WEBVTT - 3 Signs You Could Be Dealing With Depression & How to Stop Self-Sabotage 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:06.120 This episode discusses serious matters including suicide, childhood, trauma, substance use, 0:00:06.200 --> 0:00:09.719 and depression. Every single morning, the first thing I would 0:00:09.760 --> 0:00:15.400 do is cry, just because being awake was that difficult. 0:00:15.520 --> 0:00:17.480 I feel like a like a ticking time bomb. It 0:00:17.560 --> 0:00:26.840 was just a matter of when. Really, Hey, everyone, welcome 0:00:26.880 --> 0:00:31.960 back to this very special episode of On Purpose, the 0:00:32.040 --> 0:00:34.519 number one health podcast in the world. Thanks to each 0:00:34.560 --> 0:00:36.640 and every single one of you that come back every 0:00:36.640 --> 0:00:40.839 week to listen, learn and grow. Now, I am so 0:00:40.920 --> 0:00:43.840 grateful for this amazing community that we have, for each 0:00:43.840 --> 0:00:46.640 and every one of you that lend me your ears 0:00:46.680 --> 0:00:50.320 twice a week. And as you know, I'm always always 0:00:50.360 --> 0:00:53.159 thinking about new ways in which we can serve and 0:00:53.240 --> 0:00:57.720 support our community and your journeys towards a better understanding 0:00:57.720 --> 0:01:01.160 of yourself and a better understanding of your friends, your 0:01:01.200 --> 0:01:03.880 family members, and the people around you and the world 0:01:03.920 --> 0:01:07.720 around us as well. Now this episode is sponsored by 0:01:08.040 --> 0:01:13.360 better Help Online Therapy and today I'm joined with hersu Joe, 0:01:13.640 --> 0:01:18.320 licensed marriage and family therapist and head of clinical Operations 0:01:18.360 --> 0:01:22.160 at better Help and in this new monthly series, we 0:01:22.200 --> 0:01:27.160 will be serving real listeners of the show and community. 0:01:27.680 --> 0:01:30.720 You'll hear the stories the things that they struggle with 0:01:31.080 --> 0:01:34.600 and get to sit in on a real therapy session 0:01:35.120 --> 0:01:38.360 with the intention of letting you know you're not alone. 0:01:38.959 --> 0:01:42.720 We're all dealing with something and in every show we 0:01:42.800 --> 0:01:47.400 will address different themes, different experiences, and our goal is 0:01:47.440 --> 0:01:50.120 to bring more awareness to taking care of your mental 0:01:50.120 --> 0:01:54.520 health and provide everyone the tools, resources, and encouragement they 0:01:54.600 --> 0:01:59.040 need to heal their past for a brighter future. Now, 0:01:59.440 --> 0:02:02.240 when we were thinking about this idea, one of the 0:02:02.280 --> 0:02:04.800 things I realized is that today we hear a lot 0:02:04.840 --> 0:02:09.080 about therapy. People say, oh, my therapist said this to me, 0:02:09.639 --> 0:02:13.200 or I learned this in therapy, but rarely have we 0:02:13.280 --> 0:02:16.280 actually sat in on a therapy session. We don't know 0:02:16.320 --> 0:02:19.799 what it looks like, and often our family members don't 0:02:19.800 --> 0:02:22.480 know what it looks like. I'm hoping that this is 0:02:22.480 --> 0:02:24.480 going to be a resource that you can share with 0:02:24.520 --> 0:02:27.960 your friends, your family so that they can understand therapy better, 0:02:28.080 --> 0:02:31.400 so that you can understand therapy better, and as a 0:02:31.400 --> 0:02:35.200 community we can heal together as well. Today, Hessu and 0:02:35.240 --> 0:02:40.240 I are joined by a very wonderful and special individual 0:02:40.440 --> 0:02:45.120 named Ashley, and Ashley's joined us today to share her journey, 0:02:45.160 --> 0:02:47.800 to share her story and I want you to welcome 0:02:47.840 --> 0:02:51.560 her and give her the deepest, warmest, most beautiful welcome 0:02:51.639 --> 0:02:55.040 from our on Purpose community because she's so kindly agreed 0:02:55.560 --> 0:02:58.760 to be a part of this today. So Hessu and Ashley, 0:02:59.240 --> 0:03:03.120 so grateful to have you here. I'm really really thankful 0:03:03.160 --> 0:03:06.120 to do this with both of you. And this is 0:03:06.160 --> 0:03:09.560 the first time we're doing this. It's historic and it's special. 0:03:09.600 --> 0:03:11.280 But thank you for being it. Yeah, thank you for 0:03:11.320 --> 0:03:14.320 having me. Yeah, thank you for including both of us you. 0:03:14.560 --> 0:03:18.520 It's exciting, it is, it is exciting. And you know, 0:03:18.560 --> 0:03:23.519 we were talking a bit beforehand, and we really want 0:03:23.520 --> 0:03:27.160 to honor you, Ashley and make sure that we serve 0:03:27.200 --> 0:03:29.959 you in an effective way. And so I'm going to 0:03:30.040 --> 0:03:34.440 now hand over to Sue, who's going to start this 0:03:34.480 --> 0:03:39.480 wonderful conversation and discussion. So Sue over to you. I mean, 0:03:39.480 --> 0:03:42.200 just continuing a little bit of something Jay was mentioning. 0:03:42.240 --> 0:03:44.160 I want to make sure that you feel safe, that 0:03:44.240 --> 0:03:47.640 you feel comfortable. So if there's ever a moment that 0:03:47.920 --> 0:03:51.480 the conversation is going somewhere that doesn't feel right for you, 0:03:51.480 --> 0:03:53.880 you can indicate that in whatever way that you need to. 0:03:54.480 --> 0:03:57.240 But thank you, thank you so much for being willing 0:03:57.240 --> 0:04:00.320 and open to talk about yourself for so many people, 0:04:00.360 --> 0:04:04.400 because I think part of destigmatizing the idea of seeking 0:04:04.440 --> 0:04:08.520 support is seeing other people do that, right, seeing other 0:04:08.640 --> 0:04:12.240 real people doing that, versus just hearing commercial after ad 0:04:12.280 --> 0:04:15.080 about doing this or trying this new thing. So my 0:04:15.160 --> 0:04:17.799 understanding is that you've already been in therapy for some time, 0:04:18.600 --> 0:04:20.640 and I was wondering if you could share a little 0:04:20.640 --> 0:04:23.359 bit about what initially got you to try it the 0:04:23.400 --> 0:04:28.400 first time. So initially I was so against therapy. I 0:04:28.440 --> 0:04:30.560 didn't want nothing to do with it. I thought I 0:04:30.680 --> 0:04:32.960 was a lost cause. I was like, no one can 0:04:33.000 --> 0:04:36.360 help me, Like no one can imagine what I'm going 0:04:36.400 --> 0:04:38.600 through or even trying to tell me what I can 0:04:38.640 --> 0:04:42.200 do to get better, because in my mind, nothing could 0:04:42.279 --> 0:04:47.039 help me. Twenty eighteen, I believe I overdosed on like 0:04:47.080 --> 0:04:50.320 sleeping meds, and I was after that. I was kind 0:04:50.320 --> 0:04:53.800 of actually forced into it, but I didn't have a choice, 0:04:54.000 --> 0:04:57.960 and that kind of started my therapy journey, and from 0:04:58.000 --> 0:05:01.400 there I was in therapy for two years. Something going 0:05:01.440 --> 0:05:04.520 on in your life led to some unsafe behaviors, like 0:05:04.600 --> 0:05:07.039 ways to cope, Like people often turn to substance when 0:05:07.040 --> 0:05:09.840 there is trauma because it helps numb stuff, It helps 0:05:09.880 --> 0:05:13.560 you not think about things, and sometimes you feel good, right, 0:05:13.600 --> 0:05:16.160 it makes you feel not just better from this thing 0:05:16.320 --> 0:05:18.599 that has been painful, but it feels good. And so 0:05:18.640 --> 0:05:21.320 I'm hearing that you had kind of like a mandated 0:05:21.600 --> 0:05:26.600 route into therapy. You mentioned that you wouldn't have considered it. 0:05:26.920 --> 0:05:29.440 So what were some of your ideas about what therapy 0:05:29.600 --> 0:05:33.039 was before? I didn't even know where do you even begin? 0:05:33.160 --> 0:05:35.880 What therapy looks like? I just thought someone would just 0:05:35.880 --> 0:05:38.920 sit there and tell me, Oh, how do you feel 0:05:38.960 --> 0:05:41.960 about that? M Oh, how do you feel about that? 0:05:42.240 --> 0:05:44.520 You know what I mean? That's kind of like what 0:05:44.560 --> 0:05:47.200 I thought, or like someone try to preach to me 0:05:47.320 --> 0:05:50.240 or like tell me what to do or how I 0:05:50.279 --> 0:05:52.560 should do it. But really it wasn't like that at 0:05:52.560 --> 0:05:56.039 all for me. It ended up being something different exactly. 0:05:56.160 --> 0:05:59.400 And I know you can't give an entire synopsis of 0:05:59.560 --> 0:06:02.080 the corapeutic journey that you've been through, but now that 0:06:02.160 --> 0:06:04.960 you have gone through some of these sessions and it 0:06:04.960 --> 0:06:07.400 sounds like you found out it wasn't just so how 0:06:07.440 --> 0:06:09.560 did that make you feel? How did that? And I'm 0:06:09.600 --> 0:06:11.880 sure your therapists did ask many times well how did 0:06:11.920 --> 0:06:14.799 that make you feel? What do you think of therapy? Novin? 0:06:14.920 --> 0:06:17.640 What is therapy? If somebody is to ask you, a 0:06:17.720 --> 0:06:21.320 seasoned client, like what to expect if they were to 0:06:21.320 --> 0:06:25.279 try this out? Therapy is amazing. Honestly I recommend it 0:06:25.400 --> 0:06:27.320 to everybody. They tell me the problems, like you know what, 0:06:27.360 --> 0:06:29.320 you need a therapist, and like, I don't mean that 0:06:29.360 --> 0:06:31.960 in a negative It's not a negative thing at all. 0:06:32.160 --> 0:06:35.159 It's very positive and I try to enlighten that. But 0:06:35.360 --> 0:06:39.200 for me, when I was in therapy, like okay, so 0:06:39.360 --> 0:06:42.600 you have these dark thoughts. I mean you don't recognize them, 0:06:42.720 --> 0:06:44.839 or you don't even know what they are. It can 0:06:44.880 --> 0:06:48.440 easily spiral out of control. And so with therapy, she 0:06:48.560 --> 0:06:52.359 really helps me recognize these thinking traps is what we 0:06:52.360 --> 0:06:56.640 would call them. And throughout the day I was more aware, 0:06:56.720 --> 0:06:59.440 like if I would say on worthless or you can't 0:06:59.440 --> 0:07:02.359 do that, wait a minute, like that's not true, Like 0:07:02.440 --> 0:07:04.680 let's kind of lay it out and understand like what 0:07:04.720 --> 0:07:06.760 this is, like where it's coming from. That's something I 0:07:06.800 --> 0:07:09.600 still practice until this day. Every single day catch myself 0:07:09.600 --> 0:07:12.560 thinking something negative and obviously there's more to it, but 0:07:13.320 --> 0:07:16.040 something I really took away from that. Yeah, you're describing 0:07:16.080 --> 0:07:20.440 cognitive behavioral thing it is. Yeah, you went through this 0:07:20.520 --> 0:07:23.400 process where somebody helped you learn to identify and then 0:07:23.520 --> 0:07:27.040 articulate your internal process. Because when you can start talking 0:07:27.040 --> 0:07:29.360 about it or even understanding it a little bit better, 0:07:29.600 --> 0:07:31.880 I think that's when you really are able to make 0:07:31.920 --> 0:07:35.560 strides in terms of finding healing for yourself, the ability 0:07:35.640 --> 0:07:37.840 to let the things go that you need to, the 0:07:37.920 --> 0:07:40.960 ability to move on. So you shared a little bit 0:07:41.040 --> 0:07:45.320 about what led to your first session, right somebody you're 0:07:45.360 --> 0:07:48.640 forced because it became unsafe to yourself. Exactly Can you 0:07:48.680 --> 0:07:52.520 share now what you think led to the types of 0:07:52.560 --> 0:07:57.160 feelings you were trying to numb with substances. Well, I 0:07:57.200 --> 0:08:01.239 think it was just like a let up. There wasn't 0:08:01.280 --> 0:08:05.120 like a particular event what something did trigger it, and 0:08:05.120 --> 0:08:08.000 I can talk about that, but overall, like I've been 0:08:08.000 --> 0:08:12.480 struggling with it for since I was a young child, 0:08:13.080 --> 0:08:14.640 I think it was like really just like a matter 0:08:14.680 --> 0:08:18.120 of time, And I think if I received help sooner, 0:08:18.280 --> 0:08:20.640 it wouldn't have gotten to that point. And for like 0:08:20.680 --> 0:08:24.240 a lot of people like me, unfortunately, something that drastic 0:08:25.040 --> 0:08:28.800 has to happen for us even want to accept help. Yeah, 0:08:29.360 --> 0:08:33.240 the rock bottom experience. Right, Like people, not just people, 0:08:33.600 --> 0:08:36.920 I should say, we we often feel like there's some 0:08:37.000 --> 0:08:40.480 kind of like shortcoming or something wrong with me if 0:08:40.480 --> 0:08:42.600 I need to reach out for support, because a lot 0:08:42.640 --> 0:08:45.000 of us have this misconception that therapy is for the 0:08:45.160 --> 0:08:48.400 weak minded, the people that are absent of some kind 0:08:48.400 --> 0:08:51.000 of strong will of their own. And it takes a 0:08:51.000 --> 0:08:53.920 lot of courage, I think, to finally realize, like vulnerability 0:08:54.000 --> 0:08:56.560 takes a lot of strength, being able to open up 0:08:56.559 --> 0:08:58.880 to someone, being able to open up to yourself and 0:08:58.920 --> 0:09:01.720 admit a lot of stuff. Yeah, and so you mentioned 0:09:01.760 --> 0:09:05.559 like your life led to that moment. I'm sure series events, 0:09:05.720 --> 0:09:08.400 and then you also said something about something did trigger this, 0:09:08.720 --> 0:09:11.280 so that something that you're willing to kind of open 0:09:11.360 --> 0:09:14.520 up about now. I think at that time it was 0:09:14.600 --> 0:09:18.040 my depression really had a hold of me. Every single 0:09:18.040 --> 0:09:21.560 morning I would the first thing I would do is cry, 0:09:21.960 --> 0:09:26.640 just because being awake was that difficult. I couldn't even 0:09:26.920 --> 0:09:29.560 I didn't even want to spend the days with myself. Mentally, 0:09:30.000 --> 0:09:32.079 that was going on for a couple of months, and 0:09:32.679 --> 0:09:34.840 I feel like no matter what I did, like one 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:37.040 day I would wake up, I feel like I would 0:09:37.040 --> 0:09:39.959 do a good job, but I feel like it was 0:09:40.000 --> 0:09:41.719 steal not enough. I'm like, wow, I really gave it 0:09:41.800 --> 0:09:43.840 my all and it still was not enough. I was like, 0:09:43.840 --> 0:09:46.040 what is the point of being here? One day, my 0:09:46.040 --> 0:09:49.960 ex boyfriend and I got in an argument and I 0:09:50.080 --> 0:09:54.480 was like, wow, I will I'm just again. I'll never 0:09:54.520 --> 0:09:59.120 be enough, I'll nether be worthy. And normally in those situations, 0:09:59.120 --> 0:10:02.080 I will cont like I'll have a conversation with myself 0:10:02.120 --> 0:10:04.480 like okay, Ashley, you know, one more day, one more day, 0:10:04.520 --> 0:10:06.960 like just hold on and hold on. But that day, 0:10:07.120 --> 0:10:10.439 there was no conversation with myself. A switch just flipped 0:10:10.559 --> 0:10:12.960 and I just went through with it. And I was like, 0:10:12.960 --> 0:10:15.960 worst case scenario, how I go to sleep and I 0:10:16.040 --> 0:10:18.800 wake up like okay, But like best case scenari for me, 0:10:19.080 --> 0:10:20.800 I go to sleep and I don't even know what happened. 0:10:20.920 --> 0:10:23.200 That's what I was hoping for it but exactly go 0:10:23.320 --> 0:10:26.040 outs plans, which is probably the best. I feel like 0:10:25.800 --> 0:10:28.040 a like a ticking time bomb. It was just a 0:10:28.040 --> 0:10:32.000 matter of when. Really you're describing just like living for 0:10:32.040 --> 0:10:35.679 such a long time without knowing how to regulate your 0:10:35.679 --> 0:10:38.920 emotions and really process a lot of stuff right, and 0:10:39.080 --> 0:10:42.600 like blew up in an argument. Sounds like I want 0:10:42.600 --> 0:10:44.600 to shift gears a little bit and kind of ask 0:10:44.679 --> 0:10:48.160 a little bit more about your previous therapy experiences so far. 0:10:48.720 --> 0:10:51.680 So while you've been in therapy, I'm hearing you say 0:10:51.720 --> 0:10:54.240 that you've learned some skills, You've learned some things to 0:10:54.320 --> 0:10:57.720 like cope with and navigate everyday life, Like how did 0:10:57.760 --> 0:10:59.320 you learn that stuff? Like what is it that the 0:10:59.320 --> 0:11:03.559 therapist was doing to teach these things? Right? So, I'm 0:11:03.600 --> 0:11:07.160 a huge imagery person, and like one thing we would 0:11:07.200 --> 0:11:09.599 do it was it was kind of like how I 0:11:09.720 --> 0:11:13.080 describe it, like a court case, okay, and like you 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:15.560 have your like the jury of like the lawyer and 0:11:15.559 --> 0:11:19.600 stuff like that. One thing I struggled with was feeling 0:11:19.640 --> 0:11:21.920 like I'm not capable of taking care of myself. Like 0:11:22.000 --> 0:11:25.360 I'm a grown adult. I should be able to take 0:11:25.360 --> 0:11:28.600 care of myself and I couldn't. And so we would 0:11:28.640 --> 0:11:31.360 break down the evidence, like Okay, what's real and like 0:11:31.400 --> 0:11:35.000 what's false, Like let's just recognize that there, because when 0:11:35.120 --> 0:11:37.920 you're this kind of mindset, you tell yourself so many 0:11:37.960 --> 0:11:41.559 lies stuff that's not being true. And so I would 0:11:41.600 --> 0:11:43.720 I'm like, okay, well I do this. I do my 0:11:43.800 --> 0:11:46.720 laundry sometimes, like I have been working out past couple 0:11:46.720 --> 0:11:49.160 of weeks, like, oh, you do feed yourself. You have 0:11:49.240 --> 0:11:52.120 to give yourself credit for the things that you actually do, 0:11:52.760 --> 0:11:54.679 and you I would we would write it down in 0:11:54.679 --> 0:11:58.400 the evidence section and we would write down like what 0:11:58.480 --> 0:12:02.160 was false, and basically like the jury would come to 0:12:02.240 --> 0:12:04.880 the conclusion like, no, you are capable. So yeah, you 0:12:04.880 --> 0:12:07.760 would just really just have to in that process give 0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:10.920 yourself credit and kind of look at what was real 0:12:10.960 --> 0:12:15.199 and what was it and you would shift those thoughts 0:12:15.200 --> 0:12:17.960 of I should be able to and you change it 0:12:18.000 --> 0:12:22.120 into no, you are able to, and you do. It's 0:12:22.120 --> 0:12:24.720 a lot of just shifting the way you think about stuff, 0:12:24.760 --> 0:12:29.360 taking on different perspectives. Hearing someone kind of re word 0:12:29.520 --> 0:12:32.600 or like paraphrase your life in a different way. It 0:12:32.679 --> 0:12:35.720 sounds like you've learned a lot about yourself too. There's 0:12:35.760 --> 0:12:37.120 like a period of time where it sounds like you 0:12:37.120 --> 0:12:40.120 didn't really know who you were. Like what parts of 0:12:40.240 --> 0:12:43.520 learning these skills, learning how to identify evidence for and 0:12:43.600 --> 0:12:47.440 against some kind of thought or belief helped you figure 0:12:47.520 --> 0:12:49.600 out who you are? Like, do you feel like there 0:12:49.640 --> 0:12:54.480 was some kind of self exploration self identification type of process, 0:12:54.600 --> 0:12:58.120 Like it's not just learning skills, right, it's I guess 0:12:58.120 --> 0:13:02.040 I'm trying to get to your sense of any kind 0:13:02.040 --> 0:13:05.080 of change in the ways that you perceive yourself, Like 0:13:05.120 --> 0:13:08.880 how has that kind of shifted in that two year period. 0:13:09.320 --> 0:13:12.959 So a lot of people, I believe, feel like they 0:13:13.000 --> 0:13:16.640 go to therapy and overnight they're so much better, and 0:13:16.679 --> 0:13:19.720 that's just not the case. And for me, again, until 0:13:19.760 --> 0:13:22.920 this day, I someting I had to practice every single day, 0:13:23.080 --> 0:13:25.800 so there wasn't like one particular moment where I just 0:13:25.840 --> 0:13:29.760 like saw myself in like a better light. Eventually, you 0:13:30.280 --> 0:13:35.280 keep practicing and practicing and practicing, and eventually you start 0:13:35.280 --> 0:13:37.400 to learn yourself. You start to value yourself and you 0:13:37.440 --> 0:13:40.280 see yourself in a whole different light. You have you 0:13:40.360 --> 0:13:42.480 learn boundaries, and you have them now, and you have 0:13:42.600 --> 0:13:47.800 rules for yourself and you don't allow certain people or 0:13:47.840 --> 0:13:53.160 certain situations control you as much because you have more 0:13:53.240 --> 0:13:55.760 confidence in the tools and the Kobe mechanisms that you 0:13:55.840 --> 0:13:59.840 have developed throughout therapy. And that's definitely helped me a lot. 0:14:00.200 --> 0:14:03.079 To this day, I really do see myself in a 0:14:03.160 --> 0:14:07.920 higher light, and I don't let people take advantage of 0:14:07.920 --> 0:14:10.080 me as much as I used to back in the day. 0:14:10.520 --> 0:14:14.000 Back in the day, people took advantage of you in 0:14:14.360 --> 0:14:17.840 what ways do you think that was happening that you're 0:14:17.880 --> 0:14:22.120 able to prevent now? Well, just one example, you were 0:14:22.160 --> 0:14:27.480 mentioning earlier people they kind of self that sabotage, whether 0:14:27.480 --> 0:14:30.480 it's drugs, alcohol. For me, I didn't do any of that. 0:14:30.560 --> 0:14:34.360 For me, my reckless behavior was being promiscuous. And that's 0:14:34.400 --> 0:14:36.840 kind of like what I learned growing up was giving 0:14:36.880 --> 0:14:42.480 yourself for in return for love. So that's what I 0:14:42.560 --> 0:14:45.880 thought I had to do in order to receive any 0:14:46.400 --> 0:14:51.240 sort of love. And so I would give myself to guys, 0:14:51.320 --> 0:14:53.440 you know, and like thinking, oh, this is how they're 0:14:53.440 --> 0:14:55.240 going to accept me. This is like where they're gonna 0:14:55.280 --> 0:14:58.360 love me, and this is where I'm valued. And now 0:14:58.440 --> 0:15:00.920 it's not like that at all. I'm just like, no, 0:15:01.000 --> 0:15:03.520 I have so much more to give than my body, 0:15:03.800 --> 0:15:06.640 you know what I mean. And so that's just one 0:15:06.680 --> 0:15:10.800 example of how things have definitely shifted for me. You're 0:15:10.800 --> 0:15:13.880 speaking of something huge herey is like we as people, 0:15:13.960 --> 0:15:16.320 we learn how to not only give love, but how 0:15:16.360 --> 0:15:20.440 to receive love from very significant people really early in 0:15:20.480 --> 0:15:24.920 our lives childhood, and those people that are supposed to 0:15:25.000 --> 0:15:29.280 love us unconditionally, keep us safe, nurture us, show us 0:15:29.280 --> 0:15:31.400 that the world as a safe place, have a lot 0:15:31.440 --> 0:15:33.880 of power over us as young children. And so I'm 0:15:33.880 --> 0:15:35.640 what I'm hearing is when you were a young child, 0:15:36.320 --> 0:15:40.480 some kind of event or series events taught you that 0:15:40.600 --> 0:15:47.840 love means something you know specific right, So I'm curious 0:15:47.960 --> 0:15:50.720 in your therapy experience, how much did you go back 0:15:50.760 --> 0:15:54.440 and talk about your childhood in that time? When I 0:15:54.440 --> 0:15:57.680 went to therapy, we did go, well, you kind of 0:15:57.720 --> 0:16:00.640 have to understand why you feel this way, and it 0:16:00.680 --> 0:16:04.920 does stem from your childhood everything, So we really did 0:16:04.920 --> 0:16:07.920 start from there. We broke it down from there. It 0:16:07.960 --> 0:16:15.440 really does help you start to realize how you're acting 0:16:15.480 --> 0:16:20.040 in the presence is it stems from that. We reenact. 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:22.920 We try to correct what happened to us as kids 0:16:22.920 --> 0:16:26.240 in our adult relationships. And I think we all tried 0:16:26.280 --> 0:16:29.600 to the best of our ability, but to try to 0:16:29.600 --> 0:16:32.040 correct something that happened to us when we're six, we 0:16:32.480 --> 0:16:35.080 didn't know any better, you know, trying to make this 0:16:35.240 --> 0:16:37.960 six year old, you know, be smarter. You should have 0:16:38.040 --> 0:16:41.120 known better, which we tell ourselves all the time. It 0:16:41.200 --> 0:16:44.640 sounds like you learn to have compassion for the small 0:16:44.720 --> 0:16:48.440 child inside of you. Yes, Like even to this day, 0:16:49.040 --> 0:16:50.960 Like I'm twenty seven years old, and I still, to 0:16:51.040 --> 0:16:53.800 this day, I still feel like that little girl, Like 0:16:53.840 --> 0:16:56.200 I feel like it's my duty to protect myself and 0:16:56.640 --> 0:17:00.000 be that person little Ashley needed when she was younger. 0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:02.120 You really do feel like it's your fault, like or 0:17:02.120 --> 0:17:03.720 you should have done this differently in your should have 0:17:03.760 --> 0:17:06.679 done that. You blame yourself and you're ashamed of it, 0:17:07.520 --> 0:17:09.720 but really it's not in your control and the people 0:17:09.720 --> 0:17:13.760 in your lives should have been the ones protecting you. Yeah, shame. 0:17:14.119 --> 0:17:17.920 Shame is a very powerful thing, right. It's like there's 0:17:17.960 --> 0:17:20.680 like a difference between when we feel guilty for doing 0:17:20.720 --> 0:17:23.440 something bad. We recognize that this thing we probably could 0:17:23.440 --> 0:17:25.680 have made a different choice, but shame is like adding 0:17:25.720 --> 0:17:29.679 some really painful and uncomfortable stuff on top of that. 0:17:29.800 --> 0:17:32.320 I did this bad thing because I'm a bad person, 0:17:32.840 --> 0:17:35.120 or this bad thing happened to me and I deserved 0:17:35.160 --> 0:17:38.560 it because I'm a bad person. Like in therapy, do 0:17:38.600 --> 0:17:41.760 you feel like you can remember some kind of shift 0:17:42.000 --> 0:17:45.560 in that sense of shame, like something that released you 0:17:45.760 --> 0:17:48.520 from feeling like all this stuff happened to me because 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:52.160 I'm bad? What about this process? What about talking about 0:17:52.160 --> 0:17:55.160 yourself and your life helped you start to shift this 0:17:55.240 --> 0:17:58.040 idea away from being a bad person? Because I'm hearing 0:17:58.080 --> 0:18:00.760 you say that you are a good person. When did 0:18:00.800 --> 0:18:03.640 that change? Like? How does that change? There's not one 0:18:03.720 --> 0:18:06.840 moment where it just shifts. It truly is happens over 0:18:06.920 --> 0:18:09.639 time and within my time of therapy, the two years 0:18:10.480 --> 0:18:15.200 of course, I relationships, jobs, real life situations are happening, 0:18:15.800 --> 0:18:19.520 and when I'm acting on them and I feel like, oh, 0:18:19.560 --> 0:18:21.360 this is happening to me, I deserve it. Anyways, I'm 0:18:21.359 --> 0:18:24.000 a piece of crap, you know what I mean. And 0:18:24.040 --> 0:18:27.560 so you would accept that for yourself. But over time 0:18:27.600 --> 0:18:29.919 you realize like, wait a minute, like I don't deserve 0:18:29.960 --> 0:18:31.800 that at all. It shouldn't be happened to me. You 0:18:31.800 --> 0:18:35.159 shouldn't accept that. And once you create those boundaries for 0:18:35.160 --> 0:18:38.199 yourself and practice it, it does get better. You know, 0:18:38.200 --> 0:18:39.879 a lot of people wonder like why do we go 0:18:39.920 --> 0:18:42.720 to therapy every week? What is it about this cadence 0:18:42.800 --> 0:18:45.080 of whatever? And it's like, why don't we go every day? 0:18:45.119 --> 0:18:47.760 If I'm trying to solve this huge problem that's been 0:18:47.760 --> 0:18:49.840 part of my life for such a long time, and 0:18:49.880 --> 0:18:53.360 really your life you're healing is what happens outside of therapy. 0:18:53.920 --> 0:18:56.600 It's just one hour a week most of the time. 0:18:57.040 --> 0:18:59.320 It's like, you can't expect this one hour of week 0:18:59.480 --> 0:19:02.840 talking to someone on a couch or whatever to fix everything. 0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:07.600 It's talking about some stuff, learning some things, identifying feelings 0:19:07.600 --> 0:19:10.199 and behaviors that you could try to start working on 0:19:10.280 --> 0:19:12.240 in a different way. And it's in your real life 0:19:12.240 --> 0:19:15.600 outside of the session that this transformation is really happening 0:19:16.040 --> 0:19:19.160 for some people very gradually and over a long period 0:19:19.200 --> 0:19:21.520 of time. You mentioned your twenty seven that's like, you know, 0:19:21.680 --> 0:19:24.680 potentially twenty five years of learning how to be in 0:19:24.680 --> 0:19:27.760 a particular space in a body, and it's going to 0:19:27.800 --> 0:19:31.480 take time to like unlearn, relearn and start seeing the 0:19:31.520 --> 0:19:34.879 world in a way that is safe. Right, So what 0:19:34.960 --> 0:19:38.280 would you say, like if you had not gone to therapy, 0:19:39.960 --> 0:19:42.680 you know, where would we be? Where would you be? Oh? 0:19:42.720 --> 0:19:47.920 My goodness, Like if I never went to therapy, I 0:19:47.960 --> 0:19:51.000 would not be the person that I am today, nor 0:19:51.280 --> 0:19:54.600 be the person that I'm becoming. My self awareness has 0:19:54.640 --> 0:19:58.480 grown so much and I'm able to take care of 0:19:58.520 --> 0:20:03.200 myself more ment I'm able to value my thoughts more 0:20:03.320 --> 0:20:06.399 or just like again, if I'm negative, I recognize it 0:20:06.480 --> 0:20:09.719 real quick and I try to change it into something 0:20:09.800 --> 0:20:13.480 more enlightening and more actually true. Let go from false 0:20:13.800 --> 0:20:17.280 to true. You know, people come to therapy and over time, 0:20:17.320 --> 0:20:20.000 after what's called the assessment period, where your therapist is 0:20:20.000 --> 0:20:21.960 getting to know you and asking you about your family 0:20:22.040 --> 0:20:24.600 history and like all your school stuff and everything you 0:20:24.680 --> 0:20:29.199 remember from your family, childhoods, whatever. Once you move past 0:20:29.600 --> 0:20:34.080 this initial period where you're building this relationship, you start 0:20:34.240 --> 0:20:37.040 thinking about goals. What are the goals that I want 0:20:37.040 --> 0:20:39.000 to work on? And so you and your therapists like 0:20:39.040 --> 0:20:42.879 agree on these usually two or three major things that 0:20:43.000 --> 0:20:47.720 you want to achieve through this process, and usually you're 0:20:47.760 --> 0:20:50.399 looking for something called smart goals. People talk about this 0:20:50.400 --> 0:20:53.439 all the time. You want to be specific, measurable. What's 0:20:53.480 --> 0:20:58.879 not always explicitly stated as a goal is increased self awareness. 0:20:58.960 --> 0:21:01.600 But I think that's all always going to be an outcome, 0:21:01.800 --> 0:21:04.000 at least I think most therapists are hoping that that's 0:21:04.040 --> 0:21:06.000 an outcome for their clients. So I'm really glad that 0:21:06.040 --> 0:21:08.640 you were able to even identify that that's something that's 0:21:08.640 --> 0:21:11.840 shifted for you. Is self awareness? Yes, honestly. Without my 0:21:11.880 --> 0:21:14.560 self awareness, I think I would be so lost, because 0:21:14.640 --> 0:21:17.359 I do believe self awareness is the first step, Like 0:21:17.440 --> 0:21:20.280 you have to even recognize what you're doing or how 0:21:20.280 --> 0:21:22.840 you're behaving or what you're thinking about yourself. That's where 0:21:22.840 --> 0:21:25.080 it's starting, like from recognizing it. So if you don't 0:21:25.080 --> 0:21:28.040 recognize it, you really can't move forward or even try 0:21:28.040 --> 0:21:31.760 to get better. You were talking about the assessments, right, 0:21:31.960 --> 0:21:34.760 and so maybe like every six months we would review 0:21:35.560 --> 0:21:37.680 and when I was feeling better, you know, I'm doing better, 0:21:38.480 --> 0:21:43.400 we're reviewing from six months ago. And it was so sad. 0:21:43.560 --> 0:21:45.840 I was I was my heart was breaking for six 0:21:45.880 --> 0:21:49.640 months ago, Ashley. And she was saying, she was saying, 0:21:49.640 --> 0:21:52.119 I'm referring to honest but that's how I feel like. 0:21:52.119 --> 0:21:55.080 I feel like a new person, like honestly, but she 0:21:55.240 --> 0:21:58.440 was just referring to her like a self like unworthy, 0:21:58.600 --> 0:22:04.000 I'll never get better. It was very very dark thoughts, 0:22:04.960 --> 0:22:08.000 and I was so sad for I'm like, oh my god, 0:22:08.000 --> 0:22:09.720 I'm like that was me. Are you trying? You're on 0:22:09.760 --> 0:22:12.639