1 00:00:01,560 --> 00:00:14,720 Speaker 1: Crime. Hello, we one, and welcome back to another episode 2 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:17,759 Speaker 1: of Real Time Crime. I'm your host Leo Lamar and 3 00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:24,240 Speaker 1: I have with me sometimes now oftentimes Dmitri. Hello, oftentimes Dmitri. 4 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:28,280 Speaker 1: I'm in paradise. I know you are. And this is 5 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 1: the first time we're doing this podcast, like all the 6 00:00:30,920 --> 00:00:35,080 Speaker 1: way around the world. It's nine pm here, and I 7 00:00:35,120 --> 00:00:38,280 Speaker 1: will say that it doesn't make it any easier the 8 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:40,440 Speaker 1: later it gets for me, and it doesn't make it 9 00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 1: any easier the earlier we do this for me, So 10 00:00:42,680 --> 00:00:45,480 Speaker 1: it's never easy for me. That was the whole reason 11 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:47,479 Speaker 1: we sent you over there was because we're like, we 12 00:00:47,520 --> 00:00:49,559 Speaker 1: could do the podcast a regular time, but it'll be 13 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:52,839 Speaker 1: nighttime for her. It'll be perfect and Leo will finally 14 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:56,280 Speaker 1: be awake. Well, let me tell you, I could sleep 15 00:00:56,320 --> 00:00:59,320 Speaker 1: as late as you will let me. Oh boy. And 16 00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:01,800 Speaker 1: I'm in a eza in case anyone who's interested, No, 17 00:01:01,920 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 1: I won't say Abitha because apparently that's not actually how 18 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:08,000 Speaker 1: you're supposed to say it. It annoys me anyway, so yeah, 19 00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:11,560 Speaker 1: and mostly because it annoys Dmitri. Today we will be 20 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:15,480 Speaker 1: discussing a couple of hot topics, some of your favorite 21 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:18,520 Speaker 1: I's only got a sexphone operator right now. I don't 22 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:22,240 Speaker 1: know what they sound like, but sure, sure, sure, sure 23 00:01:22,560 --> 00:01:27,319 Speaker 1: how much it's twenty dollars per minute. So of course 24 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:29,920 Speaker 1: we've got two amazing guests for you today, and we'll 25 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:34,000 Speaker 1: be talking about The Big Con, which airs on Apple 26 00:01:34,080 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 1: TV Plus and on Apple Podcasts May six. So get 27 00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:43,240 Speaker 1: excited because we've got guests who are gonna be speaking 28 00:01:43,240 --> 00:01:46,520 Speaker 1: to the nature of that show and the podcast. Our 29 00:01:46,560 --> 00:01:49,919 Speaker 1: first guest today is James Lee Hernandez. He's a multi 30 00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 1: Emmy and pg A Award nominated filmmaker and critically acclaimed podcaster. 31 00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:58,520 Speaker 1: He recently directed, wrote, and edited the five time Emmy 32 00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:03,760 Speaker 1: nominated HBO origin old documentary series mcmillions with his creative 33 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 1: partner Brian Lazarte, who will be meeting next Hernandez executive 34 00:02:07,400 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 1: produced the series with Mark Wahlberg, Stephen Levinson, Archie Gibbs, 35 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 1: and Lazarte. Hernandez as a founding partner of fund Meter, 36 00:02:15,200 --> 00:02:18,480 Speaker 1: a TV and film production company specializing in Stranger than Fiction, 37 00:02:18,560 --> 00:02:24,359 Speaker 1: scripted and unscripted content. Recently announced, Hernandez and Lazarte are writing, directing, 38 00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: an executive producing two documentary series for Apple TV Plus 39 00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 1: through fund Meter, The Big Con, and The Jet. Both 40 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:33,840 Speaker 1: shows are slated to be released in two and then 41 00:02:33,880 --> 00:02:37,320 Speaker 1: we have Brian Lazarte. He's an Emmy nominated filmmaker and editor. 42 00:02:37,480 --> 00:02:40,800 Speaker 1: His credits include a variety of award winning documentaries and series, 43 00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:44,920 Speaker 1: most notably mcmillions for HBO, which he wrote, directed, executive produced, 44 00:02:44,919 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 1: and edited alongside James Lee Hernandez. His four part Apple 45 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:52,040 Speaker 1: TV Plus original docs series The Big Con and Apple 46 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 1: TV Plus original documentary series The Jet will be available 47 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:58,400 Speaker 1: to stream this year. Some other credits may include Katie 48 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:01,080 Speaker 1: Perry part of Me three d a, HBO's Emmy Award 49 00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:05,200 Speaker 1: winning Sonic Highways, fed Up at ESPN's Emmy Award winning 50 00:03:05,200 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 1: Hawaiian The Legend of Eddie Aku, thirty for thirty. I mean, 51 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:11,240 Speaker 1: the list goes on and on, and we are so 52 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:14,440 Speaker 1: excited to be speaking with them today about their new show, 53 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:17,040 Speaker 1: The Big Con, which is a four part Apple TV 54 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:21,120 Speaker 1: Plus documentary series with a companion podcast about Eric c. 55 00:03:21,280 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 1: kN hilarious that his last name is Con when he's 56 00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:30,200 Speaker 1: a con man. Yeah, I mean, it's hilarious who defrauded 57 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:33,680 Speaker 1: the government and taxpayers over half a billion dollars. Former 58 00:03:33,720 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 1: Eastern Kentucky attorney Eric S. Kon is known for committing 59 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 1: the largest social Security fraud case in history. The Big 60 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:44,720 Speaker 1: Con examines his larger than life story, the people he defrauded, 61 00:03:44,800 --> 00:03:47,240 Speaker 1: and his inevitable run from the law. The trailer described 62 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:50,200 Speaker 1: Cohn as one of the biggest lawyers in Appalachia and 63 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 1: his celebrity was unavoidable. He used his riches to attract 64 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:57,160 Speaker 1: porn stars, throw out rageous parties, and open to Halloween 65 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 1: themed brothel. My kind of guy. He had ventually caught 66 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:03,240 Speaker 1: the eye of law enforcement after defrauding taxpayers in the 67 00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:06,920 Speaker 1: United States. Out of mill subscribers can watch the four 68 00:04:06,960 --> 00:04:09,920 Speaker 1: part documentary series and Apple TV Plus, and anyone can 69 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:12,400 Speaker 1: listen to The Companion Show on Apple Podcast when both 70 00:04:12,440 --> 00:05:01,560 Speaker 1: premiere on May six. M HM, Hi James and Brian, 71 00:05:01,680 --> 00:05:04,280 Speaker 1: So nice to meet you. Hello, nice to meet you 72 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:07,880 Speaker 1: as well, and Leeah. I don't usually record from what 73 00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:11,920 Speaker 1: looks like the inside of an insane asylum, but I 74 00:05:11,960 --> 00:05:14,880 Speaker 1: am in a BISA, not to brag, and I'm this 75 00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 1: is the only location that has WiFi. There's no five 76 00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:21,080 Speaker 1: G on this island. I mean, nothing works here and 77 00:05:21,160 --> 00:05:23,920 Speaker 1: yet I have three bars of service here. So this 78 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:25,920 Speaker 1: is the room that I'm podcasting in today. I don't 79 00:05:25,920 --> 00:05:28,400 Speaker 1: want to tell her that her regular apartment looks more 80 00:05:28,440 --> 00:05:32,440 Speaker 1: like an insane asylum than her hotel room. But well, 81 00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 1: he's not wrong that that actually that journey took me 82 00:05:36,240 --> 00:05:38,440 Speaker 1: all over the place. One I was going to think 83 00:05:38,480 --> 00:05:41,040 Speaker 1: that you actually were insane asylum, and I learned her. 84 00:05:41,839 --> 00:05:43,560 Speaker 1: And now I'm a little upset that we're not at 85 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:46,159 Speaker 1: some party with you right now on the beach. So 86 00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:50,480 Speaker 1: I'll deal. Well, I do have three brain cells left, 87 00:05:50,480 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 1: so I will end up in an insane asylum. Comes 88 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:56,720 Speaker 1: full circle really at our our l A premiere last 89 00:05:56,800 --> 00:06:01,560 Speaker 1: night and we're up a little late, so we thanks 90 00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:04,200 Speaker 1: for the invite, guys, not that I could have made it, 91 00:06:04,279 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: just you know, wanted to be invited so I could say, no, 92 00:06:06,520 --> 00:06:12,200 Speaker 1: I'm in a pizza. Yeah, understandable. Just so you know, 93 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:14,599 Speaker 1: I gave you both very big intros with all of 94 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:23,440 Speaker 1: your credits right before this, so just so yeah, so 95 00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:26,520 Speaker 1: just yeah, And that's the show, ladies and gentlemen, So 96 00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:28,599 Speaker 1: just pretend that you feel really loved by us and 97 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:32,840 Speaker 1: respected if that's okay, Yeah, that easy. I mean, it's 98 00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:38,680 Speaker 1: show business, baby, So we already told people a little 99 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:41,240 Speaker 1: bit about the big Con and we're very excited for 100 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:44,800 Speaker 1: your new series and the Companion podcast. So now we've 101 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:50,400 Speaker 1: got a ton of questions for you to hit us gently. 102 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:55,839 Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not Will Smith, you know, yeah, true, 103 00:06:57,200 --> 00:06:59,760 Speaker 1: he was. He was bobbing and leaving. You know, he's 104 00:06:59,800 --> 00:07:01,840 Speaker 1: doing great. I mean the most notable hit now is 105 00:07:01,920 --> 00:07:04,599 Speaker 1: Dave Chappelle last night, and then Chris Rock came on 106 00:07:04,839 --> 00:07:07,120 Speaker 1: and said, was that you Will Smith? You guys heard 107 00:07:07,160 --> 00:07:11,800 Speaker 1: about this? I'm sure yes. I mean as a comedian, 108 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 1: I find this terrifying. Terrifying. It is like that's the 109 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:18,520 Speaker 1: that's like the terrible thing about this is that now 110 00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:21,560 Speaker 1: that's all of a sudden like normalizes something insane like 111 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:25,040 Speaker 1: that happening, which it absolutely should not be. And hopefully 112 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:27,800 Speaker 1: it goes back to the seventies, eighties and nineties of 113 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:31,119 Speaker 1: the Academy Awards next year where there's some insanely large 114 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:36,600 Speaker 1: stage that people tripped all over themselves. I also missed 115 00:07:36,640 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 1: just seeing those videos in general. But yeah, that's just 116 00:07:40,040 --> 00:07:44,120 Speaker 1: very unfortunate and like nobody should have to deal with that. Yeah. No, 117 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:46,880 Speaker 1: there's been some sort of opening where even the NBA 118 00:07:46,920 --> 00:07:49,920 Speaker 1: playoffs now people are like storming the courts. It seems, 119 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:53,480 Speaker 1: you know, more at a rapid pace and more frequently 120 00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:56,600 Speaker 1: people are running on and interrupting things. And I mean, 121 00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:59,000 Speaker 1: obviously it's got to have something to do with with 122 00:07:59,040 --> 00:08:01,000 Speaker 1: a notoriety and that's TikTok and this and that. But 123 00:08:01,080 --> 00:08:04,720 Speaker 1: it's like it's it's it's kind of insane. I think 124 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 1: you think this is going to be the norm. So 125 00:08:07,400 --> 00:08:10,920 Speaker 1: I'm just I'm pretending for a moment that like this 126 00:08:11,000 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 1: is just a fluke, uh that we're experiencing at the moment. Yeah, 127 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 1: I think that reality TV has become so rampant that 128 00:08:20,640 --> 00:08:23,640 Speaker 1: it's blending so much with society where people feel like 129 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:25,800 Speaker 1: they have to do all of these crazy things to 130 00:08:25,840 --> 00:08:30,640 Speaker 1: get noticed, you know, TikTok, reality television and and it's 131 00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:32,920 Speaker 1: everyone's just one upping each other constantly. And I don't 132 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:35,320 Speaker 1: think that these are challenges, so to speak, but I 133 00:08:35,360 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 1: do think society has become unrealistic with what people can 134 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:42,440 Speaker 1: and cannot do. You know, there's no proper morals anymore. 135 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:47,120 Speaker 1: And wanted to talk about but right up your guy's 136 00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:49,600 Speaker 1: alley though, like the Tinder swindler, right, he he swindled 137 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:51,520 Speaker 1: people out of all this money and so what happened? 138 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:53,360 Speaker 1: They're like, Oh, he's gonna get his own TV show, 139 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:56,480 Speaker 1: So why would these people see consequences accept the potential 140 00:08:56,559 --> 00:09:00,320 Speaker 1: upside to doing stuff like that. Speaking of ch if 141 00:09:00,320 --> 00:09:03,240 Speaker 1: you guys could check your pockets, I've already stolen your 142 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:06,360 Speaker 1: identities and your money. But thank you so much. I 143 00:09:06,400 --> 00:09:10,000 Speaker 1: hope to get a TV deal out of this. Yeah. Yeah, 144 00:09:10,040 --> 00:09:12,079 Speaker 1: I mean that is a really fascinating thing as you 145 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:15,120 Speaker 1: start to look at as true crime has gotten more 146 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:18,120 Speaker 1: and more popular and really what has now been deemed 147 00:09:18,160 --> 00:09:22,559 Speaker 1: true cons uh, it almost feels like, in a certain sense, 148 00:09:22,559 --> 00:09:26,880 Speaker 1: there's the annadel v level of know how she achieved 149 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:29,040 Speaker 1: what she wanted to achieve. Her whole thing was wanting 150 00:09:29,160 --> 00:09:32,560 Speaker 1: to be famous and recognized and be this whole hous thing. 151 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:35,960 Speaker 1: There is an entire TV show, scripted TV show on 152 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 1: Netflix about her, and she won. It's it's like the 153 00:09:39,520 --> 00:09:42,360 Speaker 1: end of the movie seven, Like, even though you think 154 00:09:42,400 --> 00:09:45,920 Speaker 1: that person lost, they actually did achieve the thing they wanted. 155 00:09:46,840 --> 00:09:50,920 Speaker 1: It's true. And as someone who's in ABISA getting a 156 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:54,640 Speaker 1: v I P experience and not taking any of the 157 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:56,920 Speaker 1: g A routes, I will say v I P is 158 00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:02,400 Speaker 1: always better. Thanks for the continuing to rub that in. Yeah, 159 00:10:02,440 --> 00:10:04,160 Speaker 1: I feel like we should do a shot every time 160 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:10,080 Speaker 1: she mentioned we didn't get wasn't coming through yet. I 161 00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:14,560 Speaker 1: don't know what's happening, and Adelvia and Adelvie keeps winning. Okay, 162 00:10:14,559 --> 00:10:18,040 Speaker 1: So you guys just really quickly right from millions to 163 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:21,600 Speaker 1: the big Con. What led you to your fascination with 164 00:10:21,679 --> 00:10:25,720 Speaker 1: con artists and swindlers to begin with? I don't I 165 00:10:25,720 --> 00:10:29,199 Speaker 1: don't know if it's necessarily were attracted to con artists 166 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:32,920 Speaker 1: or swindlers. I think we're just I am sorry what 167 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, it's quite the dating. Well, the 168 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:44,640 Speaker 1: the the attractive component of mcmillions was that this happened, 169 00:10:45,320 --> 00:10:47,640 Speaker 1: you know, in the in the nineties when all of 170 00:10:47,720 --> 00:10:51,840 Speaker 1: us were playing this crazy game, right, um, And so 171 00:10:51,920 --> 00:10:54,680 Speaker 1: it's pulling back the curtain at like what was happening 172 00:10:54,720 --> 00:10:57,719 Speaker 1: behind the scenes, and it's incredible fraud story. And at 173 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:00,840 Speaker 1: the helm of it was this uh as con artists, 174 00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:04,640 Speaker 1: right And in this case, because our main character is 175 00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:08,880 Speaker 1: named con Uh, there is certainly a natural attraction to 176 00:11:09,080 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 1: this person. But after doing a fraud story like mcmillians, 177 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:15,600 Speaker 1: like we weren't we weren't really thinking, Hey, our next 178 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:18,800 Speaker 1: project is going to be necessarily a fraud story, and 179 00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:21,439 Speaker 1: and if we did it, how can we do it different? 180 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:25,640 Speaker 1: What's something that we hadn't really tapped into in this 181 00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:27,480 Speaker 1: type of genre. And one of the things that we 182 00:11:27,679 --> 00:11:31,600 Speaker 1: didn't have with mcmillions was Jerry Jacobson, who was the 183 00:11:31,679 --> 00:11:34,439 Speaker 1: you know, the main person right at the helm. We 184 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:37,520 Speaker 1: had everyone else talking about him, and the series really 185 00:11:37,520 --> 00:11:40,520 Speaker 1: didn't suffer. We don't feel like for not having them, 186 00:11:40,760 --> 00:11:44,080 Speaker 1: but for the big con we knew we wanted to 187 00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 1: hear from Eric himself and we he was actually one 188 00:11:48,120 --> 00:11:49,960 Speaker 1: of the first people that we reach out to to 189 00:11:50,080 --> 00:11:52,720 Speaker 1: really see if we could build his trust and if 190 00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:56,280 Speaker 1: he could participate and how could we make that happen. 191 00:11:56,679 --> 00:11:59,439 Speaker 1: And through that process, he revealed that he'd been writing 192 00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:02,520 Speaker 1: kind of his life story. He shared it with us 193 00:12:02,559 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 1: and it was like, you know, this insane, uh rose 194 00:12:06,640 --> 00:12:10,040 Speaker 1: colored glasses view of his his life. It read like 195 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:12,760 Speaker 1: a movie. So uh, we knew that that was going 196 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:15,760 Speaker 1: to be an ingredient that would make this significantly different. 197 00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:18,920 Speaker 1: But the stakes of this story are so much greater 198 00:12:19,559 --> 00:12:23,680 Speaker 1: uh than mcmillions, And I think we were just captivated 199 00:12:23,720 --> 00:12:25,640 Speaker 1: by the possibilities of where this story can go. No 200 00:12:25,679 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 1: one had really done a deep dive on this before. 201 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:30,040 Speaker 1: But I mean this is insane. Obviously you go back 202 00:12:30,080 --> 00:12:32,240 Speaker 1: to the guy's name is con right off the bat, 203 00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:35,040 Speaker 1: maybe he's destined for this, but I mean he stole 204 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:39,480 Speaker 1: more than five fifty million and social security benefits. Like, yeah, 205 00:12:40,559 --> 00:12:42,680 Speaker 1: obviously we don't want to spoil the you know everyone's 206 00:12:42,720 --> 00:12:45,520 Speaker 1: gonna watch it anyway, But how does it How do 207 00:12:45,559 --> 00:12:48,360 Speaker 1: you go about something like does this? Does this? Did 208 00:12:48,360 --> 00:12:50,040 Speaker 1: it trickle in? He's like, I'm gonna start with this 209 00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 1: and then just realized what a grand scheme it could 210 00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:56,800 Speaker 1: be and just kept it kept snowballing in a sense, Yeah, 211 00:12:57,000 --> 00:12:59,920 Speaker 1: he started out just as a regular attorney doing sales 212 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 1: with security benefits and just in general and eastern Kentucky, 213 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:07,560 Speaker 1: the two main counties are Pike County and uh and 214 00:13:07,640 --> 00:13:11,839 Speaker 1: Floyd County, and there two basically counties that are propped 215 00:13:11,880 --> 00:13:15,920 Speaker 1: up completely by coal mining and and the eighties, seventies 216 00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:19,480 Speaker 1: and eighties, Pike County had more millionaires per capita than 217 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:22,079 Speaker 1: any other county in the nation. Now it is one 218 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:24,760 Speaker 1: of the poorest counties in the nation because coal just 219 00:13:24,960 --> 00:13:28,360 Speaker 1: is going away. It's really almost fully pulled out of 220 00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 1: the area. But part of that is coal mining is 221 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:34,160 Speaker 1: a very very difficult profession, and so you have a 222 00:13:34,200 --> 00:13:37,760 Speaker 1: lot of younger people, specially young men that are in 223 00:13:37,760 --> 00:13:41,000 Speaker 1: their forties and fifties, that are now just totally decimated 224 00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:44,640 Speaker 1: by working in the coal industry. They can't work anymore, 225 00:13:44,640 --> 00:13:47,000 Speaker 1: they can't stand, they can't really sit for long periods 226 00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:49,200 Speaker 1: of time, and so they need to go on these 227 00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:51,440 Speaker 1: benefits to help them for the rest of their lives. 228 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:55,199 Speaker 1: Eric saw this and also saw the opportunity that a 229 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:58,600 Speaker 1: lot of these people don't know lawyers. They don't they 230 00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:00,840 Speaker 1: it's all word of mouth. They just well, you know, 231 00:14:00,880 --> 00:14:03,160 Speaker 1: who did you like a friend and neighbor, who did 232 00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:04,840 Speaker 1: you get your benefits from? Okay, I'm gonna go to 233 00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:07,880 Speaker 1: that person. And so he bought out every billboard in 234 00:14:07,880 --> 00:14:11,920 Speaker 1: the small town. He did all these crazy commercials. He 235 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:16,199 Speaker 1: bought out like almost every ad in the newspaper. They 236 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:19,880 Speaker 1: were doing radio ads, it's songs. He was really, as 237 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:22,480 Speaker 1: he referred to himself, a marketing genius in the sense 238 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,520 Speaker 1: that everybody then knew Eric con is the person you 239 00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:28,120 Speaker 1: go to to get your benefits. And what they didn't 240 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:32,120 Speaker 1: understand is that behind the scenes, Eric was getting these 241 00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:36,480 Speaker 1: rubber stamps to just put anybody on benefits because he 242 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:43,160 Speaker 1: had public officials and judges on the payroll. Wow, I mean, 243 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:47,720 Speaker 1: that's straight up mafia style, it is, and it's wild 244 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:51,560 Speaker 1: because it's not really that complex of a scheme. It's 245 00:14:51,720 --> 00:14:56,080 Speaker 1: the the tried and true. You know, you scratch my back, 246 00:14:56,120 --> 00:14:59,120 Speaker 1: I scratch yours. Um. But at the same time, it 247 00:14:59,200 --> 00:15:02,960 Speaker 1: exposes this massive flaw in the system of social security 248 00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:06,320 Speaker 1: because the reason, one of the reasons con was so 249 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,360 Speaker 1: successful is that he was getting people benefits in like 250 00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:12,600 Speaker 1: two months. Normally people had to wait eighteen months to 251 00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:16,320 Speaker 1: two years to get their benefits. And that is all 252 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:20,080 Speaker 1: because of the way social security works. It just takes 253 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 1: so so long to get you approved to get these benefits. 254 00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:26,800 Speaker 1: If the system worked better than things like this wouldn't happen. 255 00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:31,480 Speaker 1: It seems to me, excuse me. The people that are 256 00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:36,200 Speaker 1: best at this, whether it be the mcmillions or this um, 257 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:37,960 Speaker 1: they have to have two things. They have to be smart, 258 00:15:38,080 --> 00:15:40,160 Speaker 1: right they have they have to be smart to pull 259 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:42,280 Speaker 1: this kind of thing off. But they have to just 260 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:46,920 Speaker 1: give zeros about anybody that they're affecting. I mean, right, 261 00:15:47,240 --> 00:15:51,320 Speaker 1: they don't care about anybody else. Well. Eric C. Khan 262 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:55,000 Speaker 1: is one of the most fascinating complex characters. I think 263 00:15:55,560 --> 00:16:00,400 Speaker 1: in a documentary series. Uh we when we non biased opinion, 264 00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:05,240 Speaker 1: it's it's obviously can we start calling him Eric con artist? Please? 265 00:16:06,840 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 1: I mean he just I think when people watch the 266 00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 1: documentary series, you're gonna go into it thinking you know 267 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 1: who he is. Uh, and you're gonna have strong feelings 268 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:23,000 Speaker 1: about him, and then by the fourth episode, by the end, 269 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:26,440 Speaker 1: you might have a completely different feeling about him. Uh. 270 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:29,440 Speaker 1: And are you gonna make us like this guy? Yeah? 271 00:16:30,080 --> 00:16:34,520 Speaker 1: Reasoning is he giving all the money to charity? I 272 00:16:34,520 --> 00:16:36,160 Speaker 1: don't even I don't even think like that. I think 273 00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:39,040 Speaker 1: it's more of a feeling that you might have. Um, 274 00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:41,280 Speaker 1: I don't know if you'll know how you'll feel. You 275 00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:44,280 Speaker 1: you're just gonna feel different. Um. But you know when 276 00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:47,440 Speaker 1: you talk about like what is it about these people? 277 00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:51,400 Speaker 1: Is it narcissism? Is it greed? Uh? Is it the 278 00:16:51,520 --> 00:16:55,720 Speaker 1: lack of shame? Right? Which you know it very well 279 00:16:55,840 --> 00:16:58,720 Speaker 1: could be. Um, and that could be a superpower, right, 280 00:16:58,760 --> 00:17:00,720 Speaker 1: Like I don't give him so I'm gonna all right, 281 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:04,640 Speaker 1: I don't know. Wow, he's been acting really strangely are 282 00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:08,800 Speaker 1: we are we allowed to swear you haven't listened to 283 00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:12,359 Speaker 1: the podcast, which is clear, but I mean, well, or 284 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:14,600 Speaker 1: you didn't listen to me thirty seconds ago I said, 285 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:17,720 Speaker 1: zero seconds ago. Or you haven't listened to any of 286 00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:21,160 Speaker 1: my stand up. Yeah. No, just go on, guys, go ahead, 287 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:23,720 Speaker 1: please please feel free to curse. Feel free to curse, 288 00:17:24,040 --> 00:17:26,760 Speaker 1: all right, But you know, at the at the point 289 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:30,840 Speaker 1: in which you learn about how crazy this crime is, 290 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:35,119 Speaker 1: right Eric, I mean, social security is not a stexy 291 00:17:35,440 --> 00:17:39,359 Speaker 1: um like backdrop for a crime. And it's one of 292 00:17:39,359 --> 00:17:41,560 Speaker 1: the reasons why he got away with it first so long, 293 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:45,520 Speaker 1: because people weren't paying attention or people just didn't understand it. 294 00:17:45,760 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 1: And when you try to dig in, it's a little complicated. 295 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:50,879 Speaker 1: And so one of the things that we really worked 296 00:17:50,920 --> 00:17:54,359 Speaker 1: hard at was find a way to really help people 297 00:17:55,440 --> 00:17:59,040 Speaker 1: understand this in a really entertaining and fun way. And 298 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:01,240 Speaker 1: because there is a lot of humor, there's a lot 299 00:18:01,320 --> 00:18:06,560 Speaker 1: of you know, just quirky, uh, stranger than fiction components 300 00:18:06,560 --> 00:18:09,560 Speaker 1: of the story. But there's also this great tragedy. I mean, 301 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:13,560 Speaker 1: when when Eric does this, you know, gets away with 302 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:16,720 Speaker 1: her for ten years, uh, when he finally gets busted, 303 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:19,960 Speaker 1: he goes on the run, and while he's on the run, 304 00:18:20,359 --> 00:18:25,359 Speaker 1: this crazy thing happens in eastern Kentucky, uh, with everybody 305 00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:29,200 Speaker 1: who was associated with him in one way or the other. Um. 306 00:18:29,240 --> 00:18:31,680 Speaker 1: And it's part of the devastation of this story as well. 307 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:35,360 Speaker 1: I feel like we it's hard to follow up questions 308 00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:40,560 Speaker 1: about that without giving away too much. It feels like true, yeah, 309 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 1: well you know, Bob, and weave through the minefield of 310 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:57,879 Speaker 1: giving too much away. Ye. It sounds like there's a 311 00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:00,080 Speaker 1: lot that that that that is going to happen. And 312 00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:03,160 Speaker 1: so it's a four part series, right, correct. So it's 313 00:19:03,359 --> 00:19:06,800 Speaker 1: a four part documentary series on Apple TV Plus called 314 00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:11,480 Speaker 1: The Big Hunt coming out Basis and um. It really 315 00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:16,040 Speaker 1: takes you through the journey of Eric and you really 316 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:18,920 Speaker 1: start to understand who he is. But at the core 317 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:23,160 Speaker 1: of this entire thing are these two whistleblowers, Sarah and Jennifer. 318 00:19:24,119 --> 00:19:26,919 Speaker 1: They worked for the Social Security Administration in one of 319 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:30,880 Speaker 1: the local offices in West Virginia and they had been 320 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:35,480 Speaker 1: ringing the alarm bells for years that something was going 321 00:19:35,560 --> 00:19:39,040 Speaker 1: on with one of the judges and with Eric Kahan. 322 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:41,600 Speaker 1: But they were only on one side of it. They 323 00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:43,600 Speaker 1: couldn't really figure it out, but they were staying, Look, 324 00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:46,160 Speaker 1: this is not supposed to happen the way that this 325 00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:51,840 Speaker 1: is going. And it is fascinating because until Damian Plata, 326 00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:55,720 Speaker 1: who wrote the Wall Street Journal article about this, they 327 00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,520 Speaker 1: weren't even recognizing local news wasn't wanting to cover it. 328 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 1: People that at work that they were supposed to report 329 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:06,240 Speaker 1: any sort of wrongdoing or anything to just turn their 330 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:09,439 Speaker 1: backs on them and and a lot and retaliated against them, 331 00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 1: try to get them fired. Um. And so we we've 332 00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:16,600 Speaker 1: really seen this journey what it means to stand up 333 00:20:16,600 --> 00:20:19,800 Speaker 1: for what you think is right, because Sarah Jennifer didn't 334 00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:23,159 Speaker 1: get any sort of benefit at all out of standing 335 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:26,800 Speaker 1: up against the Social Security administration. Actually quite the opposite. 336 00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:31,480 Speaker 1: They were chastise and really like and they they people 337 00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:34,320 Speaker 1: try to get them fired, but they stood up for 338 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:36,720 Speaker 1: what was right. And it also shows, you know, with 339 00:20:36,840 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 1: Damien stepping in and shining a light on this and 340 00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 1: then all of a sudden that leads to a Senate 341 00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:45,640 Speaker 1: hearing that leads to investigations happening. Um. It shows why 342 00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:48,520 Speaker 1: the news exists because you know, all of us, as 343 00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:51,360 Speaker 1: individual citizens, there's only so much we can do. Our 344 00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:53,560 Speaker 1: voice can only be so loud, But when you have 345 00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:56,200 Speaker 1: the megaphone of an EFC, like the Wall Street Journal, 346 00:20:56,640 --> 00:21:00,600 Speaker 1: that really holds a government entity to a task. It's 347 00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:04,440 Speaker 1: interesting what you said. I find that more common nowadays, 348 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:06,480 Speaker 1: where people who are afraid to do the right thing 349 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:09,240 Speaker 1: or to speak up because it's it almost it's like 350 00:21:09,280 --> 00:21:11,520 Speaker 1: it doesn't matter the people that say, oh, hey, this 351 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:13,399 Speaker 1: is people are being hurt by this, this this is 352 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:15,440 Speaker 1: being done, we need to stop this. Then all of 353 00:21:15,480 --> 00:21:17,680 Speaker 1: a sudden, those guys get slandered to those guys get 354 00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:20,160 Speaker 1: and it's like it's it's a it's a fine line 355 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:22,439 Speaker 1: to walk. So I think there's I think heroes in 356 00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 1: that sense kind of stand out more nowadays when they 357 00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:28,320 Speaker 1: can get stuff done and get people behind them. It's hard. 358 00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:29,760 Speaker 1: I mean you even see it with the Me Too 359 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:32,560 Speaker 1: movement where some people who come out against people who 360 00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:35,720 Speaker 1: have harmed them. Now people don't want to work with 361 00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:40,200 Speaker 1: them for whatever reason, and it's difficult to come forward. 362 00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:42,920 Speaker 1: But you know, I would like to just pivot really 363 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:45,800 Speaker 1: quickly and maybe go back to talking about Eric. But 364 00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:51,000 Speaker 1: Eric was apparently super popular in Kentucky, right, and he 365 00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:54,600 Speaker 1: was touted as this like modern day Robin hood. H 366 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:59,400 Speaker 1: where do you think that that characterization came from? If 367 00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:01,359 Speaker 1: you can give us a little nugget without giving too 368 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:05,120 Speaker 1: much a way, Well, in a lot of ways, he 369 00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:09,119 Speaker 1: really did want to help people, or at least on 370 00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:13,040 Speaker 1: the surface, well it appeared, I mean Elizabeth Holmes said 371 00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:17,119 Speaker 1: the same thing, right. I mean, he you know, he 372 00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:20,760 Speaker 1: was born in that region of the country, and so 373 00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 1: he had seen first him his parents were, you know, 374 00:22:23,320 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 1: in the cold camps and uh, and so he'd seen 375 00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:29,280 Speaker 1: extreme poverty. Um. And so I think that there was 376 00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:33,480 Speaker 1: an inherent like interest in wanting to do something for 377 00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:38,000 Speaker 1: his area. UM. Now, people can argue that that's not 378 00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:42,919 Speaker 1: what his motivations were, certainly, but he was providing benefits 379 00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:46,199 Speaker 1: to people who needed them, and he was providing them 380 00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:49,800 Speaker 1: faster than anyone else, and he was guaranteeing them when 381 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:52,280 Speaker 1: other people were having to wait for a year and 382 00:22:52,280 --> 00:22:55,160 Speaker 1: a half or more to get their benefits. He was saying, hey, 383 00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 1: I can get it too in thirty days, like when 384 00:22:57,400 --> 00:23:01,960 Speaker 1: you don't have an income, like you can't wait a year, 385 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:05,199 Speaker 1: especially if you've got real medical problems, like how are 386 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:09,360 Speaker 1: you supposed to survive? Or eighteen months while you wait 387 00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:12,320 Speaker 1: to get an easily check of nine dollars a month 388 00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:15,800 Speaker 1: from the from the federal government. So and that's usually 389 00:23:15,800 --> 00:23:19,880 Speaker 1: like at most. So he was able to do something 390 00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:24,159 Speaker 1: that no other attorney could, and everybody who went to 391 00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:26,800 Speaker 1: him just sall like, okay, well this this person is 392 00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:29,840 Speaker 1: saving my life right now. Um. And when you think 393 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:31,280 Speaker 1: of Robin and do you think of you know, stealing 394 00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:32,760 Speaker 1: from the ridge and giving the poor like it's a 395 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:36,040 Speaker 1: victimous crime, It's like, well, Eric, you know, had his 396 00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:38,520 Speaker 1: deal with a with a judge and he was you know, 397 00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:43,040 Speaker 1: basically cheating the system and and getting money for people 398 00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:46,480 Speaker 1: faster because of this you know corruption that was happening 399 00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:50,399 Speaker 1: within his you know, popular people. But his you know, 400 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:53,840 Speaker 1: this idea of it being a victim was crime. And like, oh, 401 00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 1: the government has all this money, so who cares if 402 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:58,879 Speaker 1: I'm you know, taking a few million to help my 403 00:23:58,880 --> 00:24:02,960 Speaker 1: my neighbors here get their benefits faster. But that isn't 404 00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:05,159 Speaker 1: the case. I mean, we all like as far as 405 00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:07,280 Speaker 1: you know people in the States, right, like we all 406 00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:09,480 Speaker 1: pay in at the system, right our taxes go into 407 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:12,080 Speaker 1: this safety net of social security, and we don't think 408 00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:14,320 Speaker 1: about it now because it's like especially being young, we're 409 00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:18,040 Speaker 1: thinking like, oh, it's our parents are grandparents like dealing 410 00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:20,760 Speaker 1: with social Security. But there's a huge portion of this 411 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:23,800 Speaker 1: fund that's allocated to the stability benefits. It's a designed 412 00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:26,360 Speaker 1: for people that if you can't work because you've got 413 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:29,600 Speaker 1: injured on a job or just you know, felt ill 414 00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:33,960 Speaker 1: and can't you know, perform anymore, like what you know, 415 00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:36,320 Speaker 1: what safety net do we have? And this is it? 416 00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: And deaps someone take advantage of it is essentially someone 417 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:43,879 Speaker 1: who's stealing money from all of us. About him, sorry, 418 00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:45,640 Speaker 1: as you're talking about him, I like him more and more. 419 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:47,440 Speaker 1: I'm like, ah, I see what he was likable. I 420 00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:49,760 Speaker 1: knew that's gonna happen. Now she's gonna want to know 421 00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:53,520 Speaker 1: if he's singled there it is. Well, that does get 422 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:57,120 Speaker 1: into the side of Eric. That is really interesting because 423 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 1: we talked about an episode and we get a very 424 00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:04,280 Speaker 1: deep into it in episode two. But he's had a 425 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:08,080 Speaker 1: few wives, so he's always looking back at the list. Really, 426 00:25:08,840 --> 00:25:12,280 Speaker 1: it sounds like there's hope for me. I stand by 427 00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:15,080 Speaker 1: the modern day robin Hood for you. I stand by 428 00:25:15,119 --> 00:25:17,960 Speaker 1: the modern day robin Hood nickname, because if Robin Hood 429 00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:20,000 Speaker 1: was like the world is so upside down. Now. I 430 00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:23,040 Speaker 1: think that's exactly how Robin would Robin Hood would act now, 431 00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:26,320 Speaker 1: It's just it wouldn't be that that glorious like stealing 432 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:28,720 Speaker 1: from the bridge. There'd be some sort of side takes, 433 00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:30,480 Speaker 1: some sort of shitty thing on the side. I swore 434 00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:34,000 Speaker 1: for you guys, and so I stand by that nickname. 435 00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:36,200 Speaker 1: I think you can have it, and Leah, don't pursue 436 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:38,959 Speaker 1: a relationship with him. I'm not going to, no question. 437 00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 1: Do you think that he actually thought he was going 438 00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:45,840 Speaker 1: to get away with it? Oh, you know, we've talked 439 00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:48,320 Speaker 1: to Eric a lot, and it's been really fascinating to 440 00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:52,919 Speaker 1: see the process of topping him over the past almost 441 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:58,359 Speaker 1: three years. At this point, Um, he never necessarily thought 442 00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:00,480 Speaker 1: he was going to totally get away with it. He 443 00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:04,119 Speaker 1: has been described and even himself said he kind of 444 00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:07,760 Speaker 1: he likes to take risks. One of his best friends 445 00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:10,359 Speaker 1: and old assistants said that she felt like he was 446 00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:14,960 Speaker 1: addicted to risk taking. And you know, in this situation 447 00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,159 Speaker 1: the with one of the judges he was working with 448 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:21,760 Speaker 1: main judge, they talk about and we have this in 449 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:25,440 Speaker 1: the series that yeah, they could do something and if 450 00:26:25,440 --> 00:26:27,639 Speaker 1: anything ever went down, they just take it to the grave. 451 00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:30,960 Speaker 1: But as we all see in this day and age, 452 00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:33,159 Speaker 1: there's just way too much evidence, way too much of 453 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:36,439 Speaker 1: a paper trail. Uh. Technology is too good to be 454 00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:41,040 Speaker 1: able to just keep anything secret basically anymore. Um. And 455 00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:45,239 Speaker 1: so it is definitely in a situation where you just 456 00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,240 Speaker 1: try to stay present and think, well, this is working now, 457 00:26:48,359 --> 00:26:50,639 Speaker 1: and you know, in the future, I'm sure I'll be 458 00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:53,120 Speaker 1: able to figure something out to get to get out 459 00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:56,200 Speaker 1: of it. Yeah. There there's a lot of different ways 460 00:26:56,240 --> 00:27:00,800 Speaker 1: to think about this, because when we were making mcmillions, UH, 461 00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:03,639 Speaker 1: there's always the people who are in in you know, 462 00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:06,679 Speaker 1: working with Jerry Jacobson that said like, okay, this is 463 00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:09,480 Speaker 1: the last one, this is the last time. But with 464 00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:12,800 Speaker 1: Eric uh and what's revealed in the documentary series, and 465 00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:15,640 Speaker 1: we talked about it early on, it's just the relationship 466 00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:19,080 Speaker 1: he has with this one special judge and between the 467 00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:22,240 Speaker 1: two of them. Uh, there's you know, the judges helping 468 00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:25,560 Speaker 1: rubber stamp all these people through the system, and the 469 00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:30,720 Speaker 1: judge has what is called judicial independence. So there's kind 470 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:34,240 Speaker 1: of this loophole in the system where they have the 471 00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:38,439 Speaker 1: ability to make decisions whether or not someone gets benefits 472 00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:42,639 Speaker 1: independent of anybody else. With no oversight and that, and 473 00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:46,160 Speaker 1: and that's how they realize like, hey, there's nothing anybody 474 00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:49,600 Speaker 1: can do about what we're doing. Um I can put 475 00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,520 Speaker 1: a hundred percent of the people through the system and 476 00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:58,120 Speaker 1: nobody can do anything about it. Uh. But obviously, as 477 00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:00,960 Speaker 1: the you know, this goes on for years and years, 478 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:04,119 Speaker 1: and these whistleblowers who actually worked, you know, within the 479 00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:07,640 Speaker 1: Social Security Administration are saying, hey, something is not right here, 480 00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:11,960 Speaker 1: like there, this system is not it's not designed like 481 00:28:12,080 --> 00:28:14,600 Speaker 1: this and it's not supposed to be functioning like this. 482 00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:17,919 Speaker 1: But you you'll see within the documentary series like just 483 00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:22,439 Speaker 1: how broken it is that, you know, they couldn't they 484 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:25,199 Speaker 1: couldn't get the word out. They couldn't they were trying 485 00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:29,080 Speaker 1: to like make the point to supervisors, they were trying 486 00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:30,760 Speaker 1: to go to press, they were trying to go anyway. 487 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,600 Speaker 1: No one wanted to touch it until this one Wall 488 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:38,520 Speaker 1: Street drone reporter independent on his own, started looking into 489 00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:42,960 Speaker 1: this and realizing, like, how is it possible a judge 490 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:49,320 Speaker 1: it's approving of all cases that he sees when the 491 00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,959 Speaker 1: average you know, administrative law judge like does like sixty 492 00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:54,480 Speaker 1: and this guy is like doing twice the three times 493 00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,080 Speaker 1: as many cases per years everybody, Like it just doesn't 494 00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:03,480 Speaker 1: add up, like of the people you see not be disabled. Wow, 495 00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:08,880 Speaker 1: But but doesn't it also show the loopholes and the 496 00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:11,320 Speaker 1: issues with the system itself. It's almost like he should 497 00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:14,680 Speaker 1: be thanked for showing the ways in which people can 498 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:21,000 Speaker 1: calm the system. Yeah, not really, we can say that 499 00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:28,120 Speaker 1: that he exposed the issues. You guys don't want to 500 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:32,440 Speaker 1: thank a criminal, that's so weird. Yeah, I'm thankful that 501 00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:34,880 Speaker 1: when we have a story to tell that includes them. 502 00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:39,080 Speaker 1: But yeah, but really it does show like huge, very 503 00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:42,719 Speaker 1: huge flaws in Social Security and that is the massive 504 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:45,880 Speaker 1: underlying thing with us. We we lure you in with 505 00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:49,200 Speaker 1: the craziness of Eric, but there's actually a point to 506 00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:54,360 Speaker 1: this entire situation, which is Social Security administration really has 507 00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:56,640 Speaker 1: a lot of huge flaws. It's one of the largest 508 00:29:56,760 --> 00:30:00,600 Speaker 1: entities in American government. It's one of the largest budgets, 509 00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:03,240 Speaker 1: and if there's a lot of money, people are going 510 00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:06,800 Speaker 1: to try to exploit it. But this really shows that 511 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:10,200 Speaker 1: human beings that are waiting for their benefits, that need 512 00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:12,600 Speaker 1: those benefits shouldn't be waiting a year and a half. 513 00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:17,280 Speaker 1: They need help now. And to be able to show 514 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,280 Speaker 1: how this is exploited and it's funny. And when we 515 00:30:20,400 --> 00:30:24,840 Speaker 1: talked to the Senate Subcommittee of Investigations who looked into 516 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 1: this to really lead onto this big Senate hearing, which 517 00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:33,480 Speaker 1: is a very climactic moment in the series. They talked 518 00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:36,320 Speaker 1: about the fact that they came to the realization and 519 00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:39,480 Speaker 1: senators came to the realization that nobody had really asked 520 00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:43,200 Speaker 1: for records from the Social Secure administration for about fifty years. 521 00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:47,120 Speaker 1: They kind of just let Social Security do their own thing. 522 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:52,320 Speaker 1: But every single government entity needs oversight. It doesn't matter 523 00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:55,360 Speaker 1: what it is. There's a reason for checks and balances 524 00:30:55,720 --> 00:30:59,760 Speaker 1: because things can get loaded, things can get continue to 525 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:02,520 Speaker 1: run in a certain way, become very comfortable, and if 526 00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:05,280 Speaker 1: you're not trying to make things more efficient, then you're 527 00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:08,280 Speaker 1: just hurting the people who need it most. Yeah. I mean, 528 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:10,880 Speaker 1: I know that we don't have as much time with 529 00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:13,280 Speaker 1: you as we want, so maybe we could just ask 530 00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:19,840 Speaker 1: a final question. Great, thank you, So that'll be a 531 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:23,520 Speaker 1: goals perfect. So you know that you know you've studied 532 00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:27,320 Speaker 1: multiple con artists at this point through the years, do 533 00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:29,440 Speaker 1: you feel like there's a common through line or a 534 00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:33,280 Speaker 1: common thread that they share personality wise that you've seen 535 00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:38,600 Speaker 1: or noticed. Yeah, I think that there. I mean, I 536 00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:42,560 Speaker 1: don't know if there's necessarily a common through line, but 537 00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:50,720 Speaker 1: there's definitely the uh ability to as James pointed out before, 538 00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:53,720 Speaker 1: is like to take that risk, you know, inherently, Like 539 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:56,920 Speaker 1: we all kind of ponder like if you could you know, 540 00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:59,760 Speaker 1: if you I mean we talked about with Mgmion Psyche 541 00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:02,480 Speaker 1: if you saw you know, a wallet on the ground 542 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:05,040 Speaker 1: and had you know, ten thous dollars in it? Uh, 543 00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:09,040 Speaker 1: Like what compels you to pick that wallet up and 544 00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:12,720 Speaker 1: return it to the rightful owner with all the money 545 00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:15,760 Speaker 1: in it? Um? But if no one's around, like, and 546 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:18,560 Speaker 1: you need the money, Uh, what's not to stop you 547 00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:20,560 Speaker 1: from just taking it and saying, hey, this is my 548 00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:24,240 Speaker 1: lucky day. And we're always you know, we find ourselves 549 00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:29,560 Speaker 1: in these unique moments of life where we're conflicted or 550 00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:32,760 Speaker 1: we we have to make a choice about what's the 551 00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:34,560 Speaker 1: right thing to do and what's the wrong thing to do. 552 00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:37,520 Speaker 1: And I think what's fascinating with this is it's an 553 00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:41,480 Speaker 1: illustration of what happens when someone leads, you know, leans 554 00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:45,760 Speaker 1: into that temptation. Uh, when someone says, hey, I'm just 555 00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:48,360 Speaker 1: gonna go for it. Um, I think what happens in 556 00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:50,600 Speaker 1: a lot of these cases is you get away with 557 00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:53,920 Speaker 1: it once and you're like, oh my gosh, there was 558 00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:57,840 Speaker 1: a thrill to it perhaps, or like, look, it's not 559 00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:01,240 Speaker 1: hurting anybody, so let me do it again. And then 560 00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:05,560 Speaker 1: it becomes so systematic and you're not even thinking that 561 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:08,959 Speaker 1: you're committing a crime. Um And I think a lot 562 00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:11,040 Speaker 1: of people talk themselves into thinking, hey, I'm kind of 563 00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:13,640 Speaker 1: owed this for something. They justify it with something else 564 00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:16,680 Speaker 1: in their life. Right, it's the rationalization that you can 565 00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:19,200 Speaker 1: go down and you get away with a little bit. 566 00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:21,480 Speaker 1: You can get away with a little bit. And the 567 00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:24,720 Speaker 1: thing that we always see is that, unfortunately, and everyone's 568 00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:27,480 Speaker 1: experienced this, greed gets the better of you if you 569 00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:30,080 Speaker 1: let it. And on the other side of that is 570 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:34,479 Speaker 1: that level narcissism of I'm owed this. This is I'm like, 571 00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:37,360 Speaker 1: I'm not hurting anybody. The U. S. Government is the 572 00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:41,000 Speaker 1: largest entity on the planet basically, so what if I'm 573 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:44,160 Speaker 1: taking a few extra million dollars from them? How's that 574 00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:47,880 Speaker 1: going to affect a budget that's trillions of dollars? And 575 00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:51,600 Speaker 1: it is we just we've we've with mcmillions. It was 576 00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:54,960 Speaker 1: funny because and all in all, they stalled about four 577 00:33:55,160 --> 00:34:00,080 Speaker 1: million dollars. This is five and fifty million dollars, and 578 00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:03,640 Speaker 1: but the motivations are very much the same. Yeah. Well, 579 00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:07,280 Speaker 1: and I think that there's there's probably commonalities too with 580 00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:11,400 Speaker 1: childhood or some sort of trauma or some experience that 581 00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:14,719 Speaker 1: really affected kind of how like in the case of 582 00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:18,120 Speaker 1: Eric's ekhan in a story like we we actually we 583 00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:22,600 Speaker 1: talked about Eric's mom and what he was like his 584 00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:24,560 Speaker 1: relationship with his mom, and we feel like in a 585 00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:29,440 Speaker 1: lot of ways, like that did affect his desire to 586 00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:33,280 Speaker 1: get out there, his desire to be recognized, his desire 587 00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:38,080 Speaker 1: to do something that was meaningful, and you know, I 588 00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:41,040 Speaker 1: had to have some success in a small town. Like 589 00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:43,680 Speaker 1: he was a he wasn't he was a geniue. I 590 00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:51,320 Speaker 1: mean he self proclaimed genius by the way. He uh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 591 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:56,960 Speaker 1: So I'm now a fraud con person. Yeah, So, you know, 592 00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:00,879 Speaker 1: there's there's a lot of commonalities, but there's also there's 593 00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:03,520 Speaker 1: got to be something that you can trace back to 594 00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:07,879 Speaker 1: early in life with all these people that's like, hey, 595 00:35:07,960 --> 00:35:11,320 Speaker 1: I you know, this is the reason why I decided 596 00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,400 Speaker 1: to pick up that wallet and claim the ten thousands 597 00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:16,359 Speaker 1: of my stuff rather than try to do the right 598 00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:20,560 Speaker 1: thing that makes sense. I mean, I'm I'm more totally 599 00:35:20,600 --> 00:35:24,120 Speaker 1: interested in knowing more about the Halloween themed brothel and 600 00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:28,000 Speaker 1: wondering if if people were having sex and zombie which 601 00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:35,000 Speaker 1: and sexy Donald Trump costumes. Uh, that whole thing. That 602 00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:37,880 Speaker 1: is one of the most shocking things we've found out about. 603 00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:43,239 Speaker 1: When we're talking to people about Eric, it came up that, oh, yeah, 604 00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:46,439 Speaker 1: Eric had a brothel. Because part of what you learned 605 00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:49,919 Speaker 1: in the series is that one week out of every 606 00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:53,600 Speaker 1: single month, Eric would fly somewhere around the world to 607 00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:57,360 Speaker 1: try and basically find a new wife, women a biza. 608 00:35:57,719 --> 00:36:01,560 Speaker 1: Sorry what so he's getting a you know, the the 609 00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:04,200 Speaker 1: conjugal visits you might have to go to talk but 610 00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:07,160 Speaker 1: if only you do how many times I talked about 611 00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:10,920 Speaker 1: conjugal visits? Okay, go on. So we we find that 612 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:12,719 Speaker 1: he's traveling around the world doing other stuff, and then 613 00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:15,200 Speaker 1: it comes up that like, oh, at one point Eric 614 00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:19,320 Speaker 1: bought a brothel and owned and random brothel, and we're 615 00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:22,120 Speaker 1: just mind blown about this whole thing. I mean, our 616 00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:25,160 Speaker 1: entire team we worked with here at fund Meter was like, 617 00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:28,960 Speaker 1: is this is this real? Then we start researching it 618 00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:31,880 Speaker 1: and sure enough. Yeah. I even talking to Eric. He 619 00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:34,600 Speaker 1: talks about it in the series of you know, was 620 00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:38,279 Speaker 1: it a brothel? Was it a go go? And he 621 00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:41,200 Speaker 1: one of my personal favorite quotes of it. You know, 622 00:36:41,200 --> 00:36:43,839 Speaker 1: it was like, you know, you go there and if 623 00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:46,560 Speaker 1: you like it, you take it home. That's that's sort 624 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:51,120 Speaker 1: of how he looked his go go slash brothel. But um, 625 00:36:51,160 --> 00:36:54,440 Speaker 1: it is it is a wild scenario. And uh, I 626 00:36:54,520 --> 00:36:56,680 Speaker 1: really wish it still existed because I'd love to go 627 00:36:56,719 --> 00:37:00,880 Speaker 1: to Thailand and uh has a pat Hi there? I haven't. 628 00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:04,160 Speaker 1: I haven't heard anything. After Leah suggested that there was 629 00:37:04,200 --> 00:37:07,880 Speaker 1: such a thing as a sexy Donald Trump costume, I 630 00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:09,799 Speaker 1: was like, I was like, is it Is it a 631 00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:14,800 Speaker 1: good thing that we don't have any photos? Or I 632 00:37:15,239 --> 00:37:17,760 Speaker 1: want to see that. I could see it now, someone 633 00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:20,800 Speaker 1: just with a spray tanned orange face, with white eyes, 634 00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:25,879 Speaker 1: a wig and just nothing else. All right, moving on, 635 00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:31,880 Speaker 1: So everyone's gonna have nightmares tonight thanks to me? Or 636 00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:34,600 Speaker 1: is there anything else about the show? Any last thoughts 637 00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:36,960 Speaker 1: that you want to tell us or the listeners about, 638 00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:41,279 Speaker 1: or any parting words that you want to share. I mean, 639 00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:43,280 Speaker 1: I think one of the things that you said before 640 00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:48,160 Speaker 1: about like you know, you know, standing up for what's right, 641 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,120 Speaker 1: and like there's a there's an inspirational side to this 642 00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:56,440 Speaker 1: story as well, And there's also a cautionary tale of 643 00:37:57,200 --> 00:38:01,000 Speaker 1: what happens when you can are a problem. Um, because 644 00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:05,400 Speaker 1: with our two whistleblowers, they were saying, hey, there's a 645 00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:09,640 Speaker 1: problem here, and they were being ignored, and they were 646 00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:11,960 Speaker 1: being were time and time again. What happens with a 647 00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:14,400 Speaker 1: problem when you ignore it. It doesn't just go away 648 00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:17,360 Speaker 1: like a lot of people wanted to. Uh, it just 649 00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:20,439 Speaker 1: becomes a bigger problem and a bigger problem. And this 650 00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:25,160 Speaker 1: is really a horrific illustration of how big that problem 651 00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:29,080 Speaker 1: can get and how can affect so many people. And 652 00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:32,120 Speaker 1: I had just one person early on just said you 653 00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:35,879 Speaker 1: know what, right, there's a problem here and I can 654 00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:38,920 Speaker 1: help stop it. But so many people avoided it, and 655 00:38:39,160 --> 00:38:41,760 Speaker 1: then people went out of their way to actually stop 656 00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:45,440 Speaker 1: them from making that problem known to other people. And 657 00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:49,000 Speaker 1: it so I think that there's a great cautionary tale 658 00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:52,160 Speaker 1: in this story. So it's got everything. It's got humor, 659 00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:57,960 Speaker 1: it's got tragedy, it's got inspiration, it's got sell them 660 00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:05,680 Speaker 1: sell it's got from Halloween being yeah, yeah, the underlying 661 00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:11,560 Speaker 1: sexy Donald Trump's is we just like as outrageous as 662 00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:15,520 Speaker 1: Eric is, and he's crazy and saying and fun and 663 00:39:15,840 --> 00:39:18,080 Speaker 1: just watching his commercials will make you laugh. But at 664 00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:20,920 Speaker 1: the same time, there are people that are still fighting 665 00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:22,959 Speaker 1: to try and get their benefits back. This is still 666 00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:27,360 Speaker 1: a problem right now, and you know, the people that 667 00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:30,040 Speaker 1: are fighting for their benefits have really had a hard time. 668 00:39:30,080 --> 00:39:33,240 Speaker 1: So we're really we hope above anything that this shines 669 00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:36,279 Speaker 1: a light on this entire topic so that the people 670 00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:39,200 Speaker 1: who need help can get it, and that some changes 671 00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:42,520 Speaker 1: at the very top, governments, whole level start to happen 672 00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:47,239 Speaker 1: so things like this don't happen again. Amazing. I'm looking 673 00:39:47,280 --> 00:39:49,319 Speaker 1: forward to it. And on a personal note, I want 674 00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:51,840 Speaker 1: to thank you guys for mcmillions because I was in 675 00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:53,799 Speaker 1: the nineties. I was on a mission to win that thing. 676 00:39:53,840 --> 00:39:55,120 Speaker 1: I had a lot of food I didn't want to 677 00:39:55,120 --> 00:39:57,440 Speaker 1: eat because somehow I thought I was like Charlie and 678 00:39:57,480 --> 00:39:59,600 Speaker 1: the chocolate factory. I saw one of those little things 679 00:39:59,600 --> 00:40:00,759 Speaker 1: on the ground and then I went and I was like, 680 00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:02,359 Speaker 1: that's it, and I picked it up and I never won. 681 00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:04,200 Speaker 1: So the fact that you exposed that there was a 682 00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:08,040 Speaker 1: problem and it wasn't just me um, sadly, I appreciate 683 00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:11,319 Speaker 1: all that. I remember it also as a little kid, 684 00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:17,600 Speaker 1: very very young, because I'm eighteen basically, so I don't 685 00:40:17,600 --> 00:40:23,120 Speaker 1: like that you guys laughed, but uh, well is what's 686 00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:27,080 Speaker 1: the legal drinking age and a visa, isn't it? So yeah, yeah, 687 00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:31,200 Speaker 1: yeah I don't drink, but yeah I'm barely legal. But 688 00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:33,880 Speaker 1: I know I remember it as a kid too. And 689 00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:38,040 Speaker 1: also mcmillian's helped me get through the pandemic. So much 690 00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:42,000 Speaker 1: appreciated to you. We're like, oh, good content, thank you, 691 00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:44,720 Speaker 1: thank you. That's that's awesome to hear. You know. We 692 00:40:44,719 --> 00:40:48,600 Speaker 1: we worked insanely hard on that entire thing, and uh, 693 00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:52,399 Speaker 1: the big con got us through the pandemic because that's 694 00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:55,959 Speaker 1: basically all we've been been doing since the world shut down. 695 00:40:55,960 --> 00:40:59,200 Speaker 1: So that was an interesting challenge, but we we got 696 00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:02,000 Speaker 1: it done well. James and Brian, thank you so much 697 00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:05,680 Speaker 1: for coming on the podcast today, and anyone who's listening. 698 00:41:05,719 --> 00:41:08,440 Speaker 1: If you have Apple tv plus, congratulations you've made a 699 00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:11,799 Speaker 1: great choice. If not, download it now so that you 700 00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:15,800 Speaker 1: can also watch the show. It's coming out May six, 701 00:41:16,040 --> 00:41:19,520 Speaker 1: so tomorrow, and you can also listen to the Companion 702 00:41:19,560 --> 00:41:23,320 Speaker 1: Show on Apple Podcasts. Yes, the Big on on Apple 703 00:41:23,320 --> 00:41:25,640 Speaker 1: TV plus Basics. Then there's a companion podcast. What else 704 00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:29,560 Speaker 1: do we have fun new year? We got a new 705 00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:35,040 Speaker 1: line of kidding. Yeah. Well, if you guys wanted to 706 00:41:35,040 --> 00:41:38,200 Speaker 1: buy my new fragrance, it's Curious by Britney Spears and 707 00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:42,640 Speaker 1: it's out now, so check yourselves at CBS. Gentlemen, it's 708 00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:44,680 Speaker 1: been an honor and a pleasure. Thank you so much 709 00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:46,319 Speaker 1: for coming on the podcast today, and we can't wait 710 00:41:46,360 --> 00:41:49,640 Speaker 1: to watch the show and listen to the podcast. Oh, 711 00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:51,879 Speaker 1: thank you so much for having us. Thanks guys, Well, 712 00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:54,399 Speaker 1: of course, have a good one, all right, you too, 713 00:41:54,640 --> 00:42:10,279 Speaker 1: bye bye ye, all right you guys. In today, our 714 00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:14,080 Speaker 1: hot topics are going to be Dave Chappelle getting attacked 715 00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:16,880 Speaker 1: on stage at the Netflix as a Joke festival, and 716 00:42:17,400 --> 00:42:20,800 Speaker 1: a complaint against Bill Murray over a difference of opinion 717 00:42:20,840 --> 00:42:22,840 Speaker 1: on set shutting down a film. So we're going in 718 00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:27,000 Speaker 1: real Hollywood today. Let's talk about Bill Murray first, because 719 00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:29,800 Speaker 1: I can't even believe anyone would complain about Bill Murray. 720 00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:33,560 Speaker 1: This just seems ridiculous to me. However, I don't know 721 00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:36,200 Speaker 1: if you know this, but there was actually previously a 722 00:42:36,200 --> 00:42:40,080 Speaker 1: complaint against Bill Murray during uh the filming of Charlie's 723 00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:42,719 Speaker 1: Angels in two thousand, when Lucy Lou said that she 724 00:42:42,840 --> 00:42:45,280 Speaker 1: had some issues with him and that he was hurling 725 00:42:45,280 --> 00:42:47,719 Speaker 1: insults at her while doing a scene and some of 726 00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:52,399 Speaker 1: the language was and I quote, inexcusable and unacceptable. So 727 00:42:52,520 --> 00:42:58,400 Speaker 1: interesting to hear that, But now moving forward. Apparently for 728 00:42:58,520 --> 00:43:01,600 Speaker 1: roughly two weeks after search Like Pictures suspended production on 729 00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:05,280 Speaker 1: the film Being Mortal to investigate a complaint filed against 730 00:43:05,280 --> 00:43:08,560 Speaker 1: Bill Murray, the actor described the inciting incident as a 731 00:43:08,600 --> 00:43:11,960 Speaker 1: difference of opinion. During a recent sit down with c NBC, 732 00:43:12,440 --> 00:43:14,120 Speaker 1: Murray said, I had a difference of opinion with a 733 00:43:14,120 --> 00:43:16,279 Speaker 1: woman I'm working with. I did something I thought was 734 00:43:16,320 --> 00:43:19,080 Speaker 1: funny and it wasn't taken that way. The company, the 735 00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:20,960 Speaker 1: movie studio, wanted to do the right things, so they 736 00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:22,759 Speaker 1: wanted to check it all out and investigate it, and 737 00:43:22,760 --> 00:43:25,799 Speaker 1: so they stopped the production. Murray said that the woman 738 00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:28,920 Speaker 1: who filed the complaint are they're both trying to make 739 00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:31,840 Speaker 1: peaks with each other. He says, We're both professionals, we 740 00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:34,120 Speaker 1: like each other's work, we like each other. I think 741 00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:36,160 Speaker 1: if we can't really get along and trust each other, 742 00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:38,520 Speaker 1: there's no point in going there's no point in going 743 00:43:38,600 --> 00:43:43,680 Speaker 1: further working together or making the movie as well. Oh yeah, yeah, 744 00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:46,640 Speaker 1: I like Bill Murray a lot. I'm a big fan. 745 00:43:47,880 --> 00:43:51,400 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I'm not. I'm not justifying anything that I 746 00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:54,280 Speaker 1: don't know. I don't know what was said, the stuff 747 00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:57,480 Speaker 1: I don't know, the Charlie's Angels things. If something was 748 00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:01,120 Speaker 1: done wrong, then I'm not then I don't advocate that, 749 00:44:01,200 --> 00:44:03,680 Speaker 1: but I really I'm a big fan of his I 750 00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:07,359 Speaker 1: kind of don't. This doesn't feel like a major thing. 751 00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:09,839 Speaker 1: This sounds like maybe somebody was offended or maybe there 752 00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:12,040 Speaker 1: was something, and it sounds like they're working it out there. 753 00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:14,919 Speaker 1: And I'm almost content. And I'm not saying I don't 754 00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:16,719 Speaker 1: want to talk about it, but I'm almost content leaving 755 00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:18,640 Speaker 1: it at that, because I feel like a lot of 756 00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:21,120 Speaker 1: people get involved in stuff that doesn't need it and 757 00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:23,200 Speaker 1: it becomes a bigger thing. I'm not ready to take 758 00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:25,600 Speaker 1: Bill Murray down without the facts, and I don't want 759 00:44:25,640 --> 00:44:27,000 Speaker 1: to take Bill Murray down, and I don't want other 760 00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:28,920 Speaker 1: people take him down if he did something wrong. I 761 00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:31,719 Speaker 1: hope that they can work that out. Do people ever 762 00:44:31,760 --> 00:44:34,600 Speaker 1: know what was said? I don't know. It sounds like 763 00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:36,480 Speaker 1: they're kind of keeping it pretty close to the vest. Now. 764 00:44:36,600 --> 00:44:39,520 Speaker 1: I think I'd be foolish to say no, because I 765 00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:43,600 Speaker 1: think everything eventually comes out. Um, it seems crazy that 766 00:44:43,760 --> 00:44:46,320 Speaker 1: with all the information and the Amber heard and Johnny 767 00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:49,360 Speaker 1: Depp trial, we know everything that happened between them, including 768 00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:52,000 Speaker 1: shifting the bed. How could we not know what was 769 00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:54,080 Speaker 1: said on set? And you know, I think the social 770 00:44:54,120 --> 00:44:59,080 Speaker 1: opinion always impacts the actual decision as well, and and 771 00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:01,800 Speaker 1: you know, it can affect people's careers. So we found 772 00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:04,960 Speaker 1: out that something happened that people didn't think was that 773 00:45:05,000 --> 00:45:06,799 Speaker 1: big of a deal. Maybe it would make this woman 774 00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:09,960 Speaker 1: look really bad and then and it would make the 775 00:45:09,960 --> 00:45:13,279 Speaker 1: studios look ridiculous and everyone look ridiculous. But if they 776 00:45:13,520 --> 00:45:15,399 Speaker 1: if what he said was really bad and they're trying 777 00:45:15,440 --> 00:45:18,080 Speaker 1: to protect Bill, you know, there's just so many ways 778 00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:21,040 Speaker 1: that's can all play out. Yeah, And I think that's 779 00:45:21,080 --> 00:45:23,520 Speaker 1: that's kind of where I'm at. I think we don't 780 00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:27,960 Speaker 1: always need to be a giant court of opinion. I 781 00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:29,560 Speaker 1: think it's good to weigh in on stuff. It's good 782 00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:32,680 Speaker 1: to know stuff. But you know, things happened, you know, 783 00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:34,520 Speaker 1: I know there was this thing recently with Steve Martin 784 00:45:34,560 --> 00:45:36,279 Speaker 1: when people went back and like the King Tut thing, 785 00:45:36,320 --> 00:45:38,560 Speaker 1: and it's like, guys, that was thirty years ago. It 786 00:45:38,600 --> 00:45:40,759 Speaker 1: was a different context. You can't go back and dig 787 00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:43,479 Speaker 1: that up. Granted this just happened now, but I don't 788 00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:46,840 Speaker 1: know that there has to be this. To me, without knowing, 789 00:45:47,280 --> 00:45:49,200 Speaker 1: it doesn't sound like it's there's a major thing. There's 790 00:45:49,200 --> 00:45:51,640 Speaker 1: no police, there's no you know. So it's like, whatever 791 00:45:51,680 --> 00:45:54,160 Speaker 1: it was, it sounds like it can be. It can 792 00:45:54,200 --> 00:45:57,759 Speaker 1: be cleaned up without it without it going through you know, 793 00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:02,480 Speaker 1: the general court of opinion. Man, I wish I knew 794 00:46:02,520 --> 00:46:05,360 Speaker 1: what was said. I really do. I'm so nosy. But 795 00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:09,719 Speaker 1: also because yeah, ay, and be also because you know, 796 00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:14,000 Speaker 1: I think that as a comedian sometimes you just not 797 00:46:14,040 --> 00:46:18,400 Speaker 1: that you don't know the line, but it's just you 798 00:46:18,440 --> 00:46:20,759 Speaker 1: have no filter and you kind of assume around other 799 00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:23,760 Speaker 1: artists you can just be free and be yourself. And 800 00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:27,400 Speaker 1: sometimes it's never meant to make someone feel uncomfortable or 801 00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:29,600 Speaker 1: make someone feel bad. Maybe you're just you know, saying 802 00:46:29,640 --> 00:46:32,319 Speaker 1: something ridiculous or yeah, we have no idea what the 803 00:46:32,360 --> 00:46:34,120 Speaker 1: context was. We don't know if he was talking about 804 00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:35,640 Speaker 1: someone on set. We don't know if he was talking 805 00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:38,720 Speaker 1: about something completely random and she just found it inappropriate, 806 00:46:39,320 --> 00:46:42,080 Speaker 1: and so, you know, it's it's always interesting to see 807 00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:45,160 Speaker 1: how people get slammed for something that maybe nothing or 808 00:46:45,680 --> 00:46:47,560 Speaker 1: or nothing that might be something. There's a lot of 809 00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:50,600 Speaker 1: pressure when you're brought in to do something as a comedian, 810 00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:53,279 Speaker 1: and as a comedian and actor, you know, there's a 811 00:46:53,280 --> 00:46:55,440 Speaker 1: lot of pressure. You're you're almost seen as you know, 812 00:46:55,440 --> 00:46:57,160 Speaker 1: you've got to kind of entertain people on the set. 813 00:46:57,200 --> 00:46:59,120 Speaker 1: You got and I'm not saying that means cross lines, 814 00:46:59,160 --> 00:47:00,879 Speaker 1: but sometimes you feel like, okay, well I gotta do this. 815 00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:03,440 Speaker 1: So it is possible that you would say some stuff 816 00:47:03,480 --> 00:47:05,880 Speaker 1: that normally you wouldn't say, or maybe it was a 817 00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:08,640 Speaker 1: long day and you did. I'm not making excuses for him, 818 00:47:08,640 --> 00:47:10,120 Speaker 1: but I'm saying that this is a thing there is 819 00:47:10,160 --> 00:47:13,160 Speaker 1: pressure to entertain, so it's very possible. Like you said, 820 00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:15,439 Speaker 1: you start, you know, kind of joking around with people 821 00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:16,920 Speaker 1: on the line, gets a little blurred and all of 822 00:47:16,960 --> 00:47:19,040 Speaker 1: a sudden you've gone over it, which it's a lot 823 00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:21,040 Speaker 1: easier to do nowadays. Do you think it's going to 824 00:47:21,080 --> 00:47:25,480 Speaker 1: harm his career this incident. I don't think so. I 825 00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:27,560 Speaker 1: hope not, and I think it's gonna be a little 826 00:47:27,560 --> 00:47:29,279 Speaker 1: bit of a gray area if we don't find out 827 00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:31,200 Speaker 1: what happened, because then people will be like, well, I 828 00:47:31,200 --> 00:47:34,520 Speaker 1: don't know what I'm dipping my toe in here, so right, 829 00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:40,120 Speaker 1: I mean, Dave Chappelle survived cancel culture, Joe Rogan survived 830 00:47:40,200 --> 00:47:42,839 Speaker 1: cancel culture. I think that there are some people who 831 00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:45,520 Speaker 1: are so much larger than the entertainment industry that can't 832 00:47:45,560 --> 00:47:48,240 Speaker 1: be canceled. Yeah, and I'd like to Fahil Murray seems 833 00:47:48,280 --> 00:47:51,520 Speaker 1: like one of those people. And Bill Murray is not 834 00:47:51,600 --> 00:47:54,520 Speaker 1: someone that has been you know, um an ass and 835 00:47:54,600 --> 00:47:58,080 Speaker 1: has has done things. He's known for being, you know, 836 00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:01,360 Speaker 1: a good guy and in a lot of different situations. 837 00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:07,320 Speaker 1: Although I've got questions for Lucy Lou. Yeah. Right. Anyway, 838 00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:13,239 Speaker 1: speaking of drama in the workplace and Hollywood, if you 839 00:48:13,320 --> 00:48:17,360 Speaker 1: haven't heard about this yet, just the other night in 840 00:48:17,480 --> 00:48:20,279 Speaker 1: Hollywood at the Hollywood Bowl, Dave Chappelle was tackled by 841 00:48:20,320 --> 00:48:23,239 Speaker 1: someone in the front row who had a gun and 842 00:48:23,360 --> 00:48:25,640 Speaker 1: a knife. How they got the gun in the knife 843 00:48:25,640 --> 00:48:27,719 Speaker 1: into the Hollywood Bowl when they were metal detectors and 844 00:48:27,800 --> 00:48:30,680 Speaker 1: everyone's phones were being locked up is beyond me. Apparently 845 00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:34,360 Speaker 1: they were so consumed with locking up people's phones that 846 00:48:34,520 --> 00:48:36,440 Speaker 1: they missed a gun, Like, how does that not go 847 00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:39,360 Speaker 1: through the metal detector. It's all very odd. And apparently 848 00:48:39,360 --> 00:48:41,319 Speaker 1: this guy snuck into the front row. He didn't have 849 00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:44,400 Speaker 1: a front row seat or anything, and he went on 850 00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:47,280 Speaker 1: stage tackled Dave Chappelle and this is all for Netflix 851 00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:51,319 Speaker 1: as a joke, and he came up, he stood up, 852 00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:53,480 Speaker 1: Chris Rock came grabbed the mic. Set is that you 853 00:48:53,560 --> 00:48:58,720 Speaker 1: Will Smith, L O L. And Jamie Fox, Jon Stewart, 854 00:48:58,840 --> 00:49:01,319 Speaker 1: all the other comedians just started running and chasing and 855 00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:03,680 Speaker 1: beating the ship out of this guy along with security. 856 00:49:03,719 --> 00:49:06,840 Speaker 1: He left mangled, his arm was broken, twisted in a 857 00:49:06,840 --> 00:49:11,279 Speaker 1: million pieces. But I mean, man, this is um this 858 00:49:11,360 --> 00:49:14,480 Speaker 1: is pretty despicable. Also, you know, I wonder what the 859 00:49:14,520 --> 00:49:16,839 Speaker 1: motive was. We haven't even gotten there. With Will Smith 860 00:49:16,920 --> 00:49:18,960 Speaker 1: and Chris Rock, we know what the motive was, We 861 00:49:18,960 --> 00:49:21,600 Speaker 1: know what was going on, but with this guy, we 862 00:49:21,680 --> 00:49:26,000 Speaker 1: have no clue. Right And also, you know, there were 863 00:49:26,040 --> 00:49:32,160 Speaker 1: no consequences for Will Smith physically, you know, he professionally 864 00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:34,279 Speaker 1: he's been you know, banned for ten years and blah 865 00:49:34,320 --> 00:49:36,760 Speaker 1: blah blah. But for this guy, he was immediately tackled, 866 00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:41,840 Speaker 1: beat up. It's just interesting to see how there's a 867 00:49:41,880 --> 00:49:44,680 Speaker 1: difference and how people are treated Because a reputation walked 868 00:49:44,680 --> 00:49:49,320 Speaker 1: on stage and smacked Chris Rock. Uh, somebody that was 869 00:49:49,400 --> 00:49:53,759 Speaker 1: unknown jumped up and and and tackled Dave Chappelle, So 870 00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:56,040 Speaker 1: that that's the difference. The difference is people like, oh, 871 00:49:56,080 --> 00:49:57,799 Speaker 1: I know this guy is once he's walking up, what 872 00:49:57,840 --> 00:49:59,279 Speaker 1: he do? Oh I can't believe he did that. That's 873 00:49:59,320 --> 00:50:01,680 Speaker 1: not like him. This is who knows what this guy 874 00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:05,120 Speaker 1: is doing? So they grabbed him and beat him up, 875 00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:08,480 Speaker 1: and you know, neither is correct. Both are scary. Um. 876 00:50:09,200 --> 00:50:12,720 Speaker 1: I tend to think that the obviously that Dave Chappelle 877 00:50:12,719 --> 00:50:15,520 Speaker 1: one is is a is more scary to think about. 878 00:50:16,320 --> 00:50:20,120 Speaker 1: Because I got past security, got on stage tackle him. 879 00:50:20,160 --> 00:50:24,160 Speaker 1: It could have been gun had a gun, I mean, 880 00:50:24,200 --> 00:50:27,279 Speaker 1: I still just don't. Also, that is so bizarre that 881 00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:28,719 Speaker 1: the guy brought a gun but decided to get on 882 00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:31,200 Speaker 1: stage and tackle him instead of using the gun. I mean, 883 00:50:31,360 --> 00:50:33,080 Speaker 1: I just read somewhere that it was a replica gun, 884 00:50:33,120 --> 00:50:34,759 Speaker 1: but then he had a real knife attached to it 885 00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:38,160 Speaker 1: like that right there says there's a whole bunch of 886 00:50:38,560 --> 00:50:42,000 Speaker 1: craziness going through that head. But um, to do any 887 00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:43,719 Speaker 1: of that but um, yeah, it could have been a 888 00:50:43,719 --> 00:50:45,920 Speaker 1: thousand times worse than it was. It could have been 889 00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:48,160 Speaker 1: a thousand times worse. The fact that Dave just brushed 890 00:50:48,160 --> 00:50:50,920 Speaker 1: it off and everyone started making jokes immediately goes to 891 00:50:50,960 --> 00:50:55,600 Speaker 1: show you how jaded comedians are already by violence or 892 00:50:55,680 --> 00:50:58,439 Speaker 1: like expecting something bad to happen that shouldn't be the norm. 893 00:50:58,960 --> 00:51:01,360 Speaker 1: I know, and I'm torn because I really appreciate the 894 00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:03,759 Speaker 1: professionalism of being able to bounce both of them, Chris 895 00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:06,520 Speaker 1: Rock to being able to bounce back and and do 896 00:51:06,680 --> 00:51:09,239 Speaker 1: what you're what you do make people feel a little 897 00:51:09,239 --> 00:51:11,759 Speaker 1: more comfortable to make some jokes about it. But it's 898 00:51:11,760 --> 00:51:14,040 Speaker 1: also like I don't want that. I don't want the 899 00:51:14,080 --> 00:51:17,600 Speaker 1: ability to do that to diminish the reaction to these 900 00:51:17,640 --> 00:51:20,200 Speaker 1: types of things, right, And and I know as a 901 00:51:20,200 --> 00:51:23,799 Speaker 1: comedian I deflect with comedy a lot. In fact, last night, 902 00:51:23,800 --> 00:51:27,399 Speaker 1: I was having a very intense emotional conversation with someone. 903 00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:29,719 Speaker 1: I just made a joke and I just thought, in 904 00:51:29,719 --> 00:51:31,880 Speaker 1: that moment, why did I have to do that? You know, 905 00:51:31,920 --> 00:51:33,840 Speaker 1: it's because I was so uncomfortable that I had to 906 00:51:33,840 --> 00:51:37,040 Speaker 1: bring laughter into it and make it less serious and 907 00:51:37,120 --> 00:51:40,560 Speaker 1: to take away any element of pain or anything for 908 00:51:40,640 --> 00:51:43,160 Speaker 1: me or the other person. And a lot of times 909 00:51:43,160 --> 00:51:45,120 Speaker 1: I'm just you know, I do that, and I think 910 00:51:45,160 --> 00:51:46,719 Speaker 1: that a lot of comedians do that because it's our 911 00:51:46,840 --> 00:51:51,080 Speaker 1: fence mechanism and it makes everything okay. Not everything needs 912 00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:52,920 Speaker 1: to be made okay. Like that's a pretty scary thing 913 00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:59,520 Speaker 1: to happen. But anyway, I mean, look, the podcast wentlong today. 914 00:52:00,320 --> 00:52:02,839 Speaker 1: It's short, but it went long. Does that make sense? 915 00:52:05,600 --> 00:52:08,800 Speaker 1: And now Dmitri has to go be a celebrity And 916 00:52:09,040 --> 00:52:11,480 Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Dmitri. Did you get invited to Tom Cruise's 917 00:52:11,520 --> 00:52:13,960 Speaker 1: new movie premiere? I did. I'm I'm off to the 918 00:52:13,960 --> 00:52:17,360 Speaker 1: top gun Maverick premiere. And will you take photos on 919 00:52:17,400 --> 00:52:20,759 Speaker 1: the red carpet with your arm extended out pretending to 920 00:52:20,800 --> 00:52:23,320 Speaker 1: hold an invisible person so that I can photoshop myself 921 00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:25,480 Speaker 1: into the photos. It's just the way you painted that, right. 922 00:52:25,480 --> 00:52:28,440 Speaker 1: There is probably a no I'll go out and pretend 923 00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:30,719 Speaker 1: to hold an invisible person. I'm probably gonna say no, 924 00:52:30,719 --> 00:52:32,640 Speaker 1: but I'll see what I can do. We don't want 925 00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:34,040 Speaker 1: to seem crazy on the red carpet in front of 926 00:52:34,080 --> 00:52:36,080 Speaker 1: all your peers and Tom Cruise, that's so weird. There's 927 00:52:36,160 --> 00:52:38,759 Speaker 1: enough crazy out there. I think I'm gonna stand and 928 00:52:38,800 --> 00:52:41,680 Speaker 1: stand down on this. Ha ha. Okay, Well, you have 929 00:52:41,800 --> 00:52:44,440 Speaker 1: a fabulous time on the red carpet. I mean at 930 00:52:44,440 --> 00:52:47,759 Speaker 1: the movie premiere tonight. I'm wondering who you're wearing. I 931 00:52:47,760 --> 00:52:49,440 Speaker 1: would love to see photos at the gown, you know, 932 00:52:49,480 --> 00:52:51,640 Speaker 1: I'm just so curious. Well, if you'll have me back, 933 00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:55,399 Speaker 1: I'd love to come back and talk about it. If 934 00:52:55,440 --> 00:53:00,359 Speaker 1: you guys also see a crime in the future, one 935 00:53:00,400 --> 00:53:03,040 Speaker 1: that is Dimitri's hair and makeup that I'm sure we'll 936 00:53:03,080 --> 00:53:05,560 Speaker 1: follow after this, it's gonna be beautiful. It's gonna be 937 00:53:05,600 --> 00:53:09,560 Speaker 1: a beautiful wig. If you see a crime, like, for example, 938 00:53:09,719 --> 00:53:13,600 Speaker 1: if you were at Netflix is a joke last night, 939 00:53:13,840 --> 00:53:16,160 Speaker 1: two nights ago, when this airs, or whenever you're listening 940 00:53:16,200 --> 00:53:17,840 Speaker 1: to it. If you were in there and you saw 941 00:53:17,880 --> 00:53:20,759 Speaker 1: what happened, you're supposed to call us. You know that, right. 942 00:53:21,040 --> 00:53:23,600 Speaker 1: We have a call in number for this exact reason, 943 00:53:24,040 --> 00:53:26,520 Speaker 1: and you know what it is. It's eight six six crime. 944 00:53:26,680 --> 00:53:30,319 Speaker 1: If you witness a crime that's not too scary, you like, 945 00:53:30,360 --> 00:53:32,239 Speaker 1: don't don't call us for the scary ones, you know 946 00:53:32,280 --> 00:53:33,640 Speaker 1: what I mean. Like, that's when you call the cops, 947 00:53:33,680 --> 00:53:35,560 Speaker 1: So we're not the cops. We can't do anything for you. 948 00:53:35,600 --> 00:53:38,759 Speaker 1: We're social slits. You know this crime and you want 949 00:53:38,760 --> 00:53:41,320 Speaker 1: to call and confess. We can help you with that too. Yeah, sure, 950 00:53:41,640 --> 00:53:44,799 Speaker 1: like we'll pardon your sins. We will call in eight 951 00:53:44,880 --> 00:53:47,439 Speaker 1: six six twenty one crime. That's eight six six two 952 00:53:47,440 --> 00:53:50,600 Speaker 1: one two seven four or six three eight six six 953 00:53:50,719 --> 00:53:54,919 Speaker 1: twenty one crime six to anyone crime that's eight six 954 00:53:54,960 --> 00:53:59,320 Speaker 1: six two one two seven four six three. All right, y'all, 955 00:53:59,719 --> 00:54:03,080 Speaker 1: it's day safe. Have a great night that. Don't commit 956 00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:08,080 Speaker 1: any crimes until the next podcast. Okay, love you all. Bye. 957 00:54:09,000 --> 00:54:15,799 Speaker 1: It's real time. Crop it real time Gray, I mean, 958 00:54:15,880 --> 00:54:18,480 Speaker 1: is it actually real time crime or solving anything or 959 00:54:18,560 --> 00:54:19,960 Speaker 1: is that just the thing we say, it's a thing 960 00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:22,640 Speaker 1: we say, got it? Okay, see you next week for 961 00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:25,520 Speaker 1: more real time crime, only on i Heart Radio.