Speaker 1: And now move the Sticks with Daniel Jeremiah and Bucky Brooks.
Speaker 2: What's up, everybody, Welcome to move the sticks, DJ, Bucky Rhett.
Speaker 2: I feel like we were all just together because we
Speaker 2: were we were last.
Speaker 3: Night watching the watching the Super Bowl. I'm gonna go ahead, Buck.
Speaker 4: I felt bad because I was walking out of the building.
Speaker 5: I just read at the desk, just kind of hanging out,
Speaker 5: like like when when they.
Speaker 6: Just sitting there there.
Speaker 7: You know, I was doing my best Chris Rose impression
Speaker 7: for the the re air of our NFL Game Day Final,
Speaker 7: which you know is done live from New Orleans. So
Speaker 7: those guys shut the Superdome down. And when that gets
Speaker 7: shut down, then I pop up and you hear my
Speaker 7: voice every now and then on the re air of
Speaker 7: NFL Game Day Finals. So I think I get a
Speaker 7: I got a credit for that when it wins an Emmy.
Speaker 3: So yeah, rightly, so rightfully.
Speaker 4: So.
Speaker 2: By the way, it's time for the lead block, presented
Speaker 2: by Team Mobile for Business. Football needs a network willing
Speaker 2: to go the extra yard. So do you go further
Speaker 2: with T Mobile for Business, guys, I'm going open, I'm
Speaker 2: going open floor here. We got a chance to watch
Speaker 2: the game together discuss the game. But Buck, I'm curious,
Speaker 2: now we've had a night to kind of sleep on
Speaker 2: it and digest it, what stands out to you the most.
Speaker 5: The thing that sends out is just telling over everything
Speaker 5: just as we're debating the two teams leading up to
Speaker 5: the thing. I think the back to back champion thing,
Speaker 5: the three peat thing, the sixteen or seventeen one score
Speaker 5: games and a row thing made everyone scared.
Speaker 4: To go against the Kan City Chiefs.
Speaker 5: But when you really looked at this and if you
Speaker 5: did a tell of the tape, it was decidedly in
Speaker 5: the eagles favor.
Speaker 4: And last night we were.
Speaker 5: Talking, I said, it kind of reminded me of when
Speaker 5: Mike Tyson got knocked out by Buster Douglasy was fumbling
Speaker 5: around for his mouthpiece, and I'm gonna go even farther
Speaker 5: with that analogy. It reminded me of Mike Tyson taken
Speaker 5: on the event to Holy Field when he bit his ear.
Speaker 5: I felt like we saw the Kan City Chiefs act
Speaker 5: out of character because very early in the game they
Speaker 5: were over one filmed by the talent disparity between their
Speaker 5: team and the Eagles, and I think it played into
Speaker 5: the way that they played.
Speaker 4: We've never seen the Kansa the Chiefs look like.
Speaker 3: That, well once once once we have and Tampa Bay Buccaneers.
Speaker 7: And that's what this that's what this felt like. This
Speaker 7: felt like a team that did not have answers for
Speaker 7: a more talented defensive front. I mean, you know they
Speaker 7: I think in the second half we saw him try
Speaker 7: to kind of chip a little bit more and a
Speaker 7: couple of times actually ended up working against them, you know,
Speaker 7: chip the edge into the center, Mahome steps up and
Speaker 7: banging the interior. I mean, it was like anything that
Speaker 7: they tried, you know. That's what it also felt like too.
Speaker 7: It was like, you know, it's like it's you know,
Speaker 7: like trying to run up you know, you know, run
Speaker 7: up a hill that's got water pouring down it.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 7: It was just like just kind of fighting against it
Speaker 7: everywhere everything they did. You know, even though like we
Speaker 7: talked about it at the at our halftime show, you know,
Speaker 7: like DeAndre Hopkins like it's a shot to put them
Speaker 7: in fueld goal range to get some kind of positivity
Speaker 7: before the end of the half, and guy with the
Speaker 7: most sure hands maybe in the.
Speaker 6: League over the course of his career, loses.
Speaker 7: It, you know, just drops it, and you know that
Speaker 7: again that adds to kind of the building frustration that
Speaker 7: they go into the half the half with. But I
Speaker 7: think ultimately DJ with this comes down to and then
Speaker 7: for the purposes of what we do here, just extreme
Speaker 7: roster construction in terms of developing and committing to the
Speaker 7: defensive front. And that's really what showed up in a
Speaker 7: large way. I mean you go down through the line. Mean,
Speaker 7: you got three first round picks, which you know is
Speaker 7: pretty dang good, right, Jordan Davis, Jalen Carter, Nolan Smith.
Speaker 7: The later two obviously the ones that really showed up,
Speaker 7: Brandon Lliams, well, Brandy Graham right of course another one
Speaker 7: sure as part of the rotation, and then Milton Williams,
Speaker 7: Moro Ojamo, You've got Jylex Hunt, who was you know,
Speaker 7: like a firecracker coming off the edge, and this one
Speaker 7: as a rookie you're throwing Josh Sweaten there as a
Speaker 7: fourth round pick.
Speaker 6: And it's just over the course of the last five.
Speaker 7: Years, they've just been pounding that dedication to upgrading and
Speaker 7: continuing to fortify that front. And I think that's one
Speaker 7: of my favorite things when we get to the draft
Speaker 7: is when you see teams you know, go in there
Speaker 7: and continue to try to upgrade a position that is
Speaker 7: already a perceived strength, right, because that's what allows you
Speaker 7: to have this kind of depth and talent when you
Speaker 7: get into big games like this.
Speaker 3: Oh, I want to get to that point.
Speaker 2: Because Jack, our buddy Jack Android, who does great research,
Speaker 2: he had posted this. So think about the twenty four Eagles.
Speaker 2: They lost a Hall of Fame center in Kelsey, six
Speaker 2: time Pro Bowl defensive tackle in Fletcher Cox, their sack
Speaker 2: leader in twenty two and twenty three, and Hassan Reddick.
Speaker 2: They and he didn't write this, but they even missed
Speaker 2: on Bryce Huff who they paid, and they still had
Speaker 2: an abundance of riches of all the guys that you
Speaker 2: just mentioned there. So it's never a problem solved, move
Speaker 2: on to something else. It is a they are watering
Speaker 2: that plant every single year.
Speaker 3: Buck.
Speaker 2: It is pass rush as offensive line, and they might
Speaker 2: have some other needs, maybe we need to maybe we
Speaker 2: need some bushes over it, but you know what, we're
Speaker 2: gonna water these We're gonna water these ones every single year.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: And it's not only that, like they're aggressive in everything
Speaker 5: that they do because as much as we've talked about
Speaker 5: the last day and a half about their offensive and
Speaker 5: defensive lines, they've also made bold moves when it came
Speaker 5: to upgrading the playmakers that they wanted.
Speaker 4: Uh. You saw the trade that they made to acquire
Speaker 4: A J. Brown.
Speaker 5: They doubled down by making sure they had an elite
Speaker 5: receiver that they drafted early in the draft. And DeVante
Speaker 5: Smith you think about now, and Quinnan Mitchell first round cornerback.
Speaker 4: They double up in the second round.
Speaker 2: It feels like they've got first and second und players
Speaker 2: at every position everywhere.
Speaker 5: They realized what they lost when Chelsea Gardner Johnson departed,
Speaker 5: So what they do They bring him back and pay him.
Speaker 5: This is a team that I would say for all
Speaker 5: of this stuff we talk about, Uh, their bold moved
Speaker 5: whatever is, they quickly acknowledge their mistakes and they quickly
Speaker 5: worked to repair them.
Speaker 7: Let's talk for a moment though, about risk tolerance too,
Speaker 7: because that's a part of this equation as well. Right,
Speaker 7: you don't get Jalen Carter where they got Jalen Carter.
Speaker 7: You know, if you aren't taking into account the entirety
Speaker 7: of the player profile, which.
Speaker 6: Is everyone knows had some significant things happen off the.
Speaker 7: Field with the car situation, but they're able to get
Speaker 7: comfortable enough with it and with the player, and they
Speaker 7: bring in.
Speaker 6: A support structure to help the player.
Speaker 7: I mean, like it wasn't the same type of risk
Speaker 7: with with Nolan Smith, but obviously enough for a talented
Speaker 7: player like that to slip to him at the back
Speaker 7: end of the first round. There was some risk there.
Speaker 7: I mean ended up taking to Kobe Dean in the
Speaker 7: third round. I would argue at that point, it's not
Speaker 7: a risk. Is a really good player they ended up
Speaker 7: getting in the third round because other teams weren't willing
Speaker 7: to I think that that part of it too, is
Speaker 7: kind of intriguing to see play out on this stage.
Speaker 2: Well let's let's take those individually. Okay, Yeah, So Jalen
Speaker 2: Carter had off the field issues. If you watch j
Speaker 2: Carter's tape, he played with passion, energy, fire like and
Speaker 2: you talk to people and do your background on him. Yes,
Speaker 2: needs to grow up. There's some maturity stuff up. This
Speaker 2: guy loves football like he is on the football field,
Speaker 2: you'll see him. I remember a play I think it
Speaker 2: was against Kentucky where he's chasing a play, you know,
Speaker 2: thirty forty yards downfield. So he has some off the
Speaker 2: field issues, but he loves football. Nolan Smith didn't have production.
Speaker 2: Everybody was panicked, didn't have sack production. Well, if you
Speaker 2: look at that situation, start, first of all, he loves football.
Speaker 2: This guy plays with energy and passion. He's in a
Speaker 2: rotation with the best defense in football where they blow
Speaker 2: everybody out. So you're in a rotation, you're only gonna
Speaker 2: play half the game anyways, and you're sharing snaps, your
Speaker 2: production is not going to be there. You can look
Speaker 2: at the whole picture here and see Nakobe Dean. He's undersized,
Speaker 2: you know he's undersized. Well, guess what. He loves football again,
Speaker 2: passionate leader and it ended up being Look, the size
Speaker 2: issue got him this year. Maybe you could say that contributed,
Speaker 2: maybe it didn't to his injury. When he was playing,
Speaker 2: he was playing lights out. They have collected all these guys,
Speaker 2: Buck that are they are football character Like there's we
Speaker 2: talk about all the time. There's personal character and there's
Speaker 2: football character football character wise on the field. Those guys
Speaker 2: that I remember having this discussion, you know, I won't
Speaker 2: mention the player, but as a player is going to
Speaker 2: go on to be a Hall of Famer.
Speaker 3: And that was.
Speaker 2: Somebody had told me. A coach of his had said, look,
Speaker 2: he's made mistakes. He you know, don't don't. I don't
Speaker 2: doubt it for a second. But the threat of having
Speaker 2: football taken away from him, you can mean he won't
Speaker 2: be able to live without football. He loves football so
Speaker 2: much that I think that will correct some of the
Speaker 2: behavioral stuff that he struggled with.
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, it's It's funny because a lot of us
Speaker 5: always talk about, like, hey man, you want guys that
Speaker 5: love it, that obsess over it.
Speaker 4: They're committed and not just interested in the sport.
Speaker 5: And when you talk about all of those guys, and
Speaker 5: I've heard Syrian about it, I've heard other coaches talk
Speaker 5: about it, like to play for us, they have to
Speaker 5: love ball because what we're going to ask them to do,
Speaker 5: you have to love it or you will fully embrace
Speaker 5: all of the things that they're gonna ask you to do.
Speaker 4: I told DJ read this. You may have been out
Speaker 4: of the room.
Speaker 5: I talked about watching the Eagles in pregame, and I
Speaker 5: remember I was working with the Jags and I remember
Speaker 5: coming to one of my colleagues like look at the difference, Like, look,
Speaker 5: they're having a practice in pregame with the development of
Speaker 5: the practice squad and the young guys, and they are
Speaker 5: going when I mean they're coming off the field fully
Speaker 5: lathered up. I was like wow on a Sunday. And
Speaker 5: so what it told me is they're no Burger eaters
Speaker 5: on that team, meaning guys that get on the trip
Speaker 5: and just eat all the snacks and they're hanging out
Speaker 5: on the sideline.
Speaker 6: They're gonna work.
Speaker 4: Yeah, everybody has to work.
Speaker 5: And I think neary Nick Sirianne for all the things
Speaker 5: that people have kind of taken them to task for
Speaker 5: in terms of his personality and all those things, I
Speaker 5: believe his pedigree is all over this Eagles team meaning
Speaker 5: Mountain Union, three time national champion, played under a great
Speaker 5: coach who has a winning tradition. You think about all
Speaker 5: the things that he learned along the way, all of
Speaker 5: that comes out. Rick Patino talked about how Nick Siriani
Speaker 5: in Indianapolis because Nick wanted to know about how to
Speaker 5: build a culture a winning environment. How he's always asking
Speaker 5: those questions. I think the way that you see this
Speaker 5: team play, it is a parent that they have high
Speaker 5: standards and they get guys who really relish those standards
Speaker 5: and expectations.
Speaker 6: I think that's really interesting.
Speaker 7: The other part of this is, you know, we talk
Speaker 7: about the players, but I think, you know, we also
Speaker 7: need to look at the power of position coaches in
Speaker 7: this in this equation too. With the Philadelphia Eagles, you know,
Speaker 7: you talk about bringing a group together and you might
Speaker 7: be talking about two of the best in the league.
Speaker 7: Talking about Clint Hurt who came over in twenty three
Speaker 7: to run the defensive line senior defensive assistant and then
Speaker 7: obvious Stoutland University with with coach Jeff Stoutland has has
Speaker 7: you know, resurrected Makai Becton's career, has developed Jordan Mylotta
Speaker 7: into a premier left tackle. You're talking about those interior
Speaker 7: guys being a cohesive unit as well, with with Dickerson
Speaker 7: and Cam Jurgen stepping in for a legend in Jason
Speaker 7: Kelcey and win in a flip in Super Bowl in
Speaker 7: the first year without him. Like, I think those two
Speaker 7: in particular, not to say that the other guys you know,
Speaker 7: don't meet that standard, because they certainly do, but man,
Speaker 7: I mean what those guys have done with those units
Speaker 7: in particular. Now, look, they've been given great talent, right,
Speaker 7: but you got to develop it, and you got to
Speaker 7: mold it and you gotta shape it.
Speaker 6: I think that's important to know.
Speaker 4: I want DJ to bring this up because we talked
Speaker 4: about it last night.
Speaker 5: He talked about how they are willing to draft guys
Speaker 5: that are on the comp they're not quite fully realize
Speaker 5: as prospects, but they understand it may take a year
Speaker 5: or two for them to do it, and that I
Speaker 5: believe is combined with what they have as a coaching staff.
Speaker 4: We always talk about coaches.
Speaker 5: In today's game, oh man, guys aren't developing like you
Speaker 5: got to have a finished product. The Philadelphia Eagles are
Speaker 5: not afraid of coaching unrefined prospects.
Speaker 4: They have a plan.
Speaker 5: In place that if there may be a year or
Speaker 5: two out, they're okay with that. All the guys that
Speaker 5: you mentioned on the offensive line, those guys weren't ready
Speaker 5: to play when they got there, but they afforded the
Speaker 5: luxury of sitting a year or two behind a really
Speaker 5: good offensive line. To me, is everything that works together.
Speaker 5: It's the front office, the coaching staff, and the players.
Speaker 5: They all are in lockstep in terms of they know
Speaker 5: exactly what they want to get, what fits their environment,
Speaker 5: and then their coaches and front office understand how to
Speaker 5: maintain that environment.
Speaker 2: And also, I mean, I'll give a shout out to
Speaker 2: my guy and Jeremia Washington coach, and yeah, he's coaching
Speaker 2: the outside linebackers and pass rushers. And think about we
Speaker 2: came into the league together as scouts. His dad's a
Speaker 2: legendary defensive line coach, but Washed came in as a scout,
Speaker 2: so he has a perspective to look at somebody like
Speaker 2: Jlex Hunt, or to look at somebody like Nolan Smith
Speaker 2: and see, okay, there's work to The tools here from
Speaker 2: a scouting standpoint are so rich, and then it's up
Speaker 2: to me to develop them and coach them and refine them.
Speaker 2: But like, give me those guys all day long. Whereas
Speaker 2: I think sometimes traditional coaches we always joke buck they want, hey,
Speaker 2: give it to me and clear packaging, already assembled, no
Speaker 2: assembly required. I just want to coach scheme. I want
Speaker 2: to be able to tell him we're running this stunt.
Speaker 2: And when we like, here's Keith like no, no, no, we
Speaker 2: got to work on fundamentals. Man, we got to stay
Speaker 2: after practice and we got to grind through how you're
Speaker 2: getting out of your stance. Like, we've got to work
Speaker 2: on those things. And I think I was thinking of
Speaker 2: Aaron Glenn. Aaron Glenn getting the head coaching job with
Speaker 2: the Jets. Aaron Glenn started off as a scout. Do
Speaker 2: you think that's helped him with some of the pieces
Speaker 2: they've added in the secondary in Detroit over the last
Speaker 2: few years because he can sign off and say, I
Speaker 2: know what that's supposed to look like.
Speaker 3: Now it's up to me to get it out of them. Yeah.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think the relationship is important in terms of
Speaker 5: the scouting and the coaching, making sure.
Speaker 4: They marry up.
Speaker 5: So often we act like both of those operations working
Speaker 5: silos when they really should be working together. When it
Speaker 5: comes to player acquisition and play a development, they need
Speaker 5: to be on the same page.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, boy, watch these guys were rolling this gosh.
Speaker 7: I mean to see again to think about you know,
Speaker 7: it's not just that the blue chip talent.
Speaker 6: I mean, even though you could argue.
Speaker 7: It was there with guys like Josh Sweat and Jaylex Hunt,
Speaker 7: but the fact that they come you know, and.
Speaker 3: Like that though yeah, I mean that's what I'm saying
Speaker 3: there for that whole ride.
Speaker 7: That is a credit to their development, their commitment to it,
Speaker 7: and their passion for it. I think that's a great
Speaker 7: point you make about a scouting background, you know, for
Speaker 7: a coach and understanding what to look for and then
Speaker 7: how you.
Speaker 6: Can mold those raw skills right and then make it
Speaker 6: into a big time player. So credit I think.
Speaker 2: Also I think also Buck is uh if you look
Speaker 2: at what's and how he's I mean how he's Look,
Speaker 2: he's the best executive in the NFL. I don't know
Speaker 2: how you and they can argue against it just now
Speaker 2: with what he's done. So but I look at when
Speaker 2: you had how we and the Andy Reid influence of
Speaker 2: how what Andy believed in core philosophy wise, and then
Speaker 2: you incorporate really kind of i'll call the Ravens model
Speaker 2: that came in when when Joe d and Andy Widel
Speaker 2: came in there and then they kind of mixed this
Speaker 2: whole thing together. Wash is there who has experience in
Speaker 2: all these different areas they've kind of taken like there's
Speaker 2: there used to be kind of oh, you could be
Speaker 2: kind of an analytics team or you're like an old
Speaker 2: school scouting teast, like they have mixed it all together
Speaker 2: and Howie has put it all together where it is
Speaker 2: the it's the envy of the league.
Speaker 6: Man.
Speaker 2: They got somebody, as somebody texted me, they got they
Speaker 2: got Sakwan Barkley for.
Speaker 3: Gabe Davis Prices. Like, think about that for a second.
Speaker 5: I mean not only like that is great, and I
Speaker 5: want to go back to what you were talking about
Speaker 5: in terms of the best of both worlds, right, And
Speaker 5: I can tell you, as someone who didn't grow up
Speaker 5: scouting in the Baltimore Ravens system, it was always the
Speaker 5: envy of the league when we talked about it because
Speaker 5: it's team like they never missed on top picks. And
Speaker 5: then you talk about the Eagles and the analytics and
Speaker 5: how they were able to mix that in the other
Speaker 5: thing that I'm going to talk about in Red alluded
Speaker 5: to it when he talked about the coaching, making Sirianni
Speaker 5: be the CEO type coach, making him concentrate on being
Speaker 5: the head coach as opposed to the head coach, class
Speaker 5: play caller and those things. I believe their merits to that,
Speaker 5: and I believe that Sirianni deserves a lot of credit,
Speaker 5: one for improving as a coach, but two the foresight
Speaker 5: that the upper management had and saying, hey, we need
Speaker 5: you to learn how to run the entire operation. Your
Speaker 5: job is to manage the team. DJ you talked to
Speaker 5: me about what they say fundamental days, where they spend
Speaker 5: days like things that show up on tape, they fix
Speaker 5: the problems.
Speaker 4: You know, we heard in postgame Brandon Graham talked.
Speaker 5: About we didn't have any victory Mondays, and so to me,
Speaker 5: I can tell you having been around the team that
Speaker 5: had a lot of Mondays off, when you work on
Speaker 5: Monday to correct the things that showed up on Sunday,
Speaker 5: it allows you to jump on Wednesday, which is the
Speaker 5: first practice day of the week, with clarity in terms
Speaker 5: of what we need to do and how we need
Speaker 5: to get better. This is a team that is not
Speaker 5: only a development team when it comes to the long range.
Speaker 5: They are an improvement team that each week they try
Speaker 5: to take steps to get better.
Speaker 4: And we saw it comedy in the championship.
Speaker 2: I want to get back to you on that. Talking
Speaker 2: about those fundamental days. One of the things that we've
Speaker 2: talked about previously is non negotiables right. We did a
Speaker 2: whole episode on this in the past about hey, these
Speaker 2: are things every team should have that you should have
Speaker 2: a spouting philosophy that says we can take them in
Speaker 2: different shapes and sizes, but we will not compromise on this,
Speaker 2: and you can go position by position. We talk about
Speaker 2: you know, Bill Belichick and that presentation. He will not
Speaker 2: play with the dumb safety. I don't care for the
Speaker 2: most athletically gifted guy in the world if you are
Speaker 2: not smart and not play safety for him, not happening.
Speaker 2: And what one of the tenants that we've talked about
Speaker 2: over the last few years. And it's something to keep
Speaker 2: in mind as we go into this draft. And I'll
Speaker 2: give I'll give the Chiefs credit on this as well.
Speaker 2: Do you want the most underrated thing in scouting right
Speaker 2: now is tackling?
Speaker 3: Look at the tackling.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the tackling on the perimeter. And look at Cooper
Speaker 2: dejen and his batting average out there in space against
Speaker 2: those athletes, and.
Speaker 3: Flip it around.
Speaker 2: Look at some of the like Nick Bolton and some
Speaker 2: of the tackles Chili good.
Speaker 3: It was great.
Speaker 2: And that's why I'm I'm sitting here going, oh, you know,
Speaker 2: I get paid to cover. Not not anymore, man, not
Speaker 2: in this league. If you can't tackle with the way
Speaker 2: the past game is horizontally in this league right now,
Speaker 2: all this, you know the shell coverage, you better get
Speaker 2: some corners that can freaking tackle.
Speaker 5: Man, it's funny that you brought that up. When I
Speaker 5: was at the East West Shrine game. I didn't get
Speaker 5: a chance to talk to PJ. Fleck from Minnesota directly,
Speaker 5: but I was listening to a podcast. We were talking
Speaker 5: about the things that they've done to punch above their
Speaker 5: weight at the University of Minnesota and the things that
Speaker 5: they talk about turnovers one. Mis tackling was two because
Speaker 5: mistackling leads to explosive plays. And when we looked at
Speaker 5: those two teams play, particularly the Eagles who decided we're
Speaker 5: not gonna blitz, We're gonna play an umbrella coverage which
Speaker 5: required you to tackle in space. Man, it is underrated
Speaker 5: the value in having guys on the perimeter that can
Speaker 5: get players down in one on one situations.
Speaker 4: You never saw the cancer.
Speaker 5: The Chiefs really have those big explosive plays that they
Speaker 5: can have with their speed athletes and Xavier Worthy and
Speaker 5: Marquis Solery Brown on the horizontal things and that is a.
Speaker 4: Testament to their ability to tackle well in space.
Speaker 7: Well, look at some of the players you know from
Speaker 7: some universities you know that have top flight defenses that
Speaker 7: send guys to the league. I mean, you look at
Speaker 7: what Tom Allen has done in his career at Penn
Speaker 7: State going down to Clemson. It's takeaways, tackling, effort, takeaways,
Speaker 7: tackling effort. Kane Wamick at Alabama the same way. Takeaways
Speaker 7: tackling and effort, takeaways tackling. So like that, I mean,
Speaker 7: and then you find guys that fit those bills. And
Speaker 7: obviously the scouts like you can see that when I'm
Speaker 7: sure you guys can attest when.
Speaker 6: You go to schools like you can see the schools that.
Speaker 7: Make the emphasis on that type of fundamental as it
Speaker 7: comes to And look, I know it's it's a lot
Speaker 7: different now is where you know, we tackle far less,
Speaker 7: we talk about it far less, you know, in the landscape.
Speaker 2: But for the corner position, I would argue that, well,
Speaker 2: I got Bucket's been in the league longer than I was,
Speaker 2: but I got in a three and we did literally
Speaker 2: have we had conversations that he's a cover corner like
Speaker 2: he's he'sn't really tackle.
Speaker 3: We were paying him to cover. He's a cover corner.
Speaker 2: And now and I you know, my opinion on it
Speaker 2: is that just we've seen so many condensed formations and
Speaker 2: offensive coaches have gotten so smart and that they are
Speaker 2: going to make you the force player and you can't
Speaker 2: hide anymore out there on the perimeter.
Speaker 4: It has always been a part of the game. It
Speaker 4: has always been a thing.
Speaker 5: Like I can tell you going back to when I
Speaker 5: was in Jacksonville and we played against the Titans or
Speaker 5: the Oils, whatever they would call at the time, with
Speaker 5: Eddie George. They would deliberately crack the safeties and make
Speaker 5: the cornerback have to tackle Eddie George over and over
Speaker 5: and over again.
Speaker 4: Tackling has always been a part of it.
Speaker 5: And I'm gonna say this because people and some coaches
Speaker 5: like to use the lack of practic this time, we're
Speaker 5: not putting pads on.
Speaker 4: As an excuse for not having a good tackling team.
Speaker 5: That's not it, man. The fundamentals can be taught without
Speaker 5: having the pass on. You have to be committed to
Speaker 5: doing time on task to being a really good tackling team.
Speaker 5: And it also not only has to be who you
Speaker 5: bring in. They need to be good tacklers, but it
Speaker 5: has to be a point of emphasis. You can't cut
Speaker 5: out three to five minutes of tackling to get some
Speaker 5: more scheme stuff. I love what we're was saying, takeaways,
Speaker 5: tackling and effort. To me, that's really what it's about.
Speaker 5: And we're seeing that the great teams, they all emphasize
Speaker 5: those things.
Speaker 2: Have no doubt that was now, well, that's a rap
Speaker 2: actually for the lead block presented by Team Mobile for Business.
Speaker 2: Football means a network will undergo the extra yard. So
Speaker 2: do you go further with Tea Mobile for Business. We're
Speaker 2: gonna take a quick pause. Let's hit the chief side
Speaker 2: of this thing. We haven't hit that title. We'll hit
Speaker 2: that right after this. All right, guys, let's jump over
Speaker 2: to the other side here the Kansas City chiefs. I'll
Speaker 2: give you my quick analogy and uh, you know what,
Speaker 2: we'll get into all the things there and where they
Speaker 2: go and this you know, sky's not falling Kansas City.
Speaker 2: You've got Patrick Mahomes, you've got Andy Reid, you've got
Speaker 2: a great defense. We'll get to all that stuff. But
Speaker 2: my my image that I had was, you know, if
Speaker 2: the super Bowl was on the if the super Bowl
Speaker 2: was on the thirtieth floor of a building, the Chiefs
Speaker 2: have to use the stairs, man like, they don't have
Speaker 2: an elevator anymore like that. That it's hard like And
Speaker 2: that's what's incredible what they've done. And they've won all
Speaker 2: these games this year, all these one possession games, all
Speaker 2: these close games, all these late comebacks, but it felt
Speaker 2: like everything was so hard and eventually that wasn't going
Speaker 2: to work, you know, And I thought in this game
Speaker 2: it was you know they got that was just kind
Speaker 2: of exposed in this one. Every single worth that they
Speaker 2: had which they had been able to overcome and cover up,
Speaker 2: got exposed.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 7: Look, and I think you know, the thing that we're
Speaker 7: going to talk about now is how do they rebuild
Speaker 7: the offensive line because that that is exactly what got
Speaker 7: exposed in their last Super Bowl loss to the Tampa
Speaker 7: Bay Buccaneers in the COVID year. And then that's kind
Speaker 7: of where we felt like this was going now and
Speaker 7: they're gonna have to spend a lot of resources and
Speaker 7: was that was that.
Speaker 2: The trade for I got to go back and look
Speaker 2: that up now, Was that did they trade for Orlando
Speaker 2: Brown right after that Super Bowl?
Speaker 7: Yeah, that was the first remake, the first iteration of
Speaker 7: the remake, right, it was after that.
Speaker 6: And then remember Toney was already.
Speaker 3: There, right, yeah, he's been there.
Speaker 6: He was the free agency signing.
Speaker 7: But it was the tackles that they really redid, and
Speaker 7: that's when they went out and got you know, was
Speaker 7: it John Taylor right after that too? I felt like
Speaker 7: that was not long after right there, and you know,
Speaker 7: they spent all that money to go get those guys
Speaker 7: in those resources and then you know, fortified the interior
Speaker 7: right after that, right, Uh, well with Creed Humphrey and
Speaker 7: then and Trey Brown. So they've got to go they
Speaker 7: gotta go that route again with.
Speaker 3: The tax traymith, right, what I say, Trey Brown?
Speaker 6: Yeah, you're right. So yeah, I I think that's that's
Speaker 6: the one thing.
Speaker 7: And then the other part of it is is like
Speaker 7: this you know, kind of slow deceleration from where they were,
Speaker 7: uh when they won a Super Bowl before this last run,
Speaker 7: right it, which which was a complete you know, I
Speaker 7: don't want to say.
Speaker 6: Complete, but it was a it was a it was
Speaker 6: a total.
Speaker 7: Slowing down from the way that they attacked defenses in
Speaker 7: the past, right Tyreek kill's gone, We're gonna find a
Speaker 7: different way to operate, and they had done that very well.
Speaker 7: But when you can't protect, and when you can't you know,
Speaker 7: allow your quarterback to make some of those you know,
Speaker 7: some of those quicker some of those throws, and allow
Speaker 7: your your receivers to make plays with the ball in
Speaker 7: their hands.
Speaker 6: Like you're just you're not going to.
Speaker 7: Have a successful outing at the highest level against top
Speaker 7: tier talent.
Speaker 6: And that's just they just didn't have, you know, the
Speaker 6: wardaddies to borrow your expression.
Speaker 7: To fight this uh this way, to fight that battle
Speaker 7: this way.
Speaker 6: I'll be curious to see how they reinvent themselves with
Speaker 6: this one.
Speaker 5: Well, look, man, at one, I think the reinvention that
Speaker 5: they were able to do, and I'll say this, five Super.
Speaker 4: Bowls and six years is ridiculous.
Speaker 5: The only thing, the only thing that I can say
Speaker 5: comes close to that is in the same realm as
Speaker 5: the Buffalo Bill's going four straight.
Speaker 4: I came to the Bills on the heels of that.
Speaker 5: But just the resilience, the competitive stamina, the focus that
Speaker 5: you have to have to go back to back to
Speaker 5: back like the Chiefs have gone and to think about
Speaker 5: five times in six years, it's remarkable. Even though they
Speaker 5: have a three and two record in that run is
Speaker 5: one of the great runs.
Speaker 4: That we've seen in the National Football League.
Speaker 5: To me, this kind of feels like that pause that
Speaker 5: the New England Patriots had after they won three and
Speaker 5: four years, where you have to take a reset and
Speaker 5: it may take them a while to kind of get back.
Speaker 5: Patrick Mahomes would give them a chance, but I think
Speaker 5: what we saw they kind of have to bottom out
Speaker 5: a little bit and build it back up. They've been
Speaker 5: able to kind of patchwork the offensive, the offense for
Speaker 5: a little bit, the offensive line and the playmakers. They
Speaker 5: got to commit to building this offense up right way
Speaker 5: for them to legitimately have a chance to deal with
Speaker 5: some of the talented teams that they're going to face
Speaker 5: over the next few years. This is a chance for
Speaker 5: Beach and Andy Reid to really reset refolks and do it.
Speaker 5: And I'm actually glad that they got knocked out and
Speaker 5: they didn't lose it on cars because I believe this
Speaker 5: gives them a chance to really see where the flaws
Speaker 5: and the weakenses are in their team.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, the defense is still in great shape.
Speaker 2: I mean, they play they played fine, they stopped the run,
Speaker 2: they did what they had to do. They let the
Speaker 2: ball go over their head a couple times, but that
Speaker 2: was a risk. That was the way they had to
Speaker 2: play that game against that Eagles offense. So defensively, they're
Speaker 2: still They've got some free agents, but they're still in
Speaker 2: a good spot there.
Speaker 3: I would say. The hardest thing is tackles are hard
Speaker 3: to find. Man, when you're picking thirty, thirty one or
Speaker 3: thirty two every year, there's not many of them and
Speaker 3: their premium positions and they go so at some point
Speaker 3: time and I don't know that this is the right one,
Speaker 3: but at some point in time they're going to have
Speaker 3: to probably be aggressive and go try and go get one,
Speaker 3: like trade up and go get a tackle. Think about
Speaker 3: the Eagles, They've had the luxury of having Lane Johnson
Speaker 3: as a Hall of Famer, and you just plug it.
Speaker 3: You you draft one of those guys in the top five,
Speaker 3: and you hit, you set it, you set it and
Speaker 3: forget it. Like he's said, like that, you don't have
Speaker 3: to worry about that. And then they they struck gold.
Speaker 2: Uh you know with my lotta and uh in a
Speaker 2: late round on a rugby player and ended up hitting
Speaker 2: on that.
Speaker 3: But that's it's so hard to do.
Speaker 2: So I look at it, you know, doing the Charger
Speaker 2: games of gosh, you know, you think, man, the Charger's
Speaker 2: got a long way to go to figure out how
Speaker 2: to close the gap. I'm like, you know what, they've
Speaker 2: got the two tackles, like two young tackles that you
Speaker 2: can just set it and forget it. Like they're hard
Speaker 2: to find. Man, They're really really hard to find. That's
Speaker 2: gonna be the biggest challenge for the Chiefs to me,
Speaker 2: and Brett Veach is really really good and he's gonna
Speaker 2: he's gonna have to figure out a way to go
Speaker 2: address that. They can't they can't run through the tournament.
Speaker 2: In my opinion, it's gonna be hard to continually run
Speaker 2: through that tournament playing the way they've had to play.
Speaker 2: And in hindsight, I know in they said Joe Tounei
Speaker 2: was their most valuable player for kicking out to left tackle.
Speaker 2: But last night was the first time that I thought
Speaker 2: about it, and I thought, you know what, did weaken
Speaker 2: two positions? Like if he's a guard, he's really good
Speaker 2: at guard, And now we can develop all we can
Speaker 2: send all our help, and like I said, it felt
Speaker 2: like in this one buck there was these holes in
Speaker 2: the boat and they plug one and then there was
Speaker 2: water coming out of another one.
Speaker 5: You know, there is something to be said for that,
Speaker 5: Like in moving someone out, you basically weaken two positions.
Speaker 5: Because Tuney's not a natural left tackle and you've given
Speaker 5: up what he was as an all pro guard. There's
Speaker 5: something they have to consist it. But they have to
Speaker 5: fix that. I mean we've said it. I mean for
Speaker 5: two years they've had issues on the edges. I mean
Speaker 5: it's been a huge issue. They tried to throw money
Speaker 5: at it with Juwan Taylor. He certainly, in my mind,
Speaker 5: has been a disappointment in terms of what they thought
Speaker 5: that he would be on Perimer. They have to fix
Speaker 5: that because, look, if number fifteen is uncomfortable, they don't
Speaker 5: have a chance. They have to make sure that he
Speaker 5: is always comfortable, because if he's comfortable, he can get
Speaker 5: it done by himself.
Speaker 6: Well, I mean you think about it.
Speaker 7: You know, outside of the twenty one draft, right, which
Speaker 7: is when they nailed it on Creed Humphrey in the
Speaker 7: second and Trey Smith in the sixth, there's not another
Speaker 7: guy that rotates in there that they've hit from the
Speaker 7: draft on the offensive line.
Speaker 6: Yeah, since twenty one, right, since twenty one or before?
Speaker 3: Yeah, or before.
Speaker 7: I mean, like we were talking about all the you know,
Speaker 7: all the guys that have been on that line for
Speaker 7: the Eagles, you know, even prior to that. But I mean, like,
Speaker 7: you know, Janie Morris, third round pick in twenty three,
Speaker 7: Kingsley Suamantilla, second round pick this year, rookie didn't hadn't
Speaker 7: worked out. I don't know if they're ready to close
Speaker 7: the book on that yet, but you know, there's some
Speaker 7: time there perhaps, But then you know, the other guys
Speaker 7: are you know, kind of depth players it was, you know,
Speaker 7: Norzad Hanson, Like, you know, it just hasn't hit that
Speaker 7: way for them outside of those two guys.
Speaker 6: Score really dang good. Let's not take away from that,
Speaker 6: but you know.
Speaker 7: There's just not that there's not that that kind of
Speaker 7: cupboard full of guys.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and look, we have to mention it.
Speaker 2: I know, he's he's a no doubt first ballot Hall
Speaker 2: of Fame are going to go down as arguably the
Speaker 2: best player to ever play the position, at least in
Speaker 2: the conversation. But Kelsey doesn't have the juice he had,
Speaker 2: you know, three years ago, four years ago. So they
Speaker 2: need they need to get some more dynamic players to
Speaker 2: add to their skill position group. That's that's got to
Speaker 2: go along with it. And I would also add had
Speaker 2: zero run game, none, and they don't have They don't
Speaker 2: have a big time back.
Speaker 4: I mean, well that that was the thing.
Speaker 5: They don't have anyone that when we stand up in
Speaker 5: the defensive meeting and we talked about, hey, guys, this
Speaker 5: week we got the cancy the Chiefs. Who's the running
Speaker 5: back that we fear that we have to stop. Look,
Speaker 5: they tried it a few years ago, Clyde edwars Allar,
Speaker 5: but it wasn't.
Speaker 4: It didn't work out for them.
Speaker 5: They need a big time back that will offset some
Speaker 5: of the pressure and attention that you put on Patrick Mahomes.
Speaker 5: We've seen it and it's one of the things that
Speaker 5: I think will be the theme of the off season.
Speaker 5: We can talk about the renaissance of the running backs,
Speaker 5: but I would say it's not necessarily just the renaissance
Speaker 5: of the back. Is teams that had established quarterbacks paired
Speaker 5: them with an established back and it opened up the offense.
Speaker 5: Look at the Eagles, look at the Ravens, even look
Speaker 5: at the Packers. When you have a marquee back playing
Speaker 5: with the marquee quarterback, it makes it nearly impossible.
Speaker 4: For a defense to really come up with the answers
Speaker 4: to defense.
Speaker 7: And you know, the last thing I'll say on the Chiefs,
Speaker 7: and you know where they're at from a roster standpoint, is,
Speaker 7: you know, we also got to take into consideration.
Speaker 6: You know, Rashie Rice was out for pretty much.
Speaker 3: That's dude, that's a great point.
Speaker 7: That's a that's a huge You could make an argument
Speaker 7: as to whether he's not, you know, a wide receiver
Speaker 7: one on on.
Speaker 6: Every team in the league, but he was on this.
Speaker 7: Team, yes, and that's tough to overcome when, like, you know,
Speaker 7: you don't just have again another guy like that you
Speaker 7: can you could throw in there. Obviously they traded for
Speaker 7: DeAndre Hopkins, tried try it just never quite got there.
Speaker 2: Yea, with hot No, I think that's a great point,
Speaker 2: you get. I mean, think about if they can somehow
Speaker 2: go find a tackle and free agency, I don't know,
Speaker 2: you know, you don't Ronnie Stanley on the back nine.
Speaker 2: Maybe he comes in there.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: There's ways you can try and address that, and then
Speaker 2: if you get an explosive back, which this draft has
Speaker 2: plenty of, you can find your future tight end in
Speaker 2: this draft as well. It can look different. There's not
Speaker 2: a lot that needs to be done defensively. I mean,
Speaker 2: they have a lot of talented young players. Got to
Speaker 2: pay some of them, but they're in great shape on
Speaker 2: that side of the ball. All right, guys, it's time
Speaker 2: for Hot or Not, brought to you by with Sabbi
Speaker 2: Hot Cloud Storage Buck. There's only one coordinator in this
Speaker 2: game that's gonna leave, and that's Kellen Moore. Looks like
Speaker 2: it's gonna be the head coach of the New Orleans
Speaker 2: Saints and coming off of a hot performance to say
Speaker 2: the least, with the last two games, the NFC Championship
Speaker 2: Game and then the Super Bowl.
Speaker 5: Look, man, I'm gonna say this, I am really really
Speaker 5: impressed by the growth that Kellen Moore displayed as a coach.
Speaker 5: We always talk about players getting developed, and this is
Speaker 5: the developmental league for players, but it's also a developmental
Speaker 5: league for coaches. You had a chance to see Kellen
Speaker 5: Moore as as a coordinator for the Charges. We all
Speaker 5: watched him as the coordinator for the Dallas Cowboys, and
Speaker 5: I would say that Kellen Moore's growth as a run
Speaker 5: game caller in terms of calling the run game, being
Speaker 5: creative with the run game and those things, man, it's
Speaker 5: going to help him so much going forward as a
Speaker 5: head coach and maybe head coach, play caller and those things.
Speaker 5: What he was able to do with the Eagles is
Speaker 5: I couldn't even imagine how he's gonna be able to
Speaker 5: do it because I'm like, man, he's gonna bring the
Speaker 5: same playbook that he said other places, they're gonna try
Speaker 5: and throw it. It's not gonna match the personnel. And
Speaker 5: early in the year he put all the creativity in
Speaker 5: the run game as opposed to the passing game. And
Speaker 5: this offense, even though the Super Bowl numbers don't reflect it,
Speaker 5: their creative running game keeps defensive coordinators up at night
Speaker 5: and then it allows them to be a little more simplistic,
Speaker 5: but the passing game yet still explosive in both areas.
Speaker 7: Yeah, that's smart, and I think the evolution for Kellen.
Speaker 7: You think about this three teams in three years, right
Speaker 7: with Dallas to the Chargers and the now to the Eagles,
Speaker 7: and man, I think that.
Speaker 6: Point soon before. Yeah, I think a lot.
Speaker 7: Of times when you start seeing that kind of movement,
Speaker 7: you wonder like, all right, is the is the is
Speaker 7: the luster coming off a once very shiny object in
Speaker 7: terms of the coaching community. But man, he is he
Speaker 7: has really found himself in Philly and yeah, I mean
Speaker 7: having a generational talent and Saquon Barkley this certainly helps,
Speaker 7: and a really good offensive line and the tools to
Speaker 7: work with that way. But I think now it's so
Speaker 7: valuable for him to really see it and to explain that,
Speaker 7: you know, in detail, that formula you know, to Jeff
Speaker 7: Ireland and a Mickey Loomis. I'm like, guys, I know
Speaker 7: I can win if we find ways to simulate that
Speaker 7: type of construction. And the Saints have done in the past,
Speaker 7: I mean, arguably had one of the greatest drafts in
Speaker 7: history in the Alvin Kamara Draft, Ryan Ramcheck, Marshaun Lattimore,
Speaker 7: that whole thing. Like they I'm not saying they can
Speaker 7: do that again, but they can find ways to reemphasize
Speaker 7: what's important, especially to a Kellen Moore let offense and team,
Speaker 7: and we'll see where they.
Speaker 3: Go with it.
Speaker 2: Jeff Ireland's really good man. He is a good evaluator,
Speaker 2: and I think if you give him the instructions buck
Speaker 2: like that, that's to me as a great personnel guy,
Speaker 2: when you say, hey, this is what we're looking for,
Speaker 2: he can go find it.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: No, I think it would be interesting DJ. I'm pretty
Speaker 5: sure this was in his background. Kellen Moore's dad was
Speaker 5: a great high school coach, yes.
Speaker 3: Correct, Yeah, and his brothers a coordinator at Missouri.
Speaker 4: Yeah. So like he understands what this is.
Speaker 5: This is not something that I would say is going
Speaker 5: to be challenged or daunting in terms of doing it.
Speaker 5: What I want to see and this is what I
Speaker 5: believe the Saints haven't done. I want to know what
Speaker 5: that their identity was. I felt like it was very
Speaker 5: clear in a parent for years under Sean Payton what
Speaker 5: the New Orleans Saints were about. On O offense, despite
Speaker 5: all the stuff with Drew Brees, They're still gonna run
Speaker 5: the football when they did best, they were gonna run
Speaker 5: the football with multiple backs. They're gonna do it. On defense,
Speaker 5: They're gonna be very aggressive. I'm looking forward to seeing
Speaker 5: the Saints kind of get back to that because when
Speaker 5: I think about the Saints. The first thing I think
Speaker 5: about is don't patrol and then whatever they've been on
Speaker 5: offense with Drew Brees or whatever, if he can marry
Speaker 5: those two things where they have Dome patrol on defense
Speaker 5: and that fun offense.
Speaker 4: Time me up. I'll be ready to go that.
Speaker 7: Don't you disparage the Domet patrol by suggesting that there
Speaker 7: could be another There will never be another Pat Swilling
Speaker 7: Ricky Jackson, Von Johnson and Sam Mills.
Speaker 6: Let me make that perfectly clear.
Speaker 1: I just like I just remember seeing the picture that
Speaker 1: would hang, the banner that would hang, Uh, is incredible,
Speaker 1: just a little bit of that.
Speaker 4: I just there's so much history and energy and.
Speaker 7: That they've got to have a dominant d that Look,
Speaker 7: the offense is funded, the screens and the shots that
Speaker 7: they were doing with with with Sean Payton was in
Speaker 7: you know, Robert Meacham and Dewrie Henderson running sixty yards
Speaker 7: downfield virtually uncovered like that.
Speaker 6: That stuff was awesome.
Speaker 7: But man, that don't rocks when that defense is rolling,
Speaker 7: and I think that this is an aging defense.
Speaker 4: Now.
Speaker 7: Look, Cam Jordan has been one of the best players
Speaker 7: in the league. The Mario Davis has been one of
Speaker 7: the best players in the league. Can they help you
Speaker 7: usher in the new era or do you really have
Speaker 7: to tear it down? I think it's I think it's
Speaker 7: probably the former. I think they probably help usher it in.
Speaker 2: I'm looking forward to it. It's gonna be interesting to
Speaker 2: see you. Obviously, we'll wait and get let that announcement
Speaker 2: become official. But a nice finish if it is a
Speaker 2: finish for Kellam Moore there in Philadelphia. That was this
Speaker 2: week's Hot or Not segment, brought to you by with
Speaker 2: Sabi Hot Cloud Storage, store more and do more with
Speaker 2: your data.
Speaker 3: Try them for free at Withsabi dot Com.
Speaker 2: Closing closing statements here buck anything else you want to
Speaker 2: add before we get out of here on that Super Bowl.
Speaker 5: Football is great like no matter what we say about it,
Speaker 5: no matter how those the results end up. Football is
Speaker 5: so great like to think about how the season started
Speaker 5: and then we watch it finish up with the Eagles
Speaker 5: winning the Super Bowl in dominant fashion, all of the
Speaker 5: twist and turns through the season to watch it end
Speaker 5: of like that is one of the reasons why look, man,
Speaker 5: I am a football jockie.
Speaker 4: Sign me up for it anytime.
Speaker 5: But now we get to close that chapter and we
Speaker 5: get to kind of cast our eyes towards the draft
Speaker 5: and the Combine, the draft and all of that as
Speaker 5: everyone has completely hit the reset button saying, hey, that
Speaker 5: was twenty four. We're ready to go to twin twenty five.
Speaker 5: We can win it.
Speaker 4: I'm excited about this part in the process.
Speaker 6: Bucky, that was beautiful. There ain't no time for nostalgia Indianapolis.
Speaker 6: Two weeks today.
Speaker 7: Man, the combine is coming down the pipe and hitting
Speaker 7: around it. Man.
Speaker 6: Draft season is here, and it does not wait.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I hope. That's it's hope season. Yeah.
Speaker 2: And if you want to have hope, just look at
Speaker 2: what the team the toys in the trophy did over
Speaker 2: this period of time one year ago.
Speaker 3: That that was it.
Speaker 2: They built a super Bowl finishing piece in this free
Speaker 2: agency and in the draft, and they went and won
Speaker 2: the whole thing. And that's what's so great about football
Speaker 2: versus some of these other sports. Every single city, no
Speaker 2: matter where you are, no matter what you need, you
Speaker 2: have hope that you can go find it this offseason.
Speaker 3: And we're going to be the.
Speaker 2: Place to discuss all of it as we head towards
Speaker 2: free agency.
Speaker 3: And the draft. So we appreciate you hanging with us.
Speaker 3: We'll see you next time, right here on move sticks.