1 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:14,680 Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to OKP Daily with me 2 00:00:14,920 --> 00:00:19,120 Speaker 1: your girl Daniel Moody recording from the Home Bunker, Folks. 3 00:00:19,360 --> 00:00:24,840 Speaker 1: So I am, you know, going on social and I 4 00:00:24,880 --> 00:00:33,440 Speaker 1: see that Lauren fuckin' Bobert was thrown out of a performance. 5 00:00:34,360 --> 00:00:39,840 Speaker 1: Why because that piece of trash was vaping and recording 6 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:44,720 Speaker 1: and doing god knows what else. And when security came 7 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:49,840 Speaker 1: over to remove her trashy ass, she had the audacity 8 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:52,800 Speaker 1: to say, do you know who I am? I could 9 00:00:52,880 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 1: think of no other party that has lowered the fucking class, 10 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:05,640 Speaker 1: this bar, truth, bar, decency bar, any type of fucking 11 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:11,480 Speaker 1: bar than the Republican Party with their elevation of their 12 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:13,120 Speaker 1: fucking trash element. 13 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:19,640 Speaker 2: It is so disgusting and so beneath, beneath. 14 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:27,200 Speaker 1: The body of Congress to have these people have the 15 00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:29,520 Speaker 1: audacity to have been voted in. 16 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:33,080 Speaker 2: Now, look, I know that Lauren Bobert won. 17 00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:35,640 Speaker 1: Her last election, I think by like five hundred and 18 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:40,200 Speaker 1: thirty something votes, And I'm just like, what the fuck 19 00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:44,680 Speaker 1: is wrong with the people of Colorado? Honestly, right, like, 20 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:48,080 Speaker 1: you look at like that woman shouldn't have received a vote, 21 00:01:48,480 --> 00:01:52,160 Speaker 1: let alone winning an election by over five hundred When 22 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 1: you look at Lauren Bobert, you say to yourself, she 23 00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 1: represents me? And if she does, then my god, do 24 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 1: you need some wind dex And like a lobotomy. I'm 25 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:11,200 Speaker 1: looking at these people that have entered Congress underneath the 26 00:02:11,280 --> 00:02:16,239 Speaker 1: Republican Party and they are sewer rats. Like I honestly 27 00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:18,639 Speaker 1: don't know what else to say. This is the type 28 00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:23,600 Speaker 1: of trash that has the audacity to call the Obamas 29 00:02:23,639 --> 00:02:27,600 Speaker 1: outside of their name, that have the audacity to look 30 00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 1: at Black's fucking excellence and fix their mouth to open 31 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:38,840 Speaker 1: it to say anything. Marsh Reytail agreed, Lauren Bobert and 32 00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 1: the rest of the gutter rats belong nowhere, let alone 33 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:48,120 Speaker 1: in Congress. And I just you know, this is a 34 00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:54,800 Speaker 1: reminder of just how utterly broken our government is. And 35 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:57,520 Speaker 1: I don't say that in the way that the Republicans said, oh, 36 00:02:57,560 --> 00:02:59,639 Speaker 1: it's broken, so we got a gut it and put 37 00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:01,799 Speaker 1: in a unch of fascists in their no, no, no, 38 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:04,840 Speaker 1: I say it in the way that the fact that 39 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:12,160 Speaker 1: we don't have clear, easy mechanisms to remove people who 40 00:03:13,880 --> 00:03:21,200 Speaker 1: dishonor their seat, their responsibility, their office. So whether that's 41 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:25,680 Speaker 1: giving a fist up to insurrectionists right that are getting 42 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:30,720 Speaker 1: ready to storm the Capitol, whether that is putting other members, 43 00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:35,320 Speaker 1: your colleagues on crosshairs, right in crosshairs, on your website, 44 00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:40,200 Speaker 1: making violent anime, making violent threats, whether they be verbal 45 00:03:40,440 --> 00:03:44,760 Speaker 1: or online, all of these, all of these should be 46 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:51,200 Speaker 1: considered violations of the oath that you took. And for 47 00:03:51,240 --> 00:03:55,440 Speaker 1: the love of God, I can't understand why these people 48 00:03:55,480 --> 00:04:00,400 Speaker 1: are still allowed to sit in this body and Kevin mcleary, 49 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:04,280 Speaker 1: the Fisher Price Speaker of the House, elevating these people 50 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:10,280 Speaker 1: to places of prominence. They are in embarrassment, but you 51 00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:14,840 Speaker 1: can't shame the fucking devil. So there you have it, folks. 52 00:04:14,960 --> 00:04:19,479 Speaker 1: Coming up on today's show, I'm very excited for you to, 53 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:24,400 Speaker 1: you know, switch gears from the regular political mayhem and 54 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:29,680 Speaker 1: actually get into the conversation that I have with Mark Spears, 55 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:34,880 Speaker 1: who is one of the executive producers and hosts of 56 00:04:35,600 --> 00:04:39,440 Speaker 1: a new show on Hulu that is streaming right now 57 00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:45,800 Speaker 1: called The Conversations Project. And The Conversations Project is centered 58 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:51,039 Speaker 1: around black owned wine, black owned restaurants, and meaningful, meaningful 59 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:57,000 Speaker 1: conversations inside of the black community. We are at a time, folks, 60 00:04:57,040 --> 00:04:59,480 Speaker 1: where books are being banned. I'm certain I had the 61 00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:04,680 Speaker 1: dreamline night that Martin Luther King's birthday at Black History 62 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:07,240 Speaker 1: Month were banned in the United States. That's on a 63 00:05:07,279 --> 00:05:10,599 Speaker 1: far off dream to have, not with the current climate 64 00:05:10,640 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 1: that we are living in. So it is more important 65 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 1: than ever that we watch, write, and share shows like 66 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:22,479 Speaker 1: Hulu's The Conversations Project. So coming up next, my conversation 67 00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:29,599 Speaker 1: with the host and one of the executive producers, Mark Spears. Folks, 68 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:32,360 Speaker 1: I am very happy to welcome to OKF Daily for 69 00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:36,080 Speaker 1: the very first time, Mark Spears, who is a co 70 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:40,720 Speaker 1: host and the executive producer of Hulu's new show The 71 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:44,880 Speaker 1: Conversations Project and is a senior and NBA writer for 72 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:49,240 Speaker 1: ESPN and an escape Mark, thank you so much for 73 00:05:49,279 --> 00:05:54,279 Speaker 1: making the time to join WOKF. Tell us about this show, 74 00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 1: The Conversations Project, because I have been one that is 75 00:05:58,200 --> 00:06:02,440 Speaker 1: believed that the art of conversation is dead. People do 76 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:07,240 Speaker 1: not gather and have conversation anymore. They just nitpick at 77 00:06:07,240 --> 00:06:10,640 Speaker 1: each other on social media. So tell us the reason 78 00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:12,119 Speaker 1: behind your show. 79 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:17,160 Speaker 3: I was inspired years ago by The Cosby Show in 80 00:06:17,279 --> 00:06:22,479 Speaker 3: terms of seeing a black lawyer and a black doctor 81 00:06:23,160 --> 00:06:26,920 Speaker 3: married to each other, and at that time I was 82 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:30,240 Speaker 3: really engrossed in reading newspapers and magazines. And you know, 83 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:34,360 Speaker 3: my mom always had me around very educated black people, 84 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:39,160 Speaker 3: very educated people of color, very successful. Dennis lived across 85 00:06:39,160 --> 00:06:42,800 Speaker 3: the street. Both my parents are college educated, and so 86 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:47,720 Speaker 3: I just remember seeing stories about how that's unrealistic, not 87 00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 3: can there'd be a black doctor and a black lawyer 88 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 3: married to each other. 89 00:06:52,320 --> 00:06:54,279 Speaker 4: And that was offensive to me, even as a you know, 90 00:06:54,360 --> 00:06:54,880 Speaker 4: as a kid. 91 00:06:55,720 --> 00:06:59,000 Speaker 3: And then I would, you know, see all these movies 92 00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:03,240 Speaker 3: that often portrayed black people in a negative light, oftentimes 93 00:07:03,279 --> 00:07:08,280 Speaker 3: and selling drugs or in impoverished situations or you know, 94 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:13,240 Speaker 3: doing crazy things. And then the only other light were 95 00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:16,040 Speaker 3: also shown in and hey, I write about it is 96 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:22,320 Speaker 3: in athletics also and in the entertainment world, and so 97 00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:26,880 Speaker 3: but I always it just was frustrating to me because 98 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:30,120 Speaker 3: if we're not entertaining, we're picking your pocket, right like, 99 00:07:30,280 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 3: And so I remember watching mo Better Blues. It's the 100 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 3: movie that made me fall in love with jazz. It's 101 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:41,240 Speaker 3: the movie that it's my favorite movie all time, and 102 00:07:41,720 --> 00:07:46,560 Speaker 3: just being enamored with Bleak Gilliam and his crew and 103 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:51,160 Speaker 3: how they all had money but in a legitimate way, 104 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:55,840 Speaker 3: and they all dressed nice and they all were very 105 00:07:55,880 --> 00:08:02,080 Speaker 3: strong mentally, had had also great verbiage right, and just 106 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:03,920 Speaker 3: were like great dudes. And I was like, those are 107 00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:05,720 Speaker 3: the kind of cats I would like to hang out with. 108 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:08,520 Speaker 3: And I was like inspired by Bleeke Gilliam because he 109 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:14,200 Speaker 3: had this loft in Harlem where you know, his girlfriend 110 00:08:14,320 --> 00:08:18,200 Speaker 3: or one of his girlfriends called him Clark Bennecourt and 111 00:08:18,240 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 3: he saw her on the television and I was like, whoa, 112 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:23,559 Speaker 3: he has a flat. 113 00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:25,400 Speaker 4: I didn't even know what a flat was in. 114 00:08:25,360 --> 00:08:28,280 Speaker 3: Harlem and he's watching he's talking to her but on 115 00:08:28,320 --> 00:08:31,600 Speaker 3: a television before he let her in, and I was like, 116 00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 3: that's the kind of black dude I aspired to be. 117 00:08:35,280 --> 00:08:39,959 Speaker 3: Then I saw Boomerang, Then I saw Love Jones, and 118 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:43,840 Speaker 3: I saw like Have Plenty, and I saw these movies 119 00:08:43,880 --> 00:08:48,280 Speaker 3: The Best Man right, where you see black people in 120 00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:52,559 Speaker 3: this positive light and doing great things and being educated, 121 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:54,960 Speaker 3: and I'm like, why is it that we're always shown 122 00:08:55,559 --> 00:08:59,000 Speaker 3: differently most more often than that, And so I just 123 00:08:59,559 --> 00:09:02,560 Speaker 3: then recent years, it's just kind of paying me to 124 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:07,280 Speaker 3: see these reality shows and see you know, us being 125 00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:10,600 Speaker 3: portrayed with throwing drinks on each other and yelling and 126 00:09:10,679 --> 00:09:14,199 Speaker 3: arguing as you mentioned and like not having any cordial conversation, 127 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:20,000 Speaker 3: and you know, or athletes or entertainers like Beyonce where 128 00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:23,200 Speaker 3: you know, like they said and do the right thing. 129 00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:25,559 Speaker 3: You know, Prince and Michael Jackson not just the magic, 130 00:09:25,600 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 3: They're not just black, They're better than black. So if 131 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:33,199 Speaker 3: we entertain you, it's okay, right. But so, to make 132 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:37,040 Speaker 3: a long story short, the thing that I love about 133 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 3: the show and wanted to have in this show is 134 00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:44,360 Speaker 3: just black excellence, black success, all having dinners. 135 00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:45,920 Speaker 4: These are the dinners I have all the time. 136 00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:49,600 Speaker 3: Where I'm not even talking about the NBA, even though 137 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:52,040 Speaker 3: I've been covering the NBA since ninety nine. I'm talking 138 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:58,199 Speaker 3: about what's happening in the world, music, politics, what pains 139 00:09:58,280 --> 00:10:02,760 Speaker 3: us as people, what makes a smile as people. And 140 00:10:02,880 --> 00:10:05,480 Speaker 3: so to have a show like this where I'm having 141 00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:10,520 Speaker 3: people constantly say I needed this, this is me, this 142 00:10:10,600 --> 00:10:14,760 Speaker 3: is this is what I'm about, and we could disagree 143 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:17,120 Speaker 3: without throwing a drink on you or cursing you out, 144 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:21,520 Speaker 3: like we could have cordial conversation. Iron sharpens iron conversation. 145 00:10:22,280 --> 00:10:24,640 Speaker 3: And also, I think a great thing about our formula 146 00:10:24,679 --> 00:10:26,679 Speaker 3: of this show, which is, you know, an all black 147 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:31,520 Speaker 3: show with a black wine every every episode, and a 148 00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:35,920 Speaker 3: chef who's cooking really amazing meals that aren't just fried 149 00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 3: chicken and barbecue and hamburgers, respectfully, because I have friends 150 00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:45,480 Speaker 3: who that's what they do, right, but showing more upscale 151 00:10:45,559 --> 00:10:50,000 Speaker 3: kind of meals. Yeah we have Sean, Yeah, we have 152 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:53,360 Speaker 3: rock Sane Chante. Yeah, we have Roy Wood Junior and 153 00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:57,839 Speaker 3: Natari not but we also have philosophers, we have an astronaut, 154 00:10:58,760 --> 00:11:00,720 Speaker 3: you know, we have teachers of a woman in the 155 00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 3: hair industry. So even though we have these some of 156 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:07,240 Speaker 3: the bigger names, I think some of the other names 157 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:09,560 Speaker 3: who may not be big names, but they're just brilliant, 158 00:11:10,600 --> 00:11:12,720 Speaker 3: make you feel like I could be at that dinner. 159 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:16,000 Speaker 4: This is realistic to me, and I want to be 160 00:11:16,040 --> 00:11:16,559 Speaker 4: at that dinner. 161 00:11:16,600 --> 00:11:19,040 Speaker 3: I want to feel and I want to debate with 162 00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:21,199 Speaker 3: them and have fun with them and laugh and cry 163 00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:23,920 Speaker 3: with them, and you know, drink that wine. 164 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:25,439 Speaker 4: And so. 165 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 3: There are just so many things that I think went 166 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:32,160 Speaker 3: into this that I'm really really proud of. And I 167 00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:35,240 Speaker 3: think this is an image award type of show that 168 00:11:35,920 --> 00:11:38,280 Speaker 3: you know, when this is all when people get to 169 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:42,040 Speaker 3: see it, And like, my mom is as picky as 170 00:11:42,080 --> 00:11:44,280 Speaker 3: they come, and she love her son, but if it 171 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 3: was something that was embarrassing to her, she would let 172 00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:50,000 Speaker 3: me know. I went from watching one episode to all 173 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:52,840 Speaker 3: six in the day and a half. And it's those 174 00:11:52,920 --> 00:11:54,920 Speaker 3: kind of things and these texts that I'm getting, like 175 00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:58,000 Speaker 3: saying thank you, that make me feel really great about 176 00:11:58,000 --> 00:11:58,520 Speaker 3: what we did. 177 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:07,160 Speaker 1: Talk to me about the idea with regard to creating 178 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:12,040 Speaker 1: a kind of salon environment where you are showcasing different 179 00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:19,400 Speaker 1: black vittnors, different wine and the food and drink experience 180 00:12:19,480 --> 00:12:24,480 Speaker 1: associated with the conversation, like why was that really important 181 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:27,480 Speaker 1: to you? And kind of the a core of the show. 182 00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:32,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, Initially myself and chef David Lawrence, who's phenomenal chef. 183 00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:37,800 Speaker 3: He has a restaurant called Good Nights in Hillsburg, California. 184 00:12:38,080 --> 00:12:41,720 Speaker 3: People want to go find them. We just wanted to 185 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:44,840 Speaker 3: do a show where we brought athletes to vineyards and 186 00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:47,000 Speaker 3: brought him into the kitchen with him and I was 187 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:49,640 Speaker 3: going to interview him in the winery and the taste room, 188 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 3: but ultimately end up at a dinner table with other 189 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:56,720 Speaker 3: cool guests like you see on the show. And so 190 00:12:57,320 --> 00:13:00,160 Speaker 3: I mean that was the original concept and who a 191 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:05,720 Speaker 3: landscape love the dinner portion, and so we always wanted 192 00:13:05,720 --> 00:13:08,600 Speaker 3: to do the initial show at black wineries and showcase 193 00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:12,400 Speaker 3: black wines. We have a black chef who has Jamaican roots, 194 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:15,960 Speaker 3: but you know, he's not your typical chef. He's doing 195 00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:19,079 Speaker 3: black eyed p cake and stuff like that, like not 196 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 3: just black eyed p black eyed p. 197 00:13:20,720 --> 00:13:24,240 Speaker 4: Cake, right, and he's just legendary and special. 198 00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 3: And I just wanted to highlight the you know, me 199 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:34,560 Speaker 3: living in the Bay Area so close to Napa Valley, 200 00:13:34,600 --> 00:13:38,120 Speaker 3: there's so many great black wineries that even black people 201 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 3: don't know of, you know, respectfully, the Brown Family wine, 202 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:45,000 Speaker 3: which is an amazing wine. When you it's like we 203 00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:48,000 Speaker 3: only in McBride's sisters who was in our show, Like 204 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:52,400 Speaker 3: you only think about them, right, you don't know j Moss, 205 00:13:52,440 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 3: you know, you don't know p Herrel, You don't know 206 00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:59,200 Speaker 3: Theopolis or Andre Mack or you know o'copy. There's so 207 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:03,839 Speaker 3: many great, great black wines out there. And so when 208 00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:07,720 Speaker 3: we did actually a show out in the Bay Area, 209 00:14:07,920 --> 00:14:10,440 Speaker 3: but the day before the release of the show, and 210 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:13,040 Speaker 3: two of the women, the woman that does Theopolis and 211 00:14:13,080 --> 00:14:17,199 Speaker 3: Pehrrell were there, like they were nearly in tears because 212 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:20,640 Speaker 3: it's like, okay, now we finally feel accepted in a 213 00:14:20,720 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 3: world that we are kind of, like you know, oftentimes 214 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:29,200 Speaker 3: look like outcasts in. And so I'm really proud of 215 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:33,240 Speaker 3: showcasing those wines every episode, and I hope people buy 216 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:37,680 Speaker 3: them and support them. I'm really really proud of David 217 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:41,400 Speaker 3: Lawrence showcasing his food. And I if the one gripe 218 00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:45,360 Speaker 3: I'm getting right now is we need more food. 219 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:48,120 Speaker 4: We need more talk about the food. Like y'all can't 220 00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:48,600 Speaker 4: taste it. 221 00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:51,240 Speaker 3: It ain't scratching stuff right, like you wanta have to 222 00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:54,320 Speaker 3: go to this restaurant to taste this food, But they 223 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:57,320 Speaker 3: want more to talk about the food, and maybe we 224 00:14:57,360 --> 00:15:01,840 Speaker 3: definitely should incorporate that, assuming there's a more seasons going forward. 225 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:03,040 Speaker 2: I love it. 226 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:06,080 Speaker 1: I'm a big fan of wine. And as a matter 227 00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:08,320 Speaker 1: of fact, it's funny because I'm going up to NAPA 228 00:15:08,720 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 1: in October and now you're making me think like, oh, 229 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:13,080 Speaker 1: should I try and get it too? 230 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:15,160 Speaker 2: Can I try and go to Hiltsburg? 231 00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:22,120 Speaker 3: But You're like, yes, yes, I'll connect you with David. 232 00:15:22,280 --> 00:15:25,640 Speaker 2: And you know yeah, because I I love. 233 00:15:26,920 --> 00:15:31,120 Speaker 1: Thank you, I love the I love the experience of 234 00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:35,960 Speaker 1: wine tasting, and I love the experience of learning right 235 00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:38,600 Speaker 1: and I think that the marriage of the two that 236 00:15:38,640 --> 00:15:44,600 Speaker 1: you've brought together on the show again it is it's 237 00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 1: it's unfortunate. One. It's unfortunate that we feel like we 238 00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:53,320 Speaker 1: continue to have to disrupt a narrative about black people 239 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:56,760 Speaker 1: and black culture. Right. I think that all of the 240 00:15:57,280 --> 00:16:00,720 Speaker 1: movies and the shows that you named are all of 241 00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:05,400 Speaker 1: the reasons why I wanted to growing up in a 242 00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:10,480 Speaker 1: very white area, wanted to take in so much and 243 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:14,400 Speaker 1: just drink in black culture and the black experience because 244 00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:16,800 Speaker 1: I knew it was more than what Hollywood was pushing 245 00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:20,200 Speaker 1: out and that every so often, you know, particularly the 246 00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:22,400 Speaker 1: shows that you were naming in the nineties and the 247 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:26,160 Speaker 1: early two thousands that came out, you know, really did 248 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:29,560 Speaker 1: have a beautiful moment. And I think that what you're 249 00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:32,880 Speaker 1: creating is an incredible moment as well. 250 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 2: And I'm curious. 251 00:16:33,920 --> 00:16:37,160 Speaker 1: You know a lot of people look at reality TV 252 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:41,040 Speaker 1: and you mentioned it, and they say, well, these women, 253 00:16:41,160 --> 00:16:43,880 Speaker 1: these people they're in their bag, they're getting there, you know, 254 00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:47,200 Speaker 1: they're getting their checks, and you know everything isn't all 255 00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:53,280 Speaker 1: you know, Love Jones and Brown Sugar and these types 256 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:56,920 Speaker 1: of black people that all black people need to have 257 00:16:57,080 --> 00:17:01,320 Speaker 1: a showcase. What do you say to that kind of 258 00:17:01,480 --> 00:17:06,879 Speaker 1: critique with regard to the way that the basketball wives, 259 00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:11,480 Speaker 1: the loving hip hop franchises and all of those kind 260 00:17:11,520 --> 00:17:15,240 Speaker 1: of play into the stereotype, but they are showcasing a 261 00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:19,200 Speaker 1: part of the black community that does in fact exist. 262 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:23,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a really good question and a tough one too, 263 00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:26,639 Speaker 3: because you know, I don't want to, you know, hate 264 00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 3: on anybody else's means of making money, right, I could 265 00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:34,119 Speaker 3: just speak for kind of what we do, and I 266 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:37,440 Speaker 3: think what we do is is a positive image. 267 00:17:37,840 --> 00:17:38,040 Speaker 4: You know. 268 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:41,119 Speaker 3: I had a friend telling a story about how he 269 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:45,880 Speaker 3: went to Korea, South Korea, actually North Korea. Charles Smith, 270 00:17:46,359 --> 00:17:48,960 Speaker 3: who played in the NBA. He went there with Dennis Rodman, 271 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:52,159 Speaker 3: and he said that there was a man who was 272 00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:54,200 Speaker 3: there like tour guide, who was really rude to them 273 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:56,840 Speaker 3: from the moment that he got there, and he just 274 00:17:56,840 --> 00:17:59,120 Speaker 3: gave him kindness the whole time. And then he said 275 00:17:59,119 --> 00:18:01,280 Speaker 3: he went and watched TV be on a show, I 276 00:18:01,280 --> 00:18:03,600 Speaker 3: mean in his hotel room and just saw like all 277 00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:07,120 Speaker 3: the shows of black people and negative images, bad images. 278 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 3: And after about five or six days of being there 279 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:13,960 Speaker 3: and they were about to leave, he said the host 280 00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:16,320 Speaker 3: before he left, who had been rude and mean to 281 00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:20,639 Speaker 3: him the whole time, started crying and hugged him, and 282 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:24,440 Speaker 3: he realized that the only images he's seen of black 283 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:28,880 Speaker 3: people are bad images. Yeah, like he's always been force 284 00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:31,600 Speaker 3: fed these bad images, and now he finally got to 285 00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:34,800 Speaker 3: meet somebody black and they're an amazing person. No matter 286 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:38,240 Speaker 3: how mean he was to them day to day, they 287 00:18:38,240 --> 00:18:41,040 Speaker 3: still were the bigger person and they still were great 288 00:18:41,119 --> 00:18:45,000 Speaker 3: to him, and that broke through. So to me, I 289 00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:47,920 Speaker 3: want everybody black to watch this. I want white people 290 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:52,560 Speaker 3: to watch this. I want to penetrate people in rural 291 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:55,639 Speaker 3: areas who, you know, maybe don't even get to know 292 00:18:55,880 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 3: black people or be around black people. You know, And 293 00:18:58,440 --> 00:19:00,720 Speaker 3: all my travels around the country, I'll go to some 294 00:19:00,760 --> 00:19:04,200 Speaker 3: cities where I might be the only black dude stopping through. 295 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:07,159 Speaker 4: So you know, you don't know what you don't know. 296 00:19:07,200 --> 00:19:07,960 Speaker 4: If you're never. 297 00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:10,159 Speaker 3: Around us and get to know us, then you're going 298 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:14,320 Speaker 3: to think what TV and the media say about us. Right, 299 00:19:14,520 --> 00:19:19,680 Speaker 3: So hopefully I'm waiting for that text or that email 300 00:19:19,800 --> 00:19:24,840 Speaker 3: or somebody white saying, hey man, I was wrong about 301 00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:25,399 Speaker 3: black people. 302 00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:26,960 Speaker 4: I was wrong. 303 00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:32,160 Speaker 3: I apologize or now I know better? You know, now 304 00:19:32,200 --> 00:19:37,080 Speaker 3: I know also understand your pain. More understand why you 305 00:19:37,119 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 3: guys hurt, why you guys fight for what you think 306 00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:45,800 Speaker 3: is right, because oftentimes, if you don't listen to the 307 00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:48,680 Speaker 3: other side of the story, you won't understand the pain. 308 00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:52,320 Speaker 4: And maybe in this instance, it makes them shut up 309 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:54,280 Speaker 4: and listen to us. 310 00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:58,439 Speaker 3: And so hopefully through this, like, look, there's always going 311 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:00,879 Speaker 3: to be some other programming. There's always going to be 312 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:03,840 Speaker 3: a reality show. There's always going to be a dunk, 313 00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:05,400 Speaker 3: and I need there to be a dunk because that's 314 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:10,280 Speaker 3: my It's always going to be an amazing Beyonce concert. 315 00:20:11,600 --> 00:20:16,160 Speaker 3: But I also want them to have dinner with us 316 00:20:16,200 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 3: with this show and say, man, my son, there's an 317 00:20:21,560 --> 00:20:26,239 Speaker 3: astronaut on the show. Representation matters. I could be an 318 00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:30,919 Speaker 3: astronaut too. Wow, that professor was pretty cool. Maybe I 319 00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:33,920 Speaker 3: should try to be a professor. He was smart. Or 320 00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:36,399 Speaker 3: I didn't understand that they were making that much money 321 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:39,960 Speaker 3: in the hair industry, or you know, it's okay to 322 00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:46,760 Speaker 3: be uniquely me. And so even while we're penetrating the 323 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:51,880 Speaker 3: white culture, hopefully I hope that a black kid watches 324 00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:55,800 Speaker 3: and realizes that, like, he doesn't have to be an 325 00:20:55,840 --> 00:20:57,480 Speaker 3: athlete or a singer. 326 00:20:57,640 --> 00:20:59,119 Speaker 4: To be successful in this world. 327 00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:04,439 Speaker 3: Yeah, that getting good grades can lead to getting a 328 00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:07,639 Speaker 3: great education, can open so many doors for them. And 329 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:10,640 Speaker 3: you're not going to be able to jump forever. Even 330 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:13,159 Speaker 3: if you do make it to the NBA. You're you know, 331 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:16,359 Speaker 3: every single doesn't last. Most don't. 332 00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:18,440 Speaker 4: Most don't even get a record out right. 333 00:21:18,640 --> 00:21:21,920 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, what is your other alternatives? We want to 334 00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:25,680 Speaker 3: show the alternatives in a beautiful way, and I think 335 00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:25,960 Speaker 3: we do. 336 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:29,400 Speaker 1: And I think that that is I think it's important, 337 00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:33,679 Speaker 1: particularly now when you have you know, insta famous with 338 00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:38,600 Speaker 1: Instagram and TikTokers, and this idea that the more out pretty. 339 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:39,440 Speaker 4: Enough to get right. 340 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:43,320 Speaker 3: I've been sitting there for I've been sitting that forty 341 00:21:43,359 --> 00:21:45,320 Speaker 3: four thousand for about six months now. 342 00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 4: Man, you know that's good. 343 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:48,000 Speaker 2: That's still really good. 344 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:51,240 Speaker 4: It's good. I like, dang, I ain't cute. I can't. 345 00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:52,639 Speaker 4: I can't get my numbers up. 346 00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:54,320 Speaker 2: But it's just this idea. 347 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:58,600 Speaker 3: Although I get I get DMS every day, somebody tell me, hey, 348 00:21:58,600 --> 00:21:59,879 Speaker 3: I can help you get your numbers. 349 00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:06,199 Speaker 1: See exactly the advertise the advertisers. But I think that 350 00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:10,199 Speaker 1: it is really important, you know, when you're talking about 351 00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:15,120 Speaker 1: young people at a time when they see people getting rich, 352 00:22:15,560 --> 00:22:20,800 Speaker 1: getting famous, you know, getting likes that a lot of 353 00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:24,440 Speaker 1: that is not sustainable, right, and that there are other 354 00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:30,200 Speaker 1: means and kind of expanding their idea of what success 355 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:32,640 Speaker 1: actually looks like. And that's what I think that your 356 00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:36,679 Speaker 1: show does, with you know, the myriad of conversations and 357 00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:38,800 Speaker 1: all the different types of people that you bringing together 358 00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:43,240 Speaker 1: at the table, is to redefine what success is, right, 359 00:22:43,359 --> 00:22:47,240 Speaker 1: and what black is and what it means to be black. 360 00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:52,439 Speaker 1: I want to ask you as we close out, you know, 361 00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:55,320 Speaker 1: what was one of the most surprising things that came 362 00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,159 Speaker 1: out of one of your one of your episodes, one 363 00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:00,880 Speaker 1: of the conversations that you had. 364 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:04,320 Speaker 3: Well, I think there was also some growth with everybody 365 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,000 Speaker 3: as well, because two of the episodes we had transgender 366 00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:11,920 Speaker 3: women on the show, and I thought that was beautiful. 367 00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:15,040 Speaker 3: I thought that was great. And one of the women, 368 00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:18,480 Speaker 3: Lena Bloom, she challenged, She's like, when is the last 369 00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:23,000 Speaker 3: time you taking somebody transgender to lunch, you know, to 370 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:25,199 Speaker 3: check on them? And I was almost I was basically like, 371 00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:28,000 Speaker 3: you're the first one I've ever met, right. 372 00:23:28,040 --> 00:23:29,840 Speaker 4: I think there's assumption that. 373 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:33,760 Speaker 3: Like I, we come across maybe you know people from 374 00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:36,920 Speaker 3: the lgbt Q plus community every day, and I do 375 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:41,480 Speaker 3: come across people every day and living in the Bay Area, nobody. 376 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:43,840 Speaker 4: That's just a part of our life. We hey, man, 377 00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:46,520 Speaker 4: live your life how you want to or not. 378 00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:53,120 Speaker 3: I'm several people friends of mine that I love them, right, 379 00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:56,760 Speaker 3: but I actually had never met anybody transgender before. So 380 00:23:56,880 --> 00:24:02,199 Speaker 3: to like have dinner twice and spend time with two 381 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,359 Speaker 3: of the transgender women in the course of this show. 382 00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:07,400 Speaker 3: At the end of the show, you just basically say, 383 00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:09,720 Speaker 3: because you know, there are people in the in the 384 00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 3: black community too. 385 00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:15,400 Speaker 2: That are homophobic, right, yeah, yeah, that's part. 386 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:17,760 Speaker 3: Of our culture as well. But then afterwards you're like 387 00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:24,160 Speaker 3: just regular people like with us. Yeah, and so hopefully 388 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:29,280 Speaker 3: in that realm too, somebody could also be like, you 389 00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:32,879 Speaker 3: know what, I shouldn't act that way towards somebody that 390 00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:35,919 Speaker 3: is gay. I should just accept them for the person 391 00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 3: that they are, the same way, you know, as a 392 00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:43,439 Speaker 3: black person, we want to be accepted, you know. So 393 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:48,119 Speaker 3: they're like getting double hit, right, yeah. So, but I 394 00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:51,840 Speaker 3: think that's great that in this show that you could 395 00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:54,920 Speaker 3: have dinner with somebody transgender and and see that they're 396 00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:58,919 Speaker 3: just a normal person. But just the different levels of 397 00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:04,240 Speaker 3: walks of success as I think it's not when when 398 00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:08,479 Speaker 3: you see a musician or when you see uh a 399 00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:12,720 Speaker 3: comedian like we have or see actor like you almost 400 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:15,879 Speaker 3: feel like that's not attainable. But I do feel like 401 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:20,600 Speaker 3: we have a myriad other people very high degrees to 402 00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:25,880 Speaker 3: success that aren't in the so called entertainment fields that 403 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:28,080 Speaker 3: make you feel like, hey, I. 404 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:31,600 Speaker 4: Can be at that table, or maybe for a younger person, 405 00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:34,200 Speaker 4: I could be that. Yeah that's cool too. 406 00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:38,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, Mark, I got to tell you, I think that 407 00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:41,879 Speaker 1: it's great. I think that the Conversations Project is needed. 408 00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:47,280 Speaker 1: Congratulations on it, and I hope that I see you 409 00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:55,000 Speaker 1: at the Image Awards. I throw it out you throw 410 00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:56,960 Speaker 1: it out there and you never. 411 00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,680 Speaker 4: Know and everybody else I'm don't know what else is 412 00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 4: doing this. 413 00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:04,399 Speaker 2: Yeah, So thank you so much. 414 00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:05,879 Speaker 4: But I hope people copycat it. 415 00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:10,240 Speaker 2: I hope that they do too, because we do. 416 00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:14,040 Speaker 1: We need more positivity, We need more nourishment, uh and 417 00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:18,400 Speaker 1: good and good energy and incredible conversations. So Mark, thank 418 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:20,480 Speaker 1: you so much for making the time for wok f 419 00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:24,280 Speaker 1: and folks. Check out the Conversations Project, which is out 420 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:33,119 Speaker 1: on Hulu right now. That is it for me today, 421 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: dear friends on wokay f as always power to the 422 00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:38,639 Speaker 1: people and to all the people. 423 00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:39,119 Speaker 2: Power. 424 00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:42,720 Speaker 1: Get woke and stay woke as fuck.