1 00:00:08,600 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 1: Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan. If you ever come 2 00:00:20,760 --> 00:00:25,600 Speaker 1: in contact with someone that works in forensics, a specifically 3 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:29,320 Speaker 1: medical legal death investigation and they tell you that they've 4 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:36,200 Speaker 1: seen it all, or that they've seen everything, don't walk 5 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:43,120 Speaker 1: run away from them because they're lying. No one ever 6 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:49,960 Speaker 1: sees everything. There's too many variables. You've got geography, you've 7 00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:55,080 Speaker 1: got modes of death, you've got circumstances, but most of all, 8 00:00:55,160 --> 00:00:58,400 Speaker 1: you've got individuals, and all of those pieces come into 9 00:00:58,400 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 1: play and they make each case unique. But there are 10 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 1: those events that mark you as a death investigator, those 11 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:11,160 Speaker 1: of us that I think that some people think that 12 00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:15,800 Speaker 1: we're imbued with some kind of supernatural strength because we're 13 00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:18,920 Speaker 1: around death all the time. There are those events that 14 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 1: cross our paths over the years that do in fact 15 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:27,880 Speaker 1: mark us that we can't quite seem to escape even 16 00:01:27,920 --> 00:01:37,839 Speaker 1: in our dreams. Today, I'm thinking about investigators in Knoxville, Tennessee, 17 00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:44,240 Speaker 1: specifically Knox County and a case that occurred back in 18 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:47,960 Speaker 1: nineteen ninety five, and how many of those people might 19 00:01:48,000 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 1: be retired by now. But I can guarantee you this, 20 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:54,120 Speaker 1: when they close their eyes at night, they can still 21 00:01:54,160 --> 00:01:57,160 Speaker 1: see this crime scene and they can still see the 22 00:01:57,160 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 1: body of Colleen Slimmer. Today, we're going to talk about 23 00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:06,639 Speaker 1: one of the most brutal homicides that ever took place 24 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: in that part of Tennessee. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan, and 25 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:21,480 Speaker 1: this is Bodybags David. I'd been doing some reading and 26 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: came across something the other day that really caught my attention. 27 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:29,280 Speaker 1: You know, you and I spent a lot of time 28 00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:32,320 Speaker 1: researching cases. And the reason it's kind of popped onto 29 00:02:32,320 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 1: my radar, I think was the fact that it involved 30 00:02:37,639 --> 00:02:44,600 Speaker 1: the only woman on Tennessee death Row, and that was, 31 00:02:45,240 --> 00:02:48,280 Speaker 1: you know significant, She's the only person that his own 32 00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:51,560 Speaker 1: death row. She was placed on death row. I think 33 00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 1: she was actually convicted when she was nineteen, but the 34 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:56,400 Speaker 1: event happened when she was eighteen. But that's that's not 35 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:58,520 Speaker 1: the only thing that drew me to this case from 36 00:02:58,520 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 1: a forensic standpoint. When I began to read, because I 37 00:03:01,440 --> 00:03:03,640 Speaker 1: had not heard of this case. When I began to 38 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:10,320 Speaker 1: read and I came across these three words, asphalt, box cutter, 39 00:03:11,160 --> 00:03:15,120 Speaker 1: and pentagram, I couldn't help myself. I had to read 40 00:03:15,280 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 1: about this case, and you know, there's certain things that 41 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 1: you wish she had never read, but I felt like 42 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,400 Speaker 1: that we needed to tell this tale because this case, 43 00:03:23,720 --> 00:03:27,240 Speaker 1: her case, this lady on death row, this case has 44 00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 1: come back into the news just recently because she she's 45 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 1: trying to get her case. She's trying to get off 46 00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:34,840 Speaker 1: death row, essentially, is what's happening. 47 00:03:34,840 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 2: She's trying to have her sentence changed because of her 48 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 2: age at the time the crime was committed. 49 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:43,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, I can't. You can't take the measure of what 50 00:03:44,040 --> 00:03:47,120 Speaker 1: this poor victim went through. And that's what body bags 51 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 1: is about, Dave. That's what it's about the victims. It's 52 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,280 Speaker 1: not about the perpetrators. The perpetrators are means to an 53 00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:55,880 Speaker 1: end to tell the stories of the victims. And this 54 00:03:56,480 --> 00:03:59,680 Speaker 1: poor young lady, she was purely a victim. 55 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:03,720 Speaker 2: Christa Pike was eighteen. Colleen Slimmer, the victim, was nineteen. 56 00:04:03,960 --> 00:04:06,440 Speaker 2: To Darryl's ship, that's another name we need to throw 57 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 2: in here, he was seventeen. Now let me share you 58 00:04:08,800 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 2: very quickly, the reason we've been talking about this case 59 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:16,520 Speaker 2: is because to Darryl's Ship was boyfriends with Christa Pike. 60 00:04:16,640 --> 00:04:20,160 Speaker 2: Christa Pike was eighteen to Darryl's ship seventeen when they 61 00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:24,520 Speaker 2: committed this heinous crime together. Colleen Slimmer was nineteen and 62 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:29,240 Speaker 2: they were all part of Job Corp. Krista Pike had 63 00:04:29,279 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 2: dropped out of high school and floated around joined Job war. 64 00:04:32,600 --> 00:04:35,360 Speaker 2: This is an abused girl. I'm not going to justify anything. 65 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 2: I'm just pointing out that Christa Pike had an upbringing 66 00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:44,280 Speaker 2: of the worst kind. She was abused in every way 67 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:47,920 Speaker 2: that it's possible, and her mother had her using drugs 68 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:51,039 Speaker 2: before she was a teenager. I only say that as 69 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 2: knowing a little background. She's in job Corps. It's now 70 00:04:54,839 --> 00:04:58,960 Speaker 2: nineteen ninety five and Colleen Slimmer signs a two year 71 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:03,280 Speaker 2: deal to be with now in that job Corps in Knoxville, 72 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 2: Christa Pike and to Daryl Ship hooked up. They became 73 00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:10,719 Speaker 2: boyfriend girlfriend, and Krista Pike was jealous of Colleen Slimmer. 74 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:13,479 Speaker 2: She thought Colleen was putting the moves on her boyfriend, 75 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 2: and Christa Pike started harassing Colleen Slimmer. It got so 76 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:22,520 Speaker 2: bad that Colleen actually called home and said, Mom, I 77 00:05:22,520 --> 00:05:24,560 Speaker 2: got to get out of here. I've got to come 78 00:05:24,560 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 2: home please, And she said, you can't, Dear, you signed 79 00:05:27,200 --> 00:05:29,279 Speaker 2: it to your contract. You've got to do it. So 80 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:32,520 Speaker 2: Christa Pike to Darryls Ship and another person get together 81 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:36,120 Speaker 2: and they invite Colleen Slimmer out, say, hey, we want 82 00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:38,880 Speaker 2: to bury the hatchet. We stopped the abuse, stop the harassment. 83 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:40,600 Speaker 2: We're going to let's go over here. We're going to 84 00:05:40,640 --> 00:05:42,080 Speaker 2: go out the woods. We're going to smoke some weed 85 00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:44,240 Speaker 2: like a peace pipe. That's what we're going to do. 86 00:05:44,480 --> 00:05:47,200 Speaker 2: That's how they lured Colleen Slimmer out of the dorm 87 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:51,000 Speaker 2: that January twelfth, nineteen ninety five. They lure her to 88 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:54,200 Speaker 2: an area of the campus Tennessee campus in Knoxville, and 89 00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 2: it was a very out of the way area where 90 00:05:57,080 --> 00:06:00,000 Speaker 2: they could then beat. This attack took thirty to five 91 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:02,599 Speaker 2: forty minutes, according to Christapike. Now, Joe, you mentioned a 92 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:08,640 Speaker 2: slab of asphalt, a box cutter, pentagram. When Colleen Slimmer 93 00:06:08,680 --> 00:06:12,080 Speaker 2: had been lured out there, it was to be attacked 94 00:06:12,480 --> 00:06:15,200 Speaker 2: by Krista Pike and to Daryl Ship joined in. The 95 00:06:15,240 --> 00:06:17,760 Speaker 2: beating took thirty to forty minutes, and during that time 96 00:06:17,839 --> 00:06:22,240 Speaker 2: Slimmer taunted, beat, slashed, and carved with a box cutter 97 00:06:22,279 --> 00:06:24,480 Speaker 2: and a meat cleaver. A mini meat cleaver was used 98 00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:28,720 Speaker 2: in the attack. They abused Colleen Slimmer at nineteen years old, 99 00:06:28,760 --> 00:06:31,480 Speaker 2: to the point where it was so vicious and evil. 100 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:35,000 Speaker 2: They carved a pentagram into her chest. And then when 101 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:39,640 Speaker 2: she wouldn't die, Krista Pike said, the beat won't die, 102 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 2: I want to see her brains flow. So she grabbed 103 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:46,919 Speaker 2: a slab of asphalt and slammed it down onto the 104 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:54,120 Speaker 2: head multiple times on Colleen Slimmer until her brains flowed 105 00:06:54,160 --> 00:07:00,000 Speaker 2: out of her head. Then Krysta Pike, as a souven 106 00:07:01,279 --> 00:07:05,280 Speaker 2: took a chunk of that skull from Colleen Slimmer and 107 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 2: the three people walked back to the dorm, went back 108 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 2: to bed, and the next morning went to breakfast and 109 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 2: christ the Pike showed off that piece of skull just 110 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:20,560 Speaker 2: people in the job corps and told them what she 111 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 2: had done, told them what it was. Can you imagine 112 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:30,680 Speaker 2: what kind of person could do that? 113 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:33,720 Speaker 1: Well? I think that it's the kind of person that 114 00:07:33,760 --> 00:07:36,880 Speaker 1: a defense attorney would argue was not in their right mind. 115 00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 1: And of course the jury at the time didn't see 116 00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:44,480 Speaker 1: it that way. As a matter of fact, they they 117 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:49,400 Speaker 1: held her fully responsible regardless of what kind of upbringing 118 00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 1: she had had, how much trauma she had endured and 119 00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 1: the way they were in I'm obviously no attorney, don't 120 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 1: want to be. They had held that there's no delineation 121 00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:12,400 Speaker 1: between brain maturity between the ages of seventeen, which makes 122 00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:18,480 Speaker 1: you a juvenile, and eighteen, which gives you adult status. Okay, 123 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: and look, yeah, that's you know, that's arguable. I suppose, however, 124 00:08:27,440 --> 00:08:29,960 Speaker 1: there has to be a delineation somewhere in time in 125 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:33,560 Speaker 1: the state of Tennessee has set that delineation at eighteen. 126 00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:35,840 Speaker 2: And the reason this battle has come out is because, 127 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:39,000 Speaker 2: as we said, she CHRISTA. Pike has tried to get 128 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:42,920 Speaker 2: her death sentence removed. Now, by the way, at this taping, 129 00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:49,520 Speaker 2: it's been twenty nine years, twenty nine years since the 130 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:53,440 Speaker 2: murder of Colleing Slimmer. The victim was nineteen. It's been 131 00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:58,080 Speaker 2: twenty nine years, Joe, and this woman is still on 132 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 2: death row. She's lived, yes, she's still and she's arguing 133 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:05,079 Speaker 2: that she'd the argument as well to Darryl Ship, who 134 00:09:05,120 --> 00:09:07,240 Speaker 2: was also there and also did contribute to the beating. 135 00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 2: He was seventeen at the time of the murder and 136 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:14,680 Speaker 2: his sentence was life in prison with the possibility of 137 00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 2: parole after twenty five years. Something along those lines were 138 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 2: plus twenty five years. Yeah, okay, sentence to life with 139 00:09:21,400 --> 00:09:25,240 Speaker 2: the possibility of parole, whereas Krista Pike was sentenced to death. 140 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:29,160 Speaker 2: And that's the argument. He was seventeen, she was eighteen. Now, 141 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:30,959 Speaker 2: the other person that was with him I mentioned, I 142 00:09:31,040 --> 00:09:34,280 Speaker 2: didn't deal with her a lot. Shadola Peterson was nineteen 143 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:39,800 Speaker 2: at the time. She turned state's witness and received probation 144 00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:44,000 Speaker 2: in the case. I don't agree with that, but that's 145 00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 2: another day for a lawyer to deal with. But she did. 146 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 2: She walked away. I've read through all of Christoph Pike's 147 00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:54,079 Speaker 2: statement on what she claims happened, and Joe. Usually when 148 00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 2: I read a case and I see the statement by 149 00:09:56,160 --> 00:10:01,960 Speaker 2: the suspect, I think it's probably fifty percent accurate, and 150 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:05,760 Speaker 2: it is less than what I would expect. This was 151 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 2: the most difficult thing I've ever read. 152 00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:12,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, it literally, it literally makes vomit rise up in 153 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:16,400 Speaker 1: your throat as you're that's really forgive me for saying that, 154 00:10:16,280 --> 00:10:18,679 Speaker 1: but that's really the only way I could actually describe it, 155 00:10:19,760 --> 00:10:23,080 Speaker 1: because you're talking about a fellow human being that is 156 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:27,440 Speaker 1: capable of doing this and gloats over it. Essentially and 157 00:10:27,559 --> 00:10:30,400 Speaker 1: fully admits it. She didn't she didn't run from it. 158 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:33,480 Speaker 1: And when you think about the horror that was inflicted 159 00:10:34,320 --> 00:10:41,480 Speaker 1: upon this poor victim, Colleen, there was actually one moment 160 00:10:41,760 --> 00:10:49,080 Speaker 1: during this attack where this person looks around at the 161 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:53,160 Speaker 1: others that are there and she says, forgive me, but 162 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:56,920 Speaker 1: she says this, this bitch just won't die, you know, 163 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 1: And so she's fully aware of what she is doing. 164 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:06,040 Speaker 1: As matter of fact, going back to you know, the 165 00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:10,920 Speaker 1: instruments that were used here, you can argue that that 166 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 1: the that the asphalt was probably there. It's a weapon 167 00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:18,840 Speaker 1: of what we referred to as a weapon of opportunity 168 00:11:18,920 --> 00:11:21,640 Speaker 1: or a weapon of convenience is a common term that 169 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:25,200 Speaker 1: she used. But do you walk around, Dave with a 170 00:11:25,240 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 1: meat cleaver in your back pocket? Do you? 171 00:11:27,200 --> 00:11:27,480 Speaker 2: I mean? 172 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:29,320 Speaker 1: And I guess if you work at a grocery store, 173 00:11:29,320 --> 00:11:32,040 Speaker 1: which I did when I was a kid doing stock 174 00:11:32,120 --> 00:11:34,280 Speaker 1: I carried a box cutter with me everywhere I went. 175 00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:39,560 Speaker 1: Most people don't, you know, but they came with a 176 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 1: box cutter in hand. They're working for job corps. Maybe 177 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:45,360 Speaker 1: they had jobs as stockers. I don't know. They had 178 00:11:45,400 --> 00:11:47,640 Speaker 1: access to a box cutter, but they purposed to go 179 00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:49,400 Speaker 1: out there with it. And you know, one of the 180 00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:51,960 Speaker 1: things that she that Pike had alluded to in here 181 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:55,000 Speaker 1: is that you said, you know, the peace pipe. They 182 00:11:55,440 --> 00:11:58,120 Speaker 1: they were going to smoke weed while they were out there. 183 00:11:58,120 --> 00:12:03,320 Speaker 1: And this is actually the location on on campus. On 184 00:12:03,400 --> 00:12:07,480 Speaker 1: campus is adjacent to the old steam plant at ut 185 00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:11,480 Speaker 1: and it is isolated. I saw something quite fascinating in 186 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:15,559 Speaker 1: one of the newsreels from the time back then, which 187 00:12:15,760 --> 00:12:19,040 Speaker 1: was kind of interesting to see. Within I think it 188 00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:24,920 Speaker 1: was about within twenty four hours of this having been processed. 189 00:12:24,920 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 1: The scene. The reporter was standing on the very location 190 00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:31,200 Speaker 1: it was not locked down, standing on the very location 191 00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:35,960 Speaker 1: where Colleen's body had been found, and he walks over Dave, 192 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:41,080 Speaker 1: and this was like kind of this incredible moment. He's 193 00:12:41,080 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 1: standing there and Dave, there is a pile of fractured asphalt, 194 00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:50,720 Speaker 1: and he walks over and he says, this is where 195 00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:53,720 Speaker 1: the asphalt came from. And he reaches down, he picks 196 00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:56,439 Speaker 1: up a chunk of asphalt and he holds it up 197 00:12:56,559 --> 00:12:59,440 Speaker 1: and he said, they crushed your skull with a piece 198 00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:03,199 Speaker 1: of asphalts similar to this. It's probably from that same grouping. 199 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:05,160 Speaker 1: You know that it was all busted up. It was 200 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:07,520 Speaker 1: an old road and they just kind of dumped the 201 00:13:07,559 --> 00:13:10,160 Speaker 1: stuff back there, but they took her back there with 202 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:13,720 Speaker 1: the specific aim of taking her life and not just 203 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:16,319 Speaker 1: taking her life. It's one thing to take someone's life, 204 00:13:17,559 --> 00:13:23,600 Speaker 1: but it's altogether another thing to torture them, and in 205 00:13:23,640 --> 00:13:51,840 Speaker 1: Colleen's case, that's what they did. When my memoir came 206 00:13:51,880 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 1: out a few years ago, Blood Beneath My Feet, my 207 00:13:55,320 --> 00:13:59,359 Speaker 1: publisher was kind of an off the beaten path publisher, 208 00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:01,840 Speaker 1: what they referred to as a boutique publisher, but he 209 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:06,560 Speaker 1: was well known in Hollywood and famously, you know, published 210 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:08,720 Speaker 1: a lot of stuff that other people would not touch 211 00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:13,560 Speaker 1: because of the nature of it. And I had kind 212 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:18,360 Speaker 1: of an uncomfortable moment because he had the publisher had 213 00:14:18,400 --> 00:14:25,440 Speaker 1: actually befriended Anton Levey and had re published the Satanic 214 00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:28,560 Speaker 1: Bible some years back. I was like, Oh Lord, what 215 00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 1: have I gotten myself into? And all I could see 216 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:34,280 Speaker 1: at that moment in time was my book about death 217 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:37,240 Speaker 1: and my life around death being associated with Satanic Bible. 218 00:14:37,320 --> 00:14:39,880 Speaker 1: And of course, you know, publishers publish all kinds of things. 219 00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 1: You know, it doesn't mean anything but the idea of 220 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:46,520 Speaker 1: a pentagram kind of entering into this and entering into 221 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:49,440 Speaker 1: this particular case, it made me reflective for a moment 222 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:51,920 Speaker 1: the day that I found out some of the other 223 00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:55,280 Speaker 1: works that have been published by this company, and I 224 00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:59,600 Speaker 1: was thinking, what drives someone to take what has been 225 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:02,800 Speaker 1: you know, declared essentially, I guess, by the Church of 226 00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:09,040 Speaker 1: Satan as the symbol of Satanism. What would cause a 227 00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:12,560 Speaker 1: young woman, what would give her the thought in her mind? 228 00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:17,200 Speaker 1: What would be the motivation for taking a box cutter 229 00:15:17,280 --> 00:15:20,200 Speaker 1: which has got roughly if you've never seen a box cutter, 230 00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 1: the blade on it at its greatest thing is diagonal 231 00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 1: in shape. It's got a very sharp point on it. 232 00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:28,960 Speaker 1: But the blade surface itself is only about an inch 233 00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:31,480 Speaker 1: and a half in length most of the time, and 234 00:15:31,600 --> 00:15:34,080 Speaker 1: there's more of the blades inside of the device. It's 235 00:15:34,080 --> 00:15:37,520 Speaker 1: got to handle with. It's actuated by the thumb. You 236 00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:39,160 Speaker 1: can kind of press it out and then once one 237 00:15:39,200 --> 00:15:42,200 Speaker 1: gets toulen, you kind of, you know, unscrew it and 238 00:15:42,240 --> 00:15:45,480 Speaker 1: then re engage with a new blade very sharp initially. 239 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:50,000 Speaker 1: But how do you feel comfortable enough, I think, to 240 00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:55,440 Speaker 1: not only carve onto another human beings body, But what 241 00:15:55,560 --> 00:15:59,840 Speaker 1: are you trying to say by taking this young woman 242 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:03,920 Speaker 1: and carving a pentagram not only into her forehead but 243 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 1: also onto her chest. David, it's just it's beyond the pail. 244 00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:10,680 Speaker 2: There are several things when you pointed this story out 245 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:13,720 Speaker 2: to me, but back to the pentagram. When I was 246 00:16:13,720 --> 00:16:17,720 Speaker 2: telling you about Christa Pike and her upbringing, alluding to 247 00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:21,400 Speaker 2: having a rough childhood, it led her down a path 248 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:24,800 Speaker 2: that was not your typical eighteen year old female at 249 00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 2: the time, and seventeen year old to Darryl Ship susceptible 250 00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:32,840 Speaker 2: to a strong woman who they dabbled in the occult. 251 00:16:32,280 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 2: They had dabbled in Satanism. They had dabbled in these things. 252 00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:38,640 Speaker 2: I say dabbled because that's the only way one can 253 00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:44,360 Speaker 2: explain to young people of difficult backgrounds getting together and 254 00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:47,400 Speaker 2: you know, doing drugs and looking at things thinking it's 255 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:50,560 Speaker 2: cool to you know, worship Satan or whatever it is 256 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:53,560 Speaker 2: they were trying to do. But there are a couple 257 00:16:53,640 --> 00:16:56,000 Speaker 2: things you mentioned. Torture and when you were talking about 258 00:16:56,040 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 2: the reporter being able to get out there on the 259 00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:01,920 Speaker 2: crime scene the next day, they were able to find 260 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:07,040 Speaker 2: that during this torture, during this beating, that two different 261 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:10,439 Speaker 2: times Colleen Slimmer was able to get up and run 262 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:13,960 Speaker 2: from them and was able to get away far enough 263 00:17:14,240 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 2: that they ripped her shirt off. That's when they carved 264 00:17:16,080 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 2: the pentagram in. But more than that, it was to 265 00:17:19,320 --> 00:17:20,080 Speaker 2: humiliate her. 266 00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:21,919 Speaker 1: Yea, and absolutely right. 267 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:25,199 Speaker 2: There were away from her body, thirty feet from her body, 268 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:29,119 Speaker 2: thirty feet from where her body was found. They found 269 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:33,120 Speaker 2: a blood pool where she had I don't know if 270 00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:35,879 Speaker 2: she expired there, and then they drug her body, but 271 00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:38,080 Speaker 2: there was so much physical evidence in that area. That's 272 00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:40,399 Speaker 2: why I'm shocked to even think that a reporter was 273 00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:42,480 Speaker 2: standing in the midst of it. That they had cleared 274 00:17:42,520 --> 00:17:45,760 Speaker 2: the crime scene so quickly. But when the body was found, 275 00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:48,760 Speaker 2: the yard serviced individuals that he didn't even think it 276 00:17:48,800 --> 00:17:50,840 Speaker 2: was a person. He thought it was an animal carcass 277 00:17:51,160 --> 00:17:52,240 Speaker 2: until he got closer. 278 00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:54,600 Speaker 1: And I've seen and I think you may have too. 279 00:17:54,680 --> 00:17:58,639 Speaker 1: I saw the crime scene images here. And as a 280 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:03,480 Speaker 1: matter of fact, when when she's observed, when Colleen is observed, 281 00:18:03,560 --> 00:18:05,520 Speaker 1: when you take that, you know there's a couple of 282 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:08,520 Speaker 1: Just so people understand how we do photography at crime scenes, 283 00:18:09,119 --> 00:18:13,000 Speaker 1: we do what is referred to as macro views and microviews, 284 00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:14,679 Speaker 1: and kind of let me break that down for you. 285 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:19,119 Speaker 1: If you imagine a compass being in the center of 286 00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:24,359 Speaker 1: the scene, okay, north, south, east, and west. We start 287 00:18:24,440 --> 00:18:27,520 Speaker 1: off very very broadly. That's our macro shots, and we 288 00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:32,080 Speaker 1: will take images Initially they're called overall shots from all 289 00:18:32,119 --> 00:18:35,120 Speaker 1: four points of the compass okay, to give you orientation 290 00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:39,440 Speaker 1: so that when because that moment is only frozen, it's 291 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:42,160 Speaker 1: frozen for that moment. Tom when there because the remains 292 00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:43,600 Speaker 1: they're not going to be there forever. They're going to 293 00:18:43,640 --> 00:18:46,440 Speaker 1: be removed, and so you have to capture that. It's 294 00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:50,080 Speaker 1: part of documenting what we do. And then once you've 295 00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:54,119 Speaker 1: gotten those overall shots, you move in about half the 296 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:58,000 Speaker 1: distance between that outer shot that you took those overalls 297 00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:00,320 Speaker 1: to about half the distance, and then you were peat 298 00:19:00,359 --> 00:19:03,359 Speaker 1: that process again, and then some people even come in 299 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:06,480 Speaker 1: closer and then do the three hundred and sixty degree 300 00:19:06,520 --> 00:19:10,640 Speaker 1: thing again. And then you start to take microshots where 301 00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:13,399 Speaker 1: you're focusing in on individual pieces of evidence. You know, 302 00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:15,680 Speaker 1: you had mentioned the blood, for instance, there may have 303 00:19:15,720 --> 00:19:20,600 Speaker 1: been drag marks, there may have been bits of clothing. 304 00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:23,240 Speaker 1: You know, they had talked about ripping her clothing off, 305 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:26,960 Speaker 1: but when you see her, Dave, you can tell. I 306 00:19:27,040 --> 00:19:30,520 Speaker 1: think the only way you could really describe her remains 307 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 1: is that she was pummeled. It looked as though she 308 00:19:35,000 --> 00:19:38,879 Speaker 1: had been beaten into the ground, and she was lying, 309 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:42,679 Speaker 1: And anybody in medicine kind of knows what I'm going 310 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 1: to say. She was in what's referred to as as 311 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:49,160 Speaker 1: a left recumbent position, so that means that the left 312 00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:54,119 Speaker 1: side of her body was actually contacting the ground. Her 313 00:19:54,240 --> 00:19:58,480 Speaker 1: right leg is over her left, She's still wearing her jeans, 314 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:04,040 Speaker 1: and her arms like almost like a final cry, are 315 00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:08,320 Speaker 1: extended up above her head, almost as if you know, 316 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:13,320 Speaker 1: she's pleading for no more. And the evidence itself that 317 00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:17,320 Speaker 1: when you begin to examine these injuries to her body, 318 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:23,600 Speaker 1: they belie a sense of horror that generally cannot be 319 00:20:23,720 --> 00:20:27,480 Speaker 1: expressed to most people when you see it. Somebody had 320 00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:30,000 Speaker 1: talked at I think that was the news people. They 321 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:33,760 Speaker 1: had said that she had sustained Initially they said multiple 322 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:37,160 Speaker 1: stab wounds. Well, these are not stab wounds. These are 323 00:20:37,160 --> 00:20:42,159 Speaker 1: what we refer to as incized injuries. So when you 324 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:45,960 Speaker 1: begin to see the difference between the way we define 325 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:49,040 Speaker 1: a stab wound versus an incized woe, a stab wound 326 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:52,720 Speaker 1: is narrow and deep. Okay, So if you imagine a 327 00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:56,879 Speaker 1: knife being plunged into a body. An incized woon is 328 00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:00,600 Speaker 1: what many people refer to as a cut. It's a slice. Okay, 329 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:03,480 Speaker 1: She's got multiple slices all of her body, and these 330 00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:08,720 Speaker 1: are not even part of the pentagram. Are slices, obviously, 331 00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:12,600 Speaker 1: but Dave, her throat was cut multiple times, and you've 332 00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:17,160 Speaker 1: got what are referred to as superficial in sized areas 333 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:22,200 Speaker 1: that just go into what's referred to as the subcutaneous 334 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:23,200 Speaker 1: layer of the skin. 335 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 2: But they refer to the gaping maw of her neck. 336 00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:29,800 Speaker 1: There is and here's the troubling thing about it. Let 337 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:33,080 Speaker 1: me just so that I am just absolutely accurate with this, 338 00:21:33,240 --> 00:21:36,560 Speaker 1: and I'm looking at the images as we speak right now. 339 00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:39,400 Speaker 1: From what I can see, I'm counting in this one view. 340 00:21:39,640 --> 00:21:42,320 Speaker 1: In addition to this, you use the term in right, 341 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:48,320 Speaker 1: you are gaping maw. I'm seeing one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, 342 00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:53,040 Speaker 1: eight eight superficial. This is on her neck alone, though 343 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:57,800 Speaker 1: I'm seeing eight superficial incized ones there. You know what 344 00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:01,359 Speaker 1: that means to me? That means that at not only 345 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:03,920 Speaker 1: were they trying to cut her throat, but they were 346 00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:07,520 Speaker 1: torturing her. Because this is a superficial event. If you 347 00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:10,639 Speaker 1: wanted to kill her, you could take that box cutter 348 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:13,320 Speaker 1: and drive it into her throat and end her life 349 00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:16,960 Speaker 1: pretty quickly. That's not what happened, because she's got these 350 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:19,080 Speaker 1: marks in addition to her neck, she's got them all 351 00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:21,560 Speaker 1: over her chest, she's got them all over her back, 352 00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:24,760 Speaker 1: in addition to these strikes that she sustained with the 353 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:28,160 Speaker 1: meat cleaver that's there, which are chopping injuries. Those are 354 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:31,120 Speaker 1: completely different in appearance than say, for instance, and then 355 00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:35,840 Speaker 1: sized injury. And when you see her body overall, remember 356 00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:38,920 Speaker 1: I was referring to the recumbent position, she almost Dave 357 00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:44,440 Speaker 1: looks as though she's blended into the ground. She's covered 358 00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:49,720 Speaker 1: in blood. It doesn't look human. So that her body 359 00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:53,919 Speaker 1: doesn't look human upon first glance. I can understand why 360 00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 1: this person Dave that discovered her thought that this isn't 361 00:22:58,040 --> 00:23:00,600 Speaker 1: this is this can't be real. This can't be real 362 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:01,200 Speaker 1: what I'm saying. 363 00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:04,280 Speaker 2: Can you imagine when he actually described I went and 364 00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:09,040 Speaker 2: read what he said, and he talked about He said 365 00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:11,080 Speaker 2: it in such a way that you could understand he 366 00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:13,280 Speaker 2: was talking about it in the nicest way he could. 367 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:15,600 Speaker 2: He said he didn't realize what he was looking until 368 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:18,320 Speaker 2: he saw her breasts, and that's when he knew it 369 00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:22,080 Speaker 2: was a female, a young woman, and then he was horrified. 370 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:25,439 Speaker 2: Until then he didn't have enough information to go on 371 00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:29,200 Speaker 2: to be mortified. You know what he is saying. But Joe, 372 00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:32,040 Speaker 2: take it the next step. Because you mentioned I didn't 373 00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:34,359 Speaker 2: realize how many cuts arond the neck. I looked at 374 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:35,040 Speaker 2: the pictures too. 375 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:37,919 Speaker 1: I wish you hadn't. I tell you the truth that 376 00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:41,359 Speaker 1: it's one of those things I hate. I feel guilty 377 00:23:41,400 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 1: because I've subjected you to it. You know, this is 378 00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:45,080 Speaker 1: the stuff that I've had to look at my whole life. 379 00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:47,040 Speaker 2: Here's the side of me that comes into this when 380 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:49,640 Speaker 2: I read. The first thing I did is I read 381 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:54,240 Speaker 2: the report on christ Pike asking for reconsideration of the 382 00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:59,200 Speaker 2: death penalty. Yeah, and I looked at that and I thought, well, 383 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:01,119 Speaker 2: let's you know, when I was eighteen, I did some 384 00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:04,200 Speaker 2: stupid stuff too. But this isn't a stupid stuff. This 385 00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:06,720 Speaker 2: isn't a flight of fancy. This isn't I'm mad because 386 00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 2: this girl upset me and trying to steal my boyfriend, 387 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:11,680 Speaker 2: and I'm gonna hurt her. I'm gonna you know that 388 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:16,800 Speaker 2: this is a planned, not even a chaotic even joke. 389 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:19,800 Speaker 2: This was a planned murder. There was never any plan 390 00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:22,800 Speaker 2: for Colleens Slimmer to make it back to the dorm alive. 391 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:27,200 Speaker 2: And I'm I'm sadden, to be honest with you that 392 00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:31,040 Speaker 2: that the witness who turned on him, Shadola, how they 393 00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:33,440 Speaker 2: gave her a free ride when they had all the information. 394 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:38,919 Speaker 2: They didn't need Shadola Peterson to turn state's witness. They 395 00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:41,680 Speaker 2: already had this. You're talking about Christoph Pike. The very 396 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:44,639 Speaker 2: next morning, Okay, the next morning, Joe, she's sitting at 397 00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:47,280 Speaker 2: the christ at the breakfast table with her other dorm 398 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:53,280 Speaker 2: mates talking about this piece of skull is from Colleen's head. 399 00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:55,119 Speaker 2: I killed her last night. 400 00:24:56,280 --> 00:24:58,679 Speaker 1: And there she is displaying it as if it's some 401 00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 1: kind of trophy. Well, upon further consideration, Dave, I have 402 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:07,160 Speaker 1: to say, I don't know that this is so much 403 00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:13,880 Speaker 1: a case of someone dabbling in Satanism or the occult 404 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:18,600 Speaker 1: as much as it is satanism, because this is one 405 00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:22,000 Speaker 1: of the most sadistic homicides I've every born witness to. 406 00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:46,920 Speaker 1: I get all kinds of interesting phone calls, Dave, that 407 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:50,200 Speaker 1: you can imagine I'll have people that will reach out 408 00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:53,399 Speaker 1: to me because they I don't know, they have a 409 00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:55,480 Speaker 1: case they want me to look into, or I'll have 410 00:25:55,760 --> 00:26:01,440 Speaker 1: just the most bizarre questions that people might have regarding death. 411 00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:03,520 Speaker 1: And it's okay, you know, to get those questions because 412 00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:07,160 Speaker 1: people are curious. But I think probably the first time 413 00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:09,840 Speaker 1: I ever got this question asked of me, and it 414 00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:13,560 Speaker 1: was not It had nothing to do with a phone call. 415 00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:15,399 Speaker 1: It had to do I was at a party and 416 00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:21,360 Speaker 1: I had someone walk up to me and say, say, hey, 417 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:24,560 Speaker 1: Jos's wondering I'd read somewhere that you can donate your 418 00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:28,480 Speaker 1: body to the Body Farm at UT you know, like 419 00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:33,520 Speaker 1: a anatomical donation. I was like, yeah, I think you can. 420 00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:35,960 Speaker 1: Actually do you know what that involves? You know, I'm 421 00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:40,239 Speaker 1: asking right quizzically. Oh yeah, yeah, we know that they 422 00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:43,600 Speaker 1: do the decay studies on bodies and this sort of thing. 423 00:26:45,320 --> 00:26:51,080 Speaker 1: And what's fascinating about this case that we're talking about today, 424 00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:55,880 Speaker 1: Colleen's case, is that, you know, it's it's not Stone's Throw, 425 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:58,600 Speaker 1: but it's very close to actually the location of the 426 00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:00,720 Speaker 1: Body Farm at ut And you know, so, did you 427 00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:04,600 Speaker 1: know that the body farm actually plays a role in 428 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:10,359 Speaker 1: this particular case, because arguably one of the best forensic 429 00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:13,720 Speaker 1: anthropologists anywhere in the world. I'd put him up against 430 00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:18,520 Speaker 1: anybody in the world actually was involved in this case, 431 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 1: and it had to do with that bit of skull 432 00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:24,800 Speaker 1: that Pike brought to the breakfast table with her that day. 433 00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:29,320 Speaker 2: I couldn't imagine what kind of person would think it 434 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:30,200 Speaker 2: was a good thing. 435 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:31,199 Speaker 1: You know. 436 00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:34,719 Speaker 2: The arrest on this case took thirty six hours because 437 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:36,960 Speaker 2: of Pike. And so that's why I have such a 438 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:41,240 Speaker 2: problem with Sadela Peterson being let go by turning state's witness. 439 00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:47,000 Speaker 2: But how did that piece of skull that Christa Pike 440 00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:49,760 Speaker 2: was showing off as a trophy, How did that play 441 00:27:49,800 --> 00:27:51,679 Speaker 2: into what took place at trial? 442 00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:58,040 Speaker 1: Well, it's significant because you know what you do. What 443 00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:04,679 Speaker 1: you do have here is you're displaying an anatomical uh, 444 00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:12,760 Speaker 1: an anatomical feature that's easily easily traced back to this 445 00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:16,840 Speaker 1: young woman's skull. And just imagine it's kind of like, ah, 446 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:18,199 Speaker 1: let me see, how can I put this? 447 00:28:19,240 --> 00:28:21,160 Speaker 2: Could they have traced it back to her at that time? 448 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:22,920 Speaker 2: And could it? Could it? Is there a part of 449 00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:25,320 Speaker 2: bone that would actually be untraceable that you could say 450 00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:26,639 Speaker 2: I found this on the road. 451 00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:30,080 Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I was actually gonna be much more simplistic. 452 00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:31,360 Speaker 1: I'm not going to be I'm not going to talk 453 00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:34,679 Speaker 1: about anything as sophisticated as DNA here. But what what 454 00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:37,399 Speaker 1: I'm what I was going to say is uh uh 455 00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:44,640 Speaker 1: it's it is truly like a jigsaw puzzle. And when 456 00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:48,240 Speaker 1: you have uh, this fracturing of the skull, and if 457 00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:55,040 Speaker 1: you can imagine, uh, Colleen skull looked like uh, it 458 00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:59,600 Speaker 1: looked like a fractured egg essentially with bits of the 459 00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:04,239 Speaker 1: shell missing. That's that's the easiest way that I can 460 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:09,240 Speaker 1: kind of describe that to a layman. And what happened 461 00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:12,720 Speaker 1: was was that a gentleman. And I urge anybody hearing 462 00:29:12,720 --> 00:29:15,960 Speaker 1: this please take a look at this guy. He's fascinating 463 00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:22,280 Speaker 1: Doctor Murray Marx. He's a forensic anthropologist. I don't know 464 00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:24,239 Speaker 1: if he's still at you t or not, but he was. 465 00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:28,840 Speaker 1: He famously ran the body Farm after doctor Bass who 466 00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:33,720 Speaker 1: founded it doctor Bill Bass, Murray Marx took it over 467 00:29:33,760 --> 00:29:35,880 Speaker 1: and managed the body Farm. I don't know if Murray 468 00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:38,240 Speaker 1: is still there or not, but anyway, he became involved 469 00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:42,440 Speaker 1: in this case. And the key here is that they 470 00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:46,920 Speaker 1: wanted they the prosecution wanted to be able to demonstrate 471 00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:53,760 Speaker 1: I think, not just the physical assemblage that they would have, 472 00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:56,960 Speaker 1: you know, because it's very common for a forensic anthropologist 473 00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 1: to take a fragment, it's goal or any other fragmented bone, 474 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,720 Speaker 1: and they have this unbelievable skill set, David. They have 475 00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:06,160 Speaker 1: the patients of a watchmaker. They can take these little 476 00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:11,840 Speaker 1: particulate bits and bring them back together. It's amazing to watch. 477 00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:15,640 Speaker 1: And they I think that not only did they want 478 00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:20,080 Speaker 1: to anatomically place this bit of skull back in there, 479 00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:25,360 Speaker 1: but it was through this demonstration I think that they 480 00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:30,400 Speaker 1: were able to say, Okay, this is what they did 481 00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:34,880 Speaker 1: to calling, this is what they did. Not only did 482 00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:39,480 Speaker 1: they crush her skull, she sustained multiple fractures in her skull, 483 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:45,360 Speaker 1: but they took a trophy as well, and we have 484 00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:49,440 Speaker 1: to begin to consider, you know, really what that means 485 00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:53,520 Speaker 1: in this case, and how does it factor into the 486 00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:56,360 Speaker 1: consideration as to whether or not she needs to be 487 00:30:56,520 --> 00:31:00,520 Speaker 1: on death row? You know, are there mitigating facts here? 488 00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 1: I don't know, because I'm not an attorney and I'm 489 00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:05,240 Speaker 1: certainly not a psychologist. What I do know is that 490 00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:10,120 Speaker 1: the physical evidence here demonstrates somebody that was very purposed uh, 491 00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:16,160 Speaker 1: in accomplishing this task. You've got this poor young girl 492 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:19,560 Speaker 1: that has been sliced all over her body. If if 493 00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:23,320 Speaker 1: these these photographs are just absolutely beyond the pale a 494 00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:25,720 Speaker 1: matter of fact, I can't believe that they're they're actually 495 00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:30,600 Speaker 1: you know, spinning about out there on the internet. The 496 00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:32,960 Speaker 1: depth of them, the amount of pain that would have 497 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:36,959 Speaker 1: been associated just with those and yet she's not you 498 00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:41,920 Speaker 1: know what what this person said, She's not dying. Yeah, 499 00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:45,000 Speaker 1: she's not going to die from these superficial injuries that 500 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:49,440 Speaker 1: you've inflicted. But it's going to cause such an amazing 501 00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:53,800 Speaker 1: amount of pain and in the last moments of Colleen's life. 502 00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:56,880 Speaker 1: That's why I use the term sadistic earlier. This it 503 00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:58,960 Speaker 1: goes to torture. It absolutely goes to. 504 00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:02,360 Speaker 2: Torture, actually defined by Christa Pike. You know, I told 505 00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:05,520 Speaker 2: you how reading her statement of what took place, and 506 00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:10,760 Speaker 2: it's a very long statement. She exp she actually explains 507 00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:13,920 Speaker 2: this in living color, like she's reliving it as she 508 00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:17,959 Speaker 2: gives her statement to police, telling them what transpired. There 509 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:21,240 Speaker 2: were several times in the beating process that lasted thirty 510 00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:23,080 Speaker 2: to forty minutes, and I think it might have lasted 511 00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:25,719 Speaker 2: a lot longer, right, But you know this is from 512 00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:29,680 Speaker 2: her from Christa Pike's account, where she as soon as 513 00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:35,800 Speaker 2: they got to the area, Christa immediately starts pounding on her. Colleen. 514 00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:39,360 Speaker 2: She hits her in the head with her knee several times. 515 00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:42,240 Speaker 2: She is putting her knee her head on the ground 516 00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:45,600 Speaker 2: several times, and Colleen is screaming, why are you doing this? 517 00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:47,960 Speaker 2: Why are you doing this? And she's you know, because 518 00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:51,200 Speaker 2: of him, and they let her back up. She tried 519 00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:54,640 Speaker 2: to run, Colleen, or Christa said, when she tried to 520 00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:57,840 Speaker 2: run away. He she didn't name him, but he, her boyfriend, 521 00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:02,400 Speaker 2: chased her down, brought her back. She again, she's getting pummeled, 522 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,240 Speaker 2: she's getting hit, she's getting her head bashed in, she's 523 00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:07,560 Speaker 2: getting kicked. When she's on the ground, she's being kicked. 524 00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:11,600 Speaker 2: And she gets up and runs again again she has 525 00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:14,640 Speaker 2: caught and drug back. That's when one of the times 526 00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:16,200 Speaker 2: when she got up and ran, one of the cuts. 527 00:33:16,200 --> 00:33:18,560 Speaker 2: And this is Krista Pike said. The long cut on 528 00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:21,120 Speaker 2: her back was the second time she tried to run. 529 00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:24,160 Speaker 2: She cut her in the back because she was trying 530 00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:27,720 Speaker 2: to kill her then, but she wouldn't die. I look 531 00:33:27,760 --> 00:33:29,320 Speaker 2: at this over and over. I've read this and I 532 00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:32,040 Speaker 2: can't think what kind of person Joe I mean, she 533 00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:36,400 Speaker 2: wants us to believe that she should be taken off 534 00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:39,360 Speaker 2: death row because it's been so many years that we're 535 00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:42,040 Speaker 2: supposed to forget her description of what she said she 536 00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:44,400 Speaker 2: did to this nineteen year old girl who did nothing 537 00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,680 Speaker 2: but want to be in job corps. She terrorized her 538 00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:50,840 Speaker 2: for weeks leading up to it, lured her into an 539 00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:54,440 Speaker 2: area where she could beat her. She had two friends 540 00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:56,800 Speaker 2: standing by to make sure the girl couldn't get away. 541 00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:01,200 Speaker 2: Then she beat her repeatedly about out the head, the body. 542 00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:03,880 Speaker 2: She kicked her, She bruised her, and she cut her. 543 00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:07,000 Speaker 2: She used a mini meat cleaver, she used a box cutter, 544 00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:11,520 Speaker 2: and then when she wouldn't die, she threw us and 545 00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:13,480 Speaker 2: she couldn't move. She was laying on the ground, she 546 00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,719 Speaker 2: could no longer get up. She dropped a piece of 547 00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:19,680 Speaker 2: asphalt on her head to crush her skull to make 548 00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:22,279 Speaker 2: her brain come out, and then had the temerity to 549 00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:25,000 Speaker 2: grab a piece of that head and take it with 550 00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:25,960 Speaker 2: her as a trophy. 551 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:31,480 Speaker 1: You know. And there's a statement that Pike May two 552 00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:37,280 Speaker 1: that is kind of a curious statement. She is quoted 553 00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:42,880 Speaker 1: as saying that I just felt mean that day? What 554 00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:46,680 Speaker 1: what what is that? S What does that entail? You 555 00:34:47,120 --> 00:34:49,880 Speaker 1: just feel mean that day? Because I got to tell 556 00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:52,960 Speaker 1: you I've I've had I've been mean before in my life, 557 00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:55,840 Speaker 1: been mean to people. I think that many people in 558 00:34:55,880 --> 00:35:00,480 Speaker 1: our audience can understand that. But this is not This 559 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:02,960 Speaker 1: is not being mean, all right. This is not something 560 00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:05,000 Speaker 1: that you slap your hands child for or put them 561 00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:07,200 Speaker 1: in the corner and say, don't do that. You're being 562 00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:09,600 Speaker 1: mean to your brother or your sister or whatever the 563 00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:15,120 Speaker 1: case might be. This is not mean. This is sadism, yes, 564 00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:20,719 Speaker 1: because you're you're looking, you're looking to torture someone. And uh, 565 00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:24,920 Speaker 1: you know sometimes I scoff at the saying, you know, 566 00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:27,440 Speaker 1: and it's it's wrote. People say it all the time. 567 00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:30,919 Speaker 1: Hurting people hurt people, you know. I've heard that over 568 00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:34,040 Speaker 1: and over and again throughout my entire life. The problem 569 00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:37,120 Speaker 1: is is that hurting people hurt people. The hurt the 570 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:40,720 Speaker 1: hurting people that are hurting people are rarely, if ever, 571 00:35:40,760 --> 00:35:43,320 Speaker 1: held accountable for their actions. 572 00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:45,600 Speaker 2: And I'd go further with that. If she didn't beg 573 00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:48,920 Speaker 2: for her life, if Colleen Slimmer, if Christoph Pike didn't 574 00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:51,839 Speaker 2: report how she begged for her life. Christer Pike took 575 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:55,680 Speaker 2: great pains to say that Colleen Slimmer said, look, I 576 00:35:55,719 --> 00:35:57,799 Speaker 2: won't tell anybody what you've done. Just let me go 577 00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:02,360 Speaker 2: why she's kicking colleing. Christo Pike told Colleen stop talking 578 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:04,759 Speaker 2: to me, shut up, and she said the reason she 579 00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:06,920 Speaker 2: told her to shut it's too hard to hurt somebody 580 00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:07,799 Speaker 2: when they're talking to you. 581 00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:11,680 Speaker 1: Yeah. I think that that's another factor that enters into this, 582 00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:14,279 Speaker 1: because you've got an individual that at that point in 583 00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:17,879 Speaker 1: time she was incapable of mercy even though it's being 584 00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:21,760 Speaker 1: asked of her. And that goes again to this idea. Okay, 585 00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:26,640 Speaker 1: well if we if we don't keep you on death row, 586 00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:29,880 Speaker 1: because I can only imagine that that date is approaching 587 00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:33,400 Speaker 1: quicker and quicker and quicker, you logic would dictate that 588 00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:35,960 Speaker 1: it would have to be what are you going to do? 589 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:37,800 Speaker 1: Are you going to turn her out into the general 590 00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:40,880 Speaker 1: population of the prison? I wonder how the other prisoners 591 00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:43,680 Speaker 1: would feel about that having her there, because you're talking 592 00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:47,520 Speaker 1: about somebody that is not capable of displaying mercy, and 593 00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:50,800 Speaker 1: certainly in the instance involving Colleen, that's the case. 594 00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:54,680 Speaker 2: You know, even on top of this, Joe, this wasn't 595 00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:57,040 Speaker 2: the only time that she tried to kill somebody. She 596 00:36:57,120 --> 00:36:59,719 Speaker 2: was successful in killing Colleen Slimmer. But you know, after 597 00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:02,560 Speaker 2: she was in prison, she tried to kill a cell 598 00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:07,960 Speaker 2: mate with a shoestring. They actually charged her with attempted murder. 599 00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:09,360 Speaker 2: Happened in two thousand and one, after she had been 600 00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:13,640 Speaker 2: in prison for five years, she strangled Patricia Jones. Now 601 00:37:13,719 --> 00:37:16,959 Speaker 2: that woman didn't die, but they charged christ the Pike 602 00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:20,120 Speaker 2: with attempted murder and she was convicted of that. So, yeah, 603 00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:23,560 Speaker 2: you want to let that person out that has no 604 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:26,360 Speaker 2: compunction about trying to take the life of somebody. 605 00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:31,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, And I can't imagine that that would make any 606 00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:37,279 Speaker 1: sense whatsoever, you know, I it's it's kind of shocking 607 00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:41,360 Speaker 1: when you think about the idea that, Okay, you've already 608 00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:44,760 Speaker 1: been convicted of arguably one of the most brutal murders 609 00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:48,239 Speaker 1: that has taken place, certainly in Knox County, I would imagine, 610 00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:52,120 Speaker 1: and that was well reported and this sort of thing. 611 00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:56,719 Speaker 1: How's that rehabilitation going. It doesn't sound like it's going 612 00:37:56,800 --> 00:38:00,279 Speaker 1: very well, because five years afterwards you've got her still 613 00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:04,319 Speaker 1: attempting to murder someone that's in close proximity to her, 614 00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:08,359 Speaker 1: So I would be I would be really shocked. And 615 00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:10,479 Speaker 1: from what I understand, David correct me if I'm wrong. 616 00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,640 Speaker 1: The judge denied. They did denied this motion, didn't they. 617 00:38:13,760 --> 00:38:17,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, he a Knox County judge rejected the bid to vacate, 618 00:38:17,680 --> 00:38:20,040 Speaker 2: which is the death sentence of Krista Pike. So yeah, 619 00:38:20,080 --> 00:38:23,239 Speaker 2: she's still on death row. They have not. I was 620 00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:25,040 Speaker 2: looking it up to make sure they have not set 621 00:38:25,120 --> 00:38:27,880 Speaker 2: a death date yet. That's something that goes through a 622 00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:30,440 Speaker 2: different process. But they had to get through this last 623 00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:33,759 Speaker 2: part of it, which they said, no, you know, you 624 00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:35,960 Speaker 2: were eighteen, you were in an Adulton, Tennessee at the time 625 00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:38,200 Speaker 2: when it happened. And their argument, of course, was that 626 00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:41,279 Speaker 2: her boyfriend was seventeen at the time and he was 627 00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,960 Speaker 2: given life without you know, he wasn't given a death 628 00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:46,839 Speaker 2: sentence and she was. I can tell you is that 629 00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:50,799 Speaker 2: I felt differently when we started this case than when 630 00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:52,960 Speaker 2: after I read her a statement, having read a lot 631 00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:56,200 Speaker 2: of admitted you know statements where people admit things yes, 632 00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:59,719 Speaker 2: and knowing that they're going to discount their own interaction, 633 00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:02,279 Speaker 2: gonna you know, make it lick like less bad for 634 00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:07,640 Speaker 2: themselves and if that's her less bad version of what happened, Yeah, 635 00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:09,759 Speaker 2: I'm horrified. I wouldn't want to even be in the 636 00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:10,799 Speaker 2: prison with her now. 637 00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:15,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, because the further you read you realize that it 638 00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:22,640 Speaker 1: gets darker and darker and darker. And for Colleen, for Colleen, 639 00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:28,480 Speaker 1: she met her end at the hands of the sadistic woman. 640 00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:33,920 Speaker 1: I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is body Bags.