1 00:00:01,440 --> 00:00:03,560 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to The Doug Gotlieb Show podcast. Be 2 00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:05,680 Speaker 1: sure to catch us live every weekday three to five, 3 00:00:06,040 --> 00:00:09,479 Speaker 1: twelve two Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. Find your local 4 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:12,840 Speaker 1: station for the Doug Gottlieb Show at Foxsports Radio dot com, 5 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:15,840 Speaker 1: or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app 6 00:00:15,920 --> 00:00:20,840 Speaker 1: by searching apps car from America Doug Gottlieb Show, Fox 7 00:00:21,239 --> 00:00:26,400 Speaker 1: Sports Radio. This show is sponsored by DraftKings sports booking, 8 00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:29,360 Speaker 1: official sports betting partner of the NFL and NBA, and 9 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:31,160 Speaker 1: right now you can use the promo code Gottlieb to 10 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:33,160 Speaker 1: claim your special offer DraftKings Again. 11 00:00:33,400 --> 00:00:37,680 Speaker 2: Promo codes Gottlieb at DraftKings. The Crown is yours. Welcome, 12 00:00:37,880 --> 00:00:44,440 Speaker 2: Welcome in, Jay Stu, You'll love this. So as you 13 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:46,519 Speaker 2: guys know. And I popped on the show yesterday from 14 00:00:46,520 --> 00:00:49,640 Speaker 2: the airport. We were in Saint Thomas, the Virgin Islands 15 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:52,000 Speaker 2: for the last week with my with my basketball team, 16 00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 2: and it was I mean when I say the weather 17 00:00:56,240 --> 00:01:01,240 Speaker 2: was perfect, this is a a from somebody who grew 18 00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:06,280 Speaker 2: up in southern California. It was perfect, warm but not 19 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:08,600 Speaker 2: too hot. It's like eighty five every day, a little 20 00:01:08,600 --> 00:01:11,560 Speaker 2: bit human but not no bugs, no not like perfect, 21 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:15,480 Speaker 2: and we're supposed to get like fifty five mile in 22 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:18,679 Speaker 2: our wins this afternoon still may happen here in Green Bay. 23 00:01:18,840 --> 00:01:21,160 Speaker 2: We're supposed to get just like a dusting and I'm 24 00:01:21,200 --> 00:01:23,280 Speaker 2: looking at like five or six inches of snow when 25 00:01:23,319 --> 00:01:25,160 Speaker 2: it was supposed to be like an inch of snow. 26 00:01:27,440 --> 00:01:30,880 Speaker 2: I was on an island like yesterday, and we're digging 27 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:34,960 Speaker 2: out the snow today. But such is life. Welcome to 28 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:37,160 Speaker 2: the Gottlieb Show. Good to be back, Good to be 29 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:40,399 Speaker 2: with you. Let's talk some spots, shall we. I heard 30 00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:44,320 Speaker 2: something from Joe Burrow, and it's really interesting, Like Joe 31 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:48,800 Speaker 2: Burrow today is going to be healed hailed as a hero, right, 32 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:51,920 Speaker 2: I mean, just like like you go through the heroes 33 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:57,560 Speaker 2: of our lifetime in sports, and Joe Burrow's going to 34 00:01:57,600 --> 00:02:04,400 Speaker 2: be listed among those guys. Because well, this is what 35 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:07,600 Speaker 2: he said. What he was asked about the argument being 36 00:02:07,600 --> 00:02:10,160 Speaker 2: made the Bengals should not play him tomorrow or the 37 00:02:10,160 --> 00:02:11,920 Speaker 2: rest of the season because they're out of the playoffs. 38 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:13,440 Speaker 2: Here's what Joe Burrow had to say. 39 00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 3: I understand why people feel that way, but if you 40 00:02:17,320 --> 00:02:23,080 Speaker 3: look at it from my perspective, I'm a football player, 41 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:26,080 Speaker 3: and if I get hurt, I'm going to go through 42 00:02:26,120 --> 00:02:28,360 Speaker 3: the rehab process, and then I'm going to let everybody 43 00:02:28,360 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 3: know when I feel like I can go out there 44 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:37,000 Speaker 3: and play. I'm not gonna ever go to somebody and say, yeah, 45 00:02:37,040 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 3: I'm healthy, but no, I don't think. I don't think 46 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:41,320 Speaker 3: I should go out there and play. That doesn't make 47 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:42,639 Speaker 3: a lot of sense to me. I'm not going to 48 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 3: live my life and play this game scared of something happening. 49 00:02:49,919 --> 00:02:53,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, And the idea is that we're somehow making it 50 00:02:53,840 --> 00:02:58,440 Speaker 2: heroic for Joe Burrow to do his job, which is 51 00:02:58,520 --> 00:03:00,840 Speaker 2: be quarterback of the Bengals. What he's saying is like, 52 00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 2: I'm a football player. I play football. When there's a 53 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:10,799 Speaker 2: football game, it makes total sense. And here's the I 54 00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:16,160 Speaker 2: don't know if it's a catch twenty two or jaxtaposition Chase, 55 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:19,720 Speaker 2: do you you're you can parse my words as as 56 00:03:19,800 --> 00:03:21,600 Speaker 2: much as you'd like and tell me what you think. 57 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:25,920 Speaker 2: But on one hand, and Jason, I think you like 58 00:03:26,040 --> 00:03:32,120 Speaker 2: to poke fun at gen Z rightfully so for how 59 00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:38,640 Speaker 2: they have become just an entitled generation of people. But 60 00:03:38,680 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 2: if you think about it, the people who are asking 61 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:45,000 Speaker 2: Joe Burrow, why are you playing the games don't mean 62 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 2: anything because you got a one percent chance of making 63 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 2: the playoffs. Those are the same people who are critical 64 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:55,360 Speaker 2: of modern day athletes for being soft, or for only 65 00:03:55,360 --> 00:03:59,000 Speaker 2: playing when they want to play, or for load management. Like, 66 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:06,640 Speaker 2: on one hand, our generation, right gen X, was the 67 00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 2: one that came up with load management. Our generation is 68 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 2: the one that said, hey, let's be smart, don't play 69 00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 2: a guy when he needed because all he can do 70 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:16,960 Speaker 2: is get hurt. And yet our generation is the same 71 00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:19,040 Speaker 2: one that it's like, hey, those guys are soft. They 72 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:22,880 Speaker 2: don't play every game like previous generations and our generation did. 73 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:27,400 Speaker 2: It's it's it's kind of a fascinating social experiment here. 74 00:04:29,480 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 2: And yeah, I mean I there's lots of things you 75 00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:35,880 Speaker 2: learn the more you're around sports. First thing you learn 76 00:04:36,000 --> 00:04:38,240 Speaker 2: I think people are learning, especially this is not everybody 77 00:04:38,279 --> 00:04:41,520 Speaker 2: plays football loves football, but Joe Burrow does. 78 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:42,680 Speaker 4: Not. 79 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:50,320 Speaker 2: Everybody that that that plays sports understands that the job 80 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:52,640 Speaker 2: of sport is not just to play when you want 81 00:04:52,640 --> 00:04:54,880 Speaker 2: to play or when it's good for the team to play, 82 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 2: but at all times. And again it's our generation, the 83 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:03,320 Speaker 2: older generation, that that let me give you a college 84 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:08,600 Speaker 2: football example, right, we are and I have been harshly 85 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:11,760 Speaker 2: critical of players sitting out of bowl games in the past, 86 00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:15,679 Speaker 2: or sitting out of games you know red there's there's 87 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:18,800 Speaker 2: a movement. There's been a movement of guys four games 88 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 2: in the year red shirting and saying refusing to play 89 00:05:21,960 --> 00:05:25,200 Speaker 2: because things weren't what they thought. And if you do 90 00:05:25,279 --> 00:05:27,280 Speaker 2: have the ability to red shirt, even if you play 91 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:30,719 Speaker 2: four games in college football, it's easy to be critical 92 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:32,440 Speaker 2: of those guys and say, what are you doing. You 93 00:05:32,480 --> 00:05:33,960 Speaker 2: sign up to play for a school. You play for 94 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:35,880 Speaker 2: the school. If they want to play you one snap 95 00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:38,840 Speaker 2: or one Hunter snaps, you play. That's what you do, 96 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:42,120 Speaker 2: and now you're getting compensated to play. That's what you do. 97 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,280 Speaker 2: On the other hand, it's our generation which came up 98 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:49,640 Speaker 2: with these rules. It's our generation which is firing coaches three, 99 00:05:49,760 --> 00:05:52,600 Speaker 2: four or five games in the season, which essentially cancels 100 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:54,920 Speaker 2: the season and says we have no hope and says 101 00:05:54,920 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 2: we're looking to move on anyway. So I think that 102 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:04,960 Speaker 2: Joe Burrow is a heroic figure, not about heroic but 103 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:07,720 Speaker 2: it's the kind of message that when you say it, 104 00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:11,760 Speaker 2: how can you not be a Joe Burrow fan. On 105 00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:17,159 Speaker 2: the other hand, isn't he simply doing his job. It's 106 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:21,279 Speaker 2: like the old Chris Rock bit on guys saying, like 107 00:06:21,440 --> 00:06:23,839 Speaker 2: I take care of my kids, you're supposed to take 108 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:29,960 Speaker 2: care of your kids. Yeah, that's what you're supposed to do. 109 00:06:30,080 --> 00:06:32,640 Speaker 2: It's the same thing as a quarterback. Why are we 110 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:35,960 Speaker 2: celebrating a guy for playing quarterback on a three and 111 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:39,000 Speaker 2: eight team when he's making a ton of money to 112 00:06:39,080 --> 00:06:41,040 Speaker 2: be the quarterback. Whether they're three and eight or eight 113 00:06:41,040 --> 00:06:45,560 Speaker 2: and three, it shouldn't matter. And the root cause of 114 00:06:45,560 --> 00:06:50,920 Speaker 2: the problem is not gen Z, it's gen X. We 115 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:54,120 Speaker 2: came up with all these ideas, and we've come up 116 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 2: with the decision to fire coaches early on the season 117 00:06:57,160 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 2: and essentially cancel their seasons. We came up with oldmand 118 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:03,840 Speaker 2: so we know we shouldn't be surprised when players dive 119 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:07,600 Speaker 2: into that. But we also should feel super weird and 120 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 2: self conscious about guys saying, Hey, I think it's weird 121 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:14,000 Speaker 2: to even celebrate the fact that I'm playing football. 122 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:19,760 Speaker 5: Go ahead, Jason, it's an interesting Uh, you're right, it's 123 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:24,480 Speaker 5: an interesting human experiment. It's an interesting social experiment. And 124 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 5: I'll explain. So I'm guessing in our talk space there 125 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 5: is an overlap between the people that have been against 126 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:37,880 Speaker 5: load management for years and the same people probably this 127 00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:41,280 Speaker 5: week being like the Bengals are idiots for playing Joe Burrow. Yes, 128 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:43,680 Speaker 5: they want they want their cake and they want to 129 00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:46,760 Speaker 5: eat it too. Now it's an interesting social experiment. And 130 00:07:46,840 --> 00:07:49,080 Speaker 5: you know me, I don't. I don't do this lightly. 131 00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:52,280 Speaker 5: I don't go here often, but I will say this, 132 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:55,120 Speaker 5: how much how much does race play into this? How 133 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 5: much of the load management is black guys not working 134 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:02,080 Speaker 5: who make a lot of money? And this week don't 135 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:04,600 Speaker 5: play Joe Burrow? Why would you play Joe Burrow? The 136 00:08:04,600 --> 00:08:06,920 Speaker 5: white quarterback? But how about do you think that is? 137 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 2: It hadn't come to my mind at all. 138 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:16,720 Speaker 5: I do think, I do think it strikes me this week? 139 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:21,760 Speaker 2: Oh I well, I don't. I don't know on on Burrow. 140 00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 2: I mean, part of Burrow's thing is he has been 141 00:08:23,680 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 2: hurt a lot, right, he has been hurt a lot. 142 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:28,640 Speaker 2: So it's it's more than just like, well, you've never 143 00:08:28,680 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 2: been hurt like he'd been hurt a lot, or it 144 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:34,880 Speaker 2: feels that way. I do think that there are other instances. 145 00:08:35,280 --> 00:08:39,920 Speaker 2: NBA players probably catch the most flack for it that 146 00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:44,040 Speaker 2: there's always going to be a group of people that 147 00:08:44,440 --> 00:08:46,880 Speaker 2: you know, you have the racial bias of a black 148 00:08:46,920 --> 00:08:50,719 Speaker 2: guy not going to play in a game is somehow 149 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:53,640 Speaker 2: a bigger deal than a white guy not playing a game. 150 00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:57,560 Speaker 2: My issue with that is I have a blind spot 151 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:00,280 Speaker 2: to it because it just doesn't It's not that I 152 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:02,560 Speaker 2: would never think about it, but the more you say it, 153 00:09:02,800 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 2: the more you go, yeah, okay. I don't know if 154 00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:11,160 Speaker 2: it's there with football, because I think that people believe 155 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:14,400 Speaker 2: that football players ultimately everybody gets hurt when it's not 156 00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:20,040 Speaker 2: really the case. It's not really the case. It's like 157 00:09:20,080 --> 00:09:23,800 Speaker 2: Tom Brady played twenty years, Yeah, the turs acl Yeah, 158 00:09:23,960 --> 00:09:27,040 Speaker 2: but that's literally like the only injury he ever had. 159 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:32,079 Speaker 2: It's kind of crazy, and he was a statue back there, statue. 160 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:35,280 Speaker 2: But it is a tremendous social experiment. 161 00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:39,080 Speaker 5: And you bring up the that the fact that there 162 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:41,880 Speaker 5: we always think that all these people when they get 163 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:45,600 Speaker 5: to the professional level are in it to win it, like, yes, 164 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:49,160 Speaker 5: their only goal is to win at all costs, especially 165 00:09:49,240 --> 00:09:53,199 Speaker 5: in team sports. And remember Cam Newton said this about 166 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:54,040 Speaker 5: six weeks ago. 167 00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 6: Remember, would you rather being a spot where you can 168 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:03,559 Speaker 6: individually achieve success, have statistics and lose or would you 169 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:05,880 Speaker 6: want to be someone that contributes to a team that 170 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:06,840 Speaker 6: can win a Super Bowl? 171 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:08,480 Speaker 7: And I'm glad you asked that. 172 00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:12,240 Speaker 4: When you're talking about individual play, this is how I 173 00:10:12,679 --> 00:10:15,120 Speaker 4: this is how I take care of my family. Team 174 00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:18,439 Speaker 4: success don't take care of my family. So if I'm 175 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:21,079 Speaker 4: thinking about it from a personal standpoint, of course, we 176 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:23,840 Speaker 4: want the best of both worlds. But if you're asking 177 00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 4: me what gives you extincsions, what gives you top tier money, 178 00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:31,360 Speaker 4: what gives you certain things, there's some more players that 179 00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:35,839 Speaker 4: have rings, championships and things that are struggling rather than 180 00:10:36,679 --> 00:10:40,280 Speaker 4: son quote unquote bus that has had money and they're 181 00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:42,760 Speaker 4: doing right by their money. 182 00:10:43,960 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 2: Yeah. I don't. Yeah, it's just it's such a bad narrative. 183 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:52,080 Speaker 2: I do think there are people that believe that. I 184 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:54,079 Speaker 2: just don't think they're the brightest people in the world. 185 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:59,920 Speaker 2: But yeah, that's what some people do. Believe and get 186 00:11:00,120 --> 00:11:01,120 Speaker 2: credence to what you're saying. 187 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:03,400 Speaker 8: Be sure to catch the live edition of The Doug 188 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:07,360 Speaker 8: Gottlieb Show weekdays at three pm Eastern noon Pacific on 189 00:11:07,480 --> 00:11:10,280 Speaker 8: Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app. 190 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:15,480 Speaker 2: Sesame Straight helped raise all of us. Now it's your 191 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 2: turn donate this holiday season at sesame dot org because 192 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:23,920 Speaker 2: the world needs Sesame and Sesame needs you. Rich Ornberger 193 00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:26,600 Speaker 2: will join us upcoming in about six seven minutes. This 194 00:11:26,679 --> 00:11:29,760 Speaker 2: is the Doug Gottlieb Show here on Fox Sports Radio. 195 00:11:31,559 --> 00:11:34,880 Speaker 2: Shor Sanders had another time with the media today. Here's 196 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:35,560 Speaker 2: what he had to say. 197 00:11:36,400 --> 00:11:41,240 Speaker 9: All your supporters out, I dare say that that Kevin 198 00:11:41,320 --> 00:11:43,719 Speaker 9: Stefanski was sabotageing me. 199 00:11:44,640 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 7: So you just want to start trouble. 200 00:11:46,200 --> 00:11:48,959 Speaker 10: Well, I know, I want to ask you with your 201 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:50,040 Speaker 10: relationship with him? 202 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 11: Yeah, Well, what people do outside the building isn't really 203 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:56,559 Speaker 11: in my control, is not in my power. So youah, 204 00:11:56,640 --> 00:11:58,440 Speaker 11: like I go out there and tell him to do whatever. 205 00:11:58,600 --> 00:12:00,920 Speaker 11: You know, that's that's not nothing not control or nothing 206 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 11: I could do. But overall, you know, I'm just happy 207 00:12:04,760 --> 00:12:07,640 Speaker 11: to be here cause Stefanski, you've been coaching, uh since 208 00:12:07,679 --> 00:12:10,120 Speaker 11: I got here, and uh you've been doing a very 209 00:12:10,120 --> 00:12:12,439 Speaker 11: great job, you know with everything that's going on. 210 00:12:12,679 --> 00:12:16,720 Speaker 10: But what is your relationship like with him? And when 211 00:12:16,720 --> 00:12:18,080 Speaker 10: we don't see you guys together. 212 00:12:18,440 --> 00:12:20,760 Speaker 11: Definitely like a coach, you know, he tells me what 213 00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 11: I need to do on and off the field. We've 214 00:12:23,800 --> 00:12:27,880 Speaker 11: definitely grown our relationship and everything is grown. So I'm 215 00:12:27,920 --> 00:12:28,880 Speaker 11: just thankful to be here. 216 00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 2: Well, that was a non answer answer, wasn't That was 217 00:12:35,160 --> 00:12:38,440 Speaker 2: a non answer answer, And that non answer tells you 218 00:12:38,520 --> 00:12:42,720 Speaker 2: everything you need to know. Tells you everything you need 219 00:12:42,760 --> 00:12:49,600 Speaker 2: to know. Oh wait, there's more. Here's Kendrick Perkins. He 220 00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:52,600 Speaker 2: was on a podcast this week. This is his comment 221 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:54,040 Speaker 2: about shador Sanders. 222 00:12:54,400 --> 00:13:02,480 Speaker 12: Shadula Sanders is the most powerful black man since two 223 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:05,440 Speaker 12: thousand and nine. You know it happened in two thousand 224 00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:09,360 Speaker 12: and nine, that's when President Obama got elected in office. 225 00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:13,880 Speaker 12: He's the most powerful black man since two thousand and nine. 226 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:16,240 Speaker 12: You said you were sitting there watching the game in 227 00:13:16,280 --> 00:13:17,320 Speaker 12: your house, and what you did? 228 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:18,320 Speaker 2: You ran? 229 00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:19,400 Speaker 12: You ran with the TV. 230 00:13:20,040 --> 00:13:21,240 Speaker 2: Right, what was you doing? 231 00:13:21,320 --> 00:13:21,560 Speaker 7: dB? 232 00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:27,959 Speaker 12: You was chairing like when Shadua Sanders is on the field. 233 00:13:28,960 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 12: And when I say powerful, powerful, because it's two sides 234 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:34,920 Speaker 12: of it, right, think about it. Okay, you got the 235 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:38,719 Speaker 12: black community. He bringing the whole black community together. I 236 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:42,280 Speaker 12: ain't ran across one black person that then said one 237 00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:43,760 Speaker 12: bad thing about should do it. 238 00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:44,640 Speaker 2: We won't even. 239 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:47,960 Speaker 12: Guess what not one because he has the balance. He 240 00:13:48,040 --> 00:13:52,000 Speaker 12: has the balance of that. I'm arrogant, but I'm humble too, 241 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:56,280 Speaker 12: and he having fun with it. And on top of that, 242 00:13:56,679 --> 00:13:58,439 Speaker 12: y'all want me to say it ain't y'all want me 243 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:01,120 Speaker 12: to feel it ain't gonna happen. He's the most powerful 244 00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 12: black man in sports, no other, no other matter of fact, 245 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 12: black man. He the most powerful player in sports. 246 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:15,280 Speaker 2: I don't really know where to go with a lot 247 00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:19,840 Speaker 2: of that. I will say this I have. I mean, 248 00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:22,440 Speaker 2: half my team is is black. I have half my 249 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:26,640 Speaker 2: staff as black, and and the general consensus from my 250 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:30,160 Speaker 2: staff guys is they are big Shador and Dion fans, 251 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:40,200 Speaker 2: Chad and Dion fans. He's not the most powerful guy 252 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:44,080 Speaker 2: in sports. I do think that the black community by 253 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:48,080 Speaker 2: and large embraces him and seems to have made this 254 00:14:48,320 --> 00:14:54,480 Speaker 2: into some sort of uh racial thing. Well it's it's 255 00:14:54,600 --> 00:15:00,880 Speaker 2: comedy because Dylan Gabriel is not white, you know. And 256 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:03,520 Speaker 2: oh yeah, by the way, the guy who was the 257 00:15:03,560 --> 00:15:09,200 Speaker 2: starting quarterback before injury for the Cleveland Browns, who has 258 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:13,920 Speaker 2: the largest guarantee in the history of the league, just 259 00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:16,080 Speaker 2: so happens to be black as well. That's the actual 260 00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:19,280 Speaker 2: starting quarterback of the Cleveland Browns. So there's a lot 261 00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 2: too it that has nothing to do with race, and 262 00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:24,280 Speaker 2: that Kendrick Perkins, maybe he's been hanging out with Ryan 263 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 2: Clark too much, is making it completely about race. But 264 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:29,920 Speaker 2: I do think the black community has embraced him. I 265 00:15:29,920 --> 00:15:31,840 Speaker 2: don't think any of the other stuff is true or 266 00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 2: factual or whatever. But I just again, this is why 267 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:41,120 Speaker 2: it better work, because if it doesn't, nobody wants that 268 00:15:41,160 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 2: on their team. Nobody wants the idea of if you 269 00:15:43,880 --> 00:15:47,960 Speaker 2: don't play a guy, you're racist or you don't want 270 00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:54,800 Speaker 2: him to do well. And Shador is not helping it. Mike, Look, 271 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:58,560 Speaker 2: you have to stop lying to yourself and lying to 272 00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:03,720 Speaker 2: the public. You do whether or not Shador has a 273 00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:07,240 Speaker 2: good repute, a good relationship with Kevin Stefanski or not. 274 00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:12,400 Speaker 2: The answer he gave is a telling answer, and it 275 00:16:12,520 --> 00:16:16,480 Speaker 2: is a terrible answer because it throws fuel to the fire. 276 00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:20,640 Speaker 2: It's very easy because his initial part of the answer 277 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:23,480 Speaker 2: was great. The initial part of the answer was there's 278 00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:25,760 Speaker 2: lots of noise outside the building. I can't control that, 279 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 2: period stop fix it. Then the guy's like, no, but 280 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:34,880 Speaker 2: what's your actual relationship? Like, well, he's like a coach 281 00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:38,920 Speaker 2: and it's gotten better, and he tells me what to do. 282 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:46,040 Speaker 2: The only answer you need is, hey, people outside, they 283 00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:53,800 Speaker 2: don't know what's your relationship? Like great, awesome, he's been great. 284 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 2: I keep learning. I love his offense. I love it here. 285 00:16:58,440 --> 00:17:00,120 Speaker 2: I can't wait to get out there and show everybody 286 00:17:00,360 --> 00:17:02,520 Speaker 2: what we're putting in between last week and this week. 287 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:05,919 Speaker 2: That's the answer. That's how you do it. And we 288 00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 2: can sit there and go like, well, he's young, he 289 00:17:07,600 --> 00:17:14,400 Speaker 2: isn't bull bull because he could take coaching from his dad, 290 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:16,240 Speaker 2: and his dad is not helping him. His dad is 291 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:20,600 Speaker 2: hurting him because he just killed his coach once again 292 00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:26,080 Speaker 2: without trying, without openly trying to play that answer for 293 00:17:26,119 --> 00:17:29,240 Speaker 2: me one more time before bringing rich Hornberger, remember listen 294 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:31,320 Speaker 2: to the entire because the first part is good. First 295 00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:33,479 Speaker 2: part is like, hey, I can't control everything else. But 296 00:17:33,520 --> 00:17:35,119 Speaker 2: then when they follow it up and ask what your 297 00:17:35,119 --> 00:17:37,600 Speaker 2: asking relationship is, that's when he stepped in it. 298 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:43,000 Speaker 9: All your supporters out, I'd dare say that that Kevin 299 00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:45,879 Speaker 9: Stefanski was sabotage. 300 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:48,160 Speaker 7: And so you just want to start troubling out. 301 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:51,440 Speaker 10: I know, I want to ask you what your relationship 302 00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:51,800 Speaker 10: with him? 303 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:55,680 Speaker 11: Yeah, well, what people do outside the building isn't really 304 00:17:55,680 --> 00:17:58,080 Speaker 11: in my control, is not in my power, So you 305 00:17:58,160 --> 00:17:59,679 Speaker 11: had like I go out there and tell him to 306 00:17:59,680 --> 00:18:01,920 Speaker 11: do it. You know, that's that's not nothing I could 307 00:18:01,920 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 11: control or nothing I could do. But overall, you know, I'm. 308 00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:07,800 Speaker 7: Just happy to be here. Cose Stefanski. 309 00:18:07,800 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 11: He's been coaching, uh since I got here, and uh, 310 00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:13,159 Speaker 11: he've been doing a very great job, you know with 311 00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:14,160 Speaker 11: everything that's going on. 312 00:18:14,400 --> 00:18:18,440 Speaker 10: But what is your relationship like with him? And when 313 00:18:18,440 --> 00:18:19,800 Speaker 10: we don't see you guys together. 314 00:18:20,200 --> 00:18:22,520 Speaker 11: Definitely like a coach, you know, he tells me what 315 00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:25,520 Speaker 11: I need to do on and off the field. We've 316 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:29,640 Speaker 11: definitely grown our relationship and everything is grown. So I'm 317 00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:30,600 Speaker 11: just thankful to be here. 318 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:33,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, he is, he says grown. He didn't say it 319 00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:36,720 Speaker 2: was good. He didn't say it was great. He made 320 00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:39,159 Speaker 2: it out like he'sssos do on and off the field. 321 00:18:39,920 --> 00:18:45,560 Speaker 2: It feels like he's like a parent. It's a bad answer. 322 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:49,119 Speaker 2: It's bad as he was doing so well up into that, 323 00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:52,479 Speaker 2: but hey, he's been doing great with everything. What's your 324 00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:56,000 Speaker 2: relationship actually? Like it's like a coach, like a player. 325 00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:59,200 Speaker 2: Doug Gottlieb Show on Fox Sports Radio. Let's welcome in 326 00:18:59,320 --> 00:19:02,400 Speaker 2: Rich Ornberger. He joins us now on Fox Sports Trade 327 00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 2: He's got his own daily radio show in San Diego. 328 00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:08,280 Speaker 2: Plus's co host to Countdown to Kickoff with Jared Smith 329 00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:10,920 Speaker 2: Brian no airs each Sun eighteen nine am New Eastern Time. 330 00:19:11,119 --> 00:19:13,080 Speaker 2: Listen live on any of our Fox Sports Radio Philisy 331 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:16,920 Speaker 2: iHeartRadio at presented by Bett MGM rich. What'd you think 332 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:20,520 Speaker 2: of Shador Sanders's answer when he was asked about his 333 00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:21,760 Speaker 2: relationship with his coach. 334 00:19:23,359 --> 00:19:28,439 Speaker 13: I didn't have an enormous problem with it, but I 335 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:31,800 Speaker 13: do agree with you. There is an answer that is 336 00:19:31,840 --> 00:19:37,919 Speaker 13: going to lead to zero media questioning, zero criticism, and 337 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:42,960 Speaker 13: then there's the answer that he gave. Look, everybody knows 338 00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:45,080 Speaker 13: the right answer. He grew up in a house with 339 00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:49,000 Speaker 13: a father who's a professional football player, former professional football 340 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:53,199 Speaker 13: player turned coach. He has been media trained since he 341 00:19:53,400 --> 00:19:56,160 Speaker 13: was in high school. He knows exactly what he's doing 342 00:19:56,680 --> 00:19:59,800 Speaker 13: every step of the way. So trust me when I 343 00:19:59,840 --> 00:20:02,240 Speaker 13: tell you, and I don't need to tell you. But 344 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 13: he's not careless with his words. He knows what he's 345 00:20:07,560 --> 00:20:09,400 Speaker 13: doing and he knows what he's saying. When he says 346 00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:12,520 Speaker 13: it's a growing relationship instead of it's a great relationship, 347 00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:16,040 Speaker 13: he knows what he's inferring when he tells a reporter 348 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:19,879 Speaker 13: who asks him about the relationship that he tells me 349 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:23,000 Speaker 13: what to do on and off the field. He knows 350 00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:26,360 Speaker 13: that that is going to paint a portrayal of their 351 00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:29,680 Speaker 13: relationship in a certain light. That is going to lead 352 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:35,160 Speaker 13: to some either condemnation from people around the Brown who, 353 00:20:35,600 --> 00:20:38,560 Speaker 13: you know, think that Shador is being strangle held by 354 00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:41,879 Speaker 13: this organization in some way, or it's going to be 355 00:20:42,640 --> 00:20:46,840 Speaker 13: you know, it's going to potentially lend credence to the 356 00:20:46,920 --> 00:20:49,160 Speaker 13: argument that he really needs to be reined in by 357 00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:53,719 Speaker 13: this organization. Whatever he knows, he's going to make a headline. 358 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:56,800 Speaker 13: And so I completely agree with you that there is 359 00:20:56,840 --> 00:21:00,399 Speaker 13: a team friendly way to answer questions, and there is 360 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:03,000 Speaker 13: the way he decided to answer the question, and he 361 00:21:03,040 --> 00:21:04,520 Speaker 13: knew exactly what he was doing. 362 00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:10,120 Speaker 2: Stut Gottlieb Show here on Fox Sports Radio. Okay, what 363 00:21:10,119 --> 00:21:11,639 Speaker 2: did you actually think of how he played? 364 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:15,560 Speaker 13: You know what, Look, he's got a lot to improve on, 365 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:17,840 Speaker 13: but I can see the light. 366 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:18,719 Speaker 2: You know. 367 00:21:18,840 --> 00:21:21,320 Speaker 13: I don't want to make the comparison because I don't 368 00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:24,840 Speaker 13: think it's apt. But if you looked at Josh Allen 369 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:28,280 Speaker 13: when he came into the league, he was he was 370 00:21:28,320 --> 00:21:31,520 Speaker 13: an unfinished product. You know, he was an unfinished product, 371 00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 13: and he was playing with the guy who I think 372 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:38,800 Speaker 13: offensively really understood what he needed in Brian Gable, and 373 00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:43,119 Speaker 13: he developed over years. It literally took years into a 374 00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 13: top tier caliber starting quarterback in the league. And then 375 00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:50,520 Speaker 13: you know, last year he won the MVP. So he's 376 00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:53,000 Speaker 13: continued to grow and he's continued to assert himself in 377 00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:56,840 Speaker 13: the correct directions. Now do I think that Cador Sanders 378 00:21:56,920 --> 00:21:59,439 Speaker 13: could ever play to the level of Josh Allen, I 379 00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:02,439 Speaker 13: don't know. I mean, it's so hard to get to 380 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:06,120 Speaker 13: that top echelon, you know, where we're talking about maybe 381 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:11,280 Speaker 13: the five greatest players playing in the NFL currently. It's 382 00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:13,359 Speaker 13: hard to get there, So will he I don't know. 383 00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:16,679 Speaker 13: But what I can tell you about the samples of 384 00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:20,000 Speaker 13: Shador Sanders that I'm watching is there times where he's 385 00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:22,960 Speaker 13: doing some really bone headed things with the football. There's 386 00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:25,760 Speaker 13: times where the scheme isn't helping him, and there's time 387 00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:30,800 Speaker 13: where I can see exactly the reason why you know, 388 00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:34,040 Speaker 13: he was considered a top tier talent leaving college and 389 00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:36,680 Speaker 13: then you know, fell down the draft board obviously for 390 00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:41,280 Speaker 13: you know, either exterior reasons or personality reasons or you know, 391 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:44,560 Speaker 13: or potentially certain talent evaluators just didn't love the way 392 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:47,720 Speaker 13: he played. But I can see the talent, So it's 393 00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:50,439 Speaker 13: a little bit of a mixed bag. It's still extremely 394 00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:53,640 Speaker 13: early to say for certain whether or not he's going 395 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,560 Speaker 13: to be, you know, a Josh Allen or if he's 396 00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:59,119 Speaker 13: going to be you know, sort of an afterthought quarterback, 397 00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 13: you know that ends up being a career backup. 398 00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:06,080 Speaker 2: Stuck Ottleep Show here on Fox Sports Radio. That's the 399 00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:09,080 Speaker 2: voice of Rich Ornberger. Course, Rich played in the league, 400 00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:11,880 Speaker 2: covers the league. You can listen to them here on 401 00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 2: Fox Sports Radio Countdown to Kickoff every Sunday morning, which 402 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:17,879 Speaker 2: is presented by Bett mgim. All right, let's get to 403 00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:20,320 Speaker 2: the teams that actually matter. That's my one thing about 404 00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 2: the Browns, like, why are we talking about the teams 405 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:27,160 Speaker 2: that don't matter? Game that matters? Packers and Lions. Packers 406 00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:32,200 Speaker 2: and Lions. Game wasn't truly competitive when it's playing Lambeau. 407 00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:35,480 Speaker 2: But that's first game of the season. New staff for 408 00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:40,600 Speaker 2: the Lions. This time around, Detroit's a three point favorite. 409 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:44,040 Speaker 2: What do you think of Packers Lions Ford Field tomorrow 410 00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:45,200 Speaker 2: noon Central time? 411 00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:52,000 Speaker 13: Man, I'll tell you what, it's really good to get 412 00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:56,320 Speaker 13: the Packers at home if you're the Lions, Because the Lions, 413 00:23:56,840 --> 00:24:00,439 Speaker 13: I think we were all expecting them to be a 414 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:04,320 Speaker 13: more complete team than they have been so far today. 415 00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:09,439 Speaker 13: I think Jan Campbell has struggled in some ways calling 416 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:14,800 Speaker 13: this offense, and then as a result of having Micah 417 00:24:14,800 --> 00:24:18,600 Speaker 13: Parsons that you have to plan your offense around when 418 00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:21,000 Speaker 13: you face the Green Bay Packers. That doesn't make life 419 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:24,719 Speaker 13: any easier. I mean, he's a he's a great player, 420 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:28,320 Speaker 13: and you know, you better get those tackles some help 421 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:32,080 Speaker 13: he's got. He's got some really high level offensive lineman 422 00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 13: on that on that team. But you either need to 423 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:39,080 Speaker 13: get the ball out of Jared Goff's hands immediately, or 424 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:42,440 Speaker 13: you need to get Penne Suole and Taylor Decker some help. 425 00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:46,800 Speaker 13: And and and that means chip help from the backs 426 00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:49,520 Speaker 13: and tight ends coming in there and bumping Michael Parsons 427 00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:52,520 Speaker 13: off this rush. And that means double teams fighting to 428 00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:56,359 Speaker 13: Micah Parson's way. And that also means getting Jamar Gibbs 429 00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 13: or Jamir Gibbs involved in the passing games, you know, 430 00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:03,280 Speaker 13: I mean, even if even if you're only hitting two 431 00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:06,440 Speaker 13: yard passes or three yard passes, getting the ball into 432 00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:09,880 Speaker 13: hands of a playmaker beyond the line of scrimmage. If 433 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:11,720 Speaker 13: he can make one man miss, we know he can 434 00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:15,120 Speaker 13: make the defense pay. And that is going to help 435 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:17,280 Speaker 13: Jared Goff get rid of the football sooner, which I 436 00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:20,520 Speaker 13: think should be. It'll be mission critical in this game 437 00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:21,720 Speaker 13: against the Packers. 438 00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:29,720 Speaker 2: Caleb Williams, Now, I mean sixteen touchdowns, four interceptions. Everybody 439 00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:32,120 Speaker 2: has an opinion on a week to week basis, Give 440 00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:35,520 Speaker 2: me the thirty thousand foot view of the Bears of 441 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:39,199 Speaker 2: Caleb Williams. As Friday they get the Eagles coming off 442 00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:41,640 Speaker 2: that loss to the Cowboys. 443 00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:45,000 Speaker 13: Caleb Williams has improved a great deal with Ben Johnson 444 00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:48,359 Speaker 13: as his as his coach and you know, kind of 445 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:52,880 Speaker 13: by proxy, his offensive coordinator. I'm not saying that I'm 446 00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:56,760 Speaker 13: I'm a believer in Kate Williams, and I think that 447 00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:59,720 Speaker 13: he is going to be, you know, the next Steve 448 00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:05,240 Speaker 13: Young or anything that resembles like a Patrick Mahomes for example. 449 00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:11,879 Speaker 13: But I've seen some upside here since getting a voice 450 00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:15,000 Speaker 13: in the headset. But really seems to understand how to 451 00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:18,960 Speaker 13: limit his liabilities and how to really focus on his strength. 452 00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 13: And he's shown some improvisational skills at times this season 453 00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:26,800 Speaker 13: that really impressed me. Now, you know, do I think 454 00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:29,920 Speaker 13: that they're going to end up winning the NFC North, 455 00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:34,480 Speaker 13: the Bears led by Caleb Williams, I don't know. I 456 00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:37,679 Speaker 13: think that's a really competitive division, and I think a 457 00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:41,560 Speaker 13: lot can happen after Thanksgiving, So we'll see starting with 458 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:46,560 Speaker 13: the Eagles here on Friday. But do I find myself 459 00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:50,000 Speaker 13: more and more pressed with Caleb Williams, Yeah, I do. 460 00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:52,760 Speaker 13: I think he had kind of a rough start. We 461 00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:54,720 Speaker 13: were just talking about Shrador. He kind of had a 462 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:58,160 Speaker 13: rough entry into the NFL as well because of some 463 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:01,920 Speaker 13: of the grumblings about how father was going to get 464 00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:04,760 Speaker 13: involved if the wrong team drafted him, and there was 465 00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:07,240 Speaker 13: some scuttle butt about whether or not he would even 466 00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:09,520 Speaker 13: play for the Bears, and you know, they end up 467 00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:12,560 Speaker 13: taking him, and you know, that storyline kind of goes away, 468 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:15,920 Speaker 13: but the feeling I don't think ever did so I 469 00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:19,159 Speaker 13: think that stuck with him for the first full season. 470 00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:22,440 Speaker 13: I think here with a new head coach, he's looking 471 00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:26,080 Speaker 13: much more competent and so this could be a year 472 00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:29,960 Speaker 13: where they either sneak into the I would guess that 473 00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:32,080 Speaker 13: the Bears end up being a wildcard team. If I 474 00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:34,760 Speaker 13: were to put like my name on it right now, 475 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:37,520 Speaker 13: I think the Bears don't end up winning the NFC North. 476 00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,280 Speaker 13: I do think they sneak into the postseason as a 477 00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:42,399 Speaker 13: wildcard team and then from there you roll the dice. 478 00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:44,280 Speaker 13: You know, who knows, maybe they can sneak off with 479 00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:45,080 Speaker 13: the first round win. 480 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:48,399 Speaker 2: Stuck Gottlieb Show here on Fox Sports Trader, that's the 481 00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:53,520 Speaker 2: voice of Rich Ornberger. Rich nobody thought much, myself included 482 00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:56,520 Speaker 2: the Cowboys. Yet here they are at five hundred, fresh 483 00:27:56,600 --> 00:27:59,199 Speaker 2: off win over the Eagles and the Chiefs. Everybody just 484 00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:03,520 Speaker 2: assumes that figure it out, and they have, but they haven't. 485 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:07,560 Speaker 2: That's a huge game for the Chiefs, and suddenly the 486 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:12,000 Speaker 2: Cowboys seem competitive with it. Can they upset the Chiefs tomorrow? 487 00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:13,160 Speaker 13: They can? 488 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:14,320 Speaker 2: They can? 489 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:19,919 Speaker 13: I think that if you believe all of the hype, 490 00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:25,720 Speaker 13: you assume like the Chiefs are are going to win 491 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:28,240 Speaker 13: another Super Bowl or appear in another Super Bowl, and 492 00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:31,639 Speaker 13: the Dallas Cowboys are destined to be, you know, dog 493 00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:35,960 Speaker 13: meat of the NFC. But don't buy the hype. I mean, 494 00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:39,600 Speaker 13: just watch the games. The Cowboys have all pro talent 495 00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:42,960 Speaker 13: on that offense, The Cowboys have a defense that's really 496 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:46,040 Speaker 13: struggled this year, but they've won some track meets and 497 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:50,240 Speaker 13: they've made some plays when they've needed to defensively in 498 00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:54,960 Speaker 13: tight games. Now, in the NFL, it's very different from college. 499 00:28:55,160 --> 00:28:57,600 Speaker 13: You know, Look, you can have teams on your schedule 500 00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:00,680 Speaker 13: late in the season where you're gonna beat them by 501 00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:03,760 Speaker 13: forty points because you're thirty seven and a half point favorites. 502 00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 13: You know, in the NFL, everybody can beat everybody. So 503 00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:10,640 Speaker 13: you can't convince me that this is just a rollover 504 00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:12,719 Speaker 13: game for the Chiefs, like they are going to just 505 00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:14,760 Speaker 13: you know, just because they're coming off a fresh window 506 00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:18,520 Speaker 13: going to ot with the Colts, and you know, and 507 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:21,600 Speaker 13: and you know they're playing on a short week like that, 508 00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 13: they will automatically lose. No, they're not going to roll 509 00:29:26,240 --> 00:29:29,800 Speaker 13: over for anybody. But I also don't consider them automatic 510 00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 13: winners either because of where they've been and who they are, 511 00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:36,640 Speaker 13: they still got to play these games in Dallas Cowboys, 512 00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:40,160 Speaker 13: they're a formidable threat. And I think Dak Prescott is 513 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:43,280 Speaker 13: playing some really good football and nobody seems to notice 514 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:46,160 Speaker 13: because he's got just above a five hundred average or 515 00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:48,600 Speaker 13: five hundred record. With the five to five and one 516 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,320 Speaker 13: record that the Cowboys are boasting right now. 517 00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:55,560 Speaker 2: Doug Gottlieb Show here on Fox Sports Radio. Last thing 518 00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:59,040 Speaker 2: we started the show talk about Joe Burrow and how 519 00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:01,320 Speaker 2: now he's going to be this figure because he's playing 520 00:30:01,320 --> 00:30:04,680 Speaker 2: football when they have a very very very medusical chance 521 00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:08,520 Speaker 2: of making the playoffs and rich. It does strike me 522 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:13,480 Speaker 2: as ironic that you're in my generation, like we're the 523 00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 2: ones that kind of came up with the idea of 524 00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:20,240 Speaker 2: sitting guys. It might have been agents back in college football, right, 525 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:22,920 Speaker 2: but sitting guys because well they didn't have much to 526 00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:26,920 Speaker 2: play for and load management in the NBA, and it 527 00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:30,479 Speaker 2: doesn't make sense. Nobody would thirty years ago, nobod would say, hey, 528 00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:32,440 Speaker 2: you shouldn't play because you're not in the playoffs. But 529 00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:35,400 Speaker 2: now it's very much part of the conversation. That conversation 530 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:38,720 Speaker 2: has been started by our generation. But we're the same 531 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:42,520 Speaker 2: generation that's critical of the guys now for missing games 532 00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:45,520 Speaker 2: when they're healthy enough to play. Where do you stand 533 00:30:45,560 --> 00:30:48,760 Speaker 2: on Joe Burrow becoming kind of a hero for yesterday 534 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:51,600 Speaker 2: going like, look, I'm a football player. If I get hurt, 535 00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:54,760 Speaker 2: I'll rehab and I'll come back next year. It be fine, right. 536 00:30:56,200 --> 00:31:00,360 Speaker 13: I love the attitude. I love the attitude, and you 537 00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:02,800 Speaker 13: know I agree with you. I think there are times 538 00:31:02,800 --> 00:31:06,240 Speaker 13: where a coach needs to come back and throttle back 539 00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:09,479 Speaker 13: a player, but that needs to be how it goes. 540 00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:12,760 Speaker 13: I don't think. I don't think it's a good message 541 00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:15,280 Speaker 13: to send when you're a team leader and one of 542 00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:17,600 Speaker 13: the best players not only on the field but on 543 00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:21,920 Speaker 13: the planet, and in a reckless game like football, you're 544 00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 13: saying things like, hey, I got to really look out 545 00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:27,880 Speaker 13: for the future, not only mine, but the future of 546 00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:31,280 Speaker 13: this franchise because they're really gonna need and rely on 547 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:34,760 Speaker 13: my talents next year. No, no, no, screw that. You 548 00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:37,080 Speaker 13: need to be the guy that's chomping out the bit 549 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:39,800 Speaker 13: to get back on the field. And if anybody is 550 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:42,880 Speaker 13: going to say anything about whether or not you should play, 551 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:47,400 Speaker 13: it needs to be the voices in the room around you. 552 00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:48,880 Speaker 13: You know, it needs to be your head coach saying 553 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:51,920 Speaker 13: absolutely not, under any circumstances are we sending you back 554 00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:55,719 Speaker 13: out there. You know it's still too early. You know, 555 00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:57,840 Speaker 13: you miss nine weeks of the season with turf tow 556 00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:00,959 Speaker 13: what's two more weeks, what's three more weeks, Like, if 557 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:04,080 Speaker 13: you want to play when we're closer to the finish 558 00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:06,360 Speaker 13: line here, just to get a couple of games on 559 00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:08,680 Speaker 13: your belt, we could have that conversation, but we're not 560 00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:12,000 Speaker 13: rushing you back in a lost season yet, Like that's 561 00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:14,120 Speaker 13: the way this should have been. If it's going to 562 00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:16,520 Speaker 13: be messaged, it should be messaged. So I think Joe 563 00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:19,640 Speaker 13: Burrow is pitch perfect here. If the coach thinks it's 564 00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:22,040 Speaker 13: okay for you to play, if the trainers and the 565 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:24,480 Speaker 13: doctors think it's okay for you to play, then you 566 00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:27,840 Speaker 13: better go play football. Because guess what, you are a 567 00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:31,400 Speaker 13: grown man playing a kid's dean for a king's ransom, 568 00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:34,240 Speaker 13: and it is the best job on earth. And Doug, 569 00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:36,560 Speaker 13: I know you welcome me on because I like to 570 00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:38,400 Speaker 13: talk and I like to talk to you, but also 571 00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:40,640 Speaker 13: because of my playing experience, and I can tell you 572 00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:43,440 Speaker 13: it is one of the most fun games and most 573 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:45,400 Speaker 13: fun things you could do with your life playing in 574 00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:47,880 Speaker 13: that league. So if you got a quarterback who does 575 00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:51,080 Speaker 13: want to get off the field, you got the wrong quarterback. 576 00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:54,720 Speaker 13: So I think Joe Burrow is hitting all of the 577 00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:57,520 Speaker 13: right notes, not only with the fan base, but with 578 00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 13: his teammates. And that's the reason why he's one of 579 00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:01,160 Speaker 13: the best doing it. 580 00:33:01,760 --> 00:33:04,320 Speaker 2: That's the voice of Rich Orenberger, former offensive lineman, hosts 581 00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 2: his own daily show in San Diego, and you can 582 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:08,320 Speaker 2: also hear him count down to Kickoff with Jared Smith 583 00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:10,440 Speaker 2: and Brian know Airs each Saturday between nine am and 584 00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:12,720 Speaker 2: new Eastern time. Listen live on our Fox Sports tradi 585 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:16,480 Speaker 2: affiliates on the iHeartRadio app presented by bet MGM. Rich. 586 00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:18,320 Speaker 2: Happy Thanksgiving. Thanks for joining us. 587 00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:21,560 Speaker 13: Yeah, Happy Thanksgiving? Doug anytime, happy to do it. 588 00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:23,840 Speaker 8: Be sure to catch the live edition of The Doug 589 00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:27,400 Speaker 8: Gottlieb Show weekdays at three pm Eastern noon Pacific. 590 00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:36,760 Speaker 2: Doug Gottlieb Show, Fox Sports Radio. Mm hmmm, Sesame Street 591 00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:39,600 Speaker 2: help raise all of us. Now it's your turn donate 592 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:41,960 Speaker 2: this holiday season at sesame dot or. Because the world 593 00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:44,520 Speaker 2: needs ses to me and says to me needs you. 594 00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:49,840 Speaker 2: Let's go to Isaac Lohncrawm with the game. 595 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:55,880 Speaker 8: This is game time on the Doug Gottlieb Show. 596 00:33:57,000 --> 00:33:59,520 Speaker 2: It's the Doug gottlib Show, Fox Sports Radio. Ey sick 597 00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:00,640 Speaker 2: long Crow. What's the game today? 598 00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:01,040 Speaker 5: Hey Doug. 599 00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:03,640 Speaker 14: Before we get to the game, some rather interesting NFL 600 00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:06,720 Speaker 14: news just dropping The Detroit Lions just announced four time 601 00:34:06,760 --> 00:34:10,759 Speaker 14: Pro Bowl center Frank Ragnow is coming out of retirement. 602 00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:15,160 Speaker 14: Ragnow had retired in June after seven seasons in the NFL, 603 00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:17,480 Speaker 14: again a four time Pro Bowler, and now onto. 604 00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:20,240 Speaker 8: The game for better or worse? 605 00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:25,280 Speaker 14: Well timely? First topic for better or worse? The Packers 606 00:34:25,680 --> 00:34:31,040 Speaker 14: or the subject of this development moments ago? The Lions. 607 00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:36,960 Speaker 2: The Lions better or worse than what Packers? Oh, Packers 608 00:34:36,960 --> 00:34:39,680 Speaker 2: are better. You don't go get Frank net raight Now 609 00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:42,759 Speaker 2: out of retirement unless there's something wrong at center. It 610 00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:46,120 Speaker 2: doesn't scream desperation. But I do think the Packers are 611 00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:46,600 Speaker 2: the better team. 612 00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:49,719 Speaker 14: That's a good point. Perhaps it should have been Ragged 613 00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:52,680 Speaker 14: later instead of rag Now. All right, with that horrible 614 00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:55,000 Speaker 14: punt out of the way, for better or worse, two 615 00:34:55,040 --> 00:35:00,000 Speaker 14: more combatants tomorrow. The Cowboys are the Chiefs. 616 00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:02,319 Speaker 2: I kind of think the Cowboys are better. I'm gonna 617 00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:05,759 Speaker 2: go Cowboys are better. Chiefs are worse because there's there's 618 00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:09,040 Speaker 2: a level of expectations on the Chiefs which normally resides 619 00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:09,719 Speaker 2: on the Cowboys. 620 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:13,480 Speaker 14: You know what, I'm with you one hundred percent on 621 00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:16,640 Speaker 14: there wouldn't have said it, you know, six weeks ago 622 00:35:16,760 --> 00:35:20,120 Speaker 14: or whatever and the final matchup of Thanksgiving. For better 623 00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:22,840 Speaker 14: or worse, the Ravens are the Steelers. 624 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:24,840 Speaker 2: Oh, I think the Ravens are a lot better than 625 00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:26,680 Speaker 2: no Ravens playing the Bengals. 626 00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:29,480 Speaker 14: Oh sorry, sorry, Ravens are the Steelers? 627 00:35:29,480 --> 00:35:29,960 Speaker 2: Sorry just. 628 00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:32,479 Speaker 5: North in general? 629 00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:36,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, Ravens our quarterback is better. I think the Steelers 630 00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,320 Speaker 2: defense is massively overrated. 631 00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:40,520 Speaker 5: I like the Ravens, all right. 632 00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:41,839 Speaker 8: Uh. 633 00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:44,480 Speaker 14: I have to qualify this by saying I'm not the 634 00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:47,200 Speaker 14: one who suggested this next one, so please don't shoot 635 00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:50,720 Speaker 14: the messenger here. But for better or worse, Justin Allen 636 00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:52,000 Speaker 14: or Anthony Roy. 637 00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:54,759 Speaker 2: So Anthony Roy was the nation's leading scorer. He played 638 00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:57,240 Speaker 2: for me last year. He broke his ankle ten games in. 639 00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:01,840 Speaker 2: Justin Allen average twenty six game in the D three level, 640 00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:04,360 Speaker 2: and he had twenty seven and twenty eight in his 641 00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:07,880 Speaker 2: last two games. I'm going with Justin Allen because he 642 00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:13,800 Speaker 2: plays for me. Now that that's my answer. Okay, Andon 643 00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:16,080 Speaker 2: Roy plays for a different school. There you got, I'm 644 00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:16,719 Speaker 2: taking my guy. 645 00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:17,640 Speaker 5: All right. 646 00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:23,040 Speaker 14: This is going to be a Thanksgiving related item here. 647 00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:27,040 Speaker 14: For better or worse, dark meat or white meat? 648 00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:31,759 Speaker 2: Dark meat? Always always who eats. Who likes white meat? 649 00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:33,880 Speaker 2: White turkey meat? It's so dry? 650 00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:40,800 Speaker 5: No, that isn't the white meat. Isn't it best? Because 651 00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:44,319 Speaker 5: you could best utilized gravy. Like the dark meat doesn't 652 00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:47,200 Speaker 5: need gravy, the white meat does, and it's a great combination. 653 00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:51,560 Speaker 2: I'm sure you're right. I don't like gravy, so I 654 00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:54,680 Speaker 2: like I think the dark meat works with the cranberry 655 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:59,400 Speaker 2: and the stuffing or the dressing, whichever you do in 656 00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:01,560 Speaker 2: the sweet is all that. I think the dark meat 657 00:37:01,560 --> 00:37:03,279 Speaker 2: still works for it. But you're right. The white meat 658 00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:05,799 Speaker 2: is more absorbent, but it's absorbent for reason, and I 659 00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:07,600 Speaker 2: don't like gravy, and it's probably part of the reason 660 00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:08,399 Speaker 2: I don't like white meat. 661 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:12,800 Speaker 14: You cannot get this sort of Thanksgiving analysis anywhere else, 662 00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:15,759 Speaker 14: compared to this edition of For Better or Worse. 663 00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:17,920 Speaker 12: Game. 664 00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:22,000 Speaker 8: This is game time on the Doug Gottlieb Show. 665 00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:25,200 Speaker 2: Actually, I think you can get it everywhere, but I 666 00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:28,160 Speaker 2: just don't know if people share their knowledge their thoughts, 667 00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:31,839 Speaker 2: because look, I could be wrong. Maybe I'm wrong about 668 00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:33,960 Speaker 2: all of this. It's a Doug Gotlieb show on Fox 669 00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:38,040 Speaker 2: Sports Radio. The Midway is next. It's a Thanksgiving theme Midway. 670 00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:40,560 Speaker 2: You'll like it on the Doug Gottlieb Show. You're on 671 00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:41,880 Speaker 2: Fox Sports Radio.