1 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:05,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of 2 00:00:05,360 --> 00:00:10,559 Speaker 1: My Heart Radio. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. 3 00:00:10,600 --> 00:00:14,240 Speaker 1: Listener Mail. My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Joe McCormick. 4 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:16,640 Speaker 1: And it's Monday, the day of the week that we 5 00:00:16,680 --> 00:00:21,360 Speaker 1: read back some of the messages that you've sent in recently, Rob, 6 00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 1: if you don't mind today, I think I'm going to 7 00:00:23,360 --> 00:00:26,960 Speaker 1: start off with a response. Wow, this was a quick turnaround. 8 00:00:27,000 --> 00:00:29,160 Speaker 1: This is a response. We already got to part one 9 00:00:29,200 --> 00:00:31,440 Speaker 1: of our series on The Seven Day Week, which ran 10 00:00:31,720 --> 00:00:40,720 Speaker 1: last Thursday. Rob, you cool if I do this one alright? 11 00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:44,199 Speaker 1: This is from Kennedy. Kennedy says, Hi, I just finished 12 00:00:44,280 --> 00:00:47,520 Speaker 1: listening to the part one episode of The Seven Day Week. 13 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:53,000 Speaker 1: I was intrigued because I have time space synesthesia, so 14 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:57,280 Speaker 1: I see time in the space around me, including weeks, months, 15 00:00:57,320 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 1: and years. If it hasn't already been done, this would 16 00:00:59,880 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 1: make an interesting podcast topic. I don't know. I don't 17 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:05,960 Speaker 1: know much about this. This sounds fascinating now. Also, while listening, 18 00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:08,959 Speaker 1: I kept hoping you would bring up menstruation as a 19 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:13,080 Speaker 1: biological or natural cause. For weeks or months, I saw 20 00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:16,480 Speaker 1: a post awhile ago hypothesizing that women may have been 21 00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 1: the first to track time in a month like pattern. 22 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:23,399 Speaker 1: Because of twenty eight day minstrel cycles, a period is 23 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:27,160 Speaker 1: also often five to seven days. Just wondering if you 24 00:01:27,200 --> 00:01:29,919 Speaker 1: looked into the influence of this on our current system 25 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:34,520 Speaker 1: of months and weeks. Thank you for the fantastic episode. Sincerely, Kennedy. Well, 26 00:01:34,560 --> 00:01:38,000 Speaker 1: thanks Kennedy. Yes, I think these are both really interesting ideas. 27 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:41,160 Speaker 1: In part, when we talked about one of the main 28 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:44,880 Speaker 1: functions of the week being as an organizing principle for 29 00:01:44,959 --> 00:01:47,440 Speaker 1: what the historian that we cited in that episode, David 30 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 1: Hankin calls stocktaking, but we were also referring to as 31 00:01:51,760 --> 00:01:56,720 Speaker 1: time conceptualization or mental time travel. Basically, the week plays 32 00:01:56,720 --> 00:02:00,360 Speaker 1: a role in helping us mentally organize events in the 33 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:04,240 Speaker 1: recent past in near future. And I think on this front, yeah, 34 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 1: it's it's totally worth remembering that as much as we 35 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:13,679 Speaker 1: all do some extent visualized time, some people really visualized time, 36 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 1: or really have even no choice but to visualize time, 37 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:20,920 Speaker 1: and in a very concrete and vivid way. I remember 38 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:24,240 Speaker 1: a while back having a conversation with with a family 39 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: member who was if I recall correctly, I think the 40 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,960 Speaker 1: way she was describing things was talking about having a 41 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:34,320 Speaker 1: form of something like time space synaesthesia, where they would 42 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:38,560 Speaker 1: they would vividly perceive time as a type of ribbon 43 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:42,560 Speaker 1: that rotates in a circle around them, and there was 44 00:02:42,840 --> 00:02:46,240 Speaker 1: some kind of visual cue making parts of that ribbon. Um, 45 00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:48,280 Speaker 1: I don't know, like marking them off in terms of 46 00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:52,040 Speaker 1: days or weeks or months. Interesting. Yeah, I mean this 47 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:54,480 Speaker 1: instantly makes me think, like, whatever is going on with 48 00:02:54,520 --> 00:03:00,000 Speaker 1: that that person's individual um uh, you know, synesthesia experience, 49 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:02,639 Speaker 1: Like how would it differ if they had grown up 50 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:08,519 Speaker 1: with a different perception of time, a different calendar system. Yeah, 51 00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:11,160 Speaker 1: But on the second question you raise about the origins 52 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:13,480 Speaker 1: of the week, and I guess this would not necessarily 53 00:03:13,480 --> 00:03:16,360 Speaker 1: be a strict seven day week, but some kind of 54 00:03:16,400 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 1: time organization unit on the order of like five to 55 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:22,680 Speaker 1: seven days or so on. The origins of that possibly 56 00:03:22,720 --> 00:03:26,800 Speaker 1: being linked to the human minstrel cycle. I don't know 57 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 1: if anybody has any direct evidence of that, and I 58 00:03:29,160 --> 00:03:31,360 Speaker 1: don't know what that would be. Maybe like I don't know, 59 00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:34,680 Speaker 1: written records from the ancient world from you know, Mesopotamia 60 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 1: or anywhere making this connection themselves to tying the earliest 61 00:03:39,640 --> 00:03:43,040 Speaker 1: concepts of weeks to the minstrel cycle. But it seems 62 00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 1: like inherently a very plausible biological basis for that kind 63 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:49,400 Speaker 1: of organizing principle. Um. Kind of on the same level 64 00:03:49,400 --> 00:03:52,920 Speaker 1: as like the the agricultural market cycle hypothesis. Right. You know, 65 00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:56,360 Speaker 1: there are some fairly universal human experiences that are going 66 00:03:56,400 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 1: to be happening in cycles on the order of you know, 67 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:04,440 Speaker 1: some group of days that subdivides the lunar month. Yeah. Yeah, 68 00:04:04,480 --> 00:04:06,760 Speaker 1: And and of course we do know that in different 69 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 1: cultures there would be rituals and practices associated with with 70 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:14,880 Speaker 1: Instrell cycles. So uh yeah, I initially thought the same thing. 71 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:16,720 Speaker 1: I thought, well, there have to be some papers out 72 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:20,400 Speaker 1: there that discussed this um that that at least consider 73 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:24,280 Speaker 1: this connection, uh, if not presents some sort of evidence 74 00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:27,200 Speaker 1: like we're discussing here. But I I really couldn't find 75 00:04:27,279 --> 00:04:30,080 Speaker 1: much out there. Uh. Not to say that my research 76 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:33,600 Speaker 1: skills are are perfect and above reproach, but if there was, 77 00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:36,640 Speaker 1: if there was something good out there, I missed it. Uh. 78 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:38,760 Speaker 1: And I would love to be corrected if if anyone 79 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:41,400 Speaker 1: out there has a paper or or in fact this 80 00:04:41,440 --> 00:04:44,960 Speaker 1: post that has mentioned I would love to read more. Well, yeah, 81 00:04:44,960 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 1: I guess anything you came across that was like a 82 00:04:47,720 --> 00:04:53,800 Speaker 1: biological reasoning that you were hypothesizing to underlie the week. Um, 83 00:04:53,839 --> 00:04:56,279 Speaker 1: it would be hard to establish a clear link. I 84 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:57,800 Speaker 1: mean I think that was also true when you were 85 00:04:57,800 --> 00:05:02,520 Speaker 1: looking at that paper paper in the journal uh Chronobiology International, 86 00:05:02,560 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 1: that was trying to find some kind of biological origin 87 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 1: for um, for the seven day week. I mean, whatever 88 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:09,920 Speaker 1: it is, you'd have a hard time showing like, yes, 89 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:12,360 Speaker 1: this is definitely the reason. But I think some things 90 00:05:12,920 --> 00:05:16,800 Speaker 1: seem at least prima facy plausible and yeah, I would 91 00:05:16,839 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 1: definitely say menstruation as one of them. Yeah, it's actually 92 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:23,840 Speaker 1: briefly mentioned. It's mentioned only once in that Rheinberg at 93 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:28,880 Speaker 1: All paper and Chronobiology. Uh. They write, quote, we wish 94 00:05:28,920 --> 00:05:32,559 Speaker 1: to point out the endogenous roughly thirty day minstrel rhythm 95 00:05:32,640 --> 00:05:36,720 Speaker 1: of women, which also converts survival rate, is integrated into 96 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:41,840 Speaker 1: the complex multiple period biological time structure. This raises the 97 00:05:41,920 --> 00:05:45,680 Speaker 1: question of whether the roughly seven day rhythms are in 98 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:50,320 Speaker 1: any way of survival value for the human or other species. 99 00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:55,200 Speaker 1: So they're thinking about it, but that's really all there 100 00:05:55,320 --> 00:05:57,719 Speaker 1: is about minstrel cycles in this particular paper. But again, 101 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:01,000 Speaker 1: if someone knows of some some more research writing contemplation 102 00:06:01,080 --> 00:06:05,159 Speaker 1: out there about this possible connection. Shoot it our way. 103 00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:07,800 Speaker 1: We'd love to read about it. But either way, Yeah, 104 00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:16,520 Speaker 1: strong idea, great email, Kennedy. Oh Rob, there was one 105 00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:18,599 Speaker 1: other h do you mind if I read this next 106 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:21,359 Speaker 1: message about lava boats is pretty short? Yeah, go for it. 107 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 1: So this is in response to the episode we did, 108 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:26,279 Speaker 1: I guess a couple of weeks ago now about lava 109 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:29,039 Speaker 1: boats in In sort of both ways, you could interpret that. 110 00:06:29,480 --> 00:06:32,000 Speaker 1: I talked for a long time about pumice rafts, you know, 111 00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:34,800 Speaker 1: these volcanic rocks that you know, floating on the surface 112 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:38,239 Speaker 1: of the ocean and make these vast, undulating parking lots 113 00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:40,600 Speaker 1: in the middle of the Pacific. But then we also 114 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:42,719 Speaker 1: talked about the idea of, well, could you sail a 115 00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:45,159 Speaker 1: boat on a on a flowing river of lava like 116 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:47,160 Speaker 1: you might see it one of the volcanoes in Hawaii. 117 00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:51,520 Speaker 1: And Zach had some a great point about the latter 118 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:54,560 Speaker 1: idea about trying to actually sail a boat on on 119 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:58,200 Speaker 1: a river of lava. So Zack says, Hey, Robert and Joe, 120 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:00,680 Speaker 1: I was thinking about the idea of riding a superheated 121 00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:04,240 Speaker 1: steel boat from lava into water. One thing that came 122 00:07:04,279 --> 00:07:08,320 Speaker 1: to mind was the Leaden frost effect. Depending on your 123 00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:11,800 Speaker 1: momentum when entering the water uh and style of boat 124 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 1: flat bottom or keeled, you could potentially be in for 125 00:07:14,760 --> 00:07:17,920 Speaker 1: a wild ride. Love the show. It sure helps keep 126 00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:20,560 Speaker 1: this trucker entertained. Thanks for all you guys and your 127 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:23,680 Speaker 1: team do Zach, Zach. This is a This is a 128 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:26,640 Speaker 1: great point. The leaden frost effect, for anybody out there 129 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:31,160 Speaker 1: who's not familiar is a is a really interesting physics 130 00:07:31,240 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 1: principle that essentially has a counterintuitive effect. So like, if 131 00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:40,280 Speaker 1: you heat up a pan and you dribble some water 132 00:07:40,400 --> 00:07:42,840 Speaker 1: into it. Uh, you know, the water the heat the 133 00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 1: heat from the bottom of the metal panel transfer into 134 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 1: the water and will start to boil. But if you 135 00:07:47,640 --> 00:07:51,120 Speaker 1: get the pan really hot, like ripping hot before you 136 00:07:51,200 --> 00:07:54,480 Speaker 1: dribble the water in, something totally different happens. Instead of 137 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:56,800 Speaker 1: it pooling on the bottom of the pan and then 138 00:07:56,920 --> 00:08:01,080 Speaker 1: boiling and then boiling off into steam, the droplets of 139 00:08:01,080 --> 00:08:05,120 Speaker 1: water will instead appear to float over the surface of 140 00:08:05,120 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 1: the pan and kind of skitter around madly. Uh. And 141 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 1: they actually, in this form take a longer time to 142 00:08:12,160 --> 00:08:14,080 Speaker 1: boil off than they do if the pan is at 143 00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 1: a lower temperature. And the reason for that is this 144 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:20,040 Speaker 1: principle known as the leading frost effect. It's where when 145 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 1: there's a huge temperature difference, the h the steam that 146 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 1: comes off of that you know, piece of that, that 147 00:08:26,600 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 1: little droplet of water creates an insulating layer. It's sort 148 00:08:30,200 --> 00:08:34,600 Speaker 1: of like a cushion of water vapor that's instantly vaporized. 149 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:37,560 Speaker 1: That makes it take longer for the heat to transfer 150 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:40,559 Speaker 1: into that droplet of water and essentially makes it float 151 00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:43,120 Speaker 1: over the surface of the pan. And you can imagine 152 00:08:43,160 --> 00:08:46,600 Speaker 1: a similar thing going on with any kind of superheated 153 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:50,240 Speaker 1: piece of metal coming into contact with water, maybe sort 154 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:53,200 Speaker 1: of like dancing around on a on a cushion of steam. 155 00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:55,840 Speaker 1: Oh wow, Yeah, I didn't really think about this in 156 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:59,880 Speaker 1: our initial discussion. Yeah that this this, this might make 157 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:08,160 Speaker 1: a really wild ride for sure. Yeah. All right. We 158 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:10,480 Speaker 1: have a response to a Vault episode here from Jim 159 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: in New Jersey. Uh, specifically our ketchup episode of Invention, 160 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:19,320 Speaker 1: which we recently re aired. Uh. Jim says, Robert and Joe, 161 00:09:19,400 --> 00:09:22,160 Speaker 1: there was a Hines processing plant in my hometown of 162 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:26,520 Speaker 1: south central Pennsylvania. A family friend worked there. He refused 163 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:29,200 Speaker 1: to eat Hinz Ketchup based on what he witnessed in 164 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:33,640 Speaker 1: the processing. Figuratively, he saw how the sausage was made, 165 00:09:33,679 --> 00:09:36,280 Speaker 1: but literally he saw how the Ketchup was made. But 166 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:38,800 Speaker 1: he would eat other brands of Ketchup. His family would 167 00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: tease him and ask, do you think they make Ketchup 168 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:43,760 Speaker 1: any differently? I didn't think about this. Is is Hins 169 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 1: gonna come after us with their lawyers for reading this 170 00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:52,560 Speaker 1: or whatever? I like Hines Ketchup. There you go, unpaid endorsement. Yeah, anyway, 171 00:09:52,559 --> 00:09:55,360 Speaker 1: he continues. You ended your invention of of the Ketchup 172 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:58,839 Speaker 1: episode by asking if you had any listeners who had 173 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:01,960 Speaker 1: never eaten ketch Up. I can't be that listener, but 174 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:04,680 Speaker 1: I know one person whom I can guarantee never tasted 175 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 1: catch Up. My father. My dad was an extremely picky eater. 176 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:10,960 Speaker 1: He wouldn't eat any foods to contain tomatoes in any form. 177 00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:14,520 Speaker 1: No catch up, spaghetti and sauce, pizza, sliced tomatoes, etcetera. 178 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:17,960 Speaker 1: He would eat spaghetti with melted butter on it. Tomatoes 179 00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 1: was only one of his forbidden foods, but it was 180 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 1: probably the one that cast the widest net. Unfortunately, Dad 181 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:27,360 Speaker 1: died years ago, so I can't follow up with him 182 00:10:27,400 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 1: about this due to his tomato aversion. I never tasted 183 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 1: pizza until age fifteen, when on the way home from 184 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:37,000 Speaker 1: a Saturday school trip, the bus stopped at Pizza Hut 185 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:40,960 Speaker 1: for dinner. After one taste, I practically moaned, what is 186 00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:45,319 Speaker 1: this food of the gods? Jim and New Jersey? Oh wow, Jim. Well, 187 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:48,319 Speaker 1: so I can sort of relate because I never went 188 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:51,560 Speaker 1: that far. Like, I always liked pizza and stuff, but um, 189 00:10:51,720 --> 00:10:55,439 Speaker 1: unless it was in a highly sort of processed and 190 00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:59,119 Speaker 1: sort of hidden form, actually did not much like tomatoes 191 00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:01,480 Speaker 1: when I was a little kid. Uh. There there were 192 00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:03,680 Speaker 1: weird exceptions though, I mean I did like some things 193 00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:06,040 Speaker 1: with tomatoes in them, but like most of the time, 194 00:11:06,160 --> 00:11:09,200 Speaker 1: if if there were visible chunks of tomato and something 195 00:11:09,240 --> 00:11:11,679 Speaker 1: I did not like it, did not want it. And 196 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 1: I don't know what changed. I mean, now tomatoes are 197 00:11:14,160 --> 00:11:16,880 Speaker 1: one of my favorite foods. But but yeah, as a kid, 198 00:11:17,000 --> 00:11:19,800 Speaker 1: I remember being grossed out. Yeah, I don't remember being 199 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:22,840 Speaker 1: super into just like raw tomatoes when I was a 200 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:25,959 Speaker 1: little kid. My son, however, as always eating them. He's 201 00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:27,560 Speaker 1: a He's a much better eater than I was at 202 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:31,520 Speaker 1: his green up growing up, Um, like a pretty early 203 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:33,240 Speaker 1: age you would pick up a tomato and just eat 204 00:11:33,320 --> 00:11:36,720 Speaker 1: like an apple. So yeah, no problem there. But you know, 205 00:11:36,800 --> 00:11:38,560 Speaker 1: if you're not in you know, even if you're not 206 00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:42,040 Speaker 1: into tomato based substances or for some reason you can't 207 00:11:42,040 --> 00:11:45,439 Speaker 1: have tomato based foods, you can certainly still have pizza. 208 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:47,160 Speaker 1: You can get a white pizza, you can have like 209 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:50,880 Speaker 1: a pesto based pizza. Um. And I would agree that 210 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:55,680 Speaker 1: the pizza not a controversial opinion here is pretty great. Uh. 211 00:11:55,920 --> 00:11:57,920 Speaker 1: And I would expand that to to when I say 212 00:11:57,920 --> 00:12:00,839 Speaker 1: pizza did not just mean like literal pizza, and also 213 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:04,240 Speaker 1: some of the sort of turf wars between like one 214 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:08,359 Speaker 1: pizza tradition in another. But if you just take in 215 00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:13,360 Speaker 1: into account like all flat bread based foods, um, it's 216 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:16,360 Speaker 1: it's a perfect formula. You know. Actually thinking about food 217 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 1: versions of this type though it's making me wonder, like 218 00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:22,360 Speaker 1: what is the psychological basis of food aversion? Like how 219 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:25,080 Speaker 1: is a food you don't like represented in the brain? 220 00:12:25,120 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 1: Because it just remembering my childhood, so there were so 221 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:30,240 Speaker 1: many things I didn't want to eat because I thought 222 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:33,840 Speaker 1: I didn't like tomatoes, but like I loved tomato salsa, 223 00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:37,440 Speaker 1: and I would eat pizza that had tomato sauce on. 224 00:12:37,480 --> 00:12:40,960 Speaker 1: It was like tomato worked as a sauce or something 225 00:12:41,080 --> 00:12:43,800 Speaker 1: like if it was in liquid form, But I didn't 226 00:12:43,800 --> 00:12:47,520 Speaker 1: want chunks of tomato. I think I don't know why 227 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:49,920 Speaker 1: that would be, like what's happening in my little kid 228 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:53,040 Speaker 1: brain to cause me to feel like that. I mean, 229 00:12:53,040 --> 00:12:55,280 Speaker 1: it's a pretty complex issue. I know there've been some 230 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:57,480 Speaker 1: some papers written on this. I know some of it 231 00:12:57,559 --> 00:13:01,160 Speaker 1: comes down to two textures and uh, and I'm not 232 00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:05,520 Speaker 1: sure in all cases what the exact principle is there. 233 00:13:05,559 --> 00:13:08,120 Speaker 1: I mean, sometimes it's something to do with the path 234 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:11,920 Speaker 1: the actual like physical palate of the mouth. I've also 235 00:13:12,040 --> 00:13:13,840 Speaker 1: read that, of course, when you're getting into things like 236 00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:17,240 Speaker 1: spices and more complex flavors. Uh. You know, part of that, 237 00:13:17,280 --> 00:13:21,960 Speaker 1: of course is it's literally a developed taste. But in 238 00:13:22,040 --> 00:13:24,760 Speaker 1: other cases, I think there's a strong argument that like 239 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:28,800 Speaker 1: a smile child could not survive a dose of a 240 00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:32,280 Speaker 1: of a poison that might otherwise be okay in an 241 00:13:32,320 --> 00:13:35,439 Speaker 1: adults body, and therefore there they have to be more 242 00:13:35,480 --> 00:13:39,560 Speaker 1: selective in what they will actually tolerate. Oh interesting, Yeah, 243 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:43,120 Speaker 1: lower lower body mass means that you you have to 244 00:13:43,160 --> 00:13:46,520 Speaker 1: protect yourself more with your mouth. Yeah. Now, I haven't 245 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:48,839 Speaker 1: actually looked at at the research on that, so I 246 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:51,960 Speaker 1: don't know if that's a popular opinion right now or 247 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,679 Speaker 1: you know, popular hypothesis, or if they're uh, you know, 248 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:57,079 Speaker 1: it's the kind of thing that we have to perhaps 249 00:13:57,080 --> 00:14:00,319 Speaker 1: come back and discuss in greater detail, but very I mean, 250 00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:01,960 Speaker 1: you do have kids, little kids that are all in 251 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 1: on spice, but a lot of kids seem to be, 252 00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 1: you know, kind of you have to ease into it. 253 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:17,520 Speaker 1: You have to develop that spice taste over time. All right. 254 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:21,200 Speaker 1: This next message was in response to the Moses effect. 255 00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:23,800 Speaker 1: This is from Shannon. If you didn't catch that recent 256 00:14:23,880 --> 00:14:27,280 Speaker 1: Vault episode. The Moses effect, again, is a phenomenon that 257 00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:30,040 Speaker 1: falls under the category of knowledge neglect, where if you 258 00:14:30,080 --> 00:14:32,560 Speaker 1: ask somebody how many of each type of animal did 259 00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:35,520 Speaker 1: Moses take onto the arc, most people will say too 260 00:14:35,840 --> 00:14:38,160 Speaker 1: even though they know that it was in the story, 261 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:40,360 Speaker 1: it was Noah and not Moses. So you just like 262 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 1: ignore that part of the question. It just like doesn't 263 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:47,200 Speaker 1: even register in your mind. Um so, so Shannon says, Hi, guys, 264 00:14:47,560 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 1: I don't know if you explicitly mentioned it, but it 265 00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:52,840 Speaker 1: seems to me that the Moses effect is dramatically lowered 266 00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:57,320 Speaker 1: when a foreign language is involved. I speak German, and 267 00:14:57,400 --> 00:15:01,040 Speaker 1: if I were to translate a question to or from English, 268 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:03,960 Speaker 1: I know that I would detect the trickery much more 269 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:07,040 Speaker 1: quickly than if I simply answered when I was more 270 00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:09,560 Speaker 1: fluent in German, I might have been more prone to 271 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:12,640 Speaker 1: fall for the deception. I assume the same is true 272 00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:15,440 Speaker 1: for any non native English speaker, that they would notice 273 00:15:15,480 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 1: that Moses is the incorrect actor in the question. I 274 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:21,920 Speaker 1: think the implication of this is that the trickery in 275 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 1: the Moses illusion relies on fluency, and the trickster quote 276 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:29,640 Speaker 1: surfs the wave of that fluency to get past our 277 00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 1: usual breakers. Thanks for all you do, Shannon, Uh yeah, 278 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:36,120 Speaker 1: I'd say on his face that that totally makes sense 279 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:39,040 Speaker 1: to me. In fact, it's been a while since we 280 00:15:39,080 --> 00:15:40,760 Speaker 1: did that episode, so I don't remember for sure. But 281 00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 1: I think some of the studies that looked at the 282 00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:47,720 Speaker 1: Moses effect looked into whether altering processing fluency, like doing 283 00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:50,840 Speaker 1: something to make it harder to understand the question or 284 00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:54,680 Speaker 1: make it go slower as you absorb it, would increase 285 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:58,240 Speaker 1: people's chance of noticing it. But again, I don't remember. 286 00:15:58,280 --> 00:16:05,480 Speaker 1: It's been a bit alright. As some of you know, 287 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:09,080 Speaker 1: we have a discord, uh message board? Is that what 288 00:16:09,160 --> 00:16:11,360 Speaker 1: you call it? Discord? We have a discord. I guess 289 00:16:11,400 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 1: it's maybe the way of saying it. I've still never 290 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:17,080 Speaker 1: been there. Yeah, I I poke around in there, and 291 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:21,280 Speaker 1: there's a a number of users in there. It's it's 292 00:16:21,400 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 1: very chill. If you were interested in joining the discord, 293 00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:26,280 Speaker 1: just shoot us an email. You doing the email address 294 00:16:26,280 --> 00:16:28,480 Speaker 1: at the end of this episode, and I'll shoot you 295 00:16:28,520 --> 00:16:31,400 Speaker 1: back the invite code UM, because I don't think there's 296 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:34,240 Speaker 1: a way to just automatically point you to it. But anyway, 297 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:36,960 Speaker 1: we heard from a listener by the name of ev 298 00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:41,120 Speaker 1: EVI writes in and says the following. From the episode 299 00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:43,960 Speaker 1: Music and Memory, Rob mentions a song in the beginning 300 00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 1: uh m nine. This is by Boards of Canada from 301 00:16:47,240 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 1: a Few Old Tunes, Volume one. They include a link 302 00:16:51,720 --> 00:16:55,360 Speaker 1: to both the discogs page about it discogs dot com 303 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:59,800 Speaker 1: of course, tremendous resource anytime you're you're researching albums and 304 00:17:00,040 --> 00:17:04,359 Speaker 1: artists and in particular releases and so forth. And they 305 00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:08,199 Speaker 1: also include um YouTube clip uh and they say this 306 00:17:08,240 --> 00:17:12,080 Speaker 1: song reminded me of music featured in the computer animated 307 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:17,440 Speaker 1: movie The Mind's I. The similarities in the music were 308 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:19,720 Speaker 1: not as close as I originally thought, but I figured 309 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:22,360 Speaker 1: you all might enjoy this classic and maybe someone will 310 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:24,439 Speaker 1: hear the song M nine and spark a memory of 311 00:17:24,520 --> 00:17:28,159 Speaker 1: something else that gets closer. And for your auditory and 312 00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:31,560 Speaker 1: visual pleasure, here's the sequel, Beyond the Mind's Eye, and 313 00:17:31,560 --> 00:17:35,000 Speaker 1: they include a link to that as well. Um, Joe, 314 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:39,360 Speaker 1: do you remember The Mind's I? Uh, not by title alone. 315 00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:41,760 Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe if I watched it. So this 316 00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:46,320 Speaker 1: was especially the first one i've I've kind of finally remember, 317 00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:48,320 Speaker 1: because there were a lot of TV ads for it 318 00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:50,760 Speaker 1: you could you could send off to get a copy 319 00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:55,480 Speaker 1: of this. It was a like a VHS of all 320 00:17:55,520 --> 00:17:59,439 Speaker 1: of this just cutting edge computer animation stuff that I 321 00:17:59,480 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 1: don't know. I haven't I haven't rewatched all of it, 322 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:05,400 Speaker 1: but some of it would probably come off a bit 323 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:09,040 Speaker 1: rough by today's standards for sure, But you know, it's 324 00:18:09,119 --> 00:18:12,000 Speaker 1: very like dreamy and kind of new a G and 325 00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:17,600 Speaker 1: futuristic and I had to look it up one. James 326 00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:20,080 Speaker 1: Reynolds did the music for the first one. I think 327 00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:22,920 Speaker 1: some different artists were involved in music for the subsequent releases, 328 00:18:23,840 --> 00:18:27,200 Speaker 1: but yeah, this one, this one was advertised all over 329 00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 1: the place, and I think I may be rented it 330 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:32,439 Speaker 1: from a VHS store at some point. So this was 331 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:38,720 Speaker 1: like a mail order computer animation clip show. Yeah. Yeah, 332 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:40,520 Speaker 1: there's like an eight hundred number you could call and 333 00:18:40,560 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 1: you could order your own copy of The Mind's Eye. 334 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:45,320 Speaker 1: And uh. I remember at the time it was like 335 00:18:45,359 --> 00:18:47,480 Speaker 1: you would you would see these commercials and you're like, wow, 336 00:18:47,520 --> 00:18:50,280 Speaker 1: the future is here. Look at this. It's like pure 337 00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:53,800 Speaker 1: moods for the eyes. Oh yeah, I mean I would. 338 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:56,480 Speaker 1: I would very much classify in the same category. Have 339 00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:59,800 Speaker 1: pure moods is another one of those that is the 340 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:03,639 Speaker 1: Your Moods was a purely a musical release, of course, 341 00:19:04,119 --> 00:19:06,879 Speaker 1: but there were a lot of TV ads for it, 342 00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:08,800 Speaker 1: and it had had some great tracks on it. I 343 00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:12,560 Speaker 1: still think about Pyramids at least once a month. Wait, 344 00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:15,280 Speaker 1: my memory can't be right because I'm remembering. It had 345 00:19:15,359 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 1: like the Exorcist theme and the theme from the X Files, 346 00:19:20,080 --> 00:19:23,680 Speaker 1: but also India and stuff. It was pretty great. Great. 347 00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:26,840 Speaker 1: I definitely had a copy together. Yeah, and it I 348 00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:28,760 Speaker 1: think it actually it introduced me to a number of 349 00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:34,639 Speaker 1: these artists. Yeah, you had Enigma, Anya um uh. A 350 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:39,960 Speaker 1: number of big evangelist is on there, Micah um oldfield In, 351 00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:44,480 Speaker 1: Neil Morriconi, the Orb, Brian Eno. You also got a 352 00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:47,840 Speaker 1: little Kinny g in there. But yeah, a lot of 353 00:19:48,080 --> 00:19:50,600 Speaker 1: big names and sort of the like the New Age 354 00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:56,119 Speaker 1: and electronic uh uh, you know world U Tubular Bells 355 00:19:56,200 --> 00:19:59,000 Speaker 1: part one being the Exorcist theme song. See now I 356 00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:00,840 Speaker 1: want to listen to it. Can practically I can hear 357 00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:04,040 Speaker 1: that Enigma song returned to Innocence. I just pounding through 358 00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:06,959 Speaker 1: my head. Now, wow, what a strange idea, But like, 359 00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:08,320 Speaker 1: I don't know, I just it was one of those 360 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 1: things you see it on TV as a kid, You're 361 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:13,439 Speaker 1: just like, Okay, this is what culture is. Yeah, this 362 00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:21,720 Speaker 1: this is the world I was born into. Let's see, Rob, 363 00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:23,440 Speaker 1: I'm taking a look at some of these other messages 364 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:26,920 Speaker 1: you brought in from the discord, since I haven't seen 365 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:29,440 Speaker 1: these before. Oh we have one from Robin tying back 366 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:33,480 Speaker 1: to Jim's message about the about the Ketchup Vault episode. 367 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:36,320 Speaker 1: Robin says, with regards to the Ketchup episode, if you 368 00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:39,359 Speaker 1: folks have not yet tried kim chi on your hot 369 00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:43,359 Speaker 1: dog type food of choice, I will highly recommend it. Uh, well, 370 00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:45,760 Speaker 1: Robin would go right along with that, because obviously, you know, 371 00:20:45,800 --> 00:20:48,800 Speaker 1: a cabbage type vegetable, especially in some sort of fermented 372 00:20:48,960 --> 00:20:51,359 Speaker 1: or dressed form, works well on a hot dog, and 373 00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:55,040 Speaker 1: some people put cole slaw on there or Sauer kraut. Yeah, 374 00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:57,520 Speaker 1: kimchi works great as well. But then Robin goes on 375 00:20:57,560 --> 00:21:01,639 Speaker 1: to say, um may I also recommend squigging some q 376 00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:05,040 Speaker 1: P Japanese style mayo on there, in keeping with Joe's 377 00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:09,639 Speaker 1: recommended go chu jong and mayo dipping sauce. Um. I 378 00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:13,680 Speaker 1: don't think I've ever tried exactly that QP spelled k 379 00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:16,760 Speaker 1: e w P i e in in English is a 380 00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:20,479 Speaker 1: I don't know how exactly it's different than just regular 381 00:21:20,520 --> 00:21:23,399 Speaker 1: American mayonnaise, but but there there's something different about it, 382 00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:26,639 Speaker 1: has a different kind of richness or something. The bottle 383 00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:30,120 Speaker 1: looks very cute too, like I wanted to squeeze it. 384 00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:32,560 Speaker 1: But but I don't think I've ever actually had it myself. 385 00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:35,520 Speaker 1: I always end up using um mayo or vegan mayo 386 00:21:35,720 --> 00:21:38,679 Speaker 1: just from the grocery store. Um, but I want to 387 00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:42,480 Speaker 1: try it. I'm actually having kim chi with mayo on 388 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:46,560 Speaker 1: veggie dogs for dinner. Tonight. Wow, I'm excited. Well, what 389 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:50,040 Speaker 1: a coincidence. So I don't think I would normally, under 390 00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:54,240 Speaker 1: regular circumstances just go with a type of mayonnaise on 391 00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:56,560 Speaker 1: a hot dog, but yeah, I can go well when 392 00:21:56,640 --> 00:21:59,840 Speaker 1: paired with other types of condiments like sharper condiments or 393 00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:03,280 Speaker 1: something that secidic, like like kim chi or something. Um. 394 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:07,440 Speaker 1: I remember many many years ago when I went to Iceland. 395 00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:11,640 Speaker 1: There they have a special way of dressing their pilcer 396 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:14,000 Speaker 1: the hot dogs there, like you would get it basically 397 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:18,239 Speaker 1: any any gas station there. That's like, uh, there's like 398 00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:20,359 Speaker 1: I don't remember, like four or five condiments that go 399 00:22:20,359 --> 00:22:23,000 Speaker 1: on everything. It includes like some onions and some kind 400 00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:26,199 Speaker 1: of sharper kind of sweet and sour sauce, and then 401 00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:29,960 Speaker 1: I think also some type of mayonnaisy creamy sauce. It 402 00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:32,840 Speaker 1: sounds good. It sounds very good. Anyway, Thank you, Robin. 403 00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:35,120 Speaker 1: All right, Well, it looks like we're at a time 404 00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:37,760 Speaker 1: we had we had some weird house listener man we 405 00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:40,720 Speaker 1: wanted to read. We're gonna save that for next time. Uh, 406 00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:42,920 Speaker 1: and when is next time? Well, it's gonna be next Monday. 407 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:44,840 Speaker 1: That's when we do listener mail and the stuff to 408 00:22:44,840 --> 00:22:46,920 Speaker 1: Blow Your Mind podcast feed We do our core episodes 409 00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:50,680 Speaker 1: on two season Thursdays, we do a short form artifact 410 00:22:50,800 --> 00:22:54,359 Speaker 1: or monster fact on Wednesdays, and then on Friday, that 411 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:56,600 Speaker 1: is time for Weird House Cinema. That's when we set 412 00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:00,159 Speaker 1: aside most serious matters and we just discuss a strange film. 413 00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:03,359 Speaker 1: Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer Seth 414 00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:05,800 Speaker 1: Nicholas Johnson. If you would like to get in touch 415 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:08,120 Speaker 1: with us with feedback on this episode or any other, 416 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:10,119 Speaker 1: to suggest a topic for the future, or just to 417 00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:13,000 Speaker 1: say hello, you can email us at contact at stuff 418 00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:22,719 Speaker 1: to Blow your Mind dot com. Stuff to Blow Your 419 00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:25,160 Speaker 1: Mind is a production of I Heart Radio. For more 420 00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:27,760 Speaker 1: podcasts my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, 421 00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:30,679 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.