Speaker 1: Pushkin. It was a senseless act on my part. It
Speaker 1: definitely made no sense, and it was something that if
Speaker 1: I could go back and undo it, I absolutely would.
Speaker 1: Every day I think about and hope that I could
Speaker 1: and wish that I could go back and undo that. Hey,
Speaker 1: everyone I started recording started from the bottom to find
Speaker 1: and document unconventional success stories and to have them be
Speaker 1: told firsthand. But I didn't expect to ever speak with
Speaker 1: anyone like Larry Miller. In some ways, Larry's career is
Speaker 1: super conventional. A bachelor's an accounting, an NBA, working his
Speaker 1: way up at an iconic American brand like Campbell's Soup.
Speaker 1: Then there's his time helping to build Jordan brand with
Speaker 1: Michael Jordan himself. But what underlies his tire story the
Speaker 1: degrees his early career, His work with MJ is an
Speaker 1: extraordinary story of redemption and second chances. Miller was born
Speaker 1: in Philadelphia, PA. Westphilly, you know, made famous by The
Speaker 1: Fresh Prince. That show may have been a comedy, but Westphilly,
Speaker 1: like other hoods, is deadly serious. Miller himself had an attentive,
Speaker 1: loving family, but that didn't make growing up at his
Speaker 1: neighborhood any easier, and ultimately he wound up succumbing to
Speaker 1: the pressure of the streets in heartbreaking fashion. In this
Speaker 1: episode of Started from the Bottom, I talked to Miller
Speaker 1: about his career, how he navigated moving up the ladder
Speaker 1: at Campbell's Soup, his switched to sports apparel, moving from
Speaker 1: being an accountant to a businessman to building a brand
Speaker 1: out of one of the most famous faces and names
Speaker 1: in the entire world. But no matter how impressed will
Speaker 1: be by his career moves, when Miller tells me about
Speaker 1: his secret who's harboring for all his career, You'll be
Speaker 1: all the more astonished. This is started from the bottom,
Speaker 1: hard earned success stories from people like us. To start
Speaker 1: a conversation, Larry tells me about a formative moment in
Speaker 1: his life when he was trying to find his first
Speaker 1: job out of college. The way it was set up
Speaker 1: back then is there was what was called the Big
Speaker 1: eight accounting firms, right and everybody with an accounting degree,
Speaker 1: your goal was to get hired by one of the
Speaker 1: Big eight. And I felt the same way. And the
Speaker 1: one that I was really interested in was Arthur Anderson.
Speaker 1: At the time, they were one of the Big Eight.
Speaker 1: I went to the office and spent the whole day.
Speaker 1: They're interviewing with a bunch of different people, and all
Speaker 1: day I'm thinking in the back of my mind, should
Speaker 1: I share my story with these folks? Should I say something?
Speaker 1: And I kept, you know, kind of thinking, and finally
Speaker 1: I get to the last person at the end of
Speaker 1: the day was a hiring manager. So I decided, you
Speaker 1: know what, I'm going to share my story with this guy.
Speaker 1: So I sit down with him and I said, hey,
Speaker 1: you know, there's something I want to talk to you
Speaker 1: about that didn't come through and the other interviews that
Speaker 1: didn't come through on the application. And then I went
Speaker 1: in and started to tell him about my past, that
Speaker 1: I had started my education while I was incarcerated, blah
Speaker 1: blah blah. And I could see as I'm talking to him,
Speaker 1: I could see his face changing. And finally, when I
Speaker 1: got done, he said, wow, that's an amazing story. And
Speaker 1: he reached in his pocket and he pulled out an
Speaker 1: envelope and he said, uh. He said, I have an
Speaker 1: offer letter here that I was all ready to give you,
Speaker 1: but I can't give it to you now. He said,
Speaker 1: I can't take the chance on hiring you and something
Speaker 1: happened down the line, So I wish you the best,
Speaker 1: but I can't hire you. And at that point I
Speaker 1: decided I wasn't going to share my background anymore. If
Speaker 1: it came up, I wasn't going to deny it, or
Speaker 1: if somebody asked directly, I wasn't gonna be dishonest, but
Speaker 1: I wasn't going to volunteer the information, and I never
Speaker 1: did it to that point. Was that a pretty immediate
Speaker 1: instinct after that or was it did that come out
Speaker 1: of maybe even just a period of after that feeling
Speaker 1: like well, I think it was pretty immediate, because as
Speaker 1: I'm he's telling me this, I was like, man, I
Speaker 1: should have never said anything. But the reality is I'm
Speaker 1: glad I did because I think in an environment like that,
Speaker 1: with public accounting and all the regulations and all, something
Speaker 1: would have probably come up at some point. And once
Speaker 1: the Campbell's opportunity came up, I figured it was probably
Speaker 1: better not to go public accounting. The chances of my
Speaker 1: background getting exposed or coming up in public accounting were
Speaker 1: a lot greater than if I was working for a
Speaker 1: company like Campbell. So I decided to take the job
Speaker 1: at Campbell. Super when you got there and your degrees
Speaker 1: in accounting, what did you learn even some of the
Speaker 1: soft skills, maybe even beyond just accounting, Like, what did
Speaker 1: you learn with that being your first you know? One
Speaker 1: of the things that I realized early on was that
Speaker 1: I was going to have to take some control of
Speaker 1: my career. And so I remember one point, this guy
Speaker 1: who's started in the training program with me. He had
Speaker 1: gone to work for a company called Missus Paul's. They
Speaker 1: were a division of Campbell's Soup at the time. They
Speaker 1: make fish sticks, fish products. But he had gone to
Speaker 1: work for Missus Paul's and he and I were pretty close,
Speaker 1: and so he called me up one day. He said, man,
Speaker 1: I was surprised that you weren't interested in the job
Speaker 1: we had for you over here. I said, what are
Speaker 1: you talking about? He said, well, we you know, we
Speaker 1: reached out about a job for you over here and
Speaker 1: we were told that you weren't interested. I was like,
Speaker 1: no one said anything to me about that, So that
Speaker 1: kind of got my you know, got my standard up
Speaker 1: a little bit, and I was like, you know, this
Speaker 1: is not right. At least someone should have said something
Speaker 1: to me and given me the opportunity to say yes.
Speaker 1: Or no. So I actually set up a meeting with
Speaker 1: the guys who ran the department, and I stepped to
Speaker 1: him about it. I was like, listen, you know, I
Speaker 1: understand that Missus Paul's reached out about a job that
Speaker 1: they were interested in me for and they were told
Speaker 1: that I wasn't interested without me even knowing about it.
Speaker 1: And we're like, well, we thought this was what's best
Speaker 1: for your career. I said, you know what, I appreciate that,
Speaker 1: but I think I should be involved in deciding what's
Speaker 1: best for my career. And okay. So I ended up
Speaker 1: going over and interviewing for that job at Missus Pauls
Speaker 1: and moving over and taking that job at Missus Paul's.
Speaker 1: But if my friend hadn't called me and told me
Speaker 1: about it, I would have never known. I would have
Speaker 1: never gotten to at least give it a shot to
Speaker 1: see if it was something I wanted to do. So
Speaker 1: my last role at Campbell's was actually working in the
Speaker 1: soup plant, which was an amazing experience for me. One
Speaker 1: of the differences in a situation like that is that
Speaker 1: every day you have a new goal, and you know
Speaker 1: whether you hit your goal or not. Every day. It's
Speaker 1: like Hey, we need to produce X number of Kansas
Speaker 1: tomato soup. Did we hit that number? If we did? Cool,
Speaker 1: then if we did it, then we got to talk
Speaker 1: about what went wrong, why we didn't hit it, and
Speaker 1: what we're going to do to make it up. Every day,
Speaker 1: the plant manager would, you know, every morning, all the
Speaker 1: managers would get together and talk about what had happened
Speaker 1: the day before. And one of the things that I
Speaker 1: learned from these guys is that they would go at
Speaker 1: each other. I mean like going at each other hard
Speaker 1: because hey, you messed up. I'm gonna let you know
Speaker 1: you messed up. They'd argue and curse, and then at
Speaker 1: the end of the meeting like, yo, man, let's go
Speaker 1: get a couple of coffee. Yeah, you're coming over this weekend. Yeah.
Speaker 1: It was like nobody took it personal. It's like, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna tell you that you screwed up, and you know,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna call you out and tell you exactly what
Speaker 1: was wrong. But it's not personal. I'm not you know,
Speaker 1: we're still good whatever. But I and that was that
Speaker 1: was something that I learned in that experience. It's like,
Speaker 1: try not to take it personal when somebody's giving you
Speaker 1: feedback on something that you you know you should have
Speaker 1: done a better job at you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: And that's something that's not always easy to do because
Speaker 1: it's easier to take it personal when somebody's telling you
Speaker 1: that you screwed up. And these guys taught me that
Speaker 1: you got to figure out how to take that feedback.
Speaker 1: Take it in, but then you gotta let it go. No,
Speaker 1: you can't take it personal, right, Take it in, make
Speaker 1: the tweak, ye, and then let it. But by the
Speaker 1: time you leave Campbells, you were there five years, five years,
Speaker 1: five years. You got a little late start for college,
Speaker 1: so you're thirty five. Somewhere in that about thirty five.
Speaker 1: Where are you at in terms of thinking about your career.
Speaker 1: Are you thinking I'm okay to stay here as long
Speaker 1: as I can keep moving up, or you realizing maybe
Speaker 1: this isn't the exact right fit, or well, you know, Um,
Speaker 1: It's funny because I never thought about like, Okay, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna do this and then this is the next job.
Speaker 1: My focus was always if I always felt like, if
Speaker 1: I kill this job that I'm in, what's next will
Speaker 1: materialize for me. I'll be able to you know, because
Speaker 1: one of the things I realized is that if you
Speaker 1: have a good reputation in terms of your work ethic
Speaker 1: and doing things that the way you're supposed to, people
Speaker 1: want you on their team. Yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: And so I never was like focused on, well, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna do this, and then the next move is this
Speaker 1: one and next. I was always focused on I'm gonna
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do my very best at the job that
Speaker 1: I'm in, and then we'll see what materialized. And unfortunately
Speaker 1: for me, you know, things kind of worked out with
Speaker 1: that process, But but that that was the way I
Speaker 1: always approached it. This like I'm gonna kill the job
Speaker 1: I'm in and focus on that, and then what's next
Speaker 1: to materialized for me? And I think we'll see as
Speaker 1: we kind of progressed through here, is that that tactically
Speaker 1: worked for you? It did, The thing seemed to just
Speaker 1: follow in your lap at that point. It did. But
Speaker 1: I think I know, beyond shadow of doubt that I'm blessed,
Speaker 1: way beyond my wildest streams. But I think it was
Speaker 1: also putting in the work and being willing to step
Speaker 1: up and speak up when I felt like the need
Speaker 1: was there for me to protect my own career, right right, So,
Speaker 1: just moving ahead a little bit, you eventually make your
Speaker 1: way to a company called Jansen, which is a company
Speaker 1: I guess what would you call it an apparel sports company? Swimwear. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so Jansen basically start out as a swimwear company, making,
Speaker 1: you know, swimwear, cruise ships, beach in swimwear, and then
Speaker 1: branched out into other sportswear categories, but mainly is known
Speaker 1: for a swimwear But moving over from more the food
Speaker 1: industry to apparel, did that feel like a challenge to
Speaker 1: you or did it for like a whole new sort
Speaker 1: of world to learn or did it feel I think
Speaker 1: the fundamentals of business you can apply regardless of what
Speaker 1: the industry is. I think when you change industries, you
Speaker 1: still are going to apply your same leadership style, your
Speaker 1: same basic business principles. It's just then learning the new industry.
Speaker 1: Then people were willing to teach me the industry to
Speaker 1: share with me. I remember in swimwear they have what
Speaker 1: they call market weeks, and as the finance guy there
Speaker 1: was that's not something that I would typically have been
Speaker 1: involved in, but I requested to go to those market
Speaker 1: meetings and sitting on the meetings when the sales guys
Speaker 1: are pitching the customers, sitting on the meetings where there
Speaker 1: were discussions between sales and customers and feedback on product.
Speaker 1: Because I wanted to learn as much as I possibly
Speaker 1: could about not just the finance part of the business,
Speaker 1: but the rest of the business as well. You were
Speaker 1: asking to do that as a controller. Yeah, wow, Yeah.
Speaker 1: And then eventually the guy who was running the women's
Speaker 1: swimwear division, he approached me one day and he's like, man,
Speaker 1: you should come and work with me, you and I
Speaker 1: together kind of running the swimwear it. He had more
Speaker 1: of the creative side of like what the products should
Speaker 1: look like. He was more focused on, you know, this
Speaker 1: is the product we should have, this is where we
Speaker 1: should sell it. And when we tied the conversation about it,
Speaker 1: he said, you know, man, you know I want you
Speaker 1: to come over and help me out with all the
Speaker 1: numbers and the business stuff. And I said, fine, I'm
Speaker 1: willing to do that as long as you teach me
Speaker 1: the other side of the business that you're good at.
Speaker 1: And so we had a great working relationship and we
Speaker 1: had the business on fire. This really starts a new
Speaker 1: chapter in your career, right, because it kind of moved
Speaker 1: me out of finance. That was the first time I
Speaker 1: actually moved out of the finance department and my job there.
Speaker 1: My title there was director of business Development for the
Speaker 1: swimwear division, and that, like I said, was the first
Speaker 1: like outside of actually finance. At this point, you're out
Speaker 1: of finance, You're running your first company. Were you Were
Speaker 1: you terrified? No? Actually, the thing that I was most
Speaker 1: concerned about throughout all of this was my story coming out,
Speaker 1: like somebody finding out about my past, and that coming
Speaker 1: out and that hindering what I was trying to do
Speaker 1: and hindering the progress that I had been making. That
Speaker 1: was the thing that worried me the most. Im everything
Speaker 1: else just felt kind of easy, maybe not necessarily easy,
Speaker 1: but I looked at it like, hey, if somebody else
Speaker 1: can do it, then I could probably do it. Now
Speaker 1: that I can't do brain surgery right just because somebody
Speaker 1: else could do it. But in the business world, in
Speaker 1: the corporate world, the way I looked at it's like, Okay,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm gonna figure out. I'm gonna figure this out.
Speaker 1: After the break, Larry gets a little more revealing about
Speaker 1: what he really went through to get to the top.
Speaker 1: We're back with my conversation with Larry Miller. We're about
Speaker 1: to get into his upbringing in West Philly, a neighborhood
Speaker 1: that shaped him, but not before it broke him. Maybe
Speaker 1: you want to talk a little bit about the neighborhood. So,
Speaker 1: you know, growing up, I had a strong family. You know,
Speaker 1: there were eight kids in the family, my mom and dad.
Speaker 1: My dad worked every day in the factory and made
Speaker 1: sure that we, you know, had what we needed. My
Speaker 1: mom took care and raised eight kids. So you know,
Speaker 1: I had a good childhood. It's not like I can't
Speaker 1: blame anybody else for what I did. These were choices
Speaker 1: that I made, and I think at a certain age,
Speaker 1: just the allure of the street really started to pull me,
Speaker 1: and I started to want to be one of the
Speaker 1: cool guys in the street because you know, to me,
Speaker 1: you were seeing it exactly. That's how you get noticed,
Speaker 1: that's how you you know, build, that's how you be
Speaker 1: to your point be seen. And so I first time
Speaker 1: I was ever arrested, I was twelve years old. Friend
Speaker 1: of mine and I stole a bike and we got caught.
Speaker 1: I ended up with probation and then a little bit
Speaker 1: around the time I decided to join the gang, joined
Speaker 1: the gang. And you know, I'm the kind of person.
Speaker 1: Once I kind of decided to do something, then I'm
Speaker 1: all in. And when I joined the gang, I was.
Speaker 1: I was all in. And what what game I was from?
Speaker 1: My gang was called the Cedar in the game fifty
Speaker 1: six and Seedar Avenue. And when I was sixteen years old,
Speaker 1: I uh, I shot another kid and killed him. And
Speaker 1: he wasn't someone that was in a gang. He just
Speaker 1: happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Speaker 1: And it was a senseless act on my part. It
Speaker 1: definitely made no sense and it was something that if
Speaker 1: I could go back and undo it, I absolutely would.
Speaker 1: Every day I think about uh and hope that I
Speaker 1: could and wish that I could go back and undo that,
Speaker 1: but but I can't. And you know, fortunately for me,
Speaker 1: I've been able to connect with his family and they
Speaker 1: they have forgiven me. It was it was amazing. We
Speaker 1: met my daughter and I met with them, and um,
Speaker 1: they you know, expressed their feelings and you know the
Speaker 1: pain that this had caused them. But at the end
Speaker 1: they all said, hey, but but but we forgive you.
Speaker 1: And so that that's been If nothing else comes out
Speaker 1: of this whole process, the fact that of having that
Speaker 1: forgiveness from them has been has been amazing for me.
Speaker 1: But I was sent and says I was sixteen. I
Speaker 1: was charged as an adult. I pleaded guilty to second
Speaker 1: degree murder and was sentenced to four and a half
Speaker 1: to twenty years. Did the four and a half, got out,
Speaker 1: knocked around in and out of jail doing crazy stuff again,
Speaker 1: ended up going back to jail for a number of
Speaker 1: armed robberies, and this time I ended up with a
Speaker 1: sentence of four to ten and I had to do
Speaker 1: nine months of the backtime, so I ended up with
Speaker 1: four years and nine months. And this time when I
Speaker 1: was incarcerated, they had a program where you could take
Speaker 1: college classes inside the jail, and there were a number
Speaker 1: of colleges that were offering classes. Temple University, Cheney State, Villanova,
Speaker 1: Montgomery County Community College, Philadelphia Community all were offering classes
Speaker 1: inside the jail. And there was a program where you
Speaker 1: could qualify to move into these trailers that were outside
Speaker 1: side of the wall, so that the jail had a
Speaker 1: jail wall and the trailers were on the other side
Speaker 1: of the wall, and in this program, you could live
Speaker 1: in those trailers and then leave every day and go
Speaker 1: to school and just had to be back by eight
Speaker 1: o'clock in the evening. When I heard about that program,
Speaker 1: I was like, man, that's how I want to do
Speaker 1: my time. If if I gotta be here, I want
Speaker 1: to do it like that. So I started doing what
Speaker 1: I needed to do to qualify for that program, which
Speaker 1: was take classes inside, not getting into any trouble. You
Speaker 1: had to have half of your minimum sentences. So got
Speaker 1: to that point, I moved out to those trailers and
Speaker 1: started at Montgomery County Community College, got my associate's degree
Speaker 1: while I was in that program, transferred down to a
Speaker 1: halfway house in North Philly, started going to Temple. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you transferred over into Temple right transferred and I was
Speaker 1: able to transfer all of my credits. So I started
Speaker 1: that Temple as a junior. So I with my associalist
Speaker 1: degree and finished my bastelors in two years and started
Speaker 1: at Campbell suit But when I was graduating from from
Speaker 1: Temple and companies would come on campus, like I said,
Speaker 1: to interview. One of the things I did early on,
Speaker 1: I took interviews with companies that I knew I didn't
Speaker 1: want to work for for whatever reason, but I didn't
Speaker 1: know anything about interviewing and all that because I'm coming
Speaker 1: from the street. So I was like, you know what,
Speaker 1: I need some practice at this. So I took interviews
Speaker 1: with companies I knew I didn't want to work for
Speaker 1: to get the practice, so that by the time the
Speaker 1: companies came that I wasn't trusted in, I was killing
Speaker 1: it because I had figured out the right questions to
Speaker 1: ask the answers to that they wanted to hear. I
Speaker 1: mean I because I had taken all these interviews and
Speaker 1: gotten the feedback on it. By the time the companies
Speaker 1: came on campus that I wanted, I was interested and
Speaker 1: I was killing them. Wow. Like one of the questions,
Speaker 1: you know, it was always like her, so, so where
Speaker 1: do you see yourself in five years? Right? And I
Speaker 1: thought a lot about that question, you know, as a
Speaker 1: controller or CFO whatever, And I thought about it and
Speaker 1: I was like, it's a little bit deeper than that,
Speaker 1: I think to me, And the way I would answer
Speaker 1: that question is I would always tell them, you know,
Speaker 1: my goal is I want to be a decision maker.
Speaker 1: I want to be in a position where I'm helping,
Speaker 1: helping to make decisions that determine the direction of company
Speaker 1: is going to go in, and I'm willing to take
Speaker 1: the responsibility for those decisions. Like, if they work out,
Speaker 1: then great, If they don't, I'll take the responsibility. But
Speaker 1: my goal is I want to be a decision maker.
Speaker 1: Oh that's a very good answer. But but but but
Speaker 1: that was the reality for me, and I think that's
Speaker 1: the way I always looked at it. I didn't I
Speaker 1: didn't box myself into I want to be in finance.
Speaker 1: I want to be a controller. I want to be
Speaker 1: It was like, I want to be sitting at the
Speaker 1: table helping to make decisions. We really took that questions
Speaker 1: that face value. You really looked inside yourself and thought, well,
Speaker 1: what is it that I really want my career exactly?
Speaker 1: I want to be a decision I want to be
Speaker 1: somebody that's that's college shots right, right. We got to
Speaker 1: take a quick break, but when we come back, Larry
Speaker 1: Miller makes his mark at Nike. In January of twenty
Speaker 1: twenty two, Larry came out with his secret. The story
Speaker 1: of his murder conviction was in his book Jump, My Secret,
Speaker 1: Journey from the Streets to the Boardroom, which he co
Speaker 1: wrote with his daughter. But for four decades after getting
Speaker 1: out of prison, Larry kept his past his secret, fearful
Speaker 1: it would jeopardize his career. He told no one, even
Speaker 1: as he made impressive moves from prison to Campbell's to
Speaker 1: Jansen to Nike, where he was finally out of the
Speaker 1: finance game and ready to start building a legendary brand.
Speaker 1: Our first job at Nike was the head of apparel
Speaker 1: in the US, which was about a billion dollar business
Speaker 1: at the time. So jes see US apparel at that point.
Speaker 1: And what I didn't know when I started at Niki
Speaker 1: until after I got here. But at the time I
Speaker 1: was hired at Nike, I was the first black vice
Speaker 1: president in the history of the company. I did not
Speaker 1: know that until I got here. But that put a
Speaker 1: little bit. I added pressure on the fact that, you
Speaker 1: know what, I got to make sure that I did.
Speaker 1: I deliver on this. It must have put pressure both
Speaker 1: ways in terms of the feeling of like being one
Speaker 1: of one here at Nike, the pressure to deliver. But
Speaker 1: I'm also wondering if if you felt pressure as as
Speaker 1: a black man who's an executive at Nike, that sort
Speaker 1: of built off of the greatness of black athletes? Did
Speaker 1: that feel Could that have felt fun? That's why I
Speaker 1: was I think that's why I was a little surprised
Speaker 1: or a lot surprised when I found out that I
Speaker 1: was the first, because you assume based on you know,
Speaker 1: Nike's involvement with the athletes and that that the company
Speaker 1: a certain way. But but you know, fortunately now that
Speaker 1: number has has gone way up. I think we've got
Speaker 1: forty to fifty black vice presidents here now. So were you?
Speaker 1: I mean, you're coming from West Philadelphia, born and raced race,
Speaker 1: had born a race, shout out the fresh Prince, and
Speaker 1: you're moving up through the corporate ranks, not a lot
Speaker 1: of black faces, not just a Nike yeah, anywhere you go. Right,
Speaker 1: How did you put that feeling of discomfort that might
Speaker 1: cause to the side or didn't or did not feel
Speaker 1: that with you? No? It did, and I never put
Speaker 1: it to the side. I just kind of dealt with
Speaker 1: it and kind of figured out the best way that
Speaker 1: I was going to deal with it to still keep
Speaker 1: moving forward and accomplish what I was trying to accomplish.
Speaker 1: But I never forgot about it because it's so obvious.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, you go into a room and
Speaker 1: you know, you look around and it's just you sitting there,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, And so you can't not
Speaker 1: you know, you can't forget it because it's in your
Speaker 1: face all the time. But I think what you have
Speaker 1: to do is make sure that you represent yourself in
Speaker 1: the way that you should represent yourself as a person
Speaker 1: of color, as a black person in that room. You
Speaker 1: speak up on the things that you need to speak
Speaker 1: up on, but do it in a way that is
Speaker 1: non threatening to folks, but making your point, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, making your point and making sure that
Speaker 1: people understand that if something's not right, it ain't right,
Speaker 1: and you need to make sure that you voiced that.
Speaker 1: And in a way that goes back to that first
Speaker 1: example of that. You know, when you're at Campbell super Nape.
Speaker 1: They didn't even tell you about that job opportunity and
Speaker 1: you went in and you dressed it. It's like, on
Speaker 1: one hand, if if you make yourself above approach, if
Speaker 1: you do your job well and you show up and
Speaker 1: are professional, then you can demand certain things. You know,
Speaker 1: the reason I went back went to school and got
Speaker 1: my NBA wasn't because I like school or just wanted
Speaker 1: to go to school. I figured at some point I
Speaker 1: was gonna get to a situation where I'm in the
Speaker 1: runnings for a job or a position and somebody else's
Speaker 1: as well, and they have an NBA and I don't.
Speaker 1: Then that's to me, that's the roadblock that that would
Speaker 1: be put up in front of me to keep me
Speaker 1: from from getting to where I think I should be.
Speaker 1: So I'm going to remove that as a barrier exactly.
Speaker 1: So you know, you got to tell me something else
Speaker 1: as to why you didn't give me the job. I
Speaker 1: knew that that was a roadblock that I had to
Speaker 1: move out of the way. Yeah. Can you tell the
Speaker 1: story of the Jordan brand launch in ninety nine. So
Speaker 1: at the time, actually Nike decided that there were three
Speaker 1: businesses that they were going to put dedicated teams on
Speaker 1: with the president and a team of people that were
Speaker 1: solely focused on that business. And it was golf, Nike Golf,
Speaker 1: which was had a different distribution and was kind of
Speaker 1: different than the rest of the Nike business, ACG which
Speaker 1: is the outdoor business, and then Jordan. Those were the
Speaker 1: three and so so I was asked to put a
Speaker 1: team together and strategies on how we were gonna take
Speaker 1: that logo and evolve it into a brand. And the
Speaker 1: first launch that we had was the Air Jordan fifteen.
Speaker 1: And this was the first shoe that Michael wasn't going
Speaker 1: to be playing in and wearing, right because he retired.
Speaker 1: At that point, he was retired. And the formula had
Speaker 1: been that we tinker designs a really cool shoe and
Speaker 1: we do some marketing with Spike Lee or Bugs Bunny
Speaker 1: or somebody, and then Michael wears the shoe eighty two
Speaker 1: games and into the playoffs. That was the formula of
Speaker 1: how we were gonna have what was driving this business,
Speaker 1: and now you're taking him playing out, so a big
Speaker 1: piece of the formula is not there anymore. And there
Speaker 1: were a lot of people, both internal and external, who
Speaker 1: thought that it would never work, that that's the formula,
Speaker 1: formulas done. It was a nice run, but it's over
Speaker 1: at this point. There were a lot of people who
Speaker 1: felt that way, and you know, fortunately there were folks
Speaker 1: internally who thought differently, as guy named Howard White, who
Speaker 1: was basically the one who suggested and recommended me to
Speaker 1: run the Jordan business. And Howard was always a proponent
Speaker 1: of the fact that he believed the brand could be bigger,
Speaker 1: that we could really evolve that into a brand, even
Speaker 1: what the shoes the air Jordan's shoes had banned while
Speaker 1: he was playing. Absolutely, And I mean, you know, if
Speaker 1: you look at the business back then when he retired,
Speaker 1: the business was around one hundred and forty one hundred
Speaker 1: and fifty million dollars. In this year, it's over five
Speaker 1: billion dollars. So so we would been able to not
Speaker 1: only sustain it after he retired, but to continue to
Speaker 1: grow it, kind of grow it exponentially. Yeah, running a
Speaker 1: company's one thing, but running a company that's really built
Speaker 1: a round a Living Legends brand, did you having to
Speaker 1: work alongside Was that a different kind of pressure or?
Speaker 1: I mean, I think the biggest pressure was, you know,
Speaker 1: making sure that we represented mj the way he wanted
Speaker 1: to be represented and the way he felt that we
Speaker 1: should be representing him and that the brand should be
Speaker 1: representing him. That was that was the biggest challenge, Just
Speaker 1: making sure that everything we did aligned with who he
Speaker 1: was and what he was about and what he brought
Speaker 1: to not just on the court, but off the court
Speaker 1: as well. Just making sure that we stayed aligned with
Speaker 1: with who MJ is. We were blessed to have a
Speaker 1: living legend that we could actually you know, talk to
Speaker 1: and make sure that we're doing things the way he
Speaker 1: wanted them done, and that we're doing things and representing
Speaker 1: him the way he wanted to be represented. I think
Speaker 1: we were add an advantage to me. He was kind
Speaker 1: of like our secret sauce. Being able to go and
Speaker 1: talk to MJ and run things by him and make
Speaker 1: sure that he was on board with the things we
Speaker 1: wanted to do. That kept us aligned with who he is,
Speaker 1: and I think that's what made us be able to
Speaker 1: you know, represent him in a way that resonates with consumers.
Speaker 1: It's probably what makes the brand feel authentic. Authentic. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: just curious. How's the relationship with Phil Knight, who's another
Speaker 1: very larger than life character here at Nike. Phil phil
Speaker 1: Knight is someone that I have the utmost respect for.
Speaker 1: Not only do I consider Phil a colleague and something
Speaker 1: that I work with, but I consider him a friend.
Speaker 1: And over the years we've developed a friendship relationship and
Speaker 1: I always felt like Phil had my back. So if
Speaker 1: I needed to push something through or something wasn't going
Speaker 1: I felt like I could go to Phil explain it
Speaker 1: to him, and he would help me figure out how
Speaker 1: to get past it. So he's an incredible individual, and
Speaker 1: like I said, I feel fortunate to consider him a friend.
Speaker 1: When I decided that I think I'm going to move
Speaker 1: forward with doing this book, right, So the two people
Speaker 1: there were no. I had a list of people that
Speaker 1: I wanted to have an opportunity to talk to before
Speaker 1: they heard about it somewhere else, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: I didn't want to like read about the fact that
Speaker 1: you know, I have all this history and not have
Speaker 1: And so at the top of the list where Michael
Speaker 1: Jordan and Phil Night they were you knew before this
Speaker 1: book comes out and it's written, but you know, before
Speaker 1: this comes out. I got to go to Phil them
Speaker 1: where a bunch of other folks were on the list,
Speaker 1: but they were to two at the top. So my
Speaker 1: desire was to sit down in person and have the conversation,
Speaker 1: but it was during the pandemic, so I had to
Speaker 1: do it digitally. So I reached out to both of
Speaker 1: them and basically said, hey, something personal I like to
Speaker 1: talk with you about whenever you get an opportunity. So
Speaker 1: Phil hits me right back I have a video conference
Speaker 1: with him. So I share that with Phil and he said,
Speaker 1: you know, when when I got the message that, uh,
Speaker 1: that you wanted to talk about something personal, he said,
Speaker 1: I didn't know what to expect, but it absolutely wasn't
Speaker 1: this so so but he but then he said, look,
Speaker 1: you know, he said, I think you have to tell
Speaker 1: this story. He said, uh, it's it's inspirational. It's aspirational.
Speaker 1: I think it will motivate some people, and I'll support you.
Speaker 1: However I can, well, what did you tell Phil? Basically that, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, my daughter had convinced me to tell my
Speaker 1: story and that the part that people don't know about
Speaker 1: is that from you know, the age of twelve, thirteen
Speaker 1: to thirty, I was in and out of jail. I
Speaker 1: was convicted of murder. I mean said, I laid the
Speaker 1: whole whole deal out for him and and like I said,
Speaker 1: he was like, you know, you have to tell the story.
Speaker 1: And then it was the same with them Jack. We
Speaker 1: finally ended up. It took a little bit longer to
Speaker 1: connect with him, but when we did connect, same thing
Speaker 1: I kind of went through, like, hey, my daughter convinced
Speaker 1: me that I need to tell this story. Kind of
Speaker 1: shared it with him, and his first comment was, I
Speaker 1: agree with your daughter. You need to tell this story.
Speaker 1: People need to know the things you've been through. And
Speaker 1: he said, this can be a motivational story. So so
Speaker 1: both of them, I think if either one of them
Speaker 1: had been well, maybe you shouldn't do this, but I
Speaker 1: might have been much more reluctant. But they were both
Speaker 1: not only supportive but encouraging, like, you know, you need
Speaker 1: you need to tell this story. The fact that you
Speaker 1: came from where you came from, doing what you did,
Speaker 1: and found it in yourself to forgive yourself, found it
Speaker 1: in yourself to let yourself be better, be different. It's
Speaker 1: not something a lot of people offer themselves, you know,
Speaker 1: and it's really important that you did that. I think, well,
Speaker 1: you know, it's like I said it was. It was.
Speaker 1: It was challenging. I mean for years I was so
Speaker 1: afraid that this would come out. I mean I had
Speaker 1: nightmares on a regular basis. I had recurring nightmares of
Speaker 1: like getting locked up again and going back to jail
Speaker 1: and I'm trying to get back to my life and
Speaker 1: trying to figure out what's going on. And this was
Speaker 1: something that happened like at least once or twice a month,
Speaker 1: I would have, you know, these nightmares, migraines. I actually
Speaker 1: had to end up going to the er a couple
Speaker 1: of times because I had these migraines so bad. And
Speaker 1: I know it was all because I was of the
Speaker 1: stress and anxiety I was feeling, because I was holding
Speaker 1: all of this in and afraid that at some point
Speaker 1: it was going to come out. You know. The other
Speaker 1: the other positive thing about this to me is that
Speaker 1: it allowed me to tell the story of my own terms,
Speaker 1: and I think that has been a real benefit for
Speaker 1: me just and you know, once I started talking to
Speaker 1: my daughter and kind of getting some of this stuff
Speaker 1: out to her, the nightmares stopped, the migraines stopped. And
Speaker 1: I think it's all because I've let go of all
Speaker 1: this pressure and tension and anxiety that I was holding
Speaker 1: in because I was afraid that this story might come out. Wow.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm I'm just um humbled and and you know,
Speaker 1: grace grateful that I've been able to get through the
Speaker 1: things that I've been able to get through, and um,
Speaker 1: you know, you have a story that could maybe inspire
Speaker 1: some some other other people. You know, I was thinking
Speaker 1: about you know, so, so reality is, you know, I
Speaker 1: didn't have to do this, right, I could have, Like
Speaker 1: a friend of mine said, man, you were planning to
Speaker 1: take this story to the grave, which I was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're right about that. But you know, I know it
Speaker 1: was the right thing to do. I already know it
Speaker 1: has helped some people, It's inspired some people. And I
Speaker 1: feel like I've been so blessed in my life with
Speaker 1: the things that I've been able to have access to
Speaker 1: and be exposed to, that if I didn't share this
Speaker 1: story that I wouldn't be showing my gratitude for how
Speaker 1: how blessed I've been. And it's allowing me to give
Speaker 1: something back. It's allowing me to give something back that
Speaker 1: can maybe help some other people. Absolutely. I mean it's
Speaker 1: like again, people talk about the cycle, the cycle of
Speaker 1: violence and that occurs in the street, and it really
Speaker 1: is that. And some of that is down to you
Speaker 1: feeling worthless because you did something where you feel, well,
Speaker 1: now I have no worth you know. Um, the whole
Speaker 1: recidivism cycle, it's I mean, you get in trouble for something,
Speaker 1: you go to jail, you don't learn anything or acquirity
Speaker 1: knowledge or training or anything. That's going to allow you
Speaker 1: to change your life. You go back out, you did
Speaker 1: the same thing, and you end up right back in,
Speaker 1: and then it's it's it's a it's a vicious cycle,
Speaker 1: you know. I am so One of the things I'm
Speaker 1: really happy and proud about coming out of this book
Speaker 1: is that Harvard Business School has decided that they're gonna
Speaker 1: make a case study for their NBA program their first
Speaker 1: year NBA students out of this book. It's going to
Speaker 1: be a part of the curriculum for NBA students. I'm
Speaker 1: excited about that because to me, these are like entrepreneurs
Speaker 1: and CEOs of the future, and for them to have
Speaker 1: a different perspective on giving people another chance and on
Speaker 1: redemption and you know, all those things, I think is great.
Speaker 1: So I'm really excited about the fact that they're doing that.
Speaker 1: But one of the statistics that I saw in the
Speaker 1: case that they did it said that, so the resident
Speaker 1: of the rate is like seventy six seventy seven percent somewhere,
Speaker 1: and that's on the people who end up going back.
Speaker 1: If someone learns a skill or a trade while they're incarcerated,
Speaker 1: that seventy seven percent number goes to thirty percent. If
Speaker 1: they get a bachelor's degree, that seventy seven percent go
Speaker 1: to six percent, and a master's degree is at zero.
Speaker 1: So to me, that just really confirms the fact that education,
Speaker 1: learning and skill learning things that are going to allow
Speaker 1: you to have a positive impact when you get out.
Speaker 1: That's what really makes a difference, and that's those opportunities
Speaker 1: and things that allow you to feel pride in yourself too,
Speaker 1: exactly feel good about yourself, like I look what I did,
Speaker 1: and look what I can do. And when you learn
Speaker 1: all these things, you know, you start reading, you're like,
Speaker 1: it's the whole world. So something like I think the
Speaker 1: number I saw it was like ninety two percent of
Speaker 1: people who are incarcerated are eventually going to get out.
Speaker 1: The goals should be they come out better people than
Speaker 1: they were when they went in. And that's only going
Speaker 1: to happen if we're doing things while people are incarcerated
Speaker 1: to help them become better people. And the program that
Speaker 1: like you had when you were in jail, that it
Speaker 1: is gone. The program that I was in then it
Speaker 1: doesn't exist anymore. So if I was there today, I
Speaker 1: couldn't come out and do what I've been able to
Speaker 1: do because the program that I was able to take
Speaker 1: advantage of to change my life doesn't exist anymore, and
Speaker 1: to me, that's part of the problem. That's part of
Speaker 1: the issue. We need to figure out, you know, how
Speaker 1: we can start to give people that opportunity to feel
Speaker 1: good about themselves that you were talking about and believe
Speaker 1: that they can. At the end of the day, it
Speaker 1: starts with somebody believing that they can change their life.
Speaker 1: That's where it starts. And I think once someone has
Speaker 1: that desire and that belief that they can change their life,
Speaker 1: then it's like, Okay, here are the steps that you
Speaker 1: need to take to do that. Here are the things
Speaker 1: that but it's hard to find that now. I think
Speaker 1: to going back to your point about Harvard now including
Speaker 1: your book Jump as required reading for first year NBA students.
Speaker 1: Not only will hopefully these kids see that you should
Speaker 1: get people second chances. We all need second, third, or
Speaker 1: four and sometimes in life for various things. But even
Speaker 1: if you just look at from a pure business perspective,
Speaker 1: what someone who's been through the things that you've been
Speaker 1: through can bring to the table, you're really up against
Speaker 1: a rock and a hard place that you're going to
Speaker 1: fight for success for yourself success for company. If you
Speaker 1: look at an archetype of a person you kind of
Speaker 1: want to fill a role, it might be this person
Speaker 1: who's had to fight tooth and nail to just get
Speaker 1: an eighth of what these you know, other applicants. Some
Speaker 1: of the most intelligent, creative people I've ever met are
Speaker 1: people that I've met when I was incarcerated. There's a
Speaker 1: whole workforce there that we're not tapping into because we
Speaker 1: need to develop those folks. And hey, when you're when
Speaker 1: you're in jail, you got time, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: You got time on your hand. So why not give
Speaker 1: people a positive way to utilize that time by training
Speaker 1: them and give them them education or teaching them to
Speaker 1: You know, a friend of mine when when I was
Speaker 1: when I was sixteen and incarcerated, a friend of mine
Speaker 1: that was there was learning how to cut hair. I
Speaker 1: was one of the first people. I was like, yo,
Speaker 1: don't mess me up. I was one of the first
Speaker 1: people that he cut. He got out and opened up
Speaker 1: a barbershop, has employed people. I mean, so, you know,
Speaker 1: it doesn't have to necessarily be a college degree. It
Speaker 1: just has to be some skill set that you can
Speaker 1: then utilize to kind of build your life with. And
Speaker 1: you know, for me it was college. For him it
Speaker 1: was Barbara. You know what I mean, absolutely absolutely, Larry Miller,
Speaker 1: real honor and real pleasure to sit here and in
Speaker 1: your office, in your life story. So thank you so much, pleasure,
Speaker 1: pleasure to share, you know, some of these thoughts and insights.
Speaker 1: And maybe there's a sixteen year old Larry Miller out
Speaker 1: there somewhere about to do something stupid, and maybe the
Speaker 1: story can make them think twice and make it a
Speaker 1: little easier on themselves, exactly. And then you know, hopefully
Speaker 1: there are people that have never had any kind of
Speaker 1: contact with the criminal justice system, but they're in positions
Speaker 1: where they can hire people or provide opportunities for people,
Speaker 1: and maybe this story would inspire them to give somebody
Speaker 1: a chance, or to help somebody to get a skill
Speaker 1: set or an education that can help them to improve
Speaker 1: their life. Thanks so much to Larry Miller for opening
Speaker 1: up about his journey from Westville to the executive ranks
Speaker 1: of Nike and Jordan Brand. His achievements are absolutely unthinkable.
Speaker 1: It's almost a fairy tale, but in reality, it's the
Speaker 1: kind of achievement that we need to view as and
Speaker 1: make repeatable Larry Miller's proof that when someone really decides
Speaker 1: to make a change to their circumstances, that change can
Speaker 1: be lasting, at least when provided the same opportunities as
Speaker 1: everyone else. Larry, finally opening up all these years later,
Speaker 1: hopefully brings us a little bit closer to that place.
Speaker 1: Started from the Bottom is produced by David Jaw, edited
Speaker 1: by Keishaw Williams, Engineered by Ben Holliday, Booked by Laura
Speaker 1: Morgan with production help from Lea Rose. The show's executive
Speaker 1: produced by Jacob Goldstein, who's not all up in the
Speaker 1: videos for Pushkin Industries. Our theme music's by Ben Holliday
Speaker 1: and David Jaw featuring Anthony Aggas and Vannah Joe Lack.
Speaker 1: Listen to Start Up from the Bottom wherever you get
Speaker 1: your podcasts and if you want add three episodes available
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Speaker 1: If you like your show, please remember to share, rate,
Speaker 1: and review us on your podcast app. I'm justin Richmond