Speaker 1: You might have the only original power worms and crystal
Speaker 1: clear pepsi color left on the planet. Yeah, Mike had
Speaker 1: always accuses me of giving a lure that I know
Speaker 1: isn't going to work. How many times a season do
Speaker 1: you hear clients say we're gonna need a bigger boat
Speaker 1: every day? What kind of weird British solution is Eric
Speaker 1: and visioning? Here are we going to a point in
Speaker 1: otter Lord? Good morning, degenerate anglers, and welcome to Bent,
Speaker 1: the fishing podcast that wants to punch the face of
Speaker 1: the guy that bails on a fishing trip and says guests,
Speaker 1: I made the right call when he finds out that
Speaker 1: the fishing sucked. I'm Joe Surmelie, and I'm joined today
Speaker 1: by a dear friend I know feels the same way.
Speaker 1: My amigo, Jimmy Fee of On the Water magazine is
Speaker 1: guest hosting today. What's up, Jimmy? What's up Joe? That
Speaker 1: is I feel like one of the cardinal rules of
Speaker 1: being a good fishing body not not doing that exact thing.
Speaker 1: We have. We have had that conversation, So is that
Speaker 1: guy's I guess I made the right Well I went
Speaker 1: and you didn't you did not make the right call
Speaker 1: um anyway. So it's funny because I told listeners they'd
Speaker 1: be hearing from many frequent Bent guests, but with you,
Speaker 1: I've I've pretty much lied because you've never been on
Speaker 1: this show before. So you're like you're a fresh voice,
Speaker 1: which means nobody knows anything about you. So if you
Speaker 1: had to, I don't know, describe yourself in three words,
Speaker 1: what would they be? So right now, three words for
Speaker 1: me and my fishing would definitely be needs some sleep. Oh,
Speaker 1: you're doing the thing where you're out all night with
Speaker 1: the fish and the striped bass. I've been doing, yeah,
Speaker 1: and and some weirder stuff. I got into some nighttime
Speaker 1: crabbing last night, nighttime. Who doesn't like you'll like lose
Speaker 1: sleep to go nighttime crabbing to catch crabs because that's
Speaker 1: when the crabs are active, That's when my kids are asleep.
Speaker 1: It's it's really what what that comes down to? You
Speaker 1: know what? That what that's like? Okay, fair enough? Uh As,
Speaker 1: look all right, So I'm making fun of you for
Speaker 1: nighttime crabbing, but I'm I'm not nighttime crabbing, and I'm
Speaker 1: gonna make him here feels slightly uncomfortable for a sec
Speaker 1: because he's a humble man. Um, but he is one
Speaker 1: of the most devoted surfcasters I know. I would say elite.
Speaker 1: Elite is the word I would use, Um, dude, Like,
Speaker 1: you've caught more more huge stripers in the surf than
Speaker 1: anyone else I know personally, and I mean barring Bob
Speaker 1: garbage man. But unlike your average insta here, you stay
Speaker 1: very hush hush about your surf fishing in particular. I
Speaker 1: mean part of that is because I don't get any
Speaker 1: good pictures of my fishing the surf. It's a very
Speaker 1: hard environment. I'll I'll give you that. But man, yeah,
Speaker 1: I've always respected that about you so much. And we're
Speaker 1: also good buddies because we've worked in the same industry
Speaker 1: for a long time. Like you're a multi species, multi
Speaker 1: media angler. I guess that's what we are, like myself. Um,
Speaker 1: you work full time for a media company, writing, editing,
Speaker 1: shooting and hosting videos. So like when venting needs to
Speaker 1: happen about our jobs, about the behind the scenes stuff
Speaker 1: that the viewers and readers don't see, I can just
Speaker 1: text you and you understand, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: It's like it's like two brains. It's like brain surges.
Speaker 1: I can just x uh uppermoter neurons. Am I right,
Speaker 1: And you're just like totes you know, well plate well
Speaker 1: uh So. One of the other reasons I wanted to
Speaker 1: have you on is because, um, I wanted to talk
Speaker 1: about loose theme here fomo fear of missing out. And
Speaker 1: I think it's fair to say that, regardless of the fishery,
Speaker 1: every angler experiences fomo. But you and I have a
Speaker 1: very specific kind of fomo, which is tuna fomo. Oh,
Speaker 1: and it's it's not for tuna. The fishing has been
Speaker 1: so good for the past few seasons. It's not a
Speaker 1: fear of missing out. It's a fact of missing out.
Speaker 1: I'm not worried I'm going to miss out. I know
Speaker 1: I'm missing out right there with you. I'm right there
Speaker 1: with you. I mean. And part of the problem, right,
Speaker 1: it's for all the different kinds of fishing we do.
Speaker 1: It's like the one thing where we're we're reliant on
Speaker 1: other people like you and I don't have the means
Speaker 1: to just like, well, I'm gonna go tuna fishing Saturday.
Speaker 1: Like it's just one of those things we need somebody
Speaker 1: else to take us. That's kind of part of the problem.
Speaker 1: You do. You either have a close friend with a boat,
Speaker 1: or you have a good boat yourself, and that's your
Speaker 1: ticket to the tunic grounds. And if you don't have that,
Speaker 1: you're always a couple degrees away of having that reliable
Speaker 1: tuna invite when you know the bite's good, which leaves you, Joe,
Speaker 1: you book a trip, you have to book something months
Speaker 1: in advance. I'm getting to that, right. And now, see
Speaker 1: you live up on Cape Cod, so you're you're surrounded
Speaker 1: by saltwater. Um. And like I said, I've never owned
Speaker 1: a boat big and capable enough to get me to
Speaker 1: these fish. But I feel like five six years ago,
Speaker 1: I don't know about you, but like I had rides
Speaker 1: out the wazoo, like I was turning down this tuna
Speaker 1: guy to go with that tuna guy. And for multitude
Speaker 1: of reasons, that's just changed. Right, boats get sold, people's
Speaker 1: kids grow up and eat up more time, and so on.
Speaker 1: And I'm not bitter about it, but like you said,
Speaker 1: it's just it's just facts. Now I've just sort of
Speaker 1: learned to live with it. Um. So I do I
Speaker 1: just try and book a charter with a guide at
Speaker 1: least once a season, and without fail, that day will
Speaker 1: be canceled by whether or engine trouble or whatever. I
Speaker 1: have always had better luck on impromptu tuned trips than
Speaker 1: planned ones, but those are rare anymore. And like you said,
Speaker 1: you like you also can't invite yourself. It's kind of
Speaker 1: like code. You have to be invited. There's a lot
Speaker 1: that goes into tuna fishing, not only fueling the boat,
Speaker 1: which is very expensive because you're running further than you
Speaker 1: would for your typical inshore trip. The gear itself is
Speaker 1: very expensive. It's tough to be like, Hey, I'll bring
Speaker 1: some P. B and J's. Can I get on the
Speaker 1: boat this weekend? I got some dill pickle wrangles if
Speaker 1: I can get in on that, Yeah, exactly. It's it's
Speaker 1: like the crews are very tight. It tends to be
Speaker 1: the same guys that run with each other over and
Speaker 1: over again, and either you're in or you're not. But now,
Speaker 1: the big problem that you and I have is we
Speaker 1: both closely follow some badass tuna charter guides and every
Speaker 1: season I'm like, I'm gonna unfollow these people. And it's
Speaker 1: not because they're not good dudes. But I just can't
Speaker 1: take the fomo like I just it gets to a
Speaker 1: point where I I can't stand looking. And here's a
Speaker 1: hot tip for everybody, right, Following charter guides is pretty
Speaker 1: much a trap. Like if you suffer from any sort
Speaker 1: of fishing fomo, you don't follow local guides because it's
Speaker 1: very easy to forget that it's their job to be
Speaker 1: out there every day, you know what I mean? Oh, definitely. Yeah,
Speaker 1: in general, it's not the captains who are out there
Speaker 1: catching the fish every day, right, they're the ones they're
Speaker 1: putting the clients on the fish, and that comes with
Speaker 1: its own set of headaches. I've been on boats with
Speaker 1: captains who are so let's call it intense, that they
Speaker 1: really want you to get into the fish, that it's borderline.
Speaker 1: They're yelling, they're yelling, and you have to be yelling.
Speaker 1: I've I've been yelled at many times. But the point
Speaker 1: is that like that guy is getting the getting the
Speaker 1: love because he's the captain. But the dude who actually
Speaker 1: got to really in that fish that you didn't for all,
Speaker 1: you know, that was his one a year. Like that
Speaker 1: was the trip he booked five months ago and he
Speaker 1: got lucky and got the weather. Um. But regardless, at
Speaker 1: the time of this recording, I've not gotten out for
Speaker 1: tuna once this season. Um. But you know you and
Speaker 1: I are eyeballing a lot of the same captains because
Speaker 1: on the water your magazine covers New England and New Jersey. Um.
Speaker 1: And I won't hear from you for for like a month,
Speaker 1: and then randomly on a Tuesday at two pm, I'll
Speaker 1: get this text from Jim. That's just tell me you're
Speaker 1: getting on this tuna bite, right? You do that, and
Speaker 1: I sigh and grovel and I tell you why I'm not,
Speaker 1: and then I won't hear from you again for another month. Well,
Speaker 1: this year's bite was so good midsummer down here. The
Speaker 1: text was just right to the point, when are you
Speaker 1: going tuna fishing? And and my response was you. That's when, like,
Speaker 1: I was so angered by that point in the summer
Speaker 1: that I hadn't gotten my piece of the action. I
Speaker 1: felt bad. It felt like I was rubbing it in
Speaker 1: at that point, which I wasn't. I just assumed you've
Speaker 1: been out there. They were practically there were guys in
Speaker 1: kayaks catching them off New Jersey. That's not true, guys,
Speaker 1: it's like, but it happened. Guys went out there looking
Speaker 1: for fluke and caught some blue fin tuna. Well good
Speaker 1: for them and the kayak they rode in off. But
Speaker 1: you can't come. You can't complain anyway because you you
Speaker 1: got yours man very recently, Like tell us about the
Speaker 1: giant it's scratcher you just caught. Yeah. So I was
Speaker 1: out with my friend, Captain Rob Taylor, and he runs
Speaker 1: Newport Sport fishing guide service and he also does come
Speaker 1: martial fishing for giant bluefin tuna. So he happened to
Speaker 1: have a day where he didn't have a charter. He
Speaker 1: was going out to try to catch a bluefin tuna
Speaker 1: to sell. Was kind enough to invite me out with him,
Speaker 1: and uh man, we waited all day in the rain
Speaker 1: in Cape Cod Bay until we finally got our bite
Speaker 1: at five thirty. And it was a pretty quick battle
Speaker 1: forty five minutes. Uh pretty quick for it's short. That's
Speaker 1: short for a tune to the size that size. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it was a insure wait a five and ten pounds.
Speaker 1: When we brought it the you call up the truck,
Speaker 1: they come. They lifted out of the boat and then
Speaker 1: that that fish ideally goes to auction and and we'll
Speaker 1: probably fly to Japan. It's probably on its way there now.
Speaker 1: So you didn't get to taste any of that, obviously
Speaker 1: because Rob sold it. But that's a that's a different
Speaker 1: caliber tuna fishing. That's not the fun running gun jigging
Speaker 1: pop stuff like what's that really like? I've never done that.
Speaker 1: I'n't caught a five pound fish like you reeled you
Speaker 1: like you did it so much as I am just
Speaker 1: the guy who just cranked the handle on the reel.
Speaker 1: I was the one not losing the fish. That's that's
Speaker 1: your loan job. As the angler. Rob does the it's
Speaker 1: an important job. It's a a job, but it's the
Speaker 1: the captain that he set the drag, he did all
Speaker 1: the rigging for it. He's got the boat in the
Speaker 1: right place, caught the bait so all, and then he's
Speaker 1: positioning the boat around the fish while you're fighting it.
Speaker 1: But everything is in place so that it minimizes the
Speaker 1: margin for our The rod remains in the rod holder.
Speaker 1: There's a swiveling rod holder with the big one thirty
Speaker 1: size Shamano Thiagra reel, which is like the big bucket
Speaker 1: reel you see in jaws, just much older and much nicer,
Speaker 1: and then a really long but really strong rod that
Speaker 1: just and all that does it stays right in the
Speaker 1: rod holder. You're not really holding the rod and feeling
Speaker 1: the power of that fish. You were just trying to
Speaker 1: gain line when that fishes is stopped and turns his
Speaker 1: head in your destruction. But that's all the time you
Speaker 1: don't see on weiked tunas. So what I'm asking you is, like,
Speaker 1: how painful is it? They don't really talk about that,
Speaker 1: Like is it tortured to real like that? Uh, you
Speaker 1: start to burn out pretty quickly, especially you know, I'm
Speaker 1: not not in the best shape, and uh, like your shoulder,
Speaker 1: your arms starts to burn and and they do. You
Speaker 1: see a wicked tuna. A lot of let's call it
Speaker 1: yank and crank where those guys are grabbing the line, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: pulling it down to get there, their crank on the reel.
Speaker 1: Each captain fish is a different way. Rob Fish is
Speaker 1: a tighter drag than most captains, so he just has
Speaker 1: the guys cranking the real That eliminates another margin for error.
Speaker 1: Where my first giant I ever hooked, it was a
Speaker 1: couple of years ago, I was out with another captain
Speaker 1: and doing that yank and crank style, and the fish
Speaker 1: went to run and I had a grip on the
Speaker 1: line and pop the leader right off. So then let
Speaker 1: go in time. Well, good for you. I'm happy for
Speaker 1: you that you got your big tuna. I'm also hoping
Speaker 1: to get robbed on this show at some point, because
Speaker 1: you tell me he's quite a character, right, um. And
Speaker 1: you know who else as a character, My buddy Conway
Speaker 1: Bowman out in California. And this is the guy that
Speaker 1: is pioneered fly fishing for mako sharks, among many other things.
Speaker 1: And I have fomo about this too because I've never
Speaker 1: done it. But it's just not quite the same, right
Speaker 1: because it's not in my backyard. I just I can't
Speaker 1: be too upset about something happening on the opposite coast.
Speaker 1: But if you're a sweetwater angler, you might get upset
Speaker 1: about one of the answers Conway gives in this week's
Speaker 1: Covering Water. I'm going in. I can hold it. I'm
Speaker 1: all right joining me today for covering Water. My old buddy,
Speaker 1: my old pal, Conway Bowman, San Diego, pioneer of fly fishing,
Speaker 1: for Mako sharks. What's going on? Man, how's life out there?
Speaker 1: And so cal Well, it's uh, it's life and so
Speaker 1: cal Um. You know, lots of lots of crazy stuff
Speaker 1: going on. We just had a They tried to recall
Speaker 1: the governor and he uh yeah, he weathered that storm,
Speaker 1: which is amazing anyway, so we're back to square one.
Speaker 1: But other than that, it's fine. I mean, it's a
Speaker 1: it's California, but it's southern California, so it's different. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's different, but it's good, you know, excellent. Well, we
Speaker 1: have to tell everybody what happens. So this is actually
Speaker 1: take two on covering water with Conway a bowman, because
Speaker 1: the last time we did this, all I heard in
Speaker 1: my headphones was the creepiest, eeriest horror movie gong. It's
Speaker 1: like the it's like a droning. I think we were
Speaker 1: channeling the other side. And what was creepier is you
Speaker 1: couldn't hear this on your end, right, I know, it's weird.
Speaker 1: It was really weird. It like it was literally some
Speaker 1: Poulter guy ship. And I recorded a piece so that
Speaker 1: you guys can hear this now. Conway couldn't hear it.
Speaker 1: This is all I could hear. Yeah, I don't hear that.
Speaker 1: Let's see this podcast. Yeah, there's nothing else abopen hold
Speaker 1: hold on. So I'm wondering, dude, have you like have
Speaker 1: this like did you do the sage or hire the
Speaker 1: little Poulter guyst lady? Have you have you corrected this problem?
Speaker 1: You've got the demons out of the Bowman residence. I
Speaker 1: don't know. I do think this house is honted though.
Speaker 1: This is really weird stuff that's been that has happened
Speaker 1: since we moved in here about six years ago, just
Speaker 1: you know, just weird stuff. So it might be haunted.
Speaker 1: I don't know. But if if somebody listening, somebody techie,
Speaker 1: knows what that was, they'll be like, oh, yeah, it
Speaker 1: was just this let me know. Because even our audio
Speaker 1: guy Phil was like, I don't know, man, I've never
Speaker 1: heard anything like that before. It was weird. Yeah yeah,
Speaker 1: but anyway, man, So beyond beyond uh, you know, fly
Speaker 1: fish and Fromaco is that whole deal? I mean, you've
Speaker 1: been the host of several TV shows, Ford Outfitters, fly
Speaker 1: Fishing in the World, Fifty Places to fly Fish Before
Speaker 1: you Die, You've written books, You've traveled all over the
Speaker 1: world to chase fish. And what I also think I
Speaker 1: know about you is, um, you grew up in the
Speaker 1: in the surf skate scene out there a little bit right,
Speaker 1: there's a little bit of punk rock and you. And
Speaker 1: I think I once saw a picture which I'd love
Speaker 1: to have, by the way, to post on Instagram to
Speaker 1: promo this. It's a very young you with like big
Speaker 1: frosted wavy hair, like super eighties like thrash hair. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's what I had, hair I had, I had, quite yeah,
Speaker 1: quite right on, right on. So anyway, did Here's how,
Speaker 1: Here's how covering water works. So this segment is designed
Speaker 1: to just look sort of beyond the fishing skills and
Speaker 1: really get a deeper behind the scenes look at who
Speaker 1: our guests really are. So I'm gonna put two minutes
Speaker 1: on the clock and I'm just gonna rapid fire twenty
Speaker 1: questions that you will get through as many as we can.
Speaker 1: But the whole idea, right, you don't have much time
Speaker 1: to think. You just have to answer, and at the
Speaker 1: end I will give you one full minute to elaborate
Speaker 1: or back pedal on whichever answer you think was most damnit.
Speaker 1: Sound good? Sounds all right? Here? We go two minutes
Speaker 1: on the clock with Conway Bowman. Of all the fish
Speaker 1: you've targeted, what was the most difficult to catch on
Speaker 1: fly time this year? In point break? Who are you
Speaker 1: rooting for? Bodie or Johnny? Utahah? Really all right? The
Speaker 1: worst place you ever had a hook stuck in you
Speaker 1: was my back? Oh that's okay. How many times a
Speaker 1: season do you hear clients say we're gonna need a
Speaker 1: bigger boat every every day? Okay? The most underrated fish
Speaker 1: in US waters is the car beautiful social distortion or
Speaker 1: black flag black flag love it. The oldest piece of
Speaker 1: tackle you own and still use is flu your Metalist
Speaker 1: fourteen ten classic classic. Your favorite line from Fast Times
Speaker 1: at Ridgemont High is uh, Mr Hand, Mr Hand? No,
Speaker 1: it's oh god, so many I got you man? Okay,
Speaker 1: we're part of that. We're on my time, our time
Speaker 1: whatever that our time, right on, right on? Which part
Speaker 1: of the makeo on the fly process do people screw
Speaker 1: up most often? Um? The cast? Really? Okay? If you
Speaker 1: could choose one celebrity to fish with for a day,
Speaker 1: who would it be? Keith Richards Nice we share a birthday,
Speaker 1: by the way. Um, so you've targeted tons of species.
Speaker 1: Tell me which one is still on your bucket list?
Speaker 1: The man guard the man? What does the man man guard? Wait,
Speaker 1: we'll elaborate late. I'm a Cloucks running out. The last
Speaker 1: concert you attended was Oh my god, um English speed. Okay, alright,
Speaker 1: last one. What's the most overrated fish in US waters?
Speaker 1: The large mouth bass? Beautiful? Could not agree more? That's
Speaker 1: time that dude? That was That was great. So there's
Speaker 1: there's several ones I think could use some elaboration, But
Speaker 1: I'm curious to hear which one we you only get
Speaker 1: to pick one. Which one do you want to tell
Speaker 1: us more about? Uh? It's the Johnny Utah or boat.
Speaker 1: And I'm sorry, Yeah, it was good. I'm sorry. I
Speaker 1: commend you for using You just said that large mouth suck.
Speaker 1: But you're gonna use your time here on bent to
Speaker 1: tell us why body is cooler and that's why I
Speaker 1: love you, So go ahead. Uh, Well, he just is.
Speaker 1: I mean he was more tan. He looked more like
Speaker 1: a surfer, although he could. Patrick Swayzey was a horrible paddler,
Speaker 1: by the way. He was a he was just he
Speaker 1: was just more badass. I mean, he skydived he robbed
Speaker 1: a bank. Uh and uh he was he was the
Speaker 1: Bodhi softa Bra. Yeah. I mean, you know he was Bodie.
Speaker 1: He controlled his environment, whether he whether it was controlling
Speaker 1: war child or um, you know, or controlling the police officer.
Speaker 1: I mean at the end of the movie, you know
Speaker 1: that was it. He did it his way because he
Speaker 1: was the Bodhi softa bra. Hands down, no bullshit. That
Speaker 1: is the best elaboration on covering orter we've ever had
Speaker 1: in a year and a half. That was the best
Speaker 1: appreciated so much, dude. So people, so people know you
Speaker 1: are still actively guiding like they can still They probably
Speaker 1: have to book in advance, but you are still doing
Speaker 1: the Mako thing on a weekly basis in season, right.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, absolutely. And it's it's getting uh, I mean
Speaker 1: it's this year was probably my busiest year in a
Speaker 1: long time. Um. And uh, the fishing is great. The
Speaker 1: fish are big, They're getting bigger. It's the weirdest thing
Speaker 1: I've over the last ten years. I've seen an increase
Speaker 1: in the size. It's crazy. Um. But yeah, but if
Speaker 1: people want to book with me, they got to get
Speaker 1: ahead of it because you know, I've got other stuff
Speaker 1: going on too, but I would say six months to
Speaker 1: book with me. Yeah, it's crazy because there's been kind
Speaker 1: of this resurgence of of I don't know if it's uh,
Speaker 1: you know, anglers wanting to target a big game fish
Speaker 1: on the fly ride, but I think they're discovering that
Speaker 1: they really don't have to fly. Well. Number one, COVID
Speaker 1: pretty much shut shut everybody down for traveling. So they said, well,
Speaker 1: let's let's do the next best thing, or let's do
Speaker 1: a really good big game fish and let's go to
Speaker 1: San Diego because it's close, you know, and and so
Speaker 1: and that really sort of um kind of carved out
Speaker 1: a whole new clientele for me. So and this year
Speaker 1: has been insane. It's been absolutely right on, right on. Dude.
Speaker 1: I've known you for years. I've been saying I'm gonna
Speaker 1: do this for years. I remember the first time I
Speaker 1: read about it was in Field and Stream, long before
Speaker 1: I ever worked there. And I have not gotten there yet.
Speaker 1: So hopefully the next hopefully, the next time I see
Speaker 1: it will be on your boat. But uh, in the meantime, man,
Speaker 1: I appreciate you coming out for covering water, best elaboration
Speaker 1: ever boating for the wind have you ever heard of
Speaker 1: a man guard, Jim, I haven't. It sounds like man
Speaker 1: bear pig from South That's That's exactly what came to mind,
Speaker 1: was man bear pig. I looked it up and it's
Speaker 1: native to the Tigris and Euphrates river system in Iran, Iraq,
Speaker 1: Syria and Turkey. And it looks like a machiner or
Speaker 1: like a she fish, kind of big silvery thing. And dude,
Speaker 1: I'd never heard of it before. Um, perhaps I should
Speaker 1: do a finclips about those. But there's a there's a
Speaker 1: very short man guard Wikipedia page, like, there's not a
Speaker 1: whole lot there, though it does say that they eat birds,
Speaker 1: and if they'll eat that, I'm certain they couldn't resist
Speaker 1: a spin walker from our sponsors thirteen Fishing. Is it
Speaker 1: a walking bait? Is it a prop bait? It's both,
Speaker 1: Jim with the blade uniquely positioned at the belly to create,
Speaker 1: as thirteen puts it, a beguiling sputter. How beguiling Joe
Speaker 1: it is? I also read that the man guard is
Speaker 1: in trouble, probably because the party boat fleet in Iran
Speaker 1: is just hammering them constantly. But let's talk about party
Speaker 1: boats for a second. You're a big fan of party
Speaker 1: boat fishing, and so am I. Um and on the water.
Speaker 1: You guys recently launched a new video series called at
Speaker 1: the Rail, which I'm super jealous of because finally somebody
Speaker 1: has gone all in on a media property that just
Speaker 1: glorifies party boat fishing. Yeah, there's such a rich culture
Speaker 1: to party boat fishing that dates back to before World
Speaker 1: War One, and it's it's still such a vibrant part
Speaker 1: of the Northeast fishing culture, but you don't see much
Speaker 1: of it. You don't hear about it much in videos
Speaker 1: and YouTube videos and magazines, and it's all over the
Speaker 1: country right like it's a big deal here. But I
Speaker 1: mean there's party boats on every coast, including the golf
Speaker 1: and this is the first time I've seen somebody just
Speaker 1: focus on that. Yeah. I've been party boat fishing since
Speaker 1: my first ever saltwater trip. That was the first time
Speaker 1: I ever got out there on the you know, I
Speaker 1: went deep sea fishing on a half day boat out
Speaker 1: of Seattle City, New Jersey, and never owning a boat
Speaker 1: to this point, it's always my way to get out
Speaker 1: there and do the fishing I wouldn't be able to
Speaker 1: do on my own and there's a boat in the
Speaker 1: northeast for just about any type of fishing you want
Speaker 1: to do, from back bay fishing for flounder or fluke
Speaker 1: to going out to the canyons and catching tuna. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I can tell you guys did a great job
Speaker 1: with it. Our mutual friend in your colleague got Anthony
Speaker 1: the chi Chi. There's one line in your In Your
Speaker 1: Porgy episode, I believe it was No Haddock episode, when
Speaker 1: you you said his lucky charm is actually lucky charms.
Speaker 1: It's a it's a lucky Charms cereal bar and you
Speaker 1: were like, that is the laziest lucky charm I have
Speaker 1: ever seen in my life of all the things. It's
Speaker 1: like he was, He's like, I need a superstition, and uh,
Speaker 1: that makes sense, I need a lucky charm. He goes, well,
Speaker 1: party boats so they can also they can easily fix fomo,
Speaker 1: right like if they If you can't find a ride,
Speaker 1: there's always that option. However, you know, like the risk,
Speaker 1: and I think the fun of party boat fishing, of course,
Speaker 1: is that you don't know who you're fishing with. And
Speaker 1: I know over the years you and I have both
Speaker 1: met some characters um and and party boat people. They
Speaker 1: tend to be good salt of the earth people. You
Speaker 1: seem like you have a thought on that. I've very
Speaker 1: rarely had an experience where I'm fishing next to, or
Speaker 1: fishing near or somebody who I would rather not be
Speaker 1: fishing near. Everybody's going out there with the same goal,
Speaker 1: have a good time, get some fish. It is you
Speaker 1: don't run into too many jerks on the party boats. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, you're right, man, Like, they're always just really good,
Speaker 1: down home people, kind of like the people Bruce Springsteen
Speaker 1: sings about you Springsteen fan, Jim. Of course, Joe. You
Speaker 1: couldn't grow up around New Jersey without being a Springsteen fan. Well,
Speaker 1: that's true, but like people think like born in the USA,
Speaker 1: came in the mail with samples of tide. That's not true.
Speaker 1: But yes, there's Jersey pride there and wouldn't you know it.
Speaker 1: Someone sent me audio of Bruce at a recent Jersey show,
Speaker 1: and while he normally ran was about politics and ship
Speaker 1: at the beginning of his songs, he apparently decided to
Speaker 1: give a regional party boat report. Oh wow, hey, now
Speaker 1: wondering if you'll take a little trip with me? That's
Speaker 1: right to a little place called Asbury Park, New Jersey.
Speaker 1: You know, the big Mohawk was fishing about three miles
Speaker 1: off beautiful Asbury Park yesterday and they had Paul who
Speaker 1: who keeper flute. You know. The other day I was
Speaker 1: talking to my old friend Tony, that Tony Tony from
Speaker 1: Point Pleasant, New Jersey. When Tony's not working at the
Speaker 1: Sestis factory, he likes to do a little fishing. I mean, heck,
Speaker 1: who doesn't. Right, Tony said he was out on the
Speaker 1: Gambler last week and he caught how hey, hi Hope
Speaker 1: keeper black sea bass. Doesn't that sound tasty, doesn't he?
Speaker 1: You know what goes good with black sea bass? Tequila? Yeah,
Speaker 1: but you know, according to my buddy Lester, there's no
Speaker 1: hard alcohol allowed on the Sea Queen up here in Brooklyn.
Speaker 1: I know why I feel you, but old Lester said,
Speaker 1: you know what, I didn't need any liquor because I
Speaker 1: was feeling plenty high after catching who who he hope
Speaker 1: keeper Porties. This one goes out to Lester and all
Speaker 1: the boys at the lead taste testing facil Billion Yonkers.
Speaker 1: I always remember to tip your mate, Oh hey, how
Speaker 1: I fished on most of those boats the boss is
Speaker 1: talking about you ever bring me into him out there, Jim,
Speaker 1: because on board, who knew maybe maybe this season? Well,
Speaker 1: I know it sounds he did a perfect job of
Speaker 1: describing like the occupations of several of the people you'll
Speaker 1: meet on a party boat. I particularly enjoyed the lead
Speaker 1: taste testing facility guy. Anyway, let's move on from trying
Speaker 1: to win the pool with the biggest fish on the
Speaker 1: party boat to me trying to win the pool and
Speaker 1: fish news by catching a bigger, better news story than
Speaker 1: my co anchor, Hayden Sammock. Fish news. That escalated quickly.
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna do a quick bit of housekeeping here.
Speaker 1: I actually have a message, direct message from Mr Miles
Speaker 1: Nulty to all of you listening. And this is so perfect.
Speaker 1: Hayden's already laughing. This is so perfect because in his
Speaker 1: farewell episode, Lance V The Great Lands V pointed out
Speaker 1: how badly Miles sucks at social media. So, like, if
Speaker 1: I may, right, most people know that you don't use
Speaker 1: your work email to like sign up for porn Hub
Speaker 1: premium or only fans or cat Toys monthly or whatever. Right,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying? Yeah, yeah, you know I
Speaker 1: didn't really think about it too much. I should probably
Speaker 1: call some places, but yeah, I got you call the
Speaker 1: places you use your work email for too, in case
Speaker 1: you uh cut and run. Yeah, anyway, listen, So Miles
Speaker 1: used his freaking meat eater email to sign up for Instagram,
Speaker 1: and now he yet and now he doesn't work here anymore,
Speaker 1: and that email went away. This literally happened two days
Speaker 1: before our farewell show. So now he cannot get into
Speaker 1: his Instagram account to respond to all your lovely messages
Speaker 1: and comments and well wishes. And he personally asked me
Speaker 1: to convey this to you so that nobody thinks he's
Speaker 1: just like a giant dick that's too good to answer, right,
Speaker 1: And I gotta say there is a possibility that by
Speaker 1: the time you guys are hearing this, this issue will
Speaker 1: have been resolved. But at last check in, like things
Speaker 1: were not looking good. Like he's working on it, but
Speaker 1: apparently he's like you know, Instagram, and nobody on Instagram
Speaker 1: is beating his pager back. Are all the range among
Speaker 1: among startups? Oh my god? So hopefully that gets fixed.
Speaker 1: But but now you all know, there you go, message
Speaker 1: conveyed hating what's going on with you man, how you
Speaker 1: living this week? What you've been up to? Hey, dude,
Speaker 1: just been poking around the y'all elk woods there this season. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I saw your elk meat hauling adventures on the ground
Speaker 1: and that's great and all, but we need to get
Speaker 1: you away from that. I mean, here at Bent we'll
Speaker 1: take a half day of trout and a trip to pizza, wings,
Speaker 1: steaks and things over a fourteen mile round triphike to
Speaker 1: help a buddy any day. Um, but I'm kiding, of course. Man.
Speaker 1: It's cool to see so many of my colleagues out
Speaker 1: in Montana putting arrows in elk, very good stuff, and
Speaker 1: I know what a challenge that is. Where I mean,
Speaker 1: so I've read I couldn't do it, but I hope
Speaker 1: you get yours. Man, you're feeling good. Are you gonna
Speaker 1: get it done? Well? First off, it actually ended up
Speaker 1: being closer to oh dude, it is stupid brutal man. Uh.
Speaker 1: As soon as we shot those two elk man, we
Speaker 1: were like yes, and then we're like, oh, no, stupid brutal.
Speaker 1: I think I'll get it done. It's a lot like
Speaker 1: it's a lot like muskie fishing m in you know,
Speaker 1: the only way to get it done is like sheer
Speaker 1: volume of effort, you know, right an, Yeah, I we'll
Speaker 1: see what's up right on. So, how are you feeling
Speaker 1: about your news story this week? Don't worry about me, bro,
Speaker 1: I got okay, good, all right fish news. Remember, folks,
Speaker 1: this is a competition. And at the end, Phil my wonderful,
Speaker 1: smart kind, charismatic boss. It's Joe's leadoff this week. So Joe, yeah,
Speaker 1: you had the honors in your inaugural run, but now
Speaker 1: it's my turn. So um, let's see. I've got a
Speaker 1: record fish story this week with a twist. But first
Speaker 1: I have to ask have you any experience catching Benito
Speaker 1: or False Avocore or a Little Tuny as they're better
Speaker 1: known from where we go from Yeah, a little tun No,
Speaker 1: you know, I haven't personally. I've heard their riot Old
Speaker 1: Tommy are over at Orbits goes off about them on
Speaker 1: his podcast all the time. Man, he makes them seem
Speaker 1: fun dude, big fan yep. Yeah, but uh, you know
Speaker 1: before I made the move out was they were like
Speaker 1: super high on my agenda? Right? Um? I happen to
Speaker 1: know you, however, do have a lot of experience? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I love them? I love. The matter of fact, Albi's
Speaker 1: season is just about to kick off here. Also a
Speaker 1: matter of fact, this week's guest co host, Jim Fee
Speaker 1: is an I'll be slayer and he sees them even
Speaker 1: sooner up on Cape Cod than I do in Jersey,
Speaker 1: so he's already getting his fix. Um. But where I live,
Speaker 1: these fish have this insane cult following. They only come
Speaker 1: inshore for a short time. They fight like hell, and
Speaker 1: of course like they're super popular with the Salty bro
Speaker 1: Bra fly crowd from step bro Bra. What was that
Speaker 1: that clip? That that's that's from a trailer to a
Speaker 1: documentary called al or Nothing, which I highly highly recommend
Speaker 1: everyone looks up on YouTube. And I'll just say, long
Speaker 1: before any of you ever heard the name Bob the
Speaker 1: garbage Man, there was Shane Babcock, the world's greatest false
Speaker 1: albacore fly fisherman. Anyway, I digress. The point is that
Speaker 1: in the north right these fish are revered, but once
Speaker 1: you get south of North Carolina, they're they're pretty much
Speaker 1: considered junk like, including in the Gulf of Mexico. There
Speaker 1: there a year round and they just tend to get
Speaker 1: in the way of the stuff guys really want to
Speaker 1: catch like tuna and kingfish stuff like that. Well, late
Speaker 1: this summer, Alabama Angler, I want to say it's it's
Speaker 1: probably pronounced Kyle, but there's an extra A in there,
Speaker 1: so it could also be Kale k A y l E.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna just say Kyle. Kyle Davis signed himself up
Speaker 1: for the Alabama Deep Sea Fishing Rodeo, which is I
Speaker 1: understand it is a weekend long event. Now, what Davis
Speaker 1: wanted to catch were black fin tuna, And before I
Speaker 1: even got to the fish part, I was struck by
Speaker 1: a quote from Davis who said he was seventy four
Speaker 1: miles off in a one ft boat boat. I mean, dude,
Speaker 1: that's some cowboys ship right there. Boy, that's a brave dude. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Now I have no idea what he was running, but
Speaker 1: they had to be carrying extra and Yeah. And while that,
Speaker 1: while that sounds like crazy to non cowboy me, this
Speaker 1: is also why I love you Southern golf boys. I
Speaker 1: mean that if you need fresh tuna, you'll just trap
Speaker 1: a drum a diesel to a rubber raft and get
Speaker 1: after it. And I respect that. Um. Anyway, so Davis
Speaker 1: he found his tuna but mixed in were bonita, which
Speaker 1: is very common. They go hand in hand, and I
Speaker 1: can tell you from experience. We all get crazy on
Speaker 1: the Instagram here when we land like a five pounder
Speaker 1: on fly in mont talk, that's nothing. In the Gulf,
Speaker 1: they're huge. Oh dude, they will break a nine weight
Speaker 1: um and how huge, might wonder? Well? Davis ended up
Speaker 1: sticking a bobo that weighed twenty two pounds four ounces.
Speaker 1: But that number is technically inaccurate, and I'll get to
Speaker 1: that right, So a little twisty here, Um, you with me?
Speaker 1: Still with me? Hayden? Well, I mean you're talking to
Speaker 1: it totally, you know, neophyte in the in the bobo catching,
Speaker 1: don't you do for a trip home? Like in the
Speaker 1: next couple of weeks. I'll make it happen. So anyway,
Speaker 1: Davis said they were keeping some of the benita they
Speaker 1: were catching, um and as soon as they hit the deck,
Speaker 1: they'd cut him in half because they'd end up right
Speaker 1: in the freezer back home to use on later trips
Speaker 1: for bait. Well, the benita they were catching were so
Speaker 1: big they decided to keep one to weigh in at
Speaker 1: the rodeo. Now, I said that final weight was technically
Speaker 1: inaccurate because Davis and crew had stayed out fishing I'm
Speaker 1: thinking probably overnight, so it didn't hit the Rodeo scale
Speaker 1: until thirty six hours after it was caught, which means
Speaker 1: it likely weighed more than twenty two pounds four ounces.
Speaker 1: But even after losing some water weight, it's still qualified
Speaker 1: for an Alabama state record, beating the twenty one pound
Speaker 1: record that had stood since nineteen fifty six. So here's
Speaker 1: the fun part. It took the Rodeo people a little
Speaker 1: time to figure out that this was a state record,
Speaker 1: and when they did, they immediately got in touch with
Speaker 1: Davis and said, hey, we're gonna need that fish, and
Speaker 1: he was like, hey, I already cut it in half
Speaker 1: and threw it in the Babe freezer right. So luckily
Speaker 1: he had enough photographic evidence that the fish will still
Speaker 1: qualit five. But here's what I think is funny. While
Speaker 1: I'm sure Davis thinks it's cool to claim the record,
Speaker 1: he wasn't treating that fish any different than the thousands
Speaker 1: of other bonita he's probably whacked up over the years
Speaker 1: for bait, and I can almost guarantee between nineteen fifty
Speaker 1: six one, many, many many bonita bigger than twenty one
Speaker 1: pounds have been caught, but none of the people that
Speaker 1: caught them down in the Gulf off Alabama gave enough
Speaker 1: of a ship about them to think or care about
Speaker 1: claiming a state record, you know what I mean? Okay,
Speaker 1: So I kind of love and hate this, uh for
Speaker 1: two reasons. First Off, I love that this dude is
Speaker 1: cutting up state record fish for bait. It's actually actually
Speaker 1: happened before. There's been stories of people like eating world
Speaker 1: records and ship Oh yeah, I mean you hear about him.
Speaker 1: But somehow, and I don't know why, it just makes
Speaker 1: me happy. I guess it's. I guess it's because like
Speaker 1: in this era of like Lion class record goofball is
Speaker 1: trying to turn like anything into a record to have
Speaker 1: their name in the book somewhere. Ye. Like this speaks
Speaker 1: to like a a sort of like pure form of pursuit,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Said, Well, yeah, I call
Speaker 1: it this thing, but I'm trying to catch this thing.
Speaker 1: So this thing is now bait regardless of its you
Speaker 1: know status. Yeah that said. I kind of hate it
Speaker 1: because it's just like the trash fish thing, you know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: false Albi's not that I know a lot about them
Speaker 1: are cool, Like they look cool, they fight hard, they
Speaker 1: burn drags, but everyone has collectively decided for some reason
Speaker 1: they're just like you know right now. I kind of
Speaker 1: got a theory about it. I found that, with like
Speaker 1: some exceptions like tarpan for instance, a lot of fish
Speaker 1: are labeled trash fish because of like perceived edibility. Uh
Speaker 1: do they do they just like taste shitty or well? Yeah,
Speaker 1: And it's a it's a fair question. And I think
Speaker 1: a lot of the the lack of table fair opportunity
Speaker 1: to be with with Albie's um has created that that
Speaker 1: vibe you're talking about. And I got to be real honest,
Speaker 1: I've never eaten one. I've hacked up a lot of them,
Speaker 1: and I can tell you compared to like a skip
Speaker 1: jack tuna or some of the other lesser tunas, man
Speaker 1: like that meat is so red it's almost black, and
Speaker 1: you can just sort of smell the oiliness sort of
Speaker 1: mackerel uh scent that these fish have, which is why
Speaker 1: they're such great bait. That said, every once in a
Speaker 1: blue moon, you'll see a piece of media pop up
Speaker 1: where like somebody claims that we're all crazy and they
Speaker 1: make like the best sashimi ever and I haven't tried it,
Speaker 1: but you know, you you'll see a video pop up
Speaker 1: or a catching cook where somebody's like, if you bleed
Speaker 1: him and you do this, it's the best ever. But man,
Speaker 1: I feel like if that were true, more people would
Speaker 1: have caught onto that, you know what I mean, Like
Speaker 1: you just don't. It's just not working. And like skip Jack's,
Speaker 1: they're kind of like subpar, but they're way better than
Speaker 1: a false apocor if I catch skippies, I'll keep some
Speaker 1: if we're you know, but I don't know, man I
Speaker 1: I just think that's that's what it is. They just
Speaker 1: are such a strong flavored fish. Yeah, I mean that
Speaker 1: would be difficult for me, you know. I'm I'm a
Speaker 1: huge sushi guy. Man sushi and sushimi until it comes
Speaker 1: out my eyeballs. But I am not a fan of
Speaker 1: like oily fish, like mackerel, like totally turns me off,
Speaker 1: right right. We're gonna explore a lot more of that
Speaker 1: and when the new season of B Side drops with
Speaker 1: our first episode, oily fishes is kind of like the deal.
Speaker 1: But um, I would try it. I should. I should,
Speaker 1: Just to say that I did it. Maybe this season
Speaker 1: I'll bleed one out and just and just see. Dude, Well,
Speaker 1: when I come down there and we go, i'll be fishing.
Speaker 1: Let's do it. But you can eat all you want,
Speaker 1: all right, speaking of eating all the fish you want,
Speaker 1: yeah no, no, Tom's all you can eat fish bag.
Speaker 1: My story comes from the otter side of the pond
Speaker 1: in the UK. I have to I don't like it,
Speaker 1: but I can't not like it because I appreciate you
Speaker 1: trying to spin these It's great. Actually I love it. Forget.
Speaker 1: I just said that, it's just keep being you. So
Speaker 1: a UK couple is what I can only describe as
Speaker 1: deeply deeply disturbed over recent developments in their backyard pond.
Speaker 1: Uh Eric and Linda Mackenzie have recently discovered that something
Speaker 1: had invaded their pond and has just been absolutely destroying
Speaker 1: the prized fish that they stocked, like some fifteen years ago. Oh,
Speaker 1: I can already guess what the prized fish are, but
Speaker 1: I will let you continue. Basically, during their daily stroll
Speaker 1: around the fishing grounds or whatever British folks call a
Speaker 1: walk around a pond, they kept finding carcasses of these
Speaker 1: prized fish. So I guess they had like a buddy
Speaker 1: with a trail cam or something, because they slapped one
Speaker 1: up and immediately found out what was killing their fish.
Speaker 1: And he guesses, I'm gonna say otter. Yeah, so you
Speaker 1: already forgot that you made the otter pun It wasn't
Speaker 1: a big otter. Yeah. Uh. And they figured that the
Speaker 1: otter has marked like ten fish worth an estimated five
Speaker 1: thousand pounds, which is I don't know the exactly version, right,
Speaker 1: but that's a ship ton of American dollars. I was
Speaker 1: gonna say, I'll take your word for it, because I
Speaker 1: don't know math or currency either. Um. I I know
Speaker 1: enough about British fishing culture to to understand the way
Speaker 1: things work there, so I know where we're going, um,
Speaker 1: and I know that that certain things that we we
Speaker 1: wouldn't pay a shiny nickel for worth that kind of
Speaker 1: money there. So continue on. Let's hear what they lost
Speaker 1: for five thousand pounds. Well I'll get to that, but
Speaker 1: to continue the story, these folks are like are pissed.
Speaker 1: They're they're like really really pissed. And you know how
Speaker 1: a lot of times, like the matter, folks get the dumber,
Speaker 1: they get absolutely absolutely anger just like completely shuts down
Speaker 1: your brain function. Yes, well, Mr mackenzie said, and I quote,
Speaker 1: we would like to see some restriction on their breeding
Speaker 1: before the fish stock in our rivers is depleted. So wait,
Speaker 1: he's talking about wild rivers, but the problem here happened
Speaker 1: in his private pond. Yeah. Yeah, it's obviously reductionist. This
Speaker 1: guy is clearly taking a personal problem existing in an
Speaker 1: artificial environment that he created and applying his experience to
Speaker 1: the entirety of the UK to be fair, is also
Speaker 1: mostly an artificial environment. We have some listeners across the
Speaker 1: pond Man that they're like still trying to figure out
Speaker 1: if they like you or not. You gotta be careful,
Speaker 1: although I'm I'm gonna make fun of them later in
Speaker 1: this show too. So sorry. I'm a big fan of
Speaker 1: your chalk streams anyhow. I just wish I was allowed
Speaker 1: to fish some and had the money to do so.
Speaker 1: I showed up there. Yeah, only bamboo anyhow. When I
Speaker 1: read I'm sorry guy, anyhow, when I read that quote,
Speaker 1: my first thought was that there was like some organization
Speaker 1: that was like doing some vigilante reintroduction type stuff with
Speaker 1: these odors, you know, maybe breeding them and dumping these
Speaker 1: captive bread otters into the river. Uh, that's not the case.
Speaker 1: In the research I did, Eric specifically mentioned a UK
Speaker 1: conservation organization called the Otter Trust, So I checked out
Speaker 1: their website thinking that I was going to see something
Speaker 1: about a breeding program. Um, and there is absolutely no
Speaker 1: mention of a breeding program. And further research, the only
Speaker 1: thing that I could really find was that there was
Speaker 1: a ten year period from like the mid eighties to
Speaker 1: the mid nineties where about two hundred individual otters were
Speaker 1: released at a time when there were very very few otters.
Speaker 1: So it's not like we're dumping thousands of hosto like waters. Ye.
Speaker 1: So yeah, again, all that to say that there's no
Speaker 1: vigilante otter reintroduction going on. It's like a vigilante uh
Speaker 1: cat the cat. It's a cat who is vigilant that Gordon, Okay,
Speaker 1: And that means or at least it sounds like the
Speaker 1: Mackenzie's are somehow suggesting that we limit the otter's ability
Speaker 1: to breed in the wild. Yeah, man, And so yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it's it's just a case of two people like
Speaker 1: going all that wild stuff that's happening out there, we
Speaker 1: need to do something about that immediately, Yeah, because I
Speaker 1: like the stuff that I got going on in my pond. Um. Now,
Speaker 1: I have no idea how they'd go about limiting, like,
Speaker 1: you know, the otters breeding in the wild. But if
Speaker 1: they do start some sort of anti otter anti breeding coalition,
Speaker 1: I'd like to formally suggest the slogan no more otters.
Speaker 1: We'll make surets to that right right along with my
Speaker 1: dolphins T shirt. It's sort of the same thing, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean, Like we have having a lot
Speaker 1: of fun with the dolphins, but same deal, man. I mean,
Speaker 1: unfortunately this happens too often where you know, you see
Speaker 1: this with like it's kind of like where I live
Speaker 1: and where you're from, like people like I think the
Speaker 1: deer are pets and things and anything we can do
Speaker 1: to protect the deer from this or that, you know,
Speaker 1: shutting down bare hunts to protect this and protect that.
Speaker 1: It's like you just can't meddle that far with the
Speaker 1: wild man, Like sorry, And I know who even has
Speaker 1: the time to suggest all these things or right to
Speaker 1: whoever they have to write to, expecting people to what
Speaker 1: jump up and start what trapping otters or even caring
Speaker 1: or looking a gets similar to snake heads. They're everywhere now,
Speaker 1: and like every once in a while, some one will
Speaker 1: pop up in a new place and people like called
Speaker 1: d ep, like get down here right now, and it's like, dude,
Speaker 1: they're not gonna like they're not the Ghostbusters, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. I just swoop in and like set
Speaker 1: up the trap like for slimer, you know. So it's
Speaker 1: it's just lunas. Like you said, people get dumb when
Speaker 1: they're mad. Yeah, I mean I guess you've got to
Speaker 1: give the British folks points for consistency, because this is
Speaker 1: like the most hilariously colonialist solution to a native species
Speaker 1: living the way it has forever. Yes, you know, yes
Speaker 1: for millennia. Yeah, and and and I have one more
Speaker 1: quote that's just kind of unbelievable. So for folks who
Speaker 1: suppose love nature, as is mentioned many times in the
Speaker 1: articles I've found about this prized fish massacre, I can't
Speaker 1: imagine two folks being more out of touch with reality.
Speaker 1: Eric Mackenzie says, and I quote, we enjoy our walks
Speaker 1: around the surrounding countryside and seeing the local wildlife, but
Speaker 1: feel strongly the more should be done to control these animals.
Speaker 1: And take responsibility for their actions. Like what does that
Speaker 1: even mean? I really want to know, Like, what kind
Speaker 1: of weird British solution Eric isn't visioning? Here? Are we
Speaker 1: going to a point an otter lord? If that paid well,
Speaker 1: I'd go over there and be the otter lord, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean? Try something different for a little while.
Speaker 1: I don't think it'd pay very good. It might get
Speaker 1: you on the chalk streams, though, you know what I'm saying, Like,
Speaker 1: maybe that's a perk of the job, you know, it could. Uh. Now,
Speaker 1: I'm sure you've noticed I've been referring to the otter
Speaker 1: victims as surprized fish. Joe, ask me what kind of
Speaker 1: fish these are. I'm just gonna guess. I'm gonna say
Speaker 1: their carp because I know they're about some carp over there.
Speaker 1: They are grass carp, grass carp. That's interesting to me.
Speaker 1: I see. Now again, I'm not super fluent in the
Speaker 1: in the entirety of the carp scene there, but mostly
Speaker 1: what you see and what I know guys will spend
Speaker 1: big bucks on are the mirrors and the commons and
Speaker 1: the ones with the long fantails. I didn't even know
Speaker 1: grass carp was a thing over there. I'm wondering if
Speaker 1: their native or invasive. Do you know, Oh, they are
Speaker 1: invasive for sure? Really yeah? Kind of the interesting thing
Speaker 1: about it is um there is, I believe is small,
Speaker 1: you know, population that can breed in the wild because
Speaker 1: of water temperatures. But for the most part, when you
Speaker 1: find grass carp in the UK, they're effectively sterile because
Speaker 1: the water temperature never gets to the point that they're
Speaker 1: able to spawn. Got you. They're not even native in
Speaker 1: the UK, which I think kind of falls in line
Speaker 1: a little bit with the char story we discussed last week.
Speaker 1: Sure with native species, although obviously these aren't fish there
Speaker 1: otters um being extirpated in favor of imported and exotic species.
Speaker 1: Uh somehow, Like you know, people equate a better fishing
Speaker 1: opportunity to a better environment, and I just don't think
Speaker 1: that that's true. No, you're right, man, Like grant, imported
Speaker 1: grass carp should not win out over cute, playful otters.
Speaker 1: I agree, very similar to the char deal. Uh, Phil,
Speaker 1: what do you feel like today? What kind of sashimi
Speaker 1: grass carp or false alvacore? I'm not sure. I would
Speaker 1: actually probably venture to guess that the grass carp might
Speaker 1: end up being better. Um, but that was a fun one.
Speaker 1: We're gonna hear from Phil. He's gonna judge us, Okay,
Speaker 1: he's gonna to lay down the law. And then as
Speaker 1: soon as we're done, we're actually gonna do our first
Speaker 1: for official Nibbles and SIPs segment because I've asked for
Speaker 1: voice recordings from you guys, and boy are you delivering.
Speaker 1: Sorry Hayden, but I've got to give it to the
Speaker 1: Otter podcast host until you stop making these shitty puns,
Speaker 1: Joseph Mellie, you're the winner. Listen. All three of us
Speaker 1: can play music. And I'll be damned if our band
Speaker 1: name isn't going to be Vigilante Otto reintroduction. Catch us
Speaker 1: on the event, Spotify playlist and probably nowhere else. It
Speaker 1: is of loneliness. Oh god, so Jim, I recently put
Speaker 1: out the call for our listeners to send me voice
Speaker 1: memos for a fresh segment. I'm calling Nibbles and SIPs
Speaker 1: and our audio engineer Phil. He doesn't care for the name.
Speaker 1: But that's too bad. Um, But but I told people
Speaker 1: you could send a comment, question, rant rave. These things
Speaker 1: could be done drunk or sober. Anything goes and I've
Speaker 1: been getting some response. Yeah, nibbleson SIPs reminds me of
Speaker 1: what another one of our mutual friends, crazy Alberto Nie,
Speaker 1: used to say when he would describe how the trout
Speaker 1: we're feeding and he would call them kisses and slaps.
Speaker 1: That just reminds me that I gotta get Alberto knee
Speaker 1: on this show. Kisses and slaps. It could have gone
Speaker 1: either way, but I'm sticking with nibbles and SIPs. So anyway,
Speaker 1: So last week, my my inaugural nibble and Sip was
Speaker 1: a fan telling me I mispronounced some hockey ship. So
Speaker 1: this week we have actually a very fun question from
Speaker 1: listener Noah Dodson. Here it is, Hey guys, So my
Speaker 1: question is I do a lot of fishing with my dad.
Speaker 1: We go to a local lake for a lot of
Speaker 1: large mouth and small smallmouth bass. Well, my dad's about
Speaker 1: seventy one years old and the only bait he use
Speaker 1: a soft plastic worms, most time in colors that the
Speaker 1: companies don't even make anymore. He uses these alongs with
Speaker 1: copious amounts of what he calls monkey pee. What can
Speaker 1: I do to convince him to diversify his bait? Pile.
Speaker 1: There is so much to say about this. Where do
Speaker 1: we start? Yeah, so I've never heard of that particular
Speaker 1: fish attracting. Uh, monkey monkey, you're referring to the monkey pee. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so I was taken aback by the monkey pee. I've
Speaker 1: never heard of it either. Um. Now, we we were
Speaker 1: both accurate in assuming that it is in fact a
Speaker 1: cent attracting, but I was. I was thinking it's got
Speaker 1: to be homemade, like some backwoods homebrew or something. But
Speaker 1: I followed up because I had to know. According to know,
Speaker 1: a monkey piece smells like garlic, and his pops puts
Speaker 1: it on on every bait, and it is not homemade.
Speaker 1: He bought it many many years ago, which makes me
Speaker 1: wonder did he buy it by the case or does
Speaker 1: he just not fish that often? Because how long can
Speaker 1: a bottle or two from the eighties or whenever last
Speaker 1: if he literally puts it on every bait. No, not
Speaker 1: that you describe it like that reminds me of the
Speaker 1: old There used to be aerosol cans of fish spray,
Speaker 1: you remember those, And they would smell like, oh god,
Speaker 1: they would always blow up eventually like if you left
Speaker 1: them in Oh my god. That you're right I don't
Speaker 1: remember what they were called. Bang? Is that what they
Speaker 1: were called? Bang? Bang? Yep, there were all kinds of
Speaker 1: things like that. They were the aerosol cans and they
Speaker 1: would always ooze if you left him in your tackle box.
Speaker 1: And then only the hardcore salty you guys are gonna
Speaker 1: remember this, But do you remember the freaking bait bombs.
Speaker 1: It was like a grenade, an aerosol grenade that you
Speaker 1: would shake and like pull the pin and drop down
Speaker 1: on a line to depth and it would just blow
Speaker 1: up in the middle of the water column and create
Speaker 1: like a huge cloud of bunker or mackerel oil. I
Speaker 1: must have missed that one. That does not ring a bell.
Speaker 1: That's great, God, dude, you wouldn't have missed it if
Speaker 1: you were there when one blew up in the cutty
Speaker 1: cabin of my old pursuit, just because as it was overheated,
Speaker 1: I forget, it gets rather hot down there in the summertime,
Speaker 1: and like I didn't even remember it was in there,
Speaker 1: um and and it was. It was a bad, bad deal. Anyway.
Speaker 1: I would love to know the specifics um of Noah's
Speaker 1: dad's arsenal, because once again, if you can, if you
Speaker 1: can really lean on discontinued baits and colors. These worms.
Speaker 1: He says, he's using mostly discontinued stuff. If you can
Speaker 1: do that for years and years, you gotta have one
Speaker 1: hell of a stash. Um And I don't know, it
Speaker 1: could also be worth a lot of money, Like he
Speaker 1: might have the only original power worms in crystal clear
Speaker 1: pepsi color left on the planet. Oh that's a that's
Speaker 1: a collectible item right there. I love crystal pepis. Did
Speaker 1: you love the real crystal pepsi? I thought it was gross.
Speaker 1: They brought it back a couple of years ago, and
Speaker 1: I went on a mission to find it. I finally
Speaker 1: found out a Walmart two towns overly, Really I did?
Speaker 1: I did? It tastes terrible? It was horrible. So yeah,
Speaker 1: that that in pepsi COONa? Did you go looking for
Speaker 1: that with pepsicona? Was awful? That was really bad crystal
Speaker 1: clear for the wind. But I think to get to
Speaker 1: the root of the question, though, uh no, let me
Speaker 1: tell you a story about my dad, who is about
Speaker 1: the same age as your dad. Like, I'll take him
Speaker 1: smallmouth fishing and I'll be catching fish on We'll just
Speaker 1: say a new age jerkbait, and I'll give the man
Speaker 1: the same jerkbait, but he doesn't feel like jerking it
Speaker 1: as hard as I am. He just wants to sit
Speaker 1: and relax. And I used to get frustrated, and now
Speaker 1: I say, you know what, man, here's an inline spinner
Speaker 1: just casting real and on days when his gooch level
Speaker 1: isn't turned up to full blast, he does just find
Speaker 1: that way and he's happy, like he doesn't need to
Speaker 1: be the next KVD. Yeah, my dad always accuses me
Speaker 1: of giving a lure that I know isn't going to
Speaker 1: work like he he says, Oh, yeah, he thinks I'm
Speaker 1: giving him one that I'm not worried about losing. So
Speaker 1: are you sometimes? Did you got a whole arsenal of
Speaker 1: like nicely turned wood and special striper stuff, And will
Speaker 1: you give him like the beat up bucktail? Yeah, he's
Speaker 1: getting the old bomber, not the thirty dollar needlefish. But no,
Speaker 1: I know plenty of people like that where they I'm
Speaker 1: I'm one of the people like that. Take the Cape
Speaker 1: Cod Canal, for example, which is just the road from me.
Speaker 1: You have these newer paddle tail swim baits that everybody uses.
Speaker 1: I would much rather throw a bucktail and I will
Speaker 1: watch all the people around me catch the fish on
Speaker 1: the paddle tail swim baits, and I will at a
Speaker 1: certain point after like three fish, it's too late to change.
Speaker 1: After watching people catch three fish, you can't change. Now
Speaker 1: we've got to prove the point. I gotta be like, well,
Speaker 1: this is just good. If I changed after the first one,
Speaker 1: it's okay. But after three I'm like, oh no, now
Speaker 1: now I'm riding this one. Yeah. Man, Like at that point,
Speaker 1: you've just got to stick to your guns. Like I
Speaker 1: I totally get what you're saying. Um, But I think
Speaker 1: another point here is like why you got to change
Speaker 1: the man's program at seventy two years old, Like if
Speaker 1: he wants to fish the old stuff, like no, I
Speaker 1: just let him. Just let him do it, Like he
Speaker 1: doesn't need to diversify his bait pile, which I found
Speaker 1: it being a weird term. It's like financial or something,
Speaker 1: isn't it diversifying bait pile? Um? And I mean, if
Speaker 1: he's catching fish, right, even more reason to just leave
Speaker 1: the man alone. Like I've found over the years that
Speaker 1: if someone is receptive to learning what I have to teach,
Speaker 1: like they're excited about it. I really enjoy that. I
Speaker 1: would rather see them catch the fish than me catch
Speaker 1: the fish. But if they're not, I just stopped being
Speaker 1: concerned about that person and focus back up on me
Speaker 1: catching fish. Like you lost your chance, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean? Exactly, Yeah, I'm perfectly content using the lure
Speaker 1: that's catching. I don't need you to use it too,
Speaker 1: so exactly it's my lure anyway. No, that was a
Speaker 1: really fun question, man, I do appreciate it. Um. I
Speaker 1: guess if you still insist on on modernizing your old man,
Speaker 1: you could throw all his ship out and replace it
Speaker 1: with spy baits and and top water bats or something
Speaker 1: he'd love. A sure, he'd love a good top water
Speaker 1: bat lauer, perhaps a top water snake. Um. By the way, No,
Speaker 1: it just got himself some swag for that. And you
Speaker 1: can too. If you record a voice memo and it
Speaker 1: ends up being played on this show. Surprise me and
Speaker 1: you can send those two bent at meat eater dot
Speaker 1: com or you can send him via d M to
Speaker 1: my Instagram account. Either way, tell me something. So we
Speaker 1: are just about out of time here, but I've actually
Speaker 1: got a fitting end of the line. Segment this week.
Speaker 1: It's sort of ties back to Noah's question um, because
Speaker 1: it's a great example of a lure that has It's
Speaker 1: got many alternatives, but the O G. Striper guys want
Speaker 1: the O G version. So Jim, you're a striper guy
Speaker 1: of the highest caliber. But without giving away the name
Speaker 1: of the lure, if I said sand deal teaser invented
Speaker 1: in England, would you know what I was talking about?
Speaker 1: I would know exactly what you're talking about. It's going
Speaker 1: to be a pretty heavy duty of resistant to bluefish teeth,
Speaker 1: perfect imitation of a sand deal, nice kicking tail. It
Speaker 1: is definitely this one, unless it's the other one. Let's
Speaker 1: find out. Well, that's not loud enough. Here's a short
Speaker 1: list of destinations that salty angler's dream of visiting. Vanawattu
Speaker 1: in the South Pacific, the Great Barrier Reef, the Say Shells, Hawaii,
Speaker 1: Cabo San Lucas believes, the Florida Keys. Now, in case
Speaker 1: you missed it, what did not make that list was England.
Speaker 1: I mean they saltwater fish over there, right, But when
Speaker 1: I think of coastal fishing in England, I kind of think, man,
Speaker 1: it would suck to be a salty eye in England.
Speaker 1: They chased like congareels and dog fish, pollock or haddock
Speaker 1: or something. I mean, basically, they're a list species. Are
Speaker 1: all the ship we shake off the line over here
Speaker 1: in the Northeast. Now that said, one might assume that
Speaker 1: there couldn't possibly be some brit made lord that's better
Speaker 1: or more original than what a salty Americans came up with.
Speaker 1: But that's wrong. Red Guill Loures ever heard of the company?
Speaker 1: If you don't chase straight bass on the beaches of
Speaker 1: the New are at these strong chance you haven't. But
Speaker 1: red Gill is to England what companies like Arbigast and
Speaker 1: Smithwick were to the US. Red gills started in nineteen
Speaker 1: fifty in the Cornish fishing village of Mevagissi in southwest England.
Speaker 1: The original red gill lure was designed by Alex Ingram
Speaker 1: and it was actually way ahead of its time. The
Speaker 1: red gill mimics a sand deal, which is a common
Speaker 1: bait fish species found in the North and Middle Atlantic.
Speaker 1: Pretty Much every inshore species that lives where sandials lives
Speaker 1: eats them starting from the back. The red gill actually
Speaker 1: has a paddle tail, which wouldn't become common on other
Speaker 1: lures for many many years. That paddle tapers into the
Speaker 1: rest of the tail, which is ribbon thin, until it
Speaker 1: meets the belly of the lure. The body widens out
Speaker 1: and finishes at a tapered very anatomically correct sand deal head.
Speaker 1: But here's what else made the lure so unique. It's
Speaker 1: not really a soft plastic Red gills are more rigid
Speaker 1: maid from what feels more like vinyl. Yet despite that rigidity,
Speaker 1: the taper still allows that thin paddle tail to kick
Speaker 1: and flutter. Red gills also have a hollow channel that
Speaker 1: runs from the nose to the belly. In a way,
Speaker 1: it's designed kind of like a tube fly. You wouldn't
Speaker 1: put a red gill on a jig head. Instead, you'd
Speaker 1: thread your line through the bait, tie the hook to
Speaker 1: the tag end, then draw the line back through the
Speaker 1: nose until that hook seats perfectly in the red gills belly.
Speaker 1: Now we got sand deals over here too, and during
Speaker 1: the fall they're inshore migration often collides with the fall
Speaker 1: striper migration to mimic this forage. There are plenty of
Speaker 1: sand deal imitations on the market, but back in the day.
Speaker 1: The only option old timey surfcasters really had where slim
Speaker 1: metal lures and plugs. But sand deals can be very
Speaker 1: small and to steel phrase from the fly crowd. Matching
Speaker 1: the hatch precisely can be really important, but delivering something
Speaker 1: the true size of a small sand deal fifty feet
Speaker 1: out past the waves that's pretty challenging. At some point
Speaker 1: in history, likely in the fifties or sixties, smart surfcasters
Speaker 1: realized that a red gill could be rigged ahead of
Speaker 1: their metal lures and plugs as a teaser via a
Speaker 1: dropper loop on their leader. The primary lure now provided
Speaker 1: the umph for a proper distance cast, but the red
Speaker 1: gill matched that hatch, and because red gills weighed pretty
Speaker 1: much nothing, they also didn't affect the action of the
Speaker 1: main lure, essentially allowing anglers to present a buffet of
Speaker 1: forage size options in a single retrieve. That rigid construction
Speaker 1: also made red gills extremely durable and able to withstand
Speaker 1: season after season of abuse. Thanks to the Internet, red
Speaker 1: gills are a bit easier to get ahold of today,
Speaker 1: but for many years they were not. Select shops on
Speaker 1: the Striper Coast carried them, but they were a bit
Speaker 1: of a secret weapon, kind of a hot commodity. I
Speaker 1: ended up with a handful in the early two thousand's
Speaker 1: because the magazine I was working for was running a
Speaker 1: piece about vintage striper lures and had them shipped straight
Speaker 1: across the pond to us. And I still have most
Speaker 1: of them. They're tattered, scraped up, but in my opinion,
Speaker 1: red Gills are still the best sand deal teaser you
Speaker 1: can use. There are plenty of US made knockoffs and
Speaker 1: other options, but none I trust more than the original
Speaker 1: red Gil. And believe me, there are days when your
Speaker 1: teaser is more important and catches a lot more fish
Speaker 1: than your primary lure. Also, I love you England, and
Speaker 1: I was just kidding earlier. One of these days I'll
Speaker 1: pop over for a pint and to catch some of
Speaker 1: your conger eels and dog fish. So that's it for
Speaker 1: this week. Remember if your dad wants to dribble monkey
Speaker 1: piss all over his helicopter lures, just let him. The
Speaker 1: British invasion of striper lures only included one bait, and
Speaker 1: therefore was a very small invasion. Springsteen probably hogs the
Speaker 1: back corner of party Boat, and Jim Fee will just
Speaker 1: out fish him from the front. I don't know about that.
Speaker 1: I might outsing him. I'd love to see it either way,
Speaker 1: outsing him or out fish him. Huge thanks to you
Speaker 1: Jim for co hosting this week. Um you can find
Speaker 1: him on the Graham. You should. He's at James t
Speaker 1: Fe and go watch on the waters at the Rail
Speaker 1: if you love the party boat scene. Also, if you
Speaker 1: want to hire Bruce Springsteen or Raylioted to do your
Speaker 1: fishing reports, you need to check out at Para Denoia
Speaker 1: on Instagram. Keep all those salming items, awkward moments, voice memos,
Speaker 1: all the stuff I usually ask for. Uh, just coming
Speaker 1: to Bent at the meat eator dot com. Keep using
Speaker 1: those degenerate Angler and Bent podcast hashtags, and finally, don't
Speaker 1: forget that the easiest way to cure fomo is to
Speaker 1: just never look at social media or listen to phishing
Speaker 1: podcast Little Unlet Right, Love Love