a quarterback every year anyway. But if
Speaker 1: you believe Bryce is the best quarterback, and if you
Speaker 1: just got three years, which for any size is small,
Speaker 1: I mean, I think two is going into year four.
Speaker 1: Let's say you let's say realistically, Kyler gives you two
Speaker 1: more years and then retires and goes, I'm done. Well,
Speaker 1: he had Josh Rosen and everybody was getting fired and
Speaker 1: Kyler got into the playoffs. And so it's like chet Holmgren,
Speaker 1: if you told me where you're gonna get four really
Speaker 1: good years from him, the first round of the NBA's
Speaker 1: a bust. Sure, So that's interesting that if it's just
Speaker 1: you're looking at it as and three years, I don't know.
Speaker 1: If it's just three years, I think that would concern me.
Speaker 1: But if you're like, hey, this guy's going to give
Speaker 1: you his full rookie contract, his fifth year option, and
Speaker 1: one franchise tag and you're never gonna have to give
Speaker 1: him the massive deal and you're going to instantly be relevant,
Speaker 1: have the quarterback on the route on the cheap deal,
Speaker 1: That's something I've never really considered that idea, but that
Speaker 1: I just and by the way, and maybe he defies
Speaker 1: the odds. Maybe he is Drew Brees, and you know,
Speaker 1: because he has so accurate and seems like such a
Speaker 1: good kid, it just seems like so small in a
Speaker 1: big man's game. You mentioned the Colts and you asked
Speaker 1: me on the show today about Lamar. Would you Peter
Speaker 1: King said that he believes that the Ravens would just
Speaker 1: give you Lamar straight up for the fourth pick. Would
Speaker 1: you do that if you were Indie, just a four
Speaker 1: pick for Lamar Jackson, number four overall pick this year's draft.
Speaker 1: You give them that, and you got to give Lamar deal.
Speaker 1: Peter King says he thinks the Ravens would say yes
Speaker 1: to that. They wouldn't try to match. They wouldn't fourth overall.
Speaker 1: Pick Lamar straight up if I'm in the would heart
Speaker 1: beat yes, because I think in the NFC he would dominate.
Speaker 1: In the AFC, he'll make you very viable. And and
Speaker 1: I also think that Indies in a situation now we're
Speaker 1: at best, they're going to get the third best quarterback
Speaker 1: unless somebody leaps them correct in a bad quarterback class
Speaker 1: or Lamore Jackson and you and you can take a
Speaker 1: deep breath and say we're off this damn treadmill. So
Speaker 1: I think the Lamar conversation has been so I don't
Speaker 1: know that any conversation has ever frustrated me more because
Speaker 1: it it seems like to me obvious where he is
Speaker 1: as a player. He is clearly not a top five
Speaker 1: quarterback in football, just clearly not. And I understand anyone
Speaker 1: of un animas MVP get it. I understand that some
Speaker 1: of the folks will be like, here are just his
Speaker 1: passing stats, not his rushing stats. I'm like, honestly, I
Speaker 1: could give a shit. I watched the games. I know
Speaker 1: he's not a great passer. I know he's not I
Speaker 1: know there are you know, mahomes Borough, Trevor, Herbert Allen,
Speaker 1: those five guys are better than him. I understand Justin
Speaker 1: Herbert doesn't. If Justin Herbert were, it's like, hey, you
Speaker 1: can have him for two first round picks. There is
Speaker 1: somebody would offer him a contract by now I know
Speaker 1: this to be true. Right, there's those five guys, right.
Speaker 1: I also know that right now, if you're actually ranking
Speaker 1: quarterbacks going down the list, Dak Prescott's like tenth and Dak,
Speaker 1: I think Lamar's better than Dak. You might say Dak
Speaker 1: Prett and Lamar whatever it is. At worst, Lamar's the
Speaker 1: tenth best quarterback. So he's not one of the absolute
Speaker 1: no brainers. He's still better than twenty starters. So, like,
Speaker 1: let's all take a deep breath. Teams are so desperate
Speaker 1: for quarterbacks you give Daniel Jones forty million a year
Speaker 1: for four years. So again, so is he perfect? No?
Speaker 1: Is he hurting himself by not having an agent? I
Speaker 1: think unquestionably yes? Is it frustrating that he hasn't the
Speaker 1: passing wise, he's actually awesome, it's some of the really
Speaker 1: hard stuff. It's the layups that he's not great at,
Speaker 1: has never gotten great at. And it's frustrating. Sure, But
Speaker 1: does it still seem baffling to me that a team
Speaker 1: like Detroit isn't like m We Dame nevermy the playoffs
Speaker 1: with Jared Goff. We have extra first round picks. We're
Speaker 1: in the soft conference, in a division that next year
Speaker 1: the most established quarterback is going to be Kirk Cousins. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we'll pay Lamar Jackson and maybe go to the super Bowl.
Speaker 1: Even though he's not perfect. I do think there's something else.
Speaker 1: So we both admit his unorthodox personal representation hurts and
Speaker 1: that the injury is really hurt. There is a third
Speaker 1: thing that an executive in the league told me about
Speaker 1: a year ago is that if you bring him in,
Speaker 1: you better go find a backup that works for him
Speaker 1: if he gets hurt. And it's a different offense and
Speaker 1: your typical offense, so you've got to make some real
Speaker 1: staff changes. And if he's a franchise guy you got
Speaker 1: to sign, you got to bring in a whole new group.
Speaker 1: And it's almost like in our space, there's people that
Speaker 1: do play by play, and there's people that are analysts,
Speaker 1: and then there's guys like you and I that are
Speaker 1: opinionists and generalists. Well, we don't work doing games or
Speaker 1: hosting a show, right, you have to bring in people
Speaker 1: who create topics for you. And I so Lamar is
Speaker 1: unique and that he's not your classic drop pack, but
Speaker 1: he's a better thrower than you think. He does have
Speaker 1: an injury issue, one of them, kind of freaky in
Speaker 1: the pocket, but he's got such a dynamic style of
Speaker 1: which you should absolutely lean into that there is a
Speaker 1: okay if we bring him in an indie, Okay, Shane Steiken,
Speaker 1: what do you have to do to your staff to
Speaker 1: do this? And so now I'm not saying there aren't
Speaker 1: a lot of things you can't do with Lamar you
Speaker 1: can do with our quarterbacks, but he is such I listen,
Speaker 1: I talked to Sean Payton about Russell Wilson when he
Speaker 1: was not the Broncos coach, and I said, what would
Speaker 1: you do? And he said, I'd get him back to
Speaker 1: playing basketball on grass. He goes, russells at his bass
Speaker 1: playing basketball on grass. Well, that's not Drew Brees, right.
Speaker 1: So you're literally bringing in staff and people and personnel
Speaker 1: that work with basketball on grass. So Lamar's that, to
Speaker 1: I would say, an even hyper version of that. So
Speaker 1: he's a very I guess what I'm saying is The
Speaker 1: downside to Unique is that you have to build people
Speaker 1: to support Unique, correct, and it's not as easy's That's
Speaker 1: why listen, Do I think the league as a whole
Speaker 1: doesn't want to do guaranteed deals? Obviously? Do I think
Speaker 1: the owners might be, you know, at the owners meetings
Speaker 1: asking around, you're not gonna You're not doing guaranteed We're
Speaker 1: not We're not going down there. You know, the Brown
Speaker 1: screwed us. We're not going further. Sure, So do I
Speaker 1: think there is that level of collusion? If you sure?
Speaker 1: But as I said before, if Trevor Lawrence, we're done
Speaker 1: with this contract, franchise tagged, and for the whole league
Speaker 1: it was like Trevor was like, Hey, I want a
Speaker 1: fully guaranteed deal and it's gonna cost two first round picks.
Speaker 1: Five of these teams would have said, I don't care
Speaker 1: who gets mad at me, I'm doing it. So part
Speaker 1: of the reason there hasn't been a hot Lamar market
Speaker 1: is because of the things that you're talking about. There
Speaker 1: are some limitations and it is not simple, but there
Speaker 1: is still a massive instant upside, particularly for an NFC
Speaker 1: team where going into next year, the best quarterback in
Speaker 1: the conference I think Jalen Hurts has earned that, but
Speaker 1: he's only shown to us for one year, and then
Speaker 1: after that it's Kirk and I sorry, it's Stafford coming
Speaker 1: off an injury, or Dak or whomever. We have no idea,
Speaker 1: and so that part of it is it is. And
Speaker 1: my theory on that is, I think most of the
Speaker 1: these teams are waiting until after the draft because if
Speaker 1: you're like, if we sign Lamar, we're going to be better,
Speaker 1: So our pick in the future years will be worse
Speaker 1: than pick this year, so might as well spend our
Speaker 1: you know, use our pick this year, and then the
Speaker 1: two first round picks we'd have to give up are
Speaker 1: going to be in the twenties or whatever it is.
Speaker 1: I also think when I saw the report that the
Speaker 1: Patriots were shopping mac Jones, that I'd keep an eye
Speaker 1: on Belichick the volume. Make sure to check out the
Speaker 1: dram On Green Show. I brought Draymond Green into the
Speaker 1: volume because one of the more entertaining voices in sports.
Speaker 1: Unique perspective understands behind the rope, also chops up with
Speaker 1: guests like Gary Peyton, Zach Levine, Tracy McGrady. Make sure
Speaker 1: download the Draymond Green Show. Wherever you get your podcasts,
Speaker 1: only on the Volume Podcast Network,