Speaker 1: Hey guys, Steve, here, you are listening to one of
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Speaker 1: to listen to. Yeah, bye bye, Thinking Sideways. I don't understand.
Speaker 1: You never know stories of things. We simply don't know
Speaker 1: the answer too. Well. Hi, there, welcome to another episode
Speaker 1: of Thinking Sideways. I'm Joe, joined by Steve and Den. Hey,
Speaker 1: so here we are again for another hard hitting UM. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So anyway, so okay, this is a little bit of
Speaker 1: an unsolved mystery. There's UM. Today we're gonna talk about
Speaker 1: the Circufe Cirkufe for those of you who don't know
Speaker 1: about it, was a French submarine that disappeared supposedly in
Speaker 1: the Caribbean, although some people argue differently, but the circuf
Speaker 1: was a submarine that was built in France in the
Speaker 1: late twenties early thirties. Said, no, excuse me. It was
Speaker 1: built in the late twenties. It was launched in nine
Speaker 1: nine and commissioned in nineteen thirty four into the French Navy. Um,
Speaker 1: it was the largest sub ever built at that time.
Speaker 1: It's about sixty feet. It's about the same length as
Speaker 1: the Los Angeles claud Los Angeles Class nuclear sub today. Um,
Speaker 1: do you have us a reference that is in a submarine?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I say, well, we think it's longer than
Speaker 1: a football field. Okay, yeah, it's it's helpful. That's actually
Speaker 1: very big. I mean, obviously we're building much bigger subs
Speaker 1: these days. The biggest sub ever built was built by
Speaker 1: the Russians was actually the Soviets, the Typhoon. It was
Speaker 1: the sub that was in the hunt for Red October.
Speaker 1: Five hundred sixty ft long. Yeah, it's it's enormous and
Speaker 1: and yeah, so that's the biggest one ever, not the
Speaker 1: one that jumped. That's not the Red for Red October.
Speaker 1: Yeah that was not. Yeah yeah, yeah, you know when
Speaker 1: the Hunt forod October they come up for Ayer and
Speaker 1: it's like they jumped and where that Yeah that was Yeah,
Speaker 1: that was a Los Angeles Class a lot smaller. So,
Speaker 1: but but at that time it was a big honking
Speaker 1: sub and it had to be big because it had
Speaker 1: to do so much. I mean, it wasn't just doing
Speaker 1: what ordinary substitute, which is go running torpedo ships. It
Speaker 1: also had a big turret on the top of it
Speaker 1: in front of the conning tower that had two eight
Speaker 1: inch guns in it, and so it was like basically
Speaker 1: kind of like a battleship and it was gonna say
Speaker 1: eight each guns. Those are destroyers at the time had
Speaker 1: guns that were almost that size. Yeah yeah, yeah. And
Speaker 1: so so it's it's like a ship that is also
Speaker 1: a submarine or a submarine that can glide across the Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like well back back in those days, really up
Speaker 1: until the invagtion of the snorkel in the forties, most
Speaker 1: most submarines were really designed and built to run on
Speaker 1: the surface most of the time and just submerge when
Speaker 1: controversy occurs, like saying, you know the aircraft, and the
Speaker 1: aircraft shows up and they wanted like torpedo you and
Speaker 1: kill you, and so that's a good time to submerge. Maybe, Yeah,
Speaker 1: but they spent back in those days, they spent most
Speaker 1: of their time in the surface. So anyway, besides the
Speaker 1: besides having these big hawking guns in a turret in front,
Speaker 1: they also had a hangar aft of the conning tower
Speaker 1: that contained a floatplane. And obviously it was a skinny
Speaker 1: little hangar, so they had to pull the wings and
Speaker 1: stuff off of this thing to get it stowed away.
Speaker 1: I can't imagine what a nuisance that would be. And
Speaker 1: imagine imagine it's like, okay, guys get up on deck
Speaker 1: and pull that thing out and put it together. And
Speaker 1: they say, I don't remember how long it took, but
Speaker 1: they were talking about in the research how long it
Speaker 1: took for it to dive and how it made it
Speaker 1: just like obscenely impractical for being able to make it
Speaker 1: get away from anything. Yeah, you want to be able
Speaker 1: to dive quickly, and it took like over two minutes
Speaker 1: to dive. Take it tiny a little bit, Yeah, and yeah,
Speaker 1: I was. I was trying to do a little research
Speaker 1: on that because that is a long that is an
Speaker 1: extended dive period, and I was wondering if perhaps it
Speaker 1: lacked a negative tank, because typically diesel subs that we build,
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's the same for all countries
Speaker 1: are not that we build ours with negative tanks. And
Speaker 1: a negative tank is a tank that when you surface. Normally,
Speaker 1: when you submerge, you blow the negative tank out, but
Speaker 1: when you surface be filled up with water. The idea
Speaker 1: of being as it gives you negative buoyancy. When it's
Speaker 1: time to flood those tanks, it pulls you under quicker. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and uh, and so once you submerge and you blow
Speaker 1: the negative listing. Perhaps lacked the negative tank, I don't know,
Speaker 1: or perhaps I've had a really kind of a pathetically
Speaker 1: small one. You know, they were just busy like trying
Speaker 1: to pull things in. And yeah, well I remember reading
Speaker 1: about the sign when we're talking about how big it is,
Speaker 1: and maybe this is why it didn't have an adequate tank.
Speaker 1: Is it had a area to hold forty prisoners. So
Speaker 1: I mean that's had a brig which is huge on
Speaker 1: a submarine. Oh yeah, well, I'm sure they were sure
Speaker 1: they were stacked in there like cordwood. Still, that's a
Speaker 1: lot of space, a lot of space on a submarine. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm sure they probably made good use of it for
Speaker 1: storing food and stuff like that. Where French sailors after
Speaker 1: watter all, so they had to have a wine cell.
Speaker 1: Why why did it have the airplane again, because I
Speaker 1: remember there was there was some specific reason that there
Speaker 1: was a plane involved, because that's not what you're normally
Speaker 1: happen to song. Uh. You know, actually back in those days,
Speaker 1: a lot of subs did carry floatplanes. It's not it
Speaker 1: wasn't that unusual. But wouldn't they just use radar? Yeah,
Speaker 1: they didn't have radar back in those days, and sonar
Speaker 1: and sonar was not that well developed either, so you know,
Speaker 1: in order to find targets, you know, like say ships
Speaker 1: and stuff like that, they would launch their plane. The
Speaker 1: plane would go buzz around and find something and then
Speaker 1: come back and come back and tell I'm more radio back.
Speaker 1: I guess it seems like just such a backwards way
Speaker 1: to like be doing all this stuff right in that
Speaker 1: in between period where they're like, okay, we have to
Speaker 1: be able to do these things. But we don't have
Speaker 1: the technology, so I know, we'll just strap some guns
Speaker 1: on it, trap a plane on it, and we'll just
Speaker 1: see where it goes. It just seems so like a
Speaker 1: like kind of just a bad idea that design. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I can't, you know, And I would imagine that in reality,
Speaker 1: the plane, for example, would probably not be pulled out
Speaker 1: of the hangar very often. You can you imagine what
Speaker 1: a what a huge news is it would be. And
Speaker 1: you're very vulnerable if enemy aircraft do show up while
Speaker 1: you're saying dismantling the plane, well, you're just gonna have
Speaker 1: to like leave the plane die. Yeah, I mean they
Speaker 1: were going to make I think this was the first
Speaker 1: of seven of these that they were planning to make.
Speaker 1: It they were, Yeah, the plan was to to build
Speaker 1: a series of them, but this was the first one.
Speaker 1: And they built this thing because the Washington Naval Treaty
Speaker 1: placed limits on naval construction that submarines were admitted from that.
Speaker 1: So they built this big honking thing, which is basically
Speaker 1: they called it. They called it a submerged cruiser or something.
Speaker 1: They called it an underwater cruiser, but basically, yeah, it
Speaker 1: was a loophole. They were exploiting a loophole, said well,
Speaker 1: if we can build this this thing that's kind of
Speaker 1: like a frigate or a battleship or something like that,
Speaker 1: but it's technically a submarine and totally totally what it is.
Speaker 1: Right if the battleship, it can hardly submerge. It's just
Speaker 1: like on a technicality, it has to. Okay, and the
Speaker 1: flaw if when I was doing the reading on this
Speaker 1: is the flaw is okay. Well it's gigantic, which is awesome.
Speaker 1: We've got the giant subs, the biggest one ever made,
Speaker 1: and it's got these massive guns. But because they were
Speaker 1: on a sub which doesn't sit the high hut of water,
Speaker 1: these guns were supposed to be able to shoot I
Speaker 1: believe it's fifteen miles. That's an eight inch gun could shoot.
Speaker 1: Max ranged on the on these guns was twenty four miles,
Speaker 1: but unfortunately they were not able to see twenty four miles, right,
Speaker 1: so they could only shoot I think it was eight
Speaker 1: or ten or something. Yeah, depend yeah, they had they
Speaker 1: had like a station where they could sight from the
Speaker 1: top of the conning tower and and that gave them
Speaker 1: a range of I believe eight miles and then if
Speaker 1: they used the periscopes, they could get a little higher
Speaker 1: up and say, can see further away. That gave them
Speaker 1: a range of about ten miles the periscope. And then
Speaker 1: but if there, if they wanted to go to max range,
Speaker 1: they could launch the floatplane and then the floor plane
Speaker 1: could actually could actually you know, guide him in. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it just it was. It was again, it's an awkward
Speaker 1: way to solve the problem. Well we don't have this,
Speaker 1: so we'll do that. And well we don't have that,
Speaker 1: so let's just try this. It just seemed cobbled together. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: And it's like and this is this is possibly apparently
Speaker 1: it was. It looks to me, I mean, if you
Speaker 1: look at the thing, if you look at pictures of
Speaker 1: it, it it looks really top heavy for submarine. And they
Speaker 1: were talking that was talking about it behaving very badly
Speaker 1: in rough seas, rolling really badly, and that could be
Speaker 1: one clue to the mystery. The whole thing is as
Speaker 1: to what happened to it. Is like, then we'll get
Speaker 1: into the theories about what happened to it. But I'm
Speaker 1: thinking it's quite possible that if they just tried to
Speaker 1: submerge in rough seas, I was, like, you noticed earlier,
Speaker 1: I had my old submarine manual out. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I warted to confirm something that that I remembered from
Speaker 1: reading it long long ago. But apparently submersion of a submarine,
Speaker 1: center of gravity and the center of buoyancy cross one another.
Speaker 1: So essentially, when you're on the surface, your center of
Speaker 1: gravity is above the center of buoyancy, and then as
Speaker 1: you submerge, the center of buoyancy moves up. If you
Speaker 1: can imagine a line moving vertically through the submarine, and
Speaker 1: eventually it winds up. Center buoyancy wants up above the
Speaker 1: center of gravity. But at that point where the two
Speaker 1: points meet, the submarine becomes very unstable. So because it's
Speaker 1: just like a roly poly, right, yeah, yeah, it's not
Speaker 1: like a surface ship where you know, if you if
Speaker 1: you list to one side, it sets up a writing
Speaker 1: arm and tends to push you back. It's not like that.
Speaker 1: And so that's even a possibility that possibly, and I'm
Speaker 1: getting get ahead of myself, because but what the hell, Well,
Speaker 1: it's it's all in the size and the build of
Speaker 1: this thing, So it makes sense. Yeah, yeah, so I
Speaker 1: could see, I could see the possibility where it's just
Speaker 1: bad luck. You know, they're they're submerging in rough seas
Speaker 1: and they hit that point of instability and then hit
Speaker 1: they get hit by a big wave. And and I
Speaker 1: don't know if you guys looked at any pictures or
Speaker 1: diagrams of the SUBMODT. Yeah, yeah, the eight inch guns
Speaker 1: are fed this vertical magazine and the ammunition is stored
Speaker 1: at the lowest deck of the submarine. And so that's yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like and so I'm sure that formed part of
Speaker 1: the ballast of it putting all that, because you know
Speaker 1: that that eight h ammo has got away a ton. Yeah,
Speaker 1: those are big. Yeah, So that's kind of my kind
Speaker 1: of something I was curious about. It's like, you know,
Speaker 1: they obviously weren't able to replenish. They were were actually
Speaker 1: out doing stuff, shooting and shooting at things and stuff
Speaker 1: like that, using up their ammo. And I don't think
Speaker 1: they had a supply line back to France, which was
Speaker 1: occupied by the Germans by this time. So what happened
Speaker 1: down there? Did they did they think to put counterbalancing
Speaker 1: weights down there or did they have trim tank second,
Speaker 1: so it might not have had the weight that they
Speaker 1: were expecting. Yeah, counters that sense. Yeah, but anyway, I'm
Speaker 1: getting ahead of myself though. Okay, So anyway, so we
Speaker 1: talked about the issues that she had. She rolled, she
Speaker 1: rolled badly in rough seas and took a long time
Speaker 1: to dive. So back to the history of the ship
Speaker 1: a little bit. So she served in the French Navy,
Speaker 1: but the Germans invaded France in May nineteen forty the Seracuf.
Speaker 1: Hope I'm pronouncing that correctly, all of our French listeners
Speaker 1: right in her call. Yeah, she was in Breast being refitted.
Speaker 1: And I don't know where Breast is, but I assume
Speaker 1: it's on the coast of France. She uh, So at
Speaker 1: that point she she's left and went to England and
Speaker 1: stayed there being refitted in Plymouth, England. And then in
Speaker 1: July the Brits launched an operation called Operation Catapult. And
Speaker 1: I'm not going to go to all the specifics of Catapult.
Speaker 1: I had to do with a lot of French ships
Speaker 1: being either either coming up to our side or being scuttled.
Speaker 1: But in the part the phase that affected the Circouf
Speaker 1: is that all French ships that were in port in
Speaker 1: Britain and also in Canada were boarded by our marines
Speaker 1: and basically the crews were taken off them and most
Speaker 1: of them were repatriated to France. And then the idea
Speaker 1: was that these ships and submarines whatever, we're gonna be
Speaker 1: turned over the Free French Navy under you know, you know,
Speaker 1: the free French guys, remember Charles de gall and all stuff.
Speaker 1: And I'm guessing the idea of however misguided here was
Speaker 1: that if there's any French who are on the ship
Speaker 1: who have been turned by the Germans for whatever reason,
Speaker 1: that you get them off so that the ship doesn't
Speaker 1: become a threat to you while your quote unquote using
Speaker 1: it in your service. Yeah, i'd be a correct assumption. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so yeah, the French, So the French, after the
Speaker 1: Germans took over, the VC government formed and they were
Speaker 1: basically kind of what's what's the word, I'm thinking of
Speaker 1: the puppet government of the Germans. And so, you know,
Speaker 1: the question was for these sailors, who where where did
Speaker 1: their loyalties lie? And so they just decided to take
Speaker 1: them all the ships and you know, send them back
Speaker 1: to France and then uh, and then they turned them
Speaker 1: over to the Free French nagers. I love that that's
Speaker 1: like one of my favorite stories in history. Right, we
Speaker 1: couldn't trust some of you, so we're going to condemn
Speaker 1: all of you and just take all your stuff. Yeah yeah,
Speaker 1: good luck to be found. And actually, uh and actually
Speaker 1: this is kind of sad, but most almost the entire
Speaker 1: crew the Seracouf was was sent back to France on
Speaker 1: on a hospital ship, which was unfortunately torpedoed and sunk
Speaker 1: by the Germans. Yeah yeah, and so that that costs
Speaker 1: that cost a little bit of bitterness, yeah, I know.
Speaker 1: And the other thing that costs a little bitterness is
Speaker 1: that actually the Seracouf saw during the during Operation Catapult,
Speaker 1: actually saw a little bit of gunplay on the sub
Speaker 1: and three Brits and one French sailor were killed during
Speaker 1: the boarding of this which again caused a little bit
Speaker 1: of bitterness. Um. In August ninety they the Brits completed
Speaker 1: the refit of the ship and then turned her over
Speaker 1: to the Free French Navy for convoy patrol. You know,
Speaker 1: as you know, there was a lot of convoy going
Speaker 1: going on between America and Britain and also America and Russia,
Speaker 1: and so yeahly so convoys convoy escorts were kind of necessary.
Speaker 1: There was only one officer who had I've been sent
Speaker 1: back to France to be torpedoed and killed by the Germans,
Speaker 1: and that was Commander George Louis Blaison. I think I
Speaker 1: don't know that. Yeah, So he became the new commanding officer,
Speaker 1: and then and then a bunch of French sailors for
Speaker 1: the Free French Navy were put on board and she
Speaker 1: was assigned to convoy patrol. And uh. But at the
Speaker 1: same time there was still a bit of an atmospode
Speaker 1: of distrust between the Brits and the French. Okay, so
Speaker 1: hang on, before we go any farther, I've already seen
Speaker 1: a giant issue here, which is she had been running
Speaker 1: for a year or so with a crew that had
Speaker 1: learned and knew about the ship. And then they're all
Speaker 1: jettisoned off of this ship and an entirely new crew
Speaker 1: is put on and she's put back out to sea. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that's with a bunch of guys you don't know
Speaker 1: how exactly to do everything, especially since she's like so
Speaker 1: problem right and right, I mean she is prone to toppling,
Speaker 1: she's all these little Yeah, so ring is a complex
Speaker 1: machines too, you know. And and and I'm assuming you know
Speaker 1: that at least a strong percentage of these people have
Speaker 1: served on submarines before and had had some clue what
Speaker 1: they were doing. You gotta hope, you gotta hope again
Speaker 1: if this is this is a one of a kind
Speaker 1: sub she was the only one of her design that
Speaker 1: was ever built, which means that every ship has its
Speaker 1: own idiosyncrasies. I got to know how to deal with them.
Speaker 1: So if you've got guys who oh yeah, you gotta
Speaker 1: do this, you gotta do that. But suddenly they're all gone,
Speaker 1: you don't know what to do. You don't know if
Speaker 1: you're doing something right or wrong, which can make you know,
Speaker 1: for a catastrophic situation, even in like the most perfect submarine.
Speaker 1: Uh yeah. And and this one had another problem too,
Speaker 1: which was that it was in Britain, and obviously if
Speaker 1: they needed spare parts, well, you know, I'm sorry French,
Speaker 1: they're back in France, which is occupied by the Germans, right,
Speaker 1: so you know, you gotta like, you gotta. They're not
Speaker 1: gonna obviously set up a whole manufacturing infrastructure to make
Speaker 1: parts for this thing, for one, So we're saying it's
Speaker 1: even more cobbled together at this point, right, repairs that
Speaker 1: are being done all yeah, well, I'm sure that there's
Speaker 1: a lot of pieces and parts that could be could
Speaker 1: be made made from scratched by a qualified machinists and
Speaker 1: stuff like that, but it would be time consuming. Also,
Speaker 1: this is the war, like yeah, yeah, I say, in
Speaker 1: a sense, it's kind it's kind of like a mystery
Speaker 1: why they even processing in a service. Um it seemed
Speaker 1: like an accident waiting to happen. So but anyway, there
Speaker 1: was still at a little bit of tension there. They
Speaker 1: had a new commanding officer and a new crew. There
Speaker 1: were accusations made that people on the sub we're spying
Speaker 1: for vit friends. The Brits apparently also claimed that this
Speaker 1: so coop was attacking British ships because when you think
Speaker 1: about it, when you were in a convoy in the
Speaker 1: North Atlantic, then you know, and the convoys are kind
Speaker 1: of spread out, and so it would actually not be
Speaker 1: that tough if you're like one of the one of
Speaker 1: the escorts to just go ahead and sink one of
Speaker 1: these merchant ships. Yeah, you could do that, wouldn't be
Speaker 1: that duck. You could just sink a merchant ship, you know,
Speaker 1: and it's like, hey, what happened? I don't know. The
Speaker 1: Germans must have got him, yeah, but I got everybody.
Speaker 1: Everybody on board would have to be on board with that. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So the Brits actually actually, as part of this, they
Speaker 1: stationed a British officer and two sailors on board, supposedly
Speaker 1: to be liaisons, but more likely just to keep an
Speaker 1: eye on them and make sure that nothing like this happened.
Speaker 1: So anyways, the Cirkufa went to Halifax, Nova, Scotia and
Speaker 1: basically escorted Transatlantic convoys until one which was damaged by
Speaker 1: a German plane, and then went to the US Naval
Speaker 1: shipyard of Portsmith, New Hampshire for a refit, and then
Speaker 1: went to the New London, Connecticut, and then went back
Speaker 1: to Halifax, neb All. What happened is Pearl Harbor. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: Pearl Harbor. So they decided to send the circuf to
Speaker 1: the Pacific Theater, and so she was given orders to
Speaker 1: sail to Sydney, Australia, the Via Bermuda and Tahiti and
Speaker 1: the Panama Canal and all that stuff. So she was
Speaker 1: gonna have a neat little tour and I could just
Speaker 1: imagine that, you know, I I've read conflicting stuff. According
Speaker 1: to some accounts that I've read about this, at the
Speaker 1: time that she set out to make this voyage, she
Speaker 1: only had one functioning engine. Yeah, I know, And I
Speaker 1: can't believe that. I cannot believe they would have put
Speaker 1: her to sea for that voyage like that with one
Speaker 1: function So I am taking that with a grain of salt.
Speaker 1: Although I guess it wouldn't be so surprising given that,
Speaker 1: you know, nobody really could get their hands on the
Speaker 1: correct parts. Yeah, that's a good point. I mean, it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: but it seems to me rather dangerous to send the
Speaker 1: ship to sea with only one functioning Yeah, although I
Speaker 1: guess you say, you know, you kind of had your
Speaker 1: bet at that point, right, you say, well, you've only
Speaker 1: got one functioning engine, but it would take us like
Speaker 1: five years to actually get the parts we need in
Speaker 1: every fabricade or whatever, you know, or yeah, yeah, but
Speaker 1: you know, there's what fairly disposable dudes on this ship
Speaker 1: also like pretty disposable, So I oh, yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: either they make it and they're helpful or they don't,
Speaker 1: but we tried. Yeah, I and I I really think
Speaker 1: the proper course of action for this ship would have
Speaker 1: been to like runner not too not too far distances
Speaker 1: or very long until that second engine craps out and
Speaker 1: then just scrap it and use that steal to build
Speaker 1: you know, other stuff on the battleships or something like that,
Speaker 1: or just scrap it. Yeah, that would have been that too. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that just doesn't make any sense. It would be as
Speaker 1: if I were going to take a you know, a
Speaker 1: road trip in my car, but I only got first
Speaker 1: and second Geary. I mean that, that's essentially it. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna drive a thousand miles, but it's gonna take me
Speaker 1: weeks because my mac speed is you know, twenty miles
Speaker 1: an hour. It's just it's foolish. Yeah. Do nobody in
Speaker 1: good conscience would do that? Yeah, it is, you know.
Speaker 1: And and frankly, this thing was designed with an inadequate
Speaker 1: inadequate number of engines anyway. Um, and that probably gets
Speaker 1: back to things like, you know, if you're gonna have
Speaker 1: a big, big tour in the floatplane and a big
Speaker 1: that holds forty prisoners, well you gotta you gotta make
Speaker 1: up that space somehow. Well, but the fleet submarines at
Speaker 1: the US building World War two had four diesel engines
Speaker 1: in them. And you know, the you guys are seeing
Speaker 1: the blue Back, you know, the blue back. Blue back
Speaker 1: has got three diesel engines in, you know, and it's
Speaker 1: not even how big is I mean blue is two
Speaker 1: ft long? Yeah, and so you know, it seems to
Speaker 1: me that three is the minimum, you know, really needed. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I've got a chance to take a tour of a
Speaker 1: Russian Foxtrott submarine and that's that's a pretty small dinky
Speaker 1: sub compared to compared to this thing, and that had
Speaker 1: three diesels on it. I mean it's like, you know,
Speaker 1: three is a minimum. So yeah, so you know, design
Speaker 1: constraints are you know, submarines are there's a huge design
Speaker 1: constraint which is a total volume equals total displacement, which
Speaker 1: is not the same as for surface ships, where displacement
Speaker 1: is smaller than the actual volume of the ship. And
Speaker 1: so there's only so much space on that thing. So
Speaker 1: I assume to like do things like a brig in
Speaker 1: you had to cut out a diesel engineer too, or
Speaker 1: you know, the what is it the null tank or
Speaker 1: then then the negative tank, Yeah, the negative tanks. Maybe
Speaker 1: there is an all tank would If you look at
Speaker 1: the tanking diagram of the submarine, you would be amazing
Speaker 1: how many tanks there are on a typical submarine. Uh
Speaker 1: so where were we? Oh yeah? So so anyway, so
Speaker 1: they decide to send to the Pacific Theater. So she
Speaker 1: she left and went to Bermuda where she resupplied and
Speaker 1: then headed south and there to go to the go
Speaker 1: through the Panama Canal. I guess southwest tech Yeah, like
Speaker 1: like that would make sense, and headed southwest. The plan
Speaker 1: was to go through the Panama Canal, stop off at
Speaker 1: Tahiti for a little resupply, then on to Sydney. Uh
Speaker 1: So she never made it to the Panama Canal. She
Speaker 1: disappeared somewhere between Bermuda and the Panama Canal. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: so the question is what happened to her? Here's the
Speaker 1: installed mystery part of things. Yeah. Yeah, why would they
Speaker 1: send a ship like that? Which is a valid question. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So you know, again there were questions about her loyalty,
Speaker 1: and according to the U. S. Navy, she was done
Speaker 1: in by an accident. Accident. Okay, so and again this
Speaker 1: is this is my own fault. But I read this theory.
Speaker 1: I could never quite understand exactly how this would have
Speaker 1: gone down. I don't understand what you didn't understand about it. Well,
Speaker 1: it just seems that if this is such a massive ship,
Speaker 1: I mean, well okay, before we're getting ahead of our
Speaker 1: So what is what is the theory or give us
Speaker 1: the details on this particular one. Well what the What
Speaker 1: the U. S. Navy said is that there's an American
Speaker 1: freighter named that Thompson likes was was steaming in that area,
Speaker 1: the same area that the thing that our sub was
Speaker 1: in and reported hitting and running down a partially submerged object,
Speaker 1: and her lookouts supposedly heard people in the water, but
Speaker 1: they went on was out without stopping because they were
Speaker 1: assuming it was a U boat on German U boat,
Speaker 1: although apparently they said they had heard people yelling out
Speaker 1: in English, so there were only those problems. Yeah, there
Speaker 1: were only three people on the boat who spook English,
Speaker 1: so I mean, I was some of the French did,
Speaker 1: but you know, you think they would be like yelling
Speaker 1: in French, but you know, it's it's hard to say.
Speaker 1: It was supposedly a very very dark night, uh, and
Speaker 1: they just heard really kind of more heard and felt
Speaker 1: rather than saw. There was I found a thing on
Speaker 1: the on the interwebs, some guy who had claimed that
Speaker 1: his grandfather was on the Thompson likes and said that
Speaker 1: he was. He was. He remembered the incident very clearly,
Speaker 1: and he said it was the biggest submarine you've ever seen.
Speaker 1: Although I'm questioning that because it's like it's like I said,
Speaker 1: I thought it was a dark, moonless night and nobody
Speaker 1: could see, so I guess my my question about that is, like, okay,
Speaker 1: so you assume it's a German U boat and like whatever,
Speaker 1: like humanitarian problems without a sign, like fine, but you
Speaker 1: have lights on your ship. You have you just have
Speaker 1: you have lights on your ship, on the deck of
Speaker 1: your ship, and maybe you just like shine one down there,
Speaker 1: just like hey, what was that? Okay it was, let's
Speaker 1: keep going, or oh no, that was something much bigger
Speaker 1: and we should probably stop and try and help these people,
Speaker 1: or oh we just hit a whale, like you know, whatever,
Speaker 1: the possibility you take one light, one lookout person takes
Speaker 1: one light, turns the switch on, but it takes one
Speaker 1: light to get spotted by the enemy and be shot.
Speaker 1: This is true. This is true. If you if you
Speaker 1: believe that, you just run over a U boat. Then
Speaker 1: you just run over pretty much all of the enemy
Speaker 1: that's in the area, probably crowning. You just watched them
Speaker 1: drown for a second. Yeah, I mean it might be.
Speaker 1: It could be that if you you know, obviously from
Speaker 1: a humanitarian standpoint, because you could have just run over
Speaker 1: somebody's goat or something like that. It's hard to say,
Speaker 1: but ship a small cruise ship, yeah yeah, yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: but of course you know, of course, if if you
Speaker 1: really think that it's the U boat, well the U boat,
Speaker 1: and the U boat doesn't think the boat might sink you,
Speaker 1: So maybe you want to beat feet out of there too.
Speaker 1: I mean, maybe that's why they did it, I guess.
Speaker 1: Or you check to make sure that it's actually thinking,
Speaker 1: and if it's not, while they're like in panic mode,
Speaker 1: you shoot your one round into them and then they
Speaker 1: actually are thinking. Well you can do that, you know,
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess that just in my mind. Again,
Speaker 1: I understand I'm not a soldier in the more or
Speaker 1: anything like that, but you shine a light, I would
Speaker 1: think you would, now you'd want to know is actly
Speaker 1: what you know, what you ran over? I would think so,
Speaker 1: But they didn't. And it's kind of surprising because and
Speaker 1: I know it's wartime, but you know, a law of
Speaker 1: the sea and all that, you're supposed to stop and
Speaker 1: help people. And especially then the report that they hear
Speaker 1: people calling out in English. Yeah, you know, you think
Speaker 1: that if they actually heard somebody calling out in English,
Speaker 1: but they really didn't want to stop, then they would
Speaker 1: just keep quiet about it. So here's here's the thing
Speaker 1: is when what I didn't understand, and this gets back
Speaker 1: to my initial question, is what it didn't get is
Speaker 1: if the circuf is so large and such a manage ship,
Speaker 1: I would think that hitting it would cause excessive amounts
Speaker 1: of damage to a top side boat. I would think
Speaker 1: that that would just mangle the holy crap out of
Speaker 1: the hole to the point that that ship would go
Speaker 1: down as well, because it's it's just such a big
Speaker 1: chunk of metal in the water. I guess it could
Speaker 1: be a glancing blow. But glancing blow wouldn't sink the sun, No,
Speaker 1: but a glancing blow could tilt it off of its act.
Speaker 1: You could knock it over and it's open. Everybody's like
Speaker 1: up there doing stuff or whatever. It was over. Well,
Speaker 1: they said it was partially submerged. They say they partially
Speaker 1: submerged object that probably even when it's top side, it's
Speaker 1: partially submerged, right, Well, I mean it's always any boats
Speaker 1: partially submerged always, But it's like you know, I mean, yeah,
Speaker 1: they could have been diving, for example, they could have
Speaker 1: been surfacing and then then so this thing just sort
Speaker 1: of scrapes along the top of it. But the thing is,
Speaker 1: if it did that sort of glancing blue scraping thing,
Speaker 1: it's not going to probably damage the sub enough to
Speaker 1: sink it. To me, and this this is where this
Speaker 1: gets back to where I had issues with it. If
Speaker 1: you think about the two moving perpendicular to each other
Speaker 1: and they hit it basically a ninety degree angle, it's
Speaker 1: and it causes enough damage to sink the sub. That
Speaker 1: to me means it causes enough damage to the ship
Speaker 1: to potentially sink it as well. If it's a glancing blow,
Speaker 1: you know, so they're almost parallel to each other, well
Speaker 1: then they bounce off of each other, and that doesn't
Speaker 1: seem like that would be enough force to sink the sub.
Speaker 1: That's what I didn't get about this whole We ran
Speaker 1: them over, that's yeah, that's true. Yeah, well they did
Speaker 1: hear scraping along their keel. So that what's again to me,
Speaker 1: it kind of reinforces that the idea perhaps they were submerging,
Speaker 1: and so if they were like kind of submerging already
Speaker 1: and they got run over and then you know, that
Speaker 1: would that would cause a lot of scraping sounds and
Speaker 1: stuff like that, and there was damage apparently to the
Speaker 1: likes about I didn't see that when it wasn't I mean,
Speaker 1: it was obviously it wasn't enough damage to stop them. No, no, no,
Speaker 1: did that according to the kind of that I was
Speaker 1: talking about. The guy with the grandfather who was in
Speaker 1: the ship, he said that they were actually taken on
Speaker 1: water after Okay, well, then validity to the theory for me,
Speaker 1: because I didn't I did never see that before. I
Speaker 1: also guess you can take on some water as a ship. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you still got you've got pumps and stuff like that.
Speaker 1: You've got pumps or you know, you section off that
Speaker 1: shut section and you shut your fire door and everything's
Speaker 1: fine for you know, the twenty minutes that it takes
Speaker 1: you or yeah, I mean, yeah, even if it's two days,
Speaker 1: it's all compartment. Yeah you're gonna list badly, but yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: so it wasn't Yeah, they were taking on water, but
Speaker 1: it wasn't catastrophic. So I that that solves that for me,
Speaker 1: and I can I can run with that a little
Speaker 1: more now that I never was very weird. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: so yeah, I don't know. But you know, the question
Speaker 1: is I mean to you know, a submarine has two holes.
Speaker 1: It's got the pressure hole on the inside, then it's
Speaker 1: got the outer hole that you actually see. The pressure
Speaker 1: hall is built very stoutly to withstand tremendous amounts of
Speaker 1: water pressure. Probably the pressure hall didn't get breached. Probably
Speaker 1: maybe one or two ballast tanks got breached. So even
Speaker 1: if they weren't sunk, they were kind of screwed because,
Speaker 1: like say, for example, if your forward ballast tanks can
Speaker 1: no longer hold air because they've been breached, then if
Speaker 1: you try to surface, well you're gonna be sort of
Speaker 1: asked up in the air. You can still you can
Speaker 1: still escape and everything like that. You can still escape
Speaker 1: the sub and you can still make the surface, but
Speaker 1: you really can't operate that kind of in that kind
Speaker 1: of condition. So one theory that's out there is that
Speaker 1: they were actually done it by kind of a one
Speaker 1: two punch set. They were hit by the likes and
Speaker 1: they were damaged enough they were kind of dead in
Speaker 1: the water. And that was on the night of February eighteen,
Speaker 1: by the way, So they're dead in the water. And
Speaker 1: believe that was yes, the next day some some according
Speaker 1: to the records of the six Heavy Bomber Group there
Speaker 1: they were operating out of Panama, they claimed to have
Speaker 1: sank a large submarine north of Columbus. That's that's actually
Speaker 1: Crystal Cologne, Panama. They planned to a sanky large submarine
Speaker 1: to a seventeen and one B eighteen aircraft dropped bombs
Speaker 1: on this vessel, and so it was quite possibly the Tuku.
Speaker 1: You know, really a bad luck vessel when you think
Speaker 1: about it, you know, because if this happened, they get
Speaker 1: run over there, dead in the water, they're trying to
Speaker 1: figure out what to do, and then here comes to
Speaker 1: planes and just bomb the crap out of them. So there,
Speaker 1: so then I guess by that theory their communications are
Speaker 1: down to yeah, probably must have been. Yeah, they must
Speaker 1: have been, because you don't, I mean, it's not it
Speaker 1: doesn't happen so often that you bomb your own thing,
Speaker 1: right for your radio and tennis and towers around on
Speaker 1: the top, so something that's nothing. Yeah, yeah, it could
Speaker 1: be that the likes took off their radio stuff. You know,
Speaker 1: they weren't they were and they were unable to communicate.
Speaker 1: The thing that I finally explicable about this is that
Speaker 1: they found the submarine, they sank it. But generally speaking,
Speaker 1: in the Navy, they had like these cards that they
Speaker 1: give you that have like silhouettes of various craft or
Speaker 1: as ships and submarines and look, yeah, exactly exactly. They
Speaker 1: have all these you know, these these and they have
Speaker 1: these things that you can look at that will tell you, hey, okay,
Speaker 1: this is a U boat. Hey this is one of ours.
Speaker 1: And the Sirkup was one of the kind of one
Speaker 1: of the combat it should have been. It should have
Speaker 1: been some sort of a reference to. Certainly if they
Speaker 1: looked at there, if they looked at their reference cards
Speaker 1: and said, well, you bote, you vote your boat, there's
Speaker 1: nothing like it. Maybe the Cirkuf being one of a cord.
Speaker 1: Maybe they just never got around to putting it on
Speaker 1: the identification cards. You know, I can totally see it
Speaker 1: not being put in there. If it's one of a kind,
Speaker 1: why am I going to spend all this time adding
Speaker 1: it to all of these manuals for these guys, and
Speaker 1: these guys going, well, the Germans have been doing all
Speaker 1: this other crazy stuff. This must be one of their
Speaker 1: new subs that we've been hearing about. I just see,
Speaker 1: you know, a bunch of eighteen year old guys in
Speaker 1: an airplane going I don't know what it is. Oh well,
Speaker 1: i'll bet you, I'll bet you I know what it is,
Speaker 1: and just going crazy, dropping a ton of moms. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't see it as it doesn't
Speaker 1: look like a friendly one. So let's go ahead and
Speaker 1: kill it. I've never seen anything like that, have you. Nope? Okay,
Speaker 1: you know, and then you hail it, right or what?
Speaker 1: I don't know what that was. Hale it, You hail it,
Speaker 1: and there's no response, and you've got all right, great, right,
Speaker 1: it doesn't look like ours. It's not responding to our radio.
Speaker 1: Let's go ahead, and yeah, yeah, there are other theories too. Well, wait,
Speaker 1: I guess the next question of that is that is
Speaker 1: the place where the ship reported hitting something close to
Speaker 1: where the bombers reported bombing something. Yeah, it is so
Speaker 1: close enough that it could conceivably be the same thing. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: they're close. I did find one guy, one guy on
Speaker 1: the web who claimed that the circus could not have
Speaker 1: been in that place because if it was only running
Speaker 1: on one engine, that couldn't have it couldn't have actually
Speaker 1: gotten that far from Bermuda. But I actually that actually
Speaker 1: did a calculation. I figured out they probably could have.
Speaker 1: That's fair, yeah, probably, yeah, yeah, yeah for another day.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah. It's like, yeah, where they were sunk
Speaker 1: supposedly about twenty eight kilometers from Bermuda. They have six
Speaker 1: days to get there. Okay, but so well we've never
Speaker 1: found it, right, we've never found the wreckage. Well, according
Speaker 1: to UH is to be believed, they know, they know
Speaker 1: pretty precisely where it's at. They know the latitude and
Speaker 1: launched you to where the record is at. It's and
Speaker 1: it's an almost ten thousand feet of water and so
Speaker 1: that probably explained is when nobody has ever actually gone
Speaker 1: down to find problem. Yeah, it kind of is. It
Speaker 1: would be actually interesting too. I wish somebody would go
Speaker 1: to quite well, we need to write to Robert Ballard
Speaker 1: and as they didn't. Jack James Stowe say back in
Speaker 1: the seventies he was saying he was going to go
Speaker 1: look for it and try and find it. There was
Speaker 1: some rummer about that, but I don't believe he ever did. Well, no,
Speaker 1: he never did. But I came across the counsel that
Speaker 1: said that Cousteau was saying he was going to go
Speaker 1: look for this kouth and he made all this public
Speaker 1: kuha about it, and then the stories kind of followed
Speaker 1: that he got hushed up and basically told no, don't
Speaker 1: look for that. It would be in your better interest
Speaker 1: just not to look for that. Sung. Well, so we
Speaker 1: need to call up James Cameron. Yeah, yeah, Robert Ballard
Speaker 1: is Robert Ballard is the guy who took him down
Speaker 1: to the Titanic. We need That's the guy we need
Speaker 1: to call it. But we should just call it James Cameron.
Speaker 1: What should call it? Because actually he might think that
Speaker 1: we're so awesome he wants to put us in a movie. Yeah,
Speaker 1: uh yeah. So anyway, um there. You know, there are
Speaker 1: a lot of conspiracies theories surrounding this. One is that,
Speaker 1: uh it claims that the Brits didn't trust the Circuf.
Speaker 1: They thought that the Cirkuf was cooperating with the Vis
Speaker 1: French and actually sinking allied shipping and so this one
Speaker 1: of these series is that they deliberately sank it using
Speaker 1: using whatever, you know, aircraft and whatever. They just went
Speaker 1: out and found it and sank it. Another one is
Speaker 1: that when it was import in Bermuda, British divers swam
Speaker 1: out and attached limp it minds to it, which were
Speaker 1: time to go off several days after. What's a limpit mind? Yeah,
Speaker 1: limp it mine is a is a is a mine
Speaker 1: that's attached to a ship sold by magnets, and it's
Speaker 1: called a limp it because it's got a similar to
Speaker 1: a limp it, which is a sea snail that clings
Speaker 1: to rocks another heart. So basically what what this theory
Speaker 1: is saying then is that they just stuck a bunch
Speaker 1: of magnets with explosives on it and a couple of daytimer. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's one possibility. It's like being James Bond, Yes, James Bond,
Speaker 1: James n Yeah. Now, of course there's another theory that
Speaker 1: she was swallowed by the remainder triangle, which, of course
Speaker 1: as as possible, it's a lot more plausible to believe that,
Speaker 1: you know, leaving aside limpid minds, that she just suffered
Speaker 1: some sort of catastrophic failure because the submarine has a
Speaker 1: lot of a lot of hole openings. You know, that's
Speaker 1: where you have water that you know, the water coming
Speaker 1: in and out of you're venting and pulling in And yeah,
Speaker 1: that's entirely possible that if connection fails, And it's believable
Speaker 1: with this boat. This boat was more than ten years old. Man,
Speaker 1: it had been by this time, it had been well
Speaker 1: over a year before she had any spare parts of
Speaker 1: it was possible to sea fitting just failed and started
Speaker 1: letting lots of large amounts of water in another one,
Speaker 1: another another claim. The story is that she was caught
Speaker 1: in Long Island Sound refueling a German U boat. This one,
Speaker 1: this one. I was going to say that if you're
Speaker 1: if you're going to refuel a German U boat on
Speaker 1: the slide, it seems to be like doing a Long
Speaker 1: Island Sound is kind of a bad idea. Yeah, what
Speaker 1: is the story or the anecdotal evidence behind this? In
Speaker 1: other words, I know this this theory comes from some
Speaker 1: stories of something being sunk in the Long Island Sound,
Speaker 1: But I never could figure out how somebody tied it
Speaker 1: to being Yeah, I don't know either. I mean there
Speaker 1: might there might very well be a U boat wreck
Speaker 1: in the sound. I mean U boats were all over
Speaker 1: the place. I guess. My big question about that is,
Speaker 1: like she's running on one engine. She's got like no
Speaker 1: extra room in her entire body, right, Well, why is
Speaker 1: she refueling other things? Well, there is there is a
Speaker 1: good that is a good point. It's like you did,
Speaker 1: I mean she did. This boat actually did carry quite
Speaker 1: a lot of fuel for a submarine, which she obviously
Speaker 1: needed for herself. Yeah, probably, you know. And so there's
Speaker 1: another another story is that she was loaded up with
Speaker 1: French gold. Yeah okay, it flashed that out for you
Speaker 1: because I didn't see that one. Yeah yeah, yeah. So
Speaker 1: another another story, and again I don't place any any
Speaker 1: value on this at all, is that a lot of
Speaker 1: gold from the French treasury was actually put in their
Speaker 1: cargo compartment. You know that big space that was built
Speaker 1: to house forty prisoners. Yeah, well that's a nice big space.
Speaker 1: You stack a lot of gold bars in there. Oh
Speaker 1: those are great ballas. Yeah. I know that it's nice
Speaker 1: and low down there, and that I would definitely keep
Speaker 1: you from tipping over. So yeah, you know, but It's
Speaker 1: like like many of these stories about lost ships, somehow
Speaker 1: gold ones up getting interjected quite often. I was gonna say,
Speaker 1: this is just like the houring mcdan and Yamashita's gold
Speaker 1: talked about before. What how did Oh? Okay, well this
Speaker 1: one got it. Seems like it's what was the phrase
Speaker 1: we used, shoehorned in? Yeah? Probably probably. Well, I guess
Speaker 1: you know what about slavery? Yeah, well that's a good point.
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, I mean there's no reason they might
Speaker 1: have been running slaves from Africa to the New World.
Speaker 1: It's a little late for that. But wow. So there
Speaker 1: was a Jacques Cousteau, the Jacques Cousteau thing, so has
Speaker 1: claimed that Jacques sto actually did find it and go
Speaker 1: aboard and grab the gold, and that's why you shut
Speaker 1: up about it later. But again, that's that's not exactly believable. Um.
Speaker 1: And then there was a diver named Lee Prettyman who
Speaker 1: reported he claimed to have found it in the nineteen sixties.
Speaker 1: Uh and uh, and there was a newspaper article published
Speaker 1: about it, but he was actually forced to retract his
Speaker 1: story later on, so apparently because he apparently not Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so most of these series are really fairly weak.
Speaker 1: The strongest series at the six Heavy Bomber Group, the
Speaker 1: one that meant the one that I mentioned earlier, operating
Speaker 1: out of Panama. Their records do show that was sinking
Speaker 1: a large submarine on the morning of the February nineteen,
Speaker 1: but they never they never classified the kind of sub
Speaker 1: that they say said it was a big stuff. We
Speaker 1: said said it was a big sub. And so that
Speaker 1: seems it seems to me that you know, quite possibly
Speaker 1: they were just done in by the one to punch.
Speaker 1: You know, they get hit by a freighter and then
Speaker 1: the next morning they're trying to figure out what to
Speaker 1: do and limping towards shore and then here come these
Speaker 1: airplanes and boom. For guys, I feel bad for him.
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, it's like dying in a sub would
Speaker 1: not be a way to go there. Either you drown
Speaker 1: or you suffocate, or you start I mean, there are
Speaker 1: no good possibilities tying, and so it's like, yeah, it
Speaker 1: would be a way to go regardless of what happens. Yeah,
Speaker 1: or you managed to stub how get to the lifeboat,
Speaker 1: get over ward, you get the lifeboat and then later
Speaker 1: on you're eating sharks or you drift until you starved
Speaker 1: to death. All kinds of bad possibilities here. You're picked
Speaker 1: up by a U boating Yeah, I mean anything could
Speaker 1: happen here. Yeah. So anyway, sad, sad story. And you know,
Speaker 1: it is quite possible that they were done in by
Speaker 1: by British treachery. The Brits maybe for whatever reason, did
Speaker 1: decide to put a behind in their hole, but there's
Speaker 1: really no evidence for it. So which one so you
Speaker 1: think it was? So you, personally, Joe lean towards more
Speaker 1: of the one to punch approach, yeah, or possibly even
Speaker 1: just the one punch approach. I mean, there's no there's
Speaker 1: no real proof that the Thomas Likes actually hit this,
Speaker 1: hit this circof. There could have been other things that
Speaker 1: they hit. There's all kinds of stuff, even leaving inside
Speaker 1: ships and submarines. There's all kinds of stuff floating around
Speaker 1: the ocean. Yeah. Like you remember after after the tsunami
Speaker 1: in Japan a few years back then, like like one
Speaker 1: day somebody somebody goes on the Organ coast, goes out
Speaker 1: looks and there is this big floating dock that washed
Speaker 1: up on shore. It's like, you know, there's stuff like that.
Speaker 1: All over the place in the ocean. I mean, but
Speaker 1: they didn't obviously have containers back and they don't containers
Speaker 1: and container ships back then. But these days, you know,
Speaker 1: container ships lose containers over the side all the time.
Speaker 1: There's containers out there floating around, and you know, you know,
Speaker 1: even back in those days of World War Two, there's
Speaker 1: all kinds of stuff floating around the ocean that you
Speaker 1: can run into. So it may have been the one
Speaker 1: to punch, or it may have just been that the
Speaker 1: Thomas Likes hit something else entirely. And then these guys
Speaker 1: showed up on February nineteen in the early morning and
Speaker 1: sank listener, who personally, I I, based on the history
Speaker 1: of this this vessel, I have a feeling that to me,
Speaker 1: it's more of the mechanical issues. She had some kind
Speaker 1: of failure, because I mean, all this reading about you know,
Speaker 1: we couldn't get parts for and all this stuff. It
Speaker 1: just seems to me that something she basically spread the
Speaker 1: leak and went down because things just stopped working. It
Speaker 1: seems the simplest again, it's Accum's razor, but it's simplest,
Speaker 1: more plausible. Submarines Again, they operating a very hostile environment,
Speaker 1: and they are very complex machines. There's a lot of
Speaker 1: points of failure, and yeah, they can easily be done
Speaker 1: in by just a mechanical failure. Yeah, I mean I
Speaker 1: think I you know, when I was working on cruise ships,
Speaker 1: which is not comparable to a submarine really, but a
Speaker 1: little bit. It is that we had a ship in
Speaker 1: our fleet that like I had to go in for
Speaker 1: repairs like four times or something like that. And there
Speaker 1: was one time where they like took it out for
Speaker 1: repairs and like the front seat or just fell off
Speaker 1: the front seat or so it was like where they
Speaker 1: would load all the like cargo or whatever. So it's
Speaker 1: usually like above water and they would drop it down
Speaker 1: into the water and it just fell off like underwater,
Speaker 1: just fell off. Day. Like if it happens all the time,
Speaker 1: you know, somebody doesn't studer something on quite right, you
Speaker 1: know your you know then you know what twenty thirty
Speaker 1: years since they even had parts that were actually made
Speaker 1: for them. You know, they've been just cobbling repairs together
Speaker 1: ten years, yeah, ten years, ten years, yeah, but yeah,
Speaker 1: ten years. So well, yeah, we have in service and
Speaker 1: constantly and guys are working on in metric versus standard.
Speaker 1: It's easy to get everybody confused. Yeah, so I guess
Speaker 1: I agree with Steve. Yeah, I think mechanics, some kind
Speaker 1: of mechanical failure or a bombing. I don't think. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it could have been ebombing, It could have been I'm
Speaker 1: pretty sure it wasn't aliens, but maybe we don't think
Speaker 1: so it might have been. Okay, you think it might Okay,
Speaker 1: that's good. I'm willing to allow like a possibility, okay, alright, yeah, yeah, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1: So anyway, it's too bad for the CIRCUF. I think
Speaker 1: we solved this mystery pretty conclusively, and we think that
Speaker 1: maybe it was aliens. Okay, aliens, aliens bombing from the
Speaker 1: air and six just mechanical failure. Okay, that sounds right, perfect, Yeah, great, Okay,
Speaker 1: that's so cool now, And so now you're all experts
Speaker 1: on the CIRCUF. Alright, So if you want to see
Speaker 1: pictures of the Sokof, I've actually, I've actually found a
Speaker 1: cool picture across section of a model of the CIRCOF
Speaker 1: and so you can look at that and get an
Speaker 1: idea of the complexity of this beast. And also, if
Speaker 1: you want to see links to other sites. They will
Speaker 1: be on our website, which is Thinking Sideways podcast dot com.
Speaker 1: And if you like to if you were actually on
Speaker 1: the circuf and you somehome reculously survived, or if you're
Speaker 1: on the Thomas Likes, then you want to like like
Speaker 1: wig in a little bit here and tell us what
Speaker 1: happened then at State four line. Uh yeah, you might
Speaker 1: want to send us an email, which is Thinking Sideways
Speaker 1: Podcast at gmail dot com. Also, don't forget to check
Speaker 1: us out on Facebook and iTunes and Stitcher. And if
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Speaker 1: We really appreciate it. Let's wrap this up. Another mystery
Speaker 1: solved here on Thinking Sideways. That's it. Goodbye, talk to
Speaker 1: you guys soon. It was Aliens. I'm pretty sure now
Speaker 1: you're probably right with that.