Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2: We want to go live to the stage in Davos
Speaker 2: now where Elon Musk is speaking with black Rock CEO.
Speaker 3: Very think it's an important component of huween what we
Speaker 3: are and I'm thrilled to have Elon Musk here.
Speaker 4: He came all the way from California to be here.
Speaker 4: It's to see all of you. So thank you, Elon.
Speaker 5: You was welcome. I mean I heard I heard about
Speaker 5: about the formation of the Peace Summit and I was like,
Speaker 5: is that is that p I e c uh, you know,
Speaker 5: a little piece of Greenland, a little Pisa.
Speaker 4: Thanks, we got one.
Speaker 5: All we want is peace.
Speaker 3: Okay, I'm gonna as I said, I'm a pretty proud
Speaker 3: uh CEO of black Rock since we went public. Uh,
Speaker 3: the com pounding return of blocklock to our shoulders with
Speaker 3: twenty one percent. Since Elon took Tesla public, his compounded.
Speaker 4: Return is forty three percent.
Speaker 3: This is just another advertisement for everybody, especially for Europeans.
Speaker 3: This is why more citizens should be investing with growth,
Speaker 3: investing with your countries. Imagine if a lot of pension
Speaker 3: funds invested with Elon when Tesla went public and how
Speaker 3: much we return with the all the pension funds that
Speaker 3: invested side by side with Elon and the growth, so
Speaker 3: a spectacular return.
Speaker 4: There's very few companies.
Speaker 3: Well, I don't think there's any other company as large
Speaker 3: as Tesla today that has that compoundent return.
Speaker 4: So congratulations, I think a good measurement.
Speaker 5: Well, we have an incredible team a Tesla. That's the reason.
Speaker 3: So I want to get into there the meaningful component
Speaker 3: about technology, the possibilities. I want to talk about AI
Speaker 3: and robotics, energy, space and the progress ultimately coming down
Speaker 3: to engineering, engineering, discipline, scale execution, and few people, if
Speaker 3: not anyone, has the experience and the fortitude to confront
Speaker 3: these issues head on, not just the ideas, but the
Speaker 3: execution across so many different technology Zelon and that's why
Speaker 3: I thought it was important for us to have this
Speaker 3: dialogue here in Davos. So you're presently building on AI,
Speaker 3: on robotics, on space, on energy all at the same time.
Speaker 3: When you look across those efforts, what do they have
Speaker 3: in common from an engineering standpoint, Well, they're.
Speaker 5: All vertical technology challenges.
Speaker 4: But the.
Speaker 5: Overall goal of my companies is to maximize the future
Speaker 5: of civilization, like basically maximize the probability that civilization has
Speaker 5: a great future and to expand consciousness beyond Earth. So
Speaker 5: take SpaceX for example, that SpaceX is about build advancing
Speaker 5: rocket technology to the point where we can extend life
Speaker 5: and consciousness beyond Earth, to the Moon, to Mars, eventually
Speaker 5: to other star systems. And I think we should always
Speaker 5: view consciousness life as we know it, as as precarious
Speaker 5: and delicate, because to the best of our knowledge, we
Speaker 5: don't know if life anywhere else. You know, I'm often
Speaker 5: asked other aliens among us and I'll say that I
Speaker 5: am one.
Speaker 4: But or are you here from the future?
Speaker 5: They don't believe me, okay, So I think if anyone
Speaker 5: would know if there are aliens among us, it would
Speaker 5: be me. And we have nine thousand satellites up there,
Speaker 5: and not once have we had to maneuver around an
Speaker 5: alien spaceship. So like, I don't know. The bottom line is,
Speaker 5: I think we need to assume that life and consciousness
Speaker 5: is extremely rare and it might only be us. And
Speaker 5: if that's the case, then we need to do everything
Speaker 5: possible to ensure that the light of the light of
Speaker 5: consciousness is not extinguished because we're effectively the way I view,
Speaker 5: it is the measure, in my mind, is of a
Speaker 5: tiny candle in a vast darkness, tiny candle of consciousness
Speaker 5: that could easily go out. And that's why it's important
Speaker 5: to make life multiplanetary such that if there is a
Speaker 5: natural disaster or a man made disaster on Earth, that
Speaker 5: consciousness continues. That's the purpose of SpaceX Tesla is obviously
Speaker 5: about sustainable technology and and and also at this point
Speaker 5: we've we've sort of added to our mission sustainable abundance.
Speaker 5: So with the robotics and AI, this this is really
Speaker 5: the path to abundance for all. If you say, you know,
Speaker 5: people often talk about solving global poverty or essentially how
Speaker 5: do we make give everyone a very high standard of living?
Speaker 5: I think the only way to do this is AI
Speaker 5: and robotics, which which doesn't mean that it is without
Speaker 5: its issues. I mean this, We need to be very
Speaker 5: careful with AI, We need to be very careful with robotics.
Speaker 5: We don't want to find ourselves in a James Camera movie. Uh,
Speaker 5: you know, Terminator. He's great, great movies, love his movies.
Speaker 5: But we don't want to be a Terminator. Obviously. But
Speaker 5: if you have ubiquitous AI, that is essentially free or
Speaker 5: close to it, and ubiquitous robotics, then you will have
Speaker 5: an an explosion in the global economy, an expansion in
Speaker 5: the global economy that is truly beyond all precedent.
Speaker 3: And can that expansion be broad or is it narrow?
Speaker 3: And how can that be created? How can it broaden
Speaker 3: the global economy?
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's I mean, I mean the way to think
Speaker 5: of it is that if you have a large number
Speaker 5: of humanoid robots, the economic output is the average productivity
Speaker 5: per robot times the number of robots. Right, And actually,
Speaker 5: my prediction is the in the benign scenario of the
Speaker 5: future that we will the robots will actually make so
Speaker 5: many robots in AI that they will actually saturate all
Speaker 5: human needs, I meaning you won't be able to even
Speaker 5: think of something to ask the robot for at a
Speaker 5: certain point, like like there will be such an abundance
Speaker 5: of goods and services because the my prediction is there'll
Speaker 5: be there'll be more robots than people.
Speaker 4: So but how do you then have human purpose in
Speaker 4: that scenario?
Speaker 5: I mean, you know, there was nothing is perfect, you know,
Speaker 5: but I mean, I mean, is it is a necessary
Speaker 5: Like you can't have both, You can't have work that
Speaker 5: has to be done, uh, and amazing abundance for all
Speaker 5: because if it's if it's work that has to be done,
Speaker 5: then then then you and and only some people can
Speaker 5: do it, then then you you can't have abundance narrow
Speaker 5: narrow exactly. So but if you if you have billions
Speaker 5: of humanoid robots, and I think it will be I
Speaker 5: think I think everyone on Earth is going to have
Speaker 5: one and going to want one because you're who wouldn't
Speaker 5: want a robot to you know, assuming it's very safe,
Speaker 5: watch over your kids, take care of your pet, if
Speaker 5: you have elderly parents. A lot of friends of mine
Speaker 5: have said that for elderly parents, it's it's very difficult
Speaker 5: to take care of them. Yeah, it's expensive, and it's expensive,
Speaker 5: and they just aren't enough people to take care of
Speaker 5: the not enough young people to take care of the
Speaker 5: old people. Right, So if if they if you had
Speaker 5: a robot that could take care of and protect and
Speaker 5: elderly parents, I think that would be great. That would
Speaker 5: be an amazing thing to have and and I think
Speaker 5: we will have those things. So overall, I'm very optimistic
Speaker 5: about the future. I think we're headed for a future
Speaker 5: of amazing abundance, which is very cool and uh and
Speaker 5: definitely we are in the most interesting time in history.
Speaker 5: I think there's more a more interesting time in history.
Speaker 3: Can we can you and I reverse aging in this
Speaker 3: new history or or are we going to see it?
Speaker 4: You know, I haven't.
Speaker 5: I haven't put much time into the aging stuff. I
Speaker 5: do think it is a very solvable problem that you
Speaker 5: can do. I think when we find figure out what
Speaker 5: causes aging, I think we'll find it's incredibly obvious. It's
Speaker 5: not a subtle thing. The reason I say it's not
Speaker 5: a subtle thing is because all the cells in your body,
Speaker 5: you know, with some pretty much age at the same rate.
Speaker 5: I've never seen someone with with an old left arm
Speaker 5: and a young right arm ever in my life. So
Speaker 5: why is that? That means that there must be a
Speaker 5: synchronizing clock that is synchronizing across thirty five trillion cells
Speaker 5: in your body. And you know there is some benefit
Speaker 5: to death by the way, It's like there's there's a
Speaker 5: reason why we don't actually have a longer lifespan, because
Speaker 5: if you have, if people do live forever for a
Speaker 5: very long time, I think there's some risk of an
Speaker 5: ossification of society of things just getting kind of locked
Speaker 5: in place, and you know, it just may become stultifying,
Speaker 5: just not lack vibrancy. But that's said, do I think
Speaker 5: we'll figure out ways to extend life and and maybe
Speaker 5: even reverse aging. I think that's highly likely.
Speaker 3: I'm looking forward to that. Yeah, So in the future
Speaker 3: that you talk about the AI models, autonomous machines rockets
Speaker 3: depends on massive increases a compute, massive increases energy expensive energy,
Speaker 3: manufacturing scale.
Speaker 4: What are the mottle next to get there?
Speaker 3: And once again, with all that expenditures, again, how can
Speaker 3: we make sure that it's broughten not narrow.
Speaker 5: I just think the natural thing is it's going to
Speaker 5: be very broad because AI companies will seek as many
Speaker 5: customers as they possibly can, and the cost of AYE
Speaker 5: will get is already very low, and it's planeting every year,
Speaker 5: I mean almost the cost of AI is almost changed,
Speaker 5: meaningfully changing on a month's month basis.
Speaker 4: There's open there's open models now everywhere.
Speaker 5: Yes, very as open models, and the open models only
Speaker 5: lack there maybe a year behind, right, the private the
Speaker 5: sort of closed models. So so I think the AI
Speaker 5: companies will seek as many customers as possible which means
Speaker 5: they'll see they'll provide AI to the world.
Speaker 3: But the cost of getting to there, the compute, the chips,
Speaker 3: the fab the powering that to me, what are the
Speaker 3: what are the you know, those are a huge limiting factor.
Speaker 5: I think the limiting factor for AI deployment is fundamentally
Speaker 5: electrical power.
Speaker 4: It's just like its energy.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, I mean we're seeing the rate of AI
Speaker 5: chip production increase exponentially, but the rate of electricity being
Speaker 5: vote online is.
Speaker 4: Year acts.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's clear that we're very soon, maybe even later
Speaker 5: this year, we'll be producing more trips than we can
Speaker 5: turn on. Except for China. China. China is China's growth
Speaker 5: and electricity is tremendous.
Speaker 4: Hundred gigawatts of nuclear as we speak.
Speaker 5: Actually, solar is the biggest thing in China, So China is.
Speaker 5: I believe Chinese production capacity on solar is fifteen hundred
Speaker 5: gigawats a year, and they're deploying over a thousand gigawatts
Speaker 5: a year of solar. Now, you know, for continuous solar load,
Speaker 5: you divide that by roughly four or five call it.
Speaker 5: That's around two hundred and fifty gigawats of steady state power.
Speaker 5: Paired with batteries, and that's a very big number. That's
Speaker 5: half of the average power usage in the US. Sous
Speaker 5: US power usage on average is five hundred gigawats China.
Speaker 5: Just in solar, just like just in solar, act that
Speaker 5: can provide steady state power and batteries can do half
Speaker 5: of the US electricity output fer year just for solar.
Speaker 5: Solar is by far the biggest source of energy. And
Speaker 5: actually when you look beyond or even on Earth, but
Speaker 5: certainly beyond Earth, the Sun rounds up to one hundred
Speaker 5: percent of all energy. This is an important thing to consider.
Speaker 5: So the Sun is ninety nine point eight percent of
Speaker 5: the mass of the Solar system, Jupiter is about point
Speaker 5: one percent, and everything else is miscellaneous. Now, even if
Speaker 5: you were to burn Jupiter in a thermino yactor, the
Speaker 5: amount of energy produced by the Sun would still round
Speaker 5: up to one hundred percent, because Jupiter is only point
Speaker 5: one percent. If you teleported teleported three more jupiters into
Speaker 5: our solar system and burnt three more Jupiters and everything
Speaker 5: else in the Solar system, the Sun's energy we're still
Speaker 5: round up to. So it's really all about the Sun,
Speaker 5: and that's That's why one of the things we'll be
Speaker 5: doing with SpaceX within a few years is launching solar
Speaker 5: powered AI satellites because the space is really the source
Speaker 5: of immense power, and then you don't need to take
Speaker 5: up any room on Earth. There's so much room in space,
Speaker 5: and you can scale to enormous I mean, you can
Speaker 5: scale to I think ultimately hundreds hundreds of terror worts
Speaker 5: a year.
Speaker 3: You and I have had these conversations before it. What
Speaker 3: did you tell the audience what would it take for
Speaker 3: the United States? And what type of geography would it
Speaker 3: take to have that solar field to electrify the United States?
Speaker 3: And then let me ask a question, why aren't we
Speaker 3: doing it?
Speaker 5: Yeah? So, I mean, I guess the rough way to
Speaker 5: think about it is one hundred miles by one hundred
Speaker 5: miles or one hundred and sixty kilometers by one hundred
Speaker 5: and sixty kilometers of solar is enough to power the
Speaker 5: entire United States. So miles one hundred mile areas is
Speaker 5: I mean that you could take basically a small corner
Speaker 5: of Utah, Nevada, Nevada, New Mexico. Obviously wouldn't want it
Speaker 5: all in one place, but it's a very small percentage
Speaker 5: of the area of the US to generate all of
Speaker 5: the electricity that the US uses. And the same is
Speaker 5: true actually, I mean for Europe, you could take a
Speaker 5: small part. You could take relatively unpopulated areas of say
Speaker 5: Spain and Sicily and generate all of the electricity power
Speaker 5: that your needs.
Speaker 3: So why don't you think that there's a movement towards
Speaker 3: that here and in the United States?
Speaker 4: Well, there is, as it is in China.
Speaker 5: Well, unfortunately in the US the tariff barriers for solar
Speaker 5: are extremely high, and that makes the economics of deploying
Speaker 5: solo artificially high because China makes almost all the solar
Speaker 5: and and that what.
Speaker 3: Would it take for Europe or the US to build
Speaker 3: it commercially if it's that scale, Yeah.
Speaker 5: I think I think. Well I can tell you what
Speaker 5: we're going to do. You know, SpaceX and Tesla is
Speaker 5: we're building up large scale solar. So the SpaceX and
Speaker 5: Tesla teams, both separately are working to build to one
Speaker 5: hundred gigo what's a year of solar power in the
Speaker 5: US of manufactured solar power, and that'll probably take a
Speaker 5: center in about three years. But that's that's these are
Speaker 5: pretty big numbers, and you know, I encourage others to
Speaker 5: do the same. We obviously don't control that. You know,
Speaker 5: your your tariff policy. Uh, but for for for other countries, UH,
Speaker 5: I would reckon that this China makes solo cells that
Speaker 5: are incredibly low costs, and I think it would be
Speaker 5: worth doing a large scale solo.
Speaker 3: So I know you are You're going to be having
Speaker 3: a couple of big announcements on robotics and what it
Speaker 3: can do. I mean, when I went to the factory,
Speaker 3: you showed me those robots. How quickly you talked about
Speaker 3: the billions of robots, but how quickly and how quickly
Speaker 3: can they be deployed in a manufacturing setting. How quickly
Speaker 3: can they be utilize and be functional and be create
Speaker 3: that that abundance that you talked about.
Speaker 5: Well, humanoid robotics will advance very quickly. I think we
Speaker 5: do have some the Tael's Optimus robots doing simple tasks
Speaker 5: in the factory, except probably later this year. By the
Speaker 5: end of this year, I think they will be doing
Speaker 5: more more complex tasks and still deployed in an industrial environment,
Speaker 5: and and probably sometime next year. I'd say that by
Speaker 5: the by the end of next year, I think would
Speaker 5: be selling humanoid robots to the public. That that's when
Speaker 5: we are confident that it's very higher liability, very high safety,
Speaker 5: and the range of functionality is uh is also very high.
Speaker 5: You can basically ask it to do anything you'd like.
Speaker 3: You're already seen that in Tesla car. Is the software
Speaker 3: changes that you're doing and what is it? Every quarter
Speaker 3: now a software change that upgrades the ability of the
Speaker 3: robot within the car.
Speaker 5: Yes, the tails a full self driving software. We update
Speaker 5: it sometimes once a week and there recently some of
Speaker 5: the insurance companies have said that it is actually so safe.
Speaker 5: Where tells a full self driving so safe that uh,
Speaker 5: they're they're offering customers half price insurance if they if
Speaker 5: they use tess a full self driving in the car.
Speaker 3: And that could be monitored by the insurance company, can
Speaker 3: they Is that part of the agreement?
Speaker 5: Yeah? But I think self driving cars is essentially a
Speaker 5: solved problem at this point, right, and test tells us
Speaker 5: a role out sort of robotaxi service in a few
Speaker 5: cities and will I be very very widespread by the
Speaker 5: end of this year within the US, and then we
Speaker 5: hope to get supervisor for self driving approval in Europe
Speaker 5: hopefully next.
Speaker 4: Month really quickly.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and then maybe a similar timing for China, hopefully.
Speaker 3: I want to move to space because historically space is
Speaker 3: very capital and intensive, historically been done by governments of
Speaker 3: least space.
Speaker 4: Exchange, the whole model.
Speaker 3: But we've seen it slow to scale and now I'm
Speaker 3: starting to see it ramping up.
Speaker 4: In what you're doing and other things.
Speaker 3: Talk to us about the reasons, you know, the automation
Speaker 3: and AI, how it's changing the economics and building and
Speaker 3: preparing for us in operating in space.
Speaker 5: Sure. Well, the key brain through that tells that that's
Speaker 5: the major breakthrough that SpaceX is hoping to achieve this
Speaker 5: year is full reusability. So no one has ever achieved
Speaker 5: full reusability of a rocket, which is very important for
Speaker 5: the cost of access to space. We've achieved partial reusability
Speaker 5: with Falcon line by landing the boost stage. We've now
Speaker 5: landed the boost stage over five hundred times, but we
Speaker 5: don't we have to throw away the upper stage. The
Speaker 5: uper stage burns up on re entry for Falcon nine,
Speaker 5: so and that the cost of that is equivalent to
Speaker 5: a small to medium sized jet. So, but with with
Speaker 5: Starship which is a giant rocket. It's the largest flying
Speaker 5: machine ever made, not.
Speaker 3: The rocket that you're using for the idea of going
Speaker 3: to Mars, right.
Speaker 5: Yeah, Mars and the Moon, as well as for high
Speaker 5: volume satellite stuff. So Starship. Hopefully this year we should
Speaker 5: prove full reusability for Starship, which will be a profound
Speaker 5: invention because the cost of access to space will drop
Speaker 5: by a factor of one hundred when you're chief full reusability.
Speaker 5: It's the same sort of economic difference that you would
Speaker 5: expect that between say a reusable aircraft and a non
Speaker 5: reusable aircraft. Like if you have to throw aircraft away
Speaker 5: after every flight, that would be a very expensive flight.
Speaker 5: But if you only have to refuel, then it's the
Speaker 5: cost of the fuel. And so that's really the fundamental
Speaker 5: breakthrough that gets the cost of access to space we
Speaker 5: think below the cost of a freight on aircraft, so
Speaker 5: you know, under one hundred dollars a pound type of
Speaker 5: thing easily. So it makes putting large satellites into into
Speaker 5: space very low, very cheap. And then when you have
Speaker 5: solar in space, you get five times more effectiveness, maybe
Speaker 5: even more than that than solar on the ground because
Speaker 5: it's always sunny cold. Yeah, it's it's it's always well,
Speaker 5: it's toways sunny. So you don't have a day night
Speaker 5: cycle or seasonality or weather, and you get about thirty
Speaker 5: percent more power in space because you don't have atrospheric
Speaker 5: attenuation of the power. The net effect is solar is
Speaker 5: five times more. Any given solar panel will do five
Speaker 5: times more energy in space than on the ground.
Speaker 3: There's there any capacity in doing that and taking that
Speaker 3: power and bringing it back to Earth.
Speaker 4: Is there any way of doing that?
Speaker 3: Or you're just taking that power and utilizing it for
Speaker 3: the needs.
Speaker 4: Like building I data centers in the space.
Speaker 5: I think the case is it's a no brainer for
Speaker 5: building AI solar powered AI data centers in space because
Speaker 5: as you mentioned, it's also very cold in space. If
Speaker 5: if you're in the shadow, it's very cold in space.
Speaker 5: There's three degrees Calvin. So you just have your solar
Speaker 5: panels facing the sun and then a radiator that's like
Speaker 5: point like pointed away from the sun so it has
Speaker 5: no sign incidents, and then it's and then it's just cooling.
Speaker 5: It's a very efficient cooling system. So net effect is
Speaker 5: that the lowest cost place to put AI will be
Speaker 5: space and that'll be true within two years, maybe three
Speaker 5: three of the latest.
Speaker 3: So looking ten or twenty years out, well, how would
Speaker 3: you describe success with AI or space technology?
Speaker 4: And where do you see it is that? Can you?
Speaker 3: Are you more certain what's going to happen to the
Speaker 3: next three years or five or ten.
Speaker 5: I don't know what's going to happen in ten years,
Speaker 5: but the rate at which AI is progressing, I think
Speaker 5: we might have AI that is smater than any human
Speaker 5: by the end of this year. And I'd say no
Speaker 5: later the next year well, and then probably by twenty
Speaker 5: thirty or twenty thirty one could five years from now,
Speaker 5: AI will be smarter than all of humanity collectively.
Speaker 3: We only have a number of minutes left. But I
Speaker 3: want to humanize you for a second, so there's no
Speaker 3: speculation like you're right, pie right, I want to I mean,
Speaker 3: I would frame this question by you are the most
Speaker 3: successful entrepreneur industrialists in the twenty first century, maybe beyond.
Speaker 3: So I want to really get this. You know what
Speaker 3: inspired you? Who's inspired you? What was a foundation of
Speaker 3: your curiosity? And and importantly.
Speaker 4: What was the book? What was it?
Speaker 3: Was there an aha moment epiphany at any time in
Speaker 3: your life and career.
Speaker 5: Well, I mean as a kid, I read a lot
Speaker 5: of science fiction, sci fi, fantasy books we talked about
Speaker 5: and uh, comic books.
Speaker 6: Uh.
Speaker 5: And I always like technology.
Speaker 7: Uh.
Speaker 5: I didn't expect to be where I am today. Seems
Speaker 5: incredibly implausible, but yeah I was. I was inspired by
Speaker 5: reading about books about the future, about science fiction and
Speaker 5: uh and I guess I want to make science fiction
Speaker 5: not fiction forever. At some point turned science fiction to
Speaker 5: science fact. And uh, you know, we want to have
Speaker 5: like Starfleet and star Trek really for for real, like
Speaker 5: where we actually have giants, spaceships traveling through space, going
Speaker 5: to other planets, traveling to other star.
Speaker 3: Systems, beamed up to go back to New York. You know,
Speaker 3: I'd like to just be beamed back to New York
Speaker 3: instead of flying.
Speaker 5: Yeah, star Trek. I guess my my essential what I
Speaker 5: would call the philosophical philussy of curiosity. I'd like to
Speaker 5: understand the meaning of life. You know, the is the
Speaker 5: standard model, is the standard model of physics correct regarding
Speaker 5: the beginning of life, beginning of existence, and the end
Speaker 5: of the year verse. What what questions do we not
Speaker 5: know to ask that we should ask and a I
Speaker 5: will help us with these things. So I'm just trying
Speaker 5: to say, how do we get here, what's going on?
Speaker 5: What's real? Are there aliens? Maybe they are? And if
Speaker 5: we've got if we've got spaceships that are traveling to
Speaker 5: other star systems, we may find we may encounter aliens
Speaker 5: and or may find many long dead alien civilizations. But
Speaker 5: I'm just, I just I just want to know what's
Speaker 5: going on. I'm curious about the universe, and that's my philosophy.
Speaker 3: You see yourself ever going to Mars in your lifetime?
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean I would say, like, you know, that's
Speaker 5: a long commitment.
Speaker 4: I've been asked, wasn't that three years? Each way?
Speaker 5: It's six months?
Speaker 4: Six months? That's all it is.
Speaker 5: Yeah, six months. But the planets only aligned every two years,
Speaker 5: so uh yeah. I've been asked a few times like
Speaker 5: do I want to, you know, die on Moss And
Speaker 5: I'm like, yes, but just not on impact.
Speaker 3: That's a that's a good answer. Anyway, we're out of time.
Speaker 3: I hopefully everybody enjoyed this. I mean, there's so many
Speaker 3: myths around Elon Muss. I can tell you he's a
Speaker 3: great friend and I constantly learned so much from him,
Speaker 3: and I'm totally inspired by what he's what he has done,
Speaker 3: and then it's been inspired who he is. And I'm
Speaker 3: totally inspired by his vision of the future, and I
Speaker 3: don't think it's such a bad future, and I agree
Speaker 3: with his optimism.
Speaker 4: So Elon, thank you.
Speaker 5: Any last words, Well, I think generally, I think my
Speaker 5: last words would be I would encourage everyone to be
Speaker 5: optimistic and excited about the future good and and generally,
Speaker 5: I think for quality of life, it is actually better
Speaker 5: to err on the side of being an optimist and
Speaker 5: wrong rather than a pessimist.
Speaker 4: And right.
Speaker 8: On that note, this is Bloomberg Tech, and that was
Speaker 8: Elon Musk, the world's richest man, CEO of Tesla's SpaceX,
Speaker 8: alongside black Rock CEO Larry Think They're in.
Speaker 9: Davos and Caroline.
Speaker 8: A lot of this is Elon Musk's talking book Things
Speaker 8: We've heard Before, and I was trying to discern, like
Speaker 8: what's new and what's news. We sent the headline on
Speaker 8: the Bloomberg terminal that Tesla could be selling optimists to
Speaker 8: the public their humanoid robot at the end of next year.
Speaker 8: That seemed to move the shares for Tesla. What else
Speaker 8: caught your ear because there.
Speaker 1: Was a lot Yeah, and I think the idea of
Speaker 1: how much more improved optimists will be, how sophisticated it
Speaker 1: will become, and how.
Speaker 10: Many billions will be out there in the world.
Speaker 1: But more broadly, he also talked about where he is
Speaker 1: in terms of Starship, where he aims in terms of space,
Speaker 1: and the idea that they want to be improving full
Speaker 1: the usability.
Speaker 10: For Starship this year.
Speaker 1: And of course then the favorite talk of most CEOs
Speaker 1: at the moment, if you're in the world of AI,
Speaker 1: is putting AI data centers in space and what that
Speaker 1: means and centers a solar energy There was a lot
Speaker 1: talked about in terms of energy.
Speaker 10: Did that take your interest.
Speaker 1: Because really that seems to be the bottleneck of choice
Speaker 1: at the moment.
Speaker 8: Yeah, you know, TESLA has an energy division, right, and
Speaker 8: so it was obvious that he would kind of talk
Speaker 8: that part up. But this is something in the consciousness
Speaker 8: of the administration. The rest of supply chain. China dominates
Speaker 8: supply of solar energy and whatever SpaceX's long term ambitions
Speaker 8: are for data centers in space. Clearly Larry Think tried
Speaker 8: to get Elon Musk to say, Hey, the US and
Speaker 8: Europe should be doing more. Must didn't really bite, but
Speaker 8: he did go as far to say, well, look, this
Speaker 8: is what Tesla and SpaceX are doing over the next
Speaker 8: two to three years. No brainer to have solar powered
Speaker 8: compute and space, but also ramp up the output of
Speaker 8: cells because if you don't sell them into markets like
Speaker 8: Europe China does.
Speaker 1: Precisely, also talking about how cheaper AI could become. We're
Speaker 1: all thinking about the cost of compute, the cost of
Speaker 1: energy if you put those AI data centers in the
Speaker 1: next two to three years. He's saying more broadly, space
Speaker 1: is the cheapest place to put AI in due to
Speaker 1: three years. It's interesting the FT's just been sending a
Speaker 1: headline talking about in your Must, SpaceX lining up four
Speaker 1: banks from IPO.
Speaker 10: So we're all in on the space story right now.
Speaker 8: And he was asked what inspires you, and he said,
Speaker 8: when he was a kid, he read science fiction books.
Speaker 8: So if you're a kid out there watching and you
Speaker 8: want to be the next Zelond Musk, that's what you've
Speaker 8: got to do. We're also tracking and looking at live
Speaker 8: images of Blue Origin's New Shepherd n S thirty eight
Speaker 8: latest mission. We're on a hold right now. The window
Speaker 8: had been due to open eleven am Eastern time, eight
Speaker 8: am here on the West coast for NS thirty eight.
Speaker 8: By this point, ninety people have gone up on Blue Origin,
Speaker 8: but they're on a hold, a technical hold. We'll keep
Speaker 8: tracking it, but you can watch the launch on live
Speaker 8: go on the Bloomberg terminal carry. There is a lot
Speaker 8: going on in financial markets too, there are.
Speaker 1: And more broadly, we're seeing a bit more optimism come
Speaker 1: to life in the markets. Look the geopolitical angst put
Speaker 1: to one side and the optimism returning about all things AI.
Speaker 1: At one point, we're thinking the narrative is all around
Speaker 1: in video and Jensen Wang being bullish once again on
Speaker 1: the trillion dollars of spending that's going to be going
Speaker 1: into the idea of AI data centers, the need for
Speaker 1: But we've also got earnings on deck later today. This
Speaker 1: is something you're going to be digging into. At the moment,
Speaker 1: lawstacks up six tens percent. But look, we're in the
Speaker 1: green across the board when you're looking at every benchmark
Speaker 1: across the entire world.
Speaker 8: Head I'm taking a look at Intel because Intel posts
Speaker 8: after market and even though the chip maker is still
Speaker 8: in battled. The stock has been on a hell of
Speaker 8: a run of late, you know, on the week up
Speaker 8: almost fifteen percent, on track for its best week I
Speaker 8: think in quite a long time. But right now we're
Speaker 8: treading water. Of course we are, why because we'll wait
Speaker 8: and see actually the meat of what comes out of
Speaker 8: that earnings print again, which is after the market close
Speaker 8: around four pm Eastern time. Carry there are many news
Speaker 8: stories as well.
Speaker 1: There are in the private markets too. And guess what
Speaker 1: open ayes fundraising. We knew that, but the CEO of
Speaker 1: sam Altman has been really busy traveling in the Middle East.
Speaker 1: He's been meeting with top investors in an effort really
Speaker 1: to secure funding from an investment round that could total
Speaker 1: get this fifty billion dollars, it's according to sources in
Speaker 1: meerg suring KAfari joining us to cover the story. I mean,
Speaker 1: the valuations are gargantuan. We're thinking up to eight hundred
Speaker 1: and thirty billion dollars as where it could be. But
Speaker 1: the focus on the Middle East perhaps unsurprising for these
Speaker 1: foundation AI labs.
Speaker 11: That's right, when you think about the pools of capital
Speaker 11: that are required for these kinds of mega fundraising rounds.
Speaker 11: You're tapping beyond the usual network of Silicon Valley vcs
Speaker 11: or even New York finance firms, right, and so that's
Speaker 11: why you see CEOs like zam Altment traveling to places
Speaker 11: like Abu Dhabi to court investors.
Speaker 8: Sharen, you know, we have tried to track this as
Speaker 8: closely as possible. I think one of the things reading
Speaker 8: the report is the detail of what we know about
Speaker 8: how Sam Altman operates, the travel, who he meets with,
Speaker 8: the specific names behind the sovereign wealth funds, and the jurisdictions.
Speaker 9: He's going to give us.
Speaker 8: All the detail you can give us a good insight
Speaker 8: in what he's trying to pull off.
Speaker 11: I mean, if you think about it, this is a
Speaker 11: time when there is great interest in the Middle East
Speaker 11: and other regions tapping into the AI boom. There are
Speaker 11: also other companies fundraising. We know Anthropic is also you know,
Speaker 11: set to finalize around very soon as we've reported, you know,
Speaker 11: SpaceX maybe going IPO, but in the past they've also
Speaker 11: been fundraising. So we have you know, a limited even
Speaker 11: when you get to these larger pools of capital that
Speaker 11: extend beyond the US's ability in terms of ec firms.
Speaker 11: You're still a limit to how much these sovereign wealth
Speaker 11: funds can give. So it requires travel, requires relationships, right,
Speaker 11: It requires going out and actually meeting people, shaking hands
Speaker 11: and hopefully securing a deal.
Speaker 8: This is a big deal what we're hearing right, just
Speaker 8: to recap fifty billion dollar target raise, seven hundred and
Speaker 8: fifty billion to eight hundred and thirty billion dollar valuation.
Speaker 8: A lot of eyes on it, Bloomberg Sheren Gafari leaving
Speaker 8: the team that's been reporting and tracking it.
Speaker 10: Apple.
Speaker 1: It's set to Revampsari later this year, turning the digital
Speaker 1: assistant into the company's first AI chatbot the future is
Speaker 1: set to be integrated into Apple's lineup of iPhones, iPads,
Speaker 1: mac operating systems. Consumer tech editor Mark gum And broke
Speaker 1: the details. You join us now, Mark, It's interesting how
Speaker 1: much they're depending on Google technology potentially on their servers
Speaker 1: as well.
Speaker 10: But this is quite a move to be going to
Speaker 10: the chatbot form.
Speaker 12: This is a blockbuster move for Apple for the last
Speaker 12: several months, even in light of the new sery being
Speaker 12: delayed and not launching on time a year and a
Speaker 12: half ago, Even in light of the box launch and
Speaker 12: the delayed Apple Intelligence. Apple was steadfast and saying that
Speaker 12: it doesn't believe in the chatbot route that OpenAI is taking,
Speaker 12: the chat GPT that Google's taking with Gemini, that Microsoft
Speaker 12: is taken with Copilot. But everyone who's used these chatbots
Speaker 12: to know that this is at the very center of
Speaker 12: the generative AI battleground. Chat GPT is nearing a billion
Speaker 12: monthly active users right It's clearly resonating, and so Apple
Speaker 12: knows it needs to go in this direction, and it's
Speaker 12: doing exactly what it needs to do to make its
Speaker 12: consumers happy and to keep selling its devices and keeping
Speaker 12: its operating system in line with the future. So at
Speaker 12: the end of this year, they're going to Vampserie into
Speaker 12: a chatbot, and it's going to be far more capable
Speaker 12: than what you're seeing from chatbots today, having those features,
Speaker 12: having web search, but also having deep ties into Apple's
Speaker 12: devices allowing you to control specific apps and features.
Speaker 8: It's interesting to see the shares up about nine tens
Speaker 8: percent after the reporting, and when I read the report,
Speaker 8: it's clear Siri will be fundamentally different. But is this
Speaker 8: a direct result mark of that agreement that Apple reached
Speaker 8: with Google for Gemini to underpin this next gen of series.
Speaker 9: That kind of what the unlock has been.
Speaker 12: That has been the unlock for them to bring this
Speaker 12: to market. This is a concept that they've had for
Speaker 12: a while now, using their internal models that they've built
Speaker 12: for Syrian Apple Intelligence a couple of years ago. But
Speaker 12: based on all the delays and based on all the
Speaker 12: issues the companies had, it would have been impossible to
Speaker 12: launch that with their internal models because it just wouldn't
Speaker 12: work well, it would be subpar, and they would have
Speaker 12: crisis round two.
Speaker 5: For their AI strategy.
Speaker 12: So yes, as you said, partnering with Google for Gemini
Speaker 12: has been the unlock to actually bring this to market. Now,
Speaker 12: there are some important details here. There is a new
Speaker 12: version of Serie launching in the coming months in the
Speaker 12: first half of this year, likely around March of April,
Speaker 12: that brings to market features they announced two years ago
Speaker 12: in twenty twenty four at their Developer conference, the assistant
Speaker 12: being able to tap into personal data, being able to
Speaker 12: know what's on your screen, precise control of applications in
Speaker 12: the operating system, and to do that, they're using a
Speaker 12: custom Gemini model that mixes with their internal models, runs
Speaker 12: in the cloud on Apple servers.
Speaker 5: But this chatbot is so powerful.
Speaker 12: And needs to have as much functionality as possible to
Speaker 12: really compete with open ai and what Google Microsoft offered today.
Speaker 4: So what they're.
Speaker 12: Discussing doing is actually running this Gemini model on Google's
Speaker 12: cloud platform services as well as on Google TPUs, which
Speaker 12: is a big sea change for what Apple is doing
Speaker 12: currently with Gemini.
Speaker 8: Yeah, we've talked about the TPU unlock as well. Bluemos
Speaker 8: Mark Gunman backstrong with a big scoop, Thank you very much.
Speaker 8: Let's tend to chips that power ai. Ali Baba is
Speaker 8: preparing to ipo it's chip making tahead. Bloomberg's executive editor
Speaker 8: for Tech leading the Asia, Tmpter Elstrom joins us, Now,
Speaker 8: this is interesting. It's kind of a TUFA. We know
Speaker 8: from our reporting they're planning to ipo this unit, but
Speaker 8: in the interim they're also going to restructure it.
Speaker 9: What do we need to know?
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 13: It's a two step process that Ali Baba is looking
Speaker 13: at here. They're going to begin by restructuring the ownership
Speaker 13: of the company, allowing employees to own some of the
Speaker 13: shares here, and then later on they plan on taking
Speaker 13: it public. Now, This is an interesting move by Ali Baba.
Speaker 13: Ali Baba, course is an e commerce company at its core,
Speaker 13: it's been diversifying into a number of different areas, including AI.
Speaker 13: They have one of the leading AI models in China
Speaker 13: with its Gwen platform, and they've been working on this
Speaker 13: chip effort too. It's a bit like Amazon's push into
Speaker 13: being able to develop their own AI chips and Google's
Speaker 13: you talked about the TPUs. It's an interesting strategic move
Speaker 13: by Ali Baba because they're deciding that they do want
Speaker 13: to go ahead and spin off that chip unit. See
Speaker 13: if they can give it some independence, give it some
Speaker 13: give some ownership to the employees so that they have
Speaker 13: a motivation to be able to competitive. But then they
Speaker 13: have a very big market to address here, and they
Speaker 13: have some very significant competitors in China and of course
Speaker 13: beyond shan It too.
Speaker 1: More threats technologies just listed camera con technologies briefly.
Speaker 10: Peter.
Speaker 1: The context of the support from China on.
Speaker 13: This, well, this is a national policy, as we've talked
Speaker 13: about a number of times before the US is cut
Speaker 13: off in Vidia from selling its most advanced chips into China.
Speaker 13: In Beijing, that's seen as a very serious threat. They
Speaker 13: want to have some domestic alternatives to that. So they
Speaker 13: have a number of domestic players that are coming on
Speaker 13: strong wilways leading the way. Camera Con is probably second.
Speaker 13: Camera Con is unknown in the West, really, but it's
Speaker 13: eighty billion dollar company. They're doing quite well. And so
Speaker 13: companies like Ali Baba and more Threads and some of
Speaker 13: the other small players see a golden opportunity here. If
Speaker 13: they can develop the technology for these AI chips, they're
Speaker 13: going to have a very vibrant domestic market.
Speaker 1: I do also looking at doing something similar Peter Elstrom
Speaker 1: great breakdown.
Speaker 10: We thank you.
Speaker 8: The idea that China is behind in AI is a
Speaker 8: fairy tale. Those are the words from Alfa Mench, CEO
Speaker 8: of Miestrow, AI, Europe's only large language model player. He
Speaker 8: spoke with Bloomberg's Gumana Bassecci in Davos, and he also
Speaker 8: weighed in on whether European companies stand to benefit from
Speaker 8: enterprises looking to move away from US providers for geopolitical
Speaker 8: really reasons.
Speaker 9: Listen to this.
Speaker 14: It certainly is a growing topic top of mine in
Speaker 14: the CEO's mind of enterprises that their dependency to single
Speaker 14: providers when it comes to digital services might become a
Speaker 14: problem and is not a great answer to the verlatility
Speaker 14: that we observed in the world. So it's true in Europe,
Speaker 14: but it's also true outside of Europe. It's true in
Speaker 14: the US with Southern accounts, it's true in Canada, it's
Speaker 14: through in the Southeast Asian region where we will create
Speaker 14: a lot as well. So we do see that the
Speaker 14: technology we've built in the differentiation of it, which is
Speaker 14: that you can customize and deploy wherever you want, is
Speaker 14: something that does resonate with the geopolitical events.
Speaker 9: Yeah.
Speaker 7: Well, staying with the geopolitics, one of my colleagues spoke
Speaker 7: to the Anthropics CEO earlier this week and on China.
Speaker 7: He thought that the idea of sending advanced chips there,
Speaker 7: and this is a quote, is crazy and said it's
Speaker 7: a bit like selling nuclear weapons in North Korea.
Speaker 9: What's your view, Well, I.
Speaker 4: Think the I don't think this is true.
Speaker 14: It turns out that China does very well without Nvidia chips.
Speaker 14: We've seen China rise on the open source count and
Speaker 14: we have been at misstyle. Basically the spearhead of open
Speaker 14: source in the West outside.
Speaker 10: Of China is China behind the West.
Speaker 14: China is not behind the West. I think this is
Speaker 14: a this is a itail in the I. They are
Speaker 14: very much at piety and the year ahead is going
Speaker 14: to be extremely interesting. Respect we care about Europe maintaining
Speaker 14: its position, Europe maintaining its ability to train models because
Speaker 14: we don't think that we should rely on open source
Speaker 14: Chinese models in very critical applications. So we need to
Speaker 14: be able to create our own models and to sell
Speaker 14: them to enterprises. So it's going to be very interesting.
Speaker 14: But it's a fairy tale that China is behind.
Speaker 10: Let's talk about your own business. Do you have a
Speaker 10: revenue goal for this year?
Speaker 5: Yeah, we do.
Speaker 14: We should cross a billion by the end of the year.
Speaker 7: Okay, And in terms of CAPEX spending, what are you
Speaker 7: factoring in?
Speaker 14: We are about to do around a billion in cape
Speaker 14: expanding this year on our endevor Mistile compute, which is
Speaker 14: what we've done last year, is to start and build
Speaker 14: our clusters and to feel some of the data centers
Speaker 14: we're renting with these clusters. The idea being that because
Speaker 14: we have the hardware with the software platform, because we
Speaker 14: know how to build the models and the applications on top,
Speaker 14: combining them.
Speaker 10: With the GPUs is a.
Speaker 14: Way to get to that integrated stock aicloud services that
Speaker 14: I compitting with some of the other fully integrated for vetas.
Speaker 1: Misterie CEO Arthur mench there along with Bloomberg's Jamana Bassecci.
Speaker 1: But as we've just heard that, the status of China's
Speaker 1: AI progress has come up repeatedly at Davos yesterday we
Speaker 1: heard Google Deep Mind CEO Demis Hasibus say that China
Speaker 1: was a missed six months behind the West. These comments
Speaker 1: come as politicians have been more focused, of course, some
Speaker 1: tensions between the US and Europe, perhaps from than the
Speaker 1: AI race with China. Let's discuss the airas with China.
Speaker 1: Eliza Tobin, imagining director at Gano Global, your expertise is
Speaker 1: so important you are, and there's a special competitive studies project.
Speaker 10: You were also helping with national.
Speaker 1: Security at the government level and the China director of
Speaker 1: their lizas, so are you on the idea that it's
Speaker 1: a fairy tale that they're behind that actually they are
Speaker 1: in lockstep with the United States in terms of AI
Speaker 1: agility and compute power.
Speaker 15: Well, good morning, Caroline, is great to be on with you. Yes,
Speaker 15: So a couple of things can be true. At the
Speaker 15: same time, China is absolutely going gangbusters in AI on
Speaker 15: innovation at several layers of the stack. You know, they're
Speaker 15: doing amazing things in open source models and applications, and
Speaker 15: of course at the energy level, where America's number one
Speaker 15: advantage still lies is in computing power at scale. I
Speaker 15: think that's widely agreed upon. You know, Jensen Wong in
Speaker 15: his interview at Davos on Fox was acknowledging this when
Speaker 15: he was talking about the demand constraints that he's facing
Speaker 15: and how these this uh, you know, the just growing
Speaker 15: demand for a limited supply of these AI chips is
Speaker 15: actually growing right now. And so that's why it's somewhat ironic.
Speaker 8: And unfortunately let me let me just jump in here, sure, Liz,
Speaker 8: let me jump in. Jensen Wong may have said that
Speaker 8: in that interview, but Jensen Wan has got a vested
Speaker 8: interest to drive the sales of what is the world's
Speaker 8: most valuable company in a market he said is a
Speaker 8: potential fifty billion dollar market. Right What he doesn't address
Speaker 8: is the concern of those that basically don't think the
Speaker 8: balance is right exporting some deprecated technology still being a
Speaker 8: national security risk in part because it allows China to
Speaker 8: catch up, which is the debate of dabos with having
Speaker 8: Have they got that balance right to your mind?
Speaker 15: No, the current policy in the United States doesn't they are.
Speaker 15: The policy to license H two hundred chips to China
Speaker 15: is giving them a lifeline right where they.
Speaker 5: Need it most.
Speaker 15: You know, the compute advantage that the United States has
Speaker 15: was poised to grow exponentially if the controls stay in place.
Speaker 15: But President Trump and Jensen Wong, for the reasons you
Speaker 15: suggest in video, wants a foothold in the China market.
Speaker 15: What's ironic, of course, is that now Shi Jinping is
Speaker 15: waffling about whether he's even going to let his companies
Speaker 15: buy many of these H two hundred chips because he
Speaker 15: wants to make sure that much of the demand is
Speaker 15: going to the domestic chip makers.
Speaker 1: What's interesting is many would say, we need all of
Speaker 1: technology across the world built on underlying US chips, and
Speaker 1: that's the argument to keep them going into China. Liza,
Speaker 1: do you have much credence to that? Are you more
Speaker 1: looking at Representative Brian Mast You're saying basically that Jensen
Speaker 1: Wang has paid you and your paid minions, he says,
Speaker 1: are fighting to sell millions of advans Ai chips to
Speaker 1: Chinese military companies like Alic, Barbar and Tencent.
Speaker 15: Yeah, it's interesting that Jensen Wang is trying to shift
Speaker 15: the narrative away from the military aspects of AI.
Speaker 4: Of course, these chips.
Speaker 15: Are inherently dual use in China has a military civil
Speaker 15: fusion system in place where you can't guarantee that once
Speaker 15: these chips get into China that they won't make them
Speaker 15: available for military use. That's just a fantasy that we
Speaker 15: can sort of control that. And so, but you see
Speaker 15: that thatnarrative of these things potentially being used for military
Speaker 15: or intelligence uses is inconvenient, so and Huang is trying
Speaker 15: to kind of pivot away from that.
Speaker 8: Liza Tobin of Ghano Global, thank you. These are live
Speaker 8: pictures West Texas, Van Horn and Blue Origins Launchpad New
Speaker 8: Shepherd thirty eight.
Speaker 9: Let's listen in. We're braced for lift off.
Speaker 16: Fie for commander Sorry two one zero, Hi.
Speaker 2: Father you.
Speaker 5: Careful person eleven thousand feet.
Speaker 6: All right, New Shepherd of Pets. Take a look on
Speaker 6: your screen on the left hand side of the screen.
Speaker 6: You'll be able to follow along with our telemetry giving
Speaker 6: you altom code and speed, and then on the bottom
Speaker 6: right hand side of the screen you'll be able to
Speaker 6: see how far we are in S thirty eighth flight.
Speaker 8: Okay, you are watching live images of Blue Orangins NS
Speaker 8: thirty eight New Shepherd mission carrying the six latest astronauts
Speaker 8: commercial passengers to just above the Carmen line out of
Speaker 8: Van Horn, West, Texas. We've just hit max Q, the
Speaker 8: moment of maximum aerodynamic pressure or stress on that vehicle.
Speaker 8: The Blue Origin New Shepherd design relies on its own
Speaker 8: B three pm engine, where the propellant is a mix
Speaker 8: of hydrogen and oxygen, the byproduct of which is water.
Speaker 8: For those chemistry nerds of you that are out there
Speaker 8: and Carrow, you know, we cover this because it is
Speaker 8: the evidence of the development of commercial space. You have
Speaker 8: six people on board, some of them have paid for
Speaker 8: the privilege. We don't know how much because they don't
Speaker 8: disclose it, just for sixty seconds of weightlessness in space
Speaker 8: in what Blue Origin says are the biggest windows to
Speaker 8: ever go into space.
Speaker 1: And by now this is almost becoming regular and ninety
Speaker 1: humans above the Carmen line have been flown by Blue Origin.
Speaker 10: Thus fur right, so we're.
Speaker 1: Starting to see the cadence build up and where does
Speaker 1: that push Blue Origin in terms of its next steps
Speaker 1: in commercialization.
Speaker 8: Again, Blue Origin is a multifaceted business. So what you're
Speaker 8: watching on your screen now, as the combined vehicle makes
Speaker 8: its way up to that Carmon line, you have the
Speaker 8: third stage booster and then the caps you're on top.
Speaker 8: This is space tourism essentially, right. They will also argue
Speaker 8: that it provides a zero gravity environment even for sixty
Speaker 8: seconds to do scientific experimentation. But the news last night
Speaker 8: Blue Origin is also working on a starlink competitor, right,
Speaker 8: satellite based and consolation based connectivity. Then they have a
Speaker 8: more powerful rocket, new Glen, which is used for a
Speaker 8: wide range of commercial applications. But putting satellite deployment into
Speaker 8: low Earth orbit, we're about three minutes into this mission.
Speaker 9: We expect that the separation.
Speaker 8: To happen imminently, and then what you have is that
Speaker 8: three minute, thirty seconds mark Carrow. Those six passengers goes
Speaker 8: to the Carmen line, which is the kind of recognized
Speaker 8: boundary of space where they'll get out, undo their seat
Speaker 8: belts and float around looking out of the window. And
Speaker 8: again some of them paid hundreds of thousands. We don't
Speaker 8: have a specific number for the privilege of doing that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and some of the names might be known to
Speaker 1: many Tim Drexler, for example, but a lot of entrepreneurial names,
Speaker 1: some obstetricians or in there.
Speaker 10: But we've got T.
Speaker 1: Drexel, Lilinda Edwards, Alane Fernanand's, for example, among the six
Speaker 1: that are currently in that capsule.
Speaker 10: And there was a slight delay to it.
Speaker 1: We understand that there wasnown unauthorized personnel and the line
Speaker 1: of the rocket as to why it was pushed back
Speaker 1: that little.
Speaker 10: Bit on the day.
Speaker 1: But talk us through the risks of any of what
Speaker 1: has become standardized practice.
Speaker 8: Every launch that involves human payload, humans on board is
Speaker 8: a risk. The hold on this case, the delay, if
Speaker 8: you like, was because of unauthorized personnel on range, but
Speaker 8: that is a very wide radius. You have to control
Speaker 8: both the eight airspace and on the ground subject to
Speaker 8: itar restrictions because it's a rocket. At the end of
Speaker 8: the day. The view that you're looking at is just
Speaker 8: switch right. So you can see those two white dots
Speaker 8: if you squint and you look very closely, one is
Speaker 8: the capsule and one is the booster there's kind of
Speaker 8: rapidly coming back down to Earth. And what will happen
Speaker 8: very very soon, because we're at the four minutes thirty
Speaker 8: second mark, is those inside the capsule, the six of them,
Speaker 8: will get a one minute warning where they've been through
Speaker 8: this training process where they'll buckle themselves back in, and
Speaker 8: then it's good old fashioned rocket science where the flat
Speaker 8: bottom of the capsule and Earth's gravitational pool brings it
Speaker 8: back down into Earth's atmosphere and we can kind of
Speaker 8: go from that.
Speaker 1: And we can continue this is like a ten minute
Speaker 1: process and we're already as you say, at the halfway
Speaker 1: point ed. We can go to Lolngrush, who helps cover
Speaker 1: all things space across our network and platforms for us,
Speaker 1: and this seems to be going all according to plan
Speaker 1: as we think. But space very much in line of
Speaker 1: sight of investors at the moment, but also of the market.
Speaker 10: Well broadly, we're thinking.
Speaker 1: About Elon Musk's just come off stage over at Davos
Speaker 1: talking about how his reusable giant rocket might be there
Speaker 1: by the end of this year in terms of re usability.
Speaker 17: Yes, that is the ultimate goal of Starship, which they've
Speaker 17: been pursuing for some time for reusability. You know, actually
Speaker 17: the New Shepherd is a fully reusable system, but it
Speaker 17: obviously does not go to orbit, and so Starship is
Speaker 17: really trying to accomplish a feat that no one has
Speaker 17: been able to before. And Elon just said that they
Speaker 17: hope to get to full reusability sometime this year. That
Speaker 17: would be a major accomplishment if they can make it happen.
Speaker 17: And we'll obviously be keeping an eye out on those
Speaker 17: Starship test flights, which are always so fun, but yeah,
Speaker 17: that will be a big moment if they can make
Speaker 17: it happen.
Speaker 8: We got Bloomberg's Lauren Grass, she leads our coverage on space,
Speaker 8: and on the left hand side of your screen, we've
Speaker 8: got the downward camera on the New Shepherd booster as
Speaker 8: it returns down to Earth for about six minutes in Lauren,
Speaker 8: booster descending, and then the capsule when any second will
Speaker 8: start descending by the way, peeking at like four to
Speaker 8: five G on the way around. Karen and I were
Speaker 8: talking about how we carry this right because it's an
Speaker 8: expensive endeavor for space tourism, but Blue origins business as
Speaker 8: we see that that booster coming down is multifaceted what's
Speaker 8: the big priority for Blue right now.
Speaker 17: Well, it actually comes at a really interesting time. They
Speaker 17: just announced the third upcoming flight for their New Glen rocket.
Speaker 17: That's their much larger orbital rocket that they've launched twice
Speaker 17: now and successfully landed on a barge on that second flight. Now,
Speaker 17: New Glen is not fully reusable the second stage, the
Speaker 17: upper portion of the rocket does not come back, but
Speaker 17: they were able to achieve that partial reusability with the
Speaker 17: second flight. So they're really getting into full swing with
Speaker 17: their launch business. And so hopefully just as these new
Speaker 17: Shepherd flights are becoming routine, new Glenn flights will become
Speaker 17: routine as well.
Speaker 1: And we have at this moment the booster landing. Will
Speaker 1: see if they note it successfully it's seven minute, ten
Speaker 1: second mark. It's going to make for a beautiful picture.
Speaker 1: It just took us through the complex nature of a
Speaker 1: boosta landing.
Speaker 8: Well, booster fools three fall through the air using air
Speaker 8: resistance physics.
Speaker 9: Then it ignites that B.
Speaker 8: Three and smoothly touches down a little needle in the
Speaker 8: haystat landing a pin in the middle of the West
Speaker 8: Texas desert.
Speaker 9: Kind of moment character, isn't it?
Speaker 1: Just so there we are boost a touchdown is hit
Speaker 1: at the moment we're t plus seven thirty nine forty
Speaker 1: let's call it capsule reacquired comes at eight minutes, Lauren.
Speaker 1: And all of this is being remind us financed how
Speaker 1: people are obviously paying their way to a certain extent,
Speaker 1: and we don't know exactly who, but this is still
Speaker 1: VC backed very much the endeavor of Amazon founder Jeff Bezos.
Speaker 17: Right, I mean, as you mentioned before, passengers plate pay
Speaker 17: some undisclosed sum to fly on these these flights. But yes,
Speaker 17: I mean Blue Origin is by far very big passion
Speaker 17: of Jeff Bezos, and he has been primarily the funder
Speaker 17: of the endeavor for some time now. Obviously, the goal
Speaker 17: is to move away from that system, to have more
Speaker 17: and more customers, and to eventually become a profitable business.
Speaker 17: You know, that will either that's through satellite contracts, launch contracts.
Speaker 9: Things like that.
Speaker 17: And then also Blue Origin just announced a new mega
Speaker 17: constellation to be a competitor to Starlink, so they have
Speaker 17: a lot of different revenue streams coming in hopefully soon, Lauren.
Speaker 8: We just saw the drogue shoots and then the main
Speaker 8: shoots deploy on the New Shepherd capsule on its way down.
Speaker 8: Now it's chill, you're just floating and by the time
Speaker 8: you boost a landing speed like six miles per hour.
Speaker 8: So we will wait for that over the course of
Speaker 8: the next two minutes to ensure that the capsule lands safely.
Speaker 8: You just talked about the business of consolation based satellite.
Speaker 8: We talked earlier in the conversation about Blue Origins efforts
Speaker 8: that news last night. We also are trying to keep
Speaker 8: on top of Elon Musk's appearance at Davos, which you
Speaker 8: and I were both tuned in for. Right He did
Speaker 8: talk about starship and some of the broader kind of
Speaker 8: academic questions around space based data center as best you
Speaker 8: can just give us a summary of that while we
Speaker 8: await the Blue Origin capsule touching down.
Speaker 17: Sure, so, as Elon indicated, he's a very big fan
Speaker 17: of solar power. One of the justifications for moving data
Speaker 17: centers into space is depending on where you put them,
Speaker 17: you can have this constant access to solar power, which,
Speaker 17: as people who know much about AI and the data
Speaker 17: center industry here on Earth, power constraints can actually be
Speaker 17: a huge limiting factor. So moving to space, the likes
Speaker 17: of Elon and other billionaires, even Jeff Bezos have talked
Speaker 17: about perhaps, you know, tapping into that solar power to
Speaker 17: get near constant access to sunlight that can then power
Speaker 17: these data centers that do all this complex computing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we heard Musks saying really in the next two
Speaker 1: to three years, space is going to be the cheapest
Speaker 1: place to put AI.
Speaker 10: And there, look, we have the landing touchdown chill ed
Speaker 10: as you called it. It looks like quite a lot of
Speaker 10: dust being blown up.
Speaker 8: If you're going up at three g's and you're coming
Speaker 8: down at four to five d's, but the moment you
Speaker 8: touch the ground is just like a little then that's
Speaker 8: what I meant by chill. But again we talked about
Speaker 8: this being routine and sorry to interrupt, Carr. You will
Speaker 8: wait for confirmation from Blue but as it stands, you know,
Speaker 8: another successful mission.
Speaker 10: It is seemingly successful.
Speaker 1: We'll check in on those succes astronauts as they're known,
Speaker 1: and what the common line touching and the zero gravity
Speaker 1: feel was like for each individual. Lauren, We though always
Speaker 1: come back on Bloomberg to the financing of this and
Speaker 1: we all wait potentially twenty twenty six an enormous IPO
Speaker 1: of SpaceX as well.
Speaker 10: That must be something you're tuned in for.
Speaker 3: Oh.
Speaker 4: Absolutely.
Speaker 17: I think the entire space industry is kind of on.
Speaker 4: Pins and needles awaiting.
Speaker 17: How this IPO will play out. And obviously, as we mentioned,
Speaker 17: one of the big fueling the things fueling the IPO
Speaker 17: is this concept of raising capital capital for space data centers.
Speaker 17: So I think it'll have a very sizable impact on
Speaker 17: the entire space industry, not just SpaceX. I've spoken to
Speaker 17: a number of experts who think that this will open
Speaker 17: the door for even more investment in the space industry,
Speaker 17: which is sometimes cannsidered, very niche. So I think even
Speaker 17: the competitors of SpaceX are probably pretty excited to see
Speaker 17: how this plays out.
Speaker 8: We're going to move away from West Texas, and when
Speaker 8: Blue Origin confirms all as well, we'll bring it to
Speaker 8: the audience and go back to Elon Musk at Davos
Speaker 8: and let's listen to some of what he had to
Speaker 8: say on stage.
Speaker 5: Probably sometime next year. I'd say that by the end
Speaker 5: of next year, I think would be selling humanoid robots
Speaker 5: to the public. That's when we are confident that it's
Speaker 5: very higher liability very high safety and the range of
Speaker 5: functionality is also very high. You can basically ask if
Speaker 5: to do anything you'd like.
Speaker 8: Well, that was the timeline prediction that moved markets. Tesla
Speaker 8: Schees rose when Musk said that Musk often misses his
Speaker 8: own deadlines in the space context, Lauren, that's your domain,
Speaker 8: Just real quick, What were the kind of timelines that
Speaker 8: he gave, if any on that part of his business?
Speaker 17: Right? So he said, The things that I took note
Speaker 17: of are the fact that he thinks that space will
Speaker 17: be the cheapest place for AI data centers to be
Speaker 17: in the next two to three years. Obviously, I think
Speaker 17: that might be a very ambitious timeline as well. Jeff
Speaker 17: Bezos has given a timeline of ten years in order
Speaker 17: for it to be economically feasible, and I spoke to
Speaker 17: another expert who mentioned that makes a little bit more sense.
Speaker 17: And then on the starship front, as we mentioned, he
Speaker 17: talked about getting to full reusability sometime this year. Again,
Speaker 17: that's going to be a very big feat if and
Speaker 17: when they pull it off. I can't say speak to
Speaker 17: whether or not they will do it this year, but
Speaker 17: they've obviously been doing these periodic test flights of starship
Speaker 17: in order to reach that goal, and so either way,
Speaker 17: it should be very exciting to watch as they incrementally
Speaker 17: get closer to that development.
Speaker 1: And Lauren, you'll be along the way for us as always,
Speaker 1: guiding absolutely show and across platform.
Speaker 10: Thanks you so much.
Speaker 1: Blomberg's longrush on all Things space. We're just talking about
Speaker 1: Elo Musk at Davos. What he said, others have been
Speaker 1: there too, funny enough. Doc Trace CEO Jill Papelka, and
Speaker 1: she says that AI has quote democratized cyber attacks and
Speaker 1: there needs to be a shift towards sophisticated defenses to
Speaker 1: protect businesses. To play with Brineberg's Francin Laqua on the
Speaker 1: sidelines of twenty twenty six, Well Economic Forum, take listen.
Speaker 2: The threats are becoming more sophisticated, they're becoming more complex.
Speaker 2: And whereas before we might have thought about being attacker
Speaker 2: centric and trying to predict what the attacker was going
Speaker 2: to do.
Speaker 9: Next, that's not what dark Trace has ever.
Speaker 2: Done, and it's definitely not what we can do moving
Speaker 2: forward because we can't predict this high velocity, high threat landscape.
Speaker 2: We know that countries like Japan, for example, they used
Speaker 2: to have a natural barrier because their language was more
Speaker 2: complex and people couldn't.
Speaker 9: Quite get there.
Speaker 2: You know, the cyber attackers couldn't get their heads around
Speaker 2: creating an attack in Japanese. But now AI can create
Speaker 2: those complex, highly sophisticated threats in any language around the world.
Speaker 2: And so right we're looking at a much higher velocity
Speaker 2: threat landscape.
Speaker 18: So is AI and cybersecurity much more sophisticated than even
Speaker 18: twelve months?
Speaker 2: Oh, of course it's becoming more and more sophisticated. We
Speaker 2: have the most amazing minds in Cambridge, people who are
Speaker 2: linguistics majors, people who have majored in the classics. But
Speaker 2: now looking at how is this AI challenged for us?
Speaker 2: How do we protect the world against it?
Speaker 18: So, after a dark TRACE's acquisition by Thomas Bravo and
Speaker 18: the shift to operating privately, how has that changed your
Speaker 18: focus and investment strategy?
Speaker 2: You know, dark Trace was already changing and so the
Speaker 2: transition into private equity ownership really was it that big
Speaker 2: a deal for us? We were continuing on our path
Speaker 2: of innovating and creating the latest and greatest products. We
Speaker 2: were also working on scaling our business, so we had
Speaker 2: become really a seven hundred million dollar startup, and then
Speaker 2: we needed to ensure that our systems and our processes
Speaker 2: and our talent acquisition and all the different things that
Speaker 2: big companies do that we were doing those really well.
Speaker 18: Also, are the cyber threats coming from government agents or
Speaker 18: like you know, government entities, or what can you tell
Speaker 18: us about where the biggest threat is coming from?
Speaker 2: You know what's interesting is AI has democratized cyber attacks.
Speaker 2: It's like it's democratize so many other things, and so
Speaker 2: it doesn't it doesn't really matter where it's coming from.
Speaker 2: From a dark Trace perspective, we're going to protect you
Speaker 2: from a nation state actor, just like we're going to
Speaker 2: protect you from a Western teenager at his garage, you know,
Speaker 2: having a heyday with AI that day. So it's not
Speaker 2: it's not so much about being attacker centric. What we
Speaker 2: do want to think about, though, is how we get
Speaker 2: every anomaly and how we ensure that we're protecting from this.
Speaker 8: That was dark Trace CEO Jill Papelco, along with Bloomberg's
Speaker 8: friend Scene Lacua now coming up, a startup aiming to
Speaker 8: outperform today's AI accelerators, has attracted one hundred and ten
Speaker 8: million dollars in Series AID funding. Neurofos CEO Patrick Bowen,
Speaker 8: an M twelve managing partner Michael Stewart join us.
Speaker 9: Next. This is Bloomberg Tech.
Speaker 8: Hei chip startup Neurofoss has closed a one hundred and
Speaker 8: ten million dollar Series A funding round. The company makes
Speaker 8: an optical processing unit with over a million micron scale
Speaker 8: optical elements on a single chain. They rely on light
Speaker 8: to transmit data. It claims this OPU delivers up to
Speaker 8: one hundred x of the performance and energy efficiency of
Speaker 8: current leading GPUs and accelerated cards. Let's get to it,
Speaker 8: Patrick Burron, you're a FOSS co founder and CEO and
Speaker 8: Michael Stewart managing partner at M twelve formerly known as
Speaker 8: Microsoft Venture Fund. Patrick, the devil's in the detail here,
Speaker 8: the use of light to transmit data instead of electrons.
Speaker 8: And again I'm not an engineer, but what is this
Speaker 8: OPU design that you're developing.
Speaker 19: It's essentially designed to be a drop in replacement for
Speaker 19: a GPU, but actually runs fifty to one hundred times
Speaker 19: both faster and with fifty to one hundred times higher
Speaker 19: row energy. Of use case in the inference use case,
Speaker 19: not for training.
Speaker 8: That's right, you're an engineer by trade, by background. But
Speaker 8: then you go to the dark side Aventure capital, Why
Speaker 8: back this project? You know you're going to tell me
Speaker 8: that there's a gap, there's a problem being solved for here.
Speaker 8: There are lots of inference solutions out there, different technological underpinning,
Speaker 8: but why this one.
Speaker 20: Our investment focus is on the data center of the future,
Speaker 20: and by and large, the industry has committed massive amounts
Speaker 20: of capital to scaling the technology that we know and understand,
Speaker 20: and from our investment thesis, our investment aims, we're really
Speaker 20: looking for what is far beyond the state of the
Speaker 20: art to disrupt that, particularly towards the end of the decade.
Speaker 20: And what Patrick and his team have developed is really
Speaker 20: it's not just a new technique that's cool because it
Speaker 20: uses light, but it really delivers demonstrable benefits to the
Speaker 20: energy needed for the compute and in a way that
Speaker 20: we think could change the game. So that's something we
Speaker 20: can underwrite as the fund and we think it could
Speaker 20: impact Microsoft, but also the industry at large.
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm interested in Patrick on the next set of
Speaker 1: data centers are meant to be being built in space
Speaker 1: if you're listening to.
Speaker 10: Elo mask over at Devils today.
Speaker 1: I'm interested as to whether that is something that you
Speaker 1: think is applicable to your technology and how you think
Speaker 1: they're going to beating what are quite a lot of
Speaker 1: competitors out there. There's Light Matter, IA Labs, Runovs for example.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Absolutely.
Speaker 19: I think the thing is wherever you go, whether it's
Speaker 19: in space or it's on Earth, AI is fundamentally hardware limited,
Speaker 19: and the hardware is fundamentally power limited, right, And the
Speaker 19: move to space is an attempt to try to solve
Speaker 19: the power consumption part.
Speaker 5: Of the problem.
Speaker 19: But wherever you go, even in space, power is still
Speaker 19: going to be limited, and we're solving that problem at
Speaker 19: the fundamental physics level.
Speaker 1: Are you, Michael, seeing the adoption by well those out
Speaker 1: there at the moment building the data centers for such
Speaker 1: new interesting technology, because as you say, this could just
Speaker 1: be replacing dropped in instead of a GPU. How you
Speaker 1: seeing that revenue process as you back in with this
Speaker 1: sort of series A funding.
Speaker 20: Well, in the last couple of weeks, the last couple
Speaker 20: of months actually, we've seen a completed total breakthrough and
Speaker 20: the acceptance by the leaders in the end Stry the
Speaker 20: chip industry to use new hardware to address different parts
Speaker 20: of the inference workload. And you know, that's the last
Speaker 20: couple of large licensing and hiring deals that we've seen,
Speaker 20: and I believe that's the beginning. That's that's kind of
Speaker 20: like it's like breaking the sound barrier. Need you need
Speaker 20: those steps to happen on the part of obviously the
Speaker 20: leaders to pave the way for even more disruptive technology
Speaker 20: like what Neurofas is developing.
Speaker 8: You know, this is an industry that is still dominated
Speaker 8: by the GPU in video, right, but with the specialist
Speaker 8: inference platforms. You know, the argument that in Vidia makes
Speaker 8: is that we give five year visibility on our product
Speaker 8: roadmap and that's why each generation of Silicon that comes out,
Speaker 8: you just drop it in. How is this more than
Speaker 8: a lab experiment right now with neurofos and you can
Speaker 8: convince that that data center that's not yet planned for,
Speaker 8: let alone build that that's the best viable option.
Speaker 5: Right.
Speaker 19: The key is that right now we already have silicon,
Speaker 19: We have verified solution reel.
Speaker 5: It is real.
Speaker 19: We have taped out these chips, we've derisked the fundamental physics.
Speaker 5: So from here they're Unlike quantum.
Speaker 19: Computing, where you still need some more physics miracles to
Speaker 19: make it happen. There are no more physics miracles in
Speaker 19: our roadmap from here. It is hard engineering, but it
Speaker 19: is just engineering to get to market. And so we
Speaker 19: can build a timeline and an engineering schedule that is
Speaker 19: tractable and actually can deliver on time.
Speaker 8: You know, I'm just trying to understand how difficult this
Speaker 8: is going to be. Michael Sarah Brass is doing interesting
Speaker 8: things different technology Grok. You know, when Nvidia took Grok,
Speaker 8: they were like, well, they didn't have a place in
Speaker 8: the world. You seem to think that, actually, the underlying
Speaker 8: technology g OPU does have a.
Speaker 9: Place in the world. What evidence would you provide for that.
Speaker 20: My background is from the semiconductor industry. I got to
Speaker 20: say I wasn't sold until I visited the lab and
Speaker 20: Patrick and their team open Kimono showed me the o selloscopes,
Speaker 20: showed me the test beds. This is something that can
Speaker 20: not only work on its own, but it could be
Speaker 20: integrated with other conventional products that are in the server
Speaker 20: bill of materials. And again that's the piece I can underwrite.
Speaker 20: We're not really here in this case to look to
Speaker 20: invest in science. Although I'm a scientist, I at least
Speaker 20: think we should stand behind the technologies that could change
Speaker 20: the game for the energy needed for inference compute.
Speaker 1: Why underwrite Eurofos versus as I said, Li matter I Labs.
Speaker 20: I don't want to comment on the other companies other
Speaker 20: than I've known them and I looked at this. I
Speaker 20: looked at optical compute very seriously five years ago or
Speaker 20: so for my prior fund. In fact, I met Patrick
Speaker 20: at that time, and the concept for neurofoss was a
Speaker 20: little bit early. But I think the market conditions that
Speaker 20: demand the need for new approaches, combined with, like I said,
Speaker 20: the signals of leaders to be willing to integrate and
Speaker 20: use this technology in their platforms that are already commercially successful.
Speaker 20: This is a moving train toward heteroch unius compute and
Speaker 20: true disruptive technologies making it to market. What neuropos has
Speaker 20: that again helped us move forward is something I could
Speaker 20: see with my eyes that shows that it could work. Now,
Speaker 20: I'm going to still put the pressure on Patrick to
Speaker 20: deliver the product on time, which is definitely you know,
Speaker 20: the job of an entrepreneur.
Speaker 4: But to his point, it's not a science.
Speaker 20: Risk question as much anymore as engineering and capital. So
Speaker 20: once again that's where we can bring.
Speaker 1: Our fund in and boy is there a need for
Speaker 1: an unlock on the energy side. Patrick Byne, we thank
Speaker 1: you so much, CEO of Neurofos and Michael Stewart managing
Speaker 1: partner an M twelve. Great to have you both on
Speaker 1: on this funding round.
Speaker 8: Intel's down half percentage point, but in reality, Carriacs just
Speaker 8: treading water head of earnings after the bel it's up
Speaker 8: fifteen percent in a short US week because of the holiday,
Speaker 8: and it's up like forty six percent year to day.
Speaker 8: And whatever it tells us about AI, the reality is
Speaker 8: right now it's bread and butter business. CPUs is in
Speaker 8: demand and that's really helping it.
Speaker 10: And the PC side of the business.
Speaker 1: Many feeling that that's been a growth trajectory for them
Speaker 1: once again, and we had, of course the discussion around Panther.
Speaker 10: Lake and what they've been doing in terms of innovation.
Speaker 10: The key question is going to.
Speaker 1: Be foundry where is that actually going in terms of
Speaker 1: clear direction. Revenues are likely to fall for this fiscal
Speaker 1: quarter that they're reporting on it by six percent. Is
Speaker 1: only growth come the second half of twenty twenty six, right, Yeah.
Speaker 8: And probably some updates on lit Bu Tan the CEO,
Speaker 8: and like what's his relationship like with the president one
Speaker 8: of his shareholders now the United l States of America.
Speaker 9: All right, and these are all good.
Speaker 8: Copies of conversation, but we have had a hell of
Speaker 8: a run up before the earnings actually hit.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so maybe a bit of digestion just before they
Speaker 1: come out. But digest more of this edition of Bloomberg Tech.
Speaker 10: It's over for now, but end the podcast.
Speaker 9: Yeah, check out the pod.
Speaker 8: Astonishing episode to be frank, I mean, lots of recap.
Speaker 9: You know where to find it.
Speaker 8: Iheartspotify and on Apple and all all the bloombo platforms.
Speaker 9: This is Bloomberg Tech.