WEBVTT - A Guide for Women Entrepreneurs 0:00:02.640 --> 0:00:07.000 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. 0:00:07.400 --> 0:00:11.040 You're listening to Bloomberg BusinessWeek with Karl Messer and Tim 0:00:11.039 --> 0:00:13.200 Stenebek on Bloomberg Radio. 0:00:13.560 --> 0:00:16.560 You may remember back in July, the day that President 0:00:16.640 --> 0:00:18.639 Joe Biden said he would no longer run for president, 0:00:18.720 --> 0:00:21.960 some of America's most prominent black women across politics, business 0:00:21.960 --> 0:00:26.640 and entertainment joined thousands of their peers to galvanize support 0:00:26.880 --> 0:00:29.520 for Vice President Kamala Harris. They raised one point five 0:00:29.560 --> 0:00:32.040 million dollars in just three hours. 0:00:32.120 --> 0:00:32.959 Check this out. 0:00:33.240 --> 0:00:36.479 About forty four thousand black women, including Representative Maxine Waters 0:00:36.479 --> 0:00:41.040 of California. Other lawmakers including Joyce Beatty and Jasmine Crockett, 0:00:41.360 --> 0:00:44.400 talked of rallying behind Harris for the US presidential election 0:00:44.520 --> 0:00:48.680 case against Donald Trump. A president for election against Donald 0:00:48.680 --> 0:00:53.720 Trump this November. It was an incredible outpouring of a 0:00:53.800 --> 0:00:56.480 number of people in a very short period of time. 0:00:56.520 --> 0:00:58.120 I think a lot of people were surprised, but I 0:00:58.120 --> 0:01:01.160 would guess that our next guest is not so surprised. 0:01:01.240 --> 0:01:05.120 Doctor Carrie Mitchell Brown is a cultural architect and equity 0:01:05.200 --> 0:01:08.920 strategy She joins us here in the Bloomberg Interactive Broker's Studio. 0:01:09.160 --> 0:01:11.800 Good to see you, doctor, Thanks for joining us today. 0:01:13.240 --> 0:01:15.679 Before we get to the phenomenon that we see playing 0:01:15.720 --> 0:01:18.319 out across the country and that you've been studying for years, 0:01:19.040 --> 0:01:22.559 talk a little bit about what cultural architect and equity 0:01:22.600 --> 0:01:23.640 strategist means. 0:01:24.240 --> 0:01:26.440 First of all, it is a pleasure being here, Thank 0:01:26.480 --> 0:01:30.679 you so much. A cultural architect and equity strategists, I 0:01:30.760 --> 0:01:33.680 go into organizations and try to make them better right 0:01:34.000 --> 0:01:38.199 looking at their culture. So it's not just about changing 0:01:38.880 --> 0:01:42.880 the people who are sitting at the table. Is changing policies, 0:01:42.920 --> 0:01:46.000 making sure that people feel like they belong, making sure 0:01:46.080 --> 0:01:49.960 that everyone's contributions are valued, regardless as to where they 0:01:50.000 --> 0:01:52.800 work at in the organization, how long that they're being there, 0:01:53.000 --> 0:01:56.480 and more importantly, that there are high levels of respect. 0:01:56.880 --> 0:01:59.560 The reason I brought up what happened on that one 0:01:59.640 --> 0:02:05.280 day in late July that Sunday is because you argue 0:02:05.360 --> 0:02:08.880 that there's this emerging power shift to black women and 0:02:09.120 --> 0:02:11.160 women in general that you've observed. 0:02:11.840 --> 0:02:16.920 Yes, there is, it has been for some time, but 0:02:17.040 --> 0:02:21.760 the world has seen it operationalized. Often in our space 0:02:21.880 --> 0:02:25.200 as equity practitioners, we hear that you have to give 0:02:25.320 --> 0:02:28.520 up something in order for other people to have space 0:02:29.000 --> 0:02:33.919 inclusive leadership looks exactly like what happened there. Joe Biden 0:02:34.240 --> 0:02:38.960 made an assessment that what's required right now he could 0:02:38.960 --> 0:02:43.560 not provide in his leadership. So he transferred his leadership 0:02:43.639 --> 0:02:48.120 to a very capable black woman who has been in 0:02:48.160 --> 0:02:52.080 the trenches and demonstrated that she has a lived experience 0:02:52.440 --> 0:02:55.639 to lead in this moment and beyond and that's what 0:02:55.840 --> 0:03:00.200 is required. And he did that very very well. Were 0:03:00.240 --> 0:03:03.680 people who supported and rallied behind him, but he did 0:03:03.680 --> 0:03:06.760 it very well and it came off. It's very powerful 0:03:06.880 --> 0:03:11.680 and very transformative, and others can take up that practice 0:03:12.760 --> 0:03:17.200 in moving when their leadership no longer meets the moment. 0:03:18.200 --> 0:03:21.760 What is the next phase of this power shift towards women? 0:03:21.840 --> 0:03:26.720 I guess how do we keep this momentum going because 0:03:27.040 --> 0:03:30.519 now we do have, you know, a black woman kind 0:03:30.520 --> 0:03:33.520 of front and center stage. How do we kind of 0:03:33.600 --> 0:03:34.760 keep that continuing. 0:03:35.480 --> 0:03:38.640 Yeah, I mean it is a sign for businesses. It 0:03:38.680 --> 0:03:45.080 does really highlight that equity is necessary in all of 0:03:45.120 --> 0:03:52.040 our institutions and all of our workforces. Katanji Jackson Brown. 0:03:52.160 --> 0:03:54.760 I mean she's at the pinnacle in her career as well. 0:03:54.760 --> 0:03:58.000 We see Justice Supreme Court, Justice absolutely We saw a 0:03:58.040 --> 0:04:03.640 lot of that happening when she was finally confirmed. You 0:04:03.680 --> 0:04:09.920 know as well, it is very very important for these 0:04:10.000 --> 0:04:14.720 leaders to represent our democracy, to represent and reflect what 0:04:14.720 --> 0:04:15.560 our country looks like. 0:04:15.680 --> 0:04:15.840 You know. 0:04:15.880 --> 0:04:18.760 I want to go back to Vice President Kamala Harris 0:04:18.760 --> 0:04:22.960 because one thing that we've seen her do, or one 0:04:23.000 --> 0:04:26.000 thing we've seen her not do, is make her racial 0:04:26.040 --> 0:04:29.440 identity part of her pitch to the American people, which 0:04:29.440 --> 0:04:33.400 I think is really interesting. She's not making that front 0:04:33.440 --> 0:04:38.480 center with the campaign. Certainly former President Trump did that 0:04:39.040 --> 0:04:41.360 about five weeks ago, four or five weeks ago at 0:04:41.360 --> 0:04:44.880 that event in Chicago. But she has not made that 0:04:44.960 --> 0:04:46.560 a big part of her campaign. 0:04:47.279 --> 0:04:48.880 No, she has not made that a big part of 0:04:48.880 --> 0:04:52.640 our campaign. And it's not her only identity either. She's American, 0:04:52.760 --> 0:04:57.800 she's a woman, she is multi racial, and you know 0:04:57.920 --> 0:05:01.200 she is to represent. When she accepted her nomination speech, 0:05:01.240 --> 0:05:05.280 she represents all people and she talked about doing that 0:05:05.600 --> 0:05:09.880 for her entire career of the people, right, and most 0:05:09.960 --> 0:05:15.039 women who lead organizations, who lead corporations, who lead labor unions, 0:05:15.279 --> 0:05:18.040 who lead think tanks, they don't lead as I am 0:05:18.080 --> 0:05:21.560 a black woman president, I'm a black woman leader. We 0:05:21.640 --> 0:05:26.960 have two women currently who are black that lead Fortune 0:05:27.000 --> 0:05:29.479 five hundred companies. They don't lead with I am a 0:05:29.640 --> 0:05:32.239 black woman CEO. No, I am the CEO of the company. 0:05:32.400 --> 0:05:33.320 That's a tiny number. 0:05:33.560 --> 0:05:36.400 It is so tiny, so tiny. 0:05:36.160 --> 0:05:38.080 That is not representative of it is. 0:05:38.000 --> 0:05:41.120 Not representative of the US population at all. There is 0:05:41.200 --> 0:05:43.320 a lot of work that needs to be done there. 0:05:43.440 --> 0:05:48.279 But my example is still the same that they don't 0:05:48.400 --> 0:05:50.840 lead with. I am a black woman leader. I am 0:05:50.880 --> 0:05:54.000 a leader, a proven leader. 0:05:54.400 --> 0:05:58.680 So what groups do you target in your work as 0:05:59.000 --> 0:06:02.839 a cultural architect an equity strategist. Do you kind of 0:06:02.839 --> 0:06:07.039 focus on people early in their careers and advancing them 0:06:07.279 --> 0:06:10.599 or is this more kind of targeting people in the 0:06:10.640 --> 0:06:12.120 mid and more senior levels. 0:06:12.440 --> 0:06:16.800 I really work with organizations who are committed to ensuring 0:06:17.320 --> 0:06:22.320 that they have the right environment for black women to thrive, 0:06:22.360 --> 0:06:25.119 for everyone to thrive, but particularly for black women to thrive. 0:06:25.240 --> 0:06:29.960 So if there is an organization who has an experience 0:06:30.000 --> 0:06:33.719 that they are not able to retain talented black women, 0:06:34.320 --> 0:06:37.600 well we have a conversation to see what's going wrong. 0:06:37.680 --> 0:06:40.040 Because it's not the black women who are leaving who 0:06:40.120 --> 0:06:43.880 are the challenge. What's happening in the environment what's happening 0:06:43.920 --> 0:06:46.080 in the workplace, what's happening in the cultures, the policies 0:06:46.160 --> 0:06:48.920 or practices that create the conditions where black women do 0:06:48.920 --> 0:06:49.799 not want to stay. 0:06:51.320 --> 0:06:53.960 What are the challenges that these leaders are coming to 0:06:54.000 --> 0:06:56.200 you with when they hire you, when they bring you 0:06:56.240 --> 0:06:59.279 in to do this work. What are the problems they're 0:06:59.279 --> 0:07:00.160 trying to solve. 0:07:00.320 --> 0:07:02.520 The problems that they are trying to solve as they're 0:07:02.520 --> 0:07:07.279 trying to operationalize their commitments for racial equity, their commitments 0:07:07.400 --> 0:07:12.880 that they are making for diversity. We all know that 0:07:13.160 --> 0:07:17.800 companies with diverse teams are thirty five percent more productive 0:07:18.120 --> 0:07:23.400 in revenue, in impact in the bottom line overall than 0:07:23.520 --> 0:07:25.880 companies whose teams are not diverse. 0:07:26.600 --> 0:07:30.080 Okay, So I want to bring this up because in 0:07:30.160 --> 0:07:35.720 recent months we've seen Low's, Harley Davidson, Tractor Supply, Dear 0:07:36.280 --> 0:07:40.040 Brown Foreman all come out and say they're pulling back 0:07:40.040 --> 0:07:43.600 from pledges to commit to diversity, equity and inclusion programs. 0:07:43.640 --> 0:07:46.200 There's a real pushback to DEI right now. 0:07:46.320 --> 0:07:48.960 There is a tremendous pushback to d Ee and I 0:07:49.360 --> 0:07:52.640 right now, and one would think where they committed in 0:07:52.720 --> 0:07:56.040 the first place. After George Floyd twenty twenty, there was 0:07:56.120 --> 0:07:58.600 a lot of commitments. No company wanted to be on 0:07:58.680 --> 0:08:01.240 the wrong side of I'm not going to commit to this. 0:08:02.160 --> 0:08:04.440 We saw a lot of companies pulling back with the 0:08:04.480 --> 0:08:10.280 Supreme Court rulings coming out of the Fearless Fund and 0:08:10.360 --> 0:08:14.880 the risk of litigation. We have witnessed some organizations softening 0:08:14.920 --> 0:08:18.160 their language around their commitments on their website, but continuing 0:08:18.200 --> 0:08:23.760 to move forward, you know, with their programming. Changing the 0:08:23.800 --> 0:08:28.680 words and you know, changing the actions. You know, they're 0:08:28.720 --> 0:08:33.320 two separate things. But yeah, I would question we're they 0:08:33.400 --> 0:08:34.839 serious about it in the first place? 0:08:34.960 --> 0:08:38.040 Ten seconds permanent shift? Is this it? Or these companies 0:08:38.040 --> 0:08:39.400 circle back in the coming years. 0:08:40.040 --> 0:08:43.199 They need to circle back. It's at their own peril 0:08:43.200 --> 0:08:43.720 if they don't. 0:08:44.520 --> 0:08:47.320 All right, Doctor Kerry Mitchell Brown, thanks so much for 0:08:47.400 --> 0:08:50.560 joining us. Thank you for Contect and Equity Strategist joining 0:08:50.640 --> 0:08:53.480 us here in the Bloomberg Interactive Brokers studio. 0:08:54.440 --> 0:08:57.559 Well, she's a woman of the world, got you knows it? 0:09:00.480 --> 0:09:03.520 Well, Women in non binary venture investors of Kandy foothold 0:09:03.640 --> 0:09:06.920 in the tech industry five years faster than the advocacy 0:09:06.960 --> 0:09:10.760 group allrais expected. The leaders say, a national backlash to 0:09:11.120 --> 0:09:14.560 DEI initiatives threatens the progress that has been made. Check 0:09:14.559 --> 0:09:17.200 out these numbers, Emily, About eighteen percent of decision makers 0:09:17.200 --> 0:09:20.800 at US adventure capital firms are female. It's double from 0:09:20.840 --> 0:09:23.760 twenty eighteen when all Rais was founded and set a 0:09:23.800 --> 0:09:25.840 goal of reaching that number by twenty twenty eight that's 0:09:25.840 --> 0:09:29.079 according to the group's annual report. It was published just 0:09:29.120 --> 0:09:32.120 a couple of months ago, back in July. Very curious 0:09:32.160 --> 0:09:34.319 what Sarah Dusak has to say about all this. She's 0:09:34.360 --> 0:09:37.959 co founder of Enigma Ventures. She's got a new book 0:09:38.360 --> 0:09:40.920 just out this week. It's called Thinking Bigger. It's a 0:09:40.960 --> 0:09:44.920 pitch deck formula for women who want to change the world. 0:09:45.240 --> 0:09:48.560 Sarah joins us from Cape Town, South Africa. I should 0:09:48.559 --> 0:09:52.240 note she's a founder who founded the company under Canvas, 0:09:52.280 --> 0:09:54.480 which was sold for more than one hundred million dollars, 0:09:54.679 --> 0:09:58.319 and she's also behind the Few and Far collection. Sarah, 0:09:58.400 --> 0:10:00.000 good to have you with us. How are you. 0:10:00.760 --> 0:10:02.400 I'm very well. Thanks for having me. 0:10:02.600 --> 0:10:04.080 You know, it's interesting because we spend a lot of 0:10:04.080 --> 0:10:08.120 time talking about the small portion of VC funding that 0:10:08.520 --> 0:10:11.680 goes to women and how it hasn't improved that much 0:10:11.800 --> 0:10:13.800 in recent years. But we are starting to see, at 0:10:13.880 --> 0:10:16.240 least here in the US. And again important to note 0:10:16.240 --> 0:10:18.440 this is from a US perspective. You're joining us from 0:10:18.640 --> 0:10:22.640 Cape Town. It does seem like at least decision making 0:10:23.080 --> 0:10:27.320 or decision makers have become more representative, at least on 0:10:27.360 --> 0:10:31.640 a gender level here in the US than some organizations 0:10:31.679 --> 0:10:32.160 thought they would. 0:10:32.200 --> 0:10:35.360 What do you make of then, Yeah, I mean, we 0:10:35.440 --> 0:10:39.800 have seen the rise, a large rise of female fund 0:10:39.960 --> 0:10:44.160 managers over the last few years, but still when you 0:10:44.200 --> 0:10:47.480 look at the size of funds that female fund managers 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:51.600 are able to raise, they're still minuscule in comparison with 0:10:52.440 --> 0:10:56.000 many of their male counterparts. And that's still a problem 0:10:56.040 --> 0:10:58.640 because obviously the amount of capital that women can deploy, 0:10:58.720 --> 0:11:03.400 then influence is who is getting that capital, And what 0:11:03.440 --> 0:11:07.280 we know is that still only two percent of female 0:11:07.280 --> 0:11:09.600 founders are getting venture capital in the US. 0:11:10.360 --> 0:11:14.959 What do you make of that divergence? Is there anything 0:11:15.000 --> 0:11:18.600 that kind of explains that really large gap between who 0:11:18.600 --> 0:11:21.640 gets funding and who does it well? 0:11:21.679 --> 0:11:24.800 Bench capital historically has been a big boys club, right, 0:11:24.920 --> 0:11:31.680 so if men are typically doing the investing, then inherently 0:11:32.200 --> 0:11:36.600 we invest in All of us are prone to invest 0:11:36.679 --> 0:11:39.520 in things that we like, things that we can understand 0:11:39.600 --> 0:11:41.400 things that we can connect with. People that we can 0:11:41.440 --> 0:11:44.800 connect with, we're prone to want to invest in people 0:11:44.960 --> 0:11:48.840 like us. And so if only men are doing the investing, 0:11:49.360 --> 0:11:53.200 we're likely to see a lot more men getting investment 0:11:53.240 --> 0:11:58.280 than women. And largely women have been left behind of 0:11:58.320 --> 0:12:02.960 the conversation about what it takes to be investable. And 0:12:03.000 --> 0:12:06.360 if you think historically, you know, it was nineteen eighty 0:12:06.440 --> 0:12:10.199 eight the women could have a bank clone, a business 0:12:10.200 --> 0:12:11.440 bank loan. That's first time. 0:12:11.480 --> 0:12:14.040 Hold on, hold on, that's not long ago. Wait, that's 0:12:14.080 --> 0:12:15.960 that is that in the US? 0:12:17.200 --> 0:12:21.400 Yes, yes, it was nineteen eighty eight when a woman 0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:24.360 could have a bank loan for her business in the 0:12:24.440 --> 0:12:27.920 US that did not have to be countersigned by her 0:12:28.040 --> 0:12:31.440 partner or husband, a male counterpart of some kind. 0:12:31.760 --> 0:12:34.440 Wait, Emily, just go ahead, Emily. 0:12:34.640 --> 0:12:36.199 No, I was just saying, that's really surprised. 0:12:36.200 --> 0:12:38.160 Hoorified as I am. 0:12:38.760 --> 0:12:40.800 We both weren't even alive right too. 0:12:41.520 --> 0:12:42.160 It's rude. 0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:45.440 I was alive then you were in She always tried. 0:12:45.559 --> 0:12:48.520 That's partular history, and that's part of the gap that 0:12:48.559 --> 0:12:51.320 we've got that you know, there's there's it's been more 0:12:51.400 --> 0:12:56.920 challenging for women to grow and scale businesses, and largely 0:12:57.000 --> 0:13:00.000 women have not been in the loop about what investors 0:13:00.400 --> 0:13:03.160 looks like, and that was part of the reason for 0:13:03.200 --> 0:13:08.760 writing the book was to demystify the capital stack, demystify 0:13:08.840 --> 0:13:11.280 what it takes to be investible. Because we also know 0:13:11.440 --> 0:13:16.319 that only two percent of women ever build businesses that 0:13:16.400 --> 0:13:19.600 do more than a million dollars in revenue every year. 0:13:19.880 --> 0:13:21.840 So we've got a chicken and egg scenario there. We 0:13:21.880 --> 0:13:24.960 don't have enough women at the funding table, which we 0:13:25.080 --> 0:13:28.000 know is improving slowly, but the amount of access to 0:13:28.040 --> 0:13:31.320 capital that even those female fund managers have is mini school. 0:13:31.880 --> 0:13:36.800 But we also know that women are not building the 0:13:36.920 --> 0:13:40.880 kind of businesses that could be investible. So but of 0:13:40.920 --> 0:13:44.360 course you need capital to build the kind of business 0:13:44.480 --> 0:13:48.840 that could be investible. So this vicious circle. 0:13:49.840 --> 0:13:53.040 Well, talk about the vicious circle, because in your book, 0:13:53.080 --> 0:13:55.199 you start out the book by writing about what the 0:13:55.520 --> 0:13:57.200 heart of the problem is. 0:13:57.920 --> 0:14:00.199 What is the heart of the problem. 0:14:00.520 --> 0:14:02.880 The heart of the problem is not enough women are 0:14:02.880 --> 0:14:07.920 building big businesses. Not they're not thinking big enough about 0:14:07.920 --> 0:14:11.199 building the kind of businesses that could be investable. And 0:14:11.520 --> 0:14:15.800 we're not understanding what big looks like. And you know 0:14:15.880 --> 0:14:20.120 from from a venture capital perspective. We're talking about one 0:14:20.240 --> 0:14:24.600 hundred million big like you know, that's law for thinking 0:14:24.600 --> 0:14:27.800 about a venture backable business. Could the business that you 0:14:27.840 --> 0:14:31.280 are building one day, not tomorrow, not not five weeks 0:14:31.280 --> 0:14:34.040 from now, but one day potentially be worth one hundred 0:14:34.080 --> 0:14:37.800 million dollars or more. And that's what we've got to 0:14:37.840 --> 0:14:41.240 sort of help women understand what does that look like? 0:14:41.720 --> 0:14:44.240 How could you build a business that has that kind 0:14:44.280 --> 0:14:47.080 of potential and that's not just tech businesses. 0:14:48.240 --> 0:14:50.200 Give us your story from early on in your career 0:14:51.160 --> 0:14:53.520 when it came to your idea with relation to what 0:14:53.560 --> 0:14:54.400 you did in Montana. 0:14:55.680 --> 0:14:59.560 Yeah, my husband and I built a company called under Canvas, 0:14:59.640 --> 0:15:03.480 which today is still the leading and largest glamping company 0:15:03.480 --> 0:15:06.920 in the United States. And we did not build a 0:15:06.920 --> 0:15:10.160 tech company, but we did build a company that became 0:15:10.520 --> 0:15:14.880 worth well over one hundred million dollars. And when I 0:15:15.040 --> 0:15:18.520 started my company, I had no idea what venture capital was. 0:15:19.040 --> 0:15:21.680 I didn't really have a lot of concepts that, you know, 0:15:21.720 --> 0:15:23.520 if you were going to build a business that maybe 0:15:23.560 --> 0:15:26.000 you might need some investment, or that you would need 0:15:26.040 --> 0:15:29.000 investors to come alongside you and build it. And I 0:15:29.120 --> 0:15:35.600 was very green and very not clear about what that 0:15:35.640 --> 0:15:38.480 looked like. But I had a business that had the 0:15:38.520 --> 0:15:42.520 potential to scale, and I could see the reality of 0:15:42.520 --> 0:15:45.400 what we were building and the demand for what we 0:15:45.400 --> 0:15:49.400 were creating was there. But I had to learn the 0:15:49.480 --> 0:15:53.440 hard way about bench capital, raising money, and there were 0:15:53.520 --> 0:15:55.760 so many things I didn't know, and I thought that 0:15:55.880 --> 0:15:59.080 was me. I thought I was the only one who 0:15:59.120 --> 0:16:02.200 didn't know all these things and didn't know the venture 0:16:02.240 --> 0:16:05.040 speak and didn't know all the acronyms and didn't know 0:16:05.080 --> 0:16:10.000 the language. But since becoming a VC myself, I now 0:16:10.040 --> 0:16:13.640 know that most women don't know the language, don't know 0:16:13.760 --> 0:16:17.840 the acronyms, don't know what investible looks like. And so 0:16:17.960 --> 0:16:20.120 that was part of the reason for writing this book 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:22.280 is how do we demystify it, How do we make 0:16:22.320 --> 0:16:25.800 it easier for women to build the kind of businesses 0:16:25.840 --> 0:16:29.160 that are investible, and how do we help women understand 0:16:29.840 --> 0:16:32.040 this is the scale, this is what it takes, this 0:16:32.160 --> 0:16:35.040 is what it looks like. Because if you know what 0:16:35.080 --> 0:16:38.840 the exam questions are, you have a much better chance 0:16:38.920 --> 0:16:39.840 of passing the test. 0:16:40.480 --> 0:16:45.840 You talk about the pitch deck, How important is that 0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:52.800 stage of the process for you know, a founder kind 0:16:52.840 --> 0:16:55.680 of starting out, how crucial is it that they get 0:16:55.720 --> 0:16:57.280 that pitch deck right. 0:16:59.280 --> 0:17:03.800 The pitchtacks everything, because it's like your calling card. It's 0:17:03.880 --> 0:17:08.040 the ten pages of information that give the headlines about 0:17:08.040 --> 0:17:10.920 your business, and it's the first impression that you will 0:17:10.920 --> 0:17:15.480 give anyone about your business and about you, especially when 0:17:15.480 --> 0:17:19.680 you're pitching investors. But the wonderful thing about the pitch 0:17:19.760 --> 0:17:22.480 deck and working on your pitch deck is that it's 0:17:22.600 --> 0:17:27.400 not only relevant for going out to raise capital. It's 0:17:27.440 --> 0:17:30.880 also really relevant for helping you work on your business 0:17:31.200 --> 0:17:34.119 and helping you think about what are the building blocks 0:17:34.160 --> 0:17:37.680 of scale. And so the book unpacks the pitch deck 0:17:38.000 --> 0:17:41.160 to be able to help you write a fantastic pitch 0:17:41.200 --> 0:17:43.639 deck to go out and raise money, but it's also 0:17:43.760 --> 0:17:46.679 designed to help you think about what are the fundamentals 0:17:46.680 --> 0:17:49.560 of scale that will really help me grow and escalate 0:17:49.600 --> 0:17:50.200 my business. 0:17:50.400 --> 0:17:52.520 Well, I love that the book is filled with stories 0:17:52.560 --> 0:17:55.719 about your own experience as an entrepreneur, and I'm going 0:17:55.760 --> 0:17:57.280 to ask you to share a few of them. One 0:17:57.280 --> 0:17:59.960 of them from I Believe back in twenty and ten, 0:18:00.080 --> 0:18:05.120 and when an event producer called you and your husband 0:18:05.200 --> 0:18:10.560 to make an order for tents that you didn't necessarily have, 0:18:10.680 --> 0:18:13.640 but you saw it as an opportunity to sell these tents. 0:18:13.680 --> 0:18:14.479 Explain what happened. 0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:19.120 Yeah, that was a really pivotal moment in our business journey. 0:18:19.720 --> 0:18:21.639 We were in the very very early days of the 0:18:21.680 --> 0:18:24.680 business and we received a call from an event producer 0:18:24.720 --> 0:18:27.320 that said, I love your tents, I love what you're doing, 0:18:28.200 --> 0:18:30.520 and I'm doing a music festival in New York and 0:18:30.560 --> 0:18:34.600 I would love you to provide the tents for the business. 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:37.840 And of course we did not have one hundred and 0:18:37.840 --> 0:18:40.520 fifty tenths, which is what they were asking us for. 0:18:41.320 --> 0:18:45.440 But it was a moment in time where we knew 0:18:45.880 --> 0:18:48.760 this was this could be a game changer for us. 0:18:48.800 --> 0:18:50.679 We have to say yes, and then we have to 0:18:50.720 --> 0:18:53.399 figure out how on earth we're going to pull that off. 0:18:54.040 --> 0:18:56.040 And so we said yes. We said, well you can 0:18:56.080 --> 0:18:58.680 get those tents from us, we will help you put 0:18:58.760 --> 0:19:02.639 on your music festival, and off we went. But it 0:19:02.800 --> 0:19:05.840 was a nerve wrecking ride. I was pregnant with my 0:19:05.920 --> 0:19:09.120 second child at the time, and we asked the producer 0:19:09.200 --> 0:19:12.320 when when is the actual event? And it was the 0:19:12.359 --> 0:19:15.280 same week as my ju date with our child, and 0:19:15.280 --> 0:19:16.760 we kind of my husband and I looked at each 0:19:16.760 --> 0:19:19.280 other and said well, we still got to do it. 0:19:19.400 --> 0:19:22.080 We still got to find a way to pull this 0:19:22.200 --> 0:19:25.359 off and make this happen, and that that contract that 0:19:25.400 --> 0:19:29.280 we won was a complete game changer for our business. 0:19:29.640 --> 0:19:31.359 I want to get right back to Sarah Ducek, co 0:19:31.400 --> 0:19:33.960 founder of Enigma, a venture. She joins us from Cape Town, 0:19:34.040 --> 0:19:36.080 South Africa. She's got a new book out. It's called 0:19:36.119 --> 0:19:38.800 Thinking Bigger, a pitch deck formula for women who want 0:19:38.840 --> 0:19:42.800 to change the world. She also founded and was CEO 0:19:42.840 --> 0:19:44.960 of under Canvas, which was sold a few years ago 0:19:45.000 --> 0:19:48.080 for more than one hundred million dollars. Sarah, I want 0:19:48.080 --> 0:19:51.160 to start or continue the interview with you by hearing 0:19:51.200 --> 0:19:54.600 more about your story, because you started your career not 0:19:54.680 --> 0:19:57.440 as an entrepreneur, but as an aid worker and found 0:19:57.480 --> 0:20:00.600 yourself after a few years burnt out with that. Tell 0:20:00.640 --> 0:20:02.960 us a little more about how you started your career. 0:20:04.440 --> 0:20:07.600 Yeah. I was always very keen on saving the world, 0:20:07.920 --> 0:20:12.080 and I really believed I could, And I spent the 0:20:12.119 --> 0:20:15.080 first eight years of my career, as you said, working 0:20:15.119 --> 0:20:20.800 for NGOs because I believed that nonprofit vehicles were the 0:20:20.880 --> 0:20:24.000 only vehicles that could do good. But now I know different, 0:20:24.680 --> 0:20:29.840 and after eight years of hard grind and not making 0:20:29.960 --> 0:20:32.520 enough of a dent in any of the problems that 0:20:32.520 --> 0:20:34.720 we were trying to solve. I went back to the 0:20:34.800 --> 0:20:38.119 drawing board, burnt out, and thought, there has to be 0:20:38.160 --> 0:20:40.920 another way. There has to be a different way to 0:20:41.560 --> 0:20:44.359 solve some of the world's biggest problems. And what I 0:20:44.480 --> 0:20:49.199 realized was was that the vehicle that is designed to 0:20:49.320 --> 0:20:54.080 solve problems is actually business. The very heart of doing 0:20:54.119 --> 0:20:58.240 business is about solving a specific problem for a specific 0:20:58.400 --> 0:21:02.560 user that has to be sustainable because it has to 0:21:02.560 --> 0:21:05.040 make money otherwise it's not going to exist very long. 0:21:05.600 --> 0:21:11.400 So which really really revolutionized my thinking around could business 0:21:11.520 --> 0:21:15.600 be a vehicle for driving change, solving problems, doing good, 0:21:15.800 --> 0:21:19.120 moving us forward one step at a time, Which launched 0:21:19.160 --> 0:21:22.320 my career into business because I realized, well, if I 0:21:22.359 --> 0:21:24.879 believe that, then I should get in the ring and 0:21:24.920 --> 0:21:27.720 I should figure out is it possible to do good? 0:21:27.800 --> 0:21:30.960 Is it possible to use business as a vehicle for 0:21:31.040 --> 0:21:31.960 moving the world forward? 0:21:33.160 --> 0:21:36.679 It seems like you have a really good kind of 0:21:37.160 --> 0:21:41.000 positive mindset. And even the title of the book Thinking 0:21:41.080 --> 0:21:43.520 Bigger kind of has to do with this idea that 0:21:43.800 --> 0:21:46.520 if you put your mind to something, you can achieve 0:21:46.560 --> 0:21:50.840 it without spoiling the book. I'm wondering, you know, what 0:21:50.920 --> 0:21:55.560 kind of tactics do you give to aspiring women entrepreneurs 0:21:55.760 --> 0:21:59.760 about really changing that mindset and pivoting the mindset towards 0:21:59.800 --> 0:22:03.560 war that is focused on being successful and being confident. 0:22:04.720 --> 0:22:06.920 Yeah. One of the things I've realized over the last 0:22:06.920 --> 0:22:11.240 few years of working directly with female entrepreneurs and understanding 0:22:11.280 --> 0:22:16.119 myself also was there was two critical components missing for women. 0:22:16.880 --> 0:22:20.960 Lack of knowledge and therefore we are disempowered about how 0:22:20.960 --> 0:22:23.480 the capital markets work and how you raise capital and 0:22:23.520 --> 0:22:27.400 the building blocks of building scale, but also the mindsets 0:22:27.440 --> 0:22:31.320 that we carry around with ourselves that actually are really 0:22:31.400 --> 0:22:35.679 huge stumbling blocks, from scarcity to playing it small, to 0:22:35.840 --> 0:22:39.480 risk aversion. I mean, there are dozens, and so I 0:22:39.480 --> 0:22:42.840 started to unpack them as I tell my story through 0:22:42.880 --> 0:22:47.040 the book, because I could see many of them as 0:22:47.080 --> 0:22:50.080 a reality for myself that were sort of being a 0:22:50.119 --> 0:22:52.679 glass ceiling for me, and we're hindering my growth and 0:22:52.680 --> 0:22:55.280 what I was capable of. And as I've worked for 0:22:55.400 --> 0:22:59.639 other female entrepreneurs, I can see so many of the 0:22:59.680 --> 0:23:03.120 same mindsets coming to the fore that trip them up. 0:23:03.600 --> 0:23:07.040 And women typically want to play it safer we typically 0:23:07.080 --> 0:23:09.720 are a little bit more risk averse, and obviously that's 0:23:09.760 --> 0:23:12.760 a big generalization, but I started to see some trends 0:23:13.440 --> 0:23:16.520 and that made me realize those are as big of 0:23:16.560 --> 0:23:20.600