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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha, and welcome to stuff.

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Speaker 1: I've never told your production of I hear Radio's house

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Speaker 1: st efforts. I know that there's theme music, but in

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Speaker 1: my head I have my own after we finished, because

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Speaker 1: if we sit in silence, so like do do do do? Do? Do?

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Speaker 1: Do? Do Do do do? That's how I hear in my head.

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Speaker 1: Oh okay, maybe we could make that a reality. Well,

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Speaker 1: I like what we've got, which is nothing like what

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Speaker 1: I just said. You came up with your own thing.

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Speaker 1: I didn't sit here kind of awkwardly, but it's for

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Speaker 1: production purpose, right, for transition, Yes, seriously. Uh. And we

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Speaker 1: were having a rousing conversation about whether or not unicorns

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Speaker 1: are monsters and are they all female? Right? And I

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Speaker 1: guess according to the Cabin in the Woods, it is

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Speaker 1: a monster. Yeah, because today we're talking about female monsters. Um,

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Speaker 1: unicorns did not make the list, but maybe they should have.

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Speaker 1: But I don't know his female. Yeah, that's true, that's

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Speaker 1: the that's the question. I did not include mermaids um,

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Speaker 1: which come up a lot, but we do talk about

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Speaker 1: a lot of their kind of ums. Yeah, we're so

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Speaker 1: we're gonna do kind of a pop culture overlook and

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Speaker 1: then a historical overlook that got kind of out of hand,

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Speaker 1: just just saying this is a lot of pages. And

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Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, we are in Annie's fun house now. Yes,

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Speaker 1: I wish I could do Halloween themed episode. The excitement

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Speaker 1: that I see with the words and your face as

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Speaker 1: we're talking about these things, I'm like, wow, oh, yes,

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Speaker 1: I'm in for a treat. You are both a trick

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Speaker 1: and a treat. UM. A while back, we did an

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Speaker 1: episode on the trope in our pop culture of women

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Speaker 1: falling in love with monsters, and we mentioned in that

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Speaker 1: episode that there is a monster gender cap far more

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Speaker 1: male monsters than female monsters, and on top of that,

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Speaker 1: there is a monster beauty gap. Female monsters are generally

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Speaker 1: portrayed into sexualized manner, whereas male monsters are not. Male

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Speaker 1: monsters are also frequently allowed some sympathy whereas female ones

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Speaker 1: are not. Yeah. Uh, And we wanted to revisit this

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Speaker 1: topic in the topic of female monsters and just f

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Speaker 1: y I as in the episode we did around male

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Speaker 1: monsters were mainly talking about fictional monsters, not like our

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Speaker 1: real world human monsters. UM. We are going to tough

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Speaker 1: touch briefly on UM some fictional serial killers, but not

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Speaker 1: not generally. And I know that I've done my my

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Speaker 1: horror movies should beel on the show before. But I

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Speaker 1: think horror movies are really indicative of our anxieties and

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Speaker 1: fears as a society. And we are apparently hell afraid

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Speaker 1: of women and their bodies and yeah, all the fluids

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Speaker 1: of their bodies. No, absolutely true, absolutely true. Um. And

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Speaker 1: this does come into like an interesting conversation of what

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Speaker 1: a monster is, and we'll get we'll touch on that

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Speaker 1: a little bit more because some of them we included,

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Speaker 1: even though maybe we have some doubts. There's a gray area.

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Speaker 1: There's several gray areas, there's many, there's fifty shades of gray,

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Speaker 1: which is not a horror movie. I've been told I

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Speaker 1: haven't seen it, anither I haven't seen them though, no

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Speaker 1: trigger warning before we get into it for brief mentions

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Speaker 1: of sexual assault and violence, and yes, more specifically talking

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Speaker 1: about more non human superhuman monsters today. But okay, I

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Speaker 1: wanted to ask you, Samantha, I'm here, what's the first

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Speaker 1: female monster that comes to your head? So for me,

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Speaker 1: all the female monsters are the ghostly, motherly, demonic kind. Um.

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Speaker 1: And when or Ron Goes. So if I think of

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Speaker 1: the other on Juan or the I guess, I guess

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Speaker 1: the regular the Grudge, but we just recently watched that one,

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Speaker 1: which I love, or the Devil Worshiping Mother from Conjuring

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Speaker 1: because I love those movies, or even in the later

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Speaker 1: segments of Insidious, there is a mother figure that started

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Speaker 1: at all that haunts them. Kind of thing. Are these

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Speaker 1: spoilers should not have sat spoilers? Spoilers? I don't think

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Speaker 1: those are spoilers because they're just kind of like in

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Speaker 1: the trailer, right, or even if you like I guess,

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Speaker 1: if you want to think about again with a mother figure.

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Speaker 1: In The Red Dragon, Joseph finds, I know this is

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Speaker 1: a serial color and all that, but it began with

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Speaker 1: his mother and created this fictional serial killed monster. And

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Speaker 1: that's kind of what I think of as women and monsters.

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Speaker 1: It's all these awful mothers or stepmothers, mothers, Yeah, that

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Speaker 1: either come back for revenge or because they hated their children,

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Speaker 1: or they're part of witchcraft or something. Right. Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: that's something we've definitely talked about before, is our pop

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Speaker 1: culture anxiety around motherhood. Clearly apparently UM and I feel

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Speaker 1: like most female monsters I think of are like film fatals,

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Speaker 1: are seductresses, um or yeah, closely. Women with long black

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Speaker 1: hair just one of my favorite things. So when I

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Speaker 1: had long black hair, I used to try to scare

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Speaker 1: the hell out of people just by making that weird

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Speaker 1: grudge noise and with the hair in my face. It worked. Did.

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Speaker 1: One of my favorite costumes I ever saw a dragon

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Speaker 1: con with someone dressed as Samara from the Ring, looked

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Speaker 1: just like her and was carrying around a videotape and

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Speaker 1: like slowly trying to hand it to people. It was

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Speaker 1: so creepy. One of my favorite Halloween costumes was dressing

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Speaker 1: as the Grudge, having like a stained white gown essentially

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Speaker 1: or you know, hospital gown, with my hair all in

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Speaker 1: my face and all white, and just staring with the

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Speaker 1: one eye following people creepily. They were really creeped out

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Speaker 1: a lot of friends and a lot of day I'm

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Speaker 1: sure you didn't lose any Definitely not UM. I also

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Speaker 1: think of possessed young girls. I think that's a pretty

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Speaker 1: big trope in our horror. Kristen and Caroline have a

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Speaker 1: whole episode on Succupy kind of going off that that's

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Speaker 1: a dextorous fibtal thing if you want to check that out.

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Speaker 1: And they've done a few on witches, uh, if you

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Speaker 1: want to check those out as well. So some famous

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Speaker 1: recent examples recent ish of um female monsters. The Queen

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Speaker 1: Alien from Aliens, which by now you've either heard are

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Speaker 1: very indefinitely an alien or if you haven't, you should

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Speaker 1: check it out. Um The Queen Alien from the Faculty,

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Speaker 1: which is a movie that I loved in high school

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Speaker 1: and I think for like a month every day I

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Speaker 1: would go home and watch it with some KFC. What

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Speaker 1: a weird weird child. Wow with CASC that's very specific.

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Speaker 1: I know I went through a big KFC like just

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Speaker 1: the Chicken because the sides I think we can agree

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Speaker 1: or well, chicken finger looking good. Yes, it is a

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Speaker 1: Leventer spices secret and spices. Oh yeah, we'll never know.

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Speaker 1: It can't be like salt and pepper or whatever. It's

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Speaker 1: got to be something more. Um another alien, the alien

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Speaker 1: from under the Skin who killed men for their organs

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Speaker 1: by seducing them. The Raptors from Jurassic Park. Um, at

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Speaker 1: least the first one. They're all they're all female. Missed

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Speaker 1: that part. Yeah, that's the whole thing, like they can't

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Speaker 1: reproduce because they're all female. But then they the frog

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Speaker 1: DNA and then talk about spoilers that movie. I suppose.

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Speaker 1: I saw Godzilla from the version of Godzilla on some

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Speaker 1: list which I bring up every chance I get. That's

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Speaker 1: why it's here on this list. Um Jaws, let's bruce, yes,

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Speaker 1: but the Jaws in the book at least, because I

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Speaker 1: think that her her child is in the second one

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Speaker 1: looking for a or maybe it's the other way around.

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Speaker 1: It's a revenge tale, is it? For sure? The mom

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Speaker 1: wants revenge or the child wants revenge. I just as

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Speaker 1: soon it was because of the mayor was stupid every time,

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Speaker 1: and so he deserves his talent getting eat up. Do

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Speaker 1: you know what I'm talking about? Oh no, character, I

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Speaker 1: absolutely know what you're talking about. I watched that movie

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Speaker 1: every fourth of July because it takes place on fourth. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and then the demon from Jennifer's body, which, by the way,

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Speaker 1: she was possessed because she was not a virgin. I

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Speaker 1: did not have you seen this movie? But oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: you and I talked about this, Okay. I try to

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Speaker 1: make my friend watch it too, and he's like, this

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Speaker 1: is dumb, what is this? I'm like, it was Diablo Cody.

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Speaker 1: That's one of her first movies, and it's kind of

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Speaker 1: like mock two women in in in in the horror

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Speaker 1: like genre. But yeah, she was supposed to be maybe

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Speaker 1: spoiler alert if you're really excited about watching Jennifer's Body,

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Speaker 1: which is fairly old. Um, but she goes with this band.

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Speaker 1: The band thinks he's a virgin and they do this

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Speaker 1: whole ceremony on her instead of going correctly, she gets

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Speaker 1: possessed or she becomes a demon and right and then no,

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Speaker 1: of course not well, they like she's so hot, she's

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Speaker 1: me and she's so hot that automatically you get an

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Speaker 1: excuse except for her best friend, who's Amanda's Fred, who

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Speaker 1: was beautiful. But she plays the dowdy girl. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: come on, y'all, that always bothers me. She's the shy,

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Speaker 1: quieter friend of Megan Foxes. Was her hair in a

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Speaker 1: pony es? Yes, yes, which I'm sure all get. Diablo

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Speaker 1: Cody did that a purpose, definitely. Um. I love those

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Speaker 1: movies like that. Um. The werewolf from Ginger Snaps, which

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Speaker 1: also plays on a lot of our fears straight up

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Speaker 1: about as straight up about periods. I love it. I'm

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Speaker 1: telling you it all boils down to male writers being

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Speaker 1: afraid of periods. They should be, they should respect them

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Speaker 1: respected And um Samara from the Ring are Satiko from

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Speaker 1: the original, and um I would love to come back

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Speaker 1: and do a whole thing on that kind of genre

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Speaker 1: of Japanese horror because a lot of it has to

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Speaker 1: do with um anxiety around Hiroshima and the nuclear fallout

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Speaker 1: and a fear of like what will my children like

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Speaker 1: maybe something has gone wrong with this radiation. Um I

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Speaker 1: would love to come back to legitimate fear. I think

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Speaker 1: that's kind of how Chernobyl the whole horror stories always

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Speaker 1: kind of revolve around that as well. And then the

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Speaker 1: vampire from Let the Right One in, or a girl

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Speaker 1: walks home alone at night, fun gray area when it

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Speaker 1: comes to monsters, which I did love both of those movies.

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Speaker 1: They were fantastic in the original. The fact that these

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Speaker 1: movies came out in this kind of level and it's

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Speaker 1: just so like slow, yeah, but you kind of love it.

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Speaker 1: But then you know there's draculas brides, yeah, which are

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Speaker 1: usually portrayed pretty sexily, right, and it's kind of into

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Speaker 1: those little gray areas. Is that the monster or that

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Speaker 1: you know what? Camilla the lesbian vampire who wanted to

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Speaker 1: turn all the women she could into vampires? Do it?

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Speaker 1: Just do it? Sorrey the vampire from Octavia Butler's Fledgeling,

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Speaker 1: which I haven't seen that one. It's a book. Oh

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Speaker 1: I think it's might be in Talk to Me a movie. Okay, okay, okay,

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Speaker 1: so that's probably why. And then the main monster from

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Speaker 1: Dusk Till Dawn, which is Selma Hiak. She barely speaks

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Speaker 1: in it until she's about to kill people, but she

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Speaker 1: does her seductive dance and she turns up to be

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Speaker 1: one of the main vampires. You know, spoiler alert, But like, actually,

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Speaker 1: you do not know this? Have you seen from Dustin?

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Speaker 1: You've not seen I ain't seen it, and I didn't

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Speaker 1: know she was a vampire. What would that say? I

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Speaker 1: just never don't you? It becomes obvious And I'm sorry

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Speaker 1: I spoiled that from you. I really thought you. It's

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Speaker 1: a fairly old movie. Yeah. The Statute of Limitations I

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Speaker 1: believe is tenures and it's fairly old. Um, I know

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of like Quentin Tarantino. However, yeah, it

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Speaker 1: is a fun, over the top. It does also involve

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Speaker 1: like a serial killer. It's a weird it's hard to describe. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's a weird movie. I'm not know most of you

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Speaker 1: have watched it, because you also feel a little you

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Speaker 1: feel this little sympathy for the serial killer, like Psychotic Brother.

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Speaker 1: It's a whole level. It's a whole level. So also,

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Speaker 1: Juliette Louis is a teenage girl character. It's just some

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Speaker 1: creepy factors up in here. Definitely a good, like an

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Speaker 1: interesting movie to watch, but yeah, he the main vampire

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Speaker 1: is Elma Hiak, who is a beautiful dancer that turns

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Speaker 1: into an all eating monster and all eating monster that

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Speaker 1: just sees everything. Huh, well that vampire. You know, I

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Speaker 1: saw this movie recently and I couldn't, for the life

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Speaker 1: of me, remember what it's called. So this is very unhelpful.

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Speaker 1: But it was like, I think, um spring, but it

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Speaker 1: was about um. It sets itself up so you think

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Speaker 1: it's one of those American tourists is going to get

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Speaker 1: tortured by locals and die kind of thing because he's

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Speaker 1: like in an Italy um and he meets the hot

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Speaker 1: girl and you know, it's a horror movie, so you're like, okay,

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Speaker 1: but then it turns out she actually does love him,

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Speaker 1: but at night she turns into some kind of like

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Speaker 1: Cuthulu type but on a small level, and she has

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Speaker 1: to feed and she's trying to protect him. And also

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Speaker 1: like every so many years she will become that monster

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Speaker 1: permanently and instead of I mean, I guess spoilers, they

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Speaker 1: stayed together and it ends with them like waiting for

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Speaker 1: the sunrise on her last day and to see what happens. Um,

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Speaker 1: he's gonna get eaten probably, But I do like I

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Speaker 1: like movies like the ones we've been talking about with

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Speaker 1: the vampires and um, the ones that make you think

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Speaker 1: about the question of what is it to be a

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Speaker 1: monster because a lot of times they're killing human monsters

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Speaker 1: or just people who compared to the vampire UM aren't great. Right, Yeah, Okay,

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Speaker 1: there are a lot of witches we could talk about.

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Speaker 1: This is something that I was kind of like monsters.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if they count, but I didn't want

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Speaker 1: to include some of them. Um, we do have the

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Speaker 1: witches from The Craft, which I only watched recently because

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Speaker 1: of this show. Really, I feel like you've missed really

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Speaker 1: iconic like female bonding movies. Apparently I did. I will

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Speaker 1: make a list. I'm ready to go. Um, the the

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Speaker 1: s the witch from the Conjuring that you mentioned. Um,

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Speaker 1: and I guess Annabelle would count, even though Annabel was

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Speaker 1: more of a demon possession situation, old spirit for sure. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I thought it might be male. I don't think so.

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Speaker 1: So in the origin huh. Yeah, Look, I love Wayne's

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Speaker 1: his name Wan, James Wan, John Wayne, those John Wayne movies,

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Speaker 1: James Wang. He I think he's done some really good things.

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Speaker 1: And I know they're all kind of follow the same

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Speaker 1: little idea, but like he did. I don't know if

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Speaker 1: it was him that did the Annabel one. But it

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Speaker 1: goes to the origin story of Annabel, Yes, yes, and

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Speaker 1: they go into it's like they live in a nineteen

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Speaker 1: for theft sixties Lombo Stretch and the it's an orphanage.

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Speaker 1: It's like a small homemade orphanage with a few nuns

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Speaker 1: here there of course. Um. And it begins with the

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Speaker 1: death of this couple's baby. And so whether or not,

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Speaker 1: and I can't quite remember if it was adopted or

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Speaker 1: like what, it was always a spirit or always been

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Speaker 1: possessed whatever, whatnot. And then it comes on to possess

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Speaker 1: and become Annabel or whatever whatnot. So yes, I think

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Speaker 1: I don't know if maybe it's also gender neutral, who

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Speaker 1: knows necessarily a gender, but yes, it possesses a young girl.

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Speaker 1: Though maybe that's a spoiler alert. I haven't seen that.

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Speaker 1: I saw that movie on a plane, but I think

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Speaker 1: it landed right at the like end, you know, And

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Speaker 1: I just never saw the like of course, because we

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Speaker 1: talked about this again as children, but this time it's

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Speaker 1: all young girls. Um. And as of course again orphans

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Speaker 1: always orphans if that's the thing, either you or any

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Speaker 1: orphan or your demon orphan. Um. But yeah, they definitely

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Speaker 1: set it up as a regular trope type of here

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Speaker 1: it is. Yeah, Um, so I don't think not a

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Speaker 1: witch but a demon demon, gender neutral demon that goes

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Speaker 1: into a girl. I'll say it that way. How interesting

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Speaker 1: hard phrase these things without sounding very strange. Um. So,

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Speaker 1: I was thinking about the witches from the Witch, which

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Speaker 1: I don't that one is I think within the realm

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Speaker 1: of I don't want to spoil it, but um, they

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Speaker 1: do some monstrous things. I don't know. I don't know

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Speaker 1: where I land on that one. I don't. There's a

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Speaker 1: lot of illusion, like it's kind of cowards things. But

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Speaker 1: it's a slow burn it's a slow burn movie, yes,

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Speaker 1: So to me, it's kind of like along the lines

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Speaker 1: of Bubba Duke and that slow, slow, slow unfolding how

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Speaker 1: deep do you let it go into your mind? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: type of thing, and a lot of it does feel

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Speaker 1: like um metaphor. So I mean, I guess the truly

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Speaker 1: monstrous thing in that movie is that she's coming into

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Speaker 1: her sexuality, right, um or that's like the not only

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Speaker 1: that she's also sexualized by the brother, yes, yeah, and

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Speaker 1: then there's also this confusion, the back and forth with

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Speaker 1: the mom and the dad too. There's a whole there's

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Speaker 1: a whole thing. There is a whole thing. Um. And

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Speaker 1: this is a theme that happens all the time. But

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Speaker 1: like I would say that in that movie Witchcraft, which

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Speaker 1: is a sort of scene as like women liberating themselves

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Speaker 1: from the patriarchy and like whatever way that right, right,

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Speaker 1: and then just becoming their own and shedding some things,

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Speaker 1: shedding some things I would love to talk about that

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Speaker 1: we should have like a spoiled like a whole episode

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Speaker 1: for like if you wanted to see any of these movies.

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Speaker 1: Don't don't listen to this, Yeah, you don't listen to it,

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Speaker 1: But I want to talk about the witch. Then there's

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Speaker 1: the Grand High Witch from Royal Dolls The Witches who

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Speaker 1: appears young and beautiful but it's actually old and ugly.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Angelica Houston, she was phenomenal. I was scared

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Speaker 1: so long from that movie alone, but at the same

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Speaker 1: time I loved it because it also had like the

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Speaker 1: calmness of an English movie. So it's not your American

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Speaker 1: in your face like that I would saying. It was

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Speaker 1: just like kind of like, hey, I'm a mouse or

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Speaker 1: I'm this, and I'm just gonna walk around and oh no,

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Speaker 1: there's a witch like kind of starts doing that way.

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Speaker 1: But Angelica Houston as always the like when she acts

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Speaker 1: like she's so disgusted by children, I believe that any

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Speaker 1: moment she's going to vomit. Like she's phenomenal, phenomenal. Oh no,

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Speaker 1: I have to watch that. See we had that movie

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Speaker 1: when I was growing up, and I was so afraid

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Speaker 1: of the cover. It was scared. I didn't watch it

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Speaker 1: was again, and you're right, it became this whole like

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Speaker 1: hagwitch versus beautiful which it was just this great dichotomy

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Speaker 1: of what it was and who they really were and

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Speaker 1: how awful they were. Maybe it does have something about motherhood.

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Speaker 1: Maybe actually probably they just they just despies children. These

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Speaker 1: women despies children I were then because we're just like,

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Speaker 1: look at the feminism of the shot. I I enjoy it.

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Speaker 1: I've long wanted to do my feminist movie viewings. That

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Speaker 1: reminds me of our next The next thing I have

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Speaker 1: on the list hocus Pocus, which is coming back to theaters.

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Speaker 1: I have a ticket for it because I watched this

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Speaker 1: movie so much when I was a kid. It was

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Speaker 1: banned from our house really until I got to college,

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Speaker 1: Like from eight years old and Dell College, I didn't

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Speaker 1: see Hocus focusing on My parents were like, never will

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Speaker 1: this play. Oh that's the trick that that's when you

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Speaker 1: just get that one movie for that kids be like

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Speaker 1: stopped talking, watch your same movie. I think that it

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Speaker 1: even in like in the background, wore them out. And

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Speaker 1: in fact, I rented it so many times from Blockbuster

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Speaker 1: they eventually were like, keep it. You've earned this, You've

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Speaker 1: paid for it five times, now just just take it.

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Speaker 1: You made a payment plan. I mean hocus Pocused is phenomenal.

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Speaker 1: I had it in like the Blockbuster case was the

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Speaker 1: actual cover, so it looked like you stole it. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And then we Samantha and I were recently in Orlando,

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Speaker 1: and of course we went to Disney World, which in

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Speaker 1: August was having a Halloween celebration but not so scary,

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Speaker 1: how Mickey is not so scary Halloween party and the

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Speaker 1: show that night and we watched at midnight. Um was

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Speaker 1: hocus Pocus based and it was great. And I've had

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Speaker 1: Season of the Witch stuck in my head. Yeah. They

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Speaker 1: did a phenomenal job, all of them that portrayed it

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Speaker 1: and made this. I was wondering how they wouldn't do

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Speaker 1: this and not be kitchy and over the top. That

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Speaker 1: movie is pretty kitchy. No, but it's so well done.

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Speaker 1: Come on and yeah, it's a great movie. And I'm

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Speaker 1: excited because I want to go. I don't know if

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Speaker 1: I got my takeyabit. Yeah, that movie is definitely one

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Speaker 1: for all time, read like cult classic level. I want

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Speaker 1: to do next time I met karaoke, I want to

364
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Speaker 1: sing I put a spill on you. Um. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I remember they grown when they were like it's been

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Speaker 1: twenty six years. I think all of us just grown

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Speaker 1: got angry and said why did you that? Necessary didn't

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Speaker 1: remind us but how old we were, Dan, But that's another. Um.

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Speaker 1: It's a fun one to include on this list, I

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Speaker 1: think because their whole thing is that they're gonna suck

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Speaker 1: the youth out of your children so that they can

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Speaker 1: stay beautiful. And that's a pretty consistent theme and a

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Speaker 1: lot of our hearts definitely like the snow white yeah

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Speaker 1: idea as well. Yeah, for sure. Um, and then you

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Speaker 1: have yeah so also the classic witches of waszard of Oz.

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Speaker 1: You have Glinda, the good Witch, and then the Wicked

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Speaker 1: Witch of the West. They're all female, obviously, and they

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Speaker 1: all represented the goodness and the bad and all of this,

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Speaker 1: but it was all absolutely female. And the one powerful

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Speaker 1: person was a fake but it was a man, but

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Speaker 1: he was supposed to be all powerful who could take

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Speaker 1: all of these witches out, which I thought was kind

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Speaker 1: of interesting as well. Yeah, I don't know, it's the

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Speaker 1: horror movie, but shoot, sometimes when that scene comes on

385
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Speaker 1: where she's scared, like screeching across the sky about taking

386
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Speaker 1: your dog, God when she melts, that scared me. Yeah,

387
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Speaker 1: And the whole idea with Poppy Sue, and we know

388
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Speaker 1: the whole book book in itself was political. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I always thought that was an interesting Yeah. I debated

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Speaker 1: on including them because of Wicked, because then they're kind

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Speaker 1: of painted as good friends and good that they've been,

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Speaker 1: you know. But I think that's the whole new thing

393
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Speaker 1: is to take whatever was bad Mila, but you didn't

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Speaker 1: actually know the whole story, Like Supernatural does that as

395
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Speaker 1: well as once once upon a time on the ABC

396
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Speaker 1: Show they would do that as well. Well, that's the

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Speaker 1: fun part of a complex bill and is usually they

398
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Speaker 1: have something that you can write, really to the weird

399
00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:01,760
Speaker 1: Sisters or the wayward sisters. And from Shakespeare. Um, still

400
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Speaker 1: the female alien hybrid from Specs. So we're moving away

401
00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:07,240
Speaker 1: from which is now so we're being gone. Okay, so

402
00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:09,919
Speaker 1: we got the hybrid from which, by the way, super

403
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:12,680
Speaker 1: scary movie. I just remember the one scene of her

404
00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:14,879
Speaker 1: kissing and it's like, yeah, I pretty much blocked that

405
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:16,560
Speaker 1: movie from my memory. I saw when I was a

406
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Speaker 1: kid and I was like, no, no, beautiful model woman

407
00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:23,199
Speaker 1: who turns into a monster. Got it? Um. And then

408
00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:26,360
Speaker 1: there's Carrie from Carrie and I know, like you were

409
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Speaker 1: talking about the fact that this is also probably up

410
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Speaker 1: there with the fact that men are terrified of menstruating women,

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Speaker 1: and even though she was not necessarily a monster, she

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Speaker 1: is telekinetic and so therefore the Mother the evil mother

413
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:41,960
Speaker 1: once again. Yeah, once again, we were coming back to

414
00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:46,200
Speaker 1: created this monster who was Carrie. Yeah, so it kind

415
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:48,679
Speaker 1: of goes back to that mild like theory of what

416
00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:52,440
Speaker 1: is this. I never would have included carry on this list, honestly,

417
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Speaker 1: but she comes up on a lot of other people's list,

418
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Speaker 1: so I figured we should mention her. But to me,

419
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Speaker 1: I don't know. I guess she is telekinetic, right, So

420
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Speaker 1: the whole thing is, yes, this horror movie level, but

421
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Speaker 1: is she a monster? She becomes a monster created by

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Speaker 1: being an outcast, and of course the very obvious signs

423
00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:17,119
Speaker 1: of blood and menstruating means that she's done something evil,

424
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:20,199
Speaker 1: which was the most of the Mother has translated that

425
00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:22,800
Speaker 1: to be. And so therefore, men, if you're menstruating, your

426
00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:26,359
Speaker 1: evil Yeah, I guess. So that's what I've been told.

427
00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:32,280
Speaker 1: And I suppose along those lines, I'm a firestarter. Frying

428
00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:35,359
Speaker 1: a child that will set you a fire more as

429
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:40,280
Speaker 1: a child. Pretty scary. Yeah, then there's the main character

430
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:43,639
Speaker 1: from Teeth, which is a movie I know I've mentioned

431
00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:50,399
Speaker 1: before about vagina dentata uh. And to be clear, vagina

432
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:54,679
Speaker 1: dentata is not the monster. She uses it in a

433
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:58,879
Speaker 1: pretty like monster type way. And yeah, I feel like

434
00:24:58,920 --> 00:25:02,600
Speaker 1: again this reflects our anxiety around female sexuality. You can't

435
00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:06,000
Speaker 1: trust women. They aren't what they seem. Um. And this

436
00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:08,720
Speaker 1: movie kind of falls into a whole genre of women

437
00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:13,240
Speaker 1: wronged and that generally means raped and then getting revenge.

438
00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:16,400
Speaker 1: And this is another genre where the monster label can

439
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:20,399
Speaker 1: get really murky, really really I mean revenge movies in general.

440
00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:24,480
Speaker 1: R um uh. Still monster perhaps, but not really in

441
00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:28,239
Speaker 1: the way we're talking about today. Right. Then there's the

442
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:33,400
Speaker 1: creepy rogue AI, pretty often voiced by women, sometimes even

443
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:39,439
Speaker 1: a female avatar, like in the classic Resident Evil. So

444
00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:45,199
Speaker 1: I'm thinking like she or no her, well, not a

445
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:50,280
Speaker 1: monster but a um x makina though that is a

446
00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:55,920
Speaker 1: good example, like a rogue. The new Hilary Sweint movie

447
00:25:55,960 --> 00:26:00,560
Speaker 1: that's on Netflix. She there's an AI that takes care

448
00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 1: of this human child and then there's a battle between

449
00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:07,240
Speaker 1: who are you going to believe who's the actually evil villain? Oh?

450
00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:11,919
Speaker 1: How interesting? Um? There are a lot of female ghosts

451
00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:16,000
Speaker 1: that are I guess evil, Like, uh, Lady in Black,

452
00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:17,600
Speaker 1: that's the first one that comes to my mind. But

453
00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:21,199
Speaker 1: so there's that, you know. Um. And then there is

454
00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:25,479
Speaker 1: other mother from Coraline, which by the way, I refused

455
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:27,919
Speaker 1: to see because it looks creepy as hell is like

456
00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:30,320
Speaker 1: I just saw the button eyes. But and I was like, nope,

457
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:34,199
Speaker 1: it's good, it's good. Um. They have a are they

458
00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:36,080
Speaker 1: used to at the Center for Puppetry Arts. They had

459
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 1: a little set piece from it was do haunt me? Um.

460
00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:42,280
Speaker 1: And speaking of children, there's also we see this in

461
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:44,879
Speaker 1: children's books. A recent study from The Observer found that

462
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,760
Speaker 1: not only our children's books twice as likely to contain

463
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:50,520
Speaker 1: male main characters and there are far more likely to

464
00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:53,760
Speaker 1: have speaking roles compared to female characters, and villains were

465
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 1: eight times more likely to be male. And the researchers

466
00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:01,040
Speaker 1: at that paper are pretty good it explaining why that

467
00:27:01,119 --> 00:27:03,880
Speaker 1: is such a problem, especially at a formative age, something

468
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:06,679
Speaker 1: you're reading to your children or that they're reading. Um,

469
00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 1: can we talk about why so many of the children's

470
00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:12,400
Speaker 1: books and children's stories have their parents killed off. It's

471
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 1: because the story wouldn't happen if someone was there to

472
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:18,280
Speaker 1: be like, hey, kid, go into the woods and talk

473
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:24,640
Speaker 1: to the screepy old lady. I think it's problematic another episode. Um.

474
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:26,719
Speaker 1: There are some famous fictional serial killers I did want

475
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 1: to mention because they have this sort of supernatural element

476
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:34,080
Speaker 1: to them. Um, Jason's mom from the original Friday the Thirteenth,

477
00:27:34,119 --> 00:27:37,560
Speaker 1: although Jason is more the one that's like if you've

478
00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:41,120
Speaker 1: seen the whole series, which I embarrassingly have, Um, he's

479
00:27:41,160 --> 00:27:44,040
Speaker 1: like a demon, right, there's a whole thing. Um. And

480
00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:46,639
Speaker 1: then Mrs Loumus from Scream Too, because I love Scream

481
00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:50,760
Speaker 1: Too and I just watched it. How did that come up? Yesterday?

482
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,439
Speaker 1: You were talking, oh game when you put a reference

483
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:56,320
Speaker 1: to that, and no one except for Lauren from Favor,

484
00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:01,879
Speaker 1: and we were all like, heyl Cassandra, Oh my gosh,

485
00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 1: Lawrence always got my back's um. And there are some famous,

486
00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:11,440
Speaker 1: not so recent ish examples like the Bride Frankenstein from

487
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:14,080
Speaker 1: nineteen five, who doesn't show U until the very end

488
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:16,880
Speaker 1: of the film. And I read very funny, like two

489
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:21,640
Speaker 1: different interpretations of this film. Either the Bride screwed everything

490
00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:23,960
Speaker 1: up by rejecting the monster, because if you don't know.

491
00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 1: At the end, she's like, no, or the monster was

492
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:31,760
Speaker 1: an entitled douche. You got mad, a lady, you're injecting him,

493
00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:34,879
Speaker 1: which consign sounds one and the same again because of

494
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 1: rejection towards the monster man man monster. How interesting. Then

495
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:44,600
Speaker 1: there's Jacula's daughter from nineteen six who tries to overcome

496
00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 1: the curse of her father by finding an immortal mate.

497
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,840
Speaker 1: Uh okay, I gotta find a man, or else you're

498
00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 1: doing to monster hood. And then there's the Invisible Woman

499
00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:59,440
Speaker 1: who has an invisible baby with an invisible man. Of course,

500
00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:03,800
Speaker 1: how could you imagine if it would it be half invisible?

501
00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:06,040
Speaker 1: So would it be like if she went with a

502
00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:15,040
Speaker 1: not invisible man, oh, assuming it had a lot um.

503
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:19,880
Speaker 1: Then there is the cat Woman from Cat People, which

504
00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:22,920
Speaker 1: is a film about a woman who can't have sex

505
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:27,240
Speaker 1: or she'll turn into a panther. I mean we all

506
00:29:27,280 --> 00:29:31,360
Speaker 1: know that, right every time I have sex a cat

507
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:35,240
Speaker 1: of some sorts. Um, And that movie plays a lot

508
00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:38,520
Speaker 1: with gas lighting because even when there is like scientific

509
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:42,000
Speaker 1: evidence that yes, she does her into a panther she

510
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:46,680
Speaker 1: has sex, no one believes her. Of course, women and sex.

511
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 1: Then there is the Lost Woman from the Lost Woman.

512
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:54,200
Speaker 1: H This film depicts a woman who successfully founded a

513
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:57,200
Speaker 1: cosmetic company but is desperate to find a way to

514
00:29:57,240 --> 00:29:59,840
Speaker 1: maintain her youth. Her cosmetics are not doing it for

515
00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:04,080
Speaker 1: so she formulates an anti aging product with royal jelly

516
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:07,719
Speaker 1: from bees, with herself as the test subject, but of

517
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 1: course side effects may include turning into a lost woman.

518
00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 1: I feel like we definitely have a theme here with

519
00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 1: the whole age and baby in blood and sucks because

520
00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 1: I'm just thinking about the fact that who who was

521
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,480
Speaker 1: the the woman who bathes herself in blood trying to

522
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:27,120
Speaker 1: stay younger? But she was an actual woman, um, and

523
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 1: that was one of the reasons that kind of that

524
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:33,840
Speaker 1: whole monster theme began because of her legend. But anyway,

525
00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:36,280
Speaker 1: I'll just I just find that fascinating. And then we

526
00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:39,080
Speaker 1: have the young pigtailed girl from the nineteen sixty five

527
00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:42,000
Speaker 1: The Bad Seed, which, by the way, I'm going to

528
00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:44,360
Speaker 1: these last three movies we just talked about. I have

529
00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:46,240
Speaker 1: no idea what these movies are. I've never heard of

530
00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:51,400
Speaker 1: these movies, and I'm both horrified and intrigued. Yeah, well

531
00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 1: I've seen I haven't seen um like, I've seen them

532
00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:59,320
Speaker 1: maybe once when I was young. Uh, and I just

533
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:03,000
Speaker 1: remember thinking are kind of silly, but the bad sea

534
00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:07,880
Speaker 1: did scare me actually, um, but worth checking out if

535
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:11,680
Speaker 1: you're at all interested in this female monster thing. Um,

536
00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:15,640
Speaker 1: we have some female monsters of history. But first we

537
00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:30,680
Speaker 1: have a quick break for word from our sponsor and

538
00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:34,920
Speaker 1: we're back. Thank you sponsored. So, of course, one of

539
00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 1: the first female monsters that comes to my mind kicking

540
00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:43,440
Speaker 1: at old school is the gorgon slash Medusa from Greek mythology.

541
00:31:43,560 --> 00:31:45,080
Speaker 1: Is actually one of the first things that I was

542
00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:47,920
Speaker 1: ever proud of drawing. But then I had to admit

543
00:31:47,960 --> 00:31:50,520
Speaker 1: that I traced it when everyone was complimenting me and

544
00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:54,240
Speaker 1: asking me how I drew such a kid, I traced it.

545
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 1: I would have believed it. Um. To fill you in

546
00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 1: on her backstory, the god Poseidon raped her in Athena's temple, uh,

547
00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:06,000
Speaker 1: and Athena, outraged that this could happen in her temple,

548
00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:11,440
Speaker 1: punished who Medusa. This is such a biblical Old Testament idea,

549
00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 1: The thought being, with this punishment of she's so hideous,

550
00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:20,160
Speaker 1: men that dared to look upon her would turn to stone.

551
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:22,520
Speaker 1: Then it would never happen again. Of course, that's like

552
00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:27,040
Speaker 1: the easiest way. Um. So that is an example of

553
00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:32,040
Speaker 1: women not supporting women and some of that. Yeah, yeah,

554
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:34,920
Speaker 1: I think that's the pretty We can say that with confidence.

555
00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:38,760
Speaker 1: In some versions of this tale, Perseus states this is

556
00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:43,280
Speaker 1: a well earned punishment for Medusa. That's the most terrifying

557
00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:47,800
Speaker 1: thing of the story. I feel like, yeah, that translates

558
00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:50,800
Speaker 1: a little too well. I know, I'm very uncomfortable with

559
00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:54,120
Speaker 1: how well it translates. So another female monster from the

560
00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:57,600
Speaker 1: Greek mythology are the sirens, who lured mostly male sellers

561
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:01,360
Speaker 1: to their destruction with their beautiful song. The most well

562
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 1: known depiction is in the Odyssey oh do See has

563
00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:07,080
Speaker 1: warned of their power, had himself tied to his ship's mass,

564
00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,240
Speaker 1: while his crew put wax in their ears to block

565
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:12,640
Speaker 1: out the siren's call. These creatures, by the way, were

566
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:15,640
Speaker 1: hybrids with the bodies of birds and the heads of women,

567
00:33:15,760 --> 00:33:19,480
Speaker 1: which that's sexy, will sexy uh, And in some tales

568
00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:22,560
Speaker 1: they were persephonese companions, and when they failed to stop

569
00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:25,400
Speaker 1: her rape, they were turned into sirens, which seems to

570
00:33:25,440 --> 00:33:29,040
Speaker 1: be a common theme in Greek mythology punishing women for rape.

571
00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:34,000
Speaker 1: It seems to be it's already come up twice to exist.

572
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:37,520
Speaker 1: So the sirens seemed to originate after the Greeks had

573
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:41,480
Speaker 1: contact with Eastern art. Sirens were extremely confident in their talents.

574
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 1: They unsuccessfully challenged the Muses, and the Muses being the

575
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:48,000
Speaker 1: nine Greek goddesses of various arts. Legend goes a siren

576
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:55,120
Speaker 1: invested musically by mortal must die. Also in the Odyssey,

577
00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:59,320
Speaker 1: Scylla and Charactis sisters who were cursed to be ugly

578
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:03,920
Speaker 1: as punishment for their misdeeds. No greater punishment, of course,

579
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:08,720
Speaker 1: um Scilia was a six headed rock monster. Why whild

580
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 1: Cards was a sea monster just snacking on poor lost sailors.

581
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:17,759
Speaker 1: You know I could do so sad. Then there are harpies,

582
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:20,880
Speaker 1: Greek and Roman mythical monsters with the body of a bird,

583
00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 1: usually a vulture, and the face of an old woman.

584
00:34:24,440 --> 00:34:26,920
Speaker 1: In early legends they were not depicted that way, but

585
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:28,920
Speaker 1: in the legend of Jason and the Argonauts, which is

586
00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:31,319
Speaker 1: probably one of the most well known uh they were

587
00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:35,440
Speaker 1: portrayed as half bird, half women and quite revolting, like

588
00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:38,560
Speaker 1: they stank. They stole your food, and that was one

589
00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:41,719
Speaker 1: of the first times that it was written this kind

590
00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:45,200
Speaker 1: of signature move of theirs, that they steal your food um.

591
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:48,480
Speaker 1: Their name is derived from a Greek word meaning snatchers.

592
00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:53,239
Speaker 1: They abducted people, usually evildoers, and cruelly punished them while

593
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:57,600
Speaker 1: taking them to the furies. They are thought to The

594
00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:01,719
Speaker 1: Harpies are thought to represent wind spirits, in my opinion,

595
00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:05,480
Speaker 1: most terrifyingly portrayed in The Last Unicorn. And in case

596
00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:08,479
Speaker 1: you're wondering, there is in fact an entire essay written

597
00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:10,719
Speaker 1: about the feminism of the Last Unicorn. And I have

598
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:15,040
Speaker 1: read it. Really I love that movie. It's on my

599
00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:19,040
Speaker 1: list of terrifying children's right. You have to be it,

600
00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:21,239
Speaker 1: must have you must have rented it because you were

601
00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:24,120
Speaker 1: too young for that movie. We owned it. I don't

602
00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:27,280
Speaker 1: know that we're talking about the Tom Cruise movie Tom Crew.

603
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:31,360
Speaker 1: Oh no, no, no, I'm sorry, I'm that's legend. That's legend.

604
00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:37,000
Speaker 1: So confused because legend has it is based on a unicorn. Oh,

605
00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:41,120
Speaker 1: oh my god, and that's Tim Curry being a frightening,

606
00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:45,680
Speaker 1: frightening well I want to see this. Oh it's poor quality.

607
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:49,319
Speaker 1: That's The Last Unicorn. Okay, okay, okay, yeah, now I'm there.

608
00:35:49,719 --> 00:35:54,480
Speaker 1: Never mind, keep going two movies to watch. Um. This

609
00:35:54,520 --> 00:35:57,839
Speaker 1: whole thing, The Heartbee is where the insult heart bee

610
00:35:58,200 --> 00:36:02,319
Speaker 1: comes from, meaning a foul or unpleasant woman. Um. A

611
00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:07,239
Speaker 1: picture of a rare hearpie eagle went viral yesterday as

612
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:11,120
Speaker 1: we record this, due to its resemblance to a human um.

613
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:14,120
Speaker 1: It really is cool. Look it up like this. This

614
00:36:14,239 --> 00:36:17,680
Speaker 1: eagle in in particular, which is named after the hearpy

615
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 1: from Greek mythology, looks amazing and weird and you can't

616
00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:24,839
Speaker 1: believe it exists. So check it out. And that that

617
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:29,560
Speaker 1: that brings us to the furies or the arenes or

618
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:34,080
Speaker 1: the human ideas from Greco Roman mythology. And these are

619
00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:38,800
Speaker 1: the goddesses of vengeance, frequently depicted as hags with snakes

620
00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:41,319
Speaker 1: in their hair and snakes wrapped around their arms and

621
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:45,400
Speaker 1: blood dripping from their eyes, dressed in black carrying whips.

622
00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:50,280
Speaker 1: In their first incarnation, they were the ghost of murdered people,

623
00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:53,839
Speaker 1: or perhaps like curses come to life. The Greek poet

624
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:57,200
Speaker 1: Hessiad conceived of them as the daughters of Gaya Argaia,

625
00:36:57,320 --> 00:37:01,440
Speaker 1: birth from the blood of her murdered spouse, urinous as

626
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:05,000
Speaker 1: a pretty dark origin story. The first to describe them

627
00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:07,560
Speaker 1: in three, because normally now we think of them in threes,

628
00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:13,719
Speaker 1: was Euripides. Eventually they were named Alecto, which means unceasing

629
00:37:13,719 --> 00:37:20,040
Speaker 1: and anger. It's a funny avenger of murder, and Magara

630
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:24,239
Speaker 1: jealous and I got that pronunciation from the animated Hercules,

631
00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:26,880
Speaker 1: so that is probably not correct, although that is an

632
00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:29,720
Speaker 1: interesting kind of side because there are three I believe

633
00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:32,239
Speaker 1: there's three characters that kind of represent the furies in

634
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 1: that movie Um. They the furies were frequently depicted as

635
00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:38,400
Speaker 1: spirits of the underworld that came to the surface to

636
00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:42,839
Speaker 1: punish the wicked, particularly crimes around family and oaths. Their

637
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:46,640
Speaker 1: punishment could be something like disease or madness. They were

638
00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:51,000
Speaker 1: so feared by the Greeks that they referred to the

639
00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:56,520
Speaker 1: furies and euphemistic terms like the furies or the gracious ones,

640
00:37:56,600 --> 00:37:59,839
Speaker 1: like be nice to them, call them nice things. Maybe

641
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:03,680
Speaker 1: they leave you alone. In the Iliad, they cloud people's

642
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:07,440
Speaker 1: judgment and reason. Homer wrote that they had no pity

643
00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:09,920
Speaker 1: in their hearts, and they are sometimes called the daughters

644
00:38:10,080 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 1: of night. They are the embodiment of righteous rage, and

645
00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:16,760
Speaker 1: as such there are a lot of feminist articles written

646
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:20,719
Speaker 1: about them as well. Pretty current Um also now the

647
00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:24,640
Speaker 1: name of an Australian slasher movie, is it. Yeah, that's

648
00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:27,280
Speaker 1: what it was first results when I was searching on Google.

649
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 1: I feel like I need to try to check that out.

650
00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:33,040
Speaker 1: Of course, there's the succubus or that which lies beneath.

651
00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:35,759
Speaker 1: Check out the full episode in our archives for more.

652
00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:39,879
Speaker 1: But briefly, the succubus is a female sexual demon. That's

653
00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:42,600
Speaker 1: the nick names. Play notes. The legend of the puccubus

654
00:38:42,680 --> 00:38:45,600
Speaker 1: is thousands of years old and transcendd culture as Jins

655
00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:48,879
Speaker 1: and Arabic cultures. This demons m is approaching men while

656
00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:52,400
Speaker 1: they're sleeping and seducing them. Lord suggests sucubus are the

657
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:55,160
Speaker 1: descendants of Lilith, which we're gonna get into in a second,

658
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:58,719
Speaker 1: because I know you're super excited about that. The succubus

659
00:38:58,719 --> 00:39:01,920
Speaker 1: has taken on a sore of cultural second win lately.

660
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:04,799
Speaker 1: You can see that on our classic episode Can You

661
00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:08,920
Speaker 1: Have Sex with a Ghost? Which is okay um And

662
00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:12,040
Speaker 1: also apparently that's where we talk about y'all talk about

663
00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:15,640
Speaker 1: Kesha reported having sex with a ghost. Yeah, and that

664
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:21,319
Speaker 1: plays into a lot of sleep paralysis. Uh, there's very

665
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:27,239
Speaker 1: many actually scientific research into that very phenomenon. So yeah,

666
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:30,399
Speaker 1: check out that classic for more on that one. Then

667
00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:34,520
Speaker 1: there's Banshees, another pretty famous female monster, although I guess

668
00:39:34,520 --> 00:39:38,279
Speaker 1: she's just gonna trying to warn you. Generally, um, she's from.

669
00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:41,040
Speaker 1: This is from Irish and Scottish lower sometimes the ghost

670
00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 1: of an old maid or wailing about your impending probably

671
00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:47,720
Speaker 1: violent death. Sometimes the visage of a beautiful maiden weeping

672
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:51,160
Speaker 1: about your impending death, and some retelling. She can be

673
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:55,360
Speaker 1: found washing her blooded clothes in the river or brushing

674
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:59,239
Speaker 1: her hair with a silver comb. And modernly people think

675
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:02,920
Speaker 1: this this it originated from the sounds of barn owls.

676
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:04,239
Speaker 1: And when I read that, I was like, oh, I

677
00:40:04,280 --> 00:40:07,319
Speaker 1: can see that, because I've heard one. I had just

678
00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:11,160
Speaker 1: watched the Mothman prophecies and there was a barn owl

679
00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:15,200
Speaker 1: or a screech owl outside my window and it scared me, so,

680
00:40:17,160 --> 00:40:19,080
Speaker 1: oh my god, I thought it was a mothman. But

681
00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:21,319
Speaker 1: the next day my neighbor, who's kind of she knows

682
00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:22,799
Speaker 1: a lot about nature, was like, now that was just

683
00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:26,040
Speaker 1: now you're fine. Um. But they also have kind of

684
00:40:26,080 --> 00:40:31,200
Speaker 1: like white plumage that can look like a face. Um,

685
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:35,120
Speaker 1: And they're very silent when they fly, So I can

686
00:40:35,160 --> 00:40:37,880
Speaker 1: see how you might think it's a wheeling ghost. Of

687
00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:40,759
Speaker 1: a woman who's warning you about your death because you're

688
00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:43,600
Speaker 1: just anxious all the time. Well, I guess a warning

689
00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:46,799
Speaker 1: would be good. It's a nerving sound. Oh my gosh. Well,

690
00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:49,520
Speaker 1: then we have Grendel's mother from Beowulf, who is described

691
00:40:49,560 --> 00:40:52,640
Speaker 1: as a woman monster wife. Embodying both light and dark

692
00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:55,919
Speaker 1: sides of the feminine seems to be a common theme.

693
00:40:56,960 --> 00:40:59,799
Speaker 1: When she's first mentioned in the poem, she's described as

694
00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:04,600
Speaker 1: an avenger. There is a lot of themes of like

695
00:41:04,680 --> 00:41:10,359
Speaker 1: getting justice, punishing people for doing wrong, um, and then there.

696
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:12,640
Speaker 1: This is one of the most interesting inclusions on our list.

697
00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:16,520
Speaker 1: I think Bobba Yaga. Here we go from Russian folklore.

698
00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:19,640
Speaker 1: I had to really try to keep reining in and

699
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:21,920
Speaker 1: they will not make the whole upset about her. She

700
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:25,120
Speaker 1: lives in a hut that has chicken legs. In some

701
00:41:25,239 --> 00:41:28,680
Speaker 1: versions it spins on top of eggs and is bedecked

702
00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:34,080
Speaker 1: in skulls, and she travels herself via mortar, mortar and pestal.

703
00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:38,839
Speaker 1: When someone visits her, she may eat you or offer

704
00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:41,280
Speaker 1: to help you. That's the interesting thing about Bobby Yaga

705
00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:46,520
Speaker 1: that a lot of UH historians I think is unique.

706
00:41:46,560 --> 00:41:48,399
Speaker 1: It is because in the very same story. She can

707
00:41:48,480 --> 00:41:53,120
Speaker 1: be like a trickster, murderer, a helper, all in one woman.

708
00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:57,680
Speaker 1: We contain multitudes um. Bobby Yaga is frequently depicted as

709
00:41:57,719 --> 00:42:00,480
Speaker 1: an old woman crone or hag could be applied here,

710
00:42:00,520 --> 00:42:03,759
Speaker 1: gnarled and toad like, with long stringing, gray hair and

711
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:07,279
Speaker 1: iron teeth or no teeth. Sometimes she has written as

712
00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:11,720
Speaker 1: traveling with death and feeding on deaths, newly released souls,

713
00:42:12,680 --> 00:42:15,560
Speaker 1: and Yes. When looking at the wealth of information that

714
00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:19,200
Speaker 1: has been written about her, she is sometimes maternalistic and

715
00:42:19,239 --> 00:42:23,560
Speaker 1: others cannibalistic. Probably the most famous instance of Bobbyaga in

716
00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:28,680
Speaker 1: literature is from Vahalisa the Beautiful. This Russian fairy tale

717
00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:31,800
Speaker 1: follows Vashaliza, whose mother died when she was young. Before

718
00:42:31,800 --> 00:42:34,360
Speaker 1: her death, the mother gave her a doll like no

719
00:42:34,640 --> 00:42:37,680
Speaker 1: other doll in the world, instructing her daughter to never

720
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:39,880
Speaker 1: let anyone see it and carry it with her always.

721
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:44,200
Speaker 1: Those dolls, Those damn dolls, Those damn dolls, I actually do.

722
00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:47,960
Speaker 1: I actually pitched a whole episode on why do we

723
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:52,120
Speaker 1: think dolls are creepy? And everyone was like, no, I

724
00:42:52,239 --> 00:42:56,880
Speaker 1: wanted to know, Um, okay, so yeah, if she's carrying

725
00:42:56,880 --> 00:42:58,920
Speaker 1: it with her, always and if she's ever threatened by

726
00:42:58,960 --> 00:43:01,400
Speaker 1: evil or sorrow. The other tells Vashaalisa to find an

727
00:43:01,400 --> 00:43:04,319
Speaker 1: isolated corner or someplace that people won't see her. Take

728
00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:06,760
Speaker 1: the doll out, feed it, give it a little something

729
00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 1: to drink, and then tell it um what's bothering her,

730
00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:13,440
Speaker 1: And then the doll gets her some advice or I will.

731
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 1: And not soon after her mother's death, vashally Sa does this.

732
00:43:16,320 --> 00:43:18,400
Speaker 1: She takes up the doll, feeds it a little, gives

733
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:21,200
Speaker 1: it a drink, and then tells it about her grief

734
00:43:21,280 --> 00:43:23,279
Speaker 1: of her mother dying. And the doll listens and then

735
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:26,719
Speaker 1: says grief is worse at night and morning is wiser

736
00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:30,600
Speaker 1: in the evening, and suggested that Vashalisa go to sleep,

737
00:43:31,239 --> 00:43:34,920
Speaker 1: and Vashalisa found that she did feel better the next day. Meanwhile,

738
00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:38,360
Speaker 1: her father had found a new wife, a widower about

739
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:41,000
Speaker 1: his age with two daughters. The woman and her children

740
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:44,200
Speaker 1: moved into their house, and vashaal Lisa quickly realized that

741
00:43:44,239 --> 00:43:47,359
Speaker 1: her father's new wife was quite cruel. She wanted her

742
00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:50,520
Speaker 1: father's wealth, and her and her daughters were endious of

743
00:43:50,719 --> 00:43:54,200
Speaker 1: Vashaalisa's beauty by giving her a lot of menial and

744
00:43:54,200 --> 00:43:58,200
Speaker 1: difficult chores. They hoped to diminish her beauty, but Vashaalisa

745
00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:01,640
Speaker 1: was resilient and she has that special doll. Years went

746
00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:06,279
Speaker 1: by this way until vash Lisa reached marrying age oh no,

747
00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:10,200
Speaker 1: and everyone wanted to marry her, of course um and

748
00:44:10,239 --> 00:44:14,440
Speaker 1: this made her stepmother and sisters even angrier. So when

749
00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:17,560
Speaker 1: Vashelisa's father left to make a journey to another sardom,

750
00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:20,960
Speaker 1: his wife packed up to all the stuff, sold his house,

751
00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:24,160
Speaker 1: and moved everybody, herself or daughters, and Vashlisa to a

752
00:44:24,280 --> 00:44:28,040
Speaker 1: sad neighborhood bordering the wild woods outside of town, and

753
00:44:28,080 --> 00:44:31,000
Speaker 1: every day her stepmother sent bass Elisa into the woods

754
00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:35,880
Speaker 1: to compete various tasks. The stepmother did this knowing that

755
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:40,240
Speaker 1: Boba Yaga lived in these woods, who people believed eight

756
00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:45,759
Speaker 1: people like one, eats chickens and delicious. Her hope was

757
00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:49,720
Speaker 1: that vasha Lisa would encounter Boba Yaga and be eaten.

758
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:53,520
Speaker 1: The doll knew of Bobby Yaga and warned vasha Lisa

759
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:57,839
Speaker 1: not to approach the hut on chicken legs fair, But

760
00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:00,760
Speaker 1: the stepmother was determined and with the he of her daughters,

761
00:45:01,000 --> 00:45:04,480
Speaker 1: orchestrated a situation where Vasha Lisa had to go to

762
00:45:04,560 --> 00:45:10,680
Speaker 1: Abby Yaga to get more fire um. But Vasha Lisa

763
00:45:10,960 --> 00:45:14,040
Speaker 1: does all of this instead of getting eaten. Bobby Yaga

764
00:45:14,160 --> 00:45:16,520
Speaker 1: just is like, here's some impossible to ask, Let's see

765
00:45:16,520 --> 00:45:20,000
Speaker 1: if you can do them. And because she has that doll,

766
00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:23,960
Speaker 1: Vashi Lisa succeeds in these tasks and as a reward,

767
00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:27,760
Speaker 1: Bobby Yaga gives her one of her skull lanterns awesome.

768
00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:31,600
Speaker 1: When Vasha Lisa returns home, the lantern sets the home

769
00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:35,759
Speaker 1: of her terrible new family flame, killing them, and then

770
00:45:35,840 --> 00:45:38,200
Speaker 1: she goes on to marry the Tsar. The end happily

771
00:45:38,239 --> 00:45:41,279
Speaker 1: ever after. In this story, it's a great example Bobba

772
00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:44,680
Speaker 1: Yaga feeling filling many roles um, similar to what we

773
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:48,840
Speaker 1: discussed in our episode around the Mother Destroyer. Sometimes in

774
00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:51,879
Speaker 1: other stories she is depicted as a goddess um Are

775
00:45:51,960 --> 00:45:56,080
Speaker 1: and others the manifestation of winter storms. Perhaps because of

776
00:45:56,120 --> 00:46:02,560
Speaker 1: this enigmatic nature, she has become quite the popular figure

777
00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:05,080
Speaker 1: on the internet and yes is sometimes it's jokingly referred

778
00:46:05,080 --> 00:46:08,480
Speaker 1: to as a feminist icon. I'm not mad that no No.

779
00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:14,279
Speaker 1: She unseated the Mermaid and Jezebel's next top creature race

780
00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:19,080
Speaker 1: beating out the siren. That's fantastic. And in two thousand thirteen,

781
00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:22,600
Speaker 1: the feminist website The Hairpin launched an advice column called

782
00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:25,960
Speaker 1: Asked Baba Yaga that eventually became a book called Asked

783
00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:29,840
Speaker 1: Babba Yahua Otherworldly Advice for Everyday Troubles. The book's author,

784
00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:34,040
Speaker 1: Tasia Kaskaya said of Babba Yaga, that image of an

785
00:46:34,040 --> 00:46:36,640
Speaker 1: old woman living in the woods doing whatever she wants

786
00:46:36,680 --> 00:46:39,360
Speaker 1: all day long continues to be the dream for myself.

787
00:46:39,560 --> 00:46:43,560
Speaker 1: I'm with her, I want to be there. Um. And then,

788
00:46:43,560 --> 00:46:46,279
Speaker 1: when trying to get to the bottom of Bobba Yaga's popularity,

789
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:48,640
Speaker 1: academics thought it might be due to her ability to

790
00:46:48,719 --> 00:46:51,920
Speaker 1: house a paradox the good, the evil, and the in between,

791
00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:55,160
Speaker 1: to live outside moral codes, and for women, specifically, her

792
00:46:55,200 --> 00:46:59,600
Speaker 1: rejection of society's rules. Boom. I could see it because

793
00:46:59,640 --> 00:47:02,040
Speaker 1: I mean clearly I got I was all you are

794
00:47:02,239 --> 00:47:04,719
Speaker 1: so like and you know what with all that? Yeah,

795
00:47:04,880 --> 00:47:07,400
Speaker 1: let me do that. Um. And if you want to

796
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:09,640
Speaker 1: learn more about Bobby Yaga, you should check out the

797
00:47:09,640 --> 00:47:11,839
Speaker 1: Stuff You Missed in History Class episode, which is our

798
00:47:12,080 --> 00:47:14,560
Speaker 1: podcast done by some of our wonderful co workers here

799
00:47:14,560 --> 00:47:18,320
Speaker 1: wonderful Piztira and Bobby Yaga, and briefly, if you're wondering,

800
00:47:18,320 --> 00:47:21,720
Speaker 1: Pizza Diira is a supernatural crone from Brazilian folklore who

801
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:24,359
Speaker 1: lies and wait on roofs at night, waiting for some

802
00:47:24,440 --> 00:47:27,319
Speaker 1: poor soul with a full stomach to fall asleep on

803
00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:29,799
Speaker 1: their backs stomach pacing up so that they can jump

804
00:47:29,880 --> 00:47:33,600
Speaker 1: and trample on them. Ah and yeah, there is an

805
00:47:33,719 --> 00:47:38,080
Speaker 1: entire scientific study examining Pizza Diira and her connection to sleeperalysis,

806
00:47:38,160 --> 00:47:44,520
Speaker 1: specifically her that's a great monster. Roll over, just roll over. Now,

807
00:47:44,600 --> 00:47:46,840
Speaker 1: all they do is jump on your stomach. It's like

808
00:47:46,920 --> 00:47:49,920
Speaker 1: a cartoon coming to life. That's amazing. Well, you know,

809
00:47:50,560 --> 00:47:53,680
Speaker 1: I'm sure it's probably pretty violent. I mean, if you

810
00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:55,520
Speaker 1: really get down to it. But then at the same time,

811
00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:59,520
Speaker 1: you're like what my cousin used to tell me that

812
00:47:59,560 --> 00:48:02,640
Speaker 1: if I fell asleep on my back, I wouldn't survive

813
00:48:02,760 --> 00:48:05,240
Speaker 1: to see the morning. Into this day, I can't sleep

814
00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:08,120
Speaker 1: on my back, Yeah, because she said there was something

815
00:48:08,160 --> 00:48:10,040
Speaker 1: like waiting under your bed and it would it could

816
00:48:10,080 --> 00:48:13,799
Speaker 1: only stab you through the back. So to this day

817
00:48:13,840 --> 00:48:16,360
Speaker 1: I cannot sleep on my back. A really specific tale.

818
00:48:16,760 --> 00:48:19,480
Speaker 1: It was, It was quite specific speaking of specific tales,

819
00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:23,560
Speaker 1: this brings us probably my favorite part, right, Lilith, lilith

820
00:48:24,120 --> 00:48:28,280
Speaker 1: Um and some Jewish religious interpretations. Lilith, who was Adam's

821
00:48:28,280 --> 00:48:31,680
Speaker 1: first wife, went on to become the mother of all

822
00:48:31,880 --> 00:48:34,879
Speaker 1: the monsters, so the mother of everything we're talking about here,

823
00:48:35,719 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 1: after refusing to submit to the missionary position like sexual

824
00:48:40,520 --> 00:48:45,120
Speaker 1: mission alright, yes, co co cool Okay. So this whole

825
00:48:45,160 --> 00:48:48,319
Speaker 1: idea of like the missionary position and all of that,

826
00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:53,160
Speaker 1: this comes from a medieval Jewish text called the Alphabet

827
00:48:53,200 --> 00:48:59,480
Speaker 1: of Binsurah, which a lot of historians believe could be satirical. Um,

828
00:48:59,520 --> 00:49:04,720
Speaker 1: but okay. Lilith was created with the earth, as was Adam,

829
00:49:04,840 --> 00:49:10,600
Speaker 1: and had many strong opinions. From lorry start, she said

830
00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:14,880
Speaker 1: to Adam, I will not lie below, to which he responded,

831
00:49:15,239 --> 00:49:17,880
Speaker 1: I will not lie beneath you, but only on top,

832
00:49:18,080 --> 00:49:20,800
Speaker 1: for you are fit only to be in the bottom position,

833
00:49:21,120 --> 00:49:25,160
Speaker 1: while I am to be the superior one. Lilith snapped back,

834
00:49:25,440 --> 00:49:28,440
Speaker 1: we are equal to each other inasmuch as we were

835
00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:31,440
Speaker 1: both created from the earth. And then when Adam still

836
00:49:31,440 --> 00:49:35,719
Speaker 1: wouldn't like listen to her, she flew away. She she

837
00:49:35,840 --> 00:49:39,520
Speaker 1: took God's name in vain, which was a huge deal um,

838
00:49:39,560 --> 00:49:42,920
Speaker 1: and flew away. And then Adam was like, oh, God,

839
00:49:43,200 --> 00:49:46,600
Speaker 1: like literally, God, she flew away, what will I do?

840
00:49:47,200 --> 00:49:50,960
Speaker 1: And God sent three angels after her to persuade Lilith

841
00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:54,319
Speaker 1: to return, inform her that if she refused, one of

842
00:49:54,360 --> 00:49:58,319
Speaker 1: her children a k A demons would die each night.

843
00:49:58,760 --> 00:50:02,040
Speaker 1: And Lili for you, she said, nope, I'm not coming back,

844
00:50:02,440 --> 00:50:05,680
Speaker 1: and she promised to leave children, human children who wore

845
00:50:05,719 --> 00:50:09,160
Speaker 1: an amulet to ward her off alone. So because she

846
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:12,240
Speaker 1: was like, I won't eat all of your human children

847
00:50:12,719 --> 00:50:16,279
Speaker 1: as long as they take some precautions, they threatened to

848
00:50:16,400 --> 00:50:18,960
Speaker 1: drown her in the I think the Red Sea. When

849
00:50:19,000 --> 00:50:21,799
Speaker 1: that's why she agreed. Um, And yes, there was an

850
00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:25,080
Speaker 1: ancient practice of giving children an ambulance inscribed with the

851
00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:27,480
Speaker 1: names of the three angels that was meant to keep

852
00:50:27,520 --> 00:50:31,880
Speaker 1: Olilith away. Lilith also is frequently condemned for wondering about

853
00:50:31,920 --> 00:50:34,440
Speaker 1: at night, vexing the sons of men and causing them

854
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:40,879
Speaker 1: to defile themselves. Oh jeez. Lili's story is complex and fascinating.

855
00:50:41,239 --> 00:50:43,880
Speaker 1: The first known reference of her goes back to Samaran

856
00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:46,000
Speaker 1: list of demons from two thousand, four hundred b c.

857
00:50:46,840 --> 00:50:50,680
Speaker 1: Lee Lu demons were similar to succuby m, who seduced

858
00:50:50,719 --> 00:50:55,040
Speaker 1: sleeping men in order to produce demonic children. Iterations of

859
00:50:55,040 --> 00:50:59,240
Speaker 1: her appeared in ancient Egyptian, Greek, and Israeli legends. Got

860
00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:03,680
Speaker 1: the name checked Her and Fast and Ulysses by James Joyce.

861
00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:08,360
Speaker 1: She is labeled as the patron of abortions in C. S.

862
00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:11,759
Speaker 1: Lewis's Chronicles of Narnia. She is the ancestor of the

863
00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:15,719
Speaker 1: White which I didn't know that She's mentioned in the

864
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:18,600
Speaker 1: Chronicles of Naria. A tablet from the seventh or eighth

865
00:51:18,600 --> 00:51:22,200
Speaker 1: century BC found in Syria mentioned Lilith owe you who

866
00:51:22,200 --> 00:51:25,160
Speaker 1: fly in the darkened room, be off with you, this

867
00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:29,200
Speaker 1: instant Lilith, thief, breaker of bones, so scary like that,

868
00:51:29,200 --> 00:51:31,279
Speaker 1: I'm gonna put that us somewhere. In some versions of

869
00:51:31,280 --> 00:51:34,200
Speaker 1: the story she made it with the archangel Simuel. In

870
00:51:34,280 --> 00:51:37,600
Speaker 1: other versions a demon which I've seen versions where she's

871
00:51:37,680 --> 00:51:41,760
Speaker 1: sister of God and not necessary and the darkness whatever,

872
00:51:41,880 --> 00:51:44,839
Speaker 1: but not necessarily the wife of Adam. Yeah, I mean

873
00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:48,359
Speaker 1: that's another thing, is there is interpretation around that she

874
00:51:48,560 --> 00:51:54,319
Speaker 1: never was Adam's wife. Um, A lot of discussion around

875
00:51:54,400 --> 00:51:57,520
Speaker 1: the list. But when we wanted to touch on Judith.

876
00:51:57,560 --> 00:52:01,719
Speaker 1: Plasco wrote a parable and nteen seventy two about her

877
00:52:01,800 --> 00:52:04,719
Speaker 1: about Lilith called The Coming of Lilith, reframing the story

878
00:52:04,760 --> 00:52:07,080
Speaker 1: in a similar way that Wicked did with the Wizard

879
00:52:07,080 --> 00:52:09,000
Speaker 1: of Oz as we could win to the West. In

880
00:52:09,040 --> 00:52:11,960
Speaker 1: the parable, she fled for refusing to be treated as

881
00:52:12,000 --> 00:52:14,960
Speaker 1: lesser than Adam, who she regarded as her equal, and

882
00:52:15,080 --> 00:52:18,480
Speaker 1: was viciously slandered for it. And then she and Eve,

883
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:23,200
Speaker 1: looking for some women some support, they became fast friends,

884
00:52:23,800 --> 00:52:27,200
Speaker 1: and Lilis sort of became a feminist hero after that,

885
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:29,640
Speaker 1: an image helped along by the nineteen seventy six launch

886
00:52:29,719 --> 00:52:33,480
Speaker 1: of Lilith magazine, complete with the tagline independent, Jewish and

887
00:52:33,560 --> 00:52:38,560
Speaker 1: frankly feminist, and in the all female music festival, Lilis Fair.

888
00:52:38,680 --> 00:52:40,880
Speaker 1: Of course, little Fair. I love that. And then, you know,

889
00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:43,440
Speaker 1: as you were talking about the retelling of the stories,

890
00:52:43,480 --> 00:52:45,600
Speaker 1: and like a lot of the pop culture, which has

891
00:52:45,600 --> 00:52:48,319
Speaker 1: been a new thing to bring Lilith back up supernatural

892
00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:51,160
Speaker 1: they kind of revamped her story and that as well,

893
00:52:51,280 --> 00:52:53,720
Speaker 1: and she was also in True Blood not necessarily revamp

894
00:52:53,760 --> 00:52:57,520
Speaker 1: part of that storyline. Um, but some modern witches and

895
00:52:57,520 --> 00:53:00,719
Speaker 1: pagans invoke Lilith in their practices and right, especially those

896
00:53:00,800 --> 00:53:03,560
Speaker 1: involving the darker side of the feminine. So yeah, like

897
00:53:03,880 --> 00:53:08,600
Speaker 1: goals around money or rights, yeah, which if any listeners

898
00:53:09,320 --> 00:53:12,600
Speaker 1: are involved, and these kinds of practices and right, So

899
00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:16,160
Speaker 1: we'd love to hear from Oh my gosh, I could

900
00:53:16,160 --> 00:53:19,560
Speaker 1: talk about Lilith. There's so much to say about this. Actually,

901
00:53:19,600 --> 00:53:22,920
Speaker 1: one of my favorite books is UM called Lilith, and

902
00:53:22,920 --> 00:53:25,080
Speaker 1: it's kind of reclaiming the name because then for a

903
00:53:25,080 --> 00:53:29,480
Speaker 1: while the name was just seen as like evil. I

904
00:53:29,560 --> 00:53:31,799
Speaker 1: do like this brings us to the end of our

905
00:53:31,960 --> 00:53:34,200
Speaker 1: history of monsters, even though there's so many that we

906
00:53:34,200 --> 00:53:36,920
Speaker 1: could include, and so many of these that could be

907
00:53:37,200 --> 00:53:40,359
Speaker 1: fleshed out into full episodes. But I do think it's

908
00:53:40,360 --> 00:53:43,960
Speaker 1: interesting ending on Lilith, like this mother of monster idea

909
00:53:44,040 --> 00:53:47,640
Speaker 1: that we've been touching on the whole time UM, and

910
00:53:47,680 --> 00:53:50,320
Speaker 1: we can see these themes over and over again of

911
00:53:50,440 --> 00:53:57,879
Speaker 1: like motherhood and revenge and justice and just kind of

912
00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:03,879
Speaker 1: punishing eight which is the dark side of feminine. I mean,

913
00:54:04,120 --> 00:54:06,360
Speaker 1: Lilith is kind of the arc of being a femin

914
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:13,600
Speaker 1: saying hell no, hell no. Okay, well, yeah, we have

915
00:54:13,640 --> 00:54:15,680
Speaker 1: a little bit more for you. But first we're going

916
00:54:15,760 --> 00:54:17,960
Speaker 1: to pause for one more quick break forward from our sponsor,

917
00:54:31,719 --> 00:54:36,760
Speaker 1: and we're back. Thank you, Thank you monsters, and also

918
00:54:36,800 --> 00:54:42,799
Speaker 1: thank you sponsors who are not monsters. Well it's on

919
00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:46,960
Speaker 1: my brain, okay, and it's fair. Yes, Um, we did

920
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:49,280
Speaker 1: want to touch on some things that are changing because

921
00:54:49,560 --> 00:54:52,000
Speaker 1: we have given what I feel like are some pretty

922
00:54:52,000 --> 00:54:54,680
Speaker 1: great examples of female monsters and what they can be.

923
00:54:55,080 --> 00:54:57,400
Speaker 1: We've given some not so great ones as well, but

924
00:54:57,680 --> 00:55:00,640
Speaker 1: there is still this monster gap that we touched on

925
00:55:00,680 --> 00:55:04,480
Speaker 1: the beginning. Um, and some badass women out there are

926
00:55:04,560 --> 00:55:06,560
Speaker 1: trying to make things more equal when it comes to

927
00:55:06,640 --> 00:55:10,920
Speaker 1: our betrayal around monsters. Theodora Goss got a pH d

928
00:55:10,960 --> 00:55:14,319
Speaker 1: in English in part by writing a four page dissertation

929
00:55:14,560 --> 00:55:17,600
Speaker 1: on Victorian monsters, and she wanted to remedy this whole thing,

930
00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:20,279
Speaker 1: or at least do her part to remedy it by

931
00:55:20,320 --> 00:55:23,520
Speaker 1: writing a short called The Mad Scientist's Daughter, which follows

932
00:55:23,640 --> 00:55:29,320
Speaker 1: Katherine Monroe, Justine Frankenstein, and Diana Hyde. And she built

933
00:55:29,560 --> 00:55:32,960
Speaker 1: upon that universe with the novel The Strange Case of

934
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:35,439
Speaker 1: the Alchemist Daughter, which I kind of love. I love that, Yeah,

935
00:55:35,480 --> 00:55:37,400
Speaker 1: I love the whole plotline. And when it comes to

936
00:55:37,440 --> 00:55:40,480
Speaker 1: our entertainment. For so long, women have only been allowed

937
00:55:40,520 --> 00:55:42,960
Speaker 1: to exist within the framework of the male gaze. And

938
00:55:43,040 --> 00:55:46,400
Speaker 1: we talked about before, if she's not sexualized, she's ridiculously

939
00:55:46,520 --> 00:55:49,880
Speaker 1: de sexualized. And if these for examples shows anything, we

940
00:55:49,920 --> 00:55:53,400
Speaker 1: are still grappling with our fear of women's sexuality. Obviously,

941
00:55:53,760 --> 00:55:56,920
Speaker 1: so minor, minor thing to tackle, right, But that that's

942
00:55:56,960 --> 00:55:59,920
Speaker 1: that play in all of this um our discomfort with

943
00:56:00,040 --> 00:56:02,520
Speaker 1: women who don't behave how we expect them to, of

944
00:56:02,600 --> 00:56:05,480
Speaker 1: women who step outside the narrow box we've deemed appropriate

945
00:56:05,480 --> 00:56:08,080
Speaker 1: for femininity. That's another thing that's in play at play

946
00:56:08,120 --> 00:56:10,600
Speaker 1: and all this, And I do think it's interesting that, um,

947
00:56:10,760 --> 00:56:13,840
Speaker 1: like we said at the top, male monsters are frequently

948
00:56:13,880 --> 00:56:16,919
Speaker 1: allowed sympathy and female monsters are not. They're not as

949
00:56:18,280 --> 00:56:22,719
Speaker 1: fleshed out, they're not as a whole of characters. Um.

950
00:56:22,800 --> 00:56:25,320
Speaker 1: And this very thing and the fact that women commit

951
00:56:25,400 --> 00:56:27,400
Speaker 1: murder at much lower rates than men contribute to a

952
00:56:27,440 --> 00:56:33,799
Speaker 1: culture that sensationalized female murderers. UM. So there's a lot

953
00:56:33,840 --> 00:56:36,640
Speaker 1: to talk about, so many things when it comes to

954
00:56:36,760 --> 00:56:40,240
Speaker 1: female monsters, and not just nerdy stuff. I was getting

955
00:56:40,239 --> 00:56:42,759
Speaker 1: to talk about one of my favorite things at Lost, right,

956
00:56:43,080 --> 00:56:45,960
Speaker 1: I love that knows. I learned a lot. See how

957
00:56:45,960 --> 00:56:49,239
Speaker 1: passionate you are, and it's fantastic. Yeah, I got I

958
00:56:50,440 --> 00:56:53,480
Speaker 1: have a lot of passionate, very diplomatic way of saying it. Um.

959
00:56:53,640 --> 00:56:55,600
Speaker 1: We would love to hear from listeners if there's any

960
00:56:56,120 --> 00:57:00,040
Speaker 1: of monsters that you want to uh want us to

961
00:57:00,120 --> 00:57:02,640
Speaker 1: return to, or that we didn't mention our movies, that

962
00:57:02,640 --> 00:57:04,439
Speaker 1: we should watch, books we should read. You can send

963
00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:07,920
Speaker 1: those our way before we get into our our outro officially,

964
00:57:07,960 --> 00:57:10,000
Speaker 1: though we do have some shout outs. We do have

965
00:57:10,040 --> 00:57:13,120
Speaker 1: shout outs, so of course to backtrack with all of

966
00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:16,160
Speaker 1: our love for horror movies, and I picked a couple

967
00:57:16,200 --> 00:57:18,720
Speaker 1: out which you may have already heard, that are women

968
00:57:18,800 --> 00:57:22,240
Speaker 1: in horror movie genres or talking about mysteries of sorts.

969
00:57:22,280 --> 00:57:25,280
Speaker 1: So Women in Caskets, which is one podcast which I

970
00:57:25,320 --> 00:57:27,040
Speaker 1: know I think it's got a pretty big following anyway,

971
00:57:27,080 --> 00:57:28,600
Speaker 1: but I was like, oh, this is cool, which, by

972
00:57:28,640 --> 00:57:30,800
Speaker 1: the way, when I googled it without the word podcast,

973
00:57:30,960 --> 00:57:34,680
Speaker 1: I got some really bad pictures. Don't do that. Don't

974
00:57:34,720 --> 00:57:37,040
Speaker 1: do that. Um. And then switch Blade Sisters, which is

975
00:57:37,080 --> 00:57:40,560
Speaker 1: also another great little podcast, great to look into. Again,

976
00:57:40,600 --> 00:57:43,280
Speaker 1: they probably all have pretty big followings but if y'all

977
00:57:43,280 --> 00:57:45,440
Speaker 1: are interested and I have not, are these jump on it?

978
00:57:45,480 --> 00:57:46,800
Speaker 1: If y'all know more that I need to get it

979
00:57:46,800 --> 00:57:49,840
Speaker 1: into or especially and he needs to get into it obviously.

980
00:57:50,160 --> 00:57:53,560
Speaker 1: Um remember I was trying to I needed we need

981
00:57:53,560 --> 00:57:55,760
Speaker 1: to reach out to Tan yet because she was posting

982
00:57:55,760 --> 00:57:59,480
Speaker 1: about them recently too. Okay, Yes, you can send any

983
00:57:59,520 --> 00:58:02,280
Speaker 1: of those such questions any at all to our email.

984
00:58:02,640 --> 00:58:05,080
Speaker 1: It is Stuff Media Mom Stuff at i heeart media

985
00:58:05,160 --> 00:58:07,560
Speaker 1: dot com. You can also find us on Twitter at

986
00:58:07,560 --> 00:58:10,560
Speaker 1: mom Stuff Podcast and on Instagram at Stuff Mom Never

987
00:58:10,600 --> 00:58:14,600
Speaker 1: Told You. Thanks as always, too, super producer Andrew Howard. Okay,

988
00:58:15,000 --> 00:58:18,040
Speaker 1: and thanks to you for listening Stuff I've Never Told

989
00:58:18,080 --> 00:58:20,000
Speaker 1: You his prediction of I Heart Radio's house Stuff Works

990
00:58:20,040 --> 00:58:21,800
Speaker 1: for more. Podcast from my Heart Radio is the I

991
00:58:21,880 --> 00:58:24,040
Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to

992
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:24,800
Speaker 1: your favorite shows,