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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Greece. You shoot up a school,

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Speaker 1: gunning down young people, then you go in front of

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Speaker 1: a judge and demand that no photos of the bodies

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Speaker 1: of the victims be shown in court. Okay, that's not

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Speaker 1: how it works. You shoot the people dead, you plead

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Speaker 1: not guilty, and then you demand that nobody see the evidence. Okay,

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Speaker 1: somebody needs a little refresher and the evidence code. I'm

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Speaker 1: Nancy Greece. This is Crime Stories. Thanks for being with

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Speaker 1: us here at Foxination in series XEM one eleven. That's right.

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Speaker 1: The man who gunned down four students dead and injured

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Speaker 1: seven others at a Michigan school shooting does not want

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Speaker 1: the crime scene, including the dead bodies, shown in court.

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Speaker 1: Ethan Crumbley also trying to stop prosecutors from showing security

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Speaker 1: footage of the killing spree at Oxford High School, and

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Speaker 1: just for good measure, his lawyer also wants to bar

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Speaker 1: a video of him torturing a bird. Okay, just let

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Speaker 1: that sink in for a moment. I'm talking about Ethan Crumblely,

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Speaker 1: on trial for mass murder a school shooting. How did

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Speaker 1: the whole thing go down? Take a listen to Pierre

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Speaker 1: Thomas ABC student.

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Speaker 2: John Edwards describing the chaos to our affiliate WXYZ do pay.

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Speaker 3: We hear our principal, mister Wolf shouting Alice, lockdown, Alice, lockdown,

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Speaker 3: and then we heard the gunshots in the class, and

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Speaker 3: so we lockdown, turned lights off. Our teacher got paper

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Speaker 3: taped over the window the door and got his two

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Speaker 3: big tabled and barricaded the door.

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Speaker 4: It's just scared.

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Speaker 3: I was praying for, you know, my safety, my friend's safety,

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Speaker 3: you know, everyone's safety.

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Speaker 1: Edwards able to call his mother.

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Speaker 3: I could hear the fear in his voice, and I

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Speaker 3: know said, maybe I'm on my way. I've never been

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Speaker 3: forth fared in my life.

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Speaker 1: School officials left reeling. Of course, I'm shocked. That's a

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Speaker 1: DOVA student, really shocked and devastated. I'm sure that teacher was.

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Speaker 1: But guess what, there were warning signs, and lots of them.

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Speaker 1: Not everyone's to be should be so shocked, and that

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Speaker 1: includes some school officials and mommy and daddy. Why does

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Speaker 1: so many students have to die, I mean, young students.

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Speaker 1: Can you imagine all the times my students, my children,

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Speaker 1: your children, other students at school have practiced lockdowns, and

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Speaker 1: this teacher. I think a hero teacher goes into goes

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Speaker 1: into lockdown mode, locking the door to the classroom, barricading

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Speaker 1: the door to the classroom, turning the light saw so

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Speaker 1: the shooter can't see through into the classroom, putting paper

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Speaker 1: up so the shooter can't see through, and take potshots

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Speaker 1: his shootings hiding inside the classroom. Things we've learned from

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Speaker 1: so many other school shootings. Take a listen, embrace yourself.

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Speaker 1: Its classroom video.

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Speaker 5: Yes, come out, guys.

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Speaker 6: You don't know if.

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Speaker 1: That list right out.

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Speaker 6: We're not taking that list right out.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, bro, he said, bro red flags.

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Speaker 1: Hold on your phone. You can hear the student's hustling

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Speaker 1: and rustling trying to get out windows, trying to find

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Speaker 1: a way out. You can hear a teacher saying put

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Speaker 1: down your bags forget your bags, just get out. That's

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Speaker 1: actual sound from the school shooting. And if you can

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Speaker 1: let yourself, let your mind go there, imagine your children

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Speaker 1: in that situation trying to put down their bags and

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Speaker 1: get out a windows, sneak out anyway they can after

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Speaker 1: they hear gunshots ringing out in the hall. Mommy and

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Speaker 1: daddy go on the run after their son does that.

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Speaker 1: The Babyface Killer with Me and All Star panel. Troy Slayton,

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Speaker 1: high profile lawyer joining us out of LA. Doctor Jorkrausin,

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Speaker 1: psychologist faculty Saint Leo University and consultant author of Operation Soos.

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Speaker 1: Bobby Checkone twenty seven years with the FBI at Bobby

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Speaker 1: Chicone dot com. Doctor Tim Gallagher joining us the medical

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Speaker 1: examiner for the entire state of Florida. You can find

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Speaker 1: him at pathcaremed dot com. But joining us right now.

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Speaker 1: Crime online dot com. Investigative reporter Alexis Terreschuk. Alexis, your

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Speaker 1: son is approaching the age of these students. Did you

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Speaker 1: hear that mother saying she was telling her son, baby,

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Speaker 1: I'm on the way, I'm on the way, I'm on

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Speaker 1: the way, like she could do anything about it. I'm

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Speaker 1: just overwhelmed at all the warning signs and the victims

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Speaker 1: are so young, Alexis, how old are the victims that

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Speaker 1: lost their lives?

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Speaker 4: These kids were so young. So there were four students.

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Speaker 4: Madison was fourteen, Juliana was fifteen, Kate is seventh, was seventeen,

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Speaker 4: and Justin was seventeen. None of these kids are even

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Speaker 4: eighteen years old, Yet two of them couldn't even drive.

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Speaker 1: Yet one of them just fourteen years old. What exactly happened?

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Speaker 1: Take a listen to our cut ten The.

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Speaker 7: Drama unfolded at Oxford High School outside Detroit.

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Speaker 8: We're in lockdown right now.

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Speaker 7: Teachers and students rushed to barricade the doors. Police disarmed

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Speaker 7: the fifteen year old shooter within five minutes, but four

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Speaker 7: students were killed and seven others wounded, including a teacher.

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Speaker 7: Sixteen year old Tate mir Die a hero trying to

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Speaker 7: disarm the shooter.

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Speaker 9: Everything about us is tough.

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Speaker 7: Tatemier was number forty two on the football team. Today,

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Speaker 7: there's a petition to name the school stadium after him.

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Speaker 7: Madison Baldwin was a bright seventeen year old senior. Amid

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Speaker 7: the chaos after the shooting, her grandmother appealed for information

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Speaker 7: on Facebook. Please help my granddaughter. Madison cannot be located.

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Speaker 7: Please ask your children if they've seen her. Sadly, Madison

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Speaker 7: was among those slain. Hannah Saint Juliana is the youngest victim,

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Speaker 7: just fourteen years old. She was a talented volleyball player.

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Speaker 7: Just thinking about this little girl, fourteen years old. She's

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Speaker 7: a volleyball player, just like my daughter and I think

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Speaker 7: doctor Droy Cross and psychologists joining US faculty Saint Leo University.

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Speaker 7: I think a lot of people think, oh, that's in

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Speaker 7: a different state, that's in a different.

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Speaker 1: Community, that would never happen in my community. It's happening everywhere.

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Speaker 1: You can't disassociate yourself from what's happening at this school

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Speaker 1: by saying, well, that's somewhere other than where I live,

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Speaker 1: because you remember, the whole thing started really or came

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Speaker 1: into our consciousness at Columbine, and then there's been so

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Speaker 1: many after that. Go ahead, you think we.

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Speaker 10: Would learn, especially after Columbine, and there are certain protocols

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Speaker 10: that have been put in place for counselors and psychologists

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Speaker 10: to follow in dealing with students like this, and I

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Speaker 10: see some of those that weren't followed.

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Speaker 1: Well yeah, but from what I heard, a lot of

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Speaker 1: those were being followed. But it can't save you from

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Speaker 1: a school shooter from within the school crime stories with

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Speaker 1: Nancy Grace, the prosecutor plans to show all of this

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Speaker 1: evidence in court for a mandatory procedure, during which the

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Speaker 1: judge will determine whether life without parole is appropriate for

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Speaker 1: the crimes. How could Ethan Crumbley or his lawyer with

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Speaker 1: a straight face, ask the judge not to show crime

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Speaker 1: scene photos of the four dead bodies, plus apparently a

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Speaker 1: video of Crumbley torturing a bird in aggravation at sentencing.

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Speaker 1: They all need to review the evidence code that November thirtieth,

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Speaker 1: Crumbley left a boy's bathroom at the school and open

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Speaker 1: fire with a nine millimeter semi automatic pistol, gunning down

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Speaker 1: four classmates teens Tate Meyer, Madison Baldwin, Hannah Saint Juliana,

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Speaker 1: and Justin Schilling. Seven other injured in his hell of gunfire.

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Speaker 1: This case drew national attention, not just because of the

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Speaker 1: horrific nature of the school massacre, but because Crumley's parents

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Speaker 1: also facing involuntary manslaughter charges. This is the first time

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Speaker 1: in America parents charged in a mass shooting when the

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Speaker 1: teen child is the one who pulled the trigger. Yes,

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Speaker 1: it was an unprecedented move when a Michigan Court of

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Speaker 1: Appeals ordered the parents, James and Jennifer Crumley, to go

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Speaker 1: on trial for the deadly mass shooting by their son.

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Speaker 1: I'm quoting from the courtroom. The record squarely supports that,

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Speaker 1: but for the parents' acts and omissions Ethan Crumley would

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Speaker 1: not have killed the victims that day. They're referring to

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Speaker 1: their failure to properly secure the gun, to remove their

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Speaker 1: son from school when he made overt threats to hurt

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Speaker 1: other people, and for purchasing their mentally disturbed son a handgun.

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Speaker 1: What happened, alexis Teresschuk. There were a lot of red flags.

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Speaker 1: For instance, take a listen to our cut fourteen. This

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Speaker 1: is Linda Schmidt Fox five.

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Speaker 11: A lieutenant provided new details about the shooting.

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Speaker 5: The school security video shows Ethan exited a bathroom in

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Speaker 5: the hallway I mean, then shooting.

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Speaker 11: At students, then barricading themselves in classrooms behind stacks of

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Speaker 11: desks and shares, others racing out of school to safety.

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Speaker 1: What were officers say?

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Speaker 11: They have a journal written by Ethan Crumbley taken from

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Speaker 11: his backpack, where he expresses his desire to murder students,

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Speaker 11: as well as two videos recovered from Crumbly's cell phone.

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Speaker 5: Correc did a video made by him the night before

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Speaker 5: the incident. We're in He talked about shooting and killing

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Speaker 5: students the next day at Hoxford High School.

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Speaker 11: The prosecutor saying the teenager and the mass shooting.

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Speaker 12: I am absolutely sure after reviewing the evidence that it

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Speaker 12: isn't even a close call.

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Speaker 1: It was absolutely premeditating.

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Speaker 11: The teenager and his parents had spoken with school officials

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Speaker 11: that morning at the school about some concerning behavior in class,

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Speaker 11: but authority say there was no indication of a possible shooting.

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Speaker 1: Concerning behavior in class. Alexis Terreschek. What concerning behavior in class?

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Speaker 4: A teacher saw that he had done a drawing, even

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Speaker 4: did a drawing which showed a person being shot with

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Speaker 4: a gun on it and blood everywhere. So he you know,

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Speaker 4: we're students doodle who they love or who they were

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Speaker 4: their favorite artists in class, he was doing a doodling

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Speaker 4: of a murder scene and it was talking on there

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Speaker 4: about shooting it, and it just said help me, help me.

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Speaker 1: I don't I don't get it. Why was it? He

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Speaker 1: taken out of class right then that minute. There is

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Speaker 1: no time for what ifs in these situations. Of course,

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Speaker 1: in a perfect world, you want someone treated the moment

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Speaker 1: they began having an emotional mental issue, Bobby Chaconne. But

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Speaker 1: when a teacher sees gun blood, I want to kill

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Speaker 1: my other students, that's when he gets taken out pronto.

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Speaker 1: That's when I'm asking you.

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Speaker 9: Yeah, Nancy, I don't even see this as almost in pain.

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Speaker 9: It looks to me like he was reveling in and

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Speaker 9: he was fantasizing about carrying this thing out. He wanted

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Speaker 9: to do this, he was planning on doing it, and

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Speaker 9: he had some and he had two parents who probably

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Speaker 9: knew he was going to do it, and then they

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Speaker 9: provided him the means to do it. So this is

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Speaker 9: an egregious case.

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Speaker 1: I'm sick about it, Bobby, I'm sick, and I know

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Speaker 1: I appreciate to the choir right here, right now, because

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Speaker 1: everybody on this panel has dealt with something similar to this.

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Speaker 1: But Bobbie Chaconne, I mean, you were one of the FEDS,

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Speaker 1: the FBI that pulled the body parts of Samantha Koenig

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Speaker 1: out of the water. Okay, you've seen this. She was

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Speaker 1: a teen like this. My point is, yeah, I want everyone,

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Speaker 1: not just teens, but everyone that has a mental or

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Speaker 1: emotional crisis to be treated. Of course, but that's a

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Speaker 1: day late and a dollar sharp short as far as

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Speaker 1: I'm concerned right now, Guys, how in the hey did

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Speaker 1: he get a gun fifteen years old? And listen to

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Speaker 1: this it's a six hour take a listen to our

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Speaker 1: cut seventeen.

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Speaker 12: James Crumbley purchased a sig Sour nine millimeter model SP

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Speaker 12: twenty twenty two from atme Shooting Goes in Oxford, Michigan

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Speaker 12: on November twenty six, twenty twenty one. A store employee

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Speaker 12: confirms that Ethan Crumbley was present with James at the

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Speaker 12: time of the purchase. First statute James Crumbley completed ATF

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Speaker 12: form three hundred nine A fifty three hundred nine a.

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Speaker 4: Honor.

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Speaker 1: About November twenty six.

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Speaker 12: Twenty one, Ethan Crumbley's social media posts revealed photos of

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Speaker 12: the semi automatic handgun along with the caption just got

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Speaker 12: my new beauty today, including a moji with hearts sig

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Speaker 12: so hour nine millimeter Any questions I will answer end quote.

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Speaker 12: Subsequent to the purchase of that weapon, one of Jennifer

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Speaker 12: Crumbley's social media posts on about eleven, twenty seven to

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Speaker 12: twenty one read quote mom and Sunday testing out his

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Speaker 12: new Christmas present end quote.

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Speaker 1: And they posted that. Explain that to me. Alexis Terreschuk, the.

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Speaker 4: Mom Jennifer Crumley, she was put on her social media

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Speaker 4: the day after the Dad and Ethan went to purchase again,

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Speaker 4: but she was spending the day with her son trying

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Speaker 4: out his new Christmas present, so they were going somewhere

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Speaker 4: to practice buiring the sun. These are not the only

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Speaker 4: in the house. There are videos, police news videos of

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Speaker 4: police officers carrying armloads of weapons out of the homone

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Speaker 4: they appear to be long barrel rifles, So this is

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Speaker 4: not the only firearm.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So, Alexis Truschuk, I understand how you feel about

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Speaker 1: gun control. I also approve of certain gun controls myself.

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Speaker 1: I don't like guns. I'm a victim of gun violence.

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Speaker 1: My fiance was murdered. I get it. But Troy Slayton,

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Speaker 1: in this country, it's not a crime to keep guns

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Speaker 1: in your home, especially when you have them being kept.

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Speaker 1: Pursue it to the.

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Speaker 2: Law, right, That's correct, Nancy, and Michigan does not have

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Speaker 2: a strong or really any child access prevention laws, so

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Speaker 2: it was not illegal for the parents to keep guns

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Speaker 2: in the house, and there is no requirement in their

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Speaker 2: state to have those guns locked in the gun safe

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Speaker 2: or with trigger locks on them.

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Speaker 1: So as much as we don't like the way the

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Speaker 1: guns were kept, and I don't like a teen boy

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Speaker 1: having access to a gun without parental supervision in any way.

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Speaker 1: That's the law there, and as of right now, they

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Speaker 1: can card out one hundred long guns in that jurisdiction

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Speaker 1: and it is not a crime. But I want you

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Speaker 1: to take a listen to our cut nineteen. This is

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Speaker 1: the Oakland County Prosecutor Karen McDonald listened.

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Speaker 12: On November thirtieth, twenty one, the morning of the shooting.

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Speaker 12: The next day, Ethan Crumbley's teacher came upon a note

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Speaker 12: on Ethan's desk which alarmed her to the point that

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Speaker 12: she took a picture of it on her cell phone.

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Speaker 12: The note contained the following, a drawing of a semi

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Speaker 12: automatic handgun pointing at the words quote the thoughts won't

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Speaker 12: stop help me end quote. In another section of the

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Speaker 12: note was a drawing of a bullet with the following words.

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Speaker 12: Above that bullet quote blood everywhere end quote. Between they

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Speaker 12: of the gun and the bullet is a drawing of

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Speaker 12: a person who appears to have been shot twice and bleeding.

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Speaker 12: Below that figure is a drawing of a laughing emoji.

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Speaker 12: Further down the drawing are their words quote my life

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Speaker 12: is useless end quote and to the night right of

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Speaker 12: that are the words quote, the world is dead end quote.

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Speaker 1: Let me go to doctor Tim Gallagher joining us the

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Speaker 1: medical examiner for the entire state of Florida at pathcaremed

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Speaker 1: dot com. He's a lecturer University of Florida Med School

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Speaker 1: in Forensic Medicine, the founder and host of the International

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Speaker 1: Forensic Medicine Death Investigation Conference. I could go on Dodtor Gallagher,

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Speaker 1: thank you for being with us. Based on the wounds

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Speaker 1: that we believe the children suffered, do you believe that

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Speaker 1: they died instantly or did they lie there in pain

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Speaker 1: hearing all of the chaos and the screams and the

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Speaker 1: gunshots around them.

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Speaker 13: Well, without knowing that you know where they were shot

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Speaker 13: and what organs were destroyed in their bodies, I'd have

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Speaker 13: to say that the most likely thing would be they

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Speaker 13: are young, they are healthy, they have no other diseases,

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Speaker 13: they don't have any diabetes or obesity or anything like that.

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Speaker 13: That they had very good resilience to a gunshot wound.

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Speaker 13: So my first impression would be that because they are

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Speaker 13: healthy and they did receive a wound, that they would

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Speaker 13: be able to resist succumbing immediately to it. And so

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Speaker 13: my impression would be that there was a lot of

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Speaker 13: suffering of going on before they finally succumbed to their wounds.

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Speaker 1: Ethan Cromley school shooter and his lawyer insist the judge

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Speaker 1: not only how crime scene photos including the victims dead

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Speaker 1: bodies at the school be allowed in court. Okay, that

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Speaker 1: doesn't even make sense. What happened? Back to you, Alexis

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Speaker 1: Teresshuk What were there ages? Again?

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Speaker 4: Hannah was fourteen, Tate with Si seen, Justin was seventeen,

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Speaker 4: and Madison was seventeen. These are all such young children then,

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Speaker 4: and you know what Tate was actually taking. One of

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Speaker 4: the police officers who responded to the scene. Tate was

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Speaker 4: still alive when he responded. He didn't even wait for

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Speaker 4: the ambulance. He I'm gonna cry, but speak so sad.

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Speaker 4: He grabbed Heate and put him in his car to

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Speaker 4: rush into the hospital and he died to his car.

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Speaker 1: Sorry, you know, Alexis, when I heard the audio that

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Speaker 1: one of the teens had made, and you could hear

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Speaker 1: them rustling around trying to get out windows and the

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Speaker 1: teacher going to put down your backpack forget that, just

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Speaker 1: get out. I just I can't help it. I put

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Speaker 1: I superimposed my children, John, David and Lucy into that

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Speaker 1: situation and it's almost more than I can bear. Especially

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Speaker 1: upsetting are the warning signals take a listen to our

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Speaker 1: cut twenty.

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Speaker 12: James and Jennifer Crumbley were immediately summoned to the school.

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Speaker 12: A school counselor came to the classroom and removed the

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Speaker 12: shooter and brought him to the office with his backpack.

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Speaker 12: Counselor obtained the drawing of the shooter had already altered it.

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Speaker 12: The drawings of the gun and the bloody figure were

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Speaker 12: scratched out, along with the words helped me and my

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Speaker 12: life is useless, the world is dead, and blood everywhere.

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Speaker 12: Those were all altered by him as the meeting. At

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Speaker 12: the meeting, James and Jennifer Crumbley were shown the drawing

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Speaker 12: and were advised that they were required to get their

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Speaker 12: son into counseling within forty eight hours. Both James and

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Speaker 12: Jennifer Crumbley failed to ask their son if he had

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Speaker 12: his gun with him or where his gun was located,

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Speaker 12: and failed to inspect his backpack for the presence of

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Speaker 12: the gun which he had with him. James and Jennifer

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Speaker 12: Crumbley resisted the idea of then leaving the school at

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Speaker 12: that time other son leaving the school at that time. Instead,

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Speaker 12: James and Jennifer Crumbley left the high school without their son.

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Speaker 12: He was returned to the classroom.

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Speaker 1: Is it true, Alexis Tereschuk, that the Oxford High School

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Speaker 1: counselors allowed Ethan Cromwig to stay in class go back

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Speaker 1: in class the day of the shooting after he claimed

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Speaker 1: the graphic drawing of blood and bullets was part of

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Speaker 1: his plan to make a video game. He actually duped them.

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Speaker 4: Yes, that is absolutely true. In fact, while he was

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Speaker 4: taken out of the classroom when the teacher saw the drawing,

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Speaker 4: he in fact, they had called his parents the day

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Speaker 4: before because another teacher had seen him on his cellphone

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Speaker 4: searching googling ammunition. That raised the first red flag, so

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Speaker 4: the school called the parents immediately. They did not respond

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Speaker 4: to the school, but the prosecutor has announced that his

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Speaker 4: mom sent him a text. Jennifer sent Ethan a text,

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Speaker 4: but I'm not mad at you, l You just need

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Speaker 4: to learn not to get caught.

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Speaker 9: So he was.

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Speaker 4: The day before he'd been searching for ammunition. The school

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Speaker 4: sent a warning side to the parents, and the mom

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Speaker 4: thought it was an LOL joke, which is laugh out loud.

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Speaker 1: Okay, you need to tell me that very slowly again.

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Speaker 1: The day before the school a teacher caught Ethan Crumley

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Speaker 1: scrolling what through his iPhone looking for ammunition? Could you

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Speaker 1: explain that again?

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Speaker 4: Yes, a teacher saw him on his phone searching, searching

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Speaker 4: for ammunitions, gun ammunition. They this was a red flag

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Speaker 4: to this teacher. The teacher called somebody at the school

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Speaker 4: that the school alerted his parents. They left the parents

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Speaker 4: a message. The parents did not respond, is what the

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Speaker 4: proceeduors have said. Instead, after the shooting happened, when they

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Speaker 4: had Ethan's phone, they saw a text message from his

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Speaker 4: mom that said, I'm not mad at you. You just

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Speaker 4: need to learn how to not get caught Lol.

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Speaker 1: What is that to you? Doctor Droy Crass is just

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Speaker 1: complete denial on.

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Speaker 10: The school part system, the mom, her son, And what

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Speaker 10: is he doing scrolling the ammunition at school?

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Speaker 1: Anyway? Why wasn't that phone taken away or some reprimand

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Speaker 1: of some sort. Why are I see looking at that

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Speaker 1: during class?

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Speaker 10: Well, again, you go back to the Michigan law. That's

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Speaker 10: not against the law, it may be a red flag,

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Speaker 10: but once the red flag's up there, they didn't respond

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Speaker 10: properly to it.

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Speaker 1: What I'm saying is, why is he scrolling on his

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Speaker 1: phone during school? Anyway? That said the parents don't even

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Speaker 1: call back Alexis.

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Speaker 4: They did not the school so far that what we've

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Speaker 4: learned from the schools, they did not call back. But

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Speaker 4: then they were there the next day. And then when

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Speaker 4: Ethanstone was taken after the shooting, they saw this text message.

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Speaker 4: And this is one of the reasons. This is what

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Speaker 4: the prosecutor had said, was laying out the timeline of

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Speaker 4: what happened.

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Speaker 1: We hear about mom texting the day before when he's

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Speaker 1: caught scrolling for AMMO and she says, just don't get

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Speaker 1: caught next time. L Well, those aren't the only texts

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Speaker 1: we were learning about from mom, and maybe this is

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Speaker 1: one of the reasons. All they saw of her were

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Speaker 1: elbows and tailo on the run running the other way.

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Speaker 1: Take a listener. Cut twenty one, when.

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Speaker 12: The news of the active shooter at Oxford High School

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Speaker 12: had been made public, Jennifer Crumby texted to her son

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Speaker 12: at eleven twenty two, I'm sorry. At one twenty two

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Speaker 12: pm quote Ethan don't do it end quote. At one

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Speaker 12: thirty seven pm, James Crumbley called nine to one one

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Speaker 12: reporting that a gun was missing from his house and

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Speaker 12: he believed his son may be the shooter. Further investigation

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Speaker 12: revealed that the six hour nine millimeter handgun purchased by

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Speaker 12: James Crumbley was stored unlocked in a drawer in James

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Speaker 12: and Jennifer's bedroom.

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Speaker 1: The gun recovered from the shooter at the school after

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Speaker 1: the shooting was.

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Speaker 12: The same gun that was purchased by his father, James Crumbley.

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Speaker 1: Take a listener. Why charges are being brought against Cromley's parents.

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Speaker 1: Here's cut twenty two. This is the prosecutor.

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Speaker 12: The facts of this case are so egregious. Reading this document,

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Speaker 12: looking at it, reading the words help me with a gun,

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Speaker 12: blood everywhere. This doesn't just have impact me as a

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Speaker 12: prosecutor and a lawyer.

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Speaker 1: It impacts me as a mother.

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Speaker 12: The notion that a parent could read those words and

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Speaker 12: also know that their son had access to a deadly

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Speaker 12: weapon that they gave him is unconscionable and I think

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Speaker 12: it's criminal.

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Speaker 1: I believe it is criminal. Explain to me Alexis Teresha

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Speaker 1: what the charges are against the parents.

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Speaker 4: There are four counts of involuntary manslaughter. That is because

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Speaker 4: four people have died from this, so they are involuntary manslaughter.

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Speaker 4: Is where it wasn't directly their fault, they didn't pull

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Speaker 4: the trigger, but they are responsible for the death of

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Speaker 4: these four people.

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Speaker 1: Guys, take a listen to our cut six. It puts

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Speaker 1: you in the location at the time of the shootings.

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Speaker 1: This is Mary McDonald WDIV Local four.

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Speaker 14: The accused shooter's behavior had raised red flags before yesterday.

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Speaker 5: We have since learned that the schools did have contact

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Speaker 5: with the student the day before and the day of

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Speaker 5: the shooting.

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Speaker 14: Yesterday, before the shooting, that fifteen year old's parents were

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Speaker 14: brought to school for a face to face meeting with

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Speaker 14: school administrators over his classroom behavior. Just under three hours later,

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Speaker 14: school cameras recorded him.

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Speaker 8: And what's depicted on a video.

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Speaker 12: Honestly, Judge, I don't have the words to describe how

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Speaker 12: horrific that was.

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Speaker 14: The accused shooter seen coming out of a bathroom and firing,

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Speaker 14: aiming for students' heads with a gun his father bought

437
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:48,960
Speaker 14: last Friday.

438
00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:51,960
Speaker 1: Aiming for students' heads, obviously going into the bathroom to

439
00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:54,560
Speaker 1: get the gun locked and loaded. It was a six

440
00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:59,520
Speaker 1: hour nine SB twenty twenty. You don't play with that

441
00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:04,520
Speaker 1: nine millimeter. I want to go to you, Bobby Chicode,

442
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:06,560
Speaker 1: Explain what a nine six hour is.

443
00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 2: Well, it's a.

444
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:10,440
Speaker 9: Semi automatic pistol, which means that you know, you can

445
00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:14,760
Speaker 9: fire it fairly rapidly. It probably held anywhere between ten

446
00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:18,440
Speaker 9: and fifteen bullets in each magazine. He had extra magazine

447
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:22,440
Speaker 9: with him, which means he was planning on killing probably

448
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:25,399
Speaker 9: a lot more people than this. And so this is

449
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:28,760
Speaker 9: a This is a gun that's commonly used by both

450
00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:31,800
Speaker 9: criminals and law enforcement. It is a very effective weapon,

451
00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:35,520
Speaker 9: especially especially a cool range like he was shooting.

452
00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:53,240
Speaker 1: Prime Stories with Nancy Grace. The infamous Michigan schools cheater.

453
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:59,000
Speaker 1: Does not want bodies of his victims shown in court.

454
00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:03,400
Speaker 1: That's going to work. What are the facts of the case.

455
00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:10,320
Speaker 1: So this kid has a six hour semi nine millimeter,

456
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:14,600
Speaker 1: ten to fifteen bullets per mag with extra mags. Now

457
00:29:14,760 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 1: what about the parents. Take a listen to our twenty

458
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:20,600
Speaker 1: six seven Action News tonight.

459
00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:23,640
Speaker 6: The US Marshall has posted a ten thousand dollars reward

460
00:29:23,760 --> 00:29:27,000
Speaker 6: in the case James and Jennifer Crumbley are wanted on

461
00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:30,800
Speaker 6: charges of involuntary manslaughter and the mass shooting that put

462
00:29:30,880 --> 00:29:35,480
Speaker 6: their fifteen year old son behind bars. The search goes

463
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:39,320
Speaker 6: on as thousands gathered in Oxford tonight to mourn the

464
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:42,720
Speaker 6: tragic loss of life at the high school on Tuesday.

465
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:47,680
Speaker 1: And now we learned the US Marshals get in on it.

466
00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:51,719
Speaker 1: That means they're on the run. On the run, that's

467
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:56,400
Speaker 1: what the US Marshals do. They are government bounty hunters.

468
00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:59,680
Speaker 1: When you get the US Marshals on your tail, you're in.

469
00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:03,440
Speaker 1: Tell me about them going on the rhinal license rest shot.

470
00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 4: So the shooting took place on Tuesday, Thursday afternoon, the

471
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:11,680
Speaker 4: police were still observing them. They had kept an eye

472
00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:13,480
Speaker 4: on the family the whole time. The mom and dad

473
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 4: had actually moved into a hotel because there were probably

474
00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:19,080
Speaker 4: so many people at their home, so they were in

475
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:21,640
Speaker 4: a hotel. Everybody kept an eye on them. Friday morning,

476
00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:24,280
Speaker 4: nothing had been announced, there had been no charge announced.

477
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:28,600
Speaker 4: The police stopped their surveillance of the couple. Shortly thereafter,

478
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:32,480
Speaker 4: the prosecutor announced the charges, and they prosecutor I believe

479
00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:34,680
Speaker 4: had spoken to the police officer and they were given

480
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:37,240
Speaker 4: I'm sorry, I spoken to the defense attorney. They were

481
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:40,480
Speaker 4: given a four o'clock deadline to turn themselves in. Four

482
00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:43,560
Speaker 4: o'clock came and went. They did not turn themselves in,

483
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:47,000
Speaker 4: and in fact, the sheriff then said, at this point

484
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:50,200
Speaker 4: there was no contact with them at all. The sheriff said,

485
00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 4: he went on television to a news challenge, said we

486
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:55,520
Speaker 4: have not heard from them. They have turned off their

487
00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:58,160
Speaker 4: cell phones and their attorneys have not been able to

488
00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 4: reach them, which meant that there was no communication. So

489
00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:04,520
Speaker 4: that's when they put out the I guess they're calling

490
00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:07,719
Speaker 4: it a bolo beyond the lookout. The US Marshall's offered

491
00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:09,160
Speaker 4: the ten thousand dollars reward.

492
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:12,719
Speaker 1: Troy Slayton. It's just like Gilaine Maxwell who goes on

493
00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:16,720
Speaker 1: the run nobody can find or she's posting false lees

494
00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 1: like at an in and out Burger in LA when

495
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:22,320
Speaker 1: she's really hiding out in New Hampshire. And what does

496
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:25,120
Speaker 1: that say about a parent willing to run for the

497
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:28,680
Speaker 1: Canadian border when their son needs them more than needs

498
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:31,440
Speaker 1: ever needed them in his whole life. Take a listen

499
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 1: to Megan Fitzgeryl NBC.

500
00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:36,800
Speaker 8: This Morning, James and Jennifer Crumbly are in custody after

501
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:39,560
Speaker 8: an hour's long manhunt led to their arrest overnight.

502
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:41,600
Speaker 2: The vehicle is a blank can.

503
00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:44,520
Speaker 1: It's the kind of a vehicle on the.

504
00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:48,520
Speaker 4: Two parents of the I hurt situation.

505
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 8: The couple found hiding in a commercial building after police

506
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:52,840
Speaker 8: received a ten.

507
00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 1: They certainly appeared to be distressed.

508
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:58,360
Speaker 8: Authority say the parents of accused Michigan school shooter Ethan

509
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:01,200
Speaker 8: Crumbley failed to show up their arraignment Friday.

510
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:05,920
Speaker 1: They're finally captured hours later, and he's charged with involuntary manslaughter.

511
00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:09,960
Speaker 1: You know, a gun control expert say, they move to

512
00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 1: charge to parents is almost unheard of. What do you

513
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:17,240
Speaker 1: make of the charges, Troy Slayton.

514
00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:22,080
Speaker 2: Well, Michigan doesn't have the child access prevention laws, So

515
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:27,200
Speaker 2: if they didn't do anything illegal, then the government will

516
00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:29,760
Speaker 2: have to show. Prosecutors at their trial will have to

517
00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:34,000
Speaker 2: prove that they acted so recklessly, so beyond the pale,

518
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:38,400
Speaker 2: that any other normal, average, reasonable person would do, that

519
00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:42,560
Speaker 2: a person would know that acting so recklessly would lead

520
00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:43,960
Speaker 2: to someone's death.

521
00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 1: Would you agree that it's very rare for parents to

522
00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:47,160
Speaker 1: be charged?

523
00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:48,320
Speaker 2: This is very rare.

524
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:51,240
Speaker 1: You are saying that in Michigan. There isn't a what

525
00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:52,680
Speaker 1: kind of statue did you say?

526
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 2: No child access prevention laws with regard to firearms, no

527
00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 2: rule that they have to keep guns locked up, ammunition

528
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:03,640
Speaker 2: separate away, whether when there's a child in the house,

529
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:06,280
Speaker 2: for example, in California where I live, in New York,

530
00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:09,560
Speaker 2: in many other states, it's illegal if you have a

531
00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:12,720
Speaker 2: child in the house or a child come visit that.

532
00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:17,160
Speaker 1: Surely, certainly are not suggesting that because there's not a

533
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:23,000
Speaker 1: black and white statute, that they still did not know

534
00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:26,920
Speaker 1: that the other students were in danger after reading that

535
00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 1: note and knowing he had access to a brand new

536
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:30,560
Speaker 1: SIGs hour.

537
00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:35,000
Speaker 2: By that same argument, Nancy, the school officials should know.

538
00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:36,600
Speaker 2: Are we also going to charge the.

539
00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:38,520
Speaker 1: System that we had a gun?

540
00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:41,240
Speaker 2: But they knew that there was something that was so

541
00:33:41,400 --> 00:33:46,120
Speaker 2: alarming that he was searching ammunition that they thought to

542
00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:48,720
Speaker 2: take him out of class temporarily and then put him

543
00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:49,760
Speaker 2: back in the class.

544
00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:52,560
Speaker 1: You're artfully avoiding my question. I didn't ask you about them.

545
00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:55,640
Speaker 1: I asked you about the parents, And by your avoiding

546
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:59,480
Speaker 1: the topic, I assume that you agree with me. You know,

547
00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 1: the district superintendent informed the parents and staff members Saturday

548
00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:07,520
Speaker 1: that the parents never told the school he had access

549
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:11,120
Speaker 1: to a gun. What do you make of that, Troy?

550
00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:15,000
Speaker 2: I don't know how the gun was stored inside the house.

551
00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:19,400
Speaker 2: There were some there are some reports that the gun

552
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:23,200
Speaker 2: was locked. Maybe the kid found a key and got

553
00:34:23,239 --> 00:34:26,319
Speaker 2: access to it. We don't know yet what measures the

554
00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:30,400
Speaker 2: parents took to secure the firearm. We don't know whether

555
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,040
Speaker 2: they handed it to the kid on a silver platter,

556
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:37,759
Speaker 2: or whether somehow the kid went around some sort of

557
00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:41,320
Speaker 2: system with the parents had in place.

558
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:45,719
Speaker 9: We do know that within minutes of the shooting of

559
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,719
Speaker 9: father pulled nine one one and said he thinks his

560
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:51,400
Speaker 9: son might have a gun. I mean, the father made

561
00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:53,600
Speaker 9: that act. That's an act that the father did that

562
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:57,040
Speaker 9: shows that he knew it was very likely that his

563
00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:59,719
Speaker 9: son had that weapon. He made a nine one call.

564
00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:03,040
Speaker 1: Alexis Treushow. Where were the parents found exactly?

565
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:06,280
Speaker 4: They were found in a commercial building. It was actually

566
00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:09,600
Speaker 4: an art gallery is where they were found. But they

567
00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:11,760
Speaker 4: were hiding in a locked room inside the gallery.

568
00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:15,359
Speaker 1: Ing in a locker room inside a gallery. Now I

569
00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:17,880
Speaker 1: understand the owner of the gallery claims he didn't know

570
00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:18,879
Speaker 1: anything about this.

571
00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:21,560
Speaker 4: He did, you know, Well, he's the artist. I believe

572
00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:24,200
Speaker 4: someone else owns the whole building. He's an artist. He

573
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:27,279
Speaker 4: said that when they called him, they said, we are

574
00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:30,439
Speaker 4: getting death threats. Can we come there? And he said yes.

575
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 4: He said this was before any charges were filed against him.

576
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,200
Speaker 4: They were there, he left. He said he expected them

577
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:39,759
Speaker 4: to leave. He didn't know anything about the charges that

578
00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:40,360
Speaker 4: were filed.

579
00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:45,080
Speaker 1: Ethan Crumley school shooter and his lawyer insists the judge

580
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:48,920
Speaker 1: not only how crime scene photos, including the victim's dead

581
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,720
Speaker 1: bodies at the school bill out in court.

582
00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:55,800
Speaker 15: Nancy Ethan Crumley and his attorneys did not get their request.

583
00:35:56,239 --> 00:36:00,960
Speaker 15: Oakland County Judge Qualme Row denied Crumley's request. Test Judge

584
00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:03,719
Speaker 15: Rowe did review the crime scene footage and images of

585
00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:07,320
Speaker 15: the victims. He is the only one evaluating the evidence

586
00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:10,879
Speaker 15: at the special hearing in which the judge will determine

587
00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:15,360
Speaker 15: whether a life without parole sentence is appropriate. Testimony in

588
00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:19,600
Speaker 15: that hearing ended Friday. A date has been set for sentencing.

589
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:21,880
Speaker 15: Take a listen to CBS Detroit.

590
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:24,759
Speaker 16: The Miller hearing for the Oxford High School shooter has

591
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:27,520
Speaker 16: concluded after four days, and now we wait for the

592
00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:29,759
Speaker 16: judge to make a decision on the team who has

593
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:33,280
Speaker 16: already pled guilty to all counts, including first degree murder.

594
00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:36,719
Speaker 17: Miller hearings are required to determine whether a mandatory life

595
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:40,080
Speaker 17: sentence without the possibility of parole can be handed down

596
00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:42,960
Speaker 17: for convicted criminals who were juveniles at the time of

597
00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:43,440
Speaker 17: the crime.

598
00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:44,959
Speaker 1: So here's what happens next.

599
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:48,600
Speaker 13: The judge will announce his decision on September twenty ninth.

600
00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:52,840
Speaker 1: Sentencing is set for December eighth. Right now, our prayers

601
00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:57,080
Speaker 1: with the victims' families. We wait as justice of faults.

602
00:36:58,120 --> 00:36:58,839
Speaker 1: Goodbye friend

603
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:01,719
Speaker 2: N