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Speaker 1: You're listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM

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Speaker 1: paranormal podcast network, where we offer you podcasts of the

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Speaker 1: supernatural and the unexplained. Get ready now for Shades of

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Speaker 1: the Afterlife with Sandra Champlain.

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Speaker 2: The thoughts and opinions expressed by the host are thoughts

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Speaker 2: and opinions only and do not necessarily reflect those of iHeartMedia,

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Speaker 2: iHeartRadio to Coast AM, employees of Premiere Networks, or their

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Speaker 2: sponsors and associates. You are encouraged to do the proper

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Speaker 2: amount of research yourself, depending on the subject matter and

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Speaker 2: your needs.

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Speaker 3: Hi.

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Speaker 4: I'm Sandra Champlain. For over twenty five years, I've been

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Speaker 4: on a journey to prove the existence of life after death.

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Speaker 4: On each episode, we'll discuss the reasons we now know

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Speaker 4: that our loved ones have survived physical debt, and so

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Speaker 4: will we Welcome to Shades of the Afterlife. There is

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Speaker 4: a term that I have never used before on Shades

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Speaker 4: of the Afterlife? Can you believe it? Over one hundred

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Speaker 4: and forty episodes, this term has been appearing quite a

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Speaker 4: bit in conversations and Internet searches. All of a sudden,

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Speaker 4: there it is. The term is terminal lucidity. I know

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Speaker 4: that we've spoken about just before someone passes or the

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Speaker 4: weeks they can be alert, see loved ones that are

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Speaker 4: right there in the room with them, and they appear

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Speaker 4: just like the real people, the doctors, the nurses and families.

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Speaker 4: But there's a closely related phenomena, and that's this terminal lucidity,

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Speaker 4: which may involve loved ones coming to visit or it

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Speaker 4: may not. I remember the very first story I had

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Speaker 4: ever heard heard of this, and I just kind of

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Speaker 4: put it in the realm of deathbed visions. I had

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Speaker 4: a wonderful conversation with a hospice chaplain named Steve Kearney,

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Speaker 4: who I knew when I was cooking for the race teams.

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Speaker 4: He knew I was interested in life after death, and

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Speaker 4: he wanted to tell me the extraordinary story of when

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Speaker 4: his father died. He told me that his father had

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Speaker 4: been in a coma for months, and shortly before his death,

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Speaker 4: he became alive, awake, swung his legs over the bed,

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Speaker 4: and of course everybody's trying to stop him because he's

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Speaker 4: hooked up to all these tubes and he's looking as

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Speaker 4: if looking into heaven, and he's saying it's so beautiful there,

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Speaker 4: And they said, Dad, what do you see? And he

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Speaker 4: started telling them people that he saw that were deceased,

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Speaker 4: and then he said he saw a certain woman who

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Speaker 4: had died during this man's coma. So he was never

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Speaker 4: told that this lady died, but he could see her there.

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Speaker 4: What else can you see? And he felt like he

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Speaker 4: heard Jesus saying that he only has a short time

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Speaker 4: to live to do the things he wants to do

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Speaker 4: because he wouldn't have his body too much longer. What

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Speaker 4: did he want? He wanted an apple pie, he wanted

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Speaker 4: his family together watching a football game, and he wanted

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Speaker 4: a chocolate milkshake. With having all of those, the man

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Speaker 4: was crystal clear lucid alive, giving the family the feeling

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Speaker 4: like he was back, and just a couple of nights later,

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Speaker 4: he passed away. So terminal lucidity is when someone doesn't

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Speaker 4: have proper brain or body function and comes alive shortly

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Speaker 4: before death. The more I researched this today, the more

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Speaker 4: hospice nurses and doctors and people putting comments under YouTube

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Speaker 4: videos have experienced this with their loved ones. There have

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Speaker 4: been cases of Alzheimer's patients who really have lost use

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Speaker 4: of their mind, who haven't spoke, and again they rally.

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Speaker 4: They come back to life for just a very short time,

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Speaker 4: but can have a conversation for an hour or two

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Speaker 4: that makes sense. That's talking about life. They have memories. Now,

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Speaker 4: how is this possible in a brain with very little

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Speaker 4: brain function? There's something extraordinary going on here. This article

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Speaker 4: comes from the Scientific American magazine, written by Jesse Baring.

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Speaker 4: When my mother died in early two thousand, we had

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Speaker 4: a final farewell that some researchers might consider paranormal. At

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Speaker 4: the time, it did strike me as remarkable, and after

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Speaker 4: all that these years, I still can't talk about it

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Speaker 4: without getting emotional. The night before mom died at the

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Speaker 4: age of fifty four after a long battle with ovarian cancer,

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Speaker 4: I was sleeping in my mother's bedroom alongside her. The

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Speaker 4: truth was that I'd already grieved her loss a few

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Speaker 4: days earlier, from the moment she lapsed into what the

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Speaker 4: hospice nurses had assured us was an irretrievable coma. So

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Speaker 4: at this point, waiting for her body to expire as

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Speaker 4: a physical machine wasn't as difficult as the loss of

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Speaker 4: her beforehand, which is when I'd completely broken down. It

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Speaker 4: had all happened so quickly, and I suppose, being young

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Speaker 4: and in denial about how imminent her death really was,

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Speaker 4: I hadn't actually gotten around to telling her how very

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Speaker 4: grateful I was to have had her as my mom

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Speaker 4: and just how much I loved her. But then around

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Speaker 4: three a m. I awoke to find her reaching her

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Speaker 4: hand out to me, and she seemed very much aware.

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Speaker 4: She was too weak to talk, but her eyes communicated all.

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Speaker 4: We spent about five minutes holding hands, me sobbing, kissing

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Speaker 4: her cheeks, telling her everything I'd meant to say before

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Speaker 4: but hadn't. Soon she closed her eyes again, this time

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Speaker 4: for good. She died the next day. I didn't quite

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Speaker 4: see the experience as supernatural when it happened, and I'm

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Speaker 4: not sure I do today either, But I also didn't

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Speaker 4: have a name for the experience then. In fact, one

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Speaker 4: didn't even exist. It does now, called terminal lucidity. The

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Speaker 4: term was coined by German biologist Michael Nahm. He was

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Speaker 4: the first to review in an article on the curious

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Speaker 4: subject of cognitively impaired people becoming clear headed as their

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Speaker 4: death approaches. According to him, and of terminal lucidity. They

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Speaker 4: have been recorded for millennia, from accounts by classical scholars

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Speaker 4: such as Hippocrates and Cicero to the nineteenth century medical

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Speaker 4: luminaries like Benjamin Rush, who wrote the first American paper

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Speaker 4: on mental illness. Here's Hownam defined terminal lucidity in that

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Speaker 4: original article the reemergence of normal or unusually enhanced mental

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Speaker 4: abilities in dull, unconscious, or mentally ill patients shortly before

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Speaker 4: their death, including considerable elevation of mood and spiritual affectation,

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Speaker 4: or the ability to speak in a previously unusual, spiritualized

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Speaker 4: and elated manner. The author characterizes terminal lucidity as one

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Speaker 4: of the more common but lesser known end of life experiences.

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Speaker 4: On his list include deathbed visions, apparitions, near death or

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Speaker 4: out of body experiences, telepathic impressions, and so on. But

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Speaker 4: terminal lucidity is a vague concept, needless to say. First

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Speaker 4: of all, what exactly should qualify as the time period

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Speaker 4: shortly before death minutes, hours, days, maybe months. One man

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Speaker 4: who'd been completely catatonic for nearly two decades became almost

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Speaker 4: normal and lucid just before he passed away. And the

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Speaker 4: second subtype of terminal lucidity. The author tells us full

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Speaker 4: mental clarity can appear quite abruptly and unexpectedly, just hours

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Speaker 4: or days before death, and one study, seventy percent of

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Speaker 4: caretakers in a British nursing home said they'd personally observed

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Speaker 4: people with dementia becoming lucid shortly before the deaths. A

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Speaker 4: ninety two year old woman with advanced Alzheimer's disease, for instance,

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Speaker 4: hadn't recognized her family for years, but the day before

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Speaker 4: her death, she had a pleasantly bright conversation with them,

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Speaker 4: recalling everyone's name. She was even aware of her own

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Speaker 4: age and where she'd been living all of this time.

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Speaker 4: Such incidents happened regularly. I'm going to pause reading this

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Speaker 4: article right now because I found an excellent conversation between

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Speaker 4: two researchers of life after death talking about terminal lucidity.

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Speaker 4: So after the break we will hear from them. I'd

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Speaker 4: like to read you one more example. This woman says,

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Speaker 4: in the mid nineties, with her eyesight rapidly going, in

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Speaker 4: her memory diminishing, my maternal grandmother, Kitty Lewis, moved into

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Speaker 4: a care home after suffering a series of mini strokes

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Speaker 4: and being diagnosed with vascular dementia. From there, her behavior

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Speaker 4: began to change. This prim proper, polite and warm woman

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Speaker 4: for decades, a stalwart of whichever community she was in,

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Speaker 4: had her personality twisted and transformed by dementia, and she

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Speaker 4: became paranoid, aggressive, and verbally abusive. Her short term memory

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Speaker 4: was shot and the rest of it was patchy. She

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Speaker 4: would rarely know who we were as her family, and

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Speaker 4: in the last couple of years she was just angry, depressed,

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Speaker 4: and confused, and she didn't want to see people. We

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Speaker 4: visited anyway, sitting with her while she wanted to die.

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Speaker 4: Then in October, she was admitted into the hospital having

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Speaker 4: collapsed with a urinary track infection. For a week she

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Speaker 4: was barely conscious, but on the Sunday when my parents,

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Speaker 4: cousin and I visited, she was sitting up in bed

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Speaker 4: smiling as we walked in. For the next two hours,

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Speaker 4: she laughed and joked, completely cognitive coherent, lucid. A lifetime

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Speaker 4: of memory had returned, and we took full advantage of

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Speaker 4: it as she regaled us with escapades from her past.

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Speaker 4: My mom, who knew many of them, quietly verified everything

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Speaker 4: she said. Her funny, eloquent, vibrant mother had returned. It

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Speaker 4: all came back to her in one rush. It was

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Speaker 4: like a bolt of lightning. The clouds cleared. After we

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Speaker 4: left that afternoon. My grandma slipped into a semi conscious state,

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Speaker 4: soon not knowing who my mother was, and died within days.

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Speaker 4: We live in what I call a human energy vehicle.

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Speaker 4: We are the driver of the car. The car is

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Speaker 4: our body. The driver is us, our soul, and this

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Speaker 4: energy vehicle. Our body is so intelligent we don't need

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Speaker 4: to tell it when to breathe. We get a little

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Speaker 4: signal when it's time to sleep, when it's time to eat.

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Speaker 4: Do we know that there are trillions of cells in

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Speaker 4: our body, each doing different things, and how our heart,

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Speaker 4: our liver, our kidneys, all of that functions without us

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Speaker 4: having to be in control. I think for the dying process,

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Speaker 4: whether it's terminal lucidity, or whether it's seeing our loved

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Speaker 4: ones appear helping us cross that finish line, that the

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Speaker 4: body and the mind and our consciousness has a plan

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Speaker 4: for us. It's all regulated, and it's all controlled, and

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Speaker 4: it's all just one more way of saying, you are

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Speaker 4: a miraculous being, and you do not die, So let's

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Speaker 4: go to the break and we'll be back. You're listening

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Speaker 4: to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast

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Speaker 4: to Coast AM Paranormal podcast Network.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. Keep it here on the iHeartRadio on

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Speaker 6: Hi, it's don your sky.

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Speaker 2: Keep it right here on the iHeartRadio and Coast to

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Speaker 4: Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain

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Speaker 4: and we are talking about terminal lucidity. Here's a name

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Speaker 4: that you should know, an amazing author that I really

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Speaker 4: respect is Jeffrey Mishlov. He's the author of such books

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Speaker 4: as New Thinking Aloud, is Their Life after Death and

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Speaker 4: the Roots of Consciousness. He has fascinating conversations and really

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Speaker 4: digs about life after death, consciousness, and so much more.

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Speaker 4: In fact, if you go to YouTube, just look up

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Speaker 4: New Thinking Aloud with Jeffrey Mishlov. But here's another good

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Speaker 4: reason to listen to him. You may have heard of

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Speaker 4: the Bigelow Institute's recent contest giving away a total of

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Speaker 4: a million dollars for proof of the afterlife that our

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Speaker 4: consciousness survives death. Jeffrey Mishlov is the first place winner

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Speaker 4: and The title of his entry is called Beyond on

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Speaker 4: the Brain, The Survival of Human Consciousness after Permanent bodily Death.

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Speaker 4: You can read it at Bigelowinstitute dot org. So what

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Speaker 4: we're going to do is evesdrop on a conversation he

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Speaker 4: had with doctor Stafford Betty on this topic of terminal lucidity. Now.

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Speaker 4: Doctor Betty is a professor of religious studies at California

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Speaker 4: State University and is the author of the books The

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Speaker 4: Afterlife Unveiled. What the Dead are telling us about their world?

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Speaker 4: When did you ever become less by dying? Afterlife? The evidence?

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Speaker 7: And more so, let's listen terminal lucidity. It's you know,

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Speaker 7: I think it's only been maybe in the last ten

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Speaker 7: years that I've even heard the term.

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Speaker 6: That's right. It wasn't invented until twenty nine, two thousand

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Speaker 6: and nine. Can you believe that? And yet there have

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Speaker 6: been cases of terminal lucidity and the literature for the

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Speaker 6: last one hundred and twenty years. Yes, but there had

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Speaker 6: never been a term used to baptize the phenomena.

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Speaker 7: Well know, I suppose many people are just normally very

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Speaker 7: lucid as they get ill and as they die. It's

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Speaker 7: not unusual for a person to be lucid unless they've

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Speaker 7: suffered from some sort of a brain injury.

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Speaker 6: Exactly, or illness. And that's what terminal lucidity is looking at.

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Speaker 6: It's particularly looking at Alzheimer's patients. Take a woman who

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Speaker 6: has lost all ability to communicate with her visitors, with

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Speaker 6: her loved ones, and they come. She doesn't recognize them,

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Speaker 6: she doesn't know their name, she doesn't speak, she doesn't

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Speaker 6: seem to be even aware of her world. She's just

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Speaker 6: what we sometimes call a human vegetable.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 6: And then, for some strange reason, just before she dies

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Speaker 6: and her loved ones have come to gather around the

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Speaker 6: she irrupts into her old personality. Her brain is all

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Speaker 6: but totally destroyed, but suddenly she is able to communicate

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Speaker 6: with her loved ones. She speaks, she wonders about her

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Speaker 6: grandchildren and how they're doing. She knows everyone's names. She's

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Speaker 6: completely herself. This is an example of terminal lucidity, and

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Speaker 6: it happens. According to doctor Alexander Baianni, who's looked into

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Speaker 6: this more than anyone else alive, it happens in about

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Speaker 6: five to ten percent of Alzheimer's cases.

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Speaker 7: Well, I can say it happened to my mother who

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Speaker 7: tell me about that. My mother had Alzheimer's. She died

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Speaker 7: six years ago at the age of ninety, and she

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Speaker 7: was somewhat coherent before her death. I mean, her memory

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Speaker 7: was very, very bad, but she always recognized me. And

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Speaker 7: my wife Janelle was with her at this time, and

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Speaker 7: she reports that my mother just sort of sat up

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Speaker 7: in the bed and they had a lengthy conversation for

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Speaker 7: over two hours in which my mother was her old self,

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Speaker 7: like at least more than ten years earlier, before this

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Speaker 7: illness had destroyed so much of her memory. And they

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Speaker 7: talked about, you know, her marriage and her children, how

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Speaker 7: she was progressing with her disease. And she had had

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Speaker 7: a boyfriend who had died a year earlier, and she

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Speaker 7: was her Alzheimer's had progressed so badly that she kept

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Speaker 7: asking for him all the time the whole year. She

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Speaker 7: just could not digest the fact that he had died.

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Speaker 7: I see, But all of that was clear. She was

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Speaker 7: completely lucid.

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Speaker 6: Right, that's terminal lucidity. How long did it take before

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Speaker 6: she died after that experience? Do you remember less than

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Speaker 6: a week?

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Speaker 3: Oh?

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Speaker 6: Okay, there it is right. It usually runs between a

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Speaker 6: couple of weeks and just a matter of minutes. Yeah,

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Speaker 6: there it is now. Terminal lucidity is not something that

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Speaker 6: is confined to Alzheimer's. Anyone who has had a seriously

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Speaker 6: damaged brain or a brain that's been eaten away by

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Speaker 6: maybe cancer, is capable. Unpredictably, we never know who they're

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Speaker 6: going to.

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Speaker 7: My wife had another similar experience with a client of

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Speaker 7: hers who a psychotherapy client who she had worked with

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Speaker 7: for many, many years, who was a very serious alcoholic

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Speaker 7: and had all sorts of emotional and physical problems and

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Speaker 7: attachments due to the alcoholism. And she died in childbirth.

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Speaker 7: It was very tragic circumstances. But shortly before her death,

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Speaker 7: I think it was the same day in fact, or

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Speaker 7: maybe the day before, she like my mother, sat up

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Speaker 7: in the hospital bed and they had a lengthy conversation.

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Speaker 7: And the interesting thing is that she seemed emotionally for

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Speaker 7: the first time, totally clear, totally objective about herself, able

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Speaker 7: to look at her own life and understand things that

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Speaker 7: had eluded her in psychotherapy for years and years. And

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Speaker 7: her greatest wish at that time is, oh, I wish

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Speaker 7: everybody could see me like this. Yeah, yeah, she knew

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Speaker 7: that this was different. Yeah, that's another example. Let me

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Speaker 7: go back into the past and dretch up a couple

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Speaker 7: of famous cases. A biologist, professor.

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Speaker 6: The University of Freiburg in Germany, Michael Naum, is responsible

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Speaker 6: for bringing all of this stuff that we now call

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Speaker 6: terminal lucidity out of the dark and wrote a long

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Speaker 6: article for the Journal of Near Death Studies on famous

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Speaker 6: cases that he now recognized as being what we now

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Speaker 6: call termal lucidity. And the most famous case is that

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Speaker 6: of a girl whose name was Kita k a t

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Speaker 6: h e. Kita, a German girl, and she had the

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Speaker 6: absolutely she had. She had been born profoundly disabled, never

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Speaker 6: capable of as she grew older, of making any more

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Speaker 6: movement than just sort of spasmodic jerk. She had no

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Speaker 6: control over her body. She never learned a single word,

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Speaker 6: never spoken a word. Just a tragic case of someone

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Speaker 6: whom you would say it was better had she not

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Speaker 6: been born profound, profoundly retarded, and she had been hospitalized

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Speaker 6: her entire life. Okay, just left there basically the rod

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Speaker 6: away and I would say, fortunately, she contracted the disease

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Speaker 6: of tuberculosis as a teenager, and she was close to death,

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Speaker 6: and the most astonishing thing happened just before she died.

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Speaker 6: She became a lucid person, speaking German, singing Christian hymns.

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Speaker 6: And can you imagine the amazement of all of the staff,

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Speaker 6: somebody who had never spoken, never spoken a word.

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Speaker 7: And I know this occurs that a nephew who had

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Speaker 7: the same condition born without a corpus colosive brain severely damaged.

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Speaker 6: Unbelievable. Anyway, there she was, and she was a transformed person.

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Speaker 6: They spoke about how her face glowed with this kind

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Speaker 6: of spirituality, and up to this point it to have

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Speaker 6: been nothing but just, you know, kind of animalistic. The

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Speaker 6: only kind of sounds she ever made were animalistic sounds.

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Speaker 6: Absolute transformation. There's no way to explain via conventional brain

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Speaker 6: science how that could have happened. And that's true of

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Speaker 6: Alzheimer's patients. You know, their brains have been eaten up

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Speaker 6: to such an extent that there is no way to explain.

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Speaker 7: These lucides generally considered irreversible.

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Speaker 6: It's irreversible, it is, And this leads a number of

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Speaker 6: us to a very different kind of conclusion. The reason

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Speaker 6: these loose lucid moments happen is not because there's been

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Speaker 6: a sudden creation of billions of new brain cells in

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Speaker 6: this brain. It's that the being, the consciousness, the person

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Speaker 6: who really is, has managed to loosen herself or himself

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Speaker 6: from the brain. The soul in other words, if you

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Speaker 6: want to call it, that has managed to loosen itself

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Speaker 6: from the brain, and that has made it possible for

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Speaker 6: this remarkable transcendence.

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Speaker 7: And loosen from the brain, but still in control of

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Speaker 7: the vocal cords.

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Speaker 6: Somehow. It's very mysterious how this all works. Doctor Bognanni

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Speaker 6: uses a wonderful analogy. He talks of the consciousness or

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Speaker 6: the soul, if you will, spiritual self as being like

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Speaker 6: the sun in eclipse, and the moon is causing the eclipse.

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Speaker 6: If you move, and the moon, of course is like

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Speaker 6: the sick brain, you remove the moon or the sick brain,

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Speaker 6: then the sun shines. There was never anything wrong with

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Speaker 6: the sun in the first place. It's just that it

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Speaker 6: couldn't communicate because it was obstructed by the sick brain.

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Speaker 7: So you, in a sense regard the cases of terminal

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Speaker 7: lucidity as evidence for the notion that the spirit or

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Speaker 7: mind or psyche or consciousness can operate independently of the

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Speaker 7: soma or the body, or the nervous system and brain.

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Speaker 6: That's exactly right. It's sort of a duellist, exactly so.

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Speaker 6: And it is one of the nine types of evidence

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Speaker 6: for survival of death that I go through in my book.

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Speaker 6: It's I think it's the weakest of them, but I

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Speaker 6: think still it's very suggestive. And it becomes more suggestive

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Speaker 6: when you look at the research done by a doctor

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Speaker 6: in Britain named John Lorber. He was the head of

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Speaker 6: a hospital, or I guess it was a hospital. Six

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Speaker 6: hundred hydrocephalics were kept. Okay, and these are people with

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Speaker 6: big heads, water on the brain, yes, And in many

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Speaker 6: of these cases the brain has almost completely disappeared. The

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Speaker 6: fluid has basically taken the place of the brain.

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Speaker 4: I know you're on the edge of your seat waiting

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Speaker 4: for him to finish the story, but we have to

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Speaker 4: take a break, so don't go anywhere. We'll be right back.

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Speaker 4: You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio

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Speaker 4: in Coast to Coast a and Paranormal Podcast Network. The

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Speaker 4: Internet is an extraordinary resource that links our children to

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Speaker 4: a world of information, experiences, and ideas. It can also

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Speaker 4: expose them to risk. Teach your children the basic safety

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Speaker 4: rules of the virtual world. Our children are everything, Do

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Speaker 4: everything for them. Hi, this is Wuija board expert Karen A.

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Speaker 6: Dolman, and you're listening to the.

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Speaker 4: iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

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Speaker 8: Hi, this is ufologist Kevin Randall, and you're listening to

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Speaker 8: the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.

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Speaker 4: Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain

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Speaker 4: and we are eavesdropping on a very interesting conversation between

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Speaker 4: doctors Stafford Betty and Jeffrey mish Love on something called

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Speaker 4: terminal lucidity. Just before someone passes away, even if they

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Speaker 4: have had no brain function, can come back to life.

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Speaker 4: Let's continue his story.

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Speaker 6: A doctor in Britain named John Lorber. He was the

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Speaker 6: head of a hospital. Six hundred hydrocephalics were kept okay,

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Speaker 6: and these are people with big heads water on the brain.

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Speaker 6: Many of these cases, the brain has almost completely disappeared.

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Speaker 6: The fluid has basically taken the place of the brain.

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Speaker 6: In thirty out of six hundred cases. The IQ's of

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Speaker 6: these people with very little brain left is one hundred

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Speaker 6: or more. That's what he was able to determine. In

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Speaker 6: one case, his star pupil had only five percent of

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Speaker 6: a normal brain an IQ of one hundred and twenty

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Speaker 6: six was functioning as a normal, intelligent person, and that

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Speaker 6: leads him to believe, and it leads me to believe

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Speaker 6: that the question is the brain really necessary should be asked,

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Speaker 6: because in a few cases it obviously isn't necessary, and

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Speaker 6: that seems to be supportive of the thesis that who

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Speaker 6: we really are is not brain dependent.

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Speaker 7: Well, there are a number of other cases in the

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Speaker 7: literature of people who suffered from major brain damage. I

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Speaker 7: remember there's a famous case from the nineteenth century of

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Speaker 7: a rail road worker who had a railroad spike through

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Speaker 7: his head exactly so I was able to function normally

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Speaker 7: exactly so.

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Speaker 6: Right. There's another case that doctor professor nam on Earth

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Speaker 6: of a woman who had been in an asylum for

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Speaker 6: eight years and she had some kind of brain damage.

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Speaker 6: It was never said what was the cause of it,

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Speaker 6: but she had turned into an appalling human being. The

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Speaker 6: only thing that ever came out of her mouth while

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Speaker 6: in this asylum for eight years were horrible curses. And

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Speaker 6: she also managed to develop a particular skill of spitting

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Speaker 6: very accurately on the shoes of the priest or the

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Speaker 6: doctor who came to visit her. She was uncannily accurate

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Speaker 6: with her spinning, all right, and so shortly before she died,

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Speaker 6: she hadn't come plea transformation of character and personality. She

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Speaker 6: remembered all of those episodes of spitting. She remembered all

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Speaker 6: of those cursings, and she was profoundly sorry for them. Yes,

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Speaker 6: she felt that she was not in control. She was

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Speaker 6: aware of what was happening, but she didn't feel that

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Speaker 6: she was in control. It just suggests the number of

432
00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:24,360
Speaker 6: ways that terminal lucidity can manifest itself, and it did

433
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:26,040
Speaker 6: in this instance in a very different way.

434
00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 7: Well, when we think about brain function, right, one of

435
00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:36,200
Speaker 7: the intriguing things to me, for example, is parrots. Parrots

436
00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:40,280
Speaker 7: are animals that are highly intelligent. They can speak and

437
00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:46,560
Speaker 7: sometimes acquire a large vocabulary, and their speech is often

438
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:51,040
Speaker 7: in context it makes sense. And yet they have tiny,

439
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,080
Speaker 7: tiny little brains.

440
00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:56,840
Speaker 6: It's true, that's true. Maybe even the dinosaurs are smarter

441
00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:59,400
Speaker 6: than we give them credit for. They also had tiny friends.

442
00:32:00,200 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 7: In an era of computer technology where the processors are

443
00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:07,000
Speaker 7: getting smaller and smaller all the time, and yet more

444
00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:08,000
Speaker 7: and more powerful.

445
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 6: I know.

446
00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:11,800
Speaker 7: It's so so the size of the brain may not

447
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:15,800
Speaker 7: be as determinative as was once thought. Where we do

448
00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:19,600
Speaker 7: all of these ratios between the brain mass and the body.

449
00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:21,720
Speaker 6: Weight exactly, So that does appear to be the case

450
00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:26,560
Speaker 6: when we look at Labbres research, that really does appear

451
00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:29,520
Speaker 6: to be the case. Only in five percent of the cases.

452
00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:32,240
Speaker 6: Let that be said. You know, the other ninety five

453
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:37,320
Speaker 6: percent were pretty much lost in their hydrocephalic fluid and

454
00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:40,440
Speaker 6: they were not able to function. But this five percent

455
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 6: were able to function curiously for reasons we can't understand,

456
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:49,520
Speaker 6: with very damaged brains or very tiny brains. Who knows why.

457
00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:53,520
Speaker 7: Now. Earlier, you and I were having a conversation about

458
00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:59,040
Speaker 7: the relationship between terminal lucidity and deathbed visions. Oh okay,

459
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 7: can you pointed out to me you thought these are

460
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:02,200
Speaker 7: very different.

461
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:05,440
Speaker 6: Yeah, And we had a little disagreement on this. I

462
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:09,200
Speaker 6: would say this that you know, with in deathbed visions,

463
00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:17,480
Speaker 6: the patient, the dying person is talking lucidly to spirits.

464
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:20,720
Speaker 6: Then he or she sees visiting her or him in

465
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:25,480
Speaker 6: the room right in the hospital. Okay, whereas interminal lucidity.

466
00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 6: There isn't ever any mention of visiting paranormal entities.

467
00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:36,320
Speaker 7: That seems a little odd. I mean, if normal people

468
00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 7: who are dying experience these visions, why wouldn't a person

469
00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:45,240
Speaker 7: who was becoming lucid prior to death also experience them.

470
00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 6: That's a good question, I guess the answer would be

471
00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:53,320
Speaker 6: that they already have so much on their plate just

472
00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:56,080
Speaker 6: for them to become normal and speak to people around.

473
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:58,280
Speaker 7: Them, so they have other priorities. They have other priorities

474
00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:03,480
Speaker 7: at the time, and one priority that obviously a dying

475
00:34:03,520 --> 00:34:07,200
Speaker 7: person will have is to kind of complete the communication

476
00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:09,719
Speaker 7: at an emotional level with people.

477
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:11,840
Speaker 6: With people around them, with their loved ones, you know,

478
00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:15,279
Speaker 6: very much in this world, not in the next world. Though.

479
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:18,919
Speaker 6: There's nothing, of course that would rule that possibility out, Jeff,

480
00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:20,879
Speaker 6: I have to grant you that I just haven't come

481
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:23,800
Speaker 6: across a case like that yet. Well.

482
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:27,359
Speaker 7: And of course, the typical case where you'd even want

483
00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:31,480
Speaker 7: to remark that somebody is especially lucid prior to their

484
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 7: death is because they've had some disease or damage to

485
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 7: their brain or nervous system that would make that unusual.

486
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:41,280
Speaker 6: In the first place exactly, so that would be assumed

487
00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:43,759
Speaker 6: before you would use that phrase.

488
00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:47,840
Speaker 7: Because people who are having deathbed visions are all lucid.

489
00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:50,680
Speaker 6: That's right, they're normal people. They've not had damaged brains,

490
00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:56,160
Speaker 6: and their experiences are extraordinary enough. And we talked about

491
00:34:56,160 --> 00:35:00,439
Speaker 6: that on another program. But it's not quite the same

492
00:35:00,480 --> 00:35:06,640
Speaker 6: thing as terminal lucidity. So I remember another case one

493
00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:09,160
Speaker 6: that was written up ten years ago as a matter

494
00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:14,080
Speaker 6: of fact in Time magazine, of all things, but apparently

495
00:35:14,120 --> 00:35:17,160
Speaker 6: it didn't really have much of an impact on people.

496
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:20,279
Speaker 6: It certainly had an impact on me because it was

497
00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:23,760
Speaker 6: a classic case of terminal lucidity. He was a man

498
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:27,800
Speaker 6: who had contracted cancer what is the term when he

499
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 6: goes all over the place metastasized metastasized, and it had

500
00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:35,839
Speaker 6: completely eaten away his brain. He had almost nothing left,

501
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:40,400
Speaker 6: There was nothing to communicate with, and he again was

502
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 6: just a human vegetable, and his dear ones came to

503
00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:45,800
Speaker 6: say goodbye to him, just on the point of death,

504
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:50,759
Speaker 6: and he had this incredible lucidity. The doctor who was

505
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:54,120
Speaker 6: in charge of the case was astounded and was convinced,

506
00:35:54,400 --> 00:35:58,239
Speaker 6: though he's not a religious person, that the mind somehow

507
00:35:58,440 --> 00:36:04,120
Speaker 6: was able to through that sick brain, force itself out

508
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:07,920
Speaker 6: and say goodbye to his loved ones. That was what

509
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:10,720
Speaker 6: we used. The words he used. It forced itself through

510
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:15,840
Speaker 6: that sick brain. It didn't just jettison it, but forced

511
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:19,040
Speaker 6: its way through. I like that way of speaking it.

512
00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:24,200
Speaker 6: And it just suggests how relatively rare terminal lucidity is.

513
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:27,560
Speaker 6: Keep in mind that somewhere between ninety to ninety five

514
00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 6: percent of advanced Alzheimer's cases do not experience terminal lucidity.

515
00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:34,919
Speaker 6: Maybe because it's just too hard to do, who knows.

516
00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:39,319
Speaker 7: Yeah, I can imagine that, but it surely gives one

517
00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:43,680
Speaker 7: pause to think about the consciousness and the brain is

518
00:36:43,719 --> 00:36:45,080
Speaker 7: being very distinct from me.

519
00:36:45,320 --> 00:36:48,160
Speaker 6: It does, it does, and that of course is what

520
00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:50,399
Speaker 6: I am trying to show in my book. And it's

521
00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:54,720
Speaker 6: the last of the chapters coming out of psychical research

522
00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:58,120
Speaker 6: or paranormal research. And I think it has a statement

523
00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:01,319
Speaker 6: to make. It's very suggestive. It doesn't prove, but it's

524
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:05,319
Speaker 6: very suggestive. And I hope that doctor Bunjohnny will be

525
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:08,640
Speaker 6: able to come up with more and more evidence that

526
00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 6: supports this conclusion. And he is, I've written him, he

527
00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:18,200
Speaker 6: is very open to this possibility that this is a

528
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:20,240
Speaker 6: kind of evidence for the soul.

529
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:25,319
Speaker 7: Well, it's not so different than evidence, let's say, from

530
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 7: extrasensory perception or remote viewing, where a normal person in

531
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:33,680
Speaker 7: their normal state of consciousness is able to kind of

532
00:37:34,800 --> 00:37:39,200
Speaker 7: reach out with their mind and acquire information from distant

533
00:37:39,239 --> 00:37:43,040
Speaker 7: points in space and time that would never be accessible

534
00:37:43,120 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 7: through normal sensory means.

535
00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:48,120
Speaker 6: Yeah, well, you know, the paranormal is the paranormal, and

536
00:37:48,239 --> 00:37:52,680
Speaker 6: so what you're doing is linking these various extraordinary, unexplainable

537
00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:57,960
Speaker 6: situations together. They all suggest that our life is more

538
00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:01,799
Speaker 6: vertical than we think. You know, we're not Flanders, and

539
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 6: our good friends who are materialists or physicalists I refer

540
00:38:07,200 --> 00:38:10,680
Speaker 6: to them, at least privately, as flat Landers. They need

541
00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:12,239
Speaker 6: to verticalize their life.

542
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 7: Well, I think you can still. To be honest, you

543
00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:18,680
Speaker 7: could be a physicalist like my friend Ed May, who's

544
00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:23,760
Speaker 7: can on this program and still and disagrees. He thinks

545
00:38:23,800 --> 00:38:27,000
Speaker 7: that if I come up with solid evidence for survival,

546
00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:30,719
Speaker 7: they cannot be explained by what we call living agents,

547
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:35,839
Speaker 7: I that that would disprove his physicalism. But I think no,

548
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:39,839
Speaker 7: I think that physicalism can accommodate it. If we take

549
00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 7: a look at all of this work going on in

550
00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:48,120
Speaker 7: higher mathematics and in string theory involving higher dimensions of

551
00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:52,399
Speaker 7: space hyperspace. If we allow space to be much more

552
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:56,279
Speaker 7: complex than we normally think of it, then we could

553
00:38:56,320 --> 00:38:58,000
Speaker 7: accommodate a.

554
00:38:58,040 --> 00:38:59,600
Speaker 6: Kind of physicalism anyway.

555
00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:06,000
Speaker 7: An afterlife, And as you've talked about yourself, the communications

556
00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:09,799
Speaker 7: from the other side say it's very similar to our

557
00:39:09,840 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 7: physical existence, suggests that it's kind of physical.

558
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:17,040
Speaker 6: It is kind of physical. I would prefer to say

559
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:21,799
Speaker 6: that it's kind of material. They often speak of vibrations.

560
00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:25,239
Speaker 6: It's a kind of a physics of physics of the afterworld.

561
00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:28,759
Speaker 6: Vibrates at a level then how our sensors cannot accommodate,

562
00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:33,440
Speaker 6: cannot relate to. And it is not a purely spiritual environment.

563
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:36,560
Speaker 6: It is a world of beauty that the sensors can

564
00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:40,200
Speaker 6: appreciate that we can walk in. All of that is

565
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:45,600
Speaker 6: asserted by by spirits speaking through legitimate mediums. Absolutely. So, Yeah,

566
00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:48,920
Speaker 6: at some point maybe there will be a physics of

567
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:50,000
Speaker 6: the astral.

568
00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:53,399
Speaker 4: I think you can agree that was a pretty interesting conversation.

569
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:58,600
Speaker 4: You want to check out doctor Jeffrey mish Love and

570
00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:04,799
Speaker 4: doctor staff Betty To, a long time explorers into the

571
00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:08,520
Speaker 4: world of the Afterlife. So let's go to our next

572
00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:12,120
Speaker 4: break and we'll come back with some more stories. You're

573
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:15,799
Speaker 4: listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and

574
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:19,600
Speaker 4: Coast to Coast AM Paranormal podcast network.

575
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:29,360
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00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:47,520
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586
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593
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594
00:41:20,680 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 9: This is Afterlife expert Daniel Braakley, and you're listening to

595
00:41:24,719 --> 00:41:30,520
Speaker 9: the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast am Aeronormal Podcast Network.

596
00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:47,960
Speaker 4: Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain.

597
00:41:48,480 --> 00:41:55,120
Speaker 4: We have been talking about terminal lucidity. Hospice workers call

598
00:41:55,239 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 4: this rallying r A l l y people rally or

599
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:04,560
Speaker 4: ken rally just before they pass. What I'd like to

600
00:42:04,640 --> 00:42:09,440
Speaker 4: do now is play an old recording for you of

601
00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:14,759
Speaker 4: hospice nurses. Now, these are not examples of terminal lucidity,

602
00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:20,320
Speaker 4: but they are examples of these deathbed visions, and they're

603
00:42:20,360 --> 00:42:23,040
Speaker 4: precious and I just think they'll make you feel good.

604
00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:27,319
Speaker 4: And I know for me, it just reminds me that

605
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:31,279
Speaker 4: we go on and that loved ones are there to

606
00:42:31,360 --> 00:42:33,320
Speaker 4: greet us, So let's listen.

607
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:38,280
Speaker 8: By working with the dying, hospice nurses gain an insight

608
00:42:38,360 --> 00:42:41,840
Speaker 8: into death and the opportunity to witness the signs of

609
00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:43,120
Speaker 8: a life beyond our own.

610
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:47,480
Speaker 10: I had one gentlemen three months after I started working

611
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:50,640
Speaker 10: in hospice. I thought, I can't do this anymore. This

612
00:42:50,719 --> 00:42:53,200
Speaker 10: is just too much. I'm going to get burned. Out

613
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:56,480
Speaker 10: or it's just too stressful. And so just as I

614
00:42:56,520 --> 00:42:58,320
Speaker 10: was really trying to debate whether I was going to

615
00:42:58,440 --> 00:43:03,080
Speaker 10: leave this field or not, I had an experience that

616
00:43:03,200 --> 00:43:04,240
Speaker 10: just kind of blew me away.

617
00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:09,360
Speaker 3: And one of the LPNs came up to me and said, mistress,

618
00:43:09,520 --> 00:43:12,080
Speaker 3: and so I just died. And so I took that.

619
00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:14,160
Speaker 10: Information and we said, all right, we'll call a physician

620
00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:16,120
Speaker 10: and call a corner and get all the information that

621
00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:17,680
Speaker 10: we need. And I was walking down the hall and

622
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:20,839
Speaker 10: making bad checks and sure everybody was okay, and this

623
00:43:20,920 --> 00:43:23,359
Speaker 10: one old fellow was climbing.

624
00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:23,439
Speaker 3: Out of bed.

625
00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:27,280
Speaker 10: He was really out of pain control, and I was thinking,

626
00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:28,120
Speaker 10: you know, we need to just.

627
00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 3: Get me settled down.

628
00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:32,839
Speaker 10: And I walked into the room and I said, let

629
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 10: me help you get taken care of it. And he

630
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:36,399
Speaker 10: said I got to get out of here. And I said,

631
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:38,600
Speaker 10: I understand, you know, and he said I I have

632
00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:40,640
Speaker 10: to die. And I said, you know, I would probably

633
00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:42,400
Speaker 10: want to die too if I had that much pain,

634
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:44,319
Speaker 10: and let me help you. Let me see what we

635
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:46,960
Speaker 10: can do. He said, no, you don't understand. He said

636
00:43:46,960 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 10: I have to die. And I said, well, I don't

637
00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:50,360
Speaker 10: know where it came from. I said, well, you have

638
00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:52,640
Speaker 10: to wait till you get your own invitation. Sometimes it

639
00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:54,480
Speaker 10: just because we want to die doesn't mean we get

640
00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:58,759
Speaker 10: to die. We have to wait till it's time. Well,

641
00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:01,520
Speaker 10: that guy down there just got his invitation. He said,

642
00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:04,759
Speaker 10: I knew him from Lyman. And I said, what do

643
00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:07,520
Speaker 10: you mean And he said, well, he just shuffled by

644
00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:11,399
Speaker 10: here and I here on the back of my neck

645
00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:14,160
Speaker 10: stood up and he said, I thought that was a

646
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:19,120
Speaker 10: curious term, shuffle by. And he said, I want you

647
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:19,960
Speaker 10: to go get my son.

648
00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:22,320
Speaker 3: He said, I knew him. I knew him from Lyman

649
00:44:22,360 --> 00:44:23,120
Speaker 3: when we were kids.

650
00:44:23,160 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 10: And he said, and he just shuffled by, and he

651
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:27,200
Speaker 10: points from his door to the window and how it

652
00:44:27,200 --> 00:44:28,359
Speaker 10: acrossed in front of his bed.

653
00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:31,160
Speaker 3: And I thought, boy, there's a lot I don't know yet.

654
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:34,839
Speaker 11: I had a kid that I lost last week who

655
00:44:35,600 --> 00:44:41,520
Speaker 11: saw horses. That he saw a horse and his dream

656
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:44,120
Speaker 11: was about two weeks before he died. He was on

657
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:48,239
Speaker 11: this big brown horse and they were going through the

658
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:49,960
Speaker 11: field and it was very smooth.

659
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:52,400
Speaker 3: It wasn't like a gallop, but they weren't flying.

660
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:55,239
Speaker 11: And he said that all of a sudden they kind

661
00:44:55,239 --> 00:44:57,960
Speaker 11: of jumped over a barrier and when they landed. They

662
00:44:58,080 --> 00:45:01,480
Speaker 11: landed in a river bank that had over load its beds,

663
00:45:02,200 --> 00:45:04,800
Speaker 11: and it stopped. The horse stopped and turned sideways, waiting

664
00:45:04,920 --> 00:45:06,680
Speaker 11: for this kid to tell him which way to go,

665
00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:09,240
Speaker 11: whether to go into the woods or out of the woods.

666
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:12,080
Speaker 11: And I asked him which way he chose, and he said, well,

667
00:45:12,120 --> 00:45:14,080
Speaker 11: we went out, And I said, what do you think

668
00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:15,680
Speaker 11: would have happened if you had gone into the woods.

669
00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 3: He said, I think I'd have been gone.

670
00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:19,680
Speaker 11: And I told him I thought he would too, And

671
00:45:19,760 --> 00:45:22,279
Speaker 11: I told him that that horse would probably come back

672
00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:23,879
Speaker 11: for him when it was time for him to go,

673
00:45:24,520 --> 00:45:27,640
Speaker 11: That horse would be the one to come back. Well,

674
00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:32,800
Speaker 11: that afternoon, his mom was washing dishes and the horse

675
00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:36,239
Speaker 11: came and she went to talk to him, and she

676
00:45:36,280 --> 00:45:38,600
Speaker 11: asked David if his horse was there, and he said yes,

677
00:45:39,160 --> 00:45:41,560
Speaker 11: and she said, I think he's probably here to get you.

678
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 11: And she said I think so too, And within two

679
00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:46,040
Speaker 11: hours he had gone.

680
00:45:46,280 --> 00:45:47,400
Speaker 3: He had died on his horse.

681
00:45:49,520 --> 00:45:52,439
Speaker 12: You feel a presence, you feel something is in the room.

682
00:45:52,840 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 12: You know that there's something there. And one time there

683
00:45:57,080 --> 00:45:59,560
Speaker 12: was this man and he was really really close to death,

684
00:46:00,920 --> 00:46:04,560
Speaker 12: and he was very very weak, and and he looked

685
00:46:04,640 --> 00:46:06,360
Speaker 12: up and he he was looking at something, and he

686
00:46:06,360 --> 00:46:10,800
Speaker 12: looked very, very scared, and the nurse said to him,

687
00:46:10,840 --> 00:46:14,160
Speaker 12: it's okay. They're there to help you. There, they won't

688
00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:18,879
Speaker 12: hurt you. And and he put his hand up and

689
00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:20,799
Speaker 12: and he had his hand up like somebody was holding it.

690
00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:23,560
Speaker 12: And he did this for a few minutes. And there

691
00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:28,040
Speaker 12: is no way this man had the strength to hold

692
00:46:28,080 --> 00:46:29,040
Speaker 12: his hand up by himself.

693
00:46:30,719 --> 00:46:32,759
Speaker 10: Uh. And he died just a few minutes later too.

694
00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:41,839
Speaker 10: So there's something. I had one really neat fellow that

695
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:45,799
Speaker 10: we were taking to the hospice unit and he was

696
00:46:45,840 --> 00:46:51,960
Speaker 10: really close to dying, and his his son was nearby.

697
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:55,080
Speaker 10: And this poor guy went through an incredible bath from

698
00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:56,719
Speaker 10: the nurse, I mean, and he didn't move it all.

699
00:46:56,760 --> 00:46:57,960
Speaker 3: Didn't even blink and eye, so.

700
00:46:58,239 --> 00:47:00,920
Speaker 10: We would say he was an unresponsive And as we

701
00:47:00,920 --> 00:47:03,319
Speaker 10: were walking down the hall, pushing his bed down the hall,

702
00:47:03,800 --> 00:47:06,360
Speaker 10: he opened his eyes and he looked straight up and

703
00:47:06,440 --> 00:47:10,640
Speaker 10: his little toothless mouth and he went and waved and

704
00:47:11,000 --> 00:47:14,399
Speaker 10: then just smiled in close size, and five minutes later

705
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:17,080
Speaker 10: he was gone. I don't know who's waving at, but

706
00:47:17,120 --> 00:47:18,080
Speaker 10: that's not uncommon.

707
00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:23,800
Speaker 6: As death approaches, patients may have visions of angels or

708
00:47:23,880 --> 00:47:27,480
Speaker 6: see tunnels of white light. Other people receive angelic comfort

709
00:47:27,520 --> 00:47:28,640
Speaker 6: from someone they already know.

710
00:47:32,120 --> 00:47:35,160
Speaker 10: Patients who are closer to their dying time will see

711
00:47:35,160 --> 00:47:39,680
Speaker 10: those who have already died. Oftentimes they'll talk about dead

712
00:47:39,680 --> 00:47:45,879
Speaker 10: grandparents sitting at their bedside, brothers who've died before. I'm

713
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:50,000
Speaker 10: not so certain that we just see spirits running around.

714
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:52,200
Speaker 10: I don't really believe that, and I've never heard anything

715
00:47:52,239 --> 00:47:54,880
Speaker 10: that scary. But I have heard of a lot of

716
00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:59,120
Speaker 10: patients who are very afraid of dying talk about seeing

717
00:47:59,120 --> 00:48:01,000
Speaker 10: a father in law kitchen, and.

718
00:48:00,920 --> 00:48:03,120
Speaker 3: That would scare me out of my mind.

719
00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:06,000
Speaker 10: But they're not afraid, and it really made me realize

720
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:07,600
Speaker 10: about how they.

721
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:11,959
Speaker 3: They are just sort of drifting to the other side.

722
00:48:12,040 --> 00:48:13,719
Speaker 3: They had one foot here and one foot.

723
00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:16,279
Speaker 10: Somewhere else, and a patient who's very frightened. We'll tell

724
00:48:16,320 --> 00:48:20,600
Speaker 10: you that, and yet for some reason it doesn't bother them.

725
00:48:20,840 --> 00:48:21,480
Speaker 3: That bothered me.

726
00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:25,360
Speaker 12: But Mary was a fifty two year old woman. She

727
00:48:25,400 --> 00:48:30,080
Speaker 12: had little Gary's disease and it was getting pretty bad.

728
00:48:30,120 --> 00:48:32,840
Speaker 12: She was pretty close to death and the muscles in

729
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:35,600
Speaker 12: her throat were closing up. They weren't working very well,

730
00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:38,160
Speaker 12: and she had this fear that she was going to drown,

731
00:48:39,200 --> 00:48:45,880
Speaker 12: which is essentially was a real possibility for her, and

732
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:49,200
Speaker 12: one of her last wish was that her mother not

733
00:48:49,320 --> 00:48:52,160
Speaker 12: be told. Her mother was ninety years old, and her mother,

734
00:48:52,440 --> 00:48:54,800
Speaker 12: she liked to be called Grahama Rose, and she just said,

735
00:48:55,360 --> 00:48:57,320
Speaker 12: this is too hard for a mother to go through,

736
00:48:57,640 --> 00:48:59,839
Speaker 12: to watch a child die, and especially the way I'm

737
00:49:00,560 --> 00:49:02,000
Speaker 12: I don't want my mother to know.

738
00:49:02,560 --> 00:49:02,759
Speaker 10: Now.

739
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:05,080
Speaker 12: The family was in conflict with this, but it was

740
00:49:05,080 --> 00:49:09,640
Speaker 12: her last wish, so what could they do? And then

741
00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:13,680
Speaker 12: the story, as Gramma Rose tells me, is she lived

742
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:19,799
Speaker 12: in Texas and one night she went to bed. She

743
00:49:19,920 --> 00:49:22,439
Speaker 12: was getting into bed and she saw her husband standing there,

744
00:49:24,560 --> 00:49:28,239
Speaker 12: and her husband had been dead for twenty years, but

745
00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:33,000
Speaker 12: she said that he was as real to her as

746
00:49:33,040 --> 00:49:36,560
Speaker 12: I am to you. And he said, Rose, I've come

747
00:49:36,600 --> 00:49:40,120
Speaker 12: to take Mary home. And at that point, Grandma Rose

748
00:49:40,120 --> 00:49:42,760
Speaker 12: she just started to scream and said, no, no, please,

749
00:49:43,280 --> 00:49:45,520
Speaker 12: let me go back and hold my baby one more time.

750
00:49:45,600 --> 00:49:48,799
Speaker 12: Don't take her until I've gone and I've held her

751
00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:50,560
Speaker 12: and I've said goodbye and I've kissed her.

752
00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:51,560
Speaker 3: Please don't do that.

753
00:49:52,520 --> 00:49:55,640
Speaker 12: And so he just kind of smiled and faded away,

754
00:49:55,680 --> 00:49:58,759
Speaker 12: and she knew at that point that he would allow that.

755
00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:01,680
Speaker 12: So she got a the next plane. She came to

756
00:50:01,719 --> 00:50:06,400
Speaker 12: Denver and for three days she stayed with her daughter,

757
00:50:07,080 --> 00:50:09,360
Speaker 12: and she told her stories, and she combed her hair,

758
00:50:10,120 --> 00:50:13,680
Speaker 12: and she gave her bath, and she was holding her

759
00:50:13,760 --> 00:50:17,120
Speaker 12: daughter when she died, and I was there, and she

760
00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:20,279
Speaker 12: just looked at me and she said, you know, I

761
00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:22,239
Speaker 12: brought her into the world, and it's only right that

762
00:50:22,280 --> 00:50:23,560
Speaker 12: I'm with her when she goes out.

763
00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:26,880
Speaker 3: And it would have never happened.

764
00:50:28,239 --> 00:50:30,480
Speaker 12: If Mary's husband would have come come to her and

765
00:50:30,480 --> 00:50:32,279
Speaker 12: told her that he was taking her home.

766
00:50:35,040 --> 00:50:37,480
Speaker 10: Like one person said to me, it's easy for you

767
00:50:37,560 --> 00:50:39,040
Speaker 10: to say, it's going to be peaceful. You're not going

768
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:43,239
Speaker 10: to die, you know, and you know you're right. All

769
00:50:43,280 --> 00:50:45,440
Speaker 10: I know is what I see, And all I know

770
00:50:45,600 --> 00:50:48,719
Speaker 10: is that somewhere along the line, you're not going to

771
00:50:48,760 --> 00:50:52,880
Speaker 10: be afraid anymore. Somewhere in that last those last hours,

772
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:55,960
Speaker 10: it's going to go away and somebody will throw you

773
00:50:56,000 --> 00:50:56,759
Speaker 10: a lifeline.

774
00:50:57,560 --> 00:51:01,160
Speaker 4: I'm sitting here right now thinking just how special this is.

775
00:51:01,719 --> 00:51:04,960
Speaker 4: We really do go on and loved ones come to

776
00:51:05,040 --> 00:51:08,359
Speaker 4: greet us or animals. I want to read to you now,

777
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:11,360
Speaker 4: just a couple of quick things. This lady says, My

778
00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:14,560
Speaker 4: mom looked out the window of her hospice room and

779
00:51:14,680 --> 00:51:17,680
Speaker 4: said she saw all of the dogs she ever had

780
00:51:17,719 --> 00:51:20,759
Speaker 4: in her entire life, from the time she was a

781
00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:25,080
Speaker 4: child playing outside in the courtyard. She looked so happy

782
00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:29,360
Speaker 4: and she smiled, and then she passed away. And another

783
00:51:29,840 --> 00:51:33,560
Speaker 4: my father passed away two weeks ago. He was ninety

784
00:51:33,600 --> 00:51:38,560
Speaker 4: seven and in hospice. He had basically been non responsive

785
00:51:38,640 --> 00:51:42,680
Speaker 4: for weeks. Two days before he died, he had about

786
00:51:42,719 --> 00:51:48,240
Speaker 4: six lucid hours. He woke up continually, He asked for food,

787
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:51,960
Speaker 4: asked for a bowl of ice cream, and wanted to

788
00:51:52,040 --> 00:51:56,200
Speaker 4: drink his nightly martini, which he did. He was laughing

789
00:51:56,600 --> 00:52:00,240
Speaker 4: and joking and very much himself, and then two days

790
00:52:00,280 --> 00:52:04,320
Speaker 4: later he died. I know you may be a new listener,

791
00:52:04,920 --> 00:52:07,480
Speaker 4: or you may be a long time listener, But for

792
00:52:07,520 --> 00:52:11,160
Speaker 4: the past one hundred and forty plus episodes, I've been

793
00:52:11,239 --> 00:52:13,880
Speaker 4: trying to give you my all. Not each one of

794
00:52:13,960 --> 00:52:16,400
Speaker 4: us is going to witness a loved one have one

795
00:52:16,440 --> 00:52:20,799
Speaker 4: of these experiences, but through all these hours of episodes

796
00:52:20,920 --> 00:52:24,880
Speaker 4: to give you reasons to believe and have faith that

797
00:52:25,000 --> 00:52:29,839
Speaker 4: you are an immortal soul having a human experience. You

798
00:52:30,000 --> 00:52:34,640
Speaker 4: are so much bigger and wiser than you could ever imagine.

799
00:52:35,080 --> 00:52:37,399
Speaker 4: We are trapped by this little voice in our head

800
00:52:37,719 --> 00:52:39,960
Speaker 4: that tries to convince us that we are just human.

801
00:52:40,440 --> 00:52:43,560
Speaker 4: But that's not true. We are so much bigger. There's

802
00:52:43,600 --> 00:52:46,440
Speaker 4: more to life than meets the eye, and more to

803
00:52:46,480 --> 00:52:49,919
Speaker 4: you than you know. Right now, you are surrounded by

804
00:52:49,920 --> 00:52:53,960
Speaker 4: invisible cheerleaders who know how hard it is to live

805
00:52:54,040 --> 00:52:57,440
Speaker 4: a human life. They will be there when it's your time,

806
00:52:57,800 --> 00:53:01,319
Speaker 4: but not too soon, to help you across the veil

807
00:53:01,880 --> 00:53:07,520
Speaker 4: to probably the biggest standing ovation that you've crossed over

808
00:53:07,960 --> 00:53:10,960
Speaker 4: and completed this life. Make the most of it while

809
00:53:11,000 --> 00:53:13,880
Speaker 4: you're here. There's things that we can't do over there.

810
00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:17,719
Speaker 4: There are things that we can learn over here that

811
00:53:18,000 --> 00:53:22,160
Speaker 4: really add depth to our soul. So take up every

812
00:53:22,719 --> 00:53:27,279
Speaker 4: experience you can with that reminder. Our home base is

813
00:53:27,320 --> 00:53:30,799
Speaker 4: we Don't Die dot com. Please come visit me on

814
00:53:30,800 --> 00:53:33,560
Speaker 4: one of our Sunday gatherings, or take a course, or

815
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:37,240
Speaker 4: just check out other past episodes, or join our Facebook group.

816
00:53:37,920 --> 00:53:41,880
Speaker 4: I'm Sandra Champlain. Thank you for listening to Shades of

817
00:53:41,920 --> 00:53:45,879
Speaker 4: the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast am

818
00:53:46,080 --> 00:53:50,040
Speaker 4: Paranormal podcast Network.

819
00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:05,359
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast

820
00:54:05,400 --> 00:54:08,359
Speaker 1: Ay and Paranormal Podcast Network. Make sure and check out

821
00:54:08,440 --> 00:54:11,680
Speaker 1: all our shows on the iHeartRadio app or by going

822
00:54:11,719 --> 00:54:17,320
Speaker 1: to iHeartRadio dot com