Speaker 1: NFL Explained is a production of the NFL in partnership
Speaker 1: with I Heart Radio. All Right, you know, on this
Speaker 1: podcast we try to teach people about the NFL, my
Speaker 1: camp Michael Robinson with you. There's something else that I've
Speaker 1: been learning working with you, m Rosco. That you are,
Speaker 1: and I've said this on another podcast, one of the
Speaker 1: more positive people that I know. But if you ever
Speaker 1: throw shade at someone, it's because of the attire that
Speaker 1: they potentially are. I shouldn't say potentially. Kyler Murray, Yes, you.
Speaker 1: We did a segment on t A the other day.
Speaker 1: You threw some shade his way and I was surprised.
Speaker 1: Well again, you call it shade, Yams, but it's more
Speaker 1: of my expectations for that player are so high and
Speaker 1: I don't see him reaching those expectations. So I'm a
Speaker 1: little disappointed. Right, I'm a little disappointed. So it comes
Speaker 1: from a place of positivity. Let's say that still figure
Speaker 1: out a way to bring it, bring it full circle. Today,
Speaker 1: we're gonna have some fun. We're gonna actually talk about
Speaker 1: one of the more explosive positions on the football field,
Speaker 1: that is the wide receiver spot. But I want to
Speaker 1: take you back November. Let that one sink in for
Speaker 1: just a second. Did you have any idea like why
Speaker 1: that is a significant date from a wide receiver's perspection? Okay,
Speaker 1: now that's just say it that way. I'm assuming there
Speaker 1: was something of kids don't on that day. There's the
Speaker 1: running back. Wait, actually, and Manning's gonna he won news.
Speaker 1: Oh there's a flag how in the little Oh my goodness,
Speaker 1: you have to be kidding me. That is impossible. That
Speaker 1: is absolutely impossible. What he just did. That may be
Speaker 1: the greatest catch I've ever seen in my life. It's wow.
Speaker 1: Oh b J Handling Business Collins work said it maybe
Speaker 1: the greatest catch you ever saw. I feel like we're
Speaker 1: getting a lot of these more frequently. But when you
Speaker 1: saw it, what was your take? I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: my goodness, that can't be for real. And then I
Speaker 1: was like, well, he had to be out of bounds.
Speaker 1: And to me, what made that O. B J catch
Speaker 1: so amazing is he scored. He scored a touchdown, so
Speaker 1: we actually put the ball across the goal line as well,
Speaker 1: not only just the catch, but got some points for
Speaker 1: seeing That's what made it amazing to me. All Right,
Speaker 1: So we played the audio for you. If you if
Speaker 1: you're a little on the younger side of our demo
Speaker 1: who checks out this show, I encourage you. You can
Speaker 1: go on YouTube it like all the kids do the
Speaker 1: catch as m Rob just made reference to Eli Manning
Speaker 1: the quarterback h's the forty three yard reception with one hand,
Speaker 1: fingertips the whole thing. You know, there's a part of
Speaker 1: me and says, all right, dudes are skilled, and I
Speaker 1: get this. I got This is probably the second or
Speaker 1: third time I've made reference to him on this podcast.
Speaker 1: But Curtis Conway, good buddy of mine. Sea Way would
Speaker 1: always say this to me. Oh man, those receiver gloves
Speaker 1: a little different than what I used to play. They're
Speaker 1: really sticky, and they actually have a bunch of them.
Speaker 1: I think they're just more sticky than the ones from
Speaker 1: back in the day. They are sticky. They are little
Speaker 1: bit more sticky than the old Newman gloves that I
Speaker 1: used to wear when I was growing up. But look,
Speaker 1: these guys if they're not making these catches because of
Speaker 1: the gloves. Okay, the gloves help, yes, like Spider Man, alright,
Speaker 1: scaling walls with the way some of these gloves are.
Speaker 1: But you're outside catching with those gloves. There's not other
Speaker 1: defensive backs trying to tap you take your head off
Speaker 1: all of those things. The guys have to be skillful
Speaker 1: enough to still catch the football. And I think the
Speaker 1: reason why we're seeing so many of these crazy catches,
Speaker 1: it's all revolving around the quarterback. And the more the
Speaker 1: quarterback has passing camps as he's a younger guy, the
Speaker 1: more the seven on seven camps that are happening, these
Speaker 1: quarterbacks on throwing to themselves when the wilde receivers that
Speaker 1: are out there. So these wide receivers are just getting
Speaker 1: more reps, and so the the opportunities for the great
Speaker 1: catches are just showing up a little bit more, do
Speaker 1: you now, Look, we see great catches on Sundays and
Speaker 1: we made reference too. I mean Pickens had one, you know,
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks, you know, earlier in the season,
Speaker 1: he had great one. From a Steller's perspective, these things happen.
Speaker 1: I also wonder if social media plays a little bit
Speaker 1: of a factor and this whole thing has something to
Speaker 1: post everything trying to get those double tasks? Are you
Speaker 1: kidding me? Like, Like, I remember my son's birthday last year.
Speaker 1: He's about to be thirteen this year, and all he
Speaker 1: wanted was a background so he can post. That's all
Speaker 1: he wanted. My times have changed. I wanted money. I
Speaker 1: wanted money, Uh you know, a belt of wrestling belt.
Speaker 1: I say, you know something. He's just wanted the background
Speaker 1: so he can take selfies. That's the generation we're in. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: social media does account for because not only are these
Speaker 1: young players, young football players and youth level seeing their
Speaker 1: favorite player go on social media. But I mean, obviously
Speaker 1: you want the likes you want. You want that gratification
Speaker 1: for people looking at you. Should I should I be
Speaker 1: worried about the future. No, I believe our futures in
Speaker 1: good hands. But but there's a lot of selfies out there.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of selfies that in downtown Richmond, Virginia,
Speaker 1: we have a selfie museum. Okay, it's a real business
Speaker 1: and it makes money. Yeah. People come, they get a
Speaker 1: little bit different background, and they take selfies. That is
Speaker 1: the culture we are. And yes, yes, Mike, yes I
Speaker 1: always feel awkward doing it. Oh my god, I know
Speaker 1: that was a thing. That's a thing. It's a selfie museum.
Speaker 1: Shout out to the people down in which movie to
Speaker 1: self the museum, Yes, Emrod bringing it as we made
Speaker 1: reference to today is all about the evolution of the
Speaker 1: wide receivers. Will sprinkle in a little more selfie conversation
Speaker 1: at some point, maybe even on a different episode. We're
Speaker 1: gonna break this down from every single angle, and I
Speaker 1: know I just brought up the gloves and then being sticky.
Speaker 1: There's also a reason, not just the one handed grabs,
Speaker 1: but there's a reason why the position has evolved to
Speaker 1: the point where you can make an argument it is
Speaker 1: the most important position on the football field outside of
Speaker 1: the quarterback. We're going to go through some of the numbers,
Speaker 1: some of the data, but I think we should actually
Speaker 1: start back in nineteen seventy four and I was negative.
Speaker 1: That was negative about years. Like I was in the
Speaker 1: negative in in seventy four. My parents weren't even mar
Speaker 1: right at that point. Just to put some contact. Damn,
Speaker 1: I'm feeling old. I'm feeling old. In response to what
Speaker 1: was called the bumping run coverage, defenders could no longer
Speaker 1: restrict wide receivers after three plus yards now. That was
Speaker 1: actually increased to five yards in nineteen seventy eight, and
Speaker 1: immediately you saw a spike and it makes sense right
Speaker 1: in passing yards from one hundred and fifty nine per
Speaker 1: game in seventy eight to a hundred and eighty the
Speaker 1: following year. So it's by far the biggest spike in
Speaker 1: the Super Bowl era. Now, starting in two thousand two,
Speaker 1: I was very much alive. I was actually still in college.
Speaker 1: At that point, quarterbacks were more protected, with helmet to
Speaker 1: helmet hits becoming illegal, followed by a two thousand six
Speaker 1: rule that bart hits from below the knees on quarterbacks.
Speaker 1: And I think we can all agree on all of
Speaker 1: that stuff. Man, Yeah, for sure is good. There's dudes
Speaker 1: who you know, when when guys start going low, I'm like, oh, like,
Speaker 1: I cringe a little bit when I see those moments.
Speaker 1: It doesn't two thousand four, defensive holding and illegal contact
Speaker 1: on wide receivers became a point of m the CISTS,
Speaker 1: and in two thousand nine, any hit on a player
Speaker 1: deemed a defenseless receiver was implemented, resulting in a fifteen
Speaker 1: yard penalty. Also, we saw these hits take place on
Speaker 1: the college side where guys get injected. Look, I'm all
Speaker 1: for it because I do think it's important to keep
Speaker 1: all these players safe. But in your mind, if you're
Speaker 1: a dB, like, it's kind of hard to defend some
Speaker 1: of these dudes with some of these roles. From impossible,
Speaker 1: it is impossible. You'll see the top defensive backs Jalen Ramsey, um,
Speaker 1: who else? Give me another top day? J C. Jackson
Speaker 1: who just got paid? Yeah, all of these guys, they
Speaker 1: will tell you they're the days of the shutdown cornerback
Speaker 1: are gone. There's no longer those guys walking the planet
Speaker 1: anymore because the rules don't allow it, the gameplay doesn't allow.
Speaker 1: The ingenuity of the offenses don't allow. Yeah, we live
Speaker 1: in a Western society, but the Western society is all
Speaker 1: about the offensive, right, and you can see it show
Speaker 1: up in our game. Passing plays, passing downs and and
Speaker 1: throwing the ball through the air is exciting, right. I
Speaker 1: think in the early days of football, when it was
Speaker 1: more of a defensive struggle and running the football and
Speaker 1: two yards and a cloud of dust and all of
Speaker 1: those things, I think the people that ran our league
Speaker 1: was thinking, how can we make this more marketable? How
Speaker 1: can we get the fans a little bit more excited
Speaker 1: about their respective teams? And I think that's why you
Speaker 1: saw the explosion in the past game. That's why you
Speaker 1: saw the rules kind of change a little bit. But
Speaker 1: it does take a different type of guy to be
Speaker 1: a defensive back in today's NFL. Yeah, you can be,
Speaker 1: you know. I think I was with the Pete Carroll
Speaker 1: way of thinking about defensive backs. Longer guys not necessarily
Speaker 1: the fastest guys in the world, but they're so long
Speaker 1: that they have that makeup speed by their limbs, right,
Speaker 1: they can make up because of how long they are,
Speaker 1: I e. Richard Sherman and things like that. But it
Speaker 1: does take a unique individual, especially psychologically, and think about it.
Speaker 1: All the rules, all the things that go against defenses.
Speaker 1: You can't touch them, you can't hit them when they
Speaker 1: do get the ball, you can't hit the pastor you
Speaker 1: gotta let him and throw the football. Let him. I
Speaker 1: mean camp Chancellor hit Vernon Davis one time, and I
Speaker 1: think it was the NFC Championship. Oh man, it was awesome.
Speaker 1: He hit him so hard and runners, my guy, I
Speaker 1: love verning. He hit Vernon so hard Vernon pats almost
Speaker 1: came off. I said, how are you gonna do so hard?
Speaker 1: His pants almost came off that that's how hard he
Speaker 1: hit him. And I remember Camp said, man, I went
Speaker 1: to the ref and the ref just looked at me
Speaker 1: and then through the flag and he said, why did
Speaker 1: you throw the flag? And the ref set that just
Speaker 1: looked too hard, that violent, he said. He didn't tell
Speaker 1: me anything that was wrong with the hit. It just
Speaker 1: looked too violent. So that is the environment our defensive
Speaker 1: backs have to operate in. So they have to have
Speaker 1: from a psychological stampout. They have to have a short memory,
Speaker 1: and they gotta be wired differently, right. They can't. You know,
Speaker 1: when I say short memory, just because you had to
Speaker 1: catch on your two plays ago, you cannot let that
Speaker 1: effect the next play because more times than not, you're
Speaker 1: you're gonna get burned. Like in those moments you're the guy.
Speaker 1: Ten times out of ten you can get somebody catching
Speaker 1: the football on you. That's just the way it goes. Okay,
Speaker 1: we see Jalen Ramsey, you know, arguably the best in
Speaker 1: the game at the cornerback position. When the Tampa Bay
Speaker 1: Buccaneers were trying to come back last year, Tom Brady
Speaker 1: went after Jalen rams Earlier this season, he's been criticized.
Speaker 1: So again, it's tough to play defensive back in the
Speaker 1: National Football any truce to that old adage that their
Speaker 1: their wide receivers you just can't catch. That is true.
Speaker 1: If you're a wide receiver and you can catch, you
Speaker 1: stay on the side. Serious business. Like my son. Always
Speaker 1: give reference to my son. My youngest boy be five,
Speaker 1: was going down. I know he listens. He listens every week,
Speaker 1: so I know he's gonna enjoy thee I hear him.
Speaker 1: He has his son was going and he listens to us.
Speaker 1: So it's all way taking selfies, taking selfies while he's
Speaker 1: doing it right with its stuff. You know. That's the
Speaker 1: young people. Uh, and you know um in today's game.
Speaker 1: But I tell my son all the time, everybody wants
Speaker 1: to play wide receiver. Everybody the harder position to play
Speaker 1: in the position you get a lot of benefits of
Speaker 1: the doubt on is defensive back. Not a lot of
Speaker 1: guys want to go there because guys get toasted. Yeah yeah,
Speaker 1: not not necessarily the easiest thing, by the way, and
Speaker 1: the position, the way guys are paid, wide receivers now
Speaker 1: are cashing in in a big way. I know we've
Speaker 1: talked about that a ton on NFL Network, especially in
Speaker 1: the off season with a lot of those contracts. But
Speaker 1: you know, we briefly mentioned before m rob quarterbacks, And
Speaker 1: just to add some context on the passing game, I
Speaker 1: want to go back to nine. That was the year
Speaker 1: after the initial illegal contact role was instituted. Dan Fouts
Speaker 1: led the league with two hundred and fifty five passing
Speaker 1: yards per games. Well that's actually the point, right, So
Speaker 1: you hear two fifty five and seventy nine? How about
Speaker 1: this in two so far through week five? That would
Speaker 1: land him eighteen, just ahead of Russell Wilson. And let's
Speaker 1: be real here, Russ and shoulder. Yeah you could you
Speaker 1: feel bad saying it, but I don't feel bad. One
Speaker 1: other quick note here, by the way, Andy Dalton has
Speaker 1: more career passing yards than all but nine of the
Speaker 1: twenty nine Hall of Fame. Yeah, hey, research, is that
Speaker 1: for real? You mean to tell me Andy Dalton, a
Speaker 1: backup quarterback, already has more passing yards than twenty of
Speaker 1: the twenty nine Hall of Fame quarterbacks. Yeah, you want
Speaker 1: to hear some of the names, Yes, please, dude, Troy Aikman, Okay,
Speaker 1: Steve Jim Kelly, are you kidding me? Andy Dawn's ahead
Speaker 1: of those guys? Just just context, Matt, Like you said,
Speaker 1: it and you said it, Well, it all is going
Speaker 1: more towards the offense and the popularity of the sport.
Speaker 1: People want to see some points being s four. Welcome
Speaker 1: back to the NFL Explained podcast. Now, the first thing
Speaker 1: to note actually is from nineteen seventy four to nine
Speaker 1: eighties six, a wide receiver. This was shocking to me,
Speaker 1: lad the NFL in receptions in only two seasons. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna let that one sink in first second, Art Monk
Speaker 1: in eighty four, Dwight Clark in eighty two. So from
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty seven to twenty two, a wide receiver led
Speaker 1: the NFL and receptions every season, but one. Tony Gonzalez
Speaker 1: was that guy in two thousand four, and that was
Speaker 1: just a ridiculous season. So let's take a closer look
Speaker 1: at the one thousand yard receivers versus the rushers and
Speaker 1: two thousand there were twenty three one thousand yard rushers
Speaker 1: in eighteen thousand yard receivers. Fast forward to twenty six
Speaker 1: wide house that actually reached that mark versus just seven
Speaker 1: rushers that hit the one thousand yard milestone. By the way,
Speaker 1: that was the same total. I almost feel like we
Speaker 1: might not go back to the old school NFEL. I mean, hell,
Speaker 1: you want to talk about defense and how people don't
Speaker 1: want to see it. Remember that Thursday Night game a
Speaker 1: couple weeks back, Colts and Broncos twelve nine, And by
Speaker 1: the way, everyone's all bad game, bad game. I'm sitting
Speaker 1: here going, do you know how many great plays the
Speaker 1: defense made the game? And I'm sitting here going, all right,
Speaker 1: it's different, but defense is still a part of the game.
Speaker 1: I say that. And the wide receiver episode, I published
Speaker 1: a table. I gotta sprinkle all of this in little
Speaker 1: bit for everyone. So not only are wide receivers really prospering,
Speaker 1: they're actually doing it at a younger age. So it
Speaker 1: used to take guys a couple extra years to get
Speaker 1: acclimated to the pro game. That transition is not always
Speaker 1: easy for a lot of players. But twelve receivers under
Speaker 1: twenty six when over a thousand yards, that's the most
Speaker 1: in NFL history, Right, Jamar Chase broke the same record,
Speaker 1: Justin Jefferson broke in for the most rookie receiving yards
Speaker 1: in a season. How do you explain it? I know
Speaker 1: there's the LSU connection with the realities, like there's other
Speaker 1: dudes that are really putting up huge numbers. Yeah, that's crazy.
Speaker 1: Early on when you talk about that generation of the
Speaker 1: seventies and even before that, in the sixties, that was
Speaker 1: a running backs time. Most teams played with multiple running
Speaker 1: backs on the field. The fullback was a real position. Hell,
Speaker 1: people don't realize Frank o' harris's position was fullback, right,
Speaker 1: But he ran the football. He caught the football. Tom
Speaker 1: Rathman in that West Coast system, that was a little
Speaker 1: bit later, he caught the football a little bit more,
Speaker 1: but it was a lot more running backs involved with
Speaker 1: the game. And I think that as the business of football, right,
Speaker 1: it starts in college the business of football. I can
Speaker 1: argue that the business football starts in high school, um,
Speaker 1: where coaches are having less patients from their superiors to
Speaker 1: get the job done. And so coaches on the younger
Speaker 1: levels from the national football they they have to recruit.
Speaker 1: And when you recruit, you gotta promise young people certain
Speaker 1: things that they're gonna have when they come to university
Speaker 1: or your high school. And so I believe that a
Speaker 1: lot of the enginuity of these coaches wanted to get
Speaker 1: these players on the field earlier, so they devised plans
Speaker 1: so that they can learn the game easier. For instance,
Speaker 1: some offenses try to hurry up right or try to
Speaker 1: hurry up, you know with the Chip Kelly offenses and
Speaker 1: things like that. Well, instead of having the huddle up,
Speaker 1: call a place or everybody knows what's going on, they
Speaker 1: just stayed at the line of scrimmage, put some signs up.
Speaker 1: Receivers look to the sideline. They are now knew their route.
Speaker 1: It was a little bit more of efficient way to
Speaker 1: get to play to everybody so that you can gain
Speaker 1: an edge, so that you can gain an advantage, so
Speaker 1: the head guy can keep his job. I believe all
Speaker 1: changes came down to that. The fact that teams had
Speaker 1: to put these guys on the feel a little bit earlier.
Speaker 1: Coaches had to adjust, they had to be more efficient
Speaker 1: and play calling hints. These guys are getting more reps.
Speaker 1: These guys are getting more opportunities to catch the football. Okay,
Speaker 1: I referenced some of the numbers from the seventies and
Speaker 1: the eighties. I will say this body types have also
Speaker 1: changed as well. We will get into that later here.
Speaker 1: In terms of the wide receivers and and some of
Speaker 1: the things that we are seeing measurables from the combine. Well,
Speaker 1: from a technical standpoint, the wide receiver position is getting better.
Speaker 1: But if you ask a lot of former players, and
Speaker 1: I'm one of them, completely how the wide receiver fits
Speaker 1: into the offense, we believe they're becoming a little bit
Speaker 1: less relevant. And I say that by saying I believe
Speaker 1: in ten years, wide receivers are gonna be looked at
Speaker 1: as runners are looked at now, where you say we
Speaker 1: can find running back at any time of the draft, right,
Speaker 1: you have wide receivers. They're all running four twos and
Speaker 1: four threes. They're all right, they all can catch. You
Speaker 1: can find Stefend Diggs in the second or third round.
Speaker 1: You can find a guy in the six or seventh round.
Speaker 1: I just believe that we're seeing the golden years of
Speaker 1: wild receivers now and at some point they're gonna be
Speaker 1: looked at like running backs, like you can get one
Speaker 1: at any time of the draft, because the running backs
Speaker 1: used to be the golden position back in the day,
Speaker 1: and now it has shifted. Well, we're gonna actually coming
Speaker 1: up here and talk about some of those numbers. But
Speaker 1: if that's the case, then what becomes the value position
Speaker 1: is it defensive back, is it you know one of
Speaker 1: those d tackles, someone who are an edge guy that
Speaker 1: can get after the quarterback, can be disruptive. Does it
Speaker 1: go that direction? I believe in a football team, your
Speaker 1: offensive line right is the engine of your team. Your
Speaker 1: secondary is the battery. Like if you're using a car reference,
Speaker 1: you can't really win having a having real deficiencies in
Speaker 1: both areas. So I believe the next wave of like
Speaker 1: star athletes or whatever, well revolve around the line of scrimmage.
Speaker 1: Your big time tackles, your big time pass rushers, the
Speaker 1: big athletic guys. We saw trade by Walker goes over
Speaker 1: one overall this year. And your defensive backs guys who
Speaker 1: we just talked about the diversity and receivers. We just
Speaker 1: talked about how it used to be a golden age
Speaker 1: of running backs. Now you're gonna have to have a
Speaker 1: defensive bat who has the quickness and the speed to
Speaker 1: stay with guys like Tyreek Hill and the shifting needs
Speaker 1: to stay with Jamar Chase and guys like that. But
Speaker 1: you also have to have the pads and the aggressiveness
Speaker 1: to tackle running backs because you're gonna be in the
Speaker 1: on the field all the time. I just think the
Speaker 1: defensive players are in it. We're literally seeing them changed
Speaker 1: before our eyes. Okay, So I think coming up here,
Speaker 1: and it's important to note here wide receiver sets and
Speaker 1: how they're being used also impacts the significance of this
Speaker 1: position a year ago. It can kind of actually explain
Speaker 1: some of the draft stuff that we're seeing. U. I
Speaker 1: shouldn't say year ago, because in two thousand and six,
Speaker 1: teams lined up with three wideouts just fourteen point two
Speaker 1: percent of the time. In one that's up almost ten percent,
Speaker 1: actually exactly ten percent point two. So there is definitely
Speaker 1: a higher priority right now in terms of finding some
Speaker 1: of these guys in the NFL draft. They are they
Speaker 1: bigger though, Are they stronger? Are they faster? Tell you what? Like? Yeah,
Speaker 1: the answer shortly is yes. I'll take you through some
Speaker 1: of those numbers. And I also tell you this, do
Speaker 1: you need a big time watch receiver in order to
Speaker 1: win a Super Bowl? When the answer actually may surprise
Speaker 1: that's still to come on the NFL Explained Podcast. Welcome
Speaker 1: back to the NFL Explained Podcast. You dropped general manager.
Speaker 1: Those are the dudes who kind of handle business and
Speaker 1: putting together these teams they have been going crazy looking
Speaker 1: for wide receivers. How about this last year, six wideouts
Speaker 1: went in the top eight team picks, and the last
Speaker 1: three drafts have seen at least five taken them in
Speaker 1: the first round. And there are some dudes that we
Speaker 1: have seen really perform very well in their rookie season
Speaker 1: sophomore campaigns, like they're making a big impact. It was
Speaker 1: the first time in the Super Bowl era that there
Speaker 1: have been at least five wide receivers taken in three
Speaker 1: straight seasons in the first round their ballers. Now, between
Speaker 1: twenty the average number of first round receivers was just
Speaker 1: three point seven. So you think that the boom would
Speaker 1: actually be you know, more physical traits for some of
Speaker 1: these wide receivers that had improved. Let's take you through
Speaker 1: some of the combine numbers since two thousand three. We'll
Speaker 1: start with the forty. Nothing better than watching these dudes
Speaker 1: around the four by the way three Q Wilham the
Speaker 1: rookie corner. I would love to see him in a
Speaker 1: foot race with Tyreek Hill. Oh my goodness, did you
Speaker 1: see me? Hell end up scoring, but he tracked takes
Speaker 1: them Hill down in five steps. He was there. Taysom
Speaker 1: Hill had a five yard lead. I'm like what, I'm like,
Speaker 1: that's why we focus on the fourting in the combine.
Speaker 1: It is kid is fast. It was awesome, alright. So
Speaker 1: getting back to the numbers here would sort fascinating is
Speaker 1: from two thousand three to two thousand and five that
Speaker 1: average was four point five five seconds fast forward. You're
Speaker 1: actually talking to present day about a decrease of five
Speaker 1: hundreds of a second, which is sort of kind of
Speaker 1: like one of those but not really. When you talk
Speaker 1: about professional athletes, and I mean the highest of the
Speaker 1: height that the National Football League NFL players, Okay, that's
Speaker 1: just the the advantage that you could possibly need to
Speaker 1: get you and your team over the hump. So yeah,
Speaker 1: that's big. That's a big. Height has actually increased exactly
Speaker 1: one inch from seventy two point one inches to just
Speaker 1: over six feet seventy three point one inches, which is
Speaker 1: six one Weights have basically remained stable at two d
Speaker 1: and two points seven pounds. Vertical leap also stayed mostly
Speaker 1: the same at thirty five point five inches. There's a
Speaker 1: lot of different ways though, to be successful and rob
Speaker 1: you play with so many dudes who just did it differently.
Speaker 1: At the wide receiver spot. Is there specific characteristic that
Speaker 1: makes a wide receiver were successful in the NFL? Well,
Speaker 1: I think the number one characteristic is to wide receivers
Speaker 1: ability to just catch the football. That is the number one.
Speaker 1: So it doesn't have to be a DV exactly, so
Speaker 1: we can stay on the good guys side of the
Speaker 1: football right, the offense right, and at the end of
Speaker 1: the day, that's your number one job description your wide receiver.
Speaker 1: When the ball is in the air, your job is
Speaker 1: to be able to catch the football. And for me,
Speaker 1: number two would be catch radius to be able to
Speaker 1: protect the quarterback, meaning the quarterback can sit on his
Speaker 1: back foot and understand. Yeah, I don't necessarily have to
Speaker 1: be the most accurate on this past but I can
Speaker 1: throw it and know that my guys gonna have enough
Speaker 1: catch radius to be able to pull the ball in,
Speaker 1: catch it with his hands, and also protect the ball
Speaker 1: from an interception. Um the ability to separate at the
Speaker 1: top of routes. Um a guy that we use on
Speaker 1: our air raves. Mammanuel Sayties I thought was was awesome.
Speaker 1: Matt Is Steve Smith Senior also awesome that separating and
Speaker 1: really that's your ability to create space from the defender.
Speaker 1: Defenders are real hands that they like to grab and whatever,
Speaker 1: and they have these little tricks or how they get
Speaker 1: to cheat and all those things. We can get in
Speaker 1: that on a whole another episode. But the ability of
Speaker 1: a wide receiver to make a defensive back think he's
Speaker 1: doing something opposite then what he's really doing is something
Speaker 1: that's very important. And I don't this isn't the biggest factor.
Speaker 1: But I'll tell you one thing you can't teach this,
Speaker 1: and that's just speed. That's I mean, just going out there,
Speaker 1: the ability to pick them up, put him down, the
Speaker 1: ability to throw the ball to it's how we kill
Speaker 1: in the flat in his ability to make everybody miss,
Speaker 1: run around the defense and go a d to me,
Speaker 1: that scares defensive coordinators. Okay, so you can explain this
Speaker 1: because I don't know the answer to it. But I've
Speaker 1: been told from other NFL dudes that even if you're
Speaker 1: not the fastest guy, you can make up the difference
Speaker 1: in terms of how you run around. Absolutely. I learned
Speaker 1: how to run routes when I was training in Arizona,
Speaker 1: when I played in the National Football and that's where
Speaker 1: I lived for the entire nine years. I was in
Speaker 1: the league and a guy trained with was ant Kwan Bolden,
Speaker 1: And I remember Q used always kind lead the group
Speaker 1: when we would do I receive the drills, and I
Speaker 1: would always wonder, like, damn, Q ain't running that fast.
Speaker 1: It's like, cute, how fast are you? Bro? He'd be like, Man,
Speaker 1: I mean I ran a four six. But I can
Speaker 1: tell you now I have never ran full speed on
Speaker 1: the football field. I said, what, You've never ran full speed?
Speaker 1: He said, yeah, Bro, like our knees and stuff are
Speaker 1: our tendons aren't built to like slow down this body
Speaker 1: from going that fast. So why would you do that
Speaker 1: so much on your body? You want to feel good, right,
Speaker 1: But it doesn't feel good to get chase down. I'm
Speaker 1: telling said, bro, it don't. It don't feel good like
Speaker 1: getting chased down the tackle or looking slow on tape.
Speaker 1: He said, Look, man, it's all about controlled movements, he said.
Speaker 1: I run most of my routes at fifty. When I
Speaker 1: get to the top of the break, I give it
Speaker 1: sixty to separate. I might not get the full speed
Speaker 1: unless I'm in the open space. I got the football
Speaker 1: in my hands and I know I'm racing to the
Speaker 1: end zone, and that that led me to think of something.
Speaker 1: I started watching how the Great Ones ran their route
Speaker 1: to play with a guy by the name of Isaac Bruce,
Speaker 1: and he could always tell me, like Mike, it ain't
Speaker 1: about wunning fast, man. You need to make him think
Speaker 1: you're going deep by your arms pump and not necessarily
Speaker 1: by your legs moving their fast. And so when I
Speaker 1: noticed that, man, this isn't just a full speed thing
Speaker 1: like I see on TV. You know, you think these
Speaker 1: obviously was a running full speed, but they're not. To me.
Speaker 1: What makes a great route runners the ability to control
Speaker 1: their speed, get in and out of break smoothly, and
Speaker 1: not take false steps. And I think you look at
Speaker 1: a guy like Steve Smith, senior, guy that works with us,
Speaker 1: works for me on Thursday night football, he probably is
Speaker 1: one of the best in history of doing it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it's fascinating to me to hear the speed thing
Speaker 1: because we do make a lot of forty and speed
Speaker 1: is something that you can't teach and I'd rather have
Speaker 1: it than not have it. But for the dudes who
Speaker 1: maybe don't have it, like you know for three, actually
Speaker 1: can still have a lot of success. I had asked
Speaker 1: the question before about do you need a top end
Speaker 1: wide receiver in order to win a championship. There's some
Speaker 1: keynos there, and I think for recent football fans will
Speaker 1: be like, yeah, man, like Cooper Cup. He's a dude, right,
Speaker 1: a third round guy by the way, who's still sort
Speaker 1: of shocked if you know his story, that he's been
Speaker 1: able to make it the way that he has. But
Speaker 1: we'll start with Cooper Cup. He became the first ever
Speaker 1: to win a Super Bowl after leading the league and
Speaker 1: receiving since Jerry Rice, the goat back in now since
Speaker 1: two thousand thirteen, of the forty four teams, which is
Speaker 1: about thirty percent that played in the Super Bowl, had
Speaker 1: a wide receiver who was in the top five and
Speaker 1: receiving yards in the NFL that season. Only four of
Speaker 1: one rank Marvin Harrison, Greg Jennings who was a dude,
Speaker 1: Victor Cruz thank you very much as a Giants fam
Speaker 1: and of course Cooper Cup. Super Bowl fifty six between
Speaker 1: the Rams and the Bengals was the first Super Bowl
Speaker 1: where each team had a wide receiver who was top
Speaker 1: five in receiving yards in the NFL that season. Since
Speaker 1: Super Bowl forty six, the last first round draft pick
Speaker 1: to win a Super Bowl. Nelson Agholor and Philip Dorse said,
Speaker 1: neither of whom like the dude of dudes. Um, you
Speaker 1: know it's still playing in the league, and you know
Speaker 1: it's kind of you know, league exactly, not those dudes.
Speaker 1: So check this out. Brown general manager at the time
Speaker 1: was Ray Farmer. He actually downplayed the importance of having
Speaker 1: a superstar wide receiver. He said, I would say, how
Speaker 1: important are those guys? Name the last big time receiver
Speaker 1: to win a Super Bowl? Name that last mega guy.
Speaker 1: So keep him mind. Cooper Cup has done a he's
Speaker 1: a mega dude. Farmer, by the way, two years after
Speaker 1: he made those comments, not there, and he did draft
Speaker 1: Johnny Football Johnny Manzell. Do you tell me man like,
Speaker 1: does he have a point though? I mean, because the
Speaker 1: numbers do sort of scream you might not need Cooper
Speaker 1: Cup to go and win a chip. Yeah. I believe
Speaker 1: he does have a point. I believe that you throw
Speaker 1: to get into playoffs, but you played great defense and
Speaker 1: run the ball to a championship. Now you can argue
Speaker 1: about last year's Rams. You can argue about the Kansas
Speaker 1: City Chiefs. I think in the nineteen season when they
Speaker 1: won their Super Bowl because they did throw the football.
Speaker 1: But I do believe that there were times in last
Speaker 1: year's playoffs and in that Kansas City Super Bowl run
Speaker 1: where they had to run the football and be physical.
Speaker 1: And I think what makes Cooper Cup so different is, yeah,
Speaker 1: he was on the Super Bowl winning team. Yes, he
Speaker 1: he led the league, and he was the Triple Crown
Speaker 1: runner from a receiver standpoint, But he also has the
Speaker 1: baddest player regardless of position or side of the ball
Speaker 1: on his team, and that's Aaron Donald. And if you
Speaker 1: think about that Super Bowl, your lasting impressions and lasting
Speaker 1: memories of the Super Bowl when the Rams won last
Speaker 1: year is Aaron Donald making his plays, Aaron Donald making
Speaker 1: the sack. And oftentimes you don't see uh big time
Speaker 1: offense have a dominant defensive player like you saw in
Speaker 1: and Donald. So I still believe defense wins championships. I
Speaker 1: believe if it wasn't Faron Donald in that defense and
Speaker 1: Von Miller, day wouldn't have won that championship. But Cooper Cup,
Speaker 1: in particular, to me, what makes him so specialist. He
Speaker 1: does the dirty work Yams to meet Cooper Cup is
Speaker 1: he leaves blocks. Sometimes he is the backside cut off,
Speaker 1: he's cutting off defensive ends. He never comes out of
Speaker 1: the game. The guy has stamina like no other. He
Speaker 1: runs fifty yards down the field, jogs all the way back, run.
Speaker 1: I mean, he never comes off the field. And I
Speaker 1: think that's what And he's with a creative play caller
Speaker 1: and Sean McVeigh who understands how to focus on him
Speaker 1: in the passing game and put speed around him so
Speaker 1: he can get open. I think that's some of the
Speaker 1: issues with the Rams offense this year. They're missing that speed.
Speaker 1: But Cooper Cup is a little bit of a different
Speaker 1: situation in other wide receivers. But I don't think you
Speaker 1: need a big time number one guy to win the
Speaker 1: Super Bowl. It just be nice to have him. It
Speaker 1: would be nice. I mean, look at when I want
Speaker 1: to Super Bowl in Seattle. Maybe people called our obviously
Speaker 1: was Doug Balling, Jamaic curse. People act like they didn't
Speaker 1: know who those guys were. Now, after the Super Bowl
Speaker 1: those guys became pretty good names, but beforehand they weren't.
Speaker 1: You know, it's fascinating because you can make the argument,
Speaker 1: and you are making it that you might not need
Speaker 1: the top flight wide receiver, but at the same time
Speaker 1: I think about the dollars in this free agency pre
Speaker 1: that have been disseminated to guys who play that position,
Speaker 1: it's almost like the league is saying, no, no no, no,
Speaker 1: like I need those dudes. Yeah, I think that the
Speaker 1: league is saying. I think the younger coaches and general
Speaker 1: managers who don't always have the historical approach or lens
Speaker 1: when looking at these players. Again, when you look at
Speaker 1: some of the top organizations, they understand when to go
Speaker 1: get a hot out, They understand how to address the
Speaker 1: offensive line, how to address the defensive line, how to
Speaker 1: address the secondary. At the end of the day, I
Speaker 1: just don't think you need one of those guys to
Speaker 1: win a Super Bowl because again, you passed to get
Speaker 1: into the playoffs. You run and play great defense to
Speaker 1: a champions to get over the hump, and maybe it's
Speaker 1: just get me there and then we'll figure it out.
Speaker 1: Ask Joe Burrow in Cincinnati. All right, just want to
Speaker 1: add to this conversation, just because we mentioned sort of
Speaker 1: youth football, high school. On the college level, what we've
Speaker 1: seen in terms of one thousand yard receivers in one
Speaker 1: they were third. Were actually surprised me. I thought the
Speaker 1: number would be higher one thousand yard receivers in Division
Speaker 1: one football. In thirty nine there was thirty eight, so
Speaker 1: kind of a marginal jump. But if you go back
Speaker 1: to two thousand, it was twenty. So we have almost
Speaker 1: seen double in about a twenty year period in terms
Speaker 1: of one thousand yard receivers. Seventy five catch guys. By
Speaker 1: the way, in two thousand they were seven, they were
Speaker 1: thirty five. I think that also speaks to the scheme
Speaker 1: that you were discussing as well. And I think to
Speaker 1: take it a step further in youth football, you told
Speaker 1: me about a selfie museum. I know about these one
Speaker 1: handed grabs. Like in my mind as we're putting it
Speaker 1: together here, it becomes almost like the sexy position in football.
Speaker 1: Dare I say, like right up there with the quarterback. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And again I think social media has a lot to
Speaker 1: do with as I think we just started to show
Speaker 1: with the Odell Beckham catch, uh, you know, the media
Speaker 1: and the entire world kind of blowing that catch up
Speaker 1: has helped as well. And again it's a very skillful catch.
Speaker 1: But I believe that especially in all if our listeners
Speaker 1: can just go to the you know, the urban area
Speaker 1: in the in the places that they live and just
Speaker 1: go to a park and just watch young kids play football.
Speaker 1: You're gonna see these catches. You're gonna see the most
Speaker 1: dynamic player in the field, usually as the quarterback. To me,
Speaker 1: that's where the spread system and the running quarterbacks that
Speaker 1: it came from. It came from your football coaches just
Speaker 1: sitting there saying, you know what, I don't really know
Speaker 1: how to coach this particular schame, but I do know
Speaker 1: one thing. This kid is the best kid out there.
Speaker 1: I want to find a way to put the ball
Speaker 1: in his hands over and over and over. And to me,
Speaker 1: that style of calling plays, that style of coaching has
Speaker 1: made it to the National Football League. You know that
Speaker 1: there are generalizations that we hear about position groups in
Speaker 1: the NFL. Um diva's is it a fair label to
Speaker 1: put on wide receivers? I was. I would say that,
Speaker 1: and and diva doesn't necessarily mean negative, man Like we
Speaker 1: have a negative connotation on the word DVA necessarily mean negative,
Speaker 1: I mean little whiny. Sometimes I wouldn't want to be
Speaker 1: called I wouldn't want to be called it DVA either.
Speaker 1: But let's just think about it. The success of a
Speaker 1: wide receiver exclusively depends is on the protection of his quarterback,
Speaker 1: the abilities of his all everything about his position depends
Speaker 1: on somebody else. So you kind of gotta be a diva,
Speaker 1: right You kind of gotta make sure that you're able
Speaker 1: to create the reality you want. You're able to to
Speaker 1: get the conditions the way that you wanted so that
Speaker 1: you can go be the best version of yourself out
Speaker 1: on the football field. So, yeah, they're a little bit
Speaker 1: of a deep. Are they the most athletic guys on
Speaker 1: football field? No? Who don't believe that are the most
Speaker 1: I don't believe I received that the most athletic guys
Speaker 1: on on the football field. Um, I believe honestly. Defensive
Speaker 1: lineman on whoa to be that big, to be that athletic,
Speaker 1: to run that fast? You're going to be three hundred
Speaker 1: fifty pound man. Oftentimes they outweigh you by twenty and
Speaker 1: thirty pounds. You gotta figure out a way to get
Speaker 1: around them. You can't land on the quarterback. You gotta
Speaker 1: make understand your strike zone. I mean so many, I
Speaker 1: mean to me, Chris Jones, Aaron Donald, Jeffrey Simmons from
Speaker 1: the Tennessee Titans. What these guys some of these guys
Speaker 1: can dunk. Yeah, come on, man to me that the
Speaker 1: level of athleticism is crazy. I've heard the smartest guys
Speaker 1: that on the football fielder, offensive lineman. I could go
Speaker 1: to the center, I would say, it might have been
Speaker 1: a center. Who told me that it might have been
Speaker 1: It had to be a center, I would say, the
Speaker 1: smartest guy quarterbacks. Obviously you have to be there as well,
Speaker 1: but they don't fullbacks. Just just just sprinkling a little
Speaker 1: for the for the fullbacks as well. All right, I
Speaker 1: know I made reference to it a little bit earlier.
Speaker 1: I am in having a blast. I hope you have
Speaker 1: as well. I'm Rob doing this show. We love getting
Speaker 1: those questions continue to slide into my my TM at
Speaker 1: Mike Underscore. Yeah, you can follow um Rob at Real
Speaker 1: Mike Rob. I don't know. Maybe maybe if you ask
Speaker 1: them a football question, maybe I'll get back. I have
Speaker 1: no idea, but once you can always appreciate you guys
Speaker 1: checking us out. Tell a friend about this episode, and
Speaker 1: of course fire off those questions. It's the evolution of
Speaker 1: the wide receiver spot explained