Speaker 1: Of the Law and Order franchises. SVU is considered especially watchable.
Speaker 2: We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
Speaker 2: vicious felonies. These episodes are based on.
Speaker 1: These are our stories.
Speaker 3: Done done yay.
Speaker 2: Another episode of that Semessed Up an SVU podcast.
Speaker 1: I Am Lisa and I Am Kara, And every week
Speaker 1: on this show we recap as view, we talk about
Speaker 1: the true CREB is based on, and we interview a
Speaker 1: celebrity guest and actor from the show, and so many layers.
Speaker 1: It's really it is three podcasts in one. You're welcome.
Speaker 1: What what it's okay? So this episode is coming out
Speaker 1: August twenty sixth. My lord, that's after labor is it now?
Speaker 1: It's no, it's not, bitch, I'm dumb. It's Labor Days
Speaker 1: coming up. I'll be back in La this at this
Speaker 1: time that this episode comes out. Right now, I'm at
Speaker 1: my parents home, but I'll be back in La. I'm
Speaker 1: getting to the point where i am missing being at
Speaker 1: my home.
Speaker 2: Way wild. Yeah, tell me more about this journey. I
Speaker 2: just how did you feel on the East?
Speaker 1: What are your thoughts? Was it what you wanted?
Speaker 4: Not?
Speaker 1: No, I think it's been great. It's been great. We've
Speaker 1: had a lot of fun. I got to do a
Speaker 1: fun weekend down at the shore with some friends. I'm
Speaker 1: seeing some friends in Vermont, and I mean it's just like, uh,
Speaker 1: it's just a lot to be like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: out of your house without like but you know, you're
Speaker 1: like on the road all the time for weeks at
Speaker 1: a time, so like, but it's just that. And then like,
Speaker 1: but the kids are like very resilient. They're like down
Speaker 1: and having a good time. But they are at a
Speaker 1: farm camp this week and absolutely loving it. They did
Speaker 1: not enjoy the pub camp the week before. Oscar did
Speaker 1: try to escape. I don't know if I already talked
Speaker 1: about this on the.
Speaker 2: Please talk about puppet camp. The fact that you didn't
Speaker 2: were pills.
Speaker 1: Oh my god. The public camp was like the puppet
Speaker 1: camp was at this kid's museum that my kids love
Speaker 1: to go to, and I was like, Oh, this would
Speaker 1: be great. They'll do a little puppet stuff and then
Speaker 1: they'll go around the museum. It's like a but it's
Speaker 1: like a kid's museum, you know, so like there's water, shit,
Speaker 1: there's stuff to do, and like every day I'd be like,
Speaker 1: did you go to any exhibits. They'd be like, no,
Speaker 1: they didn't let us, Like I feel like they were
Speaker 1: in a dark room all day just playing with puppets.
Speaker 1: They let them see the museum they like, I said
Speaker 1: something like the second day, and the councilor goes, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna ask I think they should see more. And
Speaker 1: then the kids were like they took us to one thing.
Speaker 1: Like I just thought there was more them. I can't
Speaker 1: understand why it's hard to like keep track of like
Speaker 1: two dozen thirty kids or whatever running around a museum,
Speaker 1: but like because there's also regular people that are just
Speaker 1: there to be there, you know, I know, but that's
Speaker 1: like life, that's what you do, I know, the job,
Speaker 1: like I know, and they're wearing they're wearing pinnies. Like
Speaker 1: I was like, they're easy to identify, but like they
Speaker 1: were inside it was really hot out. It was like
Speaker 1: are they going outside and all They're like, it's just
Speaker 1: been so hot and I was like fair enough, but
Speaker 1: like they just like the first day Rosie said it
Speaker 1: was great, and then the second day she was like,
Speaker 1: I'm kind of like they're not letting us out of
Speaker 1: the room. And I was like, okay, you're in a
Speaker 1: dark room all day. How many puppets did she make?
Speaker 1: Or that she made a sock puppet, she made a gluppet,
Speaker 1: which is like a glove puppet. She made some little
Speaker 1: like hate like some little like stick puppet. She made
Speaker 1: a marionette. Both her and Oscar made a marionette. How
Speaker 1: am I transporting the marionettes back to La you ask,
Speaker 1: I don't think I am I leaving the marionettes. I
Speaker 1: don't know, Honestly. I went to the final show and
Speaker 1: Oscars was Oscar quit halfway through. He came inside on
Speaker 1: my lap. He goes, I don't want to be in
Speaker 1: the show. I go okay, And then they did a
Speaker 1: little puppet show at the end. It was like a
Speaker 1: show in the last day for the parents. Rosie. Halfway
Speaker 1: through the show, I literally mounted her, I go, are
Speaker 1: you okay? And she she looked upset, and we found
Speaker 1: out later she had strep throat, but she was literally
Speaker 1: looked so like. But the beginning of the peppert Shore,
Speaker 1: she was okay and she was singing along to the song,
Speaker 1: and then it's like it hit her and she just
Speaker 1: looked miserable, And I was like, I go, are you okay,
Speaker 1: and she goes I'm tired, and I go uh oh,
Speaker 1: and she gots off. I can feel she's hot. I
Speaker 1: got to take her for a strap tests she gets
Speaker 1: I will say I got her a strip test and
Speaker 1: antibiotics all within an hour, courtesy of my mom being
Speaker 1: a pediatrician. So that was helpful. But oh yeah, you
Speaker 1: really got the goods. Yeah that was good. But you know,
Speaker 1: my mom's not working anymore, so she just has to
Speaker 1: call into her old place and be like you still
Speaker 1: remember me, and they, of course like she started payless,
Speaker 1: so they let me in. Yeah, but thank got It
Speaker 1: was like a Friday and it was like right at closing, like,
Speaker 1: so I got in there, got her the beds and
Speaker 1: so did the other kids look happy or were they
Speaker 1: also upset to be at this No, a lot of
Speaker 1: them looked psyched. A lot of them look psyched, and
Speaker 1: I think Rosie would have been psyched. I think Oscar
Speaker 1: was like a little bit young again. I was sneaking
Speaker 1: him into this camp too young, and that is something
Speaker 1: I need to learn that I can't keep doing. Like
Speaker 1: he was too young and I snuck him in as
Speaker 1: a four year old when really it's a camp for
Speaker 1: five and up, and he did try to. He did
Speaker 1: run out the front door. They called me to tell
Speaker 1: me later. That was the last day. It was like
Speaker 1: the day of the puppet show. And they called me
Speaker 1: and they were like, he ran out the front door,
Speaker 1: but security got him. And I was like, great, I'm
Speaker 1: glad security was on it. And then he ran through
Speaker 1: an emergency door to go to another area. I was like, well,
Speaker 1: he clearly doesn't like it there. But they were calling
Speaker 1: me at one o'clock and I go, I'm coming at
Speaker 1: two o'clock for the puppet show. There's really nothing that
Speaker 1: can be done. They were like, Oh, we're just calling
Speaker 1: to let you know we've got it under control. I
Speaker 1: was like, I don't know if you do. He's breached
Speaker 1: two perimeters now, but you know, I got to work.
Speaker 1: So they do what they do. But now they're at
Speaker 1: farm camp and they fucking love it. They're outside all day.
Speaker 1: They're with goats, chickens, rabbits, like these huge bunnies little
Speaker 1: baby chicks. Sounds like a camp I want to sign
Speaker 1: up for. Yeah, it was very Lisa coated camp. And
Speaker 1: like they love When I drop them off, they show
Speaker 1: me all these things they love it. Rosie gets to
Speaker 1: do cooking. She's the upper grades. They get to cook things.
Speaker 1: It's great. If you live in the Connecticut area, DM
Speaker 1: me and I'll tell you what it's called. If you
Speaker 1: live in the Fairfield County area, I'll tell you what
Speaker 1: it's called. Great little camp. But yeah, they're they're excited.
Speaker 1: I mean they're they've been fine. I'm just like, you know,
Speaker 1: you just get to a point where I'm like, I'm
Speaker 1: excited for like next week I'll be with all my
Speaker 1: sibs and stuff at my brothers. So but at the
Speaker 1: time of the release of this episode, I will be
Speaker 1: home and we are in the time machine.
Speaker 2: You guys, what are you gonna do? Are you gonna
Speaker 2: get like joy? Like, what are you gonna do when
Speaker 2: you get back to La God? Well, you know around
Speaker 2: get BurgerKing impossible? Like what's your day about?
Speaker 1: I got a burger king impossible this week here. Actually,
Speaker 1: that's funny that you said that I got one this week.
Speaker 1: And my parents, like my mom's been like making dinner
Speaker 1: every night, and I'm like, you don't have to make
Speaker 1: a dinner every night. Like we're just gonna get impossibles tonight,
Speaker 1: Like we're in the mood and we haven't had one
Speaker 1: in like a month, like a long time, and she
Speaker 1: was like. We were like, do you guys want anything
Speaker 1: from Burger King? And my parents both acted like so
Speaker 1: above it. They like got they were like no, and
Speaker 1: then eventually they were like, Okay, actually get us fish sandwiches.
Speaker 1: So we got them Burger King and they were like
Speaker 1: this is delicious. They like loved it. But my dad
Speaker 1: likes to pretend he's too good for stuff like that
Speaker 1: sometimes and honestly he's not. So uh, he loved his impossible.
Speaker 1: But when I go back, I have to like put
Speaker 1: my house back together, because like I cleared it. I
Speaker 1: like I didn't like get rid of furniture, but I
Speaker 1: like cleared our personal shit out of the way for
Speaker 1: the renters. So I got to like get all my frames,
Speaker 1: like you hit it all. No, not like frames, but
Speaker 1: like all of my like toiletries out in my bed bathroom,
Speaker 1: like all the things in my bathroom drawers, Like the
Speaker 1: bathroom was basically cleared out, like I cleared up. Yeah.
Speaker 1: But the day after we get back is the kids'
Speaker 1: first day of school, and so all I have in
Speaker 1: my calendar to do is research for our podcast because
Speaker 1: we record soon after. So like I don't really have
Speaker 1: you know, too much on the cow when doing this podcast,
Speaker 1: Like it's like it really does feel like college, Like yeah,
Speaker 1: kind of.
Speaker 2: And so I had an early spot in the West
Speaker 2: Village and then a really late one and so I
Speaker 2: sat at the vest of you, like I sat at
Speaker 2: the cellar working and everyone was asking questions. You know,
Speaker 2: it's like me sitting on a laptop in the dark,
Speaker 2: and yeah, I don't know. People are impressed.
Speaker 1: Well late speaking of you just brought up college and
Speaker 1: it just reminded me of college students like using AI
Speaker 1: to like write their papers or whatever. But have you
Speaker 1: seen this like meme that people are passing around that's like, yes,
Speaker 1: I do judge you if you use chat GPT, Like
Speaker 1: if you're seeding your creativity to a machine, I think
Speaker 1: less of you or whatever. But what do you think
Speaker 1: about people that are not like professional communicators? You know,
Speaker 1: like people that are not like don't have like degrees
Speaker 1: in writing and they don't talk for a living like
Speaker 1: some people that are, Like I've talked to some friends
Speaker 1: that use chat GPT.
Speaker 2: You're the library talks to a friend, right, Like you
Speaker 2: learn you find an example on Google, Like I don't.
Speaker 2: I agree, there's like a humanity we're willingly giving away. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And the examples in that meme were like, yeah, I
Speaker 2: judge you if you can't write a text to your
Speaker 2: wife or a eulogy for a loved one without a
Speaker 2: computer doing it for you, Like that's fucked. But then
Speaker 2: I saw another me, like another internet thing where it
Speaker 2: was like.
Speaker 1: There's a college professor.
Speaker 2: I don't know if this is real, but to get
Speaker 2: everyone to be against AI, he basically is like, okay,
Speaker 2: put in these topics like print out a paper from
Speaker 2: or I don't even know if people print, like get
Speaker 2: a paper from the chat GBT. And then it was
Speaker 2: like fact check it and correct it for grammar, and
Speaker 2: he said like that turns the class against it, having
Speaker 2: to actually like proof freedom.
Speaker 1: Oh, they actually see how bad it is. Yeah. So
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I actually saw that this morning, so I don't I
Speaker 2: didn't look further into it, but like, yeah, I do
Speaker 2: judge you. And I had this conversation with my sister
Speaker 2: because she was like, well, I'm not creative like that,
Speaker 2: like I can't write this thing, and this helps me.
Speaker 2: And it's like yeah, I have friends, there are many
Speaker 2: resources like you and you have time and you could
Speaker 2: figure it out. And it's like you also are a professional,
Speaker 2: Like I think people are selling themselves short like you
Speaker 2: worked for decades in a like communicating with children, Like
Speaker 2: stop selling yourself shore obviously if someone has disability, Like
Speaker 2: there's so many things I'm for, but I want the
Speaker 2: human element. We are succumbing to just profit like always,
Speaker 2: But it's like what who benefits?
Speaker 1: I mean, like I have friends that are like I
Speaker 1: have friends that are like it takes forever to write
Speaker 1: an email. I can't think of words this and that.
Speaker 1: So the chat gypt just like helps me. And so
Speaker 1: when I saw that meme, it just made me think
Speaker 1: of this friend and like people that have said something
Speaker 1: along those lines to me. And I'm like, yeah, if
Speaker 1: you if you have to write like a difficult email,
Speaker 1: I guess yeah, if you can't write a eulogy and
Speaker 1: speak from the heart about somebody who who died, that
Speaker 1: you've been chosen to read a eulogy, like that's I
Speaker 1: there is a.
Speaker 2: I understand the good uses and like, yeah, you're writing
Speaker 2: an important email and you get that, but it's like
Speaker 2: I don't know I don't think it's worth it. I
Speaker 2: don't think for like one woman who can't write an email,
Speaker 2: it's worth everything that's happening. I'm just like giving it
Speaker 2: up because at the end of the day, like we
Speaker 2: want a functioning world, right, And like I don't know,
Speaker 2: but I also might just sound like an old person
Speaker 2: and old people always I know, I'm your technology. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but it's like, what is life about if nothing is real?
Speaker 2: Like I don't understand. I don't get it. Isn't the
Speaker 2: challenge of having to write or do something that you
Speaker 2: don't know how to do, the point of school in
Speaker 2: life and the world around us, Like I don't. I
Speaker 2: think maybe it's like the fastness of what people want
Speaker 2: from you. Maybe that's the stress. But it's like someone
Speaker 2: said that. Who said this on a podcast? It was
Speaker 2: on an episode of Stradio Lab and this was years ago,
Speaker 2: and I think I brought it up on this pod,
Speaker 2: but was it Jake Cornell? But it's like life's about
Speaker 2: going and buying stamps, Like that's what it is. Kurt
Speaker 2: Vonneguet has a little thing about that, but it's like,
Speaker 2: that's what that's.
Speaker 1: What life's about. Yeah, seeing a different person going and
Speaker 1: doing a little craft figuring stuff out, you know, I
Speaker 1: just I don't know doing things is cool, Yes, I
Speaker 1: mean I totally agree and learning because people ask us
Speaker 1: all the time. I would say, like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: you do your own research.
Speaker 2: You do your own research, and it's like, of course,
Speaker 2: like I want to have a point of view of
Speaker 2: the research, like we could get researchers, but what is then.
Speaker 1: Why am I doing this? Why am I any of
Speaker 1: the And I'm afraid of you.
Speaker 2: And organize it in the way that I want to
Speaker 2: tell it because it's and how do I know what
Speaker 2: sources you're using?
Speaker 1: What if I'm against one er? I don't like this
Speaker 1: or like, I mean, it's not for me that even
Speaker 1: when I google something the AI answer at the top,
Speaker 1: I always skip it because it's like always wrong, like
Speaker 1: it's oh I always I do subtraction AI, so I
Speaker 1: don't get any of the yes, really, I just scroll
Speaker 1: past it. Like if I put it in like what
Speaker 1: does like what.
Speaker 2: Does this statue mean or something, the searches can still
Speaker 2: be AI formulated like I do negative.
Speaker 1: A, so nothing is there interesting.
Speaker 2: But it's also like if I just let someone research,
Speaker 2: like would they have figured out that like parental alienation
Speaker 2: is actually a tactic used by abusers, Like I don't know,
Speaker 2: there's just like I don't but I enjoy this. I
Speaker 2: guess if I hated everything that I did, I would
Speaker 2: do a computer too, because I wouldn't want to do it.
Speaker 2: So maybe I'm coming from like a privileged place.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think it's like people that are just
Speaker 1: like I have to get this important email written and
Speaker 1: I'm not going to writing emails and I don't. I
Speaker 1: don't have all day, so like I'm just gonna have
Speaker 1: chat ch and it's an unfair quote unquote fight.
Speaker 2: So like you're going and asking a computer with infinite
Speaker 2: internet things and I'm being a normal It's kind of
Speaker 2: how I felt like I was getting ready with a
Speaker 2: friend years ago and I was watching and I'm like,
Speaker 2: do you do all that every time? And she was
Speaker 2: like yeah, And I was like, oh, like I didn't
Speaker 2: realize people were doing all that, you know, Like I'm
Speaker 2: kind of a Tintin moisturizer blush. I love getting my
Speaker 2: shit professionally done, but I have I've used the same
Speaker 2: colors and brands and thing products for years and so
Speaker 2: watching her like powder and do all this stuff and highlight.
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, this is an unfair game. I
Speaker 2: didn't realize we were doing all that. So that's another thing.
Speaker 2: It's like we all have to give up our humanity.
Speaker 2: I don't get that. But like if you can't text
Speaker 2: your partner without chat sheet, like that's what I'm saying, Well,
Speaker 2: I trust humans, yes, but people are doing that, and
Speaker 2: that's what I don't trust. I don't trust it. We
Speaker 2: should not give this people because people are not trustworthy,
Speaker 2: I know. But with a partner and they're asking the
Speaker 2: computer stuff, I think that's nuts.
Speaker 1: I just feel like the toothpaste is out of the
Speaker 1: tube onet like I don't know what we can do,
Speaker 1: you know, and that's scary. Are human?
Speaker 2: I just don't get it. I don't care. I don't
Speaker 2: get why people are not more mad about it. It
Speaker 2: bothers me. My nephew's roasted me. They were humiliated by me.
Speaker 2: And I get computer stuff, I get medicine stuff. I
Speaker 2: get like helping disabled people like I get so it
Speaker 2: has good, it has it has like I just don't
Speaker 2: trust people. So it's like, yeah, I want to help
Speaker 2: people that are just maybe they have dyslexia, and this
Speaker 2: would change everything for them, right, like and they but
Speaker 2: uh uh, it doesn't mean you're just because you have
Speaker 2: dyslex You could talk something now, you can like talk
Speaker 2: into your father.
Speaker 1: There's like say it dictation. Yeah, there's all kinds of things.
Speaker 1: I didn't know how to. Well, I'm a professional speaker.
Speaker 2: It's just it's tough because I like when I officiated
Speaker 2: the wedding, I got the handbooklet from the internet church
Speaker 2: right or whatever it is, and I looked at the examples,
Speaker 2: and then I went and talked to other people that
Speaker 2: I know have done it, and I wrote down their advice,
Speaker 2: and then I used the format of this thing and
Speaker 2: put my own words in it and ask someone to read.
Speaker 1: Like I guess I could have just put into.
Speaker 2: Jet GBT that they like tie food and met at
Speaker 2: Portfolio School.
Speaker 1: You know, it's like or I could have done that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: people would have been like, why does Lisa sound like
Speaker 1: a robot up there? This is weird? Is she high?
Speaker 1: I would be devastated.
Speaker 2: I asked you to do a speech at a thing
Speaker 2: that really means a lot to me, and a computer
Speaker 2: put it together because you can't spend a little extra time.
Speaker 1: I don't get it. I never will. I know. I know,
Speaker 1: maybe maybe someone will DMS and convince us, but I know,
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm like talking about for like people that
Speaker 1: are maybe not even using it for profit or for
Speaker 1: something special. They're just like using it for rudimentary But
Speaker 1: I get I mean, I get it.
Speaker 2: I'm taking away what they're in life. And I am
Speaker 2: with the youth like I'm on my phone too much.
Speaker 2: I feel disconnected, like I was in Skochie and it
Speaker 2: was just like I nothing is new. I feel so cliche,
Speaker 2: like I'm embarrassing. But I just I miss going to
Speaker 2: black bus. I miss human, I miss I miss the thing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I miss, which I think is why New York
Speaker 1: is like New York is such a different city because
Speaker 1: you are just like among people all the time. You
Speaker 1: have to be among people, like you can't be as
Speaker 1: isolated as you can in Los Angeles. And then things
Speaker 1: like chat, GPT and Zoom therapy and everything is like
Speaker 1: making everybody more and more isolated. But like New York,
Speaker 1: I feel like is one of the last cities that's
Speaker 1: like holding on to, Like you have to be out
Speaker 1: with the people, and I love that about it, you know, Yeah,
Speaker 1: CHATGBT therapy that's scary because I have the nerd in cells.
Speaker 2: It's not real. It's like I have that use this
Speaker 2: chagypt into the most misogynistic shit.
Speaker 1: What. I have a friend that uses chat gypt to
Speaker 1: like walk her through certain therapy things, and she she knows.
Speaker 1: She's like, I know how to like train it to
Speaker 1: like help me. And I was like, wow, I don't
Speaker 1: get it, Like I don't. I don't. I've never even
Speaker 1: used it, Like I've never used chat GPT, so I
Speaker 1: don't know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'll eat my words if I'm wrong, but
Speaker 2: I don't think or words won't matter.
Speaker 1: It's like people aren't reading.
Speaker 2: That's worrisome, Like, oh, who's gonna be a doctor? The
Speaker 2: doctors are using chat gibt Like it's just scary.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2: It just scares me, and I'm not into it. I'm
Speaker 2: not into it. I don't want a driverless car.
Speaker 1: I want Oh my god, I do not want a
Speaker 1: driverless car. I don't. That is so scary to me. Okay, okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: let's get started. We've got a great episode for you
Speaker 1: guys today, and we did not use chat gpt to
Speaker 1: make a second of it. Oh my god, we've.
Speaker 2: Been dying to do this episode, so I'm really excited.
Speaker 2: I feel like we've been and it's similar to others,
Speaker 2: you know, but yeah, we like it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. But for some reason, the first ten minutes, I
Speaker 1: was like, have I never seen this episode? Like it
Speaker 1: wasn't until it developed a little more that I was like, oh, yes, okay,
Speaker 1: now I know I've seen this episode like a hundred times.
Speaker 1: In fact, I confuse this episode with another episode that
Speaker 1: we've done. I think I confuse this episode with Mother.
Speaker 1: I like conflate that episode sometimes, but no, I remember
Speaker 1: this wedding so well. Yeah. For some reason, it's like
Speaker 1: when they're finding that, I'm like, what am I watching?
Speaker 1: I've never seen this? But it was a weird feeling.
Speaker 1: But then I was back.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: It is kind of like SVU and Simpsons do have
Speaker 2: that in common, where the first ten minutes truly could
Speaker 2: have nothing to do with the rest of it, Right,
Speaker 2: it's just an intro and it's uh, yeah, it'll spin out.
Speaker 2: But season eleven, episode nineteen, we're doing con and honestly,
Speaker 2: the title doesn't actually make sense, does well.
Speaker 1: I think that the episode of the title is about
Speaker 1: the first like twenty minutes, like, and I'm going to
Speaker 1: talk about something that's related to that, Like it's mostly
Speaker 1: about a sort of a Red Herring character.
Speaker 2: Yeah you know, yeahah yeah. All right, so music is playing.
Speaker 2: We're at the end Tale of a Wedding. Okay, we
Speaker 2: already mentioned the wedding, and a bridesmaid is sitting alone.
Speaker 2: She's not happy she's sitting she's pissed. A man in
Speaker 2: a red suit comes over to flirt and he's like,
Speaker 2: I've been watching you all night and she goes, yeah,
Speaker 2: and I've been watching you and you've tried to fuck
Speaker 2: everyone in here, and I'm not going to be your
Speaker 2: last last bet hurrah. And he's like, come on, you
Speaker 2: got a room and she goes, yeah, with my parents
Speaker 2: and it's like, your twenty seven, get your own room.
Speaker 1: What are you doing.
Speaker 2: You're in a fucking hotel room with your parents at
Speaker 2: this age, I don't get this at all. He leans
Speaker 2: in and he's like, well, I know a place where
Speaker 2: we can be alone, and she goes, what type of
Speaker 2: girl do you think I am? And now they're in
Speaker 2: a closet hooking up, but she falls over and she
Speaker 2: does fall on a dead body. Face is mangled blood
Speaker 2: all over the face like and eyes wide open. Knock good,
Speaker 2: she's hyperventilating, He's in shock. Annie's pissed because he's not
Speaker 2: able to like get his dick wet.
Speaker 1: And then Melinda's on the scene quickly.
Speaker 2: Male late teens blunt force traumas of the head, no wallet,
Speaker 2: Benson and stalebar are like, e, that's a bad face
Speaker 2: and it's truly been beaten off, broken teeth like, but
Speaker 2: the purp did leave a murder weapon, so that's means like,
Speaker 2: probably not planned, probably not a professional hit.
Speaker 1: And the teens dick is out, which reminds me. So.
Speaker 2: A comedian was on stage and I hated their materials
Speaker 2: so much and but a part of it and I
Speaker 2: did speak to them immediately after. I go, listen, this
Speaker 2: might be annoying and nitpicky, like you don't have to listen,
Speaker 2: but what you're doing is fucked up. But basic it
Speaker 2: was a pedophilia joke, but she kept saying slept with
Speaker 2: a child, and so when she got off stage, I
Speaker 2: was like, that's actually not a thing.
Speaker 1: It's rape a child. You should say rape a child.
Speaker 1: You can't fuck a child.
Speaker 2: And it ended up being a back and forth where
Speaker 2: she's trying to question me and it's like, you're you're
Speaker 2: just wrong.
Speaker 1: I go, I go, it's just not a thing that exists.
Speaker 2: It's just not a real thing because sex implies consent,
Speaker 2: and with a kid, there's no consent. So when you
Speaker 2: say sex with a kid, you're saying something that does
Speaker 2: not exist, so you have to say rape.
Speaker 1: And she it was like, I think she was annoyed.
Speaker 1: I guess I don't care, but just telling you about it, Yeah,
Speaker 1: oh well, well I can't wait for you to tell
Speaker 1: me who this is. But then she goes, well you
Speaker 1: would say fuck a dog.
Speaker 2: And I couldn't think of a comment fast enough, but
Speaker 2: I wish I was like, well, there's no dogs here
Speaker 2: in ma Audie, like, what are you talking about? And
Speaker 2: it is right too. She goes, do you think it
Speaker 2: like normalizes it? I go, no, that's exactly what I
Speaker 2: think it is. I go, the language is normalizing. It's
Speaker 2: like when they say underage women, that's not a thing.
Speaker 2: These things don't exist, and you're using the language of
Speaker 2: pedophiles while like, excuse it. And then she also had
Speaker 2: a joke where she goes, it's so hard to be
Speaker 2: a pedophile that's why rich people do it, right, Like
Speaker 2: it's so hard and it's so hard to do, and
Speaker 2: it's like, no, it's actually the easiest thing to do.
Speaker 1: That's why losers do it.
Speaker 2: That's why losers fucking do it, because it's easy to
Speaker 2: trick a child, like I don't know, it's just because
Speaker 2: I like doing spicy material, like I enjoy doing edgy shit.
Speaker 2: But it's like, what is your goal here? What is
Speaker 2: your point? Who are you siding with? Why are you
Speaker 2: saying this? Yeah, and why are you arguing with me
Speaker 2: when you should actually be thinking me because you're a
Speaker 2: fucking like pedophile forgiver.
Speaker 1: I don't know. Ew Okay, I'm glad you said something. Okay,
Speaker 1: so now we're back.
Speaker 2: Okay, So the teen dick is out and Stabler is
Speaker 2: on one and he goes, well, the victim has his
Speaker 2: own weapon out, and it's like, yeah, that's why Melinda
Speaker 2: was called. And so there are fluids. Benson and Stabler
Speaker 2: are like Penn and Teller here. It's really one of
Speaker 2: them got off and then the killer off to this kid,
Speaker 2: easy come, not so easy go.
Speaker 1: We need to we need one of us or one
Speaker 1: of you intrepid listeners needs to seriously make a list
Speaker 1: of like all the cum jokes they make on this show,
Speaker 1: Like they make so many cum jokes. He came and
Speaker 1: then he went easy come, not so easy go, like
Speaker 1: so many cum jokes. Yeah, you know what that is.
Speaker 1: This kid's sitting here with his fucking face beaten off
Speaker 1: and you're making cum jokes. It's kind of funny. It's like,
Speaker 1: where do we draw the line at Huci who like
Speaker 1: it's confusing?
Speaker 2: Okay, So, but the kitchen's right down the hall from
Speaker 2: this janitor's closet, so someone must have heard something and Minch, I.
Speaker 1: Said, Minch, Minch, Finch is fan munch fan fiction. That's Finch,
Speaker 1: Is it really? No? I made it up honestly. Okay,
Speaker 1: that's our new thing.
Speaker 2: So Finch are together right, so fun Okay, fin Shirt
Speaker 2: canvassing the staff. We got a chat with the lovebirds
Speaker 2: as well, so and looking at them, it seems like
Speaker 2: this trauma is gonna make them last long term. Like
Speaker 2: I like, they're suddenly like really into each other, but
Speaker 2: they're both like it was so fucking gross. She goes
Speaker 2: my hand landed on his crotch. They saw the guy
Speaker 2: at the reception and this dude's actually a server. That's
Speaker 2: why he's wearing a red suit, and everything makes more sense.
Speaker 2: But he remembered the shirt because the guy like he
Speaker 2: was serving him drinks all day. So this kid not
Speaker 2: only had a bunch of drinks, he also had a
Speaker 2: whole tray of many keysches. So they asked, like bride
Speaker 2: or groom side, but nobody fucking knows, but we did.
Speaker 2: What we do find out is the bride was yelling
Speaker 2: at him, and then the father of the bride threw
Speaker 2: the sky out, and then the woman's like, listen, my
Speaker 2: friend is a bridezilla, but I don't see her killing
Speaker 2: a dude like a teen and scratching off his face
Speaker 2: bloody and Benson, it makes a little joke again and goes,
Speaker 2: maybe he gave her the wrong China pattern.
Speaker 1: I think if you're wearing all white and you bash
Speaker 1: someone's face in, there's gonna be a couple of droplets.
Speaker 1: We're gonna have to get Dexter in there, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean?
Speaker 2: It is crazy, like Dexter's giving me a drellale that
Speaker 2: I haven't had from something in a while, Like I
Speaker 2: just love it, like I missed him, like I don't know,
Speaker 2: I'm obsessed.
Speaker 1: Same kid playing his son from They didnt recast it,
Speaker 1: did they?
Speaker 2: Okay, And even Stabler looks at Benson like, bitch, relax,
Speaker 2: stop with their little China jokes.
Speaker 1: Come only here. And we're in the credits.
Speaker 2: We're in the credits and we're talking to the bride
Speaker 2: and groom in the lobby and they've never met the
Speaker 2: city it before wedding crasher.
Speaker 1: He made a toast which is so bold.
Speaker 2: And then the groom, who is played by an actor
Speaker 2: who's also in season sixteen Agent Provocateur with Patti Lapolm.
Speaker 2: His name is Kareem Savillan, and I recognized him from
Speaker 2: the other like, I went, this is an SV guy
Speaker 2: and it was so I felt it was.
Speaker 1: The groom who has like one line in this You're like,
Speaker 1: I've seen him in another one. Yeah, a symptom of
Speaker 1: the illness, yes, But also he's in an episode of Girls.
Speaker 2: He was the door guy that Showshana Me makes out
Speaker 2: with in season two while she's dating Ray. So whatever,
Speaker 2: if you're listening, I recognized you immediately. But anyways, he goes, oh, man,
Speaker 2: that was the best toast of the night, and it's like,
Speaker 2: what duds.
Speaker 1: Are you hanging out with that? The best toast was
Speaker 1: done by a tea and you've never seen a stranger,
Speaker 1: he said.
Speaker 2: People were in tears, but then they realized nobody knew him,
Speaker 2: and so the dad walks into the lobby and he's like,
Speaker 2: that mooch, he ruined my fucking wedding. I could have
Speaker 2: killed him, and it's like, you shouldn't say that to
Speaker 2: the police, but the dad just threw him out the
Speaker 2: fire escape. So now Finn is watching the footage with
Speaker 2: hotel security, and you know, it's a good looking guy
Speaker 2: before his face was bashed in and that's I don't
Speaker 2: know if I said that or Finn, so I don't know,
Speaker 2: but the only way back in. The security guard says
Speaker 2: this through the lobby, but no one ever came in
Speaker 2: through the front, so how did he get back in?
Speaker 2: So we keep watching the camera of this back exit
Speaker 2: and someone opened the door for him, so it has
Speaker 2: to be someone from the reception. Now we're back to
Speaker 2: footage from the lobby and we see him going up
Speaker 2: in an elevator with another man and it's an old
Speaker 2: guy and they get off on the seventh floor and
Speaker 2: into the same hotel room, so uh oh, someone's getting lucky.
Speaker 2: And this guy has been in four SVUS Sacrifice, True
Speaker 2: Believers and Townhouse Incident. His name is Kevin gear And
Speaker 2: who sadly passed away in twenty seventeen. And he's playing
Speaker 2: a man from Utah with a wife and six kids.
Speaker 2: So he's like a in the closet devious type of guy,
Speaker 2: and he's trying to lie to Finn. But when Finn's like, hun,
Speaker 2: I saw the security tapes, this guy's face drops and
Speaker 2: he is the bride's godfather. And basically he was chatting
Speaker 2: up with this teen all night and the teen brought
Speaker 2: up going somewhere. The boy's name was Jack, and he
Speaker 2: charged two hundred dollars, but he's denying the killing. He's
Speaker 2: like he was in and out in an hour, and
Speaker 2: he goes, Andy's a thief. He stole my rolex, but
Speaker 2: the rolex was not found on the body, so now
Speaker 2: where with Stabler? And he found an ID So it's
Speaker 2: a sixteen year old Andrew Hingham and Jake is a
Speaker 2: fake name, which is like fine, if you're, you know,
Speaker 2: out there selling sex, you can you can go by Jack,
Speaker 2: you know, But do guys do sexy names like girl
Speaker 2: strippers and stuff like do guys have like diamond or
Speaker 2: you know, passion?
Speaker 1: I think, I mean, I just go my mind goes
Speaker 1: right to Jax Taylor, whose name is Jason Coucy, you know,
Speaker 1: like he definitely made his name more like kind of
Speaker 1: hot Jason to Jack's like, yeah, but I don't know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know if girls do, Like what was the
Speaker 1: one we just did where we talked to the girl
Speaker 1: from passion? Yeah, passion, Like I don't know if they
Speaker 1: do a little like because what would your name be? Like,
Speaker 1: I don't know, Yeah, I don't think guys do little names,
Speaker 1: but yeah, like I don't know if Jack is hot,
Speaker 1: but I guess Jack's hotter than Andrew. I don't know.
Speaker 2: Anyways, So Finn joins him, and it's like, damn, I
Speaker 2: wonder how this old man's gonna explain rape of a
Speaker 2: male miner to his wife, and also where is the watch?
Speaker 2: And where did you find this wallet? And now much
Speaker 2: comes out and he's been digging in the trash, so
Speaker 2: he's the one I found all this, and nobody but
Speaker 2: the kitchen staff has access to that trash. So now
Speaker 2: they're going to ask everyone that works in the kitchen.
Speaker 2: So somebody did rob this child after like this illegal
Speaker 2: sex work thing. I mean, it's really it's really a lot.
Speaker 2: So we're talking a lot. It's a lot of steps
Speaker 2: he had.
Speaker 1: I would say he had a very different night, you know,
Speaker 1: so many elements of his night, sneaking into the way.
Speaker 2: Like there's just like a lot, a lot going on.
Speaker 2: So one of the workers is wearing a watch. He
Speaker 2: stole it. He goes when the girls screamed, they all
Speaker 2: went running and he grabbed the watch and wallet and
Speaker 2: he said the wallet was empty. He swears, But they
Speaker 2: arrest him and the old man and they put him
Speaker 2: in the cages in the middle of the precincts. Craigan
Speaker 2: walks by them and goes shut up. So now they're
Speaker 2: having a center squadroom meeting, and I think it's weird
Speaker 2: of a meeting about the case with the two people
Speaker 2: caged up in like listening to the meeting, No.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is weird. Like they're right there and they're like, Okay,
Speaker 1: who do we got suspect twice It's like these two
Speaker 1: guys that are with an earshot. That is strange.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So now they're having a center squadroom meeting. I
Speaker 2: did just say that and I repeated it, so they
Speaker 2: do have evidence that this Utah man stayed in his room.
Speaker 2: And also the kitchen dude was like, take my DNA
Speaker 2: here and my prints. I don't care, but the watch
Speaker 2: is twenty five grand and that's a felony grand larceny,
Speaker 2: So what a bad decision? Like you probably thought nothing
Speaker 2: of it, and it's like you're going away for a
Speaker 2: fucking felony. And he's not a citizen because he was
Speaker 2: scared of Like yeah, he was like, don't deport me.
Speaker 2: And also did you notice like that even in this
Speaker 2: episode which came out in like twenty ten, uh Munch
Speaker 2: at the beginning of questioning, all the kitchen workers goes,
Speaker 2: we're not we don't care about your immigration status.
Speaker 1: We're not with IC. But they don't say ICE. They
Speaker 1: say IC and it's like, wow, that was like a
Speaker 1: term that wasn't even in our minds in twenty ten,
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, and now it's like unfortunately always on
Speaker 1: our minds.
Speaker 2: But bummer, Okay, now bigger bummer. Benson and Stabler go
Speaker 2: tell Andrew's mother that her son is dead, so she's crying.
Speaker 2: They're still trying to get scoop out of her though,
Speaker 2: and it's like, can you just give her a few
Speaker 2: seconds to more in the death of her son, like
Speaker 2: I don't under like she needs to help investigate now,
Speaker 2: But she explains her son's always been depressed and she
Speaker 2: wants to see her son, and they're like, bad idea, babe,
Speaker 2: Like the face is fucked. But they ask her for
Speaker 2: a toothbrush or hairbrush or anything that can do some
Speaker 2: DNA confirmation on him since his face and teeth are gone.
Speaker 2: So she says, the room is just like he left it,
Speaker 2: and so they're like, well, what do you mean left it?
Speaker 2: He ran away seven months ago. He calls every Sunday
Speaker 2: and Skype and she's been waiting all day for his call,
Speaker 2: and he came back once back home, but it was
Speaker 2: to steal her laptop. So now we hear the Skype
Speaker 2: ring tone ringing, and she's like, wait, wait, I only
Speaker 2: talked to him on there, and it's fucking Andrew.
Speaker 1: Andrew is alive.
Speaker 2: He has a black eye, and he says I'm scared
Speaker 2: something bad has happened, and the mom is just so
Speaker 2: happy he's alive, and then he realizes the cops are there,
Speaker 2: and he disconnects immediately and he says, don't tell them
Speaker 2: anything right before hanging up. She's like, why the fuck
Speaker 2: did you scare him away? You stupid assholes, And dramatic
Speaker 2: music plays, and now the detectives are back at work.
Speaker 2: Craigan is apologizing to the mom over the mix up,
Speaker 2: huge mix up?
Speaker 1: Do you think like they give like do they have
Speaker 1: gift cards?
Speaker 4: Ready?
Speaker 1: You'll be like, my bad, but here's two hundred and
Speaker 1: fifty dollars, Like well, I'm yeah, Like you would think
Speaker 1: they'd say, we know your son is missing. We add
Speaker 1: some like can we get the hair brush or the teeth?
Speaker 1: They didn't know they didn't know the sun was missing.
Speaker 1: They found out there, right but right, but like before
Speaker 1: you say he's dead, you just go, we do have
Speaker 1: like you know, maybe you don't say definitively he's dead,
Speaker 1: just we need help in identifying, Yeah, like an out.
Speaker 1: Their eye colors are different, like you couldn't even be like,
Speaker 1: what eye color is your son?
Speaker 2: Like they just went off this ID, but the ID
Speaker 2: and the body's eyes don't match. Wait, yeah, dude, god,
Speaker 2: we're good. Okay, So Craigan's like, don't worry those detectives
Speaker 2: are off the case. That seems like a lie, but okay,
Speaker 2: Craigan goes on and asks, why, oh, but Finn does
Speaker 2: take over.
Speaker 1: Finn does take over most Yeah, I was gonna say
Speaker 1: Benson and Stabler are sort of gone the rest of
Speaker 1: the time.
Speaker 2: No, Yeah, it's fin heavyer right, So there is no lie.
Speaker 2: Craigan's setting setting up the Those two are busy. They
Speaker 2: had like they had to go to like the fucking
Speaker 2: upfronts or something. There was like a reason they had
Speaker 2: to let let them out for the day. Craigan goes
Speaker 2: on and asks, why why would this like dead man
Speaker 2: have her son's I d She doesn't know because he
Speaker 2: has no friends. She also denies that her son is
Speaker 2: gay or a sex worker, but she's more pissed about.
Speaker 1: The gay than the sex worker. So just like preference,
Speaker 1: I guess.
Speaker 2: But he's been living on the streets and she and
Speaker 2: so he could be you know, like USh. But listen,
Speaker 2: she's like, first he is dead, now he's gay. Let
Speaker 2: me tell you how wrong you are. He was accused
Speaker 2: of raping a girl last summer.
Speaker 1: What just she's like bragging on it to be like
Speaker 1: my son is an accused rapist of women, not like
Speaker 1: just because it would be so bad, like the gay
Speaker 1: panic of this woman is really on another level, Like
Speaker 1: that's a wild thing to just offer the police about
Speaker 1: your son who's on the run and just said something
Speaker 1: bad happened, like so crazy, So we need more info
Speaker 1: obviously on all that. So someone called the girl's parents
Speaker 1: and told them that Andrew forced her to have sex
Speaker 1: against her will. The psychiatrist talks to the school like
Speaker 1: his psychiatrists and the parents and everyone, and convinced them
Speaker 1: that Andrew belongs in a hospital, not in jail, and
Speaker 1: it's because he's super depressed. And Craigan's like, okay, but
Speaker 1: that's not usually like a defense for rape. But the
Speaker 1: mom says, well, doctor Stanton said that Andrew had a
Speaker 1: complete mental breakdown. She diagnosed him with early onset schizophrenia.
Speaker 1: He was hospitalized in August and in October there was
Speaker 1: a huge escape, and she says that people convinced him
Speaker 1: to run away, like with them. You know, she's a
Speaker 1: boy mom, so it's not his idea. I thought the
Speaker 1: same thing. It was like another hashtag boy mom.
Speaker 2: He's very suggestible, she says, always desperate to belong So
Speaker 2: Craigan and Finn are in a hallway and he is
Speaker 2: the suspect. Craigan goes, okay, how about we figure it
Speaker 2: out fully before you know, fucking with this mother again, Like,
Speaker 2: let's just figure shit out. So Huang is there and
Speaker 2: to be like, well, you know, hallucinations and voices can
Speaker 2: lead to violence, but most people with schizophrenia aren't a
Speaker 2: danger to like themselves or others.
Speaker 1: So we'll see. But I also we've seen it happen
Speaker 1: on this show before.
Speaker 2: Fit is like, okay, he is depressed, then rapes a girl,
Speaker 2: then goes to the nuthatch, and then what's a nuthatch?
Speaker 1: That's a mental hospital. Yeah, it's like an insensitive way
Speaker 1: of saying it, like looney bin essentially for sure.
Speaker 2: But for some reason I was thinking like sneaks into
Speaker 2: a wedding, so I was like, I didn't know nuthatches are, Like, okay,
Speaker 2: So Finn says he's depressed, then rapes a girl, then
Speaker 2: goes to the nut atch, and then possibly murders a
Speaker 2: gay hustler. That sounds dangerous to Finn, but Huang is like,
Speaker 2: listen to the listen you know, like the younger you are,
Speaker 2: the harder it is to treat schizophrenia, and sixteen is
Speaker 2: pretty young to have schizophrenia, like it's usually more just
Speaker 2: later teens twenties. Munch comes in and he has photos
Speaker 2: from the photographer at the wedding, very episode wet, and
Speaker 2: he says, our victim wasn't the only party crasher. And
Speaker 2: in the background we see Andrew alone in the background
Speaker 2: of every photo. So now it's maybe Jack and Andrew
Speaker 2: are partners. But like this boy looks.
Speaker 1: Really really sad.
Speaker 2: Maybe he's like mad that this guy like that his
Speaker 2: friend Jack went with this old Utah man and then
Speaker 2: dragged him into the storeroom and murdered him in a
Speaker 2: jealous rage. And this is like Munch's little hypothesis. So
Speaker 2: since he might be a danger, we need him off
Speaker 2: the streets. Craigan wants to release the photos of Andrews
Speaker 2: to the public.
Speaker 1: This seems crazy.
Speaker 2: Craigan asks Swang to see how a bunch of people
Speaker 2: were able to escape Bellevue as well.
Speaker 1: Maybe the Annabelle doll was around.
Speaker 2: So he goes, well, you mentioned he's being treated by
Speaker 2: doctor Stanton, so I'm gonna start there. So yeah, Hwang
Speaker 2: goes to meet her she's super hot, half hair pulled,
Speaker 2: like you know, half up, half down?
Speaker 1: Is there a name for half up half down? Or
Speaker 1: I have to say half up half down? Every time
Speaker 1: my whole life had says have said some hair up
Speaker 1: some here down there is like think that there is.
Speaker 1: I don't know if there's a name, but I've always
Speaker 1: said some her up somewhere down.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know why, like a man in the
Speaker 2: iron mask hare, like there needs to be a name.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like a half Nielsen or something. I know that's
Speaker 1: like a skateboard move, but like, yeah, there should be
Speaker 1: like a name for it.
Speaker 2: So she's telling Huang that if I mean to have
Speaker 2: a character named Huang when the real actor's name is Wang,
Speaker 2: is like so fucked up.
Speaker 1: It's like, really, they're they're fucking with us. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: don't know if they could have known that we would
Speaker 1: someone would be talking about in this detail, this stuff
Speaker 1: that we do, but it is.
Speaker 2: It drives me fucking crazy. But she's like, if he
Speaker 2: was under my care, he'd be a fully functioning member
Speaker 2: of society. Alie Walker is the address, and she is
Speaker 2: the address. She's the actress and.
Speaker 1: I love her because she has always stuck out to me,
Speaker 1: like she was in Sons of Anarchy as like an
Speaker 1: FBI agent who's really trying to get I think she's
Speaker 1: an FBI agent. She's like really trying to take down
Speaker 1: Jax Teller and the gang. And she's really good. Yeah,
Speaker 1: she's great.
Speaker 2: And she got her start on something called Santa Barbara episodes.
Speaker 1: Oh soap. Yeah, so that's like really exciting.
Speaker 2: I just know they're the like I just know people
Speaker 2: that do soaps are really good memorizers, and I become
Speaker 2: immediately jealous, you know, I'm like, cool, you memorizing, bitch.
Speaker 2: So anyways, in the background, someone is getting electrocompulsive therapy,
Speaker 2: so someone's truly shaking getting electrocuted in the background while
Speaker 2: being held down. It's like really fucked. And Huang is
Speaker 2: judging her and asking about ECT and she's like, listen,
Speaker 2: I'm a fan.
Speaker 1: I love it, and it's just like really hard to watch.
Speaker 1: She's like, there's actually like no problem with it. They're like,
Speaker 1: maybe that's the reason he ran away. She's like, no,
Speaker 1: he actually like loved that, like this was his favorite part,
Speaker 1: like having a spoon in his mouth and getting fully electrocuted.
Speaker 1: He loved it.
Speaker 2: God, she walks off and is like, listen, a carn
Speaker 2: artist scammed his way into the hospital under a voluntary commitment,
Speaker 2: and Andrew fell under his spell. He this like, this
Speaker 2: guy was not her patient, but he wreaked havoc on
Speaker 2: the whole hall. And the guy's name was Jack Robinson,
Speaker 2: so he scammed keys, he passed three guards, stole ten
Speaker 2: brand in medical stuff from the pharmacy, So this guy's
Speaker 2: really wild. And Melinda does find Jack's prince in the system.
Speaker 2: Something popped up. There's identity theft where he passed himself
Speaker 2: off as Donald Trump's son.
Speaker 1: Well I miss that, yeah, wow.
Speaker 2: And Melinda also said that his talk screen reads like
Speaker 2: Elvis alcohol, Benzo's opiates methamphetamines. Prince on the weapon are
Speaker 2: not in the system though, and they don't match anyone
Speaker 2: in the kitchen staff, but it matches the prince she
Speaker 2: got off of Andrew's brush, So did Andrew do it?
Speaker 2: And Munch is like, but why would he leave his
Speaker 2: id there if he did do it? And also Jack
Speaker 2: is nineteen, so Utah guy actually gets.
Speaker 1: No rape charges.
Speaker 2: He did not rape a minor, but his wife's still
Speaker 2: matt and refuses to pay his bail. So hella, but yeah,
Speaker 2: so it's like normal sex work. So Melinda goes, I
Speaker 2: only found Utah's semen, only one set of stemens and
Speaker 2: so and the detectives ask more questions, and she goes, listen,
Speaker 2: his father's coming up to id the body, maybe talk
Speaker 2: to him to get some answers. We meet the dad
Speaker 2: behind and like you know, behind the glass, and like
Speaker 2: they put the sheet back over his dead son, and
Speaker 2: he says, I guess Jack finally conned the wrong person.
Speaker 2: The dad explains that his son has been running get
Speaker 2: rich quick schemes from the time he could talk, and
Speaker 2: the mother always believed him, but like you know, the
Speaker 2: dad just knew better, and the mom just kept giving
Speaker 2: him money. He goes, my son was a genius, but
Speaker 2: once he left, he just like never came back. And
Speaker 2: they would get video postcards, but that's all he knows
Speaker 2: about his son. And the videos are like really creepy,
Speaker 2: and he does look exactly like the blonde Trump son Eric. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and he's in a suit and he's pitching his parents
Speaker 2: an investment opportunity and he needs ten grand and it
Speaker 2: ends with and I love you, and his mom gave him,
Speaker 2: you know, one more shot and sent him money, but
Speaker 2: like to wear, what's the address? And the only address
Speaker 2: that he had was a place he volunteered called Willilliam's home.
Speaker 2: So Finn goes to William's home and he knows somebody there.
Speaker 2: Finn walks in and it's Ken. It's his son, former
Speaker 2: guests of the pod. He doesn't want to chat with him,
Speaker 2: even though they haven't seen each other in months. And
Speaker 2: you know, Ken is acting busy, and he goes, what
Speaker 2: do you want? Like this better be a friendly chat
Speaker 2: because it's about one of my kids. This can't be good.
Speaker 2: And he shows him a photo of the boys and
Speaker 2: Ken goes, that's frickin' frack. Fenn says, well they were.
Speaker 2: Jack was murdered and Ken is not surprised because Jack
Speaker 2: lived on the edge. Finn says his father said he
Speaker 2: volunteered there, but Ken says he never helped anybody but himself.
Speaker 2: He only crashed there when like something better had fallen through.
Speaker 2: But like that makes sense, why wouldn't you, like right,
Speaker 2: I would sleep somewhere better too before going to like
Speaker 2: a worse pla Like I don't get oh that's a
Speaker 2: sign of you know, dban behavior. But now tell us
Speaker 2: about Andrew. We hear he's a good kid, and Ken's like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I can reach him. I feel like I can reach him,
Speaker 2: but I Andrew hasn't been here in days. Finn wants
Speaker 2: like a call if he shows up, and to ask around,
Speaker 2: and he's like, no, these are street kids. They're not
Speaker 2: going to round each other. Finn doesn't like that and
Speaker 2: gets loud and in Ken's face and he's like, is
Speaker 2: there something you're not telling me? And he goes, these
Speaker 2: kids trust me and I never told them. My dad's
Speaker 2: a cop for a reason. And Finn reminds him, you're
Speaker 2: not a priest. Your shit's not privileged, and he goes,
Speaker 2: I'll ask around, and that's just to shut him up.
Speaker 2: So now we go to Taru and you know, Joel
Speaker 2: de la Fuente is there, Ruben Morales, so many names. Okay,
Speaker 2: they're trying to crack into his computer that he stole
Speaker 2: from his mother using her password, and I know you
Speaker 2: can do this, but this seems crazy.
Speaker 1: But they're controlling the computer.
Speaker 2: He has access to the webcam too, so they'll like
Speaker 2: see anything that's in front of the webcam and they're
Speaker 2: just like working his computer because the laptop's just on
Speaker 2: and open and ready to go and can just access it.
Speaker 2: And why would the mom give her password up? Nothing
Speaker 2: makes sense.
Speaker 1: I swear that the mom gives the password up because
Speaker 1: she seems pissed at the cop. She's like, first you
Speaker 1: said he was dead, then you said he's gay, now
Speaker 1: you want now you want my password? Like it is weird, Yeah,
Speaker 1: but she gives it up. So we're watching live and
Speaker 1: we see all these buildings and like, yeah, they use
Speaker 1: the buildings to get the location, and we're on the scene.
Speaker 1: Finn and Munchs are waiting. It's a nice apartment building.
Speaker 2: Finn leaves Munch though, because his son lives a few
Speaker 2: blocks away, so he's like, you know, I feel like
Speaker 2: Ken's holding something back, and he lives a few blocks
Speaker 2: from you know this wherever Andrew is or Andrew's laptop is.
Speaker 2: And so Finn goes in, but Ken doesn't live there
Speaker 2: anymore since December, the old woman says. The old Woman's like,
Speaker 2: I've been living here since December, and I checked the
Speaker 2: time stamp and it's February sixteenth, so it says two
Speaker 2: and a half to three months, like right February December
Speaker 2: to February, but later month says five months.
Speaker 1: Come on, guys, let's get the timeline correct. I've become
Speaker 1: the dork. I hate detective. I've become an embarrassment.
Speaker 2: So it's post Valentine's Day, okay, but so Ken's holding
Speaker 2: a lot back, like Ken moved and didn't. But the
Speaker 2: woman has his mail and she wants she needs to
Speaker 2: get it to him, but she does not want to
Speaker 2: give it to Finn until Finn says that he's a
Speaker 2: cop and the father.
Speaker 1: But wouldn't the father know.
Speaker 2: They'll give you as an act of good dad or
Speaker 2: a co like, wouldn't they have the address?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Still suspicious and this is why the elderly are scammed.
Speaker 1: They're not thinking. So she also and.
Speaker 2: She goes, oh my god, I love Ket, You've raised
Speaker 2: like an amazing son. He left self address, stamps, envelopes
Speaker 2: for her and she gives everything over to him and
Speaker 2: gets what the new addresses. The fucking building that Munch
Speaker 2: is at so much goes you find anything, and Finn
Speaker 2: says high blood pressure. Ken moved into this building five
Speaker 2: months ago, and like I said, not according to my math,
Speaker 2: but maybe he's like exaggerating and wants something, but this
Speaker 2: is no coincidence. His son might be harboring a killer.
Speaker 2: So we jumped to Finn just like pushing it through
Speaker 2: Ken's door, pushing him against the wall. Ken goes, are
Speaker 2: you crazy? But Finn's just pissed. They're screaming at each other.
Speaker 2: Ken goes, he moved in here with his boyfriend, and
Speaker 2: Finn goes, you're banging this kid, and Ken is pissed.
Speaker 1: He's a minor.
Speaker 2: And you think I'm a pedophile because I'm gay, and
Speaker 2: Ken screams, Andrew is straight, and Finn goes, yeah, right,
Speaker 2: his best friend's a gay hustler. And Ken has to
Speaker 2: break the news that straight men and gay men can
Speaker 2: be friends. They're allowed to be friends, and Finn goes, yeah, okay,
Speaker 2: and so what's Andrew doing here? Ken says that he
Speaker 2: found him waiting on his stoopid when he got home
Speaker 2: and someone had beat him up and he was very upset.
Speaker 2: Finn is so pissed that he has street kids at
Speaker 2: his house and that he's doing counseling sessions there. And
Speaker 2: Finn's fuming, like you're letting these street kids in here
Speaker 2: lude steal anything, and Ken screams, I'm trying to get
Speaker 2: them off the street, and I love him, So Ken
Speaker 2: says that he had him convinced to go back to
Speaker 2: his mom's house, and Andrew just stores his computer here
Speaker 2: to skype with his mother, and Ken gives him privacy.
Speaker 2: But when like Ken entered the room, Andrew was running
Speaker 2: freaked out. But honestly, at the end of the day,
Speaker 2: like stop fighting and find this kid, Like we're done
Speaker 2: with your little family trauma. Let's go father son, get
Speaker 2: to work day. So you know, diddy Murder's friend is
Speaker 2: someone trying to kill him? Like is he in danger?
Speaker 2: What is going on? Where could he be? And Ken
Speaker 2: finally does like help his father. So where do like
Speaker 2: street kids hang out? Hospital Er is a good place
Speaker 2: to chill, and then they like a hotel conference room
Speaker 2: is a place to hang out, and they don't look homeless,
Speaker 2: so they could always just pretend to be like drunk guests.
Speaker 2: And then also the Metropolitan Opera House, like they go
Speaker 2: in as everyone's being let out and they hang out
Speaker 2: in the lady's lounge because there's like a separate powder
Speaker 2: room and comfy couches, and that's where Ken does find
Speaker 2: him sleeping. It's super pretty and pink, but Andrew freaks out,
Speaker 2: like you brought the cops with you, and then Finn
Speaker 2: arrests him. Fuck you, Finn, like be chill. And then
Speaker 2: Andrew's screaming like you betrayed me. I thought you were
Speaker 2: my friend. I trusted you. Ken feels bamboozled too.
Speaker 1: He's screaming like you just said you were gonna question him,
Speaker 1: what are you doing?
Speaker 2: But they actually can't even talk to him till his
Speaker 2: mother gets to the scene. So he's in cement room.
Speaker 2: Bars Kwan, Kragan and Finn are on my shit list
Speaker 2: right now watching Andrew, but Huang is actually happy, like
Speaker 2: you know, he's off the streets.
Speaker 1: Ken gets a call from Andrew. He runs in.
Speaker 2: He wants to talk to him, and they allow him
Speaker 2: to go in there because he's not acting on behalf
Speaker 2: of the NYPD, but they're listening, of course, but Andrew
Speaker 2: spills the truth to Ken. He's like, I hated that wedding.
Speaker 2: I didn't want to be there. I was relieved when
Speaker 2: he was kicked out, but he wanted to go back in.
Speaker 2: I should have left. I should have left when he
Speaker 2: went to go have sex with that guy. But we
Speaker 2: had plans to steal caviar from the storeroom, and Ken
Speaker 2: is so disappointed, like, Jack sucks, you can't trust him,
Speaker 2: what are you doing? And he goes, But he's the
Speaker 2: one who saved me from that mental institution and he goes,
Speaker 2: you know, with Jack, I feel alive again. And this
Speaker 2: guy's such a good actor. And he plays Morello's Morello's right,
Speaker 2: is he not? Morello's person in Orange is a new Black?
Speaker 1: I think he is. But he's also in the another
Speaker 1: SF episode later called Institutional Fail, the Whoopy Goldberg episode
Speaker 1: Oh my God, where he's like the other like he's
Speaker 1: like the young social worker that's like he's like, you know,
Speaker 1: he doesn't know how many he has so many cases
Speaker 1: to keep up with.
Speaker 2: You're not gonna believe this. I brought up Institutional Fail
Speaker 2: yesterday to somebody. I bring it up all the time.
Speaker 2: I mean that like monologue Whoopy Goldberg does just like really,
Speaker 2: oh my god. He was in The Materialists, Oh yeah,
Speaker 2: John mcgarough, like he's I watch that though, Why don't
Speaker 2: I remember him? I saw that in the movies. He
Speaker 2: was in Past Lives. He has a really amazing career,
Speaker 2: and it makes sense. He's like so good in this episode.
Speaker 2: He is really talented. Yeah, Orange is the new Black.
Speaker 2: Vince mcm I don't know, I can't say it.
Speaker 1: No, but isn't John Morgaro also good friends with Ari Grainer,
Speaker 1: didn't he? She bring him up to us in like
Speaker 1: one of our first foy That was our third episode
Speaker 1: we've ever done. If you think I remember who Ari
Speaker 1: Grainer said that, she remember her talking about how they're
Speaker 1: good friends. I feel like I remember that. But he's
Speaker 1: very he's very, very working, very good. How crazy is this?
Speaker 2: He's born February sixteenth to nineteen eighty three, and this
Speaker 2: episode takes place on February sixteen.
Speaker 1: Oh little b day birthday episode for him, Yes, John Magaro.
Speaker 2: So then he says, oh, no, I can't believe I
Speaker 2: killed him. So Ken's screams, stopped talking, but he doesn't.
Speaker 2: We need to know what happens. So he tried to
Speaker 2: kiss him, so he shoved him off, and he got violent.
Speaker 2: He was flying high, he was on meth and he
Speaker 2: tried to rape him orally. And so you know this,
Speaker 2: Andrew is hitting Jack. Jack's trying to rape Andrew and
Speaker 2: they're like physically fighting, and then he pushes Jack and
Speaker 2: he hits his head and he stops breathing, but eyes open,
Speaker 2: and you know, Andrew's so upset. He's like, I knew,
Speaker 2: he knew I wasn't gay. I can't believe this is
Speaker 2: happening to me again. I trusted someone. And he goes,
Speaker 2: I was so mad that I smashed his face with
Speaker 2: with whatever I could find. I was so pissed. And
Speaker 2: then it's like, okay, but why'd you leave your wallet?
Speaker 2: And he goes, well, I panicked his face was gone.
Speaker 2: I thought if he was dead, and like people thought
Speaker 2: I was dead, then I could finally get away. Hwang
Speaker 2: and Craigan are doing a walk and talk and they're like, well,
Speaker 2: it's self defense, but also like how do we know this?
Speaker 2: So I'm glad they're like on board with the self
Speaker 2: defense of it all, but like, you know, we need
Speaker 2: to make sure it.
Speaker 1: All aligns with evidence.
Speaker 2: But also he said, you know, like I'm trying to
Speaker 2: get away, like I want to finally get away. So
Speaker 2: who what is he talking about? Is it his mom?
Speaker 2: And Craig then calls his mom a pill popper. But
Speaker 2: then we find out, you know, Andrew's always been depressed
Speaker 2: and we're just waiting for Huang to give us some scoop,
Speaker 2: and he thinks, you know that Andrew has all the
Speaker 2: red flags for abuse. Huang goes to talk to his doctor,
Speaker 2: Stanton to get more information. So Craigan sees a girl
Speaker 2: sitting at the precinct as Huang leaves to go talk
Speaker 2: to the doctor again. And this girl is looking for Andrew.
Speaker 2: So her name is Mallory Sidwell and she's the girl that,
Speaker 2: like Andrew, was accused of raping and got sent to
Speaker 2: the hospital. And Craigan's like, oh, don't worry, he's in custody, like,
Speaker 2: you don't have to be scared, and she goes and no,
Speaker 2: he didn't rape me. This is a giant mistake. I
Speaker 2: never even accused him. Whoever told my parents he raped me?
Speaker 1: Lied?
Speaker 2: Andrew is my boyfriend. So Huang is now asking Stanton
Speaker 2: about Mallory and she says, the sexual assault with the
Speaker 2: schizophrenia happened all at the same time, and he just
Speaker 2: wasn't in charge of his actions. But then she sees
Speaker 2: Mallory in wood room blind.
Speaker 1: So I don't know how this time worked out and
Speaker 1: how Stanton got here, and see like this.
Speaker 2: Is all a little silly, silly, I mean, yeah, I hate.
Speaker 2: I don't like poking holes because I'm not here to
Speaker 2: do that.
Speaker 1: Oh I do. I mean there's a lot. There's also
Speaker 1: like how much trouble could you get in if somebody
Speaker 1: randomly calls parents and says, did this boy rape you?
Speaker 1: And then you go, no, he didn't, he didn't, he didn't.
Speaker 1: He's still getting in a ton of trouble. Like I don't,
Speaker 1: I don't get it. Like, I guess you could, you know,
Speaker 1: punish kids for having sex too young or whatever, but
Speaker 1: like it seemed like this kid got institutionalized based off
Speaker 1: something that the girl, the quote unquote victim said never happened.
Speaker 1: So that's what I don't guess.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I think it's kind of like statutory things
Speaker 2: like if the parents want it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but he's sixteen, yeah you know. So yeah, I
Speaker 1: don't know. I don't know.
Speaker 2: So you're right, you're right. Okay, So so Stanton, I
Speaker 2: guess is a meeting? Ahnglong didn't go meet her.
Speaker 1: She brushed over, sees Mallory in woodroom blinds and she goes,
Speaker 1: why is she here? And Wang goes, well, she says
Speaker 1: it was consensual, and the doctor goes, well, you know,
Speaker 1: classic guilt reaction. Victims blame themselves, but Stanton is blaming
Speaker 1: Mallory on the onset of all the psychotic stuff that's
Speaker 1: going on with Andrew and that she was actually doing
Speaker 1: all these.
Speaker 2: Sexual advances, so I don't care what's happening. Quang is
Speaker 2: trying to come up with an answer to all this,
Speaker 2: and Stanton is knocking all of them down. She's like,
Speaker 2: if I didn't get involved, the violence would have escalated.
Speaker 1: I'm a hero.
Speaker 2: And Kwang's like, oh, you told Mallory's parents, and she goes, well,
Speaker 2: I was legally bound to you know.
Speaker 1: He was still a threat to her.
Speaker 2: So it's like, wait, so she's sexually advanced and then
Speaker 2: he's a threat to her, Like I don't understand what's
Speaker 2: going on. Yeah, And he's like, wait, so you had
Speaker 2: him committed instead of jail. His mom must have been
Speaker 2: happy with that. But she looks down and that means liar,
Speaker 2: and she says, well, I don't treat Joyce, but I
Speaker 2: know that she has struggled with her own issues, and
Speaker 2: I think she was overwhelmed with her later in life child.
Speaker 2: She says she's been seeing Andrew for about four years
Speaker 2: and there were tons of barriers that she couldn't break through,
Speaker 2: and Huang doesn't like her and is like, Andrew talks
Speaker 2: about getting away. Maybe he was talking about Mallory, not
Speaker 2: his mother. And she's lost and confused and she's like wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,
Speaker 2: oh my, you talk to him. She's like, I want
Speaker 2: to talk to him, but like Huang goes, no, you
Speaker 2: can't talk to him till he's arraigned. So now we're
Speaker 2: at the office of eighty A. Kendra Gill who is this?
Speaker 2: Who is who is Kendra Gill? Who is this woman?
Speaker 1: Who is she? So sorry? It sound like I was
Speaker 1: yelling at you.
Speaker 2: So Finn's there too, and basically this lawyer is screaming
Speaker 2: at them like get it together, and Ken's like, I'm
Speaker 2: done being used. I'm not going on the stand and
Speaker 2: he's not helping him put away.
Speaker 1: And so Kendra Gill is a defense attorney who later
Speaker 1: becomes a new Jersey eightya I think, oh does she
Speaker 1: do shady as shit?
Speaker 2: Is she in the episode where she's shady and like
Speaker 2: doing something bad and gets caught lying?
Speaker 1: Or like she's later in Father Dearest and Rhodium Knights,
Speaker 1: which are the Delia Banks episodes, so I don't know mine,
Speaker 1: and she actually becomes she's yeah, she's a Jersey Ada,
Speaker 1: and then later she's a New York Ada who works
Speaker 1: with the SVU. I don't know. It's I don't know.
Speaker 1: They got this lady a lot of times. Gretchen Eagle
Speaker 1: if we've talked about her, because I've looked up that
Speaker 1: name before. Yes, what that's the answer to the age
Speaker 1: old question who is Kendra Gill?
Speaker 3: Go on?
Speaker 1: Is that merch? We all everybody just wears who is
Speaker 1: Kendra Gill? Merch around?
Speaker 2: So whatever, he's not on the stand, but we're they're like, listen,
Speaker 2: he's only looking at probation, you know, for going to
Speaker 2: town on the dead body. It all seems accidental, like
Speaker 2: this is chill and Ken's like, oh wow, thank you.
Speaker 2: So now that that's done, daddy needs infoam So Ken's like, listen,
Speaker 2: the mom's an absentee parent.
Speaker 1: They bonded over that. So like that's kind of shade
Speaker 1: to Finn as well. Yeah, Finn doesn't even like clock it.
Speaker 1: I feel like half the time Ken will be like,
Speaker 1: oh cause you were like the worst dud ever in
Speaker 1: Finn's like anyway, like he never cares, Finn on paper
Speaker 1: is truly just like a video games strip club guy
Speaker 1: bad Dad, but we love him bad dad who was
Speaker 1: originally a Republican. Yeah, hates immigrants. Oh man, whatever was
Speaker 1: there abuse in the home? He goes, No, just booze
Speaker 1: and pills, like she never did anything to him. Ken's like,
Speaker 1: you think she like hurt him, and Finn says, I
Speaker 1: don't know, but I want to make sure he's safe
Speaker 1: whenever he gets home after he makes bail. So Finn
Speaker 1: goes to talk to the mom to see if Andrew's there.
Speaker 1: She goes, I'm gonna go pick him up right now.
Speaker 1: Finn goes, no, he was bailed out that morning. She says, no, no,
Speaker 1: I'm on my way now. It took me a second
Speaker 1: to get the money together, but somebody already paid bail.
Speaker 2: So like, wait, what's going on? And why didn't he
Speaker 2: come home? So what's happening? Like is he not coming
Speaker 2: to you because you're abusing him? And she's like, I
Speaker 2: have never abused him, and I do believe her because
Speaker 2: she's so shocked by the question, and but like, why
Speaker 2: isn't he coming home? And it's and she's ashamed. She
Speaker 2: is ashamed and she doesn't know she the best she could.
Speaker 2: Finn says, okay, well, let's go find out who bailed
Speaker 2: him out. And where do we go? Doctor Stanton's house.
Speaker 2: She's in a silk robe. She looks like she just
Speaker 2: got fucked and she posted his bail and Finn and
Speaker 2: Huang are there and she's babbling and Finn calls her
Speaker 2: a lady. He's like, listen, lady, and she says she's
Speaker 2: doing the best thing for her client, and Huong goes
Speaker 2: really moving in with a patient a little unorthodox. She
Speaker 2: tries to slam the door, Finn does not allow it.
Speaker 2: He pushes in, runs up the stairs. George is well
Speaker 2: like following, and Andrew's on the floor. He's drugged up,
Speaker 2: and she goes, well, he's been off his meds for months,
Speaker 2: so I'm easing him back into his regimen, but he
Speaker 2: is zonked out. George is like, we're just here to
Speaker 2: make sure you're safe, and then we hear a baby cry.
Speaker 2: Everyone freezes, and Andrew just wants to sleep. Things are
Speaker 2: not good. But also this woman's in a silk robe
Speaker 2: while she's with a patient, and she's giving him drugs
Speaker 2: in her bed and who is this baby?
Speaker 1: And they left I can't believe they leave him there.
Speaker 1: It's like he's sixteen and she's in a silk robe.
Speaker 1: And am not like why they've a read more or
Speaker 1: less and she has no custody of him. But like,
Speaker 1: I don't know if they can take him into custody
Speaker 1: if he hasn't done a crime. I don't know. I
Speaker 1: do not know. Ugh.
Speaker 2: So we're at the precinct and Benson is with me.
Speaker 2: She's like, wait, an underage patient living with a shrink.
Speaker 2: This isn't good. Like, what do you mean you left him?
Speaker 2: It really is not like our people. I really am confused.
Speaker 2: So Finn says, she's bang in him and we just
Speaker 2: talked about this, okay. So Craigan says, that's a serious accusation.
Speaker 2: And it's like she's in a silk robe. I don't
Speaker 2: know how many more times I can say this. So
Speaker 2: but Andrew isn't complaining, but he is a minor, and
Speaker 2: Finn's like, she is kind of hot.
Speaker 1: It's like she hasn't whacked out on drugs. Finn wants
Speaker 1: to know how the baby daddy, like who is the
Speaker 1: baby daddy? Not how he is? Who is it?
Speaker 2: And so she's been seeing Andrew since he was twelve.
Speaker 2: That's the onset of puberty. So Craigan wants more evidence
Speaker 2: and it needs to all be air tight, and Benson says, like, stop,
Speaker 2: if Stanton was a man and Andrew was a sixteen
Speaker 2: year old girl, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.
Speaker 2: And it is true, we would have arrested, like if
Speaker 2: he was wearing a little silk outfit, like yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: Wang suggests bringing her in for something else because when
Speaker 2: they were there with him, he was lucid and not medicated,
Speaker 2: and like there were no hallucinations, there were no problems.
Speaker 2: So like if he was truly like suffering from schizophrenia
Speaker 2: six months without meds, he would have been a nut show,
Speaker 2: you know, in the words of yeah, this precinct, I
Speaker 2: would right, right, that's usually a problem. So Benson's like, wait,
Speaker 2: you think she misdiagnosed him, like he was not even schizophrenic,
Speaker 2: and then Finn goes maybe even on purpose. So but
Speaker 2: it wasn't enough to commit him and have complete authority
Speaker 2: over him, so they subpoena his medical records and we
Speaker 2: have a mini like claw clip half up, half down
Speaker 2: in cement room bars. I'm just obsessed with her in
Speaker 2: her blonde hair, like I just like her so much.
Speaker 2: So finn is finn is no doctor, He goes, but
Speaker 2: he needs an explanation on all these meds, and Huang's
Speaker 2: behind him to, I don't know, it's cute and I
Speaker 2: just like them together. So she tries to get Huang
Speaker 2: on her side, like, doc, you get it, and he goes, no,
Speaker 2: when he left you and went to Bellevue, Bellevy only
Speaker 2: gave him half the pills that you did. And she goes, well,
Speaker 2: that's what the dual diagnosis, and Guang goes, no, he
Speaker 2: does not have schizophrenia. And then you know, Kalana's a
Speaker 2: Pean clan's a pan I wrote these because of white
Speaker 2: lotus lore, but they're on the lapans and that means
Speaker 2: you're not a good doctor, Like you can't mix those together.
Speaker 2: Those drugs make someone dazed and compliant. And she's stuttering
Speaker 2: a little.
Speaker 1: Now she gets that Huang's not playing any games, and.
Speaker 2: You know, she has an answer. She's like, oh, you know,
Speaker 2: it's not an exact science. I adjusted things based on
Speaker 2: what the condition commanded. And Wong's like, no, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 2: these two drugs could have killed him taken together, and
Speaker 2: he shows her all the papers. She sits down and
Speaker 2: is like, well, I may have made a mistake. So
Speaker 2: he cut to Andrew and he's having a full monologue.
Speaker 2: He's like, neither one of my parents ever wanted me.
Speaker 2: And Benson is like, well, I know how much I
Speaker 2: know that. Yeah, She's like I get that, I feel you. Also,
Speaker 2: they now that, like they've found this kid. These two
Speaker 2: are back on the case. I guess Benson's back on
Speaker 2: the case. They're allowing her back in. Now, let's get
Speaker 2: the history of him and her. So he said it
Speaker 2: started like at first it was a waste of time,
Speaker 2: and he'd sit there and wait till the clock ran out.
Speaker 2: And then one day he started and he just poured
Speaker 2: out how lonely he was and that nobody in the
Speaker 2: world gave a crap about him. And he started crying
Speaker 2: and he couldn't stop. And then doctor Stanton put her
Speaker 2: arm around him, and it was the first time he
Speaker 2: ever felt love, and she asked if Stanton did anything
Speaker 2: more than that dumb kiss on foreheads, then cheeks, then lips,
Speaker 2: and then they started having sex and he was thirteen
Speaker 2: when it started, and he's like, I loved her and
Speaker 2: she told me she loved me too, and Benson goes, no,
Speaker 2: that's abuse, and he goes no, at first, it was
Speaker 2: awesome until she got pregnant and he freaked out. So
Speaker 2: he freaked out. He's like, you know cause she's like,
Speaker 2: you can't abandon this child like your dad abandoned you.
Speaker 2: So she's a sick bitch and Benson like really cares
Speaker 2: for him. So she's like, well, let's even make sure
Speaker 2: that you're even the dad, and he goes, well, no,
Speaker 2: she said, I'm the only person that she was with
Speaker 2: for a long time. But he couldn't handle the news
Speaker 2: of like being a father at sixteen with this guy
Speaker 2: I like with this woman, and I can't imagine everything
Speaker 2: he's going through. And so because of all the stress,
Speaker 2: he started flunking classes. He had to go to summer
Speaker 2: school and that's where he met Mallory and they were
Speaker 2: in love. And so he is now learning that Stanton
Speaker 2: is who told her parents and that's why she lied
Speaker 2: and said that he was schizophrenic, and so he's like, no,
Speaker 2: I was crazy and Benson's like, no, you felt crazy
Speaker 2: because of the meds she put you on, well she
Speaker 2: you know, and she's shoveling. She uses the word shoveling
Speaker 2: down your throat, which I don't know. I like that
Speaker 2: as a as a term. She says sternly and clearly,
Speaker 2: you are not the sick one here.
Speaker 1: She is.
Speaker 2: So now we hear her voice saying it's the most
Speaker 2: healthy relationship she's ever been in. Huang is like, oh,
Speaker 2: so you have bad relationships with men, and she admits
Speaker 2: that she used to be drawn to psychologically abusive men
Speaker 2: until Andrew a child, and she says she would never
Speaker 2: do anything to hurt him, and Finn's like, oh, except
Speaker 2: break up him and Mallory, and she goes, Andrew is
Speaker 2: sick and I was protecting that girl and him, and
Speaker 2: Finn goes, no, you were jealous of a fifteen year
Speaker 2: old that he dumped you for. She screams, he didn't
Speaker 2: dump me, Andhuang goes, well, yeah, not for long, because
Speaker 2: then you drugged him and had him locked up, and
Speaker 2: Finn goes, that's the only way he would have sex
Speaker 2: with you, and she's offended. She goes, not true, and
Speaker 2: she calls Andrew delusional, and Finn goes, wow, that's not
Speaker 2: really like a nice way to talk about the father
Speaker 2: of your child. And then Huang starts talking, and she
Speaker 2: flips her head from Finn to Huang with eyes wide open,
Speaker 2: tears streaming down, and he says to her, you used
Speaker 2: his deepest issues against him. Finn says, and now his
Speaker 2: mother has to help raise this child when you go away,
Speaker 2: and she goes, I'm not going anywhere, and it's like,
Speaker 2: who's delusional now, and Huang's like, oh, we got a
Speaker 2: paternity test, and if it proves that Andrew's the father,
Speaker 2: then you're going to jail for statutory rape. She exclaims
Speaker 2: that it wasn't rape and that they love each other,
Speaker 2: and Huang slowly says, you took advantage of a child. No,
Speaker 2: she screams, while more tears emerged. You don't understand. Andrew
Speaker 2: is a man. He is my soulmate. And Finn looks
Speaker 2: at her in the best face he's ever made in
Speaker 2: the history of this whole show. Make it a meme.
Speaker 1: He has so many good faces.
Speaker 2: But it's like Popeye, confused judgment, like you crazy bitch,
Speaker 2: Like I love this space, and so now we go straight.
Speaker 2: Since Supreme Court allocution and is judge to say Lewis
Speaker 2: Lois Lois. She's like, so you understand that allocuting and
Speaker 2: open court about the crimes you've committed. That means you
Speaker 2: agree to plead guilty in exchange for a lesser sentence.
Speaker 2: And she does understand that. And the grandma's now holding
Speaker 2: the baby, and it's like, did we have to bring
Speaker 2: the baby to court?
Speaker 1: Like? Yeah, you couldn't get a sit like the baby
Speaker 1: had to be sitting in court.
Speaker 2: Doubt they even allow that. Finn is sitting next to
Speaker 2: the grandma. Doctor Stanton turns to Andrew and says, I
Speaker 2: never meant to hurt you, and everything I did I
Speaker 2: did out of love. And he's listening and sitting next
Speaker 2: to Mallory, and I will say, this is not an allocution.
Speaker 2: You're supposed to say exactly what you did and how
Speaker 2: you did it, and this is like any manipulation tactic, right,
Speaker 2: So he won't look at her, and then he finally
Speaker 2: sighiyes her and she calls him a boy that she
Speaker 2: wanted to protect and heal, but then she fell in
Speaker 2: love with him. She says that she tried to deny
Speaker 2: her feelings but they were too strong, and she just
Speaker 2: you know, she knew that he felt it too.
Speaker 1: He nods slowly and slightly.
Speaker 2: She says, the first time they were together was the
Speaker 2: happiest moment of my life. She says, I know I'm
Speaker 2: guilty of things that many people can't understand, but I
Speaker 2: want you to know that I'm sorry if I ever
Speaker 2: hurt you, and I hope you can forgive me. She
Speaker 2: cries and nods, or does he I don't know. So
Speaker 2: he's pained and confused and troubled, and again he looks down.
Speaker 2: The people agreed to the plea bargain. So it's four
Speaker 2: consecutive counts of rape in the second degree, jail of
Speaker 2: five years for each count. So she is going to
Speaker 2: prison for twenty years. And Lois hates her ass and
Speaker 2: she says, you abuse your professional relationship with this boy
Speaker 2: in the most contemptible way. If I could, I would
Speaker 2: put you away for life. Gavel, Gavel. She's carried out
Speaker 2: by the bailiffs while screaming I will wait for you.
Speaker 1: Andrew.
Speaker 2: He is so annoyed, but also has so many emotions,
Speaker 2: like he's such a good actor. He's crying, it's like
Speaker 2: paining her, but like he's you know, he was abused,
Speaker 2: he obviously probably has certain connections and feelings, but also
Speaker 2: like dealing with this new abuse, realizing that you know,
Speaker 2: she was the one that had him institutionalized and lied
Speaker 2: about the rape.
Speaker 1: I mean, this is like a lot for this young
Speaker 1: boy to handle.
Speaker 2: He accidentally murdered his friend, like this is so he
Speaker 2: doesn't have schizophrenia right now, we have to raise this
Speaker 2: baby with his mom and Mallory Like what the fuck?
Speaker 1: I know? And it's like also like this doctor did
Speaker 1: not need to have the kid's baby, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, Like it's like you could have away. It's like,
Speaker 1: how do you use He was like, yeah, yeah, totally,
Speaker 1: but whatever. But it's also like full evidence of your
Speaker 1: crime that you're just keeping in your home, living and
Speaker 1: breathing evidence of your crime. Yeah. And so I'm glad
Speaker 1: they gave her twenty years.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and yeah that's dick wolf baby.
Speaker 1: So getting into the true crime of it all, you know,
Speaker 1: some people would say this was based on like the
Speaker 1: Susan Poulk case, which we already covered in the episode
Speaker 1: Dearly Beloved about you know, therapists that have relationships with
Speaker 1: their patients, But we already covered that one so I
Speaker 1: think the first part of this case and this episode
Speaker 1: and the reason why it's called conned is based on
Speaker 1: the Jack character, right, like he's this con man. And
Speaker 1: then I guess you could extrapolate that to say that
Speaker 1: the therapist, the psychiatrist is conning people, but like she's
Speaker 1: really honestly just manipulating and abuse her power. But this
Speaker 1: con man character I think was maybe based on this
Speaker 1: this guy named Christian Karl Gerhardt Streiter, who is one
Speaker 1: of the most famous con men of the modern age.
Speaker 1: And I actually read a long Vanity Fair article about
Speaker 1: this man back in two thousand and eight when this happened,
Speaker 1: and this all happened like this, I mean, it all
Speaker 1: happened over decades, but you know, it culminated in two
Speaker 1: thousand and eight, and I read this article back then,
Speaker 1: and I think it was before even a second piece
Speaker 1: of the case came forward. And so I'll get into it,
Speaker 1: but I think this connects to kind of Jack, the
Speaker 1: like sort of wonderkin khn man who's like, you know,
Speaker 1: starting scamming from a young age and just like scamming
Speaker 1: to a level that people that is kind of unbelievable.
Speaker 1: So Christian Karl Gerhardt Stwriter was born and raised in Germany,
Speaker 1: and then in nineteen seventy eight, when he was about
Speaker 1: seventeen or eighteen, he met an American couple that was
Speaker 1: traveling there and they said, oh, come and see us
Speaker 1: in the States if you're ever over in the States,
Speaker 1: and then he used that as an opportunity to go
Speaker 1: to the States, like he listed this couple on his
Speaker 1: visa and he went and stayed with them in Meriden, Connecticut,
Speaker 1: before ending up in Berlin, Connecticut, home of Louandela SEPs
Speaker 1: with the Savio family, and the Savios said that he
Speaker 1: told them he was an exchange student, but it came
Speaker 1: very clear that there was like something off about this guy,
Speaker 1: Like he would sleep on their couch, but he would
Speaker 1: wake up in the morning like expecting breakfast to be
Speaker 1: made for him, expecting his clothes to be washed and
Speaker 1: pressed for him, like he was some kind of aristocrat.
Speaker 1: And they were like, get the fuck out of here.
Speaker 1: So they kicked him out, and his next stop is Wisconsin.
Speaker 1: He gets to like Milwaukee, and he enrolls in a
Speaker 1: college class at the University of Wisconsin Milwaukee, and then
Speaker 1: he's like, you know what, I got to become a citizen, Like,
Speaker 1: I'm not going to get any further if I'm not
Speaker 1: a citizen. So he marries this American girl to get
Speaker 1: a green car in nineteen eighty one, leaves her the
Speaker 1: day after the wedding, okay, and he's like, thank you
Speaker 1: so much for the card, bye, like Mary J. Taylor. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I guess this is like pre the movie Green
Speaker 1: Card and all of the shit that has to go
Speaker 1: down for you to get a green card. But this
Speaker 1: guy got a green card pretty easily, I guess. And
Speaker 1: for some reason, she did not file for divorce until
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety two, even though he left her in nineteen
Speaker 1: eighty one, so I don't know why eleven years went by.
Speaker 1: But he goes out to California to get into the
Speaker 1: entertainment industry, and out there he adopts the alias Christopher Chichester,
Speaker 1: and he goes around telling people in town that he
Speaker 1: was in the British aristocracy. He like, uh, he's auditing
Speaker 1: classes at USC. He knows a lot about cinema. He's
Speaker 1: like telling people like there's people that they interview in
Speaker 1: this Vanity Fair article that are like he told me, like,
Speaker 1: come to this party, you're gonna meet George Lucas and
Speaker 1: Steven Spielberg and all these people, and like they were
Speaker 1: all there and they all knew who he was. Like,
Speaker 1: so he was able to like ingratiate himself into all
Speaker 1: of with all of these people, like truly one of
Speaker 1: these like very gifted con men. Right, he feel like
Speaker 1: you have to have charisma to be a con man,
Speaker 1: right or yeah, truly not seen at all. Yes, you
Speaker 1: have to either be silent or beloved. Yes, you have
Speaker 1: to be like sort of the one that everyone in
Speaker 1: the room is watching, so that no one suspects anything,
Speaker 1: or you're like literally camouflaged into the background. So he
Speaker 1: flirted with rich old ladies. He snuck into members only clubs.
Speaker 1: Eventually he started living in the guesthouse of a woman
Speaker 1: named Ruth Dede sohas in San Marino, which is an
Speaker 1: area I've been too many times. It's right next to Pasadena.
Speaker 1: It's a very beautiful neighborhood. I guess at the time
Speaker 1: they said that there were three times of San Marino.
Speaker 1: There was like the ultra rich, the medium rich, and
Speaker 1: then like the low and I guess Dedie lived in
Speaker 1: kind of like the low shitty part of it. But
Speaker 1: still a nice neighborhood to anyone. And she was also,
Speaker 1: according to Vanity fair quote known to everyone as a
Speaker 1: reclusive alcoholic. So he's living in her guest house. God
Speaker 1: knows if he's siphoning money from her or what even
Speaker 1: paying to live in the guest house, who knows. But
Speaker 1: eventually her son Jonathan and his wife Linda moved back
Speaker 1: in with d and Jonathan is immediately suspicious, like who
Speaker 1: the fuck is this guy? And he's worried that that
Speaker 1: this guy is like, you know, somehow taking advantage of
Speaker 1: his mother. Then in nineteen eighty five, Linda and Jonathan
Speaker 1: disappear and Gerhart Streider was a person of interest, but
Speaker 1: he claimed, oh no, they're in Europe and they did
Speaker 1: get two postcards like stamped from France from parents. Is
Speaker 1: this show? I will never trust the postcard? I know this.
Speaker 1: This is Call me on the phone, call me on FaceTime.
Speaker 1: I need to see you, Like I'm not even like
Speaker 1: with AI, I'm not even taking a phone call. I'm
Speaker 1: not taking a message on my voicemail, you know. And yeah,
Speaker 1: especially after that's what happened with what's his name, who's
Speaker 1: the who's the psycho? Rudnick, Rudnick. That's what with Rudnick,
Speaker 1: he sent the postcard. Okay, so in late nineteen eighty eight.
Speaker 1: But same with Titus will Willifer. What's his name you well, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: oh yes, he did the same thing exactly in the
Speaker 1: in the Nanny w Yeah. Oh my got him at
Speaker 1: my parents' house. So much bosh talk. Anyway, in late
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty eight, a man named Christopher Crowe is pulled
Speaker 1: over in Greenwich, Connecticut driving a truck that belongs to
Speaker 1: Jonathan Sohus, but he fled the area before the cops
Speaker 1: could talk to him. So Chichester, slash, Gerhard Strid, they're
Speaker 1: all the same person, right, Christopher Crowe. He is living
Speaker 1: in Greenwich, Connecticut at this time. He is fitting in perfectly.
Speaker 1: He dresses the part he wears like silk ascots. He
Speaker 1: speaks like an aristocrat, custom clothing, like he's got everything's
Speaker 1: embossed with like his initials and shit. He told everyone
Speaker 1: he was a film producer in la and sure enough
Speaker 1: people that would look it up. There was a guy
Speaker 1: named Christopher Crowe who worked on Hitchcock movies. So he
Speaker 1: you know, he researches his backstories before he like takes
Speaker 1: over people's identities and stuff. He gets hired somehow through
Speaker 1: hobnobbing in Greenwich at a fancy financial firm to do tech.
Speaker 1: But he would like go on the trading floor and
Speaker 1: just name drop and tell stories all day long, and
Speaker 1: until someone checked his social security number and apparently it's
Speaker 1: the same social security number as David Berkowitz, who was
Speaker 1: the son of Sam Killer. Oh so it's like he's
Speaker 1: not David Berkowitz. But it's like, why are you using
Speaker 1: that social Like I don't know. Crazy. So he loses
Speaker 1: the job. Then he just gets another job on Wall
Speaker 1: Street that he is insanely unqualified for. Like he's supposed
Speaker 1: to like lead this huge bond market. He's like never
Speaker 1: sold a bond in his life. Catch me if you
Speaker 1: can truly truly like to that. From coast to.
Speaker 2: Coast, different people, different things, Like it's really wild.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's like, I mean it's Annadelvi. It's like,
Speaker 1: you know, there's certain people that are to a level
Speaker 1: with this. He doesn't. He gets this job on Wall Street.
Speaker 1: He's unqualified. He has no real work experience at all.
Speaker 1: He doesn't even have a college degree at this point,
Speaker 1: and most of these jobs, like he talks his way
Speaker 1: into he obviously just like hobnobbed into them. He eventually
Speaker 1: gets fired from that job, but at this point he
Speaker 1: knows that Connecticut authorities are kind of looking for him
Speaker 1: because of the truck. So he quits and he says,
Speaker 1: I've got to leave the country, like and the story
Speaker 1: is always like my parents have fallen ill in Afghanistan
Speaker 1: or something like. The stories are always wild for why
Speaker 1: he has to go. A few years go by where
Speaker 1: he's kind of unaccounted for and nobody really kind of
Speaker 1: know what's up with him. He's just like lays low,
Speaker 1: and then the big con arrives. Okay. He reservices in
Speaker 1: New York City around ninety two ninety three as a
Speaker 1: physicist slash art dealer slash mathematician named Clark Rockefeller. And
Speaker 1: he doesn't necessarily tell people he's part of the Rockefeller family,
Speaker 1: but he he name drops like people from the family,
Speaker 1: so everyone's like, oh, yeah, he's in the family, so
Speaker 1: very quickly people start to know who he is around
Speaker 1: New York society. He has a Gordon Setter, which I
Speaker 1: don't even know what kind of dog that is, but
Speaker 1: I guess it's kind of a fancy dog and the
Speaker 1: dog the dog's name is Yates, which I thought was
Speaker 1: a nice little SVU tie in. And then he also
Speaker 1: somehow has a multimillion dollar art collection. He's got a
Speaker 1: mandre on, a Pollock, a Si Twombly, like, he's got
Speaker 1: what's a mandre on my fave. Yeah, he's got nice
Speaker 1: ass art. But this one woman that they interviewed for
Speaker 1: the article said she went over to his house because
Speaker 1: she was an art like an art dealer, and like,
Speaker 1: these multimillion dollar paintings are just like on the floor
Speaker 1: leaning against the wall, you know what I mean. Like
Speaker 1: he hasn't even had them professionally hung. Like it's it's
Speaker 1: like weird. And he used I guess he did this
Speaker 1: in Greenwich also, but he does this in New York City.
Speaker 1: He uses the church to gain access to society. So
Speaker 1: he goes to Saint Thomas Church, which apparently is like
Speaker 1: the main Episcopalian church. It's probably where bigs Mom goes
Speaker 1: in that episode, but I'm not going to fact check it.
Speaker 1: But you know the episode where Carrie goes to church,
Speaker 1: so and through the church he meets Julia Boss and
Speaker 1: she thinks he's so charming and amazing. Why don't you
Speaker 1: meet my twin sister, Sandra Sandra Boss, who is a
Speaker 1: Stanford grad who is currently getting her MBA at Harvard
Speaker 1: at this time. So to meet her, he throws a
Speaker 1: clue themed party. Okay, he throws a full clue themed
Speaker 1: murdermis street party. He's Professor Plum, she's Miss Scarlett. They
Speaker 1: are immediately attracted to one another, and people say she's
Speaker 1: a little bit weird too, Like she's very smart. She
Speaker 1: ends up getting a really good job at McKinsey, which
Speaker 1: is like a big consulting firm, and like making a
Speaker 1: ton of money. But she's not very good with people,
Speaker 1: and he's like kind of eccentric and like and wild
Speaker 1: and so like they sort of was like they sort
Speaker 1: of work together. So they eventually get married. They live
Speaker 1: in New York, where, like I said, she's making a
Speaker 1: ton of money. He says that he's working with third
Speaker 1: world countries helping to solve their economic problems and teaching
Speaker 1: them how much money to print or something like that,
Speaker 1: and since their third world countries, he can't really charge them.
Speaker 1: He sort of makes people think that he's living off
Speaker 1: of family money or whatever. But eventually he's living off
Speaker 1: of Sandra's money, right, so that he's able to keep
Speaker 1: up this ruse even to a higher degree. In two thousand,
Speaker 1: Sandra leaves him because he's been emotionally and she says,
Speaker 1: occasionally physically abusive, but he wins her back. He transforms
Speaker 1: into the old Clark, and then in that time that
Speaker 1: they're back together, he gets her pregnant. So soon after
Speaker 1: they find out that she's pregnant, he demands, I want
Speaker 1: to get out of New York City. Let's move to
Speaker 1: New Hampshire. So they moved to Cornish, New Hampshire, which
Speaker 1: I guess is also sort of I've never heard of it,
Speaker 1: but I guess it's also sort of blue blood, like, like,
Speaker 1: you know, nice part of New Hampshire. Not all of
Speaker 1: New Hampshire's beautiful, but like, you know, fancy. And so
Speaker 1: in two thousand and one their daughter is born. Her
Speaker 1: name is Ray I think it's for r. Eig H
Speaker 1: Ray Storo Mills, Rockefeller, and she's born in two thousand
Speaker 1: and one at Dartmouth Hitchcock, which is where I got
Speaker 1: my stitches, the only stitches I have on my body.
Speaker 1: My only scar is from Dartmouth Hitchcock Hospital. It's right
Speaker 1: near where my camp is. So they call the daughter Snooks.
Speaker 1: So in two thousand and six, so he did this
Speaker 1: crazy thing in New Hampshire also where he went into
Speaker 1: a town hall meeting and they were about to demolish
Speaker 1: a church and he just held up a check for
Speaker 1: one hundred and ten thousand dollars and was like, I'll
Speaker 1: buy the church, and everybody was like, mouths were like
Speaker 1: on the ground because I guess you know, people were like,
Speaker 1: what the fuck. So they have this historic house that
Speaker 1: they've bought in New Hampshire. He's gutted it and left
Speaker 1: all these renovations happening, and then he buys this church
Speaker 1: that he wants to restore or something. But they moved
Speaker 1: to Boston, leaving the church behind, leaving this house that
Speaker 1: never got fully renovated behind. And it's so Snooks can
Speaker 1: go to a private school in Boston. Up until then,
Speaker 1: he'd been homeschooling her. So they moved to Beacon Hill,
Speaker 1: which you and I have been to Beacon Hill to
Speaker 1: where my friend Julia. We went to my friend Julia's
Speaker 1: mom's house. But my friend Julia lives right near where
Speaker 1: they bought this house. So I texted her and I
Speaker 1: was like, did you know this whole Clark Rockefeller and
Speaker 1: his wife Sandra Boss And she was like, yes, my
Speaker 1: mom knows her liked. I was like, of course, of
Speaker 1: course there's a connect. Anyway, I just thought it was crazy.
Speaker 1: She was like, yeah, my mom was on a board
Speaker 1: with her. The mom the wife was nice. They didn't
Speaker 1: you know, I don't think she had a ton of
Speaker 1: interaction with the con man. So, like the character in
Speaker 1: this episode, this guy is extremely smart. Okay, he knows
Speaker 1: a lot about history art, He can do accents, he
Speaker 1: can memorize long pieces of literature, he could play the
Speaker 1: digeridoo like he's kind of like a savant. He can
Speaker 1: like kind of do anything. And I think that helps
Speaker 1: you convince people that you have this background that you
Speaker 1: don't have. And so because like the didurid is extremely
Speaker 1: hard to play. You have to like no circular breathing
Speaker 1: to like play it. It's like not just like I
Speaker 1: can tickle the ivories a little bit and play a
Speaker 1: couple of songs. But Sandra was kind of finally figuring
Speaker 1: this out, Like as they get to Boston and whatever,
Speaker 1: she's sort of figuring out like that he's not like
Speaker 1: what he seems, and she hires a PI in two
Speaker 1: thousand and six who confirm that he is not who
Speaker 1: he says he is. He agrees to a divorce, surrendering
Speaker 1: surrendering custody of Snooks for eight hundred thousand dollars, two cars,
Speaker 1: her engagement ring and address he'd given her, plus she
Speaker 1: agrees to no further investigation into his identity, so he
Speaker 1: gives up all. He gives up like basically custody of
Speaker 1: his daughter for eight hundred k some cars, on a ring,
Speaker 1: and address, and also to not get busted in July
Speaker 1: of two thousand and eight, so now they're divorced as
Speaker 1: of two thousand and seven. In July two thousand and eight,
Speaker 1: he's on a supervised visit with Snooks with a social
Speaker 1: worker and suv pulls up alongside them on Marlborough Street.
Speaker 1: He shoves the social worker out of the way, throws
Speaker 1: his daughter in the car, gets in and tells the
Speaker 1: driver to speed off. The social worker is hanging on
Speaker 1: to the side of the car. Okay, this is like
Speaker 1: everything about this story is like a movie, and I
Speaker 1: don't really understand why one hasn't been made yet. Like
Speaker 1: we're optioning magazine articles all the time. I don't know
Speaker 1: why this one's like not happening, but everyone is looking
Speaker 1: for them for five days. And this is where my
Speaker 1: friend Julia, she goes. It was really scary when he
Speaker 1: kidnapped his daughter because they locked down, like her whole neighborhood.
Speaker 1: They locked down Beacon Hill, they locked down Back Bay
Speaker 1: like looking for this girl. But he got out of
Speaker 1: the city and everybody was looking for them for like
Speaker 1: five days. She's missing with him until they finally get
Speaker 1: a tip that they were spotted in Baltimore and that
Speaker 1: he's just put down like four hundred k cash for
Speaker 1: some apartment, some carriage house in Baltimore, and this time
Speaker 1: he's going by chip Smith. So they lure him out
Speaker 1: of his apartment because they didn't want to burst into
Speaker 1: the apartment and like in danger of the child. They
Speaker 1: lure him out by calling him and say your boat
Speaker 1: at the marina is taking on water, and he goes,
Speaker 1: I'll be right there. When he comes out, they grab him,
Speaker 1: so they arrest him. Snooks goes back to her mom.
Speaker 1: They moved to London. Clark tries to plead insanity in
Speaker 1: his case, and he was found guilty of kidnapping and
Speaker 1: assault and battery with a dangerous weapon because of how
Speaker 1: he assaults the social worker essentially, and I guess she
Speaker 1: was dragged for a little bit. He got four to
Speaker 1: five years for the kidnapping and two to three years
Speaker 1: for the assault to be served concurrently. Meanwhile, remember Linda
Speaker 1: and John who went missing so back in May of
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety four, bones that were believed to belong to
Speaker 1: John were found buried in the backyard of their former home.
Speaker 1: But since John had been adopted, I guess they couldn't
Speaker 1: compare DNA to his family members and identify the bones.
Speaker 1: And forensic evidence showed that the victim had been struck
Speaker 1: in the head two times with a rounded blunt object
Speaker 1: and then stabbed six times, and the body had been
Speaker 1: cut into three parts. And a nighbour claims that Christopher
Speaker 1: Chichester as who he was back in San Marino, had
Speaker 1: borrowed his chainsaw or maybe he was crow at that time. Whatever.
Speaker 1: A neighbor claims that this guy had borrowed his chainsaw
Speaker 1: around that time, and the bones were not conclusively determined
Speaker 1: to belong to Sohus until twenty ten. So in March
Speaker 1: of twenty eleven, I think once they conclusively confirmed that
Speaker 1: it's this guy, La County prosecutors charge Chichester Slash Crow
Speaker 1: Slash Rockefeller aka Gerhartstreiter with Jonathan's murder. Linda's remains were
Speaker 1: never found, and that's crazy, Like his lawyers tried to
Speaker 1: argue that maybe she killed Jonathan and disappeared because apparently
Speaker 1: they were like an odd couple. But it went on trial.
Speaker 1: It went to trial in twenty thirteen, and this guy
Speaker 1: was convicted of first degree murder and the evidence was
Speaker 1: mostly circumstantial. But when they did find the remains, the
Speaker 1: skull of this body was wrapped in two different plastic bags.
Speaker 1: One is from the University of Wisconsin, Milwaukee, the other
Speaker 1: is from USC two places where he had gone and
Speaker 1: either taken or audited classes. So it was presented at
Speaker 1: trial also that he had the couple's pickup truck, Like
Speaker 1: that doesn't make any sense. So he got the max
Speaker 1: prison sentence of twenty seven years to life. He somehow
Speaker 1: appealed and got like one year knocked off of it.
Speaker 1: But he's eligible for parole in December of twenty twenty nine,
Speaker 1: which is yes, he can't be trusted. No, So I
Speaker 1: don't know how he's eligible for parole after sixteen years
Speaker 1: because it went to trial in twenty thirteen. But he'll
Speaker 1: be sixty eight when he gets out, and he will
Speaker 1: completely keep scamming. He's currently at San Quentin prison where
Speaker 1: he paints and has an absolutely wild artist statement on
Speaker 1: his page like on like like there's this page of
Speaker 1: all the artists at the jail where they make up
Speaker 1: their their own like art and like they're obviously writing
Speaker 1: about themselves in their own style, and he talks about
Speaker 1: himself like he's one of the greats and he's like
Speaker 1: some people draw inspiration from others, not this guy. He
Speaker 1: is a completely original thinker. It's so crazy because it's
Speaker 1: like literally your whole life has been copying and mimicking
Speaker 1: and like you know, but on this website he and
Speaker 1: in prison as an artist, he goes by C. K.
Speaker 1: Gerhardt Striter aka the artist formerly known as Clark Rockefeller,
Speaker 1: like aka ta fka Clark Rockefeller the way that it's
Speaker 1: like fka twigs, Like that's what he goes by, So
Speaker 1: a wild wild Uh, people buying his art, I don't know.
Speaker 1: You can look at it and tell me if you
Speaker 1: think it's any good. I also want to know, like
Speaker 1: where he got these works, because it was never proven
Speaker 1: that the works he had were fake, like his artworks
Speaker 1: that he had, and that was like a major way
Speaker 1: that he like conned people, is that he had these
Speaker 1: amazing artworks that people said were that experts said were real.
Speaker 1: So I don't know. Maybe they were eventually proven fake
Speaker 1: with like more technology, but like in the two thousands,
Speaker 1: people were like, no, this is real, Like he's got
Speaker 1: amandre on and all these and he was buying all
Speaker 1: these like upcoming artists. He was buying expensive paintings. But
Speaker 1: then eventually he was using his wife's money for that.
Speaker 1: So but I don't know how he originally had the artwork.
Speaker 1: And you know, some people were commenting on our episode
Speaker 1: that we did about the art heist, you know, the
Speaker 1: art heives one that like some that I guess people
Speaker 1: do a lot of like bartering in the black market
Speaker 1: for this kind of art, because I was like, what
Speaker 1: are you going to do with this? But I guess
Speaker 1: also they were saying people use it as a bargaining
Speaker 1: chip if they get arrested. They're like, but I can
Speaker 1: tell you where this like famous painting is as like
Speaker 1: a way to get like a deal. Wow. Cool, So
Speaker 1: I thought that was interesting since we're talking about art anyway.
Speaker 1: This episode also obviously has a lot of Mary Kay
Speaker 1: Latourno in it. I originally wasn't going to cover this
Speaker 1: one because I thought I thought that the episode Impulsive
Speaker 1: was more the one with Melissa Joan Hart, but that
Speaker 1: one is actually more connected to a different crime because
Speaker 1: like what happens in Impulsive is not what we think
Speaker 1: even though we think it's like a member. It's like
Speaker 1: in that one, the kid is like sex obsessed and
Speaker 1: he like he like basically assaults his teacher. So it's
Speaker 1: not like an affair. Sadly, I found a case in
Speaker 1: Minnesota and another one, one case from twenty nineteen and
Speaker 1: one case from twenty twenty four that is exactly the
Speaker 1: case of a therapist like molesting raping their young male client.
Speaker 1: But unfortunately another case of SBU predicting the future. So
Speaker 1: I think definitely they're talking about Mary Kay Laturno here.
Speaker 1: The way she reacts like we're in love, we're in life,
Speaker 1: it's definitely Mary Kay. So this case, I feel like
Speaker 1: we all know about it. But I'll just go through
Speaker 1: it really quickly. This case was like the punchline of
Speaker 1: my youth. Like when this happened, I was like in
Speaker 1: high school. It was like every late night show, like
Speaker 1: everybody talked about this all the time. And then you
Speaker 1: know more most recently, the movie May December is like
Speaker 1: loosely based on this case. But if you, for some
Speaker 1: reason actually have no idea what that name is, I
Speaker 1: will tell you. Mary Kay Latourneau was a teacher and
Speaker 1: a mother of four who was unhappy in her marriage.
Speaker 1: In nineteen ninety one when she met a second grader
Speaker 1: named Villie Flau. He was in second grade when she
Speaker 1: met him, and then after second grade she would like
Speaker 1: encourage his art and encourage his creative like pursuits and stuff.
Speaker 1: And then in nineteen ninety five ninety six school year,
Speaker 1: she ended up being his sixth grade teacher. So he's twelve,
Speaker 1: and at that time her life is not going great.
Speaker 1: Her marriage is hanging on by a thread. She's just
Speaker 1: had like a miscarriage that's really shaken her. So in
Speaker 1: June of nineteen ninety six, she rapes Relly Falau when
Speaker 1: he's twelve and she's is thirty four and even the
Speaker 1: Wikipedia calls it statutory rape, which I don't understand because
Speaker 1: if he's not old enough to consent, like, it doesn't
Speaker 1: really matter if he says I wanted it, if he's twelve,
Speaker 1: you know, like I statutory to me is like you're eighteen,
Speaker 1: another person's fifteen, and it's like you're in a relationship,
Speaker 1: but it's not allowed because it's statutory. Like I don't
Speaker 1: think at twelve you're allowed to be like, no, no,
Speaker 1: I wanted it, Like I don't know, this doesn't feel
Speaker 1: like maybe it was the thing. May it was a deal,
Speaker 1: I guess. But they do it in the episode too.
Speaker 1: They were like, you're guilty of satutory rape. And it's like,
Speaker 1: if she started having sex with him when he was thirteen,
Speaker 1: if she started i'm sorry, sexually assaulting him when he
Speaker 1: was thirteen, how is that statutory rape? Like to me,
Speaker 1: just because he's like, yeah, it was kind of awesome,
Speaker 1: Like I don't know, that doesn't that shouldn't change it.
Speaker 1: To me, I'd be like, that's that's the first degree.
Speaker 1: But she later told Oprah Winfrey that she considered Ville
Speaker 1: to be quote the love of my life. In September
Speaker 1: of nineteen ninety six, three months after the abuse began,
Speaker 1: she found out that she was pregnant with this twelve
Speaker 1: year old student's child. So much like the episode UH.
Speaker 1: In nineteen ninety seven, she was arrested because a member
Speaker 1: of her husband's family called in a tip and was like,
Speaker 1: you got a this woman is doing something bad. She
Speaker 1: was arrested and found guilty of two counts of second
Speaker 1: degree rape of a child. She made a deal with
Speaker 1: prosecutors that instead of taking the seven and a half
Speaker 1: year sentence, she would do six months with three months suspended.
Speaker 1: Butt would have to have no contact with Billy Fillau
Speaker 1: for the rest of her life. And she agreed and
Speaker 1: said this was a mistake and it will never happen again.
Speaker 1: But after she completed her three month prison sentence, very
Speaker 1: quickly after she's on parole, she gets busted in a
Speaker 1: car with Billy Filau, like I remember this happening. I
Speaker 1: was like, oh my god, this woman, like what the fuck?
Speaker 1: And the judges livid, much like Lois. The judge is
Speaker 1: livid and reinstates her original seven and a half year sentence. Okay.
Speaker 1: During this sentence, she gives birth to his second child
Speaker 1: that she has been impregnated with during her parole. So
Speaker 1: now they have two daughters. And she's in prison from
Speaker 1: ninety eight to two thousand and four, and she also
Speaker 1: did six months in solitary during that time for continually
Speaker 1: trying to contact Falau. So like even in prison, it's
Speaker 1: like you're in prison and there's a no contact order
Speaker 1: and you're still trying. Like so when she got out,
Speaker 1: they got the no contact order lifted. They got married
Speaker 1: in May of two thousand and five, when she's forty
Speaker 1: three and he's twenty one. They got married at a
Speaker 1: winery and two hundred people were there. I'm like, there's
Speaker 1: two hundred people that were like, we're down with this.
Speaker 1: Here we come. You know, I'm surprised. I thought they
Speaker 1: would be like they got married at a courthouse, you know,
Speaker 1: like two hundred people were like, we are coming to
Speaker 1: the Laturnau Fullau wedding and we are going to throw down.
Speaker 1: They were married for fourteen years. They rarely appeared in public,
Speaker 1: but they did do a hot for Teacher night at
Speaker 1: a club in Seattle where she hosted and he DJed.
Speaker 1: He spent a few years in Seattle area djying under
Speaker 1: the name DJ headline. But then they started having marital
Speaker 1: problems in twenty seventeen. They separated in twenty nineteen, and
Speaker 1: then she died of colon cancer in twenty twenty at
Speaker 1: the age of fifty eight. She actually had like a
Speaker 1: very aggressive stage four cancer that like I think she
Speaker 1: was diagnosed and died within like six or seven months.
Speaker 1: So a friend close to Falau told People magazine that
Speaker 1: after she died, he lost a piece of himself. He
Speaker 1: understands how fucked up everything was in how they got together.
Speaker 1: He's not stupid, but he can't turn off his feelings completely,
Speaker 1: and it's a big loss for him. He talked to
Speaker 1: her right before she passed, and they said everything they
Speaker 1: needed to say. End quote. So that's the story. I mean,
Speaker 1: if you watch the movie made December, obviously it's loosely based,
Speaker 1: but you know, it's kind of like, yeah, you can't
Speaker 1: turn off the way you were feeling. But it's just
Speaker 1: like you shouldn't have even been exposed to like that
Speaker 1: relationship at that age, with that, with those circumstances, you know.
Speaker 1: And so I don't know, he's got two kids with
Speaker 1: Mary Kay. He just had another kid with someone else.
Speaker 1: His daughters now I think are having kids. So he's
Speaker 1: a grandfather, but you know he's like in his thirties now, damn,
Speaker 1: he's still so young. I know. I know he's like
Speaker 1: a thirty something grandfather, but that's because he was a
Speaker 1: thirteen year old dad. Like it's so, I don't know,
Speaker 1: it's not good, but yeah, did you see me December? No,
Speaker 1: it's interesting, Like Julian Moore's really good. Uh and yeah,
Speaker 1: it's interesting. The guy who plays Billy Flow's kind of
Speaker 1: character is good to it'sird. He goes to my acting teacher.
Speaker 1: Oh really, Yeah, he's hot. Hot, he's really hot. But
Speaker 1: like he like he has a relationship with his kids
Speaker 1: that are teenagers. That's wild because they're so close in age,
Speaker 1: like they're not you know, damn yeah, Like I hang
Speaker 1: out with comics every day who are the age difference
Speaker 1: of me and of Mary Kay of him and his kids,
Speaker 1: like thirteen years difference. You know, Like I hang out
Speaker 1: with people all the time that are like in their
Speaker 1: twenties early thirties. I'm like, wow, like I could you
Speaker 1: could be my child if things went really badly. But yeah,
Speaker 1: so it's funny that they did this because it feels
Speaker 1: like they hint at Mary Kay in other episodes, But
Speaker 1: this all went down in like the late nineties, you know,
Speaker 1: like ninety seven ninety eight is when this was all
Speaker 1: kind of going down. And they did this episode in
Speaker 1: twenty ten, but I guess, and that's five years after
Speaker 1: they got married, after she fit like finished her whole
Speaker 1: prison sentence. So it's interesting that the show decided to
Speaker 1: dip back into somebody being that in love with a
Speaker 1: teenager when there's a huge power imbalance and illegality. But
Speaker 1: teens are just so annoying. It's like, what what are
Speaker 1: you in love with? Like I remember Amy Poehler and
Speaker 1: Tina Feye did like a weekend update about like after
Speaker 1: another female teacher got busted, like you know, essaying a
Speaker 1: student and was like and they were like, yeah, it's
Speaker 1: just like his breath always smells like Dorito's, Like you know,
Speaker 1: it's like, what is it that you're loving? Like I don't.
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously it's a control thing and it's mental
Speaker 1: it's a mental illness thing or of some sort, because yeah,
Speaker 1: it can't be I don't think it's just like I
Speaker 1: think it's also like she was in this bad marriage.
Speaker 1: She didn't like her husband, and then she's like, oh,
Speaker 1: this is this like a nice person, and it's like
Speaker 1: but it's it's a child like but you know, and
Speaker 1: that's it seems like this woman in the episode said
Speaker 1: she went for psychologically abusive people and then she's like, Oh,
Speaker 1: I can go with somebody that I can literally medicate
Speaker 1: into oblivion and they can just be a little blob
Speaker 1: hanging out with me. But that's that. We have an
Speaker 1: amazing guest, so don't go anywhere. Our guest today is
Speaker 1: an actor who you may know from several classic movies
Speaker 1: from the nineties, including Universal Soldiers, Singles While You Were
Speaker 1: Sleeping Kazam. But you know her best as the abuse
Speaker 1: of psychiatrist doctor Franz Stanton. Please enjoy our hilarious conversation
Speaker 1: with Alie Walker. Alie, really, doctor, this is so cool
Speaker 1: to me. You nice, doctor Stanton. You're out of jail
Speaker 1: and waiting a long time, so true.
Speaker 4: I'm off with good behavior. I didn't have sex with
Speaker 4: any of the young watchers.
Speaker 1: No, but I bet your home she gets out and
Speaker 1: tries to find him.
Speaker 4: She will, she will, Yeah, I love her child.
Speaker 1: Well. We talked about how it was like based on
Speaker 1: Mary Kay Latourneau and like she could have she could
Speaker 1: have only done three months in jail, and she went
Speaker 1: back to jail for six years because she couldn't seven years,
Speaker 1: because she couldn't stop.
Speaker 4: Well love, true love. It's so weird. It just creeped
Speaker 4: me out.
Speaker 1: That I even yeah, wait, tell us, tell us. When
Speaker 1: you got the script, were you like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: this is crazy, or were you like, oh, I'm going
Speaker 1: to play this delusional criminal. How fun?
Speaker 4: Like I was like, just play crazy, just play crazy,
Speaker 4: Just just play crazy. You'll do Finey.
Speaker 1: Wong's character was suspicious of you right away.
Speaker 4: Always that guy. I really think. I always want to
Speaker 4: go you're playing the result. Okay, stop it right now, because.
Speaker 1: You always knows everyone's it, you know what he does.
Speaker 4: He's really good.
Speaker 1: I was like a mental His characters supposed to almost
Speaker 1: be like a mentalist, like he like kind of just
Speaker 1: like knows.
Speaker 4: He's like, okay, he's just hitting me all the time,
Speaker 4: like what, But he's also so ethical. Oh well, above
Speaker 4: reproach is what I like.
Speaker 1: And did you play her like is she also on
Speaker 1: drugs or no? I'm thinking no, she's just popping him
Speaker 1: a full of them.
Speaker 4: I think she just had to pump him full of
Speaker 4: him to keep the relationship going, because, let's face it,
Speaker 4: he tried to you know, was it Mallory or something.
Speaker 4: I was like, yeah, what's name?
Speaker 1: But it's like, God, don't you want to kind of
Speaker 1: know who the last guy Franz Stanton dated was that.
Speaker 1: This is what she was like, this is the happiest
Speaker 1: day of my life sex with a thirteen year old?
Speaker 1: A thirteen year old?
Speaker 4: Where's the baby? I know's like? I was always like,
Speaker 4: are we going to see the baby? That adds an.
Speaker 2: I've did seeing the baby and poor which is crazy
Speaker 2: that the grandma would break like why bring the baby
Speaker 2: to court?
Speaker 4: And why give it to that woman? I mean, okay,
Speaker 4: I admittedly, but the other one. I was like, why
Speaker 4: do you think he was?
Speaker 1: The way? I had such a watching It's been going
Speaker 1: on for quite a few years. Yeah, is it may
Speaker 1: or is anybody looking?
Speaker 4: Baby's not so true?
Speaker 1: Were you like an SBU watcher before you got apart
Speaker 1: on the show?
Speaker 4: I knew Marishka for a long time for that, and
Speaker 4: you know, I kind of run into her in and
Speaker 4: out of Hollywood and stuff, and I love her. So
Speaker 4: I was thought, you know. Now, I don't really watch
Speaker 4: a lot of TV. It's the weirdest thing I do sometimes.
Speaker 4: But I love that because I knew those guys. So
Speaker 4: it was really fun and I thought it was a
Speaker 4: great show. I loved Dick Wolf shows. He was always
Speaker 4: just like, you know, a great just bump, touch hong,
Speaker 4: touch hounge. Yeah, allow would very carefully get up, go
Speaker 4: make a sandwich, come back and okay, I'm on this part.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 4: You know that's really good. I like, I love the show.
Speaker 4: I mean, I think Risk is amazing.
Speaker 5: And what's the guy's name, her sidekick, residame super maloney stayble,
Speaker 5: He's great. I love that you just called him her sidekick.
Speaker 5: We're very into I don't.
Speaker 1: Mean, you know that's really good.
Speaker 4: Well, you know, we are women, so we have to
Speaker 4: throw it.
Speaker 1: Well. He left the show after twelve seasons, and she
Speaker 1: continues to carry it on her back at season twenty
Speaker 1: seven about to begin, so thank you know, I think
Speaker 1: we can say that she's the giving the more main
Speaker 1: character energy.
Speaker 4: Well let's go there.
Speaker 2: This was a very iced tea heavy episode and he
Speaker 2: made one of my favorite faces. I mean, everyone was
Speaker 2: not into you like your character.
Speaker 4: You know, it's kind of rude, wasn't it. I was like,
Speaker 4: why do I getting so much flak? You know, an
Speaker 4: old pedophile, But it was just like so sad right
Speaker 4: in core.
Speaker 1: You weren't that sorry. You were like, hey, little guy,
Speaker 1: I'll wait for you.
Speaker 4: Yeah, well you're not going to apologize for true love
Speaker 4: or yeah that's what's.
Speaker 1: In your mind. It's just really wild that she's a
Speaker 1: person that studies the like the brain and like its emotions,
Speaker 1: and like didn't realize the.
Speaker 4: Perception is everything, right if you perceive having look at Hollywood, Yeah,
Speaker 4: look at the world. It's like we're doing a great thing.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: It's like anything can be made to look good, right,
Speaker 4: So she definitely did a lot of self convincing.
Speaker 2: There, yes, And then so I don't know, I wonder
Speaker 2: if you're bringing this up too. We loved that you
Speaker 2: were in a silk robe and they still let you
Speaker 2: stay like.
Speaker 1: They let him stay at your house. You were in
Speaker 1: a silk robe. If you had just been in jeans
Speaker 1: and a T shirt, I don't think anybody would have
Speaker 1: even clomped it. But you answered the door in like
Speaker 1: a silk rose.
Speaker 4: That you guys are in this silk robe. He's all
Speaker 4: whacked on drugs, he's underage, and there's a baby and.
Speaker 1: Then there's just like a baby crying and before they
Speaker 1: even figure it out a lot.
Speaker 4: I don't really, I mean I was good. Think about it.
Speaker 4: Think about how clever she was to cover like that
Speaker 4: silk row baby crying drugged up thirteen year old and she's.
Speaker 1: Like, I'm helping my patient and it's like.
Speaker 4: What, let me get my patient back to bed.
Speaker 1: Most people don't even know what neighborhood their therapist lives in,
Speaker 1: let alone like spending a little stint there. I also
Speaker 1: thought it was funny that like no one was onto you,
Speaker 1: and then Finn, like iced Tea's character, was like, I
Speaker 1: don't know, he's young, she's kind of hot. Like I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, I Fin, you're kind of hot.
Speaker 4: I got that shout out and I was very happy
Speaker 4: about that. The best I felt in the whole show.
Speaker 4: I was like, thank you, Finn.
Speaker 1: We have to tell you that. We just yesterday interviewed
Speaker 1: another actor from While you Were Sleeping, Michael Rispoli. So,
Speaker 1: oh my god, like back to back While you.
Speaker 4: Were Sleeping Cat He's hilaro.
Speaker 1: I just watched for the first time literally a month ago,
Speaker 1: and yeah, and I was like when I saw you,
Speaker 1: I was like, oh my girl from Sons of Anarchy and.
Speaker 4: SVU Ashley Bartlett Bacon, Yeah, you like the bastard.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you have like such vibes of like the parent
Speaker 1: trap wife in that you know, what's that woman's name,
Speaker 1: Elaine somebody like, Yeah, you like that.
Speaker 4: It's so that's a great I love that movie. That
Speaker 4: movie was so fun. I love that it was originally
Speaker 4: called Koma Guy. No, it'd be I love that cast
Speaker 4: great people to work with, is really funny.
Speaker 1: I don't know if it really would have done as
Speaker 1: well as it did if it was called Cooma Guy. Now,
Speaker 1: I don't say I think that's a good renaming.
Speaker 4: It was literally called Coma guy, and he'd be like, what, well,
Speaker 4: kind of with SVU, we interviewed someone and it was
Speaker 4: supposed to be called sex Police, Oh my god, which
Speaker 4: wouldn't have worked on I don't.
Speaker 1: Think that would have gone.
Speaker 4: Twenty seven seasons not good, No, No, twenty seven seasons.
Speaker 4: That's really impressive.
Speaker 1: They're about to enter into twenty seven in the Paul. Yeah, wow,
Speaker 1: it's amazing.
Speaker 4: I love that. I think it's a great show. I
Speaker 4: think it's a good show. I think I think I
Speaker 4: tea all of them are really good, you know.
Speaker 1: So yeah, do you have any like memories from the set.
Speaker 1: Did you end your teen boyfriend John Mugaro get along?
Speaker 1: I mean, any any little tidbits that are I know,
Speaker 1: it was a long time.
Speaker 4: I think he was with the teacher at the time,
Speaker 4: so I ended.
Speaker 1: God, he was like actually getting high school lessons.
Speaker 4: I think he was actually in a high school. So
Speaker 4: I was just like, no, no, I mean, it was
Speaker 4: just you know, it's like when you go in sets
Speaker 4: like that, they're like well oiled machines, you know. Mushka
Speaker 4: came and said high, we said hi, iced tea was great.
Speaker 4: Everybody was great. We just all like boom and we
Speaker 4: just started working. It was really easy, very very easy,
Speaker 4: very laid back. It was great. Actually, I really enjoyed it.
Speaker 4: They're really good people. I mean, Dick Wolf has great shows.
Speaker 4: And the reason I like it so much as they
Speaker 4: everybody knows what they're is expected. You know where it's
Speaker 4: going to land, you know what you're gonna do, and
Speaker 4: it's not you know, like some sets are chaotic and
Speaker 4: kind of you know, they can be kind of daunting
Speaker 4: and that's that. It was just lovely.
Speaker 1: So it was good and you just did and FBI's
Speaker 1: Most Wanted, which is another dick Wolf joint.
Speaker 4: Dylan, Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've only done guests. I think
Speaker 4: I'm like dick Wolf stuff. I've done like three or
Speaker 4: four guests, and that they've all been on like Dick
Speaker 4: Wolf stuff because just it's really you know, they're really
Speaker 4: they're cool, they're really respectful of you, they're you know,
Speaker 4: they're very It's just easy. Yeah, just create a really
Speaker 4: good environment. Those guys are really cool. All the actors,
Speaker 4: there's nobody that you know that you're like, oh, God,
Speaker 4: be careful. You know. It's just really fun and easy.
Speaker 1: That's good that there's no be carefuls on that fast.
Speaker 4: Watch cales on some sets. I guess I've been lucky.
Speaker 4: I've had a few be carefuls, but usually, oh, make
Speaker 4: a joke and move on.
Speaker 1: Can you tell me what it was like working on
Speaker 1: Sons of Anarchy. Our listeners know that I'm a huge
Speaker 1: Sons of Anarchy head, and we've had other Sons of
Speaker 1: Anarchy people on. There's a lot of Sons of Innergy
Speaker 1: people on SVU, like a lot of crossover. So I'm
Speaker 1: always pointing it out, and I your character is like
Speaker 1: the antagonist of the You're actually a good guy, but
Speaker 1: you're against them because people.
Speaker 4: Oh my god, that was the most hated character I ever.
Speaker 1: Yeah, used to like give you the sky.
Speaker 4: Like I'd go into malls with my little boys, you
Speaker 4: know at the time my kids, and people were like,
Speaker 4: you're a bitch.
Speaker 1: My god. No, but they were nice.
Speaker 4: They would laugh and be like you're the biggest bitch.
Speaker 4: I'm like, thank you so much.
Speaker 1: Like I'm literally like I'm just trying to take down
Speaker 1: a criminal enterprise. Like the Sons of Anarchy are bad,
Speaker 1: they are criminals.
Speaker 4: I'm like the good guy.
Speaker 1: I am.
Speaker 4: Like, let's be nice. She was great character to play.
Speaker 4: That was a great character to play. I love and
Speaker 4: that show is great.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I loved. I was like so obsessed with that show.
Speaker 1: So you like started and I mean, we get the
Speaker 1: sell from IMDb, so you can tell us of anything's incorrect,
Speaker 1: but you started like on a soap for like one
Speaker 1: hundred episodes or something like that.
Speaker 4: Correct. Oh, and then.
Speaker 1: I'm really impressed.
Speaker 2: Every time we talk to someone from soaps, it's like
Speaker 2: I'm impressed with how much memorization and how fast you
Speaker 2: have to learn stuff, and I bet that's like really
Speaker 2: good training.
Speaker 4: That was like one of the best jobs. I mean,
Speaker 4: that was the best way. I mean I had done
Speaker 4: a little movie and kind of fell into the business
Speaker 4: and then just started working and I got the soap
Speaker 4: and it was it was daunting because it's like, here's
Speaker 4: twenty pages, you know, so we're gonna be doing this
Speaker 4: at lunch after lunch and you'd be like okay, you know,
Speaker 4: so you just like run to your own and cry
Speaker 4: and then you know, go through. But you just it's
Speaker 4: great training. You hit your marks, you know your lights are,
Speaker 4: you learn to work with the cameras. It was crazy,
Speaker 4: but it was wonderful. I love the people. I a Martinez,
Speaker 4: Marcy Walker, Robin Wright. I mean it was a great
Speaker 4: group of people and it was just like you know,
Speaker 4: going to school. I just ate it up. So it
Speaker 4: was fun. Yeah, that was a great time.
Speaker 2: How did you fall into it? You meant you just
Speaker 2: said that into acting?
Speaker 4: I got seen in a restaurant. Actually, dude, I was
Speaker 4: a scientist.
Speaker 1: Stopped up. Oh, I say, I used.
Speaker 4: The term scientists loosely. I was a grunt, right, I
Speaker 4: had my my BS and bio and chemistry or whatever
Speaker 4: by biochemistry basically biology from UC Santa Cruz. I was
Speaker 4: applying to med schools. Didn't get into LA so I
Speaker 4: got a job in the immunology department at UCLA and
Speaker 4: was out it with a friend of mine who was
Speaker 4: an actor, and I was laughing and being goofy because
Speaker 4: I'm almost like ma, but I'm you know, cause anyway,
Speaker 4: and this guy came over to me and said, you know,
Speaker 4: you're really funny. Why don't you come in audition for
Speaker 4: this film? And I was like right, you know, and
Speaker 4: but my friend was like, no, it's actually a real movie.
Speaker 4: Go do it. So I did it, and I got it,
Speaker 4: and I'm on the cutting room floor in some movie
Speaker 4: that I, you know, never saw. And then but then
Speaker 4: I got signed. I mean, it was just crazy. I
Speaker 4: got signed by an agency, I got a couple of commercials.
Speaker 4: I just started working and I started going to classes
Speaker 4: and waiting table you know, the common drama of the actor.
Speaker 4: Started going to like every class I could find and
Speaker 4: waiting tables, and then read for the soap got it
Speaker 4: and then just started really going, you know, and it
Speaker 4: was it was, it was insiting. Man, it was great.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then you basically just like have it stopped
Speaker 1: working in like three days, like decades, so and I
Speaker 1: retired like.
Speaker 4: Five I did Ghosted was like the last I did
Speaker 4: FBI just for Funk because I know Dylan. I love
Speaker 4: Dick Walf So I was like, yes, I love that show.
Speaker 4: So I was like, okay, And you know, my friend
Speaker 4: Julie McMahon was first read. Oh you know, I did
Speaker 4: profile with him, and so I've always like watched it
Speaker 4: because I watched when he was you know there. But
Speaker 4: so I quit a few years back basically because I'm tired.
Speaker 4: I don't know, but but I wrote a book.
Speaker 1: So that's what I was wanted to ask you about
Speaker 1: your book. Yeah, let me say, okay, so you have
Speaker 1: you wrote a book this year called The light Runner.
Speaker 4: Yes, it's fanned. It's taken me about ten years to
Speaker 4: get it out because I wrote it as a pilot
Speaker 4: and the first episode in twenty fifteen, and then I
Speaker 4: gave it out. Nobody picked it up, and so I
Speaker 4: made a film and then I you know, did that
Speaker 4: I called far More, which is on Amazon Prime and
Speaker 4: Apple and all that, and then I just I kept
Speaker 4: writing so I was like, well, just write a frickin book.
Speaker 4: I mean, let me teach me, you know. So I
Speaker 4: started like just trying to write and doing it at
Speaker 4: night and doing it in the pickup line and doing
Speaker 4: it wherever I could. And I wrote a book. And
Speaker 4: then in twenty twenty two I gave it to the
Speaker 4: publisher at the small company and she loved it, and
Speaker 4: she goes, I mean, we have to edit, but I
Speaker 4: love it. And so I started editing. And then that
Speaker 4: company it was supposed come out in twenty twenty three
Speaker 4: with their company, and they went under after COVID. I
Speaker 4: just thought, you know, I'm just going to put it out,
Speaker 4: and so yeah, so I put it out. So it's
Speaker 4: called The Light Runner. It's on Amazon and Barnes and Noble.
Speaker 4: There's my my spiel, Okay, what can you give us?
Speaker 1: Like the quick like, what's the elevator pitch, what's the
Speaker 1: LaGG Okay.
Speaker 4: It's a metaphysical thriller. It's a psychological thriller. It's really
Speaker 4: at the heart of that a thriller.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 4: It's about this young psychiatrist who works in a psychiatric
Speaker 4: hospital and she gets her first case and it's this
Speaker 4: Army captain Captain Oliver Haskell, who's a war hero whose
Speaker 4: wife's been murdered and he's so depressed and down. They're
Speaker 4: worried about him. So it goes into this psychiatric hospital
Speaker 4: and she starts to listen to a story and try
Speaker 4: to figure things out, and as she does her own,
Speaker 4: her own story starts to unravel, and she starts remembering
Speaker 4: things from the past that had happened to her. She's
Speaker 4: had a lot of trauma, blah blah. But then the
Speaker 4: patients in the hospital start to explain to her how
Speaker 4: reality really works and how to find the truth of things,
Speaker 4: and it's just like this kind of slow burn I'm getting.
Speaker 4: It's given great reviews. I'm really psyched, so it's well received.
Speaker 4: So I'm just kind of like, oh my god.
Speaker 1: And does she have an affair with a thirteen year
Speaker 1: old at any point the psychiatrist that would be a no,
Speaker 1: would be you know, that's doctor good tie in.
Speaker 4: In the same word now as doctor Stanton. Then they
Speaker 4: became friends. Isn't that crazy? But so no, So I
Speaker 4: did that. That's my latest gig. And then I'll probably
Speaker 4: I don't know, I just do you know things.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it feels like you're semi retired. I think if
Speaker 1: the right thing came along, I would.
Speaker 4: But I haven't. You know, I haven't. You know, everything
Speaker 4: is auditioning now by yourself somewhere. Yeah, you know, I'm
Speaker 4: an old fossil of this. I loved meeting directors and
Speaker 4: people and working with people, and it just became, you know,
Speaker 4: the roles are pure and for the between when you
Speaker 4: get older, it's really rough, you know, and unless you're
Speaker 4: you know, Nicole Kidman, and it's like, you know, and
Speaker 4: she's amazing. So it's like I just started going, you know,
Speaker 4: just do other stuff. So I directed a film. I
Speaker 4: wrote and directed a film, won a few awards at festivals,
Speaker 4: and then was it it's called far More.
Speaker 1: Oh I'm seeing Yeah, it has Adrian Grenier in.
Speaker 4: It and like period de mateo. Yeah, and I was,
Speaker 4: you know, that was a great experience. So that was
Speaker 4: really fun, and I my writing got a lot of
Speaker 4: attention for that script. It was really great. And then
Speaker 4: I just you know, I really love to write. I've
Speaker 4: always written, and that's what made me want to do
Speaker 4: the book. So I was just like, Okay, that's great.
Speaker 4: Yeh man.
Speaker 2: So you enjoy the writing process. You're into it, Yeah, it's.
Speaker 4: Fun for me. I mean it's like it's hard, you know,
Speaker 4: some day, not every day. Some days you're like, I
Speaker 4: don't know, I got nothing, but you know, other days
Speaker 4: you're just like you know, And with this particular one,
Speaker 4: I just kind of it's really weird. I was describing this.
Speaker 4: I did a podcast esterday and I was like describing
Speaker 4: somebody and it's like, well, how do you do it?
Speaker 4: You lay out an outline. I was like, no, man,
Speaker 4: there's no way. I'm not you know, like organized. But
Speaker 4: what I do do is I do do is What
Speaker 4: I do do is I sit on a couch for
Speaker 4: hours and just daydream. And that's how I approached acting.
Speaker 4: I just sit there and make up the character and
Speaker 4: all the things that in my head. And it really
Speaker 4: I learned this in a class with Harry Master George
Speaker 4: you know who taught you know, reallyotta Walkgoggins meld me grust.
Speaker 4: And I was a baby when I went to that class.
Speaker 4: I would just be like, that's a really smart thing
Speaker 4: to do. So I did it with writing. I just
Speaker 4: sit for a few days and really kind of h
Speaker 4: that be like, and then I'd start writing and it
Speaker 4: was like stream of consciousness. It was really fun.
Speaker 1: Wow. Wait, I like that.
Speaker 4: Otherwise it gets too for me. I if I have
Speaker 4: to like block it and stuff, it gets kind of scary,
Speaker 4: like did you do your homework?
Speaker 1: Yeah? You know, yeah, and then you like at you
Speaker 1: and your outlining, you start seeing like problems and you're like, well,
Speaker 1: now I got to go back and fix that instead
Speaker 1: of moving forward. And yeah, I have.
Speaker 4: A lot of problems. To believe me, I went back
Speaker 4: up and down. But I was just like, I don't
Speaker 4: worry about.
Speaker 2: We'll go back and fix the problem that I like
Speaker 2: this brainstorming vibe.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's more fun that way. I just really like
Speaker 4: just like, oh, that'd be like when we think about
Speaker 4: that for a while, just lost in your head. You
Speaker 4: know that's cool.
Speaker 1: I feel like that's you're like diversifying, like you're doing
Speaker 1: writing and directing and different things.
Speaker 2: Do you ever like sliding doors think about your science life?
Speaker 4: Yes? That is so weird. Yes, I do. There's a
Speaker 4: lot of that in the book because in the book
Speaker 4: I talk about what reality is and time I talk
Speaker 4: about it in a very different way. I say it's
Speaker 4: not one dimensional. It just doesn't go from here to there,
Speaker 4: goes back and it can wrap around itself and all
Speaker 4: these things that they're saying, there's scientific bases in these things,
Speaker 4: and it's really weird because some of them, which I
Speaker 4: found out later are true, and I was like, really
Speaker 4: I need that, you know. So it's really fun, you know.
Speaker 4: So yeah, my science head kind of came out in
Speaker 4: the writing a lot. My dad was a physicist, and
Speaker 4: you know, I used to have like really interesting conversations
Speaker 4: with him about you know, reality and dimensions and like
Speaker 4: just like you know, how things work, and so, you know,
Speaker 4: science is pretty great. It's really it's very creative, you know,
Speaker 4: and if you could imagine something, usually if you can
Speaker 4: prove it, you know, it's fun.
Speaker 1: Okay, tell us about Kazam.
Speaker 4: You know, that's so funny. I just I just did
Speaker 4: an interview with this guy who's writing an auto auto
Speaker 4: but biography on Shack, and I was like, yeah, just
Speaker 4: asking me questions and I was like, I don't really
Speaker 4: remember it. You know. For me, it was like I
Speaker 4: just went and did my job. I had a great
Speaker 4: time with Shack. He was a hoot, and Francis was great.
Speaker 4: But it was a weird set and I was like,
Speaker 4: what is going on here? Man? Because I just like
Speaker 4: to get in, do my job, have a few laughs,
Speaker 4: and leave. And it was there was a lot like
Speaker 4: one guy who was not an actor, who was hired
Speaker 4: to play my character's boyfriend, hated what's his name? The director,
Speaker 4: Paul Michael Laser, who had you know, had a horrible
Speaker 4: just lost his wife and child.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you know, yes, Elizabeth Glazer, the
Speaker 1: Pediatric AIDS Foundation.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, just the saddest story. And I was very
Speaker 4: cognizant of that. Francis was there and he was such
Speaker 4: a sweet kid. But then there was this guy and
Speaker 4: he hated Paul or something. I wasn't there when it happened,
Speaker 4: and I came to set one day and it was
Speaker 4: like the costume person's like, come here, Camara, and I'm
Speaker 4: like what and she's like the guy walked to Lax
Speaker 4: and left. So he walked from the set to Lax
Speaker 4: like nine miles away. Then I was like, who am
Speaker 4: I doing my off camera? You know, it's just like
Speaker 4: so that was kind of nutty, right, But I never
Speaker 4: I never realized how much attention that film got, like
Speaker 4: negative attention, because I was like, oh, it's a kid's movie.
Speaker 4: It's cute. That's how I felt about it. I was
Speaker 4: just like, oh, it's a cute kids movie, okay, you know,
Speaker 4: and uh it was sweet, I thought. And then she's
Speaker 4: hating it, like and wow, And then combined that with
Speaker 4: the guy on the set, I was just like, I
Speaker 4: don't know what to think of that. I had a
Speaker 4: great time with Shack, That's all I can say. Shack
Speaker 4: and I had a ball. I was like happy.
Speaker 1: Shack's one of my favorites.
Speaker 4: Us too. By the way, he's a he's a genius
Speaker 4: and he was just a kid, you know. We went
Speaker 4: to the premiere and this was the sweetest thing. He
Speaker 4: leaned over to me. We were at the premiere in
Speaker 4: New York and he goes, hey, Alie, and I was
Speaker 4: like what we were supposed to be talking and he goes,
Speaker 4: I just had my first baby. And I was like, oh, oh,
Speaker 4: he's really sweet. It's so sweet. So I don't know,
Speaker 4: I had a great time. I've had a really good
Speaker 4: time on most of the stuff I've done. You know,
Speaker 4: I just try to Yeah.
Speaker 1: You see, like you really go with the flow. Don't
Speaker 1: have a lot of wow.
Speaker 4: I can be difficult, you know, at the writing, I
Speaker 4: could be difficult. Well it's usually about the writing, Like
Speaker 4: really I gotta what what you know? So i'd be
Speaker 4: But but not when you're you know, I mean when
Speaker 4: I was on Profiler, I had a hard time because
Speaker 4: a lot of people were running coming and going. But
Speaker 4: most of the I mean know, we're really lucky to
Speaker 4: be doing what we're doing, and you know, it's it's
Speaker 4: a hell out of waiting tables.
Speaker 1: I can't believe that you like literally could have just
Speaker 1: been a scientist if this person didn't like overhear you
Speaker 1: being a goof at dinner? Do you remember who this?
Speaker 1: Do you remember who this person was? And did you
Speaker 1: ever hear?
Speaker 3: It?
Speaker 4: Was Michael Greco and he did a little film with
Speaker 4: Chris Makepeace and I actually am seeing running through one
Speaker 4: of the hallways on it called a Loha Summer. It
Speaker 4: was a really sweet little film. Don't think he ever
Speaker 4: made anything else, but he was lovely and never.
Speaker 1: Literally launched your career over me.
Speaker 4: I got the acting bookcase I'd done it in you
Speaker 4: know college is but I was just always like, I
Speaker 4: can a living at this, you know, pay off my student.
Speaker 1: So yeah, this is cool. That's that's like that's literally
Speaker 1: like I got discovered at the supermarket type of story
Speaker 1: that like you barely ever hear.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I thought the guy was crazy when he approached
Speaker 4: me at the table. I was like, oh sure, I'm
Speaker 4: with someone you know, and legit really changed my life,
Speaker 4: just completely changed my life. Yeah, it's crazy, really crazy.
Speaker 1: This has been very fun. Yeah, thank you so much
Speaker 1: for talking to us. Anything else that you remember from
Speaker 1: your little fran Stanton days that you want to throw
Speaker 1: to our audience. I mean your eyes, I was gonna say,
Speaker 1: you're crying was very good. Like you you got your
Speaker 1: eyes got so red and you got the tears just
Speaker 1: really tumbling out talking.
Speaker 4: About love that kid. You love that teen, I love
Speaker 4: that teen love. Oh god, well, thank you for having me.
Speaker 4: You guys are a hoot.
Speaker 1: She's the best. Oh my god, I'm last girl. I
Speaker 1: might read the book.
Speaker 2: It reminded me, like I read the Barnes and Nobles
Speaker 2: synopsis and it's like it does remind me of my
Speaker 2: James Patterson days, like I want to thriller.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was like the light Runners about comics that
Speaker 1: go too long on their that's wow. I just like
Speaker 1: what a story to just get like discovered while you're
Speaker 1: working in a lab and then you're just like, I'm
Speaker 1: an actor now gonna work for thirty years series regulars writing,
Speaker 1: And yeah, super Big watched Sons of Anarchy. She's really
Speaker 1: good in it. She's so like she's like this FBI
Speaker 1: agent that's like, I'm gonna fucking get you guys. I mean,
Speaker 1: spoiler alert, it's really hard to get those guys.
Speaker 2: Uh, but aunt to have back to back while you
Speaker 2: were sleeping people, That's like, yeah, why.
Speaker 1: Back to back? When I just watched it, and like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, I just I love talking to her
Speaker 1: and wow, I love how well how much she loved
Speaker 1: joking about her relationship with that thirteen year old I
Speaker 1: mean he was sixteen by the time he was on
Speaker 1: the episode. But also I am I love that she
Speaker 1: loves Shack. Yeah, that she's in Kazam.
Speaker 2: I wonder if she truly knows the depths of like
Speaker 2: the Mendela effect, because am sin Ad Shack like universe
Speaker 2: there's like a lot of talks about because they am.
Speaker 1: Yes, the city, there's like the Sinbad Mandela effecting. Yes, totally.
Speaker 1: Oh but she is in singles, which I we didn't
Speaker 1: get to ask her about. But Singles was huge when
Speaker 1: I was like in middle school because everybody was like
Speaker 1: wearing the flannels and like walk into grunge and like
Speaker 1: that was like the grunge movie that came out. Singles.
Speaker 2: Oh interesting, Wow, it's really star studded. I've never heard
Speaker 2: of this movie.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, singles, But now that I see Matt Dylon
Speaker 1: with his long hair. Yeah, a Cameron Crow, a Cameron
Speaker 1: Crow classic. I don't know if I've ever seen a
Speaker 1: Cameron Crow movie. Almost famous, No, no, hmm, I can't
Speaker 1: name another one, so I don't know what the other
Speaker 1: ones are.
Speaker 2: Oh, I've seen Jerry Maguire. I've seen Jerry Maguire. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and I've seen we Bought a Zoo.
Speaker 1: We bought a Zoo? Wow? Waits a fast Time?
Speaker 2: Oh Elizabeth time and wait it's fast Times him he
Speaker 2: wrote it?
Speaker 1: Cool? Damn?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I mean Amy Hypocerlian. They directed it. That's
Speaker 2: who I associate with the movie. I didn't realize Cameron
Speaker 2: Crow wrote it. Wow, that was great? Yeah that in
Speaker 2: days and confused. I always get confused which ones which?
Speaker 2: But I love how Yeah we bought a sup Okay cool,
Speaker 2: I'm enjoying. Sorry, I'm like looking at this, but people
Speaker 2: really love this man, and I think he loves Tom Curuz.
Speaker 1: Okay, so what's our post mortem from this episode? I
Speaker 1: guess like pedophilia is never okay, I don't care. Yeah, like, yeah,
Speaker 1: an adult is not allowed to do anything with a teen.
Speaker 1: It's just not that's not sex. But also it's scary
Speaker 1: when it's like get help, go go, like get help
Speaker 1: for your mental illnesses and things like that, and then
Speaker 1: someone can just like so take advantage of you and
Speaker 1: like fuck with your meds and turn you into a
Speaker 1: different person and tell you you have schizophrenia. I mean,
Speaker 1: like that's just like very harrowing.
Speaker 2: I know it's a TV show, but I'm glad it
Speaker 2: is a time where someone got a sentence and I
Speaker 2: was like, yeah, she should be there for twenty years.
Speaker 1: Yeah. And then the real crime the con I don't know,
Speaker 1: it's like he is up there with like the catch
Speaker 1: me if you can guy, Like I mean, I wouldn't
Speaker 1: even say Annadelvi is kind of like even in the
Speaker 1: same realm because this guy was doing it for decades
Speaker 1: and Annadelvy got caught pretty quick. Although it's a more
Speaker 1: modern age, it's easier I think to get caught, But
Speaker 1: like this guy just like going around and it's just like,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I just don't know how you pretend
Speaker 1: to be so rich when you have no money. I
Speaker 1: don't know how you It's like the creativity, you gotta
Speaker 1: almost respect it. Uh. But I think he's a sociopath
Speaker 1: and I don't know what he thought he was going
Speaker 1: to do. I think like the only person that he
Speaker 1: actually kind of cared about was his daughter, and thats
Speaker 1: why he tried to steal her back. But it's like,
Speaker 1: what did you think was gonna happen? You were going
Speaker 1: to live in Baltimore with your kidnapped daughter, with people
Speaker 1: thinking that you're a Rockefeller on the loose, Like your
Speaker 1: wife who has millions of dollars, is not going to
Speaker 1: track her daughter down. I don't know. Delusion, delusions of grandeur.
Speaker 2: But also right, but in the real life, it's like,
Speaker 2: why if the mom is such a bad mom, why
Speaker 2: did she get another She's gonna hold the baby like
Speaker 2: the pill popping grandma oh in.
Speaker 1: The in the episode. Yeah yeah, back to the episode. Yeah,
Speaker 1: one track of mind for me. No, that's okay, I yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean that was like because she's like, I never
Speaker 1: laid a hand. That's the only thing we know about
Speaker 1: her is that she never hit her kids. But I
Speaker 1: don't think she did anything else that was that great.
Speaker 1: You know, Like her son's on the streets and she
Speaker 1: goes we skype every week. I'm like, and you can't
Speaker 1: convince him to come home, Like, I don't know. At
Speaker 1: the same time, she was working against a psychiatrist who
Speaker 1: was drugging her child for three years. Yeah, broke up
Speaker 1: with like a good girlfriend. Yeah yeah, I mean I
Speaker 1: think him and Mallory are going to stay together. That's
Speaker 1: what I think happens in the PostScript. But yeah, but
Speaker 1: I don't want her to like be a teen stepmom.
Speaker 1: I know, a teen stun andrewis to raise this baby.
Speaker 1: He doesn't want to, Like, I don't fuck this bitch.
Speaker 4: I know.
Speaker 1: I'm like part of me thinks that, like, even if
Speaker 1: she goes to jail, she should have to pay a
Speaker 1: certain amount of like child support for the child, so
Speaker 1: that they at least can use her psychiatrist's money to
Speaker 1: raise the kid. I mean, I love how we go
Speaker 1: into just a full PostScript of fake people, but I
Speaker 1: would like to see a happy life for this poor
Speaker 1: little child. I mean, I gotta be honest. The kids
Speaker 1: of Mary Kay Latourneau and Billy Filau seem like they
Speaker 1: were raised by loving parents, even though their dad was
Speaker 1: thirteen and fourteen when they were born.
Speaker 2: They're gonna write some books, I bet yeah, they'll do
Speaker 2: some sit downs with well whatever takes over for sixty
Speaker 2: minutes when it's when everyone's arrested.
Speaker 1: Yeah, when it becomes a state television run called like
Speaker 1: just like Trump tonight. All right, let's move on to
Speaker 1: our what would Sister Peg Do? For this episode? What
Speaker 1: Would Sister Peg Do is our weekly segment where we
Speaker 1: direct you towards a book, article, organization, something to give
Speaker 1: you more info about what we talked about today. And
Speaker 1: you know, we were talking about how people can't like
Speaker 1: normalize having a relationship with someone that's underage and acting
Speaker 1: like that is consensual, Like that's assault. And I feel
Speaker 1: like the not to get too political, but the the
Speaker 1: right has been co opting the term grooming for a
Speaker 1: long time, aiming at at like drag queens and trans
Speaker 1: people and people that it has nothing to do with.
Speaker 1: But grooming is a very real thing, and so we'd
Speaker 1: like to point you to an article on the Rape,
Speaker 1: Abuse and Incest National Network which it goes by RAIN.
Speaker 1: On their website, they have an article called Grooming Know
Speaker 1: the Warning Signs and this is a helpful resource to
Speaker 1: protect your children from potential groomers by identifying the recognizable
Speaker 1: patterns that grooming often follows. It also touches upon the
Speaker 1: potential threat of online grooming and so for more information
Speaker 1: head over to RAIN dot org and that will be
Speaker 1: linked in our show notes and as always, it will
Speaker 1: be in a story that we post the day this
Speaker 1: episode comes out, which will be saved in our WWSPD
Speaker 1: Highlight where you can find all of our past what
Speaker 1: would Sister peg Do's and yeah can see if you're
Speaker 1: anyone in your kid's life is sting to do something
Speaker 1: not good.
Speaker 2: And next week, I don't want to say it, we'll
Speaker 2: be doing an episode in Loco Parentis from season nineteen,
Speaker 2: episode fifteen.
Speaker 1: Fuck you, Warren Light, watch it, Watch it, guys, come on,
Speaker 1: but also Warren Light, come on the pod. We're reading
Speaker 1: for you. Thank you guys so much for listening. We'll
Speaker 1: see you next week.
Speaker 2: That's messed up as an exactly right production.
Speaker 1: If you have compliments you'd like to give us or
Speaker 1: episodes you'd like us to cover. Shoot us an email
Speaker 1: it That's Messed uppod at gmail dot com. Listen to
Speaker 1: That's Messed Up on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2: Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod,
Speaker 2: and follow us personally at Kara Klank and at glitter Cheese.
Speaker 1: As always, please see our show notes for sources and
Speaker 1: more information.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much to our senior producer Casey O'Brien
Speaker 2: and our associate producer Christina Chamberlain.
Speaker 1: And to our mixer John Bradley and our guest booker
Speaker 1: Patrick Cottner, and to Henry Kaperski for our theme song,
Speaker 1: and Carly Geen Andrews for our artwork. Thank you to
Speaker 1: our executive producers Georgia hard Start, Karen Kilgarriff, Daniel Kramer,
Speaker 1: and everybody at Exactly Right Media dub the dun
Speaker 2: M