1 00:00:03,680 --> 00:00:05,159 Speaker 1: Welcome to Talking Politics. 2 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:07,800 Speaker 2: As you know, off the Cup is your break from 3 00:00:07,840 --> 00:00:11,320 Speaker 2: the news, but at Talking Politics we dive right into it. 4 00:00:11,840 --> 00:00:12,840 Speaker 1: Today's guest is. 5 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:15,760 Speaker 2: A former colleague, and boy is she in the news 6 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:19,200 Speaker 2: right now. Her new book Independent, A Look Inside a 7 00:00:19,239 --> 00:00:22,200 Speaker 2: Broken White House Outside the Party Lines, is out now 8 00:00:22,200 --> 00:00:25,120 Speaker 2: and it's ruffling a lot of feathers. I also think 9 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:28,800 Speaker 2: it's really bold and brave and courageous to come out 10 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:31,040 Speaker 2: and say some of the things that she is. Karee 11 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 2: John Pierre was White House Press Secretary for President Joe Biden, 12 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:36,839 Speaker 2: and earlier this year she announced she was leaving the 13 00:00:36,880 --> 00:00:40,559 Speaker 2: Democratic Party to become an independent. It's my pleasure to 14 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:43,239 Speaker 2: welcome Karin John Pierre to Talking Politics. 15 00:00:43,280 --> 00:00:43,640 Speaker 1: Welcome. 16 00:00:43,920 --> 00:00:46,360 Speaker 3: Thank you so much as seeing congratulations on this. 17 00:00:46,680 --> 00:00:50,440 Speaker 4: I really appreciate this type of platform to have different 18 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:53,640 Speaker 4: type of conversations, especially today in the moment that we're in, 19 00:00:53,720 --> 00:00:54,200 Speaker 4: so thanks. 20 00:00:54,280 --> 00:00:57,920 Speaker 2: You know, I appreciate it too, like I I appreciate 21 00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:01,800 Speaker 2: I appreciate me for creating this space, but also also 22 00:01:03,080 --> 00:01:06,600 Speaker 2: like iHeart for letting me, letting me, you know, create 23 00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:10,160 Speaker 2: spaces like this, have these different kinds of conversations where 24 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:13,480 Speaker 2: we're not like on cable news three minutes. Then we 25 00:01:13,560 --> 00:01:15,520 Speaker 2: got to go to break and someone's yelling at you 26 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:18,600 Speaker 2: and you know, misunderstanding you and twisting your words, and 27 00:01:19,319 --> 00:01:21,760 Speaker 2: I'm just I'm grateful too. So this is as much 28 00:01:21,760 --> 00:01:23,680 Speaker 2: a gift to me as it is as it is 29 00:01:23,680 --> 00:01:24,360 Speaker 2: to our guests. 30 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:28,120 Speaker 4: Sometime to breathe, sometimes like a moment to breathe, let it, 31 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:30,600 Speaker 4: let it play out a little bit, right, Yeah. 32 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:32,800 Speaker 1: And talk like human. You're a human. I know that 33 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:34,160 Speaker 1: about you. You're a human. 34 00:01:34,360 --> 00:01:37,040 Speaker 3: I am human and so are you. 35 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:37,560 Speaker 5: So am I. 36 00:01:39,880 --> 00:01:42,280 Speaker 1: We're humans. We're humans. We know each other. 37 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:43,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's true. 38 00:01:43,959 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 2: If listeners don't know, we we we used to be 39 00:01:46,319 --> 00:01:46,840 Speaker 2: at CNNA. 40 00:01:46,880 --> 00:01:47,559 Speaker 1: I'm still CNN. 41 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:49,640 Speaker 2: Used to you know, come on to CNN to be 42 00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:51,880 Speaker 2: a commentator before you went I think before you went 43 00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:54,440 Speaker 2: to work on Kamala's first Well. 44 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:57,280 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a it's it's a little bit more like 45 00:01:57,800 --> 00:01:59,840 Speaker 4: there's a little back and forth. I was with MSNBC, 46 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:01,880 Speaker 4: but before I'm s NBC, I did a lot of 47 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:05,080 Speaker 4: CNN and then I you know, I was while I 48 00:02:05,080 --> 00:02:07,280 Speaker 4: was at MISBAC, I was with move On, then left 49 00:02:07,280 --> 00:02:10,360 Speaker 4: that to go do Biden and then during that general election, 50 00:02:10,600 --> 00:02:11,160 Speaker 4: I went. 51 00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:14,040 Speaker 3: To be her chiefest staff because she was the running mate. 52 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 4: Yeah it's the right, yeah that yeah, but there's but 53 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:20,480 Speaker 4: you got it. It's all it's all connected. It's all connected. 54 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:24,000 Speaker 1: How are you? I? 55 00:02:24,200 --> 00:02:27,520 Speaker 3: You know, good question. I'm going to answer it. Honestly. 56 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:28,600 Speaker 3: I'm tired. 57 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:31,360 Speaker 4: I'm tired, but good I you know, I get to 58 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 4: go home tonight and see my little one, so I'm 59 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:34,720 Speaker 4: very excited. 60 00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:37,639 Speaker 3: I'll still be doing a lot of stuff this weekend. 61 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:40,760 Speaker 4: But you know, I think waking up in your own 62 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 4: bed and you know, getting your your your your world 63 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:44,840 Speaker 4: or your. 64 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:48,000 Speaker 3: Day started is always it always great. I've been I old. 65 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 1: Are your kids? 66 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:51,680 Speaker 4: I only have one, she's eleven. She just started middle school. 67 00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:56,679 Speaker 4: She's fantastic. And I think this is my third a 68 00:02:56,880 --> 00:02:59,880 Speaker 4: Ford City of the week since like Monday. 69 00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:02,919 Speaker 1: You know, Yeah, it's a beast. I do know. It's 70 00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:03,280 Speaker 1: a beast. 71 00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 3: The book the book tour. 72 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 1: Is I know, I know. 73 00:03:08,560 --> 00:03:11,519 Speaker 2: But and here's the thing, because you're on this book 74 00:03:11,560 --> 00:03:14,520 Speaker 2: tour and every everyone's asking the same question, which is, 75 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:16,800 Speaker 2: how did you not know that Joe Biden was struggling 76 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:19,680 Speaker 2: or incapacitated and somehow over the summer of twenty twenty four, 77 00:03:19,720 --> 00:03:20,760 Speaker 2: I'm really not interested in that. 78 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:22,600 Speaker 3: I appreciate that. I appreciate that. 79 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 1: Ask and answer it because I don't know. 80 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 3: How else to answer it. 81 00:03:26,639 --> 00:03:31,360 Speaker 4: I'm telling what I saw, my experience, and it is 82 00:03:31,720 --> 00:03:34,679 Speaker 4: and it is, you know, it is not what has 83 00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:37,760 Speaker 4: been reported, and so I wanted to, you know, give 84 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:42,040 Speaker 4: a different, different way of looking at what I saw 85 00:03:42,920 --> 00:03:43,520 Speaker 4: and you and. 86 00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:47,720 Speaker 1: You have and that's and that's what's It's done. It's done. 87 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:48,360 Speaker 1: It's done. 88 00:03:48,440 --> 00:03:48,760 Speaker 3: It's done. 89 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:50,360 Speaker 1: We move we can just move forward. 90 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:53,200 Speaker 4: Move, we move forward, we can just for yes, let's 91 00:03:53,200 --> 00:03:55,119 Speaker 4: look at the moment that we're in right now, which 92 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:55,920 Speaker 4: is pretty scary. 93 00:03:56,080 --> 00:03:57,720 Speaker 3: But I'm good. This is your show, so I'm gonna 94 00:03:57,760 --> 00:03:58,000 Speaker 3: let you. 95 00:03:58,080 --> 00:03:59,680 Speaker 1: Yes, but I want to. 96 00:04:01,200 --> 00:04:04,840 Speaker 2: I think leaving a party is a big deal. I 97 00:04:04,880 --> 00:04:06,960 Speaker 2: know because I've done it. I've done it too, and 98 00:04:07,000 --> 00:04:12,120 Speaker 2: it's painful, it's disorienting, it's demoralizing, it's scary, it's all 99 00:04:12,200 --> 00:04:15,640 Speaker 2: the things, and it's it's super scary to say critical 100 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 2: things of the party you once loved, maybe still love 101 00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:23,120 Speaker 2: in a way a party you gave, I know, literal blood, 102 00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:26,279 Speaker 2: sweat and tears, because so did I. It's incredibly scary 103 00:04:26,279 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 2: to start criticizing people, you know, people you admired, people 104 00:04:31,160 --> 00:04:35,440 Speaker 2: you worked for, to criticize ideas and strategies and policies 105 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 2: and people. I know what that's like, and I think 106 00:04:38,800 --> 00:04:41,480 Speaker 2: it's really hard, it's really brave. I want to know 107 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:43,440 Speaker 2: how and when you decided to do this yes night, 108 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:44,239 Speaker 2: right with the party. 109 00:04:44,360 --> 00:04:45,080 Speaker 3: I appreciate that. 110 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 4: Look, I'm now a private citizen. This is the first 111 00:04:48,880 --> 00:04:51,720 Speaker 4: time in many years that I'm not talking for anyone 112 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:55,760 Speaker 4: that I'm not you know, I'm not you know, part 113 00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 4: of an opparatus, a political apparatus, if you will, And 114 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 4: as a private citizen, I felt like I needed to 115 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:06,360 Speaker 4: make a decision for myself, and to be quite honest, 116 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:07,000 Speaker 4: it's been. 117 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:08,279 Speaker 3: A long time coming. 118 00:05:08,720 --> 00:05:13,240 Speaker 4: But what really triggered it, honestly to finally say the 119 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:15,280 Speaker 4: idea was there, but to finally say I'm going to 120 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 4: do this is when I left the White House and 121 00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:22,160 Speaker 4: what I was experiences. I was minding my business, trying 122 00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:24,440 Speaker 4: to be a citizen again, trying to take care of 123 00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:28,120 Speaker 4: my kid, my family, doing me, if you will, and 124 00:05:28,400 --> 00:05:31,240 Speaker 4: I was going I was traveling at the airport, at 125 00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 4: the supermarket, the coffee shop, and people were coming up 126 00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:36,920 Speaker 4: to me. Obviously I was the White House Press Secretary, 127 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:38,760 Speaker 4: So I was recognizable to people. 128 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:40,360 Speaker 3: And they would say to me, what are we going 129 00:05:40,400 --> 00:05:42,160 Speaker 3: to do? What is happening? 130 00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:45,680 Speaker 4: Why is the Democratic Party not ready? Like why are 131 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:48,480 Speaker 4: they not showing fight? Why are they not showing teeth? 132 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:51,560 Speaker 4: And then I thought to myself, Oh, this is really interesting. 133 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:55,119 Speaker 4: And then there were things that were happening where where 134 00:05:55,160 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 4: members of the Democratic Party were just saying things that 135 00:05:58,880 --> 00:06:02,320 Speaker 4: bothered me as a black woman, like a black queer. 136 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:04,680 Speaker 3: Woman, I don't want to be thrown under the bus. 137 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:07,960 Speaker 4: I don't want people to feel as it were to 138 00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:11,720 Speaker 4: seem to it made it sound like, hey, this didn't 139 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:14,719 Speaker 4: poll test well, so we're not going to we're going 140 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 4: to throw this community the under the bus. 141 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:21,680 Speaker 3: And as a black woman, as we are the backbone of. 142 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 4: The Democratic Party, we are the ones that are on 143 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:26,239 Speaker 4: the front lines, and I do think we've been taking 144 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:26,960 Speaker 4: for granted. 145 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 3: So there were things like that. 146 00:06:28,920 --> 00:06:33,040 Speaker 4: That were happening, and you know, it was shocking for 147 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:39,160 Speaker 4: me to see that Democratic senators were just rubber stamping 148 00:06:39,320 --> 00:06:45,440 Speaker 4: Trump appointees nominees when when they it's like giving away 149 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:48,479 Speaker 4: your power, if you will, why are you giving you know? 150 00:06:48,600 --> 00:06:51,719 Speaker 4: Project twenty twenty five. You know what they're going to do. 151 00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:53,680 Speaker 3: You know this is going to be a lot worse 152 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:54,880 Speaker 3: than the first time around. 153 00:06:55,200 --> 00:06:58,960 Speaker 4: So why are you throwing away your power? And so 154 00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 4: it made me think, Okay, what am I going to 155 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:03,600 Speaker 4: do to have a voice in this moment and to 156 00:07:03,600 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 4: push the conversation. Oh I had this thought a while 157 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 4: ago to become an independent because I felt these things 158 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 4: inside of me and I felt that I needed to 159 00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 4: do something. 160 00:07:14,320 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 3: So honestly, s see, the book is. 161 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 4: About starting a conversation because the independent piece is very nuanced. Right, 162 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:24,040 Speaker 4: I'm not saying a third party. I am more saying 163 00:07:24,120 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 4: I want to be an independent thinker. And you know what, 164 00:07:26,400 --> 00:07:28,800 Speaker 4: you're going to have to work for my vote. There's 165 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:32,120 Speaker 4: an assumption that you will have my vote. Democratic Party, No, 166 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 4: not anymore. 167 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:34,800 Speaker 3: And you know this. 168 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 4: In doing campaigns and politics the last thirty sixty days, 169 00:07:38,480 --> 00:07:41,800 Speaker 4: who do they focus on the independence? And so there's 170 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:44,520 Speaker 4: that piece of it too, and right now, in this moment, 171 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:48,800 Speaker 4: taking it up a thirty thousand foot view, we need 172 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 4: a two party system for our democracy to work. The 173 00:07:51,560 --> 00:07:54,440 Speaker 4: two party system is not working right now. Our democracy 174 00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:58,160 Speaker 4: is hanging by a thread. That's problematic to me. That's 175 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:01,120 Speaker 4: scary to me. You have independent millions of independence. I'm 176 00:08:01,160 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 4: not the only one. So a lot of young people 177 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:07,440 Speaker 4: are becoming independents and they can't actually participate in the system. 178 00:08:07,520 --> 00:08:11,800 Speaker 4: The system is fundamentally broken and we have to do something. 179 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:14,440 Speaker 4: So this is my part. And you know, if you're 180 00:08:14,480 --> 00:08:18,120 Speaker 4: starting a conversation, that means people are talking, and I 181 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:19,280 Speaker 4: think that's a good thing. 182 00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:22,320 Speaker 3: And I'm happy to take hard questions. I'm happy to whatever. 183 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:25,520 Speaker 4: I'm fine, I'm happy to whatever ruffle some feathers that 184 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 4: that doesn't scare me. 185 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:28,840 Speaker 3: And so this is what I'm trying to do. 186 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:32,400 Speaker 1: You know, I struggled with this for a long time. 187 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:34,560 Speaker 1: I'm I'm still conservative. 188 00:08:34,640 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 2: Like people thought when I started like criticizing Trump or 189 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:40,600 Speaker 2: you know, Republicans, that I was like moving to the left. 190 00:08:40,640 --> 00:08:43,160 Speaker 2: I was, I'm critical of him because he's not conservative 191 00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 2: enough for me, and he's changed what that means, just 192 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 2: like I'm sure you're still progressive. 193 00:08:49,640 --> 00:08:50,640 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that even changed. 194 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:54,960 Speaker 4: Yeah, right, I'm aligned with the Democratic Party ideology. I'm 195 00:08:55,040 --> 00:09:00,240 Speaker 4: just critiquing them not meeting the moment, and for me, 196 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:02,440 Speaker 4: this is the way for them to for me to 197 00:09:02,480 --> 00:09:04,920 Speaker 4: push for them to meet the moment, and I'm also 198 00:09:04,960 --> 00:09:07,960 Speaker 4: speaking for millions of people who feel this way totally. 199 00:09:08,440 --> 00:09:09,080 Speaker 1: Oh totally. 200 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 2: I mean the the rise in registered voters who are 201 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:17,480 Speaker 2: unaffiliated with either major party. It's grown at nine points 202 00:09:17,480 --> 00:09:21,080 Speaker 2: since two thousand and the numbers of both Republican and 203 00:09:21,160 --> 00:09:24,160 Speaker 2: Democrat affiliate affiliated voters are dropping. 204 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:26,079 Speaker 1: And it's because I think a. 205 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:29,440 Speaker 2: Lot of people think neither party is solving problems, and 206 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:34,360 Speaker 2: they think that both parties are purity testing both candidates 207 00:09:34,440 --> 00:09:37,040 Speaker 2: and voters. And if you're not all in this, you're 208 00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:39,559 Speaker 2: not conserned. You know, you're not Republican enough. If you're 209 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:41,760 Speaker 2: not all in this, you're not a pive Democrat. And 210 00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:43,200 Speaker 2: I think people are mad about that. 211 00:09:43,840 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so. 212 00:09:44,800 --> 00:09:47,680 Speaker 4: Look, we are in a time of politics and I 213 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:50,320 Speaker 4: talk about this in my book where it's so partisan 214 00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:53,400 Speaker 4: that we're not listening to each other. Because my book, 215 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:57,280 Speaker 4: too is inspirational, it's hopeful, there's all of that. 216 00:09:57,360 --> 00:10:00,520 Speaker 3: Yes, I criticize, and I you know, shed like to. 217 00:10:00,520 --> 00:10:03,120 Speaker 4: Something that a lot of people are saying quietly, just 218 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 4: not out loud. But it is so partisan, and I 219 00:10:06,440 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 4: think this is that's why we got to where we 220 00:10:08,800 --> 00:10:12,200 Speaker 4: are today, because we're not talking to each other, and 221 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:16,160 Speaker 4: so that is that is that is such a problem, 222 00:10:16,600 --> 00:10:19,319 Speaker 4: and then with that comes hatred. With that comes to 223 00:10:19,400 --> 00:10:23,360 Speaker 4: lack of understanding, with that kind of a resentment, and 224 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:26,560 Speaker 4: you lose that values, you lose the moral compass because 225 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:29,080 Speaker 4: we're all stuck in our corners. And I think that's 226 00:10:29,080 --> 00:10:31,839 Speaker 4: why there is a horizon independence, because they're like, Okay, 227 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:34,680 Speaker 4: I can't with you, I can't with you. Young people 228 00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:36,800 Speaker 4: are like you one actually is talking to me at 229 00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:38,440 Speaker 4: all directly, And so. 230 00:10:38,360 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 3: It's become a real issue. 231 00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:45,480 Speaker 4: And let's I forget there's misinformation disinformation, Yes, there. 232 00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:47,600 Speaker 3: Is, Like we all have to be our own fact checkers. 233 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:51,480 Speaker 4: There's so much going on that's landing on at the 234 00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:53,280 Speaker 4: feet of the voter right now. 235 00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:58,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think if you're looking at you know 236 00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:03,040 Speaker 2: what both parties need to do to keep or win 237 00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:06,360 Speaker 2: back voters for midterms, but also pitching head to twenty 238 00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:08,520 Speaker 2: twenty eight, I think you have to you have to 239 00:11:08,520 --> 00:11:12,000 Speaker 2: figure out some things that maybe didn't work for Democrats 240 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:14,720 Speaker 2: in twenty twenty four. And my diagnosis of the election 241 00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:16,480 Speaker 2: has been consistent and simple. 242 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:18,600 Speaker 1: Democrats lost because they told. 243 00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:20,520 Speaker 2: Voters that they were wrong about how they felt on 244 00:11:20,559 --> 00:11:21,920 Speaker 2: the top three major issues. 245 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:23,600 Speaker 1: They told voters. 246 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:25,559 Speaker 2: The economy was great when they didn't feel it. They 247 00:11:25,559 --> 00:11:29,559 Speaker 2: told voters that crime was down when they felt unsafe. 248 00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:32,679 Speaker 2: And they told voters that immigration wasn't a crisis when 249 00:11:32,720 --> 00:11:34,560 Speaker 2: they could see it clearly was. 250 00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:36,040 Speaker 1: But what's your take if you had. 251 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:39,920 Speaker 2: To say one thing, not Biden's age because they dealt 252 00:11:39,920 --> 00:11:43,760 Speaker 2: with that, not Kamala's quick you know, you know, quick 253 00:11:43,800 --> 00:11:46,400 Speaker 2: turnaround because that won't happen again in twenty two. What 254 00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:48,600 Speaker 2: was the thing you'd tell the party? Yeah, fix this 255 00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:49,560 Speaker 2: or you're going to lose. 256 00:11:49,679 --> 00:11:49,920 Speaker 4: Yeah. 257 00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:51,400 Speaker 3: I think you're exactly right. 258 00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:55,520 Speaker 4: I think the communicating directly with people is a huge, 259 00:11:55,720 --> 00:11:56,880 Speaker 4: huge miss. 260 00:11:56,920 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 3: And look, I have to take accountability for this as well. 261 00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 4: I was speaking for the person who was the head 262 00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:05,560 Speaker 4: of the Democratic Party, so I don't, I don't I 263 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:07,760 Speaker 4: own up to that. That was your job, it was 264 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:12,560 Speaker 4: my job. But our messaging wasn't connecting. And there is 265 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 4: something to you know, And I say this in the book, 266 00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:18,600 Speaker 4: Get out of DC, folks, Let's get out of Washington. 267 00:12:18,800 --> 00:12:20,200 Speaker 3: And we look, and we look. 268 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:21,880 Speaker 4: I talked about it at the podium, so I can't 269 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:24,160 Speaker 4: even run away. I talked about the data and the polling. Oh, 270 00:12:24,240 --> 00:12:25,880 Speaker 4: consumer confidence is up. 271 00:12:25,800 --> 00:12:28,040 Speaker 1: And that doesn't do it. 272 00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:30,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, and all of that is true, I know. 273 00:12:30,080 --> 00:12:30,880 Speaker 1: It's all true. 274 00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:34,439 Speaker 3: Did not connect It was to get here, Yeah, it 275 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:35,240 Speaker 3: didn't get. 276 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:37,040 Speaker 4: Here, and they weren't feeling it. And so there is 277 00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 4: something too. And this is what I would tell Democrats 278 00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:43,480 Speaker 4: like you gotta like stay off social media, stay off 279 00:12:43,559 --> 00:12:46,720 Speaker 4: like stop looking at the poll tested you know lines, 280 00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 4: and get out. 281 00:12:48,120 --> 00:12:49,079 Speaker 3: Of Washington, d C. 282 00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:52,439 Speaker 4: And we have to figure out a way to communicate 283 00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:54,960 Speaker 4: directly to the American people so that they feel seen. 284 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:59,559 Speaker 4: And that also means going into red districts talking to Republicans, 285 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:03,960 Speaker 4: you know it means, and also making sure that you're 286 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:08,520 Speaker 4: not you're not discounting your base, right, You're not right, 287 00:13:08,880 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 4: you know, there's there's also an assumption, I think more 288 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:13,920 Speaker 4: so we see it more so in the Democratic Party 289 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 4: in the Republican Party. There's something about the Republican Party. 290 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:19,520 Speaker 4: They just line up, right, They're just lined up. The 291 00:13:19,960 --> 00:13:24,240 Speaker 4: Democratic Party, you can't let go, you can't discount your base. 292 00:13:25,040 --> 00:13:26,440 Speaker 3: You know, there's there's. 293 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:28,600 Speaker 1: No The difference is I would say this a lot. 294 00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:30,920 Speaker 3: Here you would Republican you would matter to me. 295 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:33,440 Speaker 2: But you're exactly right, and I would talk about this 296 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:35,520 Speaker 2: difference a lot, because I would say the difference between 297 00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:38,559 Speaker 2: Trump and Biden, or Trump and Kamala, Republicans and Democrats 298 00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:42,439 Speaker 2: is Democratic voters hold the Democratic Party to a much 299 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:47,360 Speaker 2: higher standard and they demand accountability, and Republicans hold Donald 300 00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:50,760 Speaker 2: Trump to a much lower standard and demand no accountability. 301 00:13:51,040 --> 00:13:55,079 Speaker 2: So when Biden wasn't connecting with black voters and getting 302 00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:58,840 Speaker 2: the coalition that Obama had gotten, they were like, you don't, 303 00:13:58,920 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 2: we don't you don't just get us. 304 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:02,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, you have to you still have to earn it 305 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:05,120 Speaker 1: and hold yourself accountable to it. 306 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:07,199 Speaker 2: That I think was the difference we saw more than 307 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:08,520 Speaker 2: anything in twenty twenty four. 308 00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:10,880 Speaker 4: Yeah, and I and look, I think to your point, 309 00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:15,000 Speaker 4: people weren't feeling what we were doing, even you know, objectively, 310 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 4: we were doing a good job. 311 00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:17,959 Speaker 3: The President had. 312 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:21,960 Speaker 4: Some historic wins that I think down the road, when 313 00:14:22,120 --> 00:14:25,680 Speaker 4: history looks back, it would it will remember him favorably 314 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:27,680 Speaker 4: for some of the things that we got to do 315 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:30,360 Speaker 4: on a bipartisan basis, and some of it wasn't right, 316 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:33,080 Speaker 4: And that is something that I do believe he would 317 00:14:33,200 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 4: be remembered favorably for. 318 00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 3: But in the moment, with misinformation disinformation. With politics being 319 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:42,440 Speaker 3: so partisan, it is hard to break through. 320 00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 4: And that means you got to you got to communicate 321 00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:49,120 Speaker 4: a lot more. You got to actually take it to 322 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:52,200 Speaker 4: the people. You got to talk to them directly, and 323 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:53,800 Speaker 4: that's how you build a coalition. 324 00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:56,480 Speaker 3: And I do agree in the differences of. 325 00:14:57,080 --> 00:15:01,640 Speaker 4: Both parties, but then that means the only is on leadership, 326 00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:05,920 Speaker 4: The illness is on that candidate to really try to 327 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:10,320 Speaker 4: be in that community regularly more you know, you know, 328 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:14,480 Speaker 4: more fiercely, like showing that fight, you know, and look, 329 00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:15,320 Speaker 4: I want to bring up. 330 00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:19,280 Speaker 3: Look, people could disagree with mom Donnie or agree. 331 00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 4: I'm not talking about his policies, but I'm talking about 332 00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:24,120 Speaker 4: how he has effectively. 333 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:25,280 Speaker 3: Engaged young people. 334 00:15:26,120 --> 00:15:28,400 Speaker 4: And the you know, the way he did is the 335 00:15:28,400 --> 00:15:32,720 Speaker 4: way he communicates, the way you know, he went into 336 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 4: into like the communities of New York City, taking the train, 337 00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:42,200 Speaker 4: talking to people directly, having those hard conversations I mean. 338 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:45,120 Speaker 3: Young people, when young people really come out in a 339 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 3: primary in the way that they did. 340 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:49,680 Speaker 4: They came out in a primary, and then after that 341 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:51,760 Speaker 4: he had to figure out how to build a coalition. 342 00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:54,840 Speaker 3: But it is that directness that he had. 343 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:58,160 Speaker 5: It is like that really that you know, politics is 344 00:15:58,200 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 5: local and going into the community that I think is 345 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:06,240 Speaker 5: a message that that Democrats can take on the national 346 00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:08,840 Speaker 5: level and see how you do that. 347 00:16:08,960 --> 00:16:11,680 Speaker 3: And he was refreshing to people, and so I think 348 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:14,440 Speaker 3: that there's something there. And I'm not talking about his policies, 349 00:16:14,560 --> 00:16:15,359 Speaker 3: you know, people. 350 00:16:15,160 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 4: I know what I know, people are going to have 351 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:19,320 Speaker 4: total people are gonna have to debate that and figure 352 00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 4: that on their own. 353 00:16:20,600 --> 00:16:24,640 Speaker 3: But the actions that he took, it resonated. It just 354 00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 3: did you know. 355 00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:27,560 Speaker 2: I was just going to bring him up because I'm 356 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:30,640 Speaker 2: covering this election. I do a daily show on this 357 00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:32,160 Speaker 2: New York City election, So I was just going to 358 00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:35,160 Speaker 2: bring up them, Dohnny. And there are lots of good 359 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:38,320 Speaker 2: lessons Democrats should take from his campaign. Some others they 360 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:41,160 Speaker 2: should not because he's not a national you know, he's 361 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 2: not a candidate you could run nationally, you can you 362 00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:45,960 Speaker 2: can run him in New York City, we'll see. 363 00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:48,400 Speaker 1: But he did do He did a sort of an 364 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:52,880 Speaker 1: old school ground game. It was like old school. It 365 00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:53,880 Speaker 1: wasn't anything new. 366 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:55,680 Speaker 3: Actually it was exactly. 367 00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:59,240 Speaker 4: It was like it was your quitt essential politics as locals. 368 00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:01,440 Speaker 4: So therefore or how do you do that? You got 369 00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:04,320 Speaker 4: to go into the community. And you know why, I 370 00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:05,960 Speaker 4: think he also did it, and I don't. 371 00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:08,040 Speaker 3: I don't know him. I've not never spoken to him 372 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:09,720 Speaker 3: as far as I can remember. 373 00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:13,879 Speaker 4: But he I think because he knew he didn't he 374 00:17:14,040 --> 00:17:17,439 Speaker 4: wasn't the incumbent, he wasn't a Cuomo. He didn't have 375 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:20,879 Speaker 4: the name idea or the name recognition, so he knew, Okay, 376 00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:23,719 Speaker 4: I have to build a grassroots ground game. Which who 377 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:26,760 Speaker 4: does that sound like to you? That sounds like Obama? Right? 378 00:17:26,800 --> 00:17:30,560 Speaker 3: Obama like that that. 379 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:35,439 Speaker 4: Grassroots on the ground game. And who does who do 380 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:37,119 Speaker 4: you bring into that when you do that? 381 00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:40,320 Speaker 3: Young people? And that's what he was able to do. 382 00:17:40,520 --> 00:17:43,600 Speaker 4: And he was a great orator and was able to 383 00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:46,520 Speaker 4: really inspire people, and that's how he shocked folks. 384 00:17:46,560 --> 00:17:47,560 Speaker 3: I'm not comparing the two. 385 00:17:47,720 --> 00:17:50,720 Speaker 4: I'm just saying there is some there is some similarities 386 00:17:50,760 --> 00:17:53,360 Speaker 4: there that sound familiar and. 387 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:54,960 Speaker 1: So totally we heard it all the time. 388 00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:58,159 Speaker 2: Yeah, when we talk to voters, I haven't seen this 389 00:17:58,280 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 2: kind of enthusiasm since Obama. 390 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:01,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, they are. 391 00:18:01,760 --> 00:18:06,360 Speaker 2: Excited, they are inspired. When will you know someone will 392 00:18:06,359 --> 00:18:08,160 Speaker 2: point out, well, some of the things he's talking about 393 00:18:08,160 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 2: doing he probably won't get to do. They don't care 394 00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:12,920 Speaker 2: they don't even care because the way he's talking, they say, 395 00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:17,960 Speaker 2: he gets me. He's exciting, he's hopeful, he's positive, and 396 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:19,720 Speaker 2: I just don't see a lot of candidates running like 397 00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:20,520 Speaker 2: that on him exactly. 398 00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:22,680 Speaker 4: And you know this, it's it's easy to campaign, hard 399 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 4: to govern. I mean that's something. 400 00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:25,240 Speaker 1: Though, and that'll be hard. 401 00:18:25,240 --> 00:18:28,040 Speaker 4: That'll be hard, and that's something that you know, if 402 00:18:28,040 --> 00:18:31,440 Speaker 4: it turns out the way that we expected to, that's 403 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:33,720 Speaker 4: something that I'm sure he has smart people around him 404 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:36,400 Speaker 4: that will help him figure that all out. And that's 405 00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:39,000 Speaker 4: the hard part, right, And that's what the incumbency met like. 406 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:41,280 Speaker 4: Once you become an incumbent, it's like, yeah, you made 407 00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:43,880 Speaker 4: it through. You won the election, and we've all we've 408 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:46,200 Speaker 4: you know, Obama had to deal with that obviously, Joe 409 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:49,560 Speaker 4: Biden and everybody has that. You know that that kind 410 00:18:49,560 --> 00:18:54,280 Speaker 4: of that to bear, and it is it's just, you know, 411 00:18:54,320 --> 00:18:56,280 Speaker 4: you can inspire, you can talk to people, you can 412 00:18:56,320 --> 00:18:58,600 Speaker 4: meet the moment, and then you have to actually govern, 413 00:18:58,680 --> 00:18:59,200 Speaker 4: and which. 414 00:18:59,040 --> 00:18:59,680 Speaker 1: Is do the work. 415 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:01,000 Speaker 3: The work. It's really hard. 416 00:19:01,760 --> 00:19:02,679 Speaker 1: So what's next for you? 417 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:05,600 Speaker 3: Well, I'm on this tour. 418 00:19:07,200 --> 00:19:10,439 Speaker 2: That yeah, that's as far as you plays, as far 419 00:19:10,480 --> 00:19:10,679 Speaker 2: as the. 420 00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:15,159 Speaker 4: Plan no, no, because I'll say this, I I'm a 421 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:16,000 Speaker 4: private citizen. 422 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:18,160 Speaker 3: It's been a while since I've been in this space. 423 00:19:18,440 --> 00:19:18,679 Speaker 5: You know. 424 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:21,359 Speaker 4: I really want to be there for my family and 425 00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:25,160 Speaker 4: the people that I love and and just be very present. 426 00:19:25,240 --> 00:19:27,399 Speaker 4: As you know, being in the White House, it's just 427 00:19:27,520 --> 00:19:30,240 Speaker 4: so hard. You try to you try to have everything, 428 00:19:30,280 --> 00:19:33,040 Speaker 4: but it's a hard thing to do. But I honestly 429 00:19:33,080 --> 00:19:35,160 Speaker 4: want to try and be able to tell stories, tell 430 00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:40,040 Speaker 4: stories of people who voices aren't aren't being lifted up, 431 00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:42,760 Speaker 4: or who people didn't know about. Like I'll talk about 432 00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:45,399 Speaker 4: these two women that I learned when I was in 433 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:48,640 Speaker 4: the White House, Ethel Pain and Alice Done Again, And 434 00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:50,840 Speaker 4: they were the two first black women to be part 435 00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:51,760 Speaker 4: of the White House Press Corps. 436 00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:53,280 Speaker 3: We're talking about seventy five years ago. 437 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:57,199 Speaker 4: And I can't even imagine as women being part of 438 00:19:57,240 --> 00:19:59,280 Speaker 4: the White House Press Corps and then women of color, 439 00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 4: black women at that. 440 00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:03,240 Speaker 3: And they have an amazing. 441 00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:04,600 Speaker 4: Story and I would love to tell that story. I'd 442 00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:06,840 Speaker 4: love to partner up with the production company. 443 00:20:06,520 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 3: And tell that story. 444 00:20:08,119 --> 00:20:10,240 Speaker 4: And so those are the things like I feel like 445 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:13,159 Speaker 4: as being a first and breaking glass ceilings. There's so 446 00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:17,359 Speaker 4: many people before me who have incredible stories who people 447 00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:20,520 Speaker 4: haven't heard of or don't quite know. 448 00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:23,159 Speaker 3: They're full the full breath of how they got to 449 00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:23,879 Speaker 3: where they got to. 450 00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:26,600 Speaker 4: And so I hope that I continue to inspire people 451 00:20:26,680 --> 00:20:29,080 Speaker 4: that I hope I continue to be a voice for 452 00:20:29,119 --> 00:20:31,240 Speaker 4: people who feel like they don't have a voice right now. 453 00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:32,840 Speaker 4: And so I just you know, I'm going to figure 454 00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:35,560 Speaker 4: out how to do that. But I'm excited. I'm excited 455 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:38,160 Speaker 4: for this book. I'm proud of this book. I hope 456 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:40,960 Speaker 4: people give it a chance. It's there's a lot more 457 00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:46,040 Speaker 4: to it, and I do believe it will inspire folks 458 00:20:46,040 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 4: and give. 459 00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:47,359 Speaker 3: People a roadmap. 460 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:50,760 Speaker 4: If you if you're interested in how to and how 461 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 4: to and how to do it and how to you know, 462 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:54,160 Speaker 4: be meet the moment. 463 00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:56,840 Speaker 2: Well, I'm sure you'll get all those opportunities, and you 464 00:20:56,920 --> 00:20:58,920 Speaker 2: deserve them. And thanks so much for coming on Green 465 00:20:58,960 --> 00:20:59,840 Speaker 2: and good luck with the book to. 466 00:20:59,840 --> 00:21:02,000 Speaker 3: Our Thank you, Scie, thank you for the conversation. I 467 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:02,680 Speaker 3: appreciate this. 468 00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 2: That was another great conversation. Thanks to Krinn. And you 469 00:21:08,359 --> 00:21:11,879 Speaker 2: can go buy her book. It's called Independent and it 470 00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:14,119 Speaker 2: covers both her time at the White House but also 471 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:19,400 Speaker 2: the twenty twenty four election and after coming up after 472 00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:22,320 Speaker 2: the break, we'll get into my mini monologue, my hot 473 00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:23,000 Speaker 2: take of the week. 474 00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:38,439 Speaker 1: Don't go anywhere. Have you been to our nation's capital. 475 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:42,640 Speaker 2: If you have, I sure hope you got a chance 476 00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:45,240 Speaker 2: to visit the White House because part of it is 477 00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:45,800 Speaker 2: totally gone. 478 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:47,280 Speaker 1: Now. That's right. 479 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:51,159 Speaker 2: After President Trump promised he would not completely demolish the 480 00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:54,320 Speaker 2: East Wing in order to make room for a new ballroom, 481 00:21:54,680 --> 00:21:55,760 Speaker 2: he did just that. 482 00:21:55,920 --> 00:21:59,840 Speaker 1: It's gone. It is gone, and the pictures are jar. 483 00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 2: The People's House is It's torn up, with an entire 484 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:11,320 Speaker 2: side exposed to onlookers and tourists and cameras the world. 485 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:16,400 Speaker 2: Dangling wires and shingles and beams and pipes are jutting 486 00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:21,080 Speaker 2: out into this airy vacuum where the East Wing used 487 00:22:21,119 --> 00:22:25,800 Speaker 2: to be. It's really it's really something to see, and 488 00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:28,840 Speaker 2: not in a good way. Now, Trump didn't ask anyone's 489 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 2: permission to take a wrecking ball to two hundred and 490 00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:35,320 Speaker 2: twenty three years of American history. I need to ask 491 00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:37,919 Speaker 2: my town for a permit to paint my front door, 492 00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:42,359 Speaker 2: but Trump just did it. Now. I've been lucky enough 493 00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:44,800 Speaker 2: to visit the White House a few times, and it's 494 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:51,479 Speaker 2: incredibly humbling. It is full of so much rich history 495 00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:55,240 Speaker 2: and tradition, and honestly, when you walk through it really 496 00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:58,920 Speaker 2: helps tell the story of America itself. It's incredibly impressive, 497 00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:03,040 Speaker 2: it's intimidating, and it's it's a really great venue for 498 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:10,320 Speaker 2: facilitating international diplomacy. As Michael Douglas's President Andrew Shepherd says 499 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:13,960 Speaker 2: in The American President, the White House is the single 500 00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:17,520 Speaker 2: greatest home court advantage in the modern world. And President 501 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:22,960 Speaker 2: Trump understands the value of first impressions, even and like 502 00:23:23,119 --> 00:23:26,080 Speaker 2: especially if they're not painting an accurate picture. You know, 503 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:28,679 Speaker 2: he may have like put gold leaf in his New 504 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:31,280 Speaker 2: York City bathrooms, but he also inflated the value of 505 00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:34,920 Speaker 2: his properties and his own net worth. Four years he 506 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:38,920 Speaker 2: famously pretended to be his own spokesman to appear more established. 507 00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:43,000 Speaker 2: He has sold everything from quote luxury ties to luxury 508 00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:47,399 Speaker 2: home goods, most of which were made very cheaply in China. Okay, 509 00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:49,879 Speaker 2: so for Trump, forget if it's genuine or not. It 510 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,600 Speaker 2: just has to look rich. So no one should be 511 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:56,919 Speaker 2: surprised that on his second go round at president, he 512 00:23:56,960 --> 00:24:00,280 Speaker 2: decided the White House needed the Trump touch to Now, 513 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:03,120 Speaker 2: He's not known for subtlety, and so Trump's already made 514 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:07,040 Speaker 2: noticeable changes painting over fixtures in the oval office. This 515 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:11,639 Speaker 2: like garish gold festooning the place with gold vases and 516 00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:17,000 Speaker 2: trophies and coasters. I mean, ugh, that's like Versailles. He 517 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:20,440 Speaker 2: added this cheesy hall of presidents, like you might find 518 00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:23,679 Speaker 2: at an Atlantic city hotel. But he was sure to 519 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:26,720 Speaker 2: put a picture of Joe Biden's auto pen where the 520 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:30,600 Speaker 2: forty six president's portrait should be, because he's the pettiest, 521 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:34,520 Speaker 2: smallest person on the planet. Well, and now he's planning 522 00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:37,000 Speaker 2: this new ballroom, much like the one he uses at 523 00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:40,359 Speaker 2: mar A Lago to host his corporate and political pals. 524 00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:44,080 Speaker 2: The new ballroom will cost two hundred and fifty million dollars, 525 00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:48,400 Speaker 2: and Trump insists it's being entirely funded by private donors. 526 00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:54,200 Speaker 2: But honestly, with his penchant for misleading about his own expenditures, 527 00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:55,800 Speaker 2: I guess we'll just have to take his word for it. 528 00:24:56,960 --> 00:25:03,040 Speaker 2: Trump is reveling in the construction, I mean construction. Here's 529 00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:07,200 Speaker 2: what he said at a Tuesday press conference, practically post coital, 530 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:09,320 Speaker 2: like he just finished a big mac. 531 00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:12,800 Speaker 1: You probably hear the beautiful sound of construction to the back. 532 00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:14,439 Speaker 4: You hear that sound. 533 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:16,879 Speaker 1: Oh, that's music to my ears. 534 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:17,680 Speaker 3: I love that sound. 535 00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 4: Other people don't like it. 536 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:19,800 Speaker 5: I love it, Josh. 537 00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:23,119 Speaker 4: I think when I hear that sound, it reminds me 538 00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:23,600 Speaker 4: of money. 539 00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:26,520 Speaker 2: No, it's not hard to see why Trump looks at 540 00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:29,800 Speaker 2: the White House and sees money. He's used the Office 541 00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:33,399 Speaker 2: of the Presidency to rake in the cash, boosting his 542 00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:38,320 Speaker 2: personal network by a record three billion just since twenty 543 00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 2: twenty four, you guys, in less than a year. 544 00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:43,840 Speaker 1: Three billion dollars. 545 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:49,320 Speaker 2: That's mostly through a lucrative family crypto venture. But that's 546 00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:54,120 Speaker 2: not all He's spending America's money, like like, like. 547 00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:54,840 Speaker 1: There's no tomorrow. 548 00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 2: He's announced a new Arcite Trump, a structure that will 549 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:01,680 Speaker 2: be built across from the Memorial to commemorate the country's 550 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:04,560 Speaker 2: two hundred and fiftieth anniversary. We don't know how much 551 00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:06,359 Speaker 2: that's going to cost or who's going to pay for it. 552 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:11,400 Speaker 2: He is refurbishing that four hundred million dollar Katari plane 553 00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:16,600 Speaker 2: that he was gifted in May, which to trick it 554 00:26:16,680 --> 00:26:18,920 Speaker 2: out like they're going to do, is going to cost 555 00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:22,320 Speaker 2: the taxpayers over a billion dollars. That's another billion with 556 00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 2: a be Trump says he's donating that plane to his 557 00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:32,080 Speaker 2: Presidential Library Foundation. New York Times report this week says 558 00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:35,800 Speaker 2: Trump is asking the Justice Department to pay him personally 559 00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:39,840 Speaker 2: two hundred and thirty million dollars as a kind of 560 00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:44,320 Speaker 2: reparations for investigating him or in other words, for doing 561 00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:49,720 Speaker 2: their job two hundred and thirty million dollars in taxpayer money. 562 00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:52,520 Speaker 2: He is asking the Justice Department to give him personally. 563 00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:56,080 Speaker 2: This is all happening, I don't have to tell you. 564 00:26:56,280 --> 00:26:59,719 Speaker 2: While the government is shut down and costing taxpayers fifteen 565 00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:04,160 Speaker 2: bis billion dollars a week. Federal employees are literally lining 566 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:09,800 Speaker 2: up for food donations. This is happening as Trump just 567 00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:15,160 Speaker 2: handed Argentina a twenty billion dollar bailout, while American farmers 568 00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:19,960 Speaker 2: are suffering under his dumb trade wars. And it's happening 569 00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:24,240 Speaker 2: while twenty two US states are either in a recession 570 00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:29,000 Speaker 2: or on the brink. Trump doesn't care because fleecing the 571 00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:34,640 Speaker 2: American people is just business as usual for him. Last year, Trump, 572 00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:38,160 Speaker 2: it was discovered, was charging more than a thousand bucks 573 00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:42,119 Speaker 2: a night on the taxpayer's credit card so that Secret 574 00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:46,400 Speaker 2: Service agents protecting his family could stay at Trump Hotels, 575 00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:48,639 Speaker 2: not a holiday inn, for one hundred and fifty nine 576 00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:51,520 Speaker 2: bucks a night, but over one thousand dollars to stay 577 00:27:51,520 --> 00:27:55,520 Speaker 2: at a Trump hotel after lying about the results of 578 00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:58,920 Speaker 2: the twenty twenty election, he fleeced his own supporters, encouraging 579 00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:03,600 Speaker 2: donations to help stop the steal, donations which he then 580 00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:06,879 Speaker 2: used to pay his own legal bills and for things 581 00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:12,879 Speaker 2: like Malania's stylist, from Golden Sneakers to Trump Bibles. He 582 00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:16,240 Speaker 2: will get his hands on your money anyway he can. 583 00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:20,119 Speaker 2: But I think Trump is stuck in the nineteen eighties, 584 00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:24,760 Speaker 2: both in terms of his gaudy interior design aesthetic and 585 00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:26,720 Speaker 2: his assumption of where the. 586 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:28,520 Speaker 1: American economy is today. 587 00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:32,400 Speaker 2: He may learn in the midterms that greed isn't as 588 00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:35,479 Speaker 2: good as it was for Gordon Gecko when his voters 589 00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:38,960 Speaker 2: can't afford gas or groceries. Or I don't know, maybe 590 00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:42,840 Speaker 2: he's stuck in the seventeen eighties with this faux French 591 00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:46,640 Speaker 2: arc to Trump a nod to the extravagant court of 592 00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:51,640 Speaker 2: Luisas and Marie Antoinette, who's lavish spending while their people 593 00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:57,080 Speaker 2: starved prompted an actual revolution. So will Americans tire of 594 00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:00,760 Speaker 2: Trump's excess as they struggle to meet ba sick needs 595 00:29:01,360 --> 00:29:04,920 Speaker 2: While he shrugs and says, let them eat crypto. 596 00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:08,360 Speaker 1: Okay, that's it for talking politics. 597 00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:11,400 Speaker 2: If you want to respond or have any ideas or 598 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:14,160 Speaker 2: questions for me, please write us at Off the Cup 599 00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:16,160 Speaker 2: at gmail dot com. That's Off the Cup Cup with 600 00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:18,400 Speaker 2: two p's at gmail dot com and. 601 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:21,720 Speaker 1: Maybe we'll read your note on the next show. 602 00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:24,080 Speaker 2: That's it for me, See you next time, and don't 603 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:26,600 Speaker 2: forget to watch Off the Cup. Go go listen to 604 00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:31,560 Speaker 2: Off the Cup and our Talking Coffee episode as well. 605 00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:32,000 Speaker 1: Thanks. 606 00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:38,320 Speaker 2: Off the Cup is a production of iHeart Podcasts as 607 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:39,800 Speaker 2: part of the Reason Choice Network. 608 00:29:40,040 --> 00:29:41,720 Speaker 1: If you want more, check out the other. 609 00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:46,160 Speaker 2: Reason Choice podcasts, Politics with Jamel Hill and Native Land pod. 610 00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:49,200 Speaker 2: For Off the Cup, I'm your host, se Cup. Editing 611 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:52,560 Speaker 2: and sound design by Derek Clements. Our executive producers are 612 00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:56,400 Speaker 2: me Se Cup, Lauren Hanson, and Lindsay Hoffman. Rate and 613 00:29:56,440 --> 00:30:00,240 Speaker 2: review wherever you get your podcasts, Follow or subscribe for 614 00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:01,920 Speaker 2: new episodes every Wednesday.