1 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:09,320 Speaker 1: Welcome to Before Breakfast, a production of iHeartRadio. Good Morning, 2 00:00:09,680 --> 00:00:14,200 Speaker 1: This is Laura. Welcome to the Before Breakfast podcast. Today's 3 00:00:14,240 --> 00:00:16,720 Speaker 1: episode is going to be a longer one part of 4 00:00:16,720 --> 00:00:20,040 Speaker 1: the series where I interview fascinating people about how they 5 00:00:20,079 --> 00:00:22,919 Speaker 1: take their days from great to awesome and any advice 6 00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:25,360 Speaker 1: they have for the rest of us. Today, I am 7 00:00:25,400 --> 00:00:28,560 Speaker 1: delighted to welcome Jenny Wood to the show. Jenny is 8 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:30,800 Speaker 1: a career expert and the author of the brand new 9 00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:32,040 Speaker 1: book Wild Courage. 10 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:33,640 Speaker 2: So, Jenny, welcome to the show. 11 00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: Thanks so much for having me. Laura excited to have 12 00:00:36,520 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 1: you here. So yeah, tell our listeners a little bit 13 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:39,120 Speaker 1: about yourself. 14 00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 3: Well, I'm in Boulder, Colorado. I've got two kids who 15 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:46,159 Speaker 3: are seven and nine. I spent eighteen years at Google, 16 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:49,280 Speaker 3: growing from entry level to executive, and I recently left 17 00:00:49,320 --> 00:00:51,800 Speaker 3: to work on this book full time. It came out 18 00:00:52,080 --> 00:00:54,840 Speaker 3: not too long ago, hit the New York Times bestseller list, 19 00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:57,720 Speaker 3: which is so exciting, so awesome, and I have a 20 00:00:57,760 --> 00:01:00,680 Speaker 3: goal to spread insane amounts of Wild Care into the 21 00:01:00,680 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 3: world so that everybody can make their days go from 22 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:03,600 Speaker 3: great to awesome. 23 00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:08,080 Speaker 1: Heay, well, then we're all about that there, So well, 24 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:11,000 Speaker 1: what are the ways that you kind of burst onto 25 00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:14,959 Speaker 1: the scene a few years ago is a famous story 26 00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 1: of how you met your husband that this went a 27 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:22,000 Speaker 1: bit viral. Maybe you can tell our listeners about that. 28 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:22,520 Speaker 4: Yeah. 29 00:01:22,520 --> 00:01:25,440 Speaker 3: Well, it's twenty eleven and I'm riding the New York 30 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:27,600 Speaker 3: City subway home from work when about twenty feet away 31 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:30,520 Speaker 3: from me stands this really good looking guy, gorgeous blue eyes, 32 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:32,959 Speaker 3: thick brown wavy hair. And even though I want to 33 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:35,039 Speaker 3: go up and talk to him, something holds me back. 34 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:37,880 Speaker 3: What if he's a convicted fella, what if he's married? 35 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:39,800 Speaker 3: What if a hundred people stare at me on this 36 00:01:39,880 --> 00:01:42,839 Speaker 3: packed train? Well, I later came to realize that underneath 37 00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 3: those questions were fears that hold so many people back, 38 00:01:45,560 --> 00:01:47,520 Speaker 3: because they're the same fears that held me back so 39 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 3: much in life. Fear of uncertainty, fear of failure, and 40 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:53,720 Speaker 3: most importantly, fear of judgment of others. So I sit there, 41 00:01:53,760 --> 00:01:56,080 Speaker 3: I do nothing as the train passes stop after stop 42 00:01:56,120 --> 00:01:58,880 Speaker 3: after stop, and life passes me by. But I'm still 43 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:00,640 Speaker 3: so taken by him. So and make a deal with 44 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:02,639 Speaker 3: the universe. I say, if he gets off at my stop, 45 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:04,840 Speaker 3: then I'll try to strike up a conversation with him, 46 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:07,400 Speaker 3: and if not, then se LEVI. Well, he gets off 47 00:02:07,400 --> 00:02:09,480 Speaker 3: at the next stop, which was not my stop, and 48 00:02:09,520 --> 00:02:12,880 Speaker 3: I say, I like slump down in my chair so disappointed. 49 00:02:12,919 --> 00:02:14,160 Speaker 4: And then all of a sudden, this. 50 00:02:14,200 --> 00:02:19,079 Speaker 3: Wave of wild courage like washes over me and practically 51 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:22,200 Speaker 3: pushes me out of my subway seat and off the train. 52 00:02:22,440 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 3: So I chase after him, tap him on the shoulder. 53 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:27,519 Speaker 3: I say, excuse me, I'm sorry to bother you. You're 54 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:29,960 Speaker 3: wearing gloves, so I can't tell if you're wearing a 55 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:32,440 Speaker 3: wedding ring. But in the event that you're not married, 56 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:34,320 Speaker 3: you were on my subway and I thought you were cute. 57 00:02:34,360 --> 00:02:36,720 Speaker 3: Any chance I could give you my business card? Then 58 00:02:36,720 --> 00:02:39,200 Speaker 3: I wait for what feels like forever, thinking this was 59 00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:43,080 Speaker 3: a terrible idea. But he takes the card, calls the 60 00:02:43,080 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 3: next day, asks me on a date a week later, 61 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:47,960 Speaker 3: and then three years later we get married. We've now 62 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:52,000 Speaker 3: been married eleven years happily. So wild courage, you know, 63 00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:54,519 Speaker 3: changed my life in that moment, and then I started 64 00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 3: using it as a habit professionally throughout my days to 65 00:02:57,320 --> 00:02:58,280 Speaker 3: be more productive, etc. 66 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, it is exciting. 67 00:03:00,600 --> 00:03:03,480 Speaker 1: I mean sometimes the things that we get inspired to 68 00:03:03,520 --> 00:03:07,840 Speaker 1: do just have I mean repercussions like you couldn't even imagine. 69 00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:10,120 Speaker 1: But what's interesting about the story. Of course you were 70 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 1: telling this story from the place where it worked. 71 00:03:13,240 --> 00:03:15,280 Speaker 4: Yeah, totally. And you talk a. 72 00:03:15,280 --> 00:03:17,760 Speaker 1: Little bit in your book about this, Right, we see 73 00:03:17,760 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 1: I think the phrases, we see everything differently in the 74 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:22,400 Speaker 1: context of success. So let's talk about it because I 75 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:24,520 Speaker 1: think it's very important for people to realize that and 76 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:25,720 Speaker 1: how they're hearing stories. 77 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:27,200 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's so. 78 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:29,480 Speaker 3: Interesting you bring that up. It's like survivorship bias. Right, 79 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:31,160 Speaker 3: so it's like, well it all worked out. Of course, 80 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 3: you can go out and tell people to have wild courage, 81 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:38,080 Speaker 3: but the reality is like our failures fuel that success, right, 82 00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:39,680 Speaker 3: you know, if you want to double your success as 83 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:43,680 Speaker 3: quadruple your failures. And wild Courage covers nine traits that 84 00:03:43,720 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 3: create the bars of an invisible cage that keep you small. 85 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:49,040 Speaker 3: And I'm encouraging people to reclaim these nine traits. Those 86 00:03:49,160 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 3: nine traits are weird, selfish, shameless, obsessed, nosy, manipulative, brutal, reckless, 87 00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 3: and bossy. And I think the move on that subway 88 00:03:57,360 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 3: that day was reckless, right, reckless, redefine And my new 89 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:04,360 Speaker 3: words is the courage to take intelligent risk, to err 90 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:06,160 Speaker 3: on the side of action. Better to learn from your 91 00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:09,440 Speaker 3: mistakes than waste time predicting the consequences of every decision. 92 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 3: Think fast and fearless, and if you're on the fence, 93 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:13,480 Speaker 3: do it. But you bring up the good point of like, Okay, 94 00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:15,480 Speaker 3: it worked out for you that day, but what about 95 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:18,039 Speaker 3: what it doesn't. The reason I advocate for it anyway 96 00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:21,560 Speaker 3: is because those risks, those little mini risks, those moments 97 00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:24,679 Speaker 3: of recklessness, as I call it, help build the building 98 00:04:24,680 --> 00:04:27,839 Speaker 3: blocks of something great in the future, because it's it's 99 00:04:27,880 --> 00:04:31,000 Speaker 3: it's building that muscle to ask the uncomfortable question, to 100 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 3: ask your boss for a race, to ask the client 101 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:35,640 Speaker 3: you know, for an upsell, to ask a friend in 102 00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 3: a new city to go out to coffee. 103 00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:38,720 Speaker 4: I've had so. 104 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:41,760 Speaker 3: Many failures, especially since leaving Google and being an entrepreneur. 105 00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:45,239 Speaker 3: I had, you know, I wanted all these fellow authors 106 00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 3: and influencers to support the book, and a lot of 107 00:04:47,320 --> 00:04:51,039 Speaker 3: them said yes. But I got so many ghosting responds 108 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:52,960 Speaker 3: or so many non responses right, and I got one 109 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:55,960 Speaker 3: from a really, really well known author that everybody would 110 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:58,880 Speaker 3: know this person's name, that was not just a no 111 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 3: I'm not going to support it with my audience, but 112 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:04,240 Speaker 3: a blatant this is the end of our friendship and 113 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:07,680 Speaker 3: my mentorship with you, Jenny, because I don't think you know, 114 00:05:07,760 --> 00:05:10,440 Speaker 3: I'm offended that you asked, basically, and it was really 115 00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:13,159 Speaker 3: hard to stomach that rejection that like, flat out not 116 00:05:13,240 --> 00:05:15,560 Speaker 3: just rejection, I'm not going to support you know, the 117 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:17,760 Speaker 3: book and with my audience, but just like and this 118 00:05:17,920 --> 00:05:20,560 Speaker 3: is the end of our relationship. And so that's a 119 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:23,839 Speaker 3: perfect example of Yes. Sometimes you take that risk, you jump, 120 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:25,640 Speaker 3: you run off the subway, you ask for the raise, 121 00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:28,520 Speaker 3: you ask for the client partnership, and you get told 122 00:05:28,520 --> 00:05:32,200 Speaker 3: to flat out no, But you still keep going because 123 00:05:32,880 --> 00:05:34,640 Speaker 3: there were the hundreds of people who said yes with 124 00:05:34,760 --> 00:05:37,200 Speaker 3: massive audience, you know, millions of people in their audience. 125 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:40,080 Speaker 3: And so if I hadn't had the boldness, the wild 126 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:41,840 Speaker 3: courage to ask that person who happened to say no, 127 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:43,920 Speaker 3: it means I wouldn't have had the same courage to ask. 128 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:45,560 Speaker 4: The other people who did help me. And it's that 129 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 4: muscle that you just have. 130 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:48,320 Speaker 3: To build over and over and over again. Even though 131 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:50,480 Speaker 3: sometimes you are going to fail. You are going to 132 00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:52,359 Speaker 3: feel rejected, you are going to feel disappointed, you are 133 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:54,080 Speaker 3: going to feel depressed, which I did feel all of 134 00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:55,200 Speaker 3: those things when that happened. 135 00:05:55,240 --> 00:05:56,960 Speaker 4: But it's the marker of a leader when you can 136 00:05:57,000 --> 00:05:57,839 Speaker 4: do that and keep going. 137 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:01,440 Speaker 1: Yeah that you realize a lot of times the response 138 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:04,920 Speaker 1: eventually to this, you know, discouragement, rejection. 139 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 2: All that is like, oh well yeah. 140 00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:09,719 Speaker 1: I mean, if the guy on the subway had been like, yeah, dude, 141 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:12,279 Speaker 1: not not doing it, you'd been like, Okay, next guy, 142 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:13,160 Speaker 1: you know, move on. 143 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:15,400 Speaker 3: That's the thing, is, like, of those three fears that 144 00:06:15,440 --> 00:06:18,520 Speaker 3: I help people push through with wild courage, fear of uncertainty, 145 00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:20,880 Speaker 3: fear of failure, fear of judgment of others, the one 146 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 3: that happens to plague me the most is fear of uncertainty. 147 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:25,960 Speaker 3: So I would have rather run off the subway and 148 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:27,760 Speaker 3: asked that guy and had him tell me a flat 149 00:06:27,800 --> 00:06:30,880 Speaker 3: out no, then leave an uncertainty the rest of my 150 00:06:30,920 --> 00:06:32,960 Speaker 3: life thinking what could have been. In fact, it's kind 151 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:34,600 Speaker 3: of a win win if he said no, I'm married. 152 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:36,520 Speaker 3: He gets to go home to his wife and kids 153 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:39,600 Speaker 3: and be like, I still got it, honey, I tell you, 154 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:40,480 Speaker 3: and I. 155 00:06:40,440 --> 00:06:41,159 Speaker 4: Have my answer. 156 00:06:41,240 --> 00:06:44,599 Speaker 3: It's like okay, no, no, nothing nothing venture, nothing lost. 157 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:47,080 Speaker 4: So you bring up a really good point, Laura. 158 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:50,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, No, I've always said that with like I 159 00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 1: mean public speaking. I do a reasonable amount of it, 160 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:54,400 Speaker 1: and at the beginning is like it's a little bit, 161 00:06:54,520 --> 00:06:57,040 Speaker 1: you know, nerve wracking to get up in front of people. 162 00:06:57,279 --> 00:06:59,279 Speaker 1: And then you do enough of it and you realize 163 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 1: some go great, some are fine, some go wrong, often 164 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:04,599 Speaker 1: for things. 165 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:05,680 Speaker 2: That have nothing to do with you. 166 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:08,040 Speaker 1: I mean they just announced like huge cost cutting right 167 00:07:08,080 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 1: before you got up on stage. 168 00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:10,480 Speaker 2: You know, it's a little. 169 00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:12,880 Speaker 1: Different than if like the boss is giving out iPads 170 00:07:12,920 --> 00:07:14,840 Speaker 1: right before you go on stage, Like the energy's a 171 00:07:14,880 --> 00:07:16,720 Speaker 1: little different now the has nothing to do with you. 172 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:19,680 Speaker 2: And but you learn, oh well, you know that one bombed. 173 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:21,880 Speaker 3: Oh well, you know, and think about how much you learn, 174 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:24,120 Speaker 3: Like my entire business is keynote speaking now and I 175 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:27,400 Speaker 3: completely understand what you're saying, And think about how much 176 00:07:27,400 --> 00:07:29,560 Speaker 3: you learn from the ones that don't go well, Like 177 00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:31,600 Speaker 3: I made a huge mistake and a keynote a couple 178 00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:34,400 Speaker 3: of weeks ago, and I asked for a confidence monitor 179 00:07:34,440 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 3: so I could see we slide was coming next, and 180 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 3: then they like reluctantly put it there. 181 00:07:38,040 --> 00:07:39,680 Speaker 4: But then I later found out. 182 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 3: Like that was a five hundred dollars cost to us, Jenny, 183 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:43,200 Speaker 3: so we wish we had known about that ahead of time. 184 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:45,080 Speaker 3: And I was like, oh my gosh, but like what 185 00:07:45,120 --> 00:07:47,880 Speaker 3: an amazing learning Like I wouldn't have even thought that 186 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 3: this would have been an incremental cost for them, And 187 00:07:50,320 --> 00:07:52,840 Speaker 3: I felt really foolish, and you know, it's disappointed and 188 00:07:52,880 --> 00:07:55,680 Speaker 3: maybe I was taking nosy too far. Nosey is the 189 00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:58,920 Speaker 3: courage to get in statiably curious to you know, dig deeper. 190 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:01,320 Speaker 3: It's about how curious drowns out fear and pulls you 191 00:08:01,320 --> 00:08:03,640 Speaker 3: toward what most is exciting to you. So use it 192 00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:05,360 Speaker 3: as a compass, and it's all about like, yeah, don't 193 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:07,800 Speaker 3: be scared to ask a question. I asked a question, Hey, 194 00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:10,960 Speaker 3: could you add a confidence monitor? But then sometimes without 195 00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:13,680 Speaker 3: even realizing it, realizing it, you can take these nine 196 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:15,560 Speaker 3: traits too far, and I call those traite traps. And 197 00:08:15,600 --> 00:08:17,360 Speaker 3: in that case, I didn't think I was taking it 198 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 3: too far, but I later learned I had taken it 199 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:21,880 Speaker 3: too far, and now I know to be more thoughtful about, 200 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:24,320 Speaker 3: you know, the investment that the client is making, et cetera. 201 00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:26,640 Speaker 4: So sometimes we get caught in these tradite traps. Without 202 00:08:26,680 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 4: even knowing it. 203 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:29,560 Speaker 1: Absolutely all right, Well, we're going to take a quick 204 00:08:29,560 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 1: ad break and then I will be back with more 205 00:08:31,120 --> 00:08:40,360 Speaker 1: from Jenny Wood. Well, I am back with Jenny Wood, 206 00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 1: who is the author of the new book Wild Courage. 207 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:45,719 Speaker 1: Has spent her career at Google and now off on 208 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:49,800 Speaker 1: her own doing lots of speaking and writing and teaching 209 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:52,600 Speaker 1: and things like that. So, Jenny, you have a phrase 210 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:55,400 Speaker 1: for when people are going after goals that you want 211 00:08:55,440 --> 00:08:59,000 Speaker 1: them to remember, which is rock, chalk talk and walk. 212 00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:01,360 Speaker 2: I think I said that directly without tripping over it. 213 00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:02,280 Speaker 4: Soday. 214 00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:04,720 Speaker 1: You can talk a little bit about what that means. 215 00:09:04,960 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, So rock chalk talk walk is goal setting 216 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 3: in a nutshell. It's about how do you have the 217 00:09:10,800 --> 00:09:13,520 Speaker 3: most productive hour in any day, right, or how do 218 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:15,720 Speaker 3: you have the most productive goals for a six month period? 219 00:09:15,760 --> 00:09:18,679 Speaker 3: So rock is what's the big thing you want to accomplish. 220 00:09:18,840 --> 00:09:21,200 Speaker 3: I set out to, you know, sell a lot of 221 00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:24,040 Speaker 3: books the week this book came out, So I said, 222 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:26,319 Speaker 3: my big goal is to sell ten thousand US hardcover 223 00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:28,960 Speaker 3: copies of Wild Courage by pup week. That was my 224 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:31,520 Speaker 3: rock and it was specific. It had a number in there, right, 225 00:09:31,559 --> 00:09:33,480 Speaker 3: and I had a date. So it wasn't wishy washy, 226 00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:33,800 Speaker 3: whether I. 227 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:34,480 Speaker 4: Achieved it or not. 228 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:37,960 Speaker 3: Chalk is I wrote it down so right here. Listeners 229 00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:39,720 Speaker 3: can't see this, but I'm showing up a little sticky 230 00:09:39,760 --> 00:09:41,120 Speaker 3: to Laura here. 231 00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:42,080 Speaker 4: But here we go. 232 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:43,920 Speaker 3: It is just like it's on my monitor and it 233 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:46,160 Speaker 3: says that what I just stated written down so I 234 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:46,959 Speaker 3: could see it every day. 235 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:48,360 Speaker 4: That's chalk write it down. 236 00:09:49,120 --> 00:09:51,520 Speaker 3: Talk is talk about it out loud, not in a 237 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:54,319 Speaker 3: MANIFESTI kind of way, but in a very practical, say 238 00:09:54,360 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 3: it to people so they can help you kind of way. 239 00:09:56,440 --> 00:09:59,360 Speaker 3: A lot of people say, well, how do I tastefully 240 00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 3: self promote at work? 241 00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:00,600 Speaker 4: Right? 242 00:10:00,640 --> 00:10:02,000 Speaker 3: Like, I don't want to share with my boss that 243 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 3: I increased, you know, customer satisfaction year a year by 244 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:06,120 Speaker 3: by this percent. 245 00:10:06,240 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 4: I'm like, no, they. 246 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:08,959 Speaker 3: Want to hear that, like they want to hear the 247 00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:11,600 Speaker 3: awesome things you're doing because they can help you. So 248 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:13,680 Speaker 3: by talking about my goal out loud, people said, oh, 249 00:10:13,760 --> 00:10:15,960 Speaker 3: let me introduce you to this other person, or you know, 250 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:17,680 Speaker 3: have you thought about this strategy? Have you thought about 251 00:10:17,679 --> 00:10:20,440 Speaker 3: bulk sales for companies? So that's talk and then walk 252 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:22,679 Speaker 3: is what's it's walk the walk? What's the one thing 253 00:10:22,720 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 3: you can do today, in this hour of your time, 254 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:28,560 Speaker 3: to be the most productive toward that goal. So, just 255 00:10:28,600 --> 00:10:30,360 Speaker 3: to give another example, let's say your goal is to 256 00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:32,720 Speaker 3: lose ten pounds. So maybe the walk is you're going 257 00:10:32,760 --> 00:10:35,280 Speaker 3: to replace the big dishes in your kitchen with smaller dishes. 258 00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:37,880 Speaker 3: And that's the one small step you can take to 259 00:10:37,960 --> 00:10:40,680 Speaker 3: move you toward that big rock. So that's rock, chalk, 260 00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:41,640 Speaker 3: talk and walk. 261 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:43,000 Speaker 2: Excellent, excellent. 262 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:48,520 Speaker 1: And you also talk a lot about betting on yourself, 263 00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:51,840 Speaker 1: right that that part of being having this wild courage 264 00:10:51,880 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 1: is the idea that you know, we need to bet 265 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:55,840 Speaker 1: on ourselves. I don't know if other people are going 266 00:10:55,880 --> 00:10:57,480 Speaker 1: to do it or not, but you know, we at 267 00:10:57,559 --> 00:11:00,400 Speaker 1: least need to put that level of support for ourselves. 268 00:11:00,800 --> 00:11:02,880 Speaker 1: So somebody's listening to this in the car on the 269 00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:07,200 Speaker 1: way to work. It's Tuesday. How practically can they bet 270 00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:08,640 Speaker 1: on themselves today? 271 00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:11,679 Speaker 4: Yeah? Well, I think when when you share bet I. 272 00:11:11,640 --> 00:11:16,400 Speaker 2: Forgot it'll be on Wednesday. But okay, it is Wednesday. 273 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, means whether it is Tuesday or Wednesday or Saturday. 274 00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:23,800 Speaker 3: You know, we think we hear betting on ourselves and 275 00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:26,400 Speaker 3: we think quit your job to be an entrepreneur. But 276 00:11:26,480 --> 00:11:29,480 Speaker 3: you can bet on yourself directly within your own team, 277 00:11:29,559 --> 00:11:31,960 Speaker 3: within your own organization, with your in your own company. 278 00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:34,200 Speaker 3: What might that look like? This comes out of the 279 00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:37,240 Speaker 3: shameless trait. Shameless is the courage to stand behind your 280 00:11:37,240 --> 00:11:39,679 Speaker 3: efforts and abilities. It's about finding your swagger. It goes 281 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 3: back to kind of how do you thoughtfully self promote 282 00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:43,920 Speaker 3: to your managers that you can get that raise, get 283 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:47,720 Speaker 3: that promotion, and bet on yourself within your organization. So 284 00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:50,760 Speaker 3: try sending what I call a shameless Monday email. It 285 00:11:51,120 --> 00:11:54,319 Speaker 3: should take no more than fifteen minutes. It's four bullets, 286 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:56,679 Speaker 3: two things you're proud of from last week and two 287 00:11:56,720 --> 00:11:59,520 Speaker 3: things you're excited about this week. Four bullets, really. 288 00:11:59,320 --> 00:11:59,840 Speaker 4: Short and sweet. 289 00:11:59,840 --> 00:12:03,559 Speaker 3: It's it's not a productivity report. It's simply sharing highlights. 290 00:12:03,800 --> 00:12:06,160 Speaker 3: Even better if you use numbers like I referenced before. 291 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:09,040 Speaker 3: But it's just sharing you know what's been going on 292 00:12:09,080 --> 00:12:11,160 Speaker 3: in your world. As a Google exact Laura, I think 293 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:13,280 Speaker 3: I only saw this about ten percent of the time, 294 00:12:13,320 --> 00:12:16,400 Speaker 3: but the people who did this always stood out as 295 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:17,480 Speaker 3: rockstar performers. 296 00:12:17,520 --> 00:12:18,880 Speaker 4: I always knew what they were working on. 297 00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:20,920 Speaker 3: It was different than them bringing it to me in 298 00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:23,440 Speaker 3: our regular weekly one on one because this is something 299 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:25,840 Speaker 3: that I, as their boss, could see my boss on 300 00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:28,440 Speaker 3: and then maybe that gets spread to other people and 301 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:31,360 Speaker 3: it just shows that they're proactive. It shows that they're 302 00:12:31,600 --> 00:12:33,840 Speaker 3: you know, proud of what they've accomplished, and it gives 303 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:35,880 Speaker 3: me an opportunity to give feedback if I need to. 304 00:12:36,280 --> 00:12:37,160 Speaker 4: And it's a. 305 00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 3: Very effective tool to betting on yourself within your job, 306 00:12:40,920 --> 00:12:42,880 Speaker 3: within your team, so that your boss falls in love 307 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:44,240 Speaker 3: with you absolutely. 308 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:47,280 Speaker 1: And you actually suggest that people use that word proud, 309 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:48,800 Speaker 1: Like you said, listen, two things you're proud of, but 310 00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:50,959 Speaker 1: you actually want people to say, I'm proud of this. 311 00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:53,600 Speaker 4: I mean, what's going on with that exactly? Well, it's 312 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:54,120 Speaker 4: just so rare. 313 00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:56,520 Speaker 3: It's like we think that we have to underplay our 314 00:12:56,840 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 3: or downplay our efforts and our abilities. 315 00:12:58,559 --> 00:12:59,720 Speaker 4: So that's why I call it shameless. 316 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 3: Right, what is the shame if you you know, did 317 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:06,360 Speaker 3: this marketing launch for the ath leisure line of the Fall, Right, 318 00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:09,640 Speaker 3: what's the shame in saying our goal was seventy percent 319 00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:12,360 Speaker 3: adoption and we got to eighty percent customer adoption whatever 320 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:15,160 Speaker 3: the metric is, Like, what is the shame in that? 321 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:18,360 Speaker 3: Like literally using the words I'm so proud of how 322 00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:20,960 Speaker 3: this marketing launch went. I'm proud of this customer feedback. 323 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:23,480 Speaker 3: Here's a screenshot of it. I'm proud of this testimonial 324 00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:25,199 Speaker 3: from a client, and we could do the same thing 325 00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:27,839 Speaker 3: for you, you know, if you're an entrepreneur. We just 326 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:30,120 Speaker 3: hired a nanny recently and she does a bunch of 327 00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:31,760 Speaker 3: stuff around the house in addition to being a nanny. 328 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:36,160 Speaker 3: She's amazing, and so in her email to us, she said, 329 00:13:36,280 --> 00:13:38,640 Speaker 3: you know, I love being with kids, I'm happy to 330 00:13:38,679 --> 00:13:41,640 Speaker 3: do grocery shopping, and I'm an exceptional cook. That's like 331 00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 3: taking I'm proud and dialing it way up to eleven. 332 00:13:44,520 --> 00:13:46,840 Speaker 3: And I have to say one of the reasons I 333 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:49,319 Speaker 3: wanted to interview her was because she had the courage, 334 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:51,600 Speaker 3: the wild courage to say in an email, I'm an 335 00:13:51,640 --> 00:13:54,079 Speaker 3: exceptional cook. I mean, of course you then got to 336 00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:55,440 Speaker 3: have the goods to back it up. And she is 337 00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:57,880 Speaker 3: a great cook. But like that really stands out and 338 00:13:57,920 --> 00:14:01,040 Speaker 3: tells me so much. She's confident, she's she is an 339 00:14:01,040 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 3: exceptional cook, and like, think how rare it is for 340 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 3: someone to say something like that. So whether it's I'm 341 00:14:06,040 --> 00:14:08,000 Speaker 3: proud or I'm really good at this, or these are 342 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:10,440 Speaker 3: my three power assets, you know, the three strengths I have. 343 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:13,480 Speaker 3: People oftentimes don't take time to identify what their three 344 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:16,679 Speaker 3: are mine or people leadership, stakeholder influence and building things 345 00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 3: from startup to scale, and whether I'm meeting my boss's 346 00:14:19,360 --> 00:14:22,480 Speaker 3: boss or a mentor or a new customer. Like, I 347 00:14:22,560 --> 00:14:25,400 Speaker 3: have those identified, I have them practiced, and I say 348 00:14:25,440 --> 00:14:27,480 Speaker 3: them and I say that I'm proud of them, because 349 00:14:27,600 --> 00:14:30,200 Speaker 3: that pride is contagious, and that positive energy is contagious. 350 00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:32,680 Speaker 3: People want to work with people who they're excited by 351 00:14:32,720 --> 00:14:34,320 Speaker 3: and like to partner with and who are positive. 352 00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:38,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, and you suggest that people actually do come up 353 00:14:38,040 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 1: with those power those three power statements and like work 354 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:40,680 Speaker 1: them in. 355 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:42,440 Speaker 2: I mean, there's all sorts of situations. 356 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:45,120 Speaker 1: Where people like say, introduce yourself, or hey, you know, 357 00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:46,720 Speaker 1: I have somebody who want to be can you tell 358 00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:48,280 Speaker 1: them a little bit about what you do, and then 359 00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:50,440 Speaker 1: you launch into the three Exactly. 360 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:52,200 Speaker 3: I was coaching someone yesterday. I do a lot of 361 00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:55,040 Speaker 3: executive coaching one on one in small groups, and I 362 00:14:55,040 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 3: was coaching someone yesterday on an interview and she was like, 363 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:01,040 Speaker 3: but what if they don't ask me, you know, what 364 00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:03,160 Speaker 3: my strengths are I'm like, Oh, it doesn't matter what 365 00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:04,600 Speaker 3: they ask you. They could say, why do you want 366 00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:06,840 Speaker 3: this job? Boom, Well I want this job because I'm 367 00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:08,160 Speaker 3: really great at blah blah blah. 368 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:10,200 Speaker 4: Okay, well what are you most excited about in this job? 369 00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:10,880 Speaker 4: Same thing? 370 00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:13,680 Speaker 3: You know, to be able to leverage my three power assets. 371 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:15,960 Speaker 3: And I always encourage people to have two business skills 372 00:15:15,960 --> 00:15:18,440 Speaker 3: and one soft skill one people skill in there. Just 373 00:15:18,480 --> 00:15:21,400 Speaker 3: like your financial portfolio, your power assets make up your 374 00:15:21,400 --> 00:15:23,760 Speaker 3: power portfolio. And just like your financial portfolio is a 375 00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:26,239 Speaker 3: mix of stocks and bonds, you want your power portfolio 376 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:29,040 Speaker 3: to be a mix of people skills and hard business skills. 377 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 3: So no matter what they ask you, a mentor a boss, 378 00:15:31,760 --> 00:15:34,440 Speaker 3: you know, an interviewer, you can always drop those three 379 00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:36,320 Speaker 3: strengths in. But it takes time to sit down and 380 00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:37,360 Speaker 3: identify what they are. 381 00:15:37,920 --> 00:15:40,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, and you don't like the phrase shameless plug or 382 00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:41,800 Speaker 1: shameless self. 383 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:45,520 Speaker 2: We throw that around a lot. I mean, what because 384 00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 2: we've identified that. 385 00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 1: I guess the idea that talking about yourself is seen 386 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:50,000 Speaker 1: as bad. 387 00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:52,160 Speaker 4: Yeah, No, I think it's I think it's such a 388 00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:52,600 Speaker 4: great thing. 389 00:15:52,840 --> 00:15:55,120 Speaker 3: By the way, it can really hurt you in your 390 00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:58,480 Speaker 3: career if you if you don't someone, you know, because 391 00:15:58,520 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 3: now that the book's doing well, and you know, people 392 00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:02,520 Speaker 3: come to me asking for help, which of course I'm 393 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:05,600 Speaker 3: delighted to offer. Someone said, hey, i'd love to talk 394 00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:07,600 Speaker 3: to you about the publishing industry, you know, would you 395 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:09,600 Speaker 3: have a conversation with me about agents? 396 00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:12,240 Speaker 4: And like that's it. 397 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:14,360 Speaker 3: There were no numbers, there was no kind of like 398 00:16:14,520 --> 00:16:16,600 Speaker 3: anything promoting the great work this person had done. So 399 00:16:16,640 --> 00:16:19,280 Speaker 3: I just initially thought, if this is probably when I 400 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:20,880 Speaker 3: can brush off, right. I'm human, I try to be 401 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:22,800 Speaker 3: productive all so I can't take every meeting that comes 402 00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:24,840 Speaker 3: my way. And then I said, you know, do you 403 00:16:24,920 --> 00:16:29,120 Speaker 3: have any examples of you know, do you have an audience? 404 00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:31,200 Speaker 3: Do you have any followers on social media? That's obviously 405 00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:33,640 Speaker 3: important for the publishing industry. She came back, She wrote 406 00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:35,160 Speaker 3: me back, She's like, well, I have two hundred and 407 00:16:35,160 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 3: seventy thousand followers across social media. And I was like, oh, 408 00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:40,760 Speaker 3: my gosh, if you had the if you and she 409 00:16:40,880 --> 00:16:42,880 Speaker 3: probably felt like, oh, it's shameless to say that in 410 00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:45,520 Speaker 3: my first email. No, that's exactly what I want to know. 411 00:16:45,560 --> 00:16:47,360 Speaker 3: It is so much more efficient. It helps me be 412 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 3: more productive. But you saving me the time of A 413 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:52,720 Speaker 3: assuming that you are totally starting out, you have no following, 414 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:55,720 Speaker 3: but B I then don't have to come back and 415 00:16:55,800 --> 00:16:58,520 Speaker 3: ask you, right, totally inefficient that i'd write back and 416 00:16:58,560 --> 00:17:00,560 Speaker 3: ask her the question. So, you know, when we talk 417 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:03,160 Speaker 3: about a shameless plug, I have this example of someone 418 00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:05,439 Speaker 3: was in a meeting with thirty people and we were 419 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:07,280 Speaker 3: talking about something that was related to this thing she 420 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:09,560 Speaker 3: just built, and she said, well, this is a shameless plug, 421 00:17:09,560 --> 00:17:11,639 Speaker 3: but I built this spreadsheet. I'm putting it here in 422 00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:13,719 Speaker 3: the group chat, and if anyone uses it, you might 423 00:17:13,760 --> 00:17:15,000 Speaker 3: find it saves you sometime. 424 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:18,119 Speaker 4: The emojis on the virtual meeting went gaga. 425 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:20,359 Speaker 3: Everyone's like, oh my gosh, this is gonna save me 426 00:17:20,440 --> 00:17:23,600 Speaker 3: thirty minutes every time I do this project. And so like, 427 00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:26,000 Speaker 3: what's the shame and sharing a tool that's going to 428 00:17:26,080 --> 00:17:28,880 Speaker 3: be helpful and help other people be productive, and yet 429 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:30,600 Speaker 3: we still are conditioned to feel like we have to 430 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:32,760 Speaker 3: underplay our efforts. We have to say this is a shameless, 431 00:17:32,800 --> 00:17:35,480 Speaker 3: shameless plug. But it's like, no, be proud of what 432 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:36,959 Speaker 3: you put out there. What I would have wanted her 433 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:39,480 Speaker 3: to say was I'm proud of this resource I put together, 434 00:17:39,520 --> 00:17:41,040 Speaker 3: and I think we'll save you each a half hour. 435 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:43,280 Speaker 1: I love anything that saves me half an hour, So 436 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 1: it saves me five minutes, I'm all over that. So 437 00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:47,800 Speaker 1: all right, well, we're gonna take one more quick ad 438 00:17:47,840 --> 00:17:57,080 Speaker 1: break and I will be back with more from Jenny Wood. Well, 439 00:17:57,119 --> 00:17:59,320 Speaker 1: I am back with Jenny Wood, who's the author of 440 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:02,200 Speaker 1: Wild Courage, just how to go after what you want 441 00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:05,760 Speaker 1: and get it. So, Jenny, we always like to talk 442 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:08,000 Speaker 1: about routines here on this show. I'm wondering if you 443 00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:11,240 Speaker 1: personally have any routines that help make you more effective? 444 00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 3: Well, can I talk about one that I have started 445 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:15,159 Speaker 3: this morning? 446 00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:17,879 Speaker 1: Okay, Well, today is as good a day as any, 447 00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 1: So if we started this morning, that's awesome. 448 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:22,040 Speaker 3: They say the best time to plant a tree is 449 00:18:22,080 --> 00:18:25,160 Speaker 3: twenty years ago. The second best time is today. So 450 00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:27,679 Speaker 3: I started this today even though for ages I've been 451 00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:28,320 Speaker 3: wanting to do it. 452 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 4: And this would be part of what I call brutal. 453 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:34,920 Speaker 3: Right, this is the trait that's the courage to protect 454 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:37,960 Speaker 3: your time and energy. It's the power of know It 455 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:40,399 Speaker 3: also gets into people pleasing, how people pleasing pleases no 456 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 3: one and keeps you small. 457 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:43,560 Speaker 4: But this is real. Brutal is about. 458 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:46,960 Speaker 3: Ruthless prioritization at its core, and it's something I've struggled 459 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:49,720 Speaker 3: with for a long time, is charging my phone next 460 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:50,480 Speaker 3: to me in my bed. 461 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:52,000 Speaker 4: And this is probably like the oldest trick in. 462 00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 3: The book to most of you listening, but I'm new 463 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:57,320 Speaker 3: to it, and I've realized that, you know, it's something 464 00:18:57,320 --> 00:18:59,359 Speaker 3: I share in Wild Courage is if you don't have 465 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:02,000 Speaker 3: the time, the energy, or the capacity to respond to 466 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,879 Speaker 3: an email, don't check it. So like if you're walking 467 00:19:04,920 --> 00:19:06,600 Speaker 3: to the subway or you know, to your car in 468 00:19:06,640 --> 00:19:08,679 Speaker 3: the parking lot from work, if you still work in 469 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:11,200 Speaker 3: an office, like there's really no point to scroll through 470 00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:13,159 Speaker 3: your work email if you're not going to action and 471 00:19:13,160 --> 00:19:14,919 Speaker 3: write back to that email in that moment, which you're 472 00:19:14,920 --> 00:19:16,760 Speaker 3: probably not. If you're walking, you might get hit by 473 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:18,960 Speaker 3: a car. Well, I was finding the same thing would 474 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:20,600 Speaker 3: happen first thing in the morning. I would pull up 475 00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:23,120 Speaker 3: my phone and then for like a good forty five minutes, 476 00:19:23,160 --> 00:19:25,439 Speaker 3: while my eyes are you know, still half closed, I 477 00:19:25,440 --> 00:19:28,240 Speaker 3: would scan through DMS on LinkedIn because I'm very active there. 478 00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:30,600 Speaker 3: I post every day. I'd scan through my inbox. I'd 479 00:19:30,600 --> 00:19:32,720 Speaker 3: listen to maybe a voice memo from someone on my team, 480 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:35,920 Speaker 3: but I just wouldn't action anything, and then I would 481 00:19:36,000 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 3: forget things I would not get back to them. So 482 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:40,880 Speaker 3: I kind of applied that same strategy I talk about 483 00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:43,359 Speaker 3: in the brutal trait, which is if you can't action it, 484 00:19:43,760 --> 00:19:46,719 Speaker 3: don't read it. And so for the first time last night, 485 00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:49,359 Speaker 3: I charged my phone in another room. My old boss 486 00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:51,359 Speaker 3: would say, charge it on a different floor of the 487 00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:53,040 Speaker 3: house if you have more than one floor, like make 488 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:55,760 Speaker 3: it really hard to get to. And then today when 489 00:19:55,800 --> 00:19:57,679 Speaker 3: I sat down at my computer, I actually could read 490 00:19:57,720 --> 00:19:59,080 Speaker 3: the emails and respond real time. 491 00:19:59,119 --> 00:19:59,879 Speaker 4: And that is brutal. 492 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:02,679 Speaker 3: It is not easy to do that because there are 493 00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:04,640 Speaker 3: so many reasons I would say I need to charge 494 00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:06,960 Speaker 3: it next to my bed. But it's a ten dollars 495 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:09,520 Speaker 3: investment in an alarm clock and a digital you know, 496 00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:13,600 Speaker 3: digital clock. But I'm trying this out and I'm hoping 497 00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:18,160 Speaker 3: that it can stick. Because it is it'll. 498 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:18,160 Speaker 4: Make a difference for me for sure. 499 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:20,639 Speaker 2: Yeah, Now that's always what trips people up. They're like, 500 00:20:20,640 --> 00:20:21,680 Speaker 2: but I need it as my alarm. 501 00:20:21,680 --> 00:20:24,399 Speaker 1: It's like, well, guess what people had alarms We didn't 502 00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:26,879 Speaker 1: magically wake up prior to smartphones. 503 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:27,600 Speaker 2: There's there's a. 504 00:20:27,560 --> 00:20:29,640 Speaker 1: Way to solve this problem exactly. 505 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:31,120 Speaker 2: You'll figure it out. You'll figure it out. 506 00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:31,880 Speaker 4: Well. 507 00:20:31,880 --> 00:20:34,320 Speaker 1: One thing I always ask people, Jenny, is what is 508 00:20:34,359 --> 00:20:36,480 Speaker 1: something you've done recently to take a day from great 509 00:20:36,520 --> 00:20:39,359 Speaker 1: to awesome? So obviously charging your phone somewhere else is 510 00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:40,959 Speaker 1: going to hopefully take your days from great to us 511 00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:42,680 Speaker 1: I'm but I wonder if you have anything else for us. 512 00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:44,520 Speaker 4: Well. 513 00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:52,400 Speaker 3: One of the I think that I oftentimes live in 514 00:20:51,520 --> 00:20:55,199 Speaker 3: a maximizer world. And this gets a little into the 515 00:20:55,200 --> 00:20:57,840 Speaker 3: trade traps again. So this is about the obsessed trait. 516 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:00,199 Speaker 3: Obsessed is the courage to set your own standard, to 517 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:03,760 Speaker 3: push perform persists. It's to let your energy fuel or 518 00:21:03,760 --> 00:21:06,760 Speaker 3: your enthusiasm really to feel like any project or any goal. 519 00:21:07,200 --> 00:21:08,640 Speaker 3: And I can take that a little bit too far. 520 00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:12,880 Speaker 3: And there's this research by psychologists and professor at Swarthmore University, 521 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:17,639 Speaker 3: Barry Schwartz, who talks about maximizers versus satisficers. Maximizers want 522 00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:21,000 Speaker 3: to dial any project up to eleven. They want to 523 00:21:21,119 --> 00:21:25,040 Speaker 3: ace every test. They want to, you know, run the marathon. 524 00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:27,360 Speaker 4: And have the fastest time. And I tend to fall. 525 00:21:27,160 --> 00:21:31,199 Speaker 3: Into that category of maximizers. However, there are also satisficers 526 00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:34,679 Speaker 3: who are okay being an eighty out of one hundred 527 00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:37,040 Speaker 3: on a lot of things. And the research suggests that 528 00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:42,720 Speaker 3: while maximizers might get slightly better results, the satisficers can 529 00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:45,520 Speaker 3: sometimes be happier. And since I think it's not a 530 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:49,159 Speaker 3: bad thing to optimize for happiness when you're taking your 531 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:52,840 Speaker 3: days from great to awesome, you know, I've tapped a 532 00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:55,359 Speaker 3: couple of times in this past week into being a 533 00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:58,720 Speaker 3: satisficer and not my natural inclination of a maximizer. Again, 534 00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:00,840 Speaker 3: this gets into trade traps. Basically, it's like where do 535 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:02,760 Speaker 3: I want to be obsessed? What projects should be an 536 00:22:02,760 --> 00:22:05,040 Speaker 3: eleven out of ten, and what projects. 537 00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 4: Can be an eight out of ten? 538 00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:09,320 Speaker 3: And so I try to not get caught in a 539 00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:12,080 Speaker 3: trait trap by taking obsessed too far on too many 540 00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:14,280 Speaker 3: different things. So this week I had some good opportunities, 541 00:22:14,359 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 3: especially spending time with my kids. I just came back 542 00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:18,520 Speaker 3: from a field trip with my seven year old daughter. 543 00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:20,640 Speaker 3: I drove them to choir a couple of times this week, 544 00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:23,399 Speaker 3: went to a field day yesterday at school, and so 545 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:25,720 Speaker 3: it forced me to be a satisficer around a couple 546 00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:27,800 Speaker 3: of projects I had brewing for work, and it actually 547 00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:32,160 Speaker 3: felt really, really great to be more discerning about where 548 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:34,439 Speaker 3: I had to just really squeeze every last ounce of 549 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:37,320 Speaker 3: productivity into a project, and where I could say, eh, 550 00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:39,119 Speaker 3: good enough, I'm going to go spend some time with 551 00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:41,679 Speaker 3: my kids. And that made me my That's made this 552 00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:42,960 Speaker 3: week awesome and not just great. 553 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:46,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm one hundred percent of satisficer on so many 554 00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:48,600 Speaker 1: things I don't like, you know, looking at the universe 555 00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:50,960 Speaker 1: of options, I want people to bring me three Oh. 556 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:52,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I go with one of those three. They're 557 00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:53,520 Speaker 2: going to be great. 558 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:55,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, That's that's something I share in Bossy. Bossy is 559 00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:57,800 Speaker 3: the courage to see others to success, and it's all 560 00:22:57,840 --> 00:22:59,479 Speaker 3: about being a strong leader. And one of the things 561 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:02,439 Speaker 3: I share is leaders love threes. Give three options and 562 00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:04,680 Speaker 3: then have a POV to your leader, Right, Like, giving 563 00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:06,199 Speaker 3: three options shows that you can look at things from 564 00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:07,240 Speaker 3: multiple perspectives. 565 00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:08,920 Speaker 4: But having a perspective, hey. 566 00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:10,960 Speaker 3: We could you know, we could sell vanilla ice cream, 567 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:13,000 Speaker 3: chocolate ice cream, or strawberry ice cream next year if 568 00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:16,280 Speaker 3: you're you know, the VP talking to the CEO, and. 569 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:18,000 Speaker 4: I recommend we go with strawberry. 570 00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:20,160 Speaker 3: Right. Giving those three options shows that you've got diverse 571 00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:23,280 Speaker 3: perspectives that you're considering. But the thing that your c 572 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:25,880 Speaker 3: suite is looking for as a leader, if you want 573 00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:28,439 Speaker 3: to be a rising leader, is do you have the courage, 574 00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:30,920 Speaker 3: the wild courage to have a perspective to pick one 575 00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:33,840 Speaker 3: of those three options and oftentimes that senior leader will 576 00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:36,000 Speaker 3: say yeah, let's go for it. Or if they say no, 577 00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:38,280 Speaker 3: then you've got really good data on their opinion, which 578 00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:40,119 Speaker 3: you don't always have. But have the wild courage to 579 00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:42,879 Speaker 3: give three options and have a stance on it. 580 00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:46,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely so, Jenny, what are you looking forward to 581 00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:46,560 Speaker 1: right now? 582 00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:50,400 Speaker 3: Hmmm, Well, it's really fun to partner with companies and 583 00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:53,760 Speaker 3: you know, different leadership teams to help them tap into 584 00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:56,760 Speaker 3: their wild courage and to improve employee engagement and to 585 00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:58,919 Speaker 3: thrive through change. Right there's so much going on with 586 00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:02,720 Speaker 3: AI and the economy and politically and in organizations restructuring 587 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:05,560 Speaker 3: that I think everyone is just looking for a dose 588 00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:09,840 Speaker 3: of realistic motivation and how they can thrive more at 589 00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:12,080 Speaker 3: work and also in life. And so just all the 590 00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:14,400 Speaker 3: incredible partnerships that are coming up with different companies, their 591 00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:16,919 Speaker 3: leadership teams or even their entry level employees because they 592 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:18,760 Speaker 3: want to get them started on the right foot and 593 00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:20,880 Speaker 3: hit the ground running. That's what I'm most looking forward 594 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:22,520 Speaker 3: to is just bringing this work to more and more 595 00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:26,240 Speaker 3: companies because it is so much fun to partner with 596 00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:27,520 Speaker 3: people on awesome. 597 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:28,679 Speaker 2: And where can people find you? 598 00:24:29,440 --> 00:24:30,919 Speaker 4: It's Jennywood dot com. 599 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,520 Speaker 3: They can find me there and reach out to me 600 00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:37,520 Speaker 3: for speaking engagements or workshops, or buying the book for 601 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:40,959 Speaker 3: their organization or to excellent excellent. 602 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:42,920 Speaker 1: Well, Jenny, thank you so much for joining us. Thank 603 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,920 Speaker 1: you to everyone for listening. If you have feedback on 604 00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:48,520 Speaker 1: this or any other episode, you can always reach me 605 00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:52,000 Speaker 1: at Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. In the meantime, 606 00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:55,240 Speaker 1: this is Laura, Thanks for listening, and here's to making 607 00:24:55,240 --> 00:25:04,760 Speaker 1: the most of our time. Thanks for listening to Before Breakfast. 608 00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:09,040 Speaker 1: If you've got questions, ideas, or feedback, you can reach 609 00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:18,800 Speaker 1: me at Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. Before Breakfast 610 00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:23,120 Speaker 1: is a production of iHeartMedia. For more podcasts from iHeartMedia, 611 00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:27,199 Speaker 1: please visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 612 00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:28,480 Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows.