WEBVTT - SYMHC Classics: Preliminary Emancipation Proclamation

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<v Speaker 1>Happy Saturday. Recently, in our episode on Susie King Taylor,

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<v Speaker 1>we talked about her account of celebrating the Emancipation Proclamation

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<v Speaker 1>with a barbecue. Originally, that section of the episode also

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<v Speaker 1>had a discussion of the Preliminary Emancipation Proclamation, which basically

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<v Speaker 1>gave the rebelling slave states a deadline to stop fighting

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<v Speaker 1>and rejoin the Union, otherwise all enslaved people in those

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<v Speaker 1>states would be free. Taylor was a laundress for the

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<v Speaker 1>first South Carolina Volunteers, which were officially mustered in on

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<v Speaker 1>November seventh, eighteen sixty two, in the window between when

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<v Speaker 1>Lincoln issued the Preliminary Emancipation Proclamation and when the Emancipation

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<v Speaker 1>Proclamation went into effect. Yeah, she did a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>things besides being a laundress, but that's how she was

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<v Speaker 1>enrolled in the volunteers. So that part of the episode

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<v Speaker 1>I cut that out. It wound up feeling kind of

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<v Speaker 1>like a digression. But we do have a whole episode

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<v Speaker 1>on the Preliminary Emancipation Proclamation and the political strategy behind

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<v Speaker 1>it and its impact on a civil war. This was

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<v Speaker 1>an interview with doctor John B. King, Junior, who at

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<v Speaker 1>the time was the Secretary of Education under President Barack Obama.

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<v Speaker 1>Today he is Chancellor of the State University of New York.

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<v Speaker 1>This originally came out on August thirty first, twenty sixteen.

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<v Speaker 1>Enjoy Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a

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<v Speaker 1>production of iHeartRadio. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>Tracy B. Wilson and I'm Holly Frye. We have an

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<v Speaker 1>interview today. Yeah, that you did, I did, I did

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<v Speaker 1>do it. We haven't had an interview in a while,

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<v Speaker 1>that's correct. Today we are talking to the Secretary of Education,

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<v Speaker 1>John B. King, Junior and Secretary King joined the United

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<v Speaker 1>States Department of Education as a principal senior Advisor in

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<v Speaker 1>twenty fifteen, and before that he was the commission of

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<v Speaker 1>Education for the State of New York. But his career

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<v Speaker 1>really began as an educator. He taught social studies in

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<v Speaker 1>San Juan, Puerto Rico, and Boston, Massachusetts. And then earlier

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<v Speaker 1>this year, we got an email from the Department of

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<v Speaker 1>Education asking whether we might like to have him on

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<v Speaker 1>the show. I just I'm gonna go ahead and thank

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<v Speaker 1>the Department of Education for asking that, because this turned

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<v Speaker 1>out to be quite lovely, because the answer was immediately

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<v Speaker 1>uh huh, yes, yes, yes, so I was yes, But

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<v Speaker 1>then it was also okay, how would that work because

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<v Speaker 1>we're not really, you know, an education policy podcast, and

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<v Speaker 1>that that wouldn't really be what our listeners would be

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<v Speaker 1>up for. So what we did was we quickly decided

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<v Speaker 1>on a topic that at that point was completely new

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<v Speaker 1>to me and I think also to Holly. It was

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<v Speaker 1>the preliminary Emancipation Proclamation. I had never heard of this before.

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<v Speaker 1>It was never mentioned in any of my history classes.

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<v Speaker 1>It also didn't come up in any of our many

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<v Speaker 1>previous episodes about slavery, the Civil War and reconstruction, of

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<v Speaker 1>which we have a lot until our recent episode on

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<v Speaker 1>contraband camps that Holly researched, that actually was researched after

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<v Speaker 1>this whole interview was scheduled, Yes, but hadn't happened yet.

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<v Speaker 1>It hadn't happened yet. And I think part of it

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<v Speaker 1>is that this particular document gets amassed into like a big,

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<v Speaker 1>kind of glossed over thing of well, there was a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of back and forth leading up to the Emancipation Proclamation,

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<v Speaker 1>and it kind of gets lumped in and it doesn't

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<v Speaker 1>get a moment to stand on its own and be examined. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>the Emancipation Proclamation, the final one, issued by Abraham Lincoln

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<v Speaker 1>on January first of eighteen sixty three, is of course

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<v Speaker 1>way more familiar to most people. That's the one that

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<v Speaker 1>declared that people enslaved in states that were rebelling against

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<v Speaker 1>the Union quote are and henceforward shall be free. That

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<v Speaker 1>January first Emancipation Proclamation did not immediately free everyone who

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<v Speaker 1>was enslaved in the United States. It only applied to

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<v Speaker 1>the Confederate states that were in rebellion, but it did

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<v Speaker 1>just set the stage for the eventual abolition of slavery

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<v Speaker 1>in the entire United States. Another date that comes up

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<v Speaker 1>pretty regularly is June teenth, which is June nineteenth of

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<v Speaker 1>eighteen sixty five, which is when the people of Galveston,

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<v Speaker 1>Texas finally got the news the Emancipation Proclamation had happened.

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<v Speaker 1>At that point, the war had also ended, so a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of times that comes up as like the like

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<v Speaker 1>the last holdout of chattel slavery in the United States.

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<v Speaker 1>Slavery was formally abolished nationwide with the adoption of the

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<v Speaker 1>Thirteenth Amendment on December eighteenth of eighteen sixty five. So

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<v Speaker 1>what we're talking about today is all stuff from way

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<v Speaker 1>before that. The preliminary Emancipation Proclamation was basically a one

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<v Speaker 1>hundred day warning of the proclamation that was to come

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<v Speaker 1>that following January. The document itself is one of Secretary

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<v Speaker 1>King's particular interests, and while he was Commissioner of Education

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<v Speaker 1>in New York, he took the document itself on a

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<v Speaker 1>seven city tour as part of an exhibition called First

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<v Speaker 1>Step to Freedom. The exhibition started out at the Schomberg

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<v Speaker 1>Center for Research in Black Culture in New York City

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<v Speaker 1>and from there, as we said, it toured to seven

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<v Speaker 1>other cities. Secretary King also co authored the text that

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<v Speaker 1>went along with that exhibition, and the first part of

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<v Speaker 1>our interview with him, we are going to talk about

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<v Speaker 1>why Lincoln decided to basically warn the rebelling states of

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<v Speaker 1>what was coming, and how that document fit into the

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<v Speaker 1>arc of how the Civil War progressed from originally from

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<v Speaker 1>the Union point of view being more about retaining the Union,

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<v Speaker 1>to eventually from the Union point of view being about

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<v Speaker 1>abolishing slavery. So joining us today is Secretary of Education

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<v Speaker 1>John B. King Junior. Thank you so much for being

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<v Speaker 1>on the show today. Happy to do it. So I

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<v Speaker 1>have heard from so many folks on your staff that

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<v Speaker 1>one of your passions is the preliminary Emancipation Proclamation. And

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<v Speaker 1>so on September twenty second, eighteen sixty two, which was

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<v Speaker 1>one hundred days before he issued the Emancipation Proclamation, President

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<v Speaker 1>Abraham Lincoln issued this preliminary Proclamation that said, among other things,

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<v Speaker 1>that if the rebelling States did not return to the Union,

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<v Speaker 1>their enslaved populations would be forever freed. So what led

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<v Speaker 1>to President Lincoln basically warning the rebelling states that this

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<v Speaker 1>was going to happen. Well, so you know, in many

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<v Speaker 1>ways it was for Lincoln a manner of political strategy

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<v Speaker 1>right to build public will around the Emancipation Proclamation. He

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<v Speaker 1>wanted to both convey that the South had had an

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<v Speaker 1>opportunity to return to the Union and also build public

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<v Speaker 1>understanding that this was essential step in order to successfully

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<v Speaker 1>prosecute the Civil War. And interestingly, he sort of timed

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<v Speaker 1>issuing the Preliminary Emancipation Proclamation for a moment when the

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<v Speaker 1>North was doing better in the Civil War. So the

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<v Speaker 1>date that it was issued is actually bound up with

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<v Speaker 1>the Battle at Antietam, and it was the success there

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<v Speaker 1>that allowed him to issue it because he had been

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<v Speaker 1>warned by Secretary Seward back in July that if he

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<v Speaker 1>issued the preliminary emancipation Proclamation at a low moment in

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<v Speaker 1>the conflict, it would seem like desperation, but if he

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<v Speaker 1>did it after a victory, it would seem like a

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<v Speaker 1>more confident maneuver done to give it South a chance

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<v Speaker 1>to return to the Union on the right terms, or

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<v Speaker 1>to move forward to finish the war. Was there any

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<v Speaker 1>chance at all that the rebelling states were going to

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<v Speaker 1>rejoin the Union after this essentially threat. No. I think

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<v Speaker 1>this really was Lincoln, as master politician, figuring out what

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<v Speaker 1>it would take to build public will. He also wanted

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<v Speaker 1>realized the historical importance of the Emancipation Proclamation, that in

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<v Speaker 1>many ways it was fulfillment of the promise of the

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<v Speaker 1>Declaration of Independence, critical defining moment for the country, And

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<v Speaker 1>I think wanted to have the Emancipation Proclamation have the

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<v Speaker 1>strongest possible foundation because he recognized its importance. So part

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<v Speaker 1>of this was, as you said, laying this legal groundwork

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<v Speaker 1>for future emancipation. So what would have happened if these

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<v Speaker 1>states had rejoined the Union in an effort to not

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<v Speaker 1>have their slaves emancipated well. Interestingly, in the preliminary Emancipation Proclamation,

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<v Speaker 1>there's language around the possibility that there would be some

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<v Speaker 1>sort of financial renumeration for the owners of slaves if

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<v Speaker 1>the slave states returned. That language does not appear in

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<v Speaker 1>the in the January eighteen sixty three Amancipatient Proclamation. And

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<v Speaker 1>so Lincoln had a vision that least in theory, that

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<v Speaker 1>the institution of slavery could have been on a kind

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<v Speaker 1>of a path to disappearance, eliminated in the territories, sort

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<v Speaker 1>of phased out in the states that had slavery in place.

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<v Speaker 1>But I think ultimately Lincoln understood that this was a

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<v Speaker 1>step that would ultimately change the nature of the war

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<v Speaker 1>and make the war fundamentally not just about protecting the Union,

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<v Speaker 1>but about ending the institution of slavery. Oh and that

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<v Speaker 1>really leads really well into my next question, which is,

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<v Speaker 1>at the start of the war, several slave states had

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<v Speaker 1>basically promised that they would secede if Lincoln was elected,

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<v Speaker 1>And so then he was elected and they did secede.

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<v Speaker 1>But from Lincoln's point of view, the war at the

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<v Speaker 1>beginning was not really so much about slavery as it

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<v Speaker 1>was about preserving the Union, and it was like the

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<v Speaker 1>focus gradually became it came around to the abolition of

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<v Speaker 1>slavery as the war progressed. So where does the preliminary

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<v Speaker 1>Emancipation Proclamation fit into this arc of moving from it

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<v Speaker 1>being about preserving the Union to also being about ending

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<v Speaker 1>the institution of slavery. You know, it's an interesting question,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm one that really the scholars of Lincoln have debated.

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<v Speaker 1>So there's one view that is that Lincoln all ways

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<v Speaker 1>intended to make progress towards the eventual abolition of slavery,

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<v Speaker 1>but was a savvy and thoughtful politician understood that the

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<v Speaker 1>first step was to not have slavery expand into the

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<v Speaker 1>into the territories. As the war began, saw the opportunity

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<v Speaker 1>to move towards emancipation, and pursued the preliminary Emancipation Proclamation

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<v Speaker 1>and the Emancipation Proclamation as as a tactic to satisfy

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<v Speaker 1>his ultimate goal of the elimination of slavery. So that's

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<v Speaker 1>one view. Another view is that Lincoln was most focused

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<v Speaker 1>always on preservation of the Union and would have chosen

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<v Speaker 1>that above all else. And you know, there's of course

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<v Speaker 1>the you know, the famous language from Lincoln where he

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<v Speaker 1>tries to make that make the point that he would

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<v Speaker 1>preserve the Union above all else, whether that was with

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<v Speaker 1>or without the institution of slavery. So one view is

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<v Speaker 1>that that was a genuine articulation of his view, and

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<v Speaker 1>another view would be that it was a political strategy

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<v Speaker 1>and that he realized he had to build public will

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<v Speaker 1>over time. And you know, and some of Lincoln's writing,

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<v Speaker 1>you hear him talking about the idea that public will

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<v Speaker 1>is essential to accomplishing things that are hard, and that

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<v Speaker 1>you need to bring the public along with you. So

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<v Speaker 1>I love his idea of the president needing to bring

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<v Speaker 1>the public along with him as he and the nation

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<v Speaker 1>were gradually moving toward abolishing slavery. That idea has been

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<v Speaker 1>present and so so many social changes we have talked

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<v Speaker 1>about on the show before, Like we've talked about some

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<v Speaker 1>really difficult times in the United States where a change

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<v Speaker 1>needed to be made and it took a while to

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<v Speaker 1>bring the people along to be more on board with

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<v Speaker 1>the change. So it's really interesting to talk about this

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<v Speaker 1>document as one piece of a more gradual attempt to

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<v Speaker 1>change the public view to the idea that abolishing slavery

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<v Speaker 1>was really something that needed to happen entirely it is. It's, uh,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, we often think about this period, I think,

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<v Speaker 1>particularly in history in a way where it gets taught

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<v Speaker 1>in a very black and white way. And I don't

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<v Speaker 1>mean that to be punny, but it's like this happened,

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<v Speaker 1>and then everybody got it, and then this happened and

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<v Speaker 1>everybody and it's like no, no, no, no no, no. It

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<v Speaker 1>was a slope for like, none of these steps were immediate.

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<v Speaker 1>They were not you know, like a door opening or closing.

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<v Speaker 1>It was all like gradual. You really had to like

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<v Speaker 1>coax it through its processes. So then continue the coaxing

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<v Speaker 1>for more than a century afterwards. So we were going

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<v Speaker 1>to take a brief break for a word from a

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<v Speaker 1>sponsor before we get back to talking to Secretary King.

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<v Speaker 1>So next up in Tracy's talk with Secretary King, they're

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<v Speaker 1>going to talk about the language of the document, which

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<v Speaker 1>is a lot more formal and legal than the Lincoln

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<v Speaker 1>era documents that a lot of US school kids wind

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<v Speaker 1>up memorizing four class It does not at all sound

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<v Speaker 1>like four score and seven years ago, not remotely. So

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<v Speaker 1>one of the things that I think a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>people remember most about Lincoln from their just regular history

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<v Speaker 1>classes is the get the Gettysburg address, And that is

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<v Speaker 1>an address that you would probably describe as being beautifully written.

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<v Speaker 1>It has this almost poetic, flowing language, and this document

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<v Speaker 1>does not really have that. It is a lot more

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<v Speaker 1>formal and egal in its tone. Can you talk about

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<v Speaker 1>that difference a little bit? Sure? Well, you know, Lincoln

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<v Speaker 1>was a lawyer, and he thought about this as a

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<v Speaker 1>as a legal action that would need to be legally defensible,

0:15:15.280 --> 0:15:21.960
<v Speaker 1>and view the emancipation Proclamation as exercise of the sort

0:15:21.960 --> 0:15:26.440
<v Speaker 1>of presidential war powers. And so the document is in

0:15:26.760 --> 0:15:32.840
<v Speaker 1>very legalistic prose and intentionally so. And he took great

0:15:32.880 --> 0:15:37.920
<v Speaker 1>care and personally authoring the document and the version of

0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:45.200
<v Speaker 1>the primary Emancipation Proclamation that the New York State Library has,

0:15:46.120 --> 0:15:51.040
<v Speaker 1>the original in Lincoln's own hand, even has cut and

0:15:51.040 --> 0:15:56.160
<v Speaker 1>pasted sections from the confiscation Acts where you can see

0:15:56.160 --> 0:15:59.680
<v Speaker 1>that he literally cut them out and pasted them. And

0:15:59.680 --> 0:16:03.440
<v Speaker 1>there's even that spot where you can see Lincoln's thumb

0:16:03.480 --> 0:16:08.640
<v Speaker 1>print in glue um on the document as he cut

0:16:08.680 --> 0:16:11.120
<v Speaker 1>and pasted into it. So this was this was for

0:16:11.240 --> 0:16:14.720
<v Speaker 1>Lincoln a very careful step, and it's it's you know,

0:16:14.760 --> 0:16:16.680
<v Speaker 1>I think one of the powerful things as a teacher

0:16:17.320 --> 0:16:22.200
<v Speaker 1>UM as you're teaching these documents is to see the

0:16:22.200 --> 0:16:26.800
<v Speaker 1>complexity of the role of historic figures. You know that

0:16:26.880 --> 0:16:34.680
<v Speaker 1>Lincoln was president making political judgments, thinking about um his legacy,

0:16:34.840 --> 0:16:39.360
<v Speaker 1>thinking about the importance of these events in the grand

0:16:39.480 --> 0:16:44.120
<v Speaker 1>sweep of history, their significance for the country. He wanted

0:16:44.160 --> 0:16:48.920
<v Speaker 1>to make sure that that emancipation succeeded. He wanted to

0:16:48.920 --> 0:16:52.480
<v Speaker 1>make sure he built public support, that he had a

0:16:52.520 --> 0:16:57.840
<v Speaker 1>strong legal position, and that he could navigate to emancipation

0:16:59.280 --> 0:17:03.360
<v Speaker 1>while preserving the role of the border states that were

0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:06.080
<v Speaker 1>members of the Union. So this is all very very

0:17:06.119 --> 0:17:10.760
<v Speaker 1>carefully executed by Lincoln. The first time that I actually

0:17:10.840 --> 0:17:13.800
<v Speaker 1>read this, it was a transcript of the document because

0:17:13.800 --> 0:17:17.320
<v Speaker 1>I have a very hard time with historical handwriting, and

0:17:17.480 --> 0:17:20.919
<v Speaker 1>I didn't realize until much later that those sections of

0:17:20.960 --> 0:17:24.439
<v Speaker 1>the previous acts were literally cut out and pasted to

0:17:24.480 --> 0:17:27.040
<v Speaker 1>the document. And that quickly became one of my favorite

0:17:27.040 --> 0:17:30.239
<v Speaker 1>things about it, was that he cut it out and

0:17:30.280 --> 0:17:32.399
<v Speaker 1>pasted it on there so it would be exactly the

0:17:32.480 --> 0:17:35.400
<v Speaker 1>word for word, and then also not have to rewrite

0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:40.160
<v Speaker 1>the whole thing yeah, yeah, old fashioned before before long

0:17:40.240 --> 0:17:46.000
<v Speaker 1>before the cutting and pasting of Microsoft word. Yea, So

0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:49.399
<v Speaker 1>there is there's one copy of this document that's in

0:17:49.440 --> 0:17:53.919
<v Speaker 1>the president's own handwriting. What happened to that physical copy

0:17:54.520 --> 0:17:59.080
<v Speaker 1>once he signed it? Well, so you know. Later the

0:18:00.440 --> 0:18:05.280
<v Speaker 1>document was donated to a commission that was set up

0:18:05.359 --> 0:18:09.080
<v Speaker 1>for the care of soldiers, of medical care of soldiers,

0:18:09.760 --> 0:18:17.159
<v Speaker 1>and that commission then held a auction and an abolitionist

0:18:17.280 --> 0:18:20.159
<v Speaker 1>won the documented an auction. He bought a lot of

0:18:20.200 --> 0:18:24.320
<v Speaker 1>tickets in the auction or raffle, and then the New

0:18:24.400 --> 0:18:29.720
<v Speaker 1>York State Legislature allocated funding to buy the document from him,

0:18:30.320 --> 0:18:32.480
<v Speaker 1>and that's how it came to be in the possession

0:18:32.480 --> 0:18:36.720
<v Speaker 1>of New York State. And New York State has periodically

0:18:37.119 --> 0:18:39.680
<v Speaker 1>shared the document with the public. And when I was

0:18:39.720 --> 0:18:41.840
<v Speaker 1>State Commissioner in New York, I was privileged to be

0:18:41.880 --> 0:18:44.680
<v Speaker 1>a part of an effort where we developed an exhibit

0:18:44.760 --> 0:18:48.840
<v Speaker 1>with the Pulmonary Mancipation Proclamation and also a speech that

0:18:49.720 --> 0:18:53.320
<v Speaker 1>doctor King gave on the hundredth anniversary of the Pulmonary

0:18:53.400 --> 0:18:57.760
<v Speaker 1>Mancipation Proclamation, And we built an exhibit for kids with

0:18:57.800 --> 0:19:01.440
<v Speaker 1>the two documents and took it all around the state

0:19:01.480 --> 0:19:03.240
<v Speaker 1>and it was during the time that the Lincoln movie

0:19:03.320 --> 0:19:05.560
<v Speaker 1>was coming out, and there was a lot of interest

0:19:05.960 --> 0:19:12.960
<v Speaker 1>when we had thousands of people and thousands of students

0:19:13.720 --> 0:19:16.800
<v Speaker 1>from schools all over the state come to see this

0:19:16.920 --> 0:19:18.840
<v Speaker 1>exhibit and come to see the document, and you can

0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:26.480
<v Speaker 1>really see people's appreciation for Lincoln in their enthusiasm just

0:19:26.680 --> 0:19:30.480
<v Speaker 1>to stand in the same space as this document. So,

0:19:30.600 --> 0:19:32.879
<v Speaker 1>I don't know if this is the case now. And

0:19:33.280 --> 0:19:37.160
<v Speaker 1>when I was studying, you know, k through twelve American history,

0:19:37.240 --> 0:19:42.120
<v Speaker 1>this was in the late nineteen eighties, early nineteen nineties,

0:19:42.320 --> 0:19:45.960
<v Speaker 1>and this whole idea that there was a preliminary Emancipation

0:19:46.040 --> 0:19:50.000
<v Speaker 1>Proclamation and that there was a process of setting legal

0:19:50.040 --> 0:19:54.280
<v Speaker 1>foundations in order to abolish the institution of slavery, that

0:19:54.400 --> 0:19:58.439
<v Speaker 1>was skipped completely over and it seemed more like the

0:19:58.520 --> 0:20:03.359
<v Speaker 1>Emancipation Proclamation and just kind of appeared out of whole cloth,

0:20:03.560 --> 0:20:06.880
<v Speaker 1>and then the slaves were free, and that's it's that's

0:20:06.920 --> 0:20:10.480
<v Speaker 1>not at all what happened. Why do you think so

0:20:10.600 --> 0:20:14.840
<v Speaker 1>much of that process is omitted from so many history

0:20:14.960 --> 0:20:19.320
<v Speaker 1>lessons about the Civil War and the abolition of slavery. Well,

0:20:19.359 --> 0:20:23.480
<v Speaker 1>you know, I thinks as a country, you know, we

0:20:23.560 --> 0:20:28.640
<v Speaker 1>so celebrate Lincoln's legacy and the notion of Lincoln as

0:20:28.720 --> 0:20:35.119
<v Speaker 1>the emancipator, which is true and right, but there's also

0:20:35.760 --> 0:20:39.240
<v Speaker 1>nuance behind that. And you know, one of the things

0:20:39.240 --> 0:20:41.720
<v Speaker 1>I tried to do when I taught in high school

0:20:41.760 --> 0:20:46.000
<v Speaker 1>history and also high school Civics was to China have

0:20:46.119 --> 0:20:51.800
<v Speaker 1>students get a sense of the complexity of politics throughout

0:20:51.840 --> 0:20:53.360
<v Speaker 1>our history. You know, It's one of the great things

0:20:53.400 --> 0:20:56.920
<v Speaker 1>about the Hamilton Musical is I think it's given a

0:20:57.000 --> 0:21:03.680
<v Speaker 1>generation of Americans a better under standing that these figures

0:21:03.680 --> 0:21:08.080
<v Speaker 1>in history aren't just two dimensional characters that a pr

0:21:08.119 --> 0:21:14.320
<v Speaker 1>and our currency. That they're complicated people operating in complicated times,

0:21:14.440 --> 0:21:22.359
<v Speaker 1>making political judgments, making very strategic decisions. And you know,

0:21:22.560 --> 0:21:26.960
<v Speaker 1>from my perspective, it makes Abraham Lincoln even more heroic

0:21:27.480 --> 0:21:30.520
<v Speaker 1>because you understand that that that he had to have

0:21:31.640 --> 0:21:38.080
<v Speaker 1>carefully plotted legal strategy, a carefully plotted political strategy to

0:21:38.240 --> 0:21:45.359
<v Speaker 1>accomplish emancipatient and ultimately to win the Civil War. It's

0:21:45.400 --> 0:21:48.600
<v Speaker 1>one of the nice things about some of the recent

0:21:50.480 --> 0:21:55.720
<v Speaker 1>books and study on Lyndon Johnson and the path to

0:21:56.640 --> 0:22:00.960
<v Speaker 1>the Civil Rights Act and the Voting Rights Act. Yeah,

0:22:01.160 --> 0:22:08.919
<v Speaker 1>these important achievements are the product not of a sudden inspiration,

0:22:09.480 --> 0:22:17.640
<v Speaker 1>but rather careful execution by very capable politicians. And sometimes

0:22:17.720 --> 0:22:20.679
<v Speaker 1>the word politician is put in a negative light, but

0:22:21.119 --> 0:22:31.720
<v Speaker 1>Abraham Lincoln was a very very capable politician. So before

0:22:31.720 --> 0:22:33.360
<v Speaker 1>we get to the end of our interview, we're going

0:22:33.400 --> 0:22:36.080
<v Speaker 1>to stop for one more brief word from a sponsor,

0:22:36.560 --> 0:22:39.200
<v Speaker 1>and after we hear from that sponsor, we are going

0:22:39.240 --> 0:22:43.280
<v Speaker 1>to talk about why this particular document is so personally

0:22:43.320 --> 0:22:57.359
<v Speaker 1>important to Secretary King. Okay, so let's get to the

0:22:57.440 --> 0:22:59.520
<v Speaker 1>end of the interview. Secretary King is going to talk

0:22:59.520 --> 0:23:03.520
<v Speaker 1>about the documents personal importance to him and as also

0:23:03.600 --> 0:23:06.400
<v Speaker 1>how it fits into the greater arc of progress toward

0:23:06.560 --> 0:23:16.280
<v Speaker 1>racial equality in the United States. So every person I

0:23:16.320 --> 0:23:19.680
<v Speaker 1>spoke with while arranging this interview with you talked about

0:23:19.720 --> 0:23:24.320
<v Speaker 1>this document being really important to you. So what does

0:23:24.359 --> 0:23:27.399
<v Speaker 1>this document specifically mean to you? And why why is

0:23:27.400 --> 0:23:31.399
<v Speaker 1>it the preliminary Emancipation Proclamation in particular that has so

0:23:31.680 --> 0:23:35.119
<v Speaker 1>captivated you. You know, I think for me, it's a

0:23:35.240 --> 0:23:42.240
<v Speaker 1>reflection of um both the ways in which United States

0:23:42.359 --> 0:23:47.320
<v Speaker 1>has fallen short of the founding values. You know that

0:23:47.520 --> 0:23:52.119
<v Speaker 1>that we have to acknowledge that the United States began

0:23:54.119 --> 0:23:57.760
<v Speaker 1>very much with the institution of slavery as fundamental to

0:23:58.920 --> 0:24:02.960
<v Speaker 1>how the country works. And there was a real tension

0:24:03.119 --> 0:24:06.720
<v Speaker 1>between the institution of slavery and the promise of the

0:24:06.800 --> 0:24:12.000
<v Speaker 1>Declaration of Independence and then and the notion, the notion

0:24:12.040 --> 0:24:15.280
<v Speaker 1>that all men aren't created equal, and so there was

0:24:15.320 --> 0:24:21.399
<v Speaker 1>this gap, and we all as Americans need to appreciate

0:24:21.480 --> 0:24:26.440
<v Speaker 1>that complexity of our history around issues of race. At

0:24:26.440 --> 0:24:31.800
<v Speaker 1>the same time, the document also illustrates and something the

0:24:31.800 --> 0:24:35.840
<v Speaker 1>President often talks about, that the trajectory of America is

0:24:35.960 --> 0:24:43.920
<v Speaker 1>towards greater equality, greater opportunity over time. And so this period,

0:24:44.320 --> 0:24:48.800
<v Speaker 1>the Civil War and reconstruction are really a second birth

0:24:49.280 --> 0:24:52.440
<v Speaker 1>of the United States. You know, when you look at

0:24:52.480 --> 0:24:56.120
<v Speaker 1>the thirteenth fourteen, fifteenth Amendments, which were really products of

0:24:56.160 --> 0:25:03.119
<v Speaker 1>the Civil War and reconstruction, they expanded the definition of

0:25:03.680 --> 0:25:08.360
<v Speaker 1>American equality and American democracy, and this document was very

0:25:08.400 --> 0:25:11.080
<v Speaker 1>much a part of that journey. And then the last

0:25:11.119 --> 0:25:17.280
<v Speaker 1>pieces this document is also about the complexity of government,

0:25:17.400 --> 0:25:24.199
<v Speaker 1>the importance of leaders figuring out how to bring the

0:25:24.280 --> 0:25:28.920
<v Speaker 1>public along on things that are hard, the importance of

0:25:30.400 --> 0:25:33.919
<v Speaker 1>leaders having a good political strategy, a good legal strategy,

0:25:35.440 --> 0:25:42.560
<v Speaker 1>as well as moral higher purpose, and Lincoln really combined

0:25:43.440 --> 0:25:46.280
<v Speaker 1>all of those things, and you see that very much

0:25:46.400 --> 0:25:51.679
<v Speaker 1>in this document and the eventual January Emancipation Proclamation January

0:25:51.680 --> 0:25:54.720
<v Speaker 1>eighteen sixty three. So is there anything else about this

0:25:54.840 --> 0:25:58.720
<v Speaker 1>document or its history that you really think that listeners

0:25:58.760 --> 0:26:04.040
<v Speaker 1>to our show should know? You know, the one thing

0:26:04.040 --> 0:26:06.560
<v Speaker 1>I would say is, just speaking as a teacher, I

0:26:06.640 --> 0:26:09.840
<v Speaker 1>just think there's so much power in students engaging with

0:26:10.119 --> 0:26:15.560
<v Speaker 1>primary source documents. And it's one thing to read, you know,

0:26:15.600 --> 0:26:18.480
<v Speaker 1>a textbook and what the textbook might say, but it's

0:26:18.480 --> 0:26:25.160
<v Speaker 1>another to delve into a historical document and really appreciate

0:26:26.920 --> 0:26:29.639
<v Speaker 1>what the author was trying to accomplish, the choices the

0:26:29.720 --> 0:26:36.440
<v Speaker 1>author made. You can imagine a powerful unit comprised of

0:26:37.040 --> 0:26:43.520
<v Speaker 1>this preliminary Emancipation Proclamation, the Mancipation Proclamation of January eighteen

0:26:43.640 --> 0:26:49.920
<v Speaker 1>sixty three, the Gettysburg Address, the Second Inaugural Address, the thirteenth, fourteen,

0:26:49.960 --> 0:26:56.840
<v Speaker 1>fifteenth Amendments. You know, just study through those powerful historical texts,

0:26:57.119 --> 0:27:01.920
<v Speaker 1>and it can be a way to inspire students both

0:27:02.000 --> 0:27:06.639
<v Speaker 1>about literacy and about social studies. It also can be

0:27:06.680 --> 0:27:12.360
<v Speaker 1>a way to help students see the nuances in our history.

0:27:14.720 --> 0:27:17.680
<v Speaker 1>Thank you so much for taking the time to speak

0:27:17.720 --> 0:27:20.080
<v Speaker 1>with us today. Was a pleasure to have you on

0:27:20.119 --> 0:27:22.639
<v Speaker 1>the show. Thanks, it's fun to talk with you, and

0:27:22.720 --> 0:27:26.399
<v Speaker 1>thanks for what you do making sure folks are learning

0:27:26.440 --> 0:27:33.959
<v Speaker 1>about our history. Thanks so much for joining us on

0:27:34.000 --> 0:27:36.879
<v Speaker 1>this Saturday. Since this episode is out of the archive,

0:27:36.960 --> 0:27:39.240
<v Speaker 1>if you heard an email address or a Facebook RL

0:27:39.359 --> 0:27:41.680
<v Speaker 1>or something similar over the course of the show, that

0:27:41.880 --> 0:27:45.840
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0:27:45.960 --> 0:27:50.640
<v Speaker 1>Podcast at iHeartRadio dot com. Our old health stuff works

0:27:50.640 --> 0:27:53.720
<v Speaker 1>email address no longer works, and you can find us

0:27:53.720 --> 0:27:56.960
<v Speaker 1>all over social media at missed in History. And you

0:27:57.000 --> 0:28:00.680
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