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Speaker 1: Hey there, and welcome to short stuff. This is Josh,

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Speaker 1: there's Chuck, there's Jerry. We're gonna talk about death, the natural,

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Speaker 1: super hip thing to do. And there's Dave Ruse in

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Speaker 1: a bottle with a cork on top, screaming, let me

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Speaker 1: out right. That was weird, but I loved it. Yeah, Dave.

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Speaker 1: Dave helps us out with the longer form stuff. But

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Speaker 1: this is one of the old I don't know how old,

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Speaker 1: but one of the old house stuff works shorties. Did

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Speaker 1: he put together? Yeah? I don't think it was old.

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Speaker 1: I think it was new, one of the new. Just

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Speaker 1: mean the old website old you gotta say it like that,

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Speaker 1: then the old with any Yeah, the oldie. We sure

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Speaker 1: wasted a lot of time. Good. So Chuck, we're talking obituaries,

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Speaker 1: that's right. Do you read these? Um Probably not because

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Speaker 1: you're under eight. No, yeah, no, I know, but people

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Speaker 1: do love him. Yeah, it's interesting that I read that

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Speaker 1: um on. Oh. I think Beyond the Dash is what

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Speaker 1: it was called, which is great because you know the

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Speaker 1: dash between the date of birth and the date of death,

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Speaker 1: there's a dash between them. There's a website, an obituary

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Speaker 1: website called Beyond the Dash and they said, in obituaries

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Speaker 1: like your final gift to a loved one, you're celebrating

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Speaker 1: their life for all to see and read. Or if

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Speaker 1: you're one of those weirdos who reads obituaries for those

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Speaker 1: people to read and see. Yeah, I think, uh, I

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Speaker 1: think it's long been like elderly people read obituaries. The

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Speaker 1: joke is sort of the you know, because they're not

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Speaker 1: in them. Man, when when ages m becomes a real

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Speaker 1: thing in like ten years, this this episode is not

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Speaker 1: going to aged already a thing, a real thing. Okay,

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Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Yeah, but they have always

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Speaker 1: well they've they've changed a lot over the years, um,

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Speaker 1: which is sort of interesting. And this uh one of

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Speaker 1: the I mean, we're going to plug the genealogy website now, Okay,

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Speaker 1: there's a genealogy website though that has apparently you can

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Speaker 1: learn a lot about your genealogy just from researching obituaries

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Speaker 1: because they list so many people in the family. It's

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Speaker 1: like a family tree there. Yeah yeah, so um. And

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Speaker 1: then even obituary websites and genealogy websites, they've unleashed a

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Speaker 1: I on these things, and the bots have really had

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Speaker 1: a field day coming up with oh, bits dating back

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Speaker 1: as far as I can see to the seventeen fifties,

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Speaker 1: at least in the United States. Yeah, this one genealogy

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Speaker 1: website has uh two hundred and sixty two million published

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Speaker 1: obituaries online. Yeah, see if you can figure out which

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Speaker 1: one it is. Yeah, I guess so. But um, so

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Speaker 1: the bots have kind of they've they've said, Okay, well,

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Speaker 1: from what we've been able to ascertain, at least from

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Speaker 1: digitized newspaper records going back to the mid eighteenth century,

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Speaker 1: bits weren't a very big thing unless you were famous,

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Speaker 1: very Yeah, that's a really good point. Yeah, the deaths

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Speaker 1: of famous, well known, successful people have always intrigued us. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't think you might might have told me that

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Speaker 1: obituaries were pre written for a lot of people, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like the New York Times, oh bits, you know, like

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Speaker 1: the real deal ones. Yeah. Um, I think you told

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Speaker 1: me that a couple of years ago or something, and

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Speaker 1: I was just astonished. I definitely knew that. Yeah, it

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Speaker 1: sounds like something I would tell you probably, and it's

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Speaker 1: not made up over or afternoon tea. Right, but they'll

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Speaker 1: they'll just have like an no bit going on somebody

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Speaker 1: and then when they finally die, they can get it

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Speaker 1: out the door really quick, just by kind of summing

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Speaker 1: up at the end, he's filling that last beyond the dash.

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Speaker 1: And maybe if they did anything noteworthy in the last

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Speaker 1: like eight months of their life, they didn't. What I

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Speaker 1: wonder is do they Uh? Is it just for old

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Speaker 1: people or people that they think like a risky I wonder,

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Speaker 1: you know, we'll have to ask Jeremy Piven. I don't

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Speaker 1: get that right. He played an obituary writer in One

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Speaker 1: in Something. Was he an obituary writer who was a

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Speaker 1: big jerk? Probably is? He got specializes in those roles

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Speaker 1: he does. Interesting. So mid nineteenth century, uh, you started

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Speaker 1: seeing this change from just famous types to regular old

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Speaker 1: people getting their local paper usually to publish sort of

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Speaker 1: stripped down obituaries. Yeah. It was called the death notice.

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Speaker 1: It was basically superstriped town. Yeah, this person died and

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Speaker 1: that's that. There's still death notices around today. And apparently

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Speaker 1: if you're into obituaries so much that, um, you will

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Speaker 1: publish a death notice. What you're saying is it's basically

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Speaker 1: like a hold the date for more information about the funeral.

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Speaker 1: They still do those today, But that was what obituaries

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Speaker 1: were Originally it was just you know, the person's name

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Speaker 1: they died, maybe who they were survived by, maybe a

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Speaker 1: little bit about the funeral. But the reason o bits

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Speaker 1: were so thin originally was because back in the day

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Speaker 1: before the Lena type was invented, and I think the

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Speaker 1: eighteen eighties, when you put a newspaper together, every page,

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Speaker 1: every letter of every word of every sentence of every

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Speaker 1: line of every page LINGO, thank you um was set

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Speaker 1: by hand, by hand, yeah, every letter. So that's why

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Speaker 1: certain obituaries just had a name and died right exactly

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Speaker 1: with the date, maybe and you were you felt lucky

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Speaker 1: to even been mentioned. Probably. But then Lena type came

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Speaker 1: along and they said, hey, we've got a lot it's

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Speaker 1: a lot easier to make a newspaper. Now, let's make

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Speaker 1: more newspaper every day. So maybe we'll take a quick

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Speaker 1: break and we'll come back and talk a little bit

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Speaker 1: more about obituaries. You you want to know, you're in luck,

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Speaker 1: just chuck, Hey, chuck, let's talk a little bit more

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Speaker 1: about obituary. Yeah. I mean, there's certain things like the

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Speaker 1: Civil War obviously would ramp up the death notices, like

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Speaker 1: tens of thousands of these going out every year. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and this was even before the lenotype too, right. I

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Speaker 1: think because they were soldiers, they felt like they needed

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Speaker 1: to do do so, even though it was a pain.

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Speaker 1: Plus also, there seems to have been a real increase

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Speaker 1: in fascination with death among the Victorians. Oh yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean that's when they were taking bereavement photography. You know,

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Speaker 1: they were holding funerals at home. But they became much

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Speaker 1: more elaborate over time. Yeah. Well, what really changed was

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Speaker 1: the newspapers discovered that they could charge people money to

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Speaker 1: get a loved one listed in an obituary column, and

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Speaker 1: they could make some dough on it, and then it

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Speaker 1: became a real thing. They made fat stacks is everyone

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Speaker 1: called it. In two thousand eleven. These stats are pretty amazing, though,

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Speaker 1: From nineteen hundred, four hundred thousand obituaries in nineteen hundred

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Speaker 1: and then, uh, and that's from two million total newspapers.

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Speaker 1: By the nineteen thirties, there were one point to five

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Speaker 1: million obituaries in about two and a half million total pages. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so obituaries themselves in number exploded because they were mecondoh right,

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Speaker 1: but they also the amount of the newspaper that they

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Speaker 1: represented exploded to and from a fifth to a half

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Speaker 1: of all pages were obituaries. Really, yeah, that's that's I mean, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's usually wrong, but I'll bet it's close one point

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Speaker 1: to five million obituaries and two and a half million pages.

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Speaker 1: That's half right down the middle on the middle. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And this is where in the thirties and forties is

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Speaker 1: where you start to see that sort of classic obituary

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Speaker 1: notice that we know today not just died, sorry, but stuff.

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Speaker 1: It's it's a four part thing, the death announcement, a

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Speaker 1: little bit of a bio who they're survived by, and

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Speaker 1: then a little bit of the funeral info. Right, And

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Speaker 1: it didn't have to be like one paragraph each, but

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Speaker 1: I mean like it was in those segments. Sometimes the

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Speaker 1: middle bio part was extensive, depending on what they've done,

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Speaker 1: you know, sometimes the survived by was bigger than other

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Speaker 1: times like that. That's that sweet story about that veteran

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Speaker 1: who died in Florida, I think a couple of months ago,

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Speaker 1: and he outlived all of his family, and somebody got

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Speaker 1: word of it and it became like a viral thing

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Speaker 1: and tens I think like ten thousand people showed up

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Speaker 1: for his funeral, to make sure that he was seen off,

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Speaker 1: that he wasn't forgotten. What is your obituary, say, I

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Speaker 1: assume you have pre written it. First of all, it

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Speaker 1: just says died, died. Yeah, I've pre written it on

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Speaker 1: draft like six or seven. Yeah, No, I have not.

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Speaker 1: Have you now yours? I haven't even thought of mine.

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Speaker 1: I'm still l I V I N. Alright, alright, alright,

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Speaker 1: So this is where the genealogy comes in, and that

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Speaker 1: now you've got spouse's name, children's names, married names of daughters, grandchildren.

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Speaker 1: I mean you might see cousins if it's noteworthy, or

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Speaker 1: even even if it's not, if that's what the family

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Speaker 1: wants in there. Right, Because so the obituary, as Ruse

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Speaker 1: puts it as a quasi legal document. A lot of

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Speaker 1: people think you have to buy law, publish this in

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Speaker 1: the newspaper. You don't. You do, by law have to

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Speaker 1: file for a death certificate like we talked about in

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Speaker 1: the home burials short stuff. But you don't have to

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Speaker 1: publish it an obituary. But it's still definitely lets the

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Speaker 1: community know, hey, this person died, if you happen to um,

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Speaker 1: if this person happened to owe your money. It's about

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Speaker 1: to say, here's your chance to come, you know, make

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Speaker 1: your claim against the estate or whatever. So it does

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Speaker 1: serve some sort of function, but it's not like a

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Speaker 1: law that you have to publish an obituary. But but

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Speaker 1: it is up to the funeral home typically to publish

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Speaker 1: the obituary or contact the local newspaper. But the family

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Speaker 1: gives all the info that they want included in it,

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Speaker 1: and they're the ones who are footing the bill. I

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Speaker 1: think it's usually charged by line. So if you want

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Speaker 1: to include cousins, sure, but you know it's going to

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Speaker 1: cost you an extra eight cents second cousin Eddie really

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Speaker 1: worth it? Yeah? Uh? And then things changed again really

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Speaker 1: after nine eleven, apparently when the obituaries became much more

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Speaker 1: personal and these great stories started coming out about the

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Speaker 1: people who died on nine eleven. And I think that's

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Speaker 1: sort of, at least according to the people that they

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Speaker 1: quote in this article, said that that kind of changed

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Speaker 1: things all over the country and people started being a

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Speaker 1: lot more honest and maybe funny and making them real memorials,

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Speaker 1: but also, like I said, being honest and not brushing

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Speaker 1: things under the rug um, like if someone suffered from

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Speaker 1: depression and died by suicide. They wouldn't just put a

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Speaker 1: vague died suddenly at home. Yeah, exactly what they used

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Speaker 1: to say. Yeah, and I'm sure some of them still do.

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Speaker 1: But I think there's a trend towards honesty and openness

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Speaker 1: now more so for sure. And and apparently according to

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Speaker 1: Susan Soaper, who is an obituary expert as far as

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Speaker 1: Dave Ruse is concerned, she said that that was probably

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Speaker 1: what turned the tide, that that September eleven narrative obituary thing.

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Speaker 1: Did you read about that last thing about the saying

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Speaker 1: that the deceased will not be missed in some cases?

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Speaker 1: Whose was that? Was that just one? As far as

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Speaker 1: I could tell, it was just one. But a few

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Speaker 1: years back there was a woman um whose children, whose

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Speaker 1: adult children, UM said that the world would be better

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Speaker 1: off without her, or the world is now better off

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Speaker 1: without her, and she will not be missed. She she

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Speaker 1: really jilted them as children and they had never forgiven

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Speaker 1: her for it, and caused a huge outcry backlash, and

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Speaker 1: actually everyone sympathized with the dead woman, not the kids,

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Speaker 1: and not the kids. The kids were taken as like

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Speaker 1: little monsters who could not, who couldn't forgive their mom.

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Speaker 1: But it was a huge deal and it really kind

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Speaker 1: of said a lot about how we view the deceased

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Speaker 1: and their last you know send off. You know, just

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Speaker 1: how how many warts should you show? Right? And like,

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Speaker 1: even if that was I don't know, I'm not gonna

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Speaker 1: take a side. But even if that's the case, is

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Speaker 1: it is it gratifying to give mom a finger on

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Speaker 1: the way out the door? Yeah? I don't know, I don't.

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Speaker 1: You'd have to ask those kids not They were very um,

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Speaker 1: they were probably very surprised at the international backlash that

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Speaker 1: it garnered. Interesting. Well, that's a f obituaries, Chuck, Yes,

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Speaker 1: that means short Stuff is out. Stuff you should Know

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Speaker 1: is a production of I Heart Radios How Stuff Works.

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Speaker 1: For more podcasts for my heart Radio, visit the I

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