WEBVTT - How Lion Taming Works 0:00:01.080 --> 0:00:04.520 Welcome to Stuff You Should Know from House Stuff Works 0:00:04.559 --> 0:00:14.600 dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. 0:00:14.640 --> 0:00:17.239 There's Charles W. Chuck Pritt. Uh. This is Stuff you 0:00:17.239 --> 0:00:23.639 should Know. Yeah. Uh, this Josh is another episode of 0:00:23.680 --> 0:00:29.240 the Summer of Sam. Are are Oh this kid is good? Yeah? 0:00:29.240 --> 0:00:32.680 Our friend Sama t Garden is programming our show here 0:00:32.680 --> 0:00:36.680 and there, Hey and Samson and haw Lian Taming Works, 0:00:36.720 --> 0:00:40.200 which is also written by Debbie Ronca my buddy, Yeah 0:00:40.320 --> 0:00:43.720 from New Jersey roller Derby Debbie as I call her, 0:00:43.800 --> 0:00:46.159 I don't call her that, No, you don't. I call 0:00:46.200 --> 0:00:50.639 her deb friend if calor roller Derber Debby. You did 0:00:50.680 --> 0:00:53.880 it perfectly the first yea roller Derby Debby, that would 0:00:53.880 --> 0:00:58.560 just get difficult. Yeah, um, well, right on, this one's 0:00:58.600 --> 0:01:00.840 just gonna be great then because there's a good article too. 0:01:00.880 --> 0:01:02.720 That's right, and you can read Debbie's also flog at 0:01:02.800 --> 0:01:06.560 freak Girl dot com. That's quite a plug. Um. And 0:01:06.600 --> 0:01:08.920 then where are we at with Saam? So Sam has 0:01:08.959 --> 0:01:12.400 now selected how lion Taming works? What was the first one? 0:01:12.760 --> 0:01:14.040 I can't remember. It was a couple of weeks ago. 0:01:14.080 --> 0:01:16.240 He's done too. Man, it was awesome, but we actually 0:01:16.280 --> 0:01:18.319 recorded a couple that he had not heard yet that 0:01:18.360 --> 0:01:21.119 he also had on his list just by chance. We're 0:01:21.120 --> 0:01:24.039 gonna attribute those to him, just just the ones that 0:01:24.080 --> 0:01:27.319 we saw afterwards. But anyway, thanks Sam, this is a 0:01:27.360 --> 0:01:32.640 good one. We'll put chuck. Um. Well, let's see. Uh, 0:01:32.760 --> 0:01:34.920 I have a bit of an intro. Have you ever 0:01:35.000 --> 0:01:37.760 heard the idea that the Simpsons have a tendency to 0:01:37.800 --> 0:01:44.000 predict the future? Uh no, okay, Well let me enlighten you. Um. 0:01:44.040 --> 0:01:49.320 There was an episode called Um Homer h O m r. 0:01:50.040 --> 0:01:54.240 Season twelve, Episode nine, excellent episode. It's where Homer Um. 0:01:54.240 --> 0:01:57.480 Basically they find out that Homer is a crayons stuck 0:01:57.480 --> 0:02:00.960 in his brain, a crayon crayon, Yeah, from childhood, and 0:02:01.040 --> 0:02:02.640 they were They removed it, and his i Q just 0:02:02.680 --> 0:02:07.360 immediately doubles classic. In two thousand seven years after Homer Um, 0:02:07.400 --> 0:02:10.680 a German lady age fifty nine, Um was going to 0:02:10.720 --> 0:02:14.320 get surgery to cure her chronic headaches. They found a 0:02:14.320 --> 0:02:17.880 pencil that was stuck up there from childhood. Did she 0:02:17.960 --> 0:02:20.920 stuck up there? Yeah, when she was a kid and 0:02:20.960 --> 0:02:25.639 apparently forgot they found they removed the pencil. She's fine. 0:02:25.760 --> 0:02:30.480 People are wacky, Yeah, but isn't that weird? Yeah? Sure, okay, UM, 0:02:30.560 --> 0:02:32.480 here's another one. Let me see what you think about this. 0:02:32.960 --> 0:02:37.760 Um Homer uh in the Treehouse of Horror nineteen who 0:02:38.080 --> 0:02:41.120 definitely didn't see that one. Really? I quit watching it 0:02:41.200 --> 0:02:45.000 after that season twenty UM, he goes to vote for 0:02:45.000 --> 0:02:48.399 Obama on election Day and the UM well, it's it's 0:02:48.400 --> 0:02:53.760 a takeoff of Dive de Bold, the the UM voting 0:02:53.800 --> 0:02:56.720 machines that had so many problems. He goes to vote 0:02:56.720 --> 0:03:00.519 for UM Obama and instead it starts owning a bunch 0:03:00.560 --> 0:03:05.240 of times for McCain. Okay, so the next I guess 0:03:05.280 --> 0:03:08.080 that year, a woman from West Virginia said that she 0:03:08.480 --> 0:03:11.279 checked the box next to Obaba and it just automatically 0:03:11.280 --> 0:03:15.360 switched over to McCain. This is after this thing came out, okay, 0:03:15.440 --> 0:03:20.200 which would mean it's predicting. Probably most chilling is UM 0:03:20.360 --> 0:03:23.440 comes from Springfield with the S spelled is a dollar sign. 0:03:23.840 --> 0:03:26.960 The subtitle is or How I Learned to Stop Worrying 0:03:26.960 --> 0:03:30.359 and Love Legalized Gambling. Season five, episode ten, Springfield gets 0:03:30.360 --> 0:03:34.080 a casino, Mr Burns Casino Great One, and in it 0:03:34.200 --> 0:03:37.000 are two characters who are obviously based on Siegfried and 0:03:37.080 --> 0:03:41.680 Roy and they're with their white tiger, Anastasia. She loves 0:03:41.800 --> 0:03:47.960 the city. Yeah, um and uh anastalgia. Um flashes back 0:03:48.040 --> 0:03:51.000 to when she was caught in the wild by Siegfried 0:03:51.040 --> 0:03:53.560 and Roy shot her with the trick Lizer gun, and 0:03:53.680 --> 0:03:56.520 Um spits out her little bubble pipe and her little 0:03:57.040 --> 0:04:01.760 beanie and attacks one of them. Yeah. This is a 0:04:01.800 --> 0:04:05.760 full ten years before the attack of Roy. Horn In 0:04:05.800 --> 0:04:08.160 two is Outan three during a show at the Mirage 0:04:08.160 --> 0:04:11.720 in Las Vegas, where Um one of their white tigers 0:04:12.640 --> 0:04:17.440 attacked him. Monte Core attacked Roy and basically just ended 0:04:17.480 --> 0:04:21.800 their career, right then. Yeah, I think on that one, like, 0:04:21.800 --> 0:04:24.360 if you're gonna write a Simpsons episode aping sick Green, right, 0:04:24.360 --> 0:04:25.800 what else are they gonna do? You're gonna have the 0:04:25.839 --> 0:04:27.880 line need him or the tiger. I'm sorry, you raise 0:04:27.920 --> 0:04:31.599 an excellent point here, but it's still it is. But 0:04:31.800 --> 0:04:35.000 you raise a very good point, and the point is, Um, 0:04:35.040 --> 0:04:39.600 I think everybody who sees someone interacting with the tamest 0:04:39.720 --> 0:04:44.039 wild animal you could possibly imagine still will not be 0:04:44.120 --> 0:04:48.520 surprised if that animal kills the person. Yeah, because, as 0:04:48.600 --> 0:04:51.920 Jack Hannah put it, very um appropriately, I think and 0:04:52.040 --> 0:04:58.200 Jack Hanna he was the original Steve Irwin. Right, uh, yeah, sure. Um. 0:04:58.320 --> 0:05:00.599 He said you can train a while animal, but you 0:05:00.640 --> 0:05:03.479 could never tame a wild animal. And that's a really 0:05:03.640 --> 0:05:09.240 big important point in the world of I guess lion taming. Yeah, 0:05:09.240 --> 0:05:12.480 and another famous lion trainer, slash Tamer. We're going to 0:05:12.600 --> 0:05:16.080 probably interchange those words. Said you can't tame a lion 0:05:16.240 --> 0:05:20.200 because if you did that, there would be no act. Yeah, okay. 0:05:20.279 --> 0:05:22.279 Part of the part of the act and part of 0:05:22.320 --> 0:05:24.760 the thrill of this for people is the fact that 0:05:24.800 --> 0:05:26.640 these are wild beasts and if it was just it 0:05:26.920 --> 0:05:29.760 was a penguin, it wouldn't be very exciting. No, it wouldn't. 0:05:31.000 --> 0:05:33.800 I'd like to see that a train penguin. Well, yeah, 0:05:33.800 --> 0:05:35.599 I'm putting your mouth in it, head in its mouth 0:05:35.640 --> 0:05:40.360 and cracking of wi fun. Yeah, it would be. Um, 0:05:40.520 --> 0:05:42.360 it would be really mind blowing if the penguin was 0:05:42.440 --> 0:05:44.120 dressed like a lion tamer and you were treating it 0:05:44.160 --> 0:05:48.400 like a lion. Okay, I've got another lion tamer quote 0:05:48.400 --> 0:05:52.000 for you, then, smart guy, all right, Gunther Gebble Williams. Yeah, 0:05:52.040 --> 0:05:53.960 he was the one I saw growing up at the 0:05:54.000 --> 0:05:56.760 Wrinkling Brothers. He said, a wild animal is like a 0:05:56.800 --> 0:05:59.320 loaded gun. It can go off at any time. So 0:05:59.400 --> 0:06:02.120 let's end the intro with that. Okay, let's talk about 0:06:02.160 --> 0:06:03.960 lion taming. You you brought up a really good point, 0:06:04.040 --> 0:06:09.000 Chuck Um. The if you are in this world these days, 0:06:09.279 --> 0:06:14.120 it's not lion tamer, it's lion trainer or wild animals trainer. Yes, 0:06:14.279 --> 0:06:16.359 because none of these people think that they have a 0:06:16.440 --> 0:06:18.839 tame animal on their hands. Now. It's sort of the 0:06:18.880 --> 0:06:22.960 hubris of some of these early jerks. Um that we'll 0:06:22.960 --> 0:06:26.880 talk about right now. Uh. Eighteen nineteen was kind of 0:06:26.880 --> 0:06:31.920 when it all got going. Frenchman named Ari Martine Um, Yeah, 0:06:31.920 --> 0:06:34.359 hey to our French listener. He was a retired horse 0:06:34.360 --> 0:06:37.400 trainer and he thought, you know what, I'm gonna try 0:06:37.480 --> 0:06:40.599 and work with a tiger, which is very different than 0:06:40.640 --> 0:06:43.840 what anyone's ever seen before. And he had a method 0:06:43.880 --> 0:06:48.320 where he worked himself into the cage little by little, 0:06:48.440 --> 0:06:50.960 like just my presence. Then I'll stick an arm in, 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:54.000 then I'll stick my head in. Take a couple of scratches, 0:06:54.240 --> 0:06:57.279 yeah here and there, and then eventually he found himself 0:06:57.320 --> 0:07:00.279 earning the trust of the big cats over time, and 0:07:00.320 --> 0:07:04.279 he would find himself completely in the cage. So he 0:07:04.320 --> 0:07:08.120 was the first first dude period. I think first American. 0:07:08.240 --> 0:07:11.360 He was the first known what you would call lion tam. Yeah, 0:07:11.520 --> 0:07:14.720 the first American was a guy named Isaac van Amburke 0:07:15.440 --> 0:07:18.880 and he was around in eighteen thirty three, and he 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:22.360 was what I meant when I said jerks, because he 0:07:22.360 --> 0:07:26.720 would apparently like beat these cats with crowbars and use 0:07:26.840 --> 0:07:29.840 very violent tactics. Yeah, and he he had a pretty 0:07:29.840 --> 0:07:37.760 good um excuse for it or um justification? Is that sarcasm? Yeah, okay, Yeah, 0:07:37.800 --> 0:07:40.080 he was. He was a biblical guy and he would 0:07:40.080 --> 0:07:44.560 actually act out Biblical scenes with these animals. And his 0:07:44.720 --> 0:07:49.120 big defense was Genesis One, and God said, let us 0:07:49.160 --> 0:07:52.880 make man in our image after our likeness, and let 0:07:53.000 --> 0:07:56.040 them have dominion over the fish of the sea, the 0:07:56.160 --> 0:07:59.720 vowel of the air, over the cattle, and over all 0:07:59.720 --> 0:08:03.360 the earth and over everything. Creeping that creep us upon 0:08:03.440 --> 0:08:06.760 the earth creep And I just like the Bible saying 0:08:06.800 --> 0:08:09.240 creep us. Yeah, it's pretty cool, and it just kind 0:08:09.240 --> 0:08:11.240 of goes on. It's like, really it's one big, one 0:08:11.520 --> 0:08:14.560 run on sentence and you can't help but wonder, um 0:08:14.600 --> 0:08:17.920 if Van Amberg would say the whole thing or just 0:08:17.960 --> 0:08:21.040 be like just read generous this one. Yeah, his big 0:08:21.680 --> 0:08:24.200 His finishing move was sort of insult to injury. After 0:08:24.320 --> 0:08:25.760 he would do all this stuff. And of course he's 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:27.480 not beating them with a crowbar in front of people, 0:08:28.080 --> 0:08:31.200 but apparently that's how he trained them to begin with 0:08:31.360 --> 0:08:35.559 out of fear and injury. And he would finish his 0:08:35.600 --> 0:08:38.360 shows by making the lines lick his boots. Oh man, 0:08:38.440 --> 0:08:42.040 what a sure I know after all that after suffering 0:08:42.080 --> 0:08:44.040 at his hands. You know, it would be awesome would 0:08:44.080 --> 0:08:46.280 be to see the steam Man of the Prairie beat 0:08:46.320 --> 0:08:49.640 the tar out of Van Amberg. You can reference our 0:08:49.679 --> 0:08:53.840 exoskeleton cast for that one, right, yeah, all right, Um, 0:08:53.960 --> 0:08:57.240 have you seen Fast, Cheap and out of Control? Uh? No, 0:08:57.920 --> 0:09:00.679 is that about robots? You gotta see that. It's Errol 0:09:00.720 --> 0:09:05.200 Morris documentary and it was about a topier gardner, a 0:09:05.320 --> 0:09:11.520 robot scientist, and a lion tamer and how all these 0:09:11.520 --> 0:09:14.040 things sort of intertwined. There was one more, a mole 0:09:14.120 --> 0:09:16.880 rat specialist. And in the movie, Dave Hoover was the 0:09:16.920 --> 0:09:20.760 lion tamer and Errol Morris also worked in because Hoover 0:09:20.920 --> 0:09:24.680 was a huge fan of Clyde Beattie. Uh. And Errol 0:09:24.679 --> 0:09:26.439 Morris worked in this old black and white footage and 0:09:26.480 --> 0:09:29.040 Clyde Beatie was almost the fifth character of that documentary. 0:09:29.080 --> 0:09:31.680 Oh yeah, yeah, it's really really great. Okay, I have 0:09:31.760 --> 0:09:36.000 a really good, um wild Animal Tamer documentary. All right, 0:09:36.080 --> 0:09:38.280 let's here. Um you introduced me to this one. It's 0:09:38.320 --> 0:09:40.640 called Cat Dancers. Have you heard of it now? Oh? 0:09:40.720 --> 0:09:45.600 My gosh, it is. It's so heartbreaking, it's ridiculous. It's 0:09:45.600 --> 0:09:47.840 about this group of people who like have their own 0:09:47.840 --> 0:09:52.480 thing going on and um, love one another and love 0:09:52.520 --> 0:09:56.679 their big cats, and then just things keep going wrong. Really, 0:09:56.800 --> 0:09:58.920 it's a really great documentary. It's one of the best 0:09:58.960 --> 0:10:01.480 I've ever seen in my entire of life. Yeah, I'll 0:10:01.559 --> 0:10:04.439 see this one out there too. Was one of my favorites. No, 0:10:04.600 --> 0:10:07.600 Fast Cheaping out of Control. Okay, well there it's both 0:10:07.600 --> 0:10:10.600 on the table. It's crazy though, that this podcast features 0:10:10.640 --> 0:10:14.200 two of our favorite documentaries, Fast Cheaping out of Control 0:10:14.240 --> 0:10:17.280 and Cat Dancers. Look for a quiz question on that one. 0:10:17.400 --> 0:10:21.640 You can get those on Netflix. So Clyde Batty, who 0:10:21.720 --> 0:10:25.000 was Dave Whoever's hero, was around in the nineteen twenties. Um, 0:10:25.040 --> 0:10:27.640 he used a pistol and a whip. Yeah, to keep 0:10:27.679 --> 0:10:29.880 things in line and I think the pistol was like 0:10:30.000 --> 0:10:35.240 a sound scare less than like a threatening thing. You 0:10:35.360 --> 0:10:38.080 go through a lot of lions shooting him in the 0:10:38.160 --> 0:10:41.600 chest that it gets expensive. But he was performing at 0:10:41.640 --> 0:10:47.319 this um at this the peak of this um lion tamers, 0:10:48.120 --> 0:10:51.959 you think of an old timey lion tamer um the 0:10:52.320 --> 0:10:55.440 peak of the appreciation from the public. Sure, because a 0:10:55.480 --> 0:10:59.200 lot of these guys they shaped the public expectations, but 0:10:59.280 --> 0:11:02.520 they were also responding to him, and the public has 0:11:02.600 --> 0:11:07.800 had a role in shaping how lion tamers lion trainers 0:11:08.200 --> 0:11:11.440 um interact with their cats. And Beattie was kind of 0:11:11.480 --> 0:11:17.440 the last of the pistol shooting whip crack in chair guys, 0:11:17.480 --> 0:11:20.840 the old guy, Yeah, Hooever actually explains the chair and 0:11:20.880 --> 0:11:23.520 Debbie's right on the money. Um, if you've ever wondered 0:11:23.520 --> 0:11:26.280 why they point a chair at a lion, it's because 0:11:26.600 --> 0:11:29.080 apparently these big cats have a have a one track 0:11:29.160 --> 0:11:32.439 mine or they're single minded, and so the four points 0:11:32.559 --> 0:11:36.559 uh of the chair legs confuse it. And uh, that's 0:11:36.600 --> 0:11:40.280 what Hoover said, So I believe it. Well, that's awesome. Yeah. Um, 0:11:40.320 --> 0:11:43.959 So you've got on Remartine who starts everything out very 0:11:44.000 --> 0:11:49.960 gently using trust yeah, um, and basically just exposing himself 0:11:50.000 --> 0:11:53.720 to these large cats. He did trust falls right and 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:57.760 the cat would catch him. Um. And uh. Then you 0:11:57.840 --> 0:12:02.160 have um van Amberg come and along Isaac van Amberg. Uh, 0:12:02.720 --> 0:12:05.640 basically just beating the tar out of these things and 0:12:05.800 --> 0:12:09.360 using a very different method fear and clide. Batty kind 0:12:09.400 --> 0:12:13.480 of carries that torch. And then after Beatty things change 0:12:13.800 --> 0:12:17.240 and you have modern lion trainers like Siegfried and Roy 0:12:17.920 --> 0:12:21.960 Gunther Gebel Williams. Is that how you say his name? Yeah, 0:12:22.160 --> 0:12:27.640 you're the German speaker going to billions. This just my 0:12:27.760 --> 0:12:30.079 eye blied. Yeah, he uh, like I said, he was 0:12:30.120 --> 0:12:31.840 the one like that was very big in like the 0:12:31.840 --> 0:12:33.600 seventies and eighties when I was growing up, right, And 0:12:33.600 --> 0:12:36.880 apparently he was in an American Express commercial. Yeah yeah, 0:12:37.000 --> 0:12:41.600 with a leopard hanging over him, the Duneley fomb without 0:12:41.600 --> 0:12:46.120 at days probably I would imagine. Um. But so you 0:12:46.120 --> 0:12:48.079 you have the then you have this kind of transition 0:12:48.120 --> 0:12:51.480 to the modern lion trainer, which was actually a circle 0:12:51.559 --> 0:12:55.480 back to the beginning a little more genteel. Well, that's 0:12:55.480 --> 0:13:00.560 just that it's like using trust, not using beatings. Um 0:13:00.320 --> 0:13:04.760 and basically just spending time with your animal to let 0:13:04.760 --> 0:13:07.040 it get to know you. Yeah, and the whip they use. 0:13:07.120 --> 0:13:08.920 Even if you see a whip these days, they're not 0:13:08.960 --> 0:13:11.040 whipping the animal. The whip is to just to sort 0:13:11.080 --> 0:13:14.840 of like, hey, this is my space, this is your space. Yeah, 0:13:15.280 --> 0:13:42.360 my spaces over your exactly spaces over there. Uh. So 0:13:42.440 --> 0:13:45.079 let's talk about the psychology of all this stuff. Yeah, 0:13:45.360 --> 0:13:49.600 animal psychology and people psychology, because it's really not that 0:13:49.679 --> 0:13:53.600 much different. Be of Skinner as a person psychologist, very 0:13:53.600 --> 0:13:56.400 famous one. Yeah, he created the Skinner Box, that's right, 0:13:56.440 --> 0:13:59.360 and his children in it. Oh is that what's his face? 0:14:00.640 --> 0:14:02.079 I don't know. I thought you're talking about the kid 0:14:02.080 --> 0:14:07.520 that was kept in isolation Arthur. Oh, um baby Albert Albert. No, No, No, 0:14:07.559 --> 0:14:11.240 that's totally different. That was fear extinction that they were studying. 0:14:11.720 --> 0:14:14.800 This is conditioning that Skinner was all about. Um. So, 0:14:14.880 --> 0:14:18.640 operant conditioning is what we're talking about. And that's basically, ah, 0:14:19.680 --> 0:14:23.920 connecting a behavior with a signal um and giving the 0:14:23.960 --> 0:14:26.360 animal a reward. Yeah. It's like it's pretty much a 0:14:26.400 --> 0:14:30.120 one to three cycle. Yeah, it's it's basically saying like, um, 0:14:30.160 --> 0:14:33.040 you did something that's any even remotely close to what 0:14:33.080 --> 0:14:35.160 I want you to do. So here's some food, and 0:14:35.240 --> 0:14:38.960 now you can have the animals attention. Yeah, like, oh 0:14:39.080 --> 0:14:42.520 where did that come from? Right now? Um, you kind 0:14:42.520 --> 0:14:45.800 of shape that behavior where it's like, come on, let's 0:14:45.880 --> 0:14:48.880 let's try turning to the right, and then if they 0:14:48.880 --> 0:14:50.560 move to the right, they get a little bit of food, 0:14:50.960 --> 0:14:53.040 and maybe if they turn all the way the right, 0:14:53.080 --> 0:14:56.520 they get a bunch of food. Um. And then you have, 0:14:56.680 --> 0:15:00.760 say you're leading him with a stick. Um, so eventually 0:15:00.840 --> 0:15:03.280 you remove the stick and replace it with something like 0:15:03.320 --> 0:15:08.360 a snap or a clap or hey, yes, you hear 0:15:08.360 --> 0:15:09.760 a lot of that, and all of a sudden you 0:15:09.800 --> 0:15:11.920 have an animal that can turn into circle when you 0:15:12.000 --> 0:15:15.880 do what you just That's right, and that's called classical conditioning. Well, 0:15:15.920 --> 0:15:18.760 it starts with opera and moves into classical conditions. Operate 0:15:19.040 --> 0:15:22.320 than capturing, than shaping than classical condition and capturing and 0:15:22.320 --> 0:15:28.520 shaping are part of opera. Exactly. Uh should we talk 0:15:28.520 --> 0:15:31.320 about Christian the line? I guess I don't see how 0:15:31.320 --> 0:15:34.760 we can. It is real people, if you've seen this 0:15:34.840 --> 0:15:37.800 on the YouTube, it is not made up. Are you 0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:41.600 sure like you realize what you're saying here? Man? Dude, 0:15:42.400 --> 0:15:45.400 it's as real as like anything in history that happened. 0:15:46.080 --> 0:15:49.120 Like I've seen the documentary about it well, and I 0:15:49.160 --> 0:15:54.040 don't think it was Christopher Guests who directed it. Uh, 0:15:54.200 --> 0:15:55.920 I can't remember the name of it. Christian the Lion, 0:15:56.080 --> 0:15:58.800 something like that. Um, you've seen it on YouTube. In 0:15:58.920 --> 0:16:03.800 nineteen the nineteen sixty nine, late sixties, Um, a couple 0:16:03.800 --> 0:16:08.560 of Aussies, John Rindell and Ace Bork, bought a lion 0:16:08.920 --> 0:16:12.720 from a department store in London. Harrod's didn't know they 0:16:12.760 --> 0:16:17.360 sold lions back then, Harrods does. It was sort of 0:16:17.360 --> 0:16:19.000 the head of London at the time. It was like 0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:21.840 the swinging sixties and these dudes were known for having 0:16:21.880 --> 0:16:24.720 this lion and like throwing parties and stuff. It was 0:16:24.760 --> 0:16:28.400 like pretty cool. And uh, the lion got bigger, of course, 0:16:28.440 --> 0:16:30.960 and they had to release into the wild with the 0:16:31.000 --> 0:16:33.720 help of the born Free people. And then there's of 0:16:33.760 --> 0:16:37.320 course the famous video where they went um to visit 0:16:37.360 --> 0:16:41.240 this lion. Like it was it years later. It was 0:16:42.160 --> 0:16:45.040 seventy three or two, I think two. I'm not sure 0:16:45.040 --> 0:16:46.760 when they released him, but it was. It was quite 0:16:46.760 --> 0:16:49.440 a while later, and there was a few years the 0:16:49.520 --> 0:16:51.840 line jumps up in like hugs the guys. It was amazing. 0:16:51.880 --> 0:16:56.640 It was pretty amazing. Are you sure it's real? I'm 0:16:56.680 --> 0:17:01.080 as sure that that's real as that you're real. Huh. 0:17:01.600 --> 0:17:04.600 Otherwise that the biggest hoax has been pulled over the world, 0:17:05.359 --> 0:17:07.120 I don't know about that. I think the Howard Hughes 0:17:07.160 --> 0:17:11.879 biography is tops Christians. That was pretty good. Um, But 0:17:12.000 --> 0:17:14.080 as Debbie points out, for every Christian the Lion, there's 0:17:14.080 --> 0:17:17.400 a sig Freed and Roy, yes, which we already kind 0:17:17.440 --> 0:17:19.200 of covered, but I think we should go a little 0:17:19.240 --> 0:17:21.880 more into it. Yeah, there's some different theories out there. 0:17:22.280 --> 0:17:25.040 So in two thousand and three, they were, um, Siegfried 0:17:25.080 --> 0:17:27.200 and Roy were doing their thing and apparently they had 0:17:27.240 --> 0:17:31.760 like I think three thousand of these performances under their 0:17:31.840 --> 0:17:35.399 belts already. Yeah, they were working with Manticre or Monta 0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:40.120 Core sorry, who was one of their tigers, um, who 0:17:40.200 --> 0:17:42.560 they'd raised from a cub and he was now seven 0:17:42.640 --> 0:17:47.200 years old. Um, so they knew this this tiger intimately, 0:17:47.240 --> 0:17:50.440 like they were its parents for all intensive purposes. Yeah, 0:17:50.440 --> 0:17:52.879 and that's one of the keys to with line taming 0:17:52.920 --> 0:17:55.320 is that you raised them from a cub. They're not 0:17:55.359 --> 0:17:58.520 going on and getting these tigers from the savannah that 0:17:58.600 --> 0:18:01.159 are grown and then taming them. So the Simpsons were 0:18:01.160 --> 0:18:06.560 wrong in their respect. But um so during this performance, uh, 0:18:06.760 --> 0:18:13.680 something happened. Um, montcor grabbed Roy Um by his wind 0:18:13.720 --> 0:18:19.720 pipe and dragged him off stage from the outset. Um. Roy, 0:18:19.800 --> 0:18:22.240 by the way, is now partially paralyzed and as a 0:18:22.280 --> 0:18:25.840 crushed trachea because of this. But from the outset, from 0:18:25.880 --> 0:18:31.080 the moment he regained consciousness, Roy said, do not destroy Monticore. 0:18:31.240 --> 0:18:34.199 He was like he something happened. He wasn't trying to 0:18:34.240 --> 0:18:37.080 hurt me, he was trying to protect me, and he 0:18:37.200 --> 0:18:40.160 was just dragging me away from whatever it was. Roy 0:18:40.240 --> 0:18:43.399 suggested that possibly he had a stroke and that freaked 0:18:43.440 --> 0:18:46.800 out the tiger. Tiger picked up on it. Um. It's 0:18:46.840 --> 0:18:50.399 also been theorized that a woman This is almost like 0:18:50.440 --> 0:18:53.040 the lone gunman theory. Actually, this is the one. I 0:18:53.080 --> 0:18:56.560 believe a woman with a beehive hair do, sitting towards 0:18:56.600 --> 0:18:59.479 the front row or possibly in the front row, was 0:18:59.680 --> 0:19:02.639 like the stretched it and confused the tiger. Yeah, um, 0:19:02.840 --> 0:19:05.520 which I guess maybe the tiger was trying to get 0:19:05.600 --> 0:19:08.840 Roy away from the beehive. Well what happened? The accounts 0:19:08.880 --> 0:19:11.480 I read is that this tiger became transfixed on this 0:19:11.560 --> 0:19:16.159 lady and like started walking towards the lady, and so 0:19:16.800 --> 0:19:22.439 Roy jumped in between them, and uh, the tiger grabbed 0:19:22.480 --> 0:19:24.920 ahold of his wrist at this point and Roy bopped 0:19:24.960 --> 0:19:27.959 him on the nose with the microphone was going release, release, 0:19:28.560 --> 0:19:31.320 and he released him and he fell backward at that point, 0:19:31.880 --> 0:19:36.240 and I think that's when the tiger, the tiger you 0:19:36.359 --> 0:19:38.960 want to say, lying, that's when he thought that Roy 0:19:39.080 --> 0:19:41.679 was in trouble because it was a big brujah all 0:19:41.640 --> 0:19:44.080 of a sudden with him falling over. People rushed out 0:19:44.080 --> 0:19:46.920 there in the confusion. They think that he grabbed him 0:19:47.040 --> 0:19:49.080 like you would grab a baby kitten around the neck 0:19:49.440 --> 0:19:52.840 to pull it off stage. So that's I believe that 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:55.960 that sounds sensible. But he didn't let go like they 0:19:56.000 --> 0:19:58.520 sprayed him when this fire extinguisher and they beat him 0:19:58.520 --> 0:20:02.960 with the fire extinguisher until he let go, and UM 0:20:03.200 --> 0:20:08.040 cut his uh what do you call it the wind pipe? Yeah, no, 0:20:08.080 --> 0:20:12.840 but the bleeder the jugular. Yeah. Well, Roy is still alive. 0:20:12.880 --> 0:20:17.240 He survived UM and they actually UM had a final 0:20:17.320 --> 0:20:20.320 performance in two thousand nine, six years later with Monticor 0:20:20.480 --> 0:20:23.159 with mont Core because he's still alive. Yep Um, and 0:20:23.200 --> 0:20:27.560 he was at the Secret Garden and Dolphin Habitat. I've 0:20:27.560 --> 0:20:31.280 been there. It's pretty awesome. Where is this It's in Vegas. 0:20:31.720 --> 0:20:35.199 I can't remember what hotel it's at, but well, the 0:20:35.200 --> 0:20:39.920 Mirrage is where they performed, but I feel like they 0:20:40.000 --> 0:20:42.439 if it's it may be at the rush Um. I 0:20:42.440 --> 0:20:45.679 can't remember. It's also possible it was at another place. 0:20:45.760 --> 0:20:48.920 But anyway, they have like their lions and a couple 0:20:48.920 --> 0:20:51.320 of tigers. They have a bunch of stuff. And it's 0:20:51.359 --> 0:20:54.800 sad because it's a small zoo, but I'm sure these 0:20:54.840 --> 0:20:57.439 animals are treated better than the average animal at a zoo. 0:20:58.119 --> 0:21:01.720 But I mean they're in these enclosed habitats. Well, they 0:21:01.720 --> 0:21:05.280 get investigated just like modern circuses do. I think their 0:21:05.359 --> 0:21:09.800 routine checks by which government agency? Is it the U 0:21:09.880 --> 0:21:12.760 s d A. U s DA does that they do circuses, zoos, 0:21:12.840 --> 0:21:15.200 that kind of thing. Um. The thing is is, if 0:21:15.200 --> 0:21:18.840 you're an animal welfare group, you probably don't think the U. 0:21:18.920 --> 0:21:21.239 S d A is doing enough. And even if they 0:21:21.280 --> 0:21:23.360 are following the letter of the law, you probably think 0:21:23.359 --> 0:21:26.199 the letter of the law isn't strong enough. And supposedly 0:21:26.240 --> 0:21:29.359 every single major circus in the United States has been 0:21:29.359 --> 0:21:33.840 cited for violating the Animal Welfare Act. Um. So I 0:21:33.880 --> 0:21:37.080 think the whole concept behind lying, taming, and lining training 0:21:37.200 --> 0:21:41.280 is fascinating for most people. But then you take another 0:21:41.280 --> 0:21:44.440 step further and you're like, these are wild animals and captivity, 0:21:44.520 --> 0:21:46.480 Like what are you doing? Yeah? Why is your head 0:21:46.520 --> 0:21:50.080 in its mouth? Exactly? And I'm glad you brought that 0:21:50.160 --> 0:21:52.120 up because then in the introduction there's a pretty good 0:21:52.119 --> 0:21:55.280 description of what a lion can do. A lion's mouth 0:21:55.359 --> 0:21:58.200 can open up wider than your head is tall a 0:21:58.280 --> 0:22:03.000 foot every centimeters. It's also, um, capable of crushing a 0:22:03.080 --> 0:22:07.200 bull spine. I love that reference that that just sounds tough. 0:22:07.520 --> 0:22:10.520 It is to spine of a bull. Yeah, um and 0:22:10.680 --> 0:22:14.280 uh the clause are about three inches long. Pretty serious stuff. 0:22:14.480 --> 0:22:17.560 So I mean, yeah, this is very serious stuff if 0:22:17.600 --> 0:22:19.800 you're a lion trainer. But at the same time, it's like, 0:22:21.280 --> 0:22:25.880 you know, how do you justify having this act? What's 0:22:25.880 --> 0:22:28.560 the act for? What's it doing? Yeah? Is it is 0:22:28.560 --> 0:22:31.480 it protecting? Is it conserving? What is it raising awareness? 0:22:31.760 --> 0:22:34.360 I think people are demanding more explanation than they did, 0:22:34.359 --> 0:22:37.320 and say the time of Clyde Beattie. Well, yeah, because 0:22:37.359 --> 0:22:39.680 back then it was fun to poke in pride things 0:22:39.760 --> 0:22:43.000 that you thought were unusual and exotic, and there wasn't 0:22:43.000 --> 0:22:45.119 a lot of respect for it. Like the initial circuses 0:22:45.760 --> 0:22:47.919 before they were these acts were I think they had 0:22:47.960 --> 0:22:50.800 horse acts, but it was mainly like, look at these 0:22:50.840 --> 0:22:54.760 animals and cages that you've never seen before, and look 0:22:54.800 --> 0:22:58.640 there's a pigmy, yeah, a bearded lady and that guy 0:22:58.720 --> 0:23:02.080 stinks so um And I think Isaac van Jerk was 0:23:02.119 --> 0:23:03.840 the first guy to put his head in the mouth too, right, right, 0:23:03.880 --> 0:23:31.720 he was. Unfortunately the lion didn't finish that job, right man. 0:23:31.720 --> 0:23:34.280 We have like a whole suite of circus arts stuff 0:23:35.600 --> 0:23:39.119 human cannonball yeah, um man, we've got to. We have 0:23:39.240 --> 0:23:42.400 several others circus arts. Yeah, that's what it's called. If 0:23:42.400 --> 0:23:45.560 you even look on the channel, it's an entertainment house 0:23:45.560 --> 0:23:49.320 stuff first dot com slash arts, slash circus Arts. It 0:23:49.320 --> 0:23:52.560 has a sub channel circus arts subchannel at how to first, 0:23:53.040 --> 0:23:55.520 because that's the kind of site it is. And if 0:23:55.520 --> 0:23:57.480 you go to that subchannel, you don't even need to 0:23:57.480 --> 0:23:58.879 do that. You can go to the search bar on 0:23:58.960 --> 0:24:01.320 the homepage at house Star dot com and type in 0:24:01.359 --> 0:24:04.440