1
00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:27,600
Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to

2
00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:31,000
Speaker 1: the show, Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so much

3
00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:33,960
Speaker 1: for tuning in. Let's give a big shout out to

4
00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:36,760
Speaker 1: our super producer, mister Max Williams.

5
00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:39,880
Speaker 2: Would you guys call me the conductor.

6
00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:42,040
Speaker 1: I've thought about it, but I don't want you to

7
00:00:42,080 --> 00:00:42,920
Speaker 1: get power man.

8
00:00:44,640 --> 00:00:46,120
Speaker 2: Like I haven't already gotten there.

9
00:00:46,520 --> 00:00:48,840
Speaker 3: No, I think you're okay. You're on the edge. You're

10
00:00:48,920 --> 00:00:53,760
Speaker 3: just on the edge of your power. Lukewarm power, curious power,

11
00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:58,960
Speaker 3: curious your nol. I bet this is Ridiculous History.

12
00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:03,240
Speaker 1: We're we're on the road for a couple of different

13
00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:07,080
Speaker 1: adventures right now, so you may you may hear us

14
00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:10,840
Speaker 1: doing some guest spots on some friends shows. We are

15
00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:13,920
Speaker 1: coming to you two thirds of the way from New York.

16
00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:18,440
Speaker 3: Oh, yes, I see, I see. I got the calculation there.

17
00:01:18,480 --> 00:01:22,880
Speaker 3: And yeah, you also might hear the thrum of a

18
00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:26,200
Speaker 3: heating unit that I can't figure out how to turn off.

19
00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:28,000
Speaker 3: But I'm doing my best. I've got the mic pointed

20
00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:30,520
Speaker 3: away from it. And Maxwell, I'm calling you that for

21
00:01:30,600 --> 00:01:33,960
Speaker 3: this episode for reasons. By the way, usually it's pretty

22
00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:36,320
Speaker 3: good at magicking that stuff away.

23
00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:40,200
Speaker 2: And actual James. Maybe maybe yes, see, I don't.

24
00:01:40,040 --> 00:01:42,600
Speaker 1: Know old m J. Also know, if you're comfortable with

25
00:01:42,680 --> 00:01:45,320
Speaker 1: us doing this on air, I can tell you what

26
00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:48,760
Speaker 1: the fan is. Background, folks, we're in the same hotel,

27
00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:50,440
Speaker 1: recording remotely.

28
00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:53,040
Speaker 3: I've seen each other yet in Atlanta.

29
00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:56,400
Speaker 1: Okay, So I was trying to figure this out while

30
00:01:56,440 --> 00:01:58,880
Speaker 1: I was doing some research this morning, because I flew

31
00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:01,920
Speaker 1: into an ungodly hour. If you I kid you not,

32
00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:04,040
Speaker 1: I bet I know what this is. You know, if

33
00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:06,040
Speaker 1: you go to your door and then you see the

34
00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:08,320
Speaker 1: light switch by the front door, you're going to see

35
00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:13,280
Speaker 1: a little plaque that says, uh like sound cancelation or other.

36
00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:16,320
Speaker 3: Okay, it's like a little knob. Yeah, let me go,

37
00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:20,639
Speaker 3: let go, uh caress the knob. Wait, not what you get?

38
00:02:20,720 --> 00:02:21,160
Speaker 3: You get it?

39
00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:25,720
Speaker 1: You get it, get it? And so uh while we're

40
00:02:25,760 --> 00:02:31,520
Speaker 1: doing that, I hope that works a bit of background, folks,

41
00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:36,200
Speaker 1: today's episode is all about model trains. Hints our banter

42
00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:37,000
Speaker 1: at the beginning.

43
00:02:37,080 --> 00:02:38,399
Speaker 3: What black magic is this?

44
00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:38,960
Speaker 2: Oh?

45
00:02:39,040 --> 00:02:43,240
Speaker 3: Did it works? It works? And it's weird because this hotel.

46
00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:45,919
Speaker 3: I guess the building is old because it's one of

47
00:02:45,960 --> 00:02:48,360
Speaker 3: those places where it has no convenient outlets and the

48
00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:51,320
Speaker 3: outlets that it does have don't like to grip a

49
00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:54,519
Speaker 3: modern plug very well. They just kind of slide right out.

50
00:02:54,720 --> 00:02:59,040
Speaker 3: And yet it has this new fangled noise masking system

51
00:02:59,240 --> 00:03:00,560
Speaker 3: for the heating.

52
00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:05,400
Speaker 1: It's because it's an open air like atrium inside and

53
00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:06,680
Speaker 1: they have that live band.

54
00:03:06,880 --> 00:03:09,799
Speaker 3: That's right, that's what I see what you're saying. So,

55
00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:12,600
Speaker 3: so the noise I was hearing was the feature, not

56
00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:13,519
Speaker 3: the bug.

57
00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:14,519
Speaker 2: Right, not yet.

58
00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:18,280
Speaker 3: It's it's white noise. It's just being generated. It wasn't

59
00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:21,040
Speaker 3: being generated. But wow, we're all learning so much about

60
00:03:21,400 --> 00:03:23,320
Speaker 3: this hotel. I'm not going to dock us and say

61
00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:24,960
Speaker 3: which one it is. But I like it here. We

62
00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:26,640
Speaker 3: like it here, and we haven't been in a while,

63
00:03:26,639 --> 00:03:28,919
Speaker 3: and I'm excited to be back in New York. And

64
00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:31,040
Speaker 3: I know we'll see each other in person very soon

65
00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:33,640
Speaker 3: been but in the meantime, we can just pretend like

66
00:03:33,680 --> 00:03:35,560
Speaker 3: it's business as usual, right.

67
00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:39,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, And that big aspiration and putting on my

68
00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:42,040
Speaker 1: vision board is I hope next time we're on the

69
00:03:42,080 --> 00:03:46,560
Speaker 1: road we can bring super producer maxwells with us.

70
00:03:47,000 --> 00:03:48,840
Speaker 3: For a second, I thought you were saying and right

71
00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:52,480
Speaker 3: now I'm putting on my vision pro uh goggles. So

72
00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:54,920
Speaker 3: that I can experience this from the moon.

73
00:03:55,240 --> 00:03:58,600
Speaker 1: Right there, we go, and we will podcast on the

74
00:03:58,600 --> 00:03:59,840
Speaker 1: moon one day.

75
00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:03,040
Speaker 3: We'll be the first. We'll be the first mark our words.

76
00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:06,800
Speaker 3: We said it here folks speaking of aspiration provision boards.

77
00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:10,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, so that might sound like a crazy ambition. Why

78
00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:13,120
Speaker 1: would you guys do that kind of thing? But you

79
00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:16,240
Speaker 1: know what, once upon a time people said the same

80
00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:19,680
Speaker 1: thing about toys like model trains.

81
00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:22,560
Speaker 3: Bro Once upon a time before that, people said the

82
00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:26,560
Speaker 3: same thing about trains. That's a very good point.

83
00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:31,040
Speaker 1: Yes, if God had wanted us to use railroads, we

84
00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:33,920
Speaker 1: would have tracks and wheels instead of feet whatever.

85
00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:34,280
Speaker 3: I thought.

86
00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:39,200
Speaker 1: So this is something that has been on our minds

87
00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:41,479
Speaker 1: for a while. I think, you know, like a lot

88
00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:46,680
Speaker 1: of kids I grew up with, I would say a dabbling,

89
00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:51,760
Speaker 1: a dabblement in the world of model trains, because these

90
00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:57,800
Speaker 1: things can get super ornate and super expensive pretty quickly.

91
00:04:57,920 --> 00:05:00,840
Speaker 1: I don't know, if you have ever had the chance

92
00:05:01,279 --> 00:05:03,840
Speaker 1: to go over to a friend's house, or maybe a

93
00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:07,480
Speaker 1: museum or an exhibit, you see someone who's gone all in,

94
00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:12,000
Speaker 1: like they have sacrificed their basement to have a little

95
00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:13,040
Speaker 1: town with a train.

96
00:05:13,560 --> 00:05:16,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, no I haven't, But if there is ever one

97
00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:21,120
Speaker 3: that I want to experience. It belongs to the seminal

98
00:05:21,440 --> 00:05:24,680
Speaker 3: nineteen seventies and on into our sixties even and on

99
00:05:24,720 --> 00:05:30,080
Speaker 3: into the present. Singer songwriter, artist extraordinary Neil Young, who

100
00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:35,720
Speaker 3: has apparently a one thousand foot square foot model train

101
00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:39,400
Speaker 3: situation on his ranch in northern California, and he's so

102
00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:44,440
Speaker 3: into classic trains, including a Lionel number seven fifty two

103
00:05:44,600 --> 00:05:49,760
Speaker 3: w Union specific, not specific, but Pacific Streamliner from the thirties,

104
00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:52,520
Speaker 3: as well as a wireless control system. All of this

105
00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:54,839
Speaker 3: like early model train stuff we're going to get into.

106
00:05:55,160 --> 00:05:56,919
Speaker 3: That'd be the one I want to hang out with.

107
00:05:57,000 --> 00:06:01,560
Speaker 3: Neil His in his model train dungeon whatever it is,

108
00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:03,120
Speaker 3: sounds more like a barn situation.

109
00:06:03,760 --> 00:06:07,880
Speaker 1: One thousand square feet. That's quite humbling because that's larger

110
00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:10,160
Speaker 1: than some of like one of my old apartments. But

111
00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:15,400
Speaker 1: I think this These things are really fascinating because they

112
00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:19,279
Speaker 1: also tell us a bit about the time in which

113
00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:22,359
Speaker 1: they were created. They're a way to view society. And

114
00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:24,200
Speaker 1: we also know we're just gonna go ahead and say this.

115
00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:27,719
Speaker 1: We're going to lean on Max at a couple points

116
00:06:27,720 --> 00:06:32,080
Speaker 1: in our conversation today because Max is a mad man

117
00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:33,160
Speaker 1: for model trains.

118
00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:37,720
Speaker 3: Mad Man Max the Conductor, Mad Max the mad Conductor.

119
00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:40,080
Speaker 3: Really like that. I like that.

120
00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:43,640
Speaker 1: And so these early trains, the first ones like they

121
00:06:43,720 --> 00:06:49,120
Speaker 1: date back to I guess like model railroading. The actual

122
00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:53,520
Speaker 1: ones that work and aren't just carved things. These date

123
00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:59,080
Speaker 1: back to the early nineteenth century tinplate toys were first manufactured,

124
00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:04,680
Speaker 1: and they were by clockwork mechanisms, so they were pretty complicated.

125
00:07:04,240 --> 00:07:08,360
Speaker 3: Very complicated, very expensive to produce, not really in the

126
00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:13,080
Speaker 3: realm of like mass manufactured objects, right.

127
00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:16,520
Speaker 1: I would say, you know, in the beginning, probably not

128
00:07:16,760 --> 00:07:21,600
Speaker 1: because they hadn't quite become popular right when they started.

129
00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:22,000
Speaker 3: It was.

130
00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:24,880
Speaker 1: It was by the end of the nineteenth century, the

131
00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:28,320
Speaker 1: end of the eighteen hundreds that the first commercial model

132
00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:30,560
Speaker 1: trains were made. So I'd say you're correct on that,

133
00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:34,840
Speaker 1: And well let's get into it. Let's start with this

134
00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:39,760
Speaker 1: great article by Barry Coulter from O Gauge Train Repair,

135
00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:43,240
Speaker 1: and you'll if you re listen to this episode, then

136
00:07:43,280 --> 00:07:45,720
Speaker 1: the title of that website will make much more.

137
00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:47,800
Speaker 3: Sense to you for sure. And by the way, Neil

138
00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:51,520
Speaker 3: Young's at least one of his you know, largest model

139
00:07:51,560 --> 00:07:55,040
Speaker 3: train setups is an O gauge which is a larger

140
00:07:55,240 --> 00:07:59,920
Speaker 3: scale model train. So before we we'll get into some

141
00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:03,800
Speaker 3: of these terms. But yeah, according to culture, model trains

142
00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:06,960
Speaker 3: is quote from this article have been the Christmas delight

143
00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:11,240
Speaker 3: of youngsters for many generations, from the most primitive replicas

144
00:08:11,280 --> 00:08:13,960
Speaker 3: of the Iron Horse in the eighteen hundreds the most

145
00:08:13,960 --> 00:08:18,520
Speaker 3: sophisticated railroad sets of today. Trains have remained atop the

146
00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:22,000
Speaker 3: Christmas lists of both the young and the old.

147
00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:29,320
Speaker 1: Because, as we're finding, they're also hacking nostalgia, right, because

148
00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:33,959
Speaker 1: kids have this vision often associated with holidays, Birthday, Christmas

149
00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:38,960
Speaker 1: in particular for the practitioners of Christmas. So when it

150
00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:42,760
Speaker 1: reminds me so much of what happens with legos, because

151
00:08:42,800 --> 00:08:45,360
Speaker 1: legos are kind of pricey, and one of the biggest

152
00:08:45,440 --> 00:08:50,520
Speaker 1: Lego markets is it children. It's adults who can finally

153
00:08:50,559 --> 00:08:55,760
Speaker 1: afford all the cool spaceships their parents wouldn't buy you Bulins.

154
00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:58,800
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, exactly. Isn't that funny though, I mean, it's

155
00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:03,800
Speaker 3: I'm stating the obvious here, but nostalgia obviously works in cycles, right,

156
00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:08,240
Speaker 3: because you can't have nostalgia for something until it's old

157
00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:11,199
Speaker 3: and kind of been forgotten and fallen out of fashion,

158
00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:14,080
Speaker 3: and then all of a sudden, you know, before you

159
00:09:14,120 --> 00:09:16,800
Speaker 3: know it, it sort of has this resurgence that can

160
00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:19,200
Speaker 3: kind of you know, wax and wane a little bit

161
00:09:19,240 --> 00:09:21,319
Speaker 3: on its own. And you know, Lego of course and

162
00:09:21,600 --> 00:09:25,080
Speaker 3: Model trains as well as we'll see really capitalize on that,

163
00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:28,599
Speaker 3: not only because of the you know, the medium itself,

164
00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:31,600
Speaker 3: but all the tie ins. Like you mentioned spaceships, right,

165
00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:34,800
Speaker 3: a lot of the big, really expensive Lego sets are

166
00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:37,000
Speaker 3: tied in with things like Star Wars, and they'll be

167
00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:40,480
Speaker 3: the classic Star Wars designs like the Death Star, the

168
00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:42,360
Speaker 3: Millennium Falcon or what have you.

169
00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:47,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, one hundred percent, and I love all of those.

170
00:09:47,080 --> 00:09:50,400
Speaker 1: In fact, I had a dark night of the soul

171
00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:53,440
Speaker 1: a few months back where I got very close to

172
00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:59,360
Speaker 1: buy just a cartoonishly expensive Lego set that I had

173
00:09:59,360 --> 00:10:02,080
Speaker 1: no room to put it anywhere, and add no business buying.

174
00:10:02,640 --> 00:10:06,600
Speaker 3: Uh. We've been doing the Lego set like floral arrangements,

175
00:10:07,480 --> 00:10:09,800
Speaker 3: and we've got so many of them now and have

176
00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:14,199
Speaker 3: actually very recently started growing our own actual facts flowers.

177
00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:17,400
Speaker 3: So the Lego flowers are sort of starting to be

178
00:10:17,480 --> 00:10:20,480
Speaker 3: a little bit in the way, so I've had to

179
00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:23,560
Speaker 3: I've had to relegate them to my basement studio situation,

180
00:10:23,559 --> 00:10:25,240
Speaker 3: which is fine because I love them and they never died.

181
00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:28,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've got I've got a couple of the Lego

182
00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:32,679
Speaker 1: architecture sets. People kept giving those to me for Christmas

183
00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:35,480
Speaker 1: because I said, anything but socks to my friends.

184
00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:38,480
Speaker 3: They celebrate Christmas also socks. As an adult, I love

185
00:10:38,520 --> 00:10:39,080
Speaker 3: a good sock.

186
00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:42,680
Speaker 1: I feel like I'm always almost out of socks. It's weird,

187
00:10:42,920 --> 00:10:46,200
Speaker 1: but all right, today's story about model trains. We have

188
00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:50,720
Speaker 1: to talk about trains, the actual trains people, you know,

189
00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:56,280
Speaker 1: normal sized people rioted And this concept is modern in

190
00:10:56,320 --> 00:10:59,320
Speaker 1: the grand scheme of things, I guess, but it dates back.

191
00:10:59,679 --> 00:11:03,440
Speaker 1: Surprise icingly, Long time Culture points out the concept of

192
00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:07,160
Speaker 1: steam engine trains and locomotives. Yes, doesn't come around till

193
00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:10,680
Speaker 1: the eighteen hundreds, but the idea of making a train

194
00:11:11,280 --> 00:11:13,600
Speaker 1: dates all the way back to you know, ancient Rome.

195
00:11:13,760 --> 00:11:15,960
Speaker 3: Oh man, I mean, it's really just a practical way

196
00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:19,320
Speaker 3: of moving stuff. You know, if you'll if if one

197
00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:22,040
Speaker 3: bucket full of stuff is good, then why not link

198
00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:24,720
Speaker 3: ten or twenty buckets full of stuff? And then you

199
00:11:24,720 --> 00:11:27,640
Speaker 3: have to do the calculation of how much pull do

200
00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:31,840
Speaker 3: I need to get these things moving? In the Roman times,

201
00:11:32,200 --> 00:11:37,439
Speaker 3: they actually created these paved sort of precursor railway systems

202
00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:41,720
Speaker 3: for these wagons that were drawn by of course animals.

203
00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:45,480
Speaker 3: And then later in England we started to see horse

204
00:11:45,600 --> 00:11:48,439
Speaker 3: drawn wagons that were built out of the same kind

205
00:11:48,480 --> 00:11:51,400
Speaker 3: of idea in order to carry coals from the mines

206
00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:55,600
Speaker 3: where they were you know, mined to loading sites onto

207
00:11:55,640 --> 00:11:58,600
Speaker 3: boats where they could then be shipped and used for trade,

208
00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:03,679
Speaker 3: you know, to all parts of the United Kingdom. So

209
00:12:03,800 --> 00:12:05,320
Speaker 3: it is a pretty And then of course in the

210
00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:07,480
Speaker 3: early days of trains we start seeing you know, the

211
00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:11,000
Speaker 3: iron horse. That's the term that's being used because it's

212
00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:15,120
Speaker 3: replacing the actual horse, much like horsepower in cars is

213
00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:18,880
Speaker 3: used as the sort of amorphous measurement for you know,

214
00:12:18,920 --> 00:12:21,640
Speaker 3: how fast and how much torque you know, a vehicle

215
00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:22,280
Speaker 3: can produce.

216
00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:26,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's kind of a skewmrph almost right, the

217
00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:28,439
Speaker 1: concept of horsepower.

218
00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:30,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, remind us again, I think we talked about it

219
00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:34,800
Speaker 3: on our episode with Morocco. But the skew morph is

220
00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:38,360
Speaker 3: sort of a familiar thing that's built into a new

221
00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:40,760
Speaker 3: thing to make people not scared of the new thing.

222
00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:44,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a pretty that's a pretty good definition there.

223
00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:49,240
Speaker 1: The roots of model trains go back to when steam

224
00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:53,120
Speaker 1: powered locomotives are first introduced. And this is a common

225
00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:55,800
Speaker 1: thing because you know, you see it now in twenty

226
00:12:55,840 --> 00:12:59,319
Speaker 1: twenty four as we record, a lot of young kids,

227
00:12:59,840 --> 00:13:03,000
Speaker 1: like very young children, go through these phases where they're

228
00:13:03,040 --> 00:13:08,080
Speaker 1: fascinated with machinery, right like construction equipment, et cetera, tru

229
00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:12,520
Speaker 1: sump trucks, space shuttles. So when the steam powered locomotive

230
00:13:12,559 --> 00:13:16,080
Speaker 1: comes out, it's like on the level of a space

231
00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:20,840
Speaker 1: shuttle and it's launching the world into industrialization. It becomes

232
00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:25,760
Speaker 1: this symbol of progress of innovation and James Maxwell no

233
00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:30,720
Speaker 1: relation to our pale Max Williams. He cites that I

234
00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:31,840
Speaker 1: had to get that one in for you.

235
00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:32,160
Speaker 3: Max.

236
00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:37,240
Speaker 1: He cites that they become this iconic thing. Originally they

237
00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:40,920
Speaker 1: weren't made for kids. They were made for engineers and

238
00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:44,160
Speaker 1: people working in the railroad industry so that they could

239
00:13:44,320 --> 00:13:52,000
Speaker 1: understand how actual full scale trains would work. Absolutely is

240
00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:53,120
Speaker 1: what you do in engineering.

241
00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:55,640
Speaker 3: You still do it. Have you ever you know, seen

242
00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:58,640
Speaker 3: like city planners or urban planners and say that you'll

243
00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:02,800
Speaker 3: always see, you know, these kind of little miniaturized versions

244
00:14:02,920 --> 00:14:06,040
Speaker 3: of a city or like of a development or whatever uh.

245
00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:10,080
Speaker 3: And and with prototyping with cars and that level of engineering,

246
00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:13,720
Speaker 3: especially when it comes to design, you'll see these very

247
00:14:13,720 --> 00:14:17,719
Speaker 3: elaborately kind of like uh crafted, hand crafted off in

248
00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:20,760
Speaker 3: clay models of the ultimate design.

249
00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:21,880
Speaker 2: I love it.

250
00:14:22,840 --> 00:14:24,840
Speaker 1: Such a sucker for that. I used to hang out

251
00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:28,640
Speaker 1: at our the building where old office was. They had

252
00:14:28,680 --> 00:14:32,640
Speaker 1: a yes, exact model. And it also reminds, you know,

253
00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:35,600
Speaker 1: it's one of the best parts of Hereditary is the

254
00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:39,600
Speaker 1: building of those models at dioramas, the best parts.

255
00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:43,640
Speaker 3: That movie is such a soul crushing bummer, but it's excellent.

256
00:14:43,720 --> 00:14:47,880
Speaker 3: It's very very good. It's a classic buddy comedy. Yeah right,

257
00:14:47,960 --> 00:14:50,360
Speaker 3: not for the faint of heart. Yeah, it's true. And

258
00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:52,400
Speaker 3: and and a lot of these techniques, you know, have

259
00:14:52,560 --> 00:14:57,240
Speaker 3: been largely replaced by digital modeling now. But you know,

260
00:14:57,600 --> 00:15:00,760
Speaker 3: much like the nostalgia boom that goes along with the

261
00:15:00,840 --> 00:15:03,840
Speaker 3: you know, resurgence and popularity of model trains and Lego's.

262
00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:06,240
Speaker 3: Like we were talking, there's a lot of sort of

263
00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:09,640
Speaker 3: classicist sort of ideas behind design where they're like, no,

264
00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:12,760
Speaker 3: we don't, we don't do the digital version, you know,

265
00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:14,160
Speaker 3: we only do it by hand.

266
00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:19,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, And speaking making things by hand, it should

267
00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:22,000
Speaker 1: be no surprise than that model trains, like a lot

268
00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:24,640
Speaker 1: of toys, to be honest, come from this sort of

269
00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:30,040
Speaker 1: high faluting I'm always say not quite high falluting, mid flute,

270
00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:41,800
Speaker 1: a mid foalute artisanal background. If you want to see

271
00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:45,800
Speaker 1: the origin the first trained toys model trains, you're going

272
00:15:45,880 --> 00:15:49,360
Speaker 1: to look into Germany in the eighteen thirties. Now when

273
00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:53,200
Speaker 1: they're making these initial trains. And I know some people

274
00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:55,480
Speaker 1: don't want to be called toy trains. So when they're

275
00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:57,720
Speaker 1: making these model trains the.

276
00:15:57,760 --> 00:16:00,760
Speaker 3: First your dad said, this isn't a toy, you know,

277
00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:01,640
Speaker 3: don't touch my.

278
00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:05,239
Speaker 1: Stuff, or like Hank and breaking bad is like they're minerals.

279
00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:07,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, don't call it rocks.

280
00:16:07,160 --> 00:16:12,000
Speaker 1: But anyway, so these these German craftsmen, their crafts folk,

281
00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:15,880
Speaker 1: they pour molten brass or maybe ten into a into

282
00:16:15,920 --> 00:16:19,400
Speaker 1: a mold, the same way that they earlier made ten soldiers,

283
00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:23,400
Speaker 1: and then they judge it up with wooden fittings like

284
00:16:23,440 --> 00:16:26,720
Speaker 1: you were talking about handcarved stuff. It makes it look

285
00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:30,080
Speaker 1: like a miniature version of a train. But these things

286
00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:34,640
Speaker 1: are fragile. They don't have any moving parts. You manually

287
00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:35,960
Speaker 1: push them along a track.

288
00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:39,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, not quite as cool. And not quite as indicative

289
00:16:39,760 --> 00:16:45,040
Speaker 3: of the like true logistics of locomotion, right, which is

290
00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:48,360
Speaker 3: ultimately I think what really attracts people to the stuff

291
00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:50,560
Speaker 3: is like that makes them like go all out and

292
00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:53,560
Speaker 3: buy the conductor's hat and stand in the middle of

293
00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:57,040
Speaker 3: their giant ring of train trav model train tracks in

294
00:16:57,080 --> 00:17:01,680
Speaker 3: their city that they are both you know, engineer mayor

295
00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:04,120
Speaker 3: and god of exactly.

296
00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:09,600
Speaker 1: And this gets us to the more elaborate early model trains.

297
00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:15,400
Speaker 1: The crafts folk over in France are already great tinsmiths

298
00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:20,639
Speaker 1: and they become known for making very ornate designs on

299
00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:25,480
Speaker 1: their toy trains, tall chimneys just so spoke to wheels,

300
00:17:25,960 --> 00:17:29,159
Speaker 1: and these trains are I would say, like if you

301
00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:31,560
Speaker 1: look at them, you would think the French ones are

302
00:17:31,600 --> 00:17:36,440
Speaker 1: almost more like art pieces. The German trains had the tracks,

303
00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:40,200
Speaker 1: but the French trains didn't. You just pushed them along

304
00:17:40,320 --> 00:17:44,199
Speaker 1: the floor. And unfortunately, it's kind of like when you

305
00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:46,440
Speaker 1: look at the Pyramids today, when you look at those

306
00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:49,960
Speaker 1: old original French model trains, you have to realize they

307
00:17:50,080 --> 00:17:53,120
Speaker 1: used to look a lot different because they were painted

308
00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:56,119
Speaker 1: and paint does not stick to tin very well.

309
00:17:56,720 --> 00:18:00,359
Speaker 3: That's a good point. Yeah, those do those classic tens

310
00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:05,040
Speaker 3: unless they've been you know, sort of preserved or sort

311
00:18:05,040 --> 00:18:09,240
Speaker 3: of re painted, I guess they do tend to lose

312
00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:12,520
Speaker 3: that luster and look a little bit decrepit. Yeah.

313
00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:15,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good point too. Like we see other

314
00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:20,960
Speaker 1: European forces making model trains. There was a designer in England,

315
00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:25,240
Speaker 1: Sir Henry Wood. Yeah, he's the one who took it

316
00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:28,240
Speaker 1: up a notch and he said, how cool would it

317
00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:32,280
Speaker 1: be if these trains actually worked like real trains. So

318
00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:35,320
Speaker 1: he built the first steam powered toys and they've got

319
00:18:35,359 --> 00:18:36,440
Speaker 1: some famous names.

320
00:18:36,600 --> 00:18:40,880
Speaker 3: That's right. Well, these are more like I guess colloquial nicknames, right,

321
00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:44,840
Speaker 3: the dribblers and the piddlers because of this sort of

322
00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:48,399
Speaker 3: snail trail they kind of leave behind them with the

323
00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:52,800
Speaker 3: excess moisture that gets produced from the steam. But still

324
00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:55,159
Speaker 3: super cool. Again, this is like a like a like

325
00:18:55,200 --> 00:18:59,880
Speaker 3: a scale model kind of situation, and it's operating largely

326
00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:03,880
Speaker 3: in the similar manner to the real thing.

327
00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:08,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, which is endlessly fascinating. They also have, as you

328
00:19:08,640 --> 00:19:10,639
Speaker 1: point out the research ear Max, they also have some

329
00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:14,320
Speaker 1: of the same annoyances for parents that other toys had,

330
00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:17,600
Speaker 1: like stepping on the lego piece you know, now you've

331
00:19:17,640 --> 00:19:22,199
Speaker 1: slipped on a snail trail of water, yeap, and and

332
00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:25,560
Speaker 1: you can't you can't break the toy training because you're

333
00:19:25,560 --> 00:19:26,919
Speaker 1: probably paid so much for it.

334
00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:31,040
Speaker 3: So these are largely in the realm of the let's

335
00:19:31,040 --> 00:19:35,400
Speaker 3: say it privileged at this point, right, I mean not always.

336
00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:37,919
Speaker 1: Again, I think mid Fillutin is good. It was definitely

337
00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:42,000
Speaker 1: a toy that well to do children would have, but

338
00:19:42,080 --> 00:19:45,399
Speaker 1: I think also at this time a lot of families

339
00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:47,160
Speaker 1: were still making their own toys.

340
00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:50,440
Speaker 3: Oh that's a good point, especially, and you know European

341
00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:55,480
Speaker 3: toys have a rich history of craftsmanship, you know, and

342
00:19:55,800 --> 00:19:58,919
Speaker 3: wooden toys, and then the idea of like making your

343
00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:05,960
Speaker 3: own that comes from this similar type of design, you know, ethos, Yeah, agreed.

344
00:20:06,119 --> 00:20:09,960
Speaker 1: And we also want to point out that the craftsmen

345
00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:14,560
Speaker 1: who were making these toy trains previously they were making

346
00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:17,920
Speaker 1: other toy trains, but they were also making musical instruments,

347
00:20:18,240 --> 00:20:22,760
Speaker 1: so they had the manufacturing prowess to make the the

348
00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:26,880
Speaker 1: small clockwork mechanisms you needed for these working toy trains,

349
00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:32,800
Speaker 1: and their clockwork approach eliminated the design flaw of the

350
00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:35,200
Speaker 1: first steam powered toys, and.

351
00:20:35,240 --> 00:20:40,159
Speaker 3: These definitely would have been Oh yeah, yeah, largely reigated

352
00:20:40,600 --> 00:20:43,000
Speaker 3: to the to the rich, the riches of the riches.

353
00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:47,760
Speaker 3: The company Newton and Co. Which already sounds like a

354
00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:52,359
Speaker 3: mega bespoke old timey company. Yeah, this is this is

355
00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:57,200
Speaker 3: the company that was making these much more elaborate brass models. However,

356
00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:03,400
Speaker 3: they still weren't particularly accurate, try as they might, nor

357
00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:07,959
Speaker 3: were they you know, scaled correctly. And again, you know,

358
00:21:08,040 --> 00:21:09,919
Speaker 3: maybe we haven't gone through this exactly, but I think

359
00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:13,280
Speaker 3: people can probably put it together. Scaling really refers to

360
00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:16,840
Speaker 3: just like how you know, like not one to one,

361
00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:18,520
Speaker 3: but like you know, if you have like a part

362
00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:21,400
Speaker 3: that is a certain size compared to the large thing,

363
00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:24,520
Speaker 3: then that smaller version is going to have that same

364
00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:27,440
Speaker 3: part be in proportion to a smaller thing.

365
00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:32,479
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, Just like with any other kind of hobbyist model,

366
00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:35,359
Speaker 1: whether that's a car or whether that's a you know,

367
00:21:35,359 --> 00:21:41,840
Speaker 1: an airplane or something, the scale is a representation of

368
00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:45,679
Speaker 1: the proportion of the accuracy of the proportions. And I

369
00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:49,240
Speaker 1: think it's like you said, one to one, so one

370
00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:50,680
Speaker 1: to one scale is life size.

371
00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:52,360
Speaker 3: It's the real thing, right, And we're going to get

372
00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:55,240
Speaker 3: into the various different types of scale in a little

373
00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:56,159
Speaker 3: bit yeah.

374
00:21:56,240 --> 00:22:00,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, and like you said with the European craftsman with

375
00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:07,160
Speaker 1: the clockwork trains, these are for the well to do families.

376
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:10,240
Speaker 1: They don't really catch on in the United States though,

377
00:22:10,359 --> 00:22:15,280
Speaker 1: at this point, and that's because it's seen as like

378
00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:19,400
Speaker 1: kind of a fancy pants European thing until Uncle Sam's

379
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:21,119
Speaker 1: folks start making their own trains.

380
00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:25,000
Speaker 3: Leave it to the Americans to take something fancy and

381
00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:30,320
Speaker 3: bespoken European and turn it into trash. I'm kidding. They're cool,

382
00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:33,440
Speaker 3: they're more accessible. It's a big deal that they do this,

383
00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:36,919
Speaker 3: but it is sort of the reputation I think of

384
00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:41,359
Speaker 3: American design compared to say European design and manufacturing to

385
00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:45,199
Speaker 3: be a little less concerned with the details and a

386
00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:49,920
Speaker 3: little more concerned with the quantity perhaps sober quality. Yeah,

387
00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:51,120
Speaker 3: economy of scale.

388
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:54,199
Speaker 1: So it's the mid eighteen hundreds. This is where we

389
00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:57,760
Speaker 1: start to see the US market of toy trains come

390
00:22:57,760 --> 00:23:03,639
Speaker 1: into the four Matthias Baldwin, founder of the Baltimore Locomotive Works,

391
00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:07,359
Speaker 1: makes a trade model in the eighteen thirties, and then

392
00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:10,639
Speaker 1: if you get to like the late eighteen thirties to

393
00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:14,840
Speaker 1: eighteen forty, then you'll see several other toy makers start

394
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:18,919
Speaker 1: making their own toy trains, and for one reason or another,

395
00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:23,679
Speaker 1: Americans prefer buying these to the European what's probably affordability

396
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:24,720
Speaker 1: is a huge part of it.

397
00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:30,160
Speaker 3: Absolutely, and I am being grossly general in my description

398
00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:34,440
Speaker 3: of American manufacturer. America obviously makes some really great products,

399
00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:37,160
Speaker 3: and there are incredible crafts folk here in the United

400
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,760
Speaker 3: States and have been for a generations. So please do

401
00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:44,320
Speaker 3: not take my tongue in cheek statement there as a

402
00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:49,040
Speaker 3: total condemnation of American toy makers and or manufactured while

403
00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:51,920
Speaker 3: good to come for us. Yeah, please don't mind. I'm

404
00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:57,000
Speaker 3: scared of you. Sebastian Bach of skid Row another massive

405
00:23:57,040 --> 00:24:00,280
Speaker 3: model train enthusiast, and Neil Young please don't come for

406
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:03,960
Speaker 3: me together gang up on me. But to that point,

407
00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:07,000
Speaker 3: this is what is considered. From from eighteen sixty two

408
00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:12,000
Speaker 3: around eighteen ninety, the golden age of American ten train making.

409
00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:18,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot of famous train makers come into the game,

410
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:22,919
Speaker 1: especially after George Brown and Co. From Connecticut makes the

411
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:26,920
Speaker 1: first self propelled American model train. It was clockwork nuts

412
00:24:26,920 --> 00:24:29,920
Speaker 1: steam powered, and so you get companies that might be

413
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:35,240
Speaker 1: familiar to model train buffs ives Holland Stafford, auth of

414
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:39,800
Speaker 1: Bergman and Co. Francis Field and Francis James follows they

415
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,479
Speaker 1: sound a lot like watch companies, you know, like a

416
00:24:42,560 --> 00:24:49,920
Speaker 1: classy yeah, watch company. But still they didn't have the

417
00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:54,280
Speaker 1: they didn't have all them we associate with model trains today.

418
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:57,679
Speaker 1: They just their designs were simple. They sold the train.

419
00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:01,080
Speaker 1: The rest of the world old you might build around

420
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:01,760
Speaker 1: the train was.

421
00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:04,920
Speaker 3: Up to you, exactly, And that's part of the fun

422
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,920
Speaker 3: of it, really is the modular nature of the whole thing, right,

423
00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:11,119
Speaker 3: which we'll get into more of the accessory options in

424
00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:15,960
Speaker 3: a little bit. So train travel has now become a

425
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:20,280
Speaker 3: bit more of a thing that you know, everyone can afford.

426
00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,520
Speaker 3: It's not just used for industry. It's used for you know,

427
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:26,720
Speaker 3: moving moving people and for kind of you know, taking

428
00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:32,440
Speaker 3: more kind of pleasure trips. Right. So James Maxwell, as

429
00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:35,199
Speaker 3: we mentioned in that Medium article, writes that with the

430
00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:37,680
Speaker 3: increasing popularity of rail travel and the advent of mass

431
00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:41,160
Speaker 3: production techniques, the toy train industry really starts to take

432
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:43,960
Speaker 3: shape in the late nineteenth century. This is when we

433
00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:49,600
Speaker 3: start to see Lionel, just an American company, and Merklen,

434
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:53,439
Speaker 3: which is a German company, start to really emerge as

435
00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:57,040
Speaker 3: kind of the main players in the game, especially in

436
00:25:57,160 --> 00:26:03,879
Speaker 3: terms of quality and affordability, kind of the balance between

437
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 3: those two right.

438
00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:09,560
Speaker 1: Right, right, So they're taking different approaches, like Mirklan focuses

439
00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:15,720
Speaker 1: on these really accurate, highly detailed replicas of locomotives and

440
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:19,520
Speaker 1: what's called rolling stock. Rolling stock is the term for

441
00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:24,000
Speaker 1: things like cargo units. Rolling stock just describes anything attached

442
00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:28,000
Speaker 1: or part of the train that is not the locomotive. Right,

443
00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:30,080
Speaker 1: so your caboose sleeper car.

444
00:26:30,600 --> 00:26:33,919
Speaker 3: Percent think about getting stopped at a railroad crossing and

445
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:38,520
Speaker 3: just seeing the line of you know, shipping containers blasting pass.

446
00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:40,800
Speaker 3: That's rolling stock. That's rolling stock.

447
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:45,119
Speaker 1: And so Miriklin appeals to collectors who are really about

448
00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:50,280
Speaker 1: high quality and authenticity, and Lionel gets more of a

449
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:55,400
Speaker 1: reputation for these are fun model trains for kids and

450
00:26:55,480 --> 00:27:00,680
Speaker 1: for serious hobbyists. And this history proves that this approach

451
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:03,560
Speaker 1: works very well for Lionel. It was founded in nineteen

452
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:09,160
Speaker 1: hundred by Joshua Lionel Cowen Cohen, and this company would

453
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:12,320
Speaker 1: go on to become one of the most influential manufacturers

454
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:13,880
Speaker 1: in all of the United States.

455
00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:17,800
Speaker 3: And it's interesting too, because initially they weren't even manufacturing

456
00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:21,879
Speaker 3: these as a toy or as you know, a solution

457
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:25,520
Speaker 3: for these hobbyists. We can totally picture this if we

458
00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:28,919
Speaker 3: think of the classic toy store, you know, department store

459
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:34,560
Speaker 3: kind of window dressing operation with the train, the model

460
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:37,359
Speaker 3: train going around and around a track. It's maybe you know,

461
00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:40,919
Speaker 3: elevated up in the ceiling, right, and that is what

462
00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 3: the original Lionel designs were meant to do. The Electric

463
00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:50,440
Speaker 3: Express was designed to be a particularly fetching window display

464
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:51,440
Speaker 3: for toy stores.

465
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it worked by golly by gum because you know,

466
00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:00,520
Speaker 1: at this point when they designed their first train, Electric

467
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:04,679
Speaker 1: Express and show it in toy stores, they're working in

468
00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 1: a world where most people are not going to have

469
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:11,199
Speaker 1: electricity in their house. So that's this huge appeal. And

470
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 1: by the time we hit nineteen oh six, they're moving

471
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:18,560
Speaker 1: so quickly. They start companies start selling pre assembled tracks,

472
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:22,880
Speaker 1: you can get different rolling stock and engines, and this

473
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:27,199
Speaker 1: is where the modern Lionel train company really begins to

474
00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:31,639
Speaker 1: take shape, because look, yeah, it might not be fancy,

475
00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:34,919
Speaker 1: it might not be the locomotive equivalent of a Philip

476
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:40,160
Speaker 1: Ptek or something, but we we know people were saying, hey,

477
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:42,280
Speaker 1: these are really good toys. They do have a lot

478
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:46,360
Speaker 1: of quality, and then Lionel does something that's even smarter.

479
00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:51,480
Speaker 1: They introduce all these cool little bells and whistles sometimes

480
00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:55,200
Speaker 1: literally cool little bells and whistles, but like smoke generators,

481
00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:57,400
Speaker 1: remote control systems, all the fun stuff.

482
00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:00,479
Speaker 3: Well it's neat too, because you know, these early Lionel

483
00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:06,360
Speaker 3: trains were powered by batteries, early kind of versions of

484
00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:08,800
Speaker 3: batteries known as wet cells, which are you know, these

485
00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:12,360
Speaker 3: little things that are filled with corrosive acid, which of

486
00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:15,080
Speaker 3: course were replaced largely by I believe dry cell batteries,

487
00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:17,400
Speaker 3: although I do you know, certain batteries you get to

488
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:19,600
Speaker 3: this day, like energizer or whatever. If you leave them

489
00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 3: in something for long enough, they do start to corrode,

490
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:24,480
Speaker 3: similar to the kind of you know, corrosion you'll see

491
00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:27,000
Speaker 3: on your car battery. So there is still some kind

492
00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:31,480
Speaker 3: of nasty chemical inside these batteries today, right, Yeah, there's

493
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:32,000
Speaker 3: still some.

494
00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:36,840
Speaker 1: Weird stuff going on, but'll you run into that with

495
00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 1: a lot of batter But I.

496
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:41,680
Speaker 3: Think the early wet cell batteries were real nasty, and

497
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:44,840
Speaker 3: then they were eventually replaced by transformers, the electric transformer,

498
00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 3: the one ten volt and in the early nineteen hundreds,

499
00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:52,800
Speaker 3: of course, electricity was still not a sure thing to

500
00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 3: be in everybody's home, and there was a lot of

501
00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:58,120
Speaker 3: fascination around that. And as we mentioned, trains were already

502
00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:01,120
Speaker 3: steam powered. Trains were already kind of representative of this

503
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:06,160
Speaker 3: idea of the future and innovation, and so electricity was

504
00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:09,120
Speaker 3: of course as well. And to incorporate that into a

505
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:13,400
Speaker 3: toy that had this aspirational quality already and already represented

506
00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 3: something that was already kind of considered this image of

507
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:22,480
Speaker 3: you know, productivity and ingenuity and the American spirit and

508
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:24,280
Speaker 3: all that stuff, it makes sense that they would have

509
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:24,800
Speaker 3: taken off.

510
00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:26,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, agreed.

511
00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:31,160
Speaker 1: And there's one thing that they didn't predict amid all

512
00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:35,120
Speaker 1: their smart business plans, the Great Depression, which again I

513
00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:38,240
Speaker 1: think is just a terrible name. So the nineteen twenties

514
00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:41,560
Speaker 1: and nineteen thirties, or this real Halcyon era, we'll get

515
00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:45,200
Speaker 1: to that later too, Halcion era for model trains, it's

516
00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:46,160
Speaker 1: golden age.

517
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:50,960
Speaker 3: It's very popular amid the populace.

518
00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:53,960
Speaker 1: They would go popular by the populace, popular with the people,

519
00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:57,960
Speaker 1: and the model train layouts. There's kind of like an

520
00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:00,320
Speaker 1: arms race of who can make the most allowed apparate

521
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:03,880
Speaker 1: expanse of ones, put your buildings in there, maybe have

522
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:06,320
Speaker 1: lifelike scenes, you know, look at that it's a little

523
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:12,520
Speaker 1: painted mailman. And people dedicated. Some people got really into

524
00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 1: it and dedicated like the entirety of their free time

525
00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:20,000
Speaker 1: to perfecting every detail about this the way you know,

526
00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:22,720
Speaker 1: the way we play Skyrim.

527
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:26,360
Speaker 3: Right, But really, would you consider the Great Depression to

528
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:27,480
Speaker 3: be an oxymoron?

529
00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:31,479
Speaker 1: I guess technically not really, because I know that you know,

530
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:32,800
Speaker 1: great can just mean.

531
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:36,400
Speaker 3: That's I guess jumbo shrimp or something.

532
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 1: You know, you're right, right, so, But but I do

533
00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:41,080
Speaker 1: I think they could have.

534
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:43,320
Speaker 3: I don't know, they had a lot going on when

535
00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 3: they're trying to.

536
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:44,240
Speaker 2: Come up with that.

537
00:31:44,800 --> 00:31:46,600
Speaker 3: You really think there was a committee meeting to name it.

538
00:31:46,680 --> 00:31:49,160
Speaker 3: I think it probably, much like you know, the Great War,

539
00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:53,000
Speaker 3: just sort of sort of came up on its own organically. Yeah.

540
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:58,120
Speaker 1: And liontel O, their own website, points out that because

541
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:01,800
Speaker 1: there was the crazy Gill did age boom in the twenties,

542
00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:06,920
Speaker 1: model trains became much more affordable. People were kind of

543
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:10,720
Speaker 1: getting into escapism. They wanted to forget World War One,

544
00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:13,600
Speaker 1: or as they just called it, World the World war,

545
00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 1: and now the credit system is rolling out so more

546
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 1: and more people can afford luxuries that once upon a

547
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:25,000
Speaker 1: time would not have been feasible for them.

548
00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:30,880
Speaker 3: American dream aka debt for Life, debt for life. So

549
00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:36,280
Speaker 3: Lionel has ads in every imaginable medium. They're in boys magazines,

550
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:40,360
Speaker 3: they're in a Saturday evening post, they're in all the newspapers.

551
00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 3: They get celebrities to endorse them. They even have branded advertising.

552
00:32:44,920 --> 00:32:50,120
Speaker 3: There's a Lionel radio show, and they had slogans that

553
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:53,640
Speaker 3: were like, real enough for a man to enjoy, simple

554
00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 3: enough for a boy to operate.

555
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 2: Also, guys jumping real quick.

556
00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,520
Speaker 4: I got the Tampa Bay Times up and they say

557
00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 4: one of the people who named the Great Depression was

558
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:07,160
Speaker 4: actually Herbert Hoover. He would refer to it as a

559
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:09,680
Speaker 4: depression when he was still in office because it sounded

560
00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 4: less worrisome to him than a panic. But it was

561
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:17,880
Speaker 4: also a guy by the name of Lionel Robbins no relation,

562
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:21,080
Speaker 4: who was a British economist who would name it the

563
00:33:21,080 --> 00:33:22,680
Speaker 4: Great Depression in nineteen thirty four.

564
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:28,239
Speaker 1: Well, they could both stand to take some crowdsourcing the

565
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 1: next time they name stuff. But yes, the Great depression.

566
00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 1: If you're listening to the show, you are very familiar

567
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:35,120
Speaker 1: with it.

568
00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:35,640
Speaker 3: This is a.

569
00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:42,000
Speaker 1: Terrible time for the United States and indeed globally. Right

570
00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 1: before the Great Depression hits, these Lionel catalogs are becoming

571
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:52,000
Speaker 1: their own kind of annual publication for kids, you know,

572
00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:56,840
Speaker 1: like like the when Lego releases a catalog, or when

573
00:33:56,920 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 1: Sears or Aikia does, it's something aspiration, and so it

574
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 1: seems like the model train is part of or it's

575
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:08,839
Speaker 1: indicative of a successful family. You hang out with your

576
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:11,839
Speaker 1: family and play with the trains together, you look through

577
00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:14,360
Speaker 1: the catalog together and pick your favorites.

578
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:26,520
Speaker 3: During the entirely depressing Depression, Lionel, along with a lot

579
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 3: of other toy companies, of course, struggled because this was

580
00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:33,719
Speaker 3: no longer a necessity. You know, people probably went back

581
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:37,320
Speaker 3: to the old European ways of whittling toys for their children,

582
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:40,200
Speaker 3: you know, making the flute out of some reds or something.

583
00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:43,440
Speaker 3: I'm not trying to be dismissive, but it definitely was

584
00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:47,080
Speaker 3: not something that was in the budget, right, Yeah, that's right.

585
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:52,239
Speaker 1: Staving off financial ruin quickly became the primary concern for

586
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:57,319
Speaker 1: the majority of the United States and Lionel, like many

587
00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:02,400
Speaker 1: other companies, was also struggling. They entered receivership, which is

588
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:06,920
Speaker 1: sort of a way to keep yourself from the precipice

589
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:11,120
Speaker 1: of bankruptcy, and they were going to go under completely.

590
00:35:11,160 --> 00:35:13,120
Speaker 1: They would have been a thing of the past were

591
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 1: it not for a partnership they made with none other

592
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:22,200
Speaker 1: than Walt Disney. They debuted the Mickey and Many hand car.

593
00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:24,640
Speaker 3: It's a one dollar wind up, which would have been

594
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:29,080
Speaker 3: like one of those classic mining carts, right where like

595
00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:32,439
Speaker 3: a seesaw kind of situation with Many on one side,

596
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:35,719
Speaker 3: Mickey on the other. And if you ever are lucky

597
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:40,720
Speaker 3: enough to be in San Francisco, I highly recommend checking

598
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:44,560
Speaker 3: out the Walt Disney Family Museum where they have a

599
00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:49,640
Speaker 3: display of all of this kind of stuff and Disneyland,

600
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:52,880
Speaker 3: disney World, anything affiliated with the actual Walt Disney Company

601
00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:57,600
Speaker 3: probably wouldn't because some of these toys, you know, and

602
00:35:57,880 --> 00:36:00,440
Speaker 3: this era of stuff could have even ventured into the

603
00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:05,200
Speaker 3: realm of problematic times. Oh yeah, but you do see

604
00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:07,760
Speaker 3: the Mickey mini hand car again, like to your point

605
00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:10,120
Speaker 3: a buck which was a lot of money back then

606
00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:15,960
Speaker 3: but was still more affordable than some and Lionel saw

607
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:19,520
Speaker 3: the success of this, and they decided to follow up

608
00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:25,759
Speaker 3: with similar designs, the Union Pacific, the Hiawatha, and the

609
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:29,480
Speaker 3: Flying Yankee, and by around nineteen thirty five they were

610
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:32,640
Speaker 3: able to get out of that receivership because they were

611
00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:34,359
Speaker 3: once again profitable.

612
00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 1: And just for perspective here too, one of the brilliant

613
00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:41,279
Speaker 1: things about the Mickey and Minni toy is that a

614
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:43,480
Speaker 1: dollar was a lot more than it is now, but

615
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,560
Speaker 1: it was still very affordable, more so than a lot

616
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:49,839
Speaker 1: of fancy locomotives. So if we could inflation calculate a

617
00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:55,359
Speaker 1: little bit due one dollar nineteen thirty four is.

618
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:58,680
Speaker 3: Drum roll please backs, can we guess?

619
00:36:59,400 --> 00:36:59,640
Speaker 2: Yeah?

620
00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:03,400
Speaker 3: Maybe twelve ninety nine ish.

621
00:37:04,320 --> 00:37:07,680
Speaker 1: Not too far. It's it's uh drum roll again, were

622
00:37:07,719 --> 00:37:11,640
Speaker 1: killing the drum rolls. It is twenty three dollars in

623
00:37:11,719 --> 00:37:15,239
Speaker 1: sixteen cents, which is surprisingly affordable. You know, that's like

624
00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:16,319
Speaker 1: a Lego kit.

625
00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:19,759
Speaker 3: It's a Lego kit or maybe eight circa of the

626
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:24,840
Speaker 3: nineteen nineties Ninja Turtle vehicle, remember those. I remember the

627
00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 3: figures more expensive. The figures were roughly five bucks, I

628
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:30,640
Speaker 3: remember that, Yeah, and then the vehicles would have been

629
00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:35,759
Speaker 3: roughly four x that. I would say, oh, man, the

630
00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:38,320
Speaker 3: one that flung pizzas. Remember that it was like a

631
00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:40,719
Speaker 3: like a hum v that had like a catapult on

632
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,240
Speaker 3: the back that would fling pizzas. That was cool.

633
00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:46,080
Speaker 1: And I remember I had the van where the door

634
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:47,759
Speaker 1: would open up and the top right.

635
00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:52,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, aside a machine gun almost things that does not

636
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:53,040
Speaker 3: exist in the show.

637
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:58,919
Speaker 1: No, maybe in the comics. So Lionel becomes profitable again

638
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:02,720
Speaker 1: in nineteen thirty, as we said, And there is another

639
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:05,840
Speaker 1: thing that they did not predict, which was World War two.

640
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:09,560
Speaker 1: So World War two has a huge effect on every

641
00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:14,960
Speaker 1: single manufacturing industry. It's really interesting. We did an episode

642
00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:20,560
Speaker 1: of Car Stuff about this year's back. Automobile production went

643
00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:24,759
Speaker 1: down to pretty much zero actually too literally zero because

644
00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:29,360
Speaker 1: people were busy making weapons of war. The world shifted

645
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:34,480
Speaker 1: to wartime production, and everything was everything was prioritizing that.

646
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:38,800
Speaker 1: So the production of toy trains also starts to decrease

647
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:41,120
Speaker 1: because of the materials you need to make them.

648
00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:43,080
Speaker 3: It's so funny too, because you know, we just did

649
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:46,120
Speaker 3: a couple of episodes on Candy and we talked a

650
00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:51,080
Speaker 3: good bit about how some of the companies that they

651
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:56,440
Speaker 3: sort of repurposed wartime manufacturing equipment to make their weird

652
00:38:56,600 --> 00:38:59,600
Speaker 3: pill shaped candies. So once the war was over, they

653
00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:02,759
Speaker 3: had to pivot back. Some companies are set up just

654
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:04,920
Speaker 3: for that kind of manufacturing, and the war end is what

655
00:39:04,920 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 3: do we do with all of this gear. Maybe let's

656
00:39:07,120 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 3: make some weird flavorless sugar tablets. But yeah, so they

657
00:39:12,200 --> 00:39:15,160
Speaker 3: you know, again, they pivoted to doing wartime manufacturing, and

658
00:39:15,200 --> 00:39:17,440
Speaker 3: then once the war ended, and then that changed.

659
00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:22,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, and look, make no mistake, after surviving the Great Depression,

660
00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:26,279
Speaker 1: when they become a defense company, they make a lot

661
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:29,719
Speaker 1: of money from it because the wallet is open. They

662
00:39:29,800 --> 00:39:33,399
Speaker 1: just don't make toy trains. And then they said, we're

663
00:39:33,400 --> 00:39:35,800
Speaker 1: not going to give up on this. They're better times ahead.

664
00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:39,040
Speaker 1: Let's try to be prescient, let's get in front of it.

665
00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:43,959
Speaker 1: And what they did next was somewhat kixotic. They they

666
00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:48,040
Speaker 1: weren't able to make trains, so they started making They

667
00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:52,640
Speaker 1: kept making their magazine, and they started telling sons and

668
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:58,040
Speaker 1: fathers in particular, like go ahead, plan your post war railroad,

669
00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:01,680
Speaker 1: you know, like think about the better days and talk

670
00:40:01,719 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 1: about weaponizing aspiration. That's brilliant, and that takes them well

671
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:07,480
Speaker 1: into the nineteen fifties.

672
00:40:07,520 --> 00:40:09,960
Speaker 3: So are they are They basically saying like, you can't

673
00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:13,800
Speaker 3: get this stuff yet, but like you plan ahead and

674
00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:17,640
Speaker 3: then then you'll be ready to go once production resumes. Yes,

675
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:18,600
Speaker 3: that's smart.

676
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:23,560
Speaker 1: I think it's it's a gamble, but it's really it's

677
00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:27,880
Speaker 1: so smart that their competitors probably thought they were a

678
00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:32,480
Speaker 1: little bit idealistic, or maybe they weren't thinking things all

679
00:40:32,520 --> 00:40:35,799
Speaker 1: the way through, or they were being foolish, but their

680
00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:40,279
Speaker 1: gamble paid off. In the nineteen fifties were the halcyon

681
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 1: days of Liodel, and the company itself says this. They

682
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:48,520
Speaker 1: had record profits, some of their most successful model trains ever.

683
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:53,200
Speaker 1: They had a television show for a second. But when

684
00:40:53,239 --> 00:40:57,160
Speaker 1: they had that television show, that's when the public, like

685
00:40:57,200 --> 00:41:00,239
Speaker 1: the zeitgeist began to shift because now people have a

686
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:03,359
Speaker 1: new piece of technology that they're fascinated.

687
00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:05,920
Speaker 3: Well, and it can be anything, right television, you want

688
00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:08,080
Speaker 3: to watch trains? There it is. I mean you got

689
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:11,440
Speaker 3: to think about it. Man Like people were largely doing

690
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:14,879
Speaker 3: this stuff because in order to experience this kind of thing,

691
00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:17,279
Speaker 3: you had to have it physically. You had to be

692
00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:19,719
Speaker 3: able to touch it and move it around and build it.

693
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:23,360
Speaker 3: And you know, we know that television has certainly had

694
00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:29,840
Speaker 3: various negative impacts on productivity individuals, you know, and kids,

695
00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:32,279
Speaker 3: perhaps the idea of brain rot and all of that

696
00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:36,439
Speaker 3: and being a little bit just overly commercialized and sort

697
00:41:36,440 --> 00:41:39,319
Speaker 3: of reducing people's imaginations. But of course all of that

698
00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:44,120
Speaker 3: stuff comes in cycles as well. So while initially TV

699
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 3: offered people this escapism that model trains just couldn't really

700
00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:52,000
Speaker 3: compete with, and of course, a little bit later video games,

701
00:41:52,040 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 3: and then of course they were cheaper plastic toys that

702
00:41:54,680 --> 00:41:58,040
Speaker 3: were advertised on TV, and you know, game magazines and

703
00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:02,000
Speaker 3: action figures and things like that. Nostalgia comes back around.

704
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:04,600
Speaker 3: It always does.

705
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:08,120
Speaker 1: Also, I just got to take a second and share

706
00:42:08,200 --> 00:42:14,920
Speaker 1: condolences with all our fellow ridiculous historians who have lived

707
00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:19,279
Speaker 1: long enough to see an era of time familiar to

708
00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 1: them become nostalgia, like the nineteen nineties or the early

709
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:24,440
Speaker 1: two thousands.

710
00:42:24,520 --> 00:42:28,360
Speaker 3: You know that that one stings man. The two thousands.

711
00:42:29,160 --> 00:42:32,680
Speaker 1: It hits weird, It hits you when when you hear

712
00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:37,600
Speaker 1: our radio colleagues playing these things on the oldie station.

713
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:41,440
Speaker 3: Yeah. Also, you're starting to see anniversaries for records that

714
00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:44,080
Speaker 3: you remember, like that came out yesterday and it's the

715
00:42:44,160 --> 00:42:47,960
Speaker 3: twenty or thirty year anniversary. Oh my god. I mean

716
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:48,959
Speaker 3: it's cool, you guys.

717
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 4: Know, Like in just a few weeks, I'm going to

718
00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:55,520
Speaker 4: see Transatlanticism and give Up by post Service and death

719
00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:56,799
Speaker 4: Cab for the second time.

720
00:42:57,040 --> 00:42:58,080
Speaker 2: Twentieth anniversary.

721
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:02,319
Speaker 4: That's like ten year out in five twenty years one.

722
00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:05,319
Speaker 3: I'm more of a postal service than death Cappers, And

723
00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:07,719
Speaker 3: I'm going to see that show as well in Atlanta

724
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 3: later this year. But I just remember clearly where I was,

725
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:15,239
Speaker 3: what was going on when that give Up record came out.

726
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:17,680
Speaker 3: But yeah, no, I'm with you, Ben, I think we've

727
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:21,360
Speaker 3: all experienced this. Anyone of a certain age, we'll understand

728
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:22,560
Speaker 3: what this help.

729
00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:26,720
Speaker 1: Like. Yeah, it'll happen to you too. If your teacher

730
00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:29,560
Speaker 1: is having you listen to this episode on model Trains

731
00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:33,640
Speaker 1: for a school thing, just think about it. Twenty twenty

732
00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:36,400
Speaker 1: four is going to be an oldies era one day,

733
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:37,720
Speaker 1: sooner than you think, folks.

734
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:39,400
Speaker 3: So anyway, the.

735
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:45,120
Speaker 1: Hobby again, it kind of loses out to this new

736
00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:48,799
Speaker 1: fascination with television, but there are always going to be

737
00:43:48,920 --> 00:43:52,840
Speaker 1: these very dedicated enthusiast and collectors and they keep the

738
00:43:52,960 --> 00:43:58,000
Speaker 1: hobby alive. In the late twentieth century model trains actually

739
00:43:58,080 --> 00:44:03,040
Speaker 1: experience a revival thanks to that nostalgia. And now you

740
00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:08,759
Speaker 1: can have you can leverage new technology tracks right right

741
00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:12,879
Speaker 1: your train systems, even cooler digital control systems. You know,

742
00:44:12,960 --> 00:44:15,640
Speaker 1: you can you can replicate if you want to spend

743
00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:18,600
Speaker 1: the time and money, you can replicate a full scale

744
00:44:18,760 --> 00:44:20,719
Speaker 1: railroad pretty accurately.

745
00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:22,640
Speaker 3: I may have mentioned this a time or two on

746
00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 3: the podcast, but like i'm I have recently in the

747
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:29,160
Speaker 3: last year gotten really into modular synthesizers and modular synthesizers

748
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:34,919
Speaker 3: a very similar money pit of perfectly customizable nerdy you know,

749
00:44:35,120 --> 00:44:38,919
Speaker 3: sound creation toys, and that is also what you get

750
00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:42,719
Speaker 3: with modern model trains. You can pick every aspect of

751
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:45,680
Speaker 3: it down to like you said, the painted figures, you know,

752
00:44:45,800 --> 00:44:49,239
Speaker 3: the trees, the buildings, what kind of lead you know,

753
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:51,719
Speaker 3: engine you might have, and you can have multiples and

754
00:44:51,760 --> 00:44:55,320
Speaker 3: all these switchers and lights and it's it's pretty endless,

755
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:57,920
Speaker 3: you know, if you want to go down that particular

756
00:44:58,040 --> 00:44:58,560
Speaker 3: rabbit hole.

757
00:44:59,000 --> 00:45:01,920
Speaker 1: And what I think I think is also fascinating with

758
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:05,200
Speaker 1: the model trains here is that there's still there are

759
00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:07,400
Speaker 1: a lot of adults who are super into them, but

760
00:45:07,440 --> 00:45:12,879
Speaker 1: there are so many crazy facts about model trains right there.

761
00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:15,359
Speaker 1: I'd love to just share a few of these that

762
00:45:15,400 --> 00:45:19,920
Speaker 1: I got from the Charles Rowse Supply Company, America's largest

763
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:25,560
Speaker 1: train store. The most pricey model train ever sold was

764
00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:29,080
Speaker 1: a Lionel train sold in two thousand and six for

765
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:31,880
Speaker 1: two hundred and fifty thousand dollars.

766
00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:32,800
Speaker 3: Neil young Byett.

767
00:45:34,560 --> 00:45:37,160
Speaker 1: We don't know, but my I wouldn't be surprised if

768
00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:40,640
Speaker 1: it were a very well to do I would assume

769
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:43,960
Speaker 1: it's a very well to do person after me. The largest,

770
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:47,520
Speaker 1: the largest train set on the world right now, per

771
00:45:47,600 --> 00:45:51,279
Speaker 1: the Guinness Book of World Records is Minnie Attila Vonderland

772
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:56,640
Speaker 1: in Hamburg. It has thirteen hundred trains, ten thousand, more

773
00:45:56,640 --> 00:46:01,200
Speaker 1: than ten thousand carriages, one hundred thousand moving vehicles like trees.

774
00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:02,799
Speaker 3: You name it. I want to go. We can get

775
00:46:02,840 --> 00:46:04,799
Speaker 3: work to pay for that trip. It might be a

776
00:46:04,840 --> 00:46:09,400
Speaker 3: forgiveness view permissioning fair. We have to we have to

777
00:46:09,520 --> 00:46:12,920
Speaker 3: really sell it out. Yeah, so and you have.

778
00:46:12,840 --> 00:46:16,279
Speaker 1: To get Max and there question, well, Pepper, it's wre things.

779
00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:18,160
Speaker 1: I think one thing we do have to deliver on

780
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:23,399
Speaker 1: here is uh, you know we mentioned previously the games

781
00:46:23,440 --> 00:46:25,960
Speaker 1: of Model the scales, the ratios.

782
00:46:26,080 --> 00:46:27,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

783
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:32,920
Speaker 1: So maybe let's yeah, let's for anybody's interested in getting

784
00:46:33,040 --> 00:46:36,280
Speaker 1: into the model train hobby or the world of model trains,

785
00:46:36,480 --> 00:46:38,400
Speaker 1: what kind of what should they know about scales?

786
00:46:38,520 --> 00:46:40,480
Speaker 3: Well, it's a couple of terms, and we've already kind

787
00:46:40,520 --> 00:46:43,319
Speaker 3: of discussed this. The scale of a model train is

788
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:46,719
Speaker 3: its size relative to the proportion of the real thing.

789
00:46:47,239 --> 00:46:48,680
Speaker 3: If you want to sound like you're in the know

790
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:51,560
Speaker 3: and model training communities, the real thing is referred to

791
00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:55,680
Speaker 3: as the prototype, which is pretty cool. We start off

792
00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:59,640
Speaker 3: with something called g scale, which is I believe the

793
00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:02,840
Speaker 3: law largest of the standard scales.

794
00:47:03,400 --> 00:47:07,200
Speaker 1: This comes from Layman Big Trains or Lehman Gross bat

795
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:12,719
Speaker 1: and they have a lot of variation in scale, but

796
00:47:13,280 --> 00:47:17,399
Speaker 1: like you could get one that's one to twenty or

797
00:47:17,480 --> 00:47:22,040
Speaker 1: one to thirty two. But generally those scales, or even

798
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:25,000
Speaker 1: if they're different scales, the trains themselves will run on

799
00:47:25,040 --> 00:47:26,120
Speaker 1: the same gauge track.

800
00:47:26,239 --> 00:47:28,200
Speaker 3: That makes sense, it would get too comple. You have

801
00:47:28,239 --> 00:47:31,600
Speaker 3: to have some standardization in order for it to all

802
00:47:31,880 --> 00:47:34,279
Speaker 3: kind of gel together. And again, sorry not to get

803
00:47:34,320 --> 00:47:36,440
Speaker 3: you nerdy into the modular sense stuff, but even though

804
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:38,720
Speaker 3: there are all different sizes and fill up different spaces

805
00:47:38,719 --> 00:47:41,239
Speaker 3: in Iraq. They all use many of most of them

806
00:47:41,360 --> 00:47:44,359
Speaker 3: use the same size screw holes to affix them into

807
00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:47,000
Speaker 3: these racks. Even though there's tons of different manufacturers that

808
00:47:47,080 --> 00:47:49,120
Speaker 3: make all kinds of different stuff, there should be some

809
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:54,160
Speaker 3: basic standardization in order for these companies to be able

810
00:47:54,160 --> 00:47:55,840
Speaker 3: to kind of play together in the same space.

811
00:47:56,160 --> 00:48:01,200
Speaker 1: Sure, and then we've got other things like the.

812
00:48:00,360 --> 00:48:01,600
Speaker 3: The o's we talked about.

813
00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:04,280
Speaker 1: I believe the earlier os some of the bigger ones

814
00:48:04,760 --> 00:48:08,440
Speaker 1: right right right, And Lionel still makes O scale trains

815
00:48:08,520 --> 00:48:13,040
Speaker 1: and accessories along with a couple of other well, a

816
00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:17,040
Speaker 1: couple of other companies. Shout out to uh, the Payter

817
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:21,480
Speaker 1: familius of our pals, Max and Alex. Uh, mister Williams

818
00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:24,640
Speaker 1: would have an O scale train around the Christmas tree

819
00:48:24,760 --> 00:48:25,319
Speaker 1: every year.

820
00:48:25,520 --> 00:48:28,680
Speaker 3: You haven't even invoked that image. That's another wonderful kind

821
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:32,200
Speaker 3: of classic Golden Age image, you know, very similar to

822
00:48:32,239 --> 00:48:35,279
Speaker 3: like the Fao Schwartz kind of window dressing stuff. That

823
00:48:35,280 --> 00:48:38,359
Speaker 3: that model train going around and around the Christmas tree.

824
00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:41,920
Speaker 3: That's pretty nostalgic stuff right there. Yeah. And when I

825
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:44,239
Speaker 3: say biggest, by the way for OSK, I think I'm

826
00:48:44,239 --> 00:48:48,239
Speaker 3: more referring to more most popular. Ah, yes, yeah, yeah yeah.

827
00:48:48,280 --> 00:48:51,160
Speaker 1: And then of course there's h O scale, there's in

828
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:53,040
Speaker 1: scale Z scale.

829
00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:53,640
Speaker 3: Uh.

830
00:48:54,200 --> 00:48:57,080
Speaker 1: Look, what we're saying is if you are remotely interested

831
00:48:57,200 --> 00:49:00,320
Speaker 1: in model trains, there is a wide world of stuff

832
00:49:00,320 --> 00:49:02,360
Speaker 1: to choose from, and there are a ton of people

833
00:49:02,680 --> 00:49:05,960
Speaker 1: who want to experience that with you. Noel Max sent

834
00:49:06,080 --> 00:49:09,760
Speaker 1: us something that I'm surprised I didn't know about because

835
00:49:09,760 --> 00:49:12,920
Speaker 1: I love these kinds of specific events. There is a

836
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:17,680
Speaker 1: model train and rail Rodiana show that comes to Atlanta,

837
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:18,920
Speaker 1: was here in January.

838
00:49:19,320 --> 00:49:20,759
Speaker 3: Awesome, Okay, I.

839
00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:23,399
Speaker 1: Want to go see a model train show.

840
00:49:23,480 --> 00:49:26,120
Speaker 4: I do choill you not being lucky? We got another

841
00:49:26,239 --> 00:49:31,720
Speaker 4: one May fourth, nine am to two pm and it is.

842
00:49:31,280 --> 00:49:34,960
Speaker 3: In akwardly busy doing Star Wars stuff. I'm just joking.

843
00:49:35,120 --> 00:49:37,160
Speaker 3: I don't. I don't do that, you know, May the

844
00:49:37,160 --> 00:49:39,799
Speaker 3: fourth with you. Oh, that's right, it's a thing now.

845
00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:41,040
Speaker 3: That sounds cool. I would love to go to that.

846
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:43,400
Speaker 3: And by the way, when I mentioned Sebastian Bach earlier,

847
00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:46,759
Speaker 3: largely from from skid Row, I largely know about his

848
00:49:47,040 --> 00:49:50,120
Speaker 3: love of model trains because of a particular season of

849
00:49:50,160 --> 00:49:55,600
Speaker 3: the Canadian kind of sitcom Trailer Park Boys that involves

850
00:49:55,680 --> 00:50:01,440
Speaker 3: the heist of a particularly expensive model train from a

851
00:50:01,719 --> 00:50:05,560
Speaker 3: Canadian model train expo, and it sort of follows the

852
00:50:05,560 --> 00:50:08,399
Speaker 3: trailer park boys around throughout the entire season and it's

853
00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:10,719
Speaker 3: a lot of fun. Want to throw one more thing?

854
00:50:10,880 --> 00:50:13,359
Speaker 1: We just have to say it because, you know, being

855
00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:16,759
Speaker 1: an American based show, we love some hyperbole, we love

856
00:50:16,840 --> 00:50:20,400
Speaker 1: some superlatives. You might ask yourself, well, guys, what is

857
00:50:20,440 --> 00:50:25,359
Speaker 1: the largest single model train engine? The answer is the

858
00:50:25,440 --> 00:50:30,400
Speaker 1: Thomas the tank engine that was built for a special

859
00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:34,800
Speaker 1: tour by BBC Visual Effects. It weighs one and a

860
00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:35,680
Speaker 1: half ton.

861
00:50:35,920 --> 00:50:36,120
Speaker 3: What.

862
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:38,719
Speaker 1: I don't know if you can still call that a

863
00:50:38,719 --> 00:50:42,360
Speaker 1: model train, So I you know what, we'll have to

864
00:50:42,360 --> 00:50:43,960
Speaker 1: write to get US world records.

865
00:50:44,239 --> 00:50:46,439
Speaker 4: If it's smaller than a train though, and it works

866
00:50:46,480 --> 00:50:48,400
Speaker 4: the same way, it's a miniature, yeah.

867
00:50:48,320 --> 00:50:52,120
Speaker 2: I guess so, yeah, miniature can be anything smaller.

868
00:50:52,520 --> 00:50:54,440
Speaker 3: And last thing for me because this is something that

869
00:50:54,480 --> 00:50:56,480
Speaker 3: maybe we should have mentioned earlier on. But if you're

870
00:50:56,520 --> 00:51:00,719
Speaker 3: wondering how model trains are powered today we talked about

871
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:03,799
Speaker 3: the early steamy ones and the battery ones and then

872
00:51:04,239 --> 00:51:07,760
Speaker 3: replaced by the transformer. It's interesting because they're actually powered

873
00:51:07,840 --> 00:51:12,040
Speaker 3: largely the way subways are powered through a current that

874
00:51:12,160 --> 00:51:17,000
Speaker 3: is carried and transmitted into the engine for all intents

875
00:51:17,000 --> 00:51:21,360
Speaker 3: and purposes, or the transformer through a powered rail that

876
00:51:21,719 --> 00:51:25,280
Speaker 3: has like you know, either soldered or clipped power current

877
00:51:25,360 --> 00:51:28,160
Speaker 3: running through it that comes from a power supply. So

878
00:51:28,200 --> 00:51:31,680
Speaker 3: part of the modular nature of model trains also comes

879
00:51:31,719 --> 00:51:34,560
Speaker 3: down to like wiring up the power and if you're

880
00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:36,200
Speaker 3: not careful, I don't know what you're doing, you could

881
00:51:36,200 --> 00:51:38,160
Speaker 3: accidentally give yourself a zapp, right.

882
00:51:38,080 --> 00:51:41,080
Speaker 4: Max, Oh, absolutely, And that had me thinking it's the

883
00:51:41,160 --> 00:51:44,799
Speaker 4: future spoiler. I was researching something else that is on

884
00:51:44,920 --> 00:51:49,400
Speaker 4: tracks and that's called third track. The third track me

885
00:51:49,400 --> 00:51:50,920
Speaker 4: in the power track, and there was something else that

886
00:51:51,040 --> 00:51:53,719
Speaker 4: is now a two track, but they did with a

887
00:51:53,760 --> 00:51:57,240
Speaker 4: third track and had very bad const questions.

888
00:51:57,520 --> 00:51:59,360
Speaker 2: So before that episode coming up, guys.

889
00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:04,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, and if you find yourself in Molden, Massachusetts, do

890
00:52:04,400 --> 00:52:07,600
Speaker 1: stop by the Charles Rose Supply Company. They are the

891
00:52:07,640 --> 00:52:11,239
Speaker 1: world's largest dealer of Lionel trains and I think they're

892
00:52:11,280 --> 00:52:15,440
Speaker 1: one of the biggest just model trains stores in general around.

893
00:52:15,600 --> 00:52:20,520
Speaker 1: So if you ever have a specific a need for

894
00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:24,200
Speaker 1: a weird, specific trip or adventure, please folks come to

895
00:52:24,360 --> 00:52:27,080
Speaker 1: us because we can help you out. Monster cars, what

896
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:31,040
Speaker 1: else model trains. We're getting into this weird things modular sense,

897
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:32,680
Speaker 1: all of the legos.

898
00:52:34,360 --> 00:52:36,279
Speaker 4: We had an entire episo, We had two episodes to

899
00:52:36,320 --> 00:52:37,440
Speaker 4: complain about fonts.

900
00:52:37,760 --> 00:52:39,839
Speaker 3: Oh gosh. Yeah. We also have an episode that's sort

901
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:42,759
Speaker 3: of been in the kiddy for a while about the

902
00:52:42,800 --> 00:52:46,040
Speaker 3: history of women in electronic music and sound design and

903
00:52:46,400 --> 00:52:49,239
Speaker 3: film scoring and things like that. And maybe we can

904
00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:52,120
Speaker 3: sneak a little bit of nerdy modular synth stuff and

905
00:52:52,239 --> 00:52:55,840
Speaker 3: history into that one, if you guys would indulge me.

906
00:52:56,800 --> 00:52:58,960
Speaker 3: But yeah, really excited about all this stuff that we've got

907
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:02,840
Speaker 3: coming up. Great tea for a future episode there, Max

908
00:53:02,880 --> 00:53:05,920
Speaker 3: and boy, I never knew there was this much to

909
00:53:06,160 --> 00:53:07,840
Speaker 3: know about model trains.

910
00:53:08,600 --> 00:53:12,239
Speaker 1: Thanks as always to our super producer and research associate

911
00:53:12,280 --> 00:53:15,160
Speaker 1: for this episode, mister Max Williams. Thanks to Alex Williams

912
00:53:15,200 --> 00:53:18,440
Speaker 1: who composed this slam and track you're here in. Thanks

913
00:53:18,440 --> 00:53:22,080
Speaker 1: to Eve's jeff Coat Jonathan Strickland ak the Quizz who

914
00:53:22,280 --> 00:53:23,279
Speaker 1: one hundred.

915
00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:24,600
Speaker 3: Percent digs model trains.

916
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:26,840
Speaker 1: I know it, I just I know the man well,

917
00:53:27,280 --> 00:53:30,200
Speaker 1: he is a He's a model train head. Huge.

918
00:53:30,200 --> 00:53:34,880
Speaker 3: Thanks to A. J. Bahamas Jacobs, who is as as

919
00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:37,560
Speaker 3: all kind. He's ahead of all kinds is his head

920
00:53:37,640 --> 00:53:40,520
Speaker 3: is full of all kinds of esoteric and fascinating knowledge.

921
00:53:41,320 --> 00:53:42,959
Speaker 3: Alex Williams who composed our theme.

922
00:53:43,400 --> 00:53:47,319
Speaker 1: Yes, Eve's Jeffcoat who maybe returning soon. I just want

923
00:53:47,360 --> 00:53:49,920
Speaker 1: to give her a shout out twice. Gabe, Lucy a

924
00:53:50,920 --> 00:53:53,040
Speaker 1: lionel themselves, and thanks to you.

925
00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:56,160
Speaker 3: And you as well, Ben. We'll see you next time, folks.

926
00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:06,920
Speaker 3: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

927
00:54:06,960 --> 00:54:09,120
Speaker 3: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,