1 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:06,200 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff Mom Never Told You from House Top 2 00:00:06,240 --> 00:00:14,480 Speaker 1: Works Nott. Come hello, and welcome to the podcast. I'm 3 00:00:14,600 --> 00:00:17,920 Speaker 1: Kristen and I'm Caroline. And as you might have judged 4 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:21,720 Speaker 1: from the title of this podcast, today, on this show 5 00:00:21,800 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 1: we are going to be using straightforward language to describe sex, 6 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:33,640 Speaker 1: and specifically anal sex. So parents, if you're listening with kids, 7 00:00:33,680 --> 00:00:35,880 Speaker 1: this is your heads up. Or people who just might 8 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:41,800 Speaker 1: be squeamish about references to behind, or people who just 9 00:00:41,920 --> 00:00:46,080 Speaker 1: play our episodes full volume at their workplace. Yeah, this 10 00:00:46,200 --> 00:00:50,280 Speaker 1: might be a headphones necessary episode to listen to. And 11 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:55,240 Speaker 1: you know, we've talked about taboo topics before on the podcast. 12 00:00:55,240 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 1: We've talked about sex before on the podcast our bodies, 13 00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 1: our volva's vagiant and as clitteresses and also our butts, 14 00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:07,280 Speaker 1: so it makes sense that we can talk about well, 15 00:01:07,560 --> 00:01:11,560 Speaker 1: our butts again. You know, people have been requesting in 16 00:01:11,640 --> 00:01:14,679 Speaker 1: anal sex episode for as long as I have been 17 00:01:14,720 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 1: doing the podcast with you, Kristen, like I, I have 18 00:01:17,800 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: been familiar with these requests for quite a while, and 19 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:22,679 Speaker 1: so here we are. Well in the years that stef 20 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:27,040 Speaker 1: Mob Never Told You has existed, Caroline, I've witnessed anal 21 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:30,679 Speaker 1: sex come more and more into mainstream conversations and even 22 00:01:31,080 --> 00:01:36,160 Speaker 1: arrive on primetime TV shows. Yeah, I was actually really 23 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:39,480 Speaker 1: surprised to see uh, well not really surprised, but on 24 00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 1: Girls when Marnie gets some attention from her boyfriend, uh, 25 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:50,680 Speaker 1: not anal sex per se, but analingus. Yeah, the internet 26 00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:53,960 Speaker 1: kind of exploded when that scene happened. There were lots 27 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:58,000 Speaker 1: of unnecessary think pieces about what does that mean? What 28 00:01:58,160 --> 00:02:00,960 Speaker 1: does it? What does it mean? Well, there was even 29 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,120 Speaker 1: an episode of The Mindy Project. I think the episode 30 00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:07,080 Speaker 1: is titled It Slipped that was pretty much all about 31 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: anal sex, at least as the subtext. And in the 32 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:16,000 Speaker 1: words of one of my favorite lady comedians, a lot 33 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:20,520 Speaker 1: of Glazer a broad City. It's on the menu now. Yeah, 34 00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:23,400 Speaker 1: it seems to be. It seems like people are getting 35 00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:26,720 Speaker 1: used to the idea that it not only uh can 36 00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:30,399 Speaker 1: feel good, but it's okay for anybody to try. Well, 37 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:33,760 Speaker 1: And the thing is, it's been happening, especially if we 38 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:37,079 Speaker 1: consider women having anal sex, which is what we will 39 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:41,119 Speaker 1: focus this episode on. It's not just about anal sex generally, 40 00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 1: but more specifically women doing it because this is stuff 41 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:47,960 Speaker 1: Mom never told you, and obviously women have been having 42 00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:53,760 Speaker 1: and enjoying and not enjoying anal sex since forever, but 43 00:02:53,880 --> 00:02:57,160 Speaker 1: it's only been in really the last decade that it's 44 00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:01,880 Speaker 1: been okay to even talk about and even experiment with 45 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:04,800 Speaker 1: ye to the point where was it a salon piece 46 00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 1: we read where the writer was discussing how it's becoming 47 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:12,800 Speaker 1: so mainstream to the point that it might actually sap 48 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:15,760 Speaker 1: the enjoyment out of it for some people who have 49 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:19,079 Speaker 1: been enjoying more so than just the act, but also 50 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:24,400 Speaker 1: the taboo factor. So so yeah, maybe maybe for those 51 00:03:24,440 --> 00:03:27,480 Speaker 1: of you who really like the taboo. Sorry, sorry, we're 52 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:30,440 Speaker 1: ruining it. We're ruining we're making anal sex of vanilla 53 00:03:30,680 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 1: as we speak. But the thing about it is there 54 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 1: are issues that we do need to talk about and 55 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:39,040 Speaker 1: we will talk about around anal sex and consent and 56 00:03:39,320 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 1: health issues and all these things, not to detract from 57 00:03:43,520 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 1: people's enjoyment of it and desire to experiment with it 58 00:03:46,280 --> 00:03:48,960 Speaker 1: or not experiment with it. It's up to you, um, 59 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 1: but to help everyone get on the same page with it, 60 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:57,000 Speaker 1: because there there's so many how to guides now in 61 00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 1: mainstream magazines. Dan Savage on Savage love, love him or 62 00:04:01,640 --> 00:04:04,680 Speaker 1: Loathe Him? Talks about it a lot. He gives lots 63 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 1: of tips for first timers. Um, but there are still 64 00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 1: some nuances that are left out in a lot of 65 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:17,640 Speaker 1: those details. Um. But first up, let's move away from 66 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:21,240 Speaker 1: the tawdry and let's get down to some legitimate statistics, 67 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:27,080 Speaker 1: because really, the people who got everyone talking about anal 68 00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 1: sex more openly, it's not other than the Centers for 69 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 1: Disease Control and Prevention here in Atlanta, Georgia, represents what 70 00:04:33,880 --> 00:04:37,720 Speaker 1: up a p L. Feel free to invite us over 71 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:41,920 Speaker 1: any time CDC were available, but not in that way. Yeah, 72 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:44,400 Speaker 1: that's right. It's been really interesting to see the C 73 00:04:44,520 --> 00:04:48,760 Speaker 1: d C. Oh, that's so many c S statistics. Also 74 00:04:48,839 --> 00:04:51,880 Speaker 1: see and C talking about the CDC here, C and 75 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:56,000 Speaker 1: C can see from the CDC statistics that more and 76 00:04:56,080 --> 00:05:00,920 Speaker 1: more people are engaging in anal intercourse and it's it's 77 00:05:01,160 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 1: kind of healthily jumped over the past couple of years, 78 00:05:03,960 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 1: over the past like two decades actually so according to 79 00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:11,200 Speaker 1: the CDC National Survey of Family Growth, and they were 80 00:05:11,240 --> 00:05:14,640 Speaker 1: looking at men and women who were engaging in heterosexual 81 00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:18,279 Speaker 1: anal sex. In particular, they found that just over thirty 82 00:05:18,320 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 1: eight percent of men between the ages of twenty and 83 00:05:20,960 --> 00:05:23,839 Speaker 1: thirty nine and about thirty two and a half percent 84 00:05:23,880 --> 00:05:28,640 Speaker 1: of women ages eighteen to forty four have heterosexual anal sex, 85 00:05:29,080 --> 00:05:32,440 Speaker 1: and those numbers came out in two thousand and six. 86 00:05:32,480 --> 00:05:36,360 Speaker 1: Is so that would be looking at reports happening in 87 00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:40,440 Speaker 1: the early odds um and that's a healthy jump from 88 00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:45,719 Speaker 1: the survey which found of men and twenty percent of 89 00:05:45,760 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 1: women were reporting having ever tried anal sex. And one 90 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:56,279 Speaker 1: notable thing about this data is that the uptick probably 91 00:05:56,360 --> 00:05:59,159 Speaker 1: isn't a byproduct of hook up culture, because I feel 92 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:01,960 Speaker 1: like there's a lot of yearmongering around the rise in 93 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:04,920 Speaker 1: anal sex of like, oh, this is because these kids 94 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:08,000 Speaker 1: aren't getting married. They're going out and they're drinking too 95 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:12,880 Speaker 1: many wine coolers and then having anal sex. But that's 96 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:15,560 Speaker 1: probably not so much the case. Thank god, they don't 97 00:06:15,600 --> 00:06:20,200 Speaker 1: make zema anymore. Also, who drinks wine coolers? Oh god? 98 00:06:20,240 --> 00:06:22,320 Speaker 1: The first time I ever got drunk, it was a 99 00:06:22,440 --> 00:06:27,440 Speaker 1: mix of smyrnoff, ice and rum and coke, all in wondering, No, 100 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:29,360 Speaker 1: not all in one drink, all in one night, though 101 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:33,440 Speaker 1: I was super ill, But it did not involve today's topic. Yeah, 102 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 1: it turns out that according to these statistics. It's not 103 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:42,599 Speaker 1: part of, like christ And said, the hookup culture. It's 104 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:46,240 Speaker 1: actually least common among people who have never been married 105 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 1: and aren't living together. It's most common among people who 106 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:53,679 Speaker 1: are in committed relationships and are living together. And that 107 00:06:54,400 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: helps explain a lot of anecdotal reports that we ran 108 00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:01,880 Speaker 1: across in our research for this episode about how for 109 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:05,440 Speaker 1: a lot of couples anal sex is actually a more 110 00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 1: intimate form of intercourse for them, and especially in the 111 00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 1: context of straight couples. But then the CDC got us 112 00:07:15,160 --> 00:07:18,680 Speaker 1: talking about this again a few years later when there 113 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:22,280 Speaker 1: are two thousand eleven National Survey of Family Growth came 114 00:07:22,280 --> 00:07:26,280 Speaker 1: out and found that even more anal sex was happening, 115 00:07:26,280 --> 00:07:29,640 Speaker 1: at least reportedly, so not as huge of a jump, 116 00:07:29,680 --> 00:07:34,000 Speaker 1: but still compared to two thousand six whereto of women 117 00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:36,840 Speaker 1: between eighteen and forty four so they had ever had 118 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 1: anal sex, that number went up to six percent, whereas 119 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 1: for the men, forty four percent reported engaging it at 120 00:07:45,400 --> 00:07:48,160 Speaker 1: some point. Well, so clearly people are getting more comfortable 121 00:07:48,200 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 1: with it literally and figuratively, which is something that we 122 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:53,600 Speaker 1: will talk about as we go on through this episode. 123 00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:57,680 Speaker 1: That it is that degree of comfort that is so important. 124 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 1: And Chris and you were mentioning that these were time 125 00:08:00,320 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 1: statistics that people who had ever engaged in anial sex. 126 00:08:03,120 --> 00:08:06,680 Speaker 1: But it's also worth noting that in that CDC report, 127 00:08:06,880 --> 00:08:10,400 Speaker 1: the percent of women A nine reporting having had anal 128 00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:15,360 Speaker 1: sex in the past year alone had doubled to twenty since. 129 00:08:16,560 --> 00:08:20,680 Speaker 1: And what I would guess has also doubled during that time, Caroline, 130 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:26,680 Speaker 1: or tripled or quadrupled is our cultural acceptance of it, 131 00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:30,440 Speaker 1: at least among maybe the people under forty. I mean, 132 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 1: there's still a lot of uh moral panic around anal 133 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:38,880 Speaker 1: sex in particularly straight people engaging in it. But like 134 00:08:38,960 --> 00:08:42,880 Speaker 1: we were talking about, I mean, it's it's so ubiquitous, 135 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:45,520 Speaker 1: almost part of the zeitguys, this one might say. And 136 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:49,560 Speaker 1: I think, piece it's so true. Our I mean, butts 137 00:08:49,640 --> 00:08:53,200 Speaker 1: in general are so zeiteguys right now. We did a 138 00:08:53,240 --> 00:08:56,120 Speaker 1: podcast a while back listeners in case you haven't heard it, 139 00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:59,079 Speaker 1: called Fat Bottomed Girls, and it was all about our 140 00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 1: cultural fascinatnation right now and historically with women's behind. And 141 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 1: I feel like this is kind of an extension of 142 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 1: all that. Yeah, well, I mean, judging by you know, 143 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 1: we mentioned Marnie on Girls but like, judging by the 144 00:09:15,080 --> 00:09:19,480 Speaker 1: pop cultural response, it's totally zeitgeiste. Yeah, if it's on girls, 145 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:24,559 Speaker 1: it is definitely zeitgeiste. But it was even in the 146 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:28,800 Speaker 1: premier episode of How To get Away with Murder, which 147 00:09:28,840 --> 00:09:31,520 Speaker 1: I just started watching, and it was interesting. I was 148 00:09:31,559 --> 00:09:34,439 Speaker 1: just listening to an interview with Shonda Rhymes on Fresh 149 00:09:34,440 --> 00:09:38,720 Speaker 1: Air and Terry Gross was asking her about, uh, talking 150 00:09:38,760 --> 00:09:41,600 Speaker 1: about sex on her shows How to get Away with Murder, 151 00:09:41,640 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: Grace Anatomy and Scandal and um uh and how they 152 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:49,320 Speaker 1: have pushed the envelope in terms of depicting sex as well, 153 00:09:49,400 --> 00:09:53,800 Speaker 1: and so so this is a clear example of that happening. Um. 154 00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:58,520 Speaker 1: And then of course there's Nicki minaj is Anaconda rap 155 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:03,120 Speaker 1: song and video of what that includes her reference to 156 00:10:03,800 --> 00:10:08,120 Speaker 1: a guy um pleasuring her named Romaine. So we'll let 157 00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:10,880 Speaker 1: you fill in the blanks there dot dot dot um. 158 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 1: And of course you do have like I feel like 159 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:16,400 Speaker 1: every other month, if you pick up a women's magazine 160 00:10:16,480 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 1: or a dudes magazine, a men's health kind of thing, 161 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:23,200 Speaker 1: or g Q or Cosmo, there will be some feature 162 00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:26,000 Speaker 1: on how to do it back there for the first time, 163 00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:28,440 Speaker 1: or do it better, or how to you know, spice 164 00:10:28,520 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 1: up your long term relationship with it. So, I mean, 165 00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:33,720 Speaker 1: it's just something that we're all talking about. And to 166 00:10:33,760 --> 00:10:37,080 Speaker 1: the point to where a number of sex writers that 167 00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:40,600 Speaker 1: we were reading liken it to the way oral sex 168 00:10:41,320 --> 00:10:44,720 Speaker 1: was the new taboo thing that you just had to 169 00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 1: try when you and I Caroline were in high school. Yeah. Well, 170 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:51,800 Speaker 1: another thing that these writers are trying to figure out 171 00:10:51,800 --> 00:10:55,880 Speaker 1: in all of these pieces about anal sex is why 172 00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:57,880 Speaker 1: are so many more people doing it? We've seen the 173 00:10:57,880 --> 00:11:00,560 Speaker 1: CDC statistics, so why is it taking off so much? 174 00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:03,000 Speaker 1: And one big thing that a lot of people site 175 00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:08,079 Speaker 1: is the pornification of sex or relationships or that hookup 176 00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:11,680 Speaker 1: culture that you mentioned earlier. That part of the it's 177 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:15,800 Speaker 1: part of that moral panic stuff that you mentioned, Kristen. Yeah, 178 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:21,040 Speaker 1: I mean, And while anal sex is often depicted important 179 00:11:21,040 --> 00:11:23,559 Speaker 1: to the point that they're at least anecdotally, are a 180 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:25,839 Speaker 1: number of straight guys who are like, WHOA, we don't 181 00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:30,080 Speaker 1: really even want to see it all that much. Um, 182 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:33,000 Speaker 1: A lot of people consider that a knee jerk, short 183 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:36,600 Speaker 1: sighted answer, especially when it comes to the question of well, 184 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:39,800 Speaker 1: why would women want to do this? Because statistically guys 185 00:11:39,800 --> 00:11:42,880 Speaker 1: are the ones and especially in heteronormative context, guys are 186 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:47,959 Speaker 1: the ones watching the porn. Women aren't watching it as much, 187 00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:52,400 Speaker 1: so why would we need to be mimicking all of that? 188 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:55,719 Speaker 1: Um So, if we dig a little bit deeper, there 189 00:11:55,760 --> 00:11:58,840 Speaker 1: are some layers to it, I think, such as a 190 00:11:58,920 --> 00:12:03,480 Speaker 1: lessoning of homophobia that for so long preached the anal 191 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:06,880 Speaker 1: sex was only something that gay men would do, and 192 00:12:06,920 --> 00:12:09,200 Speaker 1: that it was something dirty. And keep in mind people 193 00:12:09,360 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 1: that it was only in two thousand three that the 194 00:12:11,960 --> 00:12:16,920 Speaker 1: Supreme Court officially struck down anti sodomy laws in Lawrence Fee, Texas, 195 00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:20,840 Speaker 1: even though a number of states still have anti sodomy 196 00:12:20,920 --> 00:12:25,120 Speaker 1: laws on their books, and I mean just they're from 197 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:29,840 Speaker 1: for centuries and and things. In large part to many religions, 198 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 1: the anus itself and anal sex has been depicted as 199 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:39,240 Speaker 1: un natural and something that is vile and dirty, and 200 00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:44,360 Speaker 1: that since it's not procreative sex, that women shouldn't we 201 00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:46,600 Speaker 1: should certainly not engage in it, you know. And and 202 00:12:46,679 --> 00:12:49,560 Speaker 1: to that that topic of homophobia, though, we read a 203 00:12:49,559 --> 00:12:54,680 Speaker 1: couple of interviews and anecdotal reports from guys who either 204 00:12:54,760 --> 00:12:57,319 Speaker 1: were like, oh, well, yeah, it's just something I do 205 00:12:57,400 --> 00:12:59,560 Speaker 1: with my partner. It's totally great, we both enjoy it. 206 00:12:59,679 --> 00:13:02,400 Speaker 1: What ever, or there were also some quotes that we 207 00:13:02,440 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 1: saw from guys who were like, well, it's fine if 208 00:13:05,600 --> 00:13:09,839 Speaker 1: I'm the one doing it basically, so like I don't 209 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:11,120 Speaker 1: want to get to you know, I don't want to 210 00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:14,280 Speaker 1: get to graphic with my language on sminty. But there 211 00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:17,760 Speaker 1: are some attitudes still out there circulating under this sort 212 00:13:17,800 --> 00:13:21,480 Speaker 1: of like homophobia. Umbrella almost were like, uh, it's not 213 00:13:21,559 --> 00:13:23,920 Speaker 1: cool for for guys to be on the receiving end. 214 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:29,199 Speaker 1: That's just weird, right, because that is a more submissive position. 215 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:32,480 Speaker 1: Submissive but also related still in a lot of people's 216 00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:35,800 Speaker 1: minds with gay sex. Yeah, and so I mean that's 217 00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:38,840 Speaker 1: why I think it is totally valid for us to 218 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:43,360 Speaker 1: be talking about this on the podcast, not just because 219 00:13:43,679 --> 00:13:45,240 Speaker 1: you know, we do talk about sex. I think it's 220 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:49,320 Speaker 1: important to talk about sex, but I I think that 221 00:13:50,280 --> 00:13:56,679 Speaker 1: the rising acceptance of straight anal sex does say more 222 00:13:56,880 --> 00:14:00,560 Speaker 1: than stay more than about just like our poor habits 223 00:14:00,600 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 1: and things like that, because also we have to accept 224 00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:06,839 Speaker 1: that people just have a natural desire for experimentation. Some 225 00:14:06,920 --> 00:14:09,080 Speaker 1: people are just doing it because they want to do it, 226 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:11,120 Speaker 1: not because they feel some kind of pressure like oh 227 00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:12,720 Speaker 1: now this is a new third base, and I have 228 00:14:12,840 --> 00:14:14,240 Speaker 1: to do it. If I don't do it, then I'm 229 00:14:14,280 --> 00:14:18,560 Speaker 1: not an adventurous woman. So you know, there's there's that 230 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:21,120 Speaker 1: whole thing and and just accepting that, oh well, some 231 00:14:21,160 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 1: people do it because they enjoy it. Yeah, yeah, it's 232 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:29,120 Speaker 1: not all about coercion and feeling like you're less fan 233 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:32,880 Speaker 1: if you don't. Although the whole coercion factors a huge 234 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:36,360 Speaker 1: deal and it's absolutely something that we should talk about 235 00:14:36,480 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 1: and we should also mention too that sort of along 236 00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 1: the same lines as the coercion that can happen, especially 237 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 1: if some one party is more interested in doing it 238 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:49,080 Speaker 1: than another. There's a whole birth control at aspect of like, 239 00:14:49,120 --> 00:14:52,720 Speaker 1: oh well we need to do this because um you 240 00:14:52,760 --> 00:14:55,280 Speaker 1: know that way you won't get pregnant, or the whole 241 00:14:55,320 --> 00:15:00,200 Speaker 1: idea of it preserving your vaginal virginity. Yeah, this is 242 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 1: if there is a better argument. I mean, there are 243 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:08,080 Speaker 1: so so many arguments for good, solid, comprehensive sexual education 244 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 1: in this country, but the idea, the weird ideas around 245 00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:18,880 Speaker 1: preserving virginity but still wanting to be sexually active. But 246 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:21,000 Speaker 1: we're not going to call it sex because it's not 247 00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:23,400 Speaker 1: the vagina. It's not a penis and a vagina, It's 248 00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:27,640 Speaker 1: a penis and an anus. This is a huge outcry 249 00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:31,040 Speaker 1: in my mind for the need for comprehensive sex ad because, 250 00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:34,680 Speaker 1: as we will talk about, just because you have anal 251 00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:37,520 Speaker 1: sex does not mean that you are protected from a 252 00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 1: pregnancy because mistakes happen and fluids can get other places, 253 00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:47,720 Speaker 1: but also from diseases and sexually transmitted infections. Yeah, I mean, 254 00:15:47,840 --> 00:15:50,880 Speaker 1: and and and that was something too that was always 255 00:15:50,920 --> 00:15:55,440 Speaker 1: concerning with the idea of oral sex being the third base. 256 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:58,560 Speaker 1: That's the thing that precedes the quote unquote real sex, 257 00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:01,160 Speaker 1: which of course is incredibly head to normative and this 258 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:04,680 Speaker 1: gendered of you know, the real sex being a penis 259 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:08,760 Speaker 1: entering of vagina, where has like arguably these other acts 260 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:11,960 Speaker 1: of a specifically oral an anal are far more intimate 261 00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:15,840 Speaker 1: in some ways than quote unquote real sex. Yeah, I 262 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:19,200 Speaker 1: mean people, and I see people in the mist general sense, 263 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:21,880 Speaker 1: like people tend to talk about anal sex and think 264 00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 1: about anal sex is this thing that's like, oh, we're 265 00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:27,360 Speaker 1: just gonna do it because we're wild and maybe we're 266 00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:29,400 Speaker 1: a little tipsy and I just met this person at 267 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,000 Speaker 1: a bar, when really, I mean, if you talk to 268 00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:35,200 Speaker 1: people who are in relationships, and you look at statistics, 269 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:38,040 Speaker 1: Like we said earlier, this does tend to be an 270 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:40,760 Speaker 1: activity that's more between people who are committed to each other, 271 00:16:40,760 --> 00:16:44,320 Speaker 1: whether that's opposite sex or same sex partners. But one 272 00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:47,440 Speaker 1: thing that we do have to talk about is how 273 00:16:48,160 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 1: the rate of anal sex becoming UM normalized has not 274 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:59,120 Speaker 1: has written faster than the rate of comprehensive sex education, 275 00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:04,000 Speaker 1: and with that we do end up with a startling 276 00:17:04,080 --> 00:17:07,919 Speaker 1: pattern of young people in particular engaging in anal sex 277 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:12,960 Speaker 1: in ways that are not pleasurable for any body. And 278 00:17:13,119 --> 00:17:15,359 Speaker 1: a lot of this is while all of this actually 279 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:19,679 Speaker 1: is coming from study published in the British Medical Journal 280 00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:25,560 Speaker 1: which focused on a relatively small group of straight kids 281 00:17:25,600 --> 00:17:29,040 Speaker 1: between sixteen and eighteen years old who were having UM 282 00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:32,360 Speaker 1: who had had anal sex at some point at least 283 00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:37,639 Speaker 1: or multiple times. And it's a qualitative study rather than 284 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:40,400 Speaker 1: a quantitative study, so it really focuses in on their 285 00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:45,000 Speaker 1: motivations and lots of interviews. UM. But what they found, 286 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:48,800 Speaker 1: even though um it's more qualitative than quantitative, are some 287 00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:54,480 Speaker 1: pretty consistent patterns. Yeah. So they found that the first 288 00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:58,679 Speaker 1: time that these people were experiencing anal sex was typically 289 00:17:59,280 --> 00:18:02,440 Speaker 1: painful for the girls, and this indicates because a lot 290 00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:05,840 Speaker 1: of people to just assume that anal sex will always 291 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:09,919 Speaker 1: end forever be painful when it doesn't have to be UM, 292 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:14,040 Speaker 1: but this indicates. This finding indicates that there wasn't adequate 293 00:18:14,119 --> 00:18:17,880 Speaker 1: for play or preparation for it on either person's part, 294 00:18:18,280 --> 00:18:21,840 Speaker 1: and this also tends to indicate basically a lackluster experience 295 00:18:21,880 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 1: for the guys involved too. Yeah. A lot of them 296 00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:26,679 Speaker 1: reported like, I mean, yeah, I didn't and it was 297 00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:29,560 Speaker 1: it was okay, it wasn't as good as I thought 298 00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:31,920 Speaker 1: it was gonna be. UM And there was only one 299 00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:35,920 Speaker 1: girl that the researchers talked to who described any physical 300 00:18:36,000 --> 00:18:42,560 Speaker 1: pleasure whatsoever associated with it. And then, even more disturbingly, 301 00:18:42,680 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 1: or I don't know, I don't want to say that 302 00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:47,760 Speaker 1: one is worse than the other. But condoms were rarely 303 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:51,639 Speaker 1: used in this case except as a fecal barrier, despite 304 00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:55,879 Speaker 1: increased risks of SCI contraction via anal sex, because a 305 00:18:55,880 --> 00:19:00,399 Speaker 1: lot of these UH teenagers did had no idea, UH 306 00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:03,720 Speaker 1: that your risks of contracting s t I S is 307 00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:07,240 Speaker 1: actually higher with anal sex. They thought that it was 308 00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:10,679 Speaker 1: kind of the safest way they could have sex in 309 00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:17,280 Speaker 1: regard to um health and also pregnancy. Caroline is doing 310 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:21,840 Speaker 1: her squinty eyes. Well, yeah, I'm doing my squinty eyes 311 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:25,960 Speaker 1: because I think this is horrifying and sad. Um. I 312 00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:31,240 Speaker 1: am a huge proponent of comprehensive and radically in depth 313 00:19:31,480 --> 00:19:34,479 Speaker 1: sex said because, as you and I have talked about before, 314 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,480 Speaker 1: and as anyone who agrees with me on the whole 315 00:19:37,520 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: sex said thing knows, Uh, you're not going to prepare 316 00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:43,479 Speaker 1: anyone for what people are going to be doing anyway 317 00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:46,119 Speaker 1: if you don't teach them how to be safe. Yeah, 318 00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:51,080 Speaker 1: I mean, and also the need for her conversations about, yeah, 319 00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:53,639 Speaker 1: the frank conversations that people are gonna want to do 320 00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:58,560 Speaker 1: this and it can totally happen, um, but no no 321 00:19:58,760 --> 00:20:02,680 Speaker 1: education about the lead up to it. Well, yeah, I mean, 322 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:05,480 Speaker 1: there needs to be education about the lead up how 323 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:09,560 Speaker 1: to do any type of sex safely and responsibly and 324 00:20:09,600 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 1: in a pain free way, both emotionally pain free and 325 00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:16,520 Speaker 1: physically pain free. And also there needs to be the 326 00:20:16,560 --> 00:20:19,480 Speaker 1: other layer of education that anal sex isn't like a 327 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:25,199 Speaker 1: chased substitute for vaginal sex, that it is still sex 328 00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:28,480 Speaker 1: and it can still have the same repercussions that penis 329 00:20:28,560 --> 00:20:31,480 Speaker 1: and vagina sex can have. Yeah, I mean, and reading 330 00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:35,160 Speaker 1: all of these reports from these teenagers made me think 331 00:20:35,240 --> 00:20:37,560 Speaker 1: so much about when I was in high school and 332 00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:43,199 Speaker 1: when oral sex was essentially the anal sex of yesteryear, 333 00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:48,160 Speaker 1: and I could find so much information even even way 334 00:20:48,200 --> 00:20:51,920 Speaker 1: back in online and the Cosmo dot com archives about 335 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:53,480 Speaker 1: how to do it and what you should do it. 336 00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:56,439 Speaker 1: But there was and and there were expectations obviously because 337 00:20:56,480 --> 00:21:00,160 Speaker 1: this information existed, that this was something that as a 338 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:04,600 Speaker 1: highly hormonal teenager, that this was something that I would 339 00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 1: want to do and something that sexy women who were 340 00:21:07,119 --> 00:21:10,720 Speaker 1: very attractive would be doing, But there was no information 341 00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:13,560 Speaker 1: about like a, yeah, all of the trappings of it, 342 00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:15,760 Speaker 1: the lead up to it, like oh, if you don't 343 00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:17,560 Speaker 1: want to try it, you don't have to try it. 344 00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:19,600 Speaker 1: Um And I feel like it's just the same thing 345 00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:23,640 Speaker 1: all over again, just with anal sex this time. And 346 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:28,120 Speaker 1: when the researchers were talking to the boys about their 347 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:31,520 Speaker 1: motivation for wanting to try this, yes, the porn aspect 348 00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:36,159 Speaker 1: came up, but that was very much linked to status, 349 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:38,520 Speaker 1: like they wanted to try it because it was almost 350 00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:40,359 Speaker 1: like a checklist that they had of all of the 351 00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:43,560 Speaker 1: various sex acts that they could do, that they could 352 00:21:43,560 --> 00:21:45,880 Speaker 1: then tell their guys about, and that they could then 353 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:49,040 Speaker 1: be praised for, whereas, of course the opposite was true 354 00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:52,440 Speaker 1: for girls. Yeah, and I mean this actually, this idea 355 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:56,640 Speaker 1: of using anal sex is a way to attain status 356 00:21:56,680 --> 00:22:00,280 Speaker 1: among their guy friends reminded me. Actually in the might 357 00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:02,679 Speaker 1: sound weird, but it reminded me of the episode we 358 00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:05,440 Speaker 1: did about Guys and Cars, about how we talked about 359 00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:09,000 Speaker 1: how men tend to define not all men hashtag A 360 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,120 Speaker 1: lot of men tend to define their masculinity in relation 361 00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:15,520 Speaker 1: to other men, not define their masculinity in relation to women. 362 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:19,280 Speaker 1: So to me, it makes sense that if you are 363 00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:22,720 Speaker 1: a teenage boy who is maybe getting his education and 364 00:22:22,760 --> 00:22:26,199 Speaker 1: ideas about sex from porn, and there's a lot of 365 00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:31,160 Speaker 1: anal sex in porn um and you're trying to define 366 00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:34,959 Speaker 1: and emphasize your masculinity, that anal sex would be, like 367 00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:39,600 Speaker 1: you said, part of like this conquest checklist. Yeah. Whereas 368 00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:43,040 Speaker 1: for girls, while a lot of them, I think all 369 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:45,720 Speaker 1: of them, Um, in this case, we're having anal sex 370 00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:49,520 Speaker 1: within the context of dating relationships. They were still very 371 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:55,040 Speaker 1: nervous going into it because they knew that if other 372 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 1: people found out that they had tried this with their 373 00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,960 Speaker 1: due that they would be shamed for it. Mm hmm. 374 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:04,600 Speaker 1: I mean it's just a sexual double standard. It's just 375 00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:08,280 Speaker 1: you know, same old story. So there's an expectation on 376 00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:11,240 Speaker 1: boys to do it, but the expectation on girls is 377 00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:14,360 Speaker 1: to not do it or you're you're to be shamed, 378 00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:16,760 Speaker 1: and so then it's like okay, well then well it's 379 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:19,080 Speaker 1: even more of a double bind than just an expectation 380 00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:21,479 Speaker 1: to not do it. There's still an expectation to do 381 00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:23,440 Speaker 1: it that if you don't want to do then you're 382 00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:26,880 Speaker 1: apprud But then if you do do it and you're 383 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:29,160 Speaker 1: a bad girl, then you're a bad girl as long 384 00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,359 Speaker 1: as well. Maybe if you do it and then a 385 00:23:32,359 --> 00:23:34,080 Speaker 1: guy breaks up with you and you are single, then 386 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:35,600 Speaker 1: you're a bad girl. I think if you do it 387 00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:40,240 Speaker 1: and you stay together with that person, then a girl friend, yes, 388 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:45,120 Speaker 1: But as soon as that ends, because hello, sixteen, then 389 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:48,240 Speaker 1: you are going to be the girl that all of 390 00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:53,080 Speaker 1: your ex boyfriends dude friends knows did that. It's so hard. 391 00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:58,600 Speaker 1: It's so hard to be a teenager. I'm glad I 392 00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,639 Speaker 1: studied a lot. I mean it and it also thinking 393 00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:03,879 Speaker 1: about like these guys talking to each other about it. 394 00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 1: It reminds me of my first high school boyfriend. Okay, 395 00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:11,120 Speaker 1: who am I getting? Like my only high school boyfriend, 396 00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:17,080 Speaker 1: um hashtag late bloomer telling me very soon into us 397 00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:19,480 Speaker 1: dating in quotes, if you can consider like going to 398 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:22,920 Speaker 1: the Dollar movie like four times a week, dating about 399 00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:28,199 Speaker 1: what his ex girlfriend would due to him, essentially like 400 00:24:28,280 --> 00:24:30,960 Speaker 1: laying on his expectations of like she did this from me, 401 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:33,760 Speaker 1: and I just really enjoyed it. I was very inexperience 402 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:36,960 Speaker 1: at the time, and you know, there was there was 403 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:40,040 Speaker 1: no information or wherewithal to kind of bridge like where 404 00:24:40,080 --> 00:24:44,000 Speaker 1: I was and like what he was saying, and like no, 405 00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:46,080 Speaker 1: you know, thing in my head to be like, oh 406 00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:50,000 Speaker 1: wait this, this is odd that this conversation is happening, 407 00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,120 Speaker 1: But I feel like it's so common it is. Yeah, 408 00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 1: it happened to me too when I was younger and 409 00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:57,520 Speaker 1: dating guys that would like do the same thing of like, 410 00:24:57,560 --> 00:25:00,040 Speaker 1: oh well I dated this girl, and so when I 411 00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:02,239 Speaker 1: really could have used this is like obviously going off 412 00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:04,159 Speaker 1: on a tangent away from anal sex. But what I 413 00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:06,840 Speaker 1: could have used when I was that age and you too, 414 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:11,400 Speaker 1: was somebody like us being like whatever it is, whatever 415 00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:15,040 Speaker 1: it is. If somebody's doing that to you, like just 416 00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:17,639 Speaker 1: they're not worth your time. If somebody is like laying 417 00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:23,840 Speaker 1: out sexpectations for you, um, outside of the context of like, 418 00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:28,800 Speaker 1: you know, an understanding conversation, like a real actual conversation 419 00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:33,639 Speaker 1: about sex or sexual expectations or experience or whatever. Like, 420 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:37,119 Speaker 1: that's one thing, But to describe what a past partner 421 00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:40,199 Speaker 1: did in order to put pressure on you, that is 422 00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:43,240 Speaker 1: the sign of someone who is obviously not meant to 423 00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:47,320 Speaker 1: be an immature, loving, understanding, supportive relationship yea. And someone 424 00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:50,359 Speaker 1: who just doesn't understand the basics of consent. Obviously, the 425 00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:53,720 Speaker 1: whole thing of no being a complete sentence, and that 426 00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:56,919 Speaker 1: issue of consent and coercion also came up a lot 427 00:25:57,240 --> 00:26:02,600 Speaker 1: in these teenagers. Narrative is about their experiences with anal 428 00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:06,280 Speaker 1: sex because it played such a major part, to the 429 00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:10,679 Speaker 1: point that the researchers wrote, quote, women being badgered for 430 00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:14,800 Speaker 1: anal sex appears to be considered normal because we've already 431 00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:17,760 Speaker 1: established that there's the sexual double double standard at work, 432 00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:19,679 Speaker 1: and so these girls are nervous about it, but they 433 00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:21,119 Speaker 1: feel like they should do it, but they're nervous but 434 00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:23,439 Speaker 1: they should do it, and there's a whole pain aspect, 435 00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:26,119 Speaker 1: there's the expectation that it's gonna hurt, so on so 436 00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 1: many layers, there's resistance to it. So in a lot 437 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:33,840 Speaker 1: of these cases, these guys were telling they're usually girlfriends 438 00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: like oh, come on, come on, please, please, please, please please, 439 00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:40,920 Speaker 1: and sort of wearing them down, and then in some 440 00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:45,000 Speaker 1: cases using the whole reference back to the Mindy Project 441 00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:52,720 Speaker 1: episode it slipped excuse um for essentially having like non 442 00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:58,359 Speaker 1: consensual anal sex. And as upset as Kristen and I 443 00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:02,359 Speaker 1: have become during the course of this part of the conversation, 444 00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:06,240 Speaker 1: I don't think that we mean to say that all 445 00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:10,280 Speaker 1: anal sex is bad. Obviously, obviously this is definitely not 446 00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:15,760 Speaker 1: commentary on people's sexual relationships and preferences in general. But 447 00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:19,240 Speaker 1: this is an important part of sexual health to talk about, 448 00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:23,800 Speaker 1: and researchers definitely say that this just goes to show 449 00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:29,359 Speaker 1: how badly we need comprehensive sexual education, and that's exactly 450 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,120 Speaker 1: what these researchers writing in the British Medical Journal. We're 451 00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:35,399 Speaker 1: stressing that this isn't the point that we lead to 452 00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:38,879 Speaker 1: the conclusion that all teenagers should be discouraged from even 453 00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:45,600 Speaker 1: trying this, but rather that it's just clear, clear evidence 454 00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:50,520 Speaker 1: that we need more comprehensive sex education that acknowledges that 455 00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:53,480 Speaker 1: things like anal sex and oral sex happen, and that 456 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:58,000 Speaker 1: also discusses things like pain, coercion, and consent, rather than 457 00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:01,680 Speaker 1: it just being like, here's how to not get pregnant. Yeah, 458 00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:05,560 Speaker 1: good luck. Yeah, it would be incredible to arm young 459 00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:09,720 Speaker 1: people with information about consent. I mean, even if you're 460 00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:12,359 Speaker 1: not going to talk about anal sex specifically, to talk 461 00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:16,080 Speaker 1: about consent is a powerful, powerful thing. Well. And I 462 00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:19,800 Speaker 1: also have a hunch that sex education that focuses so 463 00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:26,000 Speaker 1: exclusively on not getting pregnant might end up fostering more 464 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:31,520 Speaker 1: anal sex because hey, you can't get pregnant that way, right, Yeah, 465 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:35,760 Speaker 1: but if we're talking about things slipping again, if you're 466 00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:39,040 Speaker 1: just relying on oh I'm hoping that nothing slips out 467 00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:42,840 Speaker 1: and slips in anywhere else, it's better to be smart 468 00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:48,920 Speaker 1: and armed with information about your body how sex works. Well. 469 00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 1: And this is also another reason for us to talk 470 00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:56,320 Speaker 1: about this openly, because I think the more taboo things are, 471 00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:58,480 Speaker 1: the more left in the shadows that they are, the 472 00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 1: more stigmatized they are the more room that leaves for 473 00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:06,040 Speaker 1: non consensual things to happen because you don't even want 474 00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 1: to acknowledge that you're doing it, and there are um, 475 00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:13,960 Speaker 1: there there's more doubt about well, what is right? What 476 00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:15,760 Speaker 1: is wrong? As I'm going through this, I mean, I'm 477 00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:19,920 Speaker 1: already doing this thing that's taboo, so okay, let's just 478 00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:22,760 Speaker 1: do it. Um. And this was something This is not 479 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,800 Speaker 1: all going to be downer au anal sex. We are 480 00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:31,000 Speaker 1: getting we're working our way toward orgasms people, aren't we all, 481 00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:34,120 Speaker 1: But we first have to lay this foundation, like, have 482 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:38,840 Speaker 1: some rare talk about this, because this isn't just something 483 00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:42,200 Speaker 1: that the issues of uh coercent are just things that 484 00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:47,960 Speaker 1: happen among teenagers. Um. There was another study that we found, 485 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:52,360 Speaker 1: a rare study on straight adult women's anal sex experiences, 486 00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:56,480 Speaker 1: published in two thousand fourteen and the journal Feminism and Psychology. 487 00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,960 Speaker 1: And I say the rare study because far and away 488 00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:04,560 Speaker 1: most most most studies on anal sex focus just on 489 00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:07,200 Speaker 1: gay guys, which also, hello, I mean it's not just 490 00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:09,520 Speaker 1: gay men and straight women who are having anal sex. 491 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:14,000 Speaker 1: Researchers for this Feminism and Psychology study found that five 492 00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:18,520 Speaker 1: major themes emerged around the experiences of the women that 493 00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:21,240 Speaker 1: they interviewed. And again this is another qualitative study based 494 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:26,880 Speaker 1: on interviews conversations about women's experiences, and so the themes 495 00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:32,840 Speaker 1: included initial resistance to the idea, followed by submission to 496 00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:37,440 Speaker 1: anal sex, um initial interest in it, followed by withdrawal 497 00:30:37,560 --> 00:30:40,840 Speaker 1: from subsequent anal sex experiences. So basically, they tried it, 498 00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:44,080 Speaker 1: didn't really like it, it wasn't their thing, so okay, 499 00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:48,440 Speaker 1: now we know. Um. Third, the third theme was violence 500 00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:52,440 Speaker 1: and coercion surrounding anal sex. So again this echoes. This 501 00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:55,920 Speaker 1: is basically like almost an adult version of the British 502 00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,200 Speaker 1: Medical Journal study that we were talking about earlier, and 503 00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:03,360 Speaker 1: then we have similarly echoing it as well. The social 504 00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:10,560 Speaker 1: norming aspect of dudes, guy friends normalizing straight anal sex 505 00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:15,440 Speaker 1: and seeing anal sex is something normative largely based they 506 00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:18,200 Speaker 1: think on like watching porn. This is something that like, oh, 507 00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 1: you should do we should be doing this. Don't you 508 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 1: want to do this? Um? And then five, yeah, here 509 00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:26,320 Speaker 1: we go. This is this is a great part pleasurable 510 00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:30,160 Speaker 1: experiences with anal of roticism. And yes, that is a 511 00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:34,040 Speaker 1: direct quote from a study abstract anal eroticism. Don't I 512 00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:37,280 Speaker 1: love academia. I love academia. So one of the most 513 00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:42,160 Speaker 1: important things to remember about anal sex as it becomes 514 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:46,680 Speaker 1: more and more normalized, as it becomes more and more zeitgeist, 515 00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,400 Speaker 1: is that everybody is different. Some people are gonna want it, 516 00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:52,120 Speaker 1: some people aren't, some people are going to try it 517 00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:53,600 Speaker 1: and hate it. Some people are gonna try it and 518 00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:59,800 Speaker 1: they're gonna love it. Everyone's different, and that's just good 519 00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:02,280 Speaker 1: to keep in mind. And that's pretty much the takeaway 520 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:06,400 Speaker 1: of any Like women's magazine roundup of like real women 521 00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:12,640 Speaker 1: describe their experiences with anal sex, because yes, every glamor magazine, Clear, Reclear, etcetera. 522 00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:17,480 Speaker 1: Has one of those listical types of stories, and always 523 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:19,800 Speaker 1: they run the gamut from a woman being like, it 524 00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 1: was the worst, most painful experience of my life, I 525 00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:25,160 Speaker 1: will never ever try it again, to the woman who's like, 526 00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:29,400 Speaker 1: I can't get enough of it. It saved my marriage, etcetera. Yeah, 527 00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:34,360 Speaker 1: but here's the thing. Anal sex actually correlated with more orgasm. Wait, 528 00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:39,960 Speaker 1: what how is that possible? Who said that? Caroline? Academics again, 529 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 1: lots of that sex studies. Uh so, there was a 530 00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:46,520 Speaker 1: twenty study in the Journal of Sexual Medicine that found 531 00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:52,320 Speaker 1: ninety four per cent of women that they surveyed who 532 00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:57,800 Speaker 1: received anal sex in their last sexual encounter reported reaching orgasm. 533 00:32:57,840 --> 00:32:59,840 Speaker 1: And this is a higher rate of orgasm we should 534 00:32:59,880 --> 00:33:02,480 Speaker 1: know then was reported by women who had had vaginal 535 00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 1: intercourse or received oral sex. And that study finding launched 536 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:10,000 Speaker 1: a zillion Internet headlines because of the assumption that it's 537 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:14,560 Speaker 1: something that has to be very painful and uncomfortable, especially 538 00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 1: for women, even though I don't know that there are 539 00:33:16,600 --> 00:33:21,600 Speaker 1: that many biological sex differences between male and female anuses, 540 00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:24,040 Speaker 1: but there's just the assumption that lady is gonna hate it. Oh, 541 00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:28,400 Speaker 1: but it turns out they love it. Well, some context 542 00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:32,440 Speaker 1: to this um people think that the reason why there 543 00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:36,080 Speaker 1: is that relationship between women having anal sex and orgasms 544 00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:40,040 Speaker 1: is that if you do in it correct, actually doing 545 00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:42,720 Speaker 1: it in the way that will allow it to happen, 546 00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:49,080 Speaker 1: it requires time, patients for play, a lot of the 547 00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:54,640 Speaker 1: ingredients for female orgasms. Yeah. Well, and then a lot 548 00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:58,560 Speaker 1: of things we read two recommended, like having an orgasm 549 00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:02,680 Speaker 1: before a approaching anal sex. Yeah. So there's even like 550 00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:05,200 Speaker 1: the chicken egg question with that of like, are these 551 00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:09,720 Speaker 1: of women having orgasms, having orgasms before they have anal 552 00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:13,319 Speaker 1: sex or after, or on both sides. Well, you know, 553 00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:15,640 Speaker 1: and everything we've read anal sex or vaginal sex or 554 00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:19,040 Speaker 1: any type of sex is that the more comfortable you 555 00:34:19,080 --> 00:34:22,319 Speaker 1: are with yourself and with your partner and with your 556 00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:25,839 Speaker 1: sexual activity, uh, and the more confidence you have in 557 00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:28,760 Speaker 1: one another, and the comfort level all of this stuff 558 00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:33,560 Speaker 1: is a very positive factor for potentially than having an orgasm. 559 00:34:33,600 --> 00:34:35,520 Speaker 1: In other words, if you're happy with each other, if 560 00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:37,560 Speaker 1: you're feeling good about each other and yourselves, you're more 561 00:34:37,560 --> 00:34:40,760 Speaker 1: likely to have an orgasm. Because so much of sex 562 00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:44,200 Speaker 1: is not just physical but also psychological, and so that 563 00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:46,759 Speaker 1: obviously applies to anal sex too. We talked earlier, we 564 00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:49,960 Speaker 1: hinted at the whole comfort factor for anal sex, and 565 00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:52,640 Speaker 1: this is no different. And one thing that gets talked 566 00:34:52,640 --> 00:34:57,319 Speaker 1: about a lot is the assumption that anal sex will 567 00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:01,279 Speaker 1: be or has to be, or is always painful is 568 00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:03,440 Speaker 1: not only inaccurate, but it's also doing a lot of 569 00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:07,640 Speaker 1: harm because if you automatically assume that any sexual act 570 00:35:07,719 --> 00:35:10,000 Speaker 1: is going to be painful or harm you in some way, 571 00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:13,160 Speaker 1: you're automatically not going to be as relaxed as you 572 00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:15,719 Speaker 1: could or should be. And there was a column we 573 00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:19,960 Speaker 1: were reading about this in Vogue, yes that Vogue magazine, 574 00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:24,920 Speaker 1: about one woman's experiences with anal sex, and she made 575 00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: the very good point that just basic mechanics wise, anal 576 00:35:30,600 --> 00:35:37,759 Speaker 1: sex facilitates more clitteral access, and as we have underscored 577 00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:42,120 Speaker 1: on the podcast before, women are likelier to reach orgasm 578 00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:46,160 Speaker 1: via clitteral stimulation than vaginal stimulation, so that could be 579 00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:50,719 Speaker 1: another factor in this whole orgasm correlation as well. Yeah, 580 00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:52,960 Speaker 1: and I mean we've cited on the podcast before the 581 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:57,600 Speaker 1: fact that women in same sex relationships report more orgasms 582 00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:01,080 Speaker 1: than do women in opposite sex relations ships, and so yeah, 583 00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: I mean we can't ignore the fact that it's not 584 00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:07,959 Speaker 1: just the concern of a straight woman or a gay 585 00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:10,560 Speaker 1: man or a bisexual man or woman, that there are 586 00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:14,439 Speaker 1: plenty of same sex couples out there doing this too. Absolutely. 587 00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:18,240 Speaker 1: And um, speaking of which, one piece we're reading about 588 00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:21,919 Speaker 1: this over at auto straddle dot com was talking about how, 589 00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:25,719 Speaker 1: of course anal sex can be very pleasurable because of 590 00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:30,120 Speaker 1: all of the myriad nerve endings back there as well. 591 00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:33,160 Speaker 1: So I mean, it makes a lot of sense that 592 00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:36,319 Speaker 1: women would enjoy it. What doesn't make sense, is that 593 00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:41,640 Speaker 1: it's so hard for us to collectively wrap our minds 594 00:36:41,680 --> 00:36:47,919 Speaker 1: around this being something enjoyable for women, regardless of who 595 00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:50,600 Speaker 1: they might be partnered with at the time. Well, I 596 00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:52,839 Speaker 1: mean I think that straight men get put in that 597 00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:55,759 Speaker 1: category a lot too of Like, well, whether it's by 598 00:36:55,800 --> 00:37:00,600 Speaker 1: themselves or by society, capitalist society that like, straight men 599 00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:03,640 Speaker 1: can't or shouldn't or won't enjoy it. Oh, yeah, I 600 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:07,879 Speaker 1: mean that is also something that there's still not a 601 00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:12,759 Speaker 1: ton of data on it. But um, there is evidence 602 00:37:13,200 --> 00:37:18,920 Speaker 1: that straight men are engaging in anal activities more than 603 00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:23,520 Speaker 1: ever before. Um. Tracy Clark, Floury advocative now previously at Salon, 604 00:37:24,239 --> 00:37:27,919 Speaker 1: talked to Debbie Herbenick over at the Kinsey Institute, and 605 00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:32,560 Speaker 1: she referred her to a study which found eleven percent 606 00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:35,800 Speaker 1: of guys in their early twenties reported having received anal 607 00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:38,239 Speaker 1: sex at some point. But her Bennick said, well, we 608 00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:41,600 Speaker 1: don't know exactly what that means because there were no 609 00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:46,000 Speaker 1: detailed reports on what kind of anal sex that was, 610 00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:50,799 Speaker 1: whether that was manual, or whether that was solo partnered, 611 00:37:51,239 --> 00:37:55,600 Speaker 1: all the different ways that you can have anal penetration. Yeah, well, 612 00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:59,040 Speaker 1: I mean I feel like just as anal sex itself 613 00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:03,160 Speaker 1: is pop culturally. I don't want to say really, I 614 00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:04,879 Speaker 1: mean that makes it sound like a trend, but it's 615 00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:07,640 Speaker 1: so like within pop culture now, and it's so talked about. 616 00:38:08,200 --> 00:38:11,200 Speaker 1: And similarly, you know, more and more attentions being paid 617 00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:16,280 Speaker 1: to like women's clteral stimulation and pleasing women in that regard, 618 00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:19,000 Speaker 1: the same attention now is starting to be paid to 619 00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:23,520 Speaker 1: male prostate stimulus that people are like, hello, men like 620 00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:25,920 Speaker 1: different things too. Oh yeah. I mean I feel like 621 00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:28,160 Speaker 1: that that's been around for a while, the whole like 622 00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:32,919 Speaker 1: kind of joking thing of the old school Cosmo tip 623 00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:38,560 Speaker 1: that a guy enjoys manual stimulation back there. I mean, 624 00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:41,080 Speaker 1: I feel like that's almost like a go to question 625 00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:43,880 Speaker 1: at this point. Among Like, I don't know, I like, 626 00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:46,080 Speaker 1: it's come up in lots of conversations I've had with 627 00:38:46,200 --> 00:38:48,640 Speaker 1: straight guy friends of like do you like it? Do 628 00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:50,480 Speaker 1: you not? And half the time they're like, oh no, 629 00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:54,959 Speaker 1: and other times they're like, oh huh, yeah. I don't 630 00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:57,560 Speaker 1: even want to ask my guy friends that I don't 631 00:38:57,600 --> 00:39:02,040 Speaker 1: even like, I'm just picturing I I can't even picture 632 00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:04,319 Speaker 1: a situation in which I would, for instance, ask dude 633 00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:06,719 Speaker 1: roommate about that, O, Caroline. I mean, I'm just one 634 00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:09,600 Speaker 1: of those cool girls who could like drink beer and 635 00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:14,920 Speaker 1: watch football and talk prostates with them bros. Stimulating prostates. Yeah, 636 00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:17,839 Speaker 1: just hanging out over some beers talking about talking about 637 00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:22,960 Speaker 1: sabor metrics and and prostates stimulations. Spot the whole spot 638 00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:26,640 Speaker 1: he spot. Um, and I am really curious to hear 639 00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:30,480 Speaker 1: from our guy listeners on this too. Obviously, I want 640 00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:34,720 Speaker 1: to hear from everybody, but UM, I was really interested 641 00:39:34,719 --> 00:39:38,640 Speaker 1: to see the relatively still few and far between pieces 642 00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:43,600 Speaker 1: and research looking at straight men's experiences with this, because really, 643 00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:49,879 Speaker 1: thanks to the tools that we now have, anal sex 644 00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:51,920 Speaker 1: doesn't have to be off the menu for anyone if 645 00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:53,839 Speaker 1: they don't want it off the menu. And as long 646 00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:56,960 Speaker 1: as you're safe. I mean we've mentioned we've mentioned coercion 647 00:39:57,000 --> 00:39:59,680 Speaker 1: and consent, and we've mentioned s t I S and 648 00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:03,720 Speaker 1: things like that, but we haven't explained really, uh for 649 00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:06,319 Speaker 1: for people who might not know or understand what the 650 00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:09,120 Speaker 1: deal is with the potential spread of disease. Everybody is 651 00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:10,719 Speaker 1: very familiar with the idea that you should always wear 652 00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:12,840 Speaker 1: a condom, and anal sex is no different. What's the 653 00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:17,640 Speaker 1: deal with anal fissures, Caroline, All right, Jerry, Well, the 654 00:40:17,640 --> 00:40:23,520 Speaker 1: thing is the skin uh around the anus and in 655 00:40:23,719 --> 00:40:26,840 Speaker 1: the rectum is a lot thinner, for instance, than the 656 00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:30,080 Speaker 1: vaginal wall. So the vaginal wall can take a little 657 00:40:30,080 --> 00:40:34,680 Speaker 1: more friction than can the anus and the rectum, so 658 00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:38,399 Speaker 1: hence the need for lots of lube. But what does 659 00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:41,600 Speaker 1: that fragile tissue mean for you and me and for 660 00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:44,719 Speaker 1: all of our listeners. Well, not to indicate that all 661 00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:47,400 Speaker 1: of us are having anal sex all the time, however, 662 00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:51,919 Speaker 1: those little tears and fissures in the skin can introduce 663 00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:54,120 Speaker 1: and make the spread of S t I is a 664 00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:58,120 Speaker 1: lot easier. So regardless of whether you're using an object 665 00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:02,640 Speaker 1: or a penis, it is best with a condom on 666 00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,360 Speaker 1: if you are concerned about contracting any kind of S 667 00:41:05,480 --> 00:41:08,480 Speaker 1: t I S, and even with tools as well. I mean, 668 00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:11,759 Speaker 1: it's it's good to keep in mind that bacteria can 669 00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,520 Speaker 1: travel on that toy if you are using it again, 670 00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:16,160 Speaker 1: it can hang out on it, So you want to 671 00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:17,839 Speaker 1: clean it. You want to make sure that it's made 672 00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:21,480 Speaker 1: of non porous material things like silicon that can also 673 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:24,520 Speaker 1: be disinfected. You just gotta keep it clean. I'm not 674 00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:27,439 Speaker 1: saying that it's it's a dirty, gross area to stay 675 00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:30,560 Speaker 1: away from, but it just comes with a little bit 676 00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:34,680 Speaker 1: different instruction manual. Yeah. In other words, take your time, 677 00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:39,880 Speaker 1: go slow, have lots of prep, have some lube on hand. 678 00:41:39,960 --> 00:41:42,759 Speaker 1: You're gonna need lots of lube, and just keeping in 679 00:41:42,840 --> 00:41:45,279 Speaker 1: mind that you don't have to do anything you don't 680 00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:46,520 Speaker 1: want to do. If you want to give it a 681 00:41:46,560 --> 00:41:49,320 Speaker 1: try and you like it, fine, If you don't, fine, 682 00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:52,400 Speaker 1: I mean you know, and if your partner tries to 683 00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:55,880 Speaker 1: shame you for not wanting to do it, then not fine. Yeah, no, 684 00:41:57,000 --> 00:42:00,000 Speaker 1: not fine. Well, now, listeners, we want to hear from 685 00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:03,879 Speaker 1: you about your thoughts and experiences as much as you'd 686 00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:06,719 Speaker 1: like to share. When it comes to anal sex, do 687 00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:13,280 Speaker 1: you think that it's something that signals progression in our 688 00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:16,560 Speaker 1: culture and society, that it means that we're loosening up 689 00:42:16,600 --> 00:42:20,279 Speaker 1: and sex is becoming more fluid and open for all 690 00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:23,360 Speaker 1: of us. Or does it just feel like more pressure 691 00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:26,120 Speaker 1: and the types of sexual people that we have to 692 00:42:26,200 --> 00:42:28,440 Speaker 1: be in the way that we have to act in 693 00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:31,160 Speaker 1: the bedroom or you know, wherever you like to get down. 694 00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:33,759 Speaker 1: Moms Stuff at how stuff works dot Com is our 695 00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:36,879 Speaker 1: email address. You can also tweet us at Mom's Stuff 696 00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:40,280 Speaker 1: podcast or messages on Facebook, and we've got a couple 697 00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:50,160 Speaker 1: of messages to share with you right now. Well, I 698 00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:53,560 Speaker 1: have a letter here from Eric in response to our 699 00:42:53,600 --> 00:42:57,080 Speaker 1: Anxious Women episode. He says, I just wanted to weigh 700 00:42:57,080 --> 00:42:59,680 Speaker 1: in on your nature versus nurture debate on your Anxious 701 00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:02,920 Speaker 1: Women episode. As a gay man, I started to experience 702 00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:05,279 Speaker 1: mild anxiety around the time I came out at the 703 00:43:05,320 --> 00:43:09,040 Speaker 1: age of fifteen. Because I have a very typical gender 704 00:43:09,040 --> 00:43:11,760 Speaker 1: expression in relation to my birth gender, I was often 705 00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:16,040 Speaker 1: told and praised because I didn't seem that gay. At first, 706 00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:18,440 Speaker 1: it didn't seem that out of place because high school 707 00:43:18,560 --> 00:43:20,960 Speaker 1: kids were not a bastion of self awareness. But as 708 00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:23,759 Speaker 1: I got older I'm now twenty five, I noticed that 709 00:43:23,800 --> 00:43:27,040 Speaker 1: this reaction happened on an almost daily basis anywhere I 710 00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:30,000 Speaker 1: would meet new people. I find that my anger about 711 00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:34,480 Speaker 1: this subtle, internalized homophobia triggered severe social anxiety around new people. 712 00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:37,239 Speaker 1: I find that most of my anxiety is centered around 713 00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:40,680 Speaker 1: the way that others perceived my sexual orientation, the fact 714 00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:44,200 Speaker 1: that people frequently make passively homophobic remarks to me, because, 715 00:43:44,239 --> 00:43:47,239 Speaker 1: as it has been explained to me, I'm a passible 716 00:43:47,320 --> 00:43:50,839 Speaker 1: straight man, and I'm less impacted by my sexuality makes 717 00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:54,200 Speaker 1: me second guess every gesture, word choice, and facial expression, 718 00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:57,239 Speaker 1: the result of which is overworrying and anxiety and in 719 00:43:57,280 --> 00:44:01,040 Speaker 1: some cases downright panic attacks are more often is canceling plans. 720 00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:05,040 Speaker 1: I think that pervasive sexual harassment, which has been widely 721 00:44:05,080 --> 00:44:07,680 Speaker 1: documented that women experience on a daily basis, could be 722 00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:09,879 Speaker 1: one of the ways that we nurture women into having 723 00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:13,080 Speaker 1: a higher rate of diagnosed anxiety disorder. But that might 724 00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:15,760 Speaker 1: also just be a bit of projecting. Love the show 725 00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:18,440 Speaker 1: and keep up the good work. Well, thanks Eric, Well, 726 00:44:18,440 --> 00:44:20,880 Speaker 1: I've got a let her hear from Nicole, who writes, 727 00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:23,640 Speaker 1: I'm a thirty year old African American woman and I 728 00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:26,480 Speaker 1: got diagnosed with anxiety disordered during my freshman year of 729 00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:29,600 Speaker 1: college after having a panic attack during an exam. You're 730 00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:31,880 Speaker 1: definitely right that culture has a lot to do with 731 00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:36,000 Speaker 1: notions of anxiety. While you discussed foreign cultures during the episode, 732 00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:38,320 Speaker 1: I thought to write to tell you about my experience 733 00:44:38,360 --> 00:44:41,720 Speaker 1: with this as an African American. As I'm sure you've heard, 734 00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:46,120 Speaker 1: mental health issues are still stigmatized in the African American community. 735 00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:48,799 Speaker 1: When I started college. I was a pre med major, 736 00:44:48,880 --> 00:44:52,160 Speaker 1: taking twenty credits. My first semester living away from home 737 00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:54,560 Speaker 1: for the first time, two roommates in a tiny dorm, 738 00:44:54,600 --> 00:44:57,160 Speaker 1: all the class work, and being one of only three 739 00:44:57,239 --> 00:45:00,200 Speaker 1: African American girls out of about sixty can take it's 740 00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:02,799 Speaker 1: toll on an eighteen year old. Well, my friends in 741 00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:05,520 Speaker 1: college seemed to understand, and we're very supportive. My family 742 00:45:05,640 --> 00:45:08,759 Speaker 1: was not. Older relatives told me things like I just 743 00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:11,200 Speaker 1: needed to be tough and they raised me to be strong. 744 00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:14,640 Speaker 1: Things like this made me discuss my anxiety less with them, 745 00:45:14,640 --> 00:45:17,919 Speaker 1: but more with a therapist. I saw several therapists throughout 746 00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:19,920 Speaker 1: my time in college and later in law school, and 747 00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:21,839 Speaker 1: now as an adult, I found a therapist who has 748 00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:25,279 Speaker 1: given me some coping mechanisms. As was mentioned, I think 749 00:45:25,320 --> 00:45:27,880 Speaker 1: it's a very modern, middle class millennial thing to have 750 00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:31,360 Speaker 1: a therapist. However, I still get some reactions of surprise, 751 00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:34,120 Speaker 1: like there's nothing wrong with you. Everyone has issues, et cetera. 752 00:45:34,400 --> 00:45:36,120 Speaker 1: When I speak with some of my older and more 753 00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:39,560 Speaker 1: working class African American relatives. It's my hope that shows 754 00:45:39,600 --> 00:45:42,040 Speaker 1: like yours and others will help continue to remove the 755 00:45:42,080 --> 00:45:45,239 Speaker 1: stigma surrounding mental health. Especially in minority communities where the 756 00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:48,759 Speaker 1: stakes tend to be much higher because of life circumstances 757 00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:52,600 Speaker 1: and community conditions. Oh, she says, keep up the great work. 758 00:45:52,600 --> 00:45:55,520 Speaker 1: I'm friends with both of you in my mind. Thanks 759 00:45:55,560 --> 00:45:58,560 Speaker 1: so much, Nicole, and thanks to everybody who's written into us. 760 00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:01,080 Speaker 1: Moms Stuff at how so works dot com is our 761 00:46:01,160 --> 00:46:03,840 Speaker 1: email address and drilling to all of our social media 762 00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:06,200 Speaker 1: as well as all of our blogs, videos, and podcasts, 763 00:46:06,200 --> 00:46:08,560 Speaker 1: including this one with our sources. So you can learn 764 00:46:08,600 --> 00:46:12,759 Speaker 1: more about anal sex and consent and pleasure. Head on 765 00:46:12,840 --> 00:46:19,520 Speaker 1: over to stuff mom Never Told You dot com for 766 00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:21,960 Speaker 1: more on this and thousands of other topics. Is it 767 00:46:22,080 --> 00:46:30,800 Speaker 1: how stuff works dot com