WEBVTT - NFL Draft Preview with Robert Mays

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to the solid verbal Hell that for me. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>a man, I'm forty.

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<v Speaker 2>I've heard so many players say, well, I want to

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<v Speaker 2>be happy.

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<v Speaker 3>You want to be happy for a day? Edo State

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<v Speaker 3>is that?

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<v Speaker 1>Woo woom and Dan and tie welcome back to the

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<v Speaker 1>solid verbal boys, girls, my name is Ty Hildebrandt, joining

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<v Speaker 1>me as always over there in sunny Chicago, Illinois.

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<v Speaker 2>Sir, how are you? I'm pretty good. Yesterday was cold,

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<v Speaker 2>today is warm. We get to have on one of

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<v Speaker 2>my favorite football people. I don't really even watch the

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<v Speaker 2>NFL that much. It's just out of a time thing.

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<v Speaker 2>It's fine. It's a totally entertaining league, but I'm always

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<v Speaker 2>interested in sort of the behind the scenes stuff and

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<v Speaker 2>the team building stuff involved with the NFL more so

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<v Speaker 2>than some of the game watching. And so to have

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<v Speaker 2>Robert Mays on, somebody I've I've read and listened to

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<v Speaker 2>for a while and we crossed over with at grant

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<v Speaker 2>Land briefly. I'm just fall on excited to nerd out

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<v Speaker 2>over the draft.

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<v Speaker 1>Robert Mays. He is the host of the Athletic Football

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<v Speaker 1>Show for the Athletic. He also writes about the NFL

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<v Speaker 1>for the Athletic previously, as you said of Grantland and

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<v Speaker 1>Monday Morning Quarterback at dot Com The Ringer. Yes, so

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<v Speaker 1>Robert's been around and really knows the stuff when it

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<v Speaker 1>comes to all things pro football. This is one of

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<v Speaker 1>those hybrid times of year for college football fans because

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<v Speaker 1>there are a lot of college people who are frankly

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<v Speaker 1>in the same boat as us. We pay intimate attention

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<v Speaker 1>to the college game. We're interested, if only tangentially, in

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<v Speaker 1>the NFL Draft to see where some of our players

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<v Speaker 1>and some of these names go on the next level.

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<v Speaker 1>But maybe we don't have that depth of knowledge that

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<v Speaker 1>someone like Robert does about the NFL, where guys fit,

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<v Speaker 1>where they don't fit, what kind of trends exist in

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<v Speaker 1>the NFL, etc. Etc. So we're gonna have him all.

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<v Speaker 1>We're gonna have a nice long interview to talk about

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<v Speaker 1>all things NFL draft.

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<v Speaker 2>Is the NFL not like the what is the retired

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<v Speaker 2>or the older golf level called when you're forty fifty

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<v Speaker 2>plus or something like that, the Champions Tours, the Champions Tour. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>Is the NFL not the Champions Tour of college football?

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<v Speaker 2>Is that its own like suspected level.

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<v Speaker 1>They might take exception to that label, but from our standpoint, yeah, sure,

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<v Speaker 1>not sure.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, I'm just interested NFL wise, since I mean

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<v Speaker 2>I kind of like the forty nine ers. I don't

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<v Speaker 2>really watch forty nine ers games, though. I like seeing

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<v Speaker 2>how the college players I liked for whatever reason, if

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<v Speaker 2>they're on Oregon, if they're not an organ how they

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<v Speaker 2>do That's just always interesting to me. And that's just

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<v Speaker 2>me following from Afar. But yeah, this is that week

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<v Speaker 2>where we cross over and I used to do a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of draft stuff at old jobs and seeing how,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, the teams that drafted the had the most

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<v Speaker 2>like second and third round picks, and how do that

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<v Speaker 2>correlate to wins? And also it's all fascinating to me,

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<v Speaker 2>the value system and the strategy of the draft that

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<v Speaker 2>to me is fast.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I like the presentation of the draft.

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<v Speaker 2>Remember when we did we nail? What song did we nail?

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<v Speaker 2>That would be like the commercial bumpers? Was that all

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<v Speaker 2>of the lights? Yeah, Kanye song.

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<v Speaker 1>I think I don't remember who got it, but I

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<v Speaker 1>remember we nailed it. Because there's always like a draft song.

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<v Speaker 2>Right well ahead of us. I guess Rihanna had lived

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<v Speaker 2>your life right, Yes, that was a song. That really

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<v Speaker 2>hit one year. I don't know what. I'm not paying

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<v Speaker 2>nearly enough attention to pop music to know what will

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<v Speaker 2>be used as bumpers. That's that's actually your expertise, Ti,

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<v Speaker 2>it is, so I'm putting you on the spot. I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>we'll be doing a show. Well, we'll be recording Wednesday

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<v Speaker 2>for Thursday, so there's no way we could know by then.

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<v Speaker 2>But this is our draft preview episode. So what is

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<v Speaker 2>I guess in the last three to eight months something

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<v Speaker 2>like that? What is the song that, either musically or

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<v Speaker 2>with the lyrics is going to be featured? Is that

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<v Speaker 2>bumper song? We'll call it for ESPN? I don't you're

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<v Speaker 2>on the spot?

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<v Speaker 1>Well I did. I I did read a little bit

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<v Speaker 1>about this just in preparation for this show, Okay, And no,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know what that song is going to be.

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<v Speaker 1>I believe that Kings of Leon are going to be performing.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know how, Like at where is its Cleveland?

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<v Speaker 2>Cleveland? Okay, because it was Nashville last show, which would

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<v Speaker 2>have made sense. I think they live in Nashville, the

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<v Speaker 2>Kings of Leon.

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<v Speaker 1>But I believe, if memory serves, they're going to be

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<v Speaker 1>They're going to be part of the coverage. Somehow that

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<v Speaker 1>does not quite rise to the level of what we're

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<v Speaker 1>what we're talking about here, we're talking about like the

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<v Speaker 1>pop song of the moment that ESPN is going to

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<v Speaker 1>slap on top of its coverage. Let me think about that.

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<v Speaker 1>To get back to you, I'm looking at the clothing

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<v Speaker 1>bit here.

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<v Speaker 2>Dua lipa would be great to have there. I thought

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<v Speaker 2>I couldn't tell you what song. I'm ooh hmmm, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>listening to one right now, but we don't have the

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<v Speaker 2>rights to play it, but I'm playing it in my

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<v Speaker 2>my headphones. The levitating song.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's a gem.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, if you Jenny right, it's that. If you

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<v Speaker 2>want me like, well, that's very You can tie that

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<v Speaker 2>to the draft.

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<v Speaker 1>That was the first song that I thought of when

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<v Speaker 1>you asked me that question.

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<v Speaker 2>Do a lipa featuring De Baby or Debaby featuring No?

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<v Speaker 2>It is featuring de Baby, Okay, Just to be clear,

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<v Speaker 2>leave the door open, Bruno Mars. Does that fit from

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<v Speaker 2>a sensibility?

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<v Speaker 1>No, I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a little too sexy, I think now that I

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<v Speaker 2>listen to it. Man, I don't know any of these artists,

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<v Speaker 2>which it just means I'm out of touch. It doesn't

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<v Speaker 2>mean that they're dumb. What's next, drake m? I mean

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<v Speaker 2>that that fits thematically. I don't know what the song is.

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<v Speaker 1>About, right, I need to I need to look a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit more here.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh man, we've we've already featured the weekend in the NFL,

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<v Speaker 2>so it's probably not going to be the weekend.

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<v Speaker 1>This is my assignment for the Thursday show.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, so I'm saying do a lipa. That's my final answer.

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<v Speaker 1>That's a very good answer. I will stick with that

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<v Speaker 1>for now. But this is going to be my homework assignment.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know what our show is going to be

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<v Speaker 1>on Thursday. We'll have some draft theme to it because

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<v Speaker 1>we have something, did you?

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<v Speaker 2>I will continue to watch the Netflix episode of there's

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<v Speaker 2>some like behind the track, like how various songs are

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<v Speaker 2>produced and like the Thorough Story, there's a dual leap

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<v Speaker 2>episode and it's fantastic. I don't think I saw that

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<v Speaker 2>on Netflix.

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<v Speaker 1>I did watch the Maren Morris and z Middle.

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<v Speaker 2>Now this is like a fall on half hour well

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<v Speaker 2>produced show that was like a New York Times.

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<v Speaker 1>That was a six minute clip or whatever. Yeah, right now,

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<v Speaker 1>I didn't see that one yet.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh, you should definitely go out of your way. It's

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<v Speaker 2>really good.

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<v Speaker 3>That's all. Well.

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<v Speaker 1>On that note, as Dan said, draft preview show, Robert

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<v Speaker 1>Mays from The Athletic will have him on momentarily in

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<v Speaker 1>the interim, if you could go on out to our

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<v Speaker 1>website solid reble dot com. You could find all the

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<v Speaker 1>links there if you want to follow along with your

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<v Speaker 1>podcasting app of choice. Also, if you want to sign

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<v Speaker 1>up four hour newsletter, which you can also sign up

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<v Speaker 1>for at newsletter dot soliverble dot com. As we said

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<v Speaker 1>on the last show, send us your writing samples. If

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<v Speaker 1>you're interested in being part of the fun. We've had

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<v Speaker 1>a bunch come in already. Submissions at soliverble dot com

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<v Speaker 1>is where you can submit some of the stuff that

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<v Speaker 1>you're proud of. We want to try and add some

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<v Speaker 1>more written stuff to our newsletter, to our website, et cetera,

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<v Speaker 1>et cetera as we get a little bit closer to

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<v Speaker 1>the season. If you're interested, again, submissions at soliverble dot

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<v Speaker 1>com and last, but certainly not least, verbalers dot com

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<v Speaker 1>is where you can go. I believe we're going to

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<v Speaker 1>post the video of the interview for our Patreon subscribers

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<v Speaker 1>just as a nice little bonus.

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<v Speaker 2>And Robert Mays will tell you the exact level of

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<v Speaker 2>fame that is okay with him, and he is seems

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<v Speaker 2>like he's already reached it. So maybe this will push

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<v Speaker 2>him over the top to being too famous. But we

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<v Speaker 2>don't care.

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<v Speaker 1>We don't care. He gave us permission. It's true to

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<v Speaker 1>used to video Robert Mays. He's the host of the

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<v Speaker 1>Athletic Football Show. He's an NFL writer for the Athletic

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<v Speaker 1>Mister Mays, how are you? It's Draft week? It is

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<v Speaker 1>Draft week.

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<v Speaker 4>I don't feel the least been insulted about never being

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<v Speaker 4>on because I don't really know much about college football

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<v Speaker 4>I would not be useful to your listeners except in

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<v Speaker 4>this context.

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<v Speaker 2>So we technically crossed over at Grantland. I don't think

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<v Speaker 2>we had anybody else from Grantland on. But now this

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<v Speaker 2>is this is our perfect time of year together.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Absolutely. When how long were you there? It was

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<v Speaker 3>only first year? Right? Yeah? When?

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<v Speaker 2>So it was it was the starters, which I guess

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<v Speaker 2>they were basketball Jones, then men and Blazers and us

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<v Speaker 2>when they when Bill brought in like outside, it was

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<v Speaker 2>through Jacoby brought an outside podcast to fill out the

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<v Speaker 2>grant Land network, and then I took a job at Espanation.

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<v Speaker 2>They were like, yeah, we can't really have you on anymore.

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<v Speaker 2>Like that's cool, no worries.

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<v Speaker 4>I don't remember much of twenty eleven. It's not like

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<v Speaker 4>I was drunk for most of the year. I actually wasn't.

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<v Speaker 4>I didn't do anything fun. I just was working constantly

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<v Speaker 4>and was getting like four hours of sleep at night

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<v Speaker 4>as we were trying to run the website with about

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<v Speaker 4>five people. So that time in my life is very

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<v Speaker 4>much a blow.

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<v Speaker 3>Will you do it?

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<v Speaker 2>You were doing the show with Bill Barnwell then, I

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<v Speaker 2>think or that wasn't.

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<v Speaker 3>The first year. That was later.

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<v Speaker 4>So the first year that I was there, I actually

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<v Speaker 4>did a show with e from Salam that we called

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<v Speaker 4>The Trenches. I did I should not have had a podcast.

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<v Speaker 4>It was completely irresponsible for Jacoby to put me on

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<v Speaker 4>the air. I was twenty three years old. I had

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<v Speaker 4>no idea what I was doing. I had no experience,

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<v Speaker 4>and they were just like, do you want a football podcast?

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<v Speaker 3>I was like, sure, I'll take that.

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<v Speaker 2>Actually uniquely qualifies you for a podcast. No experience, no

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<v Speaker 2>idea what you're doing. In twenty eleven. It absolutely did

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<v Speaker 2>the idea. If you had told me ten years ago

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<v Speaker 2>that podcasting would be the biggest chunk of my job

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<v Speaker 2>a decade later, I would have thought something had gone

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<v Speaker 2>horribly wrong, and I just never would have believed you.

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<v Speaker 2>But here we are, and it seems to be a

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<v Speaker 2>sustainable life, which I'll take.

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<v Speaker 1>I think it's I think it's going to continue. Yeah, all, yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>Same, because I can't write anymore.

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<v Speaker 4>I've lost the ability to do it, so fingers still

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<v Speaker 4>goes up to dry.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm screwed.

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<v Speaker 1>So okay, let's talk about the topic at hand here,

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<v Speaker 1>the NFL Draft. I got to start out with this,

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<v Speaker 1>Are you an NFL network or ESPN guy? On Draft night?

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<v Speaker 1>Which covers do you watch?

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<v Speaker 3>It's a great question.

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<v Speaker 4>I typically go NFL and Network, especially now that Daniel

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<v Speaker 4>Jeremias on. I've known DJ for a couple of years

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<v Speaker 4>and he's a buddy, so I enjoy supporting him whenever possible.

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<v Speaker 4>But I think this year we'll probably be watching on

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<v Speaker 4>silent because or I'm mute because we're doing a live

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<v Speaker 4>show the night of the draft, so we're going to

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<v Speaker 4>have it out in the background and be reacting to it.

0:10:35.520 --> 0:10:37.280
<v Speaker 4>So we're gonna have to decide on a feed. I

0:10:37.280 --> 0:10:39.160
<v Speaker 4>haven't talked to the other guys who are going to

0:10:39.200 --> 0:10:40.679
<v Speaker 4>be in the room yet. That's going to be something

0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:42.400
<v Speaker 4>that requires a little bit of teasing out.

0:10:42.960 --> 0:10:46.520
<v Speaker 1>Are you at all nostalgic for the weird awkwardness that

0:10:46.559 --> 0:10:49.760
<v Speaker 1>we saw in twenty twenty with the virtual zoom Oh yeah,

0:10:49.920 --> 0:10:51.599
<v Speaker 1>combo draft, whatever you want to call that.

0:10:51.920 --> 0:10:53.959
<v Speaker 4>Absolutely, we were talking about it on our show that's

0:10:53.960 --> 0:10:55.800
<v Speaker 4>going to run later this week, me and Lindsay Jones.

0:10:55.800 --> 0:10:57.439
<v Speaker 4>I'm sad that we're not going to have any Cliff

0:10:57.520 --> 0:11:01.040
<v Speaker 4>Kingsbury sockless with the speed up on a table and

0:11:01.120 --> 0:11:02.959
<v Speaker 4>that palatial Arizona home.

0:11:03.520 --> 0:11:05.000
<v Speaker 3>All we have now is the Rams.

0:11:05.720 --> 0:11:08.760
<v Speaker 1>Who is the coach whose son was like on the toilet?

0:11:09.000 --> 0:11:12.520
<v Speaker 4>Oh, Mike Vrabel, his son's friends doting extremely weird stuff.

0:11:12.559 --> 0:11:15.120
<v Speaker 4>Which if you had asked me to rank all of

0:11:15.120 --> 0:11:17.360
<v Speaker 4>the coaches and I had to pick the one whose

0:11:17.440 --> 0:11:19.760
<v Speaker 4>kids would be being weird stuff during the broadcast, I

0:11:19.800 --> 0:11:21.679
<v Speaker 4>probably would have had Mike Vrabel in my top three

0:11:21.840 --> 0:11:22.040
<v Speaker 4>or so.

0:11:22.559 --> 0:11:24.480
<v Speaker 2>I like, aren't the Rams do? They did? They rent

0:11:24.520 --> 0:11:25.840
<v Speaker 2>to house in Malibu? This year?

0:11:25.880 --> 0:11:28.040
<v Speaker 3>They did? They did? Sponsored by Rocket.

0:11:27.760 --> 0:11:32.880
<v Speaker 2>Mortgage of course of course, So okay, how much how

0:11:32.920 --> 0:11:36.560
<v Speaker 2>much college football do you watch for just college football's sake?

0:11:36.600 --> 0:11:38.880
<v Speaker 2>And how much do you watch through the lens of like, Okay,

0:11:38.880 --> 0:11:41.679
<v Speaker 2>this is who's coming, this is where the draft might

0:11:41.760 --> 0:11:43.600
<v Speaker 2>end up in a few months. What is your actual

0:11:43.640 --> 0:11:47.360
<v Speaker 2>college football consumption, if at all? So it changed last

0:11:47.400 --> 0:11:50.040
<v Speaker 2>year obviously for the most part. When I would watch

0:11:50.080 --> 0:11:53.080
<v Speaker 2>it organically, it would be with friends who went to

0:11:53.120 --> 0:11:56.200
<v Speaker 2>certain schools. So my buddy played volleyball at Penn State.

0:11:56.240 --> 0:11:58.520
<v Speaker 2>Who's my best friend. We watched Penn State games together

0:11:58.559 --> 0:12:00.959
<v Speaker 2>every so often. I have friends it went to Michigan.

0:12:01.480 --> 0:12:04.160
<v Speaker 2>One of my really good friends played quarterback in Indiana.

0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:07.480
<v Speaker 2>So I watch a lot of Big ten teams casually

0:12:07.520 --> 0:12:11.280
<v Speaker 2>on Saturday, and sometimes I'll catch bigger games if something.

0:12:11.360 --> 0:12:14.960
<v Speaker 2>If it's Alabama's playing whoever, Georgia on a Saturday night

0:12:15.000 --> 0:12:17.960
<v Speaker 2>at seven pm, I'll do that, But rarely does that

0:12:18.040 --> 0:12:18.840
<v Speaker 2>happen that often.

0:12:19.200 --> 0:12:20.760
<v Speaker 3>I'll watch the playoff.

0:12:20.320 --> 0:12:22.680
<v Speaker 4>Every year, so when it gets a little bit later,

0:12:22.760 --> 0:12:25.720
<v Speaker 4>I'll watch that just purely for enjoyment's sake. But I

0:12:25.800 --> 0:12:28.760
<v Speaker 4>will readily admit that I come to the process with

0:12:30.160 --> 0:12:33.839
<v Speaker 4>relatively less knowledge and drastically less relatively less knowledge of

0:12:33.880 --> 0:12:37.800
<v Speaker 4>most people, drastically less than I assume the layman would

0:12:38.000 --> 0:12:40.160
<v Speaker 4>ascribe to me. Considering I do this for a living,

0:12:40.360 --> 0:12:44.720
<v Speaker 4>I really don't watch that much college football, and for

0:12:44.760 --> 0:12:46.800
<v Speaker 4>that reason I come to this and I don't know.

0:12:47.520 --> 0:12:49.880
<v Speaker 4>I'm trying to think of a good example. I didn't

0:12:49.920 --> 0:12:53.520
<v Speaker 4>know who Christian Darisaw was before I started the draft process.

0:12:53.559 --> 0:12:55.800
<v Speaker 4>Somebody like that is never something that would come across

0:12:55.880 --> 0:12:58.440
<v Speaker 4>my plate in the normal rhythms of my life.

0:12:59.000 --> 0:13:01.520
<v Speaker 2>It's sometimes tough, by the if you cover college football

0:13:01.520 --> 0:13:03.400
<v Speaker 2>because there are so many teams. All of a sudden,

0:13:03.400 --> 0:13:05.679
<v Speaker 2>somebody appears in the top fifteen of a mock draft.

0:13:05.679 --> 0:13:08.520
<v Speaker 2>You're like, oh okay, I mean this team is you know,

0:13:08.720 --> 0:13:10.640
<v Speaker 2>four and eight or something like that, and so you're

0:13:10.679 --> 0:13:13.600
<v Speaker 2>not paying that much attention. It's difficult to find those

0:13:13.640 --> 0:13:18.559
<v Speaker 2>standouts playing for underwhelming teams. So that does happen two

0:13:18.600 --> 0:13:21.080
<v Speaker 2>people like us as well? I mean, were there people

0:13:21.559 --> 0:13:23.439
<v Speaker 2>this year where you're like, now that other than I

0:13:23.440 --> 0:13:26.400
<v Speaker 2>guess Christian Dara saw that you've come into contact with

0:13:26.440 --> 0:13:28.959
<v Speaker 2>where you're like, is anybody talking about oh yes, they are,

0:13:29.040 --> 0:13:31.640
<v Speaker 2>oh okay, good like at least it confirms my talent

0:13:31.720 --> 0:13:32.880
<v Speaker 2>for watching film.

0:13:33.160 --> 0:13:35.720
<v Speaker 4>You know, there wasn't really anybody like that again, because

0:13:35.720 --> 0:13:37.920
<v Speaker 4>I think last season was so strange and I probably

0:13:37.920 --> 0:13:40.480
<v Speaker 4>watched less than I would in a normal year. Somebody

0:13:40.679 --> 0:13:42.959
<v Speaker 4>I did like when I watched him a little bit

0:13:43.160 --> 0:13:44.920
<v Speaker 4>because I was watching him play against Penn State in

0:13:44.960 --> 0:13:48.800
<v Speaker 4>twenty nineteen was Rashad Bateman. Remember watching him in that game.

0:13:48.840 --> 0:13:51.120
<v Speaker 4>I was like, man, that guy got some route running

0:13:51.120 --> 0:13:53.000
<v Speaker 4>savvy to him. He puts a little sauce on some

0:13:53.040 --> 0:13:54.880
<v Speaker 4>of this stuff. I like the way he plays. So

0:13:54.960 --> 0:13:58.320
<v Speaker 4>that was somebody that I knew I had enjoyed. Other

0:13:58.400 --> 0:14:01.160
<v Speaker 4>than that, though not really. I mean for most of

0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:03.120
<v Speaker 4>the other guys, it was the bigger names, and I

0:14:03.160 --> 0:14:05.319
<v Speaker 4>came to them at the same pace that most people would.

0:14:06.200 --> 0:14:09.160
<v Speaker 2>Is this a season Do you feel like GM scouts,

0:14:09.160 --> 0:14:12.240
<v Speaker 2>anybody talking about the sport? Are they looking at last

0:14:12.320 --> 0:14:15.920
<v Speaker 2>fall as like we can't put an entire amount of

0:14:15.920 --> 0:14:18.560
<v Speaker 2>weight into what we saw last fall because of the

0:14:18.679 --> 0:14:20.800
<v Speaker 2>up and down nature of starting and stopping and only

0:14:20.800 --> 0:14:23.000
<v Speaker 2>playing three games or six games or you know, whatever

0:14:23.040 --> 0:14:25.720
<v Speaker 2>it is. Is there less weight on last fall or

0:14:25.760 --> 0:14:28.240
<v Speaker 2>are people just trying to pick it up hard and

0:14:28.520 --> 0:14:29.720
<v Speaker 2>project like they normally do.

0:14:30.440 --> 0:14:33.760
<v Speaker 4>It does seem like the opt outs have raised questions.

0:14:33.800 --> 0:14:36.320
<v Speaker 4>People want to know why certain players opted out, and

0:14:36.320 --> 0:14:38.400
<v Speaker 4>I think that's more that's what it is more than

0:14:38.400 --> 0:14:40.920
<v Speaker 4>anything else. I think it's it puts one more box

0:14:40.960 --> 0:14:42.640
<v Speaker 4>next to a player's name that you have to check

0:14:43.040 --> 0:14:46.000
<v Speaker 4>what it's trying to figure out the reasons if there

0:14:46.040 --> 0:14:48.040
<v Speaker 4>was a drop in play, if somebody opted out. I

0:14:48.040 --> 0:14:50.840
<v Speaker 4>think it's just led to more questions, even if they're

0:14:50.880 --> 0:14:52.120
<v Speaker 4>not taking it less seriously.

0:14:52.320 --> 0:14:54.280
<v Speaker 3>But I think it's it's caused.

0:14:53.920 --> 0:14:56.640
<v Speaker 4>More thoroughness in the process than it might require in

0:14:56.680 --> 0:14:57.360
<v Speaker 4>a typical year.

0:14:58.000 --> 0:15:01.560
<v Speaker 1>What players stand out to you when you think of

0:15:01.640 --> 0:15:04.040
<v Speaker 1>questions like are there any guys that are on your

0:15:04.080 --> 0:15:08.360
<v Speaker 1>radar where you kind of have that lingering like I

0:15:08.440 --> 0:15:10.320
<v Speaker 1>need to know more about this guy before I'd feel

0:15:10.320 --> 0:15:11.080
<v Speaker 1>comfortable with him.

0:15:11.520 --> 0:15:13.520
<v Speaker 4>I think the medical stuff with some of the guys.

0:15:13.720 --> 0:15:16.840
<v Speaker 4>Caleb Farley is somebody that when you watch him play,

0:15:17.240 --> 0:15:19.280
<v Speaker 4>I had somebody with the team last week just say

0:15:19.520 --> 0:15:21.760
<v Speaker 4>flat out, he's the most talented corner and when you

0:15:21.800 --> 0:15:23.640
<v Speaker 4>watch him play, I think that's true. You know, he

0:15:23.720 --> 0:15:26.360
<v Speaker 4>just has such great movement skills and the size is there.

0:15:26.720 --> 0:15:29.840
<v Speaker 4>It's a rare combination of physical profile and movement skills,

0:15:30.240 --> 0:15:32.520
<v Speaker 4>but I would be concerned about a back injury, a

0:15:32.560 --> 0:15:35.760
<v Speaker 4>back injury that's lingering and might require another surgery. I

0:15:35.800 --> 0:15:37.960
<v Speaker 4>think there are some teams that their doctors have okayed it,

0:15:38.120 --> 0:15:40.320
<v Speaker 4>but there's a lot of risk involved there. Jalen Phillips

0:15:40.360 --> 0:15:43.440
<v Speaker 4>is another one. When you watch him, he's got all

0:15:43.480 --> 0:15:45.760
<v Speaker 4>the physical talent in the world. Obviously, he was one

0:15:45.760 --> 0:15:48.040
<v Speaker 4>of the best recruits in the country coming out. You

0:15:48.120 --> 0:15:50.840
<v Speaker 4>see that, you know he's built the right way. You

0:15:50.880 --> 0:15:52.160
<v Speaker 4>know he uses his hands in a way that I

0:15:52.200 --> 0:15:54.680
<v Speaker 4>think other guys in his class don't typically. But there's

0:15:54.760 --> 0:15:57.520
<v Speaker 4>serious questions about his medicals and some other stuff. So

0:15:57.880 --> 0:15:59.640
<v Speaker 4>I think that's that's part of it, is guys that

0:15:59.680 --> 0:16:02.480
<v Speaker 4>opted out and guys that have medical lingering, medical concerns.

0:16:02.560 --> 0:16:05.480
<v Speaker 4>There's just less certainty associated with those guys than it

0:16:05.480 --> 0:16:06.720
<v Speaker 4>would be in a typical year.

0:16:07.440 --> 0:16:10.800
<v Speaker 1>To that point. Do you have a favorite I don't know,

0:16:10.960 --> 0:16:13.840
<v Speaker 1>over the top draft critique, you know, like we've heard about.

0:16:13.880 --> 0:16:17.040
<v Speaker 1>I think it was Penn Suol Dan. His past blocking

0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:19.000
<v Speaker 1>maybe isn't where it needs to be. The guy's a mountain.

0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:22.080
<v Speaker 1>I'm sure he'll be fine in the wal term. Zach Wilson.

0:16:22.480 --> 0:16:25.520
<v Speaker 1>Somebody said early on that he's got like a spoiled attitude.

0:16:25.560 --> 0:16:27.280
<v Speaker 1>It's not going to play well if he ends up

0:16:27.280 --> 0:16:29.640
<v Speaker 1>going to a big city like New York. Have you

0:16:29.720 --> 0:16:32.520
<v Speaker 1>heard any criticism like that that really stands out to

0:16:32.560 --> 0:16:33.720
<v Speaker 1>you as being very obvious.

0:16:34.040 --> 0:16:35.680
<v Speaker 4>I think that a lot of the conversations about the

0:16:35.760 --> 0:16:39.880
<v Speaker 4>quarterbacks have sent me back to the drawing board and

0:16:40.120 --> 0:16:43.680
<v Speaker 4>have caused me to rewatch some stuff and just reevaluate

0:16:43.720 --> 0:16:46.400
<v Speaker 4>what I could possibly be seeing. Can I watch justin Fields.

0:16:46.440 --> 0:16:49.120
<v Speaker 4>I'm not a quarterback expert. I know what I'm watching.

0:16:49.640 --> 0:16:51.320
<v Speaker 4>I watch it, but I don't study it. I guess

0:16:51.320 --> 0:16:54.240
<v Speaker 4>that's the distinction. And when I watch him play, that

0:16:54.400 --> 0:16:56.200
<v Speaker 4>just looks like the second best guy. To me, it

0:16:56.240 --> 0:16:58.400
<v Speaker 4>looks like the second most talented guy. And if you

0:16:58.440 --> 0:17:00.120
<v Speaker 4>look at where he came from and what he is

0:17:00.120 --> 0:17:02.760
<v Speaker 4>supposed to be as recruit, and it's the accuracy. When

0:17:02.760 --> 0:17:06.080
<v Speaker 4>we have guys that have true that are outliers physically,

0:17:06.320 --> 0:17:10.160
<v Speaker 4>that have the frame, the arm, strength, the mobility, all

0:17:10.160 --> 0:17:12.320
<v Speaker 4>of that stuff, I think the bigger questions about them,

0:17:12.359 --> 0:17:15.280
<v Speaker 4>for the most part are accuracy, can he place the

0:17:15.320 --> 0:17:17.640
<v Speaker 4>ball where he wants to? And the idea that Justin

0:17:17.680 --> 0:17:21.720
<v Speaker 4>Fields may be the most accurate quarterback among these four, and.

0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:23.360
<v Speaker 3>He has all of those physical tools.

0:17:23.760 --> 0:17:26.159
<v Speaker 4>I'm just a little confused about what the conversation is

0:17:26.440 --> 0:17:29.080
<v Speaker 4>and why we're not considering him the second best quarterback.

0:17:29.080 --> 0:17:31.399
<v Speaker 4>And I've asked people that I think it's because he

0:17:31.480 --> 0:17:34.040
<v Speaker 4>plays a little bit more methodically. He's not even as

0:17:34.119 --> 0:17:35.879
<v Speaker 4>quick to run as you might want him to be.

0:17:36.240 --> 0:17:38.200
<v Speaker 4>So if you're trying to have an offense that runs

0:17:38.240 --> 0:17:39.679
<v Speaker 4>on time, is he going to be able to do

0:17:39.720 --> 0:17:43.959
<v Speaker 4>that for you? I understand that concern to a certain extent,

0:17:44.240 --> 0:17:46.159
<v Speaker 4>but when I watch that guy and everything else that

0:17:46.200 --> 0:17:49.160
<v Speaker 4>I've heard about him, I just don't understand why we're

0:17:49.160 --> 0:17:51.840
<v Speaker 4>not having a more real conversation about why he should

0:17:51.880 --> 0:17:54.119
<v Speaker 4>be going to San Francisco instead of Mac Jones or

0:17:54.160 --> 0:17:54.679
<v Speaker 4>Tree Lines.

0:17:54.960 --> 0:17:56.960
<v Speaker 1>Well, I'm glad you bring up Mac Jones because that

0:17:57.000 --> 0:17:59.120
<v Speaker 1>was where I was going to go next. Is he

0:17:59.320 --> 0:18:03.760
<v Speaker 1>this year's Daniel Jones in that double Jones? Yeah, We're

0:18:03.800 --> 0:18:07.000
<v Speaker 1>getting to a point where it feels like mac Jones

0:18:07.000 --> 0:18:09.720
<v Speaker 1>has been talked up to the point where people are

0:18:09.720 --> 0:18:12.840
<v Speaker 1>willing to accept him as a potential number three overall

0:18:12.880 --> 0:18:15.840
<v Speaker 1>pick much the way Daniel Jones was talked up as

0:18:15.880 --> 0:18:17.600
<v Speaker 1>the sixth overall pick and ended up going to the

0:18:17.640 --> 0:18:21.240
<v Speaker 1>Giants pretty high. Now, from the college football side of things,

0:18:21.240 --> 0:18:23.520
<v Speaker 1>I think we came to that as Okay, Daniel Jones

0:18:23.560 --> 0:18:25.479
<v Speaker 1>is a good quarterback at Duke. I don't know if

0:18:25.480 --> 0:18:28.639
<v Speaker 1>he's a top ten pick. I think we feel similarly

0:18:28.640 --> 0:18:31.160
<v Speaker 1>about Mac Jones. I'm curious to get your take on him,

0:18:31.800 --> 0:18:34.280
<v Speaker 1>especially since you kind of came into this process with

0:18:34.760 --> 0:18:35.360
<v Speaker 1>virgin eyes.

0:18:36.240 --> 0:18:39.000
<v Speaker 4>I was expecting to like him less than I did

0:18:39.600 --> 0:18:41.680
<v Speaker 4>when I turned down a few games from last year.

0:18:41.720 --> 0:18:44.119
<v Speaker 4>I want to watch the Georgia game, and I probably

0:18:44.160 --> 0:18:46.439
<v Speaker 4>watched two or three other games of him before we

0:18:46.520 --> 0:18:48.879
<v Speaker 4>did the podcast about him a couple weeks ago, and

0:18:48.920 --> 0:18:51.760
<v Speaker 4>I expected to just see a guy that wasn't very impressive,

0:18:51.840 --> 0:18:54.639
<v Speaker 4>that had been overrated for this and this reason. But

0:18:54.680 --> 0:18:56.159
<v Speaker 4>there are a lot of aspects to his game. Was like,

0:18:56.200 --> 0:18:58.399
<v Speaker 4>I understand this. I get why you could talk yourself

0:18:58.400 --> 0:19:02.320
<v Speaker 4>into this. It's the anticipation. He plays very quickly, and

0:19:02.400 --> 0:19:03.720
<v Speaker 4>I think a lot of that is the way the

0:19:03.760 --> 0:19:07.040
<v Speaker 4>offense is distilled for him and what they're trying to accomplish,

0:19:07.080 --> 0:19:10.120
<v Speaker 4>and they have so many answers baked in because they're

0:19:10.160 --> 0:19:13.600
<v Speaker 4>both schematically better and more talented than every other team

0:19:13.640 --> 0:19:15.880
<v Speaker 4>they play, so it's easy to look like you're playing

0:19:15.960 --> 0:19:18.160
<v Speaker 4>quickly because you know who's going to be open before

0:19:18.160 --> 0:19:19.760
<v Speaker 4>the ball is even snapped. I don't know if that

0:19:20.119 --> 0:19:23.520
<v Speaker 4>speaks to processing or just the overall structure of the offense,

0:19:23.840 --> 0:19:25.520
<v Speaker 4>but there are aspects of his game like, all right,

0:19:25.960 --> 0:19:28.280
<v Speaker 4>he gets the ball out on time, He understands space

0:19:28.359 --> 0:19:31.159
<v Speaker 4>really well. He understands coverage structure and where he can

0:19:31.200 --> 0:19:33.520
<v Speaker 4>put the ball in order to give his guys a chance.

0:19:33.560 --> 0:19:36.680
<v Speaker 4>But those plays often include DeVante Smith having to come

0:19:36.680 --> 0:19:39.320
<v Speaker 4>back aggressively for the ball or come back over somebody.

0:19:39.440 --> 0:19:42.800
<v Speaker 4>So there are qualities that he has that if I

0:19:42.840 --> 0:19:45.359
<v Speaker 4>were an NFL team, especially a guy like Kyle Shanahan

0:19:45.520 --> 0:19:47.160
<v Speaker 4>who just needs the ball to go to the right

0:19:47.240 --> 0:19:50.320
<v Speaker 4>place in his mind every single time, I get where

0:19:50.320 --> 0:19:53.439
<v Speaker 4>you would land on Mac Jones. But I still after

0:19:53.480 --> 0:19:56.800
<v Speaker 4>watching him, he's not in the same stratosphere as some

0:19:56.840 --> 0:19:59.040
<v Speaker 4>of these other guys when it comes to physical ability,

0:19:59.080 --> 0:20:01.959
<v Speaker 4>And that's my biggest question is how is he going

0:20:02.040 --> 0:20:06.560
<v Speaker 4>to operate in a situation that doesn't involve perfect conditions?

0:20:06.760 --> 0:20:09.520
<v Speaker 4>And Joe Burrow is surrounded by really good players at LSU,

0:20:10.000 --> 0:20:12.200
<v Speaker 4>but he could make things happen out of structure. He

0:20:12.200 --> 0:20:15.679
<v Speaker 4>can make guys miss in the pocket. His subtle mobility

0:20:16.080 --> 0:20:19.960
<v Speaker 4>was arguably his greatest characteristic coming out of LSU. Mac

0:20:20.040 --> 0:20:22.600
<v Speaker 4>Jones doesn't have that subtle mobility. I mean, he can

0:20:23.000 --> 0:20:25.720
<v Speaker 4>Tom Brady manipulate the pocket a little bit and work

0:20:25.720 --> 0:20:27.720
<v Speaker 4>in that tiny little space, but he's not making free

0:20:27.800 --> 0:20:30.800
<v Speaker 4>rushers miss. And I just think earlier in your career

0:20:31.119 --> 0:20:33.359
<v Speaker 4>that's a huge, huge part of playing the position that

0:20:33.400 --> 0:20:34.040
<v Speaker 4>he's lacking.

0:20:34.760 --> 0:20:37.439
<v Speaker 2>Look so much of drafting a quarterback, especially in the

0:20:37.440 --> 0:20:39.600
<v Speaker 2>first round, and I know this is a pain spot

0:20:39.640 --> 0:20:43.879
<v Speaker 2>for you as a Bears fan, but is talking yourself

0:20:43.960 --> 0:20:46.639
<v Speaker 2>into a guy up near the top of the draft

0:20:46.640 --> 0:20:49.119
<v Speaker 2>that you believe can be a top tier quarterback? And

0:20:49.160 --> 0:20:51.480
<v Speaker 2>you look the last decade, even the half decade that

0:20:51.520 --> 0:20:53.680
<v Speaker 2>has passed. And I don't follow the NFL that closely,

0:20:53.720 --> 0:20:56.440
<v Speaker 2>but we're talking about a league littered with guys who

0:20:56.640 --> 0:21:00.600
<v Speaker 2>had the potential but for whatever reason, be it injuries, situation,

0:21:00.880 --> 0:21:03.840
<v Speaker 2>just didn't live up to potential, didn't work out. Is

0:21:04.240 --> 0:21:07.480
<v Speaker 2>there any broad lesson to take from the last five

0:21:07.600 --> 0:21:10.880
<v Speaker 2>years of first round dudes or top fifteen draft pick

0:21:11.440 --> 0:21:14.520
<v Speaker 2>quarterbacks that you can say, Okay, now that we've seen

0:21:15.040 --> 0:21:17.359
<v Speaker 2>these past five years of tape, this is what we

0:21:17.440 --> 0:21:19.880
<v Speaker 2>can't have in a top ten quarterback or a top

0:21:19.920 --> 0:21:21.920
<v Speaker 2>twenty quarterback. Are there lessons there at all?

0:21:22.320 --> 0:21:24.119
<v Speaker 4>It's interesting because I don't know if there is. I

0:21:24.119 --> 0:21:26.080
<v Speaker 4>don't even know if there are one or two, because

0:21:26.320 --> 0:21:29.120
<v Speaker 4>there's so many different things you can take from each circumstance.

0:21:30.040 --> 0:21:32.920
<v Speaker 4>The Panthers just traded two picks for Sam Darnolds two.

0:21:33.640 --> 0:21:37.960
<v Speaker 4>He was arguably the worst quarterback in the NFL statistically

0:21:37.960 --> 0:21:40.720
<v Speaker 4>over the last three years. I think Dwayne Haskins was

0:21:41.000 --> 0:21:43.120
<v Speaker 4>technically worse than him and maybe a couple other guys,

0:21:43.160 --> 0:21:45.280
<v Speaker 4>but he was in there thirty two through thirty five,

0:21:45.680 --> 0:21:48.640
<v Speaker 4>and the Panthers thought highly enough of him to trade

0:21:48.680 --> 0:21:50.919
<v Speaker 4>two picks to go get him, because in their minds,

0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:55.280
<v Speaker 4>that's all situation why he wasn't playing well, lack of protection,

0:21:55.720 --> 0:21:59.600
<v Speaker 4>lack of scheme, lack of planmaking talent. So that's one conversation.

0:22:00.119 --> 0:22:03.159
<v Speaker 4>I think that for a while we had learned that

0:22:03.520 --> 0:22:07.080
<v Speaker 4>picking the big, strong guy that was a little bit raw,

0:22:07.200 --> 0:22:09.200
<v Speaker 4>big strong armed guy that was a little bit raw

0:22:09.720 --> 0:22:12.960
<v Speaker 4>had been a mistake. Those guys typically don't become more

0:22:13.000 --> 0:22:15.720
<v Speaker 4>accurate in the NFL. Then you watch what happens with

0:22:15.800 --> 0:22:19.119
<v Speaker 4>Josh Allen, right, and now it shifts the conversation a

0:22:19.119 --> 0:22:21.320
<v Speaker 4>little bit. And I think what's happened with Justin Herbert

0:22:21.600 --> 0:22:23.399
<v Speaker 4>has also shifted it a little bit. We're looking at

0:22:23.440 --> 0:22:26.040
<v Speaker 4>these guys who are toolsy and saying, all right, is

0:22:26.080 --> 0:22:29.320
<v Speaker 4>it worth making the bet on a toolsy quarterback. I

0:22:29.359 --> 0:22:34.000
<v Speaker 4>don't think the conversation about Trey Lance sounds the way

0:22:34.040 --> 0:22:37.280
<v Speaker 4>it does if we didn't see what just happened last

0:22:37.320 --> 0:22:39.720
<v Speaker 4>year with Josh Allen and Justin Herbert. Because he is

0:22:39.720 --> 0:22:42.280
<v Speaker 4>a little bit scattershot with accuracy. Sometimes there is something

0:22:42.280 --> 0:22:44.879
<v Speaker 4>you have to read into when it comes to projecting

0:22:44.960 --> 0:22:46.760
<v Speaker 4>him into a full time role in the NFL. He

0:22:46.800 --> 0:22:50.480
<v Speaker 4>some only started seventeen games. But because we've seen toolsy

0:22:50.520 --> 0:22:54.439
<v Speaker 4>guys succeed recently, I think it's caused both the media

0:22:54.520 --> 0:22:58.080
<v Speaker 4>and teams to say, all right, I'll take the toolsy guy.

0:22:58.440 --> 0:23:01.960
<v Speaker 4>Because for a lot of reasons, the rules have changed,

0:23:02.240 --> 0:23:04.680
<v Speaker 4>offensive coaching is better in the NFL than it's ever been.

0:23:05.040 --> 0:23:07.639
<v Speaker 4>I think the gap between college and pro football has

0:23:07.680 --> 0:23:09.840
<v Speaker 4>shrunk a little bit that it's easier to project guys

0:23:09.840 --> 0:23:11.800
<v Speaker 4>if you can do things they're comfortable with for a

0:23:11.840 --> 0:23:14.080
<v Speaker 4>lot of different reasons. I think that that is worth making.

0:23:14.240 --> 0:23:15.840
<v Speaker 4>But I don't think we would have said that even

0:23:15.840 --> 0:23:16.480
<v Speaker 4>two years ago.

0:23:17.080 --> 0:23:20.000
<v Speaker 2>Do do people overreact to possible exceptions to the rule?

0:23:20.040 --> 0:23:20.200
<v Speaker 4>Then?

0:23:20.600 --> 0:23:22.840
<v Speaker 2>Is Josh Allen an exception to the rule?

0:23:22.920 --> 0:23:23.040
<v Speaker 4>Right?

0:23:23.080 --> 0:23:26.960
<v Speaker 2>It's lower level competition as as good as Wyoming football

0:23:27.119 --> 0:23:29.000
<v Speaker 2>has been to whatever you believe it is. I mean,

0:23:29.080 --> 0:23:31.520
<v Speaker 2>North Dakota State is not playing top tier teams, so

0:23:31.560 --> 0:23:34.960
<v Speaker 2>we're talking about toolsy against lower level competition, whereas Justin

0:23:35.000 --> 0:23:37.240
<v Speaker 2>Herbert obviously, I mean, you can make Pack twelve jokes,

0:23:37.280 --> 0:23:39.200
<v Speaker 2>but he was playing against higher level competition. He was

0:23:39.200 --> 0:23:41.720
<v Speaker 2>playing against the Auburn defense a year and a half ago.

0:23:42.200 --> 0:23:44.960
<v Speaker 2>What is that an element to things? And you mentioned

0:23:45.080 --> 0:23:48.600
<v Speaker 2>the number of games guys have started, Mitch Trubisky started

0:23:48.600 --> 0:23:51.840
<v Speaker 2>a season in college. You look at I mean, there

0:23:51.840 --> 0:23:53.320
<v Speaker 2>are four year guys who work out. There are four

0:23:53.320 --> 0:23:55.399
<v Speaker 2>of you guys who don't work out. Is it just

0:23:56.000 --> 0:23:58.560
<v Speaker 2>see a GM seeing an example of somebody who worked out,

0:23:58.600 --> 0:24:00.320
<v Speaker 2>and they're like, well, could be our guy too.

0:24:00.960 --> 0:24:01.359
<v Speaker 3>I think so.

0:24:01.880 --> 0:24:04.600
<v Speaker 4>I think people absolutely talk themselves into the exception too.

0:24:04.640 --> 0:24:07.439
<v Speaker 4>Often and with Josh Allen. You know, I learned this

0:24:07.880 --> 0:24:12.000
<v Speaker 4>in the twenty nineteen season. I went to Buffalo and

0:24:12.040 --> 0:24:13.920
<v Speaker 4>I spent a couple of days there and I talked

0:24:13.960 --> 0:24:16.000
<v Speaker 4>to him for a while. When you talk to him

0:24:16.320 --> 0:24:18.800
<v Speaker 4>and the people around him and the coaching staff there

0:24:18.840 --> 0:24:22.560
<v Speaker 4>in the front office there, he has a real desire

0:24:22.600 --> 0:24:25.720
<v Speaker 4>to get better. He's also very smart. You know, when

0:24:25.720 --> 0:24:27.440
<v Speaker 4>you watched him play in college, I think it would

0:24:27.440 --> 0:24:30.480
<v Speaker 4>have been easy to see that style of play and

0:24:30.480 --> 0:24:33.320
<v Speaker 4>think he's this big, oafish guy, and in reality, that's

0:24:33.320 --> 0:24:36.200
<v Speaker 4>not true at all. And I think that his intellect

0:24:36.320 --> 0:24:39.720
<v Speaker 4>and his desire to get better played a huge role

0:24:39.920 --> 0:24:42.440
<v Speaker 4>in the strides that he made. So if you look

0:24:42.440 --> 0:24:45.200
<v Speaker 4>at a guy and just say that's a tools he prospect,

0:24:45.400 --> 0:24:48.000
<v Speaker 4>maybe he can beat Josh Allen. I think you're reading

0:24:48.000 --> 0:24:51.480
<v Speaker 4>into the wrong things. The thing about that, though, is

0:24:51.520 --> 0:24:53.919
<v Speaker 4>that everything I've heard about Trey Lance is he is

0:24:53.960 --> 0:24:56.480
<v Speaker 4>that type of person where he is cerebral, he does

0:24:56.520 --> 0:24:59.200
<v Speaker 4>approach it the right way, and there are these glowing reviews.

0:25:00.000 --> 0:25:02.800
<v Speaker 4>If those two pieces are working in concert, maybe he

0:25:02.840 --> 0:25:05.760
<v Speaker 4>can be another guy that takes a similar step that

0:25:05.840 --> 0:25:09.160
<v Speaker 4>Josh Allen did. But those other intangible factors I think

0:25:09.200 --> 0:25:10.679
<v Speaker 4>have to be part of that conversation.

0:25:11.560 --> 0:25:13.320
<v Speaker 1>Some of the other guys that come to mind when

0:25:13.320 --> 0:25:15.479
<v Speaker 1>you talk about exception to the rule or guys that

0:25:15.560 --> 0:25:18.800
<v Speaker 1>broke the mold. Obviously, Lamar Jackson's had a lot of success.

0:25:19.000 --> 0:25:22.840
<v Speaker 1>Patrick Mahomes had a lot of success in college. I

0:25:22.840 --> 0:25:25.200
<v Speaker 1>don't know if anyone projected this kind of success moving

0:25:25.240 --> 0:25:28.800
<v Speaker 1>forward in the NFL. Who else comes to mind for

0:25:28.920 --> 0:25:31.439
<v Speaker 1>guys that GMS maybe have in the back of their

0:25:31.480 --> 0:25:34.520
<v Speaker 1>mind is like, maybe we could get the next blank.

0:25:36.040 --> 0:25:38.399
<v Speaker 4>Well, I think that DeVante Smith is going to be

0:25:38.480 --> 0:25:42.440
<v Speaker 4>an exception conversation here over the next week, because if

0:25:42.480 --> 0:25:44.679
<v Speaker 4>you look at the history of guys with that body

0:25:44.720 --> 0:25:48.040
<v Speaker 4>type and that weight, it's not good. And there are

0:25:48.080 --> 0:25:51.920
<v Speaker 4>mostly shorter guys. So he's even taller and leaner than

0:25:51.920 --> 0:25:53.480
<v Speaker 4>some of the other players who weigh less than one

0:25:53.560 --> 0:25:56.080
<v Speaker 4>hundred and seventy pounds. If he was drafted in a

0:25:56.119 --> 0:25:59.480
<v Speaker 4>top fifteen, for example, and succeeded, there are very few

0:25:59.520 --> 0:26:02.440
<v Speaker 4>players that size who've ever been drafted at that level,

0:26:02.600 --> 0:26:04.960
<v Speaker 4>and very fewer even still that have gone on to

0:26:05.000 --> 0:26:08.679
<v Speaker 4>be successful. There are so many it's always funny the

0:26:08.680 --> 0:26:11.320
<v Speaker 4>players that we get here mentioned over and over again,

0:26:11.760 --> 0:26:13.520
<v Speaker 4>but maybe he can be this and it's always that

0:26:13.560 --> 0:26:16.639
<v Speaker 4>exception guy Josh Allen to be the quarterbacks. DeShawn Jackson

0:26:16.720 --> 0:26:20.040
<v Speaker 4>is the undersized receiver. Every single time there's a five

0:26:20.080 --> 0:26:22.480
<v Speaker 4>to ten guy who weigh one hundred and sixty eight

0:26:22.520 --> 0:26:24.879
<v Speaker 4>pounds and runs a four to three eight, it's like, oh,

0:26:24.960 --> 0:26:27.240
<v Speaker 4>he can just be to Shawn Jackson's there's one to

0:26:27.320 --> 0:26:29.800
<v Speaker 4>Shawn Jackson, and I think there are a lot of

0:26:29.880 --> 0:26:32.439
<v Speaker 4>mistakes made if you're trying to chase that exception. But

0:26:32.480 --> 0:26:35.359
<v Speaker 4>I think he'll be an example and in just on

0:26:35.400 --> 0:26:38.399
<v Speaker 4>a broader level this year, this is the short armed

0:26:38.440 --> 0:26:42.640
<v Speaker 4>tackle group that it is a prevailing trait among all

0:26:42.680 --> 0:26:45.960
<v Speaker 4>of these guys because when we talk about Penney Seool,

0:26:46.160 --> 0:26:49.120
<v Speaker 4>I love Penney School. I think he has a rare

0:26:49.280 --> 0:26:53.120
<v Speaker 4>combination of frame and movement for somebody at that position,

0:26:53.600 --> 0:26:56.960
<v Speaker 4>but he's not a generational the word that gets thrown

0:26:56.960 --> 0:26:58.919
<v Speaker 4>all the way around all the time. He's not a

0:26:59.000 --> 0:27:02.880
<v Speaker 4>generational process because he doesn't check all of the typical boxes.

0:27:03.119 --> 0:27:06.679
<v Speaker 4>He has thirty three inch arms that's small for a tackle,

0:27:07.080 --> 0:27:09.560
<v Speaker 4>and a lot of guys in this class fall into

0:27:09.560 --> 0:27:13.199
<v Speaker 4>that category. Rashan Slater's arms are short. Brady Christensen has

0:27:13.240 --> 0:27:16.199
<v Speaker 4>really short arms. Liam Eichenberg has really short arms. So

0:27:16.480 --> 0:27:18.199
<v Speaker 4>what are you going to do with those guys? And

0:27:18.520 --> 0:27:21.639
<v Speaker 4>there are success stories of that position. Jake Matthews is

0:27:21.680 --> 0:27:23.879
<v Speaker 4>a thirty three and a half guy, Mitchell Schwartz is

0:27:23.880 --> 0:27:26.119
<v Speaker 4>a thirty three and a half guy. Lyle Collins is

0:27:26.160 --> 0:27:28.800
<v Speaker 4>actually shaped a lot like Penney suol Is. But again,

0:27:28.880 --> 0:27:31.879
<v Speaker 4>you're talking yourself into exceptions, and I think it happens

0:27:31.920 --> 0:27:34.040
<v Speaker 4>every year at a lot of positions, but this year

0:27:34.040 --> 0:27:36.119
<v Speaker 4>it's concentrated in a couple specific areas.

0:27:37.280 --> 0:27:38.760
<v Speaker 1>One of the other things that I know Dan and

0:27:38.760 --> 0:27:40.679
<v Speaker 1>I talked about, you mentioned Devonte Smith. I just want

0:27:40.720 --> 0:27:43.159
<v Speaker 1>to come back to that for a second. It seems like,

0:27:43.280 --> 0:27:46.800
<v Speaker 1>broadly speaking, at least from our vantage point, it's a

0:27:46.840 --> 0:27:50.160
<v Speaker 1>pretty loaded wide receiver class. Maybe that's a bit overshadowed

0:27:50.160 --> 0:27:52.000
<v Speaker 1>by the fact that so much talk, at least in

0:27:52.040 --> 0:27:54.760
<v Speaker 1>the top ten has been around quarterbacks and how are

0:27:54.760 --> 0:27:56.880
<v Speaker 1>we gonna have five quarterbacks taken in the top ten,

0:27:56.920 --> 0:27:59.600
<v Speaker 1>But at least from our vantage point and about yours, Robert,

0:28:00.119 --> 0:28:04.720
<v Speaker 1>it feels like a really, really truly loaded wide receiver cord.

0:28:05.000 --> 0:28:07.720
<v Speaker 4>It's interesting because last year was build the same way,

0:28:08.400 --> 0:28:12.640
<v Speaker 4>and I would say the number of guys is probably

0:28:12.680 --> 0:28:16.119
<v Speaker 4>similar last year in this year, but they're shaped much different.

0:28:16.160 --> 0:28:16.520
<v Speaker 3>This year.

0:28:16.960 --> 0:28:18.840
<v Speaker 4>You have a lot of guys who are in that

0:28:19.080 --> 0:28:23.400
<v Speaker 4>five eight to five eleven range. And I'll keep going

0:28:23.440 --> 0:28:25.320
<v Speaker 4>back to arm length. That sound like a weird.

0:28:25.080 --> 0:28:25.960
<v Speaker 3>Scout, No good.

0:28:26.000 --> 0:28:28.159
<v Speaker 4>My buddy Nat Tice, who does the show with me,

0:28:28.680 --> 0:28:30.879
<v Speaker 4>tweeted something I can't remember the exact details of it,

0:28:30.920 --> 0:28:35.280
<v Speaker 4>but wide receivers with less than short arms shorter than

0:28:35.320 --> 0:28:37.960
<v Speaker 4>thirty two inches. There's only been like twenty five of

0:28:38.000 --> 0:28:40.080
<v Speaker 4>them or something in the past decade. I think half

0:28:40.160 --> 0:28:42.120
<v Speaker 4>of them are coming out this year. So just I

0:28:42.160 --> 0:28:45.000
<v Speaker 4>think the shape of playmakers is changing and you're seeing

0:28:45.080 --> 0:28:48.320
<v Speaker 4>that manifest in this class. So last year you could

0:28:48.320 --> 0:28:52.360
<v Speaker 4>get a Justin Jefferson or a true prototypical outside sort

0:28:52.400 --> 0:28:54.680
<v Speaker 4>of receiver at twenty five and that guy could be

0:28:54.720 --> 0:28:56.880
<v Speaker 4>an All Pro. This year, there are a lot of

0:28:56.920 --> 0:29:00.000
<v Speaker 4>guys that are they slot guys. Is Elijah Moore Kenny?

0:29:00.120 --> 0:29:03.480
<v Speaker 4>Can he play outside? What is Rondeo Moore? The idea

0:29:03.520 --> 0:29:07.880
<v Speaker 4>that Kadarius Tony is billed as a bigger guy compared

0:29:07.920 --> 0:29:09.560
<v Speaker 4>to some of the other people in this class, I

0:29:09.560 --> 0:29:12.240
<v Speaker 4>think says a lot, so I think it beyond the

0:29:12.320 --> 0:29:14.880
<v Speaker 4>depth of it this year. I think it speaks to

0:29:15.320 --> 0:29:19.000
<v Speaker 4>how many different types of players are being put in

0:29:19.040 --> 0:29:22.600
<v Speaker 4>positions to succeed at receiver now compared to would have

0:29:22.640 --> 0:29:25.200
<v Speaker 4>been ten years ago. And you can understand why that's happening.

0:29:25.880 --> 0:29:29.120
<v Speaker 4>The idea of space as currency in football has changed

0:29:29.120 --> 0:29:29.480
<v Speaker 4>a lot.

0:29:29.520 --> 0:29:30.160
<v Speaker 3>I think in.

0:29:30.160 --> 0:29:32.840
<v Speaker 4>College it had been that way for a while, but

0:29:32.880 --> 0:29:34.640
<v Speaker 4>I think in the NFL we're kind of coming to

0:29:34.680 --> 0:29:37.400
<v Speaker 4>that place where we have a lot more three or

0:29:37.440 --> 0:29:40.040
<v Speaker 4>four wide sets. You have a guy that's playing in

0:29:40.080 --> 0:29:43.520
<v Speaker 4>the slot consistently. I mean eleven personnel and three receiver

0:29:43.600 --> 0:29:47.240
<v Speaker 4>sets in the NFL only became the prevailing personnel group

0:29:47.240 --> 0:29:49.760
<v Speaker 4>in the league less than a decade ago, so the

0:29:50.000 --> 0:29:53.360
<v Speaker 4>types of players and body types haven't necessarily caught up

0:29:53.400 --> 0:29:55.800
<v Speaker 4>to the way the sport currently looks, and I think

0:29:55.800 --> 0:29:57.840
<v Speaker 4>that we're seeing a lot of that with the types

0:29:57.880 --> 0:29:59.640
<v Speaker 4>of receivers that are available in this group.

0:30:00.080 --> 0:30:02.440
<v Speaker 2>I'm glad you mentioned personnel groupings because if you look

0:30:02.480 --> 0:30:04.240
<v Speaker 2>across the sport, and this is the stuff that actually

0:30:04.240 --> 0:30:06.160
<v Speaker 2>really interests me about the NFL when I do have

0:30:06.240 --> 0:30:09.840
<v Speaker 2>time to watch, which isn't often is certain coaches, especially

0:30:09.920 --> 0:30:12.040
<v Speaker 2>younger guys, are able to do so much out of

0:30:12.320 --> 0:30:15.640
<v Speaker 2>single personnel groups. Right, it's the forty nine ers playing

0:30:15.680 --> 0:30:19.000
<v Speaker 2>what twenty one personnel and using an athletic fullback, Or

0:30:19.040 --> 0:30:22.120
<v Speaker 2>it's the Packers and the Rams using twelve personnel and

0:30:22.240 --> 0:30:25.520
<v Speaker 2>utilizing tight ends, or the Saints not even using I

0:30:25.520 --> 0:30:27.400
<v Speaker 2>believe it's the Saints not even using a tight end

0:30:27.400 --> 0:30:31.320
<v Speaker 2>a lot. What is it about these younger minds at

0:30:31.360 --> 0:30:35.680
<v Speaker 2>coach and coordinator that will sort of affect where where

0:30:35.720 --> 0:30:38.360
<v Speaker 2>we value certain guys. Be it the shorter receivers, be

0:30:38.440 --> 0:30:41.280
<v Speaker 2>it Hbax, be it Kadarius Tony who can move all

0:30:41.280 --> 0:30:44.480
<v Speaker 2>over the place. How is value changing?

0:30:45.560 --> 0:30:49.120
<v Speaker 4>It's interesting because I think with McVeigh and the Rams

0:30:49.520 --> 0:30:53.160
<v Speaker 4>it gets the opposite. They were eleven personnel right ninety

0:30:53.200 --> 0:30:56.160
<v Speaker 4>seven percent of the time in his first year because

0:30:56.160 --> 0:30:59.400
<v Speaker 4>it's what worked, and I think that is to me,

0:30:59.480 --> 0:31:01.400
<v Speaker 4>the more interesting part of all of this is that

0:31:01.960 --> 0:31:06.880
<v Speaker 4>fewer coaches are fighting what's working. They're more open minded

0:31:06.920 --> 0:31:08.719
<v Speaker 4>about how to approach this kind of stuff. I think

0:31:08.760 --> 0:31:11.400
<v Speaker 4>the Titans are a really good example. So the Titans

0:31:11.480 --> 0:31:15.920
<v Speaker 4>under MATTL. Fleuor were a Shanahan Kubiak tinged offense a

0:31:15.960 --> 0:31:19.280
<v Speaker 4>lot of outside zone play action. As they got deeper

0:31:19.320 --> 0:31:21.400
<v Speaker 4>into their time with Arthur Smith, who took over for

0:31:21.440 --> 0:31:24.600
<v Speaker 4>Matt with Fluor, they started using more gap running schemes,

0:31:24.680 --> 0:31:27.640
<v Speaker 4>more of a vertical power play action game, and less

0:31:27.680 --> 0:31:30.320
<v Speaker 4>of the boot game. So I think there are just

0:31:30.640 --> 0:31:33.920
<v Speaker 4>coaches all around the league who are saying, what's working.

0:31:34.000 --> 0:31:38.360
<v Speaker 4>How do I filter these ideas through my players and

0:31:38.400 --> 0:31:42.280
<v Speaker 4>not fight uphill against the things that are efficient, And

0:31:42.680 --> 0:31:45.520
<v Speaker 4>one way to do that, I think is creating complexity

0:31:45.600 --> 0:31:48.760
<v Speaker 4>via personnel groups. I think if you're lining up in

0:31:48.840 --> 0:31:52.320
<v Speaker 4>eleven personnel seventy five percent of the time and that's

0:31:52.320 --> 0:31:55.400
<v Speaker 4>how you're living, you're probably doing yourself a disservice. You

0:31:55.440 --> 0:31:58.680
<v Speaker 4>probably don't have as deep, at as varied a group

0:31:58.680 --> 0:32:02.000
<v Speaker 4>of pass catchers and skill position players as you probably want.

0:32:02.240 --> 0:32:04.600
<v Speaker 4>You know, talking about the Bengals and what they need

0:32:04.640 --> 0:32:08.080
<v Speaker 4>to do them going with Jamar Chase at five I

0:32:08.080 --> 0:32:10.160
<v Speaker 4>think makes a lot of sense because they I think

0:32:10.280 --> 0:32:12.440
<v Speaker 4>led the league in eleven personnel last year. They have

0:32:12.560 --> 0:32:14.640
<v Speaker 4>through receivers on the field. At the same time, I

0:32:14.720 --> 0:32:17.760
<v Speaker 4>wouldn't want to live that way In an ideal world,

0:32:17.800 --> 0:32:20.040
<v Speaker 4>I would want to have more options than that, and

0:32:20.080 --> 0:32:23.320
<v Speaker 4>a way to create complexity, even if it's not really

0:32:23.360 --> 0:32:24.480
<v Speaker 4>that much more complex.

0:32:25.640 --> 0:32:29.080
<v Speaker 2>Something you mentioned in going through some smaller receivers is

0:32:29.120 --> 0:32:32.360
<v Speaker 2>what is Rondale Moore. It's a fantastic question, and it's

0:32:32.400 --> 0:32:34.800
<v Speaker 2>a question that sort of pops up more and more.

0:32:34.840 --> 0:32:36.800
<v Speaker 2>This year we have Kyle Pitts, right who is a

0:32:36.840 --> 0:32:38.760
<v Speaker 2>tight end who can play like receiver and he's not

0:32:38.800 --> 0:32:41.120
<v Speaker 2>a tweeter because some lucky team is going to figure

0:32:41.120 --> 0:32:42.959
<v Speaker 2>out how to weaponize Kyle Pitts. Last year we had

0:32:43.000 --> 0:32:45.760
<v Speaker 2>Isaiah Simmons. What is Isaiah Simmons? You know, he's a safety,

0:32:45.800 --> 0:32:47.640
<v Speaker 2>He's a linebacker. He can line up, you know, and

0:32:47.720 --> 0:32:50.680
<v Speaker 2>rush the quarterback if need be. Are more and more

0:32:50.920 --> 0:32:54.120
<v Speaker 2>coaches and coordinators on either side of the ball getting

0:32:54.120 --> 0:32:56.600
<v Speaker 2>better at figuring out what a player is instead of

0:32:56.600 --> 0:32:57.720
<v Speaker 2>what a player isn't.

0:32:58.080 --> 0:33:01.800
<v Speaker 4>Yes, I think, I think absolutely they are. Ty brought

0:33:01.840 --> 0:33:04.120
<v Speaker 4>up to DK Metcalf. I think it's a perfect example.

0:33:04.800 --> 0:33:08.120
<v Speaker 4>One of the questions about DK Metcalf coming in was, well.

0:33:08.000 --> 0:33:09.880
<v Speaker 3>What does he get? What can he do? We haven't

0:33:09.920 --> 0:33:11.120
<v Speaker 3>seen him do many things.

0:33:11.160 --> 0:33:12.760
<v Speaker 4>He lined up on the left side of the formation

0:33:12.960 --> 0:33:15.360
<v Speaker 4>at ole Miss and ran very fast in a straight

0:33:15.400 --> 0:33:18.720
<v Speaker 4>line all the time. That's what he did. And instead

0:33:18.720 --> 0:33:21.480
<v Speaker 4>of saying, well, what else can he do, the Seahawks

0:33:21.520 --> 0:33:23.400
<v Speaker 4>picked him and said let's just have him do that

0:33:23.520 --> 0:33:26.400
<v Speaker 4>for a while. And it worked. And that's what you

0:33:26.440 --> 0:33:29.479
<v Speaker 4>saw him do. I mean as a freshman, as a rookie.

0:33:29.840 --> 0:33:31.920
<v Speaker 4>He lined up in one spot and he ran go

0:33:32.080 --> 0:33:35.600
<v Speaker 4>routes and slants. That's it, and it worked because that's

0:33:35.640 --> 0:33:38.840
<v Speaker 4>what he's comfortable doing. His teammate from ole Miss, AJ Brown,

0:33:38.920 --> 0:33:42.160
<v Speaker 4>I think, is another great example. AJ Brown is fantastic

0:33:42.200 --> 0:33:44.040
<v Speaker 4>with the ball in his hands. He is a monster.

0:33:44.160 --> 0:33:46.959
<v Speaker 4>He is so big, he's so strong, such a smooth

0:33:46.960 --> 0:33:50.680
<v Speaker 4>mover that Titans said, okay, this is what you do. Well,

0:33:51.000 --> 0:33:55.200
<v Speaker 4>we're gonna build in yack opportunity after yack opportunity into

0:33:55.200 --> 0:33:58.440
<v Speaker 4>the structure of the offense until you get your footing

0:33:58.640 --> 0:34:01.520
<v Speaker 4>and you get a comfort level with some other aspects

0:34:01.520 --> 0:34:03.320
<v Speaker 4>of what we want to do. And I think that's

0:34:03.360 --> 0:34:06.560
<v Speaker 4>happening more and more often. And a guy like Rondeo Moore,

0:34:07.240 --> 0:34:09.799
<v Speaker 4>there's a version of him that fits in the NFL. Now,

0:34:09.840 --> 0:34:12.919
<v Speaker 4>if you go look at what the Rams have done,

0:34:12.920 --> 0:34:14.759
<v Speaker 4>for example, with all of the jet motion that they

0:34:14.880 --> 0:34:17.160
<v Speaker 4>use and the eye candy that they use. The Chiefs

0:34:17.160 --> 0:34:19.560
<v Speaker 4>are another good example of that. The one I'm picturing

0:34:19.760 --> 0:34:23.560
<v Speaker 4>is green Bay. Green Bay runs a similar The bones

0:34:23.600 --> 0:34:25.640
<v Speaker 4>of their offense are similar to what the Rams want

0:34:25.680 --> 0:34:27.799
<v Speaker 4>to do. They come from the same tree, but they

0:34:27.800 --> 0:34:31.160
<v Speaker 4>don't have that eye candy deception element to what they

0:34:31.200 --> 0:34:34.279
<v Speaker 4>are because they don't have that small space receiver. They

0:34:34.280 --> 0:34:36.960
<v Speaker 4>had to use Tyler Irvin in that role, who's a

0:34:37.080 --> 0:34:39.600
<v Speaker 4>hybrid returner. They had to use Aaron Jones in that

0:34:39.680 --> 0:34:41.600
<v Speaker 4>role even though he's a running back. A guy like

0:34:41.680 --> 0:34:45.960
<v Speaker 4>Rondel Moore fits perfectly into that idea, And that archetype

0:34:45.960 --> 0:34:48.600
<v Speaker 4>of player didn't exist in the NFL ten years ago.

0:34:48.880 --> 0:34:51.120
<v Speaker 4>Even if you had a slot guy, it was a

0:34:51.160 --> 0:34:53.960
<v Speaker 4>Wes Welker type. There wasn't as much motion. You didn't

0:34:54.120 --> 0:34:57.360
<v Speaker 4>need as much explosiveness from that type of player. And

0:34:57.400 --> 0:34:59.560
<v Speaker 4>I think that now a guy like that is more

0:34:59.640 --> 0:35:01.520
<v Speaker 4>valuable in the league than he ever would have been before.

0:35:01.600 --> 0:35:05.080
<v Speaker 2>So basically, if you could reboot Taevon Austin to twenty

0:35:05.120 --> 0:35:08.800
<v Speaker 2>twenty one, there's a better chance that he could find

0:35:08.880 --> 0:35:09.960
<v Speaker 2>a niche in the league.

0:35:11.040 --> 0:35:14.040
<v Speaker 4>Yes, but I also think that I don't know if

0:35:14.040 --> 0:35:16.200
<v Speaker 4>it would have been a bigger niche than he had before.

0:35:16.320 --> 0:35:19.319
<v Speaker 4>I think the problem with tavan Austin is not his usefulness.

0:35:19.360 --> 0:35:22.200
<v Speaker 4>I think it's where he was drafted. If Tavon Austin

0:35:22.280 --> 0:35:24.880
<v Speaker 4>was a fourth round pick, we wouldn't look at Tavon

0:35:24.920 --> 0:35:27.919
<v Speaker 4>Austin's career and say that's a disappointment. And I think

0:35:27.960 --> 0:35:31.359
<v Speaker 4>that's an aspect of drafting and value that comes up

0:35:31.400 --> 0:35:34.400
<v Speaker 4>over and over again. For me, I would never take

0:35:34.480 --> 0:35:38.000
<v Speaker 4>the small, fast guy high. I just wouldn't do it

0:35:38.040 --> 0:35:42.480
<v Speaker 4>because you can find that guy elsewhere. Speed is available.

0:35:42.719 --> 0:35:45.480
<v Speaker 4>Can Jalen Giten is a perfect example to me. Jalen Geiiten,

0:35:46.040 --> 0:35:49.400
<v Speaker 4>I think was available after cutdown Day and signed with

0:35:49.440 --> 0:35:52.040
<v Speaker 4>the Chargers last year, and he runs a four to three.

0:35:52.080 --> 0:35:54.719
<v Speaker 4>He gives you a vertical aspect to your offense. You

0:35:54.719 --> 0:35:58.360
<v Speaker 4>don't need to draft him eleventh overall like the Raiders

0:35:58.360 --> 0:36:01.600
<v Speaker 4>did with Henry Ruggs. That's not necess I feel like

0:36:01.640 --> 0:36:03.560
<v Speaker 4>teams are looking at what it's happening with Tyreek Hill

0:36:03.600 --> 0:36:06.560
<v Speaker 4>and said, speed is what we're missing. Tyreek Hill isn't

0:36:06.560 --> 0:36:09.800
<v Speaker 4>good because he's fast. Tyreek Hill is good because he's

0:36:09.920 --> 0:36:12.439
<v Speaker 4>fast and he is able to weaponize that speed because

0:36:12.440 --> 0:36:15.760
<v Speaker 4>he doesn't have to slow down because he's incredibly strong. Again,

0:36:15.840 --> 0:36:18.080
<v Speaker 4>he's one of those guys that I think leads to

0:36:19.080 --> 0:36:22.160
<v Speaker 4>evaluation mistakes among other teams because they're looking for the

0:36:22.200 --> 0:36:22.880
<v Speaker 4>wrong things.

0:36:23.760 --> 0:36:26.000
<v Speaker 1>So we haven't mentioned his name yet. Trevor Lawrence. Trevor

0:36:26.080 --> 0:36:28.799
<v Speaker 1>Lawrence comes into the league presumably first overall pick. He's

0:36:28.800 --> 0:36:30.960
<v Speaker 1>going to go to the Jacksonville Jaguars. He's going to

0:36:31.040 --> 0:36:34.160
<v Speaker 1>have a new coach, a former college coach in Urban Meyer.

0:36:34.880 --> 0:36:37.520
<v Speaker 1>What does that situation look like for a guy like

0:36:37.520 --> 0:36:39.759
<v Speaker 1>a Trevor Lawrence, who many on the college side have

0:36:39.840 --> 0:36:42.480
<v Speaker 1>viewed for a long time, even before he was playing

0:36:42.480 --> 0:36:45.760
<v Speaker 1>for Clemson as a generational type talent. Can he succeed

0:36:45.800 --> 0:36:46.880
<v Speaker 1>at the next level quickly?

0:36:47.239 --> 0:36:47.640
<v Speaker 3>I think so.

0:36:48.320 --> 0:36:50.120
<v Speaker 4>I do believe that he can, because if you look

0:36:50.160 --> 0:36:52.319
<v Speaker 4>at what the Jaguars have done, I actually think it's

0:36:52.320 --> 0:36:55.040
<v Speaker 4>a really fascinating way to do a teardown. I am

0:36:55.080 --> 0:36:58.440
<v Speaker 4>a fan of pressing the reset button hard. I think

0:36:58.480 --> 0:37:01.280
<v Speaker 4>that it's a way to get it out of these

0:37:01.719 --> 0:37:05.239
<v Speaker 4>really murky middle ground situations. The team find teams find

0:37:05.239 --> 0:37:08.440
<v Speaker 4>themselves in what the Dolphins did at what the right

0:37:08.480 --> 0:37:11.040
<v Speaker 4>after the Browns did it, I think is exactly how

0:37:11.080 --> 0:37:12.680
<v Speaker 4>you should approach that sort of thing. It's why I

0:37:12.719 --> 0:37:15.360
<v Speaker 4>get frustrated with the Bears and them trying to tinker

0:37:15.719 --> 0:37:18.440
<v Speaker 4>with this model that clearly isn't working. The Jags have

0:37:18.480 --> 0:37:21.520
<v Speaker 4>done that. They hit the reset button in pretty much

0:37:21.520 --> 0:37:24.800
<v Speaker 4>every conceivable way. They traded Khalais Campbell, they traded Yanni Knakway,

0:37:24.800 --> 0:37:27.400
<v Speaker 4>they traded Jay and Ramsey. That one we can discuss,

0:37:27.480 --> 0:37:32.040
<v Speaker 4>but they I think that by purging the roster of

0:37:32.200 --> 0:37:35.399
<v Speaker 4>expensive talent starting over, you've given yourself a blank slate.

0:37:35.480 --> 0:37:38.680
<v Speaker 4>The one area where they did not do that, where

0:37:38.680 --> 0:37:41.560
<v Speaker 4>they did not purge the roster of second contract and

0:37:41.640 --> 0:37:45.120
<v Speaker 4>third contract veterans was the offensive line. They brought back

0:37:45.160 --> 0:37:47.400
<v Speaker 4>Cam Robinson on the franchise tag to play left tackle

0:37:47.400 --> 0:37:49.920
<v Speaker 4>for them this year. Jawan Taylor s so their right tackle,

0:37:50.239 --> 0:37:54.360
<v Speaker 4>so off aj Can, Brandon Linder, Andrew Norwell I believe

0:37:54.440 --> 0:37:57.920
<v Speaker 4>is still there. Rattling off starting offensive lines by hard

0:37:57.960 --> 0:38:01.920
<v Speaker 4>is something at the copy. But they have five starting

0:38:01.960 --> 0:38:03.920
<v Speaker 4>caliber line and they brought back to their left tackle

0:38:03.920 --> 0:38:06.680
<v Speaker 4>in the tag, and I think at first glance, you

0:38:06.760 --> 0:38:08.640
<v Speaker 4>look at that and you'd say, why is a team

0:38:08.760 --> 0:38:13.080
<v Speaker 4>drafting first overall, using the franchise tag on someone. That's

0:38:13.080 --> 0:38:15.320
<v Speaker 4>something you do to keep your roster together when you

0:38:15.320 --> 0:38:19.000
<v Speaker 4>think you're close. But the idea of saying our offensive

0:38:19.000 --> 0:38:21.480
<v Speaker 4>line is going to be intact when we get this

0:38:21.600 --> 0:38:24.120
<v Speaker 4>once every ten year sort of guy in here because

0:38:24.160 --> 0:38:27.080
<v Speaker 4>we can't ruin him. I actually like that as a

0:38:27.080 --> 0:38:29.680
<v Speaker 4>way to allocate your resources. So if the line is

0:38:29.760 --> 0:38:33.920
<v Speaker 4>and I think sometimes it's overstated how bad these situations are,

0:38:34.280 --> 0:38:36.080
<v Speaker 4>but it's not as if we have to dig back

0:38:36.080 --> 0:38:39.279
<v Speaker 4>into deep history to find a number one overall pick

0:38:39.320 --> 0:38:43.040
<v Speaker 4>with a bad offensive line. It happened last year. That's

0:38:43.560 --> 0:38:47.040
<v Speaker 4>very recent. And I think that Lawrence's situation with the protection,

0:38:47.120 --> 0:38:49.480
<v Speaker 4>which is where I'd start in any of these conversations,

0:38:49.880 --> 0:38:51.920
<v Speaker 4>is better than it was with Joe Burrow last year.

0:38:52.440 --> 0:38:57.080
<v Speaker 4>The weapons is an interesting conversation because they have Leviska Chanalt,

0:38:57.280 --> 0:38:59.840
<v Speaker 4>who they drafted last year I believe in the second round.

0:39:00.440 --> 0:39:03.000
<v Speaker 4>Interesting talent. I mean, obviously he had was one of

0:39:03.000 --> 0:39:06.040
<v Speaker 4>those super charged yack guys coming into the NFL. I'll

0:39:06.040 --> 0:39:08.520
<v Speaker 4>be curious to see what he looks like in this offense.

0:39:08.520 --> 0:39:11.560
<v Speaker 4>But he's young. They have Marvin Jones they brought in

0:39:11.600 --> 0:39:13.960
<v Speaker 4>as a one year free agent rental. I think he's

0:39:14.000 --> 0:39:16.680
<v Speaker 4>the perfect sort of guy you have as an outside option.

0:39:16.960 --> 0:39:18.520
<v Speaker 4>And then DJ Shark is in the last year of

0:39:18.560 --> 0:39:21.719
<v Speaker 4>his contract. They have another first round pick and an

0:39:21.719 --> 0:39:24.719
<v Speaker 4>extra second round pick because Chark is going to the

0:39:24.800 --> 0:39:26.840
<v Speaker 4>last year of his deal. He wasn't picked by this regime.

0:39:27.000 --> 0:39:29.480
<v Speaker 4>He could absolutely see them trying to draft a pass

0:39:29.520 --> 0:39:31.880
<v Speaker 4>catcher high up in this draft to add a little

0:39:31.960 --> 0:39:34.920
<v Speaker 4>juice to that group. If they go get an Elijah

0:39:35.000 --> 0:39:38.960
<v Speaker 4>Moore or somebody like that, that's a I like that.

0:39:38.960 --> 0:39:40.960
<v Speaker 4>That is a group you can work with. In the

0:39:41.000 --> 0:39:44.680
<v Speaker 4>personnel side. On the coaching staff side, Daryl Bevell is

0:39:44.719 --> 0:39:49.440
<v Speaker 4>their offensive coordinator. Daryl Bevell is as NFL establishment as

0:39:49.480 --> 0:39:52.480
<v Speaker 4>you can possibly get. Everyone's team has had. Daryl Bevell

0:39:52.560 --> 0:39:56.399
<v Speaker 4>is their office at that point, and he's not an

0:39:56.400 --> 0:39:59.279
<v Speaker 4>exciting name, but if you look at the results, it's

0:39:59.280 --> 0:40:01.600
<v Speaker 4>been pretty solid. You know, they were too run heavy

0:40:01.640 --> 0:40:03.359
<v Speaker 4>in Seattle. How much of that was him and how

0:40:03.400 --> 0:40:05.120
<v Speaker 4>much of that was Pete Carroll at the end, It's

0:40:05.120 --> 0:40:07.960
<v Speaker 4>hard to say, but they were I believe seventh in

0:40:08.040 --> 0:40:11.560
<v Speaker 4>EPA per drop back over the from twenty twelve through

0:40:11.560 --> 0:40:15.520
<v Speaker 4>twenty seventeen when he was there with Russell Wilson. That

0:40:15.680 --> 0:40:18.480
<v Speaker 4>is encouraging to me. He was very good with Matthew

0:40:18.480 --> 0:40:20.600
<v Speaker 4>Stafford in twenty nineteen for the first half of the season,

0:40:20.640 --> 0:40:24.000
<v Speaker 4>that play action, aggressive down the field approach, which I

0:40:24.000 --> 0:40:25.920
<v Speaker 4>think will work out well with Trevor Lawrence. And the

0:40:25.960 --> 0:40:28.719
<v Speaker 4>other thing that not a lot of people have talked

0:40:28.719 --> 0:40:32.440
<v Speaker 4>about but I find interesting, is that he was double

0:40:32.560 --> 0:40:35.160
<v Speaker 4>was with Russell Wilson at the beginning in Seattle when

0:40:35.239 --> 0:40:37.719
<v Speaker 4>Russell Wilson was kind of the cog in this machine

0:40:38.040 --> 0:40:40.080
<v Speaker 4>that had a great defense in a great running game.

0:40:40.440 --> 0:40:42.440
<v Speaker 4>And I don't think Trevor Lawrence should ever be that.

0:40:42.920 --> 0:40:46.520
<v Speaker 4>But I do like having an offensive coordinator that understands

0:40:46.560 --> 0:40:49.960
<v Speaker 4>how to insulate his quarterback if necessary, how to take

0:40:50.000 --> 0:40:52.640
<v Speaker 4>something off of Lawrence's plate, if they get to a

0:40:52.640 --> 0:40:55.719
<v Speaker 4>place where he's getting hit way too much, something like that,

0:40:55.760 --> 0:40:57.640
<v Speaker 4>like we need to drop back a little bit less.

0:40:57.960 --> 0:40:59.799
<v Speaker 4>So I just think the pieces are in place. And

0:40:59.800 --> 0:41:03.239
<v Speaker 4>that's before we even mention what influence Urban Meyer is

0:41:03.280 --> 0:41:06.480
<v Speaker 4>going to have. What does this look like, So all

0:41:06.520 --> 0:41:09.680
<v Speaker 4>of the factors combined, I'll say this, The offensive line

0:41:09.719 --> 0:41:13.440
<v Speaker 4>is not great, the weapons aren't great. We have not

0:41:13.560 --> 0:41:16.719
<v Speaker 4>total certainty about what the schematic circumstances are going to

0:41:16.800 --> 0:41:20.359
<v Speaker 4>look like. But we have seen recent examples where it's

0:41:20.360 --> 0:41:24.840
<v Speaker 4>been much much worse with much lesser quarterbacks than Trevor Lawrence.

0:41:25.200 --> 0:41:28.759
<v Speaker 1>You bring up Urban in college obviously a god. How

0:41:28.800 --> 0:41:30.240
<v Speaker 1>do NFL people feel about a Ramayer?

0:41:31.760 --> 0:41:35.560
<v Speaker 4>I think it's curiosity more than anything else. You know, what,

0:41:36.520 --> 0:41:39.040
<v Speaker 4>how do you build a program at this level? What

0:41:39.080 --> 0:41:41.200
<v Speaker 4>types of players do you look for? What does he

0:41:41.280 --> 0:41:43.920
<v Speaker 4>look like in building a roster when he can't have

0:41:44.040 --> 0:41:47.520
<v Speaker 4>anybody that he wants. You know, when somebody that you

0:41:47.600 --> 0:41:50.319
<v Speaker 4>pick in the third round has to start for you

0:41:50.360 --> 0:41:53.480
<v Speaker 4>because you have no defensive talent, how frustrating is it

0:41:53.480 --> 0:41:55.880
<v Speaker 4>going to be when that guy is talent efficient in

0:41:55.920 --> 0:41:59.200
<v Speaker 4>ways that you're not typically used to dealing with Schematically?

0:41:59.200 --> 0:42:01.359
<v Speaker 4>What does it look like? I mean, obviously Urban Meyer

0:42:01.480 --> 0:42:04.480
<v Speaker 4>ushered in an entire new era of what offensive football

0:42:04.520 --> 0:42:06.919
<v Speaker 4>looks like at the college level. What does it look

0:42:07.000 --> 0:42:09.680
<v Speaker 4>like in the NFL? How does he mesh with? Again,

0:42:09.800 --> 0:42:13.839
<v Speaker 4>somebody who is extremely traditional in Daryl Bevell and Brian

0:42:13.920 --> 0:42:17.000
<v Speaker 4>Schottenheimer is their passing game coordinator. It's hard to have

0:42:17.040 --> 0:42:19.759
<v Speaker 4>a more establishment last name in the NFL than that,

0:42:20.160 --> 0:42:21.719
<v Speaker 4>So what does it end up looking like?

0:42:22.239 --> 0:42:25.160
<v Speaker 3>That? To me is the overarching feeling here is I

0:42:25.280 --> 0:42:26.480
<v Speaker 3>want to see what it is.

0:42:26.560 --> 0:42:28.400
<v Speaker 4>I don't know how to feel about it yet, but

0:42:28.520 --> 0:42:30.120
<v Speaker 4>I know I want to watch what it looks like

0:42:30.160 --> 0:42:30.719
<v Speaker 4>from day one.

0:42:31.320 --> 0:42:34.279
<v Speaker 2>When gms and scouts or whoever is making decisions in

0:42:34.320 --> 0:42:38.080
<v Speaker 2>the front office look back to college, do they look

0:42:38.080 --> 0:42:39.920
<v Speaker 2>in the way I guess Bill Belichick has done. Like

0:42:39.960 --> 0:42:42.719
<v Speaker 2>Bill Belichick will listen to Nick Saban, perhaps more than

0:42:42.719 --> 0:42:46.040
<v Speaker 2>other college coaches, and I guess draft Rutgers players. That's

0:42:46.080 --> 0:42:49.200
<v Speaker 2>a thing that was there for a little bit. But

0:42:49.520 --> 0:42:51.880
<v Speaker 2>is there some sort of benefit of the doubt, especially

0:42:51.920 --> 0:42:55.080
<v Speaker 2>with coaches who used to coach a position group. Nick

0:42:55.120 --> 0:42:58.359
<v Speaker 2>Saban used to coach defensive backs. Kirk Farens as your

0:42:58.480 --> 0:43:02.640
<v Speaker 2>beloved Marshallyanda, We'll tell you he was an offensive line coach.

0:43:02.640 --> 0:43:04.719
<v Speaker 2>He was an offensive line coach in the NFL. Dabosweeney

0:43:04.760 --> 0:43:07.440
<v Speaker 2>coached receivers before he was the head coach at Clemson,

0:43:07.480 --> 0:43:10.680
<v Speaker 2>and Clemson receivers have done pretty well in the NFL.

0:43:11.000 --> 0:43:15.040
<v Speaker 2>Is that something that gms and scouts have in the

0:43:15.080 --> 0:43:19.200
<v Speaker 2>back of their mind as they're building their boards. Just

0:43:19.280 --> 0:43:23.640
<v Speaker 2>the background of the college head coaches positionally that Okay,

0:43:23.640 --> 0:43:26.000
<v Speaker 2>they can identify, they can develop this guy's going to

0:43:26.040 --> 0:43:28.840
<v Speaker 2>be ready for the NFL because this is their specific

0:43:28.880 --> 0:43:30.440
<v Speaker 2>head coach and that is his specialty.

0:43:30.800 --> 0:43:30.960
<v Speaker 3>Oh.

0:43:31.040 --> 0:43:33.799
<v Speaker 4>I don't know if the GMS are necessarily thinking that,

0:43:33.920 --> 0:43:36.880
<v Speaker 4>but I absolutely think if I were the owner and

0:43:37.000 --> 0:43:39.000
<v Speaker 4>I were looking for a slightly out of the box

0:43:39.080 --> 0:43:41.319
<v Speaker 4>hire and somebody who and I go back and forth

0:43:41.360 --> 0:43:44.640
<v Speaker 4>on this, I typically land when if I were hiring

0:43:44.640 --> 0:43:47.520
<v Speaker 4>a head coach, yeah, and I were building my qualifications,

0:43:48.560 --> 0:43:52.040
<v Speaker 4>I would start with a list of play calling offensive

0:43:52.040 --> 0:43:54.840
<v Speaker 4>head coaches. That's where I would start, because I just

0:43:54.840 --> 0:43:57.600
<v Speaker 4>think it's the easiest way to sustain success. You look

0:43:57.640 --> 0:43:59.960
<v Speaker 4>at what happened with the Falcons when Kyle Shanahan left

0:44:00.280 --> 0:44:03.040
<v Speaker 4>and how quickly they fell off. What's going to happen

0:44:03.120 --> 0:44:06.239
<v Speaker 4>now that Arthur Smith is no longer in Tennessee after

0:44:06.280 --> 0:44:09.480
<v Speaker 4>he had so much success. We don't ask those questions

0:44:09.480 --> 0:44:12.000
<v Speaker 4>about Andy Reid and Sean Payton or even the Patriots

0:44:12.040 --> 0:44:14.600
<v Speaker 4>with Josh McDaniels to a certain extent, they're there all

0:44:14.719 --> 0:44:15.080
<v Speaker 4>the time.

0:44:15.160 --> 0:44:17.160
<v Speaker 3>So that's where I would start. But if you weren't

0:44:17.200 --> 0:44:18.239
<v Speaker 3>one of those people.

0:44:18.040 --> 0:44:20.359
<v Speaker 4>If you were a little bit more open mind about

0:44:20.360 --> 0:44:22.640
<v Speaker 4>the types of coaches you'd want to run your program.

0:44:23.040 --> 0:44:25.440
<v Speaker 4>I think looking at a college coach and saying that

0:44:25.520 --> 0:44:28.920
<v Speaker 4>person has managed a roster, he's thought about where holes

0:44:28.960 --> 0:44:31.360
<v Speaker 4>can be, he's thought about how position groups fit together,

0:44:31.760 --> 0:44:33.960
<v Speaker 4>all of that stuff. I think there's value in that.

0:44:34.000 --> 0:44:36.520
<v Speaker 4>I think there's value in being able to look at

0:44:36.520 --> 0:44:39.839
<v Speaker 4>a coach who has big picture experience and how that

0:44:39.880 --> 0:44:43.919
<v Speaker 4>can translate to having personnel control in the NFL, which

0:44:43.960 --> 0:44:46.520
<v Speaker 4>he most likely does. I don't know what the actual

0:44:46.560 --> 0:44:49.000
<v Speaker 4>details of it are, but he's in charge there, and

0:44:49.040 --> 0:44:51.360
<v Speaker 4>I think that you can absolutely talk yourself into his

0:44:51.480 --> 0:44:54.719
<v Speaker 4>experience building rosters at Ohio State informing what he'd be

0:44:54.760 --> 0:44:55.840
<v Speaker 4>able to do in Jacksonville.

0:44:56.440 --> 0:45:00.440
<v Speaker 2>Are there systems on either side of the ball that

0:45:00.440 --> 0:45:04.160
<v Speaker 2>that scare gms that's just like, Okay, this team ran

0:45:04.239 --> 0:45:06.000
<v Speaker 2>this three four, but I don't like what they did

0:45:06.000 --> 0:45:08.640
<v Speaker 2>with gaps. I don't like the coverage is that they played.

0:45:08.680 --> 0:45:11.560
<v Speaker 2>Are there specific systems in the way that like, obviously,

0:45:11.600 --> 0:45:14.920
<v Speaker 2>the spread was something that NFL teams were wary of

0:45:15.000 --> 0:45:17.840
<v Speaker 2>early on. Whatever spread means it's now obviously means like

0:45:17.880 --> 0:45:20.600
<v Speaker 2>thirty different things. But other systems to this day where

0:45:20.600 --> 0:45:22.879
<v Speaker 2>you're just like, I don't trust that these guys aren't

0:45:22.920 --> 0:45:25.000
<v Speaker 2>taught to do this on either side of the ball.

0:45:25.520 --> 0:45:30.200
<v Speaker 4>I feel like there's not as much hesitancy or there's

0:45:30.239 --> 0:45:33.160
<v Speaker 4>not as much reticence among coaches now as there was

0:45:33.200 --> 0:45:37.400
<v Speaker 4>five to ten years ago, because the same problems still exists.

0:45:37.640 --> 0:45:40.680
<v Speaker 4>You know, the spread offense hasn't gone away. There's the

0:45:40.760 --> 0:45:43.080
<v Speaker 4>RPOs and the way that the screen game works. When

0:45:43.120 --> 0:45:45.560
<v Speaker 4>you watch Trevor Lawrence, mean, it's a Mickey Mouse offense

0:45:45.640 --> 0:45:47.600
<v Speaker 4>compared to what he would run in the NFL.

0:45:47.920 --> 0:45:49.440
<v Speaker 3>I mean, it's.

0:45:48.800 --> 0:45:51.600
<v Speaker 4>Incredibly efficient, but a lot of it is baked into

0:45:51.600 --> 0:45:53.400
<v Speaker 4>the structure in terms of what he's doing.

0:45:53.920 --> 0:45:56.320
<v Speaker 3>And I don't think that is as.

0:45:56.239 --> 0:45:58.280
<v Speaker 4>Much of a concern as it used to be because

0:45:58.320 --> 0:46:01.040
<v Speaker 4>those two things are converging. There's more RPOs in the

0:46:01.160 --> 0:46:03.600
<v Speaker 4>NFL than there was five to ten years ago. I

0:46:03.600 --> 0:46:07.319
<v Speaker 4>think NFL teams are willing to steal from college wholesale

0:46:07.680 --> 0:46:10.080
<v Speaker 4>in a way they weren't ten years ago, So that

0:46:10.239 --> 0:46:12.920
<v Speaker 4>concerned to me, is a little less important. Same goes

0:46:12.960 --> 0:46:16.120
<v Speaker 4>for wide receivers. I remember Kys Shanahan talking about this

0:46:16.160 --> 0:46:18.200
<v Speaker 4>a couple of years ago in regard to Deebo Samuel

0:46:18.560 --> 0:46:20.560
<v Speaker 4>where he was saying that you don't see as many

0:46:20.600 --> 0:46:23.920
<v Speaker 4>receivers run traditional routes in college for a few different reasons.

0:46:24.040 --> 0:46:25.839
<v Speaker 4>It's not the structure of the offense. They're not playing

0:46:25.880 --> 0:46:27.719
<v Speaker 4>against a lot of pressman coverage, if they're not playing

0:46:27.719 --> 0:46:30.440
<v Speaker 4>in the SEC, all that other stuff. But instead of

0:46:30.480 --> 0:46:33.880
<v Speaker 4>saying this is a problem because I can't evaluate that person,

0:46:34.239 --> 0:46:37.080
<v Speaker 4>he's saying I'm gonna do what works for him. I'm

0:46:37.080 --> 0:46:38.640
<v Speaker 4>gonna get the ball in his hands. I'm gonna let

0:46:38.640 --> 0:46:40.600
<v Speaker 4>them play in space. So that's kind of what I

0:46:40.640 --> 0:46:43.320
<v Speaker 4>was saying before about offensive coaches evolving in the league.

0:46:43.400 --> 0:46:46.759
<v Speaker 4>I think there are fewer excuses and fewer instances of

0:46:47.040 --> 0:46:49.160
<v Speaker 4>Bill Walsh did it this way, so that's how we're

0:46:49.160 --> 0:46:51.320
<v Speaker 4>going to do it. I think those walls have fallen

0:46:51.360 --> 0:46:54.959
<v Speaker 4>down a little bit defensively, I think it's a little

0:46:54.960 --> 0:46:58.200
<v Speaker 4>bit more complicated. I think that's where some bigger gaps

0:46:58.200 --> 0:47:02.000
<v Speaker 4>are starting to exist, especially when you're not dealing with

0:47:02.040 --> 0:47:04.959
<v Speaker 4>some of the teams that have high quality quarterback cornerback talent.

0:47:05.239 --> 0:47:06.800
<v Speaker 3>If you look at what Ohio State.

0:47:06.600 --> 0:47:08.800
<v Speaker 4>Had been doing when Okuda was there and some of

0:47:08.840 --> 0:47:11.040
<v Speaker 4>those other guys, what Alabama can do on a play

0:47:11.040 --> 0:47:14.200
<v Speaker 4>to play basis Georgia, there's a press man, they're doing

0:47:14.280 --> 0:47:16.239
<v Speaker 4>things and you're seeing them in man coverage. You can

0:47:16.280 --> 0:47:18.600
<v Speaker 4>project that into the NFL. If you're looking at some

0:47:18.600 --> 0:47:20.920
<v Speaker 4>of these teams in the Big Twelve or other places

0:47:20.920 --> 0:47:23.759
<v Speaker 4>where it's quarters every play and that's all you see

0:47:23.760 --> 0:47:27.520
<v Speaker 4>them do, it's really hard to project defensive backs out

0:47:27.560 --> 0:47:30.799
<v Speaker 4>of that system in terms of what you expect from them.

0:47:30.840 --> 0:47:33.760
<v Speaker 4>I mean, if you're watching a corner turn in quarters

0:47:33.800 --> 0:47:36.000
<v Speaker 4>every single play, you don't know what he looks like

0:47:36.040 --> 0:47:38.160
<v Speaker 4>in man coverage for the most part. So I think

0:47:38.239 --> 0:47:41.520
<v Speaker 4>that gap is interesting, But also I think that stuff

0:47:41.560 --> 0:47:43.719
<v Speaker 4>is starting to converge a little bit. The idea that

0:47:43.800 --> 0:47:46.719
<v Speaker 4>Carl Scott, who was one of the people who oversaw

0:47:46.840 --> 0:47:49.319
<v Speaker 4>the secondary in Alabama for so many years and the

0:47:49.320 --> 0:47:51.680
<v Speaker 4>ways that they would play those specific coverages that they

0:47:51.719 --> 0:47:54.680
<v Speaker 4>measured in, is now on the staff with the Vikings.

0:47:54.920 --> 0:47:57.520
<v Speaker 4>I think that's really interesting. I think that's even another

0:47:57.600 --> 0:47:59.960
<v Speaker 4>example of the two games kind of coming to get

0:48:00.040 --> 0:48:02.959
<v Speaker 4>other in ways they weren't before. Brandon Staley is another

0:48:02.960 --> 0:48:05.960
<v Speaker 4>good one. He did a ton of college specific stuff,

0:48:06.040 --> 0:48:09.239
<v Speaker 4>especially with fronts with the Chargers last year. So as

0:48:09.320 --> 0:48:11.920
<v Speaker 4>coaches get younger as coach, as they get more open minded,

0:48:12.080 --> 0:48:13.800
<v Speaker 4>I think we're gonna see some of this stuff filter

0:48:13.920 --> 0:48:14.480
<v Speaker 4>both ways.

0:48:15.320 --> 0:48:18.520
<v Speaker 2>Are there guys that you don't anticipate being taken high

0:48:18.560 --> 0:48:20.600
<v Speaker 2>at all this year where you just you've caught them,

0:48:20.640 --> 0:48:23.520
<v Speaker 2>even caught them watching tape on other guys where you've said,

0:48:23.840 --> 0:48:25.520
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, I think this guy's just gonna be good.

0:48:25.560 --> 0:48:27.640
<v Speaker 2>He might be projected as like a fifth round pick.

0:48:27.840 --> 0:48:29.920
<v Speaker 2>I guess this is your football guy, right, capital F,

0:48:29.960 --> 0:48:32.600
<v Speaker 2>capitol G football guy. Are there guys this year Whe're

0:48:32.640 --> 0:48:34.080
<v Speaker 2>just like, Yeah, I think this guy's gonna be in

0:48:34.080 --> 0:48:34.959
<v Speaker 2>the league for six years.

0:48:36.440 --> 0:48:39.520
<v Speaker 4>Those I haven't digging that deep into the pool of players,

0:48:39.560 --> 0:48:42.160
<v Speaker 4>if I'm being honest. I mean I've watched the top

0:48:42.280 --> 0:48:45.640
<v Speaker 4>ten or at top like eight to ten at most positions.

0:48:46.160 --> 0:48:49.359
<v Speaker 4>I'm trying to think of somebody that I've stumbled onto that, Like,

0:48:49.400 --> 0:48:51.439
<v Speaker 4>there are guys that I've watched a little bit lower

0:48:51.480 --> 0:48:54.120
<v Speaker 4>at certain spots that I think are intriguing. Peyton Turner

0:48:54.160 --> 0:48:57.080
<v Speaker 4>from Houston is an edge rusher that I watch him.

0:48:56.920 --> 0:48:59.320
<v Speaker 4>I'm like, Oh, that guy, I don't know. I like

0:48:59.400 --> 0:49:02.759
<v Speaker 4>what he's He's high cut, and the competition isn't very good.

0:49:02.800 --> 0:49:04.560
<v Speaker 4>I don't really know what to make of him, but

0:49:04.680 --> 0:49:06.600
<v Speaker 4>he's somebody that jumped out to me a little bit.

0:49:06.800 --> 0:49:08.479
<v Speaker 4>But other than that, I mean, most of the guys

0:49:08.520 --> 0:49:10.840
<v Speaker 4>I've watched are in the top one hundred or so,

0:49:10.840 --> 0:49:13.040
<v Speaker 4>so I'm not the best person to ask about that.

0:49:13.440 --> 0:49:15.680
<v Speaker 2>Do you have any theories like you did about Justin

0:49:15.719 --> 0:49:19.799
<v Speaker 2>Herbert that aren't necessarily grounded in specific data? But you're

0:49:19.840 --> 0:49:21.520
<v Speaker 2>just like, look, this is how I feel about this

0:49:21.600 --> 0:49:23.920
<v Speaker 2>kind of player, this is how I feel about this position.

0:49:24.160 --> 0:49:25.759
<v Speaker 2>I don't care that I don't have a ton of

0:49:25.760 --> 0:49:28.000
<v Speaker 2>supporting proof. Maybe you did for Justin Herbert and he

0:49:28.080 --> 0:49:32.280
<v Speaker 2>was the exception. What are your latest theories about anything

0:49:32.440 --> 0:49:34.240
<v Speaker 2>with the draft?

0:49:34.280 --> 0:49:35.839
<v Speaker 3>This one is rooted in a little bit of data.

0:49:36.000 --> 0:49:38.000
<v Speaker 4>One of the conversations I've had a lot over the

0:49:38.080 --> 0:49:40.239
<v Speaker 4>last month, and I've written about it, We've talked about

0:49:40.239 --> 0:49:43.200
<v Speaker 4>on our show A Bunch is what the Bengal should

0:49:43.200 --> 0:49:48.000
<v Speaker 4>do at five and all of the kind of points

0:49:48.040 --> 0:49:51.239
<v Speaker 4>in forming that discussion. So if you're the Bengals and

0:49:51.280 --> 0:49:54.680
<v Speaker 4>you could pick between Penny Suel and Jamar Chase, you

0:49:55.239 --> 0:49:57.759
<v Speaker 4>I don't think that whatever direction you go in that

0:49:57.800 --> 0:50:00.160
<v Speaker 4>whoever you pick among those two, you're not just picking

0:50:00.239 --> 0:50:02.360
<v Speaker 4>one of those players. You're sending a message about what

0:50:02.520 --> 0:50:05.560
<v Speaker 4>you value in picking one of those players. And I

0:50:05.640 --> 0:50:07.839
<v Speaker 4>understand if they went with Chase, if they assigned Riley

0:50:07.840 --> 0:50:10.320
<v Speaker 4>Reef in free agency, they have two starting caliber tackles.

0:50:10.520 --> 0:50:12.760
<v Speaker 4>You probably find an interior alignment in the second round.

0:50:13.000 --> 0:50:14.960
<v Speaker 4>And if you think Jamar Chase is a rare talent,

0:50:15.080 --> 0:50:17.120
<v Speaker 4>if you want to pick him at five, go crazy.

0:50:17.160 --> 0:50:19.399
<v Speaker 4>He feels in need all that stuff. But I think

0:50:19.400 --> 0:50:23.040
<v Speaker 4>it's led to conversations about scarcity and about where we

0:50:23.080 --> 0:50:25.799
<v Speaker 4>find these players, because in my mind, when I wrote

0:50:25.800 --> 0:50:28.480
<v Speaker 4>about it and have thought about it, I just see

0:50:28.960 --> 0:50:32.120
<v Speaker 4>things you can't get elsewhere. And I've just watched what's

0:50:32.160 --> 0:50:34.839
<v Speaker 4>happened at the receiver position, especially we talked about DK

0:50:34.920 --> 0:50:37.399
<v Speaker 4>Metcalfe and A. J. Brown already where you can find

0:50:37.560 --> 0:50:40.640
<v Speaker 4>star level receivers in throughout the league. And then I

0:50:40.680 --> 0:50:45.560
<v Speaker 4>think about tackles. It's harder. It's much much harder to

0:50:45.640 --> 0:50:49.000
<v Speaker 4>find high quality tackles beyond the first round, and even

0:50:49.040 --> 0:50:51.880
<v Speaker 4>past that, it's hard to find starting quality tackles in

0:50:51.920 --> 0:50:55.480
<v Speaker 4>free agency. Riley Reef was the best offensive tackle in

0:50:55.520 --> 0:50:59.080
<v Speaker 4>free agency this year that's not very good. There's so

0:50:59.200 --> 0:51:02.840
<v Speaker 4>many receivers now, whether it's the depth of certain draft

0:51:02.840 --> 0:51:04.839
<v Speaker 4>classes or guys that you can find in the free

0:51:04.840 --> 0:51:07.600
<v Speaker 4>agent market. I just think it's harder to find a

0:51:07.640 --> 0:51:10.600
<v Speaker 4>really good receiver or really good offensive tackle than it

0:51:10.680 --> 0:51:13.759
<v Speaker 4>is to find a really good receiver. That, though, leads

0:51:13.800 --> 0:51:16.480
<v Speaker 4>to a conversation and some questions about do you need

0:51:16.560 --> 0:51:20.080
<v Speaker 4>high quality offensive tackles? Where does positional value fit into this?

0:51:20.200 --> 0:51:24.160
<v Speaker 4>So everything about the Bengals and what they're thinking about

0:51:24.360 --> 0:51:26.839
<v Speaker 4>and the debates that are happening in that building has

0:51:26.880 --> 0:51:29.200
<v Speaker 4>just led me down so many different paths over the

0:51:29.280 --> 0:51:31.840
<v Speaker 4>last month. I've thought more about the Bengals than I

0:51:31.920 --> 0:51:33.719
<v Speaker 4>ever thought I would in the lead up to any

0:51:33.760 --> 0:51:35.080
<v Speaker 4>sort of NFL draft.

0:51:35.200 --> 0:51:37.319
<v Speaker 2>Let me jump in real quick. So, what is because

0:51:37.320 --> 0:51:40.600
<v Speaker 2>you mentioned that, and you mentioned earlier you can wait

0:51:40.640 --> 0:51:42.560
<v Speaker 2>on speed. You can find speed in the fourth round.

0:51:42.640 --> 0:51:44.800
<v Speaker 2>You know, you can find a dude who's five to eleven,

0:51:44.880 --> 0:51:46.800
<v Speaker 2>two hundred and can run a four to four or whatever,

0:51:47.040 --> 0:51:48.120
<v Speaker 2>and you can plug him in the.

0:51:48.120 --> 0:51:48.879
<v Speaker 1>Way you see fit.

0:51:49.320 --> 0:51:53.359
<v Speaker 2>What does your positional value draft board look like? What

0:51:53.400 --> 0:51:55.520
<v Speaker 2>do you need to grab as soon as possible if

0:51:55.719 --> 0:51:57.880
<v Speaker 2>you are Robert May's general manager, and what are you

0:51:57.880 --> 0:51:58.319
<v Speaker 2>waiting on?

0:52:00.160 --> 0:52:03.160
<v Speaker 4>I think, I mean, quarterback is a different conversation outside

0:52:03.160 --> 0:52:07.520
<v Speaker 4>of quarterback. Yeah, yeah, outside of quarterback. I don't have

0:52:07.560 --> 0:52:11.719
<v Speaker 4>any hard and fast rules. I've rethought a lot of

0:52:11.719 --> 0:52:14.319
<v Speaker 4>this stuff compared to what I would have thought five

0:52:14.400 --> 0:52:16.120
<v Speaker 4>years ago. If you had asked me five years ago,

0:52:16.560 --> 0:52:23.400
<v Speaker 4>I would have said quarterback, edge rusher, offensive tackle, a corner, receiver,

0:52:24.560 --> 0:52:29.799
<v Speaker 4>and then probably interior defensive line, interior offensive line, and

0:52:29.840 --> 0:52:34.040
<v Speaker 4>safety somewhere in there. I think the game has changed

0:52:34.080 --> 0:52:37.279
<v Speaker 4>a lot, and I think that my views on it

0:52:37.320 --> 0:52:40.040
<v Speaker 4>have changed a decent amount. I think corner and edge

0:52:40.120 --> 0:52:42.680
<v Speaker 4>rusher are closer than they would have been. There's a

0:52:42.680 --> 0:52:45.080
<v Speaker 4>lot of data out there suggesting that past coverage is

0:52:45.080 --> 0:52:47.960
<v Speaker 4>more valuable than past rush. I don't know how much

0:52:48.000 --> 0:52:49.680
<v Speaker 4>I believe that or buy into that. I think they're

0:52:49.719 --> 0:52:52.440
<v Speaker 4>probably pretty close. I also think that if you can

0:52:52.480 --> 0:52:56.960
<v Speaker 4>find a dominant interior rusher, that that changes the equation

0:52:57.360 --> 0:52:59.200
<v Speaker 4>in the same way that an edge rusher might like

0:52:59.239 --> 0:53:02.200
<v Speaker 4>an Aaron Donald or Chris Jones or even at Toforest

0:53:02.239 --> 0:53:05.320
<v Speaker 4>Buckner last year. I think those guys. The gap between

0:53:05.360 --> 0:53:07.200
<v Speaker 4>that and the best edge rusher has probably shrunk a

0:53:07.239 --> 0:53:12.400
<v Speaker 4>little bit. I think that safeties aren't less valuable than

0:53:12.400 --> 0:53:14.720
<v Speaker 4>they've been, but with the way the league is going,

0:53:15.760 --> 0:53:18.360
<v Speaker 4>or seeing so many more split safety coverages in the NFL,

0:53:18.960 --> 0:53:23.160
<v Speaker 4>that prototypical middle of the field center field safety that

0:53:23.200 --> 0:53:26.279
<v Speaker 4>needs to be rangy isn't as valuable anymore because there

0:53:26.280 --> 0:53:29.120
<v Speaker 4>are a fewer teams sticking in a Cover three shell

0:53:29.200 --> 0:53:32.359
<v Speaker 4>and playing that way. So if your safety requires less

0:53:32.400 --> 0:53:36.680
<v Speaker 4>movement skills, maybe he's not as impressive on tape and

0:53:36.719 --> 0:53:38.520
<v Speaker 4>you can find him a little bit later in the draft.

0:53:38.520 --> 0:53:40.560
<v Speaker 4>So I don't know if their importance has changed, or

0:53:40.600 --> 0:53:43.400
<v Speaker 4>if the types of players that can fit those roles

0:53:43.520 --> 0:53:45.680
<v Speaker 4>that pool has just gotten bigger. So I think it's

0:53:45.800 --> 0:53:47.320
<v Speaker 4>very muddy. I mean, it depends on what sort of

0:53:47.360 --> 0:53:51.359
<v Speaker 4>system you're running. It's definitely something that I've rethought and

0:53:51.440 --> 0:53:53.840
<v Speaker 4>reshuffled more in the last couple of years than I

0:53:53.920 --> 0:53:56.040
<v Speaker 4>probably had in the previous five years combined.

0:53:56.080 --> 0:53:58.080
<v Speaker 1>All right, mister Mays, we'll get you out of here

0:53:58.120 --> 0:53:59.640
<v Speaker 1>on this rapid fire. I'm going to put you on

0:53:59.680 --> 0:54:02.520
<v Speaker 1>the spot. I hate to do it, but's why we're here.

0:54:03.000 --> 0:54:05.279
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to give you a handful of teams and

0:54:05.320 --> 0:54:07.720
<v Speaker 1>I want you to tell me who they should pick. Okay,

0:54:07.960 --> 0:54:13.359
<v Speaker 1>let's do it. The Jets at two, Justin Fields. I

0:54:13.440 --> 0:54:15.640
<v Speaker 1>like that pick. That's the correct pick for those playing

0:54:15.640 --> 0:54:18.280
<v Speaker 1>along at home. The Falcons at four.

0:54:21.080 --> 0:54:25.560
<v Speaker 4>Trey Lance if Justin Fields is off aboarded too, Okay.

0:54:26.760 --> 0:54:28.919
<v Speaker 1>My New York Giants at eleven.

0:54:30.040 --> 0:54:33.280
<v Speaker 3>Elijah Vera Tucker if he's there, and.

0:54:33.160 --> 0:54:34.880
<v Speaker 1>Your Chicago Bear is at twenty.

0:54:36.560 --> 0:54:38.360
<v Speaker 4>That I don't have as much of a conviction on

0:54:38.480 --> 0:54:41.719
<v Speaker 4>because I think that it'll depend on who's around and

0:54:42.680 --> 0:54:46.640
<v Speaker 4>certain positions. That team is not nearly as fully formed

0:54:46.680 --> 0:54:49.080
<v Speaker 4>as people seem to like, or people seem to think

0:54:49.080 --> 0:54:51.759
<v Speaker 4>and people seem to talk about. I don't think they're

0:54:53.719 --> 0:54:55.960
<v Speaker 4>one receiver or one tackle. I think they need an

0:54:55.960 --> 0:54:58.840
<v Speaker 4>offensive tackle, they need secondary help, they need receiving help.

0:54:59.080 --> 0:55:01.720
<v Speaker 4>They could probably, I mean, there's so many different areas

0:55:01.760 --> 0:55:05.560
<v Speaker 4>so idea. If we're up to me, and I think

0:55:05.560 --> 0:55:07.680
<v Speaker 4>if Darisol was on the board, I would take him.

0:55:07.680 --> 0:55:11.560
<v Speaker 4>I don't think he will be. If it were beyond that,

0:55:11.640 --> 0:55:14.440
<v Speaker 4>I think it would probably come down to Rashad Bateman

0:55:14.680 --> 0:55:17.839
<v Speaker 4>and Tevin Jenkins, and I'd probably take Bateman just because

0:55:17.880 --> 0:55:20.240
<v Speaker 4>I love his game in the style which he plays,

0:55:20.640 --> 0:55:22.920
<v Speaker 4>and who knows how long Al Robinson's going to be there,

0:55:23.200 --> 0:55:25.840
<v Speaker 4>So again it's hard to say one specific guy just

0:55:25.880 --> 0:55:28.360
<v Speaker 4>because I think they have more holes than other people might.

0:55:29.120 --> 0:55:31.800
<v Speaker 1>And because we need to be inclusive. I should also

0:55:31.840 --> 0:55:36.759
<v Speaker 1>mention at three traded up big big headlines here leading

0:55:36.840 --> 0:55:39.920
<v Speaker 1>up to the draft, Dan's San Francisco forty fives.

0:55:41.040 --> 0:55:44.560
<v Speaker 4>Well, if they, I mean, so can we use the

0:55:44.600 --> 0:55:46.920
<v Speaker 4>players we already picked? Because if Justice Fields is there,

0:55:46.920 --> 0:55:47.400
<v Speaker 4>I would.

0:55:47.239 --> 0:55:48.240
<v Speaker 3>Pick Justin Fields.

0:55:48.360 --> 0:55:51.320
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, But if he were to go to the Jets,

0:55:51.440 --> 0:55:53.439
<v Speaker 4>then I'd still probably say Trey Lance for them too.

0:55:53.880 --> 0:55:55.960
<v Speaker 4>That's who I would pick, probably over mac Jones. But

0:55:56.120 --> 0:55:59.200
<v Speaker 4>I understand the argument for mac Jones for them. You know,

0:55:59.280 --> 0:56:01.640
<v Speaker 4>Lance is a little bit more of a project in

0:56:01.680 --> 0:56:03.920
<v Speaker 4>the sense that if the accuracy isn't where you'd want

0:56:03.960 --> 0:56:05.919
<v Speaker 4>it to be, all that other stuff. The thing though

0:56:06.560 --> 0:56:08.600
<v Speaker 4>he played the exact same amount of games as mac

0:56:08.640 --> 0:56:10.799
<v Speaker 4>Jones in college. The idea that we talked about Mac

0:56:10.840 --> 0:56:13.319
<v Speaker 4>Jones is this finished product and Trey Lance has so

0:56:13.360 --> 0:56:15.880
<v Speaker 4>far to go, which I think is how it's being viewed.

0:56:15.880 --> 0:56:17.799
<v Speaker 4>You know, mac Jones is the win now guy. Trey

0:56:17.880 --> 0:56:19.680
<v Speaker 4>Lance is somebody who could sit for a year they

0:56:19.719 --> 0:56:22.920
<v Speaker 4>started the exact same number of games in college, and

0:56:23.400 --> 0:56:24.800
<v Speaker 4>that has not been brought up nearly.

0:56:24.840 --> 0:56:28.040
<v Speaker 2>Off fit enough, Ty, here's my final question, just because

0:56:28.760 --> 0:56:33.560
<v Speaker 2>life seems to be opening up Chicago. There are few,

0:56:33.840 --> 0:56:36.520
<v Speaker 2>if any better places during the summer. What are you

0:56:36.600 --> 0:56:40.960
<v Speaker 2>eating this summer in the beautiful city of Chicago, inside, outside,

0:56:41.000 --> 0:56:41.760
<v Speaker 2>everywhere between.

0:56:42.160 --> 0:56:46.280
<v Speaker 4>I'm so excited. I have dinner reservations at Suko, which

0:56:46.320 --> 0:56:48.960
<v Speaker 4>is the Carlos Guiden who was on Top Chef and

0:56:49.000 --> 0:56:51.359
<v Speaker 4>he ran Mechik. It's his new restaurant in River North.

0:56:51.400 --> 0:56:52.840
<v Speaker 4>I'm excited to eat there this week.

0:56:53.200 --> 0:56:53.680
<v Speaker 3>I have kind of.

0:56:55.200 --> 0:56:56.000
<v Speaker 2>What kind of food is that?

0:56:56.040 --> 0:56:56.400
<v Speaker 3>Mexican?

0:56:56.400 --> 0:56:59.360
<v Speaker 4>It's Mexican food, so it's Mexican food with like French influence.

0:57:00.000 --> 0:57:04.359
<v Speaker 4>And Samus's other place, who was had a Michelin star Rosemary,

0:57:04.840 --> 0:57:07.200
<v Speaker 4>which is the new restaurant from Joe Flamm who won

0:57:07.320 --> 0:57:10.160
<v Speaker 4>Top Chef. I know about the Chicago guy. So it's

0:57:10.200 --> 0:57:14.400
<v Speaker 4>a Croatian Italian place in Fulton Market. The menu looks crazy,

0:57:14.680 --> 0:57:16.480
<v Speaker 4>it looks exactly like what.

0:57:16.480 --> 0:57:17.520
<v Speaker 3>I want to eat.

0:57:17.680 --> 0:57:20.680
<v Speaker 4>And then there's a new Greek place in Logan Square

0:57:21.200 --> 0:57:23.280
<v Speaker 4>Semi knew by one of the guys who was the

0:57:23.320 --> 0:57:26.400
<v Speaker 4>head chef. I think at rpm Italian that opened a

0:57:26.440 --> 0:57:30.000
<v Speaker 4>place called Andros Taverna in Logan Square. I want to

0:57:30.000 --> 0:57:34.640
<v Speaker 4>say it's on Kedzie, right there near the park. I'm

0:57:34.680 --> 0:57:37.600
<v Speaker 4>going there the week after. I have like six reservations

0:57:37.640 --> 0:57:39.560
<v Speaker 4>I've already set up over the next couple of weeks.

0:57:39.560 --> 0:57:43.000
<v Speaker 2>My wife looked up Rosemary and apparently there were only

0:57:43.080 --> 0:57:45.760
<v Speaker 2>reservations at like nine to thirty on Mondays available, But

0:57:45.800 --> 0:57:48.160
<v Speaker 2>that is stashed away. We will get there this summer.

0:57:48.520 --> 0:57:53.640
<v Speaker 4>I may have pulled a couple strings, so WHOA. I

0:57:54.680 --> 0:57:57.840
<v Speaker 4>don't want any more people to know who I am

0:57:57.920 --> 0:58:02.520
<v Speaker 4>than know right now. I want this level of whatever

0:58:02.640 --> 0:58:05.120
<v Speaker 4>fame is not famous the wrong word, but this level

0:58:05.160 --> 0:58:07.880
<v Speaker 4>of awareness. The fact that I can get a table

0:58:07.920 --> 0:58:10.720
<v Speaker 4>at a Chicago restaurant is exactly the sweet spot of

0:58:10.720 --> 0:58:11.640
<v Speaker 4>where I want to be living.

0:58:12.120 --> 0:58:14.000
<v Speaker 3>I say, no more than what I have right at

0:58:14.000 --> 0:58:14.520
<v Speaker 3>this moment.

0:58:14.880 --> 0:58:18.320
<v Speaker 2>That's a perfect level. I have no complaints. I would

0:58:18.320 --> 0:58:20.720
<v Speaker 2>love to reach that level. I mean, I'm in the burbs,

0:58:20.720 --> 0:58:22.400
<v Speaker 2>this is not that exciting, but there are so many

0:58:22.440 --> 0:58:24.720
<v Speaker 2>places in the city I'm dying to try. Because I've

0:58:24.760 --> 0:58:28.120
<v Speaker 2>only been here less than a year, so I essentially

0:58:28.360 --> 0:58:31.480
<v Speaker 2>my Palette is still extremely green with Chicago.

0:58:31.760 --> 0:58:34.040
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you got to get down here. I mean it's this.

0:58:34.200 --> 0:58:37.600
<v Speaker 4>There's so many places and they keep sprouting up. I

0:58:37.600 --> 0:58:39.880
<v Speaker 4>mean obviously some places closed, but I mean there are

0:58:39.880 --> 0:58:42.160
<v Speaker 4>three or four even new places that I'm really excited

0:58:42.160 --> 0:58:45.120
<v Speaker 4>about that I haven't even gotten a try that came

0:58:45.160 --> 0:58:47.480
<v Speaker 4>out as the pandemic was happening or right now. I

0:58:47.480 --> 0:58:51.240
<v Speaker 4>mean Rosemary's brand brand new, So I'm really looking forward.

0:58:51.320 --> 0:58:53.080
<v Speaker 4>Have you been to the things I'm most excited about.

0:58:53.440 --> 0:58:56.120
<v Speaker 2>I think it's called Pizza Friendly Pizza. Have you been there?

0:58:56.520 --> 0:58:59.080
<v Speaker 2>I have not, and I think it's in Ukrainian Village.

0:58:59.160 --> 0:59:01.160
<v Speaker 2>You actually go through an alley to get it. It's

0:59:01.200 --> 0:59:05.080
<v Speaker 2>like the perfect level of like very dumb, hipster pizza

0:59:05.120 --> 0:59:07.280
<v Speaker 2>stand that could exist. It's wonderful.

0:59:07.280 --> 0:59:09.200
<v Speaker 4>I think there's a bunch of them now on the

0:59:09.200 --> 0:59:10.840
<v Speaker 4>West Side. There are too many of them for me

0:59:10.880 --> 0:59:12.960
<v Speaker 4>to even try. I live right near the new Polyges

0:59:13.040 --> 0:59:15.720
<v Speaker 4>and Wicker Park, and that they already have a Logan

0:59:15.720 --> 0:59:18.280
<v Speaker 4>Square location. I mean, there's so many of them, I

0:59:18.280 --> 0:59:19.720
<v Speaker 4>feel like I'm never gonna be able to try them all.

0:59:19.720 --> 0:59:21.080
<v Speaker 4>I have to come and try your pizza at some

0:59:21.120 --> 0:59:21.960
<v Speaker 4>point anytime.

0:59:22.240 --> 0:59:25.400
<v Speaker 2>Anytime you tell me what toppings would make up the

0:59:25.440 --> 0:59:29.400
<v Speaker 2>magnificent maze or whatever we call your square or circular pie.

0:59:29.640 --> 0:59:31.480
<v Speaker 2>What is your topping of choice? Are you like your

0:59:31.480 --> 0:59:32.200
<v Speaker 2>topping combo?

0:59:34.480 --> 0:59:36.120
<v Speaker 4>I have a couple different ways that I go. I'm

0:59:36.160 --> 0:59:39.440
<v Speaker 4>a big fan of artichoke on pizza. Okay, really like artichoke,

0:59:39.480 --> 0:59:41.080
<v Speaker 4>and I am thinking of all the things I can

0:59:41.080 --> 0:59:43.040
<v Speaker 4>put it on, put on it at piece because they have,

0:59:43.080 --> 0:59:45.160
<v Speaker 4>like the most the biggest list of toppings. I'm a

0:59:45.160 --> 0:59:48.200
<v Speaker 4>big fan of green olives on pizza, so some some

0:59:48.240 --> 0:59:52.800
<v Speaker 4>sort of pepperoni, sausage, artichoke, green olive conversation combination is

0:59:53.200 --> 0:59:54.200
<v Speaker 4>where I often.

0:59:54.000 --> 0:59:54.439
<v Speaker 3>Like to live.

0:59:54.560 --> 0:59:55.800
<v Speaker 2>You like that punch of salt?

0:59:56.280 --> 0:59:57.000
<v Speaker 3>I do? I do?

0:59:57.280 --> 0:59:59.120
<v Speaker 4>I know it's a lot, but for whatever reason, I

0:59:59.160 --> 1:00:01.000
<v Speaker 4>just love green olives and it doesn't overwhelm me.

1:00:01.160 --> 1:00:03.440
<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna think on this ty this. This is as

1:00:03.520 --> 1:00:05.320
<v Speaker 2>good an insight as I could have hoped for.

1:00:06.040 --> 1:00:09.080
<v Speaker 1>This is a natural segue from draft to salty pizza.

1:00:09.120 --> 1:00:11.080
<v Speaker 1>I love it. A good way to close it out here,

1:00:11.640 --> 1:00:13.720
<v Speaker 1>Robert Mays, enjoy the rest of your week. Best of

1:00:13.800 --> 1:00:17.960
<v Speaker 1>luck to you. As the NFL Draft continues turning along.

1:00:18.000 --> 1:00:20.560
<v Speaker 1>I'm sure you'll be short on sleep at some point,

1:00:20.640 --> 1:00:23.040
<v Speaker 1>but always appreciate your coverage and watch us. Thank you

1:00:23.080 --> 1:00:25.040
<v Speaker 1>very much for stopping by. Yeah, watch the stream.

1:00:25.640 --> 1:00:26.040
<v Speaker 3>Check it out.

1:00:26.040 --> 1:00:28.400
<v Speaker 1>Where can we find Can we find the stream?

1:00:28.520 --> 1:00:30.919
<v Speaker 4>It'll be on Twitter, It'll be on the Athletics YouTube page.

1:00:30.920 --> 1:00:32.600
<v Speaker 4>If you check the Athletic app, you'll be able to

1:00:32.640 --> 1:00:34.760
<v Speaker 4>see it. I'm sure I'll tweet about it fifty times

1:00:34.800 --> 1:00:35.840
<v Speaker 4>between now and the draft.

1:00:35.880 --> 1:00:36.280
<v Speaker 3>But good.

1:00:36.320 --> 1:00:39.320
<v Speaker 4>It's me Nate Tice, Dane brug or Lindsay Jones, and

1:00:39.360 --> 1:00:42.360
<v Speaker 4>we're gonna start live at nine thirty Eastern, essentially after

1:00:42.400 --> 1:00:45.320
<v Speaker 4>the fifteenth pick. We wanted not to compete with the broadcast,

1:00:45.400 --> 1:00:48.160
<v Speaker 4>but as things are slowing down, we'll be speeding up.

1:00:48.240 --> 1:00:50.360
<v Speaker 4>So hopefully people will come and spend some time.

1:00:50.640 --> 1:00:53.320
<v Speaker 1>Done cool, well, enjoy the week, enjoy the draft, and

1:00:53.600 --> 1:00:54.520
<v Speaker 1>we'll have to have you back.

1:00:54.480 --> 1:00:56.720
<v Speaker 3>On soon anytime. Guys. I really appreciate the time. This

1:00:56.760 --> 1:00:57.840
<v Speaker 3>is great, all.

1:00:57.800 --> 1:01:01.640
<v Speaker 1>Right, Dan Robert mays one more time from the Athletic

1:01:03.320 --> 1:01:05.680
<v Speaker 1>I feel smarter, actually.

1:01:05.760 --> 1:01:08.160
<v Speaker 2>As do I I when he says things like you

1:01:08.200 --> 1:01:10.480
<v Speaker 2>can wait on speed, just like draft speed, and like

1:01:10.480 --> 1:01:12.760
<v Speaker 2>the third or fourth round. You know, there's always guys,

1:01:12.800 --> 1:01:16.080
<v Speaker 2>of that body type with that ability. I thought to myself, Yeah,

1:01:16.160 --> 1:01:19.680
<v Speaker 2>I will wait on speed as if I will ever

1:01:19.760 --> 1:01:22.240
<v Speaker 2>be in that that that share deciding on how to

1:01:22.240 --> 1:01:24.560
<v Speaker 2>build an NFL team. But like, yeah, yeah, that does

1:01:24.680 --> 1:01:28.400
<v Speaker 2>make sense. Great call, so I mas was fantastic.

1:01:28.440 --> 1:01:32.040
<v Speaker 1>I appreciate the insight of Mac Jones because Mac Jones,

1:01:32.440 --> 1:01:34.640
<v Speaker 1>no disrespect to him. I don't get it.

1:01:35.320 --> 1:01:37.120
<v Speaker 2>Give me well Son, I don't get. Let's break things out.

1:01:37.120 --> 1:01:38.280
<v Speaker 2>I don't know if you want to pull up a

1:01:39.320 --> 1:01:41.160
<v Speaker 2>mock draft or something like that. Are tell me the

1:01:41.160 --> 1:01:43.160
<v Speaker 2>guys that you get and that you don't get or like,

1:01:43.640 --> 1:01:45.360
<v Speaker 2>don't get that they're not higher and don't get that

1:01:45.400 --> 1:01:47.880
<v Speaker 2>they are high? Who like? What names to you in

1:01:47.920 --> 1:01:51.960
<v Speaker 2>this process? As a very casual NFL fan, sure ring

1:01:52.000 --> 1:01:52.320
<v Speaker 2>out to you.

1:01:53.320 --> 1:01:56.960
<v Speaker 1>I don't get any of the quarterbacks outside of Trevor

1:01:57.040 --> 1:02:01.680
<v Speaker 1>Lawrence and Justin Fields. That's it. I don't I don't

1:02:02.080 --> 1:02:03.600
<v Speaker 1>get the fascination with the others.

1:02:04.560 --> 1:02:06.760
<v Speaker 2>You don't get the fascination with Zach. Like Zach Wilson

1:02:06.800 --> 1:02:08.400
<v Speaker 2>had a really nice year, he had a great year.

1:02:08.480 --> 1:02:10.720
<v Speaker 1>Now he had a great year, he had a great year.

1:02:11.040 --> 1:02:17.320
<v Speaker 1>I still don't get it. I think it would be awesome.

1:02:18.080 --> 1:02:21.520
<v Speaker 1>It may not make total sense to reunite Joe Burrow

1:02:21.520 --> 1:02:24.960
<v Speaker 1>and Jamar Chase, but as Robert said, receiver is a

1:02:24.960 --> 1:02:27.720
<v Speaker 1>position of need, and I think it would be a

1:02:27.760 --> 1:02:31.640
<v Speaker 1>cool union to bring those two back together. So that's

1:02:31.680 --> 1:02:37.440
<v Speaker 1>interesting to me. That's just sort of narrative though, that's narrative. Yeah,

1:02:37.480 --> 1:02:42.040
<v Speaker 1>it's it's not, you know, necessarily a gets versus not gets.

1:02:42.760 --> 1:02:46.800
<v Speaker 1>I know that running backs don't get drafted that highly.

1:02:47.200 --> 1:02:51.640
<v Speaker 1>I love Nagie Harris. So I love Nagie Harris, and

1:02:51.680 --> 1:02:53.080
<v Speaker 1>I think he's going to be a monster at the

1:02:53.120 --> 1:02:56.360
<v Speaker 1>next level because, as I think we said on the show,

1:02:57.360 --> 1:03:00.959
<v Speaker 1>I feel like just this past year we got more

1:03:01.000 --> 1:03:05.240
<v Speaker 1>introduced to the moves that Naji Harris has, sure and O,

1:03:05.360 --> 1:03:06.920
<v Speaker 1>but like was given that chance to be more of

1:03:06.920 --> 1:03:10.400
<v Speaker 1>an all purpose back exactly fully weaponized in the SARK system. Yeah,

1:03:10.480 --> 1:03:14.480
<v Speaker 1>he's got serious moves, and I think he's going to

1:03:14.480 --> 1:03:17.120
<v Speaker 1>be a force at the next level for many years

1:03:17.160 --> 1:03:17.439
<v Speaker 1>to come.

1:03:18.240 --> 1:03:20.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, to me, this is all half baked. My theory

1:03:21.000 --> 1:03:24.600
<v Speaker 2>is about NFL and college value. It's what are the

1:03:25.000 --> 1:03:27.440
<v Speaker 2>things that you can do, not the singular thing that

1:03:27.520 --> 1:03:30.200
<v Speaker 2>you can do, Like for Najie Harris, it's what is

1:03:30.240 --> 1:03:32.440
<v Speaker 2>it that you can do as a receiver as well

1:03:32.480 --> 1:03:34.680
<v Speaker 2>as a running back as the NFL heads to a

1:03:34.720 --> 1:03:38.200
<v Speaker 2>more open place offensively, and that you're you're hunting for

1:03:38.320 --> 1:03:40.280
<v Speaker 2>mismatches if you're an offensive coordinator. So if you get

1:03:40.360 --> 1:03:42.800
<v Speaker 2>Najie Harris on an outside linebacker or something, that becomes

1:03:42.800 --> 1:03:47.120
<v Speaker 2>a problem. And so for offensive lineman, sure, it's great

1:03:47.120 --> 1:03:50.200
<v Speaker 2>to be able to, you know, protect the quarterback. It's

1:03:50.200 --> 1:03:53.640
<v Speaker 2>great to be able to move defensive lineman the other direction,

1:03:53.800 --> 1:03:55.240
<v Speaker 2>But like, what are you doing in the open field

1:03:55.280 --> 1:03:56.840
<v Speaker 2>if you're called upon on us? You know, what are

1:03:57.000 --> 1:04:00.439
<v Speaker 2>what are large dudes doing in terms of small dude

1:04:00.480 --> 1:04:03.400
<v Speaker 2>activity and what are smaller dudes during in terms of

1:04:03.480 --> 1:04:05.880
<v Speaker 2>larger dude activity. Are you a safety who can rush

1:04:05.880 --> 1:04:08.440
<v Speaker 2>the quarterback? Are you Derwin James? That to me is

1:04:08.480 --> 1:04:12.200
<v Speaker 2>where like the unicorns, special players are are the guys

1:04:12.280 --> 1:04:17.720
<v Speaker 2>that can do multiple things on an extremely high level.

1:04:17.760 --> 1:04:20.080
<v Speaker 2>That's fascinating. That's why I brought up Isaiah Simmons. That's

1:04:20.080 --> 1:04:22.360
<v Speaker 2>why we bring up Kyle Pitts because you know he

1:04:22.360 --> 1:04:24.320
<v Speaker 2>can be an inline blocker if asked to be, but

1:04:24.400 --> 1:04:27.480
<v Speaker 2>also he's an unguardable threat in the passing game. So

1:04:27.560 --> 1:04:30.920
<v Speaker 2>that is fascinating to see not just who is valued,

1:04:31.040 --> 1:04:33.920
<v Speaker 2>but why they're valued and what can they do at

1:04:34.360 --> 1:04:40.600
<v Speaker 2>three different elite or responsible actions than more so than

1:04:41.320 --> 1:04:43.840
<v Speaker 2>the players are like, yeah, I can, I can run

1:04:43.920 --> 1:04:46.600
<v Speaker 2>off tackle and that's sort of what I do. And

1:04:46.640 --> 1:04:50.960
<v Speaker 2>I think that's that's where we're heading from a football perspective,

1:04:51.080 --> 1:04:53.360
<v Speaker 2>is what is the what is the total bag of

1:04:53.400 --> 1:04:55.760
<v Speaker 2>tricks that I possess. That's fascinating.

1:04:56.760 --> 1:05:01.760
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I also think that Micaeh Parson should go higher

1:05:02.200 --> 1:05:05.120
<v Speaker 1>than what I've seen in a lot of recent mock drafts.

1:05:05.120 --> 1:05:08.000
<v Speaker 1>And again, I know means am I an NFL analyst

1:05:08.000 --> 1:05:12.600
<v Speaker 1>here right. I think he's the best linebacker in the draft,

1:05:12.760 --> 1:05:15.800
<v Speaker 1>and I'd be surprised if he fell to Like, gosh,

1:05:15.840 --> 1:05:18.320
<v Speaker 1>I'm looking at one that's got him at twenty, that

1:05:18.360 --> 1:05:19.880
<v Speaker 1>would stun me if he failed that far.

1:05:21.840 --> 1:05:25.560
<v Speaker 2>I'm looking right now. I mean, it's a pretty fun draft.

1:05:25.600 --> 1:05:29.240
<v Speaker 2>It's interesting to me to see Jalen Wattle and DeVante Smith.

1:05:29.280 --> 1:05:33.120
<v Speaker 2>DeVante Smith as accomplished as he was behind Jalen Waddle,

1:05:33.160 --> 1:05:35.720
<v Speaker 2>who seemed like more of a specialized player, I mean

1:05:35.800 --> 1:05:40.440
<v Speaker 2>an incredible specialized player, but DeVante Smith was just unguardable.

1:05:40.440 --> 1:05:43.400
<v Speaker 2>Now it's the size thing, But I don't know, as

1:05:43.440 --> 1:05:46.280
<v Speaker 2>May's mentioned it, just it seems like he's going to

1:05:46.320 --> 1:05:48.720
<v Speaker 2>succeed and be looked at as an exception because it's

1:05:48.760 --> 1:05:51.800
<v Speaker 2>so difficult when he's that thin. But he was playing

1:05:51.800 --> 1:05:54.680
<v Speaker 2>against SEC corners like he is in a position to

1:05:55.240 --> 1:05:58.520
<v Speaker 2>have the experience to succeed. People love your Notre Dame

1:05:58.600 --> 1:06:03.280
<v Speaker 2>linebacker a w SU Carmoa, Sue Caromo. Yeah, yeah, not

1:06:03.360 --> 1:06:06.160
<v Speaker 2>a huge linebacker, but crazy athletic and productive.

1:06:06.200 --> 1:06:08.640
<v Speaker 1>Had a really good year, really really good year.

1:06:09.360 --> 1:06:12.720
<v Speaker 2>Was all over the place. No, it's it is fascinating,

1:06:12.800 --> 1:06:16.040
<v Speaker 2>especially and he mentioned Christian Darasol like I could not

1:06:16.120 --> 1:06:17.880
<v Speaker 2>I knew the name. I couldn't tell you that he

1:06:17.880 --> 1:06:19.760
<v Speaker 2>was a first round pick versus a third round pick.

1:06:20.080 --> 1:06:23.120
<v Speaker 2>And it's just because Virginia Tech has been difficult to

1:06:23.160 --> 1:06:24.680
<v Speaker 2>watch for a couple of years, so I haven't been

1:06:24.720 --> 1:06:27.360
<v Speaker 2>watching their offensive lineman too closely, so they haven't been

1:06:27.360 --> 1:06:30.880
<v Speaker 2>playing too many huge games. But no, some of those guys,

1:06:30.880 --> 1:06:32.919
<v Speaker 2>like I remember Rashaan Slater a couple of years ago,

1:06:32.960 --> 1:06:36.400
<v Speaker 2>popped the Northwestern tackle who sat out this past year.

1:06:37.480 --> 1:06:40.160
<v Speaker 2>But man, there are some names in here I'm like, oh, man,

1:06:40.840 --> 1:06:43.360
<v Speaker 2>this is you're rolling into the second round, and you

1:06:43.400 --> 1:06:46.280
<v Speaker 2>know we're seeing god whom I seeing the second round

1:06:46.280 --> 1:06:48.200
<v Speaker 2>that I remember just being like Jalen Mayfield was really

1:06:48.240 --> 1:06:51.160
<v Speaker 2>good for Michigan. They're just it's it seems like and

1:06:51.200 --> 1:06:53.040
<v Speaker 2>it's this way every year for me. You're like, man,

1:06:53.160 --> 1:06:55.520
<v Speaker 2>this guy's a third round pick. He was good in college.

1:06:55.680 --> 1:06:57.800
<v Speaker 2>Then I realize they're all good in college.

1:06:58.080 --> 1:07:00.680
<v Speaker 1>It's yeah, it's a it's a sneaky good tight end

1:07:00.720 --> 1:07:04.160
<v Speaker 1>draft too. Kyle Pitts of course, is chief among them,

1:07:04.280 --> 1:07:08.360
<v Speaker 1>but Baby Gronk Pat Fryarmuth also in this draft. Brevin

1:07:08.440 --> 1:07:11.240
<v Speaker 1>Jordan from Miami. Also in this draft. You've got a

1:07:11.240 --> 1:07:14.640
<v Speaker 1>whole list of guys who are I think potentially playmakers

1:07:14.640 --> 1:07:16.960
<v Speaker 1>coming out of that tight end spot. So I don't know,

1:07:17.080 --> 1:07:18.920
<v Speaker 1>right in soliverbal at gmail dot com, let us know

1:07:19.000 --> 1:07:20.960
<v Speaker 1>your thoughts on who you like who you don't like,

1:07:21.000 --> 1:07:24.520
<v Speaker 1>because we said, well, we'll do a show on Thursday.

1:07:24.560 --> 1:07:27.160
<v Speaker 1>We'll have some draft angle to it.

1:07:27.160 --> 1:07:28.959
<v Speaker 2>It's the only thing to talk of Notre Dame guys

1:07:29.000 --> 1:07:31.800
<v Speaker 2>in here in the top like three hundred yeah on

1:07:31.880 --> 1:07:32.680
<v Speaker 2>a Notre Dame guys.

1:07:32.800 --> 1:07:33.000
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

1:07:33.000 --> 1:07:36.840
<v Speaker 2>Along the offensive line, along that defensive front. Fascinating.

1:07:36.840 --> 1:07:38.400
<v Speaker 1>Building a winner, Dan, that's what they're doing.

1:07:39.040 --> 1:07:42.080
<v Speaker 2>I guess, so hard for me to argue.

1:07:41.840 --> 1:07:44.240
<v Speaker 1>Big Thanks to our guest of honor today, Robert Mays

1:07:44.280 --> 1:07:47.800
<v Speaker 1>from The Athletic. We will be back on Thursday. In

1:07:47.840 --> 1:07:50.440
<v Speaker 1>the meantime, going out to our website sliverbal dot com,

1:07:50.640 --> 1:07:54.480
<v Speaker 1>check out our patreon at verballers dot com, and follow

1:07:54.480 --> 1:07:57.240
<v Speaker 1>along on social media for that Go there, Dan Rubinstein

1:07:57.840 --> 1:07:59.960
<v Speaker 1>for myself, Tie Hildebrandt, We'll talk to you all soon.

1:08:00.000 --> 1:08:01.960
<v Speaker 1>In the meantime, Stay solid, peace

1:08:07.440 --> 1:08:07.800
<v Speaker 4>MHM.