Speaker 1: Hey, welcome in. This is the all New All Ball
Speaker 1: Doug Gottlieb here and just a reminder, you can listen
Speaker 1: to the daily radio show three to six Eastern twelve
Speaker 1: to three Pacific. You can also listen to in the
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app or likely wherever you downloaded this podcast,
Speaker 1: you can download that daily podcast. Hope you're great, and
Speaker 1: we are creeping into a time in which we're gonna
Speaker 1: have basketball. I guess we have had basketball with TBT,
Speaker 1: with the Basketball Tournament on TV. Get Gets talk a
Speaker 1: little bit about that in a second, But um, like
Speaker 1: NBA basketball is a couple of weeks away, and it's
Speaker 1: gonna be fascinating because as much as we we like
Speaker 1: to act like no one's been doing anything, I think
Speaker 1: the reality is lots of guys have been doing something. Now. Look,
Speaker 1: I have heard several players say, well, I hadn't touched
Speaker 1: the ball for a couple of months. I find that
Speaker 1: to be bullshit. Frankly, Um, it doesn't mean that you've
Speaker 1: been doing You are doing full workouts the entire time.
Speaker 1: But the I haven't touched the ball in three months,
Speaker 1: Come on, and maybe you haven't, but that's negligence. You
Speaker 1: do well there was just no gym's open. Try that
Speaker 1: one with your coach. You know, we're gonna be reasonable
Speaker 1: about health and injuries and all that other stuff. But
Speaker 1: in the real in the real world of sports, I
Speaker 1: don't buy for a second that guys UH didn't touch
Speaker 1: a basketball or like guys couldn't find a gym, right,
Speaker 1: but everybody has. If you, if you're if you're an
Speaker 1: NBA player, I guarantee there is a basketball gym which
Speaker 1: you could get some shots up. Could you be in
Speaker 1: your regular routine? Of course not, that's that's reasonable. But
Speaker 1: this idea, and I'm not talking about you had a
Speaker 1: Mike Conley set up. He had a full gym in
Speaker 1: your house. Every one of those guys if they wanted to,
Speaker 1: they wanted to, was working on their game or working
Speaker 1: on their body. All right, let's welcome him in. I
Speaker 1: want to talk to hoops. I got some different thoughts.
Speaker 1: Eric Bossey, who's UH a lead basketball analysts for Rivals,
Speaker 1: good friend of the program, the radio program, and he
Speaker 1: has been on the pod before. He's awesome. Let's get
Speaker 1: after it. Let's let's welcome in. He's Eric Fosse, he's
Speaker 1: a friend of the pod and I think he does
Speaker 1: a great job, and uh, Eric, I really appreciate you
Speaker 1: taking some time with this. Um. What are your expectations
Speaker 1: for basketball in the bubble? Like when I say I
Speaker 1: hadn't played for a couple of months, they're gonna they're
Speaker 1: gonna have they have a short training camp, they start
Speaker 1: games in a couple of weeks. What are your expectations
Speaker 1: for what hoop looks like. Uh, I think it's gonna
Speaker 1: be hopefully a little bit higher level than most people
Speaker 1: are expecting, just because I feel like there's a lot
Speaker 1: of these guys who are ready to get out there
Speaker 1: and continue. But even if if it's not up to
Speaker 1: the standards that we would be expecting normally, we're watching
Speaker 1: basketball in the summer is normally, you know, Jude or
Speaker 1: July basketball is the NBA Finals, right when it's at
Speaker 1: his highest level. I'm sorry, I got a lung to
Speaker 1: goron by, so we know that it's not going to
Speaker 1: be perfect, but I don't think it's gonna be terrible,
Speaker 1: And frankly, I really don't care. I'm just so excited
Speaker 1: to get to see basketball. And I don't know, I'm
Speaker 1: kind of a nerd. I keep seeing these random names
Speaker 1: like the Michael Beasley's of the world popping up and
Speaker 1: getting another shot at things. I'm kind of interested to
Speaker 1: see these guys and see, maybe can these guys were
Speaker 1: fighting for the professional lives inject a little bit of
Speaker 1: life into things. Yeah, I mean, look, I think they're
Speaker 1: gonna get buckets. I think whether it's Beasley if he
Speaker 1: gets minutes, or is Jamal Crawford. Um, I don't think
Speaker 1: those those type of guys generally win games, but yes,
Speaker 1: I'm with you, it feels like it for those that
Speaker 1: like an advanced veterans sort of summer league where you're
Speaker 1: gonna match up those type of guys with some there
Speaker 1: will be some G League guys playing at who are hungry, right, hungry,
Speaker 1: hungry to play, And that part of it is I
Speaker 1: didn't even think of that. That part of it should
Speaker 1: make it fun. Yeah, it's just obviously that's not who
Speaker 1: you're tuning in for, Like I'm tuning in to see
Speaker 1: who's gonna win a championship. You know how Lebron gonna
Speaker 1: look after all these things like any normal basketball fan,
Speaker 1: but also you know, as someone who lives and breeding basketball,
Speaker 1: all these different substories that they're really interesting to me.
Speaker 1: They're interesting to me as well. Um. I guess my
Speaker 1: thought is pre the the the games before the playoffs,
Speaker 1: especially the teams that are established, my guests would be
Speaker 1: they cycle through everybody, they work at, they work on stuff,
Speaker 1: they they let everybody plays like right, like if you've
Speaker 1: got a uniform in, some socks and some shoes you're
Speaker 1: getting in. I think that part will be interesting. Up
Speaker 1: for like the Lakers and the Bucks and the Clippers.
Speaker 1: My expectations are for them to tinker with some lineups,
Speaker 1: play some depth, you know, try some different things as well,
Speaker 1: and it will be I can advance preseason, which I
Speaker 1: which I really like. And then you have all those kinds.
Speaker 1: Then you have the teams that are not playoff teams
Speaker 1: and that's you know, like like the Washington Wizards and
Speaker 1: how they play will be interesting. And then you have
Speaker 1: the Nets who all their best players decided to to
Speaker 1: not show up. What what I want you? When you
Speaker 1: see some of these dudes complaining about food and accommodations,
Speaker 1: what do you think? Uh? On one hand, I kind
Speaker 1: of get it because they're they're they're they're they're rich, right,
Speaker 1: And I think any rich person or a lot of
Speaker 1: rich people are a lot of people would means in
Speaker 1: that situation who are used to a certain level of service.
Speaker 1: There's there's gonna be some grass and we'd like to
Speaker 1: say that we wouldn't, but you know, I mean, I'm
Speaker 1: far from rich. And as I've gone through the years,
Speaker 1: I've been known to complain a time or two about
Speaker 1: a hotel that a lot of people would be very
Speaker 1: happy to stay in. But I think right now a
Speaker 1: lot of it is on the tongue in cheek and
Speaker 1: just kind of a woes me. But I really don't
Speaker 1: think it's that big of an issue. And you know,
Speaker 1: there's lots of things for me to get upset about
Speaker 1: in my life NBA players compared complaining about their food
Speaker 1: and Disney just isn't on tie on my list of
Speaker 1: things to worry about. No, I don't. But I also
Speaker 1: think that that it's it's um here's the part that
Speaker 1: I was thinking of, where on one level, we're starting
Speaker 1: to realize or maybe the guys are starting to realize
Speaker 1: that they do have power behind their voice, right like, like, look,
Speaker 1: your respected guys, because in your chosen craft, you've made
Speaker 1: it and many of these guys, as you've known following
Speaker 1: them through the recruiting circuit, like they're they're actually very
Speaker 1: very bright guys who would be successful in whatever field
Speaker 1: they chosen. They're just bodies and skills, and early development
Speaker 1: was basketball, and so they've used that and it's built
Speaker 1: their platform. Be like wow, you know, there's a lot
Speaker 1: of the rest of America who has come to figure
Speaker 1: out that these guys are actually super, super bright, active
Speaker 1: citizens the United States. The juctaposition of that with the
Speaker 1: bitching about food and a decent hotel room, you know,
Speaker 1: where America goes to vacation with their kids. I just
Speaker 1: think it's a it's a little bit of a dicey
Speaker 1: thing because the old picture is worth a thousand words,
Speaker 1: like video with commentary is worth even more words than that.
Speaker 1: And I just think you have to be very You're like,
Speaker 1: you don't have to kiss everybody's ass and tell them
Speaker 1: how great Disney World is and how amazing it is
Speaker 1: and when you're showing a regular hotel room. But I
Speaker 1: I just think there's a limit, and you've got to
Speaker 1: be smart with your use of social media. If you're
Speaker 1: gonna use social media just to have fun and to
Speaker 1: clown around with what's going on in quarantine. Cool, but
Speaker 1: use it for that and then you you want to
Speaker 1: you know, you want social change. I think that can
Speaker 1: be really hard for most people's brains, like my ear brain,
Speaker 1: and I think a lot of people we understand there's
Speaker 1: a difference there. I don't know if that's how more
Speaker 1: people take can make the switch in the social media. Oh,
Speaker 1: now you're serious about demanding social change. Five minutes ago,
Speaker 1: you're complaining about the fact that you've got a sandwich
Speaker 1: in some sort of plastic container. Yeah, I think I
Speaker 1: think that's a really fair point, doug Um. You know,
Speaker 1: I think what you're getting to is because some of
Speaker 1: the message there, some of the greater, broader, more important
Speaker 1: societal messages they're looking at me made, can some people
Speaker 1: look at them to go, well, I can't take this
Speaker 1: guy seriously. He's he's graping about I was chicken looks
Speaker 1: is staying in the Swan and Disney, Right. I get that,
Speaker 1: and I see that, and I see some merit in that.
Speaker 1: But I also think that anyone who's small minded enough
Speaker 1: to dismiss someone uh position on social issues or things
Speaker 1: like that because they complain about some food, you're probably
Speaker 1: not changing their mind anyway. Yeah, that's a it's a
Speaker 1: that's a very smart point me, Eric Bossi joining us
Speaker 1: here in the All Ball podcast years ago. Lebron um,
Speaker 1: it wasn't just that he chose Miami. It was the
Speaker 1: way in which he went about it. And look, you've
Speaker 1: been around for hundreds of these. I can remember the
Speaker 1: time where I put on the Notre Dame hat to
Speaker 1: choose Notre Dame and we had a little press conference.
Speaker 1: It's like a tradition that seems to be you know,
Speaker 1: like I remember, was it like Johnny be Good? Right?
Speaker 1: That was the but in that movie in the I
Speaker 1: think the eighties Anthony Michael Johnny be Good, where you
Speaker 1: have a big press conference you announce where you're gonna
Speaker 1: go to school. That was kind of what Lebron did,
Speaker 1: only he hired Jim Gray. They did in Connecticut. There
Speaker 1: was some weird aspects to it. First thing ten years
Speaker 1: ago when that announcement came down. Where were you, Um,
Speaker 1: I was in a gym watching a basketball so I
Speaker 1: didn't even get to watch it on TV. Where gosh,
Speaker 1: I can't remember. I would imagine probably probably at the
Speaker 1: Peach Jamber getting ready for the Pam. But I know
Speaker 1: I didn't watch it on TV, and so given the
Speaker 1: time of year, I'm gonna assume I was watching summer basketball,
Speaker 1: all right, So what do what? What was? Do you
Speaker 1: remember what you thought? Was you just nodding or did
Speaker 1: you think it was weird? Like? What do you think?
Speaker 1: There was a lot of talk about, cause certainly it
Speaker 1: caused a lot of things. Um to me, I thought
Speaker 1: it was I didn't think it was. I thought a
Speaker 1: little bit much ado about not thinking And when I
Speaker 1: saw the video of it, I thought back to when
Speaker 1: Kobe Bryant announced coming out of high school, because he
Speaker 1: said something very similar. He said that he was gonna
Speaker 1: take his talents to the NBA, and so I thought
Speaker 1: maybe it was kind of a nod to Kobe in it.
Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden, you know, things just exploded.
Speaker 1: I guess I didn't realize that it would it would
Speaker 1: rub so many people the wrong way. I was just like,
Speaker 1: you know, this is a a young guy making a
Speaker 1: big deal, trying to do something different, and maybe it
Speaker 1: didn't go off perfectly, but you know, I guess I'm
Speaker 1: more of a don't get too fired up about things
Speaker 1: you can't control and I'm sure in retrospect Lebron would
Speaker 1: like to do it differently, But I think the bigger
Speaker 1: conversation and it was what it led to, what's kind
Speaker 1: of the formation of the super keep and stuff that
Speaker 1: are coming about. And I think that more more than
Speaker 1: how he did it, there's what really got some people going.
Speaker 1: Did well it was it good for basketball? Yeah? I
Speaker 1: mean I don't I don't think it was. I don't
Speaker 1: think it was bad for basketball. Um, you know, we
Speaker 1: all like to see guys compete ball man. I kind
Speaker 1: of like seeing really good players play with other really
Speaker 1: good players, and that movement and they got going with
Speaker 1: with him and and and Wade and Bosh and it
Speaker 1: ushered in kind of a new era whereas you had
Speaker 1: super teams in the past, but they were they were
Speaker 1: built from within because guys were locked in the longer
Speaker 1: contracts and free agency was so much different and stuff
Speaker 1: like that. So it was kind of I guess the kickoff,
Speaker 1: kickstart and the jumping off to the NBA that we've
Speaker 1: see right now. And you know, as I mentioned to you,
Speaker 1: Sorry if I'm rambling here, I mentioned to you, I
Speaker 1: thought that was I thought it was a little bit
Speaker 1: of byproduct of the summer basketball system that Lebron came
Speaker 1: up in. When you know, he was traveling to play
Speaker 1: with the team out of Oakland with Kendrick Perkins in
Speaker 1: leon Po and stuff like that. And I thought it
Speaker 1: was just a manifestation of the summer thing that most
Speaker 1: of those younger star NBA players who didn't send much
Speaker 1: time in college came up through making its way to
Speaker 1: the NBA, and those guys kind of learning that hey,
Speaker 1: you know, we got flown all around in summer ball.
Speaker 1: Now we could kind of we could kind of take
Speaker 1: controls things and kind of reshape the NBA. Yeah. The problem,
Speaker 1: the downside to it is um again, the juxtaposition with
Speaker 1: the National Football League, where player movement is not, especially
Speaker 1: with the most important position at quarterback. It rarely happens
Speaker 1: in the prime of somebody's prime, with somebody's career because
Speaker 1: really they have to want to get rid of you
Speaker 1: in order for that to happen. Right, Like Brady left,
Speaker 1: but Brady's forty three years old. Uh, bred Farv left,
Speaker 1: but bred Farv had retired and come back. It was
Speaker 1: his third time he was trying to come back. Um,
Speaker 1: Philip Rivers is like thirty eight, thirty nine years old,
Speaker 1: and that that's the only where's you know in the
Speaker 1: primus career is no chance he's getting out of sane
Speaker 1: diego no chance. And these guys moved for the most
Speaker 1: part in the prime of their career. And what I
Speaker 1: think that does is between the teams, the familiar familiarity,
Speaker 1: and even the opponents of the teams. You you know, well,
Speaker 1: every year when you played the Annapolis Colts, you had
Speaker 1: Paid Manning. Every year when you play the Patriots, you
Speaker 1: got Tom Brady, et cetera. Like there's a it's better
Speaker 1: for the sport. And I think the same is true
Speaker 1: with the NBA. And I again, I understand the Lebron
Speaker 1: like for to me, the Lebron thing was more. Also,
Speaker 1: it wasn't just about playing with otter players than he
Speaker 1: had in Cleveland, or for better organization. But I also
Speaker 1: think it was about a kind of a coming of age.
Speaker 1: He hadn't gotten a chance to get out of Ohio.
Speaker 1: He went to high school there, he played professionally there,
Speaker 1: and like at some point, like man, I gotta see
Speaker 1: what the you know, I gotta see what the some
Speaker 1: other part of the world is, Like I gotta gotta
Speaker 1: grow up, and I think he did, and and I
Speaker 1: think even losing that first NBA Finals helped him grow
Speaker 1: up and and then and then obviously came back and
Speaker 1: made it a success story. But I understood it. I
Speaker 1: can understand it and tell you he had every right
Speaker 1: to do it and get why playing around better players
Speaker 1: already better. But I think it it won change the
Speaker 1: trajectory of how we will always look at him fair unfair.
Speaker 1: That's just the reality of it. And secondly, I think
Speaker 1: it changed the landscape of the NBA for the worst
Speaker 1: because guys don't have the same affinity for where they're playing,
Speaker 1: and they're waiting for that moment where they can get
Speaker 1: out and they can, you know, find the guys that
Speaker 1: they've always wanted to play with and create their own
Speaker 1: dream team. Yeah. I think you've got some really fair points, fair, Doug.
Speaker 1: And I think also though, if we're gonna hold players
Speaker 1: to those kind of standards on things, I think ownership
Speaker 1: and general managers and people of that nature and how
Speaker 1: they treat those star players has changed quite a bit too.
Speaker 1: I don't think there's quite as much loyalty from that
Speaker 1: end of things, and so I think that has uh,
Speaker 1: enabled these guys and emboldened them to grab the bull
Speaker 1: by the horns and do this more on their own. Whereas,
Speaker 1: like you said, you're talking about these NFL quarterbacks, there
Speaker 1: was never any questions if those guys are gonna get
Speaker 1: brought back. There's never any question is if Pat Mahomes
Speaker 1: was gonna get taken care of about the Kanas City Chiefs, right,
Speaker 1: I feel in basketball, maybe there's been a little bit
Speaker 1: more questions on those guys, and especially now with the
Speaker 1: way the contracts have taken off and everything and things
Speaker 1: of guys you know, well, you know, we really want
Speaker 1: to keep rad Beal around. Are we gonna pay him
Speaker 1: this next super Max? When you know Bill has been
Speaker 1: nothing but the best guy guy could be for the Wizards,
Speaker 1: And what have they done to help him out? Could
Speaker 1: you blame him for wanting to jump out on his
Speaker 1: next chance? You know, So there's a lot of sides
Speaker 1: you could take him. But I think you've got a
Speaker 1: fair point. And it's definitely I think it's maybe a
Speaker 1: little bit of different and how the different viewers and
Speaker 1: consumers of the NBA look at things. I think the
Speaker 1: more new school Twitter NBA fans probably don't care about it.
Speaker 1: But the old school guys, the more purist and thing
Speaker 1: like you know, who sit around and it really want
Speaker 1: a team and a guy that they can root for
Speaker 1: through his entire career in one place. They don't like it.
Speaker 1: But guys, I think now there's more fans of players
Speaker 1: versus fans of thieves. And it's probably a result of
Speaker 1: guys jumping around. So it's a little bit of both. Yeah, um,
Speaker 1: I and I do think though it, you know, I
Speaker 1: think the AU mentality also has has changed things. I know,
Speaker 1: the Oakland Soldiers thing was always interesting. And look, it's
Speaker 1: interesting because my my late father, I mean, we used
Speaker 1: to bring guys in. Ronnie Henderson stayed in my house
Speaker 1: for us a summer. I mean, you've got to go
Speaker 1: back through I could. We used to have a guy
Speaker 1: from Roman Rushenko who played with Ronnie Henderson and l
Speaker 1: s U uh uh yeah. I can think of like
Speaker 1: thirty guys who would stay at my house from out
Speaker 1: of the area. And then AU of course tried to,
Speaker 1: uh tried to, you know, change the rule where you
Speaker 1: gotta play with guys kind of in your area. But
Speaker 1: but you can get around that by saying you're going
Speaker 1: to prep school or whatever. Like there's there was always loopholes.
Speaker 1: But it's interesting because that movement combined with Lebrons movement UM,
Speaker 1: and I think some player empowerment because of social media,
Speaker 1: and I think that's why we have so much movement
Speaker 1: in college basketball, which I definitely think has hurt the work. Again,
Speaker 1: I'm a transfer and I'm not sure and for people
Speaker 1: don't know, like, yeah, I got in trouble, but I
Speaker 1: was thinking about transferring anyway, just for a better fit
Speaker 1: and to play with better players. Um. But I also
Speaker 1: think that uh so I'd be hypocritical if I didn't
Speaker 1: mention that. But I think all of this movement it
Speaker 1: makes it hard when you turn on college basketball on
Speaker 1: TV to know who's playing for who, because there's so
Speaker 1: much player movement from when you're next, no question, it
Speaker 1: all triples down and it's all part of kind of
Speaker 1: instant gratification. And you know there are a lot of
Speaker 1: players who like this. If you're a school and you're
Speaker 1: recruited kid who went to three different high schools and
Speaker 1: play for four different summer teams, I've got no problem
Speaker 1: with the kid who did that. He needs to do
Speaker 1: whatever he thinks isn't his best interest, right. But if
Speaker 1: you're a school and he recruit that kid expecting that
Speaker 1: you've got the secret saft to be the reason that
Speaker 1: he's not going to switch, well, then I pack it's
Speaker 1: kind of foolish on your part to expect a different result.
Speaker 1: You now, if you can make, if you can if
Speaker 1: you can change that and you can get that kid
Speaker 1: to stay, then wow, you know, more power to you.
Speaker 1: You've done something impressive. But a lot of it is
Speaker 1: is guys taking guys that they know they're going to transfer,
Speaker 1: or as you know this, every spring, we got a
Speaker 1: lot of we get a lot of kids to get
Speaker 1: reached on by schools, and some of us an industry,
Speaker 1: we joke around with each other like there's a lot
Speaker 1: of kids where we could probably write their transfer story
Speaker 1: the same day we write their commitment story, just because
Speaker 1: we know either a history of jumping around or we
Speaker 1: know that a schools taking a guy just to take
Speaker 1: a guy. So until we get schools not taking guys
Speaker 1: that they know they don't really have any future plans
Speaker 1: for they just want practice bodies. And until we've got
Speaker 1: guys going to places that they're serious about, it's gonna
Speaker 1: be a problem that the answers have to from all around. So,
Speaker 1: you know, I think the NBA and some of those
Speaker 1: things like it contribue it. Because you dream of playing that,
Speaker 1: you watch those guys doing it suponsciously, you think you
Speaker 1: need to do that too. It's a human nature, right.
Speaker 1: But the solution is it's as you know, Doug, it's
Speaker 1: it's a really big conversation and and and it involves
Speaker 1: a lot of moving parts. Um, okay, so what you
Speaker 1: for for people don't know? Ericson National Basketball Analysts for arrivals.
Speaker 1: You can follow on Twitter at boss Hoops. You can
Speaker 1: follo him on Facebook which is facebook dot com, slash
Speaker 1: e Boss Hoops on Instagram at the Boss Hoops as well.
Speaker 1: He's McDonald's all American voter. This is your time of year, right,
Speaker 1: this is July. You're supposed to be pee jam Vegas,
Speaker 1: Indian speace, you know, maybe coming here and watch some
Speaker 1: pangos or some l A staff or whatever. Um, how
Speaker 1: how are you able to do your job to evaluate?
Speaker 1: And we didn't have a conclusion to high school most
Speaker 1: high school hoops. We didn't have spring and we're not
Speaker 1: having summer. Yeah, it's it's been tough dugs because for
Speaker 1: the most part, most state High Schools Association has got
Speaker 1: their seasons completed or at least to a final four,
Speaker 1: quarterfinals or something like that, so you're able to go
Speaker 1: back and review the last month and a half of
Speaker 1: the season. So because there's so much more film available,
Speaker 1: whether it be with huddle or NHS or streaming services
Speaker 1: or whatever, so you can you can find a pretty
Speaker 1: good representation of how how a player finished his sophomore, freshman, software, junior,
Speaker 1: or high school. Those are the guys that were evaluating now, right,
Speaker 1: But to go beyond that, it's tricky because with these kids, man,
Speaker 1: what they looked like in February of their sophomore year,
Speaker 1: it looks a lot different than what they look like
Speaker 1: in July before junior year of high school. There's a
Speaker 1: lot of growth and a lot of maturation going on there.
Speaker 1: And yes, there's there's some events out there that are
Speaker 1: being streams. Uh, you know, like you mentioned Pengos Donos
Speaker 1: Is run leagues in Arizona and Iowa and Utah. There's
Speaker 1: been a lot of events in Texas, Florida and things
Speaker 1: like that. But that's really I would guess maybe only
Speaker 1: of the country is really out there playing and guys
Speaker 1: aren't playing against the same level of competition that you're
Speaker 1: used to sing against. And we're watching things online and
Speaker 1: some streams are great, some streams are not great. So
Speaker 1: it's it's made a very tough to evaluate. You can
Speaker 1: you still I still probably spend I don't know a
Speaker 1: minimum sendence twelve hours each weekend watching live streams to
Speaker 1: try and keep up on guys and follow up on guys,
Speaker 1: and people are given me STIPs on but you just
Speaker 1: can't substitute being in the gym and seeing guys because
Speaker 1: you get so much better feel for actual size, actual
Speaker 1: level lettuces and speed of the games, things like that,
Speaker 1: um you know, its ability to side on the fly.
Speaker 1: And then also we're only getting a quarter of the picture,
Speaker 1: and it's hard to sit there and say, okay, I
Speaker 1: feel like this guy's elevated into a top twenty five
Speaker 1: player nashally the top one hunter player or whatever, or
Speaker 1: high major wins. You can't see him against three quarters
Speaker 1: in the rest of the country, or even if not
Speaker 1: against him, you can't see those guys from all those
Speaker 1: other regions. So it's really tricky and man, I can't
Speaker 1: imagine what it's like for college coaches right now, because
Speaker 1: I know what's happening. They're getting called from high school coaches,
Speaker 1: summer coaches, and they're getting told, hey, man, you guys,
Speaker 1: say my word for this guy's this guy is a
Speaker 1: good night. You need to offer him. And we're in this.
Speaker 1: You've got to offer environment right now in high school sports.
Speaker 1: And I think that a few things are gonna happen.
Speaker 1: We're gonna see some guys go too high, some guys
Speaker 1: go too low. And like you're talking about with the
Speaker 1: transfers that have been bad, now we're about to enter.
Speaker 1: We're about to enter like a tsunami of transfers. And
Speaker 1: compared to the hurricane or whatever you want to call it,
Speaker 1: a transfers it it's going to get a lot worse
Speaker 1: before it gets better. I think I'm fascinated by like
Speaker 1: three names I want to ask you about in one.
Speaker 1: Let me start with Patrick Baldwin. Um. He's a top
Speaker 1: five on everybody's list, maybe top ten, I don't know
Speaker 1: where you have evaluated. For people who don't know, his
Speaker 1: dad is the head coach u W Milwaukee. His dad
Speaker 1: also played at Northwestern and he's a former assistant with
Speaker 1: Doug Collins. Um, he's a great student, he's a very
Speaker 1: good player. He's six nine. Last time we saw him,
Speaker 1: it was two hundred pounds. And there's the does he
Speaker 1: go to u w M and save his dad's job?
Speaker 1: Does he go to his dad's alma mater and and
Speaker 1: and kind of save save Chris Collins job? Right? Or
Speaker 1: does he go to Duke where, of course Chris Collins played,
Speaker 1: And it would it would kind of make a lot
Speaker 1: of sense. And if the other things, if the other
Speaker 1: entanglements weren't there. For somebody who hasn't seen Patrick Baldwin Jr. Play,
Speaker 1: what is he like? Uh, he's he's gifted. He's extremely skilled. Um,
Speaker 1: he's regardless of position or class, he's one of the
Speaker 1: best shooters in the country. He can handle the ball.
Speaker 1: He's as you might expect from a coach's son. He's
Speaker 1: very fundamentally sound. And by the way, another fun thing
Speaker 1: about Patrick balder and senior with the leaven Worth High
Speaker 1: School where I went, he was a stumer when I
Speaker 1: was a freshman at high school. Um, so I have
Speaker 1: gone way back with those guys. But you know, he's
Speaker 1: a new age player. I think he's you can play
Speaker 1: him in the stretch forward, you can play him as
Speaker 1: a big three. He's got tremendous versatility with with a
Speaker 1: skill set and in a high i Q and the
Speaker 1: guys worker two. So everything that you want in a prospect.
Speaker 1: And like you said, that recruitment is it's it's really
Speaker 1: interesting because by the way you get the North Carolina
Speaker 1: Xucky is the world of water real bed and I'm
Speaker 1: for the Jsy initiative. Would love to have him even
Speaker 1: though he's He's meant pretty clear he wants to college. Um,
Speaker 1: I think Duke, it's probably the team to beat, just
Speaker 1: because dad sees big picture and wants to what's best
Speaker 1: overall for a son. But having spoken to both of them,
Speaker 1: you know that that chance of coming to play with dad,
Speaker 1: it's very real. It's not something to be taken lightly.
Speaker 1: I don't think outside of that bubble people can understand
Speaker 1: how important it is for some kids to play for
Speaker 1: their fathers. They've got a chance, especially a coaches's son
Speaker 1: who hasn't had a chance to spend the type of
Speaker 1: time with his father the most kids do. Um, Okay,
Speaker 1: what about Chad Holmgren kid from Minni Haha, Academy. He's
Speaker 1: in Minneapolis, like seven ft Obviously, everybody in the in
Speaker 1: the in the Midwest wants and everybody naturally wants him
Speaker 1: really really really thin but also skilled. Is he a
Speaker 1: twenty first century player, big and that he can defend
Speaker 1: the rim, stretch the floor, and defend the ball screen? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think so. Um. You know, I think in the
Speaker 1: NBA it's not a perfect comparison, but you eventually hope
Speaker 1: to see him playing like a Karl Anthony Towns this
Speaker 1: type role, you know, a big stretch five who protects
Speaker 1: the rim but shoots the ball and isn't your typical
Speaker 1: power player around the drim that we would expect seven
Speaker 1: footers of your in the NBA. Yeah, he's got to
Speaker 1: get stronger, but and you know this, you can't mistake
Speaker 1: being skinny for lacking cutness. And the thing that people
Speaker 1: really underrat about Chat is that dude is a competitor,
Speaker 1: Like he'll he'll shove his mother out of the way
Speaker 1: to get a rebound. He doesn't care. Um, he's gonna
Speaker 1: play hard and he's a good athlete. He's just skinny,
Speaker 1: but I think he definitely projects into what people are
Speaker 1: trying to do down the road. The only thing that's
Speaker 1: gonna hamper him is just how long it takes him
Speaker 1: to develop physically. Okay, last player I want to ask
Speaker 1: you about was Kennedy Chandler, Memphis, Tennessee Sunrise Academy. Um.
Speaker 1: I believe you know he and uh maybe J D. Davison,
Speaker 1: maybe Hunter salis a kid from Omaha. Like those are
Speaker 1: three of there's the rough and kid from Mississippi. But
Speaker 1: you know, in the conversation of the top point guard
Speaker 1: in the class, when if somebody hasn't seen Kennedy Chandler,
Speaker 1: what are the missing? Uh? A little bit more of
Speaker 1: of a of a throwback point guard. I think, yes,
Speaker 1: he can score, but I think he's more of a
Speaker 1: run the team kind of guy. If you're gonna compare
Speaker 1: him to an NBA type point guard, he's more Chris
Speaker 1: Faul than Derrick Rose in terms of a style and attack.
Speaker 1: He's he's gonna pick his spots offensively. He's low to
Speaker 1: the ground and a lot more athletic and stronger than
Speaker 1: you realize. He likes that mid range jumper. Uh. As
Speaker 1: he rounds out and become more of a consistent threat
Speaker 1: from three, he can be really dangerous, but also, you know,
Speaker 1: Chris Paul, it is certainly one of the cotton. I'm
Speaker 1: not saying that the Kenny's gonna be him, but you
Speaker 1: don't see a lot of guys Chris Paul's size doing
Speaker 1: damage at the highest level of the NBA. Right He's
Speaker 1: he's he's he's he's he's the exception to the rule.
Speaker 1: So that's what Kenny's have to prove going on. But
Speaker 1: he's tough, he's a leader, he's a winner, he's strong minded.
Speaker 1: And you know, in a class that I think it's
Speaker 1: pretty imperfect to the point guard, like that's probably the
Speaker 1: position group that as a whole I would have the
Speaker 1: most questions about in the class of two thousand. You know,
Speaker 1: it's no knock on Kennity, but in a typical year,
Speaker 1: you wouldn't think of him as the best point guard
Speaker 1: in the country. You know, you would certainly think him
Speaker 1: as the top four or five point guard. But he's
Speaker 1: not typically the kind of guy you looked to and go, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, that's that's the one. And here we get
Speaker 1: back to the summer conversation. Then it's short of bean
Speaker 1: fun to see. Okay, how how how does the Hunter
Speaker 1: Saalist come along, who I'm a big believer on after
Speaker 1: seeing him with the high school team in the winners
Speaker 1: Omaha not too far from me in Kansas City. You
Speaker 1: know Kenna J. D. Davidson, who is this extreme crazy
Speaker 1: athlete and has a vision can he can't get, can't
Speaker 1: blend and be a little bit more under control and
Speaker 1: find things. And so how do we judge those guys
Speaker 1: right now? And if your schools, how do you decide
Speaker 1: which of those are prioritized. You've just gotta go with
Speaker 1: the guy that you've been you've been rocking with all along. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's fascinating you mentioned Kansas City? Is you r and A?
Speaker 1: Is he going to Florida State? Uh, I'll be off.
Speaker 1: I haven't heard yet on your I've been so wrapped
Speaker 1: up in trying to keep up with these high school guys.
Speaker 1: I forget about the transfers sometimes. But there's certainly been
Speaker 1: some rumblies about that. It's a weird one though, because
Speaker 1: you know his his old mentors, Victor Williams, who played
Speaker 1: at Oklahoma State, right and then you know he's like
Speaker 1: one of the only ones not to recommit to going
Speaker 1: to Oklahoma State because I think he wants like a
Speaker 1: bigger role, like, hey, did you guys just to play
Speaker 1: a kid? Cunningham And No, n c A tournament is
Speaker 1: actually a good thing because that means every scout is
Speaker 1: rolling into every game that you have to play. I
Speaker 1: do think that even have to sit because the year out,
Speaker 1: that could be good for him. But I don't think
Speaker 1: anybody thinks they're gonna sit this year because they all
Speaker 1: think they're gonna get uh, you know, they're gonna get
Speaker 1: to the COVID waiver. So it's a it's a weird
Speaker 1: one to me. And well, I would say she'll have
Speaker 1: a pretty good chance that a waiver since they're going
Speaker 1: to be ineligible for the n A tournament and it
Speaker 1: has them now you get automatic, you get automatic waiver.
Speaker 1: And that's that's the remarkable thing about them keeping all
Speaker 1: their players is they all could have left and transferred
Speaker 1: and play right away, right And what's what's interesting, Doug,
Speaker 1: And obviously you know Oklahoma State as well as anybody
Speaker 1: else in the country. Here you're a little bit of
Speaker 1: an interested party there. You know, maybe yours role wouldn't
Speaker 1: have been like the star player, but he stills a
Speaker 1: role that they don't have anyone else to fill right now,
Speaker 1: right they've she had a place that's going to be
Speaker 1: locked in because he's the true rim protector on the team.
Speaker 1: They don't want to have anyone else like that. It's
Speaker 1: it's I'm certainly surprised that. I'm sure. I'm sure Victory
Speaker 1: was like, what are you doing? Man? But it's it
Speaker 1: is what it is these guys, you know. I think
Speaker 1: George got off to a great start of the freshman,
Speaker 1: probably played better as a freshman than was expected, and
Speaker 1: then had some struggles up and down last year, and
Speaker 1: now here we go again. Are coming cool circles to
Speaker 1: the discussion we're at earlier with with guys that will
Speaker 1: pack up a movie. They don't want to fight through
Speaker 1: some adversity a little bit. And that's that's not a
Speaker 1: knock on you, or I'm not saying he's not willing
Speaker 1: to fight adversity or anything like that, but I think
Speaker 1: he's leaving what was really a good situation for him
Speaker 1: for the next two years. Whether or not they could
Speaker 1: play in the NA Tournament in two thousand twenty one
Speaker 1: or not, it was a really good set up for him.
Speaker 1: And so he's now going to be really tricky in
Speaker 1: picking where he goes because something might look good from
Speaker 1: the outside, but he's not gonna know for sure until
Speaker 1: he gets there. And especially in the environment that we've
Speaker 1: got going on with COVID, with so much in the air,
Speaker 1: it's a tricky time to transfer unless you're really really
Speaker 1: unhappy or you're really really getting done bad by a coach.
Speaker 1: And I don't know, maybe I'm blind to this, but
Speaker 1: I don't see Mike Boyton is the kind of guy
Speaker 1: who's doing due the dirty uh about. He's about the
Speaker 1: sharpest guy I've come across in a long time, and
Speaker 1: I think has a great future in college basketball. It's
Speaker 1: the kind of guy as a player. But I think
Speaker 1: I'd be pretty likely to want to be around. Well
Speaker 1: my my my point, what if I was and I
Speaker 1: haven't talked to your and was and this was could
Speaker 1: he have a bigger role at a different school? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm sure he could. Now. One, I don't think he
Speaker 1: he earned a bigger role, right Like it wasn't like
Speaker 1: he was. And two. But but here's the most important thing. Like, Hey,
Speaker 1: if you're what is your goal, right Like, if your
Speaker 1: goal is to go to n c A tournament, win
Speaker 1: a National Championship, Like, okay, that that I can understand.
Speaker 1: When you're Oakham State, you're not gonna have kaide in
Speaker 1: two years when you'd be a senior. But I don't
Speaker 1: believe that's his school. I believe his goal is to
Speaker 1: play in the NBA. If you're gonna play in the NBA,
Speaker 1: you're gonna play as a roller and a rim protector.
Speaker 1: That's it. That's what you're gonna do. Can you switch
Speaker 1: on ball screens? Can you defend the rim? And yeah,
Speaker 1: every year you kind of work further and further out
Speaker 1: of making shots, but that's not really all that important
Speaker 1: as much as what you do the defensive end. Can
Speaker 1: you roll, catch and finish? And I you know, guys
Speaker 1: get caught up in the how many points, how many rebounds?
Speaker 1: What did I average? Where that's actually a role you
Speaker 1: If that's your role, you won't have to change that
Speaker 1: role at all. And the hardest thing that guys have
Speaker 1: to do is they get to the NBA, like, hey,
Speaker 1: all that stuff you did in college you can't do here.
Speaker 1: We need you for a specific task. And they have
Speaker 1: to perry down what they were trying to do in college.
Speaker 1: Right right, you're exactly right, that's that's it's you. You.
Speaker 1: You were more substinct to it. I tend to ramble sometimes,
Speaker 1: but we're on the exact same page here. Maybe you're
Speaker 1: confined some place where his role is expanded. But the
Speaker 1: role that he was going to play at Oklahoma State
Speaker 1: is the role that he's perfectful, and it's the role
Speaker 1: that is likely going to be a future on the
Speaker 1: professional level. So he's walking away from as much experience
Speaker 1: for his futures he probably could have been getting any
Speaker 1: school in America. Last, is there any confidence that you're
Speaker 1: gonna have any event to evaluate in person this summer
Speaker 1: at all? Not any like event that I'm used to
Speaker 1: going to a year's past. There's there's gonna be no
Speaker 1: peace Sham or no All American camp or Las Vegas
Speaker 1: a big time or anything like that. Are there going
Speaker 1: to be some things? I mean, heck, I'm not even
Speaker 1: allowed to travel. Were owned by Verizon, and Horizon has
Speaker 1: a travel ban for all employees. So even if there
Speaker 1: were an event, until my my employer gives me the
Speaker 1: okay to go ahead and go, I'm not going anywhere now.
Speaker 1: If there's something that I can drive to and be
Speaker 1: home that same day, like, for instance, in Kansas City.
Speaker 1: In the next couple of weeks, there's a few smaller
Speaker 1: events going on where like vocan Elite when the travel
Speaker 1: seams in the country is gonna bring in forty kids
Speaker 1: for four or five days and do like a camp
Speaker 1: uh Casey Wren g MC is gonna have a couple
Speaker 1: of other nearby teams in and do kind of a
Speaker 1: campus the skirmish game. So that's that's the extent of
Speaker 1: what my in person you experiences are going to be
Speaker 1: for the summer. They're great stuff, man. I love catching
Speaker 1: up and talking hopes with you because you like me
Speaker 1: love it, you'd like me miss it. And I do
Speaker 1: think there's something cool though to having like to those
Speaker 1: of us who have grown up watching or coaching or
Speaker 1: playing in summer games and relatively empty gyms, like I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't think that's as big adjustment for most of
Speaker 1: these guys as people will lead you to believe. Obviously,
Speaker 1: for a championship NBA championship, it will be weird. I
Speaker 1: think the hard part is going to be living in
Speaker 1: the hotel room for two or three months, Like at
Speaker 1: some point you're gonna want to kill your teammates, right,
Speaker 1: Like I just need my own personal space. You're gonna
Speaker 1: miss your wife or kids or borrow or whatever that
Speaker 1: Now they can come, they can get there. They actually
Speaker 1: can get there, but they have to quarantine for four days. Right,
Speaker 1: It's not like it's not a typical going home and
Speaker 1: you know you can you can go chill out in
Speaker 1: your basement and play the next ball or you know,
Speaker 1: watched the kid ride their hoverboard and the driveway and
Speaker 1: things like that. It's different and you know, a real
Speaker 1: quick back to your original point with the playing time. Yeah,
Speaker 1: what does seating matter now? With this, It's all that
Speaker 1: matters is getting in, And I guess seating matters a
Speaker 1: little bit in terms of matchups, but home court advantage,
Speaker 1: those crowds, listen, things are all out the window. And
Speaker 1: it's it's fitting that it's a Disney at wide world
Speaker 1: of sports because so many of these guys spent so
Speaker 1: many of their formative years playing in those buildings. So
Speaker 1: I think it's kind of cool to see them going
Speaker 1: back to it. Eric great stuff. Remember you can follow
Speaker 1: him on on Twitter. We gave that out Facebook, I
Speaker 1: g wherever and still evaluating all the best hoopsters across
Speaker 1: the country. EB thanks so much, dude. Hey, thanks for
Speaker 1: having me on Doug. I really appreciate it. Man, that
Speaker 1: was that was awesome with Eric. Like it if it doesn't,
Speaker 1: if it doesn't make you feel like you're ready for basketball,
Speaker 1: like just two basketball guys. And and I'll say this,
Speaker 1: look my my issues with the bubble. I I mean, look,
Speaker 1: i haven't lived an NBA lifestyle, but I've gotten to
Speaker 1: a point where sometimes I do have to check myself
Speaker 1: my expectation for a hotel. The danger is when if
Speaker 1: you're gonna use social media to be your platform for
Speaker 1: your voice for social change, you've got to be careful about,
Speaker 1: you know, clowning a relatively nice upper upper echelon hotel
Speaker 1: room and all you can eat food service. Like I
Speaker 1: get it, you're used to want. It would be like
Speaker 1: if we're watching somebody hands you a brand new TV
Speaker 1: and says, hey, here's your TV for month. It's standard deaf. Sorry, dude,
Speaker 1: you don't get the good channels. Like we have this
Speaker 1: level of expectation because of our time in the United States.
Speaker 1: We're gonna have high death, We're gonna have the best channels.
Speaker 1: And suddenly you can't get it. I understand, you just
Speaker 1: gotta be careful about it and how it does dilute
Speaker 1: the rest of your voice when you handle it that way. Um.
Speaker 1: I now that the rosters are completed in full, I
Speaker 1: do believe that if the Clippers have Lou Williams, assuming
Speaker 1: cool I gets there and everybody's healthy, I think the
Speaker 1: Clippers benefit the most because I just losing Avery Bradley
Speaker 1: really hurts the Lakers. They were playing great basketball, but
Speaker 1: they probably didn't have the best roster. Now their roster
Speaker 1: isn't as good. Yeah, j R. Smith who can make
Speaker 1: shots and can defend and does have obviously you know,
Speaker 1: postseason experience, but I I you've you've taken away that
Speaker 1: momentum which will be hard to regenerate. And I also
Speaker 1: think that playing in front of nobody will be better
Speaker 1: for the younger guys who are more of the more
Speaker 1: recent AU generation where you just play games to play games,
Speaker 1: and you have to find ways to to to navigate
Speaker 1: this and manage against, uh, manage against you know, guys
Speaker 1: being around each other too much and eventually being at
Speaker 1: each other's stroke. Hey, hope you enjoyed the pod. A
Speaker 1: lot more to come. Remember to download subscribe and right
Speaker 1: Listen to The Doug Gotlip Show daily three to six
Speaker 1: Eastern twelve through Pacific I Heart Radio, Fox Sports Radio, etcetera, etcetera.
Speaker 1: Fall me on I G and on Twitter at Gottlieb Show.
Speaker 1: In the meantime, we're getting closer. It's gonna happen. We're
Speaker 1: gonna have actual, real basketball on TV. I'm Doug Gottliebin.
Speaker 1: This is all ball.