Speaker 1: Vietnam and Korean War veteran John Burge joined Chicago p
Speaker 1: D in nineteen seventy, a detective in nineteen seventy two,
Speaker 1: and eventually Detective commander of Area two and later Area three.
Speaker 1: During his career, heinous acts of brutality and torture were
Speaker 1: carried out by him or at his direction, fixing cases
Speaker 1: with coerced confessions and false witness statements alike. He and
Speaker 1: his brethren were known as the Midnight Crew before his
Speaker 1: termination in disgrace in nineteen nine and his eventual federal
Speaker 1: prison sentence. Purge and his crew beat an electrocuted thirteen
Speaker 1: year old Marcus Wiggins to extract the confessions of the
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety one murder of Alfredo Hernandez. Fortunately, a courageous
Speaker 1: witness named Sean Tyler came forward and ensured that the
Speaker 1: attempted frame job failed. Marcus's mother, Caroline, sued and eventually
Speaker 1: settled for ninety thousand dollars. However, the Midnight Crew didn't
Speaker 1: like being exposed. In nineteen ninety four, they tried to
Speaker 1: frame Marcus again along with Sean Tyler, for the murder
Speaker 1: of Rodney Collins, but Marcus was at school in Wisconsin,
Speaker 1: so his alibi was rock solid. Sean Tyler was not
Speaker 1: as lucky, and he's currently serving fifty eight years. Then
Speaker 1: on February Theopolis Tigue was found undressed and shot. I
Speaker 1: won't bore you with a completely made up story about
Speaker 1: a fender bender from witnesses who have since recanted, one
Speaker 1: of whom was shot in the mouth the morning he
Speaker 1: was set to deliver an affidavit. Marcus Wiggins was paroled
Speaker 1: after twenty three years in prison and has not yet
Speaker 1: been exonerated. This is wrongful Conviction with Jason Flom. Welcome
Speaker 1: back to Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flom. That's me, of course,
Speaker 1: I'm your host, and today we're gonna be telling the
Speaker 1: story with Marcus Wiggins of Marcus Wiggins. Marcus was framed
Speaker 1: three times by the same cops that let me just
Speaker 1: roll that back again, three times by the same cops.
Speaker 1: He was physically tortured in a way that you know
Speaker 1: you would see and locked up abroad in some third
Speaker 1: world country, but it happened right in Chicago with us. Today,
Speaker 1: we have his legal team and that consists of Justin Bonus,
Speaker 1: who is Marcus's pro bono appellate counsel and said, justin,
Speaker 1: welcome to wrongful convictions. And then a guy with his
Speaker 1: own amazing story, but we're gonna tell it in a
Speaker 1: different episode. But today we have Jared Adams. Jared was
Speaker 1: wrongfully convicted himself since almost three decades in prison and
Speaker 1: basically became a lawyer in prison, got himself out past
Speaker 1: the bar, worked at the Innocent Project for a couple
Speaker 1: of years as an attorney, is now in private practice.
Speaker 1: I'm super happy to have you on here this time
Speaker 1: as an attorney representing an innocent man. Appreciate the opporton
Speaker 1: great to have you here. And of course Marcus Way
Speaker 1: agains as I always say, I'm happy you're here, but
Speaker 1: i'm sorry you're here because of the reason why you're here.
Speaker 1: But anyway, welcome to wrongful conviction. I appreciate man. So
Speaker 1: let's get right into it because this story, it's a
Speaker 1: Chicago story, and of course Chicago has a miserable history
Speaker 1: of law enforcement having tortured hundreds of black men, specifically
Speaker 1: black men in a literal torture chamber. It was an
Speaker 1: offsite warehouse, and I know it sounds insane, but it's
Speaker 1: all true. It's all been documented, and hundreds of innocent
Speaker 1: men went to jail, but also cops went to jail
Speaker 1: as a result of their horrendous illital activities and their
Speaker 1: disgusting practice of torturing confessions and false witness statements out
Speaker 1: of people. And of course that group of cops was
Speaker 1: known as the infamous Midnight Crew of Chicago Police. Detective
Speaker 1: Commander John Burge. Now Laura and I writer and Steve
Speaker 1: Drizzon covered them on our show Wrongful Conviction, False Confessions.
Speaker 1: So to hear more about them, you can find that
Speaker 1: right on our feet here. But today we're here to
Speaker 1: talk about Marcus Cases specifically. So Marcus, take us back
Speaker 1: to before all of this happened. What was your life
Speaker 1: like growing up? You know, at school, I want to
Speaker 1: be a firefighter. I'll seek a service agent. You know,
Speaker 1: just being a kid, come home from school and do
Speaker 1: my homework, delicate cartoons, you know, just a normal kid life,
Speaker 1: a normal kid life. But this nightmare began when you
Speaker 1: were just thirteen years old. So Marcus gets picked up
Speaker 1: in one for homicide along with several other people, and
Speaker 1: he's beaten with a flashlight over the head, electrocuted, taking
Speaker 1: in the precinct, tortured some more along with other people.
Speaker 1: And and and from my understanding is is that people
Speaker 1: actually heard screams in the police station. And all the
Speaker 1: while that this was going on, there was a witness
Speaker 1: that could exonerate Marcus. That did exonerate Marcus, a guy
Speaker 1: by the name of Sean Tyler. And the police were
Speaker 1: so on the Sean Tyler that a judge issued a
Speaker 1: protective order for Sean Tyler that the police were not
Speaker 1: allowed to talk to Sean Tyler. And this case went
Speaker 1: on for about four or five years before the case
Speaker 1: was dismissed. In Marcus's mother filed the civil rights complaint
Speaker 1: alleging the torture by John Burge and Fred Bunky was
Speaker 1: a sergeant, Kenneth Boudreau, James O'Brien, These were all officers
Speaker 1: that were involved with Marcus's alleged statement that they took
Speaker 1: after they beat him until he gave the statement, I'm
Speaker 1: just sucked that a person, as a citizen of his
Speaker 1: country was elected shock something that this guy learned. I
Speaker 1: think I read somewhere at Vienna Yea and came over
Speaker 1: here and used that tactics. And it's not an outrage. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's that's like man blowing to me, like like the
Speaker 1: State's Attorney's office, every body that who was involved didn't
Speaker 1: say enough is enough, man, we can't allow this to
Speaker 1: happen to our citizens. I mean, I imagine with what
Speaker 1: you went through, you would have confessed to killing Abraham Lincoln.
Speaker 1: Am I right? Man? You know, people going to the
Speaker 1: type of torture, you know what I'm saying, anything just
Speaker 1: to get the mother that pressure and that pain that
Speaker 1: you're going through, especially at thirteen years old, I mean thirteen.
Speaker 1: And then the thing the thing about it too. You know,
Speaker 1: when you think about Birge Jason, you don't get decorated
Speaker 1: in Korean Wars and Vietnam Wars if you don't get trauma.
Speaker 1: You understand what I'm saying. So this is the guy
Speaker 1: who was given such power. And it may have been
Speaker 1: broken with Marcus case, but the pd S office had
Speaker 1: notes between each other for years before Marcus, and they
Speaker 1: were all saying, hey, these guys, it's like they're reading
Speaker 1: off a template. You know. It's like all of their
Speaker 1: confessions aren't signed and written the same, you know, and
Speaker 1: it's like, you know, Marcus said, somebody should have stepped
Speaker 1: up and said stop, let's not move forward until we
Speaker 1: find out if all one hundred and fifty of these
Speaker 1: black men who signed confessions, and I'm just throwing out
Speaker 1: a number, but you could just scratch out a name
Speaker 1: and you could put Marcus or anyone else's confession, Sean
Speaker 1: Tyler and all of them, and you would see the
Speaker 1: same hallmarks. There's no way judges weren't tipped that something
Speaker 1: was wrong with that. Right, every confession was the same,
Speaker 1: and every one of the victims which basically described the
Speaker 1: same treatment. That lawsuit that Marcus mom Um spearheaded, it
Speaker 1: really unearthed exactly how they were doing what they were doing, right,
Speaker 1: Because it's one thing for people to just say, hey,
Speaker 1: they're beating me, they kicking me. They found out in
Speaker 1: several different other circumstances that they were doing the same
Speaker 1: type of technics. They were smacking people with phone books
Speaker 1: so it wouldn't leave a mark, they would twist your
Speaker 1: general dues so no one could be seen, and in
Speaker 1: court were bruises on him. So when Marcus went through
Speaker 1: with the lawsuit, it's settled for ninety and made Marcus
Speaker 1: a target. From that point on. This was the Alfredo
Speaker 1: Hernandez murder, right, and ultimately they couldn't pin that on you.
Speaker 1: Now we get to the second framing, right, which is
Speaker 1: the murder of Rodney Collins, right, And so they do
Speaker 1: no investigation whatsoever. Right now, which homicide didn't they do
Speaker 1: any investigation on? They did no investigation on all of them.
Speaker 1: They rely on terrible, holy, unreliable witnesses. I mean, Marcus's name,
Speaker 1: and Rodney Collins gets thrown in there, and they list
Speaker 1: him as a gang member in the Alfredo hernande is
Speaker 1: the different gang member, and Rodney Collins and then I
Speaker 1: think a different gang member in Theopolis Tigue, which we
Speaker 1: haven't gotten to yet, which is so we did a
Speaker 1: little research Marcus on you because I went back thinking, well,
Speaker 1: why why would he be targeted by the cops in
Speaker 1: this way in the first place? And all I could
Speaker 1: find about your background is that you were described as sweet, caring, goodhearted,
Speaker 1: funny like people had nothing but good things to say
Speaker 1: about young Marcus. And I mean, were you ever in
Speaker 1: a gang or anything like that? No, No, he knew
Speaker 1: the answered that question because I researched it, and the
Speaker 1: idea that this was really good versus evil, like literally
Speaker 1: good versus evil, And we're talking about cops that were
Speaker 1: well ultimately convicted of heinous acts of violence, torture, psychological abuse, electrocuting,
Speaker 1: mock executions. Right, the same detectives that arrested and tortured
Speaker 1: Marcus and knew about Sean Tyler as an exculpatory witness,
Speaker 1: then go after Sean Tyler for the Rodney Collins murder.
Speaker 1: He's another bird victim, so is his brother. There was
Speaker 1: several others that were convicted in this murder, and Sean,
Speaker 1: I think he was beaten into the vomited blood. Sean
Speaker 1: Tyler ends up getting fifty eight years in prison and
Speaker 1: his his post conviction motion is pending and he's claiming
Speaker 1: he's innocence. So Marcus was a target of that investigation
Speaker 1: as well, from these same officers. Marcus was eliminated as
Speaker 1: a suspect because he was in school in Wisconsin, because
Speaker 1: he left the state, Okay, because he was terrified alright,
Speaker 1: as he still is. And I think if Marcus had
Speaker 1: been in the city of Chicago for the Rodney Collins
Speaker 1: murder gone down. Okay, So now we get to the
Speaker 1: crux of this situation. Why Marcus spent twenty three years
Speaker 1: wrongfully in cars rated the murder of Theopolis t on
Speaker 1: February twenty seven. This is the story of the crime
Speaker 1: that the police and State's Attorney's office used to convict Marcus.
Speaker 1: But I believe we can all see a pattern forming
Speaker 1: here that leans towards this being a total fabrication from
Speaker 1: Burge and his flunkeys. So, okay, Allegedly, Theopolis Tigue was
Speaker 1: driving down fifty first treet in Chicago with Cedric Farley
Speaker 1: and Terence Tyler Sean Tyler's fucking brother by the way, okay,
Speaker 1: and allegedly, now the maroon car in front of Theopolis
Speaker 1: Tigus car backs up into them with enough force to
Speaker 1: push them in the car backward. Then Tigue allegedly drove
Speaker 1: to the block of South Marshfield Abue, parked his car
Speaker 1: and got out to assess the damage, at which point,
Speaker 1: supposedly the driver of the maroon car, allegedly Marcus Wiggins,
Speaker 1: stepped up to Tigue and said what's up now. Tigue
Speaker 1: and the others allegedly ran, while Marcus allegedly opened fire,
Speaker 1: killing Tigue. Now, neighbors heard thirteen shots that supposedly came
Speaker 1: from a nine millimeter semi automatic. Neither were shell casings
Speaker 1: found or collected at the scene, by the way, nor
Speaker 1: were bullets recovered from Tigue's body. So police maintained that
Speaker 1: the shooting was gang related, despite what we already covered,
Speaker 1: which was that Marcus was never in any gangs. Again,
Speaker 1: the state's word here is wholly and totally unreliable. Now,
Speaker 1: according to Cedric Barley, a statement and testimony that he
Speaker 1: later recanted, he ran over the Tigue who allegedly told
Speaker 1: him that a guy named Stutter shot him, and Stutter
Speaker 1: was Marcus nickname. Yeah, Marcus, please clarified about calling you
Speaker 1: Stutter and stuff like that, like where it came from.
Speaker 1: It came from after the torture, Like about friend of
Speaker 1: my friends and my cousin them knows when I talk,
Speaker 1: I started, So it's the name because I knows I
Speaker 1: started after the torture. So that's important, Jason, because they
Speaker 1: put that chip in the witness's mouth. Man, that's intimate
Speaker 1: knowledge from somebody that you know. Soo do we want?
Speaker 1: The Pacers Foundation is a proud supporter of this episode
Speaker 1: of Ronal Conviction with Jason Flam and of the Last
Speaker 1: Mile organization. Which provides business and tech training to help
Speaker 1: incarcerated individuals successfully and permanently re enter the workforce. The
Speaker 1: Pacers Foundation is committed to improving the lives of Hoosiers
Speaker 1: across Indiana, supporting organizations that are dedicated primarily to helping
Speaker 1: young people and students. For more information on the work
Speaker 1: of the Pacers Foundation or the Last Mile Program, please
Speaker 1: visit Pacers Foundation dot org or the Last Mile dot org.
Speaker 1: This episode is underwritten by Paul Weiss Rifkin, Wharton and Garrison,
Speaker 1: a leading international law firm. Paul Weiss has long had
Speaker 1: an unwavering commitment to providing impactful, pro bono legal assistance
Speaker 1: to the most vulnerable members of our society and in
Speaker 1: support of the public interest, including extensive work in the
Speaker 1: criminal justice area. It's worth noting that a witness to
Speaker 1: the alleged fender bender, remember that part of the story
Speaker 1: reported that the car Marcus was allegedly driving was maroon
Speaker 1: or burgundy, but we know that he never her owned
Speaker 1: a Bruna burgundy car. You go to black car and
Speaker 1: the mechanic bravely also reported that when Marcus brought his
Speaker 1: black car, a get black color was black to the
Speaker 1: shop it had no damage to the rear bumper, so
Speaker 1: and the police told it. So the police knew that
Speaker 1: that didn't match up the mechanic. That information only comes
Speaker 1: out three years after his conviction. So it's documented that
Speaker 1: that car was in the shop. And get this, the
Speaker 1: police take the car out of the shop, destroy it
Speaker 1: right away. Now here's another crazy thing about this case.
Speaker 1: The victim, Theopolis Tigue, his body was discovered clothed only
Speaker 1: in a T shirt and boxers in the dead of
Speaker 1: Chicago winter. So during this time, in this era, when
Speaker 1: people were robbed, they would make them undress almost right,
Speaker 1: So that was a big detail. It was glossed over, right,
Speaker 1: So it's more likely than not how the body was found,
Speaker 1: Like you said, with the T shirt with the boxes,
Speaker 1: that he was robbed, ben shot and killed, and it
Speaker 1: had nothing to do with the scenario that they made
Speaker 1: up to get their target Marcus or he was dropped
Speaker 1: there that as well. Those are the options, but the
Speaker 1: option of back into the car, I want to go
Speaker 1: check the damage. I was shot and ran away. It's
Speaker 1: nonsense and it's never been credible. So we now have
Speaker 1: the car. He didn't own, the gunning never owned the
Speaker 1: gang that he was never in because they said this
Speaker 1: was a gang related shooting, which again would point away
Speaker 1: from Marcus. Everyone knew he was never in a gang.
Speaker 1: In fact, he used to be tormented by gang members
Speaker 1: because he wasn't in the game. So ultimately Marcus has
Speaker 1: charged with murder Atlanta Johnson. This his attorney through the
Speaker 1: initial trial, and the state utilized that were it has
Speaker 1: chosen carefully. Three witnesses, Cedric Farley, R. L. Mahan, and
Speaker 1: Kelly Stokes to testify against Marcus, and he fully recant it.
Speaker 1: He was interviewed by Kenneth Boudreau, who was a person
Speaker 1: that Marcus sued unless to say Kenneth Boudreau was a
Speaker 1: hands on interviewer, totally hands on. People want to make
Speaker 1: Chicago only look like confessions are what these guys were
Speaker 1: obtaining through torture. They were getting everything through torture. All
Speaker 1: the witnesses in this case were the type of guys
Speaker 1: that you want to flip and how do you flip them? Force?
Speaker 1: It's gonna go to move, is it right? What they
Speaker 1: weren't doing any investigating? So guess what else have you got?
Speaker 1: They do? No canvas in this case what police do
Speaker 1: when they find a body in the neighborhood, what do
Speaker 1: they do? They go door to door to talk to people.
Speaker 1: What independent witnesses do we have. They don't do that.
Speaker 1: No shell casings, no door to door. You arrest a
Speaker 1: guy three hours later, and Jason three hours after the crime.
Speaker 1: In the nineties and even till today, it is standard
Speaker 1: to do gunshot residue testing on clothing hands that the
Speaker 1: powder is going to stay on you. They don't do
Speaker 1: any of this because they don't want the physical evidence
Speaker 1: to show the unreliability of their witnesses. And I mean
Speaker 1: unreliability to me is actually a kind word in this
Speaker 1: In this case, it's kind the lies, the fabrication, and
Speaker 1: all the witnesses say when they're in the police station
Speaker 1: they're talking about Marcus Wiggins. They were aggressively disinterested in
Speaker 1: who actually committed this crime, which of course is just
Speaker 1: more the issue. Of course, you know for folks like
Speaker 1: like Marcus, you know, even like myself backed in. You
Speaker 1: can't afford a freaking attorney, man like you can't even
Speaker 1: like somebody like Justin backed in with those facts were
Speaker 1: fucking hammer him, man. The guys found damn their neked
Speaker 1: in the wintertime, if he was running when the top
Speaker 1: time to take his what you investigate? Yeah, they if
Speaker 1: they would have called the cops in this case in
Speaker 1: front of a Chicago jury, the jury would have heard
Speaker 1: that these cops were sued by this kid five years
Speaker 1: prior and they tried to frame him in ninety four
Speaker 1: like this, all would have come. And I hate to
Speaker 1: slam them because they cross examine one of the witnesses.
Speaker 1: One of the witnesses recants, but then they don't call
Speaker 1: their own investigator. But they get out of the witness
Speaker 1: that the witness recanted. A thirteen year old this guy
Speaker 1: or o Mayhan, who was named as the killer by
Speaker 1: one of our witnesses, presently recants. You know. He actually says,
Speaker 1: Marcus doesn't do it, I mean, you know, and then
Speaker 1: he and then he gets back and he recants on
Speaker 1: his recantation. All three of them later recanted their testimony, right.
Speaker 1: Two of them, Farley and Stokes, signed Afford David's admitting
Speaker 1: that their testimonies were false. That's very brave, right, considering
Speaker 1: what they had been through. When you say, well, what
Speaker 1: happened the third witness, I'm glad you asked the third
Speaker 1: witness was fatally shot in the mouth on the day
Speaker 1: that he planned to sign a similar document. That's got
Speaker 1: to give everybody the fucking chills. I mean, he was
Speaker 1: shot in the mouth on the day he was going
Speaker 1: to sign a similar and what a coincidence, Jesus Christ.
Speaker 1: That's he recanted to three different people he were cannon
Speaker 1: on the witness stand in the trial. He were canned
Speaker 1: to Marcus Is, a Pellet attorney, and then he were
Speaker 1: canned to another woman, Tracy Ross, who gave a sworn
Speaker 1: affidavit as well. So Rl Mayhan he recanted three separate
Speaker 1: times before he was killed. And if that wasn't enough,
Speaker 1: people are probably pulling their hair outs in the homeless
Speaker 1: into this or in their car. Melinda Chambers also reported
Speaker 1: what she knew what the case and assigned affidavit that
Speaker 1: she was sitting on her porch. Wintigue, a member of
Speaker 1: the black Stones Tigue was the victim, came up to
Speaker 1: her and said that he saw a murder by other
Speaker 1: black Stone members and that they were going to come
Speaker 1: after him and kill him. So this is powerful, right,
Speaker 1: because those witnesses were never called to the stand either,
Speaker 1: and we don't know if that's because of threats from
Speaker 1: detectives or more torture or just ineffective assistance. But that's
Speaker 1: certainly since Marcus was never a member of the Black Stones,
Speaker 1: you know, or any of these gangs, that certainly would
Speaker 1: have also been exculpatory. So there were all these different
Speaker 1: witnesses who could have refuted the state's phony narrative, the
Speaker 1: whole thing about the bumper. There were the witnesses that
Speaker 1: could have placed you at your girlfriend's house, multiple witnesses.
Speaker 1: Why why did your attorney not call them? And did
Speaker 1: you have the conversations with your attorney about it at
Speaker 1: that time? Man oh Man, I had. I had a
Speaker 1: conversation with them, but she was an impression day. She
Speaker 1: didn't need to call witness because our am mayhem and
Speaker 1: change his statement and there was gonna be the winning tickets,
Speaker 1: you know, listen and yeah, and I mean and it's
Speaker 1: the same thing that I went through where where it
Speaker 1: is where a lawyer court appointed, Oh this is a
Speaker 1: slam nunck. You don't have to worry about that. I've
Speaker 1: never heard of a patient saying, look that's okay, you
Speaker 1: gave me half the antibiotics, you can keep the rest.
Speaker 1: I think this half of probably work. It doesn't make
Speaker 1: any sense, right, doctors take half of my appandics? How
Speaker 1: I think that will work? Makes no sense. But you
Speaker 1: know there was no chance. This was a show trial
Speaker 1: because Marcus was never going to get a fair ruling
Speaker 1: as long as the presiding judge was then as turn
Speaker 1: Back because turn Back was was known at the time
Speaker 1: as being a part of burgess go to team when
Speaker 1: he had worked in the state's attorney's office and he
Speaker 1: had a history of accepting confessions despite knowing that they
Speaker 1: were coerced and given under torture. He allowed the state
Speaker 1: that had to wait and then um Mark, turning on
Speaker 1: to Johnson, couldn't do this, couldn't do that. He gat
Speaker 1: his state a lot of league way. I think that
Speaker 1: when I found out who done about was I stand
Speaker 1: a chance anyway? So September nine, Marcus, I mean, you
Speaker 1: had a lot of bad days in your life leading
Speaker 1: up to this, But can you take us back to
Speaker 1: that miserable day when you were found guilty of first
Speaker 1: degree murder? And since the forty six years in prison,
Speaker 1: what was that moment? Like, couln't I can't believe it.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't know, you know, killed you and then he
Speaker 1: gave me fourty six years. No, Chrison is it's what
Speaker 1: like the soldiers when they leave from overseas and come
Speaker 1: back home, they have post trumpet stress. I have that,
Speaker 1: you know what I said. Because of the torture the jails,
Speaker 1: the penitentiaries, there's not a plase tobody wanted to be
Speaker 1: so I can constantly be on guard. Yea. They feeds themselves,
Speaker 1: the officers. You know, they come in with a baggage
Speaker 1: on top of everything. Yes, that's going on in out jails.
Speaker 1: So it's a nightmare, you know what I'm saying. Don't
Speaker 1: nobody want to live at night? Man? I don't. I
Speaker 1: don't want to let a night mare no more. Two
Speaker 1: thousand two, Markets filed approachate motion with detailing about the
Speaker 1: destruction of the car, detailing that the car was in
Speaker 1: the shop. You know, it's amazing the cars in the
Speaker 1: shop cargus destroyed by the police, the piece of evidence
Speaker 1: that they needed to prove their case that there was
Speaker 1: a car accident going right. Marcus's alibis all detailed in
Speaker 1: his pro say motion in two thousand two was a
Speaker 1: very good motion. It should have had a hearing. It
Speaker 1: was summarily denied. Again, we go back to Dennis Dernbeck,
Speaker 1: the guy who presides over his trial, the guy who
Speaker 1: has this intimate relationship with these cops, is the guy
Speaker 1: that hears the post conviction motion. And then for years
Speaker 1: Marcus went really without a lawyer, and again he battled,
Speaker 1: and Northwestern got involved because they saw Marcus's case and
Speaker 1: they ended up doing a documentary. Jane Riley took over
Speaker 1: his case and God bless her, God bless her, but
Speaker 1: she passed away, and so Marcus gets stuck in limbo.
Speaker 1: He submits an application to the Torture Commission and they
Speaker 1: tell him we don't condone the fact that your witnesses
Speaker 1: were tortured, but you weren't to true. Yeah, so it
Speaker 1: was outside of yes, right, you weren't tortured in this case.
Speaker 1: You were tortured in any other case the case, but
Speaker 1: we can't help you, right. So then you know, I
Speaker 1: got involved when I saw the documentary, and of course
Speaker 1: I knew Jared is licensed in Illinois, and we kind
Speaker 1: of formed like Voltron, and you know, and literally, let
Speaker 1: me just tell you something. Very few cases that I have,
Speaker 1: Jared knows this. I've got cases were men are getting
Speaker 1: ready to be exonerated four or five years. The investigation
Speaker 1: takes right, Marcus is investigator, hits the ground in August.
Speaker 1: Motions filed in January. We've got seven half of David's
Speaker 1: from right all the witnesses of re canon full file
Speaker 1: from the prosecutor's office where you know, you see that
Speaker 1: Fred Bunkie is the supervisor at the scene of the investigation.
Speaker 1: This is a guy that Marcus sued personally. He's the supervisor,
Speaker 1: he's the quarterback. He chooses what detectives are going to interview,
Speaker 1: what this is. He chooses Kenneth Boudrow to interview Kelly Stokes.
Speaker 1: And then what we learned from Marcus Wiggins is that
Speaker 1: James O'Brien was in the police station after they arrest
Speaker 1: Marcus Wiggins three hours after them said sticks his head
Speaker 1: and says, go suck your thumb in the corner now,
Speaker 1: because allegedly after he was thirteen and he had this
Speaker 1: the trauma that he suffered when he was thirteen from
Speaker 1: being electrocuted, caused him to suck his thumb. O'Brien walks
Speaker 1: right in there and and Marcus knows O'Brien because he
Speaker 1: was beat over the head with a flashlight by James
Speaker 1: O'Brien and he tells him, we're gonna stick your ass
Speaker 1: with this one, and you ain't beaten this one, right.
Speaker 1: The misconduct was so bad in the police station that
Speaker 1: Cedric Farley, one of the witness, said that they were
Speaker 1: passing around a single photo of Marcus. They showed him
Speaker 1: a single photo of Marcus, and they're talking about the
Speaker 1: lawsuit in the police station. But it gets warre. I
Speaker 1: mean again, the first witness to mention Marcus name is
Speaker 1: Terence Tyler. And we go back to the Tyler named
Speaker 1: Terence is Sean Tyler's brother. Terrence is recovering right now
Speaker 1: from a stroke. But he recanted to two separate people.
Speaker 1: He recanted his statement and he said, I know Marcus
Speaker 1: is innocent, that he didn't commit this crime. I mean,
Speaker 1: this is unbelievable too, because Marcus has a code defendant
Speaker 1: in this case. This code offended goes bench, he goes
Speaker 1: bench trial. Let me just explain it. You have a
Speaker 1: right in America to a jury trial. Right. Would you
Speaker 1: want one person judging you or would you want twelve
Speaker 1: people judging you? Right? You want twelve? You definitely don't
Speaker 1: want to judge if you're a defendant, the code offended
Speaker 1: in Marcus's case, goes bench and gets acquitted. Wow, that's crazy, Okay,
Speaker 1: And he's still so scared to talk because of retaliation.
Speaker 1: Every witness that's Ricannon, Kelly Stokes recanon fearful retaliation, Cedric
Speaker 1: Farley recanned fearful retaliation. Lavell Adams, who was the co defendant,
Speaker 1: refuses to talk because he said his lawyer said, don't
Speaker 1: speak because the Chicago Police Department will come after you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we're talking about folks impoverished areas, no protection, no protection,
Speaker 1: there's no I'm just gonna get up and moved. That's
Speaker 1: not an option, Jason. Where with the money yet? You
Speaker 1: know it's not an option. Just hostage in their own place.
Speaker 1: And where's wit SEC for the civilians in Chicago? Right?
Speaker 1: Where's with this protection against the police. In case anyone
Speaker 1: thought we were exaggerating any part of the torture as
Speaker 1: a practice of the Chicago Police Department and not insignificant
Speaker 1: number of police officers in the Chicago p D who
Speaker 1: were doing this systematically. There was an investigation which resulted
Speaker 1: in Burge himself going to prison for three years, which
Speaker 1: don't even get me started three years for framing and
Speaker 1: torturing hundreds of people while he collected pension collective their
Speaker 1: tax dollars are paying for the ship. So there were
Speaker 1: actual convictions that this was all supported and all found,
Speaker 1: you know, And it's hard to prove these things. It's
Speaker 1: always hard to get any sort of justice when it's
Speaker 1: a person in blue that's committed almost thirty years later. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I want to I want to be real clear
Speaker 1: about this because this was a thirty year conspiracy, because
Speaker 1: it starts at one right, But Marcus is testified in
Speaker 1: other cases incredibly where he's identified these officers because being
Speaker 1: around these men for so long he was able to
Speaker 1: identify them, and courts have found him credible. I mean,
Speaker 1: this is something that is firmly established. And it's unfortunate
Speaker 1: that Marcus had the languish in prison for twenty three
Speaker 1: years and come home from the jails back until Sady,
Speaker 1: where everybody want to play politics, nobody want to step
Speaker 1: up and do the right thing, which is what you
Speaker 1: was put in these position for anyway, is to do
Speaker 1: the right thing. Yeah. And I think State's Attorney Kimpbox
Speaker 1: is the kind of person that will do the right thing.
Speaker 1: You know, we had her on Righteous Convictions just a
Speaker 1: few months ago. We asked her about your case, and
Speaker 1: although she couldn't comment on the ongoing proceedings, she expressed
Speaker 1: her hopes for getting to the truth and righting the
Speaker 1: wrongs of the past. I believe we've laid out plainly
Speaker 1: here today the only thing that justice could or even
Speaker 1: should be in here and now, with your leave application granted,
Speaker 1: the ball is in her court. If the Cook County
Speaker 1: State's Attorney's office is not willing right now to say
Speaker 1: Marcus Wiggins is actually innocent like me and Justin and
Speaker 1: and and forget me and Justine, just look at the evidence, says.
Speaker 1: If they aren't willing to do that, then then Jason,
Speaker 1: what's wrong we're being able to admit that this man
Speaker 1: didn't receive a fair trial. Well, don't ask me, because
Speaker 1: obviously nothing but Marcus. October thirty, you walked out of prison.
Speaker 1: You were paroled, You should have been exonerated, You will
Speaker 1: be exonerated. October three, you walked out of prison. What
Speaker 1: was that like? Okay, it's like a feeling that I
Speaker 1: can't describe, but I was so happened. I was I
Speaker 1: was humble, I was peaceful. It was just still so
Speaker 1: good man to actually have the feet hit the hit
Speaker 1: on the payments and walk around and just feel it,
Speaker 1: feeling freedom, feel it weird, feeling space. It was amazing. Uh.
Speaker 1: And you, I know, we know you passed your driving tests.
Speaker 1: Obviously you had to get a cell phone computer. I
Speaker 1: know I know you have love FaceTime because we've spoken
Speaker 1: on FaceTime a bunch of times. All this new stuff
Speaker 1: that happened while you were locked up, right, how is
Speaker 1: it getting used to it, starting to feel comfortable with
Speaker 1: some of this new technology and stuff. Yeah, well, I'm
Speaker 1: still I'm still learn how to work my phone, my laptop.
Speaker 1: I'm still to learn that too. That's a lot of
Speaker 1: new stuff Go Google going on out here. I'm trying
Speaker 1: to and we're going to put links in the bio
Speaker 1: to learn more about Marcus's case to be able to
Speaker 1: support him. And now we turn to the part of
Speaker 1: our show, which I call closing arguments. First of all,
Speaker 1: I thank each of you for being here, and then
Speaker 1: turn off my mic, kick back in my chair and
Speaker 1: just sit and listen and learn from whatever you want
Speaker 1: to share. Anything we might have left out or anything
Speaker 1: you want to say at all about anything. I don't
Speaker 1: care if you want to talk about the weather. So
Speaker 1: let's do this. Alphabetical order is good for me and
Speaker 1: also saves Marcus for the closing of the closing arguments.
Speaker 1: So you're bad and clean up, Marcus. Um, let's go
Speaker 1: to Jarrett first, and Justin and then Marcus. Look, justice
Speaker 1: requires us to stop waiting for things to become a
Speaker 1: hashtag before we stand up and do something. You know,
Speaker 1: as we think about the one year anniversary of us
Speaker 1: watching George Floyd loses his life, you know, we as
Speaker 1: a society have to say to ourselves We've come a
Speaker 1: long way, but there's so much work to do, and
Speaker 1: I want to I want to close my comments by
Speaker 1: saying this. There is power in people's voices. You know.
Speaker 1: People become jurors, people become judges, people are voters. People
Speaker 1: can make a difference. And I want people to think
Speaker 1: about this when they are faced with things that challenge
Speaker 1: them doing the right thing and speaking up. If your
Speaker 1: life was to be depicted in the book where the
Speaker 1: only reader would be someone that means the world to you,
Speaker 1: would they read that book and walk away impressed right
Speaker 1: now about you ending up for what's right, calling out
Speaker 1: things that are wrong. If you can't answer that question definitively,
Speaker 1: there's more work to do, Jason. I can't answer that
Speaker 1: question definitively, So I get up and our work every day,
Speaker 1: and so I'm just calling on folks to not allow
Speaker 1: the norms and the depictions and narratives of folks to
Speaker 1: ever stop their moral compass from doing the right thing.
Speaker 1: I want to thank you, my friend, for having me
Speaker 1: on the show. Justin Marcus is an honor and a
Speaker 1: pleasure and a privilege to know you, to represent you
Speaker 1: and your mom a real g I'm gonna get her
Speaker 1: name on a T shirt real soon so people know
Speaker 1: who she she is, because she is the one who
Speaker 1: should get the credit for for giving birth to you
Speaker 1: more than once. She gave birth to you to get here,
Speaker 1: and she also loved you out of that situation, and
Speaker 1: she's still fighting. Justin will tell you you, okay, she will.
Speaker 1: She She put you in, put you in your place
Speaker 1: if you say something wrong. Okay. So I thank you,
Speaker 1: guys man again for his opportunity. And it's always a
Speaker 1: pleasure to be around you. Are I appreciate justin Uh, definitely.
Speaker 1: Carolin Johnson is strong woman. UM has spoken her many,
Speaker 1: many many times. UM. So, would you want somebody that
Speaker 1: you sued to investigate you for a homicide successfully suit?
Speaker 1: I mean, I think that's like, I think this is
Speaker 1: a common sense case just to get the man a
Speaker 1: new trial. We don't even need to get to the witnesses.
Speaker 1: We could just stop it. Would you want somebody that
Speaker 1: you soothed to be the person that investigated you for
Speaker 1: a homicide? The answer is no, Okay. I mean, and
Speaker 1: these guys really really disliked Marcus. Not only does he
Speaker 1: sue them, but he also basically internally gets them in trouble,
Speaker 1: blows the lid off of bird. This is like the
Speaker 1: keystone case that sets everything in motion. This is like
Speaker 1: the clearest case I've ever seen a retaliation. And that's
Speaker 1: before we get of the witnesses. All right, Every witness
Speaker 1: in this case is recandid. There's no evidence that Marcus
Speaker 1: was in a gang. There's no evidence that there was
Speaker 1: a car accident, there's no evidence that there were showcases
Speaker 1: at the scene, there's no evidence that backs up anything.
Speaker 1: This trial literally like happened in a vacuum right where
Speaker 1: everything was literally stripped away in this trial, so you
Speaker 1: don't hear the truth. It is just clearly a depiction
Speaker 1: that only the state's attorney and the police department wanted
Speaker 1: the jury to hear. And then Marcus had no defense.
Speaker 1: How can anyone have a fair trial when something like
Speaker 1: that goes on. And then when you come back and
Speaker 1: witnesses are a little bit more willing to talk about
Speaker 1: what actually happens, because it takes time for people to
Speaker 1: come It takes time, and you know, I'm not the
Speaker 1: same as I was when I was a teenager. There
Speaker 1: are things when I was a teenager that I probably
Speaker 1: would have lied about if I had gotten put into
Speaker 1: a certain situation. So it took time for this body
Speaker 1: of evidence to come forward and these witnesses to come
Speaker 1: out and tell you what happened in that precinct. These
Speaker 1: cops were obsessed with Marcus Wiggins. And we'll name them
Speaker 1: James O'Brien scumbag, Okay, Kenneth Boudreau scumbag, and Fred Bunky scumbag.
Speaker 1: They were all under the umbrella of John Birch. These
Speaker 1: are the ones that focused on Marcus, and every single
Speaker 1: witness that testified in this case said the same thing,
Speaker 1: which is I was either beaten, I was threatened, and
Speaker 1: this is why I did what I did. And it's
Speaker 1: believable because it's happened. How I mean at this point
Speaker 1: that we don't have two, three, four, or five, six, seven,
Speaker 1: eight hands we got I don't know, there's so many
Speaker 1: hands that you'd have to have to count the fingers
Speaker 1: that this has happened. It's just it's unbelievable. And Marcus
Speaker 1: case is clear. There was no case against Marcus. This
Speaker 1: is a complete, utter fabrication, and it's the clearest case
Speaker 1: I've ever seen of retaliation in my life. All Right, Marcus,
Speaker 1: saving the best for last over to you. Well, well,
Speaker 1: we know, we know, and we see what's going on
Speaker 1: all around the country, files dealing with the police, how
Speaker 1: they fabricate they police reports. And then all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: our video comes out, obviously from what they found in
Speaker 1: the report. So we know what's going around and see,
Speaker 1: we know what's going on these officers, especially in the
Speaker 1: city of Chicago, where I feel like I'm up against
Speaker 1: a giant, and you don't nobody want to do the
Speaker 1: right thing because their friends did their careers. They were
Speaker 1: about more conventions, more of this and study doing the
Speaker 1: right thing. It frustrates me so much. It's just it's
Speaker 1: just frustrating to be so much. But I don't know
Speaker 1: a brighter note. Y'all have been a blessing to me man,
Speaker 1: since I've been out. Man, y'all truly been a blessing
Speaker 1: all y'all, you know, it's all three of y'all. You know,
Speaker 1: I want to continue to strive with what I'm doing,
Speaker 1: and I feel like I'm in debt to help the
Speaker 1: next person. I feel like I'm in debt to y'all
Speaker 1: to help the next person to be on the same page.
Speaker 1: That's all along when y'all come out, help people and
Speaker 1: fight the power that be Man, and y'all definitely been
Speaker 1: a blessed man. I've definitely appreciate y'all from the bottom
Speaker 1: of my heart. Man, And I'm just hoping I hope
Speaker 1: to kill Fox do the right thing. See how full
Speaker 1: anledgely what's going on in our community, full Mother's going
Speaker 1: on with our birth and the Men Night crew. I'll
Speaker 1: just hope everybody to do the right game. Thank you
Speaker 1: for listening. To Run for Conviction with Jason Flam. Please
Speaker 1: support your local innocence projects and go to the link
Speaker 1: in our bio to see how you can help. I'd
Speaker 1: like to thank our production team Connor Hall, Jeff Clyburn
Speaker 1: and Kevin Warns. The music on the show, as always,
Speaker 1: is by three time OSCAR nominated composer Jay Ralph. Be
Speaker 1: sure to follow us on Instagram at Wrongful Conviction and
Speaker 1: on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction Podcast. Wrongful Conviction with Jason
Speaker 1: Flam is a production of Lava for Good Podcasts in
Speaker 1: association with Signal Company Number one