1 00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:10,920 Speaker 1: Hey, what a welcome in. I'm Godiban. This is so ball, 2 00:00:11,160 --> 00:00:13,440 Speaker 1: all basketball, all the time, although we do other sports too, 3 00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:17,400 Speaker 1: So just all ball, quartertup balls. I hope maybe you 4 00:00:17,480 --> 00:00:19,239 Speaker 1: have balls, although not all of you have balls. I 5 00:00:19,239 --> 00:00:21,759 Speaker 1: mean we were like women to listen to it as well. Uh. 6 00:00:22,040 --> 00:00:25,520 Speaker 1: Chad Wilkerson is my guest upcoming. He led the state 7 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:28,040 Speaker 1: in scoring in the state of Texas twice as a 8 00:00:28,120 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: high school player. He went to O or U his 9 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:32,720 Speaker 1: last two years. He had out standing years. We played 10 00:00:32,760 --> 00:00:34,560 Speaker 1: together in the usb L and one of these tour 11 00:00:34,680 --> 00:00:37,520 Speaker 1: teams as well. We'll talk about a potential double bird 12 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:39,599 Speaker 1: incident in Texas Tech that I may or may not 13 00:00:39,640 --> 00:00:42,879 Speaker 1: be guilty of. Plus he played overseas and he's got 14 00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:45,760 Speaker 1: a great charity that we'll get into. Also, some of 15 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:48,400 Speaker 1: his thoughts and my thoughts on on college basketball and 16 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:51,159 Speaker 1: what they should do to spase it up. Let me 17 00:00:51,120 --> 00:00:54,120 Speaker 1: makebe a couple of thoughts. NBA wise, um, not surprised. 18 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 1: The nets are really good because both Kyrie and k 19 00:00:57,400 --> 00:01:00,840 Speaker 1: D are awesome. And this is kind of an excuse 20 00:01:00,880 --> 00:01:03,880 Speaker 1: my language, a fuck you tour for Kevin Durant. That's 21 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:07,440 Speaker 1: really what it is, right, Kevin Durant for his career, 22 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:10,320 Speaker 1: has probably felt like I was best player in the league, 23 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:11,760 Speaker 1: or at least he thought his best perent league he's 24 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 1: in Oklahoma City, led the league in scoring several times over. 25 00:01:14,680 --> 00:01:16,600 Speaker 1: So they'm like, oh, I can't win a championship, Fine, 26 00:01:16,880 --> 00:01:19,000 Speaker 1: now I'll go to I'll go to the Warriors. They 27 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:22,720 Speaker 1: need me. And he not only won two championships, could 28 00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:24,720 Speaker 1: have won a third, but you know, beat out Lebron 29 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:26,479 Speaker 1: James for the m v P, and frankly, I'll played 30 00:01:26,520 --> 00:01:28,520 Speaker 1: Lebron James and we can go into the If you 31 00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:31,160 Speaker 1: think it's not fair, they had too many players and 32 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:33,560 Speaker 1: the reality is that at the time they played, Kevin 33 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:36,240 Speaker 1: Love was a superstar, Kyrie Irving was a superstar, and 34 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:38,679 Speaker 1: Lebron James was superstar. I don't know why that's not 35 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:41,680 Speaker 1: equal to what the Warriors had because the Warriors had 36 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:45,680 Speaker 1: a uh, they had a better team. Well Draymond Green 37 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:48,720 Speaker 1: and Tristan Thompson. Well Draymond I like better offensively, but 38 00:01:49,720 --> 00:01:54,440 Speaker 1: they're both star role players. So look, my thing is 39 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:56,640 Speaker 1: I thought Katie was better than Lebron in the finals 40 00:01:56,640 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: both those two years, then they would have won a 41 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:01,400 Speaker 1: third NBA championship now from tearing as Achilles Tenant sits 42 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:03,840 Speaker 1: all of last year and comes back and turns out 43 00:02:03,960 --> 00:02:07,160 Speaker 1: he's still awesome. So not surprising. But the Spencer dim 44 00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:10,320 Speaker 1: Witty injury, and maybe Spencer didn't fit with them, maybe 45 00:02:10,320 --> 00:02:12,639 Speaker 1: that maybe he should have been an off the bench guy. Whatever, 46 00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:15,720 Speaker 1: But you're gonna you're gonna need some depth this year. 47 00:02:16,680 --> 00:02:19,120 Speaker 1: They're gonna need to find a way to get another dude. 48 00:02:19,200 --> 00:02:21,160 Speaker 1: I like Spencer a lot, and I think the thing 49 00:02:21,200 --> 00:02:23,640 Speaker 1: that Spencer could provide them with carras Laverd is if 50 00:02:23,720 --> 00:02:26,720 Speaker 1: Kyrie went crazy and doesn't want to follow the defensive 51 00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 1: signments and whatever, then all of a sudden, can you 52 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 1: sit him? And it's harder to sit him? Were harder 53 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 1: to sit Kyrie? Now that you'll have such a drop 54 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:37,880 Speaker 1: off without Spencer dim Witi there, But not a surprise. 55 00:02:37,919 --> 00:02:40,360 Speaker 1: The Nets should be the best team in the East. 56 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:43,240 Speaker 1: I still like Milwaukee good team. Obviously, when they shoot 57 00:02:43,240 --> 00:02:44,800 Speaker 1: as well as they've shot a couple of nights this year, 58 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:49,200 Speaker 1: they'll be great. But they're still widely dependent upon Janice 59 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:52,200 Speaker 1: and Tenna coopo and you have to remember that one 60 00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:53,880 Speaker 1: of the things that Nets have been able to do. 61 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 1: They have two shop blockers that I believe can guard Janice, 62 00:02:56,840 --> 00:02:59,000 Speaker 1: and they have KD who can guard Janice with his 63 00:02:59,120 --> 00:03:00,880 Speaker 1: size and his length in his name so he won't 64 00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:04,639 Speaker 1: get called for the fouls. I think the Nets. It's 65 00:03:04,639 --> 00:03:07,120 Speaker 1: a lots gonna depend up on health. Um. I think 66 00:03:07,120 --> 00:03:09,959 Speaker 1: the Nets. I would rank them one ahead of the Bucks, 67 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:13,120 Speaker 1: who wins and loss wise are just okay. It's hard 68 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 1: to take these games seriously so far in the East 69 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:18,520 Speaker 1: six Ers still a work in progress. Not sure if 70 00:03:18,520 --> 00:03:20,320 Speaker 1: they're gonna go after Harden and not go after heard 71 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 1: that Darryl Morey tweet was weird, super weird. But I 72 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 1: do like the Nets. I really like the Clippers, and 73 00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:29,200 Speaker 1: it's interesting that so many people are so off. The 74 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:31,200 Speaker 1: Clippers are like, Wow, their chemistry was bad and they 75 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 1: fell apart in the bubble they did. Do you know 76 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:36,560 Speaker 1: who else's chemistry was bad and they fell apart late 77 00:03:37,040 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 1: and then they reassembled the team in year two and 78 00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:41,520 Speaker 1: won a championship. That would be the l A Lakers, 79 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 1: who also, by the way, fired their coach after their 80 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:47,600 Speaker 1: first year. I think the Clippers, they maybe shouldn't be 81 00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: the favorites, but the co favorites or the one bees 82 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:53,880 Speaker 1: to the Lakers. Those two dudes can seriously play UM. 83 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:59,280 Speaker 1: I like the Abaka edition and uh I. I think 84 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:01,760 Speaker 1: that they've they've made editions of guys that don't need 85 00:04:01,800 --> 00:04:04,880 Speaker 1: the basketball. Still haven't totally solved the point guard thing. 86 00:04:05,920 --> 00:04:10,680 Speaker 1: But I like the Clippers UM and the West is 87 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:14,640 Speaker 1: relatively tough, but I don't think Denver. You know now 88 00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:17,000 Speaker 1: that you're depending more umon Mikeael Porter Jr. Who he 89 00:04:17,040 --> 00:04:19,400 Speaker 1: can be a night guy. But now they can't really 90 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:23,560 Speaker 1: stop anybody. They just can't. I don't love their ability 91 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:25,799 Speaker 1: to win a championship, but they're gonna be really competitive. 92 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:28,880 Speaker 1: Same thing with Utah, Donov Mitchell is awesome. It's a 93 00:04:28,920 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 1: really good team. And the Warriors of the team that 94 00:04:31,400 --> 00:04:35,240 Speaker 1: I hate what they've done because it means that Steph 95 00:04:35,279 --> 00:04:37,600 Speaker 1: has to dominate the ball more and that's not where 96 00:04:37,600 --> 00:04:41,920 Speaker 1: he's at his best. The Lakers, the Clippers, I think, 97 00:04:41,920 --> 00:04:44,920 Speaker 1: the Nets, and the Bucks and we'll see if somebody 98 00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:47,760 Speaker 1: wants to trade for for James Harden. That's generally the 99 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:50,839 Speaker 1: early look on the NBA, and then they you know, 100 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:52,440 Speaker 1: I know that most of these guys don't think they 101 00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:55,480 Speaker 1: should be playing yet some haven't played in so long. 102 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:58,640 Speaker 1: Some just finished playing like two weeks ago. But the 103 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 1: disparity in some of these game times in the margin 104 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:04,679 Speaker 1: of victories like hard to watch, even if you love 105 00:05:04,920 --> 00:05:08,560 Speaker 1: the actual talent in the association. All right, quickly on 106 00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:13,599 Speaker 1: college basketball. Look, I've been I've been formulating this hypothesis 107 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:18,440 Speaker 1: over why Kentucky sucks so far. Carolina is still down. 108 00:05:18,600 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: Duke's you know, not great. Kansas obviously their counse a 109 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:26,760 Speaker 1: little bit off, but still self and they're still they 110 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:29,279 Speaker 1: still they have enough veterans. I think they'll still be 111 00:05:29,360 --> 00:05:31,120 Speaker 1: very competterf They may well win the Big twelve because 112 00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 1: He's that good and their culture is that good. But 113 00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:36,720 Speaker 1: it started with Villanova, it's going to continue here a 114 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:38,640 Speaker 1: little bit of Virginia a theo. They lost some guys 115 00:05:38,680 --> 00:05:42,159 Speaker 1: to the draft, DeAndre Hunter, especially when when early went 116 00:05:42,279 --> 00:05:45,680 Speaker 1: went really really early. Cow guy went early as well. Um, 117 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:47,720 Speaker 1: but I think you're gonna see it with Gonzaga, even 118 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:49,360 Speaker 1: though they're gonna lose the one and done in jail 119 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:53,840 Speaker 1: and sugs and the depth of the Big Ten is 120 00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:57,840 Speaker 1: the easiest indicator for the change in college basketball. This 121 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:01,360 Speaker 1: is a hypotheses that I think we'll play out and 122 00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:04,440 Speaker 1: become a theory over time. Right, theory is hypotheses that 123 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:08,440 Speaker 1: has improven correct at least on on some level. Is 124 00:06:08,520 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 1: that I think what we're in the middle of a 125 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:14,640 Speaker 1: sea change in college hoop. We are now we've gone 126 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:17,880 Speaker 1: through the transfer thing, and that does matter. Right Eric 127 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:23,080 Speaker 1: Pascal of course transferred to to Villanova. How did that 128 00:06:23,160 --> 00:06:26,279 Speaker 1: change them forever? They've had players red shirt as well. 129 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:28,360 Speaker 1: I mean, look, if they don't have Jalen Brunson, I 130 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:30,239 Speaker 1: don't know if the thing all works out, that doesn't 131 00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:33,000 Speaker 1: all kind of come together and win those two national championships. 132 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:37,120 Speaker 1: But but they did. But that the idea is it 133 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 1: was always been hard to win with eighteen nineteen. And look, 134 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:46,039 Speaker 1: some of these kids are old hold backs, prehaps school. 135 00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 1: Some of them are twenty when they get to it's 136 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:49,599 Speaker 1: always been difficult to compete at the very top of 137 00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:52,560 Speaker 1: college basketball once you get deep in the instrum when 138 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:54,560 Speaker 1: you have kids and they have men. But if you 139 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:59,600 Speaker 1: have an Anthony Davis as a freshman. But here's what's interesting. 140 00:06:59,800 --> 00:07:02,760 Speaker 1: Let's look at Cole's one championship. It's Anthony Davis and 141 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:06,440 Speaker 1: that group of Kentucky Wildcats what's fascinating about it is 142 00:07:07,279 --> 00:07:10,000 Speaker 1: I pointed out Syracuse and Carolina were the two best 143 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:13,200 Speaker 1: other teams. Carolina that year had lost to them by 144 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:16,600 Speaker 1: two points in Ropperna Kendall Marshall got hurt broke I 145 00:07:16,600 --> 00:07:19,360 Speaker 1: think his wrist against Creighton and they lost in the 146 00:07:19,440 --> 00:07:24,080 Speaker 1: lead eight to Kansas UM Syracuse they lost their center 147 00:07:24,440 --> 00:07:29,280 Speaker 1: fat Melo rest in Peace two uh to academic suspension 148 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:32,239 Speaker 1: right before that tournament. They never faced either of those teams. 149 00:07:32,280 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 1: So yeah, they won, but were they really the best team. 150 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:39,040 Speaker 1: The reason I point that out is because now you're 151 00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:42,400 Speaker 1: gonna take the top five kids or some five out 152 00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:44,520 Speaker 1: of the top ten kids. I'm probably gonna go to 153 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:48,280 Speaker 1: this G League select team. Yeah, in Memphis is now 154 00:07:48,320 --> 00:07:51,320 Speaker 1: one of those recruiting juggernauts, and what Penny Penny has 155 00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:54,880 Speaker 1: been able to do, and Kentucky is no longer able 156 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:58,760 Speaker 1: to get the five best kids or five of the 157 00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:00,680 Speaker 1: ten best kids because five of them are gone. That 158 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 1: doesn't mean they can't get five of the next kids, 159 00:08:04,520 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 1: but those guys are such a substantial drop off from 160 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 1: the top five. You're not there's not You're not gonna 161 00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:17,960 Speaker 1: have an Anthony Davis anymore. And those guys the likelihood 162 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:21,200 Speaker 1: that they go to college or that they go to 163 00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 1: Kentucky and there's enough supporting talent. And and look how 164 00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:28,440 Speaker 1: IS has missed on on some of these transfers where 165 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:31,240 Speaker 1: these kids look really good at a lower level, you 166 00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 1: transfer up to level of Kentucky and it's it's a 167 00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:37,000 Speaker 1: different brand of basketball. I point that out because I 168 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:41,439 Speaker 1: believe that over the next five years, unless the rules change, 169 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:43,360 Speaker 1: and even then it's a bit of a slow, a 170 00:08:43,400 --> 00:08:47,120 Speaker 1: slow changing ship. I think like the Big Ten is 171 00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:51,280 Speaker 1: the those are the perfect schools to be positioned to 172 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:55,920 Speaker 1: win long term because they're recruiting good, solid players that 173 00:08:56,760 --> 00:09:00,360 Speaker 1: may end up being NBA players a Luca Garza whatever, 174 00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:06,160 Speaker 1: but but but not immediate impact college guys. And because 175 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:08,640 Speaker 1: of that, they stay longer. They are older. And now 176 00:09:08,880 --> 00:09:11,520 Speaker 1: look at Wisconsin, they're starting to meet your trisis twenty 177 00:09:11,559 --> 00:09:15,080 Speaker 1: four years old. You know, you're starting to two year olds. 178 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:18,040 Speaker 1: They're gonna of course, they're gonna beat teams with eighteen 179 00:09:18,120 --> 00:09:21,360 Speaker 1: nine year old kids. Of course they are. I think 180 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:25,920 Speaker 1: the Big Ten is position themselves because they're gonna bring 181 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:28,600 Speaker 1: so many kids back on a yearly basis to be 182 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 1: the conference of the next at least half decade, if 183 00:09:32,320 --> 00:09:34,800 Speaker 1: not entire decade. That's that's a belief I have because 184 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:37,200 Speaker 1: everybody else is not. Not every other school, you know, 185 00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:40,640 Speaker 1: Notre Dame could be there too. I think Virginia more 186 00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:43,320 Speaker 1: so than Carolina and Duke because Caroline Duke they're they're 187 00:09:43,440 --> 00:09:46,439 Speaker 1: they're such fashionable glamour schools and they recruit took out 188 00:09:46,440 --> 00:09:49,680 Speaker 1: of the NBA model. It's harder to keep them in school. 189 00:09:49,760 --> 00:09:51,800 Speaker 1: And when you have younger players, it's really hard to 190 00:09:51,840 --> 00:09:54,920 Speaker 1: compete against the old men. And the draft is gonna 191 00:09:54,920 --> 00:09:57,040 Speaker 1: get younger and younger and younger and younger. We're now 192 00:09:57,040 --> 00:09:59,800 Speaker 1: we're on a cycle where I don't see it ending anytime. 193 00:09:59,840 --> 00:10:02,360 Speaker 1: So him, I want to welcome to a friend of mine. 194 00:10:02,360 --> 00:10:05,440 Speaker 1: His name is Chad Wilkerson. Plato are you it's a 195 00:10:05,520 --> 00:10:07,760 Speaker 1: really good player, a really good dude. He's got an 196 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:09,640 Speaker 1: awesome charity. I want you to hear about things that 197 00:10:09,679 --> 00:10:12,160 Speaker 1: they do. But let's catch up with the former or 198 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:17,360 Speaker 1: Robert Starr. All right, let's welcome him in um. He 199 00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 1: works for Impacts Hoops and he's also joining us on 200 00:10:21,400 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 1: the fifteenth anniversary of his of his wedding. Right like that, 201 00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:29,360 Speaker 1: like that's Uh, that's the that's that's that's always fascinating 202 00:10:29,400 --> 00:10:31,920 Speaker 1: to me. On what guys do on their anniversary day. 203 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:34,079 Speaker 1: So they got married on New Year's which I think 204 00:10:34,080 --> 00:10:36,959 Speaker 1: we gotta get to. Um. He's a dad, he's a coach, 205 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:40,280 Speaker 1: he's a former hooper himself. He's Chad Wokerson and he 206 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:42,520 Speaker 1: joins us in the All Ball podcast chat. How are you? 207 00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:45,640 Speaker 1: I'm doing great, Doug. I'm so humbled and grateful to 208 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:48,880 Speaker 1: be on your podcast. I'm looking forward to this conversation 209 00:10:49,040 --> 00:10:54,120 Speaker 1: and uh sharing a few things. Okay, so your basketball 210 00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:56,480 Speaker 1: background started? Where when you started hoop? What are you? 211 00:10:56,559 --> 00:11:00,240 Speaker 1: What's your first memories of hoop? My dad was high 212 00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:03,920 Speaker 1: school coach in Grand Prairie, Texas. Uh, I grew up 213 00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:07,800 Speaker 1: in the gym. I remember just kind of hanging out 214 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:10,880 Speaker 1: with him, and especially when I got into those ten 215 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:14,600 Speaker 1: eleven twelve year old age, just being around his JV 216 00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:18,080 Speaker 1: teams and his varsity teams kind of uh, just kind 217 00:11:18,080 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 1: of being not necessarily a ball boy, but kind of 218 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:22,439 Speaker 1: a ball boy. I get out there at halftime and 219 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 1: shoot shots, waiting for my turn to uh, to compete 220 00:11:26,040 --> 00:11:28,000 Speaker 1: and play the great game of basketball. That's funny the 221 00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:30,040 Speaker 1: halftime shots thing. Okay, so this is a true story. 222 00:11:30,040 --> 00:11:31,800 Speaker 1: Maybe I need to throw my brother onto this. So 223 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:35,280 Speaker 1: my brother was a star at Elmadina High School, UH, 224 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:37,080 Speaker 1: in the city of Orange. That's what I was supposed 225 00:11:37,080 --> 00:11:39,040 Speaker 1: to go to. And I was the ball boy, and 226 00:11:39,080 --> 00:11:42,120 Speaker 1: I used to go during time, but during halftime I'd go. 227 00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:44,400 Speaker 1: And everyone knows me now as a guy who couldn't 228 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:47,120 Speaker 1: shoot in college, but I was a great shooter as 229 00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:49,200 Speaker 1: a kid, and they would people would count in the 230 00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:51,720 Speaker 1: stands how many threes that I would make? Right, And 231 00:11:51,760 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 1: I'm sure they did the same thing. Right, You're the 232 00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:56,200 Speaker 1: little guy out there just spinning it and and and 233 00:11:56,280 --> 00:11:58,200 Speaker 1: shooting jump shot. So did you play for your dad 234 00:11:58,200 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 1: in high school? I did. I played for my dad 235 00:12:00,440 --> 00:12:02,600 Speaker 1: in high school my junior and senior at a small 236 00:12:02,720 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 1: Christian school in Grand Prairie, Texas. The starting lineup was 237 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:11,200 Speaker 1: actually myself, my little brother was a six six sophomore 238 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:14,080 Speaker 1: of my cousin, my best friend from down the road, 239 00:12:14,559 --> 00:12:16,880 Speaker 1: and the one kid were recruited from South Koan Prairie 240 00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:19,679 Speaker 1: High School who wasn't started to start for us. Uh. 241 00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:24,120 Speaker 1: It was a incredible season of life where we just 242 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 1: lived and breathed whooping. I mean it was normal for 243 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:30,319 Speaker 1: us to go to the high school gym. Uh you know, 244 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:33,480 Speaker 1: ten o'clock at night and stayed till midnight. Uh, you know, 245 00:12:33,640 --> 00:12:37,160 Speaker 1: just playing the game. That's awesome. That that's like, that's 246 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:39,240 Speaker 1: like my dream. Like I've I never thought about being 247 00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:41,040 Speaker 1: a high school coach. And I'm coaching my son and 248 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:43,920 Speaker 1: au and he's like, Dad, you should you should coach 249 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 1: me in high school? Like, well, my thing is I 250 00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:49,080 Speaker 1: wouldn't necessarily do is have his friends or a cousin. 251 00:12:49,160 --> 00:12:51,840 Speaker 1: Well maybe his cousin he's my nephew. Could could hoop 252 00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:55,079 Speaker 1: a little bit. Uh, I gotta go recruit some dudes. 253 00:12:55,160 --> 00:12:57,960 Speaker 1: I gotta go get some get some, get some dudes. Um. Okay, 254 00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:02,199 Speaker 1: So why Oral Roberts. Uh? My mom and dad went 255 00:13:02,240 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 1: to Old Roberts University. My dad is from southern cal 256 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:09,199 Speaker 1: he uh he My my grandfather had a church uh 257 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:11,839 Speaker 1: in Ontario, California. My dad went to Chase the high 258 00:13:11,880 --> 00:13:16,440 Speaker 1: school in Ontario, and they heard about this university in Oklahoma. 259 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:18,720 Speaker 1: My dad jumped on a train and went there and 260 00:13:18,760 --> 00:13:23,680 Speaker 1: actually played baseball and basketball at ore U UM for 261 00:13:23,760 --> 00:13:26,760 Speaker 1: just a couple of years there. And so growing up, 262 00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:29,720 Speaker 1: I had heard about Old Robert University and uh I 263 00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 1: had wanted to go there because it was a university 264 00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:34,240 Speaker 1: that I felt like I could play at but also 265 00:13:35,200 --> 00:13:38,280 Speaker 1: um could uh study the things that were important to me. 266 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:41,600 Speaker 1: And I just happened to be there at the same 267 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:43,960 Speaker 1: time as this young coach, a guy who was a 268 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:46,840 Speaker 1: pretty decent coach named Bill Self. It just happened to 269 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:49,920 Speaker 1: be there. So yeah, so so so so Bill had 270 00:13:50,080 --> 00:13:52,160 Speaker 1: and and Bill loves to tell the story. He's like, 271 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:55,280 Speaker 1: you know, like I'll never forget when he got the 272 00:13:55,360 --> 00:13:59,079 Speaker 1: Kansas job, right and it was, uh he got the 273 00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:01,680 Speaker 1: Kansas job. He's like, uh, you guys know when six 274 00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:05,600 Speaker 1: and twenty one of my first year, right and and 275 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:08,920 Speaker 1: uh so there when they're recruiting you there there ten 276 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:12,880 Speaker 1: in seventeen, like what what what was the recruiting process? 277 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:16,120 Speaker 1: Like it was it was It was interesting. They came, 278 00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 1: they did a home visit. Uh. They they didn't do 279 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:23,800 Speaker 1: their homework per se because they were like, well, you know, 280 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:26,240 Speaker 1: you gotta go to Chapel. You got to wear a tie. 281 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 1: But my mom and dad wanted me to go to Chapel. 282 00:14:29,080 --> 00:14:31,600 Speaker 1: They wanted me to wear a tye. Uh. They had 283 00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:35,000 Speaker 1: they had grown up, uh, you know, attending the university 284 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:37,760 Speaker 1: and believe in what it stood for. And uh, but 285 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 1: I was. I was so gung ho. I was trying 286 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:43,200 Speaker 1: to recruit myself to are You. It was almost like 287 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:46,120 Speaker 1: they were, ah, we don't know about the skinny little kid, 288 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:48,520 Speaker 1: you know, and and from this little Christian school, I'm 289 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:51,520 Speaker 1: begging to go. I'm and coach self actually told me, 290 00:14:51,560 --> 00:14:53,920 Speaker 1: he said, I didn't I didn't know you were gonna 291 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:56,360 Speaker 1: be a good player. We we did. We needed a 292 00:14:56,400 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 1: fourth body. Um, we just have to have a scholarship 293 00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:02,480 Speaker 1: open up. And I was fortunate enough to go. Uh 294 00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:05,080 Speaker 1: And and the weird thing about it was, I actually 295 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:07,600 Speaker 1: uh that was the same the year I was being recruited, 296 00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:10,760 Speaker 1: Liberty University made it to the n C Double, a 297 00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:15,480 Speaker 1: tournament played in North Carolina against Rashid Wallace and Jerry Stackhouse. 298 00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:17,600 Speaker 1: And I was just like, oh, I gotta go to Liberty. 299 00:15:17,840 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 1: And it's really down to those two schools, and uh, oh, 300 00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:23,120 Speaker 1: are you ended up being in the school for me, 301 00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:25,360 Speaker 1: and it actually ended up being a dream school. Uh 302 00:15:25,520 --> 00:15:28,440 Speaker 1: playing there for coach self, I mean, he he's a 303 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:31,920 Speaker 1: brilliant coach, a great person to learn from and I 304 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:34,680 Speaker 1: owe him so much even in my career after basketball, 305 00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:36,800 Speaker 1: how kind he has been to me. You know what's 306 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:39,840 Speaker 1: interesting though, is like you you guys were people forget 307 00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:44,120 Speaker 1: or he was really got really really good. Uh during self, 308 00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:46,800 Speaker 1: your first two years, you didn't play very much. Uh, 309 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:51,160 Speaker 1: Tim Gill, Rocky Wall, Rocky Wall was just uh, I 310 00:15:51,240 --> 00:15:54,320 Speaker 1: mean he's just a for for that level. Uh. Well, 311 00:15:54,360 --> 00:15:58,120 Speaker 1: Cliff Cranshaw as well was was a very good player. Um. 312 00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:01,360 Speaker 1: And and Blake Moses is you know, but but you 313 00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:03,560 Speaker 1: didn't so okay, you didn't play very much your first 314 00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 1: two years until Barry took over. Let let me let 315 00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:08,080 Speaker 1: me start with with Bill. What was he like as 316 00:16:08,160 --> 00:16:10,640 Speaker 1: as a code were your first memories of your first 317 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:15,120 Speaker 1: kind of month of practice under Bill self? Uh? Honestly, 318 00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:19,680 Speaker 1: it was incredible because coming from a coach's home, I 319 00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:22,000 Speaker 1: love thinking the game, and it was very normal for 320 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:25,920 Speaker 1: for us to go, h have a film session, and 321 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:29,160 Speaker 1: after the film session, coach self turn off the old 322 00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:33,200 Speaker 1: school VHS and start doing a whiteboard session and he 323 00:16:33,200 --> 00:16:36,120 Speaker 1: would do time square momentum and he would quiz us 324 00:16:36,680 --> 00:16:40,760 Speaker 1: on how to put ourselves in the best situation time 325 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:42,760 Speaker 1: square momentum at the end of the game, he would 326 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:45,240 Speaker 1: make a stink. And here's the thing about coach self. 327 00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:47,720 Speaker 1: I think people they respect and they know about him. 328 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:51,120 Speaker 1: But being a player, I can tell you he knows 329 00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:53,920 Speaker 1: how to put his teams in a position, especially at 330 00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:56,720 Speaker 1: the end of the game. Not to make the shot. 331 00:16:56,800 --> 00:16:58,280 Speaker 1: The kids have to make the shot. The player has 332 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:00,360 Speaker 1: to make the shot. But a coaches Bob is to 333 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:03,840 Speaker 1: put his team in the best situation. He's an absolute genius. 334 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:06,840 Speaker 1: I mean, the other day I was I don't want 335 00:17:06,840 --> 00:17:08,280 Speaker 1: to interrupt you, but the other day I was watching 336 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:11,119 Speaker 1: them play, uh I think it was Texas Tech, and 337 00:17:11,200 --> 00:17:13,280 Speaker 1: I saw him call playing the huddle with light just 338 00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:16,280 Speaker 1: in the game situation, and I saw one of the 339 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:19,639 Speaker 1: assistant coaches fis bumping because they knew they were putting 340 00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:22,760 Speaker 1: in a wrinkle that they had not shown Tech and 341 00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:24,439 Speaker 1: they were going to get the look they wanted and 342 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:27,159 Speaker 1: they did and they scored it. Now, now look, I'll 343 00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:28,760 Speaker 1: tell you the other side of that one. Okay, So 344 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:32,639 Speaker 1: that inbounds play they ran they ran earlier in the 345 00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 1: game and Texas Tech, this is one of those coaches 346 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:37,080 Speaker 1: can only do so much. Because I talked to the 347 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:39,080 Speaker 1: Tech guys like we told them what play was coming, 348 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:41,120 Speaker 1: we called them how to play it, and they still 349 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:45,040 Speaker 1: screwed it up, right right. So so it's it's it's 350 00:17:45,080 --> 00:17:50,240 Speaker 1: really is it really is remarkable, you know, um it's 351 00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:54,440 Speaker 1: it's fascinating to me because because you know, O are 352 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:58,920 Speaker 1: You was, I had known about ore u um as 353 00:17:59,119 --> 00:18:01,520 Speaker 1: you know my dad when in the seventies when oh 354 00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:04,000 Speaker 1: are You kind of first took off, My dad was 355 00:18:04,040 --> 00:18:06,480 Speaker 1: at at Jacksonville, which is all and you w Milwaukee, 356 00:18:06,560 --> 00:18:08,320 Speaker 1: which is also an independent. So they actually I think 357 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:13,520 Speaker 1: played against Oral Roberts, and um my, i'd like, I 358 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 1: just I remember your junior year. Okay, so I'm thinking 359 00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:21,480 Speaker 1: it's your junior year right when you guys came in 360 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:26,159 Speaker 1: and played us at Gallagher and uh, do you what 361 00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:28,760 Speaker 1: do you remember about the game? Here? Here's here's I'm 362 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:30,639 Speaker 1: so glad you brought it up, because here's what I remember. 363 00:18:31,240 --> 00:18:33,560 Speaker 1: I remember coming out for I get there, you know, 364 00:18:33,640 --> 00:18:35,600 Speaker 1: we'd all the guys that wanted to get some shots up. 365 00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:38,400 Speaker 1: We get there about an hour early before the gym's full, 366 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:40,720 Speaker 1: and we get a few shots up, and I remember 367 00:18:40,760 --> 00:18:44,119 Speaker 1: coming into Gallagher Gallagher EVA, and it's a weird feeling 368 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:46,919 Speaker 1: because the stands were so vertical, and we're so I'm 369 00:18:46,920 --> 00:18:48,600 Speaker 1: getting a few shots up and I looked down the 370 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:51,120 Speaker 1: court and I remember this, Doug, It's so funny. You 371 00:18:51,200 --> 00:18:56,760 Speaker 1: had on some gray Nike sweatpants and a wife beater 372 00:18:57,880 --> 00:19:01,080 Speaker 1: and I was like, who is this guy down there? 373 00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:03,720 Speaker 1: It looked like you had just done about three sets 374 00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:06,080 Speaker 1: of curls because you're all by stepped up. And I 375 00:19:06,119 --> 00:19:08,119 Speaker 1: want to tell people. I want people to notice. I 376 00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:10,960 Speaker 1: don't think people respect how good of a player you were. 377 00:19:11,720 --> 00:19:15,399 Speaker 1: I remember in the game going this, this guy is 378 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:18,600 Speaker 1: going everywhere on the court. Now. It helped that you 379 00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:22,400 Speaker 1: had a Desert Mason and Adrian Peterson. It's guys, uh 380 00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:24,600 Speaker 1: that that could make shots for it. But you were 381 00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:27,960 Speaker 1: putting guys in positions and you had a swag, you had, 382 00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:30,320 Speaker 1: you had an aura. I was like, man, I need 383 00:19:30,320 --> 00:19:33,120 Speaker 1: to get some of those great sweat pants and where 384 00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:36,159 Speaker 1: I like that. So, So here's what here's what I 385 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:40,200 Speaker 1: recall about it. Okay, So during that season, um so 386 00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:43,600 Speaker 1: during that season, um, we were picked dead last in 387 00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:48,040 Speaker 1: the Big twelve, dead last, and um and the year 388 00:19:48,080 --> 00:19:50,120 Speaker 1: before I got there, they were seventeen and fifteen, two 389 00:19:50,119 --> 00:19:53,679 Speaker 1: consecutive years and I think, did you guys beat them 390 00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:56,000 Speaker 1: the year before. I'm trying to try remember before year 391 00:19:56,080 --> 00:19:57,760 Speaker 1: my sophomore year, we beat him at the Maybe Center. 392 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:01,320 Speaker 1: So they lost it. They got by Tulsa and got 393 00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:04,680 Speaker 1: beat by or Roberts the two games in Tulsa and 394 00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:07,600 Speaker 1: and and then Bill took over the Tulsa job, and 395 00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:09,280 Speaker 1: coach came out with you, I'm not gonna play against 396 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:13,680 Speaker 1: assistant coach, former assistant coaches anymore thing whatever. So so 397 00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:16,880 Speaker 1: so we come out and you guys were everybody respected 398 00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:19,080 Speaker 1: Tim gil and like man, Tim Gills a really good player, 399 00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:24,439 Speaker 1: and and we're undefeated. We adn't playing anybody and um, 400 00:20:24,520 --> 00:20:29,760 Speaker 1: and Philip Owens was from Stillwater was a freshman, right 401 00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:32,119 Speaker 1: and Barry Hinson, who was the head coach but he 402 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:34,040 Speaker 1: had been long time, he had been a head coach 403 00:20:34,119 --> 00:20:36,399 Speaker 1: at Stillwater High School was an os u alum or whatever. 404 00:20:36,920 --> 00:20:40,480 Speaker 1: And it was a great basketball game. And we were 405 00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:44,919 Speaker 1: down I'm gonna say like nine, maybe six, but not 406 00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:48,600 Speaker 1: nine with you know, in the second half, and Philip 407 00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:50,920 Speaker 1: Owens and checks into the game. Here comes as freshman. 408 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:54,560 Speaker 1: And so here's the way it worked. But we our 409 00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:57,640 Speaker 1: system at the time was at every free though we had, 410 00:20:57,720 --> 00:21:01,959 Speaker 1: we called what defense we were in, what secondary we 411 00:21:01,960 --> 00:21:04,320 Speaker 1: were in, what kind of offense we were in, and 412 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:07,240 Speaker 1: what fifteen second play we're in every free throw and 413 00:21:07,400 --> 00:21:09,200 Speaker 1: you know, like sometimes and we just like you'd meet 414 00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:11,600 Speaker 1: together and you just go, hey, same same ship, right, 415 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:15,199 Speaker 1: and then we and that that's it. But um, I 416 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:17,359 Speaker 1: think it was forty red was the call for press. 417 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,080 Speaker 1: So we saw Philip Owens come come in, right, and 418 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:23,720 Speaker 1: as you said, because we hadn't been very good, but 419 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:25,639 Speaker 1: we were winning, and because it was or Roberts and 420 00:21:25,680 --> 00:21:27,840 Speaker 1: you guys brought some in. The place is packed, you know, 421 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:30,840 Speaker 1: six people in there, and we put on the full 422 00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:33,800 Speaker 1: core press. And I actually afterwards there was part of 423 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:35,720 Speaker 1: me that felt really bad for the kid. Right Here's 424 00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,360 Speaker 1: because you eat in your mind, you think, well, man, 425 00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:42,320 Speaker 1: I'm from Stillwater, that guy, those point guard, all those guys, 426 00:21:42,320 --> 00:21:44,560 Speaker 1: they're playing in the position that I should be playing, 427 00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:46,760 Speaker 1: because I don't know, kid grows up in Stillwater doesn't 428 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:49,040 Speaker 1: dream of playing for os U, right, and when he's 429 00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:51,320 Speaker 1: in high school, they won a national championship or went 430 00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:53,879 Speaker 1: to the final four as well, and he and we 431 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:57,560 Speaker 1: just and before you before Barry could call a time out, 432 00:21:57,840 --> 00:21:59,400 Speaker 1: it was like a six or and eight oh run. 433 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:02,120 Speaker 1: But here is how big the win was for us 434 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:04,000 Speaker 1: over you guys that I don't know if you remember this. 435 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:07,760 Speaker 1: The last play of the game, Adrian Peterson steals a ball, 436 00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:09,440 Speaker 1: throws it to me. I throw him an alley loop. 437 00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:13,160 Speaker 1: He catches it, he dunks it and hangs on the rim, 438 00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:15,840 Speaker 1: and we win seventy three sixty six. We end up 439 00:22:15,840 --> 00:22:18,400 Speaker 1: winning by seven points after trailing by I think nine 440 00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:20,840 Speaker 1: points in the in the second half, the place goes 441 00:22:20,880 --> 00:22:22,879 Speaker 1: crazy and he like pulls himself up, like remember the 442 00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:25,720 Speaker 1: end of a white man can't jump when he pulls 443 00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:27,720 Speaker 1: himself That's what Adrian Peterson did on the rim. And 444 00:22:27,720 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 1: we're like celebrating, and somebody goes, well, we celebrating we 445 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:33,240 Speaker 1: only beat or Roberts. I was like, just go with it, man, 446 00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:35,760 Speaker 1: go with it. Anyway it was. It was out of 447 00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:38,959 Speaker 1: respect for your guy's program and the ass kicking they 448 00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:42,840 Speaker 1: took the year before. Yeah, that's kind of you to say. 449 00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:44,919 Speaker 1: We we we were at that point. We were a 450 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:48,919 Speaker 1: strong U low major mid major and uh you know 451 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:51,359 Speaker 1: we we h we we did. We had some fun wins, 452 00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:53,640 Speaker 1: we really did. We had a fun win against Arkansas 453 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,840 Speaker 1: at the Maybe Center during my career, and I got 454 00:22:56,840 --> 00:22:59,879 Speaker 1: to play in some incredible places college basketball was in 455 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,879 Speaker 1: and and Douga, I'm glad you mentioned the gym was packed. 456 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:05,399 Speaker 1: That was back in the day when you would go 457 00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:10,439 Speaker 1: to a game. I mean, the student sections were unreal, 458 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:14,480 Speaker 1: they were I'll remember that. So that same year, that 459 00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:16,959 Speaker 1: same year we thought we played this crummy schedule, right, 460 00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:20,159 Speaker 1: you guys win twenty games. We played Washington, who went 461 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:22,080 Speaker 1: to the Sweet six team at our place. They had 462 00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:25,000 Speaker 1: Mount McCullough, Dan Dick, I was a freshman. Uh, they 463 00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:27,439 Speaker 1: had Donald Watts. They had Dion Luton, who I know. 464 00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,720 Speaker 1: You know he's from Oklahoma, originally from Lawton, I believe originally. Anyway, 465 00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:34,399 Speaker 1: I remember going to that game and I couldn't get 466 00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:39,080 Speaker 1: into the gym because my dorm, h Bennett Hall, was 467 00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:41,240 Speaker 1: across the street. And so I come down and I 468 00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:42,760 Speaker 1: was running a little late. We're supposed to be there, 469 00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:43,880 Speaker 1: I don't know, like an hour and a half, two 470 00:23:43,880 --> 00:23:45,199 Speaker 1: hours for the game, and I was like an hour 471 00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:47,400 Speaker 1: fift team for the game. And I and I come 472 00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:49,639 Speaker 1: in and I just had like a hoodie and a 473 00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:53,320 Speaker 1: parka and sweats or whatever, and and I was like, 474 00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:54,600 Speaker 1: no, no no, no, I'm on and no one knew who 475 00:23:54,600 --> 00:23:56,239 Speaker 1: the hell I was. I'm you know, I'm a you know, 476 00:23:57,320 --> 00:23:59,800 Speaker 1: barely not really six foot white guy and I'm like, 477 00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:02,200 Speaker 1: I'm on the team. They're like, you know, like no, no, 478 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 1: and that. But I could. I had to cut through 479 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:06,800 Speaker 1: the student section and students are like, whoa you think? 480 00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:08,800 Speaker 1: What do you think you're doing? What were you doing? 481 00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:11,400 Speaker 1: I'm like, yo, I'm on the team. No you're not. Anyway, 482 00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:13,680 Speaker 1: it was it was hard to get into the building 483 00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,480 Speaker 1: as a player an hour before the game, let alone 484 00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:18,760 Speaker 1: as a as a as a student. How do you 485 00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:21,480 Speaker 1: think we get that back? Can we get that back? 486 00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:24,760 Speaker 1: Million dollar? Quite? I don't. With Netflix and Prime Video, 487 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:26,439 Speaker 1: I don't don't. I don't see it coming back. Bro. 488 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:30,639 Speaker 1: It's sad to say that. Uh, but you know it's funny. 489 00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:34,600 Speaker 1: I I like watching a lot of different sports. The 490 00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 1: energy is not the same in college basketball or I mean, 491 00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:41,680 Speaker 1: it's just it's not there. There's not that buzz uh 492 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 1: And I don't know how we get it back. I mean, 493 00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:48,040 Speaker 1: international soccer to me, has that energy the community that 494 00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:51,800 Speaker 1: we're losing that community in college sports. I think I 495 00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,159 Speaker 1: don't know that's my opinion. Well, I think there's a 496 00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:56,679 Speaker 1: I think there's a lot to there's a lot to 497 00:24:56,720 --> 00:25:01,600 Speaker 1: do a lot of different issues with it. Um yeah, 498 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:07,800 Speaker 1: I'm you know. I think one there's this somehow we've 499 00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:11,400 Speaker 1: gotten to this place where college sports is simply a 500 00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:16,240 Speaker 1: way station for professional sports. Right that that's a big thing, 501 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:20,600 Speaker 1: and um, the reality of it is is not in 502 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,560 Speaker 1: the reality I actually think. I don't know. I don't 503 00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:25,840 Speaker 1: think college basketball is in his back. I think it's 504 00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:29,080 Speaker 1: hard right now because there's no fans there. And I 505 00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 1: do think I think that the schools we went through 506 00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:36,399 Speaker 1: this process of this period where the one in Dunn's 507 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:39,200 Speaker 1: maybe didn't dominate in terms of winning a national championship, 508 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:42,119 Speaker 1: but they played major roles in who the top teams were. 509 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:46,640 Speaker 1: I think that's gonna end with this G League select thing. 510 00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:50,240 Speaker 1: And I think now the reason the Big Ten is 511 00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:52,359 Speaker 1: so good is they have the most four year players, 512 00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:55,359 Speaker 1: four and five year players. So I think that's gonna 513 00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:59,680 Speaker 1: help make the sport better and a little older. And 514 00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:01,960 Speaker 1: also you'll have guys who are like yo, I've I've 515 00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 1: seen you play the last three years. Um, but uh, 516 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:08,720 Speaker 1: I don't, I don't know. I don't know how we 517 00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:10,440 Speaker 1: get it back to what I would say, I think 518 00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:14,040 Speaker 1: the big problem is every games on TV. Like I remember, 519 00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:16,919 Speaker 1: I mean, obviously you're in in the Independent and in 520 00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:18,440 Speaker 1: the mid con and you didn't have a lot of 521 00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:21,400 Speaker 1: televised games till maybe the conference tournament or the one 522 00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:25,000 Speaker 1: off game. But but like when I was at Notre Dame, 523 00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:26,440 Speaker 1: like the reason I once the only reason WS the 524 00:26:26,440 --> 00:26:28,760 Speaker 1: Notre Dame is like we have eight teen nationally televised games. 525 00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:31,040 Speaker 1: We had were the only team to have NBC games, 526 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:33,520 Speaker 1: We had CBS games, we had ESPN games. Like now 527 00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: basically you can get any game ever, anywhere and you're 528 00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:39,960 Speaker 1: a major conference or there's nothing special about a TV game. 529 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:42,480 Speaker 1: I remember when Dick Vital came to call a game 530 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:46,000 Speaker 1: at Notre Dame or or Bill Raftery came at at 531 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:47,879 Speaker 1: at Notre Dame or at Oaklaham State. You're like, man, 532 00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:50,520 Speaker 1: this is the biggest thing ever. And now it doesn't 533 00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:54,399 Speaker 1: feel that way. And I so that that the the 534 00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:58,040 Speaker 1: the proliferation of college sports on television, I think as 535 00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:01,280 Speaker 1: watered down the importance of Again, and why would you 536 00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:04,040 Speaker 1: leave your dorm room or leave your apartment if you 537 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:06,320 Speaker 1: can watch all the games instead of watching one game. 538 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:08,639 Speaker 1: Part of that is there's not the connectivity to the 539 00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:11,240 Speaker 1: university because kids are only there for a second and 540 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:14,520 Speaker 1: then they transfer out. Yeah, it's true, you know, and 541 00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:16,840 Speaker 1: I don't know how I'd like to ask you this question, Doug, 542 00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:20,639 Speaker 1: do you enjoy watching I grew up going college basketball, 543 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:23,840 Speaker 1: college basketball, and then with the NBA. I love the NBA, 544 00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:26,440 Speaker 1: loved it. The college basketball was my what was my thing, 545 00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:31,320 Speaker 1: and now I find myself loving the NBA game with 546 00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:36,080 Speaker 1: the flow, the skill level, the uh the ability to 547 00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:38,560 Speaker 1: make shots. And how do you feel about do you 548 00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:43,000 Speaker 1: enjoy watching college basketball or NBA more? I think it depends. 549 00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:45,000 Speaker 1: I think this that you bring up a great point, 550 00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:47,840 Speaker 1: which is, and I've discussed this with some college coaches, 551 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:50,520 Speaker 1: is some of them are starting to come around to it, 552 00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:54,600 Speaker 1: like you you watch, uh you want, Like Michigan State. 553 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:58,560 Speaker 1: For a long time, Um, they they had the they 554 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:00,959 Speaker 1: were Now they've got taken to run horns and stuff 555 00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:04,160 Speaker 1: like their's zone offenses. What was for a long time 556 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:07,240 Speaker 1: was really rudimentary and was you know, just kind of 557 00:28:07,240 --> 00:28:08,760 Speaker 1: old school. Throw a guy in the high post and 558 00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:11,400 Speaker 1: in the short corner, you know, and you're you're you're 559 00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:15,360 Speaker 1: passing and standing and spacing or whatever, whereas NBA teams 560 00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:19,080 Speaker 1: is a little different attack versus zones. Obviously zones are 561 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,479 Speaker 1: different and how you can play them within the NBA rules, 562 00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:24,119 Speaker 1: Like I think the NBA game is. I think it's 563 00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:27,160 Speaker 1: weird because the NBA can be hard to watch because 564 00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:30,320 Speaker 1: sometimes you feel like the effort isn't what the the 565 00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:34,359 Speaker 1: the effort and now with no fans, uh, it lacks 566 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:37,000 Speaker 1: some of the zip, but the actual skill level to 567 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:39,840 Speaker 1: it and the offensive coaching in it and even the 568 00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:42,600 Speaker 1: defensive coaching, and it is spectacular so too as the skill. 569 00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:45,520 Speaker 1: I think the challenge for college coaches is going to 570 00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:48,880 Speaker 1: be who's going to be the guy who's going to 571 00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:53,240 Speaker 1: be one at a school that's good enough and two 572 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:55,040 Speaker 1: is a big enough name to go like, Hey, you 573 00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:57,440 Speaker 1: know what, I'm gonna start running NBA stuff. I'm gonna 574 00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:00,800 Speaker 1: play an NBA style and and all the dice and 575 00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:03,480 Speaker 1: see ultimately how it works. The problem with it is 576 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:06,360 Speaker 1: that I don't know if the spacing will ever be 577 00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:08,959 Speaker 1: what it is in the NBA because the skill of 578 00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:11,200 Speaker 1: shooting isn't what it is in the With the exception 579 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:13,720 Speaker 1: of the Iowa's of the world. That's so true. And 580 00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:17,600 Speaker 1: I will say this, Gonzaga is pretty to watch. They are, 581 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:19,880 Speaker 1: but but but what do they have. They have a 582 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:24,800 Speaker 1: mixture of transfers for your kids and one great one 583 00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:27,720 Speaker 1: and done. And you have a coach who can kind 584 00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:31,040 Speaker 1: of do He's not no one's firing Mark Few, so 585 00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:33,080 Speaker 1: he can take some chances and try some things and 586 00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:35,680 Speaker 1: run some different stuff. So like he's the perfect guy 587 00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:39,280 Speaker 1: to try and continue to evolve and push the limits 588 00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:44,440 Speaker 1: of what you want to do. Great, but yes, I mean, like, look, 589 00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:46,920 Speaker 1: there's sometimes the weird college basketball is that it can 590 00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:49,080 Speaker 1: be a hard watch. But I think that's a hard 591 00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:52,320 Speaker 1: watch because again, there's too many teams you're playing kids 592 00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:55,280 Speaker 1: are too young and they can't make shots, and you're like, geez, 593 00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:59,840 Speaker 1: this is I just I don't see it at the 594 00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:03,760 Speaker 1: edge level like I and in the NBA right now, 595 00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:07,360 Speaker 1: I mean, you have guys who are making shots. I mean, 596 00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:10,800 Speaker 1: it's high level skill. So do you do you do 597 00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:13,840 Speaker 1: you put the NBA rules into college basketball and and 598 00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:17,280 Speaker 1: think maybe that that helps it, you know, I I 599 00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:19,280 Speaker 1: love that question, Doug. Here here's here's what I'm a 600 00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:24,880 Speaker 1: proponent of. I don't understand how we we we we 601 00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:27,000 Speaker 1: own this game. We own the game back. I mean, 602 00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:30,760 Speaker 1: it's America. I love, I'm high on USA basketball is 603 00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:34,480 Speaker 1: but why do we have three sets of rules? Why 604 00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:36,600 Speaker 1: do we not have a shot clock universally in high 605 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:40,640 Speaker 1: school basketball? It's it's why don't we have And I'm 606 00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:43,240 Speaker 1: not saying that everybody should play the NBA rules, Maybe 607 00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:46,719 Speaker 1: we should, but there should be some sort of universal 608 00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:50,240 Speaker 1: rule that goes through our through our game, uh that 609 00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:55,240 Speaker 1: helps develop the decision making where guys become better decision makers. 610 00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:57,240 Speaker 1: I think that's the thing that people mess up with 611 00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:00,640 Speaker 1: the shot call go oh well, it's gonna it forces 612 00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:04,560 Speaker 1: you to make quicker, better decisions at a younger age. 613 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:07,520 Speaker 1: And we see that with the European players. Um, in 614 00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:10,160 Speaker 1: my opinion, i'd like to see I'd like to see 615 00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:14,240 Speaker 1: them make some more adjustments on that. Okay, So so 616 00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:16,520 Speaker 1: so let's do this. Let's do this. Let's form the 617 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:20,840 Speaker 1: perfect college basketball rule system. Chad, Chad Wokerson and Doug 618 00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:23,680 Speaker 1: gott Lab we're on the committee. Okay, do you want 619 00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:26,080 Speaker 1: to go? I'll tell you what what's better than the 620 00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:28,320 Speaker 1: twenty four o'clock? Which I like the o'clock is fine. 621 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,120 Speaker 1: I used to be like, hey, man, I want thirty 622 00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:33,160 Speaker 1: or thirty five, but now I'm like, yeah, okay. So 623 00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:35,680 Speaker 1: when I coached internationally, do you know what I love 624 00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:39,520 Speaker 1: the best? I love the fourteen second reset. I love 625 00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:44,200 Speaker 1: the fourteen second reset and um and and one of 626 00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:46,360 Speaker 1: the things that I coached when I when I when 627 00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:50,400 Speaker 1: I've coached international rules is anytime we get an offensive rebound, okay, 628 00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:51,880 Speaker 1: unless you have a layup, we want to kick out. 629 00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:53,560 Speaker 1: We want to get a three. Okay, we want to 630 00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:55,760 Speaker 1: kick out. We want to get a three. And uh 631 00:31:55,800 --> 00:32:00,480 Speaker 1: it's an idea that really I took from from Davidson. Okay, 632 00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:02,280 Speaker 1: so they used to do that. They used to practice 633 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:05,320 Speaker 1: it when Steph was there was they would call them daggers. 634 00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:07,440 Speaker 1: And anytime they get an offensive rebound, they're trying to 635 00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:09,120 Speaker 1: find Stef. And if you watch the Warriors, they do 636 00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:11,040 Speaker 1: the exact same thing. They try and find Steff and 637 00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:14,040 Speaker 1: then Duke when they won the national title. Uh, with 638 00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:17,080 Speaker 1: John Shire in that crew and Zoom Beech was like 639 00:32:17,120 --> 00:32:20,600 Speaker 1: the best offensive rebounder in basketball that year, they were 640 00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:22,800 Speaker 1: doing the exact They took that what Davidson was doing, 641 00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:25,959 Speaker 1: they started doing it. I love the fourteen second reseid. 642 00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:28,240 Speaker 1: It's like, I don't want you pulling it out and 643 00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:30,720 Speaker 1: setting it up and setting it I want to I 644 00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:34,720 Speaker 1: want to fourteen second reset. I think that's a that's 645 00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:36,960 Speaker 1: a good start. Chad Wokers, are you okay with that? 646 00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:41,160 Speaker 1: I that I I believe, I believe. Let me ask 647 00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:43,440 Speaker 1: you have another international. How do you feel about the 648 00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:46,000 Speaker 1: coaches being the only one that are able to call 649 00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:48,840 Speaker 1: a time out? Um? I like that. I don't like 650 00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:50,800 Speaker 1: the has to be a dead ball thing. I don't 651 00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:52,920 Speaker 1: mind that. I don't mind the time outs. I think 652 00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:54,720 Speaker 1: you could. I think you could cut the number of 653 00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:57,520 Speaker 1: time outs. But like, look, we're all, we're all saying 654 00:32:57,520 --> 00:32:59,760 Speaker 1: how great the NBA game is. They have like almost 655 00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:02,320 Speaker 1: limited time out, So I don't I don't like the 656 00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:04,200 Speaker 1: advanced the ball rule. I don't think you need that 657 00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:06,080 Speaker 1: in college basketball. I think, you know, like some of 658 00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:07,840 Speaker 1: the great historic plays where ones that go the length 659 00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:09,680 Speaker 1: of the court, you can just kind of figure it out. 660 00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:11,080 Speaker 1: You can always throw it to half court and call 661 00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:13,000 Speaker 1: it time out, like Roy Williams likes to do. Like 662 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:15,080 Speaker 1: there's a million different ways you can do it. So 663 00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:18,320 Speaker 1: I do like some difference. It's like football, like hash 664 00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:22,280 Speaker 1: marks are different, some of the timing and mechanisms are different. Generally, 665 00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:24,160 Speaker 1: the rules of the game are the same. I'm I'm okay, 666 00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:25,600 Speaker 1: like I like that. I would like the NBA to 667 00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:27,560 Speaker 1: go to the one and one. How how does the 668 00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:31,320 Speaker 1: NBA have The lane is wider to make it more 669 00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:33,640 Speaker 1: difficult to post up right, the three point line is 670 00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:36,160 Speaker 1: the furthest to make it more difficult eight seconds to 671 00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:38,080 Speaker 1: get it across mid court, which, by the way, I 672 00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:41,240 Speaker 1: would be okay if college basketball wanted to do that, um, 673 00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:43,800 Speaker 1: I think it would have teams pressed more be uh 674 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:46,280 Speaker 1: maybe a little bit more enjoyable watch whatever. But all 675 00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:47,680 Speaker 1: of a sudden, they're the only ones that don't have 676 00:33:47,720 --> 00:33:49,560 Speaker 1: the one and one. No, no, no, give them the 677 00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:51,520 Speaker 1: they if they can deal with the most pressure, they 678 00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:53,400 Speaker 1: can deal with the most pressure. The freethrow line to 679 00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:55,760 Speaker 1: go to one on one. I like that. We're now 680 00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 1: we're getting a little bit of compromise on both ends, 681 00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:00,840 Speaker 1: and we're kind of meeting in the middle. Optimize the 682 00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:03,760 Speaker 1: game for for for every level. And Here's what I've 683 00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:06,160 Speaker 1: always said to people, especially with the shot clock and 684 00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:09,359 Speaker 1: being a high school coach and small college coach, people 685 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:13,440 Speaker 1: would aways said, oh you listen, I've watched fourteen and 686 00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:16,879 Speaker 1: under and twelve under games in Budapest, Hungry where they 687 00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:18,560 Speaker 1: have a shot clock and they have a shot clock 688 00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:22,600 Speaker 1: operator and the kids learn how to play with it. 689 00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:25,239 Speaker 1: It's possible, you know. And so you have all these 690 00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:28,760 Speaker 1: people saying odd, I am. I think you're you're spot 691 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:32,600 Speaker 1: on with the second, with the fourteen second reset. I 692 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:35,920 Speaker 1: think that changes the game, uh at the college and 693 00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:39,360 Speaker 1: high school level, for the for for for better, for 694 00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:43,800 Speaker 1: better production from our young guys on decision making. You 695 00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:46,600 Speaker 1: can just dribble it twenty times. I hate watching I 696 00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:50,680 Speaker 1: hate watching high school basketball where one individual player has 697 00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:53,920 Speaker 1: the liberty to dribble the ball twenty times. Now, in fairness, 698 00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:56,239 Speaker 1: you did say how much you love NBA basketball. There 699 00:34:56,239 --> 00:34:59,040 Speaker 1: are a couple of NBA players that dribble the ship 700 00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:01,839 Speaker 1: out of the ball and like it's it's it's hard 701 00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:06,759 Speaker 1: to watch. Yeah, yeah, okay, so you get done. Go ahead. 702 00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:11,480 Speaker 1: You dribbled it a few times to yourself. But you know, mom, 703 00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:13,560 Speaker 1: like I would like to, I would I would say 704 00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:18,399 Speaker 1: this there never before a lonzo. I would say, there's 705 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:21,279 Speaker 1: never been a guy who's advanced past the basketball. I 706 00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:24,520 Speaker 1: was I really like to advance the advance the ball, 707 00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:27,560 Speaker 1: and you know, it's one of those and I'm I 708 00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:29,120 Speaker 1: have an eleven year old son, and this is we 709 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: talked about this all the time, like you got a 710 00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:32,440 Speaker 1: k YB. Can't throw it to that guy if he 711 00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:34,279 Speaker 1: can't dribble, But this guy, you gotta throw it to 712 00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:36,319 Speaker 1: some kind you know. I had Joe Atkins. He was 713 00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:38,759 Speaker 1: jo was like, I'm always open, Like I understand, but 714 00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:40,400 Speaker 1: if I throw it to you're going to shoot it. 715 00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:43,040 Speaker 1: So I have to sometimes be judicious. If I threw 716 00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:46,120 Speaker 1: it to Desmond, especially early in his career, like as 717 00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:48,000 Speaker 1: long as he didn't have to dribble it, and then 718 00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:50,080 Speaker 1: there was you know, because he did not have the 719 00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:52,200 Speaker 1: tightest handle in the world. But if you threw it 720 00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:54,399 Speaker 1: anywhere close to the rim, he was gonna he would 721 00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:56,640 Speaker 1: fight any human being for the basketball and find a 722 00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:59,960 Speaker 1: way to dunk it. Right, And so let me I 723 00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:01,640 Speaker 1: I think you were ahead of your time in this, 724 00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:04,520 Speaker 1: and correct me if I'm not thinking this right. But 725 00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:07,400 Speaker 1: do you if I could, if I remember correctly, you 726 00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:09,600 Speaker 1: were one of the only guys and you did it 727 00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:13,320 Speaker 1: all the time where you would penetrate to the lane 728 00:36:13,480 --> 00:36:16,200 Speaker 1: and keep your dribble alive. And I know Steve Nash 729 00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:19,600 Speaker 1: started doing that with the Suns, and you were able 730 00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:23,399 Speaker 1: to make interior passes as you kind of looped under 731 00:36:23,440 --> 00:36:26,200 Speaker 1: the basket. Uh and and not a lot of guys 732 00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:28,360 Speaker 1: were doing it back then. Yeah, I would say. The 733 00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:31,560 Speaker 1: couple of things that I that I I did and 734 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:34,200 Speaker 1: I don't remember being taught to do it well was 735 00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:36,799 Speaker 1: baseline drive, baseline drift right was was thrown to the 736 00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:40,600 Speaker 1: week site baseline and um and then and then the 737 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:43,800 Speaker 1: ability to to to to have people that are that 738 00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:47,520 Speaker 1: are cutting moving while you're you know, I think Villanova 739 00:36:47,600 --> 00:36:49,480 Speaker 1: probably does the best job, but they do jump stops 740 00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:51,840 Speaker 1: in the lane and I never jump stop in the 741 00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:54,040 Speaker 1: lane and never never. I also like one of these 742 00:36:54,040 --> 00:36:57,080 Speaker 1: guys where I remember John McCloud like, hey, you know 743 00:36:57,600 --> 00:36:59,040 Speaker 1: he pulled me aside one time. He's like, you know, 744 00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:00,840 Speaker 1: when I tell everybody to not pass the ball with 745 00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:02,400 Speaker 1: one end, you know, I'm not talking to you, like 746 00:37:02,440 --> 00:37:05,799 Speaker 1: I understand, coach, right, And and I'm like people like, well, 747 00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:07,560 Speaker 1: don't don't jump up the air or you don't know 748 00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:09,799 Speaker 1: where you're going with it, Like yeah, okay, that sounds good, 749 00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:13,640 Speaker 1: but um, I don't know teaching passing is I think 750 00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:15,840 Speaker 1: I find I mean, like you, as a coach, now, 751 00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:20,240 Speaker 1: can you I can teach guys to be better passers. 752 00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:24,560 Speaker 1: I can't teach them to see things, can you. It's shocking. 753 00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:27,560 Speaker 1: It's shocking in fact, even and with impact hooks when 754 00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:33,320 Speaker 1: I'm doing skill development, I've actually implemented some some passing drills. 755 00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:35,880 Speaker 1: I just don't Kids don't drill it, kids don't practice it, 756 00:37:36,280 --> 00:37:38,160 Speaker 1: And it's shocking if you just do a little bit 757 00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:41,600 Speaker 1: like a uh if if a corner shooter lifts, it's 758 00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:45,720 Speaker 1: shocking how bad kids are at passing on time, on target, 759 00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:48,640 Speaker 1: with movement. And you know, I grew up playing soccer 760 00:37:49,360 --> 00:37:52,760 Speaker 1: and I learned that in soccer, of of I can't 761 00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:54,480 Speaker 1: pass it to the person. I got to pass it 762 00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:57,120 Speaker 1: to where the person is going to be. And I 763 00:37:57,120 --> 00:38:00,319 Speaker 1: think that as as coaches, especially with younger players, we 764 00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:02,799 Speaker 1: need to drill that. We we need to help help 765 00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:06,279 Speaker 1: them develop that because and be honest, there's some kids 766 00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:10,000 Speaker 1: who just have it. They have the timing, they have 767 00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:14,000 Speaker 1: the vision, they have the skill set, and that's who 768 00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:15,279 Speaker 1: you want the ball in the hands and most of 769 00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:17,839 Speaker 1: the time, but we could do a better job of 770 00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:21,160 Speaker 1: of of helping young players at least practice it to 771 00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:25,600 Speaker 1: where they're proficient um at finding windows and and finding 772 00:38:25,600 --> 00:38:29,400 Speaker 1: guys on time, on target. Um. And you know, I 773 00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:31,239 Speaker 1: love what John McLoud did there with you, because I 774 00:38:31,239 --> 00:38:33,919 Speaker 1: think that's I think it's brilliant coaching when you when 775 00:38:33,920 --> 00:38:36,440 Speaker 1: you Here's what I tell kids I used to tell 776 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:38,040 Speaker 1: my high school with my last high school teams, you 777 00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:40,719 Speaker 1: can make any pass you want if it's completed, be 778 00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:43,799 Speaker 1: as creative as you want to be if it's completed. Now, 779 00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:46,080 Speaker 1: if you do some jackwagon passing, it's a turn over. 780 00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:50,200 Speaker 1: But I love the creativity of basketball. And when you 781 00:38:50,239 --> 00:38:53,319 Speaker 1: have a player that's skilled to do it. I love 782 00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:56,200 Speaker 1: coaches who release guys to do that. You know. So 783 00:38:56,239 --> 00:38:58,520 Speaker 1: here's what I tell kids. As I tell my kids 784 00:38:58,520 --> 00:39:01,480 Speaker 1: about passing, and I don't no matter what age. As 785 00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:03,840 Speaker 1: I asked, somebody, do you guys, do you know what 786 00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:06,680 Speaker 1: the golden rule is? And they start asking, they start 787 00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:08,600 Speaker 1: talking in basketball terms like no, no, no, no no, do 788 00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:11,719 Speaker 1: you know what the golden rules? So finally you get 789 00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:14,880 Speaker 1: some kids that are like meekly say like, um, do 790 00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:18,239 Speaker 1: unto others as you love done unto you? Like yes 791 00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:21,800 Speaker 1: it is Okay, So I want you to think about 792 00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:23,640 Speaker 1: that in terms of passing, Like, what do you mean? 793 00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:26,360 Speaker 1: I was like, do you want to pass at your toes? 794 00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:29,480 Speaker 1: Or do you want to pass that's crisp, firm on 795 00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:32,399 Speaker 1: the seams at your chest? You know? Do you want 796 00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:34,360 Speaker 1: to somebody I call him burn somebody out? Or you 797 00:39:34,360 --> 00:39:36,239 Speaker 1: throw it too hard? Or do you want the right pace? 798 00:39:36,440 --> 00:39:38,640 Speaker 1: And they all know what the I was like. All right, Well, 799 00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:41,400 Speaker 1: if you want that, then do that to your teammates, 800 00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:46,000 Speaker 1: because nothing in in basketball. The only thing more contagious 801 00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:50,279 Speaker 1: than COVID is selfishness or unselfishness. Right, if you take 802 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:52,600 Speaker 1: a bad shot, then he's gonna take a bad shot, 803 00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:54,560 Speaker 1: and he's gonna if you give a bad pass and 804 00:39:54,600 --> 00:39:56,160 Speaker 1: be like, man, if you I'm gonna give you, Like 805 00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,319 Speaker 1: if you give somebody like that, if you becoming one 806 00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:02,000 Speaker 1: more team, one more past team, you'd be amazed at 807 00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:03,920 Speaker 1: how everybody would if they just kind of fall in 808 00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:07,319 Speaker 1: line and do unto others as a passer as you 809 00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:09,360 Speaker 1: want done unto you. All right, So you mentioned coaching. 810 00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:12,680 Speaker 1: You get done playing at O are you played for Barry? 811 00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:14,399 Speaker 1: Guys don't make the n C a term, but it's 812 00:40:14,400 --> 00:40:17,400 Speaker 1: a good program. First, I have to I have to ask, like, 813 00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:19,080 Speaker 1: what was it like to go to O Are you 814 00:40:19,160 --> 00:40:21,479 Speaker 1: for people who you had the tie rule? Right? Didn't 815 00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:23,919 Speaker 1: you have to have a tie in class? And then 816 00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:26,360 Speaker 1: you know, you weren't allowed to curse or drink and 817 00:40:26,400 --> 00:40:30,080 Speaker 1: no pre marital sex? Like what was that? That was 818 00:40:30,160 --> 00:40:34,160 Speaker 1: not my experience in college? Um? What was your experience 819 00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:38,000 Speaker 1: in college? Like it are you? Yeah? It's different. It 820 00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:40,760 Speaker 1: was definitely different, but it's something that I had chosen. 821 00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:45,280 Speaker 1: And and here's the interesting thing about having an experience 822 00:40:45,320 --> 00:40:52,799 Speaker 1: at a religious school. Um. The two things. Number one, Um, 823 00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:56,600 Speaker 1: you get these these world class speakers come in and 824 00:40:56,760 --> 00:40:58,239 Speaker 1: and you know, and to be Claude honest with you, 825 00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:01,040 Speaker 1: we had a one seat rule and chapel, we all 826 00:41:01,040 --> 00:41:03,000 Speaker 1: the BASTL players. We had one seat in between us 827 00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:05,279 Speaker 1: so we could lay out and and and take a 828 00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:08,920 Speaker 1: nap if we needed to. Uh. So it wasn't like 829 00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:11,279 Speaker 1: we're sitting there taking notes. But the interesting thing is 830 00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:13,680 Speaker 1: you have these world class speakers and now I want 831 00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:17,040 Speaker 1: to pay two hundred and twenty five dollars of to 832 00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:20,839 Speaker 1: go here John Maxwell speak in Atlanta. When we were 833 00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:24,480 Speaker 1: getting those guys weekly and so that it's a different experience. 834 00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:27,759 Speaker 1: The second thing is lifelong friends. I've got five of 835 00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:30,759 Speaker 1: my teammates and at Old Roberts, five of them have 836 00:41:30,920 --> 00:41:36,600 Speaker 1: churches now. And Uh, they're incredible fathers, their incredible husband 837 00:41:36,600 --> 00:41:40,360 Speaker 1: They're not perfect, but they've given their life to serve others. 838 00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:44,000 Speaker 1: And and the fruit of that, and and and the 839 00:41:44,080 --> 00:41:46,399 Speaker 1: deep relationships I have. I mean, like when I look 840 00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:50,240 Speaker 1: back at my sophomore year, the Earl McClellan's, the tim Gills, 841 00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:54,640 Speaker 1: the Rocky Walls, that the guys you mentioned, Uh, they're 842 00:41:54,640 --> 00:41:57,680 Speaker 1: like brothers to me. I mean it's and you know this, Doug, 843 00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:00,520 Speaker 1: There's nothing like a locker room to bring pull together 844 00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:04,040 Speaker 1: from different socio economic from different cultures, from different races. 845 00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:08,120 Speaker 1: A locker room is one of the most special places 846 00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:11,480 Speaker 1: on earth. And the experience of ore you on the 847 00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:14,839 Speaker 1: basketball team was awesome because I got I had the 848 00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:17,200 Speaker 1: the O r U experience, but I also had the 849 00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:21,239 Speaker 1: Division one basketball experience, and that was a dream for me. Uh. 850 00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:23,160 Speaker 1: And to play for a Hall of Fame coach and 851 00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:25,520 Speaker 1: just to kind of put a cherry on top. Uh. 852 00:42:25,640 --> 00:42:27,520 Speaker 1: Three years ago my phone ring and Coach something and 853 00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:29,920 Speaker 1: called me very often. But we have a relationship and 854 00:42:29,960 --> 00:42:32,160 Speaker 1: it was coached self and he said, hey, Chad, I 855 00:42:32,239 --> 00:42:34,359 Speaker 1: want I want that group of basketball players from more 856 00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:36,680 Speaker 1: you to come to the Hall of Fame induction and 857 00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:39,440 Speaker 1: I'm gonna pay for you guys to come. And so 858 00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:40,800 Speaker 1: he said, can you call some of the guys And 859 00:42:41,080 --> 00:42:42,919 Speaker 1: I called the guys and every one of them said yes, 860 00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:46,879 Speaker 1: And he was so honoring of us. Here's a man 861 00:42:46,920 --> 00:42:49,960 Speaker 1: who's won a national championship and is at the pinnacle 862 00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:53,560 Speaker 1: of of college basketball and for him to give us, uh, 863 00:42:53,680 --> 00:42:57,440 Speaker 1: you know, a moment of respect. Uh at Old ropport University. 864 00:42:57,600 --> 00:43:00,120 Speaker 1: You know, I can't say enough good things about Oh 865 00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:03,120 Speaker 1: Roberts University and my experience there. I would do it 866 00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:05,600 Speaker 1: all over again. I'll just say this, like I don't 867 00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:07,600 Speaker 1: we don't mean I Bill told me he'll come on 868 00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:09,359 Speaker 1: the pod and we'll do it. We'll do it. I'm 869 00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:11,200 Speaker 1: I'm doing a Kansas game later this year, so we're 870 00:43:11,239 --> 00:43:13,239 Speaker 1: gonna sit down and know it'll probably a long one. 871 00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:17,400 Speaker 1: I find him to be the best, Like again, not 872 00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:20,680 Speaker 1: a guy that's without flaw right. He doesn't you know, 873 00:43:20,800 --> 00:43:25,080 Speaker 1: he uh you know, he'll he'll he'll curse, he'll ride dudes, 874 00:43:25,360 --> 00:43:27,759 Speaker 1: he'll tell everybody his team is soft. And then when 875 00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:29,239 Speaker 1: you say his team is soft, and be like, man 876 00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:30,880 Speaker 1: who said that? Who I would you say that, you know, 877 00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:34,160 Speaker 1: like publicly or whatever. Like he's not a he's not 878 00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:37,520 Speaker 1: a flawless human being. But I I I like of 879 00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:40,160 Speaker 1: the people I would love to play for in college basketball, 880 00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:43,280 Speaker 1: he and Chris Beard two of my absolute favorites because 881 00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:45,960 Speaker 1: they're just real. They're real, and they're genuine, and they 882 00:43:46,040 --> 00:43:49,200 Speaker 1: never forget the people who worked hard for them, and 883 00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:51,560 Speaker 1: you're kind of part of their family. I never played 884 00:43:51,600 --> 00:43:52,759 Speaker 1: for Bill Cell. I don't know if you know this. 885 00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:54,880 Speaker 1: This is a true story, and I'll see if he 886 00:43:54,960 --> 00:43:58,840 Speaker 1: ever got it. When I got done playing at Oklahoma State, 887 00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:03,160 Speaker 1: I wrote him a letter and I said, uh, coach, 888 00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:05,360 Speaker 1: you know, like if that year we both went to 889 00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:07,080 Speaker 1: the Lead eight, we were gonna We never played each 890 00:44:07,080 --> 00:44:09,120 Speaker 1: other against Tulsa. We only played him pick up all 891 00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:10,800 Speaker 1: we had to come to Reynolds Center there. Guys wouldn't 892 00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:14,319 Speaker 1: come up to our place. And um, I wrote him 893 00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:16,719 Speaker 1: a letter saying like, look, I want to I want 894 00:44:16,760 --> 00:44:18,080 Speaker 1: to play as long as I can play. Am I 895 00:44:18,120 --> 00:44:20,279 Speaker 1: going to broadcasting, But I'd love to coach with you 896 00:44:20,360 --> 00:44:23,360 Speaker 1: someday and and I went into kind of reasons why 897 00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:26,480 Speaker 1: and it's it's real, like I I have so I 898 00:44:27,160 --> 00:44:29,440 Speaker 1: really genuinely like him as a human being, and I 899 00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:32,399 Speaker 1: think he has an incredible basketball coach. And that's ah, 900 00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:35,080 Speaker 1: it's it's interesting kind of the the ties of that 901 00:44:35,160 --> 00:44:36,920 Speaker 1: and of course our ties in the in the U 902 00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:39,560 Speaker 1: S b l uh. Last thing, and this is something 903 00:44:39,600 --> 00:44:43,280 Speaker 1: I happen to ask you, is, if I remember correctly, 904 00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:46,440 Speaker 1: I think you led the state in scoring in Texas 905 00:44:46,560 --> 00:44:49,200 Speaker 1: like twice. Like, how did how do you mentally go 906 00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:53,480 Speaker 1: from like leading the state of Texas and scoring too 907 00:44:54,440 --> 00:44:57,239 Speaker 1: not playing earlier in your career? How did you how 908 00:44:57,239 --> 00:45:02,520 Speaker 1: did you manage those emotions? That's a great question. Um, 909 00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:04,160 Speaker 1: I give a lot of credit to my dad. I 910 00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:08,279 Speaker 1: played with a freedom that most players don't get and 911 00:45:08,280 --> 00:45:10,080 Speaker 1: when and here's the cool thing about playing for your dad, 912 00:45:10,120 --> 00:45:12,200 Speaker 1: And I hope to provide this for my son some day. 913 00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:14,799 Speaker 1: I have three little boys, five, four and one and 914 00:45:14,840 --> 00:45:16,960 Speaker 1: one on the way here in three months while our 915 00:45:17,000 --> 00:45:19,799 Speaker 1: our fourth boy, and I want to provide here's what 916 00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:22,160 Speaker 1: I here's what I had with my dad and I 917 00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:23,520 Speaker 1: played with him. I don't know if you remember this 918 00:45:23,560 --> 00:45:25,319 Speaker 1: we played with athletes first, and we used to play 919 00:45:25,320 --> 00:45:28,400 Speaker 1: ex college players to exhibitions my dad. I played for 920 00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:30,560 Speaker 1: my dad there a little bit there is as a 921 00:45:30,600 --> 00:45:33,400 Speaker 1: twenty three year old and had some of the best games. 922 00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:36,680 Speaker 1: Here's what I had. I had this unconditional love. And 923 00:45:36,719 --> 00:45:40,680 Speaker 1: my dad's a wonderful man of God and wonderful like human, unbelievable, 924 00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:45,400 Speaker 1: just integrity, great, But a competitive monster wants to just 925 00:45:45,800 --> 00:45:47,480 Speaker 1: do you play? You know, he wants to beat your 926 00:45:47,480 --> 00:45:51,080 Speaker 1: brains out. And my dad created this competitive drive inside 927 00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:54,879 Speaker 1: my brother and I. But wrapped around that competitive drive 928 00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:56,960 Speaker 1: was this unconditional love, Like I knew that if I 929 00:45:57,040 --> 00:46:00,080 Speaker 1: screwed up, it didn't change how he felt. And so 930 00:46:00,200 --> 00:46:03,080 Speaker 1: as a coach, I'm trying to figure out as a trainer, 931 00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:05,799 Speaker 1: as a coach, how can I provide that for young people, 932 00:46:05,840 --> 00:46:12,120 Speaker 1: Because when they feel safe inside a relationship and they 933 00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:15,359 Speaker 1: feel like they can sail forward, you can get some 934 00:46:15,400 --> 00:46:18,040 Speaker 1: really magical moments. And so I had magical moments all 935 00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:20,319 Speaker 1: throughout my high school career. But then when I got 936 00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:23,040 Speaker 1: to are You and I give credit to to to 937 00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:26,080 Speaker 1: my teammates that the older guys that James cruizes the 938 00:46:26,160 --> 00:46:30,359 Speaker 1: oral McClellan's I felt like a brother. And so when 939 00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:33,759 Speaker 1: we were playing Arkansas at bud Walton and Kareem Reid 940 00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:36,919 Speaker 1: made a buzzer beater shot to beat us by one. 941 00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:42,080 Speaker 1: I didn't play, but three minutes that game, I felt 942 00:46:42,160 --> 00:46:45,600 Speaker 1: completely a part of the game. I felt completely a 943 00:46:45,640 --> 00:46:48,280 Speaker 1: part of the team. When Cliff Crenshaw made a three, 944 00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:51,000 Speaker 1: I felt like I had done my job in practice 945 00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:54,200 Speaker 1: guarding him, Like there was a there was a but 946 00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:57,239 Speaker 1: a coach's son, but you're also that you're a coach 947 00:46:57,280 --> 00:47:00,640 Speaker 1: of son, and and but I always struggle with that, 948 00:47:00,719 --> 00:47:03,920 Speaker 1: like I I don't know, I don't know if I 949 00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:07,400 Speaker 1: told this story. So my my junior years, so my 950 00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:10,759 Speaker 1: softwa year, we surprised everybody. My junior year, we were 951 00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:13,560 Speaker 1: like top five in the country preseason and we lost 952 00:47:13,560 --> 00:47:16,200 Speaker 1: Brett Robisch was our starting center. It was was awesome. 953 00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:18,719 Speaker 1: Uh chat Alexander was kind of a glue guy, but 954 00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:22,879 Speaker 1: returned everybody else and we added Glenn and Alexander who 955 00:47:22,880 --> 00:47:26,080 Speaker 1: had transferred in a midyear, who was also led the 956 00:47:26,080 --> 00:47:27,640 Speaker 1: state in scoring in the state at all time lean 957 00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:30,080 Speaker 1: score in State of Texas high school basketball history. So 958 00:47:30,120 --> 00:47:31,600 Speaker 1: everybody thought like we're gonna be better and he was 959 00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:37,080 Speaker 1: eligible mid mid year, and I, uh, Glennon was a 960 00:47:37,080 --> 00:47:40,600 Speaker 1: handful for our team chemistry when he wasn't playing and 961 00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:44,759 Speaker 1: I was playing great. And uh then I got a 962 00:47:44,920 --> 00:47:47,760 Speaker 1: I got a technical in a loss to Florida Atlanta. 963 00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:50,920 Speaker 1: We beat TCU, who was nactually ranked Lean Alan whatever, 964 00:47:51,480 --> 00:47:55,120 Speaker 1: and then we we played Florida Atlantic and I got 965 00:47:55,120 --> 00:47:58,040 Speaker 1: a technical and we went from It was like we 966 00:47:58,040 --> 00:48:02,040 Speaker 1: were down, they were down three and we inbounded the 967 00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:04,440 Speaker 1: ball and I thought I got fouled, and like I 968 00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:06,719 Speaker 1: had like a scratch across my face, and they lay 969 00:48:06,760 --> 00:48:08,160 Speaker 1: the ball in and I look at the ref and 970 00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:11,720 Speaker 1: like that, that's a fucking foul, right, and he teased 971 00:48:11,719 --> 00:48:13,239 Speaker 1: me up. They make two free what it was like 972 00:48:13,239 --> 00:48:15,040 Speaker 1: a one Here's what it was. So one point game, 973 00:48:15,040 --> 00:48:16,640 Speaker 1: they get to steal it's a three point game, and 974 00:48:16,719 --> 00:48:18,960 Speaker 1: get the technical foul, make both free throws. It's five 975 00:48:19,000 --> 00:48:20,600 Speaker 1: point game. I come out of the game and they 976 00:48:20,600 --> 00:48:22,520 Speaker 1: score another bucket. It's a seven point went out down 977 00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:26,799 Speaker 1: seven to shitty ask Floria Atlantic, right, and and so 978 00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:28,759 Speaker 1: we came back. We had a chance to win the game, 979 00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:31,200 Speaker 1: and we did. Like it was crazy sequence events and 980 00:48:31,239 --> 00:48:33,960 Speaker 1: we didn't win. I had eight points and eighteen assists, 981 00:48:34,880 --> 00:48:37,960 Speaker 1: and but I was because I got the t like, 982 00:48:38,040 --> 00:48:40,200 Speaker 1: you know, obviously coach was pissed and we're ranked. We're like, 983 00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:42,120 Speaker 1: and we had an eighty one game non conference home 984 00:48:42,160 --> 00:48:46,719 Speaker 1: winning stream. So so that Saturday we got fly out. 985 00:48:46,719 --> 00:48:52,200 Speaker 1: We're playing in Anaheim, which is uh a uh five 986 00:48:52,239 --> 00:48:54,600 Speaker 1: minute drive from my house. My house I grew up 987 00:48:54,640 --> 00:48:56,760 Speaker 1: in to play u c l A, where my sister 988 00:48:56,840 --> 00:48:58,759 Speaker 1: was a cheer had been a cheerleader. My brother went 989 00:48:58,800 --> 00:49:01,560 Speaker 1: to school. They offered me a scholarship. I turned him down. 990 00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:04,960 Speaker 1: And then the first time around or whatever, and we 991 00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:07,040 Speaker 1: had season tickets as kids were playing U c l A. 992 00:49:07,080 --> 00:49:09,480 Speaker 1: And it's Baron Davis first game back in the pond, 993 00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:13,360 Speaker 1: and I get a tea early in the game. They like, 994 00:49:13,480 --> 00:49:16,960 Speaker 1: there's a rough named Charlie Range. Charlie Range is a 995 00:49:17,320 --> 00:49:22,120 Speaker 1: was a horrible homer official. He was awful and early again, 996 00:49:22,120 --> 00:49:23,799 Speaker 1: we're not getting any calls, and I swear to God, 997 00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:26,280 Speaker 1: this is all I said. I was like, come on, Charlie, 998 00:49:26,320 --> 00:49:27,960 Speaker 1: we gotta gotta even him up a little bit, right, 999 00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:29,360 Speaker 1: like I flipped the ball. But here I am a 1000 00:49:29,360 --> 00:49:31,160 Speaker 1: college kid going like, we need to even him up 1001 00:49:31,160 --> 00:49:33,080 Speaker 1: a little bit, and he teased me and we're like, 1002 00:49:33,120 --> 00:49:36,319 Speaker 1: what the what. So then end of the half, it's 1003 00:49:36,360 --> 00:49:40,399 Speaker 1: like a two point game and we run one four 1004 00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:42,440 Speaker 1: flat because I got barn on me and he's not 1005 00:49:42,680 --> 00:49:44,839 Speaker 1: again his first game back. He's heavy, he's not moving great. 1006 00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:48,680 Speaker 1: I go past Baron and they got Dan gets reach 1007 00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:55,040 Speaker 1: and Jerome Moiso and I take him up and I 1008 00:49:55,080 --> 00:49:57,720 Speaker 1: think I can shoot a floater instead of just dishing 1009 00:49:57,719 --> 00:50:00,919 Speaker 1: the ball off whatever, and I mean that thing got 1010 00:50:00,960 --> 00:50:03,839 Speaker 1: rejected to like mid court. Baron leaks out, he gets 1011 00:50:03,840 --> 00:50:06,160 Speaker 1: a lay up, he lays it in and then he 1012 00:50:06,239 --> 00:50:10,799 Speaker 1: comes back talking shit, you know yeah, yeah yeah, and 1013 00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:14,359 Speaker 1: like because the bump shoulders with me, right, and so 1014 00:50:14,440 --> 00:50:16,160 Speaker 1: I bumped. I was like, get out of my face, dude, 1015 00:50:16,800 --> 00:50:19,360 Speaker 1: That's all I said. And he takes a dive and 1016 00:50:19,400 --> 00:50:21,439 Speaker 1: the revs turn around. They just see him taking a dive. 1017 00:50:21,480 --> 00:50:25,480 Speaker 1: They assume so um they called intentional foul. He makes 1018 00:50:25,480 --> 00:50:27,360 Speaker 1: two free throws. We go into the locker room. The 1019 00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:29,840 Speaker 1: refs come into like that intentional foul occurred before the 1020 00:50:29,840 --> 00:50:32,640 Speaker 1: buzzer went off. It's a technical foul. He's out of 1021 00:50:32,640 --> 00:50:35,120 Speaker 1: the game. It's seton technical foul, so I have to 1022 00:50:35,160 --> 00:50:38,600 Speaker 1: sit in the locker room. We lose by three, and 1023 00:50:38,680 --> 00:50:41,560 Speaker 1: I'm in the doghouse. Now I buried with the bone 1024 00:50:42,120 --> 00:50:44,239 Speaker 1: and like I'm here, I'm in California. Only game and 1025 00:50:44,280 --> 00:50:47,640 Speaker 1: I don't even make it past the halftime. So the 1026 00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:50,279 Speaker 1: next eight games I came off the bench. I bare 1027 00:50:50,360 --> 00:50:53,000 Speaker 1: That year I led the country and scoring inscue me 1028 00:50:53,040 --> 00:50:55,359 Speaker 1: an assist. I only averaged twenty six minutes a game 1029 00:50:55,400 --> 00:50:57,720 Speaker 1: because the next eight games I played like single digit 1030 00:50:57,760 --> 00:50:59,719 Speaker 1: minutes for the only time in my career, never in 1031 00:50:59,760 --> 00:51:03,239 Speaker 1: my care anyway. So one game, we're playing Southeast Missouri State. 1032 00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:07,319 Speaker 1: I think I played eight minutes and we're struggling, and 1033 00:51:07,360 --> 00:51:10,279 Speaker 1: we're struggling because we're playing without a point guard. Right, 1034 00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:13,560 Speaker 1: we end up end of the game, Adrian Peterson gets 1035 00:51:13,560 --> 00:51:15,680 Speaker 1: an open three right in front of the bench, hits it. 1036 00:51:15,680 --> 00:51:18,440 Speaker 1: It kind of takes us from like eight to eleven, 1037 00:51:18,719 --> 00:51:21,560 Speaker 1: and we're gonna win the game, right, So the next 1038 00:51:21,640 --> 00:51:25,840 Speaker 1: day we come in emergency film session. Everybody has to 1039 00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:29,000 Speaker 1: be there at seven am. I'm like, dude, we just won. 1040 00:51:29,120 --> 00:51:32,120 Speaker 1: We played like crap, but I'm barely playing. Like we're 1041 00:51:32,120 --> 00:51:33,480 Speaker 1: working through some things like why do we have a 1042 00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:36,000 Speaker 1: film session. We just won. So we come in and 1043 00:51:36,000 --> 00:51:38,040 Speaker 1: we're not watching the whole game, watching one clip and 1044 00:51:38,080 --> 00:51:40,560 Speaker 1: it's Adrian Peterson hitting the shot. So we go around 1045 00:51:40,560 --> 00:51:42,319 Speaker 1: and we said they score around the room and they 1046 00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:44,319 Speaker 1: start asking everybody like what do you see here, and like, 1047 00:51:44,400 --> 00:51:46,840 Speaker 1: guys are like, man, Pete's got his feet set. We 1048 00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:50,480 Speaker 1: ran the play right, It's a big bucket. Everybody jumps up, 1049 00:51:51,520 --> 00:51:54,759 Speaker 1: so they take remember those laser pointers, Yeah, okay, so 1050 00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:56,520 Speaker 1: they take a laser pointer and they circle me on 1051 00:51:56,560 --> 00:51:59,200 Speaker 1: the bench. All the coaches are taking me and I'm 1052 00:51:59,239 --> 00:52:01,000 Speaker 1: the only guy that doesn't get up when he makes 1053 00:52:01,040 --> 00:52:05,200 Speaker 1: the three right? And why because I was pissed right 1054 00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:08,319 Speaker 1: like I'm sitting here like yo, I'm and and the 1055 00:52:08,440 --> 00:52:12,040 Speaker 1: lesson was like, hey man, you either cheer for your 1056 00:52:12,040 --> 00:52:15,400 Speaker 1: teammate or go find another team. That was really it. 1057 00:52:15,520 --> 00:52:16,840 Speaker 1: So then they we go out in the court and 1058 00:52:16,880 --> 00:52:19,399 Speaker 1: then they run everybody else. Doug's more important. The rest 1059 00:52:19,400 --> 00:52:21,160 Speaker 1: of it. Doesn't care about you guys. You guys just 1060 00:52:21,280 --> 00:52:24,240 Speaker 1: run I run him to the nkle smoke. That was coach. 1061 00:52:24,719 --> 00:52:26,880 Speaker 1: So that's how that was a lesson that I It 1062 00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:28,839 Speaker 1: only took me one time to learn, but I learned 1063 00:52:28,840 --> 00:52:30,279 Speaker 1: that because I was a bit of a powder. I 1064 00:52:30,320 --> 00:52:33,160 Speaker 1: hated that was really white and shoot because if I missed, 1065 00:52:33,160 --> 00:52:34,880 Speaker 1: he would take me out. So I was like, all right, 1066 00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:37,120 Speaker 1: screw it. I just won't shoot because I hated coming 1067 00:52:37,160 --> 00:52:40,000 Speaker 1: out of games. And I just always like, you were 1068 00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:42,239 Speaker 1: a great high school player, great and and you had 1069 00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:44,320 Speaker 1: to sit and wait your turn. I just always wondered 1070 00:52:44,360 --> 00:52:46,520 Speaker 1: how you had that in you. I gotta I gotta 1071 00:52:46,520 --> 00:52:48,839 Speaker 1: ask you if you remember this, because I don't think 1072 00:52:48,880 --> 00:52:53,240 Speaker 1: people I watched you shoot as a teammate if Athletes 1073 00:52:53,320 --> 00:52:55,680 Speaker 1: first and in the USB L and I knew you. 1074 00:52:55,760 --> 00:52:57,640 Speaker 1: I was like, man, he makes shots, he makes shots. 1075 00:52:57,920 --> 00:52:59,800 Speaker 1: I don't know if you remember this. We were at Texas. 1076 00:53:00,840 --> 00:53:03,920 Speaker 1: You're playing for Athletes. First. You and I get out 1077 00:53:03,920 --> 00:53:05,960 Speaker 1: there at the quarter about an hour before and tell 1078 00:53:05,960 --> 00:53:07,680 Speaker 1: me if I'm if I'm thinking this wrong. We get 1079 00:53:07,680 --> 00:53:10,680 Speaker 1: out there about hour and they have like twenty just 1080 00:53:11,440 --> 00:53:15,440 Speaker 1: doma flyche fraternity brothers that show up an hour early, 1081 00:53:15,960 --> 00:53:19,000 Speaker 1: and they want to taunt you every time you shoot. 1082 00:53:19,640 --> 00:53:22,640 Speaker 1: They want to yell brick brick brick, and so they're 1083 00:53:22,640 --> 00:53:24,560 Speaker 1: just trying to play and you're kind of playing games 1084 00:53:24,600 --> 00:53:26,640 Speaker 1: with them. You're making shots, but then you go hit 1085 00:53:26,680 --> 00:53:28,359 Speaker 1: the rim a couple of times and they go quick 1086 00:53:28,360 --> 00:53:32,440 Speaker 1: bick bick brick. And I remember the game starting and 1087 00:53:32,520 --> 00:53:34,120 Speaker 1: you're a starter. Of course, we had a good little 1088 00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:36,560 Speaker 1: squad there. Uh. We had some some guys who end 1089 00:53:36,640 --> 00:53:39,640 Speaker 1: up being pros over in Europe, including yourself and myself. 1090 00:53:40,080 --> 00:53:43,359 Speaker 1: And uh, I remember early, I mean early in the 1091 00:53:43,400 --> 00:53:46,200 Speaker 1: game against Tech, you catch the ball in the deep 1092 00:53:46,239 --> 00:53:48,719 Speaker 1: corner right in front of the student section, and you 1093 00:53:48,840 --> 00:53:51,000 Speaker 1: just raise up to shoot a three. And I'm going, 1094 00:53:51,000 --> 00:53:55,239 Speaker 1: oh my gosh, duck's just ripping a three. You raise up, 1095 00:53:55,560 --> 00:53:58,960 Speaker 1: you shoot it, snap your wrist, you swish it. And 1096 00:53:59,000 --> 00:54:03,200 Speaker 1: this is before Twitter, Instagram. I know the story to 1097 00:54:03,280 --> 00:54:07,279 Speaker 1: the student section and double bird them on your way 1098 00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:12,360 Speaker 1: back down the court, and it was classic. But I 1099 00:54:12,360 --> 00:54:15,520 Speaker 1: think now your dad was a coach, right, Okay, so 1100 00:54:15,600 --> 00:54:19,400 Speaker 1: you're so Actually I didn't double Burdom. This is true story. Okay, 1101 00:54:19,440 --> 00:54:21,279 Speaker 1: Here's that I hit the three and I did the 1102 00:54:21,880 --> 00:54:24,480 Speaker 1: hand like like if there was a TV camera you 1103 00:54:24,480 --> 00:54:27,360 Speaker 1: couldn't see it. And then and then and when I 1104 00:54:27,600 --> 00:54:31,120 Speaker 1: lift was you on the on the way down the 1105 00:54:31,160 --> 00:54:33,160 Speaker 1: court right to all the and they and they were dying. 1106 00:54:33,719 --> 00:54:35,839 Speaker 1: So your dad takes me out of the game and 1107 00:54:35,920 --> 00:54:40,200 Speaker 1: he goes, it's a great shot. Okay, it's a great shot, 1108 00:54:40,480 --> 00:54:46,320 Speaker 1: and and I love the attitude. Okay, but we don't 1109 00:54:46,360 --> 00:54:49,000 Speaker 1: do the finger. We don't. We don't. We don't do 1110 00:54:49,040 --> 00:54:51,000 Speaker 1: the finger. And I was like, yeah, my bad, sorry 1111 00:54:51,000 --> 00:54:53,799 Speaker 1: about sorry about that one. Talk about that. How many 1112 00:54:53,920 --> 00:54:57,640 Speaker 1: can you name the teams that we play? Oh Man, 1113 00:54:57,760 --> 00:55:01,680 Speaker 1: Steven F Austin, Texas Tech. Oh, I don't. I don't 1114 00:55:01,680 --> 00:55:05,000 Speaker 1: remember Stephen. I think we did, Stephen F. I didn't 1115 00:55:05,040 --> 00:55:06,440 Speaker 1: play in the o U game because I played. I 1116 00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:07,920 Speaker 1: don't know if you remember this. So I played with 1117 00:55:07,960 --> 00:55:11,279 Speaker 1: my dad's squad that I played with you guys, and 1118 00:55:11,320 --> 00:55:14,200 Speaker 1: then I played one. I played like I played twenty 1119 00:55:14,280 --> 00:55:17,360 Speaker 1: games in twenty two days. And the culmination was it 1120 00:55:17,400 --> 00:55:21,359 Speaker 1: played against Carolina with the e A Sports and Drew 1121 00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:23,200 Speaker 1: Barry was my teammate and we were we had to 1122 00:55:23,280 --> 00:55:26,200 Speaker 1: lead at the half and leave at the half and 1123 00:55:26,200 --> 00:55:28,560 Speaker 1: and we played in Carmichael where Jordan played, and it 1124 00:55:28,600 --> 00:55:32,400 Speaker 1: was it was so much fun, so much fun, and 1125 00:55:32,440 --> 00:55:35,839 Speaker 1: we just got homered and lost. Um. But so I 1126 00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:39,359 Speaker 1: remember we played Texas State, which was Southwest Texas State 1127 00:55:39,400 --> 00:55:41,680 Speaker 1: back then. Right the Bobcats. They had the big wall 1128 00:55:41,880 --> 00:55:43,719 Speaker 1: right behind right behind one of the hoops is a 1129 00:55:43,800 --> 00:55:46,520 Speaker 1: huge wall. Weird, Jim. We played North Texas together, we 1130 00:55:46,520 --> 00:55:48,839 Speaker 1: beat them. We beat North Texas in the super pit, 1131 00:55:49,600 --> 00:55:54,000 Speaker 1: we beat Texas State, we lost the Tech and we 1132 00:55:54,080 --> 00:55:57,480 Speaker 1: beat SM. You. I'm trying to think who else we played. 1133 00:55:58,080 --> 00:56:00,919 Speaker 1: I didn't play. Here's the easy part. We beat os 1134 00:56:01,000 --> 00:56:03,640 Speaker 1: U that year and you weren't at that game. We 1135 00:56:03,680 --> 00:56:06,640 Speaker 1: went and played and ended so that the ened people 1136 00:56:06,680 --> 00:56:08,759 Speaker 1: could see O s U. I guess. So we go 1137 00:56:08,840 --> 00:56:12,120 Speaker 1: play in the coliseum and end we're playing O s U. 1138 00:56:12,480 --> 00:56:15,000 Speaker 1: We give Coach Sudden his only exhibition loss in the 1139 00:56:15,000 --> 00:56:19,320 Speaker 1: history of his career. He was ticked and Tim played. 1140 00:56:19,760 --> 00:56:22,399 Speaker 1: Tim Gill played out of his mind. I actually had 1141 00:56:22,520 --> 00:56:26,160 Speaker 1: thirty six or thirty seven that game, and that game 1142 00:56:27,040 --> 00:56:29,360 Speaker 1: was back when you used to send vhs over to Europe. 1143 00:56:29,719 --> 00:56:33,879 Speaker 1: My first European contract came from the game and enit 1144 00:56:33,920 --> 00:56:36,120 Speaker 1: It gets Oaklhoma State, where we handed them their only 1145 00:56:36,120 --> 00:56:39,960 Speaker 1: exhibition loss. So my apologies to O s U. But 1146 00:56:40,040 --> 00:56:43,759 Speaker 1: it did help me get a contracted europe Uh. That's 1147 00:56:43,800 --> 00:56:45,520 Speaker 1: but I mean, it's so funny to think about my 1148 00:56:45,600 --> 00:56:48,359 Speaker 1: kids ask, hey, you know, Dad, what about your game? 1149 00:56:48,800 --> 00:56:52,359 Speaker 1: Like my games weren't on YouTube, it was via. It's 1150 00:56:52,400 --> 00:56:54,480 Speaker 1: like VHS was gold back then. You know, if you 1151 00:56:54,480 --> 00:56:56,279 Speaker 1: could get can I get the film after the game 1152 00:56:56,960 --> 00:57:00,000 Speaker 1: to send over to you know, to Russia, to China 1153 00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:02,640 Speaker 1: and at uh you know you're paying, You're going up 1154 00:57:02,640 --> 00:57:05,280 Speaker 1: to Kinko's and get It's just it's a different world 1155 00:57:05,280 --> 00:57:08,160 Speaker 1: now when you got so we're your first overseas spot 1156 00:57:08,200 --> 00:57:12,560 Speaker 1: was where Budapest Hungry was actually played against Adrian Peterson. 1157 00:57:12,880 --> 00:57:14,480 Speaker 1: He played, Yeah, yeah, he played, He played there. He 1158 00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:16,560 Speaker 1: I think they won his team in the league. Yeah, 1159 00:57:16,600 --> 00:57:18,680 Speaker 1: we hung out a little bit. He's he was a great, 1160 00:57:18,880 --> 00:57:22,600 Speaker 1: great human being, a great player on my word, could play, 1161 00:57:22,600 --> 00:57:25,160 Speaker 1: Oh man, I mean people. I don't think people know 1162 00:57:25,200 --> 00:57:26,600 Speaker 1: when he say age a Pierce now everbody thinks the 1163 00:57:26,680 --> 00:57:29,240 Speaker 1: running back, you know, and even I think Desmond would 1164 00:57:29,240 --> 00:57:30,920 Speaker 1: have been like in terms of just a college player. 1165 00:57:30,920 --> 00:57:33,240 Speaker 1: In terms of skill, Pete was the best I ever 1166 00:57:33,280 --> 00:57:35,800 Speaker 1: played with. Desmond doesn't just played hard and was crazy 1167 00:57:35,840 --> 00:57:38,440 Speaker 1: athletic and competitive. Pete was so good. Of course he 1168 00:57:38,560 --> 00:57:42,240 Speaker 1: tours knee in the Chicago pre draft. He actually Corey 1169 00:57:42,280 --> 00:57:45,560 Speaker 1: Carr was my teammate in Israel. My second year, Corey 1170 00:57:45,600 --> 00:57:49,680 Speaker 1: got hurt towards a c L and Pete came replaced him, 1171 00:57:49,760 --> 00:57:51,240 Speaker 1: and the team was so cheap they were supposed to 1172 00:57:51,240 --> 00:57:53,040 Speaker 1: get him his own apartment. He stayed with me for 1173 00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:56,040 Speaker 1: like two months and then I left because they were 1174 00:57:56,360 --> 00:57:58,560 Speaker 1: they were they were killing me with their they were 1175 00:57:58,600 --> 00:58:01,800 Speaker 1: starting to get crazy, you with the money and Pete. 1176 00:58:02,000 --> 00:58:04,760 Speaker 1: I left Pete my what used my car and my 1177 00:58:05,040 --> 00:58:06,960 Speaker 1: kept my apartment and everything. I mean, he's an all 1178 00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:09,800 Speaker 1: time great guy who's now a father and works for 1179 00:58:10,720 --> 00:58:13,360 Speaker 1: He's had a finance on a Toyota dealership down in 1180 00:58:13,480 --> 00:58:17,520 Speaker 1: um in Fort Worth. Okay, So budap best thing about 1181 00:58:17,560 --> 00:58:23,440 Speaker 1: Budapest is what uh the food googlesh. I had a 1182 00:58:23,480 --> 00:58:26,000 Speaker 1: little restaurant next to my apartment, which we call the flat. 1183 00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:28,760 Speaker 1: It was a grandmother, mother and a daughter, three making 1184 00:58:28,760 --> 00:58:31,480 Speaker 1: food for a h people with eight seats in the 1185 00:58:31,520 --> 00:58:34,960 Speaker 1: little restaurant. They make homemade food every day. I I 1186 00:58:35,000 --> 00:58:38,400 Speaker 1: never cooked in Budapest, I never. I never I ate 1187 00:58:38,440 --> 00:58:41,520 Speaker 1: their three meals a day. Uh. They became my family. 1188 00:58:41,960 --> 00:58:45,360 Speaker 1: The food was it's real food, man, It's like moms 1189 00:58:45,360 --> 00:58:49,000 Speaker 1: and grandma's making real food. Uh you know that. That 1190 00:58:49,120 --> 00:58:53,200 Speaker 1: was special. Okay, So your second year was where I 1191 00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:58,360 Speaker 1: was in London, England. London Towers was Nick Nurser coach. No, 1192 00:58:58,560 --> 00:59:00,760 Speaker 1: Nick was with the Bride and Bears. Nick was our 1193 00:59:00,840 --> 00:59:03,160 Speaker 1: you know, our assistant coach with the Uh. So I 1194 00:59:03,160 --> 00:59:06,840 Speaker 1: go way back with Nick. He was the head coach 1195 00:59:06,840 --> 00:59:10,000 Speaker 1: of the Bride and Bears. And you'll remember these guys. Uh, 1196 00:59:10,160 --> 00:59:14,360 Speaker 1: Nick had a Sterling Davis from Tulane and he had 1197 00:59:15,000 --> 00:59:21,080 Speaker 1: he had Randy Duck. Randy Duck. Randy Duck and Sterling 1198 00:59:21,160 --> 00:59:24,440 Speaker 1: Davis became like celebrities in England. They were like on 1199 00:59:24,480 --> 00:59:27,760 Speaker 1: the MTV Music Awards for England. Uh. They had so 1200 00:59:27,880 --> 00:59:30,680 Speaker 1: much pop out there. And you know, and who knew 1201 00:59:30,760 --> 00:59:34,680 Speaker 1: Nick Nurse would end up being a championship NBA coach. Uh, 1202 00:59:34,760 --> 00:59:37,160 Speaker 1: it's a small basketball world. You know that rand Randy Duck. 1203 00:59:37,240 --> 00:59:40,560 Speaker 1: So Randy came and joined. So here's how in two 1204 00:59:40,560 --> 00:59:43,520 Speaker 1: thousand we play. We had like five os U guys 1205 00:59:43,680 --> 00:59:47,400 Speaker 1: and Brian, Brian Gates was our coach. And Brian was 1206 00:59:47,680 --> 00:59:50,600 Speaker 1: he had he was like assistant who the head coach 1207 00:59:50,840 --> 00:59:53,600 Speaker 1: quit like the day before the first game. And then 1208 00:59:53,680 --> 00:59:55,680 Speaker 1: I was late to shoot around, so I didn't start 1209 00:59:55,840 --> 01:00:00,440 Speaker 1: right and uh, um, but that was that was a 1210 01:00:00,480 --> 01:00:03,080 Speaker 1: fun year. We had a squad. So then I was 1211 01:00:03,280 --> 01:00:05,600 Speaker 1: so then the year the year we played together the 1212 01:00:05,600 --> 01:00:11,920 Speaker 1: Oklahoma Storm, or the half year before I've quit, um was, 1213 01:00:12,440 --> 01:00:14,760 Speaker 1: I was playing in the A B A. I left Israel. 1214 01:00:15,080 --> 01:00:16,840 Speaker 1: I went to play for a guy named as Track, 1215 01:00:16,840 --> 01:00:19,320 Speaker 1: who I had known, and I felt like he fixed 1216 01:00:19,360 --> 01:00:21,880 Speaker 1: me right, like he got me, he got me right 1217 01:00:22,040 --> 01:00:23,680 Speaker 1: as as a player. And I played in the A 1218 01:00:23,720 --> 01:00:25,120 Speaker 1: B A and we were set to go to the 1219 01:00:25,160 --> 01:00:28,120 Speaker 1: A B A playoffs and James Bryant was was the 1220 01:00:28,160 --> 01:00:30,800 Speaker 1: owner of the Oaklahoma Storm. So he told me, like 1221 01:00:30,880 --> 01:00:33,280 Speaker 1: I think everybody made like between five hundred and a 1222 01:00:33,360 --> 01:00:37,400 Speaker 1: thousand a week or something with the Storm. So what 1223 01:00:37,440 --> 01:00:39,640 Speaker 1: he did was he said like, look, I want you 1224 01:00:39,720 --> 01:00:41,200 Speaker 1: to be the face of my team. I'm gonna pay 1225 01:00:41,240 --> 01:00:45,360 Speaker 1: you twenty a week, okay, and I'm gonna pay your wife, 1226 01:00:46,120 --> 01:00:50,000 Speaker 1: um put her on salary with our with our our 1227 01:00:50,080 --> 01:00:54,080 Speaker 1: ticket sales, and and but but you have to be 1228 01:00:54,120 --> 01:00:58,920 Speaker 1: at training camp. So I got there and and Kareem 1229 01:00:58,960 --> 01:01:00,840 Speaker 1: and didn't like me, and I had never even met 1230 01:01:00,920 --> 01:01:03,200 Speaker 1: Corenem just didn't like me. And I think he didn't 1231 01:01:03,240 --> 01:01:05,600 Speaker 1: like me because he didn't like James Bryant, and James 1232 01:01:05,600 --> 01:01:08,600 Speaker 1: Bryant was telling me, you know, this is your point guard, 1233 01:01:09,120 --> 01:01:12,520 Speaker 1: and so he wouldn't start me, and so it was 1234 01:01:12,760 --> 01:01:15,360 Speaker 1: me you. And remember we had a teammate named Gabe 1235 01:01:15,360 --> 01:01:18,480 Speaker 1: Frank Dave is now a doctor in uh in North Carolina. 1236 01:01:19,160 --> 01:01:21,640 Speaker 1: And we'd come off the bench and it was like 1237 01:01:21,640 --> 01:01:24,360 Speaker 1: our plus minus was crazy. It was crazy. It was 1238 01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:27,640 Speaker 1: it was a joke, right. And I remember we were 1239 01:01:27,640 --> 01:01:31,400 Speaker 1: playing in Oklahoma City at the Myriad and I had 1240 01:01:31,440 --> 01:01:35,080 Speaker 1: played great the night before and I played really, really, 1241 01:01:35,120 --> 01:01:38,600 Speaker 1: really well, and I just felt like I felt so 1242 01:01:38,760 --> 01:01:41,800 Speaker 1: defeated because I would do a radio show in the 1243 01:01:41,920 --> 01:01:44,640 Speaker 1: in the middle of the day and and and then 1244 01:01:44,680 --> 01:01:46,440 Speaker 1: I put, you know, so much effort and I was like, 1245 01:01:46,680 --> 01:01:49,040 Speaker 1: my I maxed out at like twenty minutes in a game, 1246 01:01:49,960 --> 01:01:52,720 Speaker 1: and you know, like I, you know, when you're and 1247 01:01:52,720 --> 01:01:55,040 Speaker 1: I just like, you know, what, fuck it, I'm done. 1248 01:01:55,360 --> 01:01:57,200 Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not gonna I'm not gonna play for 1249 01:01:57,200 --> 01:02:01,240 Speaker 1: this dude anymore. But I we did have But do 1250 01:02:01,280 --> 01:02:04,200 Speaker 1: you remember the salina when I got into it with Kareem. 1251 01:02:04,280 --> 01:02:07,360 Speaker 1: I vaguely remember it. Other guys were on that team, 1252 01:02:07,360 --> 01:02:10,120 Speaker 1: remember it. I don't remember it that well. Well, I 1253 01:02:10,400 --> 01:02:12,920 Speaker 1: actually got into a kaream also, and after you had 1254 01:02:13,000 --> 01:02:16,880 Speaker 1: left the team, I had a similar experience, you know, 1255 01:02:16,920 --> 01:02:19,880 Speaker 1: where the fans would be begging for me to get 1256 01:02:19,880 --> 01:02:21,400 Speaker 1: in the game. I get in the game and cream 1257 01:02:21,400 --> 01:02:23,800 Speaker 1: with jerk me and and I like to say good 1258 01:02:23,800 --> 01:02:26,800 Speaker 1: things about everyone, and so I'm gonna say this, Kareema 1259 01:02:26,840 --> 01:02:29,440 Speaker 1: Bill Jabar scored the most points in the history of 1260 01:02:29,440 --> 01:02:32,120 Speaker 1: the game. Cream A bul Jabar is a brilliant book writer. 1261 01:02:32,680 --> 01:02:36,400 Speaker 1: He's a brilliant thinker, He's a brilliant man. Um. I 1262 01:02:36,440 --> 01:02:40,760 Speaker 1: did not enjoy playing basketball for him per se, but 1263 01:02:41,160 --> 01:02:43,320 Speaker 1: he won a championship. We want a championship. But I 1264 01:02:43,800 --> 01:02:46,880 Speaker 1: got into it with him in practice, uh during a 1265 01:02:46,920 --> 01:02:49,800 Speaker 1: shoot around, and he actually kicked me off the team. 1266 01:02:49,840 --> 01:02:52,160 Speaker 1: And I went back to Grand Parrie, Texas and was 1267 01:02:52,200 --> 01:02:55,960 Speaker 1: substitute teaching at my dad's school, and James Bryant called 1268 01:02:55,960 --> 01:02:57,920 Speaker 1: and said, hey, we need a shoot her, come on 1269 01:02:57,960 --> 01:03:00,080 Speaker 1: back and I said, I don't know, and again in 1270 01:03:00,200 --> 01:03:02,960 Speaker 1: and I didn't get month, but he bumped me up 1271 01:03:02,960 --> 01:03:05,800 Speaker 1: a few hundred a week and say get back here. 1272 01:03:06,080 --> 01:03:08,919 Speaker 1: But I do remember this, Doug. We had so much 1273 01:03:08,960 --> 01:03:12,760 Speaker 1: talent on that team. Ira Clark Corey Brewer. I mean 1274 01:03:13,000 --> 01:03:16,720 Speaker 1: it was a prose. I mean it was you know, 1275 01:03:16,800 --> 01:03:19,400 Speaker 1: and and Kaream won a championship. He's he's a world 1276 01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:21,959 Speaker 1: championship USBO coach. I tell people all the time that 1277 01:03:21,960 --> 01:03:24,480 Speaker 1: that movie, um what was it called semi pro with 1278 01:03:24,680 --> 01:03:28,880 Speaker 1: with Colin's name Will Carroll. Yeah, that's that. That was 1279 01:03:28,920 --> 01:03:33,240 Speaker 1: a semi true story. It's the USB hill. Oh yeah 1280 01:03:34,720 --> 01:03:40,000 Speaker 1: about so, so this is my first year, my first year. 1281 01:03:40,040 --> 01:03:42,920 Speaker 1: I'm we're with this team and we've been training camp whatever. 1282 01:03:43,200 --> 01:03:45,520 Speaker 1: And I remember my dad telling me like, and I 1283 01:03:45,600 --> 01:03:48,479 Speaker 1: was like, Dad, these guys are so good, like they're 1284 01:03:48,600 --> 01:03:53,000 Speaker 1: so so good. And because we had Willie Burton, we 1285 01:03:53,040 --> 01:03:57,840 Speaker 1: had Bubba Wells Uh, we had uh Darry mcclinn was 1286 01:03:57,840 --> 01:04:00,160 Speaker 1: the other point caud We had all these guys that 1287 01:04:00,160 --> 01:04:02,480 Speaker 1: that played that that had a cup of coffee or 1288 01:04:02,720 --> 01:04:04,640 Speaker 1: I mean Willy Burton scored fifty points the NBA game. 1289 01:04:04,640 --> 01:04:06,920 Speaker 1: And I was like, man, how are these why are 1290 01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:10,560 Speaker 1: these guys in Enid, Oklahoma making five week? Right? My 1291 01:04:10,640 --> 01:04:14,320 Speaker 1: dad was My dad said like, son, there's always a reason. Okay, 1292 01:04:14,320 --> 01:04:17,280 Speaker 1: Now I'm not gonna name names of of but it 1293 01:04:17,400 --> 01:04:22,160 Speaker 1: within in the very first game of the history of 1294 01:04:22,200 --> 01:04:25,840 Speaker 1: the Oklahoma Storm. I saw the reason for like all 1295 01:04:25,880 --> 01:04:28,240 Speaker 1: of them, right, for like all of them. Like one 1296 01:04:28,280 --> 01:04:31,280 Speaker 1: guy was literally rolled out of the Strip Club, which 1297 01:04:31,360 --> 01:04:33,760 Speaker 1: was in our parking lot of our holiday in to 1298 01:04:33,840 --> 01:04:36,560 Speaker 1: go to the game and then went there immediately afterwards. 1299 01:04:37,040 --> 01:04:40,080 Speaker 1: One guy was at the Sonic parking lot, you know, 1300 01:04:40,160 --> 01:04:44,320 Speaker 1: having to cheeseburgers and uh root forty four coke for 1301 01:04:44,440 --> 01:04:47,520 Speaker 1: the game. So one guy was women. One guy it 1302 01:04:47,600 --> 01:04:51,680 Speaker 1: was food. One of the guys was just batshit crazy, right, 1303 01:04:52,000 --> 01:04:54,280 Speaker 1: one of the guys that wouldn't pass, couldn't get along 1304 01:04:54,320 --> 01:04:57,520 Speaker 1: with others, Like there's always a reason. And that team 1305 01:04:57,600 --> 01:05:02,120 Speaker 1: got to the finals. We lost. Sean Colson was great. Um, 1306 01:05:02,240 --> 01:05:04,280 Speaker 1: we lost in a close game, but that was a 1307 01:05:04,320 --> 01:05:07,840 Speaker 1: that was a fascinating, fascinating Okay, so Budapest hungry. Then 1308 01:05:07,880 --> 01:05:09,840 Speaker 1: you go to London. Best thing about playing in London 1309 01:05:12,520 --> 01:05:15,200 Speaker 1: I didn't my mom. My mom travels the world as 1310 01:05:15,240 --> 01:05:19,240 Speaker 1: an international director for a nonprofit. London's her favorite place. 1311 01:05:19,360 --> 01:05:21,840 Speaker 1: I'm not a big fan. I didn't really lie. I 1312 01:05:21,880 --> 01:05:25,640 Speaker 1: didn't get down with London, the weather, the now. The 1313 01:05:25,680 --> 01:05:27,919 Speaker 1: next year I went to Portugal, So I'm gonna skip London. 1314 01:05:27,960 --> 01:05:31,160 Speaker 1: I'm gonna go straight to Lisbon, Portugal. I lived fifteen 1315 01:05:31,200 --> 01:05:34,120 Speaker 1: minutes from the beach, twenty five minutes from the number 1316 01:05:34,120 --> 01:05:37,160 Speaker 1: one casino in Portugal. No, no, Lord, forgive me. I 1317 01:05:37,160 --> 01:05:39,720 Speaker 1: I frequent the casino a little bit, uh, for some 1318 01:05:39,800 --> 01:05:44,040 Speaker 1: activities there. When I was a pro in Portugal, Lisbon 1319 01:05:44,200 --> 01:05:46,320 Speaker 1: was unreal. And then my last year I played in 1320 01:05:46,440 --> 01:05:52,280 Speaker 1: instable Turkey. Um and Uh that's a crazy city. Uh, 1321 01:05:52,440 --> 01:05:55,960 Speaker 1: just a crazy place. And and to think that, you know, bass, 1322 01:05:56,000 --> 01:05:57,680 Speaker 1: the game of basketball would take me all of I 1323 01:05:57,720 --> 01:06:00,960 Speaker 1: played in the Philippines with Dennis Rodman right before he 1324 01:06:01,000 --> 01:06:02,560 Speaker 1: went to North Korea with those other guys. I did 1325 01:06:02,560 --> 01:06:06,080 Speaker 1: the same. Uh, Yeah, I went. I was it was. 1326 01:06:06,160 --> 01:06:11,520 Speaker 1: It was Alex Sandwich, Generald Dawkins, Calvin Murphy, um ots 1327 01:06:11,600 --> 01:06:15,080 Speaker 1: Bird's song, Sydney Moncrease and Dennis Rodman was our headliner. 1328 01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:19,760 Speaker 1: And it was Kareem read Oh lou Fama team, another guy, 1329 01:06:20,040 --> 01:06:23,080 Speaker 1: young guy, and myself and a guy named Colin Bodicker. 1330 01:06:23,120 --> 01:06:27,040 Speaker 1: Colin is the color guy for TCU basketball now. And 1331 01:06:27,320 --> 01:06:29,800 Speaker 1: we went over and I could tell you stories for 1332 01:06:29,920 --> 01:06:34,080 Speaker 1: days about that trip. But it was basketball. I'll give 1333 01:06:34,080 --> 01:06:37,280 Speaker 1: you one. I'll give you one here so Dennis Rodman, Um, 1334 01:06:37,320 --> 01:06:42,560 Speaker 1: he's forty three, um, forty two or forty three years old. Uh, 1335 01:06:42,720 --> 01:06:44,520 Speaker 1: we've gotta we're gonna be gonna play two games. We're 1336 01:06:44,520 --> 01:06:47,080 Speaker 1: gonna play the Filipino national team. And we played him 1337 01:06:47,120 --> 01:06:50,000 Speaker 1: in front of fourteen thousand people. It was unreal. But 1338 01:06:50,040 --> 01:06:52,160 Speaker 1: before we played then we had to play an exhibition 1339 01:06:52,240 --> 01:06:56,640 Speaker 1: game in Cebu City, which was a forty minute plane. Right, 1340 01:06:57,160 --> 01:06:59,960 Speaker 1: so typical fashion our our our promoters has hate the 1341 01:07:00,080 --> 01:07:02,120 Speaker 1: down in the lobby. Were staying at the Shango Law Hotel, 1342 01:07:02,360 --> 01:07:05,320 Speaker 1: best hotel I'll stay then is in Manila. Unreal. We're 1343 01:07:05,320 --> 01:07:06,920 Speaker 1: in the lobby. He said, be down there at ten. 1344 01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:08,680 Speaker 1: So we get down. Five of us are down there 1345 01:07:08,680 --> 01:07:10,440 Speaker 1: at ten am. You know, I don't know what the 1346 01:07:10,440 --> 01:07:14,480 Speaker 1: flight was at in Uh, twenty minutes later about you know, 1347 01:07:15,680 --> 01:07:18,360 Speaker 1: ten of us are there. Then finally the last guy. Well, 1348 01:07:18,400 --> 01:07:23,880 Speaker 1: everyone's there except for who Dennis Rodman. And Dennis traveled 1349 01:07:23,880 --> 01:07:27,920 Speaker 1: with a handler and a bodyguard at the time, and uh, 1350 01:07:28,160 --> 01:07:31,040 Speaker 1: we know the bodyguard wasn't there. The hammer. They were 1351 01:07:31,040 --> 01:07:32,560 Speaker 1: all up in his room in the suite. He had 1352 01:07:32,600 --> 01:07:35,520 Speaker 1: this big suite and so they were sending Bellman up there. 1353 01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:37,400 Speaker 1: They were sending people there, beating on the door. Nobody's 1354 01:07:37,440 --> 01:07:41,520 Speaker 1: coming out of the door. Now now it's almost eleven. 1355 01:07:41,920 --> 01:07:44,240 Speaker 1: Our promoter, who I think was paying Dennis, you know, 1356 01:07:44,280 --> 01:07:47,080 Speaker 1: around a hundred and fifty thousand dollars a game, is 1357 01:07:47,160 --> 01:07:51,240 Speaker 1: going just crazing the lobby, cursing, and yeah, he's asking 1358 01:07:51,320 --> 01:07:54,640 Speaker 1: Darryl Dawkins what's wrong with this guy? And just going nuts. 1359 01:07:55,240 --> 01:07:56,760 Speaker 1: And we're gonna have to get on the tour bus 1360 01:07:56,760 --> 01:08:00,560 Speaker 1: and go to the airport. And so right before, I mean, 1361 01:08:00,600 --> 01:08:02,720 Speaker 1: we we're waiting till last second, we're in this beautiful 1362 01:08:02,760 --> 01:08:07,760 Speaker 1: it's it's marble white, uh flooring. It's just in about 1363 01:08:07,840 --> 01:08:10,120 Speaker 1: twenty five yards from where we're all. You know, it's 1364 01:08:10,320 --> 01:08:14,200 Speaker 1: these guys are NBA legends, Alex English, Darryl Dawkins. These 1365 01:08:14,200 --> 01:08:18,760 Speaker 1: guys are one like one millisecond before we're about to 1366 01:08:18,800 --> 01:08:22,080 Speaker 1: walk out the lobby, do you hear the the elevator 1367 01:08:22,120 --> 01:08:28,080 Speaker 1: doors ding? And Dennis Rodman walked out of the elevator 1368 01:08:29,240 --> 01:08:33,160 Speaker 1: with two Filipino hookers on each side, and he's in 1369 01:08:33,160 --> 01:08:36,640 Speaker 1: a towel, and and all ten or twelve of us 1370 01:08:36,720 --> 01:08:38,439 Speaker 1: that were in the lobby, they're kind of just paused 1371 01:08:38,439 --> 01:08:42,160 Speaker 1: and just kind of froze, and Dennis yells over to 1372 01:08:42,200 --> 01:08:44,600 Speaker 1: the group. He goes, hey, who wants to go to 1373 01:08:44,640 --> 01:08:47,840 Speaker 1: the hot tub? And of course we're all getting paid 1374 01:08:47,880 --> 01:08:50,519 Speaker 1: to play. Nobody says a word. We walk out and 1375 01:08:50,520 --> 01:08:53,960 Speaker 1: get them the tour bus. Dennis goes to the hot tub, 1376 01:08:54,800 --> 01:08:56,800 Speaker 1: so we get them the tour bus. We're getting carted 1377 01:08:56,840 --> 01:08:59,439 Speaker 1: through Manila, which is crazy traffic. We get to the 1378 01:08:59,439 --> 01:09:03,000 Speaker 1: airport unloading all the backs and everything, you know, and 1379 01:09:03,080 --> 01:09:05,639 Speaker 1: we walk into the airport. We're about to go through 1380 01:09:05,640 --> 01:09:10,400 Speaker 1: security and incomes Dennis Rodman in some pajama pants ed, 1381 01:09:10,479 --> 01:09:14,680 Speaker 1: hardy hat, uh t shirt flip flops, walks up right 1382 01:09:14,680 --> 01:09:16,920 Speaker 1: to the group. It was like, hey, what's up, guys? 1383 01:09:17,080 --> 01:09:20,720 Speaker 1: And I look at Dennis and I'm like, Dennis, what how? 1384 01:09:20,960 --> 01:09:22,760 Speaker 1: He goes the hot tub? Was great? Why didn't you come? 1385 01:09:22,880 --> 01:09:24,840 Speaker 1: I said? And if we're did't pay to play basketball, 1386 01:09:24,960 --> 01:09:26,920 Speaker 1: I said, how did you get here? He said, A 1387 01:09:26,920 --> 01:09:29,519 Speaker 1: lot hopped on the motorcycle with the police chief of Manila, 1388 01:09:29,840 --> 01:09:32,160 Speaker 1: and he just he just sped through traffic and got 1389 01:09:32,200 --> 01:09:35,760 Speaker 1: me here. That's amazing. That's amazing. That that that that 1390 01:09:35,800 --> 01:09:38,960 Speaker 1: trumps slightly my We flew into Missouri and we got 1391 01:09:39,040 --> 01:09:41,000 Speaker 1: delayed because of the weather, and we went to a 1392 01:09:41,600 --> 01:09:46,200 Speaker 1: We went to Ah, what's the What's olive Garden in 1393 01:09:46,200 --> 01:09:49,559 Speaker 1: in Columbia, Missouri, And we go and sit down and 1394 01:09:49,600 --> 01:09:53,960 Speaker 1: the waitress comes out and says, uh, I'm sorry, sir, 1395 01:09:54,040 --> 01:09:55,559 Speaker 1: we don't have any food. And he's like, you tell 1396 01:09:55,640 --> 01:09:58,360 Speaker 1: me Eddie Sutton, his boys are hungry. We had employee, 1397 01:09:58,760 --> 01:10:01,800 Speaker 1: we had a reservation like for two hours ago. We 1398 01:10:01,840 --> 01:10:04,639 Speaker 1: got delayed and they started. The chefs were going home 1399 01:10:04,640 --> 01:10:07,160 Speaker 1: and the manager starts making spaghetti in the in the 1400 01:10:07,280 --> 01:10:09,760 Speaker 1: in the kitchen that Dennis Roving getting the police chief 1401 01:10:09,760 --> 01:10:13,559 Speaker 1: of Manila, Trump said, ever so slightly, was a great 1402 01:10:13,640 --> 01:10:17,120 Speaker 1: human being too. He treated us like gold. I love. 1403 01:10:17,200 --> 01:10:19,000 Speaker 1: I mean, I have nothing but good things to say. 1404 01:10:18,840 --> 01:10:21,840 Speaker 1: He's a lost soul in some ways, but he's also 1405 01:10:22,080 --> 01:10:25,880 Speaker 1: a loving, kind human being. And I experienced that first 1406 01:10:25,880 --> 01:10:28,080 Speaker 1: thing and he treated me like gold. Now, Doug, I 1407 01:10:28,240 --> 01:10:31,559 Speaker 1: just got talked about anniversary. I had just gotten married 1408 01:10:32,040 --> 01:10:34,479 Speaker 1: in the sports promoter three months later says, hey, we 1409 01:10:34,479 --> 01:10:36,840 Speaker 1: need you over in the Philippines. And my wife made 1410 01:10:36,840 --> 01:10:38,719 Speaker 1: me promise that I wouldn't go out to the club 1411 01:10:38,720 --> 01:10:41,360 Speaker 1: with Dennistrobman, And I'm proud to say, I did not 1412 01:10:41,400 --> 01:10:42,920 Speaker 1: go to the club with Denis Roman. That's why I'm 1413 01:10:42,960 --> 01:10:46,559 Speaker 1: still married fifteen years later. All is well. Uh, but 1414 01:10:46,680 --> 01:10:49,160 Speaker 1: it was a great basketball takes you into some of 1415 01:10:49,200 --> 01:10:53,840 Speaker 1: the craziest experiences and people. It was wonderful. Yeah. So 1416 01:10:53,920 --> 01:10:57,720 Speaker 1: Willie Burton was my teammate with the usb L and 1417 01:10:57,840 --> 01:11:00,800 Speaker 1: so when we needed a wing in Russia that in 1418 01:11:00,880 --> 01:11:03,040 Speaker 1: the next winner, I was like, man, you guys should 1419 01:11:03,040 --> 01:11:04,840 Speaker 1: get Willie Burton. That dude can get buckets. He's in 1420 01:11:04,880 --> 01:11:08,080 Speaker 1: great shape. And so Willie was paranoid. For one, he's 1421 01:11:08,120 --> 01:11:10,680 Speaker 1: a recovering alcoholic at the time, but he was paranoid 1422 01:11:10,680 --> 01:11:14,599 Speaker 1: about about everything, but really the Russians, and he's tried 1423 01:11:14,640 --> 01:11:16,559 Speaker 1: to convince me that they were really spying on him. 1424 01:11:16,800 --> 01:11:19,760 Speaker 1: Don't let anybody clean your apartment, they'll plant the things. 1425 01:11:20,040 --> 01:11:22,080 Speaker 1: So he used to give me a thousand rubles to 1426 01:11:22,120 --> 01:11:24,360 Speaker 1: gamble with him and to make sure that he didn't 1427 01:11:24,400 --> 01:11:27,400 Speaker 1: drink and to make sure that nobody messed with him, 1428 01:11:27,439 --> 01:11:29,640 Speaker 1: and he would give him every every So, like I 1429 01:11:29,720 --> 01:11:31,600 Speaker 1: was super cheap, and I was on a on a 1430 01:11:31,640 --> 01:11:33,920 Speaker 1: budget and I just got married, and so I I 1431 01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:35,720 Speaker 1: was like, cool, you can give me. We're roommates on 1432 01:11:35,720 --> 01:11:37,559 Speaker 1: the road and give me a thousand roubles to go 1433 01:11:37,640 --> 01:11:40,040 Speaker 1: gamble with him, and like when I'd run out, he'd 1434 01:11:40,040 --> 01:11:42,840 Speaker 1: be like, here, here's a thousand more whatever, just don't leave. 1435 01:11:43,200 --> 01:11:45,759 Speaker 1: And I wasn't allowed for him. I wasn't allowed to Willie. 1436 01:11:45,760 --> 01:11:48,000 Speaker 1: I'm I'm not a stay out I'm not a hangout guy. Dude, 1437 01:11:48,000 --> 01:11:49,639 Speaker 1: I need to go to bed. He's like, no, man, 1438 01:11:49,680 --> 01:11:51,599 Speaker 1: you're you're you're my guy. This is this is what 1439 01:11:51,600 --> 01:11:54,479 Speaker 1: what you do. So, I mean it does take you 1440 01:11:54,520 --> 01:11:59,760 Speaker 1: to some crazy, crazy, crazy places. Okay, I want to 1441 01:11:59,800 --> 01:12:02,599 Speaker 1: get to what you're doing now in terms of service. 1442 01:12:02,920 --> 01:12:06,040 Speaker 1: I know you're working with Impact Basketball, but you're you're 1443 01:12:06,040 --> 01:12:08,960 Speaker 1: doing something else with books. Tell me about it. Yeah, yeah, 1444 01:12:09,000 --> 01:12:11,800 Speaker 1: it's it's pretty cool. Uh. About four four and a 1445 01:12:11,800 --> 01:12:15,799 Speaker 1: half years ago, I partnered with my co founder, Casey Stewart. 1446 01:12:15,920 --> 01:12:19,960 Speaker 1: He's a incredible entrepreneur there in l A and he 1447 01:12:20,360 --> 01:12:23,160 Speaker 1: produces world class videos. And we just came up with 1448 01:12:23,160 --> 01:12:28,120 Speaker 1: this idea that you know, there's there's kids who uh, 1449 01:12:28,280 --> 01:12:32,640 Speaker 1: books and education can be so transformational, but but that 1450 01:12:32,840 --> 01:12:37,360 Speaker 1: married with sports is is something that could be kind 1451 01:12:37,360 --> 01:12:39,400 Speaker 1: of kind of neat. So we started booking a ball. 1452 01:12:39,520 --> 01:12:42,519 Speaker 1: It's booking a ball dot org. And we just started simply. 1453 01:12:42,520 --> 01:12:44,320 Speaker 1: And here's the cool thing about it. We don't have 1454 01:12:44,960 --> 01:12:47,320 Speaker 1: what when people give to our our our five and 1455 01:12:47,400 --> 01:12:49,439 Speaker 1: one c three, it all goes to books and balls. 1456 01:12:49,479 --> 01:12:52,479 Speaker 1: Because we all have a jobs, we all work. This 1457 01:12:52,560 --> 01:12:55,400 Speaker 1: is this is like our our side mission. No one 1458 01:12:55,439 --> 01:12:57,600 Speaker 1: takes a salary, no one takes money from it. We 1459 01:12:57,720 --> 01:13:01,439 Speaker 1: just simply buy a lot time soccer balls. But here's 1460 01:13:01,479 --> 01:13:04,040 Speaker 1: the cool thing, Doug. When you give a kid a book, 1461 01:13:04,680 --> 01:13:06,559 Speaker 1: you know, we give them adventure books and books on 1462 01:13:06,640 --> 01:13:09,559 Speaker 1: hope and and books on uh, you know, to to 1463 01:13:09,640 --> 01:13:14,360 Speaker 1: inspire them. It's pretty neat. But when you see, uh, 1464 01:13:15,120 --> 01:13:19,160 Speaker 1: a seven year old kid who has nothing and you 1465 01:13:19,200 --> 01:13:25,280 Speaker 1: hand him a a seven dollar McGregor soccer ball, and 1466 01:13:25,360 --> 01:13:29,440 Speaker 1: he thinks that he just hit the world class lottery 1467 01:13:29,520 --> 01:13:34,280 Speaker 1: because he has his own ball. Sports brings a joy 1468 01:13:34,800 --> 01:13:37,559 Speaker 1: and children like no other thing. In my opinion, it's 1469 01:13:37,640 --> 01:13:40,800 Speaker 1: something about a ball. And I can tell you story 1470 01:13:40,840 --> 01:13:43,879 Speaker 1: after story of our times and Ecuadors and bobwe Sadan 1471 01:13:44,280 --> 01:13:46,200 Speaker 1: all these different places we've been able to go and 1472 01:13:46,200 --> 01:13:49,320 Speaker 1: partner with other plate people to to give these these 1473 01:13:49,720 --> 01:13:52,360 Speaker 1: uh soccer balls basketball. So when we go out to Asia, 1474 01:13:52,360 --> 01:13:54,000 Speaker 1: we do basketballs, which is kind of neat because I 1475 01:13:54,080 --> 01:13:57,160 Speaker 1: like basketball, but we do a lot of soccer balls. Um. 1476 01:13:57,240 --> 01:13:59,840 Speaker 1: It just brings a joy and it gives us a 1477 01:14:00,040 --> 01:14:01,920 Speaker 1: chants to say, hey, and this is the neat thing. 1478 01:14:01,960 --> 01:14:05,080 Speaker 1: My my brother has adopted three African childre he has 1479 01:14:05,120 --> 01:14:07,720 Speaker 1: five children, three or from Africa, and I call him 1480 01:14:07,760 --> 01:14:10,920 Speaker 1: the varsity squad. I'm the JV squad. I'm just sending. 1481 01:14:10,960 --> 01:14:13,760 Speaker 1: I'm sending materials and and and spending my time and 1482 01:14:13,840 --> 01:14:17,400 Speaker 1: resource there. But I haven't adopted. But what we want 1483 01:14:17,400 --> 01:14:20,160 Speaker 1: to do is I just for one moment, I want 1484 01:14:20,160 --> 01:14:23,000 Speaker 1: to tell these young these young people, I see you, 1485 01:14:23,760 --> 01:14:29,680 Speaker 1: we see you. You matter. Uh, you have potential, you 1486 01:14:29,760 --> 01:14:33,160 Speaker 1: have you have gifts. And so we do it with 1487 01:14:33,200 --> 01:14:37,679 Speaker 1: the soccer ball, basketball and inspirational books. Um and Doug, 1488 01:14:37,720 --> 01:14:39,920 Speaker 1: here's the here's the net thing about it. You know 1489 01:14:40,040 --> 01:14:42,680 Speaker 1: this when you're when you're a high level athlete. And 1490 01:14:42,720 --> 01:14:45,559 Speaker 1: I was an NBA player and I got close but 1491 01:14:45,600 --> 01:14:49,679 Speaker 1: didn't make it. But I experienced some incredible highs in sports. 1492 01:14:50,200 --> 01:14:52,479 Speaker 1: It almost seems like it's hard for guys to keep 1493 01:14:52,600 --> 01:14:56,960 Speaker 1: chasing that that experience, that that what what brings me 1494 01:14:57,000 --> 01:15:00,600 Speaker 1: that that that deep satisfaction that playing then against the 1495 01:15:00,680 --> 01:15:03,360 Speaker 1: U C a layer. And I'm telling you, Doug, when 1496 01:15:03,400 --> 01:15:06,200 Speaker 1: I hand it's the way when I hand a ball 1497 01:15:07,520 --> 01:15:11,000 Speaker 1: to a seven year old orphan, It's like a day 1498 01:15:11,080 --> 01:15:17,320 Speaker 1: winning shot over and over again. Bro. So here, I 1499 01:15:17,479 --> 01:15:19,200 Speaker 1: I do have a question. How do I get my son? 1500 01:15:19,360 --> 01:15:24,719 Speaker 1: I get my kids books for for Christmas? And and 1501 01:15:24,840 --> 01:15:27,160 Speaker 1: uh I try and get them ones that I think, 1502 01:15:28,080 --> 01:15:30,800 Speaker 1: but I just and they can all. My son is 1503 01:15:30,840 --> 01:15:35,559 Speaker 1: in this like I hate reading thing any any any advice, 1504 01:15:36,320 --> 01:15:40,840 Speaker 1: no patience. I hated reading, Doug. I read every cliff 1505 01:15:40,920 --> 01:15:42,320 Speaker 1: note in high school. I never read a book in 1506 01:15:42,400 --> 01:15:46,400 Speaker 1: high school. I was salutatorium just because I can memorize notes. 1507 01:15:46,760 --> 01:15:49,080 Speaker 1: I get to college, I don't like reading, but my 1508 01:15:49,160 --> 01:15:51,960 Speaker 1: mom and dad birthed a little bit of like they planted. 1509 01:15:51,960 --> 01:15:54,360 Speaker 1: If you just plant seats, I get to I get 1510 01:15:54,360 --> 01:15:57,000 Speaker 1: to actually, I get to Budapest hungry. And I'm tired 1511 01:15:57,000 --> 01:15:59,240 Speaker 1: of watching Animal plan It twenty four hours a day. 1512 01:15:59,280 --> 01:16:02,559 Speaker 1: I've only got three stations. I'm tired of watching Crocodile Hunter. 1513 01:16:02,760 --> 01:16:05,400 Speaker 1: I pick up a book and I go, oh my gosh, 1514 01:16:05,439 --> 01:16:07,679 Speaker 1: I'm twenty three and now I'm falling in love with books, 1515 01:16:08,040 --> 01:16:10,880 Speaker 1: so patients, Man, let him be a kid. Let him 1516 01:16:10,880 --> 01:16:13,680 Speaker 1: don't have fun plant seeds though, And that's what we're 1517 01:16:13,680 --> 01:16:15,200 Speaker 1: doing with Book on the Ball. We're just we're not 1518 01:16:15,240 --> 01:16:17,880 Speaker 1: doing we're not doing major work. Man, I'm not I'm 1519 01:16:17,920 --> 01:16:22,519 Speaker 1: not blind to that, but we're planning seeds. Man. All right, 1520 01:16:22,560 --> 01:16:24,560 Speaker 1: I get two more one. How can somebody donate the 1521 01:16:24,560 --> 01:16:28,880 Speaker 1: book in a Ball? It's simple. My my partner, Casey Stewart, 1522 01:16:28,920 --> 01:16:31,639 Speaker 1: is a world class uh producer of videos and stuff 1523 01:16:31,680 --> 01:16:34,400 Speaker 1: and he he made us a really nice uh website, 1524 01:16:34,400 --> 01:16:36,200 Speaker 1: Book on the Ball dot org. It's all right there. 1525 01:16:36,320 --> 01:16:40,000 Speaker 1: You just click donate, uh. And it's simple. We made 1526 01:16:40,040 --> 01:16:42,680 Speaker 1: it simple to do. It's just a few clicks. Um. 1527 01:16:42,760 --> 01:16:47,240 Speaker 1: And again, man, I always tell people, Um, if you 1528 01:16:47,280 --> 01:16:49,400 Speaker 1: want to give to a Book on the Ball, it's 1529 01:16:49,439 --> 01:16:53,400 Speaker 1: it's pretty neat because, um, it's all going to it's 1530 01:16:53,439 --> 01:16:56,559 Speaker 1: all going to the exact mission. And we're gonna we're 1531 01:16:56,560 --> 01:16:58,639 Speaker 1: gonna continue doing that. I mean, we're just gonna buy 1532 01:16:58,680 --> 01:17:01,160 Speaker 1: books and balls and we've partner with people to distribute 1533 01:17:01,160 --> 01:17:03,479 Speaker 1: it all over the world. A partner with a group 1534 01:17:03,479 --> 01:17:06,920 Speaker 1: out of Florida that's world class with the books. Um, 1535 01:17:06,920 --> 01:17:09,360 Speaker 1: it's just a book on the ball dot org book 1536 01:17:09,520 --> 01:17:12,559 Speaker 1: and a ball dot org and uh, you can follow 1537 01:17:12,600 --> 01:17:15,639 Speaker 1: us on social media. We've got all that stuff too. Um, Doug, 1538 01:17:15,680 --> 01:17:18,240 Speaker 1: thank you so much for letting me go. You haven't 1539 01:17:18,240 --> 01:17:21,520 Speaker 1: got I haven't gotten my last question yet. I love it. Okay. 1540 01:17:21,560 --> 01:17:24,160 Speaker 1: Obviously with the with with COVID, you haven't been able 1541 01:17:24,160 --> 01:17:26,559 Speaker 1: to travel. Do you know where your first trip is 1542 01:17:26,600 --> 01:17:31,240 Speaker 1: going to be once once everything opens up? No, we don't. 1543 01:17:31,720 --> 01:17:34,000 Speaker 1: And then that that is all in flux right now. 1544 01:17:34,000 --> 01:17:38,720 Speaker 1: It's very easy, you know, man, it's very especially international travel. Um. 1545 01:17:38,760 --> 01:17:40,519 Speaker 1: We've actually done a lot of We've done a lot 1546 01:17:40,600 --> 01:17:43,599 Speaker 1: of domestic things lately. Um, we just did a project 1547 01:17:43,600 --> 01:17:48,280 Speaker 1: and uh in Mexico because we could get there. Uh, 1548 01:17:48,320 --> 01:17:51,920 Speaker 1: we don't know, but I will tell you this when 1549 01:17:51,920 --> 01:17:54,080 Speaker 1: we find out, you'll be the first to know. Okay. 1550 01:17:54,120 --> 01:17:55,519 Speaker 1: Because I want to go on one of these trips 1551 01:17:55,520 --> 01:17:57,640 Speaker 1: that that was the other part and I want to 1552 01:17:57,800 --> 01:17:59,320 Speaker 1: I want to bring my I'd like to bring one 1553 01:17:59,360 --> 01:18:01,800 Speaker 1: of my kids, potentially my son. Whatever. I wanted to 1554 01:18:01,800 --> 01:18:04,120 Speaker 1: see what what the rest of the world lives like, 1555 01:18:04,600 --> 01:18:09,200 Speaker 1: because they get a complete different view of how their 1556 01:18:09,280 --> 01:18:13,160 Speaker 1: how their life is uh in comparison. Uh, chat I 1557 01:18:13,400 --> 01:18:16,040 Speaker 1: I've been honored to call you a friend. I'm glad 1558 01:18:16,040 --> 01:18:17,720 Speaker 1: we got a chance to catch up. We will do 1559 01:18:17,800 --> 01:18:20,280 Speaker 1: so more in the future. Maybe popula on when I 1560 01:18:20,320 --> 01:18:22,519 Speaker 1: got when I got self on the pod. In meantime, 1561 01:18:22,880 --> 01:18:25,920 Speaker 1: have a happy and safe new Year. Congratulations on the 1562 01:18:26,000 --> 01:18:30,559 Speaker 1: upcoming birth of another son. And and if you want 1563 01:18:30,600 --> 01:18:32,320 Speaker 1: to name him Doug, that's all cool too as well. 1564 01:18:32,400 --> 01:18:36,240 Speaker 1: Right like it was like I was going to rip rip, 1565 01:18:36,320 --> 01:18:40,000 Speaker 1: we got Ace Pierce a gunner and now ripped. The 1566 01:18:40,080 --> 01:18:43,200 Speaker 1: Stallions are destined for greatness. But just like you know, 1567 01:18:43,240 --> 01:18:46,840 Speaker 1: what I'm excited about is taking them on these trips 1568 01:18:46,920 --> 01:18:49,600 Speaker 1: to get a perspective on on the world and to 1569 01:18:49,720 --> 01:18:54,240 Speaker 1: be a caring, loving human being. It's awesome, man. Hey, listen, 1570 01:18:54,240 --> 01:18:55,519 Speaker 1: have a I have a blessed new Year. Thanks for 1571 01:18:55,680 --> 01:18:59,680 Speaker 1: thanks to you. You know I'm gonna do. I want 1572 01:18:59,680 --> 01:19:02,559 Speaker 1: to tell you sail a recruitment story in a different pod, 1573 01:19:02,760 --> 01:19:04,360 Speaker 1: and we will talk about it. It'll be great. I 1574 01:19:04,400 --> 01:19:06,680 Speaker 1: think you'll really really like it. I want to do this. 1575 01:19:06,840 --> 01:19:09,280 Speaker 1: I want to offer up my Twitter handle at gottlieb 1576 01:19:09,320 --> 01:19:12,360 Speaker 1: show you follow me on Instagram. Same thing. We got 1577 01:19:12,439 --> 01:19:14,280 Speaker 1: tons that we have lots of good pods coming out, 1578 01:19:14,320 --> 01:19:16,840 Speaker 1: You're gonna really enjoy it. In the meantime, send me 1579 01:19:16,920 --> 01:19:20,439 Speaker 1: questions whatever you want, covered guests that you want. I 1580 01:19:20,520 --> 01:19:23,200 Speaker 1: got good ones up coming for you, UM, and have 1581 01:19:23,280 --> 01:19:26,240 Speaker 1: a happy New Year. Look, we're almost out of this thing. Obviously. 1582 01:19:26,280 --> 01:19:30,240 Speaker 1: The college basketball season, it's been bumpy, but we'll get there. 1583 01:19:30,680 --> 01:19:33,160 Speaker 1: The NBA season, they probably started too quick, but they 1584 01:19:33,200 --> 01:19:35,960 Speaker 1: had to do five million dollars mistake. And you've got 1585 01:19:35,960 --> 01:19:38,920 Speaker 1: to get the playoffs in before everybody leaves for the summer. 1586 01:19:38,920 --> 01:19:40,960 Speaker 1: Because this year when you can travel and ask yourself, 1587 01:19:40,960 --> 01:19:43,800 Speaker 1: are you're gonna travel? Of course you are. But there's 1588 01:19:43,840 --> 01:19:46,559 Speaker 1: so much talent in college, so much talent in the pros, 1589 01:19:46,600 --> 01:19:48,439 Speaker 1: so many good stories to share with you. I hope 1590 01:19:48,439 --> 01:19:51,480 Speaker 1: you enjoyed this pod and and give to the organization 1591 01:19:51,920 --> 01:19:54,320 Speaker 1: in the meantime. Thanks so much for listening and downloading 1592 01:19:54,680 --> 01:19:58,240 Speaker 1: UH this podcast throughout the year. Our numbers are unbelievable 1593 01:19:58,360 --> 01:20:02,559 Speaker 1: your support. Remember to ascribe, rate review, write a little review. 1594 01:20:03,280 --> 01:20:04,880 Speaker 1: I don't know. I think that helps me. I guess 1595 01:20:04,880 --> 01:20:07,360 Speaker 1: I couldn't hurt UM even it's a negative review, but 1596 01:20:07,400 --> 01:20:08,880 Speaker 1: my would be a negative view. You listen all the 1597 01:20:08,920 --> 01:20:11,800 Speaker 1: way to the end, right That makes Sense, Thanks so 1598 01:20:11,880 --> 01:20:13,760 Speaker 1: much for listening on Doug Gottlieb. This is all ball