Speaker 1: On the Dog Cast. The questions asked, movies have wenenuum?
Speaker 1: Are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands do? And
Speaker 1: that start changing it? Come on, Welcome to the back Dodecasts. Yay,
Speaker 1: my name is Jamie, my name is Caitlin, and this
Speaker 1: is our second Seattle live episode of the back Gas.
Speaker 1: A lot of familiar faces. Thank you. I changed velvet
Speaker 1: suits because I care and I do have many velvet suits.
Speaker 1: Gotta get airtime for all of them on our audio podcast.
Speaker 1: I'm in the same outfit, so I'm in the same crocks,
Speaker 1: so we choices were made. Welcome to the show. Yes, welcome,
Speaker 1: Um clap if you are a listener of the Bechtel Cast,
Speaker 1: and uh yeah, is there anyone here who came with
Speaker 1: a friend and who hasn't heard the show before? Okay,
Speaker 1: we go one A shaking hand rose in the audience.
Speaker 1: This is okay. So Caitlin and I when we go
Speaker 1: to do live shows in various cities, we have so
Speaker 1: far never done a movie that takes place in the city.
Speaker 1: In fact, we always do movies that take place in
Speaker 1: the absolute wrong city, and people are how you say,
Speaker 1: angry about this movie? We did? This did Princess Diaries
Speaker 1: in New York. That's a movie about San Francisco. Correct,
Speaker 1: we did in San Francisco. We did the Breakfast Club
Speaker 1: takes place in a suburb of Chicago. I think the
Speaker 1: easiest way to get us to do the correct movie
Speaker 1: in the correct city is to put the name of
Speaker 1: the city in the title, although we could have done
Speaker 1: this movie be in New York. So it's Sleepless in Seattle.
Speaker 1: Is the name of the mover doing my rond of applause?
Speaker 1: Who has seen the movie? And? Uh? Which which Seattle? Light?
Speaker 1: Is that? Right? That's fun to say, Uh which Seattle?
Speaker 1: I is the holdout and has not seen Sleepless in Seattle.
Speaker 1: We've got some edgeloords and the crawd I love it
Speaker 1: when you think about it, Caitlin, and I feel like
Speaker 1: I'm about to really polarize the audience. But when you
Speaker 1: think about it canonically, is Seattle a spinoff of Boston? Um?
Speaker 1: Because that's what I'm I don't mean like culturally, Jesus,
Speaker 1: I mean Frasier spun off Cheers, Seattle spun off Boston.
Speaker 1: It's cannon. I see. That's just my hot take for
Speaker 1: the evening. Well, I'm sure we'll talk about this. But
Speaker 1: despite this movie taking place at least partly in Seattle,
Speaker 1: this movie barely is about Seattle. Like it. She seems
Speaker 1: to be mostly Sleepless in Baltimore in New York. Yeah,
Speaker 1: shall we bring our guests, Yes, we should. Our guest
Speaker 1: is awesome. She is a local Seattle comedian. She runs
Speaker 1: a weekly show at this very space, the Rendezvous called
Speaker 1: Comedy Nest, and she recently opened for Cameron Esposito. Give
Speaker 1: it up for Andy. I want Ceo, I want CEO,
Speaker 1: want I packed it up. I want Ceo. Lookome Hi
Speaker 1: to be here. To make it very you actually have
Speaker 1: to pass a test to begin speaking. I thought you
Speaker 1: were gonna like ask to play the piano, kind of
Speaker 1: Billy Joel's situation. Suddenly pianos wheeled up and you're we're
Speaker 1: going to see if you're on the pod. Well, thank
Speaker 1: you so much for being here. Tell us about your
Speaker 1: history and your relationship with Sleepless in Seattle. Historically, I've
Speaker 1: lived in Baltimore as well as Seattle, and this biopic
Speaker 1: kind of it kind of works out if you think
Speaker 1: about it as gender, but the other one. Anyway, I
Speaker 1: worked on the harbor right where she like sulks on
Speaker 1: a bench for most of the movie. Sure, romantically, it's
Speaker 1: one of the postcard she stares, Wow, Okay. And then
Speaker 1: I worked on a ferry that went around that harbor,
Speaker 1: and so you'd give like a fake tour to people
Speaker 1: to get tips. And so they had installed these lamp
Speaker 1: posts that weren't really ever there, but they saw them
Speaker 1: for the movie. Yeah, install them there in the movie.
Speaker 1: You can see them. They look old timey and stuff.
Speaker 1: When people have budgets, they just do like funked up
Speaker 1: random things. Right now, when they were shooting the wire
Speaker 1: in Baltimore actually had to install dilapidated houses because like
Speaker 1: not all the neighborhoods had them, or like they created
Speaker 1: bus stops. It was pretty hilarious. They did everything the
Speaker 1: city couldn't do. But my partner pointed out that he
Speaker 1: worked on the same ferry and then he was working
Speaker 1: on some pirate ship that went around Seattle's harbor, and
Speaker 1: then he realized he spent most of his summer meaning
Speaker 1: out the house from Sleepless since Seattle. So he's really
Speaker 1: got the connection. I I sleep next to him, so
Speaker 1: that's like contacts. Yeah, that's the transitive reperty. Next to
Speaker 1: someone who has the info, you also have the info.
Speaker 1: That's how it works. We're both trans so we just
Speaker 1: it just happens. Yeah, it's it's like a vulturoun of ambiguity. Well,
Speaker 1: to bring up the fight Club episode, which we recently did,
Speaker 1: it's like Tyler knows this, so I know this. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's the same thing. When did you first see list?
Speaker 1: I honestly seen bits and pieces of it at like
Speaker 1: family gatherings for a long time. It wasn't until it
Speaker 1: like really sat down to watch it a couple of
Speaker 1: weeks ago that I really like sat through the whole thing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was very interesting. You're not wrong, I have I
Speaker 1: have no notes for I had never seen it. Um. Sorry,
Speaker 1: I can feel myself getting sick currently. That's my fault.
Speaker 1: And also I'm better. Oh no, I had never seen
Speaker 1: this movie before until like a week ago when we
Speaker 1: started prepping for this tour. Yeah, it just it's not
Speaker 1: the type of movie that I would ever seek out.
Speaker 1: Our friend Katherine, I know. I'm so sorry. Our friend Catherine,
Speaker 1: who I watch a lot of movies with, had been
Speaker 1: trying to get me to watch this movie for like
Speaker 1: a year, and meanwhile I was like making her watch
Speaker 1: Paddington and stuff, and I kept refusing, but I did
Speaker 1: often posit theories as to what the movie might be about.
Speaker 1: UM So I was like, Yeah, it's about how Meg
Speaker 1: Ryan owns a bookstore in Seattle and Tom Hanks Ellen's
Speaker 1: a bigger bookstore called Amazon, and and they are fighting
Speaker 1: about it, but then they start emailing and they're falling
Speaker 1: in love over email. Well I know that now because
Speaker 1: I had also never seen You've Got Mail, and Catherine
Speaker 1: was always trying to get me to watch that, but
Speaker 1: they called You've Got Email. That's my only note for
Speaker 1: that movie. Otherwise, perfect piece of feminist text. What's your
Speaker 1: history with Sleepless in Seattle? Um? I kept sort of
Speaker 1: came to this movie in a in a bizarre reverse way.
Speaker 1: I before I saw any of Nora Fron's movies. I
Speaker 1: saw the documentary about her That Everything Is Copied documentary,
Speaker 1: which was really good, and she's like a fascinating figure
Speaker 1: with some serious blind spots. But I first like became
Speaker 1: interested in Nora Fron and then went back maybe about
Speaker 1: a year or two ago, and like started watching back
Speaker 1: all of her movies. We did when Harry met Sally
Speaker 1: on the podcast. I had to watch it then, and
Speaker 1: I watched sleep List in Seattle for the first time,
Speaker 1: maybe a year or two ago, and I was like, oh, no,
Speaker 1: you know, because I very much love Nora Fron and
Speaker 1: yet this movie Oh no, you know, yeah, so you
Speaker 1: know it was It was weird because it was like
Speaker 1: like falling in love with an artist and then two
Speaker 1: days later being like, what have you done to me?
Speaker 1: It was a real fling I had with Nora f Bron,
Speaker 1: and she let me down almost immediately. Sorry, it's okay,
Speaker 1: you know she's dead son in power. So I showed
Speaker 1: her I'm alive. Oh okay, that's one way to look
Speaker 1: at her. Okay. So oh yeah, this is now the
Speaker 1: roast of Nora Affront. Is this a normal part of
Speaker 1: the show where you say whether or not you've beaten somebody. No,
Speaker 1: But it's now a part of the show where I
Speaker 1: roast everyone who can't roast me back because I'm a coward.
Speaker 1: I'm still somewhat of a Nora Affront stand and I like,
Speaker 1: I like a lot of what she represents, and she
Speaker 1: did pave a lot of paths for future female writers
Speaker 1: and filmmakers, and I don't want to disk. I mean,
Speaker 1: I have a whole thing, but I love Nora upfront.
Speaker 1: This movie is yikes. Yes, well let's jump in with
Speaker 1: the recap. Okay, So this movie starts out basically the
Speaker 1: same exact way that the movie The Rock starts out,
Speaker 1: because it's Tom Hanks staring at a gravestone that might
Speaker 1: as well say his wife Key has just died. And
Speaker 1: he's more much like The Rock when Ed Harris, he's
Speaker 1: sort of yelling at the grave. Yeah, why do these
Speaker 1: men yell at the gravestones of their recently diseased and
Speaker 1: Edwards this case, it's raining heavily, so he's yelling through
Speaker 1: the weather to the grave. This is where you can
Speaker 1: start the drinking game of like if you take a
Speaker 1: shot every time you see something famous that should be
Speaker 1: on a postcard. Like the entire movie is just shots
Speaker 1: of stuff. Even Chicago seems to raise up like it's
Speaker 1: trying to check out what's happening. The buildings come up
Speaker 1: over the hill like wood go Away, sis right, the
Speaker 1: movie having a moment here there's this weird reveal that
Speaker 1: doesn't need to happen where it seems like they're in
Speaker 1: like just a grassy, rural grave yard, and then there's
Speaker 1: like a tilt that's like, wait a minute, they're near city,
Speaker 1: and it's like, who, people in cities aren't supposed to die.
Speaker 1: They were like, wait a second, so in this universe
Speaker 1: people who live in cities die. It's almost like, well,
Speaker 1: there's two ways we can do it. We could just
Speaker 1: put Chicago at the bone of the screen. No, that's
Speaker 1: not good enough. It needs to t open the entire
Speaker 1: skyline here, like a musical number from Chicago, a full
Speaker 1: on Dutch ankle. Uh. They do introduce it basically, like
Speaker 1: Tom Hanks is like, so, Torecap, my wife is dead
Speaker 1: and and the kids like why and he's like that
Speaker 1: just happens sometimes. And the kids like, oh, thank you,
Speaker 1: And that's the first thing. Yes, why are they yelling?
Speaker 1: I don't know, but Tom Hanks spends almost the rest
Speaker 1: of the movie yelling still he's an America sweetheart, are
Speaker 1: really fucking creepy and mean in this movie. So he
Speaker 1: is his wife has just died of cancer, and he
Speaker 1: is heartbroken because they were very much in love. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and he decides that he needs a change of scenery
Speaker 1: because everything in Chicago reminds him of his wife, and
Speaker 1: again it's another famous part of Chicago. It's them going
Speaker 1: into Wriggley Stadium. It's just another postcard that Oprah is
Speaker 1: throwing a pitch, like why is this happening? So he
Speaker 1: takes his young son, Jonah, and they moved to Seattle.
Speaker 1: I ever heard of it. The cast member of Fraser
Speaker 1: in this movie lives in Baltimore, which is But then
Speaker 1: here's my theory. They heard David Hyde Pierce say utter
Speaker 1: the words Seattle and they're like, now, hold on a second.
Speaker 1: We've got to get this guy in a Seattle based
Speaker 1: piece of media, and that's why he won all those Emmy's. Yeah,
Speaker 1: good theory, thank you. Okay. So we cut to eighteen
Speaker 1: months later, we are in Baltimore. We meet Annie, that's
Speaker 1: Meg Ryan's character. Also Tom Hanks is His character's name
Speaker 1: is Sam, so probably going to call him Tom Hanks.
Speaker 1: So Annie ak Meg Ryan has just gotten engaged to Walter.
Speaker 1: That's built maman. But he is a dweeb who is
Speaker 1: allergic to everything, so we don't like him. We give
Speaker 1: we can get into this Nora Fron school of man
Speaker 1: who is addicted to you and faithful to you above
Speaker 1: all others. Yet he has an allergy is repulsive. Oh no,
Speaker 1: he's into a roma therapy. Dear Lord, our bedroom is
Speaker 1: so moist at night, at comfortable, it smells like lavender.
Speaker 1: I need to divorce this man, this sexy man who
Speaker 1: doesn't care when I'm essentially cheating on him. She is
Speaker 1: driving in her car and she's flipping through the radio
Speaker 1: and she hears a kid she's yelling. She's yelling at
Speaker 1: the radio. Oh true, Yeah, She's like, better change the channel, Like,
Speaker 1: what is who's the sound guy on this There's no
Speaker 1: rhythm in this movie. If you watch The Christmas Care
Speaker 1: because I was literally watching it before it came here,
Speaker 1: and she does not sound like she's ever saying a
Speaker 1: Christmas carol before. She's like ging tone deaf Meg Ryan, Well,
Speaker 1: she's if she's yelling at radio, she's kind of like us,
Speaker 1: like we're always, you know, criticizing media. So she sucks
Speaker 1: in this movie though, and we're cool good yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So she's driving in a car, she is listening to
Speaker 1: the radio and she here's a kid call into a
Speaker 1: radio show. This kid being Jonah Sam's son, and he
Speaker 1: speaks with Dr Marcia who's like an advice radio host person,
Speaker 1: and he's like, my Christmas wish is for my dad
Speaker 1: to have a new his wife wife. So then Jonah
Speaker 1: puts his dad on the phone and they talked to
Speaker 1: Dr Marcia about his wife. Yeah. But then also like
Speaker 1: Tom Hanks is back and forth in this movie, and
Speaker 1: like he's either very endearing on the radio or yelling
Speaker 1: at his son on the radio, which is like read
Speaker 1: the room, dumbass, Like why are you yelling at your
Speaker 1: son on national radio. It doesn't stop like two thousand
Speaker 1: women from being like he seems like the greatest I
Speaker 1: in the world. I mean, speaks to their judgment of character,
Speaker 1: because Jesus Christ, he's yelling at his son the whole
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get your David. He's so dreamy. So he's
Speaker 1: talking to the lady and he's like, I can't sleep
Speaker 1: at night. I am sleepless. I live in Seattle. And
Speaker 1: that's where we get the Dr Marcia. Annie, who is listening,
Speaker 1: is like, Wow, this guy seems nice. She's like she
Speaker 1: as wrecks her car. She says like three or four
Speaker 1: words at the same time as him, and she thinks
Speaker 1: he's kids met like this whole movie is like, is
Speaker 1: love connected to the power of coincidence? And that is
Speaker 1: I'm just like, no, it's it's much in the same
Speaker 1: way that like, it's the least common denominator of things
Speaker 1: happening in the world. It's like if you pick up
Speaker 1: a paper clip and you think somewhere else in the world,
Speaker 1: somebody's picking up a paper clip, and I'm like, I'm
Speaker 1: supposed to be with that person. It's just such a
Speaker 1: low bar for connection in the world. It's like Magrin,
Speaker 1: if you want to break up with Bill Palman, many
Speaker 1: people would be honored to have him, So just break
Speaker 1: up with him, not go through this insane Oh god,
Speaker 1: I can't wait to apply the bush Em test to
Speaker 1: this movie. Although in this case it's a female character,
Speaker 1: I's gonna call it the Stevia. Stevie is still a
Speaker 1: woman's name, so you could be this. It's going to
Speaker 1: be the Stevie Stevia because it's a what is it.
Speaker 1: It's a sugar substitute. Okay, I don't know, I might
Speaker 1: be poisoned. Who knows. So she's like, yeah, this guy
Speaker 1: seems great, and then she goes into a diner and
Speaker 1: they're all like Wow, he seems right. And then there
Speaker 1: are like many women calling into the radio show and
Speaker 1: they're like, wow, he seems great. And then she gets
Speaker 1: very emotionally invested in this story his story, which is
Speaker 1: not interesting. It's like pretty normal. He's yeah, he's a
Speaker 1: grieving husband who is not dealing with it well via
Speaker 1: screaming at his son all the time, So not inspiring,
Speaker 1: actually quite sad, and someone should call and be like,
Speaker 1: should be checking on the sun. Like right, I feel
Speaker 1: like if you play the movie Big before this, it
Speaker 1: feels like a weird sequel. Love this theory. And then like,
Speaker 1: except for the Zoltar things kind of like make sure
Speaker 1: my dad meet someone else they can kiss. This is
Speaker 1: a perfect fan theory. And she's a she's one of
Speaker 1: mcgriyan has one of the only jobs women are lawed
Speaker 1: to have in this genre, which is journalist. So she
Speaker 1: goes to work with her friend and colleague, Becky played
Speaker 1: by Rosie o'donnald, and everyone's like, you should turn this
Speaker 1: into a story. This is interesting. There's nothing happening in
Speaker 1: Baltimore right now. So she's like, yeah, this guy seems great.
Speaker 1: I'm going to write a story about him, and then meanwhile,
Speaker 1: Sam gets a bunch of letters from horny women who
Speaker 1: have heard his story and want to be his wife,
Speaker 1: and he's not interested in any of them. So then
Speaker 1: Annie goes to her brother Nile Crane a k a.
Speaker 1: David Hyde Peers. There's not really much to talk about
Speaker 1: Niles's character, so I'll just say here this character's office
Speaker 1: that she goes into at some point, what is his job?
Speaker 1: Because there's so many wild pis in his office while
Speaker 1: he's like love is a construct, but he there's an
Speaker 1: oversized typewriter. What says there? There's just a piano and
Speaker 1: a harp. There's a large harp, There's there's a grandma phone.
Speaker 1: Like I mean that most of the time, when you
Speaker 1: have David Hyde Pierce in a movie or TV show,
Speaker 1: you just want him flustered in front of antiques, and
Speaker 1: this movie delivers on every level. David Hyde Pierce is
Speaker 1: in just a room full of Central Casting antiques, and
Speaker 1: he's all like, I'm having these fantasies about this guy
Speaker 1: who lives in Seattle who I've never met. I'm like
Speaker 1: questioning whether or not I want to marry Bill Pullman,
Speaker 1: and Niles is just like, do whatever you want love
Speaker 1: is a lie and she's like, Okay, you're right, I
Speaker 1: just have cold feet and I'm gonna move on. But
Speaker 1: the fact that he's like love is a lie and
Speaker 1: she's like, Okay, I will get married. Like. Meanwhile, Sam
Speaker 1: is talking to his friend I think his name is
Speaker 1: Jay Rob Reiner, and Rob Reiner is encouraging him him
Speaker 1: to like get back out into the dating. Yeah. He's like,
Speaker 1: you've got a nice butt, Tom Hanks, and and they're
Speaker 1: talking about dating and how like, you know, Sam should
Speaker 1: get back out there, but it's been so long since
Speaker 1: he's dated he doesn't know this like changing landscape. And
Speaker 1: then Rob Briners are like, well, there's this decorator woman, Victoria.
Speaker 1: You should ask her out, so he does. Meanwhile, this
Speaker 1: is where it gets really fun. Annie starts to cyberstock
Speaker 1: and then really stock Sam, which is ten times it's
Speaker 1: hard to do in the sere stalking a special a
Speaker 1: lot of large hardware. So I will say there's more
Speaker 1: female hacking in this movie. In the nineties. There is
Speaker 1: nobody says I'm in which I was going to say,
Speaker 1: representation wise is piss poor for the hackers. She needs
Speaker 1: to say she dares well she's in, is she not?
Speaker 1: That's a consent thing. You gotta say it. First of all,
Speaker 1: Hacker should have designy to computers. May I enter, and
Speaker 1: if the computer enthusiastically consents, they can say I'm in. Well,
Speaker 1: it acted like it was like print yes or her factors.
Speaker 1: I think we've all we've all met somebody off a
Speaker 1: Craigslist and gone, what's your factors? So Annie is like,
Speaker 1: I can't get this guy out of my mind, and
Speaker 1: she writes him a letter to both Sam and Jonah
Speaker 1: and she's like, hey, let's meet on Valentine's Day in
Speaker 1: New York City at the Empire's Day Building. On the
Speaker 1: top of it, she proposes the third act of the
Speaker 1: movie Yes, And then Jonah reads a letter and he's like, wow,
Speaker 1: I really like the sound of her. But Sam is like,
Speaker 1: but Rosie o'donald sends it. Meg Ryan's like, right, because
Speaker 1: it's scary. Right, we've all written a scary letter and
Speaker 1: then not sent it. That's relatable. I've done that many times.
Speaker 1: That's the whole premise of To All the Boys I've
Speaker 1: Loved Before. Everyone's written a scary letter and then read
Speaker 1: it back and then been like, hold on, have I
Speaker 1: become a person I hate. But Rosie o'donald sends Rosio
Speaker 1: donald sends it, and then Sam reads it, but he
Speaker 1: dismisses her as a romantic option because she lives in
Speaker 1: Baltimore and it's too far away from Seattle. Out of
Speaker 1: all the many examples there are to reject her as
Speaker 1: a romantic option in that letter, he chooses distance. Well,
Speaker 1: he doesn't know that she is stalking him, which she
Speaker 1: starts to really double down on because first of all,
Speaker 1: she hires a detective, very unsubtle detective, yeah, to like
Speaker 1: take photos of him and like spy on him on
Speaker 1: his date with Victoria. So Sam starts dating Victoria, which
Speaker 1: upsets Jonah because he's all about your new his wife
Speaker 1: should be Annie, this random lady who I read a
Speaker 1: terrifying letter from, like says, oh my god. Oh but
Speaker 1: and and also the reason we're not supposed to like
Speaker 1: Victoria is because she laughs. Yeah, she has a sense
Speaker 1: of humor. She is too expressive, and Jonah likes his
Speaker 1: mother's silent and meg Ryan Again, when you see the
Speaker 1: private detective like lean over the balcony at them, and
Speaker 1: he's like zooming in the cameras so loud it sounds
Speaker 1: like a car back ago. It's like and also that
Speaker 1: shot zooming in. Tom Hanks is acting wild on this
Speaker 1: first day. He's like moving his head around. It's like,
Speaker 1: what are you talking about? And then he feeds her,
Speaker 1: which you're like, okay, okay, setting a weird president for
Speaker 1: this relationship. Everything about that reads like a child in
Speaker 1: a man's body. Yes, right, he wouldn't know a grown woman. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this is this is a good theory. If someone tried
Speaker 1: to fade me on a first date, I would commit
Speaker 1: arson be very upset. So meanwhile, Annie is like, well,
Speaker 1: if I'm going to write this story that I think
Speaker 1: is interesting, I better go to Seattle. So she this
Speaker 1: is funding from work, I guess. And then she's getting
Speaker 1: off her plane at the airport, just as coincidentally, Sam
Speaker 1: is seeing off Victoria for a trip that she's going on.
Speaker 1: And so Sam sees Annie and he's like, hubba, hubba,
Speaker 1: who is that? And then Annie proceeds to follow him
Speaker 1: to the beach, follow him to another beach, spy on him,
Speaker 1: lurk around standing house. She has found out his address.
Speaker 1: She goes to his house and then sees him like
Speaker 1: playing with his son, and then she's like, what a
Speaker 1: nice guy. I love him. She's too far away to
Speaker 1: see that Tom Hanks is probably yelling at that's what's
Speaker 1: making the boat show. And then they do come face
Speaker 1: to face and they say hello to each other, but
Speaker 1: she has just seen him be really excited to see
Speaker 1: his friends. Susie played by Rita Wilson, Tom Hanks's real
Speaker 1: life his wife and then his sister and not no,
Speaker 1: I'm not saying his wife is his sister. Oh my god.
Speaker 1: Isn't Susy supposed to be his sister or maybe his friends.
Speaker 1: I think he's supposed to be sister. I didn't realize that,
Speaker 1: and that's why it's like double ridiculous. And it's like
Speaker 1: you thought his sister was his wife. But but it
Speaker 1: also like he does hug her like it's his wife, yes,
Speaker 1: and that's why Annie is confused. So she's like, oh, man,
Speaker 1: he's got a girlfriend. I'm just gonna go back to
Speaker 1: Baltimore and forget all about this Sleepless in Seattle. But
Speaker 1: then Jonah buys a flight to New York with the
Speaker 1: help of tiny Gabby Hoffman, and he goes to the
Speaker 1: Empire State Building to look for Annie and like waits around,
Speaker 1: and then Sam realizes that his son is missing because
Speaker 1: he's a bad father and he does not keepings like
Speaker 1: I'm yelling and no one is crying. He is my son.
Speaker 1: This is how I find out if my son's homes.
Speaker 1: You let me down. That's sun sonar. So he goes
Speaker 1: chasing after him, goes to New York City. Meanwhile, Annie
Speaker 1: and Walter are having like Valentine's dinner and she's just like,
Speaker 1: we gotta break up because you have allergies and and
Speaker 1: he's like okay, he's so chill about so he takes it.
Speaker 1: I'm like, what is going on with Bill Palm? It's
Speaker 1: his allergy medication. It's affecting his emotional response. So then
Speaker 1: she goes to the Empire State Building and then Sam
Speaker 1: is arriving there around the same time to get Jonah,
Speaker 1: but they like just miss each other. But wait, Jonah
Speaker 1: left his backpack, so he and Sam go back and
Speaker 1: then they see Annie rand M lady who could be anyone,
Speaker 1: but they're like, are you Annie, and she's like yeah,
Speaker 1: So then they hold hands and are in love, and
Speaker 1: then there's a bad c g I shot of the
Speaker 1: Empire staple day, it's so bad, it's really funny. And
Speaker 1: then we're like, and that is sleepless in Seattle. It
Speaker 1: ends in New York. Why couldn't they have chosen a
Speaker 1: building in Seattle is a good question. Yea, the space Needle. Realistically,
Speaker 1: this movie would have ended with Jonah being kidnapped and
Speaker 1: Tom Hanks living out the rest of his days wishing
Speaker 1: he hadn't yelled at his son so much. This was
Speaker 1: more of a take into the situation than anything. But okay,
Speaker 1: so here's the thing with this movie. It's an all
Speaker 1: female reboot of The Stalking Trip. I think it's great. Yes,
Speaker 1: it feels like a pretty standard you know, nineties rom com,
Speaker 1: you know, upon first glance, but with with a few exceptions.
Speaker 1: Which is that unlike a lot of movies where a
Speaker 1: woman feels like she needs a man to feel complete
Speaker 1: or other people are telling her that she needs a
Speaker 1: man to be complete, this right, well, this movie is
Speaker 1: about a boy telling a man that he needs a wife.
Speaker 1: So that's like sort of a subversion of I mean,
Speaker 1: in in in Jona's case, it's a cry for help
Speaker 1: because he's like, my dad, can we get anyone else
Speaker 1: in this house? Like that? Used to me what he's asking,
Speaker 1: did y'all have his much fun with how that kid
Speaker 1: is like his roommate and every Nora f from maybe
Speaker 1: one of the Nora Front troupes that is so annoying
Speaker 1: and it's like just a little wise child trope. I'm
Speaker 1: so am like this kid would be sneezing on things,
Speaker 1: he would be sticky, right. There are a number of
Speaker 1: scenes where he's like, yeah, women scratch up men's backs
Speaker 1: during sex. I've seen it on cable and then and
Speaker 1: the message of that is like, whoa Nora f Fron
Speaker 1: just roasted cable? You're like And then Tom Hanks is
Speaker 1: like mumbling to himself and he's like, I've fun six, no,
Speaker 1: seven women in college and then he sees it as
Speaker 1: Sanders right there and he's like, how long have you
Speaker 1: been there? And he's like, I've heard you had sex
Speaker 1: with seven women and he's like it was eight. Actually
Speaker 1: I remembered another one. So you screaming about all the
Speaker 1: women's college. Also, he has that a whole storyline is like, son,
Speaker 1: get out of my way so I can fuck someone.
Speaker 1: He's so annoyed with his son. He's like son, it's
Speaker 1: almost like he could set up boundary. He makes no effort. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean to like, there's nothing good about this movie,
Speaker 1: but also there's everything good about this So it's it's confusing,
Speaker 1: but that it's like, we do get to see a
Speaker 1: male character grieve to some extent. The way he grieves
Speaker 1: is very toxic and mostly by yelling at his son um.
Speaker 1: There is at least a grieving narrative. I feel like
Speaker 1: a lot of the time men are not like part
Speaker 1: of word to believe the reason that women are attracted
Speaker 1: to him is because he is grieving his wife at all. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Like she's like, oh, I've got to be with him.
Speaker 1: If I eyed, he'd be piste. So the real big subversion,
Speaker 1: the actual huge subversion of this movie when it comes
Speaker 1: to like, you know, the romcom genre, is that it's
Speaker 1: the woman stalking the man this time, which we've painted
Speaker 1: at already. But do not stalk, Just do not unless
Speaker 1: it's just on Instagram on a fake account that you
Speaker 1: have and then stuck away. Baby sixty seven. I just
Speaker 1: made like a quick list of all the things that
Speaker 1: she does. She calls around to figure out how to
Speaker 1: get in touch with the radio show. Then she calls
Speaker 1: the radio show to get his phone number. She calls
Speaker 1: his phone number, it gets his last name, does a
Speaker 1: very old Google search slash like hacker thing to search
Speaker 1: for him, figures out that he's an architect because computer
Speaker 1: it right, and then hires someone to do the background
Speaker 1: check and to take photos of him. Then she flies
Speaker 1: to Seattle, shows up at his house. He's not there.
Speaker 1: She follows him on his boat, lurks around nearby, you know,
Speaker 1: watches him a day passes, does the exact same thing
Speaker 1: where she follows him on a boat. So what I'm
Speaker 1: hearing is she has a lot of agency, so it's
Speaker 1: very independent. She's a very aspective character. Yeah, and and
Speaker 1: and the subtext to why women are lusting after Tom Hanks,
Speaker 1: a man who is truly doing the bare minimum of
Speaker 1: grieving his wife, is that women. I mean, there's this
Speaker 1: whole sub text to this movie that women would do
Speaker 1: anything to be shown genuine love from a man. Because
Speaker 1: it's like we see even though Meg Ryan's character is
Speaker 1: receiving that for most of the movie, and then she's like, nah,
Speaker 1: I want a man, I know, yells at his son. Right.
Speaker 1: The idea is that like all women, no matter what
Speaker 1: their circumstances are are just like desperate and like horny
Speaker 1: and just like need a man that they'll like send
Speaker 1: letters to a man they've never met. Something that has
Speaker 1: brought up a lot in this movie, and I wanted
Speaker 1: to give some hot context for us, is there is
Speaker 1: a statistic that has cited several points in this movie,
Speaker 1: uh saying that you know, it's easier to get killed
Speaker 1: by a terrorist and get married after forty So does
Speaker 1: anyone know the backstory for this? Oh? Mensa? All right?
Speaker 1: So Nora, So this was a story that was published
Speaker 1: in Newsweek magazine, where Nora Ffron worked for a long
Speaker 1: time and successfully sued at one point because they were sexist,
Speaker 1: which there is a terrible Amazon Prime series about if
Speaker 1: anyone cares. But there was a cover story that I
Speaker 1: believe is in the mid seventies published in Newsweek that
Speaker 1: I think Nora Efron is trying to comment on the
Speaker 1: in this movie because she hates Newsweek magazine because she
Speaker 1: sued them. But they published a cover story about how
Speaker 1: women over forty were fucked like that was what the
Speaker 1: story was. It was all false statistics. There was like
Speaker 1: Newsweek later had to retract the story, but even so
Speaker 1: because the story came out and came out at a
Speaker 1: time where apparently everyone was reading Newsweek, there were charts.
Speaker 1: It was written by wait for it all men, and
Speaker 1: it was saying that like single women after a certain
Speaker 1: point in their life just basically become defunct. And there
Speaker 1: was this chart that said, like, you're more likely for
Speaker 1: this to happen, You're more likely for this to happen,
Speaker 1: and the more likely to be killed by a terrorist
Speaker 1: thing was the thing everyone remembered. So what Nora Fron
Speaker 1: is trying to do is roast Newsweek Because Nora Fron,
Speaker 1: if you're a fan of hers, is notoriously very petty,
Speaker 1: which is why I love her. If you watch if
Speaker 1: you learn anything about her, and then watch one of
Speaker 1: her movies, you're like, there she goes again. She can't
Speaker 1: let anything go, which I can relate with um in
Speaker 1: in any case. That's why that is like cited in
Speaker 1: this script over and over, even though they don't make
Speaker 1: that clear. It's weird because it's like we first hear
Speaker 1: that statistics said by Meg Ryan's male co workers, right,
Speaker 1: and then Megrian every time it said. The woman in
Speaker 1: this scene says that's not true because they're supposed to
Speaker 1: be Nora Ffron's pettiness, and they're right, it's not true.
Speaker 1: But I feel like there's a lot of there's a
Speaker 1: few different male characters written into this script that are
Speaker 1: like cartoonishly misogynist so that Meg Ryan will look chill,
Speaker 1: which she's not. Yeah, I feel like the movie makes
Speaker 1: an attempt to show any man who says this statistic
Speaker 1: to show them to be stupid, stupid, you know, and
Speaker 1: like Victor Garber, who Titanic Connection is so handsome, well,
Speaker 1: like Rerida Wilson's character is like, that's not true. That's statistic,
Speaker 1: it is not true, and then he's just like yeah, okay.
Speaker 1: And my read was like the movie is trying to
Speaker 1: make them seem like idiot assholes, but I don't know,
Speaker 1: it felt like it wasn't because even so, like every
Speaker 1: time it's employed, the female character is like, that's not true,
Speaker 1: but she's still made out to look ridiculous because the
Speaker 1: scene where Rita Wilson's like, that's not true, she's still
Speaker 1: sobbing about what sounds like a very troubling movie. Right, Yeah, Yeah,
Speaker 1: the men there may just seem like idiots, but at
Speaker 1: the same time, the women in the movie are all
Speaker 1: portrayed to be like, I need love from a man,
Speaker 1: or more love from a man, because we've got Meg
Speaker 1: Ryan's character, who is in a committed relationship that seems
Speaker 1: to be caring, but then she's like, but he's not
Speaker 1: good enough, and I need more romance from God. The
Speaker 1: in most Nora Ron movies, her vibe is very much like,
Speaker 1: I'm going to make men and women equally irrational and
Speaker 1: neurotic and impossible to understand their rationale for everything, And
Speaker 1: that's true. Equality is everyone's out of their minds. That's true.
Speaker 1: Everyone's yelling at their sun. Just Tom Hanks is yelling
Speaker 1: at his son. Okay, he's since fence time yelling at hair.
Speaker 1: It suns a roommate. Son is not his son. It's
Speaker 1: not his forty son is forty. They're like sitting in
Speaker 1: an egg shaped you're listening to the Beatles back courts.
Speaker 1: Do you like glance over most of the things that
Speaker 1: like a fifty year old would do with the person
Speaker 1: he met from a record store, because that's a I
Speaker 1: do like that Jonah's best friend is a girl, because
Speaker 1: I feel like there's not that much representation on screen
Speaker 1: of like you know, a young boy and young girl
Speaker 1: being friends and she and she also is like smart
Speaker 1: and you know, although she also sobs at this this
Speaker 1: troubling movie, she's she's a hacker as well. Yeah, where
Speaker 1: she and she knows how to get the tickets. She's
Speaker 1: basically like ninety three StubHub like she knows how to
Speaker 1: get the tickets and how to get him on the plane,
Speaker 1: and she sets up the whole itinerary and then she's like, okay,
Speaker 1: time to die probably like and then she withholds information
Speaker 1: about where he is so that he certainly does. But
Speaker 1: the movie has a happy ending. One of the big
Speaker 1: things I noticed about this movie is that the characters
Speaker 1: within Sleepless in Seattle are very influenced by other media
Speaker 1: and other movies. And you know, the carry Grant version
Speaker 1: of a fair Remember gets referenced a lot. Annie says
Speaker 1: something like, you know, she's watching it and she's like,
Speaker 1: those were the days when people knew how to be
Speaker 1: in love. And Rosier Donald's like, you're you're crazy. It's
Speaker 1: a movie. Like that's your problem. You don't want to
Speaker 1: be in love. You want to be in love in
Speaker 1: a movie. But this movie Sleep listens Seattle is still
Speaker 1: it's like the exact same thing. It's still like a
Speaker 1: romance movie where you're all we're all tricked into thinking
Speaker 1: that love is real watching this dark Caitlin, Oh my god,
Speaker 1: so unfair to Remember? I did it deep dive on
Speaker 1: So when A Fair to Remember is an important part
Speaker 1: of this movie. It's like where the construct of the empire,
Speaker 1: state building and the Valentine state comes from. But also
Speaker 1: like it turns out there's a lot of stuff that's
Speaker 1: from the movie, including like somebody being creepy and taking
Speaker 1: pictures of them. It doesn't pass the back tail test.
Speaker 1: Surprise from doesn't pass the backdel test, and it's made.
Speaker 1: It's actually a remake of another movie called Love Affair
Speaker 1: thirty nine. Okay, so we got it's a star is
Speaker 1: born basically just that he's remaking it. But here's the
Speaker 1: important part. So the important part is in the movie,
Speaker 1: the women to cry over it, and then the men
Speaker 1: mock the women for crying over the movie and A
Speaker 1: Fair to Remember. I get teary eyed and fake upset
Speaker 1: about the movie. Dirty dozen. Yes, So I take hormones
Speaker 1: and there becomes a period between my dosages of hormones
Speaker 1: when I have the most amount of testosterone. So I'm
Speaker 1: manned up. I had a beer, I watched football, I
Speaker 1: ate a pizza. Then I watched Dirty Dusn't and it
Speaker 1: was all right, yeah, this is gonna be another's chuck.
Speaker 1: It doesn't pass to me. I know it doesn't. Not
Speaker 1: all women. The longest a woman's on screen is someone
Speaker 1: getting stabbed. Cool, cool, cool, you know, feminist text. But
Speaker 1: then to try and again with a hypothesis. I had
Speaker 1: my dosage of estrogen, and then I watched an Affair
Speaker 1: to Remember, okay, and I think I timed it wrong.
Speaker 1: It just like put me to sleep. It was just
Speaker 1: there's a couple kind of there's a couple like musical numbers.
Speaker 1: There's musical numbers and all the other Affair to Remember
Speaker 1: remakes and it's quasi racist. But the only other thing
Speaker 1: that you know is there's another remake of an Affair
Speaker 1: to Remember that's in Indian one. So there's a Ballywood
Speaker 1: version of an Affair to Remember called Man and that
Speaker 1: was three hours long. I watched that one sober. It
Speaker 1: has four dance numbers. All good, it passed the back.
Speaker 1: But then then I have a new test, which is
Speaker 1: finding the movies that are three hours long but still
Speaker 1: somehow don't pass the back like there are so there
Speaker 1: are more than a few. But I was, yeah, that's
Speaker 1: so that was my research. Oh my god, thank you
Speaker 1: so and a fair Remember did not make you cry
Speaker 1: like it does all of the women in this movie.
Speaker 1: You know, I mistimed it because I ended up like
Speaker 1: watching My roommates were watching like Stephen Universe the next day,
Speaker 1: and I was like in tears, like I was in
Speaker 1: I get in tears over the most ridiculous things, like
Speaker 1: when I have a head full of Astarton, thank you
Speaker 1: for the steep dive that you have. This this is why,
Speaker 1: this is why this didn't help you at all. No,
Speaker 1: this is this is very good context for the conversation
Speaker 1: we're gonna have is content content content. I loved it.
Speaker 1: I just don't understand in movies so often that are
Speaker 1: like referencing older movies, they kind of keep continually saying
Speaker 1: like this is when love was real, back when women
Speaker 1: couldn't vote, Like they're like, it's like we see all
Speaker 1: these female characters longing for a time when they had
Speaker 1: less rites, and and then this movie kind of reinforces
Speaker 1: the idea that like, there are certain movies that are
Speaker 1: women's movies, and there are certain movies the guys movies,
Speaker 1: because like the women are all crying over, including like
Speaker 1: Cabby Hoffman are crying over and a fair to remember,
Speaker 1: the men are making fun of them. They're saying dirty
Speaker 1: doesen't is what I like to watch, Like dirty Doesn't?
Speaker 1: Incoming my Name is Victor Garber. It was like Victor
Speaker 1: Garber is this is the only role I've ever seen him?
Speaker 1: And then I was like, oh, how could you? Like?
Speaker 1: He legally blonde? What he's hot in the movie though,
Speaker 1: it's like he's not, so I forgive anything. Um. In
Speaker 1: this movie he was wearing an outfit that no I was.
Speaker 1: I was like, I could take your leave this look,
Speaker 1: and he was being horrible. So I did like the
Speaker 1: constant acronyms from the kids, like h why didn't that stick?
Speaker 1: And then there's the weird part where like Jonah is
Speaker 1: talking about reincarnation and the possibility reincarnation and how he
Speaker 1: could be reincarnated from another another plane, like this kid
Speaker 1: is on mushrooms. He's listening to Penles records backwards and
Speaker 1: talking about reincarnation. It's it's probably that we like find
Speaker 1: out that he's thirty six and adopted and we're just
Speaker 1: seeing him from an outside person. One more thing where
Speaker 1: there is a character is influenced by movie is Sam
Speaker 1: talks about fatal Attraction and how it scared the ship
Speaker 1: out of him. He's like scared the shot out of
Speaker 1: me and every man in America, and he cites that
Speaker 1: as a reason to not go and meet Annie in
Speaker 1: New York City, which doesn't make sense because it has
Speaker 1: nothing to do with fatal attraction. And you can literally
Speaker 1: it was just so dumb of like a line that
Speaker 1: it's like remember that movie that's semi recent, and so
Speaker 1: the movie practically like pauses for laughs. Everyone could be
Speaker 1: like fatal attraction, women who want careers are scary, like um,
Speaker 1: but it has nothing to do with fatal attraction. It's
Speaker 1: the same punchline that's like this is at a time
Speaker 1: when the crying game is still used as a punch
Speaker 1: line for reveal about a trans Yeah, like this is
Speaker 1: this is a big time like Craig game and like
Speaker 1: we're supposed to laugh. There were so many it was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: there were so many like transplanic movies from the like uh,
Speaker 1: silence of the Lambs, and then earlier was Sleepaway Camp.
Speaker 1: Like there's a line where Rosie O'Donnell says the falling
Speaker 1: the guy could be a crackhead, a transvestay. Yeah, that'd
Speaker 1: be trouble. Oh no, there's more work to do. Yeah.
Speaker 1: This is still in the middle of like trans women
Speaker 1: are dangerous. This is like the hot part of the nineties. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we're now we're in danger. How progressive can we talk
Speaker 1: about the map graphic that seems to happen. It's like
Speaker 1: you can go to the you can go to the
Speaker 1: bathroom and then come back. I know it's still going across.
Speaker 1: I like I think that that was like, first of all,
Speaker 1: this movie, it does take place in too many things,
Speaker 1: so I found it helpful. Um, and I kind of
Speaker 1: like when movies are like, let's assume everyone seeing this
Speaker 1: movie is an absolute idiot and they like can't remember
Speaker 1: that because I am that viewer and it was helpful
Speaker 1: for me. I don't know how how worth it is
Speaker 1: to talk about this, but there is discussion of like
Speaker 1: the changing landscape of dating that the Sam character has
Speaker 1: to deal with, because like Tom Hanks and Rob Brenner's
Speaker 1: characters are talking about you know, like Sam's got to
Speaker 1: get back out there. Boys are getting some bruise, and
Speaker 1: they're talking about it's there is a moment where we
Speaker 1: we alluded to this earlier, but they talk about Tom
Speaker 1: Hanks's but and I feel like a lot of movies would,
Speaker 1: like especially from this era, would have taken that opportunity
Speaker 1: to do like no homo, I don't know if you're
Speaker 1: attractive or not, like but Rob Briners like, I think
Speaker 1: it's a good butt and say thanks. I thought that
Speaker 1: was genuinely cute. Even upon rewatching, I thought it was
Speaker 1: very cute. It was like, all right, you get me right,
Speaker 1: But then Rob Brener is like, well, nowadays you split
Speaker 1: the check with your day. And then Sam's like, I
Speaker 1: don't think I could ever let a woman pay for dinner.
Speaker 1: So he is not a feminist icon. But also if
Speaker 1: a man is like that, like take his money you like,
Speaker 1: so like if a guy gets all fucking scary white
Speaker 1: and I was like no, but Tom I was like,
Speaker 1: all right, man, I will get more like dipshit. And
Speaker 1: then he works up the nerve to call Victoria, who
Speaker 1: is called a hoe in this movie, like time like
Speaker 1: treated so terrible. She did nothing wrong. No, she did
Speaker 1: is enjoy herself. She just giggled here and there when
Speaker 1: Tom Hanks made a goof It's it's the same like treatment.
Speaker 1: If you like go back and watch an episode at Steinfeld,
Speaker 1: You're like, that person just has one thing that makes
Speaker 1: them quirky and they're exaggerate so much as a reason
Speaker 1: to like break up with that. Yeah, And that's like
Speaker 1: one of the things that I saw that Tom Hanks
Speaker 1: and Meg Ryan's character actually had in common is that
Speaker 1: they would write off what seems like a positive relationship
Speaker 1: based on one thing such as laughing or allergies. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, they deserve each other. They're horrible. They're
Speaker 1: both basically George Costanza. Yes, like I'm fine sleeping in
Speaker 1: a room with a humidifier. That's kind, that can be
Speaker 1: rather nice. Who doesn't like a rainforest? Yeah? If I
Speaker 1: feel I feel for Victoria in this movie, because she
Speaker 1: truly seems like she really likes him. For quite some time,
Speaker 1: it seems like he likes her as well. But it's
Speaker 1: like Jonah just goes rogue, like he's just he hates her.
Speaker 1: It is so unclear. He just is like, no, I
Speaker 1: want scary lady. Now and like he just goes totally rogue.
Speaker 1: He's on mushrooms. Then the kid goes full in so
Speaker 1: because then whenever he does work up the nerve to
Speaker 1: call Victoria and like ask her out that phone conversation
Speaker 1: we only hear sam side of it, but it's clear
Speaker 1: that like she's calling all the shots, like she's deciding
Speaker 1: where to go to dinner, what time they're gonna go,
Speaker 1: they're going to meet there, rather than like him picking
Speaker 1: her up, and like her being just a decisive woman
Speaker 1: who knows what she wants is framed by the movie
Speaker 1: is being like, oh, no, she's scary and weird, so
Speaker 1: I didn't like to but she Yeah, It's like she's
Speaker 1: truly just out here trying to have a job in
Speaker 1: a relationship. Okay, leave Victoria alone. And she says like,
Speaker 1: I'm so glad you called me. I thought night you
Speaker 1: were never going to call. And it's like, I call him.
Speaker 1: I hope she and Bill Pullman met each other, because
Speaker 1: that's a lovely story, isn't me? Or is Bill Pullman
Speaker 1: looked like face from the A team for most of them?
Speaker 1: Don't I don't know? I this is peek Bill Pullman
Speaker 1: for metely. I mean, he's firing on all cylinders here.
Speaker 1: He's about to reach week Bill Pullman, which canonically is
Speaker 1: Daddy and Casper, that is he his character. I it
Speaker 1: sucks because he truly did nothing wrong, but it's just
Speaker 1: like any I don't know. In some ways, I feel
Speaker 1: like it's punishing him for any sort of gentleness and
Speaker 1: like making out gentleness and a man to be emasculating
Speaker 1: and a weakness. And something that Meg Ryan seems to
Speaker 1: find completely repulsive is that when he is affectionate towards her,
Speaker 1: she's like, oh, and she gets in the closet with
Speaker 1: her radio and or you know, the fact that he
Speaker 1: has any illness makes her you know, and and I
Speaker 1: don't know. It's it's just so bizarre the way this
Speaker 1: character is treated. But Victoria's treated much the same way
Speaker 1: of like she's doing nothing wrong. She seems to be
Speaker 1: invested in the relationship, and they're just both treated like dogshit.
Speaker 1: But the thing that Bill Pullman's character is that scene
Speaker 1: at the end where Meg Ryan, can you imagine someone
Speaker 1: you are about to marry? Sits you down and says, okay,
Speaker 1: So there's this radio show on Valentine's day. It's literally
Speaker 1: like if someone in this audience, like if there's a
Speaker 1: couple here who's about to get married, and then one
Speaker 1: of you sat the other one down, and it was like,
Speaker 1: so there's this podcast called the Backdoorcast. I was gonna
Speaker 1: update it further. It's like, so I met somebody on
Speaker 1: Snapchat or Okay, It's like, okay, if I say I'm
Speaker 1: getting married, I sit the person I'm getting married down
Speaker 1: and I'm like, listen, I heard this show called The
Speaker 1: Joe Rogan Experience, and I have to marry Joe Rogan
Speaker 1: today and and and my partner was like, I totally interested.
Speaker 1: We've already figured out the wedding favor is going to
Speaker 1: be a d MT. Yeah. His reaction is so accommodating.
Speaker 1: That is he on mushrooms. I just feel so badly
Speaker 1: for for him. There could be a super cut of
Speaker 1: all of the partners of the different main couples across
Speaker 1: these movies, just totally piecing out from the relationship totally amicably,
Speaker 1: and it was ridiculous. It's third different levels of like, no,
Speaker 1: go ahead, I just want you to be happy, like
Speaker 1: no one wants Meg Ryan to be happy. Alternative he
Speaker 1: like captured her and he's like, you're mine. No, No,
Speaker 1: I think the alternative is like, Okay, this fucking sucks.
Speaker 1: But if this is what you have to do, I
Speaker 1: guess fuck off. Like he could speak to her as
Speaker 1: if he were frustrated, but she's doing is obnoxious and unhinged.
Speaker 1: So there is a weird trope that I need. If
Speaker 1: you have more examples of this trope, please shout it out.
Speaker 1: But ghost of his Wife trope appears in this movie.
Speaker 1: It also happens in Casper with ghost Daddy Bill Pullman,
Speaker 1: the only person hotter in Caspar. Then Bull Pullman is
Speaker 1: Bill Pullman's ghost during the part where Bill Hallman's a ghost.
Speaker 1: But yeah, Tom Hanks's wife comes over. She's in a nightgown,
Speaker 1: she's got a glass of wine, like, and Tom Hanks
Speaker 1: is just like, I miss you, my wife, and she's
Speaker 1: like it's okay. But we agree that they're like in
Speaker 1: Seattle by that point, right, Yes, the ghost had to
Speaker 1: get on a plane, Like the ghost came with them,
Speaker 1: Like there's an old chest of she guided and you're like,
Speaker 1: I know this fella killed her. Well let's just keep
Speaker 1: it around. That was just like a weird extension of
Speaker 1: his wife. Trope is like she just came to deposit
Speaker 1: a piece of wisdom and to basically give him permission
Speaker 1: to fuck Meg Ryan at some point, um, which is
Speaker 1: you know, I mean she was already her headstone has
Speaker 1: already been yelled at by Tom hankson to add insult
Speaker 1: to injury, they got a flyer ghost out to Seattle
Speaker 1: to say it's okay to hook up with Meg Ryan.
Speaker 1: I don't find that trope to be that troubling. I
Speaker 1: just think it's bad writing. Yeah, sure, sure, but there
Speaker 1: are certainly more regressive tropes around. I think. I think
Speaker 1: it's um, it's it. I think it works in movies
Speaker 1: that are like super natural, I guess. But then again,
Speaker 1: like you end up with something where a wife has
Speaker 1: to die to be some sort of mechanism for the
Speaker 1: movie moving forward, like woman has to die. True, it's
Speaker 1: and and I mean Tom Hanks and Meg Ryan both
Speaker 1: need kind of just to continue acting as they're acting
Speaker 1: throughout the movie, which is irrationally. I feel like they
Speaker 1: add in characters to give them permission to act that way.
Speaker 1: I think Rosie o'donald's character is seems like that a lot,
Speaker 1: where sometimes Meg Ryan will call her and just be like,
Speaker 1: is what I'm doing unsafe and irrational? And there's like
Speaker 1: a scene for Rosie o'donald's like somehow no and Groads
Speaker 1: like sounds good. Hear that audience, it's fine. Click like
Speaker 1: it's just so fucking weak. I will say, Rosie o'donald
Speaker 1: is like she's almost cast like a quasi Ricky Lake
Speaker 1: in the role, and she nails Baltimore like that is
Speaker 1: a Baltimore attitude in a kind of curt way. And
Speaker 1: I give them props for that. But then again, like
Speaker 1: that newspaper would just be covering murders. There's more going
Speaker 1: on in Baltimore. No, No, there's a lonely man in Seattle. Sorry,
Speaker 1: this corpse just washed up in front of your house,
Speaker 1: because we've found corpses in front of our house. We're
Speaker 1: I've worked right there, and they would just like have
Speaker 1: to shut off our work because just find bodies, not
Speaker 1: not necessarily murders, just like you know, a corpse sure
Speaker 1: of course died of natural you know, a drug person
Speaker 1: falls in Yeah, I mean, as we know from the
Speaker 1: that corpse that washes up that was Robert Durst self
Speaker 1: defending himself. Yeah, you dismember your neighbors in self defense anyway.
Speaker 1: And then our other female character that we see semi
Speaker 1: frequently is Sam's sister, played by his wife, and we
Speaker 1: don't really know that much about her except that she
Speaker 1: I mean she sort of used as like an exposition
Speaker 1: machine basically to be like, hey, you should move to
Speaker 1: I don't know Seattle. I mean, she just sort of
Speaker 1: functions in relations. Yeah. The first thing that she says
Speaker 1: is here's how to make food because women, uh. And
Speaker 1: then later that long scene where she is recapping the
Speaker 1: movie of an Affair to Remember and crying during it.
Speaker 1: So at least I don't do that as I'm recapping
Speaker 1: movies on the podcast, but I am Victor garbering the
Speaker 1: whole time. Is there a movie you would cry as
Speaker 1: you recite back Paddington too? Maybe I'm just like an
Speaker 1: emotional robot, But describing a movie doesn't make me cry.
Speaker 1: Does that happen? Do people cry when you describe a movie?
Speaker 1: I don't think people describe movies to each other very much.
Speaker 1: I think we just do that. But I think that's
Speaker 1: one of that's one of the things that this movie,
Speaker 1: like women are just shown as being so emotional that
Speaker 1: like the thought of a romantic story will make you
Speaker 1: just cry for a while. Yeah, and that's stupid. Yeah so,
Speaker 1: but also I cry constantly at the drop of a
Speaker 1: hat about many things. However, the description of that movie
Speaker 1: sounds just like, oh, no, I will say. In the
Speaker 1: middle of mon the three hour Bollywood version essentially of
Speaker 1: this movie, there becomes a part where the female lead
Speaker 1: starts washing the feet of the grandmother in the temple,
Speaker 1: and uh, I got Syria eyed during that. Okay, that's
Speaker 1: that's where the two. I mean, crying during a movie
Speaker 1: I think is normal, But crying while describing yeah that
Speaker 1: I don't know. Not to shame anyone who does that,
Speaker 1: but I feel like that just doesn't happen very often.
Speaker 1: But all the women shown in this movie are constantly
Speaker 1: talking about and affair to remember, even like the the
Speaker 1: security guard at the end, it's like, oh, yeah, I'm
Speaker 1: at the Empire State Building and you're trying to go
Speaker 1: up to the roof, just like that movie. It's my
Speaker 1: wife's favorite, Like, yeah, you could have easily been like
Speaker 1: written at that so that he was his favorite of that. Nope,
Speaker 1: there are boy movies and there are girl movies. I mean, well, boys,
Speaker 1: as we all know, should be listening to Beatles records
Speaker 1: backwards and being yelled at by their fops. Do we
Speaker 1: have any other final thoughts? Uh no, this movie absolutely blows.
Speaker 1: Don't watch him? Should we take some questions comments from
Speaker 1: the crowd Q and went, oh yeah, come come on down,
Speaker 1: so that you're talking into my guest you. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: just wanted to mention my favorite scene in the movie
Speaker 1: where half the cast is yelling at Gabby Hoffman about
Speaker 1: where that annoying kid is and her father walks up
Speaker 1: and introduces himself, saying, this is your father speaking like
Speaker 1: explaining who he is to I just wanted to know
Speaker 1: your thoughts on that. I hope that that was them
Speaker 1: meeting for the first time. He's like, listen, I was
Speaker 1: called in after nine years. How old are those kids?
Speaker 1: Like eight? Nine? Yeah? Yeah, I think that that was
Speaker 1: them meeting Cannon. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yes, I thought it
Speaker 1: was interesting. I don't want to know your thoughts on
Speaker 1: this that the only attribute that the child Jonah gets
Speaker 1: to learn about his mom is that she could peel
Speaker 1: an apple, like in one whole strip, and that somehow
Speaker 1: is the like I don't know that was just weird.
Speaker 1: Is thank you for bringing that up, because that is
Speaker 1: first of all, so specific that hearing it said out loud,
Speaker 1: you're like you. And then, just to be sure, you
Speaker 1: also see Meg Ryan do it, and then you're like you,
Speaker 1: no one would do that you. Why is she so
Speaker 1: handy with a knife? Why it's like seeing this stalker
Speaker 1: character use a knife handily is like, yikes, that's like
Speaker 1: in all action movies when somebody's like peeling like an
Speaker 1: apple with a bowie knife, right, like that seems like
Speaker 1: it's an oh man when she's like listening to him
Speaker 1: on the radio, and it was like it's like she's
Speaker 1: thinking of that as like his skin. And she's crying
Speaker 1: during that scene too, because women be crying all the time,
Speaker 1: but not so hard they can't see their knife. Like
Speaker 1: when I thank you for that happen when I couldn't sleep,
Speaker 1: Mom would split wood with a hatchet. She showed then
Speaker 1: on your foot any other questions comments, Yeah, So I
Speaker 1: just need to get this off my chest because I'm
Speaker 1: super embarrassed about this. I've seen this movie once years ago.
Speaker 1: I remember nothing about it before coming to the show,
Speaker 1: but this was like my partner in my movie that
Speaker 1: we watched on our first date, and I guess we
Speaker 1: found this like romantic enough to like still be dating
Speaker 1: like four years later, but we started like, oh sleep
Speaker 1: List in Seattle, and I'm like, oh my god, brave
Speaker 1: for sharing. Let's applaud this bravery because thank you, thank
Speaker 1: you're here. Do you have any couple movies like the
Speaker 1: movies you have as a in your relationships or I
Speaker 1: think I've told this anecdote on the podcast before, but
Speaker 1: in one of my worst relationships ever, but it's started
Speaker 1: with the gentleman if you can call him that, okay.
Speaker 1: I whenever to his apartment. I was like nineteen or twenty,
Speaker 1: and he was just like, I love Drive. Ever seen it?
Speaker 1: And I was like no, and he was like, let's
Speaker 1: watch it. I have it in the DVD player already. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Drive cute up. And then we were watching it. I
Speaker 1: personally think that movie is a fucking drag. Was not
Speaker 1: enjoying it. And then he was just like, there's a
Speaker 1: scorpion jacket in the movie and he kept looking over.
Speaker 1: He's just like that jackets cool, right, And I was like,
Speaker 1: I guess twenty minutes later he was like, I have
Speaker 1: that check Okay, but that's also the jacket. They what
Speaker 1: is it is? Somebody helped me out here, he said,
Speaker 1: jacket also in a gay cruising movie. Yeah, it's a
Speaker 1: really famous jacket, like a scorpio rising jacket. I'm forgetting
Speaker 1: the name of it, but it's from a reference to something. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's a a cruise name jacket. Hell yeah. So he's like,
Speaker 1: I have the jacket. He pulls the jacket out of
Speaker 1: his closet and just leaves it next to me suggestively,
Speaker 1: and then twenty minutes later he's like, I've always wanted
Speaker 1: to make out while a girl's wearing that jacket, and
Speaker 1: then I did for three years. That's I'm a feminist.
Speaker 1: I've never been in a relationship, so I have no
Speaker 1: movies and I'm in a relationship with myself and our
Speaker 1: movie is Paddington. Yeah, oh, I know. I'm sorry. Do
Speaker 1: you think I didn't know Paddington two was better? I
Speaker 1: I still haven't seen Paddington. Caitlin made me watch it
Speaker 1: on Christmas. I saw the first one by myself and
Speaker 1: I enjoyed it. It's so I think we me and
Speaker 1: my partner ours is just the It's really just the
Speaker 1: seventh season of Simpsons, because you like, you have to decide,
Speaker 1: if you're in a long enough relationship, you have to
Speaker 1: decide which season of the Simpsons you agree is the best.
Speaker 1: I can tell you right now, it will help you.
Speaker 1: We've been together for seventeen years, so yeah, we find
Speaker 1: this season that we liked Season seven. Okay, beautiful, it's
Speaker 1: a beautiful love story. Gang. Does this movie pass the
Speaker 1: Betel test? Well? I there is a quick exchange towards
Speaker 1: the beginning where Annie's mom is holding up a dress,
Speaker 1: and so they talk about this dress back and forth
Speaker 1: for a couple lines, but the rest of the conversation
Speaker 1: is about Walter and about Annie's dad, and the context
Speaker 1: is like, here, take this dress so that you can
Speaker 1: marry a man, right, so you can marry Bill Pullman. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't feel like it at all. Yeah, every other
Speaker 1: exchange either. There. I thought there was an exchange between
Speaker 1: Meg and Rosie where they're talking about a Polaroid commercial
Speaker 1: and there's something about a refrigerator. I wasn't fully listening.
Speaker 1: This movie is very boring, but yeah, I know they're
Speaker 1: not talking about a man. They're talking about some commercial.
Speaker 1: I missed that one. But there are a number of exchanges.
Speaker 1: There aren't as many as you would think. I guess,
Speaker 1: but because there are a lot of female characters in
Speaker 1: this movie, they're just they're not really frequently seen interacting,
Speaker 1: with the exception of like Meg Ryan and Rosie o'donald right. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and almost all of their conversations are about a man
Speaker 1: in Seattle that she's never met or Walter. Does it
Speaker 1: count as a conversation if she's yelling at the radio
Speaker 1: where Dr Mark I don't do. I think if she's
Speaker 1: yelling at Dr Marcia, uh no, but also a compelling argument.
Speaker 1: Does it pass the Backtel test if Tom Hanks's yelling
Speaker 1: at a child? Yes, Um, I think Alfred Molina could
Speaker 1: have played Jonah. You stepped on my I think he
Speaker 1: could have played Jonah. And I think he could have
Speaker 1: played Jonah well. And I think if Tom Hanks is
Speaker 1: yelling at Alfred Molina, who's playing a nine year old,
Speaker 1: we've got a psychological thriller on her and I would
Speaker 1: love it. So that's yeah. Also, it tragically passes the
Speaker 1: Bechtel test. Yeah. I've seen two different readings where it
Speaker 1: like did or didn't pass the test. Yeah, it's I
Speaker 1: I will say I did think that that exchange with
Speaker 1: my gain Rosie did pass. Yeah, that I totally forgotten.
Speaker 1: So that's says something about that conversation. I've seen this
Speaker 1: movie three times in the past week, and I don't
Speaker 1: remember that conversation. Still don't work. Yeah, but I guess
Speaker 1: it passes, so hooray. So yeah it did. So female
Speaker 1: talking is fine and back well with that, let's rated
Speaker 1: on our nipple scales. Nipples based on his portrayal of women.
Speaker 1: I think that it gets like a half nipple. Women
Speaker 1: are portrayed as just being these like blubbering, like always crying,
Speaker 1: like hyper emotional, like no matter what, I need more
Speaker 1: men in my life. Yeah. The fact that she is
Speaker 1: stalking and that's not addressed in any way, and it's
Speaker 1: actually seen as being very cool and romantic. She's given
Speaker 1: permission to do it by multiple characters, so like when
Speaker 1: you do it, it's okay, right right. The movie subverts
Speaker 1: the trope of men's talking women, but that's also not good.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I guess a half nipple because Gabby Hoffman,
Speaker 1: are you giving your nippt to? I'll give my nipple
Speaker 1: to I guess to Nora Affron. Yeah, because she did
Speaker 1: right and direct it. So I mean, we've got a
Speaker 1: female phonemaker, but she didn't do a very good job.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give this movie a nipple and a half
Speaker 1: because I am Anora affront stand even though she you know,
Speaker 1: mistakes are made, but um, she did marry Carl Bernstein
Speaker 1: and then they got divorced and then she roasted him
Speaker 1: NonStop until she died, which was fucking incredible. And I
Speaker 1: I just I love Nora a Fron so much. Um,
Speaker 1: and it has nothing to do with this movie, although
Speaker 1: you know she's clearly the person driving it. But it's
Speaker 1: weird there. I think the kind of a recurring problem
Speaker 1: throughout her movies is that she kind of tries to
Speaker 1: have it both ways a lot of time, where all
Speaker 1: her female characters are very active, but what they're active
Speaker 1: doing you're like, oh no, like there, I mean, we
Speaker 1: can't deny me. Bryant's character is active as fuck because
Speaker 1: she is committing crimes like she is. She's actively talking
Speaker 1: someone the whole movie. Uh, She's trying to subvert things
Speaker 1: at times that I think missed the mark with like
Speaker 1: every time a woman you know, refutes like no, that
Speaker 1: terroristatistic is wrong. But then she's also kind of made
Speaker 1: to look dumb in the same scene women being blubbering dummies,
Speaker 1: but they're also hackers, so you know she there. There's
Speaker 1: a there's a lot of mixed bagginess to to this
Speaker 1: movie that doesn't I don't even think that, like the
Speaker 1: female stalker thing is an issue of its time. It's
Speaker 1: just like weird. Okay, But I'll go nipple and a
Speaker 1: half and I'll give one to Nora and I'll give
Speaker 1: the other half to Rosie. All Right, I'm gonna give it.
Speaker 1: Uh Well, considering I've watched all of the other Love Affair,
Speaker 1: there's a fair to remember. There's the other Love Affair
Speaker 1: from four, there's the Bollywood movie, and then this. I
Speaker 1: think in the uber of all it's the only one
Speaker 1: more woman doesn't get struck down in traffic. So can
Speaker 1: I give it at least one nipple for that? Yeah?
Speaker 1: And I'll give another nipple for the for the girl
Speaker 1: Jessica um and also for the I'll cross both those
Speaker 1: nipples too for the hopeful sequel that follows Jonah and Jessica,
Speaker 1: as Jonah was on to and create Instagram and Jessica
Speaker 1: invents the first Himalayan Salt Lamp compelling. I like that movie.
Speaker 1: So yeah, this movie, he's boring and I don't like it. Um.
Speaker 1: Thanks for kesn uh Andy, Where can people follow you online?
Speaker 1: Why would you like to plug? Yeah? I do the
Speaker 1: comedy nest downstairs here in the grotto every Tuesday. It's
Speaker 1: an awesome hate free female focus showing room. Great. All right,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us. Yes, give it
Speaker 1: up for Andy. Oh my, uh, my co workers are
Speaker 1: probably listening to this right now. I'm probably on break.
Speaker 1: Hell yeah, thank you for coming. Give up for yourselves.
Speaker 1: Thank you. There you have it. That was the last
Speaker 1: of the live shows that we recorded on our West
Speaker 1: Coast tour. Thanks again to our guest Andy I Wantio
Speaker 1: for joining us. Thank you to the Jewel Box Theater
Speaker 1: at the Rendezvous in Seattle and all of their staff
Speaker 1: for helping us to put on the various shows that
Speaker 1: we did there in Seattle. Thanks again to Sam Junio
Speaker 1: for recording the show and being our road dog for
Speaker 1: the West Coast tour. Uh And speaking of tours, we've
Speaker 1: got another one coming up in the Northeast. We will
Speaker 1: be in New York, Philadelphia, Washington, d C. And Boston
Speaker 1: at the end of April and beginning of May. So
Speaker 1: check out our website bechtel cast dot com and click
Speaker 1: on live appearances for all of the dates, venues and
Speaker 1: other details for those shows. And if you live in
Speaker 1: or near any of those places, we hope to see
Speaker 1: you there and then all the usual stuff. Follow us
Speaker 1: on Twitter, Instagram and Facebook at bechtel Cast right and
Speaker 1: review us on iTunes. That helps us out a lot.
Speaker 1: Subscribe to our matren at patreon dot com slash spectel Cast,
Speaker 1: where we do to bonus episodes every single month and
Speaker 1: it's only five dollars. What a damn good special. Uh.
Speaker 1: And then we've also got merch at t public dot
Speaker 1: com slash the backtel Cast, including a few new designs
Speaker 1: by our very own Jamie Loftus like Woman in Stem
Speaker 1: and Rise of the Matriarchy. And that about does it
Speaker 1: for this episode, So thanks as always for listening. And
Speaker 1: this is Sleepless in Seattle signing off just kidding, it's
Speaker 1: Caitlin by