Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2: And joining us now for more live from Capitol Hill
Speaker 2: is Senator Warren, who of course is ranking member of
Speaker 2: the Senate Banking Committee. Senator, welcome back to Bloomberg TV
Speaker 2: and Radio. We do have many questions for you about
Speaker 2: what's happening with the CFPB specifically, but we also saw
Speaker 2: today as you and your colleagues pressed the chairman repeatedly
Speaker 2: about the influence this administration's policies like tariffs, are going
Speaker 2: to have on monetary policy. When we are considering policies
Speaker 2: that could potentially be inflationary, do you see justification here
Speaker 2: for the Fed to even be thinking about cutting rates?
Speaker 1: So, Lord, I press the Fed to lower interest rates
Speaker 1: because I want families to be able to have cheaper
Speaker 1: mortgages and to be able to pay off their credit
Speaker 1: card debts. But I truly understand the hesitancy that the
Speaker 1: Fed chair expressed today because we live the world of
Speaker 1: on again, off again tariffs that Donald Trump has put
Speaker 1: in place and taken out of place. Don Trump's on again,
Speaker 1: off again firing tens of thousands of federal workers, his
Speaker 1: on again, off again Whether or not we're going to
Speaker 1: have federal contracts honored to sell wheat and other commodities
Speaker 1: to the federal government for purposes of international aid. Whether
Speaker 1: or not the financial cops are going to stay on
Speaker 1: the beat or are people just now is an open
Speaker 1: season on cheating consumers. Look, Donald Trump needs to settle
Speaker 1: down and focus on what he ran for president on,
Speaker 1: and that is lowering costs for American families. That's where
Speaker 1: he needs to keep his attention and that will put
Speaker 1: the Fed in a much better place to lower interest rates.
Speaker 3: Well, Kayley mentioned the CFPB Senator, so let's talk about
Speaker 3: consumers for a moment. This is obviously something that's very
Speaker 3: important to you, and we got into it with Mick
Speaker 3: Mulvaney yesterday, former Acting White House Chief of Staff, who
Speaker 3: spent some time at that agency, and what he had
Speaker 3: to say about the double edged sword of how the
Speaker 3: CFPB is funded.
Speaker 4: Let's listen, Liz Warren created this agency when she was
Speaker 4: a Harver professor. She drummed up the idea she wanted
Speaker 4: something in her mind that was above politics. Consumer protection
Speaker 4: in her mind, was too important to trust too elected officials.
Speaker 4: The double edged sword of that is that when ro
Speaker 4: Hitchopra's running the place and Congress wants to shut them down,
Speaker 4: he can sort of go and get his money without
Speaker 4: having to worry about what Congress thanks. But the other
Speaker 4: side of the sword is if russ Vote is running
Speaker 4: the place and he doesn't want to draw any money
Speaker 4: down from the Fed, he doesn't have to.
Speaker 3: When you consider that funding mechanism, Senator, did you trump
Speaker 3: proof the CFPB enough to withstand this period of time?
Speaker 1: So you know, I hope you had a good time
Speaker 1: yesterday with Migmulvaney. But let's be clear. The CFPP is
Speaker 1: funded in the largest sense, just like every other bank regulator,
Speaker 1: starting Peck in eighteen sixty three with our very first
Speaker 1: bank regulator, the Office of the Controller of the Currency,
Speaker 1: Congress said we cannot fund the banking regulators through the
Speaker 1: appropriations process and expect them to still do their jobs.
Speaker 1: Even in eighteen sixty three, they were so afraid that
Speaker 1: those big financial institutions would come in and influence Congress
Speaker 1: to cut back, for example, on the money to enforce
Speaker 1: the legal regulations. And so all of the agencies that
Speaker 1: are the banking regulators have been funded outside the political process.
Speaker 1: And by the way, Midgmulvaney, the Republicans. Some of the
Speaker 1: giant banks have already argued all the way to the
Speaker 1: United States Supreme Court and back again that that kind
Speaker 1: of funding is not right, and the United States Supreme
Speaker 1: Court said it's fine. Congress has done it in many
Speaker 1: other circumstances. They can continue to do it. But you
Speaker 1: know what this is really about, and where we are
Speaker 1: right now, is about sidelining the cops, the financial cops.
Speaker 1: Right now, we have no one who is enforcing the
Speaker 1: consumer financial protection laws anywhere in our federal government on
Speaker 1: the big banks and the non bank financial institutions. That's
Speaker 1: what Chair Pal said today, and that's a real problem
Speaker 1: for every American who has a credit card, mortgage, payday loan,
Speaker 1: car loan, student loan. Right now, Donald Trump Elon Musk
Speaker 1: have just declared open season on every consumer in America.
Speaker 2: Well, what about open season on the financial regulators? As
Speaker 2: we talk about those that have similar funding structures to
Speaker 2: the CFPB. Senator, where are you concerned they'll target next?
Speaker 1: Look, if the Republicans want to change the funding mechanism
Speaker 1: to the CFPB, they've got the majority in the House
Speaker 1: and the Senate. Let them come over here and try
Speaker 1: to do that. Don't make an end run that is
Speaker 1: clearly illegal by letting Elon Musk shut down the agency. Effectively,
Speaker 1: come over here to Congress. Congress created the CFPB and
Speaker 1: the other regulators, and Congress is the only one that
Speaker 1: can shut them down. You might ask yourself, though, since
Speaker 1: they're in control, why haven't they done that? And I'll
Speaker 1: tell you the reason why. It's because the CFPV is
Speaker 1: very popular, and it's not just popular among Democrats, it's
Speaker 1: popular among Republicans and independence because nobody likes getting cheated
Speaker 1: by a giant bank, Nobody likes getting scammed on their
Speaker 1: car along nobody likes financial institutions taking advantage to consumers,
Speaker 1: and the CFPB is the one agency on the side
Speaker 1: of consumers.
Speaker 3: I don't know if you had your eyes, Senator on
Speaker 3: the other end of Pennsylvania Avenue a little while ago.
Speaker 3: But Elon Musk himself, oh, I believe he referred to
Speaker 3: as the co President in your opening remarks today in
Speaker 3: the committee joined President Trump, who was sitting behind the
Speaker 3: resolute desk. Elon Musk in a black overcoat, talking about
Speaker 3: the effort here in the work that's being done by dose.
Speaker 3: Let's listen quickly to what he.
Speaker 5: Said, What meaning does democracy actually have If the people
Speaker 5: cannot vote and hope they will be decided by their
Speaker 5: elected representatives in the form of the President and the
Speaker 5: s in the House, then we don't live in a democracy.
Speaker 6: We live in a bureaucracy. So it's incredibly important that
Speaker 6: we close that feedback we fix that feedback group, and
Speaker 6: that the public, the public's elected representatives, the President of
Speaker 6: the House and the Senate, decide what happens as opposed
Speaker 6: to a large unelected bureaucracy.
Speaker 3: Senator Warren, is there any chance this could work?
Speaker 1: I have no idea what Elon Musk is trying to
Speaker 1: say here. Does he not actually understand how government works?
Speaker 1: Or is he just trying to blow more smoke here? Look,
Speaker 1: if Congress wanted to shut down the CFPB, they have
Speaker 1: the power to do it, just like they have the
Speaker 1: power to shut out any other agency in government. That
Speaker 1: is the power allocated to Congress. It is not the
Speaker 1: power allocated to Elon Musk. Nobody voted for him, and
Speaker 1: even if they had, nobody at the other end of
Speaker 1: Pennsylvania Avenue has the right to shut down an agency
Speaker 1: and not spend the money and do the work that
Speaker 1: Congress has actually empowered it to do so.
Speaker 2: Is Congress and specifically your party within it, as the
Speaker 2: minority senator, is the only real recourse you have here
Speaker 2: to act against what the Department of Government efficiency in
Speaker 2: this administration is doing to shut down the government next month.
Speaker 1: You know, I listen to the premise of your question. No,
Speaker 1: when people in the administration are violating the law, we
Speaker 1: have a lot of recourse. Starts out with a whole
Speaker 1: bunch of lawsuits that are out there right now against them.
Speaker 1: And is those lawsuits correctly determined that they are breaking
Speaker 1: the law, they got to stop. That means they have
Speaker 1: to restart the payments. That means they have to put
Speaker 1: the financial copts back on the beat. That means they
Speaker 1: have to go ahead and continue the government contracts as
Speaker 1: the law requires. This is how government works, three equal
Speaker 1: branches of government. And right now in the courts there's
Speaker 1: litigation over what the administration, what Elon Musk has done.
Speaker 1: When he's found to have violated the law, he's supposed
Speaker 1: to get in compliance with the law. This is not
Speaker 1: a problem we need to fix later. This is a
Speaker 1: problem right now. When we have got Elon Musk and
Speaker 1: his little band of hackers in our financial system illegally,
Speaker 1: then we need to get him out.
Speaker 3: Well, Senator, I think Kayley was maybe referring to a
Speaker 3: couple of senators from New Jersey who suggested that a
Speaker 3: government shutdown may be one of the only ways to
Speaker 3: put pressure on this situation. That was a conversation on
Speaker 3: Sunday Morning television. But as we talk today on Bloomberg
Speaker 3: TV and radio, I wonder your thoughts on some concerns
Speaker 3: that if there were in fact a shutdown, no matter
Speaker 3: whose fault it is, some of these departments might not
Speaker 3: ever reopen when there was a deal to fund the
Speaker 3: government because of the efforts of dogs. Do you see
Speaker 3: it that way?
Speaker 1: Look, I appreciate that you frame the question the way
Speaker 1: you have. Let's understand, Donald Trump is already shutting the
Speaker 1: government down by letting Elon Musk move in against us AID.
Speaker 1: He's shutting down the government by letting them move against
Speaker 1: the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau and firing the financial cops.
Speaker 1: He's shutting the government by renegging on millions of federal contracts.
Speaker 1: He's shutting down part of the government shoot He's shutting
Speaker 1: down the government that promised to help fund childcare centers
Speaker 1: and places that are trying to help vents find housing.
Speaker 1: Donald Trump, through his co president Elon Musk, is in
Speaker 1: the business of trying to shut down the government right
Speaker 1: now and doing so illegally. That's why we're in the courts.
Speaker 1: That's why we need to solve this problem, not weeks
Speaker 1: from now. We need to solve it right now because
Speaker 1: people are getting hurt right now.
Speaker 3: Well, stay close with us on this, Senator, We have
Speaker 3: a lot to learn still and your insights are important
Speaker 3: to us.
Speaker 1: On Bloomberg.
Speaker 3: Democratic Senator Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts, that's the ranking member,
Speaker 3: of course, on the Senate Banking Committee. We thank you
Speaker 3: for being with us.