1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,160 Speaker 1: This is Kelly Henderson and you are listening to the 2 00:00:02,240 --> 00:00:06,760 Speaker 1: Velvet Edge podcast. This week, I am sick um. I 3 00:00:06,800 --> 00:00:09,040 Speaker 1: think I just have a really bad cold, but because 4 00:00:09,039 --> 00:00:12,480 Speaker 1: it's yesterday, I went to get coronavirus tested and I 5 00:00:12,520 --> 00:00:15,640 Speaker 1: am still awaiting those results. Because of this, I have 6 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:18,040 Speaker 1: had to reschedule some interviews, but I am hoping to 7 00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:20,320 Speaker 1: be back next week with all new episodes of the 8 00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:24,080 Speaker 1: v podcast. While I have been resting and isolating, I've 9 00:00:24,120 --> 00:00:25,800 Speaker 1: also been doing a lot of reading and I am 10 00:00:25,880 --> 00:00:28,960 Speaker 1: finding the words love addiction popping up into a lot 11 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:32,040 Speaker 1: of my books, my Instagram feed, and also some podcast 12 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:36,680 Speaker 1: I listened to. I find this topic extremely fascinating, as 13 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 1: it has also opened my eyes to a lot of 14 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:41,479 Speaker 1: the types of anxious attachments that I've personally had in 15 00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:45,159 Speaker 1: dating relationships and what that stemmed from from earlier in 16 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:48,239 Speaker 1: my life and even my childhood. Last year, I had 17 00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:52,360 Speaker 1: an incredible conversation about this exact topic with relationship columnist 18 00:00:52,440 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 1: and founder of the Breakup boot Camp Amy Chan. If 19 00:00:55,760 --> 00:00:58,960 Speaker 1: you find yourself in the same types of relationship dynamics 20 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:01,840 Speaker 1: over and over, or if you are going through a 21 00:01:01,880 --> 00:01:04,679 Speaker 1: tough breakup or divorce, or even if you're in a 22 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:09,640 Speaker 1: relationship and you just are finding yourself unsatisfied. Highly recommend 23 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:11,840 Speaker 1: this listen and even reaching out to Amy to do 24 00:01:11,959 --> 00:01:14,600 Speaker 1: further work. The work she is doing with people both 25 00:01:14,640 --> 00:01:17,440 Speaker 1: in and out of relationships to take back their power 26 00:01:17,560 --> 00:01:22,120 Speaker 1: and find their true happiness is truly astounding. Here's our conversation. 27 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:26,959 Speaker 1: So you're a relationship columnist and an editor at just 28 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:30,039 Speaker 1: my Type dot c A. I was reading that the 29 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:33,520 Speaker 1: Observer called you a relationship expert whose work is like 30 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:38,240 Speaker 1: that of a scientific Carrie Bradshaw. Yeah, I mean, I 31 00:01:38,240 --> 00:01:40,520 Speaker 1: feel like that's a pretty big compliment. I love Carrie 32 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:45,680 Speaker 1: Bradshaw's great. I mean, yeah, I take really complex topics 33 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:49,960 Speaker 1: and themes around love, less and desire, and I break 34 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 1: it down in a way that the common person could understand. 35 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:56,280 Speaker 1: So I inject it with the science and psychology. That's 36 00:01:56,280 --> 00:01:57,800 Speaker 1: what I was reading about when you said you feel 37 00:01:57,840 --> 00:02:00,400 Speaker 1: like you have a gift for taking the taking complex 38 00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:03,280 Speaker 1: topics and theories and just breaking them down into content 39 00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:08,480 Speaker 1: that a mass audience can understand. M M exactly, So 40 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,000 Speaker 1: I mean what kind of things? I mean? I, to 41 00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:13,399 Speaker 1: be quite honest, spent the whole morning on your website. 42 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:18,280 Speaker 1: It's amazing. I could still be doing it right now 43 00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:22,000 Speaker 1: if I, UM, we hadn't had this schedule because it's 44 00:02:22,040 --> 00:02:24,840 Speaker 1: such a vast you know, there's so many different kinds 45 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 1: of topics and that, Like you said, there's a lot 46 00:02:26,480 --> 00:02:29,080 Speaker 1: of love. There's things on lust, there's things on getting 47 00:02:29,120 --> 00:02:31,919 Speaker 1: to know yourself and self esteem. How did you get 48 00:02:31,919 --> 00:02:37,600 Speaker 1: into this? Yeah? So growing up I was able to 49 00:02:38,400 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 1: master many different parts of my life, so front groups, 50 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 1: my grades, jobs, but the one area that I struggled 51 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:53,800 Speaker 1: with constantly was relationships. And I found myself constantly disappointed 52 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:59,079 Speaker 1: and hurt in love. And after another painful breakup at 53 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:01,920 Speaker 1: the age of twenty five five, I decided just to 54 00:03:01,960 --> 00:03:05,600 Speaker 1: write about my own experience and I just posted on 55 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:07,880 Speaker 1: my social media I think it was my Space at 56 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:10,520 Speaker 1: the time, and a bunch of people reached out and 57 00:03:10,520 --> 00:03:12,760 Speaker 1: we're like, you know, thank you for sharing. This really 58 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:16,880 Speaker 1: helped me, and I thought, Okay, maybe I have something here, 59 00:03:16,919 --> 00:03:19,800 Speaker 1: maybe I'm a writer. So I actually pitched almost a 60 00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:23,400 Speaker 1: hundred different publications with this blog, and most of them 61 00:03:23,440 --> 00:03:26,880 Speaker 1: ignored me. Some said you're not a writer, and one 62 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:32,680 Speaker 1: said sure, we'll will publish a contributed guest post, and um, 63 00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:35,840 Speaker 1: from that point on. I ended up being a regular 64 00:03:35,880 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 1: columnist for them for seven years and it launched my 65 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:44,440 Speaker 1: career in writing. Uh. And so now for over a decade, 66 00:03:44,480 --> 00:03:49,240 Speaker 1: I've been writing and researching the psychology of relationships. Do 67 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 1: you feel like a relationship expert? I think, Uh, it's interesting. 68 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 1: I have a lot of expertise, and I think I 69 00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:02,440 Speaker 1: will always be a student and be because of that mentality. Uh, 70 00:04:02,520 --> 00:04:06,040 Speaker 1: that continues to strengthen my expertise, if that makes sense. 71 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:08,600 Speaker 1: I think the moment you think you have it and 72 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:12,880 Speaker 1: you mastered it anything, um, is the moment you will 73 00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 1: actually start to get less skilled in what you're doing. 74 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:18,560 Speaker 1: And so I think I've got to be a student 75 00:04:18,640 --> 00:04:23,360 Speaker 1: in love of love and relationships and emotional uh communication 76 00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:26,159 Speaker 1: and intelligence for the rest of my life. So do 77 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:28,760 Speaker 1: you like when you're writing? Do you write about your 78 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:32,240 Speaker 1: personal experiences? Like are you writing about dating that you 79 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:34,240 Speaker 1: go you know, dates that you go on, or is 80 00:04:34,279 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 1: this just things that you're observing and other women or people. 81 00:04:38,360 --> 00:04:41,560 Speaker 1: It's a combination. So I used to use a lot 82 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:44,720 Speaker 1: of my own personal narrative, uh, just to kind of 83 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:47,760 Speaker 1: connect with the readers, and then I would bring in 84 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:51,159 Speaker 1: the science and psychology of what's going on. Um Now 85 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 1: I talk more about bigger concepts, and I'll use other 86 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 1: examples of myself. Um in my book, I use examples 87 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:00,880 Speaker 1: of people who've come through a new and we've had 88 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:04,360 Speaker 1: wrote significant changes through using some tried and tested methods 89 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:08,479 Speaker 1: what we've done. Um. So now it's a combination. So 90 00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:12,160 Speaker 1: you mentioned Renew, which is the breakup boot camp that 91 00:05:12,200 --> 00:05:15,360 Speaker 1: you started in two thousand seventeen, and I was reading 92 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:18,039 Speaker 1: that you left a six figure job, like a nine 93 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:22,400 Speaker 1: to five type job to start this. Yeah. Yeah, So 94 00:05:22,520 --> 00:05:26,240 Speaker 1: I was a case marketing officer of a national company 95 00:05:26,760 --> 00:05:30,680 Speaker 1: and um it was. It was an amazing job. And 96 00:05:30,920 --> 00:05:34,720 Speaker 1: I had this idea to create, uh, this company which 97 00:05:34,760 --> 00:05:37,880 Speaker 1: is now called Renew Breakup boot Camp. And we took 98 00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:40,960 Speaker 1: a scientific and spiritual approach to healing and rewind the heart. 99 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:44,120 Speaker 1: And I had thought about this idea and sat on 100 00:05:44,120 --> 00:05:47,480 Speaker 1: it for a long time, and it was inspired from 101 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:52,159 Speaker 1: my own breakup. I was living in Vancouver seven years 102 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:55,440 Speaker 1: ago and I was in a relationship with someone I 103 00:05:55,480 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 1: thought I was going to spend the rest of my 104 00:05:57,040 --> 00:05:59,919 Speaker 1: life with, and I had put so much of my 105 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 1: identity in him and us that when that relationship fell apart. 106 00:06:04,520 --> 00:06:08,840 Speaker 1: I completely fell apart. I spiraled into depression, panic attacks. 107 00:06:09,520 --> 00:06:12,400 Speaker 1: I had thought the suicide and I thought I was 108 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:16,360 Speaker 1: going crazy because it just seemed like nothing I was 109 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:20,039 Speaker 1: doing could make the pain and the suffering go away. 110 00:06:20,800 --> 00:06:25,760 Speaker 1: And I did everything from therapists to going to energy 111 00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 1: healings to yoga retreats, and while they were helpful, um 112 00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:33,000 Speaker 1: I found that the minute I went back into my apartment, 113 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:36,359 Speaker 1: I was left the same demons that were in my head. 114 00:06:36,960 --> 00:06:39,560 Speaker 1: And so UM I came up with an idea to 115 00:06:39,839 --> 00:06:43,880 Speaker 1: create a safe space for women retreat into nature where 116 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:46,880 Speaker 1: everyone's sleeping under one roof. There was a chef cooking 117 00:06:46,920 --> 00:06:48,560 Speaker 1: all of our meals so that we're getting all the 118 00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:50,920 Speaker 1: nutrition you need. Because that was one thing that happened 119 00:06:50,920 --> 00:06:55,120 Speaker 1: after my breakup. I completely stopped eating. And um, you 120 00:06:55,560 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 1: leave a little bit different than how you came. And 121 00:06:58,480 --> 00:07:03,320 Speaker 1: so at breakup Boop Hamps I bring in fourteen different experts, 122 00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 1: ranging from psychologists to hit and the prist, the energy healers. 123 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 1: We even bringing in the Dominatrix who had a page 124 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 1: from Berkeley. She just specifically on the psychological power dynamics 125 00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:17,720 Speaker 1: and um, you know, hour by hour from eight thirty 126 00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 1: morning till about midnight. The women are in programming to 127 00:07:21,760 --> 00:07:26,640 Speaker 1: really shake up those old patterns that are often are 128 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:29,080 Speaker 1: lodged deep in our subconscious so that we can create 129 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:34,680 Speaker 1: an opening for new seeds to actually impunt um. And so, yeah, 130 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 1: I left my job to take a risk to build 131 00:07:37,160 --> 00:07:40,960 Speaker 1: this company and it's been such a ride, and it's 132 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 1: been absolutely incredible. I was telling you before, but I 133 00:07:44,400 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 1: had a friend randomly go last weekend I did. I 134 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:50,000 Speaker 1: was already scheduled to speak to you, and she went 135 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:52,560 Speaker 1: to this boot camp. But I knew she was doing something, 136 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:54,040 Speaker 1: but I didn't know what it was called. And so 137 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:56,080 Speaker 1: when she came back, she called me and I I was like, 138 00:07:56,160 --> 00:07:59,080 Speaker 1: oh my gosh, you should really interview the founder of 139 00:07:59,200 --> 00:08:02,320 Speaker 1: this place. I just went she's amazing to tell me 140 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:05,280 Speaker 1: her your name, and I was like, what, I already 141 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:08,600 Speaker 1: have an interview scheduled with her. But when she came back, 142 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 1: I saw the difference, truly. I mean I felt like 143 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:15,360 Speaker 1: she was lighter. I felt like she had just discovered 144 00:08:15,400 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 1: parts of herself that you know, they've probably always been 145 00:08:17,800 --> 00:08:20,560 Speaker 1: in there, but for whatever reason, she wasn't able to 146 00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:24,120 Speaker 1: tap into that. Um. So what are the blocks that 147 00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:27,360 Speaker 1: we all have that an experience like this can just 148 00:08:27,440 --> 00:08:32,000 Speaker 1: open you up. Yeah, great question. So most of the 149 00:08:32,040 --> 00:08:35,560 Speaker 1: women who come saks, they're cutting to renew, breakup boot 150 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:39,199 Speaker 1: camp because of the X, trying to get over a relationship. 151 00:08:39,679 --> 00:08:42,480 Speaker 1: What every single one of them figure out at the end, 152 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:45,559 Speaker 1: it's like, Oh, it's not just about the X. And 153 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:51,440 Speaker 1: here's the thing. We we recreate the emotional experiences of 154 00:08:51,480 --> 00:08:54,840 Speaker 1: how we are wounded. With children, it's recycled pain, and 155 00:08:54,920 --> 00:08:58,200 Speaker 1: so our relationships when they fall apart, it's like a 156 00:08:58,240 --> 00:09:00,880 Speaker 1: band aid being ripped off, and then you have to 157 00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:04,160 Speaker 1: deal with all of that compound trauma that has been 158 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:07,360 Speaker 1: building up since you were a young child. Now, a 159 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 1: lot of these belief systems and patterns and loose they're 160 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:13,839 Speaker 1: very deep in our subconscious. They're developed by the between 161 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:16,520 Speaker 1: the time around zero to seven years old before your 162 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:20,680 Speaker 1: prefrontal cortex is developed, and um, you don't have the 163 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:25,600 Speaker 1: cognitive ability to process what's going on, and so we 164 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 1: believe these certain things that are super unhelpful from I'm 165 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:32,640 Speaker 1: not enough and I need to earn love or validation 166 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 1: I'm not worthy of love, or you might have grown 167 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 1: up in a household where it was really chaotic, and 168 00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:42,880 Speaker 1: so your model of what love feels like is one 169 00:09:42,880 --> 00:09:47,200 Speaker 1: of chaos. Uh. For myself, I grew up with a 170 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:51,040 Speaker 1: pretty chaotic um family. There was always screaming and yelling, 171 00:09:51,120 --> 00:09:53,559 Speaker 1: that was the norm, and I had a father who 172 00:09:53,800 --> 00:09:58,080 Speaker 1: was never around, and so at a very young age, 173 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: I was always trying to prove myself of earn his love, 174 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:04,440 Speaker 1: earn his attention, and if I got good grades, sometimes 175 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:07,760 Speaker 1: I would at that and that developed the belief system 176 00:10:07,800 --> 00:10:11,360 Speaker 1: in me that I'm not enough. And so in my 177 00:10:11,440 --> 00:10:15,240 Speaker 1: adult ears, even though the people I david looked very different, 178 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:19,640 Speaker 1: the emotional experience was exactly the same. I was always 179 00:10:19,640 --> 00:10:23,040 Speaker 1: pining for their love, fighting for their attention, the last 180 00:10:23,120 --> 00:10:26,559 Speaker 1: on the totem pole, trying to get up to my prioritization. 181 00:10:27,240 --> 00:10:30,120 Speaker 1: And I couldn't figure out, and so I kept blaming, like, Oh, 182 00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:33,000 Speaker 1: it's it's the guys in Vancouver. It's now, it's the 183 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:36,040 Speaker 1: guys in New York. It was always something else's fault 184 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:40,120 Speaker 1: until I realized I was a common denominator. And I 185 00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:42,959 Speaker 1: say this not because there was something wrong with me, 186 00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:45,839 Speaker 1: and for anyone listening, it's not because there's something wrong 187 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:48,319 Speaker 1: with you or that you are broken and you need 188 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:52,160 Speaker 1: to be fixed. It's that we have belief systems that 189 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:56,000 Speaker 1: are often launched deep in our subconscious mind, and many 190 00:10:56,040 --> 00:10:58,720 Speaker 1: times if we're not getting the outcomes that we want, 191 00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:03,679 Speaker 1: especially in love, it's because those belief systems are dysfunctional. 192 00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:08,240 Speaker 1: And so that is the foundation of what programs us 193 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:10,480 Speaker 1: to feel the way we do and at the way 194 00:11:10,520 --> 00:11:13,200 Speaker 1: we act and choose the people that we choose when 195 00:11:13,200 --> 00:11:15,680 Speaker 1: it comes to relationships. You know what I heard in 196 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:17,959 Speaker 1: that that I think is so interesting, and this has 197 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:21,200 Speaker 1: been very much my experience as well, is when you 198 00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:24,199 Speaker 1: said they all looked very different, but they were exactly 199 00:11:24,280 --> 00:11:27,240 Speaker 1: the same actually about all the men you dated. And 200 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:30,000 Speaker 1: I've always dealt with that because every single boyfriend I've 201 00:11:30,040 --> 00:11:32,320 Speaker 1: ever had has looked really different. And so people are like, 202 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:34,240 Speaker 1: you don't really have a type, Like, I think, that's 203 00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:37,200 Speaker 1: so interesting. The order I've gotten in the more work 204 00:11:37,240 --> 00:11:39,120 Speaker 1: I've done on myself, I'm like, oh, no, I have 205 00:11:39,160 --> 00:11:43,160 Speaker 1: a type, very much have a type, and they're all 206 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:46,959 Speaker 1: exactly alike. And the dynamic in our relationship is the same, 207 00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:50,760 Speaker 1: although it just presents itself a little bit differently externally. 208 00:11:52,040 --> 00:11:56,000 Speaker 1: So fascinating to me, Why is that so isn't there something, um, 209 00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:58,280 Speaker 1: I was reading on your side about just the subconscious 210 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:01,280 Speaker 1: patterns and love, which is what you sort of just described. 211 00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:04,160 Speaker 1: But why is that? Are we just trying to heal 212 00:12:04,360 --> 00:12:10,120 Speaker 1: our old relationships with these new relationships? Yeah? So um. 213 00:12:10,160 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 1: There is something called attractions of deprivation UM, coined by 214 00:12:15,760 --> 00:12:19,880 Speaker 1: an author and researcher name Ken Paige, and he describes 215 00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:25,960 Speaker 1: this as UM adults. As adults, we try to recreate 216 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 1: the original seed of the crime, and so that our 217 00:12:29,160 --> 00:12:32,679 Speaker 1: subconscious line things that if we recreate it, we can 218 00:12:32,880 --> 00:12:35,480 Speaker 1: actually solve what we couldn't solve as a child. So 219 00:12:35,520 --> 00:12:39,920 Speaker 1: for example, if I was only to give more and 220 00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:44,000 Speaker 1: do more, maybe finally I will earn that love now, 221 00:12:44,600 --> 00:12:47,200 Speaker 1: that love that I was never able to earn when 222 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,120 Speaker 1: I was a young child with my father. And so 223 00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 1: are my works in loops. So if there's an open 224 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:55,760 Speaker 1: loop and you weren't able to figure that out as child, 225 00:12:56,360 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 1: you almost recreate that scenario over and over again trying 226 00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:02,960 Speaker 1: in an have to solve it now. And and there's 227 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:09,000 Speaker 1: other things. So um. There's also something called attachment theory, 228 00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:13,160 Speaker 1: which is UM super fascinating. By the age of around 229 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:17,000 Speaker 1: two years old, we develop an attachment system, a style 230 00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:21,240 Speaker 1: on how we're going to relate romantically as adults. And 231 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 1: there's three main different attachment styles and UM, the first 232 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:29,760 Speaker 1: one is secure reached searcher say this without fifty percent 233 00:13:29,800 --> 00:13:33,640 Speaker 1: of the population and people who have a secure attachment style, 234 00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:39,960 Speaker 1: they are not codependent. They are open to receiving and 235 00:13:40,120 --> 00:13:42,920 Speaker 1: giving love. When there's an argument or a fight, they 236 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:45,720 Speaker 1: don't turn it into a catastrophe. They do not put 237 00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:48,760 Speaker 1: their identity or their sense of self worth on the 238 00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:54,760 Speaker 1: validation of their partner. And UM they are very even 239 00:13:54,880 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 1: keel in um emotional distress. And so this is the 240 00:14:00,360 --> 00:14:03,200 Speaker 1: product of parents who were able to be consistent with 241 00:14:03,240 --> 00:14:06,960 Speaker 1: their caregiving a tune to their needs. And so the 242 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:11,439 Speaker 1: child actually grows up. UM instead of the task and 243 00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 1: systems to their parents, now transfers onto the attachment system 244 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:17,920 Speaker 1: they have with their primary partner, and they feel safe, 245 00:14:17,920 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 1: and they feel secure, and they feel supported, and they're 246 00:14:20,320 --> 00:14:22,200 Speaker 1: able to go out into the world and explore. I 247 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:28,200 Speaker 1: know that they have a safe based Did you say, so, yeah, 248 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:35,600 Speaker 1: are these people I haven't met any Well, what might 249 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:38,680 Speaker 1: be fashioned to you that you may fall into one 250 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:41,800 Speaker 1: of these other categories? So I was explaining the avoidant 251 00:14:41,840 --> 00:14:47,600 Speaker 1: attachment style UM. This is usually the product of parents 252 00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:51,960 Speaker 1: who wore U and meshing their child, meaning they treated 253 00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:55,000 Speaker 1: their child as if they had to have an adult responsibility. 254 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:58,240 Speaker 1: So it could have been the child acted as a therapist, 255 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:02,120 Speaker 1: the stand and father, the stand and other um, something 256 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,240 Speaker 1: other than being the child they had to take on 257 00:15:04,400 --> 00:15:07,840 Speaker 1: the role of an adult uh it or a child 258 00:15:07,880 --> 00:15:11,520 Speaker 1: who had very over controlling parents UM. This can also 259 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:14,440 Speaker 1: lead to someone growing up have been avoid attachment. And 260 00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:16,640 Speaker 1: what happens with people who have been avoid and attach 261 00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:21,920 Speaker 1: them is they actually subconsciously suppress their attachment system. So 262 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:24,840 Speaker 1: this means they might be able to get into relationships, 263 00:15:24,880 --> 00:15:28,360 Speaker 1: but they always keep an emotional distance. And what happens 264 00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 1: is when someone gets too close, what they will do 265 00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:35,080 Speaker 1: what's called deactivating strategies, meaning they will do things that 266 00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:40,360 Speaker 1: will actually squelch intimacy. So for example, this might look 267 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:44,880 Speaker 1: like you go on a romantic weekend with someone and 268 00:15:45,080 --> 00:15:48,960 Speaker 1: UM Suddenly after you get back, the person pulls away 269 00:15:49,280 --> 00:15:52,840 Speaker 1: and need space and starts to being a loose and 270 00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:57,040 Speaker 1: inconsistent UM because in their mind they're like, oh my gosh, 271 00:15:57,040 --> 00:15:59,280 Speaker 1: it's too much pressure, it's too close. And then they 272 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:02,080 Speaker 1: kind of freak out, they retreat, and so this is 273 00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:06,640 Speaker 1: an example where they're squelching intimacy, but they don't know 274 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:09,240 Speaker 1: what's going on. So if you're not aware of attachment theory, 275 00:16:09,360 --> 00:16:12,560 Speaker 1: you just think that this is normal. Another tendency for 276 00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:15,520 Speaker 1: people who have an avoidant attachment style is they might 277 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:19,160 Speaker 1: be chasing a unicorn. UM. So you know, things might 278 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:21,360 Speaker 1: go well in the first few weeks of the first 279 00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:24,800 Speaker 1: few months, and then suddenly all the imperfection fled in 280 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,880 Speaker 1: and they're constantly looking for some one better because the 281 00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:31,880 Speaker 1: unicorn just can't be found. UM. So those are examples 282 00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:36,840 Speaker 1: of avoidance. And then the third um, which is makes 283 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:38,640 Speaker 1: something most of the women who come to renew who 284 00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:42,560 Speaker 1: have an anxious attachment style. So this is used the 285 00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 1: products of inconsistent caregiving. Sometimes your needs were met, sometimes 286 00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:51,000 Speaker 1: they weren't. And it's a very um disregulated nervous system. 287 00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:54,160 Speaker 1: And so people who have an anxious attachment style, they 288 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:57,560 Speaker 1: have a fundamental fear of being abandoned or rejected at 289 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:00,760 Speaker 1: any time, and so if they ever that there's a 290 00:17:00,880 --> 00:17:04,680 Speaker 1: threat to the connection, UH, their nervous system goes on 291 00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:08,240 Speaker 1: like total alarm selves and they actually can't calm down 292 00:17:08,680 --> 00:17:12,480 Speaker 1: until connection is re established. They might engage in what's 293 00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:16,879 Speaker 1: called protest behavior, which looks like you send a text 294 00:17:16,920 --> 00:17:20,960 Speaker 1: message and you don't hear back for four hours from 295 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:25,239 Speaker 1: your partner, and UM, you're like, oh, scare you. I'm 296 00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:28,200 Speaker 1: gonna just wait four days until I message you back, 297 00:17:28,760 --> 00:17:31,720 Speaker 1: or you m might keep calling crazy and crazy like 298 00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 1: over and over and over again. Um. You might even 299 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:37,920 Speaker 1: date someone and start being like, oh my gosh, I 300 00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:40,680 Speaker 1: really feeling something for this person. I'm gonna just go 301 00:17:40,720 --> 00:17:43,359 Speaker 1: and uh this other person here on the side, just 302 00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:48,040 Speaker 1: to take the edge off. And so um, anxious are 303 00:17:48,119 --> 00:17:51,720 Speaker 1: drawn to avoidance, and avoidance are drawn to anxious. And 304 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:55,200 Speaker 1: the key thing that really differentiates them is avoidance having 305 00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:58,440 Speaker 1: in here a fear that their freedom and their independence 306 00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:02,399 Speaker 1: is going to be taken away, and anxious haven't injured 307 00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 1: fear that they will be abandoned or rejected. Now, they're 308 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:07,920 Speaker 1: both drawn to each other because they both confirm each 309 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:11,960 Speaker 1: other's belief systems. So we okay, wait, let me try 310 00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:15,800 Speaker 1: to unpack that a little bit. Um, So we're drawn 311 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:19,400 Speaker 1: to someone because they reaffirm our belief systems, but it's 312 00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:24,240 Speaker 1: not necessary. It's like our fears, right, Yeah, So, I 313 00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:27,480 Speaker 1: mean belief can definitely be fears at the same time. 314 00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:30,320 Speaker 1: So if I have an inherent belief that I am 315 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:33,320 Speaker 1: going to be abandoned, whether or not I'm aware of 316 00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:38,520 Speaker 1: that belief. Sometimes it's very deep subconscious. I will I 317 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 1: tracked situations where that emotional experience is going to play 318 00:18:43,119 --> 00:18:46,159 Speaker 1: out the way that I believe it's going to. I 319 00:18:46,200 --> 00:18:49,080 Speaker 1: will choose people in that way. I might find that 320 00:18:49,160 --> 00:18:52,440 Speaker 1: people who are secure and consistent and who won't leave me. 321 00:18:52,600 --> 00:18:56,359 Speaker 1: I might say, you're boring, um, and I'm like, I 322 00:18:56,359 --> 00:18:59,119 Speaker 1: don't have chemistry with those people. But you recreate that 323 00:18:59,160 --> 00:19:02,280 Speaker 1: emotional experience that is rooted in the belief system that 324 00:19:02,359 --> 00:19:05,320 Speaker 1: you believe in. Isn't it so interesting though? Because those 325 00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:09,679 Speaker 1: seem like they would be negative experiences from our childhood 326 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:11,719 Speaker 1: or even you know, like in your adult life. They 327 00:19:11,720 --> 00:19:15,560 Speaker 1: don't feel good, So why would we keep recreating them? 328 00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:19,639 Speaker 1: Because it's in your subconscious. So on a logical level, 329 00:19:19,760 --> 00:19:23,920 Speaker 1: you're like, oh, yeah, that bad boy who has red 330 00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:27,960 Speaker 1: flags all over, who cheated on his last three girlfriends, 331 00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:31,199 Speaker 1: who I met us far while I was drunk. I 332 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:34,760 Speaker 1: totally shouldn't like this guy. And then he Texas and 333 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:37,400 Speaker 1: you're like, Okay, just this one, this one one drink, 334 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:41,520 Speaker 1: I'll go right. Uh, logically we know we shouldn't, but 335 00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:46,480 Speaker 1: our decisions, our actions are are usually compelled by how 336 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:50,359 Speaker 1: we feel and how we feeled. Um, isn't something that 337 00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:53,040 Speaker 1: we can control with our logical mind. A lot of 338 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:58,480 Speaker 1: stems from our subconscious of how we feel and what 339 00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 1: we do is governed by our a subconscious mind. So 340 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:05,440 Speaker 1: once you become aware, I mean, because when you're talking 341 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:09,159 Speaker 1: about this anxious and avoid anxious anxious and avoidance, I 342 00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:12,719 Speaker 1: mean you're definitely describing a lot of my relationships. So 343 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:14,920 Speaker 1: and I've, as I said, I've become aware of that 344 00:20:14,960 --> 00:20:17,960 Speaker 1: as I've gotten older. Um, but how do you change 345 00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:21,120 Speaker 1: I mean the way that you're describing it as so subconscious? 346 00:20:21,240 --> 00:20:23,320 Speaker 1: Is it that you go to therapy you have this 347 00:20:23,359 --> 00:20:27,800 Speaker 1: new awareness, but like, how do you actually change that dynamic? 348 00:20:28,320 --> 00:20:31,479 Speaker 1: Great question? And about the studies show that between twenty 349 00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:37,240 Speaker 1: of the population does change their attachments though, and there's 350 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:41,439 Speaker 1: different ways. So, um, do you have a do you 351 00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:44,359 Speaker 1: identify more with an anxious or an avoidance? Probably I 352 00:20:44,359 --> 00:20:46,960 Speaker 1: identify more with anxious, but I did I was going 353 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:50,200 Speaker 1: to ask you this too, because I read that, Um, 354 00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:52,840 Speaker 1: you can kind of if you're one, you're probably the 355 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:55,720 Speaker 1: other two sometimes like you can kind of vacillate between 356 00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:59,760 Speaker 1: the two. Is that true? So so you have one 357 00:20:59,840 --> 00:21:03,440 Speaker 1: that predominant. And again this is pretty much wired in 358 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:05,800 Speaker 1: you by their age run two years old and the 359 00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:09,080 Speaker 1: way they've tested this and it's been repeated over and 360 00:21:09,119 --> 00:21:12,439 Speaker 1: over again, this test it's called the Strange UM, the 361 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:15,760 Speaker 1: Strange situation test where they actually test babies and see 362 00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:18,440 Speaker 1: how they react when their mother leaves the room. Um. 363 00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:21,440 Speaker 1: And then they follow these babies until adulthood and they 364 00:21:21,800 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 1: attachments that pretty much stage exactly the same. And so 365 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:29,600 Speaker 1: what's turkey though, is you can develop coping mechanisms that 366 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:34,280 Speaker 1: look like it's the other type of attachment. For example, 367 00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:38,879 Speaker 1: for me, I am formally UM had an anxious attachment style. 368 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:42,120 Speaker 1: I have what's called an URN secure. Through work, I've 369 00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 1: been able to become secure in my attachment style now. UM, 370 00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:49,919 Speaker 1: but what used to happen in my early twenties, I 371 00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:54,400 Speaker 1: would just call call, calls, show up unexpectedly. UM, That's 372 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 1: how I handled the anxiety. And Uh, once I realized 373 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:03,280 Speaker 1: that that looks crazy, and I was like, oh my God, 374 00:22:03,320 --> 00:22:05,120 Speaker 1: I'm not gonna do that. So I went the other 375 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:09,040 Speaker 1: way around, and I would reject people before they had 376 00:22:09,080 --> 00:22:12,280 Speaker 1: any chance to reject me. I would take any inclination 377 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:15,679 Speaker 1: that they might be disinterested and reject them. So on 378 00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:18,000 Speaker 1: the other side, it looked like I was an avoidance, 379 00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:21,080 Speaker 1: but I was an anxious masquerading as an avoidance. It 380 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:24,800 Speaker 1: still stemmed from a fear of being abandoned and rejected. 381 00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:26,919 Speaker 1: And that's why it's important to look at what is 382 00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:31,160 Speaker 1: a fundamental fear, UM, and the way that I'll share 383 00:22:31,200 --> 00:22:37,680 Speaker 1: how um I rewired my attachment style and there's they're 384 00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:41,000 Speaker 1: they're definitely is a way to do it, and UM, 385 00:22:41,040 --> 00:22:44,159 Speaker 1: it takes time, and it takes practice, and it takes discipline, 386 00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:48,040 Speaker 1: and so the very first step is awareness. UM. And 387 00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:51,000 Speaker 1: then started to look at what your tendencies are when 388 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 1: you're triggered. And so I realized there's certain things that 389 00:22:54,320 --> 00:22:57,920 Speaker 1: would trigger me UM. Which would be the two main 390 00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:01,520 Speaker 1: things is if the person I liked and initiate making 391 00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:04,840 Speaker 1: plans for me, or if they were inconsistent in their communication. 392 00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:08,840 Speaker 1: When this happened, the exact same thing would occure. I 393 00:23:08,840 --> 00:23:11,720 Speaker 1: would go into a spiral. I would make up these stories, 394 00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:14,880 Speaker 1: and then I would do something that would sabotage. And 395 00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:18,439 Speaker 1: so once I started to actually map out what I 396 00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:21,240 Speaker 1: was doing, and then I started to look at, Okay, 397 00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:24,679 Speaker 1: what are the actual facts? And so I realized that 398 00:23:24,760 --> 00:23:28,720 Speaker 1: how so many times I was just creating so many 399 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:32,439 Speaker 1: stories and assumptions and projecting. If someone didn't call me 400 00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:35,320 Speaker 1: back right away, I would automatically be like, oh my god, 401 00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:37,159 Speaker 1: you don't like me. He's not into you. I look 402 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,400 Speaker 1: like a fool. I better do something and sabotages when 403 00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:44,080 Speaker 1: they were busy at work, they were traveling, um. And 404 00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:47,320 Speaker 1: so I started to just look at my reactions and 405 00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 1: start changing how I would react. And this would be 406 00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:53,600 Speaker 1: really difficult in the beginning because my natural tendency was 407 00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:56,879 Speaker 1: you feel the uncomfortable emotion and you act on it 408 00:23:56,960 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 1: right away. You send that text, you make that call, 409 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,480 Speaker 1: you do that thing. And so I think the very 410 00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:06,760 Speaker 1: first thing after awareness is pause, the art of the pause, 411 00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:12,240 Speaker 1: and um learning that the emotion will move through your body. 412 00:24:12,720 --> 00:24:15,919 Speaker 1: It takes ninety seconds for emotion to move through your body. 413 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:18,760 Speaker 1: Anything more than that are the stories that you're attaching 414 00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:22,359 Speaker 1: to that emotion. That's why that can turn that one 415 00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:25,679 Speaker 1: little thing a panic or anxiety can turn into a 416 00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:30,280 Speaker 1: spiral that can last days, if not weeks. UM And 417 00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:33,919 Speaker 1: then of course therapy will help. There's actually therapists at 418 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:38,480 Speaker 1: our trained in attachment therapy therapy. UM. I did hypnosis 419 00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:42,280 Speaker 1: which worked really really well for me. UM hypnosis works 420 00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:45,199 Speaker 1: on about the population. So I think you need to 421 00:24:45,280 --> 00:24:50,480 Speaker 1: find what works for you. And also, UM, attachment is 422 00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:53,880 Speaker 1: on a spectrum, and so you could be if you're 423 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:58,040 Speaker 1: highly highly um you know, anxious on the spectrum. If 424 00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 1: you gave someone who's highly avoided, it's going to keep 425 00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:05,040 Speaker 1: rewounding you. And so understanding that yes, you might have 426 00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,800 Speaker 1: crazy chemistry with that person, but it's likely going to 427 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,360 Speaker 1: end up like the last many time, which is complete 428 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:15,200 Speaker 1: pain and heartbreak, and that's not helping you heel. And 429 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:18,560 Speaker 1: so look for partners who are more secure, because when 430 00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:21,240 Speaker 1: you're with someone who is more secure in their attachment, 431 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:25,320 Speaker 1: you will start to rebuild your trust. You will start 432 00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:29,880 Speaker 1: to rewire those associations that, Oh, someone who doesn't call 433 00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:31,960 Speaker 1: you back in an hour, that doesn't mean that the 434 00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:36,120 Speaker 1: connection is uh is abandoned or you're going to get rejected. 435 00:25:39,840 --> 00:25:44,119 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I'm processing. Okay, So if you so 436 00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:46,760 Speaker 1: I do identify more with the anxious. But I've found 437 00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:50,080 Speaker 1: this really interesting when you said, um, that you can 438 00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:52,480 Speaker 1: kind of do the thing where like it triggers your 439 00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:56,280 Speaker 1: abandonment and then you decide because that person didn't give 440 00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:58,639 Speaker 1: you what you need, like you're going to punish them with, 441 00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:01,399 Speaker 1: you know, not talking for four days or something. That 442 00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:04,119 Speaker 1: is my pattern is very much like I shut down. 443 00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:05,760 Speaker 1: I don't know if it makes me feel like I'm 444 00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 1: the one back in control or what it is, but 445 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:10,280 Speaker 1: I think that's where I thought maybe I went to 446 00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:14,600 Speaker 1: avoid it. M hmm, yeah, it's it's it's definitely make 447 00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:17,760 Speaker 1: good point. It's like a false sense of control, a 448 00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:20,760 Speaker 1: balth sense of feelings you have power over the situation 449 00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:27,840 Speaker 1: when really you're stepping away from connection. Also sabotaging intimacy. Yes, wow, 450 00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:31,680 Speaker 1: so could you? I mean, let's say, so I'm obviously 451 00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:35,240 Speaker 1: identifying as an anxious attachment person to say I'm dating 452 00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:39,040 Speaker 1: someone who realizes, oh, maybe they're a little avoidant. Can 453 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:42,920 Speaker 1: you work through that together? Is that possible or is 454 00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:45,640 Speaker 1: it just like if you realize that within your relationship 455 00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:49,600 Speaker 1: you just need to get away from each other. No, totally, 456 00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:52,119 Speaker 1: you can totally work through it, and so the goal 457 00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:57,119 Speaker 1: is for both people to become more secure. Okay, does 458 00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,359 Speaker 1: it make sense if you start to work on becoming 459 00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:03,320 Speaker 1: more secure or yourself, Um, that will automatically help the 460 00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:06,960 Speaker 1: bond and the connection between the avoidance and the anxious. 461 00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:10,080 Speaker 1: But here's the kicker. Both people need to be equally 462 00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:14,400 Speaker 1: invested in working through it. That means when you're triggered 463 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:20,040 Speaker 1: because um, your partner needs space and it's distancing, you 464 00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:25,359 Speaker 1: don't suddenly do something reactive and sabotage or punish or 465 00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 1: act passive aggressive. And that means your partner who has 466 00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:33,120 Speaker 1: a more avoidant tendency when they need space, they instead 467 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:38,480 Speaker 1: of iceland drawing, they have open and honest communication, even 468 00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:41,919 Speaker 1: if it's uncomfortable and says, hey, right now I'm feeling 469 00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:44,720 Speaker 1: a bit of pressure. Um, you know it's not that 470 00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:47,720 Speaker 1: I don't like you or really enjoy this connection, but 471 00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:50,000 Speaker 1: I need some time. How do you feel about that? 472 00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:54,360 Speaker 1: It's really practicing this art of open and honest communication 473 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:57,720 Speaker 1: even if it's really uncomfortable. And if two people are 474 00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,200 Speaker 1: game to try to work through this because of don't 475 00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:03,160 Speaker 1: work through it together now, at some point you're going 476 00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:06,199 Speaker 1: to have to Otherwise the same problems are just going 477 00:28:06,280 --> 00:28:09,159 Speaker 1: to keep coming up over and over again. I like 478 00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:11,600 Speaker 1: that you say, this is one of your favorite quotes 479 00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:16,600 Speaker 1: on the website, but it says chemistry does not guarantee compatibility. Definitely. 480 00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:20,719 Speaker 1: I mean, but isn't that so interesting because in our society, 481 00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:23,480 Speaker 1: I feel like, you know, the spark you feel when 482 00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:26,280 Speaker 1: you meet someone, or that I that first eye contact, 483 00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:29,080 Speaker 1: when you feel the just that the butterflies in your 484 00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:31,720 Speaker 1: stomach and the fireworks going off like that is so 485 00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:35,879 Speaker 1: praised as, oh, we just have such good chemistry, but 486 00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:40,800 Speaker 1: that's not necessarily the key to a good relationship. Oh totally. 487 00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:45,080 Speaker 1: I mean, look, if they were to make a two 488 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:50,680 Speaker 1: hour romantic comedy and you know, the storyline went, Uh, 489 00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:53,960 Speaker 1: two people met, they were introduced by friends, They had 490 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:58,120 Speaker 1: a dinner. A week later, they had another dinner, and uh, 491 00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:01,160 Speaker 1: throughout the next few months, they went on various states 492 00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:05,240 Speaker 1: and enjoyed each other's company. Anyone's going to watch the 493 00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:09,440 Speaker 1: phone for it. But what if you know, um, two 494 00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:13,960 Speaker 1: people met, you know at a party, and um, their 495 00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:18,520 Speaker 1: parents hated each other and they were immortal enemies and 496 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 1: then they had to fight through you know, the different 497 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:24,480 Speaker 1: politics and all these things and then suddenly they like 498 00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:28,520 Speaker 1: met like the fireworks is what sells, right, It's what 499 00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:32,720 Speaker 1: sells the songs, the books, like you know the movies. 500 00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:37,040 Speaker 1: As we've been set the storyline since we were little kids, 501 00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:41,520 Speaker 1: and so you know what we are sold as. This 502 00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:48,840 Speaker 1: is love is really classic love addictions, dysfunctional, codependent, uh lust, 503 00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:53,240 Speaker 1: and it is not love. And so I think what 504 00:29:53,360 --> 00:29:57,400 Speaker 1: happens is two things. I think we are bombarded with 505 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:01,920 Speaker 1: messages from culture and media uh um that love should 506 00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:06,120 Speaker 1: be something that is full of intensity and excitement and 507 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,880 Speaker 1: ups and downs and fiery, rip your clothes off, can't 508 00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:12,560 Speaker 1: live without you type of sex. If you have to 509 00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:16,720 Speaker 1: look at the science behind this, the chemistry is really 510 00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:22,240 Speaker 1: concoction of dopamine oxytocin feel good chemicals that are happening 511 00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:24,520 Speaker 1: in your body when you meet someone and you're in lust. 512 00:30:24,680 --> 00:30:27,680 Speaker 1: These last for about eight months about two years on 513 00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:31,720 Speaker 1: a scientific level. Um. And so it's there's a for 514 00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:35,120 Speaker 1: sure expiry day. And can you be married for twenty 515 00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 1: years and keep sparking these chemicals, Yes, but it's not 516 00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:41,840 Speaker 1: the same as the first eight key two years. You 517 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:44,880 Speaker 1: actually couldn't sustain it. It would actually be very very 518 00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:50,080 Speaker 1: unhealthy for you. And so um, there's that which is 519 00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:52,920 Speaker 1: like the idea of what love is, which is actually 520 00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:57,000 Speaker 1: not real and leading you to with really false expectations. 521 00:30:57,040 --> 00:31:00,200 Speaker 1: And the second thing is, as I mentioned earlier, you 522 00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:03,080 Speaker 1: didn't have a healthy model of love, what love looked like. 523 00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:06,360 Speaker 1: You are going to be chasing the same thing because 524 00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:09,920 Speaker 1: human beings like what is familiar. So if you're familiar 525 00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:14,960 Speaker 1: with chaos, if you're familiar with being um given attention 526 00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:18,800 Speaker 1: one moment and then your your parents punishing you by 527 00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:23,480 Speaker 1: withdrawing love the other, that's your sense of familiarity, that's 528 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:26,400 Speaker 1: your homeostasis, and that's what you're going to be drawn to. 529 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:30,880 Speaker 1: A k A have chemistry with as an adult, and 530 00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:34,480 Speaker 1: so I call this your chemistry compass. And your chemistry 531 00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:38,040 Speaker 1: compass might be broken if it keeps pointing you to 532 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:41,240 Speaker 1: people who are wounding you in the exact same way 533 00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:46,080 Speaker 1: I was reading. There's an article on your site about 534 00:31:46,160 --> 00:31:48,680 Speaker 1: love addiction and just saying that we do live in 535 00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:52,520 Speaker 1: a love addicted society, that that's just become the norm. 536 00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:55,880 Speaker 1: It's a Dr Larry Young, he's the director of Translational 537 00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:59,440 Speaker 1: Social Neuroscience, notes that experiencing a loss from a partner, 538 00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:02,080 Speaker 1: such as separation or death as akin to an addict 539 00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:07,920 Speaker 1: craving drugs. Yeah, and that's exactly what happens at breakup 540 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:11,320 Speaker 1: boot cap. They are their physically and withdrawal. If they 541 00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:15,280 Speaker 1: were to do SMR I stand on the brain after separations, 542 00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:17,040 Speaker 1: they would see the same part of the brain is 543 00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:20,560 Speaker 1: activated as a heroine user feeding for their fix. They're 544 00:32:20,600 --> 00:32:24,840 Speaker 1: physically in withdrawal. And so yeah, it could be super 545 00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:29,760 Speaker 1: addictive because what happens when you feel less for someone, um, 546 00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:33,600 Speaker 1: you have a kind of dopamine that's pulsing through your body. 547 00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,560 Speaker 1: Dopamine is that feels good, pleasure chemical. It's what you 548 00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:43,080 Speaker 1: get when you have chocolate, when you do cocaine, when um, 549 00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:46,960 Speaker 1: the apple of your eye gives you affection and attention, 550 00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:50,480 Speaker 1: and it's also what makes you feel like complete hell 551 00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:54,080 Speaker 1: when they don't return your affection. Right, You're getting hits, 552 00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:57,280 Speaker 1: I mean legitimately like a drug addict. It's I mean, 553 00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:00,240 Speaker 1: that's so interesting to think about. So it's that is 554 00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:03,240 Speaker 1: what we are equating with love and our society. And 555 00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:05,400 Speaker 1: you know, you're saying, this is not real love, this 556 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:10,040 Speaker 1: is love addiction. What is love? What does that look like? Yeah? 557 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:14,200 Speaker 1: So I think for anyone who's listening out here, UM, 558 00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:18,160 Speaker 1: if you don't have an idea of what healthy love 559 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:21,280 Speaker 1: feels like because you didn't have a healthy model of it, 560 00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:24,840 Speaker 1: um or you haven't experienced it or a romantic relationships, 561 00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 1: this is what I suggest you do, because it's going 562 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:31,360 Speaker 1: to to feel very different. But the very first thing 563 00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:34,520 Speaker 1: to do is create awareness, even on us to reb level, 564 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:38,200 Speaker 1: so that you can one day experience it on an 565 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:43,600 Speaker 1: embodied level right down. What if what is unhealthy relationships? 566 00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:47,120 Speaker 1: Unhealthy relating? Look like? I don't want to say unhealthy 567 00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:49,520 Speaker 1: love because it's not love in the first place. And 568 00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:55,680 Speaker 1: unhealthy is up and down, is chaotic, is inconsistent, is punishing, 569 00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:59,920 Speaker 1: is abusive, all those things. Those web flags write that down, 570 00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:04,320 Speaker 1: right down, so it's very clear what unhealthy looks like, 571 00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:07,280 Speaker 1: so that you can use that as your parameters the 572 00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:10,680 Speaker 1: next time you lock eyes with someone across the bar 573 00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:13,400 Speaker 1: and you're like, oh my gosh, red flags, look at 574 00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:15,400 Speaker 1: that list and be like, oh, you know what, my 575 00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:18,839 Speaker 1: chemistry you know is all up on you. But I 576 00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:24,080 Speaker 1: know better because I'm going I'm falling in the same track. Um. 577 00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:27,160 Speaker 1: And so healthy love if you don't have a model 578 00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:29,960 Speaker 1: of what it is. Romantically, I'm sure you can find 579 00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:33,919 Speaker 1: um some examples of how healthy love feels like from 580 00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:38,920 Speaker 1: friends or family, because it's all the same thing. Romantic love, uh, 581 00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:42,000 Speaker 1: familial love, it's all part of the same thing. It's love. 582 00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:48,080 Speaker 1: And that love is consistent, it's supportive, it's accepting. Uh, 583 00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:53,840 Speaker 1: it's warm, it's kind, it's patient, Uh, it's inspiring, it's empowering, 584 00:34:54,600 --> 00:34:58,479 Speaker 1: and it's just start to marinate in what that has 585 00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:02,200 Speaker 1: felt like for you in past and keep building on 586 00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:06,560 Speaker 1: those experiences. And and that means if you're saying no 587 00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:10,120 Speaker 1: to that person who you know is the adds all 588 00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:12,359 Speaker 1: the warning signs of the red flags because you know 589 00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:16,200 Speaker 1: that that's not healthy, that means open up your heart, 590 00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:19,080 Speaker 1: open up your mind to give a chance to people 591 00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:22,640 Speaker 1: who you might not feel this intense chemistry with in 592 00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:25,680 Speaker 1: the beginning, but it might grow because you need to 593 00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:29,640 Speaker 1: start getting familiar with what healthy looks like and feels 594 00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:32,520 Speaker 1: like before you ask you to jump in. You don't 595 00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:36,840 Speaker 1: go from high high, low low dysfunctional relating to suddenly 596 00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:40,320 Speaker 1: super healthy. That's just not how it works. It works 597 00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:43,760 Speaker 1: in changing one degree at a time, getting a little 598 00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:47,400 Speaker 1: bit healthier, partner by partner. So I read your you 599 00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:50,640 Speaker 1: talked about your dating experience, and as you mentioned earlier, 600 00:35:50,840 --> 00:35:54,080 Speaker 1: you were picking men who kind of recreated your relationship 601 00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:56,879 Speaker 1: with your father, and a lot of times that looked 602 00:35:56,920 --> 00:36:00,600 Speaker 1: like what was it workaholics or just emotionally available in 603 00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:05,399 Speaker 1: some capacity, but you started dating differently. Can you tell 604 00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:09,839 Speaker 1: us about that? Yeah. So I just had a track 605 00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:15,080 Speaker 1: record of going for guys who just never prioritized me, 606 00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:17,920 Speaker 1: and I was always just trying to earn their attention 607 00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:23,040 Speaker 1: and prove myself. I was always timing for someone, and um, 608 00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:26,560 Speaker 1: there was pivotal moment where I realized I had a problem. 609 00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:29,479 Speaker 1: And I actually had a guy friend of mine who's 610 00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:33,359 Speaker 1: this amazing person, and he was messaging me on on 611 00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:37,160 Speaker 1: Facebook and he's like, hey, Amy, Um, you know, I 612 00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:39,920 Speaker 1: know we're friends, but it seems like we have like 613 00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:42,879 Speaker 1: similar values, and I was wondering if you'd be open 614 00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:48,360 Speaker 1: to seeing if there's a romantic connection here. And I 615 00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:53,560 Speaker 1: had a physical reaction of disgusted and I was like oh. 616 00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:56,800 Speaker 1: And I remember my teammates at the office was like, 617 00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:59,759 Speaker 1: oh my god, are you okay? What happens? And I 618 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:02,640 Speaker 1: have stopped and like, oh my gosh, like if I'm 619 00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:06,880 Speaker 1: getting a visceral reaction like this over a nice guy 620 00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:12,080 Speaker 1: who is kind, loving, intentionally wants to date me, is 621 00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:16,239 Speaker 1: respectfully asking me, and I'm rest acting like this, there 622 00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:20,040 Speaker 1: is something wrong here. And I realized that my chemistry 623 00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:25,239 Speaker 1: compass was way broken, and so I didn't experiment on 624 00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:28,520 Speaker 1: myself and I decided I'm like, Okay, I'm gonna be 625 00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:32,600 Speaker 1: open to going on dates with people who intentionally want 626 00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:35,600 Speaker 1: to go on a date with me, who seem healthy, 627 00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:41,319 Speaker 1: kind and have similar values, UM and secure, and even 628 00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:44,040 Speaker 1: if I don't feel the chemistry, I'm just gonna explore. 629 00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:46,640 Speaker 1: And so I went on a date with this guy. 630 00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:49,279 Speaker 1: I went on multiple dates with him, UM and I 631 00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:54,640 Speaker 1: continued UM. I probably met seven different people, going on 632 00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:57,680 Speaker 1: multiple dates with them UM. And I did this for 633 00:37:57,719 --> 00:38:01,239 Speaker 1: about eight months, and I at a point of frustration 634 00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:04,840 Speaker 1: because I was like, this experience isn't working, like chemistry 635 00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:07,680 Speaker 1: isn't building. And I remember there was one of the 636 00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:12,640 Speaker 1: guys who earlier on in the very beginning UM, I 637 00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:14,319 Speaker 1: had said to him like, hey, you know, I just 638 00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:16,040 Speaker 1: want to be upfront with where I'm at. I don't 639 00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:19,400 Speaker 1: feel chemistry right now, but if you're open to, like 640 00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:22,200 Speaker 1: hanging out like no pressure, as like friends, Like I'm 641 00:38:22,239 --> 00:38:24,440 Speaker 1: down and he's like yeah, he's like, I want to 642 00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:27,040 Speaker 1: get to know you as a human. Like if that's 643 00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:29,520 Speaker 1: on a friendship level, I'm totally cool with that. So 644 00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:31,520 Speaker 1: I would hang out with this person every once in 645 00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:34,399 Speaker 1: a while and just you know, no, not I ever 646 00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:37,239 Speaker 1: feel pressure or anything like that, just as friends. And 647 00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:40,840 Speaker 1: I remember it was eight months after and this probably 648 00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:42,959 Speaker 1: are like eight time hanging out. We were having dinner 649 00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:46,480 Speaker 1: and remember looking across the table at him and I 650 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:51,759 Speaker 1: was like, oh, like, you look handsome, and I just 651 00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:55,600 Speaker 1: realized I was like physically attracted to him, and I'm like, 652 00:38:55,760 --> 00:39:00,600 Speaker 1: what the hell just happened? And what happened was through time, 653 00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:05,080 Speaker 1: I started to become more comfortable with him. And even 654 00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:07,520 Speaker 1: though I didn't feel in the very beginning that I 655 00:39:07,600 --> 00:39:11,680 Speaker 1: had a chemistry, a romantic chemistry with him, I knew 656 00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:15,000 Speaker 1: I enjoyed hanging out with him. And eventually that spark, 657 00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:21,480 Speaker 1: whatever it was, turned into romantic chemistry, and chemistry grew 658 00:39:21,640 --> 00:39:25,799 Speaker 1: because I started to see who he was for his 659 00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:30,439 Speaker 1: character and for his soul. And that took time. And 660 00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:33,960 Speaker 1: you know, if those first seven got if I didn't, 661 00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:37,239 Speaker 1: you know, do this with and slowly but surely get 662 00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:41,600 Speaker 1: more familiar and more comfortable with what healthy felt like, 663 00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:44,680 Speaker 1: what it felt like to date someone who intentionally wanted 664 00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:47,600 Speaker 1: to date me. I would have never developed feeling with 665 00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:50,200 Speaker 1: this guy. And that's what I mean. It's just one 666 00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:53,160 Speaker 1: degree at a time. You need to get familiar with 667 00:39:53,239 --> 00:39:57,759 Speaker 1: how it feels like so your brain doesn't just reject it, right, 668 00:39:57,800 --> 00:40:00,799 Speaker 1: It's that rewiring I had mass there, Pisto told me. 669 00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:02,560 Speaker 1: I was just telling me about her experience, and she 670 00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:06,399 Speaker 1: said that when she first started to heal and and 671 00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:09,360 Speaker 1: grow from this stuff, that she could walk started to 672 00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:11,399 Speaker 1: be able to walk into a room and could tell 673 00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:14,960 Speaker 1: the man she needed to get away from immediately because 674 00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:18,359 Speaker 1: she would be so drawn to them. And that's Isn't 675 00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:20,120 Speaker 1: that so interesting though? Because I think that if you 676 00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:23,640 Speaker 1: told someone who isn't doing this work, they would be like, well, what, 677 00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:26,040 Speaker 1: that's the person that you probably are, you know, super 678 00:40:26,040 --> 00:40:28,000 Speaker 1: attracted to you or have the chemistry with, But that's 679 00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:31,000 Speaker 1: not always going to be healthy, which I think is 680 00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:34,960 Speaker 1: so interesting. Yeah, if you don't have a history of 681 00:40:35,120 --> 00:40:39,640 Speaker 1: healthy relationship, if you, you know, meet someone and it's 682 00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:43,920 Speaker 1: like off the charts chemistry, that's usually not a sign 683 00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:45,960 Speaker 1: of a green light. It's a red light for the 684 00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:50,239 Speaker 1: reason for that polarity, and it's because that person you 685 00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:53,839 Speaker 1: can sub like subconsciously it's like, oh my gosh, they're 686 00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:57,680 Speaker 1: going to like really hit those deep wounds of mine. God, 687 00:40:58,120 --> 00:41:01,520 Speaker 1: it's so crazy and that all. Also it's like for me, 688 00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:04,600 Speaker 1: I know, um, just being in the dating world now, 689 00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:08,040 Speaker 1: it's it's kind of like, oh, like you trust yourself 690 00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:11,040 Speaker 1: once you know that might be your pattern, Because if 691 00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:12,920 Speaker 1: you're drawn to somebody, does that mean it's like the 692 00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:16,800 Speaker 1: bad you know, the bad chemistry or the the repeating 693 00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:21,279 Speaker 1: the patterns you've always done. I think that if you 694 00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:24,080 Speaker 1: once you start doing the work and creating the awareness. 695 00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:27,279 Speaker 1: It really just depends on where you're at. Like, as 696 00:41:27,320 --> 00:41:30,080 Speaker 1: I mentioned, if you have never really looked at this 697 00:41:30,120 --> 00:41:34,200 Speaker 1: stuff and have a history of dating people who are 698 00:41:34,239 --> 00:41:37,680 Speaker 1: carerible for you, then yes, your chemistry compass is probably 699 00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:43,759 Speaker 1: way broken and you're not prioritizing compatibility enough. Um. You know, 700 00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:46,920 Speaker 1: as you continue to get healthier yourself and more secure, 701 00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:49,319 Speaker 1: you'll start to see a difference in who you are 702 00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:52,120 Speaker 1: drawn to and who has drawn to you. That's probably 703 00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:55,000 Speaker 1: the quickest way to take a look at how are 704 00:41:55,040 --> 00:41:59,960 Speaker 1: you doing on an emotional health level? Um? And hope 705 00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,600 Speaker 1: when you get to a point where you know you 706 00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:06,400 Speaker 1: addressed some of those limiting belief systems that have been 707 00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:09,640 Speaker 1: kicking around for decades, and you're more secure and you're 708 00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:14,800 Speaker 1: not facing yourself worth, identity and self esteem on someone else, 709 00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:18,160 Speaker 1: and you have a strong foundation, and when you're coming 710 00:42:18,200 --> 00:42:20,960 Speaker 1: from that place, you can start trusting your gut and 711 00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:25,279 Speaker 1: your intuition. I do believe that every relationship, or this 712 00:42:25,320 --> 00:42:27,799 Speaker 1: has been my experience, at least every relationship I've been 713 00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:30,600 Speaker 1: has been some lesson to get me to the next 714 00:42:30,680 --> 00:42:34,840 Speaker 1: level of knowing myself greater or being a better version 715 00:42:34,840 --> 00:42:38,880 Speaker 1: of myself and some capacity. Um. Do you think you 716 00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:41,000 Speaker 1: know that statement? You know how people are always saying 717 00:42:41,360 --> 00:42:45,720 Speaker 1: you can't love someone fully until you love yourself. Um. 718 00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:49,719 Speaker 1: I I agree with that, But I also lately have 719 00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:53,360 Speaker 1: been one, you know, bouncing around the idea of relationships 720 00:42:53,400 --> 00:42:55,919 Speaker 1: truly do show me sides of myself that I didn't 721 00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:58,320 Speaker 1: even know we're in there, or you know, old wounds 722 00:42:58,360 --> 00:43:01,080 Speaker 1: that I haven't healed yet, or old traumas. And I 723 00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:03,960 Speaker 1: was reading somewhere on your website and it said, when 724 00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:06,560 Speaker 1: you open up your heart, or when you open up 725 00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:09,680 Speaker 1: your heart for love, anything that hasn't been healed will 726 00:43:09,719 --> 00:43:13,560 Speaker 1: come out of hiding. Yeah. And I think that's so 727 00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:16,799 Speaker 1: true because I can be going about my life not 728 00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:20,040 Speaker 1: understanding or knowing that stuff is still in there or 729 00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:22,440 Speaker 1: you know, like they said, the old wounds thing that 730 00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:25,120 Speaker 1: they're in there. But when I get in certain relationships, 731 00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:27,320 Speaker 1: it gets triggered and it comes out and it forces 732 00:43:27,320 --> 00:43:30,960 Speaker 1: me to kind of face another layer of things about 733 00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:37,720 Speaker 1: myself or my past or even my attachment styles. Totally. 734 00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:39,600 Speaker 1: I mean there, I think you hit a point in 735 00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:43,400 Speaker 1: your evolution where to go. The next step is really 736 00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:47,799 Speaker 1: in relation with another person. Yeah. It's very easy when 737 00:43:47,880 --> 00:43:52,080 Speaker 1: you're single and not really having to be vulnerable, not 738 00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:57,839 Speaker 1: really having to create true intimacy, um, to just be like, oh, 739 00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:02,239 Speaker 1: everything's all great. It's it's when you're with someone and 740 00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:05,279 Speaker 1: choosing to like stick through it that your stuff is 741 00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:09,399 Speaker 1: going to come up. Yeah. Wow, I love that you say. 742 00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:12,320 Speaker 1: Our greatest lesson in this lifetime is to practice opening 743 00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:20,239 Speaker 1: our hearts even when it hurts, especially when it hurts. Yeah, totally. Um, 744 00:44:20,440 --> 00:44:23,319 Speaker 1: So I could obviously talk about this stuff forever with you, 745 00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:26,560 Speaker 1: but you guys, should go check out this website, UM 746 00:44:26,640 --> 00:44:29,239 Speaker 1: just my type dot c a where Amy talks about 747 00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:31,840 Speaker 1: all of these different topics. You have guest writers sometimes 748 00:44:31,840 --> 00:44:35,360 Speaker 1: as well, who are different experts in their fields. What 749 00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:37,560 Speaker 1: else I mean? We have the Breakup boot can't we 750 00:44:37,560 --> 00:44:40,239 Speaker 1: talked about? You have a book coming out right in 751 00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:44,160 Speaker 1: the spring. I do so. I have a book called 752 00:44:44,280 --> 00:44:48,279 Speaker 1: Breakup boot Camp, The Science to Rewire Your Heart, being 753 00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:53,359 Speaker 1: published by HarperCollins on NATHIF and it is really a 754 00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:55,200 Speaker 1: lot of what we've just talked about. It's for that 755 00:44:55,239 --> 00:44:58,840 Speaker 1: woman or man who can't actually come attend one of 756 00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:02,640 Speaker 1: my physical retreats. But it is to help you look 757 00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:06,719 Speaker 1: at your past relationships to identify the subconscious patterns and 758 00:45:06,760 --> 00:45:10,760 Speaker 1: blocks that's causing the same patterns and outcomes to repeat, 759 00:45:11,280 --> 00:45:15,879 Speaker 1: and block by block we build a stronger, sturdier foundation 760 00:45:16,480 --> 00:45:20,440 Speaker 1: so that you can actually create healthy love with yourselves 761 00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:24,080 Speaker 1: and then hopefully with another person. UM. So it's all 762 00:45:24,200 --> 00:45:28,160 Speaker 1: on rewiring. It's the psychology and the psych science of love, 763 00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:33,799 Speaker 1: lust and desire. Wow. And that comes out when fIF 764 00:45:35,040 --> 00:45:37,640 Speaker 1: fIF I will repost about that when it comes out 765 00:45:37,640 --> 00:45:39,879 Speaker 1: to remind you guys, um that you can go out 766 00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:43,560 Speaker 1: and get it UM. Also, I saw on the website 767 00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:45,680 Speaker 1: there are a couple of different things you can sign 768 00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:48,359 Speaker 1: up for. You know, is it like a monthly subscription 769 00:45:48,640 --> 00:45:52,960 Speaker 1: or what were the two different options? Yeah, so UM 770 00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:55,960 Speaker 1: you can sign up for actually have a Patreon, so 771 00:45:56,040 --> 00:45:58,839 Speaker 1: you can go onto either just by tech dot yer 772 00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:01,359 Speaker 1: or where New break Up wet camp dot com. And 773 00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:06,120 Speaker 1: I actually have kind of a secret blog that isn't 774 00:46:06,120 --> 00:46:08,320 Speaker 1: on just my types and this is like a combination 775 00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:12,279 Speaker 1: of like just my deep, raw unfiltered thoughts. I have 776 00:46:12,400 --> 00:46:15,799 Speaker 1: my own personal dating diaries on their UM. I have 777 00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:19,000 Speaker 1: asked Amy, so you can ask me anything and I can. 778 00:46:19,040 --> 00:46:24,000 Speaker 1: I'll actually personally answer your love and dating it's UM questions, UM. 779 00:46:24,080 --> 00:46:27,120 Speaker 1: And the other is it's a it's a thirty day 780 00:46:27,400 --> 00:46:31,160 Speaker 1: UM breakup course, So after a breakup, it's a daily 781 00:46:31,320 --> 00:46:34,640 Speaker 1: email with an activity and some psychology of what's going 782 00:46:34,680 --> 00:46:37,080 Speaker 1: on and something you can do to get yourself out 783 00:46:37,080 --> 00:46:39,319 Speaker 1: of a funk. Oh, I have to go sign up 784 00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:42,920 Speaker 1: for this? Um? Okay, where else can people find you? 785 00:46:42,960 --> 00:46:46,479 Speaker 1: On Instagram? Social media? What are your handles? Yeah, I'm 786 00:46:46,600 --> 00:46:49,680 Speaker 1: at miss Amy chan across the board. So am I 787 00:46:49,880 --> 00:46:52,840 Speaker 1: S S A M Y C H A N amazing 788 00:46:52,920 --> 00:46:54,680 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for being here and just this 789 00:46:54,719 --> 00:46:57,759 Speaker 1: work that you're doing. I totally appreciated, and I know 790 00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:00,279 Speaker 1: a lot of my friends have just really or it's 791 00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:02,319 Speaker 1: to dive and stuff like this, so I really think 792 00:47:02,360 --> 00:47:06,080 Speaker 1: it's amazing that you're pioneering this for us. Thank you. 793 00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:08,799 Speaker 1: This was so fun. Thank you for being here, and 794 00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:11,759 Speaker 1: thank you guys so much for listening by. This is 795 00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:15,160 Speaker 1: Kelly Henderson and you've been listening to the Velvet's Edge podcast. 796 00:47:15,480 --> 00:47:17,920 Speaker 1: I truly believe that every one of us has a 797 00:47:17,960 --> 00:47:20,960 Speaker 1: little velvet and a little edge, so it's so important 798 00:47:20,960 --> 00:47:24,120 Speaker 1: to remember that to be strong, you must be soft too. 799 00:47:24,520 --> 00:47:27,040 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for sharing in those stories with me. 800 00:47:27,520 --> 00:47:30,520 Speaker 1: You can follow Velvet's Edge on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter, 801 00:47:30,719 --> 00:47:33,239 Speaker 1: as well as velvet's Edge dot com. If you have 802 00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:36,560 Speaker 1: it yet, go to Apple Podcast and subscribe, rate and 803 00:47:36,600 --> 00:47:40,640 Speaker 1: review this podcast. Join me every Wednesday for more conversations 804 00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:44,520 Speaker 1: on lifestyle, beauty, and relationships. Thanks for listening.