Speaker 1: Hi Catherine, Hi Chelsea.
Speaker 2: How are you.
Speaker 1: Oh I'm good. I'm good. I'm just enjoying my new house.
Speaker 1: I had an energy cleaner come to my house.
Speaker 3: That's excellent.
Speaker 1: Do they do a little samey?
Speaker 4: Well, I wasn't there, which is how I prefer that
Speaker 4: to go down. I was on the road this weekend
Speaker 4: and they cleared my house of energy and she sent
Speaker 4: me an email with all sorts of shit about my
Speaker 4: house and what energy was holding on too, and some
Speaker 4: past life stuff. And I was like, oh, you know
Speaker 4: how I feel about pause lives. I just can't get
Speaker 4: my head around that. But I also spoke to a
Speaker 4: numerologist that one of my makeup guys referred me to
Speaker 4: because he told me a really fascinating story. He lost
Speaker 4: his dog and this numerologist helped him actually find his Missishka,
Speaker 4: like he led them to.
Speaker 1: Him right, And I was like, oh, I'd like to
Speaker 1: talk to that guy.
Speaker 4: So I only did a half hour reading because I
Speaker 4: don't have a lot of intention span for that.
Speaker 1: Kind of stuff. But I'm interested. I'm just not like
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 4: But every psychic in every medium, and every numerologist or
Speaker 4: astrologist that I have spoken to has told me that
Speaker 4: my mother is with my dogs all that my dogs
Speaker 4: all go to my mom.
Speaker 1: And I had this reading like two weeks ago before.
Speaker 4: Bernice was like going downhill and the neumerologists said Bert,
Speaker 4: he goes Bert and Bernie and I was like Bert
Speaker 4: and he goes is this Sesame Street? And I'm like, no, no,
Speaker 4: those are my dogs, Burt and Bernice. Burt and Bernice
Speaker 4: and he goes and Chunk and Tammy. Oh my gosh,
Speaker 4: I said the four dogs names that I have had.
Speaker 4: I mean, he didn't say Burt and Bernie's but this
Speaker 4: was premonitionionary because he did say Burt and Bernie. He
Speaker 4: goes Sesame Street or there's something about Oscar the Grouch
Speaker 4: and then Burt and Bernie and I was like, oh,
Speaker 4: those are my two dogs. But anyway, I had to
Speaker 4: say goodbye to Bernice last week. Knowing that she was
Speaker 4: going straight to see my mother made me just so happy.
Speaker 3: Yes, well, and Larelin Jackson talks about that in her
Speaker 3: book as well. There was one couple she did a
Speaker 3: reading for who know people came through for, but like
Speaker 3: all these pets and animals came through for, and even
Speaker 3: like a bee, they have saved from the middle of
Speaker 3: the road, and now I feel bad every time I
Speaker 3: be like in a puddle and I pulled out, Oh oh.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're there.
Speaker 4: I don't know if I have time to be pulling
Speaker 4: bees out of puddles though story I mean, I do
Speaker 4: have time, I just don't know that I'm going to
Speaker 4: be spending it that way.
Speaker 1: It's okay, it's okay.
Speaker 4: Doug went to Doggy Daycaren and Whistler and she was like,
Speaker 4: what do you want from this? She's like, this is
Speaker 4: our first discovery session.
Speaker 1: I was like what. I was like, discoveries, what do
Speaker 1: you mean. I'm like, it's a dog, Like, just fucking
Speaker 1: drain him.
Speaker 4: Meanwhile, Doug doesn't listen to anything, so he's just like
Speaker 4: all my other dogs.
Speaker 1: He's so sweet. He is so beautiful, doesn't matter. He's
Speaker 1: such a beautiful baby.
Speaker 4: We got to Vegas yesterday. We're all in a hotel room.
Speaker 4: There's like ten of us and we're all in a
Speaker 4: hotel room and Doug gets up on the bed urinates
Speaker 4: all over the bed in the hotel room in this
Speaker 4: huge suite that they gave us, and then ten minutes
Speaker 4: later he pisses all over the dining room floor and
Speaker 4: it sounded like a horse was peeing. Like Everyone's like,
Speaker 4: oh my god, is there a faucet on? And then
Speaker 4: we all looked and saw Doug Pete twice back to back.
Speaker 4: Oh no, oh, I thank you for this smarting that
Speaker 4: we just ruined.
Speaker 1: Oh no, well, I'll give it back to me the
Speaker 1: next time I'm there. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Well, Chelsea, I have just a sweet email from a listener.
Speaker 3: This was in a follow up to our Jane Fonda episode.
Speaker 3: She says, your Chelsea, I wanted to tell you how
Speaker 3: much I enjoyed the last podcast with Jane Fonda. She's
Speaker 3: such an icon and made such an impact on me
Speaker 3: in my youth and now in my later adulthood and
Speaker 3: everything in between. I was hooked on her from her
Speaker 3: fitness videos in the eighties and on Golden Pond. Spoke
Speaker 3: to me too as I had a hard father, then
Speaker 3: Nine to five book Club, and of course Grace and Frankie.
Speaker 3: As a fifty six year young woman, I look and
Speaker 3: listen to her with awe and admiration. When she said
Speaker 3: she closed up shop at eighty six, I felt that
Speaker 3: I'm happily divorced, single with a situationship with the wisdom
Speaker 3: that there are many roads to a good life. Really
Speaker 3: and truly, thank you for the podcast, love listening. Bravo
Speaker 3: to you all the best. Chrissy D in Chicago.
Speaker 4: I love hearing about how many people lives have been
Speaker 4: impacted by Jane Fonda.
Speaker 3: Oh totally, totally, And I just love that she says
Speaker 3: like there are many roads to a good life. So
Speaker 3: much of the time I'm on the show, we talk
Speaker 3: about like should I do this or that? And you know,
Speaker 3: you say this a lot, but it's like when you
Speaker 3: make the choice and you choose to go towards something
Speaker 3: that's the right thing, and if it's not, you change.
Speaker 4: Yeah, absolutely, and also just committing to your decision that
Speaker 4: you're making. When life hands you a curveball, it's okay,
Speaker 4: that's what life is, curveballs. Like, it doesn't have to
Speaker 4: go the exact way you want everything to go.
Speaker 1: In fact, if it does, then you're not really learning
Speaker 1: much at all.
Speaker 3: Right, it's right, exactly, So thanks for writing in, Chrissy.
Speaker 3: What's going on, Chelsea.
Speaker 4: Well, my two nieces are in college. My other one
Speaker 4: is graduated, so I'm getting ready to see them soon. Fine,
Speaker 4: actually invited two of them to I'll be on the
Speaker 4: podcast to give gen Z advice to young listeners.
Speaker 1: So this is a call to action.
Speaker 4: Actually, my nieces Jordan and Charlie are coming on to
Speaker 4: give advice because they're both great at it. They're both
Speaker 4: super smart, and they're both very compassionate, and Jordan definitely
Speaker 4: has a psychology brain. So I thought that would be
Speaker 4: good to incorporate more family members into the podcast. So
Speaker 4: if you're their age, my niece is nineteen and then
Speaker 4: twenty five. So if you guys are, if you have
Speaker 4: young kids or that age range, if you guys have questions,
Speaker 4: please send them in and we'll curtail them to that
Speaker 4: special episode.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Or if you have questions about gen Zers right in.
Speaker 4: If you want to understand gen Zers too, if you're
Speaker 4: older and you need some intel for your own children
Speaker 4: or whatever's happening, that's a good idea too.
Speaker 1: But yes, definitely for our younger listeners. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Our guest today has a new podcast called Messi that
Speaker 3: she co hosts with Christina Applegate, and I think we're
Speaker 3: ready to welcome her to the show, right, Chelsea.
Speaker 4: Yeah, our guest today is Jamie Lynn Sigler. Hi, Jamie
Speaker 4: Lynn Sigler, what's happening?
Speaker 5: What's I'm so excited to talk to you.
Speaker 1: Oh, it's so nice to see you. When was the
Speaker 1: last time we saw each other?
Speaker 5: Was it on your show?
Speaker 1: I don't know was it.
Speaker 5: It's like a very long time. It's been a very long.
Speaker 4: Well you look exactly the same, so you well that's
Speaker 4: not true, but thank you very much. I know you
Speaker 4: have a new podcast with Christina Gate. It's called MESSI,
Speaker 4: where you guys discuss your diagnoses, your lifestyle, well, I mean,
Speaker 4: not your diagnosis, your life with MS.
Speaker 5: So, yeah, and and other things.
Speaker 1: Of course, of course it's not only about MS.
Speaker 4: So tell me a little bit about reaching out and
Speaker 4: you guys connecting and figuring out that you even wanted.
Speaker 1: To do this.
Speaker 6: Yeah, well we were, you know, we've kind of been
Speaker 6: peripheral friends for a number of years, and then when
Speaker 6: she was diagnosed, our mutual friend mister Lance Bass put
Speaker 6: us in touch because I think, you know, she was
Speaker 6: in the middle of filming dead to me and was
Speaker 6: scared and confused and didn't know what this would mean
Speaker 6: for her and me, being somebody that's lived with this
Speaker 6: over two decades, he felt like I could help her
Speaker 6: and it just morphed into this beautiful friendship. Like I
Speaker 6: didn't realize how badly I needed to have somebody that
Speaker 6: also was having my sane experience to talk to. I'd
Speaker 6: never had that before. And we'd have these two hour
Speaker 6: conversations where we'd be laughing and crying and getting really
Speaker 6: intimate in ways that I had never done before. And
Speaker 6: she called me one morning, like super early, and she
Speaker 6: was like, I feel like we need to put these
Speaker 6: conversations out. I think it'll be healing for the both
Speaker 6: of us and for other people. And what we found
Speaker 6: since is it's been really cool because as specific as
Speaker 6: we're getting in our journeys and what we're dealing with
Speaker 6: in our lives, it's kind of universal for everybody because
Speaker 6: everybody's life is messy. Everybody has things that they push
Speaker 6: through and have to everybody has hands that were dealt
Speaker 6: that they wish they didn't have, And it's about basically
Speaker 6: trying to learn how to accept that and move forward
Speaker 6: with it. And so we're kind of taking you on
Speaker 6: that journey with us.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's very true.
Speaker 4: I think that a lot of people things happen in
Speaker 4: life all the time that completely changed the trajectory of
Speaker 4: what you thought was going to happen, and how you
Speaker 4: get around that psychologically, emotionally, physically, all of you know,
Speaker 4: all of the requirements that are necessary for you to
Speaker 4: soldier on. So tell me a little bit about your
Speaker 4: your experience, because I know that you kind of kept
Speaker 4: it hidden for a while your diagnosis, right.
Speaker 5: I did.
Speaker 6: I kept it hidden for almost sixteen years, and you know,
Speaker 6: there's a lot of things that led me to become
Speaker 6: public with it, the main one being I couldn't really
Speaker 6: hide it anymore and I didn't want to lie, and
Speaker 6: I didn't like the feelings of shame I was developing
Speaker 6: around it, you know, because it.
Speaker 5: Was a secret.
Speaker 6: I was starting to feel guilty and embarrassed by it,
Speaker 6: and I knew that I needed to just see, you know.
Speaker 5: I was so fearful.
Speaker 6: I was so fearful that people would only seems when
Speaker 6: they looked at me that I would lose work.
Speaker 5: That I just didn't know what it would mean for
Speaker 5: my life.
Speaker 6: Once I said it out loud, and ever since then,
Speaker 6: it's been like eight years. It's been this really slow
Speaker 6: process of acceptance for me, and I'm not quite there yet,
Speaker 6: but I'm getting there, and it's just, you know, it
Speaker 6: affects my walking, It affects my gait. That's the way
Speaker 6: it affects me the most. And I've just in the
Speaker 6: past two years finally started using a cane and a
Speaker 6: walking stick when I need And that took a lot
Speaker 6: for me to get there. It took a lot for
Speaker 6: me to actually say I am disabled, I have a disability,
Speaker 6: because I think for a long time maybe it meant
Speaker 6: that I was losing the battle, that it meant that
Speaker 6: I wasn't doing all the right things. And so, like
Speaker 6: you said too, the emotional journey, though beyond the physical,
Speaker 6: has been the greater one, and with that has come
Speaker 6: a lot of amazing gifts.
Speaker 1: I bet tell us about that.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I used to be the most closed off person
Speaker 6: in the world.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 6: I came from an immigrant mother who was like, never
Speaker 6: let them see you sweat, always put your lipstick, always
Speaker 6: look perfect, never let them know that there's a problem
Speaker 6: or you are a problem. And it's been a journey
Speaker 6: of kind of undoing that, and in my vulnerability and
Speaker 6: my forced vulnerability, because what I struggle with is on
Speaker 6: the outside, so people mention it, people see it. It's
Speaker 6: it's forced me to talk about it. I've had the
Speaker 6: greatest connections with people. It's deepened all my relationships and
Speaker 6: deepened my relationship with myself and my self worth and
Speaker 6: my value as a human no matter what I'm doing
Speaker 6: in my career or what my body, how my body
Speaker 6: is moving. And I really know wholeheartedly that I would
Speaker 6: not be who I am today without MS. As much
Speaker 6: as it breaks my heart to struggle the way that
Speaker 6: I do physically, I know it's part of my journey
Speaker 6: and I'm grateful for it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Wow, well that's huge.
Speaker 4: I mean, I think once you get to that place,
Speaker 4: then you really are around the corner from acceptance, because
Speaker 4: it sounds like you are an acceptance.
Speaker 5: I hope so I am.
Speaker 6: And it's really helped to talk about it, especially on
Speaker 6: MESSI and what Christina's done for me, because we're in
Speaker 6: two really different places with this. You know, she's still
Speaker 6: in the new phases and she's angry and she's she's
Speaker 6: in her grief. And not to say that I don't dip.
Speaker 5: My toe in that every once in a while, of
Speaker 5: course I do. I'm human.
Speaker 6: But what she's really allowed me to do is sit
Speaker 6: down sometimes and be like this sucks.
Speaker 5: I hate this. I wish I didn't have it.
Speaker 6: For so long I didn't allow myself to say that
Speaker 6: I was afraid to and she's She's taught me the
Speaker 6: beautiful balance of being able to express my emotions but
Speaker 6: still press forward and have the gratitude that I have.
Speaker 4: And can you educate us a little bit on how
Speaker 4: MS presents differently for different people, or like what the
Speaker 4: telltale signs are.
Speaker 6: Like definitely, yeah, MS is very different for everybody, which
Speaker 6: is I think kind of like the confusing part for people.
Speaker 6: And it's why you have to be your own advocate
Speaker 6: and speak onto like how it's affecting you and not
Speaker 6: hold back when it comes to that. So, like I said,
Speaker 6: for me, it's affected my gait and how I walk,
Speaker 6: and in the beginning stages was my bladder. So when
Speaker 6: I was working on Sopranos and I wasn't telling anybody,
Speaker 6: in the middle of a take, I'd be like, I'm sorry, sorry,
Speaker 6: I gotta go because I was gonna pee my pants.
Speaker 6: That is a very common symptom among women.
Speaker 1: And why does that happen?
Speaker 4: What is it doing to your bladder that it makes
Speaker 4: you have to go, Like impulsively.
Speaker 6: So there's so along all of our nerves is myolin.
Speaker 6: It's like if you look at a cord that you're
Speaker 6: going to plug in your lamp to the wall, there's
Speaker 6: this thick coating around the wires, and so the myolin
Speaker 6: is that for our nerves, and MS attacks the myolin,
Speaker 6: so there's little holes that are poked or it can
Speaker 6: damage it completely, so it weakens the signal and sometimes
Speaker 6: with that weakened signal, it could cause a spasm. So
Speaker 6: it can cause your bladder to start spasming, which then
Speaker 6: your brain is confused like do we have to go,
Speaker 6: do we have to pee?
Speaker 5: Do we hold it? What do we do?
Speaker 6: And then sometimes you just don't have the control. Unfortunately,
Speaker 6: there's medications that can help that. There's a lot of
Speaker 6: disease modifying drugs. But you know, for some it can
Speaker 6: affect their speech, their hands, cognitively, it can affect their
Speaker 6: energy levels. Luckily for me that's not the case. It's just,
Speaker 6: like I said, my bladder and my walking, and it's
Speaker 6: kind of been this like really slow burn for me
Speaker 6: over the last twenty two years, for better or worse.
Speaker 6: But I'm like, I'm a real stubborn fighter, and I
Speaker 6: keep trying, and I work out as much as I can,
Speaker 6: and I push my body as hard as it can go,
Speaker 6: because not only do I have dreams that I still
Speaker 6: keep alive, but I have two little boys that I
Speaker 6: really want to be as present for as I can.
Speaker 6: But there's also the hard reality of my limitations when
Speaker 6: it comes to being a mother.
Speaker 4: And do those physical limitations Are they the same always?
Speaker 1: Are they? Or does it? Is it sporadic? It's always
Speaker 1: the same?
Speaker 5: Yeah? For me, yes, yes, it's it's it's it.
Speaker 6: And I think that that works for me because I
Speaker 6: kind of know what I'm dealing with every day, and
Speaker 6: especially when I work, it's easy for me to say, Okay,
Speaker 6: here's what I can do, here's what I can't do,
Speaker 6: here's what I need, here's what I don't need.
Speaker 5: It's allowed me to find my voice at work.
Speaker 1: I bet.
Speaker 4: I mean, I mean, if you said you were hiding
Speaker 4: that right from your people you were working with for
Speaker 4: so long, how did you I mean having to actually
Speaker 4: a tell people like this is what's happening and then
Speaker 4: be set boundaries up like Okay, I want you to
Speaker 4: hire me, but now I have to give you four
Speaker 4: reasons why you might look away and go, we're not
Speaker 4: hiring her.
Speaker 5: Yep, yep. I've dealt with all of it. I've dealt
Speaker 5: with you know.
Speaker 6: My last job, I got hired on just to be
Speaker 6: like a recurring guest star, and then they kept me
Speaker 6: on for two seasons as a regular, And so in
Speaker 6: that experience, I was like, Oh, I'm not a burden.
Speaker 6: This doesn't deter anybody. They hired me for my talent
Speaker 6: and they worked around it, which was great. But at
Speaker 6: the end of that experience, I felt really strongly that
Speaker 6: the next thing I do, I just want to work
Speaker 6: in this body, Like, why can't I just walk the
Speaker 6: way I walk and play a character. It doesn't have
Speaker 6: to all be about MS, because my whole life is
Speaker 6: not about MS. But I've lost a role recently where
Speaker 6: they felt like the male character wouldn't look very good
Speaker 6: if he broke up with a girl that had a disability,
Speaker 6: which I get. I'm not mad at, I understand. I
Speaker 6: understand their ways of thinking, but also a lot of
Speaker 6: my trepidations about coming out about it was because there's
Speaker 6: nobody on camera that moves like me, unless it's like
Speaker 6: very specifically, like they're the character that has a disability
Speaker 6: and they're they're sympathetic or they're a villain, and I'm
Speaker 6: just gonna do my part and hopefully try to change that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like it. I like everything you're saying.
Speaker 4: That's very powerful, and I'm and noted on the podcast
Speaker 4: not only revolving around the disease, but revolving around your
Speaker 4: real lives. Because in order to represent MS on TV,
Speaker 4: or on podcasts or in media in any way, it
Speaker 4: doesn't have to be addressed all the time. You just
Speaker 4: have to have people who haven't who are acting like
Speaker 4: regular people, because that's what you are, a person.
Speaker 5: That's exactly right.
Speaker 4: So talk to me about your marriage, because I know
Speaker 4: you had a divorce when you were very very young.
Speaker 4: I was probably traumatic from what I gathered, correct, And
Speaker 4: then you went on to meet this new guy, your
Speaker 4: husband of how many years?
Speaker 6: Well, we've been together thirteen years, but we've been married.
Speaker 4: Eight okay, and you have two boys with him m hm.
Speaker 4: And so how did you go from a toxic relationship
Speaker 4: to the healthy relationship because that's what our listeners all
Speaker 4: want to know about.
Speaker 5: Let's talk about it.
Speaker 6: Well, my first marriage, so I've never really talked about
Speaker 6: much so he was ten years older than me, and
Speaker 6: then he became my manager.
Speaker 4: As it was funny though, sorry to interrupt, but I will,
Speaker 4: because isn't it funny that you can have a first
Speaker 4: marriage and almost forget that you were married all the time.
Speaker 4: Think about that, like people are upset about breaking up
Speaker 4: with people. It's like you might not even remember this
Speaker 4: person fucking ten years from now or five years from now.
Speaker 4: There are people that I was in relationships with that
Speaker 4: I've forgotten about.
Speaker 5: It's so true.
Speaker 6: I too, I forget all the time that I was married,
Speaker 6: literally married to somebody.
Speaker 1: Once, so something to remember people, Yes, that is very true.
Speaker 5: Life goes on.
Speaker 6: So after that, I had a series of three boyfriends
Speaker 6: that were all lovely, and you know, my first husband
Speaker 6: was like this kind of like showman like who turned
Speaker 6: out to be a bit of a sociopath. And then
Speaker 6: my next boyfriend was the opposite. He was like super quiet, reserved,
Speaker 6: which is kind of what I needed.
Speaker 5: And then I dated my.
Speaker 6: Co starred Jerry Ferarra an Entourage for a little bit,
Speaker 6: who was just like loving and supportive. Then I started
Speaker 6: going through like a little bit of an athlete phase.
Speaker 6: And then yes, I remember that but my end then
Speaker 6: my husband was an athlete and he's eight years younger
Speaker 6: than me, so when we were we weren't set up.
Speaker 6: He was hanging out with my best friend's husband because
Speaker 6: they were both baseball players, and I was in a
Speaker 6: dry spell for a while and he was leaving for
Speaker 6: spring training in a few weeks, and literally my girlfriends.
Speaker 5: Were like, he's so cute, he's into you, just like
Speaker 5: fucking for a little while, like have some fun, like.
Speaker 6: Come on, and I was like, okay, And I think
Speaker 6: because of that, we didn't play any games. You know,
Speaker 6: it was no like don't text or don't call, or
Speaker 6: leave a little space, leave a little time. We just
Speaker 6: jumped in just having fun and getting to know each
Speaker 6: other and kind of the rest is history.
Speaker 5: You know, we did long distance.
Speaker 6: We got pregnant by accident less than a year later,
Speaker 6: but that was just kind of, I say, God's way
Speaker 6: of interfering to keep me where I was, because I
Speaker 6: kind of had a history of like a year or
Speaker 6: two in and then I ran because of my divorce
Speaker 6: and like my fear of getting too deep into a relationship.
Speaker 6: And he is wonderful. He is the most supportive and patient,
Speaker 6: loving guy. And I would say the only I wouldn't
Speaker 6: call it an issue. But the thing that we really
Speaker 6: have to work through is the MS in this relationship,
Speaker 6: which sometimes feels like the third person in our relationship
Speaker 6: because sometimes I need him to.
Speaker 5: Back off with how much he's helping me.
Speaker 6: Sometimes I need him to just let me vent and
Speaker 6: not have to fix those types of things, which is
Speaker 6: like sort of been our only real struggle, thankfully.
Speaker 1: And as it should be.
Speaker 4: I mean, that is a struggle, so it wouldn't not
Speaker 4: be and you're blessed to not have to be stressed
Speaker 4: about anything else in your relationship.
Speaker 1: That is true.
Speaker 4: And I think that's very sagacious what you just said
Speaker 4: about venting, because that's definitely a thing.
Speaker 1: I want to fix people's problems always.
Speaker 4: I want to tell them what to do, and I
Speaker 4: want to give them advice, and I want to get involved.
Speaker 4: And that's not always welcome or necessary. Some people just
Speaker 4: want to fucking vent and that's it. They just want
Speaker 4: to get it off their chest and they don't want
Speaker 4: you to help them fix it, which is what you're saying.
Speaker 4: And I can respect that because I definitely have been
Speaker 4: there too. And then there are people that just can't
Speaker 4: see the forest for the trees who you want to help,
Speaker 4: but you can't because they're not listening. They don't get it,
Speaker 4: they don't see the problem, and they're focusing on the
Speaker 4: small things instead of the larger picture. But I think
Speaker 4: it is a very valuable thing to remember that sometimes
Speaker 4: people just need to be heard and to be listened to.
Speaker 4: And since I don't get to practice that on the podcast,
Speaker 4: because that's what this podcast is about, is giving advice
Speaker 4: and talking to people, I do want to say that
Speaker 4: I practice that.
Speaker 1: In real life with people.
Speaker 4: When I know that somebody has an issue, I just
Speaker 4: I'm trying very hard to sit and not interfere and
Speaker 4: just listen and hold someone or rub their arm or
Speaker 4: their back or whatever, because everyone needs that every once
Speaker 4: in a while. We all go through shit where you
Speaker 4: just you know somebody can't fix it, but want you
Speaker 4: want to complain, you want to get it out.
Speaker 1: It's like one thing after another.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you need to like release the pressure, valve a
Speaker 6: little bit, you know, like get.
Speaker 5: Some of that air out.
Speaker 6: And yeah, and I tell my husband and friends even
Speaker 6: sometimes like thank you for listening. This is something I
Speaker 6: want to.
Speaker 5: Figure out on my own. This is something that I
Speaker 5: know I'm going.
Speaker 6: To grow from figuring out on my own. And I
Speaker 6: think that comes also with time and experience of figuring
Speaker 6: out as the complainer or as the person that's needing
Speaker 6: to vent, differentiating like a mice saying this because I
Speaker 6: need your help, or am I saying this because I
Speaker 6: just need to vent, but knowing that I'm going to
Speaker 6: figure it out on my own.
Speaker 1: Okay, well, let's take a break and we'll be right back.
Speaker 3: If you need advice from Chelsea, write into Dear Chelsea
Speaker 3: Podcast at gmail dot com. You can ask about your
Speaker 3: biggest dating conundrums, the cheating scandal that's rocking your friend group,
Speaker 3: the funniest marital disagreements you need Chelsea to weigh in on,
Speaker 3: or anything else that's Dear Chelsea Podcast at gmail dot com.
Speaker 4: And we're back. We have some callers today, Jamie. I'm
Speaker 4: so happy you're here to give advice. Okay, what do
Speaker 4: we got, Catherine?
Speaker 3: We actually have people calling in from all over the place.
Speaker 3: We've got someone calling in from Spain, someone calling in
Speaker 3: from New Zealand's exciting.
Speaker 4: I can't believe people get my podcast overseas. Oh interesting,
Speaker 4: I didn't know how the internet works. Yeah, we'll start
Speaker 4: with Megan. So she is almost twenty one.
Speaker 1: Oh.
Speaker 3: She is calling from Spain, where she's been doing a
Speaker 3: semester abroad. So Meghan says, Dear Chelsea, I need your
Speaker 3: advice on whether or not to invite both my parents
Speaker 3: to my twenty first birthday party. I'm in college, and
Speaker 3: six months ago I found out my parents are getting
Speaker 3: a divorce. I already go to school out of state
Speaker 3: and I rarely see my family, but I haven't seen
Speaker 3: them in months now because I'm in another country for
Speaker 3: the semester. I'm heading home in a couple of weeks,
Speaker 3: and my birthday is the first week I'm home from
Speaker 3: study abroad. My siblings have been keeping me updated on
Speaker 3: all the drama, but I'm the youngest, so they're definitely
Speaker 3: keeping things from me. What I do know is my
Speaker 3: dad now has a long term girlfriend, and my mom
Speaker 3: has just started seeing.
Speaker 5: Someone great Great.
Speaker 3: My parents haven't spoken since Christmas, just through lawyers, so
Speaker 3: my birthday would be the first time they'd be in
Speaker 3: the same room. I know they want me to be happy,
Speaker 3: and we'll do whatever I want them to do, but
Speaker 3: I also know one of them will be extremely bummed
Speaker 3: if they aren't there to celebrate me. Thanks so much
Speaker 3: for being my therapist when I can't visit my actual therapist.
Speaker 3: Whatever advice you can give would be amazing. Megan, Why
Speaker 3: she is Hi?
Speaker 1: You little almost twenty one year old cutiepows Hi?
Speaker 2: Hi?
Speaker 7: How are you?
Speaker 2: Hi?
Speaker 1: Cutie? This is Jamie Lan Siegler. She's our special guest today.
Speaker 7: Hi, Jamie.
Speaker 1: Hi.
Speaker 4: I think it's a perfect opportunity for your parents to
Speaker 4: challenge up to meet the moment and make this their
Speaker 4: first outing. And it's not about them.
Speaker 1: It's about you.
Speaker 4: Yeah, No, definitely, And I think listen, obviously, somebody got
Speaker 4: very hurt, but if they're both dating other people, that
Speaker 4: softens everybody's pain. Obviously, your father, if he has a
Speaker 4: long term girlfriend, then he's probably had her for a while,
Speaker 4: and your mother probably hates thinks he's an asshole, but
Speaker 4: she's dating someone and that's very positive. And if you
Speaker 4: feel like you should have a conversation with either one
Speaker 4: of them beforehand, then you should do that too, just
Speaker 4: to be like, hey, this is a big day for me.
Speaker 4: You know, it's my twenty first birthday and I really
Speaker 4: would love to have both of you there, and I
Speaker 4: know you want to be with me, and let's just
Speaker 4: make this as easy and pain free as possible.
Speaker 7: Yeah, no, I completely agree.
Speaker 8: I think I struggle with having like those conversations with them,
Speaker 8: just being the youngest and having to.
Speaker 7: Go with the flow. I never really I don't.
Speaker 8: Like to make things about me entirely, so it's definitely
Speaker 8: going to be difficult to have that conversation with them.
Speaker 8: But my sisters also said the same thing. They were like,
Speaker 8: you know, look like this could be the first time
Speaker 8: we really get them together and we can test the waters.
Speaker 8: But if you don't want that, they said they would
Speaker 8: support me in whatever decision I make, And I have
Speaker 8: been debating, telling them I don't even want either of
Speaker 8: them there and just doing a whole thing with my
Speaker 8: friends and my siblings' friends and celebrating it separately. But
Speaker 8: it's a big birthday, especially, you know, I've been waiting
Speaker 8: to turn twenty one having older siblings all in their twenties,
Speaker 8: so I.
Speaker 1: Know the feeling. I'm with you, I got it.
Speaker 8: Oh yeah, I definitely need to have a conversation with them,
Speaker 8: and if whatever happens, it happens.
Speaker 7: But I know they're not going to intentionally try to
Speaker 7: ruin my day.
Speaker 1: No, they're not.
Speaker 4: And also something you just said, you have problems putting
Speaker 4: yourself first, This is a great opportunity to put yourself
Speaker 4: for f You're going to have to go through life
Speaker 4: and there are going to be times where you have
Speaker 4: to put yourself first.
Speaker 1: And that doesn't mean you're selfish.
Speaker 4: That just means that you're healthy and you know that,
Speaker 4: like certain dynamics require.
Speaker 1: This is your birthday party.
Speaker 4: And if you don't want to have the conversation, then
Speaker 4: write them an email and put it on the email together.
Speaker 4: Put them on the email together if you want to
Speaker 4: be like, Okay, this is all I've ever known. I
Speaker 4: understand you guys aren't together, and I totally support both
Speaker 4: of you. This is my birthday. I would love to
Speaker 4: have both of you there. If we can have a peaceful,
Speaker 4: joyful celebration, and if you don't think that you can
Speaker 4: come with that attitude, then we'll celebrate on our own
Speaker 4: at another time. But I don't want this birthday to
Speaker 4: be about your divorce. Actually, write down exactly what I
Speaker 4: just said.
Speaker 1: Because that was really perfect.
Speaker 5: I just wrote it down.
Speaker 7: Good thing it's being recorded.
Speaker 8: Yeah yeah, no, but you said, you know, you saying
Speaker 8: an email. That's actually really interesting because my dad would
Speaker 8: honestly reply to an email faster than a text message.
Speaker 7: So that's a good idea.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's how you know what generations people are from.
Speaker 7: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I do have older parents.
Speaker 3: So even if you're sort of an adult like you
Speaker 3: are now, when your parents get a divorced, you have
Speaker 3: to grow up really fast. So you know, this is
Speaker 3: that first conversation that you have to have where like
Speaker 3: you are taking the reins of this relationship dynamic.
Speaker 1: So how are you feeling about their separation and divorce?
Speaker 1: Does that bother you? Were you shocked? Were you upset?
Speaker 7: Well, it was more I wouldn't say shocked.
Speaker 8: It was more like we didn't think it was ever
Speaker 8: going to happen because they would always put their relationship
Speaker 8: in even us first.
Speaker 4: Well, of course, these couples they wait until their kids
Speaker 4: are out of the house. It's like, who the fuck
Speaker 4: are you waiting? Like, the kids don't get they just
Speaker 4: want normal parents. And when you're fucking fifteen through twenty one,
Speaker 4: you are not thinking about your parents.
Speaker 1: You are thinking about your life.
Speaker 8: Right, It's been a lot of ups and downs, just
Speaker 8: because when I first found out, I didn't find out
Speaker 8: in like the best way possible. But then I was
Speaker 8: also at school like fifteen hundred miles away, and now
Speaker 8: I am studying abroad in the completely diferent country, So
Speaker 8: I'm I don't even know the full story of what's
Speaker 8: happening back home. I just get what my siblings tell me,
Speaker 8: because obviously my parents aren't telling me anything. They're just
Speaker 8: sugarcoating everything. So I don't necessarily know exactly what I'm
Speaker 8: going home to. I just have an idea of what
Speaker 8: I'm going home too. And that's the other thing that
Speaker 8: I'm struggling with.
Speaker 3: What are your siblings saying about it?
Speaker 8: I mean, as much as I love my brother and
Speaker 8: I love talking to him in a person, have to
Speaker 8: finish that way.
Speaker 1: We all know, brothers.
Speaker 4: You should see the text I got my I had
Speaker 4: to put my dog down recently, and my brother sent
Speaker 4: me this text. And I have two brothers, and one
Speaker 4: of them is so sweet and so loving, and the
Speaker 4: other one is a fucking asshole. And the texts I
Speaker 4: got from my I mean, the two texts just describe
Speaker 4: their I might have to put them in my new
Speaker 4: book because it really just shows you who.
Speaker 1: Each person is.
Speaker 7: Yeah. No, well, first I just want to say I'm
Speaker 7: sorry about your dog. I loved seeing all those.
Speaker 1: Oh thank you many thank you.
Speaker 4: What are they saying your sister's saying about the dynamics
Speaker 4: since they separated.
Speaker 8: I think they're telling me what I ask them questions about.
Speaker 7: And one my sister, she.
Speaker 8: Does like still live in my hometown and so she's
Speaker 8: getting it all in person, so a lot. And she's
Speaker 8: also the oldest, so my mom is kind of putting
Speaker 8: everything on her, and then my dad is asking her like, oh, like,
Speaker 8: how's your mom doing? And she's very much in the middle.
Speaker 8: So sometimes when we call to catch up, she kind
Speaker 8: of just dumps it all on me, and which I'm
Speaker 8: okay with because then I am getting the full truth.
Speaker 8: Whereas my other sister, who knows way more about everything
Speaker 8: that's been happening, like she's known since the beginning, She's
Speaker 8: more like, I'll tell you whatever you want to know
Speaker 8: and whatever you ask questions about. But I don't want
Speaker 8: to ruin your study abroad experience by just calling you
Speaker 8: when something happens and telling you what's going on. You know,
Speaker 8: she just waits for me to ask.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it sounds like you have great sisters.
Speaker 5: Yeah, okay, it's so considerable.
Speaker 8: I do.
Speaker 7: I'm really lucky.
Speaker 4: Yeah, totally, that's so nice. I have great sisters too.
Speaker 4: It's so Jamie, do you have sisters?
Speaker 5: No, I grew up with two older brothers.
Speaker 1: Okay, so then you have you have to deal with that.
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 7: Yeah you understand the brother that.
Speaker 6: Yeah, of course, of course. But I think you know,
Speaker 6: like your parents made this decision for them and what
Speaker 6: was right for their lives, Like Chelsea said, like this
Speaker 6: is your opportunity to do that for yourself, and your
Speaker 6: twenty first birthday is one to remember hopefully, and like
Speaker 6: you should say that in your email. If you feel
Speaker 6: like they're not going to be able to show up
Speaker 6: for you the way that you need, then maybe it's
Speaker 6: just not the place for them to be at.
Speaker 5: Maybe you don't even want them there.
Speaker 3: Maybe you have like a family dinner and like you
Speaker 3: get to go out and get trashed with your friends,
Speaker 3: you know, for like at the actual twenty first birthday, what.
Speaker 1: Is the plan? Is it a big party?
Speaker 8: You said, it's a big group of us going downtown,
Speaker 8: Like a lot of my friends won't be home from
Speaker 8: school yet, so it's only a few of my friends,
Speaker 8: but it's my siblings and all of their friends who
Speaker 8: also watched me grow up and they've all.
Speaker 7: Been waiting for me to turn twenty one.
Speaker 8: So it's going to be it's going to be so
Speaker 8: much fun because it's a big group. But also I
Speaker 8: don't know who knows what of what's been going on
Speaker 8: because everything is so new. So if a fight does
Speaker 8: break out, like I really don't want to be put
Speaker 8: in a situation, and I doubt my siblings want to
Speaker 8: be put in a situation where we have to like
Speaker 8: explain that or like cover that up.
Speaker 1: You know, well, I think this email will cover.
Speaker 4: You'll find out where they are and if they're able
Speaker 4: to be in the same space together, and if they're not,
Speaker 4: then you know, then they're not and that's okay too,
Speaker 4: Like then you can have celebrate with them individually, because
Speaker 4: it does sound like what you're going to do is
Speaker 4: basically like a bar crawl, right.
Speaker 7: That's that's exactly what we're doing. Yeah, party, bus bar.
Speaker 4: That's going to be more fun without your parents anyway,
Speaker 4: So you could go either way you want with this one.
Speaker 4: I mean, you know, and they'll probably only come and
Speaker 4: then leave, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: They're not going to be there all night.
Speaker 7: Yeah right, They're probably gonna go home by ten.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah.
Speaker 3: And I would worry less about like a fight breaking
Speaker 3: out than like just general tension.
Speaker 1: My last piece of advice that will tell you is hydrate.
Speaker 3: Hydrate all day and then between every day you have
Speaker 3: a water you'll see get I would love to try
Speaker 3: that one time.
Speaker 4: I would love because of how much I fucking detest water.
Speaker 4: But now I have my new water flavorers that.
Speaker 1: I like my electro life.
Speaker 4: But I would love to go out drink, have a
Speaker 4: glass of water like everyone's been fucking talking about for
Speaker 4: the last fifty thousand years, and see if.
Speaker 1: That makes a fucking difference. Because I doubt it will
Speaker 1: does for me, it does the.
Speaker 8: Next day, then maybe I should Maybe I should tell
Speaker 8: them to drink water.
Speaker 1: I just get an IV Get an IV there. It
Speaker 1: is a preemptive well.
Speaker 8: Honestly, I was thinking about that, just booking an appointment
Speaker 8: and getting.
Speaker 4: Get a phyplactic IVY so that you're prepared for all
Speaker 4: the water that all the dehydration coming your way, and
Speaker 4: also have a great fucking birthday. Twenty one is a
Speaker 4: huge birthday. That's your first big birthday in your life
Speaker 4: other than when you turn eighteen.
Speaker 1: That's good.
Speaker 8: Well, eighteen these days isn't like that big of a
Speaker 8: deal because like what, you can vote, maybe get drafted
Speaker 8: to the war, but what all the perks.
Speaker 4: Seventeen was big because of your license, So that was
Speaker 4: my that was seventeen sixteen. Oh I didn't get my license,
Speaker 4: so sixteen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, seventeen was big.
Speaker 4: Eighteen was big, and then twenty one and then after
Speaker 4: that it's every ten years.
Speaker 7: So yeah, I'm gonna say it's just down hope from here.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I enjoy yourself and your future is Thank you so much. Okay,
Speaker 4: you're welcome. Hoy Bday, Happy birthday.
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 7: I appreciate it. Bye guys, Bye Jamie.
Speaker 1: What's your situation? Are you allowed to drink while you're
Speaker 1: on the medication you're on for MS or no?
Speaker 6: I am allowed. I just don't alcohol for whatever reasons.
Speaker 6: Never really hit me, right, Oh cannabis does?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Oh interesting, interesting, very nice.
Speaker 4: It's why all drugs affect me in a positive way
Speaker 4: and other people either like it's they like one or
Speaker 4: the other. Typically alcohol or cannabis, right, all of my
Speaker 4: friends that are cannabis people don't like alcohol, you.
Speaker 6: Know, I get in my younger years, I just would
Speaker 6: get slappy, like I'm the girl that like the decision
Speaker 6: making goes out the window, Like wouldn't it be funny
Speaker 6: if I flashed them so I fly, you know, like
Speaker 6: I would just be.
Speaker 1: Right, I hear you. Okay, fair enough.
Speaker 3: Well, let's take a break and we'll be right back.
Speaker 3: Our next caller is Katie. She says, Dear Chelsea, I'm
Speaker 3: writing in today to ask you about an issue that
Speaker 3: I've honestly struggled with ever since I was a teenager. Basically,
Speaker 3: my question is this, how do you deal with a
Speaker 3: friend who develops romantic feelings for you when you don't
Speaker 3: have the same interest in them. This has happened to
Speaker 3: me many times over the years, mostly with my guy friends,
Speaker 3: and I never feel like I handle the situation well.
Speaker 3: My typical approach is to ignore the signs that they
Speaker 3: have feelings for me as long as possible, and then
Speaker 3: when they finally decide to bring up their feelings, I
Speaker 3: try to shut it down as politely as I can.
Speaker 3: No matter what, I always end up feeling guilty about
Speaker 3: the situation, like I've been leading them on or something. Also,
Speaker 3: when we do end up having the conversation about dating
Speaker 3: and how I'm not interested, it frequently feels like they're
Speaker 3: trying to argue with me or convince me to change
Speaker 3: my mind. The way I see this is if I'm
Speaker 3: not attracted to you romantically or interested in you, I'm
Speaker 3: not going to spend my limited time and energy giving
Speaker 3: it a chance. Life's too short for that shit. So
Speaker 3: how do I shut these types of conversations down while
Speaker 3: preserving the friendship? Katie Hi, Katie Hi?
Speaker 1: Hi, This is JB. She's our special guest, So say
Speaker 1: hi to her.
Speaker 7: Hi, Nice to meet you too.
Speaker 4: Okay, so you seem to get a lot of people.
Speaker 4: Is it all men or are you implying that there
Speaker 4: was a woman that has a crush on you now?
Speaker 2: Oh that Well, there is a woman who has a
Speaker 2: crush on me now, but that's kind of my fault.
Speaker 2: But well, we met on a dating app, so like
Speaker 2: that's a separate issue.
Speaker 1: Okay, let's go back. I'm curious about that issue also.
Speaker 2: But yeah, well so, but mostly the issue is like
Speaker 2: straight guys that I've been friends with, I don't think
Speaker 2: I can think of a single guy friend that I
Speaker 2: have that I'm still friends with who didn't have a
Speaker 2: crush on me at some point. So I feel like
Speaker 2: I'm constantly having to deal with this, but also like
Speaker 2: a lot of my friends deal with this too, where
Speaker 2: you know, they're like they it's some guy they know,
Speaker 2: some guy like they work with or is like a
Speaker 2: mutual friend or something like that, and then it just
Speaker 2: gets really awkward really fast.
Speaker 4: And have you ever handled it where it was a
Speaker 4: successful result and you remain friends with the guy after
Speaker 4: they revealed to you that they had feelings.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I have a few guy friends who handled
Speaker 2: it well and we're still friends.
Speaker 4: And how did you handle those interactions when it came
Speaker 4: down to the wire.
Speaker 2: I mean, I just feel like I was like, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm not interested. Can we just be friends? And I
Speaker 2: feel like a lot of the work is on their part,
Speaker 2: like of being like, Okay, yeah, I'm going to be
Speaker 2: cool with this and I'm going to accept it. I
Speaker 2: was like, hey, I understand if you like need some
Speaker 2: time and space, that's fine, but then the ball's.
Speaker 7: Kind of in their core. I feel like to not
Speaker 7: be weird.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, I mean, if you tell someone that you're not interested,
Speaker 4: they have to say take that information and accept it.
Speaker 4: They can't be like, well you should be because of
Speaker 4: ab and c. Like that's kind of really annoying. You
Speaker 4: can't be convinced to date somebody you should like me
Speaker 4: because yeah, yeah, I have had this experience, Jamie. I'm
Speaker 4: sure you've had plenty of friendships where they thought it
Speaker 4: was headed in a different direction.
Speaker 6: You know, not many, maybe once or twice, But I
Speaker 6: think it was just more like I went on a
Speaker 6: date or two and then not feeling it and the
Speaker 6: other person really not understanding.
Speaker 4: Why isn't that amazing though, that you could be on
Speaker 4: such different tracks?
Speaker 6: Yeah, Like, isn't it very clear that there's not a
Speaker 6: connection here.
Speaker 1: It's like chemistry is palpable.
Speaker 4: When there is chemistry between two people, you feel it
Speaker 4: and both people feel it. So if the person that
Speaker 4: you're telling that you don't have chemistry with, that you're
Speaker 4: not interested doesn't understand that there's no chemistry, then they've
Speaker 4: never felt chemistry between another person before, yes.
Speaker 5: And to try to like make it work.
Speaker 6: I mean, I've also been in situations where you know
Speaker 6: you're dating somebody and then after a while you can
Speaker 6: feel that they're not feeling it anymore. And it's the worst,
Speaker 6: but it's so clear you can feel the shift, and
Speaker 6: it's it's important too, and you're right, and it was
Speaker 6: on me to do the work for it.
Speaker 3: Well yeah, well we women can, that's right, right, Yeah,
Speaker 3: maybe these guys just aren't feeling it.
Speaker 7: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I do think though, listen and when you know somebody
Speaker 4: has a crush on you, since this is a pattern,
Speaker 4: it happens to you frequently, I do think you can
Speaker 4: get a little bit smarter about nipping it in the
Speaker 4: bud before it becomes an issue. You know, make it
Speaker 4: very clear that you are not available in that way,
Speaker 4: even if you're single, that you're not interested in that
Speaker 4: kind of dynamic with friends, Like I love having a
Speaker 4: friend like you. I hope you can be friends for
Speaker 4: a long time. I hope I can introduce you to
Speaker 4: my next boyfriend and my husband. I hope you'll be
Speaker 4: at my wedding, you know, like making a delineation about
Speaker 4: the friendship and making it very clear, this is us,
Speaker 4: this is what we're doing, and it's not going to
Speaker 4: go beyond that. In as gentle a way as possible.
Speaker 4: I think it is helpful to steer the person off course,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: You know, I almost wonder too, because Katie and I
Speaker 3: want you to talk about this for a second, but
Speaker 3: like when we talked to you, like, I love being single,
Speaker 3: and I think sometimes the person who's like not interested
Speaker 3: at all sort of is like guys are like, yeah,
Speaker 3: it's a.
Speaker 4: Magnetic attraction because you don't you're not despert and you're
Speaker 4: not asking for anything. So that's when men are turned
Speaker 4: on when you're not interested. So it's totally normal. Like
Speaker 4: I've had this so many times with men when I've
Speaker 4: been single, roommates, guys, and I'm but I was so
Speaker 4: clueless to it because I was just an idiot, you know,
Speaker 4: until they actually try to kiss me and I'm like,
Speaker 4: what the fuck are you doing?
Speaker 1: But I do lead people on without thinking of it.
Speaker 4: So I had to really curb my behavior with male
Speaker 4: friends to let them know, like just because I'm flirty
Speaker 4: and fun and I like to take my top off
Speaker 4: doesn't mean I want to fuck you.
Speaker 7: Yeah, for sure, for sure.
Speaker 2: And I guess just being like just because I'm single
Speaker 2: doesn't mean I'm interested or doesn't mean I'm available, Like
Speaker 2: automatically like, is.
Speaker 4: There anything you're doing that you think you should change?
Speaker 4: Is there any behavioral patterns that you think are leading
Speaker 4: to this?
Speaker 7: I don't think so.
Speaker 2: I'm not even really that flirty like of a person,
Speaker 2: Like I'm just kind of me hanging out here doing
Speaker 2: what I do, you know, But I think there are
Speaker 2: some guys where if you're just nice to them at all,
Speaker 2: they fall in love with you.
Speaker 1: So well.
Speaker 4: Also because you are happy and you are centered and
Speaker 4: you are grounded, that is attractive to men.
Speaker 1: You know. It's like, look, she's got her shit together.
Speaker 1: That's fun. Okay. So there's nothing you're doing that you
Speaker 1: think that is leading it to this.
Speaker 4: So I would just try and be like a little
Speaker 4: bit more proactive about it before it comes up. Try
Speaker 4: and just keep your eyes open for that and just
Speaker 4: when you sense it, make it clear.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you can even like what Chelsea said about
Speaker 3: when you do have to address it tag onto that
Speaker 3: don't make it weird, like this doesn't have to be
Speaker 3: a thing, like let's keep being friends and like.
Speaker 1: Yes, let's have this. That's good.
Speaker 7: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I like that.
Speaker 4: If someone said that to me that I had a
Speaker 4: crush on, I would be like oh okay, yeah, like
Speaker 4: it's not good fuck.
Speaker 1: You anyway, but thank you for that's up. I'm glad
Speaker 1: I know I have a friend out there. Awesome. Well
Speaker 1: did that help, Katie?
Speaker 3: Yes, definitely, okay, awesome, all right, let us know next
Speaker 3: time as happens if things worked out well and yeah.
Speaker 5: For sure for sure.
Speaker 1: Okay, bye, Katie.
Speaker 7: Well thanks for having me bye.
Speaker 5: I mean it's not a bad problem to have.
Speaker 3: I think there's some women who like are just not
Speaker 3: interested in like the men around them, and it's magnetic,
Speaker 3: like you said, no.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's something happens. It's it's always like that, yep.
Speaker 4: And also people create narratives, like when they hang out
Speaker 4: with you, they start to believe whatever they want to
Speaker 4: believe about the dynamics. So they're like, oh, yeah, I
Speaker 4: hung out with her again. She's spending time with me.
Speaker 4: She obviously likes me.
Speaker 6: Yes, right, your brain can find evidence for whatever story exactly.
Speaker 3: It's like she doesn't dislike you, or she wouldn't be
Speaker 3: inviting around.
Speaker 5: But yeah.
Speaker 7: Well.
Speaker 3: Georgia is calling in from New Zealand. Her subject line
Speaker 3: was Graves disease is a stupid name for a stupid condition.
Speaker 1: Dear, Chelsea.
Speaker 3: I'm writing a need of some advice from my favorite
Speaker 3: doctor comedian podcast Queen. I'm a twenty eight year old
Speaker 3: woman in New Zealand and I was recently diagnosed with
Speaker 3: Graves disease and autoimmune condition where my thiraid goes way
Speaker 3: too fast. This came after experiencing some mild, vague symptoms,
Speaker 3: and the diagnosis came as a big shock. I've always
Speaker 3: been generally happy and healthy. The diagnosis has left me
Speaker 3: feeling insecure, ashamed, lost and confused. There's been some weight
Speaker 3: gain on my medication inevitable in this case, and some
Speaker 3: eye symptoms, and I'm ashamed because that's such a vain concern.
Speaker 3: I'm also worried about the impact this has on my fertility,
Speaker 3: as my husband and I were keen to start trying
Speaker 3: next year and that may no longer be an option.
Speaker 3: Do you have any advice on adjusting to a huge
Speaker 3: life change, be it health related or not. I'm seeing
Speaker 3: a therapist I love, but would love any advice you
Speaker 3: have to give. Love from New Zealand, Georgia.
Speaker 1: Hi, Georgia, Hi, Yeah, how are you? I'm good?
Speaker 5: Hi?
Speaker 1: Thanks for calling from all the way from New Zealand.
Speaker 4: Jamie, why don't you start this one since you have
Speaker 4: more experience.
Speaker 5: Yes, So, Georgia, Hi, nice to meet you. I'm Jamie.
Speaker 6: I live with also an autoimmune neurological disorder called MS,
Speaker 6: so I understand and can sympathize greatly with what you're
Speaker 6: feeling and going through.
Speaker 5: And I'm sorry.
Speaker 6: I've lived with this for a very long time, over
Speaker 6: twenty two years. So the advice that I could give
Speaker 6: you is I developed this kind of like three step
Speaker 6: thing for myself that really helps me. And the first
Speaker 6: step is to reflect, and that means to sit with
Speaker 6: the hard feelings, the grief, the sadness, the depression, the
Speaker 6: despair of what you thought was going to be for
Speaker 6: your body, for your old body, all of those things.
Speaker 6: You have to give yourself the space to feel all
Speaker 6: of those things. And the second step is reframe. So
Speaker 6: there has to be acceptance over your diagnosis and what
Speaker 6: this means for your life, and that means you're going
Speaker 6: to have to reframe that and the decisions and things
Speaker 6: that you're going to make. Doesn't mean that things are hopeless,
Speaker 6: but you have to figure out the adjustments and the
Speaker 6: way that you're going to need to pivot. And then
Speaker 6: the third step is reach out, reach out for help.
Speaker 5: There's resources, there's people, there's.
Speaker 6: Tons of opportunity to research and find mind whatever little
Speaker 6: bit of help might help you. There's tons of modalities
Speaker 6: for different things, and I think that those are kind
Speaker 6: of three steps that I come back to often still.
Speaker 6: I mean, it's not like it's one and done, but
Speaker 6: it really helps me kind of process the way a
Speaker 6: disease that you have no control over sometimes affects you.
Speaker 4: And also, I'm sure there's a support group for people
Speaker 4: who have been diagnosed with graves. That's where you should start,
Speaker 4: you know, to get advice and tools for dealing with
Speaker 4: it from people who have been experiencing it.
Speaker 9: Yeah. Yeah, and that's all very helpful. I think that
Speaker 9: those three steps are a really interesting way to I
Speaker 9: think I did a lot of the first step sitting
Speaker 9: with it, feeling a lot of feelings, and then I
Speaker 9: think I sort of jumped to step three of reaching
Speaker 9: out and getting into therapy and looking for those resources
Speaker 9: and that sort of thing. I still think what I've
Speaker 9: struggled with and maybe what I need to focus on
Speaker 9: more is that reframing step and that acceptance and actually
Speaker 9: looking forward instead of sort of being like, either it's
Speaker 9: going to be fine and just sort of cutting or
Speaker 9: I'm feeling really down about it.
Speaker 5: It's going to change day to day.
Speaker 6: Might have good weeks, you might have good months, you
Speaker 6: might have good years, or you know, it's you have
Speaker 6: to give yourself grace through all of it. Strength doesn't
Speaker 6: mean that you're like handling it with positivity and everything's great.
Speaker 6: Strength means that you're just still showing up for yourself
Speaker 6: wherever you are that day, wherever you are.
Speaker 5: In that moment, in my opinion, and.
Speaker 6: That is really difficult, and I understand that. And also
Speaker 6: getting a good community around you, whether it's two three people,
Speaker 6: whoever it is. It's important for you to not go
Speaker 6: through this too much in your own head and with
Speaker 6: your own self.
Speaker 7: You know.
Speaker 4: Can I ask you what is the status of being
Speaker 4: able to have children? Did they say that that is
Speaker 4: off the table or that it may not be on
Speaker 4: the table.
Speaker 9: So a little update. I'm actually pregnant now.
Speaker 3: Oh oh my god, Telsey, work quickly.
Speaker 1: That is so fast.
Speaker 4: You just called in like five minutes ago and you're
Speaker 4: already pregnant.
Speaker 9: I haven't very very quickly. I had a thyroid ectomy.
Speaker 9: So they actually removed the thyroid, which meant that I
Speaker 9: am no longer on medication, which meant I couldn't get pregnant.
Speaker 9: And so it got the clear from my doctors in
Speaker 9: about December, and we thought, okay, well, this might take
Speaker 9: quite a long time.
Speaker 5: You know, getting.
Speaker 9: Hormones back to normal can have a huge effect. And no,
Speaker 9: that didn't take that long.
Speaker 1: That's amazing.
Speaker 4: I mean, there you go, right there, there's a sign
Speaker 4: from the universe telling you that everything is going to
Speaker 4: be okay, but slightly different, you know what I mean.
Speaker 5: Yeah, then your body is an abandoning you.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I think it has been. It's definitely helped with
Speaker 9: gaining some of that trust back. Surely you're quite familiar
Speaker 9: with that feeling.
Speaker 8: I'm feeling.
Speaker 9: I've quite felt quite betrayed for the first time from
Speaker 9: my own body. It has definitely been quite healing to
Speaker 9: gain some of that trustpack.
Speaker 2: I think.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Wow.
Speaker 3: Georgia, when we talked earlier, you had mentioned that some
Speaker 3: of your symptoms have continued even after having some treatments.
Speaker 3: Do you want to tell us a little bit about that?
Speaker 3: And I wonder if Jamie has some wisdom on like
Speaker 3: dealing with disappointments when it comes to different treatments.
Speaker 9: Yeah, so I'm now on because I have no function,
Speaker 9: I'm now on medication that helps my thyroid to work well,
Speaker 9: the sort of fake thyroid replacement replacement, and so that
Speaker 9: has led to I guess a different set of symptoms.
Speaker 9: Where before getting pregnant there was a bit of weight gain,
Speaker 9: and I guess things went the other way, feeling maybe lethargic.
Speaker 9: And the big one that I have had since is
Speaker 9: I also developed thyroid eye disease, which is sort of
Speaker 9: a different disease from Graves, but you get it because
Speaker 9: of Graves. And it meant that my eyes have changed
Speaker 9: in appearance. They sort of bulge out a bit more.
Speaker 9: I've had some treatment so my island that it made
Speaker 9: sort of my eyelids sort of raise, and so I
Speaker 9: looked quite surprised, And I was surprised when I was
Speaker 9: learning about Graves. That was a symptom that wasn't going
Speaker 9: to go away just when we treated the thyroids stuff.
Speaker 9: And so I felt like I was, Oh, I'm going
Speaker 9: to get on top of it, get my thyroid taken out.
Speaker 9: I think there's still some you're realigning with the fact
Speaker 9: that some of these changes might be more permanent.
Speaker 6: That's hard to accept sometimes. Yeah, yeah, I understand that,
Speaker 6: and I can understand sometimes the way that one treatment
Speaker 6: can affect you for the better, but then there's side
Speaker 6: effects from that. It's it's a very unfortunate and frustrating
Speaker 6: dance that you have to dance it.
Speaker 5: But this is all new to you still.
Speaker 6: And sometimes these things just take time. And I think
Speaker 6: like living in the beautiful journey of pregnancy and going
Speaker 6: through this pregnancy, I remember for me during both my pregnancies,
Speaker 6: like finally feeling like my body with doing what I
Speaker 6: wanted it to do was something that was, like you're saying,
Speaker 6: like really important because for so long and still today
Speaker 6: sometimes it felt like my body's betraying me and not
Speaker 6: doing what I wanted to do. So I would say,
Speaker 6: hold on as much as you can to those gifts
Speaker 6: because they are real and are important, and sometimes they
Speaker 6: could just make the other stuff just you know, it's
Speaker 6: what you have to focus on. You have to choose
Speaker 6: sometimes what you focus on, because sometimes there's just nothing
Speaker 6: you can do about the other things, you know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and you know, with regard to your eyes, I'm
Speaker 4: sure there are things you're going to be able to
Speaker 4: find out that you can do. Actually, but in the meantime,
Speaker 4: if you do feel stuck like, oh this is I
Speaker 4: can't change this, I can't change this, then you really
Speaker 4: should go to the next thing, you know what I mean, Like,
Speaker 4: there's no point in sitting there and digging a hole
Speaker 4: when you're not going to get to water, Like that
Speaker 4: is just kind of reversing and you're resisting reality. And
Speaker 4: you just and you want to be always moved, being
Speaker 4: forward right with respect to yourself, when you need to
Speaker 4: sit and reflect and take your time to sit with
Speaker 4: your emotions and what they mean. Absolutely, but always with
Speaker 4: the ball moving. You have a baby coming, you have
Speaker 4: all this excitement to prepare for. You have a husband
Speaker 4: that loves and adores you, and I'm sure it as
Speaker 4: has he been good through this process?
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh well that's great.
Speaker 4: And so of course you don't want, you know, you
Speaker 4: don't want things to happen to you physically that you're
Speaker 4: not prepared for or that you didn't ask for. But
Speaker 4: that's when you really have to focus on all the
Speaker 4: love and the light that is there.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, So just don't get mired in the things that
Speaker 4: you can't change and instead get miired and the things
Speaker 4: that are growing and can change.
Speaker 9: Yeah, thank you. I think it's really strong advice to
Speaker 9: carry forward.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and you're going to write down those three things
Speaker 4: that Jamie said because it's recorded.
Speaker 7: Yes, I am. I was almost writing them down at
Speaker 7: the time.
Speaker 6: So when I get this, if you go to reframing
Speaker 6: ms dot com, I collaborate with the vartists on this
Speaker 6: three step guide and it's all in detail there.
Speaker 1: Oh great, that's great for our listeners.
Speaker 5: Yeah, reframing ns dot com.
Speaker 9: Thank you.
Speaker 4: Okay, well, thank you, Georgia. I'm coming to New Zealand.
Speaker 4: I'm doing shows there, are you coming.
Speaker 9: Yes, you're coming to my city? I will babe.
Speaker 1: Oh good, okay, great, great, I hope to see you there.
Speaker 9: Okay, thank you so much.
Speaker 1: Okay, bye, honey. Oh that was cute.
Speaker 5: That was great advice, Chelsea. I'm taking that from myself too.
Speaker 5: It's so true. You know, you just have to sometimes.
Speaker 6: Just shift the focus, because you know, I could have
Speaker 6: every right to kind of, you know, focus on all
Speaker 6: the things that are not working and going, but you know,
Speaker 6: I just what would my life be?
Speaker 5: Then I have to keep moving forward? Focusing on the
Speaker 5: good things.
Speaker 9: Right.
Speaker 4: Well, I think you're doing a pretty good job of
Speaker 4: keeping your shit together, Jamie, and very inspiring. Oh shit,
Speaker 4: before I say goodbye, we'll take a break and come
Speaker 4: back and we're back with Jamielen Sigler.
Speaker 3: So, Jamie, I remember I was listening to MESSI and
Speaker 3: you mentioned some neuroplasticity stuff that you've learned. Is there
Speaker 3: anything you can teach our listeners about that are so neuroplasticity?
Speaker 5: God, I hope I don't, butger this. I am not
Speaker 5: a doctor.
Speaker 1: Don't worry. I I'll help you out.
Speaker 6: Okay, great, please doctor Chelsea, but correct me if I'm wrong.
Speaker 6: The neuroplasticity is basically, sometimes you can build new pathways
Speaker 6: for function in your body, and it can take It
Speaker 6: takes a lot of repetition and it takes a lot
Speaker 6: of work. And that's what I work on daily through
Speaker 6: my own physical therapy and things I've learned from wonderful
Speaker 6: different therapists. Like for me, it's, you know, lifting my
Speaker 6: right foot up. A lot of those nerves are damage.
Speaker 6: But if you do concentrated, constant, like really isolated movements,
Speaker 6: the idea is that the body can figure out a
Speaker 6: new pathway to kind of get you there again. It
Speaker 6: takes a lot of work and it takes a lot
Speaker 6: of commitment, but these are the things that you know
Speaker 6: give hope. You know that the body is miraculous and
Speaker 6: there's been many beautiful stories of healing. And you know, again,
Speaker 6: whether it's me being a stubborn Taurus or not, like
Speaker 6: I still hold out a lot of hope for better days,
Speaker 6: and I think that that's sometimes what gets me up
Speaker 6: in the morning.
Speaker 4: I mean, I read an article, I guess about this
Speaker 4: guy who was in a terrible car accident and damaged
Speaker 4: his spine so badly he was never going to walk again.
Speaker 4: They told him he was never going to walk again.
Speaker 4: I mean, this just happened to this guy, the skier,
Speaker 4: the guy that Mikhaela Schiffern just got engaged to. He's Norwegian,
Speaker 4: I forget his name. He had a terrible ski accident.
Speaker 4: He could have died, Like the ski went through his
Speaker 4: craft muscle and opened it was like two seconds from
Speaker 4: an artery. If he hadn't been where he was in
Speaker 4: relation to like getting medical treatment, he would have died.
Speaker 4: And he is up and walking like he's an athlete.
Speaker 4: So that's not a great example, but I was reading
Speaker 4: an article. I mean it is a great example because
Speaker 4: it's willpower and it is strength of mind, it's fortitude,
Speaker 4: and it's like, are you gonna let somebody tell you
Speaker 4: what's to happen for the rest of your life or
Speaker 4: are you going to actually impact what's going to happen
Speaker 4: for the rest of your life. So this guy who
Speaker 4: had no chance of ever walking again, just did rehab
Speaker 4: for fourteen hours every single day, and not that everyone
Speaker 4: has fourteen hours, but he was not going to take
Speaker 4: that diagnosis.
Speaker 1: He's like, I reject that. I reject that. And this
Speaker 1: guy is skiing today.
Speaker 4: So that's where I read the article when I was
Speaker 4: in Whistler, because I met a friend of his and
Speaker 4: she directed me towards it, and so like, I mean,
Speaker 4: he turned his life around, and I totally And neuroplasticity
Speaker 4: is a very very provable thing. Like people create neuropathways
Speaker 4: new neural pathways all the time, And as a very
Speaker 4: bona fide pot smoker, I'm constantly trying to create neural
Speaker 4: pathways because of the woods that are the ones that
Speaker 4: I've burned through. But I mean, not firing on all cylinders,
Speaker 4: so you know what I mean it now. But yes,
Speaker 4: I would just say, like everyone I love, I love
Speaker 4: that subject matter, and I want to read more about
Speaker 4: neuroplasticity because.
Speaker 6: That mind is very, very powerful and I think the
Speaker 6: biggest tool in your toolbox totally.
Speaker 3: We talk about neuroplasticity pretty often on this podcast from
Speaker 3: like a mental health standpoint and like shifting your worldview,
Speaker 3: but it's really cool to hear about the ways it
Speaker 3: can potentially help people with chronic illness and physical stuff too.
Speaker 6: I think too, like what you believe is true, and
Speaker 6: I think sometimes when you have a condition that forces
Speaker 6: you in a doctor to be in a doctor's office
Speaker 6: a lot of the time, you could be talked at
Speaker 6: a lot and feel like you have no voice in
Speaker 6: the matter, and you're being told what's going on in
Speaker 6: your body and even what you're feeling. And I fortunately
Speaker 6: have a neurologist that I started working with eight years
Speaker 6: ago that said to me, Jamie, I want your voice
Speaker 6: to be the loudest one in this room. And I'm
Speaker 6: so grateful for that because he said, I can't tell
Speaker 6: you what you feel.
Speaker 5: I don't have MS.
Speaker 6: I live with MS patients every day, but you need
Speaker 6: to tell me how you feel, what you feel is
Speaker 6: going on, so that I can help you the best
Speaker 6: that I can. And I think that it's important for
Speaker 6: anybody in life, no matter what you're dealing with, to
Speaker 6: just trust yourself and then yes, I think the mind
Speaker 6: can be very powerful in any kind of healing.
Speaker 1: Well, thank you so much. This was so great. What
Speaker 1: a great episode. I love thank you.
Speaker 5: You should come on Messy.
Speaker 1: I love you anytime. Amazing, Okay, awesome, all right, take care.
Speaker 5: Thank you guys so much. Thank Bie.
Speaker 1: Okay, guys, So for stand up.
Speaker 4: We added a second show in Sydney, and we added
Speaker 4: a second show in Prior Lake, Minnesota, which is now
Speaker 4: going to be May twenty fourth. We added the Santa
Speaker 4: Barbara Bowl, which is so fun. I performed there last year.
Speaker 4: That's August seventeenth, the Santa Barbara Bowl. We added a
Speaker 4: second show at Santa Rosa on August second, and we
Speaker 4: added two dates at Hawaii.
Speaker 1: Guys.
Speaker 4: I'm coming to Hawaii on July nineteenth to k Who.
Speaker 4: I'm gonna be at Cough Who Louis, and then I'm
Speaker 4: coming on July.
Speaker 1: Twenty at to Honolulu.
Speaker 4: And I just added another date on August first, Auburn, Washington, SO.
Speaker 4: And all my Australia and New Zealand dates are up,
Speaker 4: and I will be announcing a European tour shortly and May.
Speaker 1: Third, which is my mother's birthday.
Speaker 4: Norman, Oklahoma, So Oklahomians, Oklahomans, Oklahom's come bye.
Speaker 3: If you'd like advice from Chelsea, shoot us an email
Speaker 3: at Dear Chelsea podcast at gmail dot com and be
Speaker 3: sure to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited
Speaker 3: and engineered by Brad Dickert executive producer Catherine Law and
Speaker 3: be sure to check out our merch at Chelseahandler dot
Speaker 3: com