WEBVTT - Surveillance: Alan Krueger's Economic Legacy

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<v Speaker 1>Ye. Welcome to the Bloomberg Surveillance Podcast. I'm term Keene

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<v Speaker 1>jay Leie. We bring you insight from the best in economics, finance, investment,

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<v Speaker 1>and international relations. Find Bloomberg Surveillance on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud,

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<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg dot Com, and of course, on the Bloomberg. This

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<v Speaker 1>past weekend, the field of economics lost a giant. This

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<v Speaker 1>program lost a very good friend. It is with great

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<v Speaker 1>sadness that I say that Princeton University economist Alan Krueger

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<v Speaker 1>has died. The course was suicide. He was fifty eight. Alan,

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<v Speaker 1>who had been a professor at Princeton seven, served in

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<v Speaker 1>Obama's White House from after a stint as the Treasury

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<v Speaker 1>Department's Assistant Secretary for Economic Policy. In addition, he served

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<v Speaker 1>as chief economist at the Labor Department for a year

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<v Speaker 1>during President Bill Clinton's administer ration. Our listeners will remember

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<v Speaker 1>him joining us on nearly every first Friday of the

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<v Speaker 1>month to discuss the payrolls report. He made us all

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<v Speaker 1>smarter every time he spoke, and put in great effort

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<v Speaker 1>to help us all care about the people behind the

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<v Speaker 1>data in a way not enough people do. He cared

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<v Speaker 1>a loyal public servant and a world renowned labor market expert.

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<v Speaker 1>I want to bring in on the phone now Danny

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<v Speaker 1>Blanche flat Denmouth Professor of Economics. And here in the

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<v Speaker 1>studio Michael Mckeeblinberg International Economics and Policy correspondent, Mike Sad

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<v Speaker 1>Sad day Um, and we get the opportunity now, and

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<v Speaker 1>we should take the opportunity to reflect on his legacy.

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<v Speaker 1>We were all shocked, and his legacy is a great one.

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<v Speaker 1>And uh when all he wishes that he had been

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<v Speaker 1>able to read the tributes to him over the last

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<v Speaker 1>twenty four hours um before he died. Because he was,

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<v Speaker 1>as you say, extraordinarily well respected. The amount of the

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<v Speaker 1>number of contributions he made in the labor anomics area tremendous.

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<v Speaker 1>Starting with his work on the minimum wage. He and

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<v Speaker 1>David card theorized that maybe what the books were telling

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<v Speaker 1>us was wrong and that minimum wages don't decrease unemployment.

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<v Speaker 1>New Jersey raised the minimum wage. They went to the border.

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<v Speaker 1>They looked at cities on the Pennsylvania side and the

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<v Speaker 1>New Jersey side and found that there was no real impact.

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<v Speaker 1>The findings remained controversial, and uh, there are caveats, but

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<v Speaker 1>basically he changed the whole conversation. And now we have

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<v Speaker 1>cities and states across the country raising the minimum wage.

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<v Speaker 1>Probably would not have happened without Alan Krueger's work. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>Danny Blanche Flower, come on in here, because one thing

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<v Speaker 1>Jonathan said, that's very true. Uh, he cared. Alan Kruger cared.

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<v Speaker 1>And can you give us a sense of some of

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<v Speaker 1>the research that he did. Uh, that really made a

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<v Speaker 1>huge difference from your perspective. Right, And a great friend

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<v Speaker 1>of mine. I've known since the beginning with the end

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<v Speaker 1>of the nineties when he first went to Princeton. So

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<v Speaker 1>and I remember, actually he has book on the Mister Measurement.

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<v Speaker 1>Actually we bought him a hat David Carden and Alan

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<v Speaker 1>hats and I have long memories of Alan. I mean

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<v Speaker 1>a titan of the field. I mean a great empiricist.

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<v Speaker 1>If people go and look at Google Schollar, here's ninety

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<v Speaker 1>thousand sights that's unbelievable. And work across the whole range

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<v Speaker 1>of fields. So the Mister Measurement work is courses was crucial.

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<v Speaker 1>But there's lots of other things. There's work on education,

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<v Speaker 1>there's early work on growth, um, there's work on inequality,

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<v Speaker 1>on computers, on uber on terrorism, on long term unemployment,

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<v Speaker 1>on opioids, all all all work related, two problems out

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<v Speaker 1>there that Alan saw about trying to look at problems

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<v Speaker 1>in the world, trying to do something about them and

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<v Speaker 1>trying to fix them. And obviously we should also talk

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<v Speaker 1>about the policy work that he did um as chief

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<v Speaker 1>eclumnist at the Labor Department with Robert Reich and Bill Clinton,

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<v Speaker 1>who wrote a beautiful comment yesterday for him, his time

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<v Speaker 1>as Assistant Secretary of the Treasury with Geitner, and then

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<v Speaker 1>again his time for Obama as a as the Chief

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<v Speaker 1>Economic Advisor, and again Obama wrote a beautiful thing yesterday.

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<v Speaker 1>So this is a sad, sad loss for our field,

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<v Speaker 1>a sad loss to me of a friend, Danny. Let's

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<v Speaker 1>talk about the late eighties. Michael talked about Allen's contribution

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<v Speaker 1>to the minimum wage debate. It was the late eighties

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<v Speaker 1>and overwhelmingly there was this massive consensus that for low

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<v Speaker 1>wage workers, if you establish a minimum wage, you'll put

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<v Speaker 1>up that minimum wage. It would damage employment. Just walk

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<v Speaker 1>me through how much Annan Krueger did to just change

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<v Speaker 1>the way we think about something that we take for

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<v Speaker 1>granted now, right, I mean, I was I remember it

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<v Speaker 1>very well. The early I've been working on wages, and

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<v Speaker 1>I remember David Carl and Allen working on this project.

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<v Speaker 1>I went to the original conference about the book in

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<v Speaker 1>I think or I think it was, And basically the

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<v Speaker 1>thing that they did was it was past breaking in

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<v Speaker 1>two senses. It was past breaking because the result you've

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<v Speaker 1>talked about, and it was past breaking because they conducted

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<v Speaker 1>experiments which actually have taken over an economic which in

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<v Speaker 1>the in the eighties and early nineties was just dominated

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<v Speaker 1>by theory. So Allen and David, particularly now and later

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<v Speaker 1>pushed this thing where you go and look at the world.

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<v Speaker 1>And what they looked at was this experiment. And then

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<v Speaker 1>they sitting in Princeton, They're interested in what goes on

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<v Speaker 1>to at the minimum wage, and they and they looked

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<v Speaker 1>at an experiment of fast foodhouses um along the border

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<v Speaker 1>between New Jersey and Pennsylvania, and you saw a rise

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<v Speaker 1>in the right in the minimum wage in I think

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<v Speaker 1>it was a New Jersey if I recall. And what

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<v Speaker 1>they did was they actually looked and went measured what happened.

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<v Speaker 1>And what they found was one of the big things

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<v Speaker 1>they found is as the minimum wage was right was increased.

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<v Speaker 1>What you saw was that people actually ended up and

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<v Speaker 1>they hired better people, but people day longer. So actually

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<v Speaker 1>what it turned out was employment fact in some of

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<v Speaker 1>the results, you actually see a rising employment. Arise in

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<v Speaker 1>the minimum wage from a very low level generated the

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<v Speaker 1>result that employment actually rose. And this was hugely controversial.

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<v Speaker 1>You can look back at the literature and the comments

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<v Speaker 1>made by all kinds of people about the work that

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<v Speaker 1>they did, and this generated a huge debate. And I

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<v Speaker 1>think the answer the big deal was arise in the

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<v Speaker 1>minimum wage when it was so low actually had positive

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<v Speaker 1>employment effects. So that was hugely controversial. But methodologically, really

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<v Speaker 1>they introduced this thing when you go and look at

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<v Speaker 1>the world, you see what happens there and you report it.

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<v Speaker 1>And that's why the book was so important. And then

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<v Speaker 1>Alan followed all kinds of stuff like that later I'm

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<v Speaker 1>conducted surveys and so on, and did so when he

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<v Speaker 1>worked for President Obama. Um so I mean, I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>as I said, I think the right word I would

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<v Speaker 1>say is a true tightener, and the other thing I

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<v Speaker 1>actually sound and perhaps go back to what Mike was saying,

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<v Speaker 1>I think the question Alan was an absolute shoe it

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<v Speaker 1>to win the Nobel Prize there's no doubt of that.

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<v Speaker 1>Probably the greatest, the greatest incuraicist we've seen of our age.

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<v Speaker 1>We really have lost someone who was really important. The

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<v Speaker 1>the idea that he looked at data and gathered data

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<v Speaker 1>that wasn't available and based his conclusions on data very

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<v Speaker 1>important because a lot of people look at his career,

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<v Speaker 1>they look at the minimum wage, they look at his

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<v Speaker 1>employment in two Democratic administrations, and they say he had

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<v Speaker 1>to be a liberal Democrat, But he was really uh

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<v Speaker 1>an economist looking at problems. As Danny said, one of

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<v Speaker 1>the most interesting things he did was look at the

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<v Speaker 1>effect of licensing unemployment. You have to be licensed to

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<v Speaker 1>be a hairdresser, you have to be licensed in states

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<v Speaker 1>to braid hair, things like that, and the impact that

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<v Speaker 1>had on holding down employment. And that is a conservative

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<v Speaker 1>cause and a lot of people on the Republican side

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<v Speaker 1>have cited that as important work. So it wasn't that

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<v Speaker 1>he was taking a liberal or conservative viewpoint. He was

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<v Speaker 1>taking an economist foot point. And he really also highlighted

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<v Speaker 1>the opioid epidemic as a problem for the labor force,

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<v Speaker 1>showing detailing how nearly half of men fifty four and

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<v Speaker 1>not in the labor force took pain medication every day.

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<v Speaker 1>This was revolutionary, Danny, and definitely changed the conversation in

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<v Speaker 1>the United States about this about this epidemic. Absolutely, I

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<v Speaker 1>had a big influence on me. I talked to Alan

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<v Speaker 1>about the work that he'd done. I actually went off

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<v Speaker 1>afterwards that wrote the paper myself about pain. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>Alan's work was really important. Let's let's broaden it, um.

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<v Speaker 1>The work on pain was really important. To work on

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<v Speaker 1>people leaving the labor force was really important. So this

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<v Speaker 1>was about I mean, I absolutely agree with everything Might

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<v Speaker 1>just said. I think you would also say his work

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<v Speaker 1>was about trying to improve the human condition. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>think about this work about opiod. Mike's completely right, this

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<v Speaker 1>is not political. I'm I always think that what Alan

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<v Speaker 1>did was he snapped at the heels of complacency, try

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<v Speaker 1>to look at things and said is that right? So

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<v Speaker 1>he went and worked on Uber. But there's a great

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<v Speaker 1>paper he works on trying to look at what happened

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<v Speaker 1>at Firestone, looking at the looking at the evidence and

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<v Speaker 1>the factory and says, why did those Firestone tires fail?

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<v Speaker 1>Turned out they failed because the quality of workers who

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<v Speaker 1>actually made him in a two week period was actually

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<v Speaker 1>the really important thing that Alan went and looked at

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<v Speaker 1>the data and thought about it as as Mike said,

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<v Speaker 1>not political in that sense, trying to think about improving

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<v Speaker 1>the human condition and understanding how how the economy works.

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<v Speaker 1>And I think that's that's crucial and central to his contribution.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, work on inequality. What what what? What? Why

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<v Speaker 1>is the inequality rising? What's the cause of it? He

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<v Speaker 1>talked about computers and the use of computers impacting people's

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<v Speaker 1>wage rates. That's not political, It's about trying to understand

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<v Speaker 1>how the world works. Danny is great to catch how

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<v Speaker 1>but you Danny Blanche flat down with professor of Economics

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<v Speaker 1>and a special thanks to Michael mcke Blomberg International Economics

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<v Speaker 1>and Policy correspondent. We should say that if you are

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<v Speaker 1>having thoughts of suicide, please do call the National Suicide

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<v Speaker 1>Prevention Life Flotline at seven three eight to five, or

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<v Speaker 1>go to Speaking of Suicide dot com, forward slash resources.

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<v Speaker 1>Princeton University economist Alan Krueger has died. His contribution to

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<v Speaker 1>the field of economics cannot be overstated. He will be

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<v Speaker 1>missed by all that knew him, including all of us

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<v Speaker 1>here at Bloomberg. Over the weekend, America lost a brilliant

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<v Speaker 1>economist and many of us lost a dear friend. This

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<v Speaker 1>according to former President Barack Obama. He was talking about

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<v Speaker 1>Alan Krueger at the Princeton professor and advisor to UH

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<v Speaker 1>former Presidents Obama and Clinton. UH President Obama saying he

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<v Speaker 1>saw economic policy not as a matter of abstract theories,

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<v Speaker 1>but as a way to make people's lives better. He

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<v Speaker 1>died over the weekend at age fifty eight. The cause

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<v Speaker 1>was suicide. UH. We want to remember Alan Krueger for

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<v Speaker 1>so many things, for his contributions to the field of economics,

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<v Speaker 1>but also to his personality which graced this show, graced

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<v Speaker 1>many shows on Bloomberg and throughout the media and economics

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<v Speaker 1>profession influenced politics, crossed both aisles of the political spectrum

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<v Speaker 1>and joining us to do so. Bessie Stevenson, Bloomberg Opinion columnist,

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<v Speaker 1>former U S Department of Labor Chief economist, currently Associate

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<v Speaker 1>Professor of Public Policy at the University of Michigan's Ford School,

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<v Speaker 1>joining us by phone. Peter Koy also joining us Bloomberg

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<v Speaker 1>Business Week, Head of Economics. Here in our Bloomberg eleven

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<v Speaker 1>three Oh Studios, Betsy, I want to start with you.

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<v Speaker 1>I I know you know you knew Alan Krueger personally.

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<v Speaker 1>Can you give me a sense of what his biggest contribution,

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<v Speaker 1>in your mind was to the economics profession. Oh, that's

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<v Speaker 1>a really a hard place to start. I think, Um,

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<v Speaker 1>Alan's biggest contribution to the profession was his insatiable curiosity,

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<v Speaker 1>and that insatiable curiosity led him to UM investigate so

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<v Speaker 1>many things that have gone on to be incredibly important.

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<v Speaker 1>Lots of people cite his minimum wage work UM, which really,

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<v Speaker 1>through careful empirical analysis, shows that the kind of negative

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<v Speaker 1>employment effects that we are our models taught us might

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<v Speaker 1>happen with a minimum wage didn't seem to be as

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<v Speaker 1>bad in practice. UM. And that again came out of

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<v Speaker 1>his real curiosity. He had a knack for trying to identify, um,

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<v Speaker 1>what economists call natural experiments, trying to look around the

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<v Speaker 1>world and see, is there something that can help me

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<v Speaker 1>get at the root causal effect of some kind of policy?

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<v Speaker 1>And so with that, you know, he's pioneered a real

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<v Speaker 1>empirical revolution. And uh, and so I think if you

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<v Speaker 1>ask somebody the profession was his biggest contribution, it was

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<v Speaker 1>um what some people call the credibility revolution, bringing empirical

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<v Speaker 1>analysis to economics in order to be able to objectively

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<v Speaker 1>look at questions and find the answer regardless of your

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<v Speaker 1>preconceived notions, based on scientific analysis. Peter, boy, you were

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<v Speaker 1>the chief economist of the Labor Department, which was a

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<v Speaker 1>job he had had before. What what did he tell

0:13:45.679 --> 0:13:50.400
<v Speaker 1>you before you took that post? Um? You know he

0:13:50.840 --> 0:13:55.079
<v Speaker 1>uh uh. For me, it was a really um tough

0:13:55.120 --> 0:13:57.280
<v Speaker 1>decision whether I should take that post because I was

0:13:57.360 --> 0:14:00.000
<v Speaker 1>actually still an assistant professor. I was a ten year

0:14:00.120 --> 0:14:03.839
<v Speaker 1>yet um, and you know, Alan had the view that

0:14:03.920 --> 0:14:07.040
<v Speaker 1>it was a really hard job, but it was incredibly

0:14:07.920 --> 0:14:12.320
<v Speaker 1>fulfilling and that what we were doing and our profession

0:14:12.440 --> 0:14:14.920
<v Speaker 1>was trying to make people's lives better and getting some

0:14:15.040 --> 0:14:20.120
<v Speaker 1>experience on the ground. Um. You know, actually working with

0:14:20.240 --> 0:14:24.480
<v Speaker 1>a policy um that we were um studying and debating

0:14:24.480 --> 0:14:27.680
<v Speaker 1>would make me a better economist than he was, right, Peter,

0:14:27.800 --> 0:14:30.120
<v Speaker 1>you know, it's interesting to me. I'm thinking of some

0:14:30.160 --> 0:14:34.080
<v Speaker 1>of the more recent contributions, uh that Professor Krueger made

0:14:34.640 --> 0:14:36.920
<v Speaker 1>having to do with the opioid epidemic, where he changed

0:14:36.920 --> 0:14:41.440
<v Speaker 1>the conversation very much about what the impact was. Can

0:14:41.480 --> 0:14:43.360
<v Speaker 1>you give us a sense of how much he did

0:14:43.640 --> 0:14:48.240
<v Speaker 1>change that conversation. You know, as Bessie Stevenson said, he

0:14:48.360 --> 0:14:50.760
<v Speaker 1>was all about getting the data and looking at it

0:14:50.800 --> 0:14:54.000
<v Speaker 1>in fresh ways, and people have had a sense that

0:14:54.160 --> 0:14:57.040
<v Speaker 1>opioids were an issue, but it wasn't until he gathered

0:14:57.080 --> 0:14:59.680
<v Speaker 1>the data that people grasped how big the issue was.

0:15:00.200 --> 0:15:02.440
<v Speaker 1>I think he found that if you looked at um

0:15:03.040 --> 0:15:06.560
<v Speaker 1>working age males who were not in the labor force,

0:15:07.320 --> 0:15:11.160
<v Speaker 1>close to half of them were taking pain killers of

0:15:11.200 --> 0:15:15.840
<v Speaker 1>one kind or another. And that, you know, could have

0:15:15.880 --> 0:15:18.520
<v Speaker 1>been as hard to disentangle the cause and effect, whether

0:15:18.560 --> 0:15:19.960
<v Speaker 1>it was because they were in pain that they were

0:15:19.960 --> 0:15:21.600
<v Speaker 1>out of labor force, or whether it was taken to

0:15:21.640 --> 0:15:24.520
<v Speaker 1>pain killers that made the mindfit for the labor force.

0:15:24.600 --> 0:15:28.600
<v Speaker 1>But one way or another, it was crucial information that

0:15:28.640 --> 0:15:33.000
<v Speaker 1>has really, I think made people even more sensitive to

0:15:33.040 --> 0:15:36.200
<v Speaker 1>the depths of the opioid crisis and is as many

0:15:36.200 --> 0:15:40.040
<v Speaker 1>other things he's done, led to policy changes. So definitely,

0:15:40.640 --> 0:15:44.400
<v Speaker 1>Alan Krueger made a lot of contributions on the economics side.

0:15:45.000 --> 0:15:48.280
<v Speaker 1>On a personal level, he was just a wonderful guy

0:15:48.520 --> 0:15:51.840
<v Speaker 1>and Betsy Stevenson, you you spent a lot of time

0:15:51.880 --> 0:15:53.600
<v Speaker 1>with him. I mean, can you give us a sense

0:15:53.600 --> 0:15:57.640
<v Speaker 1>of what it was like to work with him. UM.

0:15:57.760 --> 0:16:01.360
<v Speaker 1>So you know, Alan was really a wonderful guy. Is

0:16:01.400 --> 0:16:06.640
<v Speaker 1>the right way to say. He's extremely generous, UM and

0:16:06.640 --> 0:16:11.600
<v Speaker 1>in kind and easy going, and those were not Um

0:16:11.840 --> 0:16:17.440
<v Speaker 1>qualities they too often found an economists. He was. He

0:16:17.600 --> 0:16:22.080
<v Speaker 1>was someone who really was enthusiastic about all his foreignings

0:16:22.120 --> 0:16:25.320
<v Speaker 1>and was excited to share them with people who wanted

0:16:25.360 --> 0:16:30.560
<v Speaker 1>to listen. UM. And you know, Katherine Rampell has a

0:16:30.600 --> 0:16:34.280
<v Speaker 1>really lovely column about being his research assistant and the

0:16:34.720 --> 0:16:40.600
<v Speaker 1>Washington Post and how he you know, took her, you know,

0:16:40.640 --> 0:16:43.000
<v Speaker 1>the suggestions of a nineteen year old about how he

0:16:43.000 --> 0:16:46.160
<v Speaker 1>couldn't prove his writing, which she now cringes to think

0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:52.440
<v Speaker 1>about UM with you know, joy and happiness that you know,

0:16:53.120 --> 0:16:56.080
<v Speaker 1>that was his approach. He was a person who was

0:16:56.120 --> 0:16:59.800
<v Speaker 1>really easy to talk to. UM. And and I think

0:17:00.200 --> 0:17:03.000
<v Speaker 1>mentored just an enormous amount of people. And I think

0:17:03.000 --> 0:17:06.720
<v Speaker 1>you see that by that outpouring of tributes and grief

0:17:06.840 --> 0:17:10.840
<v Speaker 1>UM on social media, because he really did take the

0:17:10.960 --> 0:17:16.480
<v Speaker 1>time to mentor young faculty and young undergrads and people

0:17:16.480 --> 0:17:19.480
<v Speaker 1>who were interested in economics. UM. And you saw that

0:17:19.520 --> 0:17:21.760
<v Speaker 1>on your show. He would take the time to come

0:17:21.800 --> 0:17:24.680
<v Speaker 1>and and chat with you guys about economics, because that

0:17:24.800 --> 0:17:27.600
<v Speaker 1>is is who he was with, someone who was always

0:17:28.080 --> 0:17:32.560
<v Speaker 1>excited to be around people and help, you know, advance

0:17:32.680 --> 0:17:35.280
<v Speaker 1>the study and knowledge of economics. And when he would

0:17:35.320 --> 0:17:38.520
<v Speaker 1>come into the radio studio or the television said, he

0:17:38.560 --> 0:17:42.000
<v Speaker 1>would stay after the segment was over. He would come early,

0:17:42.320 --> 0:17:44.640
<v Speaker 1>and he would talk about tennis, and he would talk

0:17:44.680 --> 0:17:47.760
<v Speaker 1>about vacation plans. So it was not just, you know,

0:17:47.800 --> 0:17:51.119
<v Speaker 1>a sort of hit and run. Peter Koy, I am curious.

0:17:51.680 --> 0:17:54.880
<v Speaker 1>There is this feeling that economics is sort of its

0:17:54.920 --> 0:18:01.280
<v Speaker 1>own language and then it speaks of different curves and ratios.

0:18:01.560 --> 0:18:05.640
<v Speaker 1>And Alan Krueger really touched on pop culture in many ways.

0:18:05.680 --> 0:18:09.359
<v Speaker 1>At one point even looking at concert tickets how they

0:18:09.359 --> 0:18:11.800
<v Speaker 1>had surged him price. It started to generate more revenues

0:18:11.840 --> 0:18:14.440
<v Speaker 1>for performers than CD sales. Can you talk a little

0:18:14.480 --> 0:18:19.159
<v Speaker 1>bit about the sort of importance of the tangible aspects

0:18:19.240 --> 0:18:23.639
<v Speaker 1>of some of his research. He incorporated the economics of

0:18:23.720 --> 0:18:27.040
<v Speaker 1>rock and roll into his freshman econ course at Princeton,

0:18:27.119 --> 0:18:30.960
<v Speaker 1>which was hugely popular, and it's because it was a

0:18:31.000 --> 0:18:36.640
<v Speaker 1>window into supplying demand, changing nature of labor markets that

0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:40.040
<v Speaker 1>you can really learn from and that was a book.

0:18:40.080 --> 0:18:42.600
<v Speaker 1>He's a book out this year called rock an Omics,

0:18:43.320 --> 0:18:48.320
<v Speaker 1>and he's um, I hope it sells really well because

0:18:48.600 --> 0:18:51.840
<v Speaker 1>in some ways it'll be his last gift to us.

0:18:54.080 --> 0:18:57.760
<v Speaker 1>It's incredibly sad. Yes, thank you both for being with us.

0:18:57.800 --> 0:19:01.480
<v Speaker 1>Betsy Stevenson, Bloomer opinion columnist, former U S Department of

0:19:01.560 --> 0:19:05.640
<v Speaker 1>Labor Chief economist as well as an associate professor at

0:19:05.840 --> 0:19:10.359
<v Speaker 1>the University of Michigan's Forward School. Peter Koy, Bloomberg economics

0:19:10.440 --> 0:19:13.720
<v Speaker 1>editor for the Business Week magazine, joining us here in

0:19:14.040 --> 0:19:19.280
<v Speaker 1>the Bloomberg Interactive Broker Studios. We are remembering Alan Krueger,

0:19:19.600 --> 0:19:23.679
<v Speaker 1>Princeton professor, advisor to UH former Presidents Barack Obama and

0:19:23.680 --> 0:19:29.480
<v Speaker 1>Bill Clinton, longtime economics behemoth, someone who is expected to

0:19:29.480 --> 0:19:34.240
<v Speaker 1>win the Policer Prize UH and and and really in economics. UH,

0:19:34.640 --> 0:19:39.359
<v Speaker 1>we lost a huge giant of the field. UH. He died.

0:19:39.480 --> 0:19:43.440
<v Speaker 1>The cause was suicide. He was fifty eight years old.

0:19:43.800 --> 0:19:46.560
<v Speaker 1>If you are having thoughts of suicide, please do call

0:19:46.680 --> 0:19:51.120
<v Speaker 1>the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at two seven three, eight

0:19:51.119 --> 0:19:55.280
<v Speaker 1>to five five, or go to Speaking of Suicide dot com,

0:19:55.320 --> 0:20:01.600
<v Speaker 1>Forward Slash resources get help, seek it out how the conversation. Uh,

0:20:01.760 --> 0:20:10.919
<v Speaker 1>it is worth it. Thanks for listening to the Bloomberg

0:20:10.920 --> 0:20:16.880
<v Speaker 1>Surveillance podcast. Subscribe and listen to interviews on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud,

0:20:17.240 --> 0:20:21.480
<v Speaker 1>or whichever podcast platform you prefer. I'm on Twitter at

0:20:21.520 --> 0:20:25.760
<v Speaker 1>Tom Keene before the podcast. You can always catch us worldwide.

0:20:26.200 --> 0:20:27.320
<v Speaker 1>I'm Bloomberg Radio