1
00:00:10,720 --> 00:00:14,360
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, a weekly

2
00:00:14,440 --> 00:00:19,200
Speaker 1: conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the small

3
00:00:19,239 --> 00:00:22,360
Speaker 1: decisions we can make to become the best possible versions

4
00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:26,480
Speaker 1: of ourselves. I'm your host, doctor Joy hard and Bradford,

5
00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:31,960
Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or

6
00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:35,480
Speaker 1: to find a therapist in your area, visit our website

7
00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:39,320
Speaker 1: at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com. While I hope you

8
00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:43,360
Speaker 1: love listening to and learning from the podcast, it is

9
00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:46,280
Speaker 1: not meant to be a substitute for a relationship with

10
00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:57,600
Speaker 1: a licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much

11
00:00:57,600 --> 00:01:00,080
Speaker 1: for joining me for session three twenty six of the

12
00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:03,200
Speaker 1: Therapy for Black Girls Podcast. We'll get right into our

13
00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:09,959
Speaker 1: conversation after a word from our sponsors. The reviews for

14
00:01:10,080 --> 00:01:13,679
Speaker 1: Sisterhood Heels are rolling in and I simply cannot stop

15
00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:18,160
Speaker 1: smiling at the hot girl books on Instagram shared finish

16
00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:20,679
Speaker 1: reading this warm hug of a book last night and

17
00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:23,240
Speaker 1: while it made me once a hug my sister friend

18
00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:26,920
Speaker 1: so bad, Sisterhood Heels is a beautiful guide on how

19
00:01:26,959 --> 00:01:29,800
Speaker 1: we as black women can use our community and friends

20
00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:33,240
Speaker 1: to aid in our healing process. Thank you so much

21
00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:36,880
Speaker 1: for the beautiful review. Have you grabbed your copy yet?

22
00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:45,520
Speaker 1: Get one for yourself and a friend at Sisterhoodheels dot com.

23
00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:49,240
Speaker 1: This sex Positive September, we recognize that part of being

24
00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:53,040
Speaker 1: sex positive is taking responsibility for your sexual health by

25
00:01:53,080 --> 00:01:58,240
Speaker 1: destigmatizing the conversation around STIs, knowing your status, and staying

26
00:01:58,280 --> 00:02:01,040
Speaker 1: up to date on the latest information. Joining me for

27
00:02:01,080 --> 00:02:05,240
Speaker 1: this conversation is returning guests. Doctor Tanya M. Bass. Doctor

28
00:02:05,320 --> 00:02:09,240
Speaker 1: Bass holds certifications as a Certified Sexuality Educator with the

29
00:02:09,280 --> 00:02:14,560
Speaker 1: American Association of Sexuality Educators, Counselors and Therapists, as well

30
00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:18,600
Speaker 1: as a Certified Health Education Specialists. She is currently faculty

31
00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:22,480
Speaker 1: for the University of Michigan's Sexual Health Certificate program, as

32
00:02:22,520 --> 00:02:25,360
Speaker 1: well as the lead instructor for Human Sexuality at her

33
00:02:25,400 --> 00:02:30,720
Speaker 1: alma mater, North Carolina Central University. In our conversation, we

34
00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:34,600
Speaker 1: explored the common types of STIs in their symptoms, the

35
00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:38,560
Speaker 1: importance of education and the prevention of STIs, and how

36
00:02:38,600 --> 00:02:41,520
Speaker 1: getting to know your body can help you better recognize

37
00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:45,960
Speaker 1: STI symptoms. If something resonates with you while enjoying our conversation,

38
00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:49,519
Speaker 1: please share with us on social media using the hashtag

39
00:02:49,639 --> 00:02:53,320
Speaker 1: TBG In session or join us over in the sister

40
00:02:53,400 --> 00:02:56,079
Speaker 1: circle to talk more about the episode. You can join

41
00:02:56,160 --> 00:02:59,119
Speaker 1: us at community dot therapy for Black Girls dot Com.

42
00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:04,560
Speaker 1: Here's our common conversation. Well, thank you so much for

43
00:03:04,639 --> 00:03:06,359
Speaker 1: joining us again, doctor Bass.

44
00:03:06,680 --> 00:03:11,320
Speaker 2: Yes, it's exciting. Been like following and sharing with people.

45
00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:15,280
Speaker 2: I know your following is growing and growing, so that's amazing. Yes.

46
00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:17,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, so the last time you were with us was

47
00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:20,720
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty. A lot has happened since then. Update

48
00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:23,400
Speaker 1: us on what's been going on for you since your

49
00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:24,440
Speaker 1: last appearance here.

50
00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:25,040
Speaker 3: Yeah.

51
00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:27,720
Speaker 2: I think since my last appearance, I actually became doctor

52
00:03:27,800 --> 00:03:32,760
Speaker 2: Bass because I completed my dissertation in April twenty twenty one.

53
00:03:33,480 --> 00:03:36,360
Speaker 2: Been working and doing a couple of things with our

54
00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:39,960
Speaker 2: professional organization. But have you seen my background. It literally

55
00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:45,160
Speaker 2: looks like an institution because it is an institution. I'm

56
00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:47,960
Speaker 2: at nccu'sm my alma mater here in Durham, and I

57
00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:49,320
Speaker 2: just finished teaching class.

58
00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:51,280
Speaker 3: So just been teaching and loving it.

59
00:03:51,840 --> 00:03:53,840
Speaker 1: We brought you back because we are, of course again

60
00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:57,240
Speaker 1: celebrating sex positive September. I mean, we wanted to have

61
00:03:57,480 --> 00:04:01,760
Speaker 1: I think a very important conversations around STDs and STIs

62
00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:05,040
Speaker 1: as we start can you tell us the definition of

63
00:04:05,080 --> 00:04:08,680
Speaker 1: an STD and STI Is there a difference between those terms.

64
00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:12,880
Speaker 2: So I want to say, like historically, as we think

65
00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:18,120
Speaker 2: about STDs and STIs, like the name has definitely transition.

66
00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:21,600
Speaker 2: Always think about TV shows when people ask me about this.

67
00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:25,600
Speaker 2: But the original kind of name was like venereal disease,

68
00:04:25,839 --> 00:04:29,159
Speaker 2: and I remember when JJ on Good Times had VD.

69
00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:35,039
Speaker 2: So it went from being this weird, uncomfortable term of

70
00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:38,599
Speaker 2: venereal DS to sexually transmitted disease, which meant that it

71
00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:43,600
Speaker 2: was any kind of condition that could be transmitted from

72
00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:47,760
Speaker 2: person to person through sexual contact. And I think as

73
00:04:47,760 --> 00:04:51,880
Speaker 2: we've evolved, there are some of those types of conditions,

74
00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:55,520
Speaker 2: whether it's a bacteria or virus or even a parasite

75
00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:58,800
Speaker 2: that people get, but some of them don't cause disease,

76
00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:01,360
Speaker 2: Like your body might be in the disease state or

77
00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:04,600
Speaker 2: a state of illness at the moment, but you don't

78
00:05:04,600 --> 00:05:07,039
Speaker 2: live with that for the rest of your life. And

79
00:05:07,120 --> 00:05:10,440
Speaker 2: so most people were trying to transition away because it

80
00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:14,240
Speaker 2: had such a negative connotation to infection, which is.

81
00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:15,680
Speaker 3: Exactly what it is.

82
00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:21,840
Speaker 2: Because this pathogen or this bacteria, parasite or virus comes

83
00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:25,360
Speaker 2: into your body and infects you with it, and so

84
00:05:25,760 --> 00:05:28,880
Speaker 2: with treatment it actually will go away, kind of like

85
00:05:28,920 --> 00:05:32,040
Speaker 2: a science infection or a coal they're infections that are

86
00:05:32,080 --> 00:05:33,480
Speaker 2: temporarily although there are.

87
00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:35,600
Speaker 3: Some things that could be lifelong.

88
00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:38,359
Speaker 2: It just helped with the explanation of like, you become

89
00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:42,440
Speaker 2: infected with this thing, but you're not a diseased individual.

90
00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:46,760
Speaker 2: The side part is the worlds aren't meeting yet, so

91
00:05:46,880 --> 00:05:51,320
Speaker 2: you'll hear people say STD slash STI or d slash

92
00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:54,680
Speaker 2: I because some of the documentation from even the federal

93
00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:58,840
Speaker 2: government like the CDC doesn't match the language that they

94
00:05:58,960 --> 00:06:01,960
Speaker 2: use to help reduce stigma. So we still have to

95
00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:06,560
Speaker 2: use the terms interchangeably because some documents you'll see like

96
00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:10,520
Speaker 2: it's STD Awareness Month versus STI awaar in this month

97
00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:14,000
Speaker 2: or something like that. But pretty much just letting people

98
00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:17,920
Speaker 2: know that there's not a real difference. It's about the

99
00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:21,800
Speaker 2: stigma and the connotation around disease versus infection.

100
00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:25,479
Speaker 1: Got it. So to help continue to decrease the stigma,

101
00:06:25,560 --> 00:06:28,720
Speaker 1: the term we should be using as STIs. Okay, so

102
00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:31,039
Speaker 1: can you talk to me about some of the most

103
00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:35,080
Speaker 1: common STIs And I'm also interested to hear if that

104
00:06:35,160 --> 00:06:37,960
Speaker 1: has changed within the last ten years, is there a

105
00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:41,920
Speaker 1: new STI that is more prevalent now then that was

106
00:06:41,960 --> 00:06:43,560
Speaker 1: not maybe like several years ago.

107
00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:47,120
Speaker 2: Well, there have been some shifts right Earlier in the years,

108
00:06:47,160 --> 00:06:50,279
Speaker 2: like let's say the seventies, we saw more people having

109
00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:53,719
Speaker 2: gonorrhea or the collap and people would say that people

110
00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:55,600
Speaker 2: were burning, right because it calls.

111
00:06:55,680 --> 00:06:56,960
Speaker 3: Burning upon your nation.

112
00:06:57,839 --> 00:07:01,680
Speaker 2: But after that we started seeing more chlamydia, which is

113
00:07:01,839 --> 00:07:05,680
Speaker 2: very similar to gonnerrhea, but under the microscope acuse, true,

114
00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:09,800
Speaker 2: different bacteria, but the infection works the same way in

115
00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:14,040
Speaker 2: our bodies. The shift has been we have seen rates

116
00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:18,680
Speaker 2: of syphilis, which has been around pretty long too, but

117
00:07:18,840 --> 00:07:21,800
Speaker 2: we saw a decrease in syphlis and then an increase

118
00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:25,040
Speaker 2: in the late nineties. We had a lot of efforts,

119
00:07:25,400 --> 00:07:27,440
Speaker 2: especially in North Carolina where I am. We had a

120
00:07:27,480 --> 00:07:31,120
Speaker 2: syphilis elimination project right like it was basically going to

121
00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:34,320
Speaker 2: different places trying to eliminate and reduce that because it

122
00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:38,640
Speaker 2: is one hundred percent preventable out of all the infections.

123
00:07:39,200 --> 00:07:41,239
Speaker 3: And we saw those rates come down in the South.

124
00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:45,920
Speaker 2: But during COVID we started seeing a resurgence or increase

125
00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:50,120
Speaker 2: in syphilis due to a range of factors. So if

126
00:07:50,160 --> 00:07:54,160
Speaker 2: I were to say, if we think about the bacterial infections,

127
00:07:54,200 --> 00:07:57,360
Speaker 2: primarily it would be ganeria and chamythia and I use

128
00:07:57,400 --> 00:08:01,560
Speaker 2: them together, and then syphilis and syphilis rising. If I

129
00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:07,760
Speaker 2: think about viral infections, HIV or course is still very common,

130
00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:11,040
Speaker 2: with herpes probably being the most common because a lot

131
00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:13,080
Speaker 2: of times people don't even know they have it.

132
00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:16,800
Speaker 1: MM, thank you for that. So what are some of

133
00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:20,360
Speaker 1: the common like shared symptoms of STIs that people should

134
00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:21,400
Speaker 1: be on the lookout for.

135
00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:24,320
Speaker 2: Now here's the wild thing. I guess it's like I

136
00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:26,400
Speaker 2: really get excited about it, but not in like a

137
00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:29,960
Speaker 2: weird way, but ultimately like the science behind it is

138
00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:33,480
Speaker 2: kind of like knowing how it works, right, the epidemiology

139
00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:36,200
Speaker 2: of it. And so when we look at goannery and chlamydia,

140
00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:40,120
Speaker 2: for many people, there are no symptoms at all. It's

141
00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:43,320
Speaker 2: laying in your body, it's growing, it's doing its thing,

142
00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:46,880
Speaker 2: but it's also being attuned to your body or aware

143
00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:49,559
Speaker 2: of your body. One of the most common symptoms is

144
00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:52,800
Speaker 2: an abnormal discharge, and that's gonna usually come from the

145
00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:56,880
Speaker 2: urethra or maybe around the vagina, and it's something that

146
00:08:57,120 --> 00:08:59,760
Speaker 2: you have to be aware of to know that it's

147
00:08:59,800 --> 00:09:00,959
Speaker 2: at normal.

148
00:09:00,840 --> 00:09:02,760
Speaker 3: So you have to be a tuned to your body.

149
00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:05,360
Speaker 2: And then secondly, which is a sign we were talking

150
00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:10,040
Speaker 2: about earlier, which is a burning upon urination. So when

151
00:09:10,040 --> 00:09:13,720
Speaker 2: you're urinate, if there's like a tingling, itching or burning

152
00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:18,160
Speaker 2: kind of feeling during yourination, those are the most common symptoms.

153
00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:23,760
Speaker 2: Now with syphilis, which is another bacterial infection, those symptoms

154
00:09:23,920 --> 00:09:26,319
Speaker 2: can mimic a whole lot of things because syphilis is

155
00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:30,000
Speaker 2: a stage disease, so during the first stage, a lot

156
00:09:30,080 --> 00:09:33,040
Speaker 2: of people don't know they have it because the first

157
00:09:33,200 --> 00:09:36,280
Speaker 2: symptom is like I will use the word sore, but

158
00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:38,360
Speaker 2: most of the time when you're sore, people are like

159
00:09:38,440 --> 00:09:41,120
Speaker 2: it hurts, but it doesn't hurt. So it's really a shanker,

160
00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:44,960
Speaker 2: and it's going to appear where you became infected. So

161
00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:46,480
Speaker 2: if you have oral sex, it's going to be in

162
00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:48,880
Speaker 2: your mouth, you have anal sex, or vaginal sex, it's

163
00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:50,559
Speaker 2: going to be on your vaginal or your penis, or

164
00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:52,520
Speaker 2: your shaft or your testicles.

165
00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:53,199
Speaker 3: Anywhere in your anatomy.

166
00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:58,679
Speaker 2: And the interesting thing about it is that this sore

167
00:09:58,840 --> 00:10:00,840
Speaker 2: or shanker is going to go way on its own.

168
00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:03,840
Speaker 2: So you see something abnormal, you're like, wow, what is

169
00:10:03,880 --> 00:10:07,160
Speaker 2: that it doesn't hurt you, may or not put something

170
00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:10,120
Speaker 2: home remedy on it, and then it's gonna go away.

171
00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:14,520
Speaker 2: But that just means a bacteria now is basically going

172
00:10:14,559 --> 00:10:18,960
Speaker 2: through your body and causing more infection. So those symptoms

173
00:10:19,080 --> 00:10:21,439
Speaker 2: in the second stage could be like a rash on

174
00:10:21,559 --> 00:10:25,040
Speaker 2: your hands. It could look like eczema, It could look

175
00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:28,160
Speaker 2: like psoriasis. A real kind of not really funny story,

176
00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:31,120
Speaker 2: but when I was working as a disease investigator, my

177
00:10:31,280 --> 00:10:35,400
Speaker 2: dermatologist had diagnosed someone that I had given syphilis results

178
00:10:35,800 --> 00:10:40,320
Speaker 2: too as having psoriasis, and as a specialist in his field,

179
00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,480
Speaker 2: he looked at this skin condition and was like, that

180
00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:48,280
Speaker 2: is definitely psoriasis, but it was actually secondary rash a

181
00:10:48,320 --> 00:10:52,160
Speaker 2: syphilis that just occurred in this individual. So they also

182
00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:55,000
Speaker 2: called syphilis a great imitator, So you could have a

183
00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:58,559
Speaker 2: rash and not really know that it's actually syphiless or

184
00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:01,680
Speaker 2: an sci So the most common would be no symptom,

185
00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:05,080
Speaker 2: the burning upon urination and the discharge, and then it

186
00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:09,480
Speaker 2: could be different rashes or appearances on your skin that

187
00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:10,760
Speaker 2: could be presented.

188
00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:14,640
Speaker 1: As okay doctor, bas So, given that the most common

189
00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:18,400
Speaker 1: symptom is no symptom, what kinds of things do you

190
00:11:18,440 --> 00:11:20,520
Speaker 1: think people need to know then to try to keep

191
00:11:20,559 --> 00:11:23,160
Speaker 1: themselves safe or to be able to go to a

192
00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:26,240
Speaker 1: physician or a medical professional to kind of get checked out.

193
00:11:26,280 --> 00:11:27,400
Speaker 1: What should they be looking for?

194
00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:28,400
Speaker 3: That's what I was saying.

195
00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:32,199
Speaker 2: I feel like people really need to examine and look

196
00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:36,320
Speaker 2: at and be aware of their own bodies. As someone

197
00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:40,760
Speaker 2: who may have a menstrual cycle, what does the discharge

198
00:11:40,960 --> 00:11:44,040
Speaker 2: or I'm using discharge but maybe the vaginal lubrication look

199
00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:47,720
Speaker 2: like throughout your monthly cycle, how it feels, how it looks,

200
00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:51,000
Speaker 2: et cetera. Be an attuned to what your labia looks like,

201
00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:54,240
Speaker 2: your genitals in general for everybody, so that you can

202
00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:58,400
Speaker 2: say this spot wasn't there before and realize that you

203
00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:00,920
Speaker 2: might need to go in the biggest thing is to

204
00:12:01,080 --> 00:12:05,440
Speaker 2: normalize testing, to go in, talk to your sex partners,

205
00:12:05,800 --> 00:12:10,520
Speaker 2: to normalize testing and really normalize a diagnosis. One of

206
00:12:10,559 --> 00:12:14,800
Speaker 2: the things I've come into acceptance of and want people

207
00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:19,840
Speaker 2: to accept as well, is that having an STD diagnosis.

208
00:12:19,480 --> 00:12:22,199
Speaker 3: Can be a part of a normal and.

209
00:12:22,280 --> 00:12:27,400
Speaker 2: Even air quotations. I guess healthy sexual development like it

210
00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:32,000
Speaker 2: could happen to you and you can also manage it.

211
00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:33,400
Speaker 3: You can also cure it.

212
00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:37,520
Speaker 2: You can also not have it happen again, and it's

213
00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:40,960
Speaker 2: part of your sexual experience and not the end of

214
00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:45,480
Speaker 2: a sexual experience or have to be something that you

215
00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:48,720
Speaker 2: feel condemned for for the rest of your life because

216
00:12:48,720 --> 00:12:49,520
Speaker 2: it can happen.

217
00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:51,240
Speaker 3: Does it happen to everybody?

218
00:12:51,480 --> 00:12:51,600
Speaker 2: No?

219
00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:54,640
Speaker 3: But can it happen to everybody? Yes?

220
00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:57,800
Speaker 2: So I think having those open conversations with your doctors

221
00:12:57,800 --> 00:13:01,360
Speaker 2: and being attuned to what your body actually looks like

222
00:13:01,440 --> 00:13:02,800
Speaker 2: and feels like mm hmm.

223
00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:06,760
Speaker 1: So how would you suggest somebody get started with familiarizing

224
00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:08,320
Speaker 1: themselves with their bodies.

225
00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:09,520
Speaker 3: It's good that you ask me that.

226
00:13:09,600 --> 00:13:12,160
Speaker 2: So I was telling you I just finished teaching class

227
00:13:12,200 --> 00:13:16,360
Speaker 2: and we're just covering anatomy and having the conversation with

228
00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:19,400
Speaker 2: students and asking them like have they really looked at

229
00:13:19,400 --> 00:13:23,120
Speaker 2: their genitoia before? And most of them have not, and

230
00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:27,320
Speaker 2: they think of it as weird or uncomfortable, and ideally

231
00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:29,600
Speaker 2: it kind of is weird and uncomfortable, but it's your body.

232
00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:31,680
Speaker 2: Like we look at our faces all the time. We

233
00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:34,960
Speaker 2: probably look at our legs and arms and our hands.

234
00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:36,760
Speaker 2: I know we look at our hands a lot, and

235
00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:39,840
Speaker 2: so just looking at are there changes, Like what is

236
00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:42,480
Speaker 2: this actually supposed to look like if we think about

237
00:13:42,559 --> 00:13:46,400
Speaker 2: even when I'm teaching, I try to be as diverse

238
00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:50,480
Speaker 2: as I can in images that I use around anatomy,

239
00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:54,200
Speaker 2: but it's still not your anatomy, and so ultimately you

240
00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:56,360
Speaker 2: have to do that. So I encourage them to take

241
00:13:56,360 --> 00:14:01,120
Speaker 2: a mirror, spend a little time with themselves, get to

242
00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:05,160
Speaker 2: know what they look like, and even compare, not in

243
00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:08,080
Speaker 2: a they want to change your body kind of way,

244
00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:11,880
Speaker 2: but compare their bodies, like with the anatomy assignment of

245
00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:15,000
Speaker 2: like learning the exterior body parts so that they can

246
00:14:15,080 --> 00:14:19,080
Speaker 2: identify them for themselves. But yeah, it really takes getting

247
00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:22,040
Speaker 2: used to your own body and a level of comfort.

248
00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:27,320
Speaker 2: And I think some of our parents, even grandparents have

249
00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:31,560
Speaker 2: really fostered a sense of that and making people comfortable.

250
00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:34,480
Speaker 2: But it's still in many instances uncomfortable for them to

251
00:14:34,560 --> 00:14:35,800
Speaker 2: even have those conversations.

252
00:14:35,840 --> 00:14:38,240
Speaker 3: So you don't always learn it in your house.

253
00:14:39,400 --> 00:14:41,080
Speaker 1: You know, it's interesting, doctor to ask, because I feel

254
00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:43,400
Speaker 1: like I remember somebody asking me a question like that,

255
00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:45,760
Speaker 1: like probably a professor like you asking a question like

256
00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:48,560
Speaker 1: that in undergrad and a lot of people feeling uncomfortable

257
00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:50,560
Speaker 1: and like, oh, absolutely not. We haven't done that, and

258
00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:53,680
Speaker 1: I was curious to hear if students. Now twenty plus

259
00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:56,560
Speaker 1: years later, we're feeling more comfortable, but it sounds like

260
00:14:56,600 --> 00:14:58,360
Speaker 1: you're still getting a lot of like, no, I'm not

261
00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:01,240
Speaker 1: comfortable doing that. In it you have to encourage them

262
00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:03,360
Speaker 1: to like actually pull out a mirror and like look

263
00:15:03,400 --> 00:15:04,320
Speaker 1: at their genitals.

264
00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:07,640
Speaker 2: I think there's this weird stigma I think, perhaps in

265
00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:11,520
Speaker 2: our households, perhaps in general society, of like why are

266
00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:12,760
Speaker 2: you looking at yourself?

267
00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:14,400
Speaker 3: Something must be wrong with you.

268
00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:16,800
Speaker 2: And it's kind of like it's okay for your partner

269
00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:21,479
Speaker 2: to look but not you, And that's definitely an imbalance,

270
00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:23,600
Speaker 2: like you should be looking at it even before your

271
00:15:23,640 --> 00:15:26,400
Speaker 2: partner looks at it in my opinion.

272
00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:29,040
Speaker 1: Right right, So I'm curious act your bass. It feels

273
00:15:29,080 --> 00:15:33,160
Speaker 1: like maybe five to ten years ago, there was this

274
00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:37,520
Speaker 1: huge push around like the HPV vaccine. Have you seen

275
00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:41,360
Speaker 1: or has the research shown like a significant decrease in

276
00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:43,320
Speaker 1: HPV related to the vaccine.

277
00:15:43,400 --> 00:15:47,200
Speaker 2: I started working on even a project to prevent HPV

278
00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:51,160
Speaker 2: or prevent cervical cancer a few years back. Wow, And

279
00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:55,120
Speaker 2: it was actually ten years ago to do that and

280
00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:57,840
Speaker 2: encouraging the use of the vaccine and no course just

281
00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:00,480
Speaker 2: like with any vaccine. We've seen this with COVID, there

282
00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:03,760
Speaker 2: are some hesitations around that, and then when you start

283
00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:08,520
Speaker 2: thinking about something that is going to reduce an STI

284
00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:12,800
Speaker 2: in this case, it also makes people uncomfortable because they

285
00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:16,440
Speaker 2: think you're giving someone the green light, especially young people,

286
00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:19,760
Speaker 2: because it was predominantly for individuals who are like nine

287
00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:23,480
Speaker 2: to twenty four years old, that you're encouraging sexual behavior

288
00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:28,320
Speaker 2: when many of us already know folks probably even without consent,

289
00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:31,440
Speaker 2: are already engaging in sexual activity.

290
00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:33,080
Speaker 3: But it's also preventive.

291
00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:36,880
Speaker 2: And the idea around hesitation of like what in the

292
00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:40,400
Speaker 2: future are these vaccines potentially side effects, etc.

293
00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:42,600
Speaker 3: But we certainly have seen it.

294
00:16:42,680 --> 00:16:47,000
Speaker 2: I know in many states the HPV vaccine became a

295
00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:52,240
Speaker 2: part of the required immunizations for childhood immunizations, so that

296
00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:54,240
Speaker 2: it was added to that list just like.

297
00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:57,560
Speaker 3: The other ones. And we have seen a decrease in that.

298
00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:02,480
Speaker 2: But I do think as e as HPV is to

299
00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:06,920
Speaker 2: transmit that we still have to keep those messages out

300
00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:10,760
Speaker 2: there that we can prevent cervical cancer or any kind

301
00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:14,560
Speaker 2: of complications were related to at least four to six

302
00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:16,680
Speaker 2: types of HPV.

303
00:17:16,680 --> 00:17:19,600
Speaker 1: Mmmm hm, you know, and just like that campaign. It

304
00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:22,239
Speaker 1: does feel like there have been years and years of

305
00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:26,040
Speaker 1: efforts to decrease the numbers of STIs and STDs, right,

306
00:17:26,320 --> 00:17:28,520
Speaker 1: but it does feel like there's still an increase. Like

307
00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:31,280
Speaker 1: you mentioned, what do you feel like it's going to

308
00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:33,959
Speaker 1: take to like finally see a decrease And what do

309
00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:36,080
Speaker 1: you make of the fact that we are still seeing

310
00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:39,320
Speaker 1: such high numbers of things like chlamity and syphilis.

311
00:17:39,359 --> 00:17:41,960
Speaker 2: If I could use a couple of terms, like you know,

312
00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:44,880
Speaker 2: like in a period or maybe a comma, I mean

313
00:17:45,320 --> 00:17:48,720
Speaker 2: interesting enough, racism is really at the root of a

314
00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:53,520
Speaker 2: lot of this oppression, power and capitalism. And I say

315
00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:58,080
Speaker 2: that because now we have so many newer technologies, and

316
00:17:58,119 --> 00:18:01,800
Speaker 2: we also have had multiple technies where there's some things

317
00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:05,560
Speaker 2: that can prevent multiple things, so like it could be

318
00:18:05,920 --> 00:18:11,959
Speaker 2: pregnancy in HIV or HIV and other STIs, and so

319
00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:15,399
Speaker 2: we have something called doxy prep that is available. A

320
00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:18,520
Speaker 2: lot of people in the community, the general community may

321
00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:21,080
Speaker 2: not know about it. I think the marketing, just like

322
00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:25,880
Speaker 2: a lot of things have started in communities where let's say,

323
00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:28,640
Speaker 2: scientists or researchers will say are more.

324
00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:31,679
Speaker 3: At risk, like gay men, and I think that's fair.

325
00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:35,119
Speaker 2: But I also think we have to look at the

326
00:18:35,160 --> 00:18:39,760
Speaker 2: intersectional approaches around that and how a lot of communities

327
00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:43,280
Speaker 2: are vulnerable and so we need to promote doxy prep

328
00:18:43,720 --> 00:18:48,000
Speaker 2: equitably and inclusively. The same would be true for HIV PREP.

329
00:18:48,119 --> 00:18:55,919
Speaker 2: So the pre exposure prophylaxics are actual medications that people

330
00:18:55,960 --> 00:19:01,040
Speaker 2: can take to help protect them from say doxy PREP,

331
00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:04,920
Speaker 2: that will protect folks from gonerhea if they take this medication.

332
00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:09,199
Speaker 2: And then we have PREP, which is the mainstream one

333
00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:12,760
Speaker 2: where we're now seeing more Black women in particular, thinking

334
00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:16,200
Speaker 2: about you know, your work and sometimes who you're supporting

335
00:19:16,520 --> 00:19:21,919
Speaker 2: Black women having more exposure and access to PREP to

336
00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:26,119
Speaker 2: prevent HIV. But in the beginning, PREP wasn't fully marketed

337
00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:30,680
Speaker 2: to our community in that way, and even if it was,

338
00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:36,399
Speaker 2: it wasn't financially accessible either. So I think we have

339
00:19:36,520 --> 00:19:39,800
Speaker 2: to look at making sure when we get advances in

340
00:19:39,880 --> 00:19:44,600
Speaker 2: our technologies that it's available and accessible to everyone.

341
00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:48,359
Speaker 1: I appreciate you bringing that in and clarifying, because I

342
00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:50,119
Speaker 1: was going to ask you, like, is doxy PREP the

343
00:19:50,119 --> 00:19:53,560
Speaker 1: same one? But it sounds like those are two different medications,

344
00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:57,280
Speaker 1: one for gneria and one for HIV prevention. Got it?

345
00:19:57,400 --> 00:20:00,600
Speaker 1: Got it? So continuing with that line of things, are

346
00:20:00,640 --> 00:20:03,600
Speaker 1: there other things that Black women need to be aware

347
00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:08,119
Speaker 1: of in terms of our particular risk factors for certain STIs? Like,

348
00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:10,080
Speaker 1: are there other things that you've seen or in your

349
00:20:10,119 --> 00:20:12,240
Speaker 1: work that you think black women need to really have

350
00:20:12,359 --> 00:20:13,000
Speaker 1: on their radar?

351
00:20:13,160 --> 00:20:13,399
Speaker 3: I do.

352
00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:15,520
Speaker 2: I think that we really have to think about our

353
00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:19,800
Speaker 2: overall sexual health and ensuring that we're doing the best

354
00:20:19,800 --> 00:20:25,240
Speaker 2: that we can in terms of monitoring our overall sexual

355
00:20:25,240 --> 00:20:28,080
Speaker 2: health and wellness, whether that be anytime.

356
00:20:28,200 --> 00:20:30,080
Speaker 3: And I don't say sexual health like just our health

357
00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:30,640
Speaker 3: in general.

358
00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:33,680
Speaker 2: So if we get a cold or we're really stressed out,

359
00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:37,280
Speaker 2: our immune system is going to be compromised. And just

360
00:20:37,320 --> 00:20:42,160
Speaker 2: like getting pregnant, innocence, getting an STI or STD everything

361
00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:44,080
Speaker 2: has to be just right. So it has to be

362
00:20:44,119 --> 00:20:47,320
Speaker 2: that a you're exposed to it by someone, and that

363
00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:50,560
Speaker 2: b it can actually get into your body. And then

364
00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:53,879
Speaker 2: see the part that when I'm speaking to our overall health,

365
00:20:54,240 --> 00:20:57,680
Speaker 2: like how is your body able to potentially fight off

366
00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:02,920
Speaker 2: this virus or this bacteria because your immune system plays

367
00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:06,879
Speaker 2: a part and whether you get affected or not as well.

368
00:21:07,200 --> 00:21:09,359
Speaker 2: And so if we can really take care of our

369
00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:13,800
Speaker 2: health being stressed out, if you already have a diagnosis

370
00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:17,439
Speaker 2: in particular for herpes. If you don't manage your stress,

371
00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:21,199
Speaker 2: Herpes is activated by a nervous system, and so if

372
00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:23,679
Speaker 2: you're at a state of stress, even if you're taking

373
00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:27,280
Speaker 2: medication to manage it, a lot of times you have

374
00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:31,640
Speaker 2: what we call outbreaks in herpes that you can't suppress

375
00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:35,760
Speaker 2: the outbreaks until you don't have one, And so with

376
00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:39,640
Speaker 2: one of the medications that suppresses, you have to not

377
00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:43,040
Speaker 2: have that outbreak. But if you're at a state of stress,

378
00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:47,200
Speaker 2: you're always in kind of an outbreak state, because you

379
00:21:47,280 --> 00:21:50,080
Speaker 2: might have an outbreak and go into recovery and then

380
00:21:50,119 --> 00:21:53,040
Speaker 2: another outbreak kind of overlaps that one, so you don't

381
00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:57,359
Speaker 2: have that space to take the medication to suppress HIV.

382
00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:00,919
Speaker 2: I remember working with a student who was in law school,

383
00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:04,560
Speaker 2: and I'm pretty sure that was stressful, and she was

384
00:22:04,640 --> 00:22:08,080
Speaker 2: in a long distance relationship and she had a herpes diagnosis,

385
00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:11,760
Speaker 2: and she was so frustrated. She went to our counseling

386
00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:15,159
Speaker 2: center because she really needed to manage her stress, and

387
00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:18,000
Speaker 2: in turn that was something that could help her.

388
00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:20,359
Speaker 3: Manage her herpes outbreaks as well.

389
00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 2: So we really have to take care of our overall

390
00:22:22,880 --> 00:22:26,920
Speaker 2: health in general to help keep that you know, things

391
00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:30,719
Speaker 2: at bay or manageable may not prevent it, but at

392
00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:33,920
Speaker 2: least we have a strong immune system to help fight

393
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:36,639
Speaker 2: it off and help with the recovery as well.

394
00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:50,879
Speaker 1: More from our conversation after the break, So, I feel

395
00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:53,119
Speaker 1: like the answer to this will be a lot because

396
00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:56,280
Speaker 1: you are a sex educator. But what role do you

397
00:22:56,320 --> 00:23:00,639
Speaker 1: feel like education has in decreasing the number of STI

398
00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:02,040
Speaker 1: is that we typically are seeing.

399
00:23:02,280 --> 00:23:05,639
Speaker 2: I think it has a huge role. I mean I

400
00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:10,680
Speaker 2: came into this work old school, pre the full Internet.

401
00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:13,439
Speaker 3: We had like a little bit of internet, and we

402
00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:14,440
Speaker 3: had hotlines.

403
00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:18,320
Speaker 2: People were calling from all over the United States asking

404
00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:22,480
Speaker 2: questions and questions that you think is kind of common knowledge,

405
00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:25,600
Speaker 2: but people really don't know, like how is the disease

406
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:28,399
Speaker 2: transmitt it? What are the signs and symptoms? Where do

407
00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:32,400
Speaker 2: I even go to get tested or treatment? And those

408
00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:35,480
Speaker 2: are things I think, as someone who works as an educator,

409
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:38,640
Speaker 2: take for granted because I have the answers and I've

410
00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:41,920
Speaker 2: had these conversations with people who are doing the same thing,

411
00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:46,400
Speaker 2: and so education can play a role to ensure that

412
00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:50,919
Speaker 2: people can do their best to protect themselves. When I

413
00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:54,600
Speaker 2: think about STD prevention and education, I use the term

414
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:57,120
Speaker 2: we all know better than we do, and I can

415
00:23:57,160 --> 00:24:00,960
Speaker 2: also equate that to like flossing your teeth in general.

416
00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:03,399
Speaker 2: I can say if we were to think about first

417
00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:07,919
Speaker 2: hand defense for SEIS is condom use well abstinence right,

418
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:10,040
Speaker 2: because people are always gonna say, well, if you have

419
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:13,720
Speaker 2: the same But again, that's gonna choice people have freely

420
00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:17,160
Speaker 2: because of non consensual events, and it's not a choice

421
00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:19,840
Speaker 2: that's realistic for some people, and it's just not a

422
00:24:19,920 --> 00:24:22,760
Speaker 2: choice people want, period. But if we go to the

423
00:24:22,800 --> 00:24:26,200
Speaker 2: next line of defense, which would be condoms, there are

424
00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:29,840
Speaker 2: people going back to flossing teeth. Pretty much everyone knows

425
00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:33,560
Speaker 2: and has heard that a condom can't prevent pregnancy and

426
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:38,960
Speaker 2: transmission of infection. However, there are reasons why people choose

427
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 2: not to. Everyone knows you should floss your teeth because

428
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:46,200
Speaker 2: it's gonna help you have better dental health. But people

429
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:49,240
Speaker 2: have reasons that they choose not to flyss even if

430
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:51,800
Speaker 2: it's I don't have time because I'm rushing out the

431
00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:54,399
Speaker 2: door every day, so I'll brush my teeth, but I

432
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:58,160
Speaker 2: don't floss them. They're gonna be reasons why people don't

433
00:24:58,240 --> 00:25:01,760
Speaker 2: use condoms. But through edge occasion, we can help people

434
00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:05,160
Speaker 2: make behavior change, and so how do I make time?

435
00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 2: Or if I don't like the way condoms feel, how

436
00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:12,159
Speaker 2: do I make them feel better? And I'm living with

437
00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:14,840
Speaker 2: a guilt trip. Well, I'm not living, I'm recovering because

438
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:18,720
Speaker 2: I know you're a therapist, So I'm recovering from the

439
00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:22,679
Speaker 2: guilt trip of being programmed in a prevention world that

440
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:26,640
Speaker 2: used to tell people, Oh, condoms can feel just as good,

441
00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:28,880
Speaker 2: or they feel just as good, or put a little

442
00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:32,800
Speaker 2: lube on it, and that's really not true. In theory,

443
00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:35,720
Speaker 2: they can feel better, but it doesn't feel the same.

444
00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:38,840
Speaker 2: You can get some that are thin and that may

445
00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:42,959
Speaker 2: feel better, but ultimately we have to make condoms enjoyable.

446
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:46,240
Speaker 2: It's like if you get a meal that you're hungry,

447
00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:48,760
Speaker 2: but it's not really satisfying. You might put a little

448
00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:51,520
Speaker 2: saracha or hot sauce on it and it's gonna make

449
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:54,720
Speaker 2: it a little more pleasurable and enjoyable, but it's still

450
00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:58,280
Speaker 2: not what you might have wanted to taste originally.

451
00:25:58,320 --> 00:25:59,560
Speaker 3: So you added something to it.

452
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:03,640
Speaker 2: And I think education allows us to explore and explain

453
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 2: how to make things more pleasurable that are actually a

454
00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:08,800
Speaker 2: preventive effort.

455
00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:11,000
Speaker 3: When you think about prep A.

456
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:13,480
Speaker 2: Lot of people don't like taking medication or have a

457
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:17,560
Speaker 2: hard time, you know, swallowing pills. But through knowing that

458
00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:22,480
Speaker 2: this is something that can help reduce HIV transmission, that's

459
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:25,439
Speaker 2: just another bonus and relief that you don't have to

460
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 2: worry about as much as you would if you didn't

461
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 2: have that type of preventive efforts. So I think education

462
00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:33,159
Speaker 2: is paramount.

463
00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:35,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I appreciate those analogies. I think that's super helpful

464
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:38,720
Speaker 1: to really help people understand like why sometimes we don't

465
00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:41,400
Speaker 1: make the choices that we maybe know we should make.

466
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:41,720
Speaker 3: Great.

467
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:44,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, So I am sure that you were aware

468
00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:48,480
Speaker 1: of this, and the TVG team found this article recently fascinating.

469
00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:50,879
Speaker 1: So there has been an increase of course in like

470
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:53,960
Speaker 1: STDs and STIs in elder care homes.

471
00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:55,520
Speaker 3: Have you seen this?

472
00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 1: Can you talk with us a little bit about like

473
00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:01,400
Speaker 1: what is causing this spike is happening with this population?

474
00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:04,680
Speaker 2: The biggest thing and this actually started a few years back,

475
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:07,440
Speaker 2: like at least in my experience here in North Carolina.

476
00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:08,440
Speaker 3: Won't name any.

477
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:13,720
Speaker 2: Places, but there are articles available online should you google.

478
00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:17,120
Speaker 2: But it's really that idea of like as we grow

479
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:21,080
Speaker 2: older that we're not sexual beings, we don't have desires

480
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:23,639
Speaker 2: and we're not connecting. But you got to think about it.

481
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:26,080
Speaker 2: We're still going to have feelings. We're still going to

482
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 2: have desire, and a lot of the centers where people

483
00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:34,199
Speaker 2: live in facilities, they also have opportunity, right, and so

484
00:27:35,800 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 2: you know, there's opportunity to actually engage in sex, and

485
00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:42,520
Speaker 2: so we don't make condoms available. I recently had a

486
00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 2: conversation with a local department of aging to talk about

487
00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:50,720
Speaker 2: coming to speak with their residents and if staff who

488
00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:56,800
Speaker 2: are there about pleasure, about aging, and about safety and sexuality.

489
00:27:56,320 --> 00:27:59,600
Speaker 3: Because until we're gone, we're going to be sexual.

490
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:04,440
Speaker 2: And the ideas that we don't provide prevention information because

491
00:28:04,760 --> 00:28:07,040
Speaker 2: we think we're out of the child very age and

492
00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:13,159
Speaker 2: so pregnancy is not of importance, but STIs still should be. Also,

493
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:17,200
Speaker 2: there are people, even if they're not having relationship and

494
00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:23,440
Speaker 2: physical intimacy within the resident or in the facility, they

495
00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:29,240
Speaker 2: have people who are coming in and sex workers and girlfriends,

496
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:33,760
Speaker 2: boyfriends whomever could actually come and visit and bring things

497
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 2: into the facility as well. So we really I think

498
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:42,600
Speaker 2: the rise is not having conversations about pleasure and intimacy

499
00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:48,000
Speaker 2: as people age and then only equating risk factors for

500
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,040
Speaker 2: sex with pregnancy prevention.

501
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it does feel like prevention overall has moved

502
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:59,320
Speaker 1: away from so much like don't get pregnant, right, because

503
00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:01,240
Speaker 1: it feels like that was the focus for a very

504
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:02,960
Speaker 1: long time. Can you talk a little bit about that

505
00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:04,280
Speaker 1: transition that you've seen.

506
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,480
Speaker 2: I think people were embracing what we call sex positivity,

507
00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:14,480
Speaker 2: where there's more to healthy sexuality than disease or pregnancy prevention.

508
00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:17,880
Speaker 2: I also think, at least from a public health perspective,

509
00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:21,040
Speaker 2: and I hope this is true universally, although I know

510
00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:25,360
Speaker 2: there are challenges. Is that we have come to the

511
00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:30,400
Speaker 2: realization of the stigmatizing effect of some of our prevention efforts. Right,

512
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 2: So if you look at data and disparity in numbers

513
00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:38,280
Speaker 2: and communities of color, and I specifically think about the

514
00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:42,640
Speaker 2: black community and black women and girls being stigmatized as

515
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:46,600
Speaker 2: being hypersexual or the ones who actually need a long

516
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:50,600
Speaker 2: acting reversubal contraception versus being able to choose from the

517
00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,960
Speaker 2: many methods that are available that work for them. We

518
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:58,400
Speaker 2: are moving towards and not just the things you shouldn't do,

519
00:29:59,240 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 2: but the things you.

520
00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 3: Can can do.

521
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:05,120
Speaker 2: Are encouraged to do as part of being sex positive

522
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:11,000
Speaker 2: and experiencing pleasure. I always give credit to doctor Jocelyn Elders,

523
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:14,920
Speaker 2: who was our first African American Surgeon General. Although she

524
00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:18,880
Speaker 2: paid the cost for advocating for a masturbation, which is

525
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:23,520
Speaker 2: a very sex positive approach, she's left the door open

526
00:30:23,560 --> 00:30:27,120
Speaker 2: for people like me and others to continue talking about

527
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:31,080
Speaker 2: it and promoting getting to know your body, doing things safely,

528
00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 2: and another option to experience pleasure that doesn't involve someone else.

529
00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:40,880
Speaker 1: I appreciate you bringing her up because, yeah, she definitely

530
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:43,520
Speaker 1: was not looked upon favorably. I think at the time

531
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:49,560
Speaker 1: that was happening. Yeah, So I think something else that

532
00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:52,720
Speaker 1: people could benefit from is hearing more about how they

533
00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:56,120
Speaker 1: should take care of themselves, like post like a sexual act,

534
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:58,720
Speaker 1: So what kinds of things should someone be doing kind

535
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 1: of immediately after sex that is like good for your health. Yeah.

536
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:06,760
Speaker 2: I think a lot of people talk about urinating, so

537
00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 2: emptying your bladder. Some people say before and after. I

538
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:16,240
Speaker 2: think there's some conflicting things there, but urinating not necessarily

539
00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:20,239
Speaker 2: you know, having to shower, but definitely separating for a

540
00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 2: little while, like discarding any condoms if there are sex

541
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:27,680
Speaker 2: toys or any other objects being used to make sure

542
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 2: that they are cleaned properly, and just keeping an eye

543
00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:36,960
Speaker 2: out on again, what's happening in your body, posts intimacy,

544
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:41,000
Speaker 2: just to make sure everything is air quotation is normal

545
00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:44,680
Speaker 2: for you in that situation. I would definitely say prior

546
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:48,800
Speaker 2: to though, having those conversations with your sex partners if

547
00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 2: you're able to. I know, sometimes someone that you might

548
00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:56,239
Speaker 2: encounter might not be a long term partner, might not

549
00:31:56,320 --> 00:31:59,560
Speaker 2: be someone you know very well, but you could still

550
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:04,840
Speaker 2: try to approach asking the questions and not making assumptions

551
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:08,000
Speaker 2: about their health. There's a level of trust there. You

552
00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:11,920
Speaker 2: have to take that into consideration. But post keeping in

553
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:15,160
Speaker 2: touch with someone as someone who has served as a

554
00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:18,800
Speaker 2: contact tracer, well, I use that COVID language, but I

555
00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 2: was a disease intervention investigator that we had to go

556
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,160
Speaker 2: find people that other people had sex with to tell

557
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 2: them that they might have been exposed or to tell

558
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 2: them that they exposed someone. And so in this age

559
00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:37,040
Speaker 2: of technology, try to have people's information because it makes

560
00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:38,280
Speaker 2: it so much easier.

561
00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:39,960
Speaker 3: That's really important.

562
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:42,640
Speaker 2: As I was telling you about syphilis being one hundred

563
00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 2: percent preventable, if someone has sex with someone and then

564
00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:49,840
Speaker 2: they go and they develop that first sign and get

565
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:52,920
Speaker 2: tested and it's positive if they've had sex with other

566
00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:56,600
Speaker 2: people even during that time period. But they can give

567
00:32:56,640 --> 00:33:01,520
Speaker 2: the healthcare provider the information that a person can be traced,

568
00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 2: contacted and given medication to prevent them from actually ever

569
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:11,640
Speaker 2: getting syphilists themselves and giving it to someone else. So

570
00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:15,479
Speaker 2: having information, even if it's someone you don't know well,

571
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:19,040
Speaker 2: you met on an app or whatever, and having enough

572
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:24,080
Speaker 2: contact information should this occur, makes it easier too to

573
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:26,840
Speaker 2: help prevent disease from spreading in the community.

574
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 1: More from our conversation after the break, so kind of

575
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:43,880
Speaker 1: continuing along their vein of having some of these conversations

576
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:47,600
Speaker 1: with partners or potential partners. How and when do you

577
00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:51,640
Speaker 1: suggest someone share that they do actually have an STD.

578
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:52,600
Speaker 3: Listen, doctor Joy.

579
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:57,240
Speaker 2: That is a very tough question because disclosure can really

580
00:33:57,280 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 2: be dangerous, and so we think about disclosing an STD

581
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:06,719
Speaker 2: experience or status, we really have to think about the

582
00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:09,160
Speaker 2: pros and the cons and the winds and the wear.

583
00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:11,560
Speaker 2: And I don't think it really depends like some people

584
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:15,160
Speaker 2: say it depends on what the infection is or the sciard,

585
00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:18,640
Speaker 2: But I think it may not, because the first thing

586
00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:21,640
Speaker 2: is once you tell someone, you can't untell them, and

587
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:27,359
Speaker 2: you can't control anytime they might involuntarily disclose your status themselves.

588
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,360
Speaker 2: So that's like, I think the biggest fear that people

589
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:35,520
Speaker 2: actually have, and so oftentimes you really have to think

590
00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:39,879
Speaker 2: about where this relationship might be going or what did

591
00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:45,359
Speaker 2: you do to actually prevent any type of exposure. And

592
00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:49,920
Speaker 2: I say that because if it's herpes, the moral, like

593
00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:52,520
Speaker 2: if we think about society and more moral thing, people

594
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:55,040
Speaker 2: are like, yeah, you should tell people you have herpes,

595
00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:57,480
Speaker 2: And I think there's a level of truth to that,

596
00:34:57,560 --> 00:35:00,279
Speaker 2: but I also think there's a consequence to that.

597
00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:01,960
Speaker 3: And so if you think about.

598
00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:05,480
Speaker 2: The science of it, if you're not experiencing an outbreak,

599
00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:09,920
Speaker 2: if you're on suppressive therapy, and adding if you use

600
00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:14,319
Speaker 2: a barrier method, then the likelihood of you transmitting that

601
00:35:14,880 --> 00:35:17,839
Speaker 2: is very slim. Saying would be if you're like on

602
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:22,200
Speaker 2: prep or something like that. But it becomes tricky because

603
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 2: the moral tends to outweigh the science. So we have

604
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:29,759
Speaker 2: something with HIV in particular, called you equals you. So

605
00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 2: if someone's living with HIV and they're on their meds,

606
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:39,080
Speaker 2: they are in good health. They are what we considered undetectable,

607
00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:42,239
Speaker 2: so there's very small trace amounts of HIV in their

608
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:46,279
Speaker 2: blood and body fluids, then they are very much likely

609
00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:51,560
Speaker 2: to be untransmittable. However, we wouldn't tell everyone to say,

610
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:55,720
Speaker 2: go out and have the type of sex that would

611
00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:59,160
Speaker 2: cause the exchange of body fluids. But also we know

612
00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:04,440
Speaker 2: if you're on medication and you're undetectable, the likelihood of

613
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:08,880
Speaker 2: transmission is also going to be low. So there's the science,

614
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 2: and then there's the moral aspect. I don't know where

615
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:15,239
Speaker 2: the to meet is really based on the individual and

616
00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:19,680
Speaker 2: also knowing that there are risk associated with disclosing, but

617
00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 2: there's so many benefits because a lot of people are

618
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:27,719
Speaker 2: becoming more educated, so they wouldn't be as fearful of

619
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:33,160
Speaker 2: having physical intimate experiences with you because they know how

620
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:35,719
Speaker 2: to protect themselves. And so that's the piece where we

621
00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:39,920
Speaker 2: were talking earlier. Education comes into play because now the

622
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:43,600
Speaker 2: more educated I am, if I were someone who let's

623
00:36:43,600 --> 00:36:46,760
Speaker 2: say we're living with herpes, the better I can educate

624
00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:51,760
Speaker 2: you while I'm disclosing my status so you fully understand

625
00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:55,680
Speaker 2: where we are. And then also normalizing this is a

626
00:36:55,680 --> 00:36:57,280
Speaker 2: part of a life experience.

627
00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:01,520
Speaker 1: I appreciate you breaking that I wasn't even aware of

628
00:37:01,560 --> 00:37:03,799
Speaker 1: all of those, like, Okay, the risk is like much

629
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,600
Speaker 1: smaller if X, Y and Z are in place. So

630
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 1: I appreciate you sharing that with us. And it does

631
00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:12,399
Speaker 1: feel like some of those conversations are probably better had

632
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 1: with people that you know, maybe a little better, right,

633
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:16,959
Speaker 1: because it feels like there needs to be some level

634
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:19,520
Speaker 1: of trust to even be able to have that kind

635
00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:20,239
Speaker 1: of conversation.

636
00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:24,160
Speaker 2: And I know there's some advocates who are put it

637
00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:28,960
Speaker 2: out on the line and communicate immediately, but again like

638
00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:33,080
Speaker 2: they're at a different level in space than potentially, you know,

639
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:36,239
Speaker 2: the average person out in the community and what that

640
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:38,480
Speaker 2: risk look like for them.

641
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:41,920
Speaker 1: Doctor mass, I wonder if you have any suggestions or

642
00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:44,600
Speaker 1: things you could offer to somebody who maybe has had

643
00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:48,000
Speaker 1: a diagnosis of an incurable STD or an STI and

644
00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:51,760
Speaker 1: maybe see themselves as like damaged goods, so to speak,

645
00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:53,560
Speaker 1: anything that you could say there.

646
00:37:53,960 --> 00:37:56,120
Speaker 2: It really makes me sad when I hear that, because

647
00:37:56,520 --> 00:38:00,680
Speaker 2: I've seen that time and time again with individuals, even

648
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:02,640
Speaker 2: someone concerned.

649
00:38:02,160 --> 00:38:04,880
Speaker 3: With herpes and being able to.

650
00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:08,319
Speaker 2: Become pregnant and a mom and she is a mom now,

651
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:12,040
Speaker 2: so that's amazing. But having that conversation early on, she

652
00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:14,279
Speaker 2: was given a diagnosis. So this is the other thing

653
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:18,600
Speaker 2: about our peers in the healthcare setting, who are more

654
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:22,319
Speaker 2: the medical actual providers in a sense versus some of

655
00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:25,319
Speaker 2: the educators, is that she was given this diagnosis but

656
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:30,120
Speaker 2: not given any additional information about what does that mean

657
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:33,759
Speaker 2: to have a herpes diagnosis, and so therefore she just

658
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:38,480
Speaker 2: assumed that she wouldn't be able to concede. So that

659
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:42,480
Speaker 2: whole stigma around being damaged, like now I have this condition,

660
00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:47,160
Speaker 2: I can't conceive. So I think the advice is to

661
00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:51,560
Speaker 2: learn as much as you can about your condition. But

662
00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:55,279
Speaker 2: then there are so many support groups for persons living

663
00:38:55,320 --> 00:39:01,200
Speaker 2: with HIV, persons who've experienced HPV, and person living with

664
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 2: herpes who can actually educate you on navigating kind of

665
00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:11,160
Speaker 2: a new normal in a sense, because you're experience in

666
00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:15,720
Speaker 2: a different space with a diagnosis, and there's life after

667
00:39:15,840 --> 00:39:20,359
Speaker 2: a diagnosis, and there's great sex after a diagnosis, and

668
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:25,719
Speaker 2: really understanding again the science of the condition that you

669
00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:29,399
Speaker 2: have so that it doesn't interfere with the pleasure and

670
00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:33,400
Speaker 2: your sexual experiences. So I would tell that person to

671
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:37,280
Speaker 2: become educated to feel the fields because it can be scary,

672
00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:43,640
Speaker 2: it can be sad, it can be alienating, like feeling

673
00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:46,799
Speaker 2: like you're the only person out there. But given how

674
00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:50,640
Speaker 2: common many of these conditions are, knowing that you're not

675
00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:54,560
Speaker 2: alone and there are support groups and resources available, but

676
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:58,479
Speaker 2: to really understand that it can be hard and knowing

677
00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:00,719
Speaker 2: they're going to be ups and downs. A lot of

678
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:04,600
Speaker 2: times people are impacted with their mental health because it

679
00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:10,000
Speaker 2: could cause like onsets of depression and maybe even anxiety

680
00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:14,799
Speaker 2: around the diagnosis. But that there's definitely a way to

681
00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:18,520
Speaker 2: have a very fulfilling life and a very fulfilling sex life.

682
00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:22,279
Speaker 1: So what kinds of conversations should people be having with

683
00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:26,759
Speaker 1: themselves and with partners or potential partners about protected sex

684
00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:28,320
Speaker 1: versus unprotected sex.

685
00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 2: For example, if you are living with HIV, and really

686
00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:35,480
Speaker 2: even if you think about other chronic conditions, your immune

687
00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:39,680
Speaker 2: system can be compromised. So using protection really is about

688
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:45,120
Speaker 2: you first, because you're able to protect yourself and it's

689
00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:48,680
Speaker 2: okay to be selfish, and that way is like, listen.

690
00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:50,560
Speaker 3: I'm not even worried about you, I'm worried about me.

691
00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:53,960
Speaker 2: So therefore we're going to use this method or I'm

692
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:57,560
Speaker 2: going to be on prep, toxi prep, whatever it may be, condoms,

693
00:40:57,640 --> 00:41:01,200
Speaker 2: dental dams, etc. So it's okay in that regard to

694
00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:05,480
Speaker 2: be selfish, and I think for others it's okay to

695
00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:07,880
Speaker 2: be caring and say it's also about us, like it's

696
00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:10,359
Speaker 2: about me first, but then it's about us if we

697
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:14,960
Speaker 2: want to have a fulfilling sex life, not worrying about

698
00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:19,319
Speaker 2: infecting one another with something that could be important. The

699
00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:23,040
Speaker 2: other part that I'm leaning into as well as someone

700
00:41:23,080 --> 00:41:28,840
Speaker 2: who's been so prevention minded, is understanding that relationships change

701
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:32,440
Speaker 2: and as we grow and we build trust with one another,

702
00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:38,040
Speaker 2: that having condomless sex isn't the worst thing that can

703
00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:39,239
Speaker 2: happen because people.

704
00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:42,200
Speaker 3: Were already doing it. They're not necessarily.

705
00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:45,640
Speaker 2: Becoming pregnant or getting a diagnosis. But it takes time

706
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:49,560
Speaker 2: to build that trust and vulnerability, and for some people

707
00:41:49,719 --> 00:41:52,319
Speaker 2: they may never get there. I think we probably know

708
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:55,520
Speaker 2: plenty of people who are having condomless sex for a

709
00:41:55,640 --> 00:41:59,799
Speaker 2: range of different types of relationships and it hasn't been detrimental.

710
00:42:00,239 --> 00:42:04,120
Speaker 2: And so while we still want to promote the use

711
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:07,799
Speaker 2: of condoms, barriers in any other prevented methods, we also

712
00:42:07,920 --> 00:42:10,080
Speaker 2: know that some people get into that place in their

713
00:42:10,160 --> 00:42:14,239
Speaker 2: relationship where there's an opportunity I'm going to use the

714
00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:19,120
Speaker 2: word to relax it or understand and connect with their

715
00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:22,600
Speaker 2: partner in such a way that that may not be

716
00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:26,480
Speaker 2: a choice that they're still willing to make for different reasons.

717
00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:31,800
Speaker 1: So you've mentioned several times after bands this idea of

718
00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:35,239
Speaker 1: how technology has really impacted what we know and what

719
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:39,480
Speaker 1: we can learn about SCIS and STDs. I'm curious to

720
00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:41,440
Speaker 1: hear a couple of different things. So I want to

721
00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:45,799
Speaker 1: hear how technology has maybe made your job maybe easier

722
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:49,280
Speaker 1: and more difficult. And I also want to hear about

723
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:52,719
Speaker 1: social media now is a part of the landscape that

724
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:54,839
Speaker 1: probably wasn't a part of your job maybe what ten

725
00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:57,560
Speaker 1: fifteen years ago, And so I also am curious to

726
00:42:57,560 --> 00:43:00,640
Speaker 1: hear your thoughts about like current conversations you're here about

727
00:43:00,760 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 1: STIs on social media.

728
00:43:02,239 --> 00:43:05,480
Speaker 2: So I think the first thing in the advances in

729
00:43:05,560 --> 00:43:10,840
Speaker 2: technology has been a like the dating apps being open

730
00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:16,280
Speaker 2: to the federal government as well as state and local

731
00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:23,000
Speaker 2: government programs being able to provide educational and informational like

732
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:28,600
Speaker 2: commercials or marketing and tips on safe sex, like I

733
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:31,400
Speaker 2: remember Bumble was one that was open to it, and

734
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 2: some of the other ones, and you know, meeting with

735
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:40,080
Speaker 2: app developers to figure out like how to even create

736
00:43:40,239 --> 00:43:45,480
Speaker 2: something that could be transferable as educational commercials or infomercials

737
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:49,480
Speaker 2: or slots marketing, so to speak. On these apps and

738
00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:52,799
Speaker 2: apps being open to it and understanding, you know, and

739
00:43:52,840 --> 00:43:55,680
Speaker 2: sometimes we're in a crisis mode around that. But then

740
00:43:55,800 --> 00:44:00,080
Speaker 2: even with the app developers, we have some apps that

741
00:44:00,120 --> 00:44:05,279
Speaker 2: are available where maybe you're a little hesitant to you

742
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:07,840
Speaker 2: find out you have an STD, you get a diagnosis

743
00:44:08,239 --> 00:44:10,480
Speaker 2: and you really don't want to confront this person, or

744
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:13,359
Speaker 2: maybe you don't even have all that person's information, but

745
00:44:13,400 --> 00:44:16,960
Speaker 2: you can put that person's information in an app and

746
00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:19,840
Speaker 2: a message will be sent to them that could potentially

747
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:24,080
Speaker 2: protect your anonymity or if you want to disclose who

748
00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:27,320
Speaker 2: you are, but not you having to do it yourself,

749
00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:30,319
Speaker 2: but this app sends a message. So we have new

750
00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:33,879
Speaker 2: apps like that that can notify people once you put

751
00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:37,960
Speaker 2: your information in if they need to encourage them to

752
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:40,239
Speaker 2: go get testing. So I think those are some of

753
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:45,080
Speaker 2: the positive advancements. Some of the challenges are still the

754
00:44:45,160 --> 00:44:49,359
Speaker 2: TikTok experts, you know, like TikTok it's an amazing place

755
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:52,040
Speaker 2: to get information a lot of social media is, but

756
00:44:52,080 --> 00:44:58,200
Speaker 2: there's so many people who are providing misinformation that as

757
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:03,839
Speaker 2: educators and trained professionals, we're having to counter where they

758
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:07,919
Speaker 2: are and people have a large following gives them way

759
00:45:07,960 --> 00:45:11,600
Speaker 2: more credibility than someone who's either working in this work

760
00:45:11,760 --> 00:45:15,279
Speaker 2: or you know, studying and researching it as well, So

761
00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:17,720
Speaker 2: you have to counter that and being able to reach

762
00:45:17,760 --> 00:45:21,440
Speaker 2: out to some of those influencers to let them know

763
00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:26,520
Speaker 2: when information is accurate or not. It seems like many

764
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:32,560
Speaker 2: of my colleagues will get banned as credible sources than

765
00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:37,040
Speaker 2: those who are not credible, Like after my Instagram taken

766
00:45:37,080 --> 00:45:39,880
Speaker 2: away and I was like, way, but I'm doing good work.

767
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:40,840
Speaker 3: I'm trying.

768
00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:44,880
Speaker 1: So because you also are you know, heavily embedded in

769
00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:47,720
Speaker 1: working with students, what kinds of conversations are you seeing

770
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:51,040
Speaker 1: them have about SCIS, either on social media or just

771
00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:51,840
Speaker 1: even in person.

772
00:45:52,080 --> 00:45:54,759
Speaker 2: Well, are been fortunate, you know, here in North Carolina

773
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:59,480
Speaker 2: to work with some students in particular who are open

774
00:45:59,640 --> 00:46:03,120
Speaker 2: and chouraging their peers to have these conversations. So at

775
00:46:03,200 --> 00:46:06,359
Speaker 2: my school, we have a peer education group that's been

776
00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:12,720
Speaker 2: established since about two thousand and one, providing education, coordinating testing, events.

777
00:46:12,880 --> 00:46:14,560
Speaker 3: I'm at an HBCU and a lot of.

778
00:46:14,480 --> 00:46:19,960
Speaker 2: Our HBCUs have engaged in programming similar to this to

779
00:46:20,239 --> 00:46:23,360
Speaker 2: educate and or connect with their local health department. So

780
00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:27,719
Speaker 2: resources beyond student health is available to students, and you

781
00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:31,799
Speaker 2: can see that on other majority campuses as well. I

782
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:34,880
Speaker 2: think our students are open to it. I love teaching

783
00:46:34,920 --> 00:46:38,600
Speaker 2: my class. I get to ask them beyond even STDs,

784
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:40,520
Speaker 2: like what are some of the topics people want to know?

785
00:46:41,120 --> 00:46:44,279
Speaker 2: And people in the last few semesters have talked about

786
00:46:44,600 --> 00:46:49,440
Speaker 2: what it means to be sex positive actually being activists

787
00:46:49,440 --> 00:46:53,600
Speaker 2: around sexual health and access to STD service as well

788
00:46:53,760 --> 00:46:59,520
Speaker 2: as reproductive services and reproductive justice. So I think what

789
00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:04,239
Speaker 2: we're seeing is students want to be informed, but they

790
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:07,640
Speaker 2: don't want to be oppressed. And I think, as a

791
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:09,920
Speaker 2: student who felt like there was a little bit more

792
00:47:09,920 --> 00:47:14,640
Speaker 2: of oppression and judgment and thinking about balancing respectability politics,

793
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:19,360
Speaker 2: our student population I think is looking or in general,

794
00:47:19,440 --> 00:47:22,400
Speaker 2: not just my campus, are looking for ways to be

795
00:47:22,480 --> 00:47:26,560
Speaker 2: sexually liberated and safe at the same time. And they

796
00:47:26,640 --> 00:47:32,319
Speaker 2: want valid, readily available resources to be educated on and

797
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:35,760
Speaker 2: how to educate their peers. If I tell my class,

798
00:47:36,080 --> 00:47:38,440
Speaker 2: oh so and such is on Instagram.

799
00:47:38,480 --> 00:47:41,160
Speaker 3: You should follow them because they talk about this.

800
00:47:41,800 --> 00:47:43,879
Speaker 2: I can reach out to that person and say how

801
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:47,120
Speaker 2: many new followers did you get today? And they they

802
00:47:47,239 --> 00:47:49,480
Speaker 2: I'll say, I think those are probably my students for

803
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:53,440
Speaker 2: my students' friends, because they want to have it readily available.

804
00:47:55,400 --> 00:47:58,960
Speaker 1: So you mentioned earlier support groups for people that they

805
00:47:58,960 --> 00:48:01,440
Speaker 1: can join, like if they have a new diagnosis, can

806
00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:04,280
Speaker 1: you share any resources that might be helpful for people

807
00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:06,640
Speaker 1: if they have a new diagnosis or they just want

808
00:48:06,640 --> 00:48:07,320
Speaker 1: more information.

809
00:48:07,560 --> 00:48:08,160
Speaker 3: Absolutely.

810
00:48:08,280 --> 00:48:11,600
Speaker 2: One of my favorite people to follow is Courtney Brain.

811
00:48:11,800 --> 00:48:16,880
Speaker 2: He leads Something Positive for Positive People, which is a

812
00:48:16,960 --> 00:48:23,080
Speaker 2: support network and resource entity for persons living with herpes,

813
00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:26,239
Speaker 2: and I think some of what they offer actually can

814
00:48:26,320 --> 00:48:30,920
Speaker 2: apply in general. Doctor Gabrielle Evans as well as the

815
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:36,360
Speaker 2: Minority Sex Report, they also provide information Doctor Evans shares

816
00:48:36,800 --> 00:48:41,280
Speaker 2: about her own personal experiences living with herpes as well.

817
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:46,080
Speaker 2: The American Sexual Health Association, which is actually our oldest

818
00:48:46,239 --> 00:48:50,640
Speaker 2: US based sexuality education organization. Proud that it's right here

819
00:48:50,680 --> 00:48:53,160
Speaker 2: in North Carolina and I used to work there. That's

820
00:48:53,200 --> 00:48:56,279
Speaker 2: what the hotline I was totally about was established. But

821
00:48:56,400 --> 00:49:01,400
Speaker 2: now they you know, online web resources and support groups

822
00:49:01,440 --> 00:49:07,600
Speaker 2: as well as I'm gonna say virtual appointments with providers

823
00:49:07,640 --> 00:49:15,920
Speaker 2: who specialize in HIV or HPV or herpes treatment and support.

824
00:49:16,080 --> 00:49:19,440
Speaker 2: So there are a lot of different places where people

825
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:23,640
Speaker 2: can actually get resources if they're navigating a diagnosis.

826
00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:27,359
Speaker 1: Thank you for that, And what kinds of suggestions would

827
00:49:27,400 --> 00:49:30,480
Speaker 1: you give to family members or friends who may need

828
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:33,640
Speaker 1: to support someone who has just gotten a new diagnosis.

829
00:49:34,680 --> 00:49:38,680
Speaker 2: Now you're in my personal business, because you know, as

830
00:49:38,719 --> 00:49:42,239
Speaker 2: an educator, I was just thinking about a relative who

831
00:49:42,239 --> 00:49:45,759
Speaker 2: had gotten a diagnosis and it was almost like they

832
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:48,319
Speaker 2: forgot what I've ever said to them, or maybe it

833
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:52,359
Speaker 2: didn't hit then because I don't know, maybe because they

834
00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:52,959
Speaker 2: didn't have.

835
00:49:52,920 --> 00:49:53,680
Speaker 3: To deal with it.

836
00:49:54,120 --> 00:49:58,879
Speaker 2: But just reevaluating letting people know how things are transmitted.

837
00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:02,120
Speaker 2: I think about like a person having an HIV diagnosis

838
00:50:02,480 --> 00:50:06,040
Speaker 2: and being invited over to dinner and getting like paper

839
00:50:06,040 --> 00:50:10,920
Speaker 2: plate in the disposable fork and spoon, and how awful

840
00:50:11,080 --> 00:50:14,720
Speaker 2: that felt for them. So I think family and friends

841
00:50:14,760 --> 00:50:18,080
Speaker 2: need to be as educated so that when something does

842
00:50:18,719 --> 00:50:22,239
Speaker 2: happen in the family environment that they can remain supportive

843
00:50:22,239 --> 00:50:25,760
Speaker 2: and fully understand that you can take precautions. You should

844
00:50:25,800 --> 00:50:28,480
Speaker 2: take precautions, but you don't have to go to an

845
00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:32,600
Speaker 2: extreme and you don't have to really reinforce the stigma

846
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:38,520
Speaker 2: of being diseased or whatever. I think also understanding that

847
00:50:38,880 --> 00:50:41,160
Speaker 2: sometimes so this is when I said, you're in my business.

848
00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:44,640
Speaker 3: Like for me, sometimes I'm just your cousin.

849
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:49,719
Speaker 2: I'm not the Southern sexologist and nobody cares. And so

850
00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:54,520
Speaker 2: it's important to know that education is available. It might

851
00:50:54,560 --> 00:50:56,839
Speaker 2: be available in your family, but at least get it

852
00:50:57,239 --> 00:51:01,000
Speaker 2: from somewhere. And then also so I think what I

853
00:51:01,040 --> 00:51:02,880
Speaker 2: try to do in my family or trying to do,

854
00:51:03,520 --> 00:51:08,280
Speaker 2: is to break the generational secrecy and stigma and shame

855
00:51:08,680 --> 00:51:12,520
Speaker 2: around sex in general. Just being open to say, like,

856
00:51:12,600 --> 00:51:16,120
Speaker 2: we don't want the next generation to feel as lost

857
00:51:16,120 --> 00:51:19,799
Speaker 2: as we may have felt, so thinking about liberating being

858
00:51:19,840 --> 00:51:24,640
Speaker 2: sexual free and not experiencing some of the issues and

859
00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:29,000
Speaker 2: challenges we had to experience by actually sharing our stories

860
00:51:29,040 --> 00:51:33,000
Speaker 2: in context right and within boundaries so that it's a

861
00:51:33,080 --> 00:51:36,160
Speaker 2: learning experience for the generation behind us.

862
00:51:37,040 --> 00:51:39,160
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for that. You have given us

863
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:42,200
Speaker 1: so much today, Doctor Baz. If you had to kind

864
00:51:42,200 --> 00:51:44,520
Speaker 1: of distill all of what we've talked about to like

865
00:51:44,560 --> 00:51:47,320
Speaker 1: three major things you'd like for people to walk away

866
00:51:47,640 --> 00:51:49,879
Speaker 1: from this conversation, knowing what would they be.

867
00:51:50,040 --> 00:51:54,080
Speaker 2: I would want people to walk away with the desire

868
00:51:54,520 --> 00:51:59,120
Speaker 2: to really learn more about their bodies, to learn more

869
00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:04,400
Speaker 2: about the different infections in how they work, including the

870
00:52:04,480 --> 00:52:10,000
Speaker 2: prevention of but also what it's like living with a diagnosis,

871
00:52:10,640 --> 00:52:14,440
Speaker 2: and then most importantly, like I just said, sharing anything

872
00:52:14,520 --> 00:52:19,680
Speaker 2: that you learn with the next generation and even like

873
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:23,319
Speaker 2: your peers and your friends and family right now who

874
00:52:23,440 --> 00:52:24,880
Speaker 2: might be the same age issue.

875
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:28,080
Speaker 1: So where can we stay connected with you, doctor Vans?

876
00:52:28,120 --> 00:52:30,279
Speaker 1: What is your website as well as any social media

877
00:52:30,360 --> 00:52:31,440
Speaker 1: channels you'd like to share?

878
00:52:31,640 --> 00:52:34,560
Speaker 3: Sure? So my website is www.

879
00:52:34,760 --> 00:52:40,799
Speaker 2: Tanyambass dot com and I'm on Instagram at doctor Tanya MBAs.

880
00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:45,040
Speaker 3: So you can slide in the DMS if you need appropriately.

881
00:52:46,719 --> 00:52:48,720
Speaker 1: And can we find you on TikTok as well?

882
00:52:48,960 --> 00:52:49,200
Speaker 3: Yes?

883
00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:52,719
Speaker 2: And no, I'm there, I'm a voyeur. I am a

884
00:52:52,800 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 2: voyeur on TikTok, but I am there as Tanya Vass.

885
00:52:55,760 --> 00:52:59,680
Speaker 1: Yes, perfect, perfect. We will be short to include all

886
00:52:59,719 --> 00:53:01,520
Speaker 1: of that in the show notes. Thank you so much,

887
00:53:01,560 --> 00:53:03,279
Speaker 1: doctor Bass. I really appreciate it.

888
00:53:03,360 --> 00:53:04,279
Speaker 3: Thank you for having me.

889
00:53:07,800 --> 00:53:10,080
Speaker 1: I'm so glad doctor Bass was able to join us

890
00:53:10,080 --> 00:53:12,920
Speaker 1: to share her expertise for this episode. To learn more

891
00:53:12,920 --> 00:53:15,359
Speaker 1: about her and her work, visit the show notes at

892
00:53:15,400 --> 00:53:18,479
Speaker 1: Therapy for Blackgirls dot com slash Session three twenty six,

893
00:53:18,920 --> 00:53:22,319
Speaker 1: and don't forget to visit Sexpositive September dot com for

894
00:53:22,440 --> 00:53:25,919
Speaker 1: all the other incredible conversations we've had this month. And

895
00:53:26,200 --> 00:53:28,640
Speaker 1: remember to text two of your girls right now to

896
00:53:28,680 --> 00:53:31,640
Speaker 1: share this episode. If you're looking for a therapist in

897
00:53:31,680 --> 00:53:35,600
Speaker 1: your area, visit our therapist directory at Therapy for Blackgirls

898
00:53:35,600 --> 00:53:38,600
Speaker 1: dot com slash directory. And if you want to continue

899
00:53:38,600 --> 00:53:41,520
Speaker 1: digging into this topic or just be in community with

900
00:53:41,560 --> 00:53:43,960
Speaker 1: other sisters, come on over and join us in the

901
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:47,320
Speaker 1: Sister Circle. It's our cozy corner of the Internet, designed

902
00:53:47,400 --> 00:53:50,200
Speaker 1: just for black women. You can join us at community

903
00:53:50,239 --> 00:53:54,480
Speaker 1: dot Therapy for Blackgirls dot com. This episode was produced

904
00:53:54,480 --> 00:53:58,759
Speaker 1: by Frida Lucas, Elise Ellis, and Zaria Taylor. Editing was

905
00:53:58,800 --> 00:54:01,759
Speaker 1: done by Dennis and Bradford. Thank y'all so much for

906
00:54:01,880 --> 00:54:04,840
Speaker 1: joining me again this week. I look forward to continuing

907
00:54:04,840 --> 00:54:08,399
Speaker 1: this conversation with you all real soon. Take good care.

908
00:54:12,560 --> 00:54:16,759
Speaker 1: What's the reviews for sisterhood? Heels are rolling in and

909
00:54:16,840 --> 00:54:20,760
Speaker 1: I simply cannot stop smiling at the Hot Girl books

910
00:54:20,760 --> 00:54:24,200
Speaker 1: on Instagram shared finish reading this warm hug of a

911
00:54:24,239 --> 00:54:26,840
Speaker 1: book last night, and while it made me once a

912
00:54:26,920 --> 00:54:30,320
Speaker 1: hug my sister friend so bad. Sisterhood Heels is a

913
00:54:30,360 --> 00:54:33,040
Speaker 1: beautiful guide on how we as black women can use

914
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:36,560
Speaker 1: our community and friends to aid in our healing process.

915
00:54:37,080 --> 00:54:40,239
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for the beautiful review. Have you

916
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:43,480
Speaker 1: grabbed your copy yet? Get one for yourself and a

917
00:54:43,520 --> 00:54:46,440
Speaker 1: friend at Sisterhoodheels dot com