WEBVTT - Why Do Ordinary People Commit Espionage?

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to brain Stuff, a production of I Heart Radio,

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<v Speaker 1>Hey brain Stuff Lauren bog obam here. In mid July,

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<v Speaker 1>Maria Boutina, a twenty nine year old assistant to the

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<v Speaker 1>Russian Central Bank and to longtime Vladimir Putin ally Alexander Torsien,

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<v Speaker 1>was arrested in Washington, d C. On a charge of

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<v Speaker 1>conspiracy to act as an agent of a foreign government.

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<v Speaker 1>Per the affidavit, Boutina was allegedly involved in an operation

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<v Speaker 1>led by officials within the Russian government to infiltrate the

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<v Speaker 1>Republican Party, including members of the Trump campaign and the

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<v Speaker 1>National Rifle Association, for the purposes of aligning right wing

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<v Speaker 1>political interests with similar interests in Russia. Boutina's actions dovetailed

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<v Speaker 1>with continued efforts by Russian operatives to commit cyber espionage

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<v Speaker 1>to influence US elections. According to the affidavit, two American

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<v Speaker 1>citizens provided Boutina intelligence and guidance on her efforts in

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<v Speaker 1>the United States. M I five, the Intelligence Agency of

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<v Speaker 1>the United Kingdom, defines espionage as the process of obtaining

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<v Speaker 1>information that is not normally publicly available using human resources

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<v Speaker 1>agents or technical means like hacking into computer systems. It

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<v Speaker 1>may also involve seeking to influence decision makers and opinion

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<v Speaker 1>formers to benefit the interests of a foreign power. As

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<v Speaker 1>Boutina and countless other spies throughout history have discovered, espionage

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<v Speaker 1>is a dangerous game, one that can lead to imprisonment

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<v Speaker 1>or even death. What motivates people to commit acts of

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<v Speaker 1>espionage is as important as the ramifications of their actions,

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<v Speaker 1>and naturally simple ideology serves as a motivator to commit espionage,

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<v Speaker 1>but it's not the singular cause. According to a spring

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<v Speaker 1>article in the Intelligencer Journal of u S Intelligence Studies,

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<v Speaker 1>ideology is quote adopted by an individual to the degree

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<v Speaker 1>that it reflects the individuals ego. In that sense, an

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<v Speaker 1>ideology is like another motivation money, and that it serves

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<v Speaker 1>as a vehicle for the individual to express a personal

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<v Speaker 1>value or belief, and ideology has chosen in order to

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<v Speaker 1>confirm conscious or unconscious beliefs the individual has already internalized.

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<v Speaker 1>In the case of espionage, a particular ideology may serve

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<v Speaker 1>as either the actual motivation for a spy to breach

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<v Speaker 1>the trust placed in them, or simply as a means

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<v Speaker 1>of rationalizing that behavior. Three concurrent elements need to exist

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<v Speaker 1>within an individual to make them prone to acts of espionage,

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<v Speaker 1>a personality dysfunction, personal crisis, and opportunity. According to Dr

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<v Speaker 1>ur Slow Wilder, a clinical psychologist with the Central Intelligence Agency,

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<v Speaker 1>for personality elements are essential to the entry into espionage, psychopathy, narcissism, immaturity,

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<v Speaker 1>and grandiosity, she stated in an interview at the International

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<v Speaker 1>Spy Museum in Washington, d C. A psychopathic person is

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<v Speaker 1>a person whose approach to reality is ruthless and cold.

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<v Speaker 1>They have no conscience or they have very limited capacity

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<v Speaker 1>to feel guilt, so their whole approach to life is predatory.

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<v Speaker 1>Their excitement seeking. They love to con people. It's a game.

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<v Speaker 1>This is all they can do to connect with other

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<v Speaker 1>human beings. So that kind of person will commit espionage,

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<v Speaker 1>either flat out for self interest or because it's fun,

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<v Speaker 1>or both, she explained. The next is narcissism. A narcissistic

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<v Speaker 1>person is fundamentally egocentric. They can only experience the world

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<v Speaker 1>with themselves at the center. They are very much needy

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<v Speaker 1>for and will provoke circumstances that will permit them to

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<v Speaker 1>be at the center of attention. They believe that what

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<v Speaker 1>they need, want, and desire is truth. They will get

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<v Speaker 1>greedy for attention. That kind of person will commit espionage

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<v Speaker 1>as a grab for fame. Someone like that will commit

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<v Speaker 1>espionage because it makes them feel big and important. Re

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<v Speaker 1>Arting immaturity, Wilder said that an individual prone to commit

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<v Speaker 1>acts of espionage in comparison to a professional intelligence agent,

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<v Speaker 1>either for or against their nation, is quote an adult

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<v Speaker 1>who can only function as an adolescent. These people live

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<v Speaker 1>their lives in a blend of fact and fantasy. They

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<v Speaker 1>do have a conscience, they can feel deep guilt afterwards,

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<v Speaker 1>but fantasy is much more real to them than it

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<v Speaker 1>is to adults who are grounded in reality. So to them,

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<v Speaker 1>committing espionage is a bit of a game, a fantasy,

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<v Speaker 1>and online they have this illusion that if they do

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<v Speaker 1>it online, if they just turn off the machine, it

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<v Speaker 1>goes away. They have a fantasy about the implications of

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<v Speaker 1>their actions, and although on some level they might grasp

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<v Speaker 1>the reality of it, it's not real to them. The

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<v Speaker 1>grandiosity applies to all three. Furthermore, an individual must be

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<v Speaker 1>up against some form of personal crisis that produces distress.

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<v Speaker 1>According to a paper released by the CIA titled y Spy,

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<v Speaker 1>a survey of agency employees, quote identified emotional instability related

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<v Speaker 1>to ambition, anger leading to a need for revenge, feelings

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<v Speaker 1>of being unrecognized and unrewarded, and loneliness as the top

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<v Speaker 1>vulnerabilities on the road to espionage. They ranked such problem

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<v Speaker 1>behaviors as drug abuse and delicit sex as second, and

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<v Speaker 1>various mental crises or stresses brought on by debt, work

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<v Speaker 1>issues or psychological factors such as depression as third. Regarding

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<v Speaker 1>opportunity access matters, an individual must have access to sensitive

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<v Speaker 1>information of some caliber that could be of use to

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<v Speaker 1>a foreign power. All three combined, the personality, the crises,

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<v Speaker 1>and the access serve as fertile soil for acts of espionage,

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<v Speaker 1>but it is important to make the distinction between ordinary

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<v Speaker 1>people who commit espionage and individuals who join intelligence services.

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<v Speaker 1>For the article of this episode is based on how

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<v Speaker 1>Stuff Work. Spoke with Dr David L. Charney, a psychiatrist

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<v Speaker 1>with the National Office of Intelligence Reconciliation known as NOIR,

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<v Speaker 1>a nonprofit dedicated to educating the intelligence community on the

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<v Speaker 1>management of insider threats. He said, people who joined the

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<v Speaker 1>intel community spent years preparing themselves, school, applying screening, and

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<v Speaker 1>there's a huge amount of drive and ambition, identification, pride,

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<v Speaker 1>He explained that this would include people with access to

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<v Speaker 1>sensitive information who flipped, such as Edward Snowdon or Reality

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<v Speaker 1>winner quote. They're not coming into be spies, they join

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<v Speaker 1>for loftier reasons. The question is what makes a person

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<v Speaker 1>go bad. That's when you have to get more psychological.

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<v Speaker 1>According to Charney, at the core of espionage can be

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<v Speaker 1>an intolerable sense of personal failure and not necessarily a

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<v Speaker 1>shifting ideology. He said, going back to the ideological spies

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<v Speaker 1>of the nineteen thirties and forties, we run a cross

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<v Speaker 1>people all the time who you know have personal demons

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<v Speaker 1>that are driving them, but they wrapped their demons into

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<v Speaker 1>the current issue of the day to give it a

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<v Speaker 1>higher minded packaging. Anytime you try to understand, you have

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<v Speaker 1>to dig a little deeper. Today's episode is based on

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<v Speaker 1>the article why do ordinary people commit acts of espionage?

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<v Speaker 1>On how Stuffworks dot com written by Jared w Alexander.

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<v Speaker 1>Brain Stuff is production of by Heart Radio in partnership

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<v Speaker 1>with how stuff Works dot Com and is produced by

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<v Speaker 1>Tyler clang Or more podcasts for my heart Radio is

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