Speaker 1: Welcome to Out of Office, the podcast about life and leadership.
Speaker 1: I'm your host, Malika Kapoor. Every week I bring you
Speaker 1: a conversation with the newsmaker speaking at a Bloomberg Live summit.
Speaker 1: This chat, which we record offstage, is freewheeling and it's informal.
Speaker 1: We got beyond the headlines and talk about things and
Speaker 1: newsmakers don't get asked about on stage or even in
Speaker 1: their offices. Their childhood aspirations, mentors, first jobs, their education,
Speaker 1: their high points, setbacks, downtime, what they want for Christmas,
Speaker 1: family and love. Because these influences make them who they
Speaker 1: are and define how they lead. This week, what is
Speaker 1: great actually is when people on the street just come
Speaker 1: up and say thank you so much. And I get
Speaker 1: loads of that. Please keep going, keep backling for the country.
Speaker 1: Lots of hoots and toots from the taxi community, the
Speaker 1: black cabs, great group of Brexiteers. You know quite a
Speaker 1: few of them. Give me free cab raids. Yeah you know,
Speaker 1: you know your friends are Meet Richard Tis, member of
Speaker 1: European Parliament and one of the most divisive figures in
Speaker 1: British politics. He started his career as a businessman, a
Speaker 1: property developer, but he's always had one foot in politics.
Speaker 1: From twenty fifteen he became increasingly involved in Brexit and
Speaker 1: is a founder of the pro Brexit groups Leave Means
Speaker 1: Leave and Leave dot Eu. In ten he became chairman
Speaker 1: of the Brexit Party, which was founded by politician Nigel
Speaker 1: Ferrad just a year ago. It's a young party, but
Speaker 1: it's making headlines. It was one of the most remarkable
Speaker 1: elections this country has ever seen, with both Labor and
Speaker 1: the Tories having historically abysmal results. In last Thursday's European election,
Speaker 1: Nigel Forrage's new Brexit Party topped the poll of nearly
Speaker 1: thirty Richard spoke about all things Brexit at the Bloomberg
Speaker 1: invest summit in London. There's nothing worse than a job
Speaker 1: half done, badly done. So we're gonna leave. We want
Speaker 1: a clean break Brexit that maximizes our negotiating position, minimizes
Speaker 1: the uncertainty. Everyone knows where they stand and we can
Speaker 1: get on with their lives and get on with adjusting
Speaker 1: to a post Brexit world. That's Richard tis the politician.
Speaker 1: My colleague gets Staply caught up with him when he
Speaker 1: came off stage. They chatted about football, he's a Liverpool fan,
Speaker 1: his passion for property, his school years, and what Richard
Speaker 1: Tys wants for Christmas. Your's ed with the so called
Speaker 1: bad boy of Brexit. So Richard Tye, welcome to this
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Live podcast. Thanks for joining us, great pleasure, and
Speaker 1: welcome to Bloomberg's headquarters. Yeah, it's incredible. I mean, I'm
Speaker 1: a real estate guy and I've never seen a building
Speaker 1: like it. It's absolutely a first time here. It's just
Speaker 1: the first time here. I've been to the previous headquarters
Speaker 1: a number of times, hopefully when been my last time.
Speaker 1: I've really enjoyed it. You know, the canteens extraordinary, the
Speaker 1: architectures extraordinary. Um and I go, that's one of all
Speaker 1: sorts of awards indeed, And I guess Mike Bloomberg had
Speaker 1: a decision to make when choosing where to build, as
Speaker 1: you ban HQ, and that decision predated Cameron's referendum commitment
Speaker 1: on Britain's membership of the EU in January. Do you
Speaker 1: think a company looking to set up a headquarters in
Speaker 1: Europe today we're still a hundred percent go for London. Oh, definitely.
Speaker 1: You mean a financial services business for sure. I mean,
Speaker 1: let's be very clear. The threat to London and you
Speaker 1: know we will have to live with competition in all
Speaker 1: our business lives. The threat to London is not Frankfurt
Speaker 1: or Paris. The threat to London is New York and Asia.
Speaker 1: Your family have been involved in property. I think for
Speaker 1: generation that's right, And so what what made you want
Speaker 1: to continue in that and that line of work? Now?
Speaker 1: I think, Look, I grew up steeped in a family
Speaker 1: of people who are involved in property, my grandfather and
Speaker 1: my uncle, my cousin, so you know that that was
Speaker 1: the natural place to go. I love it. I love
Speaker 1: the attraction of buildings, planning them, designing them, creating them.
Speaker 1: And you know, for me the pinnacle was was when
Speaker 1: I was chief executive of a London listed multinational billion
Speaker 1: pound company on the edge of the two fifty business
Speaker 1: called CLS Holdings, and you know, we were designing new
Speaker 1: buildings and here in London we designed a very large
Speaker 1: scheme down in Vauxhall which included two fifty story towers
Speaker 1: and for me that was that was something extraordinary. And
Speaker 1: they're now underway being built. Yeah, no, fantastic. And so
Speaker 1: about thirty years and probably investment um any regrets in
Speaker 1: that time. Hell, look, we we will make mistakes in life.
Speaker 1: The key is to learn from them and to try
Speaker 1: and not make them again, and try and make you know,
Speaker 1: more good decisions than bad decisions. But but the thing,
Speaker 1: you know, successful people know that you achieve that success
Speaker 1: by you make a decision and then you monitor it
Speaker 1: and adjust it. And having gone into the world of politics,
Speaker 1: what I've seen is far too often that actually people
Speaker 1: in politics and the civil service and too many public
Speaker 1: services actually not prepared to accept when something's gone wrong
Speaker 1: and quickly change it and adjust it and be open
Speaker 1: about it, as opposed to trying to cover it up
Speaker 1: or pretend that it's not going wrong. And one thing
Speaker 1: that interests me, and from a finance point of view here,
Speaker 1: you manage to navigate the two thousand and eight financial
Speaker 1: crisis extremely well. I think you sold a significant amount
Speaker 1: of the property you had by two thousand and seven
Speaker 1: and then bought again at the bottom of the market
Speaker 1: in two thousand and nine. Yep, that's absolutely right, you're
Speaker 1: very well informed. I'm very impressed. So who are you
Speaker 1: talking to at the time and how did you have
Speaker 1: that edge that other people clearly hadn't seen to be honest,
Speaker 1: just gut instinct, pure gut instinct. Having been involved since,
Speaker 1: you know, in the markets for the best part of
Speaker 1: twenty years, I've seen a recession in the early nineties
Speaker 1: and it just felt wrong. You know, every Tom Dick
Speaker 1: and Harry amateur was piling into the residential market and
Speaker 1: the commercial market. In the mid two thousand's, the banks
Speaker 1: were doing some extraordinary things. I mean, you know, you
Speaker 1: could borrow more than a hundred percent on a commercial
Speaker 1: property loan from the Scottish banks and that you just
Speaker 1: knew in your heart of hearts that was wrong, and
Speaker 1: people were just bidding ridiculous sums for property. We had
Speaker 1: a business, we had a hundred of people, and you know,
Speaker 1: it was a private business, and we just felt it
Speaker 1: was wrong, and so we said, let's do the opposite.
Speaker 1: Let's take a very early view. We went from a
Speaker 1: hundred people down to fifteen. We did that, you know,
Speaker 1: five outsourcing lots of our house building. You know, all
Speaker 1: those people were able to get jobs because it was
Speaker 1: still a booming economy. But we de risked the business
Speaker 1: and say, by the time the recession hit, basically the
Speaker 1: business had a parlor cash and no debt, and you
Speaker 1: know again that's that's long term gut instinct, and yes,
Speaker 1: I took Essentially, I paused for a couple of years,
Speaker 1: did some advisory work in the debt world, and then
Speaker 1: in o nine I got stuck back into corporate bonds
Speaker 1: which were completely miss priced in the real estate sector,
Speaker 1: had a time of distress. And then when I joined
Speaker 1: CLS in two thousand and ten, again the market was
Speaker 1: still on the floor, but I could see great buying
Speaker 1: opportunities and over a three year period we brought over
Speaker 1: two hundred million quids worth of real estate near the
Speaker 1: bottom of the market. Okay, I want to talk a
Speaker 1: bit about your journey to getting where you are now
Speaker 1: and a bit about you know, your upbringing. You grew
Speaker 1: up in the Midlands and attended the private boarding school
Speaker 1: Upping Him. We're another vice chair. What were your your
Speaker 1: likes and dislikes at school? What were the likes and
Speaker 1: dislikes I was. I wasn't great on the academic side.
Speaker 1: I enjoyed the sporting side, you know. Upping Him was
Speaker 1: a you know, it was a it was a pretty
Speaker 1: sort of tough school back in the late seventies. You know,
Speaker 1: if you need to go to the loo, you had
Speaker 1: to go outside. So you know, things have changed a lot.
Speaker 1: But you know, I've always been more of a believe
Speaker 1: or not. I was actually I'm six ft two now.
Speaker 1: In those days that's actually really quite short. Some people
Speaker 1: used to call me titch, so I was hooker in
Speaker 1: the scrum. That was always pretty painful. But no, you know,
Speaker 1: I I got through the school years, went to university
Speaker 1: to do a very technical degree, but that stood me
Speaker 1: well in the real estate sector. Now. I don't know
Speaker 1: if you'll thank me for this, but I I looked
Speaker 1: into A levels. Yes, you research amazing. I noticed you
Speaker 1: got two ease yes yeah, one in politics and one
Speaker 1: in maths, but an A and economic yes. So there
Speaker 1: we are. Was that you're waiting your revision m or
Speaker 1: did you get unlucky with the questions on that? So? No,
Speaker 1: being candid, Um, I just messed up the revision on politics. Um,
Speaker 1: so that was just a horlicks. My maths teacher and
Speaker 1: I didn't get on. And I think with maths, you know,
Speaker 1: like in any subject, you can hit a glass ceiling
Speaker 1: in something. And for me, just after what were then
Speaker 1: called O levels, I discovered a bit later I hit
Speaker 1: the glass ceiling. But economics was really you know, I
Speaker 1: loved it, and in a sense that interest is what
Speaker 1: sort of driven me ever since. And despite the poor
Speaker 1: exam results in politics, I've always had an interest in it,
Speaker 1: always loved it. And here we are. What was it
Speaker 1: like growing up in in the Tice household? Were you
Speaker 1: close to your siblings and parents growing up? Yeah, I know,
Speaker 1: we were pretty close. Two of us went to My
Speaker 1: brother and I went to the same the same school,
Speaker 1: upping him. My sister she was at a day school
Speaker 1: and then she went to Gordonston, So yeah, we were,
Speaker 1: you know, pretty close. In the holidays, my parents basically
Speaker 1: were separated from from the year dot. So you know
Speaker 1: that comes with with with different sort of challenges. And
Speaker 1: you know I was you know, I was very lucky
Speaker 1: in many would say I was born with a silver
Speaker 1: speed in my mouth. You know, I was very lucky.
Speaker 1: So I'm very cognizant of of giving something back, playing
Speaker 1: my part in society. And I think you've got kids
Speaker 1: of your own. Yeah, I've got three kids. Do you
Speaker 1: have political conversations with them around the around the very much? So,
Speaker 1: very much. So. I've got two boys and a girl,
Speaker 1: just the girls, the only one still at school in
Speaker 1: her last year. The politics, obviously is is part of
Speaker 1: our part of our discussion, and you know, we agree
Speaker 1: on some things and we disagree on our things. In fact,
Speaker 1: it was my my second son who helped educate me
Speaker 1: when he was on his his gap year in in
Speaker 1: Asia about you know, the environmental damage caused by plastics,
Speaker 1: people just discarding plastics, the sort of the plastic mountains
Speaker 1: he saw on the beaches of Vietnam, talking about the
Speaker 1: plastic island that is in the Pacific Ocean, and you know,
Speaker 1: that was really really educational for me. I was very
Speaker 1: grateful for that. If you thinking back when you were twenty,
Speaker 1: and it's one of thing you would wish you knew
Speaker 1: then that you know now that's a great question. Yeah,
Speaker 1: a lot sound, lots of things. Networking just keep talking
Speaker 1: to lots of people. And funny enough, on the one hand,
Speaker 1: social media is good for networking, but on the other hand,
Speaker 1: it's actually very bad for talking. And I probably then
Speaker 1: wasn't wasn't a great talker, more open networking, but even not.
Speaker 1: Actually I used to be quite shy and so you know,
Speaker 1: walk into a room i'd sort of slightly sort of
Speaker 1: stay at the door. But actually, you know, you you
Speaker 1: make your own luck. You've got to make your own networking.
Speaker 1: And you know what, there's nothing like knowing people being
Speaker 1: able to pick up a phone and build that network
Speaker 1: of contacts and build connections. It's amazing how that helps
Speaker 1: you throughout your working life. Yeah. Absolutely, and then he
Speaker 1: went on to as you said, Sofford University, how do
Speaker 1: you enjoy that? And what do you make of Manchester?
Speaker 1: Um Manchester was a very different city then. I mean,
Speaker 1: it was really tough and solf was was very much
Speaker 1: the rough end of it, but it was it was
Speaker 1: a really diligent technical course. I did look to be honest.
Speaker 1: They used to call me a bit of a so
Speaker 1: the Southern PUFTA and I had a Renaer five Turbo
Speaker 1: at the time, so you know, I was known as
Speaker 1: Dick Turbot. But it was great. I played I didn't
Speaker 1: play rugby there, I played soccer. We played in the
Speaker 1: local leagues and it was you know, it was really
Speaker 1: good for me. I'm probably one of the few people
Speaker 1: that has been to strange Way Prison, not once, but twice.
Speaker 1: I'm pleased to say that was to play football where
Speaker 1: we played against the inmates and it went surprised you
Speaker 1: to learn you'll probably be pleased to learn we always
Speaker 1: had to play away. Wow, that must have been interesting.
Speaker 1: Where did you play? I was goalkeeper and so at
Speaker 1: strange ways of prison. To this day I never forget.
Speaker 1: I basically fouled an attacker, gave away a penalty and
Speaker 1: one of the inmates came up to me and he said,
Speaker 1: if you know what's good for your son, you'll let
Speaker 1: this in and did okay. Very interesting, so then you know,
Speaker 1: fast forwarding to where we are now, you've been involved
Speaker 1: in campaigning, funding and supporting Braxit for many years. You
Speaker 1: co founded leave dot e Dean, You've been really successful
Speaker 1: in business and you know you've got a lot of
Speaker 1: chargeable causes. Why is it so important to you to
Speaker 1: be involved in politics? Now? What? What? What draws you
Speaker 1: to it? I've always been drawn to it. I've always
Speaker 1: had an interest in it. I like being involved in
Speaker 1: well run businesses and I have a simple expression. If
Speaker 1: the country was one as well as a well managed,
Speaker 1: lean efficient business, then frankly would all be in a
Speaker 1: much better place. And I always said to myself, I'd
Speaker 1: want to do give will take thirty years in business
Speaker 1: and then try and give something back to public life.
Speaker 1: What have you made of former Prime Minister David Cameron's
Speaker 1: new book On the Record, quite a candid account of
Speaker 1: his time in office. I haven't actually read it. I'm
Speaker 1: sort of hoping someone might give it to me for Christmas.
Speaker 1: Generally I read books on an iPad, but it would
Speaker 1: be great if someone gives it to me. I've seen
Speaker 1: some of the serialization. I think, obviously I have to
Speaker 1: be grateful to Cameron because he gave us the referendum.
Speaker 1: What I'm not grateful for was his disgraceful involvement in
Speaker 1: Project Fear. What he should have done as Prime Minister
Speaker 1: is he should have basically said, look, this is my view.
Speaker 1: I'm going to say it a couple of times, and
Speaker 1: then I'm going to act as a a presidential style
Speaker 1: referee and call out both sides if they talk a
Speaker 1: lot of nonsense. If he had done that, he would
Speaker 1: still be Prime Minister. He didn't. He got stuck in
Speaker 1: the weeds. He chose the wrong side. He was heavily
Speaker 1: involved in Project Fear, which turned out to be a
Speaker 1: load of complete nonsense, and the rest is history. So
Speaker 1: Brexit has divided friends and family throughout the country. Boris
Speaker 1: Johnson has recently found that have your friendships or relationships
Speaker 1: suffered as a result of Brexit? Are your have your
Speaker 1: friends with many remainers at all? Yes, No, I am,
Speaker 1: And I would say a sizeable chunk of my friends
Speaker 1: votes that what I would call moderate remain voters, almost
Speaker 1: all of them now would actually vote leave on the
Speaker 1: basis of democracy and how the he has behaved since.
Speaker 1: Where I've actually really lost people on on a much
Speaker 1: more sort of the base of angst and anger is
Speaker 1: actually in the business community. I mean the real estate
Speaker 1: community in London, you know, I mean some people have
Speaker 1: been absolutely I mean they've just just gone off the chart.
Speaker 1: So you know, stuff happens. And when you put your
Speaker 1: head above the parapet, and you know, most of the
Speaker 1: business community are not brave enough to do that. But
Speaker 1: if you put your head about the parapet, you know,
Speaker 1: the grief, the angst, the victory old comes. It comes
Speaker 1: over in bucket loads. And yeah I use Twitter, and yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean the abuse is is hysterical, It's ridiculous. I
Speaker 1: didn't look at it. My kids do it upsets them,
Speaker 1: I'm broad shouldered. It's the nature of what is great
Speaker 1: actually is when people on the street just come up
Speaker 1: and say thank you so much, and I get loads
Speaker 1: of that. Please keep going, keep battling for the country.
Speaker 1: Lots of hoots and toots from the taxi community, the
Speaker 1: black cabs, great group of brexiteers. You know, quite a
Speaker 1: few of them. Give me free cab rides. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: you know your friends are sounds all right outside of
Speaker 1: business and politics. What do you do for fun? For fun?
Speaker 1: So over the years, you know, I've played a fair
Speaker 1: but golf. Skiing is my big thing. I used to
Speaker 1: do five side soccer until recently calling it soccer. What
Speaker 1: was the soccer football? You know? So that, but no,
Speaker 1: skiing is skis my big thing. I've recently got into
Speaker 1: into cycling and spin classes. I would say I'm sort
Speaker 1: of moderate at its stroke, a stroker, a bit of
Speaker 1: a clueless amateur, but it's it's great exercise. I love it.
Speaker 1: And a Liverpool fan as well, yeah, and been a
Speaker 1: very patient Liberal fan over over many decades, since the
Speaker 1: mid seventies. But you know, this could be our year.
Speaker 1: This player well over the years, I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: Douglas was sort of probably my my hero, but obviously
Speaker 1: at the moment it has to be Salah, yes, of course.
Speaker 1: And finally, how would you describe yourself in three words?
Speaker 1: Goodness me, I'm an optimist, the glass is always half full,
Speaker 1: it's never half empty, optimist, optimist, optimist, optimist, optimist, optimist,
Speaker 1: bridget Tice, thank you very much, great to be here.
Speaker 1: That was Ed Stapley in conversation with Brexit Party chairman
Speaker 1: Richard Tys. I hope you enjoyed that chat as much
Speaker 1: as I did. Our new podcast series, Out of Office
Speaker 1: Conversations about Life and Leadership, launches on January sixt and
Speaker 1: you'll be able to catch all the episodes on the
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Terminal, on our website bloombug dot com, on Apple podcasts,
Speaker 1: or on Spotify. We are also on Twitter, where a
Speaker 1: handle is simply at podcasts. We'd love it if you
Speaker 1: could take a minute to rate and review our show,
Speaker 1: so please do that if you can, and I really
Speaker 1: hope you'll join us again for more candid, informal conversations
Speaker 1: with newsmakers. This episode was produced by Laura Carlson. I'm
Speaker 1: Malika Kapoor. You can find me at This is Malika
Speaker 1: on Twitter. Thank you for listening.