1 00:00:01,400 --> 00:00:06,840 Speaker 1: Welcome to Unaddictioned the podcast. My name is doctor Zinga Harrison. 2 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:10,680 Speaker 1: I'm a board certified psychiatrist with a specialty in addiction 3 00:00:10,840 --> 00:00:15,520 Speaker 1: medicine and co founder and chief medical officer of Eleanor Health. 4 00:00:16,440 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 1: On this podcast, we explore the paths that can lead 5 00:00:19,400 --> 00:00:23,880 Speaker 1: to addiction and the infinite paths that can lead to recovery. 6 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:28,280 Speaker 1: Our guests are sharing their own experiences, the tools that 7 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:31,280 Speaker 1: have helped them along the way, and the formulas that 8 00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: allow them to thrive in recovery one day at a time. Okay, 9 00:00:36,720 --> 00:00:39,040 Speaker 1: So I know I always say like I love this 10 00:00:39,159 --> 00:00:42,400 Speaker 1: episode so much, and it's always true, but I loved 11 00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:46,080 Speaker 1: this episode so much. This we are dedicating to our 12 00:00:46,120 --> 00:00:49,199 Speaker 1: young people who may still be struggling or who may 13 00:00:49,240 --> 00:00:52,760 Speaker 1: be early on your path to recovery. I'm Lauren got 14 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:57,360 Speaker 1: sober at twenty five. She describes herself as a stay 15 00:00:57,400 --> 00:01:01,960 Speaker 1: at home drinker with addiction as early as nineteen and 16 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:07,760 Speaker 1: just celebrated her six year sober birthday. Her Instagram handle 17 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:11,520 Speaker 1: is at Brutal Recovery And don't be scared off because 18 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:17,280 Speaker 1: Lauren was anything but brutal. I'm talking about just a warm, 19 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:20,959 Speaker 1: healing conversation full of joy and laughter. 20 00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:22,400 Speaker 2: Lauren is from. 21 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:24,800 Speaker 1: Scotland, where she was born and raised. She was an 22 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 1: opera singer. She has like three degrees. Now she's a 23 00:01:28,280 --> 00:01:31,880 Speaker 1: content writer and she based her content on the messy, 24 00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:35,880 Speaker 1: awkward and unsettling parts of recovery and of being a 25 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:38,360 Speaker 1: human in the world. I think you were going to 26 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:43,039 Speaker 1: love this episode. I am thrilled to have you here. 27 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:46,959 Speaker 1: So I keep meeting so many cool, like interesting, amazing 28 00:01:47,040 --> 00:01:51,360 Speaker 1: people through this podcast and I'm like, okay, opera singer, 29 00:01:52,000 --> 00:02:01,040 Speaker 1: recovery real blazer, like okay, yeah. 30 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:04,640 Speaker 2: I'm a super stoked. So I'll do a quick introduction. 31 00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 2: Nice to meet you. I'm doctor and Zinga Harrison. 32 00:02:07,000 --> 00:02:11,680 Speaker 1: Please we're like old friends now, so in Zinga go 33 00:02:11,760 --> 00:02:16,680 Speaker 1: by and follow you on Instagram and with seriously super 34 00:02:16,680 --> 00:02:18,320 Speaker 1: stoked when Jada said you would come on. 35 00:02:18,520 --> 00:02:20,160 Speaker 2: So my book just. 36 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:24,680 Speaker 1: Came out in January, Thank you very much. It's called 37 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:28,160 Speaker 1: an Addictioned Six Mind Changing Conversations that Could Save a 38 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:32,960 Speaker 1: Life and it's a you know, storytelling, educational book. I say, 39 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:35,400 Speaker 1: I'm a doctor, but it's not a textbook. And really 40 00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:38,519 Speaker 1: what I'm hoping to do is just like get people 41 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:41,799 Speaker 1: to think about addiction differently, which then I hope will 42 00:02:41,840 --> 00:02:45,560 Speaker 1: help us think about people who experience addiction differently. And 43 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 1: I think comes with that is thinking about recovery differently. 44 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 1: And there's this concept that's the magic formula, and it's 45 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 1: like it's yours. 46 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:57,480 Speaker 2: Right, Like your formula is your formula. 47 00:02:57,520 --> 00:03:00,400 Speaker 1: And so the purpose of the podcast is like people 48 00:03:00,400 --> 00:03:04,639 Speaker 1: that have their own recovery journey just sharing their formula 49 00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:09,320 Speaker 1: and then maybe somebody interesting is like, oh, maybe that's 50 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:11,320 Speaker 1: part of my formula. I'll try it. 51 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:15,960 Speaker 3: Yes, Oh I love that. Yeah, Like I'm I am 52 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 3: one hundred percent like a believer in like the only 53 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:22,080 Speaker 3: the only like right way to get sober is the 54 00:03:22,080 --> 00:03:25,919 Speaker 3: way that like actually works for you. And I don't 55 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 3: know why that's so controversial, but like is. 56 00:03:28,320 --> 00:03:30,160 Speaker 2: That the easiest concept ever? 57 00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:32,760 Speaker 1: Like the right way is the one that works and 58 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:34,360 Speaker 1: also that changes over time. 59 00:03:34,560 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 3: Right, That's definitely been my theories. Yeah, like my different 60 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:42,120 Speaker 3: ages and stages of my recovery, I've needed like different things. Yeah, 61 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:44,880 Speaker 3: Like so I heard someone describe it. It's like, you know, 62 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:47,360 Speaker 3: it's like any relationship, like when you're three years in, 63 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:49,440 Speaker 3: like how you spend your time is different when you've 64 00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:51,560 Speaker 3: like just got together like when you have kids, Like 65 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:54,000 Speaker 3: it's different than like when you were like just you know, 66 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:58,080 Speaker 3: so it's like you've all rising it by your recovery flowers. 67 00:03:58,240 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, oh I love this metaphor. 68 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 1: Okay, so Lauren tell the listeners who is Lauren? 69 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:11,600 Speaker 3: Oh okay, So someone on a podcast recently said to me, 70 00:04:12,520 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 3: you laugh more than anyone I've ever interviewed. So I'm 71 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 3: just plugging that, like right away, Like I'm I just 72 00:04:19,480 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 3: get so giddy when I like against these conversations because 73 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:24,560 Speaker 3: it's not kind of blows my mind. But yes, so 74 00:04:24,839 --> 00:04:25,440 Speaker 3: I'm Lauren. 75 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 2: That's a huge compliment. Laughter is the medicine for the soul. 76 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 3: I really believe that. And as someone who was like, 77 00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:36,559 Speaker 3: you know, a stay at home, miserable drinker and drunk 78 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:39,040 Speaker 3: news like, the fact that I even laugh now is 79 00:04:39,440 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 3: like that's a marker of recovery. Anyway. So my name 80 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:45,280 Speaker 3: is Lauren. I'm from Scotland. That's why I sound like this. 81 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 3: I live in London. I am originally from I'm from 82 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:53,160 Speaker 3: a sheep farm and then I went really rogue and 83 00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 3: became an opera singer and lived in the USA, and 84 00:04:57,279 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 3: whilst being full time, fulled, I'm stay at home alcoholic. 85 00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:07,159 Speaker 3: I've been sober for six years. I turned six in March, 86 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:13,920 Speaker 3: Happy birthday, Thank you. Yes, it's still kind of bananas 87 00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:18,960 Speaker 3: to me. Yeah, And I spend I spend my days. 88 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:21,679 Speaker 3: People who was asking me, like, what is actually your job, 89 00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:24,720 Speaker 3: Like you just seem to be like vibing online And 90 00:05:24,760 --> 00:05:27,479 Speaker 3: my job is my job is barbing gone there. But 91 00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:30,200 Speaker 3: my I work as a writer. I write about recovery 92 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 3: and I also am I you know, creativity is a 93 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:38,279 Speaker 3: really big part of my recovery as you know, a 94 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:43,839 Speaker 3: musician by trade, So I engage with using music as 95 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:48,279 Speaker 3: a tool to self experience and self sooth and self 96 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:51,320 Speaker 3: express at the same time with the voy does and 97 00:05:51,839 --> 00:05:55,280 Speaker 3: I love it. Yeah. So that's that's that's a little 98 00:05:55,320 --> 00:05:59,560 Speaker 3: slice of me. I love whales, I love anime, I love. 99 00:06:00,880 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 2: You know, just. 100 00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:06,600 Speaker 3: Reading and I yeah, that's that's your little whistle stop 101 00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:08,480 Speaker 3: tour of everything that makes me feel. 102 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:13,279 Speaker 1: Alive, incredible. So three things I'm gonna connect with you. 103 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:16,719 Speaker 1: One one, My younger son is seventeen, so he's just 104 00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:21,200 Speaker 1: about to graduate high school and he is going to 105 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:25,880 Speaker 1: Savannah College of Art and Design here and in Georgia 106 00:06:26,120 --> 00:06:31,720 Speaker 1: to major in creative writing. So like now, yeah, totally. 107 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:34,240 Speaker 1: So now like every time I meet writers, I'm like, 108 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:37,839 Speaker 1: I may or may not ask my son to call 109 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:39,000 Speaker 1: you someday. 110 00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:43,719 Speaker 3: Please, Oh my god. Yeah, Like my kind of journey's 111 00:06:43,760 --> 00:06:47,480 Speaker 3: being a writer is such a strange side story journey, 112 00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:51,520 Speaker 3: like because obviously like a major to music, I want 113 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:54,240 Speaker 3: three degrees in music and then discovered in lockdown, like, 114 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:56,280 Speaker 3: oh shit, I don't want to do that anymore. It's 115 00:06:56,279 --> 00:06:58,200 Speaker 3: like it's kind of like that's, you know, being a 116 00:06:58,200 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 3: performers when it's raced for me, like what do I do? 117 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:05,679 Speaker 3: My original ambition was always to be a writer, a readers. Yeah, 118 00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:08,360 Speaker 3: by god. I wrote my first book in air quotes 119 00:07:08,560 --> 00:07:11,360 Speaker 3: when I was like ten and it was in and 120 00:07:11,400 --> 00:07:13,040 Speaker 3: it was about a mermaid. There was clip on it 121 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:16,080 Speaker 3: like it and I was like, so I was like, 122 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:19,640 Speaker 3: wet book. And then around you know that's not what 123 00:07:19,640 --> 00:07:22,600 Speaker 3: a book is. But and then you know, obviously I 124 00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 3: have the meme account brutal recovery. So I realized that 125 00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:27,160 Speaker 3: like I had kind of and I've been doing that 126 00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:28,560 Speaker 3: for about five years now, so I was kind of 127 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:30,840 Speaker 3: like writing all along. So I feel like that was 128 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:34,440 Speaker 3: like my neglected ambition kind of just like you know, 129 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:39,080 Speaker 3: simmering away always and then I've got my own book 130 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 3: is actually coming out next year based on you know 131 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:45,080 Speaker 3: I talk about on the page. So yeah, I support 132 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:50,320 Speaker 3: you know, writers who like feel that like Arcane urged 133 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:55,320 Speaker 3: to write like that's just absolutely it. So congratulations to 134 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:58,600 Speaker 3: your side my way anytime, if it wants to talk about. 135 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 1: I love that, and I would say I'm being uh. 136 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:05,120 Speaker 1: I was about to say preposterous, but that was not 137 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 1: the word I was looking for. I was looking for presumptuous, 138 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:12,520 Speaker 1: which maybe shairs you know, maybe share some things to 139 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:16,160 Speaker 1: say that maybe even part of your magic formula is 140 00:08:16,240 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 1: getting back to your original ambition. 141 00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:22,680 Speaker 2: But first, okay, my second my first son, that's my 142 00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 2: that's my second son. 143 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:27,680 Speaker 1: My first son is finishing up his freshman year of college, 144 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:31,760 Speaker 1: and I'm a psychiatrist. So he's majoring in psychology, which 145 00:08:31,840 --> 00:08:37,440 Speaker 1: I love, and but he's minoring in music because like 146 00:08:37,600 --> 00:08:42,240 Speaker 1: you just said, he and I learned this as I 147 00:08:42,280 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 1: was like reading his college essays. Really found his sense 148 00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:51,800 Speaker 1: of identity and self and belonging when he started playing music, 149 00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:55,520 Speaker 1: and music has become one of his you know, main 150 00:08:56,080 --> 00:09:00,600 Speaker 1: coping and resilient strategies and so he's putting music and 151 00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:05,400 Speaker 1: psychology together so that he again help people learn to 152 00:09:05,640 --> 00:09:07,080 Speaker 1: heal through music. 153 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:12,080 Speaker 3: That is absolutely astonishing. I love that because you know, 154 00:09:13,400 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 3: music can access to herself, other people, and something greater 155 00:09:15,840 --> 00:09:19,839 Speaker 3: than ourselves, like that is it's just it's magic. And 156 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 3: you know, I I really relate to you know what 157 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:25,480 Speaker 3: you said that like when you know it's so so 158 00:09:25,559 --> 00:09:28,160 Speaker 3: opera was my craft and people say like what was 159 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:31,960 Speaker 3: you know, a girl from like the west coast of Scotland, 160 00:09:32,559 --> 00:09:35,160 Speaker 3: from a sheep farm, what was she doing sing an opera? 161 00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:38,240 Speaker 3: And you know, they for me so like it was 162 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:40,920 Speaker 3: a road show came to my came to my town, 163 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:43,200 Speaker 3: like they did like outreach stuff out into the countryside, 164 00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:46,280 Speaker 3: and this road show came and they were like, hi, guys, 165 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:49,800 Speaker 3: like this is opera and I was like, oh my god, 166 00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 3: like these people are screaming like I was. I wanted 167 00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:56,800 Speaker 3: to scream, I said, I was screaming on the inside. 168 00:09:56,880 --> 00:09:59,520 Speaker 3: So I was like, wait, if you're an opera singer, 169 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:07,120 Speaker 3: you can screaming sign me like yeah, so yeah. And 170 00:10:07,160 --> 00:10:09,920 Speaker 3: then for a while, like you know, you know, being 171 00:10:10,120 --> 00:10:12,240 Speaker 3: in the class commusic scene, like there is a huge 172 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:14,920 Speaker 3: amount of the discipline and it gives you a huge 173 00:10:14,960 --> 00:10:17,800 Speaker 3: amount of self esteem. And where I kind of lost 174 00:10:17,840 --> 00:10:20,960 Speaker 3: my way with that career is I kind of replaced 175 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:25,920 Speaker 3: the praise of being a class commusician for love. So 176 00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:29,439 Speaker 3: I thought that if I was perfect, i'd beloved right. Yeah, 177 00:10:29,520 --> 00:10:32,800 Speaker 3: And there in life's the problem. So the fact that 178 00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:36,679 Speaker 3: he's doing a psychology degree alongside it his self for success, 179 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:37,520 Speaker 3: that is perfect. 180 00:10:37,760 --> 00:10:40,080 Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you, Okay. And then here's the part 181 00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:43,959 Speaker 1: I loved. I said, tell the listeners who is Lauren? 182 00:10:44,640 --> 00:10:49,840 Speaker 1: And one of the many things you said was and 183 00:10:49,920 --> 00:10:53,160 Speaker 1: I was a stay at home you know, lonely. 184 00:10:53,559 --> 00:10:56,800 Speaker 2: I think you said alcoholic. That was only one. 185 00:10:57,760 --> 00:11:01,320 Speaker 1: That was only one of the things that you use 186 00:11:01,559 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 1: to tell people about yourself. 187 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:06,800 Speaker 2: It was grew up in Scotland. It was opera. 188 00:11:06,920 --> 00:11:09,120 Speaker 1: It was wrote a book about a mermaid when I 189 00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:11,560 Speaker 1: was ten. It was came back to writing. It was 190 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:14,960 Speaker 1: like writing for a living. It was all so much more. 191 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:19,720 Speaker 1: And I think that is one of the most important 192 00:11:19,760 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 1: messages that I want people to know about people who 193 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:27,080 Speaker 1: have experienced addiction, people who are still experiencing it, people 194 00:11:27,080 --> 00:11:30,400 Speaker 1: who are in recovery, is that it is but one 195 00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:34,360 Speaker 1: piece of the puzzle that is that person. 196 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:39,680 Speaker 3: Oh my god, what beautiful observation. Like I'm really happy 197 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:42,440 Speaker 3: that that came quite organically, because that's you know, that's 198 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:44,640 Speaker 3: why I want to convince people of like with the 199 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:46,960 Speaker 3: writing that I do, like you know that that's not 200 00:11:47,040 --> 00:11:50,120 Speaker 3: you know, my my story is like you knows, as 201 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:51,680 Speaker 3: I said, I was a state at home drinker, but 202 00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:54,480 Speaker 3: you know, I had and you'd think that being a 203 00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:56,880 Speaker 3: state home drinker, you would take yourself out of harm's way, 204 00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:00,559 Speaker 3: but like you know, a lot of chit went down, 205 00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:04,280 Speaker 3: a lot of you know, another one of my things 206 00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:07,280 Speaker 3: that I consider myself in recovery from is you know, 207 00:12:07,679 --> 00:12:10,280 Speaker 3: I have a lot of behaviors around sex and love 208 00:12:10,400 --> 00:12:14,000 Speaker 3: that have caused me tremendous issues all the way into sobriety. 209 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:19,320 Speaker 3: You know, I'm in recovery from eating disorders and you know, 210 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:22,600 Speaker 3: self injury was a huge part of my story as well. 211 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:26,240 Speaker 3: And you know what for me, recovery has granted me. 212 00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:28,720 Speaker 3: Like I thought that the rest of my life was 213 00:12:28,840 --> 00:12:32,640 Speaker 3: just going to be weighing up and battling those things. 214 00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:35,840 Speaker 3: And I will be honest, like the first maybe two 215 00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:38,280 Speaker 3: years of my recovery, it was like I had a 216 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:43,640 Speaker 3: very slow two years of just working out yeah, how 217 00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 3: my brain worked, and I didn't know how to do anything. 218 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:49,160 Speaker 3: Like I got sober when I was twenty five. Started 219 00:12:49,200 --> 00:12:51,280 Speaker 3: drinking when I was thirteen, so I missed out my 220 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:54,720 Speaker 3: developmental years. So like I was a twenty five year old, 221 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:57,000 Speaker 3: like learning how to make a cup of coffee, yeah, 222 00:12:57,000 --> 00:13:00,320 Speaker 3: because I've never made result a cup of coffee. But 223 00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:03,760 Speaker 3: what I found, like you know, with having a bit 224 00:13:03,800 --> 00:13:06,080 Speaker 3: of time, like six years, it's it's it's a chunk 225 00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:11,360 Speaker 3: of time. So you know, eventually you started to have 226 00:13:11,520 --> 00:13:14,040 Speaker 3: problems in the places where you didn't have places before, 227 00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:16,440 Speaker 3: and then you work out how to deal with those 228 00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:18,840 Speaker 3: problems in the places where you didn't have places before, 229 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:22,439 Speaker 3: and then you get a life. And it's like and 230 00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:24,720 Speaker 3: for for me because like I had a really quick 231 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 3: progression and because I got sober young, I didn't really 232 00:13:28,480 --> 00:13:31,640 Speaker 3: have anything to lose, Like I didn't lose a marriage 233 00:13:31,640 --> 00:13:33,960 Speaker 3: because I'd never been married. I didn't lose the house. 234 00:13:34,000 --> 00:13:35,640 Speaker 3: I never bought a house like I was at the 235 00:13:35,640 --> 00:13:37,679 Speaker 3: start of my career, so I never got like, well 236 00:13:37,720 --> 00:13:39,439 Speaker 3: I had been fired, make no mistake, but like I 237 00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:42,760 Speaker 3: never had like that professional fall from grace Yeah, So 238 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:45,960 Speaker 3: my recovery journey has simply been the process of like 239 00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:51,920 Speaker 3: building myself and finding like, you know, what I actually 240 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:55,200 Speaker 3: am and having the unique opportunity to like build from that. 241 00:13:55,679 --> 00:13:57,839 Speaker 3: Like it's it's been, and that's I want to be 242 00:13:57,840 --> 00:14:00,400 Speaker 3: an advocate for getting sober young because a lot of 243 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:02,240 Speaker 3: the time I was like, well, what's the point of 244 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:05,480 Speaker 3: me getting sober? Like I'm a pointless, useless human being 245 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:08,679 Speaker 3: that couldn't even like do anything right. I'm twenty I'm 246 00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:11,280 Speaker 3: twenty five, and I spend my days drinking vodka by 247 00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:14,760 Speaker 3: myself trying not to cut myself, Like what pointless existence? 248 00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:17,120 Speaker 3: And then six years later, I'm just like as the 249 00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:20,400 Speaker 3: other podcast dave been a dupy podcast. He was like, 250 00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:22,320 Speaker 3: you love more than anyone I've ever met, you know, 251 00:14:22,520 --> 00:14:24,000 Speaker 3: so like that's recovery. 252 00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:25,520 Speaker 2: Recovery, that's recovery. Okay. 253 00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:29,160 Speaker 1: I love this so much so dedicating this episode of 254 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:35,920 Speaker 1: Unaddictioned podcast to our young people. Yeah, yeah, out shout 255 00:14:35,920 --> 00:14:39,720 Speaker 1: out to my young people, because you're like, kind of 256 00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:42,720 Speaker 1: what I heard you saying, is this other idea that 257 00:14:42,760 --> 00:14:45,000 Speaker 1: I want people to let go of, that like there 258 00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:48,560 Speaker 1: has to be a rock bottom and you have a 259 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 1: new experienced bottom. You're like I am twenty five years 260 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 1: old at home struggling through this vaka bottle, trying not 261 00:14:54,760 --> 00:14:58,160 Speaker 1: to cut myself every day, right, Like that is emotional 262 00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:02,600 Speaker 1: pain and struggle, but it does tend to be described 263 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:06,440 Speaker 1: in those quote older people ways lost the marriage, lost 264 00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 1: a job, kids, you, et cetera. And so can you 265 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:12,920 Speaker 1: talk to us Lauren at twenty five? How did you 266 00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:18,800 Speaker 1: even become aware of the concept that, like there could 267 00:15:18,800 --> 00:15:22,400 Speaker 1: be recovery, something could be different. How did you take 268 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:24,760 Speaker 1: your first steps on the journey? How did you know 269 00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:28,240 Speaker 1: what first steps you wanted to take, like share share 270 00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 1: that part of the experience with us? Oh are you 271 00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:33,160 Speaker 1: people specifically? 272 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:37,240 Speaker 3: Yes, for the young people, like this is my you know, 273 00:15:37,400 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 3: I think that in writing, right, we talked about how 274 00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:43,760 Speaker 3: like a usp like unique selling point, like you've got 275 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:46,040 Speaker 3: to make your book like you know what unique, And 276 00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:48,280 Speaker 3: I kind of see that like on the personal levels 277 00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:50,640 Speaker 3: purpose like what has been what has happened to me? 278 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:53,560 Speaker 3: Or what have I got that, like it is unique 279 00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:56,040 Speaker 3: to me that I can use to like help people, 280 00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 3: and that for me is like the fact that I 281 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:01,760 Speaker 3: got sober young. There's a ton in early stuff on 282 00:16:01,840 --> 00:16:04,000 Speaker 3: my story. So yes, this is for the young people. 283 00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:06,560 Speaker 3: So I actually tried to get sober for the first 284 00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:09,400 Speaker 3: time when I was nineteen. I had a really, really, 285 00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:13,160 Speaker 3: really big consequence. When I was nineteen, I was on 286 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:19,239 Speaker 3: a tour of Italy, was an opera company, and I 287 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:22,840 Speaker 3: had been you know, it was very clear that I 288 00:16:22,920 --> 00:16:26,520 Speaker 3: did not drink like other people from a very young age, 289 00:16:26,560 --> 00:16:28,200 Speaker 3: like you know, the first time I drank, I black. 290 00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:35,040 Speaker 3: I started drinking around the time that I was trigger 291 00:16:35,080 --> 00:16:38,760 Speaker 3: warning I was being sexually abused by a teacher, and 292 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:40,960 Speaker 3: I realized that when I drank, I didn't have to 293 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:44,720 Speaker 3: remember that. So I was already like you know, drinking 294 00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:47,320 Speaker 3: was my only friend. It was my protector. It was 295 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:49,600 Speaker 3: the thing that was going to make me okay. And 296 00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:53,720 Speaker 3: because I didn't deal with that trauba until I got sober, 297 00:16:54,320 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 3: I am. Yeah. I just my drinking was it was 298 00:16:57,040 --> 00:17:00,600 Speaker 3: ballistic like it was. It was feral, you know, God 299 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:02,680 Speaker 3: bless that girl, like she was just doing what she 300 00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:04,160 Speaker 3: needed to get by. 301 00:17:04,359 --> 00:17:05,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's bad to. 302 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:10,480 Speaker 3: Survive exactly, like it was pure survival. Also, I was 303 00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:14,840 Speaker 3: in Italy and I ran off with this group of 304 00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:18,679 Speaker 3: Italian men and I don't know what I took. I 305 00:17:18,760 --> 00:17:21,760 Speaker 3: just know that I took something and blocked out and 306 00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:24,120 Speaker 3: my friends found me. I don't remember the night, but 307 00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:28,280 Speaker 3: I remember waking up in like bed and that my 308 00:17:28,320 --> 00:17:30,560 Speaker 3: best friend was crying and she looks at me and 309 00:17:30,560 --> 00:17:32,680 Speaker 3: shows like I cannot even stand the sight of you 310 00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:35,680 Speaker 3: right now, and I was like, oh, I have messed up. 311 00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:38,560 Speaker 3: So that scared me sober for a while, but I 312 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 3: did not seek any help because I did not think 313 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:42,919 Speaker 3: that I needed help, because I was like, I'm nineteen 314 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:46,080 Speaker 3: years old. I am not doing anything that any nineteen 315 00:17:46,119 --> 00:17:52,280 Speaker 3: year old hasn't done. And because I didn't seek the help, 316 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:54,359 Speaker 3: I turned back to drinking. I turned back to drinking 317 00:17:54,440 --> 00:17:57,600 Speaker 3: in a way that was so intense that I made 318 00:17:57,640 --> 00:17:59,639 Speaker 3: an attempts on my life and ended up on the sideboard. 319 00:18:01,240 --> 00:18:03,879 Speaker 3: And they said, you need to get sober or you 320 00:18:03,880 --> 00:18:06,960 Speaker 3: will not make the age of twenty five. But because 321 00:18:07,080 --> 00:18:09,600 Speaker 3: I didn't want to make the age of twenty five, 322 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:11,840 Speaker 3: I was like, okay, don't time me with a good 323 00:18:11,880 --> 00:18:19,800 Speaker 3: time fantastic. So I got myself into another corner. This 324 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:23,560 Speaker 3: was another corner to do with men, and I was 325 00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:27,480 Speaker 3: kind of trapped between two men and I thought, this 326 00:18:27,760 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 3: is absolutely unbearable. I'm at the Mercy of bad Men. 327 00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:34,000 Speaker 3: I'm going to move to America. So I'd always had 328 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:35,760 Speaker 3: the idea to move to America because there was lots 329 00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:39,440 Speaker 3: of opera opportunities over there. I got I managed to 330 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:42,600 Speaker 3: apply to school, I got a scholarship. I was like fantastic, 331 00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:44,840 Speaker 3: Like here we go. And then I met all of 332 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:47,159 Speaker 3: these new people that didn't know that I was like, 333 00:18:47,320 --> 00:18:50,720 Speaker 3: you know, Lauren, the feral drinker that you didn't want 334 00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:52,760 Speaker 3: to go out with because she, you know, ended up 335 00:18:52,760 --> 00:18:54,800 Speaker 3: in the Psychechord. Like they thought I was fun and 336 00:18:54,880 --> 00:18:56,920 Speaker 3: I was foreign and I was Scottish and this is 337 00:18:56,920 --> 00:18:58,640 Speaker 3: what Scottish people are like. And I was like, yes, 338 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:00,520 Speaker 3: this is what Scottish people are like. It's not what 339 00:19:00,520 --> 00:19:04,399 Speaker 3: Scottis people are like. But you know, when you're an alcoholic, 340 00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:06,720 Speaker 3: like you know, like I was like, I've fed into 341 00:19:06,720 --> 00:19:11,760 Speaker 3: that stereotype. But then even they were like, we've got 342 00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:14,600 Speaker 3: rehearsal tomorrow. And then it got to the point that 343 00:19:14,640 --> 00:19:16,840 Speaker 3: like I was drinking before shows, and then it got 344 00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:20,280 Speaker 3: to the point that I was, you know, blackout four shows, 345 00:19:20,359 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 3: like these were three hour operas and I was blackout. 346 00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:27,920 Speaker 3: And there was this one singer who was sober and 347 00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:32,119 Speaker 3: he said to me, he was like, hey, buddy, you 348 00:19:32,359 --> 00:19:36,320 Speaker 3: know are you Are you okay? And I kind of like, 349 00:19:36,359 --> 00:19:37,840 Speaker 3: you know, and then I had that first moment of 350 00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:40,840 Speaker 3: break down like I'm not okay, Like everything is terrible, 351 00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 3: like I'm so scared, but I can't let anyone know, 352 00:19:45,560 --> 00:19:48,720 Speaker 3: like drinking is killing me, but it's also the only 353 00:19:48,760 --> 00:19:51,320 Speaker 3: thing that's keeping me together. And then he you know, 354 00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:53,480 Speaker 3: pointed me in the direction of resources. He told me 355 00:19:53,520 --> 00:19:56,399 Speaker 3: his story and I was like, yeah, I'm gonna get sober. 356 00:19:57,119 --> 00:19:59,159 Speaker 3: And I think this, like this is the part of 357 00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:01,239 Speaker 3: the story that I always hesitate to tell, but like 358 00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:04,680 Speaker 3: I start drinking again after that. I do think it's 359 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:07,639 Speaker 3: important to recognize that, like that story wasn't for nothing 360 00:20:07,680 --> 00:20:11,000 Speaker 3: because that planted a seed I could not forget. 361 00:20:11,119 --> 00:20:11,800 Speaker 2: They need you. 362 00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:16,520 Speaker 3: Yes, So yeah, that wasn't the moment that I got sober, 363 00:20:16,560 --> 00:20:18,680 Speaker 3: but it was a moment that I couldn't forget. 364 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 1: And you know, and even do not ever hesitate to 365 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:26,920 Speaker 1: tell this part of the story ever again, Like what 366 00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:29,159 Speaker 1: did the young folks say, like say it with your 367 00:20:29,240 --> 00:20:31,800 Speaker 1: chest like this, you know what I mean? 368 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:33,760 Speaker 2: Like this is. 369 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 1: So important because it is dangerous the idea that if 370 00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:42,000 Speaker 1: you try and then you drink again. There's no reason 371 00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 1: to try, because there's something about you that is dangerous. 372 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:50,600 Speaker 1: Like let's plant every single seed. Let's water every single seed, 373 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:54,920 Speaker 1: and one seed will bloom one day. We just keep gardening, 374 00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:57,080 Speaker 1: We just keep gardening. 375 00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:00,879 Speaker 3: Oh my god, my heart just all opened at that. 376 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:06,399 Speaker 3: That was stunning. Okay, yeah, and he he was you know, 377 00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:09,560 Speaker 3: he was my first gardener, like he really and we 378 00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:12,920 Speaker 3: still talk, like, you know, we met each other years later, 379 00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:15,200 Speaker 3: and you know, after that moment, and I did get 380 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:16,960 Speaker 3: a little bit of sober time after that. I did 381 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:18,879 Speaker 3: it by myself because I wasn't in a position to 382 00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:21,000 Speaker 3: ask for help. But I remember, like a couple of 383 00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 3: weeks later, like I was in a practice room and 384 00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:25,240 Speaker 3: I was dronk and he came in and he was like, hey, 385 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 3: how are you doing? And I was so full of 386 00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:28,880 Speaker 3: shamed because I was drunk. And this was the guy 387 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:30,399 Speaker 3: that like taught me that, you know, you could be 388 00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:34,239 Speaker 3: sober and happy. But as I said, like, and how 389 00:21:34,280 --> 00:21:35,879 Speaker 3: am I to say that in that short period that 390 00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,399 Speaker 3: I had sober, like that wasn't a life saving period 391 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:41,240 Speaker 3: of time, like any period of time that I spent sober, 392 00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:44,320 Speaker 3: even if it didn't stick like that was useful time. 393 00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:49,080 Speaker 3: So yeah, I then moved to a different college town 394 00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:53,159 Speaker 3: because I graduated from that degree. I did it. I 395 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:55,639 Speaker 3: wasn't ready to have a professional career because I was 396 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 3: a drunk basically, and I didn't want to go home 397 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:02,280 Speaker 3: because there was nothing there for me. I didn't have 398 00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:05,120 Speaker 3: any friends, I didn't like my I have a very 399 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:07,800 Speaker 3: loving family relationship, but like I didn't want to show 400 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:09,520 Speaker 3: my family like that I was a failure, if you 401 00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:10,920 Speaker 3: know what I mean. Like I was like, I can't 402 00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:12,760 Speaker 3: go home and tell them that, like I've squandered this 403 00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 3: huge chance. So I got and I said another master's degree. 404 00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:20,439 Speaker 3: Something I was looking out for me because I go 405 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:22,840 Speaker 3: a scholarship to this master's degree. And I moved there. 406 00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:26,200 Speaker 3: And I remember moving there and I was thinking, like, Lawren, 407 00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:31,320 Speaker 3: please stay sober, like nice, And what did I do? 408 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:33,199 Speaker 3: I got, I touched down and got drunk, and I 409 00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:36,119 Speaker 3: was like, you are so useless, Like I hate you 410 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:38,639 Speaker 3: so much. You can't even promise that you've made to yourself, 411 00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:41,240 Speaker 3: you know, just all of that self clothing. And then 412 00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:43,840 Speaker 3: my what really really really brought me to my knees 413 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:49,639 Speaker 3: was a physical withdrawal that required hospitalization. And at that point, 414 00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:51,520 Speaker 3: you know, I'd been there before. It was not my 415 00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:56,640 Speaker 3: first time that was hospitalized. But something was different. And 416 00:22:56,760 --> 00:22:59,159 Speaker 3: this is kind of like an inexplicable moment in my 417 00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:02,920 Speaker 3: recovery story that you know, even the loads of people 418 00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:04,560 Speaker 3: had tried to get me help and I'd literally just 419 00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:08,879 Speaker 3: like left the country or moved state. One final person 420 00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:10,760 Speaker 3: said to me, you know, I thought she was going 421 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:14,520 Speaker 3: to say your visa has been revoked. You got to 422 00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:16,960 Speaker 3: move home. And I remember thinking, you know, I felt relief. 423 00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:18,720 Speaker 3: I was twenty five, so I was like, Okay, well 424 00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:20,560 Speaker 3: this is the moment I killed myself, Like this is 425 00:23:20,600 --> 00:23:24,320 Speaker 3: the moment that it's all over. And she said to me, 426 00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:28,800 Speaker 3: we're going to get you help, and something inside me 427 00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:33,480 Speaker 3: just said take that help. Was it was a call 428 00:23:33,520 --> 00:23:37,320 Speaker 3: from inside the house and it just said you are done. 429 00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:41,680 Speaker 3: And I don't know what it was. You know, I 430 00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:43,879 Speaker 3: am a twelve stepper, so like I do consider that 431 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:47,440 Speaker 3: to be like paragrater than myself, because it didn't come, 432 00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:51,960 Speaker 3: you know, from anywhere I could explain or understand. But 433 00:23:52,280 --> 00:23:54,560 Speaker 3: that was the moment that I said, yes, please help me. 434 00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:58,320 Speaker 3: Like I don't know what I expected on the other side, 435 00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:02,879 Speaker 3: I was terrified, but I just, yeah, there was just 436 00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:06,600 Speaker 3: something inside. Maybe it's a soul, maybe it's my rebellious nature, 437 00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,119 Speaker 3: maybe it's just it was that last kernel of like 438 00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:12,960 Speaker 3: hoop inside me. That Yeah, it just says like you're done, 439 00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:16,360 Speaker 3: Like this, this is done. And that's not to say 440 00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:18,320 Speaker 3: the next I was so easier, but like that was 441 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:21,400 Speaker 3: then and as of my current you know spriy today, 442 00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:23,480 Speaker 3: that that was my that was my last drink and 443 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:25,400 Speaker 3: god willing will be my last drink. 444 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:33,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, such an emotional story starting all the way back 445 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:37,880 Speaker 1: trigger warning, like you said, from the teacher that violated you, 446 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:43,800 Speaker 1: and so many young people having those experiences and not 447 00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:46,440 Speaker 1: being able to get help for any number of very 448 00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:51,840 Speaker 1: complex reasons. Even how that probably carries forward to the 449 00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:55,399 Speaker 1: self loathing you had, the self harm, the drinking, just 450 00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:56,440 Speaker 1: to survive. 451 00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:58,320 Speaker 2: The love and men. 452 00:24:59,119 --> 00:24:59,400 Speaker 1: You know. 453 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:03,400 Speaker 2: You've yeah that you've that you've managed. 454 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,760 Speaker 1: I think going forward kind of with this gardening theme, 455 00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:08,760 Speaker 1: like that was beautiful. First of all, you said he 456 00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:12,399 Speaker 1: was my first gardener. That like made me a little teary. 457 00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:16,800 Speaker 1: That was so beautiful. And then this visa lady right, 458 00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:21,400 Speaker 1: like visa lady, this is my whole thing is that 459 00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:24,159 Speaker 1: each and every one of us, we don't have to 460 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:27,280 Speaker 1: know anything but just compassion. 461 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:29,400 Speaker 3: Like probably. 462 00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:36,680 Speaker 1: I didn't know anything, like she wasn't an addiction expert, right. 463 00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:41,680 Speaker 3: Right exactly, that's it. Yes, Oh my god, then you've 464 00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:45,199 Speaker 3: you've hit the nail on the head actually, and you know, 465 00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:49,680 Speaker 3: I really too. Yeah, sorry, like that that just really 466 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:53,119 Speaker 3: struck me, like there are so many people. For for 467 00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:55,200 Speaker 3: a very long time, the only people that I knew 468 00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:59,879 Speaker 3: in my life were so wear alcoholics and people in recovery, 469 00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:03,160 Speaker 3: largely because I was terrified of everyone else on planet 470 00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:05,800 Speaker 3: Earth and I only wanted to speak to people in recovery. 471 00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:08,199 Speaker 3: But my life is is very large now, like and 472 00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:10,880 Speaker 3: I've got lots of you know, friends and a freelancer, 473 00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:13,119 Speaker 3: I wrote lots of different clients, and you know, so 474 00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:15,240 Speaker 3: I'd say that balance is now like fifty to fifty, like, 475 00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:18,080 Speaker 3: you know, people in recovery and the people who've never 476 00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:25,040 Speaker 3: experienced addiction. And something that really touched me when I 477 00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:30,480 Speaker 3: when Matthew Perry died. That was a really unsettling moment 478 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 3: for a lot of people in recovery, and as obviously 479 00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,159 Speaker 3: is when anyone like like I've lost lots of people 480 00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:40,840 Speaker 3: in my recovery journey to addiction, and you know, when 481 00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:44,600 Speaker 3: someone who is high profile I passes the way, like, 482 00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:48,159 Speaker 3: it just kicks up all of that. And it was 483 00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:51,399 Speaker 3: someone in my life who has never experienced addiction that 484 00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:54,320 Speaker 3: touched that reached out to me. My sister as well, 485 00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:56,199 Speaker 3: who's you know, obviously got the experience of addiction of 486 00:26:56,240 --> 00:27:00,000 Speaker 3: being a sister of an adult. But yeah, and it's 487 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 3: this this friend never experienced addiction and didn't really know 488 00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:05,040 Speaker 3: much about my story, so that wasn't like the main 489 00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:08,320 Speaker 3: feature of our friendship was like, hey, like, I'm just 490 00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:10,439 Speaker 3: just to let you know, like I'm thinking of you today, 491 00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:15,400 Speaker 3: like it's much and how difficult this is and wow, 492 00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:18,719 Speaker 3: like and she was just coming as if Pasha shouldn't 493 00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:20,639 Speaker 3: get to be an expert. She didn't need to like, 494 00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:22,720 Speaker 3: you know, quote things at me. It was just that 495 00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:25,760 Speaker 3: little heartfelt moment of like, hey, how bet you're hurting 496 00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:27,720 Speaker 3: right now, and if you want to talk about it, 497 00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:30,920 Speaker 3: I'm here. Oh my god. Like just the small but 498 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:34,280 Speaker 3: significant moments that are really big. Yeah, I love it. 499 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:35,880 Speaker 2: I love it a lot of times. 500 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:36,080 Speaker 3: You know. 501 00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:38,760 Speaker 1: The book is called six mind Changing Conversations that could 502 00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:42,040 Speaker 1: save a life is the what do I call this subtitle? 503 00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:46,360 Speaker 1: And it's really we have been so afraid to talk 504 00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 1: about addiction because it's scary. It's ravishing the people we love, 505 00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:52,639 Speaker 1: it's stealing them from us, you know, causing us a 506 00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:56,200 Speaker 1: lot of loss. But what you just said is literally 507 00:27:56,320 --> 00:28:01,119 Speaker 1: the script for every single conversation, which is just I 508 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:03,800 Speaker 1: think I see you hurting right now, just want you 509 00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:07,080 Speaker 1: to know I'm here. It is that is the beginning 510 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:12,760 Speaker 1: of every single conversation. And your first gardener, that's how 511 00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:15,800 Speaker 1: he came to you planet the seed saved your life. 512 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:19,960 Speaker 1: That the's a lady saved your life, your sister right here, 513 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:23,000 Speaker 1: like it maybe was not at a point where your 514 00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:26,200 Speaker 1: literal life had to be saved, but like put another 515 00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:29,679 Speaker 1: little seed in your in your spirit, you know. 516 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:35,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, totally. I think like underneath or I'll speak for myself, 517 00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:39,040 Speaker 3: like underneath my addiction and underneath my alcoholism is a 518 00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:44,160 Speaker 3: fundamental fear that no one cares about me, like nobody 519 00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:46,760 Speaker 3: loves me. Like someone said to me once that like 520 00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:50,040 Speaker 3: drinking is a longing for love. Like and you know, 521 00:28:50,280 --> 00:28:53,240 Speaker 3: there's a song by Frightened Rabbit called Wish I Wish 522 00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:55,480 Speaker 3: it was sober and like there's a line and that's 523 00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,680 Speaker 3: like a blush of love. It hits me without warning. 524 00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:01,240 Speaker 3: That's how he describes strings King. Yeah, and that's how 525 00:29:01,360 --> 00:29:03,080 Speaker 3: drinking was for me. That was like the blush of 526 00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 3: love that I could not receive from any other way. 527 00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:13,200 Speaker 3: And yes, so like those little the signals you know, 528 00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:15,080 Speaker 3: when we're in a place to receive them, that like, 529 00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:18,440 Speaker 3: oh I matter, like I'm matter these people and even 530 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 3: though I'm this like Haywire alcoholic, like and sometimes with 531 00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:24,160 Speaker 3: my friends aren't in recovery, I'm kind of other of 532 00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:27,000 Speaker 3: myself because I'm like, oh, I'm like the high maintenance, 533 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:30,360 Speaker 3: recovering weirdo like you know, which is not true. That's 534 00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:35,320 Speaker 3: the percent I have. Just like yeah, like those reiterations 535 00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:39,520 Speaker 3: like of you, you matter, and it was you know, 536 00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:41,280 Speaker 3: I'm I am very lucky and I will I will, 537 00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:43,680 Speaker 3: I will always acknowledge this that like I'm a you know, 538 00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:48,040 Speaker 3: I'm an articulate educated like white women, so that you know, 539 00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:50,720 Speaker 3: I get a lot of I kind of get a 540 00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:54,240 Speaker 3: you know, I'm an acceptable alcoholic, shall we say, Like 541 00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:57,880 Speaker 3: people are comfortable hearing my story because I can put 542 00:29:57,920 --> 00:29:59,479 Speaker 3: it into good words and I can say like who 543 00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:03,880 Speaker 3: got these the And one of my charges, I suppose, 544 00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:06,000 Speaker 3: is like I really really want it to be that 545 00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:10,040 Speaker 3: we extend that level of compassion to every single person, 546 00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:13,800 Speaker 3: and that you know, whether their job of choice is 547 00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:18,520 Speaker 3: ivy use, IVY drug use or workaholism or alcoholism, you 548 00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:22,080 Speaker 3: know it. You know, it's all. It's an exercise and compassion. 549 00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:24,960 Speaker 3: And sorry, I'm so I'm in so many tangents, but 550 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,160 Speaker 3: I'm just so fired up by this conversation about compassion 551 00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:29,440 Speaker 3: because like it's it's so portent. 552 00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:34,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so potent. It's so potent. And there's something 553 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:38,800 Speaker 1: about you matter that is actually I know what it is. 554 00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:41,360 Speaker 1: I was gonna say, an innate biological need. It like 555 00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:46,440 Speaker 1: literally is based in dope. It is the adopted for 556 00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:51,520 Speaker 1: just a minute, it is like an innate need for survival. 557 00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:58,240 Speaker 1: And then there's also something particularly particularly potent about you 558 00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:02,840 Speaker 1: matter so much to me that I am making this 559 00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:08,080 Speaker 1: effort for you, right for you. Yeah, okay, time is flying, 560 00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:12,400 Speaker 1: Holy schmoles lace. So I want to get into your 561 00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:17,640 Speaker 1: magic formula. So I heard you say twelve stepper. I 562 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:22,680 Speaker 1: heard you say my usp My unique selling problem for 563 00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:26,920 Speaker 1: a human is like purpose. I hear your passion around 564 00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:31,800 Speaker 1: young people. So can you just share maybe what your 565 00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:37,120 Speaker 1: magic formula is today and how it has changed. 566 00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:42,520 Speaker 3: Oh that's such a good question. Okay, So yes, I 567 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:45,400 Speaker 3: am a told stepper. I'm a member of various twelve 568 00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:48,400 Speaker 3: step fellowships. It's not for everybody, it's certainly for me, 569 00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:53,280 Speaker 3: and I think that the reason that that works for 570 00:31:53,400 --> 00:32:00,840 Speaker 3: me is the idea of being part of something and I, 571 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:03,920 Speaker 3: you know, and I think that that means for belonging 572 00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:07,040 Speaker 3: as someone who is chronically overed and has a head 573 00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:09,560 Speaker 3: that tells me like you don't belong everyone's looking at you, 574 00:32:09,640 --> 00:32:14,720 Speaker 3: You're weird. To be in that space was not always 575 00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 3: comfortable at first, but it kind of resocialized me first 576 00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:19,520 Speaker 3: to be like, okay, like this is how you have 577 00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:22,240 Speaker 3: a conversation, this is how you make up a coffee. 578 00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:25,360 Speaker 3: And the reason why I still do that and why 579 00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:27,800 Speaker 3: that's you know, part of my magic formula today is 580 00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:32,000 Speaker 3: because I want to be a helper. Like I spent 581 00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:34,880 Speaker 3: my whole life being like, why is not what helping me? Yeah? 582 00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:39,920 Speaker 3: And I spent a lot of my life feeling you know, 583 00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:45,200 Speaker 3: like when you've I've been abused something you'll always hear 584 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:49,520 Speaker 3: is you know, if you tell someone bad, things will happen. 585 00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:52,720 Speaker 3: And that was like the first space where I told 586 00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:57,120 Speaker 3: someone something honestly and good things happened, and I learned 587 00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:01,760 Speaker 3: the purpose of honesty and coming back to myself. So 588 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:03,120 Speaker 3: you know that's. 589 00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:08,520 Speaker 2: Because you said it. 590 00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:10,600 Speaker 1: Twelve step is not for everyone, and I'm here to 591 00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:18,000 Speaker 1: tell you nothing is for everyone. Something is for everyone, 592 00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:20,480 Speaker 1: And I want to put the emphasis on what you said, 593 00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:25,280 Speaker 1: which is the twelfth step fellowship, the sense of belonging. 594 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:29,600 Speaker 1: It didn't always feel comfortable, so I always tell people like, 595 00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:31,720 Speaker 1: just try everything and then if it's not for you, great, 596 00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:34,400 Speaker 1: we're gonna try something else. But what you just said 597 00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:39,760 Speaker 1: just now, especially as a survivor of childhood abuse, that 598 00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:44,600 Speaker 1: was the first time I told somebody something quote bad 599 00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:53,200 Speaker 1: and something good happened. That is extremely healing, supremely healing. Okay, sorry, 600 00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:55,880 Speaker 1: go ahead, jumping in your magic. 601 00:33:57,840 --> 00:34:01,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, well you just perfectly summer so sucimply exactly like 602 00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:02,840 Speaker 3: what I meant. And I love that because I'm very 603 00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:03,680 Speaker 3: long form. 604 00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:12,320 Speaker 2: You know, long form competition our podcast. 605 00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:19,280 Speaker 3: So so yeah, in I So, I was in therapy 606 00:34:19,640 --> 00:34:23,200 Speaker 3: for my first year and a half of recovery. I 607 00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:26,600 Speaker 3: was doing like a talk therapy and kind of just 608 00:34:26,640 --> 00:34:29,719 Speaker 3: to get the words for what my uh my brain 609 00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:33,120 Speaker 3: was and like what you know, the voice experiences in 610 00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:36,600 Speaker 3: a way that was very very honest with a professional 611 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:42,239 Speaker 3: because I had experienced psychosis before, so we just needed 612 00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:44,640 Speaker 3: to like make make sure that, you know, I didn't 613 00:34:44,719 --> 00:34:50,440 Speaker 3: fall into any extreme mental health consequences. So that was 614 00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:52,320 Speaker 3: available to me, and I was very grateful for that. 615 00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:57,840 Speaker 3: And then in recent years, last year I did I 616 00:34:57,920 --> 00:35:01,080 Speaker 3: started trauma therapy, which was really good because I know 617 00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,960 Speaker 3: research trauma because my master's thesis was the impact of 618 00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:07,640 Speaker 3: trauma on the voice. So I had like a very 619 00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:12,279 Speaker 3: intellectual understanding of trauma. And then I realized, like, oh man, 620 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,320 Speaker 3: like this I started this research for me. It was 621 00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:22,120 Speaker 3: always about me now emotional understanding exactly right. And I'm 622 00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:25,800 Speaker 3: very very glad that that came. That that came a 623 00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:28,480 Speaker 3: year ago, because any earlier I don't know if I 624 00:35:28,560 --> 00:35:31,440 Speaker 3: necessarily would have been in place to handle it. My 625 00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:35,560 Speaker 3: my third year of recovery was just the rockiest road 626 00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:37,680 Speaker 3: I've ever experienced. It was the you know, it was 627 00:35:37,719 --> 00:35:39,640 Speaker 3: a pandemic year. I had a break up, I had 628 00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:42,840 Speaker 3: an unemployment, I had a you know, in your homemost experience, 629 00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:44,000 Speaker 3: it was it was a lot. So if I was 630 00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:46,439 Speaker 3: going through that then I would have lost my hand died. 631 00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:51,800 Speaker 3: So and I suppose, like like I said earlier, like 632 00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:56,160 Speaker 3: my recovery journey has been quite long and slow so 633 00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:58,440 Speaker 3: far because I came in and I didn't know how 634 00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:01,960 Speaker 3: to do anything. I couldn't have a conversation. I was 635 00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:06,120 Speaker 3: so scared. I was very paranoid. I you know, just 636 00:36:06,400 --> 00:36:09,600 Speaker 3: really took it very gently in the first year, and 637 00:36:09,719 --> 00:36:12,600 Speaker 3: then the second year I got a little bit braver, 638 00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:15,800 Speaker 3: And where my recovery is at to day, it's like 639 00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:19,960 Speaker 3: taking what I've learned in through my various modalities, you know, 640 00:36:20,120 --> 00:36:24,720 Speaker 3: through the twelve step recovery scene, through more trauma informed stuff, 641 00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:30,160 Speaker 3: through talk therapy, and applying that like to making my 642 00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:34,200 Speaker 3: life biggers. So thank you know, there's a really great quote, 643 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:37,759 Speaker 3: you know, pain is the touchstone of spiritual progress, and 644 00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:40,279 Speaker 3: that had absolutely been true for me. But where I'm 645 00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:44,120 Speaker 3: at today is like joy is also a touchstone of 646 00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:49,480 Speaker 3: my spiritual progress. So where I'm looking now is where 647 00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:51,279 Speaker 3: are they? You know, I feel strong enough to like 648 00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:54,399 Speaker 3: carry the vibration of joy, and I've got a lot 649 00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:56,160 Speaker 3: making up to do because I had a very sad 650 00:36:56,320 --> 00:37:01,680 Speaker 3: twenty five years, so make sure experience and joy in 651 00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:05,120 Speaker 3: my life. So that's kind of like the little thing 652 00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:09,080 Speaker 3: that you know, I've been focusing on and you know, 653 00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:12,720 Speaker 3: underpinning that with all of the principles of like honesty 654 00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:17,240 Speaker 3: and gratitude and service and love, and from those things 655 00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:20,640 Speaker 3: has come this joy and I've become you know, very 656 00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:22,640 Speaker 3: It's funny because like when I got sober, I wanted 657 00:37:22,680 --> 00:37:25,799 Speaker 3: to be like really serious and like a loose all 658 00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:29,520 Speaker 3: these things, and I've just become very enthusiastic and exuberant 659 00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:33,520 Speaker 3: and excitable. So yeah, and I think that's like, you know, 660 00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:36,719 Speaker 3: to kind of wrap up on my magic formula. Like 661 00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:43,920 Speaker 3: I didn't consider myself a worthy candidate for sobriety because 662 00:37:44,120 --> 00:37:47,440 Speaker 3: I thought that like my life was pointless. I was like, 663 00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:49,360 Speaker 3: I'm never going to make anything of my life and 664 00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:57,000 Speaker 3: me being alive is just inherently painful. But today it's 665 00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:59,920 Speaker 3: kind of like, you know, I need to keep building 666 00:38:00,360 --> 00:38:03,040 Speaker 3: this life that I don't want to run away from. 667 00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,319 Speaker 3: And that has happened, as I tho, very very very 668 00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:10,080 Speaker 3: slowly for me. But you know, if you want to, 669 00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:14,360 Speaker 3: you know, if taken yourself seriously and just make it, 670 00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:16,800 Speaker 3: you know, saying yourself like, your life is not a joke, 671 00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:19,800 Speaker 3: your life is not pointless, and then putting in this 672 00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:26,160 Speaker 3: teeny tiny actions day by day to amount to something 673 00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:29,400 Speaker 3: that like might not be magnificent, like I'm certainly not 674 00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:31,920 Speaker 3: rich and certainly not famous. I'm certainly not like you know, 675 00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:33,600 Speaker 3: I don't have a mortgage on, a husband and all 676 00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:35,399 Speaker 3: of that stuff, Like I've got boyfriend in a flat 677 00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:41,840 Speaker 3: that'll though. So it's you know, like just finding that 678 00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:44,719 Speaker 3: life you don't want to run away from with tiny, incremental, 679 00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:49,840 Speaker 3: small but significant efforts. You can't shortcut it. But like 680 00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:54,719 Speaker 3: along the way, somewhere the process became joyful, and I'm 681 00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:55,520 Speaker 3: very grateful for that. 682 00:38:56,640 --> 00:38:59,400 Speaker 2: I love it. I love every single word of it. 683 00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:04,240 Speaker 1: So honesty, gratitude, service, purpose, actually purpose. 684 00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:05,719 Speaker 2: I think maybe it came first. 685 00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:11,120 Speaker 1: Gratitude, fellowship, service, honesty. 686 00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:12,080 Speaker 3: Joy. 687 00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:16,680 Speaker 2: I love it so much. Okay, So in the last few. 688 00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:20,080 Speaker 1: Minutes of every episode, maybe I used to say like 689 00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:22,080 Speaker 1: half the time, and now I think maybe it's only 690 00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:23,080 Speaker 1: like a quarter of the time. 691 00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:25,440 Speaker 3: Do I remember to tell people upfront that I'm going 692 00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:28,239 Speaker 3: to ask this question? So did not tell you a front? 693 00:39:29,800 --> 00:39:30,960 Speaker 2: Now on the spot. 694 00:39:32,719 --> 00:39:34,719 Speaker 1: This word n addiction for the book. We made it 695 00:39:34,840 --> 00:39:38,320 Speaker 1: up and the idea is unlearned what you think you 696 00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:45,200 Speaker 1: know about addictions, Undo stigma that's killing people. Uncover one 697 00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:49,200 Speaker 1: conversation that we need to be having. And so my 698 00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:52,000 Speaker 1: question for you and I would love it. I'm legit 699 00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:56,759 Speaker 1: serious pointing this episode at our young people who think 700 00:39:56,880 --> 00:40:02,359 Speaker 1: their life is useless. There's one thing you want them 701 00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:05,719 Speaker 1: to unmirn. One stigma you want us to undo that 702 00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:08,719 Speaker 1: we're pointing at these young people, one conversation you want 703 00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:13,279 Speaker 1: us to uncover, to have with these young people, what 704 00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:15,919 Speaker 1: would you leave us with? Oh? 705 00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:20,600 Speaker 3: God, I think by what immediately came to my mind there? 706 00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:22,879 Speaker 3: And I guess like if I'm imagining like my twenty 707 00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:28,360 Speaker 3: five year old self in front of me, and you know, 708 00:40:28,600 --> 00:40:35,239 Speaker 3: I had really marked I what I thought my you know, 709 00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:38,839 Speaker 3: what I thought would be a life worth living by 710 00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:44,800 Speaker 3: achievement and by success and by the path that you know, 711 00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:49,719 Speaker 3: generations before me had followed. And that wasn't necessarily a 712 00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:53,160 Speaker 3: viable path for me. And you know for young people today. 713 00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:57,200 Speaker 3: You know we've seen, you know, all these global financial 714 00:40:57,280 --> 00:41:02,040 Speaker 3: recessions we had. We're perpetually like over stimulated by more 715 00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:08,360 Speaker 3: information than a central nervous system can handle. What our parents, 716 00:41:09,480 --> 00:41:13,840 Speaker 3: God bless them, prepared us for, they couldn't have predicted. 717 00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:19,000 Speaker 3: So we're kind of you know, for instance, like the internet, 718 00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:23,239 Speaker 3: like that's the we were the person people teaching our 719 00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:26,440 Speaker 3: parents how to use the internet. Like, you know, we're 720 00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:29,240 Speaker 3: in this weird period of time where everything just feels 721 00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:32,200 Speaker 3: like it's getting worse. And I thought that I couldn't 722 00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:36,759 Speaker 3: get sober because I couldn't change anything, Like I thought 723 00:41:36,840 --> 00:41:40,280 Speaker 3: that it was just a pointless endeavor. And I suppose 724 00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:43,000 Speaker 3: what I want to say to twenty five year old 725 00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:45,560 Speaker 3: Lauren and all of the young people that like, your 726 00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:51,799 Speaker 3: existence in itself is vital, Like it's not just important. 727 00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:57,920 Speaker 3: It's vital to your communities, to your family, to your friends, 728 00:41:58,120 --> 00:42:02,440 Speaker 3: to your neighbors, to the people that you pass in 729 00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:05,840 Speaker 3: the street. You know you are and whether you believe 730 00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:11,040 Speaker 3: it or not, you are vital. There's something inside you 731 00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:14,239 Speaker 3: that like only you can give. So like if you 732 00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:17,200 Speaker 3: are a caring person, like care for someone, If you're 733 00:42:17,239 --> 00:42:19,600 Speaker 3: a friendly person, like be a friend. If you're a 734 00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:24,040 Speaker 3: funny person, like be funny, and like find through action, 735 00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:30,319 Speaker 3: like really feel that because It's one of those things 736 00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:31,800 Speaker 3: that you like, you don't believe it till you see it, 737 00:42:32,360 --> 00:42:35,600 Speaker 3: but other people see it before you do, and you 738 00:42:35,719 --> 00:42:39,919 Speaker 3: know it's yeah, Like the word vital just keeps coming 739 00:42:39,960 --> 00:42:42,400 Speaker 3: to my mind because I don't love the people in 740 00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:44,880 Speaker 3: my life because they're like important or famous or changing 741 00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:48,800 Speaker 3: the world. Like I love them for what they do 742 00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:51,960 Speaker 3: on the day to day, like for the small interactions 743 00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:56,080 Speaker 3: that we have, for you know, just everything that they are. Yeah, 744 00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:59,400 Speaker 3: So you know it's yeah, so yeah, it's so easy 745 00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:01,480 Speaker 3: to be hoped us and you know the world is 746 00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:03,800 Speaker 3: engineered for us to be hopefuls, so we keep buying 747 00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:10,239 Speaker 3: stuff and zoning out. So let's remember our inherent worth 748 00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:14,120 Speaker 3: and you know, let's do this together. Thanks. We really 749 00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:14,760 Speaker 3: need each. 750 00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:15,840 Speaker 2: Other, we really really do. 751 00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:20,480 Speaker 1: Oh man, I felt that, like all the way down 752 00:43:20,520 --> 00:43:25,200 Speaker 1: to my pinky toes, existence is vital. 753 00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:30,080 Speaker 2: Listen, I loved this conversation. 754 00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:34,879 Speaker 3: Oh my god, I wish were dead. How far hours. 755 00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:40,360 Speaker 2: We can buil all of it? Man, Lauren, thank you 756 00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:44,680 Speaker 2: so so much, Thank you so much. 757 00:43:45,120 --> 00:43:46,719 Speaker 3: Oh my god, thank you so much for having me. 758 00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:49,400 Speaker 3: This has been so much fun, absolutely incredible. 759 00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:51,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, come on, thank you so much for tuning in 760 00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:54,480 Speaker 1: and If you like this episode, please check out my 761 00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:59,399 Speaker 1: book on Addiction, Six mind changing Conversations that Could Save 762 00:43:59,440 --> 00:44:03,720 Speaker 1: a Life, available at Barnes Andnoble, Bookshop, dot org, Union 763 00:44:03,800 --> 00:44:08,160 Speaker 1: Squaring Company, Amazon, and wherever books are sold. If you 764 00:44:08,320 --> 00:44:11,160 Speaker 1: like to this episode, please share it with someone you 765 00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:14,440 Speaker 1: think may need to hear it. Also, please subscribe to 766 00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:18,239 Speaker 1: this podcast and leave a five star review that helps 767 00:44:18,320 --> 00:44:20,520 Speaker 1: us reach any and everyone who may be looking for 768 00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:22,320 Speaker 1: support in the face of addiction.