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Speaker 1: This is the OTP presented by Farm Bureau Health Plans.

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Speaker 1: Plan on paying less for the coverage you need with

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Speaker 1: Farm Bureau Health Plans. Get a quote today at FBHP

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Speaker 1: dot com. I'm Mike Keith and our special guest on

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Speaker 1: this edition of the OTP is Stefania Bell. Stefania is

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Speaker 1: senior writer and injury analyst for ESPN, and she is

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Speaker 1: one of our favorite people. Stefani, I have to ask

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Speaker 1: you first and foremost about your Sundays in Bristol, Connecticut

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Speaker 1: at ESPN. How busy are they and how many different

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Speaker 1: channels or whatever you want to call them in the

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Speaker 1: ESPN Empire are you involved with on a Sunday.

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Speaker 2: Well, Somedays are very big. They start very early. I'm

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Speaker 2: typically up at five thirty or six, and I'm quickly

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Speaker 2: checking to see if Adam Schefter posted anything overnight in

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Speaker 2: the hours that most of us were sleeping, because he

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Speaker 2: will have information from his sources sometimes on whether a

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Speaker 2: player who's been questionable is going to go, and that's

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Speaker 2: one of the things I'm usually waiting for. And then

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Speaker 2: I sometimes I'm making calls to some of my sources

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Speaker 2: on the way into work, so it really begins before

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Speaker 2: I even get there, and then starts early with makeup.

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Speaker 2: Very important when you have television, very important that you

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Speaker 2: have other people doing it. And so I'm there at

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Speaker 2: seven thirty for that, and then I do a radio show.

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Speaker 2: I do a hit on a show called Best Week

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Speaker 2: Ever with Peter Burns and Courtney Cronin and we talk

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Speaker 2: about the top NFL injuries of the week. So go

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Speaker 2: over to our radio studios for that, and then I

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Speaker 2: come back, and you know, it's usually chatting with the producers.

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Speaker 2: It's kind of fun because now That's Countdown is back

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Speaker 2: in Bristol. All of the folks are on Sunday Countdown.

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Speaker 2: We're all kind of in the same room and sometimes

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Speaker 2: we're chatting about things that are coming up on Sunday

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Speaker 2: that are of interest to all of us, and we

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Speaker 2: kind of disperse to our different shows. And then I

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Speaker 2: go to the studio for Fantasy Football Now. And it's

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Speaker 2: funny because we usually run on ESPN two from ten

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Speaker 2: to one. That's just kind of our home base. But

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Speaker 2: because we also televised Formula One and sometimes Sunday is

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Speaker 2: like this past Sunday with the New York City Marathon,

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Speaker 2: we will bounce round to ESPN News or whatever. And

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Speaker 2: our fans are great because they do follow us. You know,

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Speaker 2: they will switch the networks and tell us like they're

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Speaker 2: following us from one place to the other. So we

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Speaker 2: have a nice loyal group that is checking in, and

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Speaker 2: I think, if I dare to brag about it, we

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Speaker 2: really do have a great show for people who care

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Speaker 2: about not just fantasy football, but for football, because we

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Speaker 2: talk to our reporters who are at different stadiums around

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Speaker 2: the country, who are giving us last minute information about

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Speaker 2: who's in and who's out, what the who's likely to play.

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Speaker 2: You know, if there's a question about who's going to

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Speaker 2: get a bigger workload on a given day, they're trying

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Speaker 2: to gather that information for us. There's weather conditions that

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Speaker 2: are to impact the games. So I am biased because

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Speaker 2: I'm on the show, but that's I think it's a

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Speaker 2: good watch if you're interested. And then after that, it's

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Speaker 2: just everybody watches games so pretty much glued to the

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Speaker 2: TV and the injury reports, in particular for me from

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Speaker 2: one o'clock.

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Speaker 1: Forward, do you get calls or do you make calls

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Speaker 1: during games? As various injuries happen around the NFL.

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Speaker 2: UH sometimes you know, it's it's it's tough because you know,

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Speaker 2: obviously hippa is very real, and so you know, I

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Speaker 2: don't even try to reach out to medical contexts that

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Speaker 2: I have because that's just not for me to do.

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Speaker 2: And we have people who are insiders who do the

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Speaker 2: reporting of injuries. But if I need clarification on something

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Speaker 2: that's been reported, or I want to make sure we're

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Speaker 2: being accurate about something, I will reach out and make

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Speaker 2: calls at times to clarify things. Or sometimes I'm talking

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Speaker 2: to people who I know are researching certain topics, saying, hey,

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Speaker 2: we're seeing X number injuries and I want to look

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Speaker 2: at taking a deeper dive on this and what kind

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Speaker 2: of data do we have to support that. So there's

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Speaker 2: a lot that's happening in terms of texts and emails

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Speaker 2: and calls, but for a variety of topics, not necessarily

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Speaker 2: just what happened to Claire x Stefani.

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Speaker 1: I imagined you feel a ton of responsibility because you

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Speaker 1: mentioned hippa, but also informing your reporters and informing the

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Speaker 1: public about what's what in certain things. There is a

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Speaker 1: lot of responsibility in that, right.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, I take that very seriously. And you know, it's

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Speaker 2: funny because when I started this injury analysis as I

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Speaker 2: kind of coined that term because nobody was really doing it.

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Speaker 2: And now if you look on the social platforms, there

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Speaker 2: are a number of injury analysts, and I'm very proud

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Speaker 2: that you know, there must have been something worth doing

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Speaker 2: if other people are doing it now. And I think

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Speaker 2: it's a reflection of the fact that people are interested

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Speaker 2: in all sorts of information. I mean, it's twenty four

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Speaker 2: to seven, as you well know, and so people want

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Speaker 2: the latest information. And unfortunately with sports, all sports, but

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Speaker 2: when you get to a collision sport like the NFL,

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Speaker 2: they're going to be injuries. So naturally it's a big topic.

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Speaker 2: I care very much about accuracy, so you won't see

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Speaker 2: me I'm posting what I think has happened in a video.

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Speaker 2: Understand that people want to know what we think right away.

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Speaker 2: I'm certainly looking at it and I'm drawing my own conclusions,

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Speaker 2: but I'm very reluctant to post what something could be

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Speaker 2: because I think that you know, we're speculating the way

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Speaker 2: you have evaluate injuries. Video can be a part of it,

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Speaker 2: but there's certainly things that happened the medical personnel and

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Speaker 2: the player on the field that are key to understanding

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Speaker 2: what the actual injury is. And then there's the imaging component,

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Speaker 2: which of course we don't have access to. So when

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Speaker 2: you see insiders like Adam Schefter, for example, reporting on injuries,

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Speaker 2: he's talking to people who are close to the situation,

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Speaker 2: and whether that's player agents who are sharing information about

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Speaker 2: their athlete because they want to get it out there,

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Speaker 2: or team personnel who are authorized to release certain information

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Speaker 2: that they are the ones who are reporting it. I

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Speaker 2: always look at my job is providing the analysis, but

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Speaker 2: I do know when I hear things that don't sound

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Speaker 2: quite correct, and so I will try to tease it out.

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Speaker 2: Or if one of our reporters comes to me and says, hey,

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Speaker 2: I'm hearing this, but I don't know if that's one

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Speaker 2: hundred percent accurate, I'll try and find out a little

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Speaker 2: bit more to clarify, because I do think that people

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Speaker 2: want accurate information, and once something is out and it's

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Speaker 2: being reported, a lot more people are inclined to come

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Speaker 2: forward and provide clarity or more detail to make sure

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Speaker 2: that what is out there is accurate.

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Speaker 1: Titan's fans, it's always game on with Duncan, so grab

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Speaker 1: a coffee and kick off the action. Whether that's drinking

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Speaker 1: a cup of coffee on your way to the game

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Speaker 1: or grabbing one to go before watching the game at home,

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Speaker 1: Duncan is always there to help you get your game on.

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Speaker 1: Just like pros, we need to be at our best

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Speaker 1: come game day, which is why Duncan is the most

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Speaker 1: important part of your game day ritual because it's always

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Speaker 1: the best call for Football America runs on Duncan Stefania.

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Speaker 1: Are Achilles injuries up this season or does it just

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Speaker 1: seem like it because high profile players, including quarterbacks have

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Speaker 1: had the injury this season.

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Speaker 2: It's a great question, and I feel like this is

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Speaker 2: something we all fall victim to. When we're watching injuries

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Speaker 2: happen in the middle of the season, it always feels

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Speaker 2: like the worst we've ever seen, the most we've ever seen,

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Speaker 2: and it's hard in the moment to actually know if

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Speaker 2: we're just having we have that perception because there's some

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Speaker 2: sort of recency bias and we're recalling these or it's

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Speaker 2: happening to high profile players, but without actual data, we

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Speaker 2: could be way off. And the NFL Health and Safety

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Speaker 2: Group does put together injury data and they provide injury

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Speaker 2: metrics from across the years, and they have the exact

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Speaker 2: data because when a player gets hurt, each club has

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Speaker 2: to file that information in the electronic medical records, so

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Speaker 2: there is a database where these injuries are being entered,

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Speaker 2: and then the NFL Health and Safety Group goes back

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Speaker 2: and looks at the aggregate over a season and compares

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Speaker 2: it to prior years. So that being said, I think

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Speaker 2: the Achilles question is great because I'm getting that question

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Speaker 2: all the time because we are seeing this and most

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Speaker 2: recently with Kirk Cousins and then Cam Akers who tore

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Speaker 2: the opposite achilles after having a successful repair a few

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Speaker 2: years ago. So I actually reached out to a source

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Speaker 2: of mine who's with the NFL Health and Safety Committee

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Speaker 2: and said that found out the numbers were slightly up

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Speaker 2: in the pre season for Achilles, but they have tapered off,

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Speaker 2: so they compare preseason injuries to in season injuries, and

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Speaker 2: there are a lot of reasons why those are teased out,

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Speaker 2: but they do tease them out. So in the preseason,

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Speaker 2: the Achilles numbers were up slightly and then they've tapered

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Speaker 2: off in season, and the numbers they gave me were

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Speaker 2: at the past five years, the number of Achilles injuries

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Speaker 2: per year hovers around eighteen to twenty. So so far

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Speaker 2: we're only through nine weeks. We are consistent with on

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Speaker 2: you know, being on pace if you will, to match

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Speaker 2: a number in that range.

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Speaker 1: Aaron Rodgers Achilles began the focus of all of this.

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Speaker 1: He claims that he can potentially be back for the

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Speaker 1: playoffs if the Jets make the postseason. So to Stefani

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Speaker 1: A Bell, does that make sense based on what you

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Speaker 1: know about the normal Achilles recovery?

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Speaker 2: So here's it is a very complicated answer. The first

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Speaker 2: thing I'll say is I never say never when it

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Speaker 2: comes to athletes recovery. I think that you know, being

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Speaker 2: a physical therapist by trade and having rehabbed numerous athletes,

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Speaker 2: I understand that it's a very different process for each

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Speaker 2: and every one of them, and depending on their motivation

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Speaker 2: level and depending on their unique set of circumstances, what

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Speaker 2: their injury history is, what their overall health is, where

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Speaker 2: they are in the seasonal calendar when the injury happens.

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Speaker 2: These are all factors that go into recovery. And so

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Speaker 2: I've just seen people bust timelines enough to know that

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Speaker 2: you never say never unless it's something extraordinary where somebody

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Speaker 2: fractures a bone and the playoff with the next week

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Speaker 2: and you know they can't play on it, for example.

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Speaker 2: So in that regard, I would say, sure, Aaron Rodgers

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Speaker 2: potentially could be back for the playoffs. But to actually

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Speaker 2: look at realistically, there's a number of things you have

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Speaker 2: to consider. There's basically three main parts to an achilles recovery.

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Speaker 2: One is the initial wound healing. That's critical. Achilles surgeries

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Speaker 2: have a slightly higher risk for infection because of the

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Speaker 2: nature of the wound, although that has gotten better in

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Speaker 2: recent years with the incisions getting smaller and some other

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Speaker 2: things they're doing to help with early wound healing. So

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Speaker 2: that's number one, because if you have an infection, your

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Speaker 2: schedule is totally thrown off and you have to redo

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Speaker 2: some things. And then there's the healing of the tendon,

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Speaker 2: and this is really the critical stage because while you

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Speaker 2: need to introduce loading gradually because tendons they need to

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Speaker 2: bear load and you have to start introducing that. You

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Speaker 2: have to introduce ankle mobility so that you don't get

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Speaker 2: a stiff joint. You have to work the other tissues

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Speaker 2: around it. You have to maintain conditioning, but you can't

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Speaker 2: overload the tendon while it's healing, because the achilles is

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Speaker 2: responsible for spring. It's your spring, it's your jumper, right

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Speaker 2: and if you overstretch it, you will remove the elasticity

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Speaker 2: from that tendon. And if you think about a rubber

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Speaker 2: band for example, that's been overstretched, or an elastic waistband

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Speaker 2: in pants when it's been overstretched, it's no good anymore.

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Speaker 2: If you overstretch the achilles too soon, you will disrupt

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Speaker 2: the potential for it to have that spring capacity and

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Speaker 2: then functionally you won't ever be right again. So that

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Speaker 2: is a really critical feature and why you can only

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Speaker 2: move just quickly through the tendon healing. But once the

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Speaker 2: tendon is healed, and typically that takes anywhere from three

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Speaker 2: to four months, so in like the twelfth to sixteen

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Speaker 2: week range, then you can get far more aggressive with

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Speaker 2: return to sport. So if you do the math, that's

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Speaker 2: kind of the over arching criteria for getting back to play.

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Speaker 2: And if you look at the position of core with

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Speaker 2: Aaron Rodgers plays, it's not like he's a wide receiver

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Speaker 2: or defensive back that needs to be leaping in the air. Frequently,

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Speaker 2: so it's a lower demand for him to get back.

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Speaker 2: He's not a runner much anymore. He's older, so he

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Speaker 2: needs to be mobile enough to do what he needs

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Speaker 2: to do in the pocket and to protect himself to

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Speaker 2: evade pressure. He has to demonstrate that he can do

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Speaker 2: those things to be able to play. It's also his

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Speaker 2: lead leg that was injured, so it's not the leg

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Speaker 2: he pushes off from to drive the ball down the

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Speaker 2: field that also helps him. So if you look at

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Speaker 2: all those things together, the demands for him to return

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Speaker 2: aren't quite as much as they would be for somebody else.

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Speaker 2: And if you allow for the healing time of the

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Speaker 2: tendon his injury was in September, it's possible he could

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Speaker 2: make the playoffs. Will he be at one hundred percent?

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Speaker 2: Not likely? Can he be functional and effective as a quarterback,

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Speaker 2: That's the part that remains to be seen. So I

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Speaker 2: understand him dangling that carrot for himself out there. You've

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Speaker 2: got to go through the rehab either way, So why

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Speaker 2: not make that a goal and see if you can

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Speaker 2: get there.

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Speaker 1: Is there a particular type of injury this season that

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Speaker 1: has Stefani a Bell particularly concerned.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think for the last couple of years, it's

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Speaker 2: been the high ankle screen because it can be so

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Speaker 2: debilitating and players will try to come back early, they

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Speaker 2: try to push it to come back early, and they

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Speaker 2: really can't function like themselves. And we've seen this injury

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Speaker 2: definitely be on the rise, and one of the ways

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Speaker 2: that it seems to be induced more recently is this

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Speaker 2: hip drop tackling technique. And the NFL is actually looking

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Speaker 2: at this. I raised the question a year ago because

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Speaker 2: if you watch videos of how these injuries happen, and

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Speaker 2: you're in tennessee Ryan Tannehill last year when he had

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Speaker 2: the ankle surgery, you know, I had the ankle injury

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Speaker 2: that ultimately requires surgery, was subject to one of these

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Speaker 2: hip drop tackles where the way that the defender sort

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Speaker 2: of collapses through the hip forces the knee inward and

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Speaker 2: the food is planted and rotating hours and that is

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Speaker 2: the mechanism for the high ankle sprain. And we see

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Speaker 2: it over and over again. And the discussion point now

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Speaker 2: is how do they better identify when a hip drop

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Speaker 2: tackle is taking place? And then how do you teach

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Speaker 2: away from it. It's tough. I mean, I feel badly

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Speaker 2: because I know that people on the defensive side of

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Speaker 2: the ball and people who coach defensive players say, you

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Speaker 2: keep making it harder for us to do the job.

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Speaker 2: And I understand that, but you also look at the

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Speaker 2: data and these high ankle sprains, if it's just a

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Speaker 2: high ankle sprain, on average, they're going to miss more

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Speaker 2: than five games. Games are more if you look at

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Speaker 2: the season, that's almost thirty percent of the season. And

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Speaker 2: if it's a more severe type injury like Tony Pollard

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Speaker 2: who had this injury as a result of the hip

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Speaker 2: drop tackle and it ends up fracturing the ankle, and

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Speaker 2: it can also end up spraining the knee an MCL injury.

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Speaker 2: So these are not insignificant, and I think the discussion

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Speaker 2: about how to move forward with that particular technique and

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Speaker 2: trying to legislate away from that and still maintain the

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Speaker 2: basic structure of the game, but also decrease these high

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Speaker 2: innkel sprains. And that's not the only mechanism for them. Certainly,

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Speaker 2: turf and the construct of different fields as well as footwear.

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Speaker 2: That's all being examined as well, because players will talk

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Speaker 2: about when their cleats don't release from the surface, when

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Speaker 2: they feel like they're stuck, and that can be a

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Speaker 2: mechanism for all sorts of lower strow many injuries, including

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Speaker 2: a high innkel sprain Stefani.

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Speaker 1: It does it feel like soft tissue injuries have lessened

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Speaker 1: in any way, shape or form with all of the

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Speaker 1: off season focus that the NFL and all of the

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Speaker 1: teams put on helping to try to prevent them.

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Speaker 2: I think we're seeing some improvement, but it's negligible so

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Speaker 2: far as in the preseason. But I think that is

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Speaker 2: not so much the off season work because players still

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Speaker 2: they disperse after mini camps and they have this six

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Speaker 2: week period and they're doing very different things depending on

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Speaker 2: the player, depending on what their situation is. Some come

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Speaker 2: back to training camp and phenomenal shape, Others don't come

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Speaker 2: back in as great of shape. And what the NFL

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Speaker 2: and NFLPA realized was they had to put some parameters

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Speaker 2: around the preseason work to try and acclimate guys to

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Speaker 2: getting back to football shape. So there are these acclamation

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Speaker 2: periods that happen in the first three days I believe,

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Speaker 2: of training camp, and then they happen again after padded

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Speaker 2: practices are introduced, with the idea being that we're going

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Speaker 2: to ramp up the amount of time that you can

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Speaker 2: spend doing padded practices. Gradually they ramp up the amount

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Speaker 2: of football activity there is because it's one thing to

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Speaker 2: be in great shape, right, Guys go and they can

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Speaker 2: be working out and be in phenomenal shape, but there's

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Speaker 2: still an adjustment to playing football. It's why we worry

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Speaker 2: sometimes when players have been out with a holdout, for example,

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Speaker 2: and haven't been in camp, you'll see them get worked

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Speaker 2: in slowly, or players coming off of injury who may

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Speaker 2: have missed preseason workouts maybe ramped up to football participation

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Speaker 2: slowly where they're seeing a limited number of snaps when

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Speaker 2: they return. I think that acclamation period is starting to

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Speaker 2: pay off in terms of what they're seeing in preseason

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Speaker 2: preseason injuries, and the question is how do you then

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Speaker 2: extrapolate some of that across the season. We've seen reduction

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Speaker 2: and padded practices, but at some level you need to

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Speaker 2: practice what you're going to participate in during the season.

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Speaker 2: So you don't want that to completely go away, but

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Speaker 2: it's a question of balance.

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Speaker 1: The Titans are in the AFC South with the Indianapolis Colts,

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Speaker 1: so we are certainly interested in them. Titans will play

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Speaker 1: them again on December third, and we will not see

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Speaker 1: Anthony Richardson, who was ironically injured in the first Titans

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Speaker 1: Colts game back into early October. The shoulder injury started

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Speaker 1: off as something that was being mentioned as a four

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Speaker 1: week injury, and then it quickly moved to season ending surgery. Stefani,

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Speaker 1: why did the Colts decide to move in that direction

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Speaker 1: with Anthony Richardson's shoulder.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'm so glad you asked this question because it

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Speaker 2: gives me a chance to make a shameless plug for

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Speaker 2: I just wanted to show that we're starting out, and

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Speaker 2: it's on the NFL on ESPN YouTube page, and the

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Speaker 2: first episode I dedicated entirely to this topic of Anthony

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Speaker 2: Richardson's injury and surgery and recovery. And in fact, I

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Speaker 2: had Alex Smith, former NFL quarterback Alex Smith, who I

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Speaker 2: did the sixty documentary with on because he actually had

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Speaker 2: the same injury and a similar surgery when he was

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Speaker 2: a young quarterback. So his perspective is very unique and

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Speaker 2: I think people would find it interesting. But to give

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Speaker 2: you a bit of the reader's digest version, ac sprains

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Speaker 2: are there are many, many different presentations of them. It's

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Speaker 2: not like one size fits all. And when you get

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Speaker 2: into the more significant injuries, there's some question about do

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Speaker 2: you treat it conservatively or do you treat it with surgery,

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Speaker 2: And in Anthony Richardson's case, it sounds like at the

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Speaker 2: beginning there was some discussion about the conservative approach, you know,

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Speaker 2: try rehab first and if it doesn't work, then so

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Speaker 2: be it, or try conservative PROCs if he can come

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Speaker 2: back and play. He consulted with multiple specialists and ultimately

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Speaker 2: the decision was that the type of AC injury he

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Speaker 2: had warranted surgery. And the reason you can infer that

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Speaker 2: is because they did go to surgery within about ten days,

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Speaker 2: and if they had wanted to try conservative approach first,

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Speaker 2: that would have been about a six week trial. So

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Speaker 2: clearly the consensus was this needs to be fixed, both

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Speaker 2: in the immediate sense and for the long term health

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Speaker 2: of his shoulder as a thrower. The good news is

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Speaker 2: that these repairs tend to be very successful. We don't

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Speaker 2: see it very often in a quarterback. We just don't

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Speaker 2: see it. We see AC sprains. Derek Carr had won

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Speaker 2: this year and he played the following week not that well,

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Speaker 2: but he has been able to recover, as it were,

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Speaker 2: while he's still participating. Anthony Richardson's injury requires surgery to

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Speaker 2: restore the anatomical alignment of the joint and to give

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Speaker 2: him the best chance of the full recovery. But now

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Speaker 2: I feel very very good about him going forward. When

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Speaker 2: he comes back next season, he should be able to

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Speaker 2: be making all his throws by June. Wow.

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Speaker 1: What is your sense on the progress of limiting concussions

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Speaker 1: in football as much as possible? Where do you think

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Speaker 1: we stand on that right now?

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Speaker 2: Well, this is another multi layered topic. I think we're

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Speaker 2: seeing improvements overall in the numbers. This is data that

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Speaker 2: the NFL Health and Safety Group puts out and I

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Speaker 2: would encourage your listeners to go to the NFL Health

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Speaker 2: and Safety page where they can actually see the data

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Speaker 2: in terms of concussion numbers. One of the things that

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Speaker 2: has happened there's again we talked about how preseason and

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Speaker 2: in season are different. One of the things I was

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Speaker 2: introduced recently with the Guardian Caps. Those are those honeycombed

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Speaker 2: looking shells that go over the helmets, and the NFL

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Speaker 2: and NFLPA jointly decided to introduce these Guardian Caps as

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Speaker 2: a pilot program and wanted to see what would be

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Speaker 2: the effect on concussions during the preseason. So they had

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Speaker 2: several position groups that were mandated to wear these, mostly

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Speaker 2: players on the line because what we've learned is that

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Speaker 2: it's the sub concussive repeat blows, if you will, but

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Speaker 2: seemed to put players most at risk for concussion injury,

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Speaker 2: and so they wanted these players who are doing repeated contact,

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Speaker 2: repeated hits to be in these caps. So it was

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Speaker 2: players on the line and then also running backs and

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Speaker 2: I believed tight ends. And what they saw was there

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Speaker 2: was a significant drop in the number of concussions in

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Speaker 2: the preseason for those position groups wearing Guardian caps. And recently,

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Speaker 2: the NFL held their league meetings in October in New

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Speaker 2: York and I attended the health and safety briefing there

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Speaker 2: and once again this year they have even further dropped

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Speaker 2: the number of concussions during the preseason. So those position

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Speaker 2: groups are wearing them in practice, and they're going to

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Speaker 2: continue wearing them in practice throughout the season, so at

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Speaker 2: the end of the season they can look back and say,

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Speaker 2: did we have an impact on concussions As far as

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Speaker 2: the numbers in season it has gone down. This is

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Speaker 2: one of the reasons that the Competition Committee has looked

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Speaker 2: at some of the rule changes around kickoffs and so forth.

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Speaker 2: But I can't really say to this year where they

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Speaker 2: are because they don't share those numbers until the season

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Speaker 2: is over and they can look back in retrospect. One

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Speaker 2: of the topics with the Guardian Caps is wondering if

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Speaker 2: this is going to be something ever that makes its

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Speaker 2: way into the playing field. That's one of many discussions

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Speaker 2: they're having still long ways off, but I think the

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Speaker 2: idea of more players wearing them in practice is certainly

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Speaker 2: going to be a topic. And you know they are

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Speaker 2: not as many contact practices once you get into the season,

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Speaker 2: so this has really been a huge focus of the preseason.

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Speaker 1: All right, So I want to wrap up by asking

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Speaker 1: you about kickoffs specifically. Not surprisingly, kickoffs produce concussions at

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Speaker 1: a much greater rate than the normal play. Touchbacks are

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Speaker 1: way up in this league, fair catches are available by rule.

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Speaker 1: This year, fewer kickoffs are being returned than ever before.

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Speaker 1: Is this our new normal or does Stefania Bell expect

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Speaker 1: them to continue to tweak it towards looking at maybe

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Speaker 1: eliminating the kickoff altogether.

435
00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 2: You're hitting on a point that's very, very topical of

436
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 2: right now, and I don't think any decisions have been made.

437
00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 2: I think this is why they gather the information that

438
00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:03,640
Speaker 2: they do, and then they go back and look at

439
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:05,840
Speaker 2: it year over a year to see what kind of

440
00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:09,560
Speaker 2: difference they're making, or if there's a particular area within

441
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:13,680
Speaker 2: the game where these injuries are where they stand out,

442
00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:17,600
Speaker 2: and the changes you just referenced are a result of

443
00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:24,439
Speaker 2: that study and what they do. In the NFL and

444
00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 2: the NFLPA, they have committees that are looking at this.

445
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:31,520
Speaker 2: They also have the engineers who go back and look

446
00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:34,200
Speaker 2: at the concussive blows. So every time there's a concussion

447
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:39,960
Speaker 2: that's suffered in a game, there is a way of

448
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 2: going back and looking at it. Used to be the

449
00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:44,080
Speaker 2: engineer sat down and looked at everyone by hand, but

450
00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:48,240
Speaker 2: they actually now this year. Artificial intelligence being what it is,

451
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 2: it goes much faster and can find all these injuries

452
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:57,160
Speaker 2: and so it can detect where these concussive blows potentially occur.

453
00:27:57,359 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 2: Then of course the people go back and look at

454
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:03,760
Speaker 2: those videos in detail. But by studying that, you know

455
00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:06,720
Speaker 2: because a player sometimes doesn't know when it happened. I mean,

456
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:09,800
Speaker 2: we might know what happened on the play, or for example,

457
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:12,120
Speaker 2: if it's during a kickoff, and sort of obviously it's

458
00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:16,400
Speaker 2: during a kickoff. But they can go back and look

459
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:19,960
Speaker 2: at these and then quantify them depending on where they're occurring,

460
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 2: and look for these kinds of trends. And that's they

461
00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:26,159
Speaker 2: when they brought it to the Competition Committee in the past,

462
00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:29,359
Speaker 2: and the Health and Safety Group really stresses this that

463
00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:32,399
Speaker 2: they bring the information to the Competition Committee and say, look,

464
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:39,080
Speaker 2: here's where the concussions are happening. Discuss you know, and

465
00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:42,800
Speaker 2: so it's not that they're mandating changes here, but they're

466
00:28:42,920 --> 00:28:45,400
Speaker 2: showing them the information that says, look, if you want

467
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,720
Speaker 2: to make the game safer, we are finding that there

468
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:52,120
Speaker 2: is this one particular area where these injuries are happening

469
00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:55,080
Speaker 2: at a much greater rate than everywhere else. And certainly

470
00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 2: there's all the other things that we've talked about in

471
00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:02,880
Speaker 2: years past, you know, the heads up tackling not you know,

472
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:06,520
Speaker 2: that's why the penalty on a defenseless receiver is what

473
00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:10,560
Speaker 2: it is. These are things where concussions have tended to spike,

474
00:29:11,080 --> 00:29:14,880
Speaker 2: and so the focus for the penalties is going to

475
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 2: be around those dangerous plays, and sometimes it's tough because

476
00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 2: we see defensive penalties sometimes already think that shouldn't have

477
00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 2: been called. But I think the tendency is going to

478
00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:30,480
Speaker 2: be to air on the side of caution and it's

479
00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 2: not going to go the other way.

480
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:36,600
Speaker 1: My last question for Stefani a bell that the Eagles

481
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:41,040
Speaker 1: push push, which they use on the quarterback sneak. There

482
00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:43,080
Speaker 1: are a lot of people who do not think it

483
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:45,960
Speaker 1: is a football play and want it outlawed. They think

484
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:50,640
Speaker 1: it's a rugby play. From your standpoint, are you worried

485
00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 1: about it being a dangerous play?

486
00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:58,960
Speaker 2: It's such a nuanced conversation. I really think it comes

487
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:02,960
Speaker 2: down to execution. I think what the Eagles have done

488
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:07,760
Speaker 2: is they have all the right bodies and the skill

489
00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:10,400
Speaker 2: level of the players to be able to execute it.

490
00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:14,440
Speaker 2: And Jalen Hurts is not a small quarterback either. When

491
00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:18,400
Speaker 2: teams that don't practice it don't use it very often

492
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:22,160
Speaker 2: try and execute it, but they're not that great at it,

493
00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:24,680
Speaker 2: and they perhaps don't have the personnel who can do

494
00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:27,520
Speaker 2: it as well. And we've seen a couple of teams

495
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:31,800
Speaker 2: try it when there's been a question about the quarterback's help.

496
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:37,000
Speaker 2: Then you start to wonder if that isn't a risk

497
00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:41,280
Speaker 2: versus reward proposition that is going in the negative direction.

498
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:46,960
Speaker 2: So I don't I sort of see both sides. I

499
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:50,920
Speaker 2: don't have an issue with the play. I just don't.

500
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:54,040
Speaker 2: I feel like if it's something that a team does

501
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:56,800
Speaker 2: well and they continue to have success at it and

502
00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 2: other teams can't replicate it, of course they don't want

503
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 2: them to be able to do it, but I do

504
00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:05,960
Speaker 2: think that there is risk involved when it is not

505
00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:11,080
Speaker 2: a well calculated exercise. So it'll be interesting to see.

506
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:13,640
Speaker 2: I'm sure what's going to happen is this will become

507
00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:16,680
Speaker 2: one of the types of plays that is studied to

508
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 2: see is their injury fallout specifically related to this type

509
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:23,840
Speaker 2: of play, and if there is, that will go to

510
00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:29,120
Speaker 2: the competition committee and enter into the conversation which is

511
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:32,640
Speaker 2: not only about the injury risk, but whether other people

512
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 2: feel like this is a justifiable NFL play.

513
00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:40,720
Speaker 1: Stefania, that is the greatest non answer answer I've ever

514
00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 1: heard in the history of an interview. You have gone

515
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:48,720
Speaker 1: to the Hall of fame right there. It teas it tas.

516
00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:53,560
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, it's a very good answer, you do you

517
00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:56,959
Speaker 1: do because I think the thing that all of us

518
00:31:57,040 --> 00:32:00,840
Speaker 1: who watch and listen to you enjoy so much about

519
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:04,480
Speaker 1: you is it's obvious you love the game and you

520
00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:07,320
Speaker 1: want to keep the spirit of the game forward. But

521
00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:11,920
Speaker 1: you also you are certainly advocating for the athletes, for

522
00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:15,120
Speaker 1: health and safety and for making it the safest game possible.

523
00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:19,800
Speaker 1: And I think that's a crossing that line and doing it,

524
00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:22,520
Speaker 1: as you like to say in that nuanced away is

525
00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 1: I think the reason why people respond to you in

526
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:27,440
Speaker 1: the way that they do well, very.

527
00:32:27,320 --> 00:32:30,160
Speaker 2: Nice of you to say. I will say, when we

528
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,280
Speaker 2: watch games on Sunday in the war room, it is

529
00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:35,040
Speaker 2: so we call it the war room, which is ridiculous.

530
00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:37,120
Speaker 2: But when we watch games in there and there's a

531
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:39,680
Speaker 2: whole bunch of US football folks in there, people you

532
00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:41,520
Speaker 2: would know who are on air, a lot of producers,

533
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,600
Speaker 2: I will cringe at certain injury. We have all the

534
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:47,080
Speaker 2: games up, and I'll be I'll yell, I'll be like,

535
00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:49,400
Speaker 2: oh no, why that. You know why they hit the

536
00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:51,800
Speaker 2: guy like that? Or I feel sorry for so and so,

537
00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:54,080
Speaker 2: and these guys will give me a hard time and

538
00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:58,000
Speaker 2: say it's fun, it's football, Like why I know but

539
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 2: I'm a physical therapist at heart, and I don't of course,

540
00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:02,720
Speaker 2: I don't ever want to see anybody get hurt. And

541
00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:05,360
Speaker 2: I understand as much as any of the injuries are

542
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:08,280
Speaker 2: part of the game. I've been on the sidelines. I

543
00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:12,800
Speaker 2: have done football that cared for football, at least many

544
00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:15,600
Speaker 2: of them in my time. I understand it's part of

545
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:17,640
Speaker 2: the game. And when you have a collision sport, I

546
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 2: think of football and hockey and even and rugby for sure,

547
00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 2: even though you know there's no helmets involved. That's a

548
00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:29,160
Speaker 2: whole other conversation. But these you're going to have injuries

549
00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:32,840
Speaker 2: that we understand they're part of the game. But football

550
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:36,680
Speaker 2: is unique, I think in this sense of the size

551
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:42,520
Speaker 2: of the players. When you put the mass and the acceleration,

552
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,760
Speaker 2: you know with the old physics equation, you know force

553
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:48,560
Speaker 2: mass times acceleration, I mean you put the size of

554
00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:51,840
Speaker 2: the bodies and the speed with which they travel. I mean,

555
00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:55,440
Speaker 2: it didn't used to be that three hundred pound guys

556
00:33:55,480 --> 00:34:00,320
Speaker 2: could fly like they do now. And so that is

557
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:04,120
Speaker 2: why we're seeing this concern about protecting the quarterback. And

558
00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:08,440
Speaker 2: it's hard. But even though they used to get hurt before,

559
00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:13,239
Speaker 2: they didn't get hit often with the same speed, and

560
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:15,840
Speaker 2: so the impact is what it is. The body is

561
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:20,120
Speaker 2: ultimately going to fail when it's confronted with those types

562
00:34:20,160 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 2: of forces, and we want we want players to be

563
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 2: around for the bulk of the season, so we have

564
00:34:26,760 --> 00:34:29,239
Speaker 2: to find a balance. And it's probably never going to

565
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:33,240
Speaker 2: make everyone happy, but I think it's still worth striving

566
00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:35,080
Speaker 2: for to the extent that we can.

567
00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:37,719
Speaker 1: Well, you have made us happy by taking time with

568
00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:39,440
Speaker 1: the Stefani bell. Thank you so much.

569
00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:43,799
Speaker 2: Oh it's my Pleasure's such an honor to be invited back.

570
00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:44,200
Speaker 2: Thank you.

571
00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:47,560
Speaker 1: We wrap up this edition of the OTP by reminding

572
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:50,240
Speaker 1: you that seat Geek is now the official ticketing partner

573
00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:53,200
Speaker 1: of the Tennessee Titans. If you haven't heard the name yet,

574
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 1: get used to it, because you'll be hearing it a

575
00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:59,040
Speaker 1: lot more this season. Whether you're buying or selling tickets

576
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:01,840
Speaker 1: to the Titans games or to any live event in Nashville,

577
00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:04,640
Speaker 1: Seat Geek is the place to do it. Seat Geek

578
00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:08,040
Speaker 1: the new official ticketing partner of the Tennessee Titans. So

579
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:14,120
Speaker 1: Titans fans and fans, I'm Mike Keith, and this is

580
00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:15,360
Speaker 1: the O t P