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Speaker 1: Well, hello everybody. You made it here. How are you?

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Speaker 1: It is almost Thanksgiving? So what can I say? Today

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Speaker 1: is going to be kind of a heavy show. No

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Speaker 1: matter who you are, no matter where you come from

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Speaker 1: or what you think, it's hard to talk about the Mideast,

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Speaker 1: especially right now. Make no mistake, it's a complex and

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Speaker 1: difficult conversation and has been for generations. But because of

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Speaker 1: social media, I think things have only grown more difficult,

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Speaker 1: more isolating. People are angry, heartbroken and exhausted, and we

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Speaker 1: need to have real conversation. We need to understand each other.

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Speaker 1: We need to come together with peace in our hearts. Today.

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Speaker 1: My guest is Alison Joseph's, who I met through social

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Speaker 1: media a couple of years ago. Her screen name is

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Speaker 1: jew in the City. Her platform is representation and education

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Speaker 1: as to who the Jewish people truly are. She has

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Speaker 1: done this long before the events of October seventh, and

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Speaker 1: I thought maybe this would be a good place to start. Here,

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Speaker 1: we are having a conversation myself and Alison Joseph. Well,

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Speaker 1: Hi everybody, it is me Rosi O'Donnell talking to Alison Joseph's. Hello, Alison,

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Speaker 1: It's very nice to meet you, sort of here on

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Speaker 1: the zoom.

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Speaker 2: Likewise, great to meet you as well.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, how long have you been online? And do you

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Speaker 1: remember when we first connected? Was it like what a

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Speaker 1: couple of years ago? Was it?

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Speaker 3: It was a couple of years ago you were posting

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Speaker 3: about Minn Orthodox life. And since my nonprofits you in

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Speaker 3: the City handles depictions of Jews and media, and our

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Speaker 3: founding mission was specifically to look at Orthodox depictions.

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Speaker 2: And I had some opinions about that show.

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Speaker 1: Yes, indeed, Now were you raised Orthodox yourself?

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Speaker 2: I was not.

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Speaker 3: And the interesting thing is that I was really raised

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Speaker 3: to hate Orthodox Jews, to judge Orthodox Jews. I was

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Speaker 3: raised to be a proud Jew, but that was kind

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Speaker 3: of more like culturally Jewish and you know, some holidays

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Speaker 3: and a sense of that the Jewish people should continue

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Speaker 3: because we've been through so much.

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Speaker 2: But I grew up in New Jersey.

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Speaker 3: We would go to Manhattan maybe once a month, out

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Speaker 3: to dinner, out to a Broadway show, and I would

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Speaker 3: see the Orthodox just kind of looking so weird, so different,

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Speaker 3: so extreme, so backwards, and I.

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Speaker 2: Felt kind of ashamed of them, actually, And then did.

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Speaker 1: You did you feel ashamed of them? Because you were

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Speaker 1: taught that or did you feel it because they were

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Speaker 1: just so other.

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Speaker 3: So I think I was taught that my father took

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Speaker 3: care of Classidic Jews when he did his residency at

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Speaker 3: Mount Sinai, And I remember some of my earliest memories

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Speaker 3: in life was him coming home from the hospital and saying,

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Speaker 3: they're dirty, they're smelly, they're ignorant, they can't speak English.

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Speaker 3: Imagine that perspective on any other minority group. I mean,

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Speaker 3: it would be pretty shocking and bigoted, But because we're Jewish,

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Speaker 3: it was kind of like we can look down on

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Speaker 3: the wrong kind of Jews. We're the good kind of

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Speaker 3: Jews and those are the bad kind of Jews. And

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Speaker 3: I will tell you that media only reinforced everything my

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Speaker 3: father taught us because media, essentially both news media and

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Speaker 3: fictional media, picks up on the crooks, creeps, and extremists

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Speaker 3: of the community.

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Speaker 1: Right, would you say for every minority or would you

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Speaker 1: say just exclusively for Jewish people.

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Speaker 3: I think media has been damaging for every minority for

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Speaker 3: most of the time. What there has been in recent years, thankfully,

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Speaker 3: is a shift now for more nuanced, more understanding and

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Speaker 3: understanding that continued negative depictions leads to danger in terms

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Speaker 3: of how that minority fares in the world. And that's

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Speaker 3: you know, that's the work that my nonprofit is doing

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Speaker 3: now for the Jewish community. So I guess what I'll

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Speaker 3: say is that I think there's been a lot of

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Speaker 3: progress for other communities. We're certainly not there yet. I'm

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Speaker 3: sure if you speak to, you know, any person from

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Speaker 3: a different minority group, they will be able to flag

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Speaker 3: for you what they still don't like about their depictions

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Speaker 3: or the representation. And I also think that they'll be

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Speaker 3: able to point to real progress made.

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Speaker 1: Now, your dad was is a doctor, Yeah, and he

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Speaker 1: would only use that kind of language about Orthodox Jews.

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Speaker 1: He wouldn't use it about other minorities around you.

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Speaker 3: Correct, because he was an open minded person who didn't prejudge.

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Speaker 1: So did you ever say to him I find that offensive?

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Speaker 2: No, because I agreed with him.

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Speaker 3: I had no people in my life to counter that

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Speaker 3: narrative because I had never interacted with them. So my

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Speaker 3: father sort of set the stage as to what I believed.

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Speaker 3: And then you know, newspaper headlines and you know TV shows,

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Speaker 3: books and movies reinforce those ideas, and there were no

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Speaker 3: real person examples to counter those ideas.

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Speaker 1: Now there are some wonderful depictions of Orthodox life on

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Speaker 1: TV on now they are much more than there used

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Speaker 1: to be. There's not only My Orthodox Life, which was

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Speaker 1: kind of a reality show and sensationalized, and they were

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Speaker 1: looking for characters to to I almost said exploit, but

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Speaker 1: there you go to exploit. And but you know the

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Speaker 1: names that I'm thinking of of those Israeli shows with

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Speaker 1: that I loved, Unorthodox was one of them, I believe right.

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Speaker 2: You're thinking of and Orthodox.

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Speaker 3: So look Stissel and there was really the Stistlemania that

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Speaker 3: took the world. And I think the reason that people

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Speaker 3: went so wild over Stissel was it was because the

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Speaker 3: first time we were seeing the humanity beneath the beards,

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Speaker 3: beneath the wigs within this community that seemed like a

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Speaker 3: world away. And I appreciate that Stissel did show the

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Speaker 3: humanity of ha Readi characters. It was excellent writing, excellent acting,

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Speaker 3: and you did get to know them and that was huge,

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Speaker 3: That was groundbreaking. My complaint with Stissel is it's the

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Speaker 3: most second most insular Orthodox community in Israel. And what

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Speaker 3: I find is that for Orthodox Jews like me, that

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Speaker 3: you could call me Centrist Orthodox or modern Orthodox don't

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Speaker 3: really ever get depicted, and people don't really know the

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Speaker 3: difference between us and the people living in the second

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Speaker 3: most insular community in Israel. And one of my good friends,

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Speaker 3: who's a reformed Jew, who saw me become observant in

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Speaker 3: high school, she asked me what I thought of it,

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Speaker 3: and I said, it's a great show.

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Speaker 2: I'm enjoying it.

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Speaker 3: It's a little extreme, and she said, huh, funny coming

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Speaker 3: from you, I said, because you think I'm living just

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Speaker 3: a life. She said, yeah, pretty much. And so my

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Speaker 3: husband and I are Ivy League educated. We travel the world,

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Speaker 3: my kids are exposed to all different types of people,

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Speaker 3: and we're both very devout, and we've also taught our

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Speaker 3: children to understand that everybody contains a divine spark, and

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Speaker 3: not everybody comes to the same conclusion. People have different

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Speaker 3: life experiences, they come to different outcomes, and we're here to,

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Speaker 3: you know, to live and sort of see the humanity

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Speaker 3: and the positive qualities of the diverse tapestry of you know,

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Speaker 3: of mankind.

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Speaker 1: Right, And how did you go from being a cultural

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Speaker 1: Jew to an Orthodox Jew? What inspired that transition in you?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So, first of all, I did not know that

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Speaker 3: such a thing was possible. I kind of thought that

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Speaker 3: the normal Jew like me were born normal and the

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Speaker 3: weird Jews were born that way.

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Speaker 1: Wow.

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Speaker 2: But what ended up happening was that.

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Speaker 3: And there's a term for what I did, which is

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Speaker 3: called to be a balshuva, a master of return. When

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Speaker 3: I was eight years old, a father in my public

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Speaker 3: school had a mental breakdown. I walked into my fourth

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Speaker 3: grade home room in nineteen eighty eight. My classmates were crying,

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Speaker 3: huddled around their desks. I immediately knew something was off.

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Speaker 3: Found out that the night before, Angela's father had killed

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Speaker 3: both children and himself, and so God, I was going

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Speaker 3: to a triple funeral that week and not even nine

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Speaker 3: years old, And sort of, as all this heaviness of

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Speaker 3: death was sitting on my child like mind, I realized

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Speaker 3: that what's going to happen when I die? I will

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Speaker 3: end my time in this world at some point. And

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Speaker 3: then I stopped the question before that, which was why

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Speaker 3: are we here in the first place, And being only

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Speaker 3: eight years old, I assume my parents must know the

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Speaker 3: answer to that. They brought three daughters into the world

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Speaker 3: so over a bagel breakfast, you know, probably the Sunday

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Speaker 3: after the funerals, I said, by the way, why are

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Speaker 3: we alive? And my parents just stared at me, and

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Speaker 3: it was this devastating realization that they literally had no plan,

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Speaker 3: they had no wisdom to share. And I started asking

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Speaker 3: other people in my world, and the response I basically

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Speaker 3: got was nobody knows. Don't think about it. And the

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Speaker 3: problem was that, like the cat was already out of

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Speaker 3: the bag, and I couldn't stop thinking about the thing

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Speaker 3: that everybody told me not to think about.

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Speaker 1: So that's so interesting that happened to me when I

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Speaker 1: was that age as well with the Vietnam War, that

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Speaker 1: I would watch it on TV because I'm sixty one,

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Speaker 1: and we would see it as we were eating dinner,

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Speaker 1: these horrific images, and my father I started to cry.

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Speaker 1: I would cry when I watched the news, and he said,

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Speaker 1: you can't watch the news anymore. Go to your room.

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Speaker 1: You're not allowed to watch the news. That was the

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Speaker 1: answer right to to a little eight year old girl,

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Speaker 1: you know, who was was scared and whose mother was

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Speaker 1: dying and was you know, it was a traumatic event

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Speaker 1: at that time that made me question kind of everything

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Speaker 1: and kind of laid down my moral compass for me.

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Speaker 1: Were your parents supportive of your desire to go towards

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Speaker 1: these these bigger ideas at such a young age. Where

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Speaker 1: when did you make the switch to knowing that an

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Speaker 1: orthodox life might be the one that inspired and filled

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Speaker 1: your heart?

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Speaker 3: Yes? So it was about seven years of insomnia and

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Speaker 3: often on panic attacks. As long as I was distracted,

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Speaker 3: I was the life of the party, the straight a student.

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Speaker 2: Everything was great.

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Speaker 3: When the distractions would stop, I would sort of go

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Speaker 3: into this point of panic. And I've learned more about

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Speaker 3: mental health sort of during COVID, and I realized now

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Speaker 3: that I was disassociating. When I was sort of go

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Speaker 3: to that point of will be somewhere or nowhere for eternity,

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Speaker 3: I would feel myself flying out of my body, which

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Speaker 3: only reconfirmed this idea that nothing here is really real,

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Speaker 3: and I would just be really terrorized, terrified in this

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Speaker 3: loop of thoughts. And although I felt the love and

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Speaker 3: protection of my parents, they weren't big enough to stand

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Speaker 3: up to eternity next to me and their protection and

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Speaker 3: their you know what they provided for us, and it

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Speaker 3: wasn't enough because I was sort of coming face to

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Speaker 3: face with you know, time and space. So They were

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Speaker 3: supportive of my being, I think a precocious thinker. The

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Speaker 3: reason that it ended up getting to going back to

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Speaker 3: my heritage was they sent us to an after school

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Speaker 3: Hebrew high after our bot mitzvahs. They didn't really care

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Speaker 3: for us to become more.

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Speaker 1: Did you go to a public school, a private school,

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Speaker 1: a Jewish school, what did you attend?

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Speaker 3: I attended a public school until eighth grade, and then

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Speaker 3: a private school for high school. And so while I

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Speaker 3: was in both public and private school to sort of

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Speaker 3: supplement our Jewish you know, knowledge and community, they sent

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Speaker 3: us to this Hebrew high after our bat mitzvah's and

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Speaker 3: it was there that, for the first time in my life,

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Speaker 3: I got to meet real, live, actual Orthodox Jews. So

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Speaker 3: no more headlines, no more negative messages from my father,

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Speaker 3: but my own personal interactions. And what I discovered was

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Speaker 3: that these people were living these really meaningful and positive

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Speaker 3: lives and they were not the weirdos that I had

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Speaker 3: been led to believe they are. Let me clarify, there

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Speaker 3: are still some weirdos. I'm not gonna master the entire community.

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Speaker 3: There's for sure weirdos, but there's weirdos everywhere I spent

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Speaker 3: my first Shabis, my first Sabbath with one of my teachers.

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Speaker 3: In my mind he was coming from a Stistle community,

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Speaker 3: even though he lived in one of the biggest modern

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Speaker 3: Orthodox communities in the Tri State area. I couldn't quite

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Speaker 3: parse the difference. But what I'll tell you is that

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Speaker 3: my soul was yearning for what they had, what I

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Speaker 3: saw in their home. When I studied Torah in depth

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Speaker 3: in his class, there was something that I had really

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Speaker 3: been longing for, and my soul felt complete and sort of.

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Speaker 3: The follow up point to this exposure to this new

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Speaker 3: way of life was in a tropical rainforest in Hawaii

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Speaker 3: when I was sixteen. During that year of sort of

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Speaker 3: exploration and opening up my mind, I saw a tree

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Speaker 3: that I was convinced had been painted on by just

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Speaker 3: some artists in the forest. And when I looked to

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Speaker 3: the top and saw the color went all the way

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Speaker 3: up this huge shoot. It's called rainbow eucalyptus, something inside

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Speaker 3: of me transformed. I like to call it a moment

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Speaker 3: of clarity, or for a split second, I delved one

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Speaker 3: layer deeper into perception and I discovered unity running throughout

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Speaker 3: all of existence. And in that moment when I felt

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Speaker 3: this unity surround me. I suddenly realized this is what

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Speaker 3: they must mean when they say God. And I was

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Speaker 3: an agnostic and atheist, certainly not a believer before that,

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Speaker 3: but sort of happening upon this moment in the Hawaii

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Speaker 3: and sort of being filled with something so big and majestic,

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Speaker 3: something shifted inside me forever. And once I sort of

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Speaker 3: named that feeling, I thought, let me look into my

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Speaker 3: heritage to see if I can delve deeper into that

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Speaker 3: experience of God to get that feeling back again.

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Speaker 1: That's intense. You were sixteen years old.

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Speaker 3: Well, if I was thinking about the end of my

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Speaker 3: life at eight, I had to get to enlightenment by sixteen.

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Speaker 1: You know. Now, what was your family's response were they

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Speaker 1: when you you know, you come and you say, I

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Speaker 1: know God, I feel a spiritual center and I'd like

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Speaker 1: to follow this? Your family was accepting and.

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Speaker 2: Nope, no.

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Speaker 3: So what I'll tell you is that my mother had

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Speaker 3: the strongest sense about Judaism. She had a religious grandmother

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Speaker 3: and grandfather that basically only spoke Yiddish, and although they

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Speaker 3: couldn't communicate, you know, in English, she we had fond

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Speaker 3: memories of their relationship to Judaism and so she was

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Speaker 3: more supportive. I was a bit of a nerdy teenager,

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Speaker 3: so if I was acting up and my mother wanted

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Speaker 3: to ground me, she would say, no shabas for you

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Speaker 3: this week, little girl. Like that was literally I got

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Speaker 3: to cancel. My punishment was getting shaba is canceled. My

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Speaker 3: father thought that I was becoming one of these extremists,

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Speaker 3: that he was taken care of that. Again, he completely

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Speaker 3: judged I think very unfairly, and so at all of

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Speaker 3: sixteen years old, I said, if you think then I'm

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Speaker 3: ruining my life and the life of your unborn grandchildren,

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Speaker 3: then please save me from this cult. But here's the deal.

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Speaker 3: You don't get an opinion until you learn something, because

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Speaker 3: ignorant people shouldn't weigh in on debates. So learn something,

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Speaker 3: meet who I meet, come for shabis, where I go

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Speaker 3: away for shabas, And once you've educated yourself, let's engage

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Speaker 3: in a debate. He didn't want to do it, didn't

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Speaker 3: want to do it, and eventually realized that he does

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Speaker 3: have to learn to properly debate me. So he began

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Speaker 3: to study to spite me, and after about a year

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Speaker 3: of studying and experiencing shobas for himself. He was almost

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Speaker 3: fifty years old. He said, you were right and I

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Speaker 3: was wrong, and now it's time to play catch up.

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Speaker 3: And he and my mother and both of my sisters

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Speaker 3: all became Orthodox.

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Speaker 1: Wow, that's pretty fascinating. What a strong manifesto you are.

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Speaker 1: You were able to sort of change the essence of

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Speaker 1: your whole family at a young age.

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Speaker 3: And my parents have fourteen Orthodox grandchildren. And again, we're

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Speaker 3: all living in this space now of very devout, very committed,

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Speaker 3: you know, to this spiritual way of life, and also

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Speaker 3: holding space for the larger world and you know our

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Speaker 3: role in making it better and sort of understanding the

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Speaker 3: complexities and nuances of humanity.

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Speaker 1: Had you at sixteen or even at eight, experienced anti

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Speaker 1: Semitism yourself.

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Speaker 2: For sure.

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Speaker 3: So my parents raised us in a town with almost

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Speaker 3: no Jews, and maybe in first grade, our neighbor across

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Speaker 3: the street, Larry said to us, I'm speaking your language,

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Speaker 3: called me a Jewish jerk. In fourth grade, a girl

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Speaker 3: named Charlene told me that Jewish people howl the moon

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Speaker 3: and prayed to the devil.

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Speaker 2: So I sort of had this sense of.

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Speaker 3: Being the lone Jew in sort of a larger gentile

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Speaker 3: world and kind of knowing what it felt like to

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Speaker 3: not belong. And it's truth is that after you know,

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Speaker 3: kind of the George Floyd was killed and there was

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Speaker 3: a lot more understanding happening about the experiences of many

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Speaker 3: people of color in this country. I read many narratives

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Speaker 3: of black women talking about kind of being that lone

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Speaker 3: person in a larger society that was not like them. Obviously,

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Speaker 3: you know, I didn't have the outward look that identified me,

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Speaker 3: but I was sort of known as the Jew. I

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Speaker 3: was the only Jewish girl in my grade for most

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Speaker 3: of my time in public school, and so I.

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Speaker 1: In jity, you were the only one.

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Speaker 3: There were towns that my parents could have moved to

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Speaker 3: that were more Jewish, they just did not move there.

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Speaker 3: I went to Catholic Mass before I went to an

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Speaker 3: orthodoxoal just to give you an idea of sort of

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Speaker 3: how little few Jews there were around me. My town

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Speaker 3: was predominantly Catholic Italian and a real pride around that,

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Speaker 3: you know, sort of ethnicity, and I appreciated their pride.

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Speaker 3: I just didn't have that sense of that sort of

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Speaker 3: community for myself. I really kind of always felt like

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Speaker 3: the lone Jew.

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Speaker 1: We'll be back with Alice and Joseph's right after this.

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Speaker 1: So let me ask you, Allison, tell me what the

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Speaker 1: world has been like for you here in the United

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Speaker 1: States since October seventh. Tell me your fear level, tell

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Speaker 1: me your tell me what's been going on for you specifically.

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Speaker 3: So, when we were little, probably five years old, my

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Speaker 3: mother sat my sisters and me down, and she gave

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Speaker 3: us a warning. She said, things are good today, but

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Speaker 3: things were good in Germany, and things were good in Spain.

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Speaker 3: And every country eventually tires of its Jews, and one

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Speaker 3: day the US may tire of us as well. We

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Speaker 3: may need to run. And so this is oh wait,

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Speaker 3: how old were you? Probably five years old?

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Speaker 2: Wow.

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Speaker 3: And I think this is sort of the experience that

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Speaker 3: so many Jews grow up with a certain knowledge that

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Speaker 3: we I may never expressed to non Jewish people, and

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Speaker 3: so from the outside there may be this sense of

349
00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:10,040
Speaker 3: things look pretty good. In fact, I only came to

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Speaker 3: sort of understand this part of my identity when a

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Speaker 3: non Jewish black man asked me a few years ago.

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Speaker 3: There was some ongoing violence, you know, towards the Hasidic

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Speaker 3: community from the black community. We did this program called

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Speaker 3: Me to Jew in the city, make a friend where

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Speaker 3: we put up a tent in Harlem and gave out

356
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Speaker 3: coffee and rugelach to try to Let's have conversations, let's interact,

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Speaker 3: Let's stop being on different sides of the street, but

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Speaker 3: let's get to know each other. This guy came by

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Speaker 3: and he said, no offense, but you seem like you're

360
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Speaker 3: doing okay, Like what persecution do Jews feel? And this

361
00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:44,239
Speaker 3: got me back to this point of I've had this

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Speaker 3: knowledge my whole life that we may have to run

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Speaker 3: one day. I summed it up as Jewish baggage is

364
00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:54,600
Speaker 3: never being able to fully unpack. So I started asking

365
00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:59,240
Speaker 3: people online did you get such a talk? And not surprisingly,

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00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:03,320
Speaker 3: many Jewish people in my network reported as similar talk.

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Speaker 2: Some talks included.

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Speaker 3: Have your passport always ready if the person was visibly Jewish,

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Speaker 3: it was you wear a baseball cap in this setting,

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Speaker 3: or look for the exits you know if you're in

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Speaker 3: this type of Jewish building. But then I realized that

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Speaker 3: the talk is actually a talk that every single Jewish

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Speaker 3: person gets. Nearly in the Passover Satar in the Hagadah,

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Speaker 3: we say every year, in every generation, our enemies.

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Speaker 2: Rise up to destroy us.

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Speaker 3: So although my mother told us this talk when we

377
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Speaker 3: were young, and that seems like a young age to

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Speaker 3: say something so heavy, we had actually been learning this

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Speaker 3: message since the first time that we went to a

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Speaker 3: passover Satar, and so I think that to answer the

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Speaker 3: question about what has the world been like since October seventh?

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Speaker 3: So I grew up having nightmares about the Holocaust. We

383
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Speaker 3: learned about the Holocaust, you know, in social studies, probably

384
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Speaker 3: starting in fifth sixth grade.

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Speaker 1: Yep.

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Speaker 2: And when you're.

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Speaker 3: A Jewish kid, I think most Jewish kids go home

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Speaker 3: and have nightmares afterwards about the Nazis rounding you up.

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Speaker 1: And I think the non Jewish kids too. I think

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Speaker 1: it is a terrifying concept to introduce to a child

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Speaker 1: and you know who's going to be the oppressor and

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Speaker 1: who's going to be oppressed. And I don't know that

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00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:20,960
Speaker 1: that exclusively was for Jewish people. I think that every

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Speaker 1: child that is forced to sort of face the atrocities

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Speaker 1: of humans against each other was terrorized by the truth

396
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Speaker 1: of the Holocaust.

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Speaker 3: It could be, you know, I've sort of I know

398
00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:37,600
Speaker 3: what my experience is and what my you know, Jewish

399
00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:39,600
Speaker 3: friends have reported back. I'll tell you something else, and

400
00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:41,720
Speaker 3: I'm curious if you've thought of this too, And I

401
00:22:41,760 --> 00:22:45,360
Speaker 3: did actually do an informal pull on our social media channels.

402
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:49,240
Speaker 3: There seems to be a large percentage of Jewish people

403
00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:53,480
Speaker 3: that sort of test their strength against whatever they're experiencing.

404
00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:56,280
Speaker 3: So what I mean is, let's say you're out somewhere

405
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Speaker 3: and you're really thirsty. You put yourself into the situation

406
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Speaker 3: of how would I have managed on a cattle car

407
00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:07,480
Speaker 3: being shipped off to Auschwitz? Wow? You We came home

408
00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:09,639
Speaker 3: a couple of years ago during winter breaking. It had

409
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Speaker 3: snowed and I didn't have boots, and we cut out

410
00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:13,800
Speaker 3: of the plane, you know, got our car our uber

411
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Speaker 3: and I had to walk through the front lawn that

412
00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:20,119
Speaker 3: was full of snow with just low shoes, And I

413
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:22,720
Speaker 3: thought to myself, how would I have fared during the

414
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Speaker 3: Death March?

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Speaker 1: And Gerda Stein? You know the story of Gerda Stein father,

416
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Speaker 1: her father told her put on your boots and it

417
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Speaker 1: was the summer and she said, Daddy, He said, you

418
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Speaker 1: don't disobey your father. And it was those boots that

419
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:42,320
Speaker 1: allowed her to survive the Holocaust that she listened to him.

420
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Speaker 1: That he didn't survive, but she survived, and she ended

421
00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:51,240
Speaker 1: up marrying the American soldier who freed her concentration camp.

422
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Speaker 1: And he went over to her and said, she opened

423
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Speaker 1: that it was they were in a bicycle factory where

424
00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:01,399
Speaker 1: they had walked walked and walked and walked, and they

425
00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,040
Speaker 1: were in the bicycle factory and he opened the door

426
00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:07,920
Speaker 1: and she was there, and she warned him. She said,

427
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Speaker 1: I just need you to know we're all Jews. And

428
00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:14,800
Speaker 1: he said, and so am I. And then they were

429
00:24:14,840 --> 00:24:17,399
Speaker 1: married and they have very many children, and they live

430
00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:21,399
Speaker 1: in Arizona, and all those stories, you know, haunted me

431
00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:25,640
Speaker 1: as well throughout my life. Now, I'm not claiming any

432
00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:31,760
Speaker 1: comparison to the heritage and the trauma tattoo on the

433
00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:37,159
Speaker 1: cellular DNA I feel of Jewish people in our recent

434
00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:44,359
Speaker 1: lifetime since the Holocaust. I'm just trying to really understand

435
00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:50,720
Speaker 1: how it all went so wrong since October seventh, Like

436
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:54,120
Speaker 1: after nine to eleven, the United States had so much

437
00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:59,119
Speaker 1: goodwill from around the world because of the terrorist attack

438
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:05,280
Speaker 1: that occurred, and then that didn't seem to happen after

439
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,800
Speaker 1: October seventh, now correct, I don't know if that's because

440
00:25:10,359 --> 00:25:15,680
Speaker 1: it seemed as though the response was very quick and

441
00:25:16,280 --> 00:25:22,040
Speaker 1: very brutal. That it almost shook people from focusing on

442
00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:24,720
Speaker 1: the seventh. Do you think that that's what occurred or

443
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:27,239
Speaker 1: what do you think is the reason for that.

444
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:32,080
Speaker 3: I think that there's a lot of anti Semites that

445
00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:34,960
Speaker 3: are out there, and I think that and this goes

446
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:37,760
Speaker 3: back to kind of the media depiction of Jews sort

447
00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:43,879
Speaker 3: of reinforcing this. Jews are seen as privileged and powerful

448
00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:46,840
Speaker 3: and wealthy and white and kind of being in control

449
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:51,680
Speaker 3: of everything, and so people kind of don't have room

450
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:55,000
Speaker 3: in their mind to see us as the oppressed and

451
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:58,000
Speaker 3: the victims. I think in the Holocaust, that's kind of

452
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:00,760
Speaker 3: like the one exception, and there's kind of the sense

453
00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:04,359
Speaker 3: that that bad thing happened, and now, look, Jews are everywhere,

454
00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:08,160
Speaker 3: and I think that. Look, I do work in diversity,

455
00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:11,600
Speaker 3: equity and inclusion. We founded the first and only Jewish

456
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,520
Speaker 3: Hollywood Bureau a couple of years ago. What we discovered

457
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:17,199
Speaker 3: was that every other minority group had been advocating for

458
00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 3: decades in Hollywood for fair and whole and nuanced depictions,

459
00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:23,240
Speaker 3: and no one ever did it for the Jews. Why

460
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:26,439
Speaker 3: Because Jews run Hollywood, because Jews have all the power,

461
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:29,119
Speaker 3: because Jews don't need any help, and so you know,

462
00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 3: what I think really is kind of the challenge is

463
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:35,040
Speaker 3: that in the minds of so many people, Jews are

464
00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:37,359
Speaker 3: at the top, So how could we be struggling? How

465
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:39,960
Speaker 3: could we be at the bottom. Jews have not been

466
00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:43,800
Speaker 3: included in so many of these initiatives around listening to

467
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:48,400
Speaker 3: the stories of the marginalized, hearing what they're experiencing, understanding

468
00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:50,960
Speaker 3: the baggage that they're carrying, how it fits into the

469
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 3: larger tapestry of how other groups tell their stories. And

470
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:59,639
Speaker 3: I think because of that, people that normally are as

471
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:03,080
Speaker 3: too to you know, being sensitive about.

472
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:06,119
Speaker 1: The social justice issues and exactly right.

473
00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 3: And by the way, David Bidil talks about this and

474
00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:11,920
Speaker 3: Jews don't count. It is a masterpiece that he wrote

475
00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:16,240
Speaker 3: explaining how this social justice movement left out the Jews

476
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:18,719
Speaker 3: and why we do belong in that conversation.

477
00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:26,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's a fascinating dilemma to try to wrap

478
00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:30,639
Speaker 1: your head around it, really is. I know, personally, for

479
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:37,200
Speaker 1: me that my response to the Israeli response of Gaza

480
00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:41,719
Speaker 1: and all the death that's happened since then, you know,

481
00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:45,360
Speaker 1: has has gutted me and millions of other people, never

482
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:50,439
Speaker 1: mind the people there. And I find that the accusation

483
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:57,600
Speaker 1: of anti Semitism is so painful to people who are

484
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,960
Speaker 1: not but want the want the bombing to stop.

485
00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:05,239
Speaker 3: So I think the thing about unconscious bias, and I

486
00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:07,640
Speaker 3: think that this is something that the black community really

487
00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:10,679
Speaker 3: brought out in the last few years, is that we

488
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 3: can be good people that have good intentions, and we

489
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:17,040
Speaker 3: can have so many unconscious biases sort of like written

490
00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:20,680
Speaker 3: into our I don't know, not say DNA, but sort

491
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:23,200
Speaker 3: of like experience or how we see the world, that

492
00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,280
Speaker 3: we may not realize what we believe. Let me ask

493
00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:29,680
Speaker 3: you a question, like, what was your feeling, you know

494
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:34,280
Speaker 3: when the US responded to nine to eleven and you know,

495
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:39,160
Speaker 3: went to Afghanistan to get rid of al Qaeda.

496
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:42,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, I went on TV with no war spray painted

497
00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:45,400
Speaker 1: on the back of my jacket, and I spoke to

498
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:50,440
Speaker 1: Phil Donniu about our need for clearer minds and that

499
00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 1: we could not go and invade a country that did

500
00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 1: not attack us on nine to eleven. And I got

501
00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:00,160
Speaker 1: in a lot of trouble personally and professionally. But I'm

502
00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:04,000
Speaker 1: a pacifist. I'm against war, you know, I'm against the

503
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:09,000
Speaker 1: I'm against what's going on in Gaza. I can't watch it,

504
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:12,320
Speaker 1: and that doesn't mean I'm anti Semitic to me, and

505
00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:15,920
Speaker 1: I don't like the accusation. I feel it's unfair. I

506
00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:20,360
Speaker 1: feel I feel the pain of my friends, large percentage

507
00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:24,280
Speaker 1: of Boom or Jewish. I feel their pain. I see

508
00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 1: their pain. I've had friendships end in the last month

509
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:33,480
Speaker 1: over this, you know, over if you don't, if you

510
00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:37,600
Speaker 1: don't write this instead of cease fire, then you are Hamas.

511
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:41,160
Speaker 1: I'm like, well, now, come on, are you seriously going

512
00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:45,320
Speaker 1: to say that to someone who says, well, maybe the

513
00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 1: response is not legal, the response to the tragedy. No

514
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:55,200
Speaker 1: one denies the atrocities. Nobody denies some.

515
00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:58,280
Speaker 3: People are actually let me actually just correct you there,

516
00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:01,480
Speaker 3: because there are actually people and just in terms of

517
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:04,200
Speaker 3: you know, explaining what we're going through. So what I

518
00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:07,760
Speaker 3: would say is that the Holocaust nightmares of my childhood

519
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:10,720
Speaker 3: started playing out in real time updates on social media

520
00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:14,520
Speaker 3: and hearing about the beheadings and the burnings and the

521
00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:17,719
Speaker 3: rapings of women where literally they said their limbs were

522
00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:21,520
Speaker 3: ripped off. It is like a level of terror, and

523
00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:24,600
Speaker 3: it feels like we are a small people and it

524
00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:27,080
Speaker 3: feels like this is a distant cousin. That's how the

525
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:29,560
Speaker 3: Jewish people feel about each other because we are a nation.

526
00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:34,400
Speaker 1: Well, you know, I would expect terror from Isis and

527
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:39,920
Speaker 1: hisbola and hamas, but I don't expect that behavior from Israel.

528
00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:45,120
Speaker 3: Okay, So just to clarify, do you think that targeting

529
00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:49,000
Speaker 3: civilians going into a civilian population and they literally had

530
00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:51,280
Speaker 3: lists of homes with people written in them who was

531
00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:53,960
Speaker 3: going to be home on October seventh so they would

532
00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:56,080
Speaker 3: know who to be able to attack. They had a

533
00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 3: list of women that they were planning to rape. I mean,

534
00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:01,520
Speaker 3: they have detailed records that they kept. Do you not

535
00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 3: see any difference between the specific targeting of civilians versus

536
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:10,360
Speaker 3: the trying to minimize civilian casualties by targeting ramas like,

537
00:31:10,400 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 3: do you not see any differentiation.

538
00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:15,400
Speaker 1: In Well, I don't think that there's a lot of

539
00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:18,280
Speaker 1: thought given to the civilians.

540
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 2: Okay.

541
00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:22,920
Speaker 3: So what I would like to sort of push back

542
00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:26,720
Speaker 3: on that is that Israel is doing an extraordinary amount

543
00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:30,760
Speaker 3: to try to prevent civilians from being killed. Look, the

544
00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:34,040
Speaker 3: reality is that I appreciate your consistency that you spoke

545
00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:38,280
Speaker 3: out against the US, you know, going to Afghanistan, because

546
00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:42,080
Speaker 3: I do think that not everyone that's complaining about Israel's

547
00:31:42,120 --> 00:31:47,240
Speaker 3: response had the same perspective with the US and in Afghanistan.

548
00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:50,240
Speaker 3: So I do appreciate that, you know, you're a pacifist

549
00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 3: through and through what the IDEF does do as Ramas

550
00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 3: embeds under schools, under hospitals, and the US has confirmed

551
00:31:58,280 --> 00:32:02,440
Speaker 3: that they've embedded under hospitals. The IDs made twenty thousand

552
00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 3: phone calls to Palestinians to warn them to get out.

553
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:09,400
Speaker 3: They've hacked it, nowhere for them to go, so so okay.

554
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:11,960
Speaker 3: So in terms of where they can go, the IDEF

555
00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 3: actually made a humanitarian corridor to help Palestinians leave the area.

556
00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:21,760
Speaker 3: Hamas was there with snipers, actually shooting both Palestinians and

557
00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:25,960
Speaker 3: the IDF. The Hamas is also there with snipers as

558
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:29,640
Speaker 3: Palestinians were trying to leave the area. Israel is doing

559
00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:35,240
Speaker 3: humanitarian pauses every day. They've provided incubators to the hospital

560
00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:37,160
Speaker 3: where Hamas has there.

561
00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:41,680
Speaker 1: They cut off food and water, Allison, they're starving people.

562
00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:44,400
Speaker 2: Okay, ten let me let me let me ask you

563
00:32:44,440 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 2: a question.

564
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:48,760
Speaker 3: Did the US provide food and water in Germany when

565
00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:49,920
Speaker 3: we fought the Nazis?

566
00:32:49,960 --> 00:32:52,040
Speaker 2: There were four million German civilians.

567
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 1: That was a war where there were two there were

568
00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:59,480
Speaker 1: nations against each other. This is an ideology, a terrorist group,

569
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:05,440
Speaker 1: a horrific outgrowth of the worst of humanity. It's not

570
00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 1: a country.

571
00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:08,760
Speaker 2: I mean you know what.

572
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 3: Israel unilaterally left Gaza in two thousand and five. They

573
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:18,440
Speaker 3: left them with greenhouses. This was a beautiful built up

574
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 3: area that Jewish people had been living in. They literally

575
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:25,680
Speaker 3: ethnically cleansed Gaza of Jews, and the idea of pulled

576
00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:29,560
Speaker 3: Jewish people out of Gaza in order to say you

577
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:33,080
Speaker 3: have this land, we will help you to develop it further.

578
00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 2: We want to partner with you.

579
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 3: And by the way, this was after five other instances

580
00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:42,120
Speaker 3: of you know, Palestinians being offered a two state solution

581
00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:44,880
Speaker 3: that they rejected those every single time. In two thousand

582
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:49,440
Speaker 3: and five, Israel unilaritly left Gaza, and they could have

583
00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:52,360
Speaker 3: done anything they wanted to, and there were plenty of

584
00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:55,760
Speaker 3: governments around the world that were ready to give funding

585
00:33:55,840 --> 00:33:59,560
Speaker 3: help build it up. Instead, very sadly, a majority of

586
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:04,720
Speaker 3: Palestinians voted Ramas as their government. And once Ramas has power,

587
00:34:04,760 --> 00:34:06,680
Speaker 3: as we both know, Ramas is not going to be

588
00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:10,080
Speaker 3: giving up power Look, my heart breaks for any innocent

589
00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:14,200
Speaker 3: Palestinian that is living there under this horrific, terrifying regime

590
00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:16,160
Speaker 3: and they don't have any way to get out or

591
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 3: get food.

592
00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:20,160
Speaker 1: We'll be back with Alice and Joseph's right after this.

593
00:34:42,160 --> 00:34:45,319
Speaker 3: Since I'm not a pacifist, I need to just ask

594
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:48,560
Speaker 3: you a question, which is, how do you stop bad people?

595
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:51,120
Speaker 3: How do you stop Nazis and al Qaeda and ISIS

596
00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:54,040
Speaker 3: and Haramas? If you're going to take a pacifist approach,

597
00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:58,160
Speaker 3: like literally, what are you supposed to do? Well, I

598
00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:01,200
Speaker 3: don't think you can kill all of the Palestinians in

599
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:03,880
Speaker 3: order to end Hamas. Wait, so I didn't say that

600
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:06,120
Speaker 3: we're doing that. And just keep in mind that Israel

601
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 3: is risking their soldiers' lives by making this into a

602
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:11,160
Speaker 3: ground war, which, as we both know, is a much

603
00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:13,279
Speaker 3: more dangerous thing to do. If Israel wanted to just

604
00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:16,879
Speaker 3: carpet bomb all of Gaza, this thing could be over

605
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:19,360
Speaker 3: in a few minutes. They have the firepower to do

606
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:23,600
Speaker 3: so they are carefully going from building to buildings.

607
00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:26,600
Speaker 1: Well, I look, I dispute that, Allison. I think that

608
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:32,319
Speaker 1: anyone watching what's going on can't claim that Israel has

609
00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 1: the moral high ground of trying to save lives in Gaza.

610
00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:42,040
Speaker 3: What did you have to say online when Hamas shot

611
00:35:42,120 --> 00:35:46,719
Speaker 3: three rockets at the Israeli hospital in Ashkaloge Did you

612
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:47,719
Speaker 3: have any comments on that?

613
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:53,279
Speaker 1: Well, there are all kinds of distortions coming from the

614
00:35:53,360 --> 00:35:56,960
Speaker 1: media about what's happening there, including I think some of

615
00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:59,680
Speaker 1: the ways that you've just presented your opinion of what's

616
00:35:59,719 --> 00:36:05,560
Speaker 1: happened there, that there's an altruistic Jewish identity that would

617
00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:10,000
Speaker 1: take care of such things as innocent civilians. I believe

618
00:36:10,080 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 1: that's who Jewish people are. That's what I believe the

619
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:17,920
Speaker 1: Tora represents. That's what I believe Jewish people are about.

620
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:22,160
Speaker 1: It's not that they are about what's happening now in Gaza,

621
00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:26,480
Speaker 1: that that what's happening now. I got in trouble because

622
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:29,960
Speaker 1: I said genocide and friends said, how could you say that?

623
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:32,960
Speaker 1: Or how could you say cease fire? I will always

624
00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:35,279
Speaker 1: say cease fire. I will always try to save the

625
00:36:35,320 --> 00:36:38,799
Speaker 1: lives of innocent people. There's no collateral damage in a war,

626
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:43,400
Speaker 1: there's just humans. So I'm not who's to blame, though

627
00:36:43,440 --> 00:36:45,920
Speaker 1: it's Hamas not to blame. There was a ceasefire on

628
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:49,160
Speaker 1: October sixth, Yes, and I do have some questions about

629
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:52,799
Speaker 1: yahu In. What took six to eight hours to get

630
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:56,239
Speaker 1: there to help people in the most the most protected

631
00:36:56,560 --> 00:37:00,640
Speaker 1: area in the Midwest, the most cameras and security footage

632
00:37:00,640 --> 00:37:05,160
Speaker 1: per per mile per kilometer. How did that happen? And

633
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:08,920
Speaker 1: you know, nine to eleven, the United States needed a

634
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:11,840
Speaker 1: reason to get into war in the mid East, and

635
00:37:11,920 --> 00:37:14,720
Speaker 1: it seems as though bet Yahoo got what he wanted

636
00:37:15,160 --> 00:37:15,879
Speaker 1: on that day.

637
00:37:17,160 --> 00:37:20,239
Speaker 3: I mean, I think that's no matter your opinion on

638
00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:26,240
Speaker 3: this man, this was really like the most horrific Jewish

639
00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:29,400
Speaker 3: attack in the life of anything.

640
00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:31,480
Speaker 1: How did it happened? And how did it happen? So

641
00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:34,560
Speaker 1: there were eight breaches? How were there eight breaches.

642
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:36,680
Speaker 3: In the LD? So it seems like Iran was involved.

643
00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:39,280
Speaker 3: It seems like Russia was involved. There was a major

644
00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:42,720
Speaker 3: hacking that happened that just destabilized everything, took all eyes

645
00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:47,040
Speaker 3: off of everything. They also simultaneously had rockets firing to

646
00:37:47,120 --> 00:37:48,200
Speaker 3: get people to look.

647
00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:48,920
Speaker 2: In the wrong direction.

648
00:37:49,280 --> 00:37:51,480
Speaker 3: So while they were looking where the rockets were firing,

649
00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:54,440
Speaker 3: they were able to open and infiltrate the the fence.

650
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:58,839
Speaker 3: And let me just clarify, Egypt has a very significant

651
00:37:58,880 --> 00:38:03,600
Speaker 3: wall with Goz. Egypt has blockaded Gaza and they don't

652
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 3: allow any free passage into Gaza. Their wall is high,

653
00:38:06,760 --> 00:38:09,120
Speaker 3: it's thick, it's deep into the ground because they know

654
00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:14,480
Speaker 3: the Palestinians build tunnels. The wall between Israel and Gaza

655
00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:16,359
Speaker 3: is just a fence, and it.

656
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:20,399
Speaker 1: Was on just a fence. We've seen it.

657
00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 3: Did not see did you not see the bulldozers that

658
00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:24,880
Speaker 3: just in that part?

659
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:28,160
Speaker 1: I agree they were fences, yes, and that's the that's

660
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:31,080
Speaker 1: the majority of the wall. I actually was shocked to

661
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:34,440
Speaker 1: find out that Israel did not have a wall as

662
00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:38,440
Speaker 1: significant as Egypt does. But they do not like this

663
00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:40,919
Speaker 1: is what I would put onto you. I appreciate that

664
00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:44,360
Speaker 1: you want to decrease, you know, the loss of human life,

665
00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:46,880
Speaker 1: and in the end, I want to decrease the anti

666
00:38:46,920 --> 00:38:51,799
Speaker 1: Semitism that's happening, and I want Israel to realize that

667
00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:57,120
Speaker 1: they're creating more terrorists every hour this goes on.

668
00:38:57,280 --> 00:39:00,359
Speaker 3: So you know what I think, when we fought back

669
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:04,960
Speaker 3: at Isis and when we fought back at al Qaeda, unfortunately.

670
00:39:05,239 --> 00:39:06,040
Speaker 2: These are.

671
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:12,520
Speaker 3: These are extremist Islamic terror groups. These are not Muslims.

672
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:16,480
Speaker 3: This is a certain radical ideology, and unfortunately, I think

673
00:39:16,520 --> 00:39:19,560
Speaker 3: the only way to defeat them is to destroy them

674
00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:24,080
Speaker 3: for any innocent I'm talking about the terrorists, not the people.

675
00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:25,560
Speaker 2: If you I mean.

676
00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:29,240
Speaker 3: The head of Hamas said right after October seventh, they'll

677
00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:32,000
Speaker 3: do another one, and another one and another one. Their

678
00:39:32,120 --> 00:39:34,960
Speaker 3: goal is to annihilate every single Jew in Israel. And

679
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:38,920
Speaker 3: they've also called for global jihad and an enafada all

680
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:39,920
Speaker 3: over the world, which.

681
00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:43,160
Speaker 1: There's no argument that they are the worst of the

682
00:39:43,239 --> 00:39:48,319
Speaker 1: worst in terms of terrorist groups. And something about their

683
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:53,840
Speaker 1: life and their history of being, as Jimmy Carter said,

684
00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:59,840
Speaker 1: an apartheid state, being in an apartheid situation when he

685
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:01,840
Speaker 1: write that book, and he got in so much trouble.

686
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:05,680
Speaker 3: Jim tell me what's in apartheid state about Israel? How

687
00:40:05,719 --> 00:40:08,040
Speaker 3: would you describe that? What do you mean by that? Well?

688
00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:10,479
Speaker 1: I was shocked when I went there to find out

689
00:40:10,560 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 1: that there was not free passage, that there were separate

690
00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:17,080
Speaker 1: roads that Palestinians had to walk on, in roads that

691
00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:18,480
Speaker 1: Israeli's got to walk on.

692
00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:22,480
Speaker 3: I've been to Israel, I've lived in Israel. I have

693
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:24,880
Speaker 3: no idea what you're talking about. There are no separate

694
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:28,319
Speaker 3: roads for Palestinians. In fact, there are one hundred and

695
00:40:28,360 --> 00:40:31,880
Speaker 3: thirty thousand Palestinians that have work permits that go to

696
00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 3: Israel every day.

697
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:36,759
Speaker 1: So I don't think that how Israel has treated the

698
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:40,120
Speaker 1: Palestinians is an apartheid type government.

699
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:45,200
Speaker 3: So let's just separate things into two different categories. There's

700
00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:49,000
Speaker 3: Israeli Arabs, two million Israeli Arabs that live in Israel proper.

701
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:54,319
Speaker 3: They're full citizens, they are in the Supreme Court, they

702
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 3: are CEOs of major banks, their television you know, hosts,

703
00:40:59,719 --> 00:41:02,440
Speaker 3: I mean, doctors, lawyers, you name it. They go to

704
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:07,680
Speaker 3: the universities. Let's contrast that to the fact that there

705
00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:11,800
Speaker 3: are basically no Jews in any other Middle Eastern Muslim countries.

706
00:41:12,280 --> 00:41:15,400
Speaker 3: In fact, eight hundred and fifty thousand Jews were ethnically

707
00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:18,439
Speaker 3: cleansed from pretty much every other Middle East and North

708
00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:19,759
Speaker 3: African country.

709
00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:20,680
Speaker 2: In the forties and fifties.

710
00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:23,960
Speaker 3: So just to say those countries don't have Jews living

711
00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:27,320
Speaker 3: there and they don't you know, have full of reti.

712
00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:30,239
Speaker 1: Doesn't mean they don't live there. It means that there's

713
00:41:30,280 --> 00:41:36,080
Speaker 1: an oppressive government that penalizes one race over the other

714
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:37,520
Speaker 1: and fields so.

715
00:41:37,520 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 3: Jews for the few Jews that are left in these places,

716
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 3: they cannot live safely and comfortably. It is certainly a

717
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:46,879
Speaker 3: scary and terrifying way to be one of the lone

718
00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:49,120
Speaker 3: Jews left in Iraq or Iran. That sort of a thing.

719
00:41:49,360 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 3: So I think in terms of the Israeli Arabs, they

720
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:56,680
Speaker 3: have full citizenship, they have there have you know, made

721
00:41:56,719 --> 00:42:00,400
Speaker 3: success in many of their careers. Then there's the separate

722
00:42:00,400 --> 00:42:05,800
Speaker 3: issue of Palestinians. Israel has offered or sort of the

723
00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:09,080
Speaker 3: world the un different entities have offered Palestinians their own

724
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:13,640
Speaker 3: state on five occasions. In two thousand, Bill Clinton sat

725
00:42:13,719 --> 00:42:19,000
Speaker 3: down with Arafat and you know, he was basically offered

726
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:23,920
Speaker 3: ninety four percent of the West Bank Gaza, East Jerusalem.

727
00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:28,200
Speaker 3: Bill Clinton said that Arafat said no fourteen times in

728
00:42:28,320 --> 00:42:31,160
Speaker 3: two weeks and never once asked for a counter offer.

729
00:42:31,719 --> 00:42:34,560
Speaker 3: Five years eight years later, Ahood almart sat down with

730
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:39,680
Speaker 3: Mohammad Abas to offer even more land, and he still

731
00:42:39,719 --> 00:42:43,160
Speaker 3: said no. Instead of giving a counter offer, they came

732
00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:45,800
Speaker 3: back with violence, and in the middle of that, Israel

733
00:42:45,920 --> 00:42:50,279
Speaker 3: unilaterally left Gaza and again gave them a piece of

734
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:53,239
Speaker 3: land that they could have turned into Palestine and could

735
00:42:53,239 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 3: have built up and could have taken care of their citizens.

736
00:42:55,840 --> 00:42:58,800
Speaker 3: That was the dream your average Israeli and your average

737
00:42:58,840 --> 00:43:01,719
Speaker 3: Jew once the two states. The problem is that when

738
00:43:01,719 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 3: over and over again you offer two state solution and

739
00:43:04,560 --> 00:43:06,480
Speaker 3: what they say again and they're saying this at March,

740
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:09,120
Speaker 3: is they want a one state solution, and a one

741
00:43:09,160 --> 00:43:12,680
Speaker 3: state solution means the death of Jews, the end of Jews.

742
00:43:12,880 --> 00:43:15,800
Speaker 3: And when you see these protesters, and I've seen a

743
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:18,200
Speaker 3: bunch of videos online where they say where should the

744
00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:18,680
Speaker 3: Jews go?

745
00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:20,080
Speaker 2: They say Jews should go to Hell.

746
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:23,160
Speaker 3: So, you know, I think if there are people that

747
00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:26,240
Speaker 3: you can work with and both sides are saying they want.

748
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:28,560
Speaker 1: You, you can't demonize people.

749
00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:29,640
Speaker 2: No, I'm not saying a people.

750
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:33,960
Speaker 3: I'm mentioning the leaders that the leadership has rejected.

751
00:43:34,120 --> 00:43:38,080
Speaker 1: Well, Justice Thod NETANYAHUO doesn't represent the vast majority of

752
00:43:38,160 --> 00:43:42,239
Speaker 1: Jewish people in Israel. I don't think that Hamas represents

753
00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:43,879
Speaker 1: the Palestinian people.

754
00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:47,719
Speaker 3: Or the Palestinian authority. Look between Hamas and the Palestinian authority.

755
00:43:47,920 --> 00:43:50,600
Speaker 3: Just a few months ago, the people of Gaza were

756
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:53,520
Speaker 3: polled and eighty eight percent said they would vote for

757
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:55,480
Speaker 3: Hamas or the Palestinian authority.

758
00:43:55,800 --> 00:43:58,720
Speaker 1: Both you know, are It's kind of what I'm hearing, Allison.

759
00:43:58,920 --> 00:44:01,879
Speaker 1: And this is why it's so pressing to me, is

760
00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:06,759
Speaker 1: what I'm hearing from Jewish friends who I love, who

761
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:09,600
Speaker 1: I have been friends with for many, many, many years,

762
00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:12,440
Speaker 1: is there's nothing we can do. We have to do this.

763
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:17,399
Speaker 1: There's justification for genocide. And I know that's a word

764
00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:21,759
Speaker 1: that that infuriates people, but it's so hard to witness it,

765
00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:25,800
Speaker 1: to watch it, and to think what those horrible people

766
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:29,640
Speaker 1: did on the seventh is you know, we're going to

767
00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:31,280
Speaker 1: outevil them by.

768
00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 3: What so was I'm defeating the Nazis genocide of Germany.

769
00:44:36,600 --> 00:44:39,839
Speaker 1: No, defeating the Nazis was not because we didn't go

770
00:44:39,880 --> 00:44:42,920
Speaker 1: and try to kill innocent people. When we were we

771
00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:43,960
Speaker 1: killed the Nazis.

772
00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:47,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, but four million civilians died in Germany during World

773
00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:50,239
Speaker 3: War two, es far during World War Yes, but this

774
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:53,240
Speaker 3: but this is a war though, this is not between

775
00:44:53,239 --> 00:44:53,920
Speaker 3: two countries.

776
00:44:53,920 --> 00:45:00,839
Speaker 1: It's between one very very militarized country, a group of

777
00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:01,840
Speaker 1: oppressed people.

778
00:45:02,239 --> 00:45:06,120
Speaker 3: So here's the thing that I'm gonna say, with kindness

779
00:45:06,160 --> 00:45:09,960
Speaker 3: and with respect, I think when you describe the power

780
00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:13,960
Speaker 3: of Israel, those powerful Jews, I think, unknowingly you are

781
00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:17,560
Speaker 3: stepping into an anti Semitic trope, which I don't blame

782
00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:19,279
Speaker 3: you for because I really do believe you have a

783
00:45:19,360 --> 00:45:21,719
Speaker 3: kind heart and you love your Jewish friends. But I

784
00:45:21,800 --> 00:45:24,759
Speaker 3: do think that when you view the Palestinians as the

785
00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:28,560
Speaker 3: oppressed people and the big, bad, powerful Jew on the

786
00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:32,399
Speaker 3: other side, I really do think that that is an

787
00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:35,360
Speaker 3: ancient anti Semitic trope of the powerful Jews.

788
00:45:36,440 --> 00:45:39,040
Speaker 1: We'll be back with Alice and Josephs right after this.

789
00:46:01,480 --> 00:46:04,799
Speaker 3: During Passover, when we talk about the ten plagues, we

790
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:08,440
Speaker 3: take ten drops of wine out of our cup because

791
00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:11,600
Speaker 3: even though the Egyptians enslaved us for two hundred and

792
00:46:11,640 --> 00:46:16,839
Speaker 3: ten years, Jewish values implore us to feel even the

793
00:46:16,880 --> 00:46:20,560
Speaker 3: pain of our enemies. And so again, I can't speak

794
00:46:20,600 --> 00:46:22,480
Speaker 3: for every single Israeli, but what I will tell you

795
00:46:22,520 --> 00:46:25,920
Speaker 3: is that when an Israeli Jewish person commits a crime,

796
00:46:26,320 --> 00:46:29,000
Speaker 3: they go to jail. There is it's a democracy, and

797
00:46:29,080 --> 00:46:33,719
Speaker 3: there are consequences. There is no democracy right now under

798
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:37,160
Speaker 3: Hamas's rule. And I think, you know, I think the

799
00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:39,680
Speaker 3: reason your Jewish friends are reacting so strongly is because

800
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:42,879
Speaker 3: there is no moral equivalence between a terror organization who

801
00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:48,240
Speaker 3: stated mission is to annihilate all Jews and an army

802
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:51,520
Speaker 3: of a sovereign democratic nation who is simply trying to

803
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:55,239
Speaker 3: protect its citizens from getting hacked up, like literally like

804
00:46:55,480 --> 00:46:57,160
Speaker 3: children with their arms cut off.

805
00:46:57,920 --> 00:47:01,320
Speaker 1: Can't say that, Alison, we see we see baby's arms

806
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:04,239
Speaker 1: being pulled from the rubble every day. So how can

807
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:05,160
Speaker 1: you help what we not?

808
00:47:05,640 --> 00:47:06,359
Speaker 2: This is what I would love.

809
00:47:06,440 --> 00:47:07,640
Speaker 1: Which evil is worse?

810
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:12,640
Speaker 3: I think the evil that targets innocence is for sure worse.

811
00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:14,560
Speaker 3: What I would love to see as a solution is

812
00:47:14,600 --> 00:47:18,960
Speaker 3: have Egypt open its border, have a temporary you know,

813
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:22,359
Speaker 3: time and place for Palestinians to make a safe exit out.

814
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:25,880
Speaker 3: Let Israel do its job to finish off Kramas, because

815
00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:28,840
Speaker 3: it will protect not only Jews, but anyone in the

816
00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:32,880
Speaker 3: world who is peace loving and has liberal values. You know,

817
00:47:33,320 --> 00:47:36,400
Speaker 3: we are we are living in basically the worst case scenario.

818
00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:38,880
Speaker 3: Like we're not at the gas chambers yet, rosy, but

819
00:47:39,080 --> 00:47:43,439
Speaker 3: like people. The day after October seventh, my husband went

820
00:47:43,600 --> 00:47:46,680
Speaker 3: to the train station, Penn Station, and there was a

821
00:47:46,760 --> 00:47:50,160
Speaker 3: rally celebrating Israel had not done any response yet, and

822
00:47:50,200 --> 00:47:54,319
Speaker 3: there was simply a celebration of Ramas supporters that were

823
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:55,560
Speaker 3: out there in this country.

824
00:47:55,680 --> 00:47:58,479
Speaker 1: Shame on them, it's shame on their soul.

825
00:47:59,080 --> 00:48:01,320
Speaker 3: This is and this is happening all over the world.

826
00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:05,120
Speaker 3: And look, we all want peace. We pray for peace

827
00:48:05,160 --> 00:48:07,839
Speaker 3: three times a day as Jewish people, and we see

828
00:48:07,840 --> 00:48:10,640
Speaker 3: that as a piece, a worldwide piece. But we will

829
00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:13,000
Speaker 3: not sit back and be killed and we will not

830
00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:14,280
Speaker 3: be defenseless Jews.

831
00:48:14,840 --> 00:48:16,880
Speaker 2: And that's my message.

832
00:48:17,160 --> 00:48:20,399
Speaker 1: Well, you know what, Alison, I've admired you and how

833
00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:23,120
Speaker 1: you speak up for your people and what you believe,

834
00:48:23,239 --> 00:48:27,200
Speaker 1: and I have loved engaging with you. And you know,

835
00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:30,920
Speaker 1: I am deeply troubled, as many millions of people are

836
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:38,799
Speaker 1: across the world by what's happening. And it's really so

837
00:48:39,040 --> 00:48:43,719
Speaker 1: unbearably depressing to me that it's hard to function. And

838
00:48:43,719 --> 00:48:47,520
Speaker 1: instead of saying things that I believe on the internet,

839
00:48:47,600 --> 00:48:50,799
Speaker 1: because you know, the serenity, prayer, the wisdom to know

840
00:48:50,840 --> 00:48:53,160
Speaker 1: the difference the things you can change and the things

841
00:48:53,160 --> 00:48:56,120
Speaker 1: you can change, there's nothing that a hashtag is going

842
00:48:56,200 --> 00:49:01,399
Speaker 1: to change in this, you know, a biblical problem. That's

843
00:49:01,440 --> 00:49:04,640
Speaker 1: that's it's it's it's it's not going to change. So

844
00:49:04,719 --> 00:49:09,240
Speaker 1: I've been resorting to doing videos about my squirrels because

845
00:49:09,280 --> 00:49:13,200
Speaker 1: I can't I can't bear it, Alison. The truth is

846
00:49:13,560 --> 00:49:16,040
Speaker 1: I can't bear it. Just like your soul was crushed

847
00:49:16,400 --> 00:49:19,080
Speaker 1: at eight years old and your spirit opened up, I think,

848
00:49:19,120 --> 00:49:22,799
Speaker 1: you know, my soul was crushed as well, by by

849
00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:26,680
Speaker 1: war and by having to visualize it. And and then

850
00:49:26,800 --> 00:49:29,760
Speaker 1: the the people all over the world who do have power,

851
00:49:29,880 --> 00:49:33,120
Speaker 1: the television industry, they decided we're not going to show

852
00:49:33,160 --> 00:49:36,879
Speaker 1: war anymore because it upsets the masses too much, you.

853
00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:38,960
Speaker 2: Know, like your father, like your fat.

854
00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:44,320
Speaker 1: And now you know, we get it in our handheld devices,

855
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:48,319
Speaker 1: and it's it's it's too much, it's too harrowing. And

856
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:51,000
Speaker 1: you know, I grew up a Catholic kid where nobody

857
00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:55,560
Speaker 1: said I love you, and nobody, uh was very mushbooky

858
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:58,320
Speaker 1: or you know. And I went over to Lourie Shackner's

859
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:01,319
Speaker 1: house and her mother kissed me on both cheeks and

860
00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:04,600
Speaker 1: my mom had just died and hugged me and they

861
00:50:04,600 --> 00:50:07,920
Speaker 1: had a shag rug and leather couches. And I have

862
00:50:08,080 --> 00:50:12,360
Speaker 1: held Jewish people in very high regard in my life,

863
00:50:12,560 --> 00:50:15,080
Speaker 1: almost as a goal of something to want to be.

864
00:50:15,640 --> 00:50:18,319
Speaker 1: I've loved my kids, I think like a Jewish mother

865
00:50:18,440 --> 00:50:21,680
Speaker 1: loves her children. And I learned it from watching the

866
00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:26,280
Speaker 1: families on Long Island, and you know, to be called

867
00:50:26,280 --> 00:50:29,920
Speaker 1: anti semitic, my son had a brisk performed by Amoil.

868
00:50:30,520 --> 00:50:33,759
Speaker 1: I am not anti Semitic, and to be accused of

869
00:50:33,800 --> 00:50:38,399
Speaker 1: it by people that you love is unbearably painful. It's

870
00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:42,719
Speaker 1: such a horrific thing to accuse someone of, especially when

871
00:50:43,400 --> 00:50:44,640
Speaker 1: that's not the truth for them.

872
00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:49,680
Speaker 3: I very much respect your position, and I really do

873
00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:51,799
Speaker 3: believe you're coming from a good place, So I will

874
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:54,080
Speaker 3: give you my stamp of approval from that place.

875
00:50:54,200 --> 00:50:56,640
Speaker 1: Well, thank you, I'll take it. I'll take it.

876
00:50:56,719 --> 00:51:00,279
Speaker 3: But what I would, I guess, just have you and

877
00:51:00,320 --> 00:51:03,879
Speaker 3: any of your listeners just sort of consider examine is

878
00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:09,240
Speaker 3: that we don't have We don't want to die again. Basically,

879
00:51:09,239 --> 00:51:12,399
Speaker 3: we don't want another October seventh. If the world would

880
00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:16,040
Speaker 3: partner with Israel and take in refugees so we could

881
00:51:16,120 --> 00:51:18,120
Speaker 3: just get rid of the people that are vowing to

882
00:51:18,520 --> 00:51:22,040
Speaker 3: come in and massacre us over and over again, Israel

883
00:51:22,040 --> 00:51:25,360
Speaker 3: would take it in a heartbeat. This is they're literally

884
00:51:25,440 --> 00:51:27,360
Speaker 3: trying to do whatever they can. And I know you

885
00:51:27,360 --> 00:51:28,279
Speaker 3: say that you doubt that.

886
00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:31,879
Speaker 1: I No, I don't doubt that. It just it sure

887
00:51:31,920 --> 00:51:34,360
Speaker 1: doesn't look like it from this point of view. You

888
00:51:34,400 --> 00:51:37,680
Speaker 1: know what, war is a horrible thing. I think nobody

889
00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:40,480
Speaker 1: is going to downplay how horrific war is. This is

890
00:51:40,560 --> 00:51:42,280
Speaker 1: not a world that Israel wanted.

891
00:51:42,600 --> 00:51:46,000
Speaker 3: The people that Hamas attacked in that rave, in that festival,

892
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:49,080
Speaker 3: those were the peace lovers. They thought a woman that

893
00:51:49,239 --> 00:51:52,279
Speaker 3: spent her life building bridges and seeing the best in

894
00:51:52,360 --> 00:51:55,959
Speaker 3: humanity and like it didn't matter. And like I would say,

895
00:51:56,040 --> 00:51:58,560
Speaker 3: that's you know, maybe some of the worst of this

896
00:51:58,680 --> 00:52:01,279
Speaker 3: that the people that wanted to sort of have that

897
00:52:01,440 --> 00:52:05,120
Speaker 3: vision of how we all live together and understand each other.

898
00:52:05,480 --> 00:52:09,080
Speaker 3: Ramas is just like in a whole different universe right now,

899
00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:12,360
Speaker 3: and while they walk the earth, we are all in danger.

900
00:52:12,760 --> 00:52:14,960
Speaker 2: And I think, really like what the goal is.

901
00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:18,440
Speaker 3: And when I speak about the Israeli army, like I

902
00:52:18,480 --> 00:52:22,000
Speaker 3: don't you've met Jewish men before, We're not necessarily like

903
00:52:22,040 --> 00:52:25,680
Speaker 3: the rambo macho type. Like these are mostly like family

904
00:52:25,760 --> 00:52:28,560
Speaker 3: guys that are going home and just want to I

905
00:52:28,600 --> 00:52:31,399
Speaker 3: don't know, not be fighting. They're doing this so that

906
00:52:31,440 --> 00:52:35,040
Speaker 3: their wives and children don't end up like hacked up

907
00:52:35,120 --> 00:52:39,719
Speaker 3: and you know, gang raped. It's really like, I know,

908
00:52:39,760 --> 00:52:42,160
Speaker 3: you don't like the outcome, and neither do I, but

909
00:52:42,760 --> 00:52:45,960
Speaker 3: to not do anything could mean the annihilation of the

910
00:52:46,000 --> 00:52:49,000
Speaker 3: Jewish people. So if any countries want to get involved,

911
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:51,960
Speaker 3: to take in refugees, open the corridor in Egypt, let

912
00:52:51,960 --> 00:52:55,280
Speaker 3: Palestinians get a safe you know, exit away, so Israel

913
00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:59,000
Speaker 3: can eradicate Ramas. That is the goal. I have a

914
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:02,960
Speaker 3: ton of Israeli fans. They are terrified, and they're also

915
00:53:03,120 --> 00:53:06,600
Speaker 3: resolute that we're not going to have another Holocaust. We

916
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:10,080
Speaker 3: will defend ourselves, and we won't be ashamed of defending ourselves.

917
00:53:11,280 --> 00:53:14,799
Speaker 1: Okay, and don't be ashamed when some people don't understand,

918
00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:19,920
Speaker 1: because it's hard to understand sometimes. You know, nobody wants that.

919
00:53:20,040 --> 00:53:24,560
Speaker 1: Nobody wants another Holocaust. Nobody wants another you know, nobody

920
00:53:24,600 --> 00:53:28,280
Speaker 1: wants anti ramp at, anti Semitism that's occurring in college

921
00:53:28,320 --> 00:53:31,600
Speaker 1: campuses all over the world. And you know, I mean,

922
00:53:32,280 --> 00:53:35,320
Speaker 1: it's uh, it feels like the end of the world

923
00:53:35,360 --> 00:53:40,680
Speaker 1: to me. And that's that's the most depressing part of it.

924
00:53:41,600 --> 00:53:44,600
Speaker 3: So I will say, as a person of faith in

925
00:53:44,760 --> 00:53:49,200
Speaker 3: the Jewish tradition, we have this concept of yamosamashiach of

926
00:53:49,400 --> 00:53:52,719
Speaker 3: you know, of a Messianic era where there will be

927
00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:55,920
Speaker 3: world peace and nations will you know, lad down their

928
00:53:55,920 --> 00:53:59,759
Speaker 3: sores and turn their swords into plowshares. And it is

929
00:53:59,800 --> 00:54:03,120
Speaker 3: some times hard to picture how that could happen. And

930
00:54:03,200 --> 00:54:05,440
Speaker 3: get what I'll tell you is that I have felt

931
00:54:05,480 --> 00:54:09,400
Speaker 3: more unity and sort of brotherhood with fellow Jews in

932
00:54:09,440 --> 00:54:11,440
Speaker 3: a way that I've never felt in my life before.

933
00:54:11,719 --> 00:54:14,440
Speaker 3: That is one of the signs that Jewish tradition says

934
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:18,040
Speaker 3: will happen before these days of peace, worldwide peace.

935
00:54:18,440 --> 00:54:21,640
Speaker 2: So I'm continuing to pray and to hold I'm.

936
00:54:21,480 --> 00:54:24,400
Speaker 1: For worldwide piece too else and that's my whole goal.

937
00:54:24,520 --> 00:54:28,920
Speaker 1: And and the end of the end of this, because

938
00:54:28,960 --> 00:54:34,360
Speaker 1: it's it's so unbearably painful, I'll give it an amin.

939
00:54:34,440 --> 00:54:36,520
Speaker 1: I'll give it one as well, shall own to you

940
00:54:36,840 --> 00:54:39,840
Speaker 1: and to all of Israel and to all of its people.

941
00:54:40,239 --> 00:54:44,279
Speaker 1: I don't want anyone killed, I don't want anyone terrorized.

942
00:54:44,400 --> 00:54:47,200
Speaker 1: And I thank you for being here. This is, you know,

943
00:54:47,239 --> 00:54:49,200
Speaker 1: a conversation that I think is going to happen a

944
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:53,279
Speaker 1: lot of Thanksgiving homes and and let's hope that that

945
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:56,799
Speaker 1: we can have conversations like this one where no one

946
00:54:56,840 --> 00:55:00,520
Speaker 1: accuses someone or yells at someone or you know, bases

947
00:55:00,600 --> 00:55:04,120
Speaker 1: them and then Hopefully that's the path that will go

948
00:55:04,239 --> 00:55:08,440
Speaker 1: down together, walking together to find peace in this world. Finally,

949
00:55:08,600 --> 00:55:10,240
Speaker 1: you know, thank.

950
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:12,080
Speaker 2: You, thanks so much. Thanks for the platform to do it.

951
00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:26,759
Speaker 1: You're more than welcome. We're not going to take any

952
00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:30,439
Speaker 1: questions today. I just wanted to offer this conversation which

953
00:55:30,520 --> 00:55:35,440
Speaker 1: maybe will bring some solace. This Thursday is Thanksgiving. Be

954
00:55:35,560 --> 00:55:38,760
Speaker 1: with your tribe, your blood, your family, your chosen family,

955
00:55:38,840 --> 00:55:42,560
Speaker 1: your friends and loved ones. Find some peace with each

956
00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:45,239
Speaker 1: other if you can, and I'll see you back on

957
00:55:45,280 --> 00:55:48,440
Speaker 1: December fifth with one of the most fabulous humans around

958
00:55:48,760 --> 00:55:51,600
Speaker 1: Murray Hill. Till then, people onward,