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Speaker 3: Hello Next Picture Show listeners, here's a friendly reminder that

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Speaker 3: if you enjoy the Next Picture Show, you'll really enjoy

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Speaker 3: patreon dot com slash Next Picture Show.

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Speaker 4: Very difficult to keep the line between the past.

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Speaker 5: You believe that someone out of the past can enter

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Speaker 5: and take possession of a living We.

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Speaker 6: May be through with the past, but the past is

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Speaker 6: not through with us.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to the Next Picture Show, a movie of the

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Speaker 3: Week podcast devoted to a classic film and how it's

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Speaker 3: shaped our thoughts on a recent release. I'm Tasha Robinson

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Speaker 3: here with Scott Tobias.

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Speaker 7: Genevieve Kaski and Keith PEPs.

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Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, it's an actual full house for the

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Speaker 3: Next Picture Show crew, all of the the og next

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Speaker 3: presture showers or back. It's been a while, guys, everybody's

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Speaker 3: been like traveling or dealing with other life obligations or

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Speaker 3: is it this pairing? Do we just do we all

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Speaker 3: love Cartoon Robots that much that we could miss this one?

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I'm always here unless I can't be here,

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Speaker 2: so Cartoon, even for episodes. I'm not the not the

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Speaker 2: you know, I'm not excited about every episode. I'm here

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Speaker 2: whenever I can be. But I do. I do like

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Speaker 2: the robots, So I am. I am excited to talk Robot.

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Speaker 7: I mean I would have been here probably no matter what.

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Speaker 7: I don't got a lot going on right now. But

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Speaker 7: I mean, as someone who has been stumping for this

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Speaker 7: particular pairing based on a trailer scene months and months ago.

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Speaker 7: I was not going to miss this one, I don't think.

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Speaker 6: But if it was about horrifying murder robots, you might

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Speaker 6: give it up a pause.

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Speaker 3: Also, four quarter spider robots?

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Speaker 6: Ooh, spider robots?

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Speaker 2: Are there spider robots movies?

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Speaker 7: I mean there's a spider like robot in our second

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Speaker 7: movie this.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, there's also you know, just a little preview. One

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Speaker 3: of the reasons that the movie that we're about to

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Speaker 3: talk about didn't get as much promo as it should

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Speaker 3: have gotten was a lot of the studious resources were

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Speaker 3: going towards Wild Wild West, a movie with a giant

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Speaker 3: spider robot in it.

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Speaker 7: That is true.

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Speaker 2: Well, hey, jenneteve I found a site that has something

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Speaker 2: called the roebug texts the tight x. It says, the

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Speaker 2: lie here looks like a spider, moves like a spider,

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Speaker 2: but it's actually a robot. Should I send this to you?

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Speaker 1: Oh?

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Speaker 7: That's that's exactly what humanity needs. I'm so glad you've

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Speaker 7: been putting resources towards that.

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, everybody's just constantly working towards a more

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Speaker 3: minority Report style future, and part of that is having

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Speaker 3: those horrible little daddy long legs camera bots in addition

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Speaker 3: to all of the other creepy robots that we need

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Speaker 3: in our robot filled future.

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Speaker 7: All right, well, with that, I'm leaving. Good night everybody.

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Speaker 3: No, no, no, you can't, you can't leave. I need

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Speaker 3: you to tell everybody about our next pairing. Our previous

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Speaker 3: pairing was about some very heavy, depressing and yet narratively

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Speaker 3: rich movies about aging and decay and mental and physical

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Speaker 3: deterioration and the inevitability of death. So it seems appropriate

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Speaker 3: that our latest pairing is the exact opposite of that.

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Speaker 3: It's a couple of sweet, life affirming stories aimed equally

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Speaker 3: like kids and adults, packed with mildly challenging but certainly

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Speaker 3: positivist messages. Genevieve, before you run out of the room

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Speaker 3: from the theoretical spiderbots, could you please tell us about

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Speaker 3: this pairing?

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Speaker 6: Oh?

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Speaker 7: I suppose? Before Bradbird was a Pixar animation taste maker

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Speaker 7: and Brain Trust member. Before he directed a well received

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Speaker 7: Mission Impossible movie and the poorly received Disney retro live

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Speaker 7: action Fantasy Tomorrowland. He made his directorial debut with the

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Speaker 7: theatrical flop The Iron Giant, an undermarketed and underseen animated

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Speaker 7: movie loosely based off Ted Hughes's nineteen sixty eight children's

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Speaker 7: novel about a giant extraterrestrial robot that can survive any damage.

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Speaker 7: BYRD moved the action to nineteen fifty's main and infused

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Speaker 7: it with messages about American militarism, government paranoia, and self determination,

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Speaker 7: all pretty heady concepts for an animated kids movie back

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Speaker 7: in nineteen ninety nine. But The Iron Giant's eventual revised

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Speaker 7: reputation is one of the greatest animated movies ever made

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Speaker 7: and one of American animation's biggest tearjerkers. Helps explain twenty

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Speaker 7: twenty four's The Wild Robot. Dreamworks's new film is also

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Speaker 7: broadly based on a children's novel, also full of heady

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Speaker 7: concepts about self determination and clai your own identity, and

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Speaker 7: also full of tear inducing moments. It seems designed as

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Speaker 7: a spiritual successor, if not an actual sequel.

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Speaker 3: So join us as we consider a groundbreaking Bring the

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Speaker 3: Kleenex movie about a robot learning about souls and sentience,

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Speaker 3: and the modern movie that puts a glossy CG spin

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Speaker 3: on the similar story. Can top of the line animation

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Speaker 3: technology compete with handmade heart. Have animated robots really changed

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Speaker 3: that much over twenty five years. We'll dig into it

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Speaker 3: after the break.

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Speaker 8: Michael, Giant Robot. I am the luckiest kid in America.

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Speaker 1: Where'd he come from?

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Speaker 4: He doesn't remember.

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Speaker 8: He is like a little kid.

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Speaker 5: Little Yeah, every hero buttneck is suck that giant thing

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Speaker 5: in the woods.

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Speaker 7: We don't know what it can do?

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Speaker 8: What are you talking about?

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Speaker 2: You think this middle Man is fun?

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Speaker 7: But who built it? The Russians, the Chinese, Martians, Canadians.

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Speaker 1: I don't care.

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Speaker 2: You are going to tell me about this thing, and

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Speaker 2: we are going to destroy it before it destroys us.

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Speaker 9: We gotta show them you're good.

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Speaker 8: You are what you choose to be.

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Speaker 4: Why Superman.

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Speaker 2: We must stop it at all costs.

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Speaker 6: Run it are.

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Speaker 2: Ready yet, I.

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Speaker 9: Thought it out there.

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Speaker 4: We've got to help it Ober now.

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Speaker 8: Giant, Oh girls.

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Speaker 3: So picture this. It's nineteen ninety nine and a new

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Speaker 3: animated movie called The Iron Giant opens in Chicago theaters.

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Speaker 3: It's only playing for a week. There's been no significant

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Speaker 3: advertising for this movie, and it isn't from one of

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Speaker 3: the majors with a familiarist, pablished house style like Pixar

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Speaker 3: or Disney YouTube won't exist for another six years, and

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Speaker 3: while studios are occasionally uploading trailers to websites where people

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Speaker 3: can watch them online, it isn't yet a common practice.

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Speaker 3: So I haven't seen a single frame of this film yet,

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Speaker 3: and I have no idea what to expect. But I'm

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Speaker 3: an animation buff. I'm hungry for something new that's not disnified,

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Speaker 3: and I've read a mildly positive Jonathan rosenbaumb brief in

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Speaker 3: the Chicago Reader that starts off quote. Like many children's

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Speaker 3: movies of this era, this feature length animation by writer

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Speaker 3: director Brad Bird is a knockoff of ET, but it's

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Speaker 3: a likable and imaginative one. So I head off to

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Speaker 3: the theater for the film's final showing in Chicago at

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Speaker 3: nine pm on a Thursday night. When the movie starts,

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Speaker 3: something seems off. The character seemed preposterously tall, gangly, and stylized.

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Speaker 3: But it's nineteen ninety nine, so it's unusual to see

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Speaker 3: asl animated American movie that isn't trying to emulate Disney's

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Speaker 3: house style, and I have no idea what the movie

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Speaker 3: is actually supposed to look like. It takes me half

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Speaker 3: an hour to really be positive that this isn't how

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Speaker 3: the Iron Giant is meant to look, that the theater

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Speaker 3: is running it with the wrong lens on the projector,

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Speaker 3: rendering everything squashed and stretched. But by then it's too late.

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Speaker 3: I'm hooked on the story, which is moving fast enough

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Speaker 3: that it's clear that by the time I could find

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Speaker 3: somebody to address the problem, I'll have missed an important

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Speaker 3: chunk of the action. It's already evident that this unknown

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Speaker 3: brad Bird guy is doing something unusual with characters as

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Speaker 3: specific and idiosyncratic as beatnik junkyard artist a dean, smugly

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Speaker 3: patriotic schemer Kent Mansley, and precocious, hyper lonely kid Hogarth Hughes.

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Speaker 3: Given the swift, surreptitious way this movie is blown through town,

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Speaker 3: I'm not convinced I'll ever have another chance to see it.

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Speaker 3: It feels like a studio discard that's only hit theaters

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Speaker 3: out of grudging, contractual obligation, and it seems positive that

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Speaker 3: once the final frame rolls, this offbeat cult experience will

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Speaker 3: be over and the film will disappear permanently. Obviously that

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Speaker 3: didn't happen, But I tell you all this to convey

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Speaker 3: how alien it felt to see The Iron Giant. In

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Speaker 3: nineteen ninety nine, the big animated movies of the year

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Speaker 3: were Tarzan, Toy Story two, Fantasia two thousand, and South Park, Bigger, Longer,

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Speaker 3: and Uncut. There are only a few modes for theatrical

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Speaker 3: animation releases in nineteen ninety nine, Pixar Disney Studio movies

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Speaker 3: emulating Disney as closely as possible, animated TV projects reported

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Speaker 3: to the big screen, imports from other countries, and the

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Speaker 3: occasional weird off brand project like Cats Don't Dance. The

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Speaker 3: Iron Giant came from Warner Animation, but it didn't feel

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Speaker 3: like a big studio project, largely because Warner Brothers had

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Speaker 3: abandoned it in the wake of the critical and box

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Speaker 3: office failure of its openly Disney aping animated movie The

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Speaker 3: Quest for Camelot the year before. It isn't particularly surprising

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Speaker 3: that Warner executives had their doubts about The Iron Giant.

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Speaker 3: Bradbird was a first time director, mostly known for his

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Speaker 3: work as a consultant on The Simpsons and as the

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Speaker 3: creator of the failed animated TV series Family Dog. The

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Speaker 3: project itself was an oddity. It was based on a

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Speaker 3: fairly shapeless children's story called The Iron Man by British

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Speaker 3: author Ted Hughes, who wrote it for his own kids

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Speaker 3: to comfort them after the suicide of their mother, Sylvia Plath.

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Speaker 3: The Who's Pete Townsend adapted that book as a stage

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Speaker 3: musical about a little boy who persuades a mysterio metal

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Speaker 3: leading robot to stand as Earth's guardian against a monstrous

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Speaker 3: space dragon, who, it turns out, has been twisted and

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Speaker 3: drawn to Earth by its many atrocities and wars, and

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Speaker 3: just needs to be straightened out and sent back to

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Speaker 3: space to make celestial music. All of which is odd enough,

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Speaker 3: But then Bird discarded most of that plot and the

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Speaker 3: setting and the themes and Townsend's music, all in order

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Speaker 3: to turn The Iron Giant into a story about patriotism

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Speaker 3: gone wrong in America's atomic age, not exactly a recipe

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Speaker 3: for hit animation in the nineteen nineties. But while The

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Speaker 3: Iron Giant was the victim of cold feet at Warner Brothers,

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Speaker 3: failing at the box office due to the lack of advertising,

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Speaker 3: merchandising support, IP support, and a minimal release window, it

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Speaker 3: was one of the many kids films of the era

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Speaker 3: that found its footing on home video, word of mouth

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Speaker 3: helped to find an audience who watched it over and over,

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Speaker 3: who grew up with its weird, warm humor and its

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Speaker 3: sharply idiosyncratic characters, And above all, they grew up with

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Speaker 3: that indelible climax where an alien robot designed as a

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Speaker 3: weapon for a mysterious war in space to protect the

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Speaker 3: little arth boy who befriended it, sacrificing himself to prove

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Speaker 3: he can choose to be a superhero not a gun.

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Speaker 3: Back in nineteen ninety nine, during its abortive theatrical run,

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Speaker 3: this movie felt like a surreptitious secret smuggled into being

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Speaker 3: passed a Disney stranglehold on American culture, but only just barely.

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Speaker 3: It felt like an anomaly in a well kept secret.

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Speaker 3: These days, it feels like a cultural staple, absolutely required

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Speaker 3: watching for any well versed animation fan, and a rare

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Speaker 3: example of quality winning out in a crowded marketplace in

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Speaker 3: spite of all the limitations it faced. I was surprised

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Speaker 3: that people did find The Iron Giant and make it

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Speaker 3: a classic, but maybe I shouldn't have been. Any movie

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Speaker 3: that manages to be mesmerizing even in the wrong aspect ratio,

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Speaker 3: with no build up or foreshadowing or backing or expectations,

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Speaker 3: and a culture that has no idea what to do

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Speaker 3: with it yet clearly has something going on and clearly

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Speaker 3: deserves a where it ended up?

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Speaker 4: Pick me up? Okay, okay, now March.

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Speaker 8: Who oh yeah, that's rock well nice place.

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Speaker 2: Huh.

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Speaker 3: Yes, I was born right down there.

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Speaker 8: We can't go there yet. People just aren't ready for you.

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Speaker 3: So, y'all, this is a movie that I've seen a lot,

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Speaker 3: but every time I revisit it, I'm sort of struck

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Speaker 3: by how simple it is in some ways. You know,

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Speaker 3: the characters are kind of broad and simple sketches that

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Speaker 3: I think you fill in via inference and understanding of

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Speaker 3: the world. There's a lot of We're going to lay

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Speaker 3: out just a few simple lines that we can bring

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Speaker 3: back for callbacks later. Revisiting this movie, I mean, does

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Speaker 3: it feel surprising after is complicated and dense and sometimes

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Speaker 3: extremely overpacked and fast paced, as animated movies have gotten,

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Speaker 3: especially over the last decade. Does it feel quaint to

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Speaker 3: you at this point the way it feels to me?

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Speaker 3: And I don't mean that at all is a bad thing.

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Speaker 3: I just mean, does it feel as radically different from

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Speaker 3: today's movies to you as it feels to me.

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Speaker 7: Now.

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Speaker 2: I don't know quaint it's a right word, but as

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Speaker 2: you were saying that, I'm thinking this is this is

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Speaker 2: pre Shrek, that what felt like was a really big

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Speaker 2: step forward and the attitudinization of a kid animation. I

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Speaker 2: don't necessarily mean that in a good way, and it's

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Speaker 2: very early days of Pixar, but I think in terms

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Speaker 2: of like storytelling, I think it's not that it's more

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Speaker 2: aligned with where Pixar was and where Pixar was going

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Speaker 2: than other animation trends.

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Speaker 4: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I mean it's a nostalgic film for one thing, So

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Speaker 2: I guess there's kind of quaintness built into it, isn't there.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, it feels like you said, nostalgic and like classic.

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Speaker 7: To me, it feels almost more like kind of more

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Speaker 7: classic Disney, but like minus the fairy tale aspect of

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Speaker 7: so much of those films, but kind of speaking to

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Speaker 7: the simplicity that Tasha is talking about, not to mention

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Speaker 7: the mostly hand drawn or it's very hand drawn feeling animation,

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Speaker 7: but like it's lacking a certain like mannickness that I

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Speaker 7: think crept in to a lot of animation around the Turnlinium.

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Speaker 7: Shrek is a really good reference point Keith for that,

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Speaker 7: so it does feel kind of of a previous era,

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Speaker 7: but that is also just so comforting to come back to,

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Speaker 7: Like this is. You know, I'm not a big movie revisitor,

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Speaker 7: Like the amount of movies I've seen more than two

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Speaker 7: or three times I could like probably count on two hands,

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Speaker 7: you know, but like this is one that every time

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Speaker 7: I watch it, I'm reminded, like, oh, yeah, this is

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Speaker 7: why this is one of my favorite movies. Like it.

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Speaker 7: It's so comforting to have it always be this good

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Speaker 7: and to like never really like fade in my estimation

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Speaker 7: on rewatch. That feels like a rare and a rare circumstance.

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Speaker 7: So I treasure it for that.

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Speaker 6: It's very refreshing to watch us. I mean, and this

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Speaker 6: will be a pretty strong point of contrast when we

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Speaker 6: talk about The Wild Robot next week and the way

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Speaker 6: it kind of deals with a similar story and it

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Speaker 6: is it is much more modernness in the way you're

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Speaker 6: talking about it being dense and incident packed. But I mean,

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Speaker 6: the Iron Giant is under ninety minutes long, and the

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Speaker 6: setup is very simple. I think we only get the

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Speaker 6: number of characters that we need. There's not a not

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Speaker 6: any rush to try to add additional flavor to it

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Speaker 6: or attitude or something like that. It's just, you know,

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Speaker 6: it's no I mean, it's just it's the boy. It's

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Speaker 6: it's the mom, the robot, the scrap iron guy, and uh,

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Speaker 6: the government guy. I mean that's it's only about five

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Speaker 6: characters in the movie that really matter.

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Speaker 2: And a giant, which is a giant, said the giant.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, it's good.

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Speaker 2: Giants.

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Speaker 7: The character, the title character, he's the title character.

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Speaker 6: He's the titular character. But I think, yeah, all of

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Speaker 6: that is refreshing. And I think when you do something

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Speaker 6: simply and well, which I think is what you get

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Speaker 6: from really good a lot of really good story books,

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Speaker 6: really children's tales, all the emotions feel clarified and sharp.

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Speaker 6: The lines in the touches that are meant to give

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Speaker 6: you a little bit of spin or whimsy or something

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Speaker 6: that they all pop because your your eye isn't distracted

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Speaker 6: by a million things at once, and your head isn't

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Speaker 6: swimming with plot details. There's just a level of focus

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Speaker 6: watching this movie that's very satisfying. It doesn't feel like

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Speaker 6: it wastes any moment at all.

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Speaker 3: How do you feel about the visual style I rewatching

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Speaker 3: it this time around, I think, as always, I find

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Speaker 3: that the subsidiary characters feel very don blue, but the

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Speaker 3: backdrop maybe feels more Disney, you know, the focus on

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Speaker 3: kind of like detailed water color environment. Brad Burden as

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Speaker 3: animators like went out to Maine and shot just like

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Speaker 3: a ton of photographs of like small rural main towns,

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Speaker 3: like looking for specificity. I think was a big deal

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Speaker 3: with them, and you know, getting covered bridges right and

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Speaker 3: like getting tree filled lanes right and that sort of thing. So,

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Speaker 3: but it has a very distinctive look, and it has

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Speaker 3: very distinctive character designs. Wondering what you think about them.

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Speaker 2: I just thought a lot A broader animated related thing

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Speaker 2: is we did not know how good we had it

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Speaker 2: at this stage of animation in general, because no one,

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Speaker 2: I don't think would have guessed hand drawn animation was

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Speaker 2: essentially on its way out or certainly in the United States, right.

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Speaker 2: But like the way the hand on animation is sort

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Speaker 2: of you know, complimented by computer touches and like just

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Speaker 2: just like the smoothness of it I mean, it's such

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Speaker 2: a beautiful looking film and you know, without feeling like

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Speaker 2: it's like, you know, pushing the boundaries of technology, which

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Speaker 2: I'm sure it probably was many in many ways. But yeah,

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Speaker 2: we just did not know, you know. I guess you

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Speaker 2: don't know when you're living in a golden age, but

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Speaker 2: like you know, and this wasn't necessarily a golden age

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Speaker 2: for other hand drawn animated American films, but you know,

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Speaker 2: it is a you know, I kind of wish this

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Speaker 2: moment would have lasted a little longer in terms of

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Speaker 2: animation technology and what the what the preferences.

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Speaker 7: Were, Tasha, You mentioning Don Bluth made something kind of

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Speaker 7: like click in my mind because, like when I said,

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Speaker 7: it reminded me of Disney films, like particularly in the

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Speaker 7: animation I was thinking specifically kind of like the seventies

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Speaker 7: era of Disney, which is when Don Bluth was with

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Speaker 7: the company still and specifically, like the character designs here

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Speaker 7: remind me a lot of the Rescuers, the human characters

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Speaker 7: which Don Bluth worked on, and so to the Disney

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Speaker 7: point of comparison, again, it feels like that very specific

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Speaker 7: era of Disney, especially in the character designs before it

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Speaker 7: kind of before the Disney Renaissance kind of gave us

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Speaker 7: this more like big eyed, pleasing, almost carbon copy human character.

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Speaker 7: There was like a minute there in Disney history where

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Speaker 7: the human characters could be a little odd looking. And

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Speaker 7: Don Bluth, I think, kind of carried that forward in

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Speaker 7: his work after Disney, and that's kind of I see

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Speaker 7: in play here. And I know Brad Bird also overlapped

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Speaker 7: with that era too and had a lot of respect

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Speaker 7: for the Nine Old Men, And I think a couple

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Speaker 7: of them are actually actually make cameos in The Iron Giant.

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Speaker 7: Am I correct there?

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Speaker 3: I didn't run across that. I mean, it would certainly

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Speaker 3: explain again some of the almost extreme specificity of some

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Speaker 3: of the faces, particular of the older men. Like there's

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Speaker 3: there's one in particular that I'm thinking of the train

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Speaker 3: conductor that explains you know, you're that's not going to

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Speaker 3: believe me, but it was an Iron man like that

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Speaker 3: looks like a caricature of an actual specific person much

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Speaker 3: more than it looks like just sort of a random design.

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Speaker 7: Well, here you go. Ali Johnson and Frank Thomas voice

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Speaker 7: the trains engineers, briefly seen near the start of the film.

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Speaker 7: Johnson and Thomas, who are animators and members of Disney's

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Speaker 7: Nine Old Men, were cited by Bird as inspirations for

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Speaker 7: his career, which he honored by incorporating their voices, likenesses,

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Speaker 7: and first names into the film.

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Speaker 3: Well there you go. Fun, Yeah, I did. And that's

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Speaker 3: an interesting piece of trivia that I did not know.

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Speaker 3: It's kind of fun, I guess to think about the

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Speaker 3: continuity of just like how many people have cited The

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Speaker 3: Iron Giant is a huge inspiration. Is the movie that

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Speaker 3: got them into animation? Or is it the movie that

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Speaker 3: taught them what animation could be? Or is like a

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Speaker 3: narrative or visual inspiration And to go back to that

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Speaker 3: movie and then just see, you know, Brad Bird himself

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Speaker 3: looking back, you know, a few more generations to his

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Speaker 3: inspirations is kind of fun. Like, yeah, I love that

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Speaker 3: kind of like chain of continuity.

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Speaker 7: Thing, especially at this sort of like inflection point for animation. Uh,

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Speaker 7: you know, to have that sense of history and nostalgia

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Speaker 7: built into like both the story and the visuals is

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Speaker 7: just a really neat thing.

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Speaker 2: That's it.

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Speaker 3: I want to know why everybody here has terrible, terrible teeth.

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Speaker 7: That's what made me think of the rescuers, like specifically, no,

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Speaker 7: the what are the.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, there are a lot of snaggle teeth. And then maybe,

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Speaker 3: now that I think about.

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Speaker 6: It, what's the state of dental care and the late fifties,

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Speaker 6: you know, I mean these kids are.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean Hogarth with his his kind of like

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Speaker 3: his uneven front teeth, one of which appears to be chipped.

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Speaker 3: He's he's kind of got buck teeth that are crowded

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Speaker 3: up against each other. Just reminds me of, you know,

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Speaker 3: some something that I see a lot in the interviews

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Speaker 3: with modern animators, you know, the computer animation kind of

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Speaker 3: algorithms really want to create people that are smooth and symmetrical,

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Speaker 3: and animators have found that that can be a little

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Speaker 3: uncanny valley, and you've always got to throw in something

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Speaker 3: that's irregular or asymmetrical or unmatched in some way, or

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Speaker 3: people's eyes just kind of like slide off the characters

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Speaker 3: and find them to slick basically. But I find myself

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Speaker 3: like a little overly focused on Hogarth's front teeth. But

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Speaker 3: even more than that, I'm thinking of like the ship's

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Speaker 3: captain at the beginning, who has just I don't know,

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Speaker 3: a snaggle teeth of all sorts of different different lengths

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Speaker 3: and shapes and sizes, and they're all kind of a

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Speaker 3: uniform like yellow green. There are a lot of kind

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Speaker 3: of startling mouths in this movie.

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Speaker 7: I like it for Hogarth. On this rewatch, I was

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Speaker 7: reminded just how much I like like Hogarth as a character.

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Speaker 7: I mean, I think all the characters in this movie

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Speaker 7: are just like really well rendered, and as Scott mentioned,

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Speaker 7: like there aren't that many of them, you know, And

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Speaker 7: just I think Hogarth feels what he feels both precocious

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Speaker 7: but actually like a real kid, you know, and like

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Speaker 7: his sense of play and his sort of like obnoxiousness

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Speaker 7: and kind of his weird teeth are a part of it. Like,

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Speaker 7: I mean, kids, you know, when their adult teeth are

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00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:29,480
Speaker 7: coming in, it can it can get a little gnarly,

437
00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:34,360
Speaker 7: you know, until their face and jaw settles to its

438
00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:37,440
Speaker 7: the size it's going to be, you know. So it

439
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:40,200
Speaker 7: just it all is kind of part of the package

440
00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:46,639
Speaker 7: of Hogarth as this like very specific yet recognizable kid

441
00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:49,520
Speaker 7: character that I really enjoy.

442
00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:52,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, I really wanted to dig into the kind of

443
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:56,920
Speaker 3: authenticity of Hogarth as a kid. You know, there's there's

444
00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:01,439
Speaker 3: kind of a lot of mildly brain behavior in this

445
00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:06,040
Speaker 3: movie where he he's he acts slick and thinks he's sly,

446
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:09,159
Speaker 3: but he's just very transparent in the way of a child.

447
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,600
Speaker 3: He has a kind of immediate sense of entitlement when

448
00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:16,119
Speaker 3: he meets the iron giant. That's just like my own robot, Like,

449
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:18,760
Speaker 3: you know, I see this, therefore I own it, you know.

450
00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:21,440
Speaker 3: He lies to his mom, he causes chaos in her

451
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:28,120
Speaker 3: in her like workplace, he eats twinkies filled with whipped cream,

452
00:24:28,240 --> 00:24:30,359
Speaker 3: or when he's been told to go to bed and

453
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,880
Speaker 3: not watch scary movies, like he runs around the woods

454
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:35,440
Speaker 3: in the middle of the night when he's been told

455
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:38,399
Speaker 3: not to, and like he has a obviously like a

456
00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:41,960
Speaker 3: very good heart. He's a sweet kid. You find out.

457
00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:44,480
Speaker 3: One of the details about this movie that always just

458
00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:46,840
Speaker 3: rolls off my back and that I forget about is

459
00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:50,640
Speaker 3: the whole detail about He was a straight A student,

460
00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:53,280
Speaker 3: and his mother felt that he wasn't being challenged enough,

461
00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:56,359
Speaker 3: so they promoted him a grade. And now he's dealing

462
00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:59,440
Speaker 3: with bullies bigger than he is who pick on him

463
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:02,000
Speaker 3: because they think he's of smarty pants. Like all of

464
00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:04,320
Speaker 3: that is a whole bunch of information that doesn't really

465
00:25:04,359 --> 00:25:07,440
Speaker 3: come into play in the movie in a meaningful payoff

466
00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:10,520
Speaker 3: kind of way, in the way like modern animated movies

467
00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:12,879
Speaker 3: seem to only throw details like that on the board

468
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:16,600
Speaker 3: if there's gonna be like a very specific narrative payoff.

469
00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:19,600
Speaker 3: But in this case, there's just like a little micro

470
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:21,400
Speaker 3: arc where you find out that he's like a fish

471
00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:24,159
Speaker 3: out of water, like a kid with no friends. And

472
00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:26,840
Speaker 3: then he gets one friend and it really matters to him,

473
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:29,200
Speaker 3: and then he gets an adult friend and that seems

474
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:30,879
Speaker 3: to be great for him too, and then by the

475
00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:33,119
Speaker 3: end of the movie he has kid friends and it's

476
00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:37,200
Speaker 3: almost as warming as you know, the big iron giant

477
00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:40,720
Speaker 3: climax scene. So I don't know, I find a Hugarth

478
00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:44,199
Speaker 3: a fun character, but I also think he's kind of

479
00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:49,240
Speaker 3: an obnoxious torp, and I kind of admire bradbirds like

480
00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:53,800
Speaker 3: daring in characterizing him that way, because you know, the

481
00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:58,600
Speaker 3: the unlikable kid character is something we just see very

482
00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 3: very rarely in this kind of movie. Unlikable is going

483
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 3: too far.

484
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:07,480
Speaker 6: It is exactly I can't call Hogarth unlikeable precocious, He's

485
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:08,440
Speaker 6: a precocious imp.

486
00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:11,400
Speaker 2: Camp I'm very mad if someone brought us work into

487
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:13,240
Speaker 2: my place of place of work though.

488
00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:14,800
Speaker 6: No, that's right, that's right.

489
00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:18,200
Speaker 7: But he's also like he's a handful, Yeah, but he's

490
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:21,159
Speaker 7: also just like courageous and headstrong, Like I mean, like

491
00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 7: barreling out into the woods at night, you know, is

492
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:27,280
Speaker 7: definitely not something I would have done as a ten

493
00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:29,359
Speaker 7: year old kid, you know, Like I kind of I

494
00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:33,720
Speaker 7: guess admire his rambunctiousness a little bit too, you know,

495
00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 7: while acknowledging that it would certainly be exasperating to deal

496
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:41,359
Speaker 7: with as his mother, you know. And I mean, I

497
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:45,200
Speaker 7: think voice performances across the board are are great. I

498
00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:47,240
Speaker 7: think we're going to like give everyone their props. But

499
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:51,520
Speaker 7: you know, Jennifer Aniston as Annie is you know, just

500
00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:55,360
Speaker 7: a really you can hear the love she has for Hogarth,

501
00:26:55,440 --> 00:27:00,359
Speaker 7: even as she is like exasperated and tired, you know,

502
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:04,760
Speaker 7: by exhausted by him. But there is one voice performance

503
00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:07,640
Speaker 7: that I think that rises above all else here, which

504
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:09,720
Speaker 7: we will get to in a moment. But before we

505
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:12,440
Speaker 7: leave Hogarth, like I do want to give it up

506
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:16,880
Speaker 7: for Eli Marienthal, who voices him like just the way

507
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:22,159
Speaker 7: that Hogarth yells like hey hey, the robot, like I

508
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:24,480
Speaker 7: can hear it so clearly in my head, and it's

509
00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:28,280
Speaker 7: so that, like it's so fitting for like a kid

510
00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:31,280
Speaker 7: of that age who is like kind of you say,

511
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:34,639
Speaker 7: entitled Tasha, maybe just like expecting a certain amount of

512
00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:37,880
Speaker 7: attention or feedback in that moment, Like he's a kid

513
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:40,600
Speaker 7: dying for attention. You know, he's alone most of the time.

514
00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:43,280
Speaker 7: You know, he wants to focus on him in this moment,

515
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 7: and I just like that all comes through so clearly

516
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 7: and just that Hey.

517
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:51,199
Speaker 2: Andison, it's really good. I looked it up. She's done

518
00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 2: any other animated films and the only other one she's

519
00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:57,520
Speaker 2: done is Storks, which I wow, barely I think everyone

520
00:27:57,560 --> 00:27:59,280
Speaker 2: has a voice in that. She sent some television too,

521
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:02,119
Speaker 2: but like, yeah, she's she's I mean, you get the

522
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:04,600
Speaker 2: feeling like maybe, you know, being on Friends had a

523
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:06,479
Speaker 2: lot of had something to do with how she got

524
00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 2: those but he really rises to it for sure.

525
00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:12,320
Speaker 3: As far as Hogarth's voice goes, the scene that always

526
00:28:12,320 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 3: stands out for me is the one where he jumps

527
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:17,840
Speaker 3: into the lake and he's clearly freezing his teeth or

528
00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 3: chattering so hard he can barely get words out, but

529
00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:22,480
Speaker 3: he's trying to get Dean in the Robot to jump

530
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:25,160
Speaker 3: in after him, and he's saying, oh, it's it's fine.

531
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:31,320
Speaker 3: It's really refreshing in this like chattery, like shivery voice,

532
00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 3: and again he's kind of being obnoxious in a very

533
00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:35,639
Speaker 3: believable kid way.

534
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:39,240
Speaker 7: You know that they watch me dive. Yeah, look at me,

535
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:40,320
Speaker 7: Look at me, Look at me, look at me.

536
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 3: But also that that quality of you know that the

537
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:46,400
Speaker 3: classic maybe goes back as long as there have been

538
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:49,120
Speaker 3: lakes and kids. You jump into the overly cold water,

539
00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:51,520
Speaker 3: and then you try to convince everybody that it's it's

540
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:54,760
Speaker 3: perfectly fine and enjoyable, to the point where he's like

541
00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:58,400
Speaker 3: calling Dean in the Robot names for not joining him,

542
00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:02,640
Speaker 3: even as it's like just so visibly nakedly obvious that

543
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:05,160
Speaker 3: he's freezing his butt off. I just find that whole

544
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:09,920
Speaker 3: sequence delightful, both from a characterization perspective and from a

545
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,200
Speaker 3: vocal perspective, but also one of my favorite shots in

546
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:17,800
Speaker 3: the entire movie is Dean clamped to his chair slowly

547
00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:20,880
Speaker 3: settling down on the road through the huge wave caused

548
00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:22,040
Speaker 3: by the giant jumping into the lake.

549
00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:23,960
Speaker 2: Oh.

550
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:26,320
Speaker 7: I love that, just like as a piece of animation,

551
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:30,320
Speaker 7: I mean, like Obviously, water animation is always sort of

552
00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:34,080
Speaker 7: like eye catching. But the way the Dean just washes

553
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:39,840
Speaker 7: out to the road like completely nonplussed is it's a

554
00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:43,080
Speaker 7: great moment of the action, I guess, of the water

555
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 7: and but like keeping the character animation really interesting within that.

556
00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:49,040
Speaker 7: I really love that whole sequence.

557
00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:52,720
Speaker 3: You know, that actually is a great opportunity for something

558
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:54,920
Speaker 3: that I was going to get to a little bit

559
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:56,480
Speaker 3: down the road after we talked about some of the

560
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 3: bigger things. But maybe we start with the small things

561
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:01,120
Speaker 3: and get back to the big things. Let's do that

562
00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:02,800
Speaker 3: in a second after this break.

563
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:13,640
Speaker 8: Hey, Dane, watch this alright, we're watching.

564
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:15,320
Speaker 7: We're watching this.

565
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 8: One's for professionals only.

566
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:20,560
Speaker 4: Funny.

567
00:30:28,840 --> 00:30:36,880
Speaker 7: Come on in, right, No thanks, yeah.

568
00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:39,560
Speaker 4: Waiting, come on in.

569
00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,720
Speaker 8: It's really really refreshing.

570
00:30:50,400 --> 00:31:09,280
Speaker 9: What you two, you big baby.

571
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:12,160
Speaker 3: So I feel like when people talk about the Iron Giant,

572
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:15,280
Speaker 3: like they think about the Superman moment, they think about

573
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 3: the way that hit them emotionally, or if they want

574
00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:20,480
Speaker 3: to zoom out a little, they mostly talk about like

575
00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:24,320
Speaker 3: the setting and the fifties Atomic age concepts and what

576
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 3: this film says about, like self determination and military adventurism

577
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:33,320
Speaker 3: and kind of America's attitude towards the entire rest of

578
00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:36,560
Speaker 3: the world. I just don't see nearly as much conversation

579
00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:42,600
Speaker 3: about things like the Dean distortion through water like floating moment,

580
00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:47,920
Speaker 3: or you know, other just like little goofy or or

581
00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:52,040
Speaker 3: clever or tiny details in the movie. And I know

582
00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:53,920
Speaker 3: from some of the conversation we had leading up to

583
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:57,400
Speaker 3: this that a lot of you have like favorite little

584
00:31:57,400 --> 00:32:00,680
Speaker 3: moments like that. What's a little detail from this movie

585
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:03,719
Speaker 3: that you forget that you rediscover every time you watch it?

586
00:32:04,360 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 6: An mit I've admits there's a there's a bit. There's

587
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:11,560
Speaker 6: a bit where where the uh where Kent Mansley is

588
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 6: on the phone and in the kitchen and and that

589
00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:16,720
Speaker 6: is not his that is the boy and his mom.

590
00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:21,400
Speaker 6: And he looks across and there's some some whimsically whimsically

591
00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 6: designed uh oven mitt staring at him, and he he

592
00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:26,720
Speaker 6: uh gets annoyed by it and turns it around.

593
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:30,200
Speaker 3: He doesn't just get annoyed by it. He's getting chewed

594
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,920
Speaker 3: out by the general who says, like, you know, listen

595
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 3: to yourself, listen to how you sound. And he looks

596
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:39,920
Speaker 3: at this like goofy face, and he has to turn

597
00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:43,400
Speaker 3: it around because it seems like it's mocking him basically, yeah, yeah,

598
00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:45,920
Speaker 3: maybe so it seems like it's it's telling him that

599
00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:48,080
Speaker 3: he sounds like a horse's ass. This is sort of

600
00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:50,680
Speaker 3: my read on you know what appears to maybe be

601
00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:54,960
Speaker 3: a very distorted pop eyed donkey. But yes, that oven

602
00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:55,880
Speaker 3: mid is hilarious.

603
00:32:56,240 --> 00:33:00,440
Speaker 2: I don't know who voices the actors and the B movie.

604
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:05,000
Speaker 7: I was going to bring up the B movie too, Yes, yeah, well.

605
00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:07,120
Speaker 2: The whole thing's good, so I'll be playing for you

606
00:33:07,160 --> 00:33:11,000
Speaker 2: to talk about. But specifically like the male lead, it's

607
00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:14,560
Speaker 2: awful performance, like sort of like stilt like you know,

608
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:18,040
Speaker 2: it's it's it's the exactly the right kind of bad

609
00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 2: movie performance from a fifties B movie. I loved it.

610
00:33:21,480 --> 00:33:24,480
Speaker 2: But here I love more for you to chew on there.

611
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:29,920
Speaker 7: Well, just like talking about the smaller animation moments and

612
00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:34,200
Speaker 7: and it's also just the hues household h with with

613
00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:36,560
Speaker 7: the oven Midt like I do love the inside the

614
00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:38,960
Speaker 7: house moments, Like I feel like so much of the

615
00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:43,200
Speaker 7: memorable scenes of this film take place like out in

616
00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:46,720
Speaker 7: the woods or up in the sky or over the sea,

617
00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:50,120
Speaker 7: and you know, have these like big like large scope scenery,

618
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:53,560
Speaker 7: but I love the little domestic moments we get too

619
00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:59,560
Speaker 7: and the scene of Hogarth watching the movie we already

620
00:33:59,640 --> 00:34:02,640
Speaker 7: kind of alluded to the filling up twinkies with more

621
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:05,479
Speaker 7: whipped cream moment, which is a really cute and just

622
00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:07,920
Speaker 7: like his you know, the sort of the classic shot

623
00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:11,640
Speaker 7: of his face illuminated by the screen is great. But

624
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:14,600
Speaker 7: I find myself wondering while watching that b movie as

625
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:17,800
Speaker 7: you see the brain inch out of the screen, was like,

626
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:19,759
Speaker 7: how would they have done that with practical effects?

627
00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:23,759
Speaker 6: For me?

628
00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:25,520
Speaker 3: I think one of the things that stands out most

629
00:34:25,600 --> 00:34:30,480
Speaker 3: visually is the sequence where Kent knows where the giant

630
00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:32,600
Speaker 3: is and they're going to go get it, and he

631
00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:35,279
Speaker 3: wants to make sure Hogarth doesn't run off and hide

632
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:39,520
Speaker 3: it somewhere else, And there's that just silent montage back

633
00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:42,600
Speaker 3: and forth between them where they're both sitting on their

634
00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:46,560
Speaker 3: respective beds, glaring at each other through the doorways, and

635
00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:48,440
Speaker 3: you just see like the elapse of time as they

636
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:52,040
Speaker 3: both get tireder and tireder, and they both go from

637
00:34:52,080 --> 00:34:55,879
Speaker 3: this kind of like heightened smugness on Kent's part and

638
00:34:56,560 --> 00:35:01,080
Speaker 3: heightened resentment and anger on Hogarth's part to just like

639
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:05,920
Speaker 3: the softness and blurriness of a very very late night

640
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:09,359
Speaker 3: leeching into a very early morning. Just the way their

641
00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:14,280
Speaker 3: eyes are drawn respectively throughout that sequence, and how much

642
00:35:14,360 --> 00:35:19,279
Speaker 3: they convey in their facial expressions of yes, I'm still

643
00:35:19,320 --> 00:35:22,480
Speaker 3: feeling this thing I was feeling five hours ago, but

644
00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:25,280
Speaker 3: I can't hold onto most of it because I'm too sleepy.

645
00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:29,280
Speaker 3: I love that sequence so much, and it's just such

646
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:32,080
Speaker 3: a you know, after like so much, so much incident

647
00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:35,719
Speaker 3: and so much energy. The quietness of it as a

648
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:40,040
Speaker 3: face off, you know, Hogarth being silent for once instead

649
00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:42,719
Speaker 3: of being a chatterbox, and them conveying all of those

650
00:35:42,719 --> 00:35:46,080
Speaker 3: emotions just without words, capped with that jaunty little moment

651
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:48,879
Speaker 3: where Hogarth just walks by the door and says, that morning, Kent.

652
00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:53,520
Speaker 3: I love that whole thing so much. Let's talk about Kent.

653
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:56,920
Speaker 3: I read some summaries of the movie going into this

654
00:35:57,040 --> 00:36:00,359
Speaker 3: just to sort of see how other people characterized Beats

655
00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:02,319
Speaker 3: in the movie, and one of the things I kept

656
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:05,879
Speaker 3: seeing is people talking about him is like hyper paranoid

657
00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:10,120
Speaker 3: and terrified of like the threat that the Iron Giant poses.

658
00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:13,480
Speaker 3: I always read his actions in the third act as

659
00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:17,399
Speaker 3: much more like covering his own ass much more kind

660
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:21,680
Speaker 3: of like selfish and self serving rather than actually afraid

661
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:24,879
Speaker 3: of the giant. So I'm curious how you guys read

662
00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:28,160
Speaker 3: that and just what you see in him in general.

663
00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:32,080
Speaker 6: To me, Kent is a very recognizable type, you know,

664
00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:37,560
Speaker 6: someone who has this core set of beliefs and assumptions

665
00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:42,120
Speaker 6: that he will never abandon, even in the face of

666
00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:45,080
Speaker 6: evidence to the contrary. You know, And I think this

667
00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:48,000
Speaker 6: is a film that, you know, given the setting, given

668
00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:50,799
Speaker 6: the anti Russian paranoia, I mean, that's kind of a

669
00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:54,280
Speaker 6: red Scare aspect to it that is sort of ingrained

670
00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:59,280
Speaker 6: in this bullheaded man who can never adjust his thinking

671
00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:02,760
Speaker 6: to a reality that doesn't conform to what he assumes

672
00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:05,600
Speaker 6: it to be. And you know, I think we are

673
00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:10,560
Speaker 6: plagued constantly with those types of thinkers in American public life.

674
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:11,719
Speaker 6: That's my take on him.

675
00:37:11,719 --> 00:37:15,680
Speaker 7: Anyway, I kind of see him as just a cynical

676
00:37:15,800 --> 00:37:19,160
Speaker 7: striver because when he arrives in this town as a

677
00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:23,000
Speaker 7: representative of what the unexplained phenomena department of an unexplained

678
00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:25,440
Speaker 7: phenomenon is something like that, you know, you get the

679
00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:27,560
Speaker 7: sense that he doesn't want to be there. He's like

680
00:37:27,640 --> 00:37:30,640
Speaker 7: not really taking this seriously. You know, he kind of

681
00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:33,200
Speaker 7: seems like he like maybe doesn't take any of this

682
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:35,840
Speaker 7: that seriously, but he's really just kind of on the

683
00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 7: lookout for opportunities to move up in his job and

684
00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:43,239
Speaker 7: his role in the military whatever. Because once he realizes

685
00:37:43,239 --> 00:37:47,239
Speaker 7: that there's something here, it's something big, like, he pursues

686
00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:51,600
Speaker 7: it with singular mania, you know, up until the very end.

687
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:54,520
Speaker 7: And I read it is coming from a place kind

688
00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:58,440
Speaker 7: of more what you're seeing, Tasha, of calculation and selfishness,

689
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:02,920
Speaker 7: kind of just a wanting to prove himself, I guess,

690
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:04,680
Speaker 7: to the detriment of all else.

691
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:08,000
Speaker 6: But even so, how does that account for his actions

692
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:11,120
Speaker 6: at the and with the general who he's defying this

693
00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:14,080
Speaker 6: as somebody who actually has seniority over him and can

694
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:17,600
Speaker 6: kind of determine his you have some say over his future,

695
00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:20,920
Speaker 6: and he's he defies him as well because he's kind

696
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:22,760
Speaker 6: of clinging to this idea of, you know, the giant

697
00:38:22,920 --> 00:38:25,400
Speaker 6: is this threat that has to be dealt with in

698
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:28,799
Speaker 6: the most extreme manner possible, no matter how much it

699
00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:30,800
Speaker 6: exposes other people to harm.

700
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:32,440
Speaker 2: If that weren't the case, he would be wrong, and

701
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:35,640
Speaker 2: he couldn't be wrong. I think that's kind of psychology works.

702
00:38:36,040 --> 00:38:38,319
Speaker 3: See, that's what I see, much more than like an

703
00:38:38,360 --> 00:38:41,239
Speaker 3: actual fear of his threat, is just kind of a

704
00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,799
Speaker 3: feeling that if he manages to blow the robot up,

705
00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:45,839
Speaker 3: then nobody could ever prove that it wasn't a threat.

706
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:48,920
Speaker 3: Nobody could ever prove that, you know, that there was

707
00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:53,640
Speaker 3: anything going on there other than how he presented the situation.

708
00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:56,800
Speaker 3: It just seems like he could redeem himself in that way.

709
00:38:56,960 --> 00:38:59,640
Speaker 3: So I guess I just don't see him as as

710
00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:03,640
Speaker 3: that frightened of the thing. You know, the biggest it's

711
00:39:03,640 --> 00:39:06,240
Speaker 3: not a heel face heel turn. It's just a heel

712
00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:10,919
Speaker 3: much worse heel turn. When he comes to the army

713
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:14,000
Speaker 3: folk after Dean has told him like the robot is harmless,

714
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:16,319
Speaker 3: he comes to them and says, you know, he killed

715
00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:18,880
Speaker 3: a kid, like we have to stop him. Like that's

716
00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 3: one of the most jarring steps, like villain steps really

717
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:23,680
Speaker 3: in the movie.

718
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:25,600
Speaker 2: I don't think he's a villain into that point. I

719
00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:27,400
Speaker 2: don't think he's a good guy, but he's like an

720
00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 2: out and out like you know, doing evil in the

721
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:33,160
Speaker 2: world character until that moment.

722
00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:38,319
Speaker 7: I mean, he's harassing Hogarth's pretty bad. Yeah, but yeah,

723
00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:43,080
Speaker 7: villainy hasn't quite risen to the level of nuking a

724
00:39:43,080 --> 00:39:43,680
Speaker 7: small town.

725
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:46,640
Speaker 2: Yet he's also having terrible digustive issues.

726
00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:52,799
Speaker 6: Fair, fair, that's a good that's a good montage too.

727
00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:55,439
Speaker 6: You're talking about montage and.

728
00:39:55,120 --> 00:39:57,600
Speaker 7: To search in you know this is this is isn't

729
00:39:57,600 --> 00:40:01,439
Speaker 7: a musical, but I do enjoy the musical beat there.

730
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:05,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, when we're talking about tiny little animation details the

731
00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:09,120
Speaker 3: weary slump of his body as he gets up from

732
00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:11,520
Speaker 3: having taken a crap behind a bush in the woods

733
00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:15,280
Speaker 3: because there was no bathroom around. Like he's his whole

734
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 3: body is just like one long, exaggerated stylized curve because

735
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:25,200
Speaker 3: he's slumping so hard. It's just it's it's great for

736
00:40:25,239 --> 00:40:28,680
Speaker 3: a man who's normally all angles, like big pointy chin,

737
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:34,000
Speaker 3: big pointy hat, big pointy nose. It seems significant somehow

738
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:37,560
Speaker 3: that for the moment he's turned into a long curve instead.

739
00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:40,440
Speaker 3: But I mean, I don't know. Like one of the

740
00:40:40,719 --> 00:40:45,400
Speaker 3: big key uh Kent Mansley lines is when the general

741
00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:47,360
Speaker 3: tells him he's about to die for his country, he says,

742
00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:50,680
Speaker 3: screw my country. I want to live, and like that's

743
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 3: a very revealing line, but to me, nothing is more

744
00:40:53,640 --> 00:40:56,960
Speaker 3: revealing than the moment where he gets Hogarth under the

745
00:40:56,960 --> 00:41:01,160
Speaker 3: spotlight and says that because of his job with the government,

746
00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:04,439
Speaker 3: I can do anything I want to anyone I want,

747
00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:07,560
Speaker 3: as long as I feel it's in the people's interests.

748
00:41:08,640 --> 00:41:12,799
Speaker 3: And man, that that line is just so precocious, I

749
00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:16,520
Speaker 3: think in terms of yeah, it's it's reaching back to

750
00:41:16,719 --> 00:41:22,160
Speaker 3: a long lineage of you know, governmental overreach and individual overreach.

751
00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:27,720
Speaker 3: But it's amazing how relevant that line still feels today.

752
00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:31,040
Speaker 3: And maybe maybe maybe I disagree with hi Keith. Maybe

753
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:33,080
Speaker 3: that's the moment where he reveals himself as a villain.

754
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:35,840
Speaker 2: Maybe, so I wanted to talk about.

755
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:39,560
Speaker 3: There's a longer cut of this movie, just by a

756
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:43,600
Speaker 3: couple of minutes, that has a couple more scenes in it.

757
00:41:43,600 --> 00:41:46,839
Speaker 3: It's called the Signature Edition, and one of them is

758
00:41:46,840 --> 00:41:50,080
Speaker 3: is just a pretty short exchange between Annie Hogarth's mother

759
00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:53,840
Speaker 3: and Dean in the diner where you first start to

760
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:57,040
Speaker 3: see maybe the spark of romance. But the other one

761
00:41:57,120 --> 00:42:00,560
Speaker 3: is a little over a minute long, and it comes

762
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:03,440
Speaker 3: right after the Soul's scene, which I also want to

763
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:05,319
Speaker 3: talk about, although that one may be a good one

764
00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:08,920
Speaker 3: to hold for connections with Wild Robot, where the Giant

765
00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:13,799
Speaker 3: falls asleep in dreams of his own past, and his

766
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:17,640
Speaker 3: dreams are electrically transmitted onto a TV that Dean has

767
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:20,360
Speaker 3: fallen asleep from, and Dean kind of like wakes up

768
00:42:21,040 --> 00:42:24,040
Speaker 3: to the Giant's nightmare on the screen. And it's a

769
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:27,000
Speaker 3: very short thing, but it gives us a hint of

770
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:29,359
Speaker 3: where he came from and what he was designed for,

771
00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:32,200
Speaker 3: like what his old world looked like and what happened

772
00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:36,239
Speaker 3: to it. And it's it's very stylized, it's very visually dramatic.

773
00:42:36,520 --> 00:42:39,000
Speaker 3: You can find it on YouTube and watch it quite easily,

774
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:41,719
Speaker 3: but it's really the only hint we get about the

775
00:42:41,719 --> 00:42:45,480
Speaker 3: Giants past. And it makes me curious what you make

776
00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:48,560
Speaker 3: of that scene, Like did the movie lose anything with that?

777
00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:50,840
Speaker 3: Is it? Is it useful to know more about the

778
00:42:50,880 --> 00:42:53,600
Speaker 3: Giants past? Did you want to know more about the

779
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:54,320
Speaker 3: Giants past?

780
00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:57,840
Speaker 2: So that seems also incorporated into what longer version calls

781
00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:01,520
Speaker 2: Signature Edition, which which I did not watch this time.

782
00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:04,240
Speaker 2: I'd seen this scene before and I watched again before

783
00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:07,440
Speaker 2: this episode. I think it's a really striking piece of animation.

784
00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:09,640
Speaker 2: But I mean, I think we can already cut I mean,

785
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:11,560
Speaker 2: if there's a conclusion to draw from it, it's that

786
00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:15,160
Speaker 2: he is at some point designed to be a weapon

787
00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:19,520
Speaker 2: or to be a being of war. I think we

788
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:22,279
Speaker 2: kind of already get that already went bye bye by

789
00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:24,440
Speaker 2: the whole way he reacts to to guns and how

790
00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:27,080
Speaker 2: he kind of goes into berserker mode at that at

791
00:43:27,080 --> 00:43:29,440
Speaker 2: that point. So I don't think it necessarily tells us

792
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:31,920
Speaker 2: anything that we didn't know already, but I do kind

793
00:43:31,920 --> 00:43:32,840
Speaker 2: of like it as a scene.

794
00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:35,799
Speaker 7: Yeah, I watched the signature edition this time, which I

795
00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:39,399
Speaker 7: don't think I had seen before. If I did, i'd

796
00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:42,239
Speaker 7: forgotten it. But I was like, I don't recall this

797
00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:45,799
Speaker 7: like seeing this scene in the movie before or at

798
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:48,879
Speaker 7: this point, and I was, I don't want to say

799
00:43:48,920 --> 00:43:51,839
Speaker 7: taken aback by it, but it definitely like struck me

800
00:43:52,040 --> 00:43:55,680
Speaker 7: for just sort of the quick tonal shift moment of it.

801
00:43:55,719 --> 00:43:59,120
Speaker 7: I mean, obviously it's a nightmare, you know, but there's

802
00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:01,680
Speaker 7: kind of so much leading up to that is like

803
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:05,719
Speaker 7: the I mean, the soul scene of course, is you know,

804
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:07,600
Speaker 7: very emotional in its own way, but there's a lot

805
00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 7: of just like play between Hogarth and the robot leading

806
00:44:11,640 --> 00:44:13,000
Speaker 7: up to that. You know, it's a lot of their

807
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:17,800
Speaker 7: friendship development that is leading up to there, and it's

808
00:44:18,080 --> 00:44:22,640
Speaker 7: just such a Again, it's a nightmarish vision, you know.

809
00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:25,400
Speaker 7: And I think it does add a little bit to

810
00:44:25,719 --> 00:44:29,200
Speaker 7: the Robot's characterization, and I feel like it makes I

811
00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:32,560
Speaker 7: Am not a gun hit a little harder and also

812
00:44:32,840 --> 00:44:38,839
Speaker 7: sort of the implication of world destruction at you know,

813
00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:43,080
Speaker 7: that he was perhaps involved with. I think also maybe

814
00:44:43,760 --> 00:44:47,840
Speaker 7: seeds the big final Superman moment in a way that

815
00:44:48,520 --> 00:44:52,000
Speaker 7: is nice. So, I mean, I think obviously the movie

816
00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 7: works perfectly without it, but I did appreciate on this

817
00:44:55,719 --> 00:44:59,600
Speaker 7: viewing sort of the little bit of like shading that

818
00:44:59,680 --> 00:45:03,680
Speaker 7: it both to the character and to the feel of

819
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:06,280
Speaker 7: the movie at that point in its story.

820
00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:08,840
Speaker 3: Well, there's a lot more that we can talk about

821
00:45:08,920 --> 00:45:11,319
Speaker 3: with the Iron Giant. I do eventually want to get

822
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:14,640
Speaker 3: to the Soul's scene and to some of the things

823
00:45:14,640 --> 00:45:16,839
Speaker 3: that the Giant says, Like we haven't really talked much

824
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:19,680
Speaker 3: about his design or how he's characterized, but again, I

825
00:45:19,680 --> 00:45:22,279
Speaker 3: think all of those are things maybe better brought up

826
00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:25,919
Speaker 3: in connections with Wild Robot, because all of these things

827
00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 3: I think are influencing what Wild Robot is doing so much.

828
00:45:29,840 --> 00:45:32,319
Speaker 3: So we can hold all of that, but I think

829
00:45:32,320 --> 00:45:35,400
Speaker 3: we would regret leaving this conversation without talking about the

830
00:45:35,400 --> 00:45:36,080
Speaker 3: Superman moment.

831
00:45:36,120 --> 00:45:38,160
Speaker 7: Okay, good god. I was like, she's not wrapping up

832
00:45:38,160 --> 00:45:39,440
Speaker 7: without Superman.

833
00:45:39,080 --> 00:45:39,279
Speaker 4: Is she?

834
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:43,359
Speaker 3: So here's my question. I have theories, and I can

835
00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:45,919
Speaker 3: hold forth on this all day, but I'm gonna shut

836
00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:47,680
Speaker 3: up and see what other people have to say. Why

837
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:49,839
Speaker 3: does that moment hit as hard as it does?

838
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:50,080
Speaker 6: Like?

839
00:45:50,200 --> 00:45:53,920
Speaker 3: Why why can I still not to this day watch

840
00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:57,200
Speaker 3: that scene without tearing up? Why is it what we

841
00:45:57,239 --> 00:46:01,080
Speaker 3: all remember? Like what in this moment and the way

842
00:46:01,160 --> 00:46:04,040
Speaker 3: it's it's designed makes it hit as hard as it does.

843
00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:06,799
Speaker 3: Assuming that you share that their response, I guess you

844
00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:10,120
Speaker 3: could also just come back and say, wait what No.

845
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:12,719
Speaker 2: I think it's perfectly set up by just sort of

846
00:46:12,880 --> 00:46:15,800
Speaker 2: explaining his Superman is the whole speech about and the

847
00:46:15,840 --> 00:46:18,000
Speaker 2: whole self determination thing we've been talking about. It is

848
00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:21,239
Speaker 2: like the ultimate moment of that is like not he'ssiondized

849
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:24,280
Speaker 2: to finding who he is and at the same moment,

850
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:28,440
Speaker 2: you know, sacrificing that thing, that sort of soul he's earned.

851
00:46:28,480 --> 00:46:32,560
Speaker 2: I guess by deciding to be not a gun. Yeah,

852
00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:34,440
Speaker 2: it's a great I mean, it's a great moments, such

853
00:46:34,440 --> 00:46:35,279
Speaker 2: a great moment.

854
00:46:35,160 --> 00:46:37,919
Speaker 7: Well, A, I'm actually tearing up just talking about him

855
00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:41,919
Speaker 7: right now, right now. But I actually I think there's

856
00:46:41,960 --> 00:46:45,120
Speaker 7: a little bit of like a feedback loop at this

857
00:46:45,239 --> 00:46:49,480
Speaker 7: point of with that line, because I started like full

858
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:52,240
Speaker 7: on crying, not even tearing up, but full on crying

859
00:46:52,680 --> 00:46:55,200
Speaker 7: at that early scene where Hogarth is showing him the

860
00:46:55,239 --> 00:46:57,520
Speaker 7: Superman comic. It's like always said the word It's like

861
00:46:57,520 --> 00:47:00,520
Speaker 7: a trigger word this movie now, you know, because I

862
00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:05,720
Speaker 7: know what's coming. But like there's so like many little

863
00:47:05,760 --> 00:47:07,640
Speaker 7: pieces of it that I think you could pick apart

864
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:09,400
Speaker 7: for why it hits as hard as it does. I

865
00:47:09,440 --> 00:47:13,320
Speaker 7: think the line setting it up, like him remembering Hogarth

866
00:47:13,400 --> 00:47:15,319
Speaker 7: saying you are what you choose to be, like that

867
00:47:15,520 --> 00:47:19,279
Speaker 7: definitely kind of what's what's the sports metaphor Scott where

868
00:47:19,480 --> 00:47:22,799
Speaker 7: like it tosses it up so that the Superman can

869
00:47:22,840 --> 00:47:29,120
Speaker 7: dunk you know, sist you know yeah or elliop yeah yeah,

870
00:47:29,160 --> 00:47:30,760
Speaker 7: you are who you choose to be is the allop.

871
00:47:32,680 --> 00:47:35,120
Speaker 7: So that makes it work. And then I alluded to

872
00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:38,120
Speaker 7: it earlier, but Vin diesel Man like like this is

873
00:47:38,160 --> 00:47:41,759
Speaker 7: his his lifetime past movie for me, because I think

874
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:45,399
Speaker 7: like the voice is a huge, huge part of it,

875
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:51,959
Speaker 7: you know, like it's so perfectly chosen for this and like, yes,

876
00:47:52,040 --> 00:47:54,080
Speaker 7: we all remember that one word, but the robot has

877
00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:57,560
Speaker 7: a lot more lines than just this one, you know,

878
00:47:57,680 --> 00:48:02,080
Speaker 7: and that there's so this like soulfulness to it all

879
00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:05,759
Speaker 7: that kind of grows as the as the movie progresses,

880
00:48:06,200 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 7: and it just culminates in the utterance of that last

881
00:48:09,719 --> 00:48:14,120
Speaker 7: utterance of Superman. Like there's just like a peacefulness to

882
00:48:14,239 --> 00:48:17,640
Speaker 7: it that I think just makes it hit. And the

883
00:48:17,680 --> 00:48:19,920
Speaker 7: look on the robot's face like it's also just a

884
00:48:20,040 --> 00:48:23,440
Speaker 7: very smart piece of animation, you know, but just so

885
00:48:23,560 --> 00:48:27,440
Speaker 7: the combination of all those things, the the line setting

886
00:48:27,520 --> 00:48:31,560
Speaker 7: it up, the visual, the voice, it's just it's it's perfect.

887
00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:34,919
Speaker 7: It's perfect. And here I am crying just thinking about it.

888
00:48:36,280 --> 00:48:39,160
Speaker 2: Anything away from from I don't mean this as glibly,

889
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:41,919
Speaker 2: because I think you can be quite good, but it's

890
00:48:42,080 --> 00:48:45,480
Speaker 2: it's been Diesels performance, right, I mean, this is this

891
00:48:45,640 --> 00:48:47,040
Speaker 2: is it? Yeah?

892
00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:51,080
Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm a call be guilty kind of guy, uh myself,

893
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:55,279
Speaker 6: But people don't remember that film as well as I do.

894
00:48:55,960 --> 00:48:58,600
Speaker 6: It almost played more powerful for me now than it

895
00:48:58,640 --> 00:49:02,640
Speaker 6: did then, because I mean, since then, we've obviously seen

896
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:05,399
Speaker 6: quite a few more superhero movies since nineteen ninety nine

897
00:49:05,600 --> 00:49:09,040
Speaker 6: than at that time, and I think it's almost there's

898
00:49:09,040 --> 00:49:13,400
Speaker 6: something so primal and a reminder of exactly what the

899
00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:17,320
Speaker 6: significance of a character like that would be, the actions

900
00:49:17,360 --> 00:49:21,160
Speaker 6: that Iron Giant takes at that moment, that type of heroes, Like,

901
00:49:21,160 --> 00:49:23,960
Speaker 6: there's something so pure about it. It's kind of a

902
00:49:24,040 --> 00:49:26,759
Speaker 6: reminder of how you know, something like the Superman myth

903
00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:30,600
Speaker 6: can have that kind of a grip on you emotionally

904
00:49:31,080 --> 00:49:34,640
Speaker 6: because you know now as now you feel I think,

905
00:49:34,920 --> 00:49:36,640
Speaker 6: if anything, a little bit of a distance from it.

906
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:39,839
Speaker 3: Yeah, I just for me, I think it just kind

907
00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:42,640
Speaker 3: of comes down to the beatific expression on his face

908
00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:45,160
Speaker 3: and the way he closes his eyes as he goes

909
00:49:45,200 --> 00:49:49,560
Speaker 3: towards death and smiles like there's something, as you say,

910
00:49:49,600 --> 00:49:52,759
Speaker 3: primal about that, but there's also I don't know, like

911
00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:56,920
Speaker 3: you know what's going on internally, Like movies aren't always

912
00:49:56,960 --> 00:50:00,279
Speaker 3: the most internal medium, but in that moment, you know

913
00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:04,120
Speaker 3: exactly like where his headspace is, and it's not on

914
00:50:04,160 --> 00:50:07,160
Speaker 3: the missile in front of him. It's he's focusing on

915
00:50:07,200 --> 00:50:09,319
Speaker 3: his own soul. You know, he's focusing on what he's

916
00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:13,239
Speaker 3: learned from Hogarth and his confidence that he's going to

917
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:15,680
Speaker 3: go on which I don't think it's a confidence that

918
00:50:15,719 --> 00:50:20,239
Speaker 3: he's literally going to physically survive this encounter. I think

919
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:23,520
Speaker 3: that he's learned pretty recently that there's a part of

920
00:50:23,520 --> 00:50:28,760
Speaker 3: you that doesn't die, and he knows that that important

921
00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:32,080
Speaker 3: part will go on, and so you know, dying to

922
00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:35,640
Speaker 3: protect the people that he's come to care about. Like,

923
00:50:35,680 --> 00:50:39,440
Speaker 3: it's just it's such a compact, simple way of communicating

924
00:50:39,440 --> 00:50:42,040
Speaker 3: all of that with just a couple of words. I

925
00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:44,520
Speaker 3: think it's really well done. But I think one of

926
00:50:44,520 --> 00:50:47,400
Speaker 3: the one of the layup elements for me is the

927
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:50,520
Speaker 3: little sequence where he turns to Hogarth and says, you

928
00:50:50,560 --> 00:50:54,000
Speaker 3: know you stay, I go no following. I think the

929
00:50:54,040 --> 00:50:56,320
Speaker 3: first time I saw that, I thought, well, that's cheating.

930
00:50:56,400 --> 00:50:58,640
Speaker 3: He didn't even know English when Hogarth said all of

931
00:50:58,680 --> 00:51:01,680
Speaker 3: that to him. But watching the movie again, I think

932
00:51:01,719 --> 00:51:05,319
Speaker 3: it's really evident that communication took him a while, but

933
00:51:05,480 --> 00:51:08,200
Speaker 3: like from the very start he understood a lot more

934
00:51:08,239 --> 00:51:11,560
Speaker 3: than we expected, Like the fact that he recognized that

935
00:51:11,600 --> 00:51:16,640
Speaker 3: Hogarth risked danger to save him, and that the gigantic

936
00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:22,840
Speaker 3: external off switch that all power plants have was the

937
00:51:22,960 --> 00:51:26,960
Speaker 3: key to that. Like the fact that you know before

938
00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:30,359
Speaker 3: he seems to have many words that he could actually vocalize.

939
00:51:30,800 --> 00:51:35,040
Speaker 3: He was very clearly taking in, like Hogarth's, things that

940
00:51:35,040 --> 00:51:38,920
Speaker 3: Hogarth said to him and responding to them and carrying

941
00:51:38,960 --> 00:51:43,880
Speaker 3: them out. And I think maybe just the understanding that,

942
00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:47,200
Speaker 3: like even back then, before he could really talk, he

943
00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:50,359
Speaker 3: was already learning from Hogarth, he was already taking things

944
00:51:50,440 --> 00:51:54,840
Speaker 3: in and processing them is actually more touching than I

945
00:51:54,920 --> 00:51:57,680
Speaker 3: realized the first time I saw this movie. I don't know,

946
00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:01,760
Speaker 3: it's just it's pretty perfect. It's pretty smoothly done from

947
00:52:02,320 --> 00:52:05,120
Speaker 3: a narrative perspective, from a scripting perspective, and from a

948
00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:06,239
Speaker 3: performance perspective.

949
00:52:06,520 --> 00:52:10,120
Speaker 7: Is there anything any of you don't like about this movie? Like,

950
00:52:10,320 --> 00:52:13,239
Speaker 7: because this is like a like pretty perfect movie for me.

951
00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:16,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's it's one of I mean, and we've

952
00:52:16,480 --> 00:52:20,000
Speaker 2: probably done movies I think are better movies, but but

953
00:52:20,040 --> 00:52:23,520
Speaker 2: there's there's does not give you a lot too, but not.

954
00:52:22,840 --> 00:52:25,759
Speaker 7: Not as far as like achieving sets out to do.

955
00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:28,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I mean, this is this is a wonderful movie.

956
00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:31,320
Speaker 2: I'm really I've loved it since it was first in theaters.

957
00:52:31,320 --> 00:52:33,400
Speaker 2: I think I saw it twice when it was in theaters,

958
00:52:33,960 --> 00:52:37,120
Speaker 2: and it was bummed that more people didn't but I've

959
00:52:37,120 --> 00:52:40,920
Speaker 2: been happy to see it get a second life. I

960
00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:43,360
Speaker 2: mean I was able to see it with my daughter

961
00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:44,880
Speaker 2: at the music Box when it kind of got a

962
00:52:44,920 --> 00:52:47,520
Speaker 2: little revival before it came out on Blu Ray, I believe,

963
00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:50,200
Speaker 2: And uh yeah, no, it's it's it's it's lived on,

964
00:52:50,360 --> 00:52:52,279
Speaker 2: It's it's it's one of those movies. It's like, maybe

965
00:52:52,280 --> 00:52:54,120
Speaker 2: he didn't find its audience the first time around, but boy,

966
00:52:54,200 --> 00:52:56,400
Speaker 2: I think that audience just keeps growing and growing. And

967
00:52:56,800 --> 00:53:00,239
Speaker 2: also he wonderfully turns up and a ready Player one

968
00:53:00,320 --> 00:53:04,319
Speaker 2: is a badass weapon, just like just like he is

969
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:05,279
Speaker 2: in this movie. Right.

970
00:53:08,200 --> 00:53:11,080
Speaker 3: I am one hundred percent fine with that, because to me,

971
00:53:11,440 --> 00:53:14,439
Speaker 3: that appearance is just kind of a commentary on how

972
00:53:14,880 --> 00:53:19,040
Speaker 3: fandom kind of ruins everything no picks things up and

973
00:53:19,080 --> 00:53:22,759
Speaker 3: mischaracterize the stuff. One thousand percent makes sense to me

974
00:53:22,880 --> 00:53:25,759
Speaker 3: that somebody that grew up with this movie and loved it,

975
00:53:25,880 --> 00:53:29,200
Speaker 3: like for all the reasons Bradbird intended, would also just

976
00:53:29,239 --> 00:53:31,600
Speaker 3: be like, oh, hey, what if I made an avatar

977
00:53:31,640 --> 00:53:33,799
Speaker 3: out of this and he was totally badass because he's

978
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:36,400
Speaker 3: like a giant shocking machine weapon.

979
00:53:36,800 --> 00:53:39,080
Speaker 2: Not I don't want to go off topic, especially as

980
00:53:39,080 --> 00:53:40,880
Speaker 2: we're wanting down. But yeah, I wish there was just

981
00:53:41,160 --> 00:53:43,680
Speaker 2: with that movie. If that element was a little bit

982
00:53:43,680 --> 00:53:46,120
Speaker 2: more less beneath the surface, I think I would have

983
00:53:46,160 --> 00:53:47,640
Speaker 2: been more on board with that.

984
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:50,239
Speaker 3: I mean, I guess take it as a sign that

985
00:53:50,280 --> 00:53:53,080
Speaker 3: this movie has had a very strong pop cultural impact

986
00:53:53,160 --> 00:53:55,719
Speaker 3: on a lot of people, which is a kind of

987
00:53:55,800 --> 00:54:00,200
Speaker 3: pretty neat given you know how many movies these days

988
00:54:00,880 --> 00:54:06,000
Speaker 3: start off with like a basically unseen, unrecognized week in theaters,

989
00:54:06,400 --> 00:54:08,600
Speaker 3: you know, don't don't get any attention, don't make back

990
00:54:08,640 --> 00:54:13,360
Speaker 3: their money, are derided as flops, and then go on

991
00:54:13,400 --> 00:54:16,440
Speaker 3: to have like this kind of like lasting memorable cultural impact.

992
00:54:16,800 --> 00:54:19,960
Speaker 3: It's just movies come and go so quickly these days,

993
00:54:20,440 --> 00:54:23,760
Speaker 3: and seeing how this movie has like found its audience

994
00:54:23,800 --> 00:54:27,600
Speaker 3: and cultural cachet over time, I think is maybe just

995
00:54:27,640 --> 00:54:30,319
Speaker 3: a very satisfying thing. So I don't know if we're

996
00:54:30,320 --> 00:54:32,640
Speaker 3: going to see the same thing from Wild Robot, which

997
00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:35,680
Speaker 3: is you know, currently tearing up the movie theater making

998
00:54:35,719 --> 00:54:37,799
Speaker 3: a ton of money. I just I don't know if

999
00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:39,520
Speaker 3: it's going to last in the same kind of way.

1000
00:54:39,800 --> 00:54:42,760
Speaker 3: So that's going to be something to talk about next week.

1001
00:54:43,080 --> 00:54:45,480
Speaker 3: But first we're going to take a break for feedback.

1002
00:54:55,600 --> 00:54:57,799
Speaker 3: Now it's time for feedback, but before we get to it,

1003
00:54:57,800 --> 00:54:59,440
Speaker 3: we want to give a shout out to Film Spotting,

1004
00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:02,760
Speaker 3: the next Pitch Your Show's Mothership podcast, hosted by Adam

1005
00:55:02,800 --> 00:55:05,759
Speaker 3: Kampenar and Josh Larson. As we record this, Adam and

1006
00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:08,320
Speaker 3: Josh just released a look back at the Shawshank Redemption

1007
00:55:08,440 --> 00:55:11,440
Speaker 3: thirty years after its release, and a breakdown of Francis

1008
00:55:11,440 --> 00:55:14,560
Speaker 3: Ford Coppola's Megalopolis, which I cannot wait to hear in

1009
00:55:14,560 --> 00:55:16,600
Speaker 3: the hopes that they'll help me parse through the parts

1010
00:55:16,600 --> 00:55:19,120
Speaker 3: of that movie that I found just baffling. Who here

1011
00:55:19,160 --> 00:55:20,320
Speaker 3: has seen it at this point?

1012
00:55:20,560 --> 00:55:22,359
Speaker 2: I need eying it out to see it?

1013
00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:25,759
Speaker 6: Just me, Tasha, I can, well have you? Have you

1014
00:55:25,800 --> 00:55:28,160
Speaker 6: got an hour? Let's let's go. Let's go over it.

1015
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:32,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's just it. This this does not seem like

1016
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:36,239
Speaker 3: an easy or quick movie to discuss. I'm looking forward

1017
00:55:36,280 --> 00:55:38,800
Speaker 3: to how Adam and Josh parsed through it because I've

1018
00:55:38,840 --> 00:55:43,279
Speaker 3: found them very useful in the past in honing in

1019
00:55:43,360 --> 00:55:47,279
Speaker 3: on like a few sharp, smart topics, like ways of

1020
00:55:47,719 --> 00:55:51,719
Speaker 3: discussing big, sprawling movies. Anatomy of a Fall comes to

1021
00:55:51,760 --> 00:55:54,760
Speaker 3: mind in terms of I think a much better movie

1022
00:55:54,800 --> 00:55:58,800
Speaker 3: than Megalopolis is certainly a much more kind of breaks

1023
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:02,120
Speaker 3: across what it's actually trying to do movie, but I'm

1024
00:56:02,160 --> 00:56:03,440
Speaker 3: looking forward to their take on it.

1025
00:56:03,480 --> 00:56:04,359
Speaker 6: They're good at what they do.

1026
00:56:05,120 --> 00:56:07,720
Speaker 3: As for feedback, here's one from our listener Pete about

1027
00:56:07,719 --> 00:56:10,480
Speaker 3: our last pairing, focusing in on how the Savages treats

1028
00:56:10,560 --> 00:56:13,480
Speaker 3: caregivers and the elderly. This was a long one. We

1029
00:56:13,640 --> 00:56:16,000
Speaker 3: edited it somewhat for length to get to more of

1030
00:56:16,000 --> 00:56:18,040
Speaker 3: the ideas that Pete's laying out, but it's still on

1031
00:56:18,080 --> 00:56:20,279
Speaker 3: the longside. Genevieve, could you read this one for us?

1032
00:56:20,600 --> 00:56:22,880
Speaker 7: Sure? I was struck by how differently I reacted to

1033
00:56:22,880 --> 00:56:25,960
Speaker 7: Tasha's view of the opening scene with David Ziaz's Eduardo,

1034
00:56:26,080 --> 00:56:28,880
Speaker 7: the home healthcare professional handling Lenny, a man not yet

1035
00:56:28,960 --> 00:56:32,000
Speaker 7: being treated for dementia. Tasha felt that the scene showed

1036
00:56:32,000 --> 00:56:34,480
Speaker 7: a small character getting some real shading to them, and

1037
00:56:34,520 --> 00:56:36,480
Speaker 7: I agree with that. But where she saw a healthcare

1038
00:56:36,560 --> 00:56:39,080
Speaker 7: worker trying to do their job while retaining some respect

1039
00:56:39,120 --> 00:56:42,799
Speaker 7: and preserving professional boundaries, I saw elder abuse. That made

1040
00:56:42,840 --> 00:56:45,320
Speaker 7: me keep a careful eye on Lenny throughout the movie.

1041
00:56:45,480 --> 00:56:47,959
Speaker 7: The unflushed poop in the toilet is obviously the last

1042
00:56:47,960 --> 00:56:51,160
Speaker 7: straw for Eduardo. Their relationship clearly strained to the point

1043
00:56:51,200 --> 00:56:53,800
Speaker 7: that they are both ready to argue over well bullshit.

1044
00:56:54,120 --> 00:56:56,439
Speaker 7: But Eduardo's solution is to take a grow man's food

1045
00:56:56,480 --> 00:56:58,239
Speaker 7: from him and put it in the fridge, saying he

1046
00:56:58,280 --> 00:57:00,400
Speaker 7: can't get his wheat checks back until he flush is

1047
00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:02,719
Speaker 7: the toilet, however, much of a pain in the ass

1048
00:57:02,760 --> 00:57:05,200
Speaker 7: Lenny is, and no matter how well Eduardo takes care

1049
00:57:05,200 --> 00:57:09,080
Speaker 7: of Lenny's girlfriend, Lenny doesn't deserve to be disrespected so brazenly.

1050
00:57:09,840 --> 00:57:12,239
Speaker 7: I didn't think it was tactful gamesmanship at all. It

1051
00:57:12,280 --> 00:57:15,000
Speaker 7: was just plain cruel in the most everyday believable way.

1052
00:57:15,440 --> 00:57:18,280
Speaker 7: I hope Duardo reflected on his actions while scrubbing shit

1053
00:57:18,320 --> 00:57:20,720
Speaker 7: off the wall, but the reality is he likely left

1054
00:57:20,760 --> 00:57:23,000
Speaker 7: out details and a call to his manager and held

1055
00:57:23,040 --> 00:57:25,440
Speaker 7: firm in his assertion that he is not a housekeeper.

1056
00:57:25,520 --> 00:57:27,880
Speaker 7: The shit's staying there in the old couple's house, stinking

1057
00:57:27,880 --> 00:57:30,040
Speaker 7: it up until one of the girlfriend's kids cleaned it

1058
00:57:30,120 --> 00:57:32,840
Speaker 7: up or paid someone else to Lenny's life, as we

1059
00:57:32,880 --> 00:57:35,960
Speaker 7: witness it is a series of every day indignities and humiliations.

1060
00:57:36,400 --> 00:57:38,360
Speaker 7: The way he has no say in where he lives.

1061
00:57:38,480 --> 00:57:40,440
Speaker 7: The scene of them loading him onto the plane like

1062
00:57:40,480 --> 00:57:43,080
Speaker 7: he's luggage to be dealt with, Then for everyone on

1063
00:57:43,120 --> 00:57:45,120
Speaker 7: the plane seeing him in a diaper and making a

1064
00:57:45,160 --> 00:57:48,920
Speaker 7: scene after there's a misunderstanding with his suspenders. It's heartbreaking stuff.

1065
00:57:49,400 --> 00:57:51,720
Speaker 7: His own daughter making him use way too much energy

1066
00:57:51,760 --> 00:57:54,280
Speaker 7: to get into a better nursing home without checking with

1067
00:57:54,360 --> 00:57:56,720
Speaker 7: him first if he even wants to move. Hell, his

1068
00:57:56,840 --> 00:57:58,720
Speaker 7: daughter not listening to him when he says he's not

1069
00:57:58,760 --> 00:58:01,200
Speaker 7: comfortable in bed, that no, he doesn't want his stupid

1070
00:58:01,240 --> 00:58:04,720
Speaker 7: red pillow. This is Michael Hannikey's stuff, Las Montreer's stuff,

1071
00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:07,840
Speaker 7: and all the laps and compelling performances and doggy redemptions

1072
00:58:07,840 --> 00:58:10,200
Speaker 7: couldn't cover up that a man is dying while wishing

1073
00:58:10,240 --> 00:58:12,560
Speaker 7: he was dead throughout most of this film. This is

1074
00:58:12,560 --> 00:58:15,960
Speaker 7: a wonderful film, filled with great performances, keen observations, and

1075
00:58:16,040 --> 00:58:19,080
Speaker 7: laughs both joyous and perverse. A film that avoids, as

1076
00:58:19,120 --> 00:58:22,640
Speaker 7: you all pointed out, typical Catharsism melodrama, but still leaves

1077
00:58:22,680 --> 00:58:24,960
Speaker 7: us feeling full and rewarded at the end. But what

1078
00:58:25,080 --> 00:58:27,880
Speaker 7: it has to say about the reality of old age infirmity,

1079
00:58:27,960 --> 00:58:30,720
Speaker 7: about an adult being treated as an ugly Unwanted Baby.

1080
00:58:30,960 --> 00:58:33,080
Speaker 7: That is what was truly savage about this film.

1081
00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:35,640
Speaker 3: Good letter, Yeah, I mean I sign off on all

1082
00:58:35,680 --> 00:58:39,040
Speaker 3: of this. I certainly did not do not remember suggesting

1083
00:58:39,040 --> 00:58:46,880
Speaker 3: that Eduardo's behavior is tactful, gamesmanship or justified. I definitely

1084
00:58:46,920 --> 00:58:49,760
Speaker 3: agree that he did not clean off that wall, and

1085
00:58:49,960 --> 00:58:51,720
Speaker 3: I'm not sure that I believe that he should have

1086
00:58:51,800 --> 00:58:54,680
Speaker 3: to clean off that wall. You know, his point is

1087
00:58:54,840 --> 00:58:58,880
Speaker 3: expressly that he is not there to take care of Lenny.

1088
00:58:58,920 --> 00:59:01,320
Speaker 3: He's not being paid to take Carovlin, and he's certainly

1089
00:59:01,360 --> 00:59:04,920
Speaker 3: not being paid to literally deal with his shit. But

1090
00:59:05,920 --> 00:59:07,480
Speaker 3: I don't know. I mean, I think you can. I

1091
00:59:07,480 --> 00:59:10,280
Speaker 3: think it can be a richer characterization than I was

1092
00:59:10,320 --> 00:59:14,880
Speaker 3: expecting from that character. And you know, just him kind

1093
00:59:14,880 --> 00:59:18,280
Speaker 3: of taking more of ownership of his position in the

1094
00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:22,680
Speaker 3: house and you know, defining his duties and not being

1095
00:59:22,760 --> 00:59:27,480
Speaker 3: lured into like literally cleaning up the poop of somebody

1096
00:59:27,480 --> 00:59:29,240
Speaker 3: who's not being paid to clean up the poop of

1097
00:59:29,920 --> 00:59:33,400
Speaker 3: That doesn't mean that, you know, it's it's not elder abuse.

1098
00:59:33,440 --> 00:59:36,120
Speaker 3: I think one of the things that's complex and interesting

1099
00:59:36,200 --> 00:59:40,200
Speaker 3: here is both of these movies are kind of dealing

1100
00:59:40,200 --> 00:59:43,320
Speaker 3: with situations where there are no good solutions, you know,

1101
00:59:43,440 --> 00:59:47,880
Speaker 3: the good solution is not, my father needs a diaper,

1102
00:59:47,920 --> 00:59:49,840
Speaker 3: but I want him to have dignity, so like we

1103
00:59:49,880 --> 00:59:54,720
Speaker 3: won't address his bathroom issues. The solution is not let's

1104
00:59:54,920 --> 00:59:57,560
Speaker 3: quietly clean up after the man who's smearing shit on

1105
00:59:57,600 --> 01:00:01,600
Speaker 3: the walls. There is no per solution to any of

1106
01:00:01,600 --> 01:00:04,280
Speaker 3: the things that these characters are facing, and I think

1107
01:00:04,280 --> 01:00:07,360
Speaker 3: that's what makes it painful and what makes us like

1108
01:00:07,480 --> 01:00:10,640
Speaker 3: look for the dark humor in all of it, you know,

1109
01:00:10,680 --> 01:00:13,480
Speaker 3: because you've got to find something somewhere when you're dealing

1110
01:00:13,520 --> 01:00:17,280
Speaker 3: with situations that just kind of suck equally for everybody.

1111
01:00:17,520 --> 01:00:21,000
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, I mean, the film allows the flaws

1112
01:00:21,040 --> 01:00:25,080
Speaker 6: of all of its characters to be exposed, making them

1113
01:00:25,240 --> 01:00:27,360
Speaker 6: more human. And I think I think, you know, with

1114
01:00:27,400 --> 01:00:31,120
Speaker 6: regard to Lenny in particular, there is sort of the

1115
01:00:31,160 --> 01:00:35,800
Speaker 6: background of how little good will he has built up,

1116
01:00:35,960 --> 01:00:38,600
Speaker 6: you know, I'm sure in whatever time however lucid or

1117
01:00:38,640 --> 01:00:41,320
Speaker 6: not lucid he was in his time with Eduardo, there's

1118
01:00:41,400 --> 01:00:43,600
Speaker 6: a lot of background of that not being a very

1119
01:00:43,640 --> 01:00:48,080
Speaker 6: good relationship to that point. And certainly, you know, with

1120
01:00:48,160 --> 01:00:51,240
Speaker 6: his his grown kids from whom he's estranged and now

1121
01:00:51,480 --> 01:00:53,840
Speaker 6: have to deal with you know, how to treat him

1122
01:00:53,840 --> 01:00:56,480
Speaker 6: at this stage of his life. You know, they carry

1123
01:00:56,560 --> 01:01:02,120
Speaker 6: those feelings of ambivalence or outright disdain with them and

1124
01:01:02,640 --> 01:01:04,800
Speaker 6: the decisions that they end up making on his behalf,

1125
01:01:05,040 --> 01:01:06,680
Speaker 6: you know, as much as they try to carry a

1126
01:01:06,680 --> 01:01:10,680
Speaker 6: certain amount of good intentions as well. So the film

1127
01:01:10,760 --> 01:01:12,600
Speaker 6: is dealing with all those complications. But I do think

1128
01:01:12,640 --> 01:01:17,240
Speaker 6: this is a very good letter, and I think it's

1129
01:01:17,280 --> 01:01:19,240
Speaker 6: an angle of the film we're thinking about really just

1130
01:01:19,320 --> 01:01:23,720
Speaker 6: kind of paying attention to the film through Lenny's perspective,

1131
01:01:23,800 --> 01:01:27,240
Speaker 6: like keeping an eye on him as as Pete does here.

1132
01:01:27,280 --> 01:01:29,720
Speaker 6: I think it's an interesting take on the movie.

1133
01:01:30,080 --> 01:01:32,360
Speaker 3: Well, we always appreciate when our listeners share their thoughts

1134
01:01:32,360 --> 01:01:35,040
Speaker 3: and their recommendations. If you feel so inclined, we can

1135
01:01:35,080 --> 01:01:37,800
Speaker 3: feature your response on a future episode. To reach us,

1136
01:01:37,800 --> 01:01:39,680
Speaker 3: you can leave a short voicemail at seven seven three

1137
01:01:40,080 --> 01:01:43,080
Speaker 3: two three four nine seven three zero, or send us

1138
01:01:43,080 --> 01:01:45,680
Speaker 3: a voice memo or email us at comments at Next

1139
01:01:45,680 --> 01:01:53,120
Speaker 3: Picture Show dot net. That's it for this episode of

1140
01:01:53,160 --> 01:01:55,440
Speaker 3: the Next Picture Show. In our next episode, we'll talk

1141
01:01:55,440 --> 01:01:57,920
Speaker 3: about the Wild Robot and before bringing the Iron Giant

1142
01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:00,960
Speaker 3: back into the discussion. Look for that uppisode next Tuesday.

1143
01:02:00,960 --> 01:02:03,720
Speaker 3: On your podcast of choice. For add free versions of

1144
01:02:03,720 --> 01:02:06,600
Speaker 3: the podcast and extra content, find us on Patreon at

1145
01:02:06,640 --> 01:02:09,600
Speaker 3: patreon dot com slash Next Picture Show. You can find

1146
01:02:09,680 --> 01:02:11,920
Speaker 3: us at next pictureshow dot net and on Blue Sky

1147
01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:13,840
Speaker 3: at the Next Picture Show. If you want to keep

1148
01:02:13,880 --> 01:02:17,280
Speaker 3: track of when new episodes drop until next week, look,

1149
01:02:17,560 --> 01:02:20,280
Speaker 3: just do your stupid homework, Okay, then you can move

1150
01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:22,920
Speaker 3: up a grade and get pounded too with all that

1151
01:02:22,920 --> 01:02:23,520
Speaker 3: that implies