1
00:00:00,650 --> 00:00:04,590
Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly Jongfast, and this is Fast Politics, where

2
00:00:04,620 --> 00:00:07,520
Speaker 1: we discuss the top political headlines with some of today's

3
00:00:07,700 --> 00:00:12,500
Speaker 1: best minds. And Representative Steve Cohen files 26 articles of

4
00:00:12,580 --> 00:00:15,950
Speaker 1: impeachment against Donald Trump. We have such a great show

5
00:00:15,970 --> 00:00:21,650
Speaker 1: for you today. MSNOW's Antonia Hilton talks. Tucker Carlson trashing

6
00:00:21,850 --> 00:00:25,750
Speaker 1: Donald Trump's lack of concern about the American people. Then

7
00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:31,580
Speaker 1: we'll talk to Texas gubernatorial candidate Gina Hinojosa about her

8
00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:34,540
Speaker 1: run to unseat Greg Abbott. But first, the news.

9
00:00:34,800 --> 00:00:38,690
Speaker 2: Smiley, the Supreme Court just always giving Trump what he wants.

10
00:00:39,150 --> 00:00:42,989
Speaker 2: And now he has control over some interesting levers of

11
00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:43,519
Speaker 2: our voting.

12
00:00:43,620 --> 00:00:46,380
Speaker 1: So I think it's early to know what this means

13
00:00:46,540 --> 00:00:49,340
Speaker 1: because it could mean a number of things. The Supreme

14
00:00:49,409 --> 00:00:52,209
Speaker 1: Court has cleared the way Friday for the Trump administration's

15
00:00:52,250 --> 00:00:56,350
Speaker 1: expanding system to verify voters' citizenship status. This is one

16
00:00:56,370 --> 00:00:58,990
Speaker 1: of the Trump world's favorite things to do, solve a

17
00:00:59,010 --> 00:01:02,830
Speaker 1: problem that doesn't exist. And the question is, will it

18
00:01:02,870 --> 00:01:07,750
Speaker 1: disqualify normal voters? And also, who will use it and

19
00:01:07,910 --> 00:01:12,920
Speaker 1: how will states fight against it? The high court's majority

20
00:01:12,959 --> 00:01:16,820
Speaker 1: said that the federal government has an obligation to respond

21
00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:20,759
Speaker 1: to requests from state and local officials seeking to verify

22
00:01:20,819 --> 00:01:25,000
Speaker 1: the citizenship of voters. Now, what exactly does that mean?

23
00:01:25,280 --> 00:01:28,009
Speaker 1: And that is, I think, a real question. Look, the

24
00:01:28,069 --> 00:01:31,510
Speaker 1: League of Women Voters has called the decision profoundly disappointing,

25
00:01:31,550 --> 00:01:33,970
Speaker 1: saying it puts millions of Americans at risk of being

26
00:01:34,350 --> 00:01:38,520
Speaker 1: unlawfully targeted by the administration's unreliable voter purchase, which we

27
00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:41,819
Speaker 1: have seen that that is sort of their hope. The D.C.

28
00:01:41,940 --> 00:01:46,160
Speaker 1: District Court ruled that the expanded SAVE program violated multiple laws.

29
00:01:46,340 --> 00:01:49,620
Speaker 1: So they are going to go back. And I think

30
00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:53,050
Speaker 1: that ultimately that this case may go back up to

31
00:01:53,070 --> 00:01:55,670
Speaker 1: the Supreme Court because This is a sort of revamped

32
00:01:55,750 --> 00:02:01,170
Speaker 1: version of the systematic alien verification for entitlement, the SAVE service,

33
00:02:01,310 --> 00:02:04,669
Speaker 1: an immigration tool that has been long used to verify

34
00:02:04,730 --> 00:02:08,580
Speaker 1: whether you're eligible for benefits because people who are in

35
00:02:08,620 --> 00:02:12,220
Speaker 1: this country not legally, they do not get benefits. A

36
00:02:12,340 --> 00:02:15,560
Speaker 1: key part of the effort was expanding SAVE queries using

37
00:02:15,600 --> 00:02:19,690
Speaker 1: Social Security. I think that we're going to see more

38
00:02:19,930 --> 00:02:23,510
Speaker 1: in this, but it could also be dangerous. The three

39
00:02:23,590 --> 00:02:29,370
Speaker 1: liberal justices, Brown, Jackson, Sotomayor, and Kagan, dissented, and they

40
00:02:29,490 --> 00:02:33,620
Speaker 1: talked about the potential for disenfranchisement. Most states are barred

41
00:02:33,700 --> 00:02:37,340
Speaker 1: from systematic voting purges within 90 days of a federal election.

42
00:02:37,560 --> 00:02:40,960
Speaker 1: So that means that we are 38 days from the

43
00:02:42,260 --> 00:02:46,310
Speaker 1: And tomorrow we will be 37 days midterms, which means

44
00:02:46,410 --> 00:02:50,470
Speaker 1: that it's hard to imagine how they would do that

45
00:02:50,790 --> 00:02:54,040
Speaker 1: if they're banned from doing it 90 days before a

46
00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:59,580
Speaker 1: federal election. I think Trump did recently lose this postal.

47
00:02:59,620 --> 00:03:03,090
Speaker 1: You know, he had wanted to fuck with mail and voting, which.

48
00:03:03,450 --> 00:03:05,690
Speaker 1: As you know, a third of all Americans vote by mail.

49
00:03:05,950 --> 00:03:08,890
Speaker 1: And so now this was, you know, they sort of

50
00:03:08,930 --> 00:03:12,110
Speaker 1: gave him a win. But again, I think we will see.

51
00:03:12,130 --> 00:03:14,710
Speaker 1: I think this fight is certainly not over.

52
00:03:15,070 --> 00:03:19,190
Speaker 2: So amazing reporting from the lever. AI regulation was coming

53
00:03:19,510 --> 00:03:23,200
Speaker 2: and then Mr. Trump killed it because he's in on it.

54
00:03:23,400 --> 00:03:26,440
Speaker 1: Look, the reason why Donald Trump doesn't want to regulate

55
00:03:26,500 --> 00:03:29,860
Speaker 1: AI is because he and his sons have invested heavily

56
00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:32,200
Speaker 1: in AI. We know this from The Washington Post. There's

57
00:03:32,220 --> 00:03:34,709
Speaker 1: a reporting in The Washington Post that says that the

58
00:03:34,930 --> 00:03:40,369
Speaker 1: Trump family millions or billions are actually invested in AI.

59
00:03:40,510 --> 00:03:42,730
Speaker 1: So that makes a lot of sense as to why

60
00:03:42,750 --> 00:03:45,220
Speaker 1: he doesn't want to regulate. But there's also another story here,

61
00:03:45,250 --> 00:03:47,840
Speaker 1: which is that Trump didn't want to regulate AI because

62
00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:50,000
Speaker 1: he knows that it's kind of a bubble. And if

63
00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:52,980
Speaker 1: he regulates it, it might break the bubble and then

64
00:03:53,020 --> 00:03:56,200
Speaker 1: the economy won't do as well. And so we might

65
00:03:56,300 --> 00:04:00,160
Speaker 1: be into a recession and that would be bad for

66
00:04:00,370 --> 00:04:04,190
Speaker 1: him and his presidency. Look, again, we have yet to

67
00:04:04,330 --> 00:04:10,450
Speaker 1: see Congress regulate technology, period, paragraph, from Facebook to Instagram

68
00:04:10,470 --> 00:04:13,630
Speaker 1: to anything. They don't regulate it. The idea that they

69
00:04:13,650 --> 00:04:16,250
Speaker 1: were going to get their shit together and be able

70
00:04:16,330 --> 00:04:19,140
Speaker 1: to do it, I don't know that that's true. In

71
00:04:19,200 --> 00:04:21,960
Speaker 1: this story, it talks about Bernie Sanders and Peter Welch

72
00:04:22,140 --> 00:04:27,190
Speaker 1: talking about how they had a plan for regulation. You know,

73
00:04:27,370 --> 00:04:32,950
Speaker 1: Chuck Schumer's daughter works for OpenAI in government relations. So

74
00:04:33,210 --> 00:04:36,089
Speaker 1: I don't know how it's going to work. Amanda. Doesn't

75
00:04:36,210 --> 00:04:37,310
Speaker 1: seem good to me. No.

76
00:04:37,870 --> 00:04:41,180
Speaker 2: So Mr. Trump met with Xi Jinping, asking him to

77
00:04:41,220 --> 00:04:44,760
Speaker 2: stop supporting Iran. And Tom Tillis is big mad.

78
00:04:44,960 --> 00:04:49,160
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, Tom Tillis is like so late to this. Again, look,

79
00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:53,700
Speaker 1: we don't know that Donald Trump asked Xi to stop.

80
00:04:53,810 --> 00:04:54,750
Speaker 1: Do we know this?

81
00:04:55,089 --> 00:04:58,010
Speaker 2: Well, there's reporting on numerous sites that say it.

82
00:04:58,230 --> 00:05:00,530
Speaker 1: OK, so maybe he did. I mean, it's hard for

83
00:05:00,570 --> 00:05:03,130
Speaker 1: me to imagine. If you're Xi, you're not listening to

84
00:05:03,250 --> 00:05:03,830
Speaker 1: anything Trump.

85
00:05:03,870 --> 00:05:06,680
Speaker 2: You're literally just waiting for the whips to stop flapping.

86
00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:09,420
Speaker 1: You know, you see the picture of Xi and Trump

87
00:05:09,480 --> 00:05:11,940
Speaker 1: and Melania all looking miserable. And then you see him

88
00:05:11,980 --> 00:05:15,320
Speaker 1: with Obama. They look kind of happy. I mean, look,

89
00:05:15,620 --> 00:05:18,429
Speaker 1: the problem is we need a lot of stuff from Chernobyl.

90
00:05:18,430 --> 00:05:22,110
Speaker 1: We need some kind of rapprochement with AI. We need

91
00:05:22,170 --> 00:05:25,690
Speaker 1: a nuclear disarmament when it comes to AI. And we

92
00:05:25,710 --> 00:05:27,430
Speaker 1: have a problem, which is we have a president no

93
00:05:27,490 --> 00:05:30,410
Speaker 1: one trusts. So even if, I mean, again, like the

94
00:05:30,450 --> 00:05:32,589
Speaker 1: problem with trying to make deals with the Chinese is

95
00:05:32,690 --> 00:05:35,590
Speaker 1: they don't, they're not very trustworthy. But the problem with

96
00:05:35,610 --> 00:05:38,230
Speaker 1: trying to make deals with Trump world is they're not

97
00:05:38,270 --> 00:05:39,169
Speaker 1: very trustworthy.

98
00:05:39,190 --> 00:05:39,250
Speaker 3: So.

99
00:05:40,089 --> 00:05:43,250
Speaker 1: I don't think there's a great solution here. And quite frankly,

100
00:05:43,270 --> 00:05:45,270
Speaker 1: you know, I was talking to someone who knows a

101
00:05:45,470 --> 00:05:47,880
Speaker 1: lot more about foreign policy than I do. And he

102
00:05:47,920 --> 00:05:51,440
Speaker 1: was saying, you know, honestly, I just hope nothing happens

103
00:05:51,510 --> 00:05:54,860
Speaker 1: in this summit because there's a terrible doomsday scenario where

104
00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:58,000
Speaker 1: Trump gives Xi Taiwan or tries to give him some

105
00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:01,740
Speaker 1: kind of deal for Taiwan. And that would kick all

106
00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:04,739
Speaker 1: of us into a global depression, the likes of which

107
00:06:05,360 --> 00:06:07,540
Speaker 1: I don't think we can even guess what it would

108
00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:07,960
Speaker 1: look like.

109
00:06:08,490 --> 00:06:11,010
Speaker 2: So there's one thing you can always bet on. It's

110
00:06:11,110 --> 00:06:14,250
Speaker 2: that John Fetterman is going to be a disappointment. And

111
00:06:14,770 --> 00:06:17,830
Speaker 2: we really saw that yesterday with him casting an important

112
00:06:17,890 --> 00:06:20,900
Speaker 2: vote on ending the Iran war where he took the

113
00:06:20,940 --> 00:06:21,740
Speaker 2: side of the Republicans.

114
00:06:21,900 --> 00:06:24,840
Speaker 1: So let's just talk about this. John Fetterman, there's a

115
00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:28,260
Speaker 1: lot of talk out there that you actually need to

116
00:06:28,300 --> 00:06:32,330
Speaker 1: get more than flipping four seats because Fetterman is going

117
00:06:32,350 --> 00:06:35,010
Speaker 1: to flip. And so you may end up needing to

118
00:06:35,110 --> 00:06:38,450
Speaker 1: have five seats. And this is why people think that,

119
00:06:38,610 --> 00:06:42,050
Speaker 1: because he does things like this. So the War Powers Act,

120
00:06:42,290 --> 00:06:45,510
Speaker 1: Republicans blocked it. Let's talk about this for a second.

121
00:06:45,690 --> 00:06:50,020
Speaker 1: This is largely ceremonial, right? Say the War Powers Act passed.

122
00:06:50,080 --> 00:06:53,740
Speaker 1: Say 51 vote for the War Powers Act. It doesn't matter.

123
00:06:53,980 --> 00:06:54,200
Speaker 3: Right.

124
00:06:54,380 --> 00:06:57,620
Speaker 1: Then Donald Trump is going to end the war. Is he?

125
00:06:57,640 --> 00:07:00,120
Speaker 1: I don't think he is. So I don't know. This

126
00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:04,820
Speaker 1: is ceremonial, but it's also, more importantly, an opportunity for

127
00:07:04,839 --> 00:07:08,510
Speaker 1: Republicans to do something that untethers themselves a little bit

128
00:07:08,550 --> 00:07:12,270
Speaker 1: from Trump and from this unpopular war. And so it's

129
00:07:12,450 --> 00:07:16,310
Speaker 1: interesting to me that for Republicans, Susan Collins of Maine,

130
00:07:16,350 --> 00:07:19,750
Speaker 1: who's up for reelection, Lisa Murkowski, who doesn't give a fuck,

131
00:07:19,990 --> 00:07:25,080
Speaker 1: Rand Paul, who is a libertarian, and Tom Tillis all

132
00:07:25,300 --> 00:07:28,620
Speaker 1: voted in favor of this War Powers Act. It's interesting

133
00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:31,600
Speaker 1: to me, like someone like Roger Marshall from Kansas who

134
00:07:31,660 --> 00:07:35,310
Speaker 1: is polling really badly, why you wouldn't just vote for this?

135
00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:38,010
Speaker 1: I just am a little bit surprised that there wasn't

136
00:07:38,050 --> 00:07:44,380
Speaker 1: more of a crossover. Antonia Hilton is the host of

137
00:07:44,430 --> 00:07:50,810
Speaker 1: The Assignment on MSNOW. Welcome, welcome, Antonia Hilton. Hey, Molly.

138
00:07:50,870 --> 00:07:53,510
Speaker 1: It's always good to see you. It's good to see you.

139
00:07:54,550 --> 00:07:58,170
Speaker 1: I guess that we saw the Tucker Carlson versus Donald

140
00:07:58,230 --> 00:07:59,810
Speaker 1: Trump fight coming.

141
00:08:00,270 --> 00:08:00,450
Speaker 3: Yeah.

142
00:08:00,470 --> 00:08:04,190
Speaker 1: But it feels like it's just getting messier and messier. Yeah.

143
00:08:04,210 --> 00:08:07,670
Speaker 4: And then somehow I still feel like there's more mess

144
00:08:07,710 --> 00:08:11,170
Speaker 4: around the corner, actually. Even though he did this extended

145
00:08:11,230 --> 00:08:15,540
Speaker 4: sit-down with NPR, it still feels like he probably has

146
00:08:15,740 --> 00:08:19,540
Speaker 4: some other punches coming around the corner at some point soon.

147
00:08:20,460 --> 00:08:23,900
Speaker 4: I'm of multiple minds about this whole thing because I

148
00:08:23,940 --> 00:08:25,420
Speaker 4: do not trust Tucker Carlson.

149
00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:28,100
Speaker 1: He is someone.

150
00:08:27,700 --> 00:08:31,410
Speaker 4: Who will switch teams when convenient. I think he's a

151
00:08:31,770 --> 00:08:34,970
Speaker 4: very smart guy who's aware of where the winds are blowing.

152
00:08:34,990 --> 00:08:36,770
Speaker 4: And the winds are blowing against Trump.

153
00:08:37,090 --> 00:08:37,710
Speaker 1: So I think it's really.

154
00:08:38,330 --> 00:08:40,550
Speaker 4: easy and like comfortable for him to now be like

155
00:08:41,050 --> 00:08:45,000
Speaker 4: the prophet of what comes next. But, you know, he

156
00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:48,280
Speaker 4: was one of the people who like helped get, you know,

157
00:08:48,300 --> 00:08:50,500
Speaker 4: a lot of, I believe, young men to the polls

158
00:08:50,559 --> 00:08:53,500
Speaker 4: for Trump back in 2024. So I just I see

159
00:08:53,559 --> 00:08:56,710
Speaker 4: all of this as like very tenuous. I don't buy

160
00:08:56,760 --> 00:08:59,810
Speaker 4: all the motivations behind it. However, that doesn't mean that

161
00:08:59,830 --> 00:09:03,050
Speaker 4: I that discredits everything that he says in this interview,

162
00:09:03,090 --> 00:09:05,730
Speaker 4: I think, like about his behind the scenes relationship with

163
00:09:05,770 --> 00:09:07,589
Speaker 4: Trump and alleged conversations there.

164
00:09:07,940 --> 00:09:10,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's a really good point. And I

165
00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:14,480
Speaker 1: also think, like, Tucker is genuinely, like, some of the

166
00:09:14,580 --> 00:09:20,160
Speaker 1: reasons that he's anti-interventionist are, like, the reasons that the

167
00:09:20,420 --> 00:09:25,600
Speaker 1: old school anti-interventionists were anti-interventionists. Like, it's not so much

168
00:09:25,660 --> 00:09:28,420
Speaker 1: that he doesn't want foreign adventuring, though, I mean, I

169
00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:33,059
Speaker 1: do think he genuinely believes in not having foreign interventioning. But, like,

170
00:09:33,100 --> 00:09:37,090
Speaker 1: his anti-Israel stance, I think, is fueled by more than

171
00:09:37,160 --> 00:09:41,609
Speaker 1: just a national security angle. I mean, there's clearly shades

172
00:09:41,650 --> 00:09:44,469
Speaker 1: of anti-Semitism there, and we've seen that forever and ever.

173
00:09:44,910 --> 00:09:48,189
Speaker 1: And like the same people who like Tucker Carlson, who

174
00:09:48,250 --> 00:09:51,730
Speaker 1: call people on the left anti-Semitic, would never say that

175
00:09:52,370 --> 00:09:55,449
Speaker 1: about Carlson. But I do think that's a real thing.

176
00:09:55,750 --> 00:09:59,210
Speaker 1: But I also wonder, like, when we see this together,

177
00:09:59,230 --> 00:10:02,790
Speaker 1: he is really smart. I mean, Tucker is really smart

178
00:10:02,840 --> 00:10:05,600
Speaker 1: and he thinks things through. And he did, in fact,

179
00:10:05,740 --> 00:10:09,620
Speaker 1: call Trump. And there's really good reporting in Regime Change

180
00:10:10,020 --> 00:10:12,900
Speaker 1: where he says to Trump, like, you know, the Middle

181
00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:14,800
Speaker 1: East is just a disaster. Why do you think it's

182
00:10:14,820 --> 00:10:17,060
Speaker 1: going to work out? And he says, everything always works

183
00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:22,579
Speaker 1: out for me, which... is the kind of high-level thinking

184
00:10:22,980 --> 00:10:27,220
Speaker 1: that you definitely want in a president. Totally, totally.

185
00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:29,860
Speaker 4: But you make a good point, which is that what

186
00:10:29,900 --> 00:10:32,819
Speaker 4: we actually already know from the established reporting and in

187
00:10:32,860 --> 00:10:36,300
Speaker 4: this book, Regime Change, is pretty well reflected in this

188
00:10:36,420 --> 00:10:39,380
Speaker 4: updated conversation between Steve Inskeep.

189
00:10:39,020 --> 00:10:40,110
Speaker 1: And Tucker Carlson.

190
00:10:40,570 --> 00:10:43,150
Speaker 4: And what Tucker Carlson is alleging, effectively, for anyone who

191
00:10:43,170 --> 00:10:45,410
Speaker 4: hasn't had the chance to listen to it yet, is

192
00:10:45,510 --> 00:10:48,540
Speaker 4: that he tried to warn Trump about all the pitfalls

193
00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:50,960
Speaker 4: of what could come with Iran. And on that front,

194
00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:52,960
Speaker 4: like the things that he thinks are the actual like

195
00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:56,059
Speaker 4: kind of like scenarios here, I think Tucker has been

196
00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:58,980
Speaker 4: right on many of those things. Again, you make a

197
00:10:59,000 --> 00:11:01,540
Speaker 4: great point, which is that his motivations and his criticisms

198
00:11:01,580 --> 00:11:05,100
Speaker 4: and whose side he's on, they're not all clean. And

199
00:11:05,140 --> 00:11:08,910
Speaker 4: he is absolutely right. at times made anti-Semitic remarks and

200
00:11:08,929 --> 00:11:11,370
Speaker 4: sort of situations. And that's something that you need to

201
00:11:11,429 --> 00:11:14,870
Speaker 4: remember when you listen to someone like Tucker Carlson. But

202
00:11:15,130 --> 00:11:17,679
Speaker 4: what is real is that he has conversations with the president.

203
00:11:17,760 --> 00:11:21,260
Speaker 4: We know the two men talk. And he's describing to

204
00:11:21,300 --> 00:11:25,490
Speaker 4: Steve this conversation. where basically he's kind of warning him

205
00:11:25,660 --> 00:11:28,490
Speaker 4: against what we know the president has now done there.

206
00:11:29,090 --> 00:11:31,870
Speaker 4: And that Trump's response kind of fundamentally is a very

207
00:11:32,050 --> 00:11:35,710
Speaker 4: nihilistic response. It's like, we're all going to die anyway.

208
00:11:35,730 --> 00:11:38,870
Speaker 4: That's maybe not a direct quote, but the essence of

209
00:11:39,150 --> 00:11:43,210
Speaker 4: what he says, allegedly back to Tucker Carlson. And you

210
00:11:43,309 --> 00:11:46,050
Speaker 4: don't want nihilism in the president of the United States. Like,

211
00:11:46,490 --> 00:11:48,570
Speaker 4: Tucker claims he said this, that he's like, well, what

212
00:11:48,610 --> 00:11:50,830
Speaker 4: about our kids and our grandkids and like the future

213
00:11:50,870 --> 00:11:52,990
Speaker 4: that we're going to leave behind for them? And the

214
00:11:53,030 --> 00:11:55,360
Speaker 4: president of the United States does not seem concerned in

215
00:11:55,390 --> 00:11:57,860
Speaker 4: his view about that at all. And that is something

216
00:11:57,900 --> 00:12:00,340
Speaker 4: that if true, we all really do need to sit with.

217
00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:02,479
Speaker 4: And that really does inform, frankly, a lot of what's

218
00:12:02,500 --> 00:12:05,679
Speaker 4: been happening on both the foreign and domestic fronts.

219
00:12:06,100 --> 00:12:08,619
Speaker 1: Yeah. And I and I think. The other thing is

220
00:12:08,660 --> 00:12:13,329
Speaker 1: there's clearly Donald Trump polling under the Bush line, right,

221
00:12:13,470 --> 00:12:17,790
Speaker 1: less than Bush. He is so unpopular that we are

222
00:12:17,910 --> 00:12:22,690
Speaker 1: seeing the kind of fissures you see when a president

223
00:12:22,750 --> 00:12:27,700
Speaker 1: is this unpopular. And that is— and because this MAGA media

224
00:12:27,740 --> 00:12:31,640
Speaker 1: complex is— so independent, they can see right away when

225
00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:34,980
Speaker 1: people don't watch their videos. Like they know, they don't

226
00:12:35,020 --> 00:12:37,800
Speaker 1: have to wait for Nielsen's, right? They can see it

227
00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:39,860
Speaker 1: right away and they see it in the comments and

228
00:12:39,900 --> 00:12:41,980
Speaker 1: they see it. And so that's why you have this

229
00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:45,530
Speaker 1: story from the Wall Street Journal about how MAGA influencers

230
00:12:45,830 --> 00:12:47,350
Speaker 1: are not talking about MAGA anymore.

231
00:12:47,630 --> 00:12:47,910
Speaker 3: Yeah.

232
00:12:48,530 --> 00:12:50,429
Speaker 4: Well, what's so interesting to me, and I actually think

233
00:12:50,450 --> 00:12:54,510
Speaker 4: Tucker Carlson is like a good representative of what's happening here.

234
00:12:54,550 --> 00:12:56,610
Speaker 4: And I think there are probably people preparing to like

235
00:12:57,080 --> 00:13:00,080
Speaker 4: write books about this or senior theses about it right

236
00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:03,809
Speaker 4: now is that like, and my friend Astead Herndon made

237
00:13:03,850 --> 00:13:07,290
Speaker 4: this point, who, you know, is a director at Vox

238
00:13:07,460 --> 00:13:11,260
Speaker 4: and hosts an amazing podcast, America Actually. And He was

239
00:13:11,300 --> 00:13:13,240
Speaker 4: basically saying that like one of the reasons why Trump

240
00:13:13,340 --> 00:13:15,500
Speaker 4: is doing what he's doing right now with the press

241
00:13:15,559 --> 00:13:18,380
Speaker 4: to MSNOW, Politico, CNN, this whole battle.

242
00:13:18,140 --> 00:13:19,920
Speaker 1: That's been going on in the background. And you're talking

243
00:13:19,970 --> 00:13:23,730
Speaker 1: about taking away their press access. The press ban.

244
00:13:23,750 --> 00:13:26,950
Speaker 4: And of course, you know, so far we've had success

245
00:13:26,990 --> 00:13:28,350
Speaker 4: in court, but we know this is not the end.

246
00:13:28,290 --> 00:13:29,809
Speaker 1: Of this battle with the president.

247
00:13:31,290 --> 00:13:34,410
Speaker 4: Is like what Astead was basically arguing is that like,

248
00:13:34,690 --> 00:13:39,079
Speaker 4: you know, Trump has incredibly low poll numbers and credibility

249
00:13:39,120 --> 00:13:41,600
Speaker 4: right now, but the only institution in America that actually

250
00:13:41,620 --> 00:13:44,660
Speaker 4: currently has lower credibility than him is the media. And

251
00:13:44,679 --> 00:13:47,140
Speaker 4: so he can punch kind of down on us because

252
00:13:47,179 --> 00:13:49,599
Speaker 4: we have struggled to build that relationship. And this is

253
00:13:49,620 --> 00:13:51,599
Speaker 4: where Tucker comes in, which I think one of the

254
00:13:51,620 --> 00:13:53,319
Speaker 4: things Tucker is really good at is, again, kind of

255
00:13:53,340 --> 00:13:56,460
Speaker 4: like seeing what's on the horizon. Where is the wind blowing?

256
00:13:56,760 --> 00:13:58,880
Speaker 4: And not only can he get ahead of Trump on

257
00:13:59,020 --> 00:14:01,470
Speaker 4: the sort of like political story of the day, but

258
00:14:01,490 --> 00:14:05,030
Speaker 4: he can kind of get ahead of the media by

259
00:14:05,410 --> 00:14:10,110
Speaker 4: talking about certain behind the scenes conversations and positioning himself

260
00:14:10,190 --> 00:14:13,340
Speaker 4: as someone who will say the real things despite what

261
00:14:13,380 --> 00:14:17,360
Speaker 4: you might call him. And he creates this sort of

262
00:14:17,380 --> 00:14:21,380
Speaker 4: like air of authenticity and realness around him that contrasts

263
00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:25,000
Speaker 4: him as this former mainstream media host with With like

264
00:14:25,460 --> 00:14:28,360
Speaker 4: the rest of us now and him where he is

265
00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:30,160
Speaker 4: in the moment. And you can see that sort of

266
00:14:30,700 --> 00:14:33,770
Speaker 4: that evolution is part of his like his his cell

267
00:14:33,790 --> 00:14:38,630
Speaker 4: of credibility. And I think that he and and other

268
00:14:38,770 --> 00:14:40,910
Speaker 4: folks like him are having success in that space. And

269
00:14:40,930 --> 00:14:43,130
Speaker 4: then I think that there are these other MAGA creators

270
00:14:43,380 --> 00:14:46,360
Speaker 4: that are really failing because they're kind of like trying

271
00:14:46,460 --> 00:14:48,220
Speaker 4: to do the old game again.

272
00:14:48,940 --> 00:14:53,020
Speaker 1: And losing in the process. Now, the question is, though,

273
00:14:53,140 --> 00:14:56,040
Speaker 1: like we talk about a Ben Shapiro, like that's a

274
00:14:56,090 --> 00:14:59,110
Speaker 1: really good example of someone whose numbers have just cratered.

275
00:14:59,350 --> 00:15:03,110
Speaker 1: The problem with Ben Shapiro is Ben Shapiro is deeply

276
00:15:03,170 --> 00:15:07,450
Speaker 1: pro-Israel and a very religious Jew. So the question here is,

277
00:15:07,570 --> 00:15:11,130
Speaker 1: we know that the right has a sort of handshake

278
00:15:11,310 --> 00:15:14,870
Speaker 1: with anti-Semitism and racism and sexism and you.

279
00:15:14,810 --> 00:15:17,170
Speaker 4: Know, and so the- And like, in some cases, literal

280
00:15:17,310 --> 00:15:20,110
Speaker 4: out-and-out Gripers and, like, Nick Klempes types.

281
00:15:20,130 --> 00:15:22,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I mean, the Nazi group chat is a

282
00:15:22,890 --> 00:15:27,540
Speaker 1: great example, right, where they were all young men of 30,

283
00:15:27,540 --> 00:15:30,220
Speaker 1: so not old enough to make good choices. That's what

284
00:15:30,280 --> 00:15:33,180
Speaker 1: sort of J.D. Vance, but, you know, there was this

285
00:15:33,220 --> 00:15:37,740
Speaker 1: group chat where they were, like, literally using Nazi ideology.

286
00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:41,950
Speaker 1: So the question is, like, Is this the beginning of

287
00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:46,350
Speaker 1: a sort of MAGA plus, plus, plus that does all

288
00:15:46,430 --> 00:15:50,270
Speaker 1: the things that they, you know, is like this new

289
00:15:50,350 --> 00:15:56,990
Speaker 1: MAGA even more sort of anti everything that we believe, right? That,

290
00:15:57,090 --> 00:16:00,880
Speaker 1: you know, is it like the difference between Reagan and Trump?

291
00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:05,600
Speaker 1: And Trump and, you know, the sort of James Fishback types,

292
00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:09,160
Speaker 1: the people who are genuinely embrace the sort of basis

293
00:16:09,260 --> 00:16:12,400
Speaker 1: of base instincts. And I think that's a real scary

294
00:16:12,420 --> 00:16:13,880
Speaker 1: question that could it is.

295
00:16:14,100 --> 00:16:15,960
Speaker 4: To be honest, I think it like for the Republican

296
00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:18,520
Speaker 4: Party is sort of the story of the next several years.

297
00:16:18,540 --> 00:16:21,220
Speaker 4: It's certainly going to be the story heading into 2028.

298
00:16:21,220 --> 00:16:25,500
Speaker 4: And as people try to figure out who inherits Trump's thing.

299
00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:28,660
Speaker 4: And to be honest, I think Tucker is someone who

300
00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:31,950
Speaker 4: is at least considering trying to be that person.

301
00:16:32,070 --> 00:16:32,450
Speaker 1: Oh, yeah.

302
00:16:33,500 --> 00:16:35,850
Speaker 4: And Ben Shapiro is a really interesting figure because I

303
00:16:35,870 --> 00:16:37,850
Speaker 4: think two things can be true, which is that like

304
00:16:38,310 --> 00:16:41,950
Speaker 4: part of the reason that he's lost audience, part of

305
00:16:41,970 --> 00:16:44,610
Speaker 4: the reason why there's tension in his relationships with figures

306
00:16:44,630 --> 00:16:47,170
Speaker 4: like J.D. Vance who can't even bring themselves to disavow

307
00:16:47,230 --> 00:16:51,490
Speaker 4: someone as horrendous as Nick Fuentes is because there are

308
00:16:51,830 --> 00:16:55,300
Speaker 4: parts of his coalition that are now motivated by anti-Semitism

309
00:16:55,340 --> 00:16:56,800
Speaker 4: and anti-Semitic conspiracies.

310
00:16:56,820 --> 00:16:57,520
Speaker 1: For sure.

311
00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:01,340
Speaker 4: And they mistreat him. And I don't mean that. I

312
00:17:01,380 --> 00:17:02,750
Speaker 4: have my issues with Ben Shapiro.

313
00:17:02,780 --> 00:17:03,530
Speaker 1: No, for sure.

314
00:17:03,650 --> 00:17:05,190
Speaker 4: And so then to turn the page to my issues

315
00:17:05,210 --> 00:17:07,189
Speaker 4: with Ben Shapiro, I think one of the challenges he

316
00:17:07,250 --> 00:17:12,050
Speaker 4: then has with another sort of segment of the media consumer, right,

317
00:17:12,130 --> 00:17:14,320
Speaker 4: is that there are people who are frustrated with Ben

318
00:17:14,340 --> 00:17:17,610
Speaker 4: Shapiro because For speaking out on behalf of like only

319
00:17:17,650 --> 00:17:21,130
Speaker 4: his own sort of view of the world and engaging

320
00:17:21,340 --> 00:17:26,320
Speaker 4: in Islamophobic and racist rhetoric at times. And so very

321
00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:29,379
Speaker 4: people who would come to his defense right now to

322
00:17:29,420 --> 00:17:32,250
Speaker 4: be like, hey, those are Nazis and this is effed up.

323
00:17:32,270 --> 00:17:33,650
Speaker 1: And we believe they're kind of like.

324
00:17:34,330 --> 00:17:36,290
Speaker 4: Not coming to Ben Shapiro's defense and they're not going

325
00:17:36,310 --> 00:17:38,090
Speaker 4: to watch his YouTube videos.

326
00:17:37,770 --> 00:17:39,750
Speaker 1: Because they're like, I remember what you said.

327
00:17:39,650 --> 00:17:43,410
Speaker 4: About my community like a year ago and I'm not interested, dude.

328
00:17:43,830 --> 00:17:45,390
Speaker 4: I think there's I think two things can be true

329
00:17:45,410 --> 00:17:47,830
Speaker 4: at once, which is that he's like there are elements

330
00:17:47,850 --> 00:17:50,530
Speaker 4: of what's happening to him that are not just not fair.

331
00:17:50,570 --> 00:17:52,280
Speaker 4: And then there are elements where it's a little bit like.

332
00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:55,200
Speaker 4: a leopard's eating my face too situation. Like you thought

333
00:17:55,220 --> 00:17:56,820
Speaker 4: you could get into bed with some of these people

334
00:17:56,859 --> 00:17:58,140
Speaker 4: and that they wouldn't turn on you?

335
00:17:58,160 --> 00:18:02,820
Speaker 1: And that's the Byron Donald's problem, right? He's running for

336
00:18:02,859 --> 00:18:07,500
Speaker 1: governor of Florida. He's Trump's guy. He can't get over 50%.

337
00:18:07,500 --> 00:18:10,159
Speaker 1: And the places he can't get over 50% are the

338
00:18:10,220 --> 00:18:14,720
Speaker 1: same places that have historically voted for the very white

339
00:18:14,740 --> 00:18:19,510
Speaker 1: supremacist candidates. And so you can see that the map

340
00:18:19,690 --> 00:18:24,889
Speaker 1: is like these people... Do not. They are too racist

341
00:18:25,070 --> 00:18:28,469
Speaker 1: to vote for a candidate, even if he espouses all

342
00:18:28,490 --> 00:18:28,970
Speaker 1: their views.

343
00:18:29,230 --> 00:18:32,680
Speaker 4: It's going to be such a fascinating. All of Florida

344
00:18:32,800 --> 00:18:37,140
Speaker 4: is like so fascinating to me. In fact, this weekend

345
00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:39,940
Speaker 4: on the assignment, we're going to have a guy named

346
00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:44,460
Speaker 4: Jimmy Glover on who is running to, you know, he

347
00:18:44,500 --> 00:18:46,359
Speaker 4: hopes to take the seat of one of the Moms

348
00:18:46,420 --> 00:18:47,560
Speaker 4: for Liberty stars.

349
00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:48,200
Speaker 1: Right.

350
00:18:48,350 --> 00:18:48,550
Speaker 3: Right.

351
00:18:49,619 --> 00:18:52,159
Speaker 4: And like in Florida, I feel like all politics is

352
00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:54,859
Speaker 4: sort of local. And a lot of what happens at

353
00:18:54,880 --> 00:18:57,760
Speaker 4: the ground level in Florida tells you sort of more

354
00:18:57,800 --> 00:18:59,120
Speaker 4: broadly about what's happening.

355
00:18:58,790 --> 00:18:59,350
Speaker 1: In the state.

356
00:18:59,940 --> 00:19:02,959
Speaker 4: And just there is this massive shift in Sarasota County,

357
00:19:03,050 --> 00:19:04,570
Speaker 4: which is a very, you know.

358
00:19:04,590 --> 00:19:06,830
Speaker 1: Their school district is part of a very red part

359
00:19:06,850 --> 00:19:07,330
Speaker 1: of the state.

360
00:19:07,770 --> 00:19:11,090
Speaker 4: And, you know, these more liberal school board members are

361
00:19:11,130 --> 00:19:14,130
Speaker 4: now snatching up these seats. And it's motivated by things

362
00:19:14,150 --> 00:19:17,130
Speaker 4: like all the book banning and sort of like self-censorship

363
00:19:17,170 --> 00:19:18,330
Speaker 4: that we saw in Florida.

364
00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:21,920
Speaker 1: Over the last several years, but also because of the way.

365
00:19:21,720 --> 00:19:23,780
Speaker 4: In which some of those board members have spoken about

366
00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:27,159
Speaker 4: the Latino community in Florida, which is still huge, their

367
00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:30,240
Speaker 4: reaction to what's happened with ICE. And so there are

368
00:19:30,380 --> 00:19:35,790
Speaker 4: so many like cultural changes happening at like a, just

369
00:19:35,830 --> 00:19:40,850
Speaker 4: like grassroots level in Florida that are working against Byron

370
00:19:40,890 --> 00:19:44,790
Speaker 4: Donalds and probably working for someone like Angie Nixon. And

371
00:19:44,850 --> 00:19:47,270
Speaker 4: so you have Byron who's like, both of them are like,

372
00:19:48,030 --> 00:19:49,730
Speaker 4: Potential historic firsts.

373
00:19:49,950 --> 00:19:51,119
Speaker 1: It's so interesting.

374
00:19:51,170 --> 00:19:51,540
Speaker 3: Yeah.

375
00:19:52,020 --> 00:19:55,840
Speaker 4: And, but it's like, so it, Angie needs more help

376
00:19:55,859 --> 00:19:59,639
Speaker 4: from the Democrats who aren't investing in her entirely, despite

377
00:19:59,660 --> 00:20:02,399
Speaker 4: the fact that like the polling is so tight, you

378
00:20:02,420 --> 00:20:04,639
Speaker 4: would think that they would at this point. And then

379
00:20:04,700 --> 00:20:07,990
Speaker 4: Byron is struggling because he is like, He can't even

380
00:20:08,050 --> 00:20:09,850
Speaker 4: run on the fact that like he is a historic

381
00:20:09,970 --> 00:20:12,950
Speaker 4: first and right and connects necessarily with the black community

382
00:20:12,990 --> 00:20:16,250
Speaker 4: in Florida. It is going to be, in my view,

383
00:20:16,750 --> 00:20:18,490
Speaker 4: one of the most interesting states to watch. I mean,

384
00:20:18,510 --> 00:20:19,830
Speaker 4: it's always like Florida, Florida, Florida.

385
00:20:19,850 --> 00:20:20,760
Speaker 1: So interesting to watch.

386
00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:23,119
Speaker 4: But I think people have like kind of or Democrats

387
00:20:23,140 --> 00:20:25,420
Speaker 4: have put Florida like on the back burner in terms

388
00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:26,419
Speaker 4: of their hopes and dreams.

389
00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:28,240
Speaker 1: And I really think they need to, like, wake up

390
00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:32,270
Speaker 1: and lock in. Well, and I also think Angie Nixon

391
00:20:32,330 --> 00:20:35,109
Speaker 1: is a really interesting candidate because she's a single mom.

392
00:20:35,530 --> 00:20:40,429
Speaker 1: She's not, you know, it's a very interesting situation to

393
00:20:40,530 --> 00:20:43,609
Speaker 1: be Angie Nixon at this moment because she really also,

394
00:20:43,970 --> 00:20:46,540
Speaker 1: you know, when you, a lot of this sort of

395
00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:49,320
Speaker 1: advertising about her is that she's so progressive. But the

396
00:20:49,380 --> 00:20:52,300
Speaker 1: reality is she was a state, you know, she worked

397
00:20:52,359 --> 00:20:56,740
Speaker 1: in the statehouse and ran in opposition to DeSantis. Which

398
00:20:56,980 --> 00:21:00,740
Speaker 1: turns out now that DeSantis is pretty unpopular, termed out

399
00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:06,359
Speaker 1: and has 10 million dollars that has disappeared under his watch.

400
00:21:06,540 --> 00:21:11,030
Speaker 1: Nobody knows where it is. That's what the the grand

401
00:21:11,070 --> 00:21:14,270
Speaker 1: jury said. They're not blaming anyone. I don't know why not.

402
00:21:14,350 --> 00:21:17,490
Speaker 1: But and so, you know, you do have to see

403
00:21:17,510 --> 00:21:20,869
Speaker 1: like that. you know, in a moment where Florida's Floridians

404
00:21:20,930 --> 00:21:24,629
Speaker 1: are really struggling with not being able to afford flood insurance.

405
00:21:24,690 --> 00:21:27,590
Speaker 1: I mean, there really is a sense in this that

406
00:21:27,670 --> 00:21:30,950
Speaker 1: this is actually sort of untenable.

407
00:21:31,210 --> 00:21:31,450
Speaker 3: Yeah.

408
00:21:31,619 --> 00:21:34,480
Speaker 4: I've had the chance to interview Angie Nixon twice now.

409
00:21:35,020 --> 00:21:36,800
Speaker 4: And one of the things that strikes me is that like,

410
00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:40,900
Speaker 4: you know, Ashley Moody, her opponent and other Republicans, like they,

411
00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:44,010
Speaker 4: of course, because of the DSA label are labeling her

412
00:21:44,030 --> 00:21:45,100
Speaker 4: as a socialist.

413
00:21:44,710 --> 00:21:47,650
Speaker 1: And They kind of are Republicans.

414
00:21:47,690 --> 00:21:50,030
Speaker 4: One of their strongest arguments in their view right now

415
00:21:50,530 --> 00:21:53,270
Speaker 4: is like, OK, we know you're not happy, but like,

416
00:21:53,430 --> 00:21:56,710
Speaker 4: do you really want these crazy people to take over?

417
00:21:56,750 --> 00:21:59,270
Speaker 4: You know, like that's their argument. And so Angie is

418
00:21:59,310 --> 00:22:02,300
Speaker 4: like mixed up in part of that strategy. But when

419
00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:04,000
Speaker 4: you actually talk to her and I think one of

420
00:22:04,020 --> 00:22:06,720
Speaker 4: the things that makes it hard for them to define

421
00:22:06,780 --> 00:22:09,520
Speaker 4: her on the ground is that like she has a

422
00:22:09,580 --> 00:22:13,970
Speaker 4: long history in the state. She has she's a union organizer.

423
00:22:14,150 --> 00:22:14,450
Speaker 1: Right.

424
00:22:14,550 --> 00:22:18,250
Speaker 4: He does like real like ground level door to door

425
00:22:18,590 --> 00:22:22,169
Speaker 4: signing up my own volunteers kind of work. And when

426
00:22:22,210 --> 00:22:25,210
Speaker 4: you talk to her, she's a very like common sense,

427
00:22:25,310 --> 00:22:31,350
Speaker 4: direct person. And she even has like she's not afraid

428
00:22:31,369 --> 00:22:32,550
Speaker 4: to talk to you about the fact that she has

429
00:22:32,570 --> 00:22:35,040
Speaker 4: like tons of disagreements with the actual DSA platform.

430
00:22:35,300 --> 00:22:35,619
Speaker 1: Yeah.

431
00:22:35,710 --> 00:22:38,200
Speaker 4: Basically, when you talk to her and you like step away,

432
00:22:38,220 --> 00:22:41,730
Speaker 4: you're my impression of her is that she's part of

433
00:22:41,750 --> 00:22:45,169
Speaker 4: the DSA because she feels like they're the closest to

434
00:22:45,210 --> 00:22:47,710
Speaker 4: being willing to fight in the way that working people

435
00:22:47,750 --> 00:22:48,150
Speaker 4: need to be.

436
00:22:48,090 --> 00:22:49,770
Speaker 1: Fought for right now. But she is.

437
00:22:49,750 --> 00:22:52,030
Speaker 4: Not like co-signing every single thing they've ever said and

438
00:22:52,070 --> 00:22:54,580
Speaker 4: doesn't agree with every person who like has something in

439
00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:58,480
Speaker 4: their national chapter to say in like a New Yorker

440
00:22:58,520 --> 00:23:01,700
Speaker 4: podcast or whatever, you know what I mean? And so like,

441
00:23:02,540 --> 00:23:06,879
Speaker 4: I just, it's interesting to see The reality of who

442
00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:09,050
Speaker 4: she is go up against what they're sort of trying

443
00:23:09,070 --> 00:23:09,670
Speaker 4: to paint her as.

444
00:23:09,930 --> 00:23:16,950
Speaker 1: And it also feels like she is genuinely not wealthy

445
00:23:17,590 --> 00:23:22,320
Speaker 1: and not right. She's genuinely struggles. And I think that

446
00:23:22,540 --> 00:23:25,780
Speaker 1: is profound because a lot of times most many of

447
00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:29,350
Speaker 1: the candidates we get who are meant to be authentically wealthy.

448
00:23:29,750 --> 00:23:33,290
Speaker 1: working class tend to be like Graham Platner, right? They're

449
00:23:33,330 --> 00:23:38,190
Speaker 1: working class. They work for their mother's restaurant, Oyster Farming,

450
00:23:38,350 --> 00:23:44,630
Speaker 1: or they're, you know, like they're not like genuinely working people.

451
00:23:44,800 --> 00:23:47,260
Speaker 1: And I think that when, you know, she talks about

452
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:51,280
Speaker 1: when those pink jackets, she gets them at, you know,

453
00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:53,960
Speaker 1: she doesn't get them sent to her by the designers, right?

454
00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:57,830
Speaker 1: She gets them at the Goodwill. And Like, I think

455
00:23:57,890 --> 00:24:02,130
Speaker 1: that that has to resonate. I mean, the authenticity of that,

456
00:24:02,230 --> 00:24:04,080
Speaker 1: I think, has to resonate. Definitely.

457
00:24:04,100 --> 00:24:08,740
Speaker 4: I also I there is an interesting slate of very

458
00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:10,620
Speaker 4: working class Democrats right now.

459
00:24:10,660 --> 00:24:10,860
Speaker 3: Yeah.

460
00:24:11,100 --> 00:24:13,940
Speaker 4: Another area in which I think the larger party infrastructure is.

461
00:24:14,390 --> 00:24:17,260
Speaker 4: hasn't like, they don't like it. They haven't like made

462
00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:19,380
Speaker 4: much hay of that when you think they would. There's

463
00:24:19,460 --> 00:24:22,679
Speaker 4: Angie Nixon. There's now, of course, Troy Jackson in Maine.

464
00:24:22,700 --> 00:24:25,540
Speaker 4: There has been conversation about him, but in large part

465
00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:28,379
Speaker 4: because he's the substitute for Graham Blattner, as you just said.

466
00:24:29,100 --> 00:24:33,520
Speaker 4: But like a real, real working class, you know, resume

467
00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:37,420
Speaker 4: or background. You have Brian Poindexter running in Ohio against

468
00:24:37,570 --> 00:24:41,720
Speaker 4: Max Miller, another candidate who I'm like, I am surprised

469
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:44,520
Speaker 4: sometimes that more Democrats aren't flying out to Ohio right now.

470
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:48,240
Speaker 4: I know that there are some that have plans to

471
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:51,330
Speaker 4: and have, but like he's running against Max Miller, a

472
00:24:51,369 --> 00:24:51,730
Speaker 4: man who.

473
00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,609
Speaker 1: Is alleged to have done things. Who has broken his

474
00:24:54,630 --> 00:24:57,970
Speaker 1: two-year-old daughter's collarbone. That's the allegation.

475
00:24:58,170 --> 00:24:58,390
Speaker 3: Yeah.

476
00:24:58,590 --> 00:25:00,970
Speaker 4: And so, you know, there's an argument to be made

477
00:25:00,990 --> 00:25:03,990
Speaker 4: that like, I would vote for a teddy bear like over,

478
00:25:04,230 --> 00:25:07,530
Speaker 4: you know, like a literal inanimate object over somebody facing

479
00:25:07,609 --> 00:25:11,090
Speaker 4: allegations like that. Like that's one argument. But Brian is, like,

480
00:25:11,170 --> 00:25:15,030
Speaker 4: an actual, like, hardworking union member. Like, you know, he

481
00:25:15,050 --> 00:25:17,109
Speaker 4: kind of represents that. And I'm just like, what are

482
00:25:17,530 --> 00:25:17,800
Speaker 4: we doing?

483
00:25:17,890 --> 00:25:21,619
Speaker 1: And Bob Brooks. There are all of these, like, union members.

484
00:25:21,740 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 1: And also Max Miller is from a very rich Ohio family.

485
00:25:25,340 --> 00:25:29,980
Speaker 1: I would, you know, like, there's so much weird class

486
00:25:30,020 --> 00:25:33,119
Speaker 1: stuff happening in this election that we're not talking about.

487
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:37,650
Speaker 1: You know, that there are, like, legitimately working class candidates.

488
00:25:37,730 --> 00:25:40,010
Speaker 1: And I... Again, I think like this phenomenon of the

489
00:25:40,050 --> 00:25:44,430
Speaker 1: Bernie dogs, right? These candidates that are endorsed by both

490
00:25:44,490 --> 00:25:49,510
Speaker 1: Bernie Sanders and the Blue Dog Democrats. Like that is

491
00:25:49,530 --> 00:25:52,429
Speaker 1: I mean, there are like seven congressional candidates who are

492
00:25:52,490 --> 00:25:56,370
Speaker 1: like that. I mean, Sam Forstag in Montana. I mean,

493
00:25:56,869 --> 00:25:59,550
Speaker 1: you know, that are just and Bob Brooks in Pennsylvania

494
00:25:59,609 --> 00:26:03,810
Speaker 1: that are just that kind of candidate, which I think

495
00:26:03,850 --> 00:26:07,590
Speaker 1: is new. I think it's it's new ish. And I.

496
00:26:09,369 --> 00:26:12,449
Speaker 4: Wonder, I guess I'll ask your thoughts on this, Molly.

497
00:26:12,570 --> 00:26:13,690
Speaker 4: Not that this is my podcast.

498
00:26:13,710 --> 00:26:15,830
Speaker 1: I don't get to ask questions. No, no, I like it.

499
00:26:15,930 --> 00:26:19,649
Speaker 1: I like it. It's very casual. You know, we're very casual.

500
00:26:20,230 --> 00:26:23,350
Speaker 4: You know, it's like, what is it about the Democratic

501
00:26:23,410 --> 00:26:25,570
Speaker 4: establishment right now that makes it hard for them to

502
00:26:25,630 --> 00:26:28,229
Speaker 4: tell that story, that makes it hard for them to

503
00:26:28,310 --> 00:26:31,610
Speaker 4: fully stand with some of those people? Like, when there's

504
00:26:31,670 --> 00:26:34,790
Speaker 4: so much opportunity and when they're pushed by reporters, they love.

505
00:26:34,630 --> 00:26:37,960
Speaker 1: To say things. Yes, we're doing this. Yes, we're looking

506
00:26:37,980 --> 00:26:39,750
Speaker 1: for these people. We're going to invest in these people.

507
00:26:40,210 --> 00:26:42,310
Speaker 4: And then it's like they're standing there going like this

508
00:26:42,730 --> 00:26:44,290
Speaker 4: and like waiting for dollars.

509
00:26:44,650 --> 00:26:47,830
Speaker 1: And I'm wondering where you think that disconnect is. So

510
00:26:48,550 --> 00:26:51,820
Speaker 1: why do I think the establishment is not meeting this moment?

511
00:26:51,910 --> 00:26:54,440
Speaker 1: And I think it's a really good question because there's

512
00:26:54,460 --> 00:26:56,960
Speaker 1: a really great piece by Rebecca Traister in New York

513
00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:02,700
Speaker 1: Magazine this week about how Troy Jackson, that the consultant

514
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:05,570
Speaker 1: class is like ruining his campaign. They are going in

515
00:27:05,609 --> 00:27:08,530
Speaker 1: there and not letting him answer questions the way he

516
00:27:08,570 --> 00:27:11,950
Speaker 1: wants to and having him say like instead of like

517
00:27:11,990 --> 00:27:19,640
Speaker 1: having moral clarity on. Palestine situation. He's saying, well, there

518
00:27:19,660 --> 00:27:22,020
Speaker 1: are good people on both. You know, he clearly knows,

519
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:25,760
Speaker 1: you know, the rest of the electorate has decided that

520
00:27:26,140 --> 00:27:29,870
Speaker 1: what's happening in Israel is not OK. The median voter

521
00:27:29,930 --> 00:27:33,969
Speaker 1: knows this to be the truth, but the elites are

522
00:27:34,050 --> 00:27:36,730
Speaker 1: still like, well, there are good people on both sides

523
00:27:36,770 --> 00:27:39,540
Speaker 1: of this. And I think that's not tenable. The consultant

524
00:27:39,560 --> 00:27:43,619
Speaker 1: class is really bad. You cannot underestimate how bad they

525
00:27:43,740 --> 00:27:46,320
Speaker 1: are and how they've just done such a bad job

526
00:27:46,420 --> 00:27:49,240
Speaker 1: at every which way. And I do think like when

527
00:27:49,260 --> 00:27:52,129
Speaker 1: we look at him and also when we look at

528
00:27:52,190 --> 00:27:56,790
Speaker 1: some of these, like the data center situation, right? And AI,

529
00:27:56,869 --> 00:28:00,280
Speaker 1: you know, This is something, it's an 80-20 issue. Voters

530
00:28:00,380 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 1: hate it. And you had consultants saying, like, don't go

531
00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:07,550
Speaker 1: too hard on this. That was a political piece. That was, yeah, yeah.

532
00:28:08,010 --> 00:28:10,199
Speaker 1: I mean, how can you not go to, this is,

533
00:28:10,490 --> 00:28:12,990
Speaker 1: if you're not going hard on, like, the death of,

534
00:28:13,270 --> 00:28:16,869
Speaker 1: you know, human, you know, creative expression, what are you

535
00:28:16,890 --> 00:28:19,730
Speaker 1: going to go hard on? Yeah. Yeah, and this has

536
00:28:19,790 --> 00:28:21,090
Speaker 1: been what you're saying.

537
00:28:21,430 --> 00:28:24,450
Speaker 4: That was a conversation that started back in 2024 when

538
00:28:24,810 --> 00:28:28,640
Speaker 4: Harris was running, was like, And Tim Walz and everything,

539
00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:31,940
Speaker 4: it was like, he had had all these initial appearances

540
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,200
Speaker 4: where he was very clearly being himself and then kind

541
00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:37,410
Speaker 4: of pulled back from some of that. And there was

542
00:28:37,470 --> 00:28:41,630
Speaker 4: this sense, and reporting to Back It, that folks had

543
00:28:41,650 --> 00:28:44,090
Speaker 4: gotten in a room and decided that things needed to

544
00:28:44,110 --> 00:28:47,470
Speaker 4: be handled a certain way. And you would think with

545
00:28:47,530 --> 00:28:49,910
Speaker 4: enough time between that election and the moment we're in

546
00:28:49,950 --> 00:28:53,280
Speaker 4: right now, there'd be some more reflection of like, hey,

547
00:28:53,940 --> 00:28:55,060
Speaker 4: thank you for your service.

548
00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:57,800
Speaker 1: Mm-hmm. Maybe we're in a new era.

549
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:00,960
Speaker 4: And those rules need to be relaxed a little bit.

550
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:05,800
Speaker 1: But I don't know. Those people should go work for Crypto. Antonio.

551
00:29:05,820 --> 00:29:08,060
Speaker 1: I think some of them are, Molly. I know they are.

552
00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:11,180
Speaker 1: That's why I said it. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

553
00:29:14,270 --> 00:29:18,910
Speaker 1: Gina Kinahosa is a member of the Texas House of

554
00:29:18,950 --> 00:29:23,890
Speaker 1: Representatives representing the 49th District and the Democratic nominee for

555
00:29:23,930 --> 00:29:28,950
Speaker 1: governor in the state of Texas. Welcome. Welcome, Gina.

556
00:29:29,130 --> 00:29:30,770
Speaker 3: Thanks, Molly. It's good to be with you.

557
00:29:30,970 --> 00:29:32,870
Speaker 1: It's good to have you. I wanted to talk to

558
00:29:32,910 --> 00:29:35,790
Speaker 1: you because you are in one of the most interesting

559
00:29:36,030 --> 00:29:39,970
Speaker 1: gubernatorial races. Talk to me about just the last conversation.

560
00:29:40,490 --> 00:29:43,930
Speaker 1: of weeks and what's happened in your race and being

561
00:29:43,950 --> 00:29:46,810
Speaker 1: a woman running for governor in Texas in the shoes

562
00:29:46,850 --> 00:29:47,880
Speaker 1: of Anne Richardson.

563
00:29:48,930 --> 00:29:50,709
Speaker 3: It's hard to tell you what's been happening in the

564
00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:52,740
Speaker 3: last couple of weeks because every day is like a

565
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:57,520
Speaker 3: year campaign. There's so much happening. But we start off

566
00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:00,700
Speaker 3: in October when we launched last year, nine to 12

567
00:30:00,700 --> 00:30:05,680
Speaker 3: points down. And now we have 11, 12 polls within

568
00:30:05,700 --> 00:30:08,670
Speaker 3: the margin of error. We have two polls in two weeks,

569
00:30:08,710 --> 00:30:12,460
Speaker 3: like big reputable polls, Siena poll, Marist poll showing us.

570
00:30:12,770 --> 00:30:16,570
Speaker 3: beating Greg Abbott. So yeah, this is a real race.

571
00:30:16,650 --> 00:30:19,170
Speaker 3: We are neck and neck and we are searching at

572
00:30:19,270 --> 00:30:22,030
Speaker 3: just the right time. So I think what it is

573
00:30:22,070 --> 00:30:24,730
Speaker 3: showing in the polling is that people just want change

574
00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:27,300
Speaker 3: because that's what we feel all over this state. That's

575
00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:30,580
Speaker 3: what we hear all over the state. Even Republicans, even

576
00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:33,740
Speaker 3: Trump voters have come our way because they're struggling in

577
00:30:33,780 --> 00:30:36,330
Speaker 3: a big way and they just want a painted it

578
00:30:36,470 --> 00:30:37,850
Speaker 3: a governor who will work for them.

579
00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:42,120
Speaker 1: Abbott would be running for his fourth term. Explain how

580
00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:44,520
Speaker 1: that changes the environment. Yeah.

581
00:30:44,620 --> 00:30:47,540
Speaker 3: So like, to be clear, the support we're picking up

582
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:52,700
Speaker 3: is not because people in Texas are suddenly team Democrat. No,

583
00:30:53,010 --> 00:30:57,490
Speaker 3: people are just anti-incumbency. People want change. There's this really

584
00:30:57,570 --> 00:31:01,530
Speaker 3: strong anti-incumbency energy in Texas, and there is no more

585
00:31:01,590 --> 00:31:05,150
Speaker 3: entrenched incumbent than Greg Abbott. And so people know who

586
00:31:05,210 --> 00:31:09,060
Speaker 3: he is. He's got like 99% name ID, right? And

587
00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:12,460
Speaker 3: so they know where to lay the blame for increased

588
00:31:12,500 --> 00:31:14,960
Speaker 3: struggle over the last decade. It is harder to make

589
00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:17,520
Speaker 3: it in Texas than it was 12 years ago before

590
00:31:17,540 --> 00:31:20,240
Speaker 3: Greg Abbott was governor. people feel that in their daily

591
00:31:20,310 --> 00:31:23,070
Speaker 3: lives and they know who to blame. And so we've

592
00:31:23,090 --> 00:31:25,910
Speaker 3: got that going for us. Now we still have about 20%

593
00:31:25,910 --> 00:31:28,190
Speaker 3: of the electorate who don't know who I am. So

594
00:31:28,410 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 3: when I kicked off this race, I think I had 20%

595
00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:34,780
Speaker 3: name ID, if that. So as people got to know

596
00:31:34,860 --> 00:31:36,940
Speaker 3: who I am, they're with me and we still have

597
00:31:36,980 --> 00:31:40,610
Speaker 3: that final 20% to reach. And so these last Now,

598
00:31:40,630 --> 00:31:44,110
Speaker 3: a few weeks of this campaign is about crisscrossing the state,

599
00:31:44,170 --> 00:31:47,940
Speaker 3: meeting with voters, up on broadcast TV. We've been streaming

600
00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:52,660
Speaker 3: for months now, reaching key demographics where they are. So, yeah,

601
00:31:52,980 --> 00:31:55,070
Speaker 3: we're doubling down to bring it home for a win

602
00:31:55,110 --> 00:31:55,610
Speaker 3: in November.

603
00:31:56,570 --> 00:32:00,830
Speaker 1: Abbott will not debate you. Why? Why do you think?

604
00:32:01,090 --> 00:32:04,370
Speaker 3: Because he has a record that is indefensible. We have

605
00:32:04,670 --> 00:32:08,620
Speaker 3: in Texas, despite the fact that Texans work harder than anybody,

606
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:10,660
Speaker 3: like we've never been afraid of work. We work more

607
00:32:10,700 --> 00:32:14,000
Speaker 3: than the national average in terms of hours worked, right?

608
00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:16,820
Speaker 3: But we have the most people without health insurance of

609
00:32:16,900 --> 00:32:19,810
Speaker 3: any state. We have the most children without health insurance

610
00:32:19,850 --> 00:32:23,709
Speaker 3: of any state. We have the most bankruptcies of any state. Texas,

611
00:32:23,750 --> 00:32:27,370
Speaker 3: which is a world economic powerhouse, And it's our small

612
00:32:27,410 --> 00:32:29,950
Speaker 3: businesses that are really struggling. We have the most people

613
00:32:30,010 --> 00:32:33,430
Speaker 3: being disconnected from their electricity because they cannot afford to

614
00:32:33,470 --> 00:32:37,440
Speaker 3: pay their bills in the state, which is an energy powerhouse.

615
00:32:37,890 --> 00:32:41,130
Speaker 3: this country and beyond, right? They can't afford to keep

616
00:32:41,210 --> 00:32:44,459
Speaker 3: the lights on. So that's Greg Abbott's record, right? He

617
00:32:44,580 --> 00:32:47,660
Speaker 3: owns it and he's hiding from it. He is a coward,

618
00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:49,620
Speaker 3: but frankly, he would be a fool to debate me

619
00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:53,130
Speaker 3: because how does he defend a record that is indefensible?

620
00:32:53,330 --> 00:32:55,890
Speaker 3: That is why he is mired in these culture wars

621
00:32:55,910 --> 00:32:59,430
Speaker 3: because that's all he's got. He has nothing left to

622
00:32:59,470 --> 00:33:03,110
Speaker 3: throw at us. And really, the culture wars in 2026

623
00:33:03,110 --> 00:33:05,790
Speaker 3: aren't working. Nobody has the luxury of fighting culture wars

624
00:33:05,870 --> 00:33:07,050
Speaker 3: in this high cost economy.

625
00:33:07,390 --> 00:33:10,930
Speaker 1: I have talked to a bunch of different candidates in

626
00:33:11,110 --> 00:33:14,390
Speaker 1: the Rio Grande Valley or further down in the state

627
00:33:14,580 --> 00:33:19,900
Speaker 1: like Garcia and also Bobby Pulido. And one of the

628
00:33:19,980 --> 00:33:24,980
Speaker 1: things they talk about is Hispanic voters and just that

629
00:33:25,140 --> 00:33:28,140
Speaker 1: they were part of this 2024 Trump coalition and they

630
00:33:28,300 --> 00:33:31,980
Speaker 1: are largely not anymore. Why do you think Trump has

631
00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:35,100
Speaker 1: lost that coalition? And do you see that in Texas?

632
00:33:35,140 --> 00:33:37,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think there are lots of reasons. I think

633
00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:40,630
Speaker 3: one is that people are just struggling a lot in

634
00:33:40,670 --> 00:33:44,310
Speaker 3: this high cost economy. And Trump ran on bringing costs

635
00:33:44,430 --> 00:33:47,110
Speaker 3: down and Far from it. I mean, we're now seeing

636
00:33:47,150 --> 00:33:52,510
Speaker 3: diesel in Texas over $ 620. Like, that's just... We rely

637
00:33:52,530 --> 00:33:55,390
Speaker 3: a lot on diesel for work here in Texas. Lots

638
00:33:55,410 --> 00:33:57,260
Speaker 3: of diesel trucks. I think we have the most of

639
00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:00,320
Speaker 3: any state. But the cost of gas is out of control.

640
00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:02,960
Speaker 3: The cost of everything is out of control in Texas.

641
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:07,380
Speaker 3: So that, coupled with the corruption, when people are struggling

642
00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:11,100
Speaker 3: just to make ends meet, and they see just all

643
00:34:11,160 --> 00:34:14,560
Speaker 3: this grift in the system and ballrooms and... all of

644
00:34:14,580 --> 00:34:18,279
Speaker 3: the things, it makes people angry. And so people do

645
00:34:18,340 --> 00:34:22,690
Speaker 3: feel betrayed by that. And these immigration ICE raids are

646
00:34:22,850 --> 00:34:27,589
Speaker 3: also making Latinos angry and scared because we all want

647
00:34:27,650 --> 00:34:30,890
Speaker 3: border security in Texas, right? I mean, from the border,

648
00:34:31,450 --> 00:34:36,259
Speaker 3: we want secure communities, safe communities. But what's happening with

649
00:34:36,300 --> 00:34:39,540
Speaker 3: these ICE raids is having the opposite effect. It is

650
00:34:39,600 --> 00:34:43,300
Speaker 3: putting us all in danger. We had last week, In Austin,

651
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:47,239
Speaker 3: a man was shot and then left overnight on a

652
00:34:47,300 --> 00:34:50,000
Speaker 3: detention floor with a bullet lodged in his back with

653
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:54,029
Speaker 3: no pain. Medication, right, the level of inhumanity. We have

654
00:34:54,250 --> 00:34:58,190
Speaker 3: Latinos being racially profiled, two young men, 17 years old

655
00:34:58,250 --> 00:35:00,969
Speaker 3: in South Texas, a couple weeks ago, on their way

656
00:35:01,010 --> 00:35:03,710
Speaker 3: to enlist in the Marines, pulled over by ICE and beaten.

657
00:35:03,950 --> 00:35:06,350
Speaker 3: We had a man in Houston a couple of months

658
00:35:06,410 --> 00:35:09,260
Speaker 3: ago who was shot and killed on his way to work.

659
00:35:09,300 --> 00:35:12,140
Speaker 3: It was a case of mistaken identity, right? I pulled

660
00:35:12,180 --> 00:35:14,140
Speaker 3: him over in an unmarked car, like on and on.

661
00:35:14,460 --> 00:35:17,540
Speaker 3: And so in that environment, nobody's safe and people are

662
00:35:17,660 --> 00:35:20,820
Speaker 3: angry about it. They want accountability. They want you to

663
00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:23,500
Speaker 3: feel safe. Living in their community is going to work

664
00:35:23,840 --> 00:35:25,200
Speaker 3: and we need change.

665
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:29,960
Speaker 1: So Texas has this really interesting electrical grid, which is

666
00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:34,470
Speaker 1: sort of independent. Will you explain, is there an opportunity there,

667
00:35:34,890 --> 00:35:38,989
Speaker 1: especially because isn't it so sort of independent that it

668
00:35:39,110 --> 00:35:42,890
Speaker 1: could be ultimately cheaper run on some renewables?

669
00:35:43,130 --> 00:35:46,129
Speaker 3: Oh, we have a lot of renewables. We have more renewables,

670
00:35:46,450 --> 00:35:49,180
Speaker 3: both wind and solar, than any state. We rely on

671
00:35:49,380 --> 00:35:52,549
Speaker 3: more renewable energy than any state. We also produce the

672
00:35:52,590 --> 00:35:56,180
Speaker 3: most carbon dioxide of any state by far, twice as

673
00:35:56,219 --> 00:35:59,700
Speaker 3: much as the next state, which is California. Remember in 21,

674
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:04,379
Speaker 3: our grid went down. We lost over 700 Texans when

675
00:36:04,420 --> 00:36:06,680
Speaker 3: that happened during winter storm year eight. That was on

676
00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:10,520
Speaker 3: Greg Abbott's watch. But our number one priority is really

677
00:36:10,540 --> 00:36:13,859
Speaker 3: a stable grid because it's essential for life. We have

678
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:17,160
Speaker 3: found out the hard way, Texas. And what is the

679
00:36:17,420 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 3: latest threat are these data centers because these data centers

680
00:36:21,260 --> 00:36:24,839
Speaker 3: are big energy guzzlers, water guzzlers too, but talking about

681
00:36:24,860 --> 00:36:27,410
Speaker 3: the grid energy guzzlers, and we just don't have the

682
00:36:27,469 --> 00:36:30,350
Speaker 3: capacity for all these data centers that Greg Abbott invited

683
00:36:30,450 --> 00:36:33,130
Speaker 3: into Texas with the richest tax breaks in the country.

684
00:36:33,390 --> 00:36:36,610
Speaker 3: So people are really concerned about the future of our grid,

685
00:36:36,710 --> 00:36:39,910
Speaker 3: about a stable grid. And there's just no plan. There's

686
00:36:39,950 --> 00:36:43,259
Speaker 3: been no plan to make sure that we can accommodate

687
00:36:43,390 --> 00:36:45,899
Speaker 3: this extra industrial traffic on the grid.

688
00:36:46,040 --> 00:36:48,899
Speaker 1: Yeah. And I mean, it's major, major. Like how many

689
00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:51,320
Speaker 1: of those projects do you think are online at this moment?

690
00:36:51,500 --> 00:36:54,319
Speaker 3: Well, we know there are hundreds of data centers that

691
00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:56,810
Speaker 3: have descended upon Texas. And these are like, so to

692
00:36:56,850 --> 00:37:02,270
Speaker 3: be clear, like hyperscale data centers. They're 800, 900 acres large, right?

693
00:37:02,370 --> 00:37:07,390
Speaker 3: So the level of impact and resource use is also hyperscale.

694
00:37:07,610 --> 00:37:10,120
Speaker 3: And that's why there's all this pushback and anger in

695
00:37:10,140 --> 00:37:13,240
Speaker 3: Texas about the data centers. We are a pro-business state,

696
00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,220
Speaker 3: but this is next level. This is something we haven't

697
00:37:16,300 --> 00:37:20,100
Speaker 3: seen before, even in Texas. And Texans have been left

698
00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:24,029
Speaker 3: out to fend for themselves against these massive data centers

699
00:37:24,070 --> 00:37:27,190
Speaker 3: that are owned by these multinational corporations, richest men in

700
00:37:27,250 --> 00:37:30,549
Speaker 3: the world. knowing we're paying for it, knowing we're subsidizing them,

701
00:37:30,830 --> 00:37:33,469
Speaker 3: knowing that they're guzzling our water and our electricity and

702
00:37:33,489 --> 00:37:37,450
Speaker 3: there are no laws to protect us, has really angered voters.

703
00:37:37,690 --> 00:37:42,090
Speaker 3: And it has created single-issue voters in Texas, especially in

704
00:37:42,130 --> 00:37:45,950
Speaker 3: rural areas where they've really, really descended. And when I

705
00:37:45,989 --> 00:37:48,350
Speaker 3: say there are no rules, there's just no protections for

706
00:37:48,370 --> 00:37:49,010
Speaker 3: these Texans.

707
00:37:49,290 --> 00:37:52,160
Speaker 1: Are you seeing in Texas what we're seeing in the

708
00:37:52,180 --> 00:37:54,580
Speaker 1: rest of the country where data centers are really an

709
00:37:54,600 --> 00:37:56,759
Speaker 1: 80-20 issue? Like it's pretty hard to find people who

710
00:37:56,780 --> 00:37:57,860
Speaker 1: are pro data center.

711
00:37:58,100 --> 00:38:01,750
Speaker 3: Absolutely. One thousand percent. It's data centers and it is

712
00:38:01,870 --> 00:38:05,590
Speaker 3: the latest physical manifestation of a governor and a government

713
00:38:05,650 --> 00:38:08,090
Speaker 3: that does the bidding of the moneyed interest and not

714
00:38:08,130 --> 00:38:11,259
Speaker 3: the taxes. And so in that way, it is a

715
00:38:11,820 --> 00:38:16,799
Speaker 3: standalone issue, but it ties into this corrupt system that

716
00:38:16,860 --> 00:38:20,839
Speaker 3: people have realized we're all paying into that Greg Abbott

717
00:38:20,860 --> 00:38:24,250
Speaker 3: has been leading for over a decade. Interesting how it

718
00:38:24,310 --> 00:38:27,830
Speaker 3: plays in 2026 as a threat in and of itself

719
00:38:28,030 --> 00:38:31,320
Speaker 3: and then a symptom of just a broken government.

720
00:38:31,610 --> 00:38:34,940
Speaker 1: Gina, one of the most famous Texans, a guy called

721
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:39,980
Speaker 1: Joe Rogan, is extremely mad about the marijuana ban that

722
00:38:40,540 --> 00:38:43,660
Speaker 1: Abbott has enacted. Will you explain to us? Because marijuana

723
00:38:43,719 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 1: is such an interesting drug in the fact that it's

724
00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:51,810
Speaker 1: regulated to hit willy-nilly in every state. Totally different.

725
00:38:51,850 --> 00:38:51,969
Speaker 3: So.

726
00:38:52,310 --> 00:38:54,290
Speaker 1: What did Greg Abbott do to marijuana?

727
00:38:54,370 --> 00:38:58,730
Speaker 3: It's kind of nuts because Greg Abbott unilaterally, he directed

728
00:38:58,790 --> 00:39:03,230
Speaker 3: his agency to classify THC derived from hemp as a

729
00:39:03,290 --> 00:39:04,489
Speaker 3: felony to possess.

730
00:39:04,870 --> 00:39:05,130
Speaker 1: Right.

731
00:39:05,230 --> 00:39:08,969
Speaker 3: And so this product, which people were buying. at even

732
00:39:09,030 --> 00:39:13,330
Speaker 3: pharmacies and stores legally just months ago is now a

733
00:39:13,410 --> 00:39:17,460
Speaker 3: felony to possess. And people aren't clear. They're not sure

734
00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:20,840
Speaker 3: is what they have illegal or not. What they have,

735
00:39:20,940 --> 00:39:23,180
Speaker 3: is that seltzer in the fridge that I bought? Is

736
00:39:23,219 --> 00:39:25,580
Speaker 3: that illegal? Like people don't know. That is not the

737
00:39:25,620 --> 00:39:28,180
Speaker 3: way the criminal law is supposed to work in America, right?

738
00:39:28,620 --> 00:39:32,860
Speaker 3: It is nuts. Most people don't understand that Greg Abbott

739
00:39:33,050 --> 00:39:35,730
Speaker 3: did this. People think that a law was passed. A

740
00:39:35,770 --> 00:39:38,850
Speaker 3: law was passed, weirdly, to do the same thing, and

741
00:39:38,890 --> 00:39:42,030
Speaker 3: Greg Abbott vetoed it. And then just a few months ago,

742
00:39:42,290 --> 00:39:45,010
Speaker 3: on his own, directed his agency to do the exact

743
00:39:45,050 --> 00:39:50,150
Speaker 3: same thing. So... The alcohol lobby has really pushed against

744
00:39:50,430 --> 00:39:54,050
Speaker 3: legalization of THC because they see it as a threat

745
00:39:54,070 --> 00:39:57,810
Speaker 3: to their bottom line. And so it's always follow the money, Molly,

746
00:39:57,950 --> 00:40:01,560
Speaker 3: in Texas. When something doesn't make sense, there's always a

747
00:40:01,620 --> 00:40:04,600
Speaker 3: big money interest that is behind it. And with Greg Abbott,

748
00:40:04,820 --> 00:40:08,680
Speaker 3: of course, like Greg Abbott, I can guarantee you there

749
00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:11,219
Speaker 3: is a big money interest behind it because that's what

750
00:40:11,260 --> 00:40:11,860
Speaker 3: motivates him.

751
00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:14,529
Speaker 1: It's funny because it's like it's the what's the matter

752
00:40:14,610 --> 00:40:19,009
Speaker 1: with Kansas election, right? Like people are seeing the government

753
00:40:19,070 --> 00:40:23,259
Speaker 1: that honors big money and corporations over them is going

754
00:40:23,300 --> 00:40:26,040
Speaker 1: to be problematic for their life.

755
00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:29,710
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right. People are feeling everybody is now feeling it.

756
00:40:30,090 --> 00:40:33,310
Speaker 3: Everybody feels it in their lives. We're all, 99% of

757
00:40:33,370 --> 00:40:35,649
Speaker 3: us are in the same boat. What I say is 2026,

758
00:40:35,650 --> 00:40:39,830
Speaker 3: this fight is about, is Texas going to be a

759
00:40:39,870 --> 00:40:42,150
Speaker 3: state that is by and for the people or is

760
00:40:42,170 --> 00:40:44,489
Speaker 3: this the billionaire's world and we just live here? That

761
00:40:44,570 --> 00:40:47,730
Speaker 3: is the fight in America. It is the fight for

762
00:40:47,770 --> 00:40:52,260
Speaker 3: Texas and it is a unifying fight, right? Because it's

763
00:40:52,360 --> 00:40:54,739
Speaker 3: all of us. It's all of us against like 15

764
00:40:54,739 --> 00:40:55,860
Speaker 3: billionaire tech dudes.

765
00:40:56,300 --> 00:40:58,520
Speaker 1: I have one last question. This is like really in

766
00:40:58,540 --> 00:41:01,759
Speaker 1: the weeds. But in the Paxson impeachment, it played out

767
00:41:01,820 --> 00:41:04,890
Speaker 1: that there were sort of two big Texas donors who

768
00:41:04,950 --> 00:41:08,430
Speaker 1: were bankrolling, you know, who went to different people and said,

769
00:41:08,469 --> 00:41:12,549
Speaker 1: if you don't vote against conviction, we're going to we're

770
00:41:12,570 --> 00:41:15,250
Speaker 1: going to run challengers. Are those guys involved in these

771
00:41:15,310 --> 00:41:18,690
Speaker 1: elections and are they protecting their guy? Because it seems

772
00:41:18,730 --> 00:41:22,730
Speaker 1: like Abbott had a lot of juice in the primary

773
00:41:22,850 --> 00:41:25,430
Speaker 1: and seems to have less in the general. Yeah.

774
00:41:25,700 --> 00:41:27,940
Speaker 3: I don't know if those guys in particular are involved.

775
00:41:27,960 --> 00:41:31,520
Speaker 3: There are so many billionaires behind Abbott. It is hard

776
00:41:31,560 --> 00:41:34,080
Speaker 3: to keep track. I just had a press conference this

777
00:41:34,219 --> 00:41:38,560
Speaker 3: week where I denounced his plan to convert 100 public

778
00:41:38,600 --> 00:41:41,930
Speaker 3: schools to AI schools in Houston, Texas. He took over

779
00:41:41,950 --> 00:41:45,150
Speaker 3: the school. Well, it means it is this model that

780
00:41:45,210 --> 00:41:49,030
Speaker 3: was developed by one of his biggest donors, Mackenzie Price,

781
00:41:49,070 --> 00:41:52,969
Speaker 3: who has given him millions of dollars, and it replaces

782
00:41:53,090 --> 00:41:57,969
Speaker 3: teachers with education guides, right? And kids sit in front

783
00:41:57,989 --> 00:42:00,790
Speaker 3: of screens and that's how they learn. And it is

784
00:42:00,830 --> 00:42:04,069
Speaker 3: what no parent wants for their kids, right? But it

785
00:42:04,170 --> 00:42:08,110
Speaker 3: is that corruption in the system, that corruption that drives

786
00:42:08,170 --> 00:42:11,670
Speaker 3: Greg Abbott. It is a legal corruption, right? It is.

787
00:42:12,250 --> 00:42:14,850
Speaker 3: In Texas, we have no caps, no limits. You can

788
00:42:14,890 --> 00:42:17,820
Speaker 3: give a politician as much money as you want if

789
00:42:17,840 --> 00:42:20,360
Speaker 3: they're running in the state race. But it is a

790
00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:23,860
Speaker 3: corrupt system nonetheless. And Greg Abbott has taken full advantage

791
00:42:23,900 --> 00:42:26,880
Speaker 3: of it. And people are finally seeing it. The data

792
00:42:26,900 --> 00:42:29,779
Speaker 3: centers kind of drove it home, hammered it home, and

793
00:42:29,820 --> 00:42:30,760
Speaker 3: people are done with it.

794
00:42:30,910 --> 00:42:33,170
Speaker 1: Gina, thank you. Thanks for coming on.

795
00:42:33,250 --> 00:42:34,950
Speaker 3: Thank you, Molly. Appreciate you.

796
00:42:38,060 --> 00:42:42,480
Speaker 1: And now your moment of fuckery. Jesse Cannon.

797
00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:45,580
Speaker 2: So Molly, we recently saw a huge uproar of people

798
00:42:45,620 --> 00:42:50,720
Speaker 2: being angry because UnitedHealthcare was using an AI that got 90%

799
00:42:50,719 --> 00:42:53,549
Speaker 2: of the cases presented to it wrong about whether to

800
00:42:53,570 --> 00:42:55,690
Speaker 2: deny the healthcare or not. And now we see the

801
00:42:55,730 --> 00:42:58,730
Speaker 2: Trump administration is using AI to deny medical care for

802
00:42:58,770 --> 00:43:01,130
Speaker 2: seniors with this disastrous experiment.

803
00:43:01,210 --> 00:43:05,830
Speaker 1: Yeah, I am shocked, shocked to see there's incompetence going

804
00:43:05,930 --> 00:43:06,830
Speaker 1: on in this government.

805
00:43:06,989 --> 00:43:08,870
Speaker 2: Are you shocked to see that AI is doing a

806
00:43:08,890 --> 00:43:09,950
Speaker 2: bad job of something?

807
00:43:10,030 --> 00:43:12,600
Speaker 1: I mean, this is the thing. This is the fucking

808
00:43:12,660 --> 00:43:15,560
Speaker 1: problem here. There are a lot of mistakes with AI.

809
00:43:15,580 --> 00:43:17,759
Speaker 1: I mean, it's like the self-driving cars or it's like,

810
00:43:17,780 --> 00:43:22,089
Speaker 1: you know, I watched the first half of the Musk documentary.

811
00:43:22,340 --> 00:43:24,930
Speaker 1: And in the first half of the Musk documentary, there's

812
00:43:25,130 --> 00:43:28,529
Speaker 1: a lot in there about how the self-driving mechanism on

813
00:43:28,550 --> 00:43:29,410
Speaker 1: the Tesla doesn't work.

814
00:43:29,570 --> 00:43:31,270
Speaker 3: Right? It's been very reported.

815
00:43:31,469 --> 00:43:34,940
Speaker 1: It doesn't work. People have died. They've written big checks

816
00:43:35,120 --> 00:43:37,580
Speaker 1: to these people who've lost their lives. And in fact,

817
00:43:37,660 --> 00:43:41,480
Speaker 1: the video, the advertisement where the guys, where it's being self-driven,

818
00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:45,190
Speaker 1: they had a mechanic in the trunk remotely controlling the car.

819
00:43:45,370 --> 00:43:49,150
Speaker 1: So it's like AI, you know, the technology may someday

820
00:43:49,210 --> 00:43:51,630
Speaker 1: be there, but it's not there today. And so I

821
00:43:51,890 --> 00:43:56,120
Speaker 1: Part of what's happening here is that you have them

822
00:43:56,280 --> 00:44:01,210
Speaker 1: using software that's incompetent by design, because remember, the larger

823
00:44:01,330 --> 00:44:04,750
Speaker 1: project here, the larger project of Trumpism is to make

824
00:44:04,870 --> 00:44:08,439
Speaker 1: the federal government fit, to make. Make it fail so

825
00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:11,859
Speaker 1: that people don't think the government works, so that we

826
00:44:11,900 --> 00:44:16,260
Speaker 1: can be done with the taxes and the social services

827
00:44:16,570 --> 00:44:20,549
Speaker 1: and the things that help people survive. And so this

828
00:44:20,690 --> 00:44:25,170
Speaker 1: is not about AI. This is about trying to make

829
00:44:25,250 --> 00:44:29,850
Speaker 1: the government not work. That's it for this episode of

830
00:44:29,950 --> 00:44:36,819
Speaker 1: Fast Politics. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, and Saturday

831
00:44:36,940 --> 00:44:40,259
Speaker 1: to hear the best minds in politics make sense of

832
00:44:40,800 --> 00:44:44,799
Speaker 1: all this chaos. If you enjoy this podcast, please send

833
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:48,430
Speaker 1: it to a friend and keep the conversation going. Thanks

834
00:44:48,530 --> 00:44:49,230
Speaker 1: for listening.