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Speaker 1: Do the trade candidates have to clear the deck or

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Speaker 1: do the free agents have to clear the deck first?

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Speaker 1: That's the balancing act that Chris Getz has to figure

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Speaker 1: out here.

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Speaker 2: Good afternoon, everybody, and welcome to a brand new episode

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Speaker 2: of Fair Territory with Ken Rosenthal. I am Alana Rizzot

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Speaker 2: taking you through the next half an hour. I am

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Speaker 2: pleased to be joined by Katie Wu, who does a

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Speaker 2: tremendous job covering the Saint Louis Cardinals for the Athletic.

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Speaker 2: As you can see, Ken is still on assignment. Katie,

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Speaker 2: thank you so much for pinch hitting for him. Appreciate

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Speaker 2: it and love having you on. Let's get to something

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Speaker 2: before we get into the Cardinals. Let's talk a bit

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Speaker 2: about the Tampa bay Rays. News breaking just moments ago

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Speaker 2: that looks like they are going to be playing at

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Speaker 2: Signed Brenner Field in Tampa for the twenty twenty five seasons.

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Speaker 2: So ironic, Katie, that the Tampa Bay Rays will actually

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Speaker 2: be playing in Tampa in twenty twenty five.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, isn't that funny?

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Speaker 4: Because for the first month of the off season we

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Speaker 4: were thinking that they wouldn't be And look, obviously it

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Speaker 4: is not an ideal situation. What happened to the race

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Speaker 4: is home stadium. But I think when you take into

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Speaker 4: consideration all of the other alternative options, this is best

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Speaker 4: case scenario. Keeping the Tampa Bay Rays in Tampa. It's

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Speaker 4: best for the organization, it's best for the players. It's

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Speaker 4: best for the families. We don't talk about that enough.

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Speaker 4: The wives and the moms of the kids having to

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Speaker 4: scramble not just on road games, but potentially having home

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Speaker 4: games that were also road games.

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Speaker 3: Nobody wants that.

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Speaker 4: So also good for the fans who want to come

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Speaker 4: out and support their home team, they can actually do

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Speaker 4: so in their home city. So all in all, you know,

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Speaker 4: I think this is best case scenario.

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Speaker 2: Not only that, but it's an opportunity for the players themselves, Katie,

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Speaker 2: to perhaps play in front of sold out crowds. Tropicana

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Speaker 2: Field only averaged about sixteen thousand fans per game, and

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Speaker 2: Steinbrennerfield only holds eleven thousand, So maybe a bit of

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Speaker 2: a different atmosphere that the players can get used to

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Speaker 2: playing in front of.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think, you know, again, it's not ideal, but

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Speaker 4: if we look at what the glass half full option,

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Speaker 4: it would be a totally different, maybe mindset or atmosphere

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Speaker 4: for raised players.

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Speaker 3: I think it will be interesting.

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Speaker 4: I did not have my bingo card two major league

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Speaker 4: teams playing in minor league stadiums next season, but given

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Speaker 4: the race circumstance, this I think makes the most sense.

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Speaker 2: All Right, the Yankees will actually be the home team,

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Speaker 2: if you will, at their own facility for four games

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Speaker 2: in April, the visiting team rather for four games in

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Speaker 2: April and two in August. Okay, let's get to what

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Speaker 2: you know best, and that is the Saint Louis Cardinals.

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Speaker 2: You recently had a column in The Athletic about how

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Speaker 2: they're going with the youth movement. Explain that a little

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Speaker 2: bit more to me about what you mean, Katie So's.

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Speaker 4: It's a little complicated, right, because for so long we've

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Speaker 4: thought of the Saint Louis Cardinals as a contending team.

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Speaker 4: You know, they were consistently in playoff contention in that

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Speaker 4: National League Central Division, and in twenty twenty five, the

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Speaker 4: final year under President Baseball Oberations John Azaelox's tenure, they're

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Speaker 4: taking a step back. Twenty twenty five is a reset period,

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Speaker 4: but it is not. It is not a tanking season.

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Speaker 4: It is not a full on rebuild. The Cardinals will

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Speaker 4: still try to field a competitive club next year. The

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Speaker 4: big difference is they are not going to do so

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Speaker 4: at the price of developing their younger players. So development

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Speaker 4: of their young core guys like Mason, Wynn, Brendan Donovan,

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Speaker 4: Lars Newbar, you go down the list, that's going to

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Speaker 4: take precedent over maybe competing in the standings.

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Speaker 3: So it's not to suggest they're tanking. They're not.

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Speaker 4: Actually, I think that you're going to see the majority

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Speaker 4: of last year's roster return. But the difference is in

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Speaker 4: years prior, and I think the conversation with Mo that

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Speaker 4: I had at the GM meetings made this very clear.

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Speaker 4: In years prior, the Cardinals felt like they couldn't give

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Speaker 4: young guys that were struggling a lot of opportunity in

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Speaker 4: the major leagues because it would cost them valuable games

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Speaker 4: in the standings. So you think about some top prospects

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Speaker 4: that have struggled, Jordan Walker, Nolan Gorman. There was almost

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Speaker 4: a pressure to get those guys out of the lineup

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Speaker 4: or maybe back in the miners to find themselves so

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Speaker 4: that the Cardinals could stay afloat with teams like the

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Speaker 4: Brewers who they have been battling with the top ennal

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Speaker 4: central for four years now. This year they're okay losing

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Speaker 4: a couple games if it means that these younger players

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Speaker 4: can get their feet underneath them, can continue playing and

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Speaker 4: basically let them show the Cardinals who they are as

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Speaker 4: players now. The reason they are going to do this

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Speaker 4: is because in twenty twenty six, when Hey and Bloom

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Speaker 4: takes over for John Waszaylock, they will have a better

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Speaker 4: understanding of what they have internally Alana and yours. Prior, again,

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Speaker 4: they felt like they couldn't do that because it cost

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Speaker 4: them valuable games. This year they are prepared to do

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Speaker 4: so just so that they know what they have finally internally.

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Speaker 2: So it's a change of philosophy because before they wouldn't

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Speaker 2: be willing to sacrifice the wins to get that youth

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Speaker 2: movement in play and to give them an opportunity to

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Speaker 2: kind of get their feet wet and succeed. It's more

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Speaker 2: of not necessarily for going twenty twenty five. You mentioned

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Speaker 2: they're not tanking, but it's perhaps more of a look

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Speaker 2: to the twenty twenty sixth season. Is it fair to

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Speaker 2: say that?

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Speaker 3: I think so?

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Speaker 4: And again, when you think about some of the players

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Speaker 4: that are coming back. When the Cardinals first announced their

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Speaker 4: plans in October.

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Speaker 3: They didn't know and we didn't know just how.

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Speaker 4: Deep this reset period would be because they had so

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Speaker 4: many veterans with no trade clauses and it was unsure

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Speaker 4: on if they would want to stay through this reset period.

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Speaker 4: You're thinking about like Nolan Arnado, Sonny Grave, Wilson Contreras,

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Speaker 4: all players that were brought to Saint Louis or signed

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Speaker 4: or declined and opt out to stay in Saint Louis

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Speaker 4: because they were under the premise that the Cardinals would

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Speaker 4: be competing for postseason contention right now. John Mozelac has

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Speaker 4: had conversations with the majority of these players and tried

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Speaker 4: to kind of figure out like would they be okay

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Speaker 4: in twenty twenty five with this reset period. Wilson Contreras

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Speaker 4: was all on board, so much so that he accepted

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Speaker 4: a position change from catcher to first.

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Speaker 3: Base and DH and sort of a hybrid role.

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Speaker 4: So that clears the way for young catchers Ivon Herrera

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Speaker 4: and Pedro Pajes to see consistent playing time, which is

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Speaker 4: consistent with the Cardinal's messaging of letting the kids play

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Speaker 4: same with Sonny.

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Speaker 3: Grave had multiple people tell me he's on board with that.

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Speaker 4: I believe Sonny would actually embrace the top of the rotation,

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Speaker 4: let's mentor the young kids kind of mentality. Still some

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Speaker 4: clarity on Nolan Arnado that we're waiting. I would imagine

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Speaker 4: as we get closer to the winter meetings, we'll have

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Speaker 4: a better idea of what his situation will look like.

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Speaker 4: But when you again, when you look at how the

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Speaker 4: Cardinals rosters project right now, it's won't be all that

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Speaker 4: different from twenty twenty four. It's just how they're using

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Speaker 4: the players will be different. We'll see a lot more

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Speaker 4: of the kids and the veterans that want to stay.

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Speaker 4: They'll certainly be welcomed.

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Speaker 2: You mentioned wanting to stay, and you brought up a

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Speaker 2: really good point about contrerasts. From the outside looking in,

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Speaker 2: it seems like this whole Contraras Saint Louis cardinal situation

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Speaker 2: has been a bit of a misstep since its inception.

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Speaker 2: But in your conversations, you're finding out that he actually

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Speaker 2: wanted to stay in Saint Louis and was willing to

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Speaker 2: make that position change in kind of that hybrid role.

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Speaker 2: What more can you tell us about those conversations, Katie.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it's certainly been an up and down relationship for

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Speaker 4: Contraras in Saint Louis, but I think it was clear,

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Speaker 4: even after twenty twenty four, when he had two injuries

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Speaker 4: that really kept him out for half the season, that

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Speaker 4: he wanted to stay and in talking with Moe, he

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Speaker 4: said both Contreras and the Cardinal's medical staff believe that

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Speaker 4: the switch from Casher to first base or DH would

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Speaker 4: be better for his long term health. Contrerass feels the same.

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Speaker 4: He likes mentoring the kids. I mean spring training last year,

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Speaker 4: he took all of the catchup in the system from

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Speaker 4: Triple A down to Low Way and.

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Speaker 3: Took them out for dinner. It's something he likes to do.

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Speaker 4: And I think when you're looking at the Cardinals overall,

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Speaker 4: they don't seem that far off. I know that they

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Speaker 4: missed the playoffs for the last two years, but I

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Speaker 4: think Conturists see something in this organization worth sticking around for.

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Speaker 4: Different players have maybe different things that they want, different incentives,

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Speaker 4: But for Contraras's sake, you know, he wanted to be

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Speaker 4: a Cardinal. He's signed here for a reason. He's okay

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Speaker 4: taking a step back from a team like a team

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Speaker 4: perspective for a year, I think because he genuinely believes

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Speaker 4: there's something to build upon here and he wants to

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Speaker 4: be a part of it.

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Speaker 2: There are a lot of different scenarios going around across

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Speaker 2: Major League Baseball in terms of regional networks, TV rights,

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Speaker 2: those types of situations. The Saint Louis Cardinals, notwithstanding, how

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Speaker 2: do you think their whole TV deal and TV situation

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Speaker 2: will affect what they can do in this free agent

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Speaker 2: market coming up with so many things still up in

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Speaker 2: the air.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a great question, and it's a problem. Like

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Speaker 3: you said, that's not just specific to Saint Louis.

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Speaker 4: Over about a third of the league is going to

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Speaker 4: deal with sort of payroll cut based on their TV

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Speaker 4: revenue or projected TV revenue, and this is something that

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Speaker 4: the Cardinals had known was coming.

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Speaker 3: For a while.

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Speaker 4: They were able to re up with Diamonds Sports Group

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Speaker 4: and FanDuel Sports Network Midwest.

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Speaker 3: It's a lot they are taking.

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Speaker 4: They were expected before they renegotiated their deals around seventy

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Speaker 4: five million dollars in twenty twenty five rights fees. They're

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Speaker 4: taking about one fourth of that away, So there will

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Speaker 4: be some deduction in payroll next year. Now the Cardinals do,

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Speaker 4: they are part owners of their own network, so that

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Speaker 4: you know, kind of plays into it and could actually

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Speaker 4: benefit them.

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Speaker 3: But this is probably the year to do.

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Speaker 4: This in conversations that we've had with the organization, because

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Speaker 4: the Cardinals weren't figuring to be big spenders in free

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Speaker 4: agency anyway. This goes back to the whole youth movement,

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Speaker 4: right they're you know, they let Paul Goldschmidt go, they

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Speaker 4: weren't going to bringing back. They probably aren't going to

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Speaker 4: be perusing the market for the high dollar spenders that

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Speaker 4: we've seen them before. In years prior the Cardinals were

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Speaker 4: all about the starting pitching market and free agency.

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Speaker 3: That's not going to be the case this year.

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Speaker 4: They're going to rely on their young pitchers, guys like

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Speaker 4: Andre Plante, Michael McGreevey, some guys coming up in triple A.

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Speaker 4: So from an organization operation standpoint, this does make sense

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Speaker 4: because it's going to come at the one year where

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Speaker 4: the Cardinals probably aren't aggressively looking for free agents on

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Speaker 4: the open market and instead working internally.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and All star first baseman Paul gold Schmidt a

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Speaker 2: free agent now too. Does that mean, also in your estimation, Katie,

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Speaker 2: that Nolan Ronado is a relatively big trade piece. Do

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Speaker 2: you see him as a Cardinal in twenty twenty five.

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Speaker 4: I think it's really hard to say, and I think

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Speaker 4: that will actually be the biggest question for the Cardinals

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Speaker 4: this off season. It's not necessarily who they go get,

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Speaker 4: it's who stays, you know. I think conversations still have

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Speaker 4: to be had between the organization and Nolan Arnado what

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Speaker 4: he wants.

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Speaker 3: You know, he wants to win above.

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Speaker 4: All, and I think it's a little premature to speculate

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Speaker 4: what that looks like. I think maybe as we get

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Speaker 4: closer to the Winter Meetings again, we'll have a better idea.

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Speaker 4: But he's certainly someone that I would keep my eye

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Speaker 4: on as trade speculation going into the Winter meetings, only

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Speaker 4: because we know so Contrarast wants to stay and is

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Speaker 4: going to and Sonny Gray wants to stay as well. Now,

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Speaker 4: if the Cardinals are overwhelmed by an offer and Sonny

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Speaker 4: agrees to it, because keep in mind, he does have

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Speaker 4: that no trade clause, maybe something changes, But for right now,

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Speaker 4: Saint Louis is planning on having both of those guys back.

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Speaker 4: We'll see what that means for Ronado, And again, I

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Speaker 4: think that's probably going to be their biggest storyline heading

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Speaker 4: into the Winter meetings.

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Speaker 2: And speaking of other storylines in the Winter meetings, you

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Speaker 2: know a lot as far as the GM meetings were concerned,

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Speaker 2: you were there. What can you tell us about where

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Speaker 2: Willi Adamas, the the free agent shortstop, may end up.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, the top free agent shortstop available. I think twenty

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Speaker 4: nine years old, that's relatively young in free agency, coming

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Speaker 4: off a stellar year for the Brewers saw him play

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Speaker 4: a lot in the NL Central. He's open to going

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Speaker 4: back to the Brewers, it's just a matter if they

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Speaker 4: can afford them. Milwaukee has always been a small market team.

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Speaker 4: The athletic projects. Willi Adamas to sign a six year

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Speaker 4: or one hundred and fifty million dollar contract in free

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Speaker 4: agency that would be much above the Brewers' payroll, however,

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Speaker 4: and I don't think he's going to go back there,

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Speaker 4: even though he's open to it, just because there will

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Speaker 4: be so many high spenders going to land a talent

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Speaker 4: like that.

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Speaker 3: I personally my speculation.

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Speaker 4: I've always thought Adonis profile as the Giants really well,

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Speaker 4: but really he could go anywhere. He's going to be

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Speaker 4: a name to watch. Blake Snell a name to watch

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Speaker 4: when you think about One Soto, obviously that's the guy

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Speaker 4: who's to control the free agent market. As enticing as

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Speaker 4: all these names are to me, nothing really happens until

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Speaker 4: one Soda decides where he wants to go.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, One Soto and Scott Borre. So we set in

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Speaker 2: the tone as far as that is concerned. All right, Katie,

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Speaker 2: time now for dude and dork of the Week.

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Speaker 5: Dude, dude, dude, dud.

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Speaker 6: Oh.

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Speaker 2: That's a great front end. That one is brand new

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Speaker 2: here on fair Territory with Ken Rosenthal. So this is

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Speaker 2: the opportunity, Katie, where you get to brag on somebody

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Speaker 2: that did something this week that you like. Who's your

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Speaker 2: due to the week?

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Speaker 4: I'm going plural, I'm going dudes of the Week. I

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Speaker 4: want to give some love to the National League manager

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Speaker 4: of the year. Finally, Pat Murphy of Milwaukee, Carlos Mendoza

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Speaker 4: of the New York Mets, and Mike Shilt of the Padres.

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Speaker 3: These are all.

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Speaker 4: First year managers that had pretty heavy expectations with their

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Speaker 4: team coming in and exceeded all of them. These three

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Speaker 4: did such a fantastic job with their clubs, all playoff

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Speaker 4: teams that Dave Roberts, who equally belongs on this list,

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Speaker 4: they just can't have four wasn't even a finalist. And

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Speaker 4: that's no knock on Dave. I think that's just a

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Speaker 4: testament to what these skippers did for their clubs.

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Speaker 3: You know, I've known Mike Schult for a while.

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Speaker 4: He was a Cardinals manager in twenty twenty one, my

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Speaker 4: first year with the club, and to see him have

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Speaker 4: the same kind of results in San Diego that he

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Speaker 4: did in Saint Louis in his first year, that was

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Speaker 4: not surprising. Seeing Pat Murphy take over after you know,

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Speaker 4: a manager will change maybe blindside.

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Speaker 3: Of the organization. That was great.

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Speaker 4: And you think about what the Mets went through early

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Speaker 4: in April and May and their deep run in September,

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Speaker 4: what they had to go through as well, all three

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Speaker 4: of those guys.

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Speaker 3: There's no clear winner here.

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Speaker 4: I wish it could be like a I don't know,

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Speaker 4: a triple A warrant because there is no for me.

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Speaker 3: But congratulations to all three with a very successful season.

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Speaker 2: Yes, all of them certainly deserving. Unfortunately only one will

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Speaker 2: win the crown, but all great seasons. Okay, my Dude

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Speaker 2: to the Week is actually an organization not in the

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Speaker 2: United States. It's a chivoote. The fact that they're letting

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Speaker 2: Roki Sasaki be posted now when they are going to forego,

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Speaker 2: you know, perhaps millions and millions and millions of dollars

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Speaker 2: to allow him to post and get to the United States.

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Speaker 2: That is a very un American corporate thing to do.

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Speaker 2: But they are listening to their player. They're listening to

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Speaker 2: their employee, if you will, about his desires. So congratulations,

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Speaker 2: they are my dude of the week.

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Speaker 3: All right.

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Speaker 2: Time now for the dork of the week. All right, kay,

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Speaker 2: So this is the category where we kind of are

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Speaker 2: left scratching our heads. Who is your dork of the Week?

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Speaker 4: First of all, it gets me every time that the

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Speaker 4: award has John Fisher's name on it. I will never

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Speaker 4: go off about It's hard for me to pick.

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Speaker 3: I'm gonna think.

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Speaker 4: You know, there's been a lot of speculation about Wuan Soto.

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Speaker 4: As we've said, do we really think the Rays are

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Speaker 4: going to be in on that? I mean, it's it's

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Speaker 4: Tampa Bay. They're not big spenders. I'm not super sold

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Speaker 4: on the idea that they're going to be in the

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Speaker 4: one Soda Sweet Steaks just kind of makes me laugh

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Speaker 4: at like typical offseason rumors.

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Speaker 2: Yes, everyone's kicking the tires. That is not true. Not

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Speaker 2: everybody is kicking the tires on Wan Soda. The Cincinnati

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Speaker 2: Reds are not kicking the tires, and either are the

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Speaker 2: Tampa Bayris. Okay, my dork of the week is whoever

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Speaker 2: signed off on this T shirt? It's the twenty and

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Speaker 2: twenty four Dodgers World Series Champion T shirt, Katie. All

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Speaker 2: of the signatures are the twenty twenty three Rangers. Oh,

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Speaker 2: all the players are Rangers who signed off on this?

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Speaker 2: Fanatics is selling a Dodgers World Series shirt with all

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Speaker 2: the twenty twenty Look at Corey Seeger's on there, John

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Speaker 2: Gray's on there.

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Speaker 6: What are we doing?

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Speaker 2: Do we not have some eyeballs on this? So anyway,

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Speaker 2: if you we happen to purchase this shirt, anybody from Fanatics,

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Speaker 2: it's incorrect. None of those players. I don't believe we're

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Speaker 2: actually on the Dodgers in twenty twenty four. I mean,

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Speaker 2: there is a Will Smith, but it's the wrong Will Smith.

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Speaker 2: So there you have it. That is my dork of

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Speaker 2: the week, as far as that is concerned. All right, Katie,

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Speaker 2: you're wonderful. I appreciate it. We look forward to reading

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Speaker 2: you in this offseason, and we'll see you again soon.

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Speaker 2: Spring training will be here before we know it. My friend, you.

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Speaker 3: Got it a lot of thanks so much.

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Speaker 2: We'll tarn all right, Katie Wu of the Athletic, We

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Speaker 2: appreciate it very much. Time now to hear from our

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Speaker 2: folks over on foul Territory. We'll be right back.

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Speaker 5: This holiday season. I want to give a gift to

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Speaker 2: All right, time now for inside dish Er Unfair Territory

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Speaker 2: with Ken Rosenthal. That is Jesse Rogers, my friend with ESPN,

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Speaker 2: does a tremendous job covering not only the Cubs and

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Speaker 2: the White Sox, but all of Major League Baseball. You

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Speaker 2: saw him all over the postseason. Jesse, thank you so

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Speaker 2: much for being here. First and foremost, what is the

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Speaker 2: likelihood that Roki Sasaki ends up on the North Side.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's certainly a possibility, and like that's an easy answer, right,

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Speaker 1: except that there's only a probably a half dozen teams

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Speaker 1: that he could end up with, and the Cubs are

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Speaker 1: absolutely one of them. Now, a lot of people in

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Speaker 1: the industry believe the Dodgers are the favorite, So let's

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Speaker 1: just assume that they are, but also say that these

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Speaker 1: other teams could make a good pitch, and.

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Speaker 6: The Cubs are one of them.

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Speaker 1: And what I'm getting at is not about affordability, because

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Speaker 1: as we know, any team could afford him.

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Speaker 6: He has to sign this minor league deal like Otani did.

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Speaker 6: We all know that. But the point is, there's only

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Speaker 6: a handful of teams Alana.

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Speaker 1: That have really been good assimilating Japanese players to the

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Speaker 1: American culture. To the various teams, A bunch of them

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Speaker 1: are represented by the same agent, Joe Wolf of the

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Speaker 1: Wasserman Group, and so he knows which teams are really good.

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Speaker 6: And what am I talking about.

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Speaker 1: I'm talking about providing the right kind of diet, the

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Speaker 1: right kind of schedule. I mean, players from Japan, just

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00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:07,840
Speaker 1: like players from the Latin American countries, just like players

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Speaker 1: from the United States, all have different ways of going

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Speaker 1: about their business and different needs. And maybe that's especially show,

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Speaker 1: especially so coming over from Japan. So what I'm getting

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Speaker 1: at is show to Amanaga, say is Suzuki, I would

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Speaker 1: guarantee you they would have good things to say about

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Speaker 1: how the Cubs have made it comfortable for them to

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Speaker 1: succeed in Chicago and with the team with the franchise

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Speaker 1: in Monaga had a great year. Suzuki's been okay, hasn't

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Speaker 1: had maybe that stellar great great year, but the Cubs

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Speaker 1: have done things to make them comfortable. I think the

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Speaker 1: Dodgers do that obviously, the Mets have done that with

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Speaker 1: Senga in a good way. Texas had Darvish originally. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: the Padres are one of those teams that do that well.

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Speaker 1: I think San Francisco and Seattle have good reputations. So again,

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Speaker 1: I feel like it comes down to a half a

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Speaker 1: dozen teams unless he really wants.

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Speaker 6: To think out side the box.

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Speaker 1: So after the Dodgers, the Cubs have a good pitch

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Speaker 1: and have some players to.

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Speaker 6: Back that up.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, basically a handful of teams. Legitimately, in the Roky

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Speaker 2: Sasaki sweep steaks okay from the north side to the

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Speaker 2: south side for just a moment. As far as the

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Speaker 2: Garrett Crochet trade happenings are concerned, does the league need

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Speaker 2: to figure out what happens to Corbyn Burns, Blake Snell,

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Speaker 2: Max Freed, before there's an actual landing spot for Crochet.

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Speaker 2: And do you think he's dealt.

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Speaker 6: Well, I do think he's dealt. I do think he's dealt.

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Speaker 1: There's not really much reason to hold on to him.

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Speaker 1: Unlike some of the closers. I don't think waiting till

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Speaker 1: July benefits Chrisquets. It's just less control for the team

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Speaker 1: that gets him a closer in July sometimes can be

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Speaker 1: more valuable than in December. So that'll be interesting with

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Speaker 1: the Ryan Helsleys of the world and Devin Williams. But

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Speaker 1: going back to Crochet, I think he's going to be traded. Look,

437
00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:58,320
Speaker 1: it is the chicken or the egg sort of controversy,

438
00:19:58,400 --> 00:20:01,840
Speaker 1: if that's the right word. Discussion like do the trade

439
00:20:01,840 --> 00:20:04,160
Speaker 1: candidates have to clear the deck or do the free

440
00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:05,800
Speaker 1: agents have to clear the deck first.

441
00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:07,920
Speaker 6: That's the balancing act.

442
00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:11,639
Speaker 1: That Chris Getz has to figure out here. Look on

443
00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:14,440
Speaker 1: the surface, you would think Chris Getz would be aggressive

444
00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:18,720
Speaker 1: because before any free agents signed, all these teams would

445
00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:21,280
Speaker 1: be available to Chris Getz. You know, once Corbin Burns

446
00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:24,840
Speaker 1: signs with let's say the Mets, probably doubtful they'd trade

447
00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:25,360
Speaker 1: for Crochet.

448
00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:27,360
Speaker 6: Don't know for sure. But like the.

449
00:20:27,359 --> 00:20:30,400
Speaker 1: Idea of signing Burns and trading for Crochet is probably

450
00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:33,040
Speaker 1: out of the mix, So you would think the trade

451
00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:36,679
Speaker 1: might happen first, so people know what their farm system

452
00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:39,280
Speaker 1: is gonna look like, they know kind of budget wise

453
00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:41,680
Speaker 1: what's gonna happen. You know, Crochet is not gonna cost

454
00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:45,680
Speaker 1: that much, and gets would be probably smart to do

455
00:20:46,280 --> 00:20:49,399
Speaker 1: that first, as every team would be open to it.

456
00:20:50,119 --> 00:20:52,640
Speaker 1: Unlike when the free agents start coming off the board.

457
00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:55,080
Speaker 1: The other theory, of course, is when all the free

458
00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:57,840
Speaker 1: agents come off the board, well, the team that you

459
00:20:57,880 --> 00:21:01,440
Speaker 1: know is left without one, it might be more aggressive

460
00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:04,960
Speaker 1: for Crochet. So timing is always difficult. I get asked

461
00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:07,920
Speaker 1: that a lot, but I would. I would if I'm

462
00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:11,440
Speaker 1: if I'm Chris Catch, I want everybody out there available

463
00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:13,840
Speaker 1: to me in a trade, and then let's see, let's

464
00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:15,360
Speaker 1: let's get into a bidding war for him.

465
00:21:15,640 --> 00:21:18,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's sometimes I wish there was a deadline in

466
00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:20,000
Speaker 2: terms of the off season of when you had to

467
00:21:20,040 --> 00:21:22,199
Speaker 2: sign guys. I get it from a player perspective that

468
00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:24,320
Speaker 2: it's going to mean more money's left on the table,

469
00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:26,880
Speaker 2: But it would be interesting to see having a deadline

470
00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:29,280
Speaker 2: in play. Okay, they do have a new manager in

471
00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:31,840
Speaker 2: Will Venable obviously, who was kind of behind the scenes

472
00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:35,160
Speaker 2: there very much laying in wait in Texas and now

473
00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:38,200
Speaker 2: as a manager for the Chicago White Sox. What is

474
00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:43,080
Speaker 2: the first order of business for Will Vennable as a

475
00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:45,440
Speaker 2: manager of the Chicago White Sox, Jesse, What does he

476
00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:46,200
Speaker 2: need to do first?

477
00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:49,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't think it's really that different despite losing

478
00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:51,760
Speaker 1: one hundred and twenty one games. He's got to connect

479
00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:54,080
Speaker 1: with his players. He has to connect with his players.

480
00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:57,240
Speaker 1: There was so much dysfunction over the last couple of years,

481
00:21:58,040 --> 00:21:59,840
Speaker 1: especially these young players that are going to be there,

482
00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:02,520
Speaker 1: feeling that at some point here Vaughn and bet Attendee,

483
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:05,280
Speaker 1: somehow someway are gonna move on. Some of these veterans

484
00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:07,760
Speaker 1: are gonna end up moving on, even Luis Robert maybe

485
00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:11,400
Speaker 1: by July. So connect with these young players that he's

486
00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:14,720
Speaker 1: going to grow with. Here's a decent young pitching corps

487
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:18,760
Speaker 1: there already and coming up to the minors. They really

488
00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:21,399
Speaker 1: don't know exactly where this position player group's going to go.

489
00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:23,679
Speaker 1: They're probably gonna get a few guys in a trade

490
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:27,879
Speaker 1: with croche Back. So connect with these young players and

491
00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:31,280
Speaker 1: all grow together. Patrick Graffall, the last manager, sort of

492
00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:33,480
Speaker 1: jumped into a veteran team that had a mix of

493
00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:36,560
Speaker 1: young players as well, and it just didn't work out

494
00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:40,400
Speaker 1: the way they thought. The connection didn't fit and feel right.

495
00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:42,800
Speaker 1: I think Venable just needs to connect with the young

496
00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:44,480
Speaker 1: group that's gonna be here for a bunch of years,

497
00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:45,880
Speaker 1: as he will be here for a bunch of.

498
00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:47,720
Speaker 6: Years, and then just let things grow.

499
00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:50,399
Speaker 1: Sort of be the opposite of Graffall in a lot

500
00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:53,960
Speaker 1: of ways, Pedro was very earnest trying to win. We

501
00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:55,920
Speaker 1: know that's not what's gonna happen here. It's gotta be

502
00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:59,240
Speaker 1: a lot of teaching that goes on. So connect, teach,

503
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:02,639
Speaker 1: and let grow. You'll probably lose less than one hundred

504
00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:04,679
Speaker 1: and twenty one games, so it will be a successful

505
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:06,119
Speaker 1: season by that measure.

506
00:23:06,119 --> 00:23:08,760
Speaker 2: Alana, Man, it'd be hard to lose one hundred and

507
00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:10,600
Speaker 2: twenty three, one hundred and twenty four. Let me ask

508
00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:12,560
Speaker 2: you this though, I mean, that's such an ever changing

509
00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:16,480
Speaker 2: roster and it looks like they're completely rebuilding. Who's the centerpiece,

510
00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:18,159
Speaker 2: who's the focal that you build around.

511
00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:20,920
Speaker 6: Yeah, it really is kind of that.

512
00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:24,680
Speaker 1: The young pitching cord Druth Thorpe Jonathan Cannon, Davis Martin

513
00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:28,800
Speaker 1: not household names, but they showed something despite a bad team.

514
00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:31,800
Speaker 1: Position player wise, I don't have an answer for you.

515
00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:35,280
Speaker 1: I mean, Colson Montgomery is a guy that's been coming up.

516
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:38,119
Speaker 1: His progress has slowed a little bit. He's their top prospect,

517
00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:41,520
Speaker 1: but that you know, you normally you might say Luis Robert,

518
00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:42,680
Speaker 1: but he's probably.

519
00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:43,080
Speaker 6: Going to get moved.

520
00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:45,639
Speaker 1: Bet attendee has not had a good run. He's probably

521
00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:48,719
Speaker 1: gonna get moved that they can dump that salary. You know,

522
00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:53,399
Speaker 1: maybe Vaughan sticks around, but I would probably answer you

523
00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:56,320
Speaker 1: the guy to build around position player wise isn't on

524
00:23:56,359 --> 00:24:01,000
Speaker 1: the team yet unless it is Colson Montgomery so or

525
00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:03,960
Speaker 1: you know, you know, they drafted a pitcher in the

526
00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:08,920
Speaker 1: in the in the top five picks, So I don't

527
00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:12,119
Speaker 1: know if I'm building around a pitcher or a position player.

528
00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:14,840
Speaker 1: But it's not quite defined who that's going to be,

529
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:16,000
Speaker 1: who that core is going to be.

530
00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:18,680
Speaker 2: Jesse, what do you think the ask is going to

531
00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:21,080
Speaker 2: be to get Crochet? What do you think the White

532
00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:24,639
Speaker 2: Sox are going to want in return to trade? Probably

533
00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:27,560
Speaker 2: arguably they're their best player on the roster right now.

534
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:32,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely a major league ready player or two, but

535
00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:35,679
Speaker 1: it has to be someone like in his first or

536
00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:36,280
Speaker 1: second year.

537
00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:39,080
Speaker 6: They're not trading for anybody that's about to go to

538
00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:39,800
Speaker 6: free agency.

539
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:43,960
Speaker 1: So major league ready player or two and then three prospects,

540
00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:44,840
Speaker 1: you know, something like that.

541
00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:45,800
Speaker 6: If they can get.

542
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:49,800
Speaker 1: Four, four maybe five if if you know, if they

543
00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:52,920
Speaker 1: can get that much, but four with two maybe major

544
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:54,840
Speaker 1: League ready and two at the lower levels, or one

545
00:24:54,880 --> 00:24:57,040
Speaker 1: major League ready and three at the lower levels.

546
00:24:57,480 --> 00:24:59,440
Speaker 6: Definitely three position players.

547
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,200
Speaker 1: It has to be three position players and then maybe

548
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:04,960
Speaker 1: add a fourth pitcher or position player. So that's what

549
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,600
Speaker 1: they're looking for again, sort of a core group to

550
00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:10,240
Speaker 1: build around. I was on another show talking about it,

551
00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:12,360
Speaker 1: like what if the Phillies trade for him, I'd ask

552
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 1: for Alec Boem, like get a get a player that's

553
00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:17,760
Speaker 1: ready to rock and roll that you could grow with

554
00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:20,800
Speaker 1: over four or five years. Maybe be that guy that

555
00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:24,040
Speaker 1: you build around along with that pitching staff. So major

556
00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:27,280
Speaker 1: league ready means triple A or one year into the

557
00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:29,760
Speaker 1: big leagues, and then let's get some prospects as well.

558
00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:30,160
Speaker 6: Yeah.

559
00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:33,040
Speaker 2: Ajay Prasinski on Foul Territory was saying that he had

560
00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:35,080
Speaker 2: heard that, you know, Alec Boem needs to grow up

561
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:38,000
Speaker 2: a little bit. Maybe he can do that in Chicago

562
00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:40,159
Speaker 2: around a younger group of guys. Maybe he can be

563
00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:42,240
Speaker 2: more of a veteran presence there. Okay, before I let

564
00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 2: you go, Jesse, let's talk about the Cubs really quick.

565
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:48,560
Speaker 2: One more thing. Is Craig Counsel under any additional pressure

566
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:50,720
Speaker 2: in his second year as the manager of the Cubs

567
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:53,760
Speaker 2: considering the contract that he signed kind of David Ross

568
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:56,320
Speaker 2: a bit blindsided. You know, they thought that Craig Counsel

569
00:25:56,440 --> 00:25:59,960
Speaker 2: was really going to bring some more wins to chicag

570
00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:01,720
Speaker 2: Is he under any pressure you think?

571
00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 6: I think he's under pressure from the fans. I'm not

572
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:06,359
Speaker 6: necessarily from the.

573
00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:11,800
Speaker 1: Front office, because look, they're not firing him even after

574
00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:13,920
Speaker 1: two years. He's got a you know, he's making a

575
00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:16,800
Speaker 1: lot of money over five, So that kind of pressure

576
00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:17,440
Speaker 1: comes in like.

577
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:19,440
Speaker 6: Year four if things aren't going well.

578
00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:22,160
Speaker 1: But I think from the fan base they thought they

579
00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:24,960
Speaker 1: were getting someone that was gonna squeeze more out of less,

580
00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:28,480
Speaker 1: and he squeezed exactly the same that David Ross squeezed

581
00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:31,520
Speaker 1: eighty three wins. So you know, I think they do

582
00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:33,480
Speaker 1: want to see his fingerprints put on this team a

583
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:35,840
Speaker 1: little bit more and get a little bit more out

584
00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:38,600
Speaker 1: of the talent there. They don't have a Superstar War

585
00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:41,080
Speaker 1: two to build around, so they really do have to

586
00:26:41,080 --> 00:26:44,640
Speaker 1: squeeze more out of three to four war kind of players.

587
00:26:44,640 --> 00:26:47,720
Speaker 1: They don't have a seven eight nine War player on

588
00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:50,960
Speaker 1: that roster. Can they get to four or five or

589
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,960
Speaker 1: five or six maybe if Suzuki has a career year

590
00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:55,480
Speaker 1: or someone else like that.

591
00:26:56,840 --> 00:26:59,040
Speaker 6: So yeah, I think he does have to squeeze more.

592
00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 1: Out of less sense and try to get closer to

593
00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:06,160
Speaker 1: ninety wins. Close to ninety wins means meaningful games in September,

594
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:07,840
Speaker 1: which is something they didn't really play this year.

595
00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:10,439
Speaker 2: Kyle Hendricks is gone, he is now a member of

596
00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 2: the Angels. Who else needs to be in that starting

597
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:14,520
Speaker 2: rotation to compliment justin Steel?

598
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:17,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean showed in Monaga had a good first

599
00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:20,840
Speaker 1: year obviously. Jamison Tian had a really good year as well,

600
00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:23,960
Speaker 1: still has two years left on his contract.

601
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:26,960
Speaker 6: They do have a good young.

602
00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:29,200
Speaker 1: Group of pitchers coming up. Ben Brown was looking good

603
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 1: then got hurt. Kate Horton was their top prospect. He

604
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:35,399
Speaker 1: got hurt. So there's some there's there's some room for

605
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,720
Speaker 1: a pitcher near the top of the rotation. I mean, honestly,

606
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:42,040
Speaker 1: in the perfect world, they would sign Corbyn Burns, a council,

607
00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:45,720
Speaker 1: you know, Milwaukee guy, and then move Immanaga to two

608
00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:48,520
Speaker 1: or Steal to two and IMMANAGAA three and Tian to

609
00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:50,160
Speaker 1: four and one of their prospects to five.

610
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 6: I don't know if they'll do that.

611
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 1: But a Max Freed, a Jack Flaherty second tier kind

612
00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:58,000
Speaker 1: of guys makes sense. So my point is there is

613
00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:01,399
Speaker 1: room for a one or two type of starter on

614
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:04,040
Speaker 1: this team, even if he isn't a true ace, and

615
00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:06,359
Speaker 1: I think they will spend in that area, whether it

616
00:28:06,400 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 1: be money or prospect capital for a pitcher.

617
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:12,560
Speaker 2: I like your idea. I like Corbyn Burns reuniting with

618
00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:15,159
Speaker 2: Craig Counsel. Before I let you go, I'm gonna ask

619
00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:17,640
Speaker 2: you the I guess six hundred million dollar question. Maybe

620
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:19,080
Speaker 2: where does one Sodo end up?

621
00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:22,120
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think it's going to be back with the Yankees.

622
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,000
Speaker 1: I think he'll do maybe even what Aaron Judge did

623
00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:27,160
Speaker 1: explore a little bit, but end up.

624
00:28:27,040 --> 00:28:27,920
Speaker 6: Back with the Yankees.

625
00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:30,560
Speaker 1: And I think it's as much about Brian Cashman as

626
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:35,479
Speaker 1: it is Brian Juan Soto, because he finally found the

627
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:38,680
Speaker 1: lineup balance. He was looking for last year, and just

628
00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:40,640
Speaker 1: to see that walk out the door and sort of

629
00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:43,120
Speaker 1: start over with Stanton.

630
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:44,840
Speaker 6: A year older and even Judge year older. I just

631
00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:46,440
Speaker 6: don't think he's going to do it. I don't know.

632
00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:50,080
Speaker 1: I honestly don't know how they replace Soto if he walks,

633
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 1: I just don't know how they do it, and they'd

634
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:54,880
Speaker 1: be back to sort of struggling, and they have enough

635
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:57,600
Speaker 1: things to figure out with the way the season ended

636
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 1: at the World Series. Keeping some lineup lefty, righty, left,

637
00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:03,320
Speaker 1: that's what they need to do, and that's why I

638
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:04,880
Speaker 1: think he ends up back with the Yankees.

639
00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:07,760
Speaker 2: All right. Jesse Rogers a tremendous job always on the

640
00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 2: baseball beat for ESPN. Thanks for taking the time. We'll

641
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:11,040
Speaker 2: talk to you soon.

642
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 6: Great seeing you a lot to be well.

643
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:15,000
Speaker 2: All right, you as well, Jesse, Thanks so much for

644
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,120
Speaker 2: being here all right. Time to shout out our friends

645
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:20,040
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656
00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:52,840
Speaker 2: here on Fair Territory with Ken Rosenthal. He will be

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Speaker 2: back on Monday. Thanks everyone for watching, subscribing, rating us

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Speaker 2: five stars. We appreciate it. Foul Territory with the guys

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Speaker 2: follows me and then Dodger's Territory with myself and Clint

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Speaker 2: see us at three pm Eastern. Thanks so much for

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Speaker 2: being with us. Take care for Mi